EP#371 | GUEST | What’s Really in Your Food? A Food Scientist Exposes the Truth with Dr. Bryan Quoc Le - Deep Shallow Dive

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
The following podcast is a deep shallow dive production.
And you're gonna love it. OK, let's go.
All right, so I have been tryingto find people to come on and
talk about food. And what's awesome is my man

(00:22):
Brian Lay is here from MendocinoFood Consulting and I'm going to
have him talk all about that. But ladies and gentlemen, we've
got a food scientist today. And this is fantastic because
as, as you and I talked before we got on air, you know, the
goal with everything deep, shallow dive is just to help

(00:43):
people understand what's going on, whether that's
geopolitically or whether that'swhat they're putting into their
body, the way they're shopping for food, you know,
understanding the back of a nutrition label and all that.
So hey man, welcome. I really appreciate it.
Why don't you maybe give a give a 2 second blurb so people can

(01:04):
kind of get to know you a littlebit and then we'll jump into
some food. Yeah, sounds good.
Yeah, honestly, I'm Brian. I graduated my PhD in 2020 in
food science, and since then I've just been helping companies
develop food products. And, you know, honestly,
sometimes you get to know a little bit more how the sausage
is made. You know, it's, it's, it's good
to inform yourself. And I realize that a lot of

(01:27):
people don't have the same knowledge that I do.
And it's, it's, it's important for us to all kind of help each
other get a better understandingof, you know, a lot of the
things that goes on behind the curtain.
Yeah, yeah. All right.
Let's talk about how the sausageis made literally and
figuratively. I'm trying to figure out why is
this country so fat? OK.
And for me, it really comes downto two things.

(01:49):
And it's not rocket science. It's calories in, calories out.
So calories out. I talk a lot about step count,
daily movement, you know, sweating, making, making
physical fitness and quite frankly, having your body move
as part of your daily regimen. But obviously the food is so

(02:12):
important. So like talk us through this
food scientist stuff. Like what are what are they
creating? Is it shit?
Are they just? Adding.
Are they just adding stuff to preserve the product so it lasts
longer? Are they adding stuff to make it
taste better, To make it look better?

(02:34):
Talk us through all that stuff. Yeah, absolutely.
Like you said, taste better, look better, last longer, you
know, you name it. But the big one cheaper, right?
Like anything that you can do tomake it cheaper.
And I think what the sad part about our industry is that I
think a lot of people come in asfood scientists hoping that they

(02:55):
can make a difference, right? Like, I don't think anyone comes
in is like, I'm going to spend my degree, you know, making
shitty food for people because, yeah, like they could be doing
something else. Let's say like these are smart
people. The issue is, it comes down to
is, you know, we, we live in a world where the food industry,
razor thin margins, everyone wants their cut.

(03:16):
A lot of it is marketing, right?A lot of it, it goes to, you
know, shareholder and, and then,you know, the, the, you know,
different corporate teams, the amount it takes to make food
like the actual serious cost is like miniscule.
You know, like at the end of theday, it might be like 10 or 20%
of the price, right? Because we're getting, you know,

(03:37):
ingredients from China, we're getting ingredients, you know,
we've got tons of soy, we got tons of corn.
And so literally everything we're trying to make from these
two things because they're supercheap.
And it's like, at some point, yeah, you're going to run out of
nutrients because you're like exhausting all these, all these
crops, like they need, they needrest, they need minerals, they
need, you know, and, and there'sthese really interesting studies

(03:59):
I, I read in the Economist maybea couple years ago, it's just
like the soil is like nothing now, like all those nutrients
are gone because. It's depleted the soil.
It's. Depleted.
Completely depleted. Yeah.
Where did it go? No, it went into, you know,
20-30, fifty years of continuousindustrial crop production.

(04:22):
So OK, you know what I mean. And are, are, when you talk
about like ingredients being from China, I know India, I
think is, is, is a big country that makes ingredients like,
yeah, are we really getting mostof our stuff from there?
Like, and is it because the United States soil is depleted
or the United States farmers aregetting just railroaded?

(04:44):
Like like why is it it's just cheaper?
It's so crazy. We have a crazy food system.
Basically. We take the corn and soy that we
produce here, We ship it out to China.
They feed it to their animals because it's cheaper to make it
here and ship it out, right, Forwhatever crazy reason.
And then they ship over, you know, you know, the finished

(05:05):
goods. And it's like, yeah, because
labor's cheaper, right? Like, you don't want to produce
stuff here in the US You might want to produce it in Mexico.
You want to be able to produce it in you want to produce it
where, you know, you're, you're not paying, you know, American
wages to, to, to pretty because it, it just it, it cuts into the
bottom line. And it, it's really this
unfortunate system where, you know, China doesn't like barely

(05:29):
has any regulations in terms of,you know, sustainability or, or,
or, you know, metal poisoning and that sort of thing.
And you start to see it, you start to see it, it creepy.
And you see sort of ingredients that come down come up from, you
know, South America and, you know, they have lead to up the
wazoo and then they have to do arecall.
But no one knows why or where itcame from.

(05:50):
It's like in the cinnamon of allplaces.
But it's like, yeah, because these countries don't have the
same rigor of testing as you would have in in a Western
country. And so.
Fundamentally, fundamentally, all of these issues with I guess
the, the, the unfortunate way ofthis food getting made, it comes
down to profit, right? It comes down to the financial

(06:13):
aspect, man, that is, that is sosad because honestly, I think
that is absolutely what is causing this epidemic of, of
obesity And people, you know, you come, you combine shitty
food with lack of movement and that's a recipe for disaster.
Let me ask you about a couple things in particular.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, aspartame.

(06:35):
And gosh, it's I'm forgetting. Hold on.
Actually, you know what's funny?I drink these.
Like sucralose? Listen, and I'm not perfect, OK?
So like let's talk about aspartame and then like sodium
benzoate, potassium benzoate, the the preservatives.
Are these awful for us or what? What are these things?

(06:56):
You know, I have mixed feelings about them because at the end of
the day, as a food scientist, I know that there's decades of
research on them in terms of their impact on humans.
And they've, they've been shown to not really have much of a
problem as far as like pure dosage wise, like they're not
going to kill you, right? Like that's fine.
The issue is like it's a preservative.

(07:18):
So what does that mean? That means that it kills
microorganisms. What does that mean?
Well, you got, you got your gut has microorganisms.
And so there's these interestingstudies that show like long term
effects, like, yeah, you, you have to have a certain amount in
the foods to make sure that it doesn't poison, poison you,
right? You don't want food poisoning.
But on the other hand is like your, your gut microbiome is

(07:39):
really sensitive, right? Like these, these, these, these,
these microorganisms that live in your stomach have evolved
with you. And now we're just like trashing
them essentially. And so I, I wonder, like, what
does that mean in the 100 years,200 years?
Like, I'm not thinking like a couple decades.
I don't think we can even, we'veeven studied it that far.
But like, you know, we're constantly like changing,

(08:01):
evolving. And we think that, you know, all
these things that we put in our bodies is like static.
It's static matter. But it's not like, like, you
know, you can get in like, severe inflammation.
Yeah, chronic inflammation. Chronic inflammation.
I want to talk. Yeah.
You know, you just said something that was honestly such
a such a light bulb for me. So I understand the sodium

(08:23):
benzoate, potassium sorbate, they're preservatives.
I understand that they kill the microorganisms so the food
doesn't spoil or the drink doesn't spoil.
So they, they have a longer shelf life, they can live on the
shelf longer and they can sell. They never pieced it together.
And then you said, hey, those have been studied.
They're not that bad. It's not going to kill you in

(08:45):
those doses. Totally get that and totally
agree with that. And my thought process on them
honestly stopped there. I never took it to that next
phase of now that I'm taking that into my body, it's not
going to kill me, but it's intended to kill microorganisms.
So it's messing with my gut and my micro bus.
Maybe that's the problem. Maybe that is the long term

(09:10):
issues of all of these preservatives that quite frankly
is not a Direct Line correlation.
Wow, that's pretty wild, dude. That's pretty wild.
OK, that's amazing. Or things like, you know, when
you see sugar free stuff, obviously they've taken, they've
removed the sugar or fat free. They've removed the fat free.

(09:31):
I think I understand a little bit better because when I turn
around and look at the label, yes, there's no fat, but there's
a ton of sugar in there. Yeah, you, you got to put
something right. You got to put something for the
taste, right? Is that for?
The taste, it's for the taste. It's like like you can't be made
of air, right. You got to have like something
to bulk it up and and sugar is dirt cheap, my friend.

(09:54):
You know, it's so cheap. And so it's funny because you
take the fat out, fat's actuallya really it, it costs a lot on
the market. Like if you think in terms of
like feed oils and that sort of thing, or coconut oil, they're
expensive. Yeah.
But sugar, you can bulk things up.
Like nobody's business to do that.
That's amazing. That's amazing.
OK, OK, well, give us give us a couple like are there any real

(10:16):
red flags people should look for?
And then do you turn everything around and do you look at the
nutrition facts, the supplement facts?
Are there any ingredients that we really need to not try to put
into our body? Yeah, that's, that's a really
interesting point. You know, honestly, I would say
#1 and this is this part of my own personal journey of learning

(10:38):
a little bit more of like what'simpacted me and so on so forth.
Like, sugar seems to be the number one enemy because, you
know, what happens is a, again, we'll go back to the gut
microbiome. Sugar.
Every species of microarrhism will eat sugar.
All of them. Yeah.
The bad ones, the good ones. Yeah, yeah.
And the more you're feeding the bad ones, the more they have a

(11:00):
foothold. And you know, 10 years down the
line, 20 years down the line, you get all this inflammation,
right. And that inflammation is like
the number one killer for everything like cardiovascular
disease, diabetes, you know, even cancer is all like the, the
ideology of it or etiology of itis derived from inflammation.

(11:20):
And I studied this, this was my PhD was I'd studied like the
effects of plant based foods andingredients on inflammation.
And you know, at the end of the day, like the gut microbiome,
like this thing has been around for millions of years, ever
since we started as humans. It's a fine-tuned machine.
And we're just like throwing. We're basically go throwing

(11:42):
gasoline and like just thinking whatever, that's crazy.
Sugar, Sugar's that number one killer.
I mean, listen, I've talked about sugar.
I've done a dedicated episode onsugar.
I really want to keep hammering that home.
I personally, you know, when I do turn things around and I look
at the the nutrition facts or even the supplement facts or

(12:03):
whatever set of factor on there,I look for sugars, I look for
added sugars. What about things alcohol
sugars? You see these alcohol sugars in
gum and other shit. What is that?
You know, it's stuff that your body doesn't know how to deal
with, right? Like that.
The idea is, like, chemically, yeah.
You know, we have enzymes that are working day and night trying

(12:25):
to break down everything that weeat.
It's stares at sugar alcohols. It's like, what the F is this,
right? And then it goes straight into
your, your colon. And all the microorganisms in
the colon are like, hell yeah. So, you know, you get, you get,
you know, if you eat too much ofthem, you know, you get
diarrhea, You get like flatulence.
It's like, you know, but same problem.

(12:45):
Long term question mark. What?
What does that mean? We're basically living
experiments, you know, biological experiments.
Yeah, long term question marks, we are biological experiments
and that applies to the COVID vaccine we are looking.
At. That too.
I digress, but I digress. OK, let me ask you about let's

(13:06):
talk about the plant based stuff.
And you know, like a few years ago, I don't think it's as big
now, but like Impossible burgersand Beyond meat and those things
came out. Gosh, at the time, at the time
my girlfriend at the time was a vegan.
So like we were eating Impossible burgers and Beyond
meat burgers and all that. And I'll tell you my biggest

(13:28):
litmus test on food, it's not while I'm eating it, but it's
the next day when I go #2. Yes, yes.
When I would eat a Impossible burger or a Beyond Meat burger,
that next day number 2 was terrific.
Like, like just awful. Just awful.

(13:50):
When I tell everybody now, I'm like, if you, you should be
looking at your number 2 every morning. 100% I, I think we
should be doing that as like a species like that's, that's what
that's what we should. I think the Japanese have it
down. I think they like are all about
it, and they have. All are they they do that.
Yeah, I think so. And and it's just you kind of

(14:10):
wonder like, yeah, that's like that's the end, end of all your
food. Like if it's coming out funny,
it's in there. Funny if it's, you know, if it
smells horrible. Yes.
That's not. Good.
It's not good. It's not good.
So talk to us about like, yeah, these plant based stuff.
What are your thoughts on that on those?
Same deal. It's like it's such a big

(14:32):
question mark for me because I Iwould say we've had plant based
foods, but they're Whole Foods. Yeah.
Or they're, they're like minimally processed, like tofu,
Like you need a little couple ofsteps to get there.
But like we've been eating that for a while.
There's a lot of these foods that we'd be eating for a while.
And I think what we're missing in our culture, in the Western

(14:52):
cuisine of at least America is like some underlying guide to
eat and and not just like nutrition, not just like health,
not just like, but more like a philosophy, right.
And like you have the Nordic countries, they have a
philosophy on food and the, and the Japanese cuisine has a
philosophy on food. And it's that idea of like, it

(15:14):
should feel pretty decent to youin your body.
Like you should not, you should not be feeling bad after eating.
And to me, if if you're putting something in there and it's it's
wrecking things up, yeah, that'sa problem.
I mean, and, and to the point ofall these plant based companies,
I think the mission, the the mission is important.
Like sustainability. I think that is that is the key.

(15:35):
But, you know, getting there, it's like by any means
necessary. I think that's an issue.
I think we have to look at it more holistically.
Like how does this impact everyone?
How does it impact like the society that we live in?
Like you can't just like shovel,like you can't shovel.
Like, you know, something that was like made in a, you know,
refinery. I think that there's something

(15:56):
wrong with that. No, totally.
Those, those bur I mean particularly the Impossible
burgers and the Beyond Meat burgers.
I would turn those around. I couldn't even pronounce the
ingredients. I'm like, Oh my God, I've never
seen so many consonants in one word, which would be like
amazing if it was on Jeopardy. And it's like, I'll take AC and

(16:16):
there's like 27. Of them.
Yeah, exactly. That's crazy.
OK, OK. So a lot of that stuff seems
like again, marketing, you know,again, it comes back to
marketing. What about, you know, I, I think
you and I initially got connected because I, I put out a
request in regards to fiber. Do you have any thoughts on
fiber and then things like Metamucil or a fiber supplement?

(16:40):
Yeah, it's it, you know, again, it's, it's so interesting to
think like we come from a world where like we try to like keep
everything a single bullet, likea silver bullet, like, OK, we
just the all right, we're on thefiber, so just throw in a bunch
of fiber, right? Or like, I don't have enough
protein, so just throw in a bunch of protein.
But food is is complex, right? Like it comes in like there's

(17:03):
all these aspects to them. And then like for fiber, in that
case, you don't get just one kind of fiber from, from plant
based sources or, you know, fruits and vegetables and that
sort of thing. There's all sorts of different
subgroups and categories of fibers.
You know, some fibers feed certain types of microorganisms,
some other fibers feed other types of microorganisms.
It's really complex. And then we've learned over the,

(17:27):
you know, last couple of decades, especially with its
interaction with the gut micro, I'm just going to keep harping
on the gut microbiome. OK.
OK. So the gut microbiome, OK.
It's huge. Like the, the reason, the number
one reason why fiber works at all is because the gut
microbiome eats it. OK, Like we don't eat it.
We don't we have nothing to do with it, but it goes down into

(17:48):
our colon and the bacteria there, they eat it and they
convert it into these these compounds called butyrates.
And these butyrates are what reduces inflammation.
Like it has been shown that if you you're just eating the right
amount of fiber for for years, for decades, you're the the, the
probability, the risk of you getting any of those chronic

(18:08):
diseases. Are we talking about, you know,
obesity, even diabetes and and cardiovascular?
Yeah. So it drops because.
Absolutely. Butyric acid or that butyrate is
protective and you got. Effective.
And it's minimizing any inflammation.
And that inflammation is is not allowed an acidic atmosphere
inside your body. Oh, no, I believe in all that,

(18:31):
man. I really do.
I believe in, you know, the cancer and all of those all of
those cells. And by the way, what feeds them
the most is that sugar we talkedabout, right?
Yeah. Exactly.
Exactly. Oh.
Dude, it's like a wicked. It's like a wicked cycle, man.
It's a wicked. Cycle.
What about what are your thoughts on this make America

(18:52):
healthy again? Like when Robert F Kennedy
junior kind of, you know, planted his his flag in the in
the Trump universe and you know,they made all this big noise
about making America healthy again, which I think a lot of it
was meant toward vaccines. I mean, if you feel comfortable
talking about vaccines, we can if not on the food side.

(19:13):
I mean, what do you think? Like, are they doing anything?
Like is this? What is this?
You know, I, I question a lot They, I, I think obviously they
have to sort of run a fine line between like banning things out,
right, and then catering to the food industry.
Food industry is huge. I mean, especially if we talk
about like just animal protein in general, you know, animal

(19:37):
agriculture huge. But I think, you know, if there
was three ways, and I'm not a nutritionist, I'm not a doctor,
I'm just talking like as a person, maybe I've studied a
little, studied a little bit, right?
I've I've caught my PhD, you know that to me that doesn't
mean as much as it maybe used to, but in any case, it's the
sugar again with that, you know,combining sugar with, you know,

(20:00):
higher fiber, lower sugar, higher fiber, higher protein,
and then, you know, just just the movement, right, like.
Get it, get it going, get it like we are as a species.
We're designed, we, we, we're probably moving around like 8 to
12 hours a day all the time for,for like hundreds of
generations. Like that's got to do something

(20:22):
to us, and now we just sit around like watching TV and like
eating mindlessly, right? Absolutely.
And so I question like, are theyreally, are they just trying to
get the like lowest hanging fruit, like let's like deal with
these artificial colors? Because like as far as Costco,
it's very minimal. It makes up like .005% of the

(20:46):
composition. But if you go, hey, let's, let's
put a cap on sugar or let's, youknow, maybe we need to like
increase fiber or protein in, inthe American diet.
Now you're talking about like hundreds of millions of tons of
material. You see what I mean?
Do you know what do you understand?
Trying to get at I think what? You're trying to get at Yeah,
Dad, let's focus on red dye number six.

(21:09):
That's like .1% of the overall cost and quite frankly, who
gives a shit? But exactly brought in, hey,
look, everybody, we've banned red dye number six, which I
think that literally was the onethey banned.
I think it was, yeah, easier that or red dye #3 but you know,
all sorts of ones. And then here's what's funny
about that, they banned that same exact ingredient in

(21:33):
cosmetics 30 years ago, but for the past 30 years, they've been
OK with us consuming it. You know what, man?
You just hit on something incredibly poignant and that is
the stupid little wins a dye #3 red dye number six.
Who cares? Let's talk about sugar.

(21:53):
But now all the sudden sugar is a 400, you know, $1,000,000 a
year industry. Yeah, yeah, dude, they're not
going after that. No, Why would they?
Why would you know how much Flack they would get?
Yeah, everything would have to be reformulated.
Everything, everything OK OK, let me ask you this.
I have a love hate relationship with protein bars.

(22:16):
Like yeah, and I'm a big proteinguy like I'm all about protein.
I honestly try to eat very minimal carbs.
I just feel better when I don't eat the the simple carbs for
sure. But even like like I'm not a big
pasta guy. I, I don't really eat anything
white. I don't eat baked potatoes, I
don't eat pasta, I don't eat rice and all that.
But I have this love hate relationship with protein bars

(22:38):
because I'm thinking to myself, OK, I want that protein.
But. I feel like that protein is not
the same protein as when I eat apiece of chicken or a piece of
meat. Are there?
Oh, no, it's totally different. You know, that protein has to go
through so many processes to getwhere it's, you know, you got,
it's got to be extracted. It's got to be like filtered,

(23:00):
it's got to be acidified and then reacidified and blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah. You know, there's so many steps.
It boggles the mind how you get to to end up with what, what you
get at the end of the day. And, and honestly, same, same
deal. I've got the same deal where I
have a love hate relationship. I like to think like, all right,
I've got my protein in. But there is fundamentally I
feel a difference when I'm eating chicken, right?

(23:22):
Or if I'm eating, you know, meat.
Because that's what that's what we've been running on, right?
Like human evolution. And the reason why we're here
today is because we learned how to take meat and throw it on a
fire, right? Like simple stuff.
And like our bodies have just adapted like all those
generations to get there. And it's like now suddenly we're

(23:43):
throwing something we've never seen before.
Yeah. I mean, who knows what's going
on? No, totally.
Like when I have those protein bars, I just don't think they're
doing what I think they're doing.
And that is this is building my muscles because supposedly
protein builds muscles. I just don't think they're doing
that. Or even protein supplements.
When I scoop a powder of the protein supplement, I just don't

(24:06):
think it's doing. I will.
I will say the fiber supplements, I've talked about
this a few Times Now and I've added that to kind of my daily
life. I do notice a difference in my
number twos that next day there's much more bulk in that
number 2 after I go, I honestly feel great.
I feel like I've emptied my bowels, like incredibly and.

(24:29):
I and. I love that feeling, but with
those protein bars I don't feel anything with.
Those protein. Powder, I'm going to stop
wasting my money. That's funny.
What about how? Go ahead?
Good. I was just going to say to your
point of the fibers doesn't takevery much the makeups.
OK, OK, there we go. There we go.

(24:49):
Comes back to that. What about hydration?
Like what are your, I mean, is it just water?
Is it tea? And feel free to give us kind of
your own personal routine, like if there's any real foods you
like and that you incorporate ona daily basis, I'd love to hear
those. Yeah, absolutely.
You know, I I used to be a big runner.
Like I spent, I spent a lot of my early greens and, and, and in

(25:12):
my 20s, like, you know, doing half marathons and that sort of
thing. So I was always big on water.
But it's interesting now that I'm in my 30s, what I crave more
is like, like a sensation of like I'm drinking something a
little bit more than just water.Now.
I still drink a ton of water, but I kind of forced myself to.
But I actually, I really like Ollipop.

(25:33):
And this is not a sponsor. I actually I just, I just, I
don't know, I mean. Wait, I I didn't hear you.
You like what? Ollipop.
Ollie Pop OK, yeah. Yeah.
I want to ask you, sparkling water is is the carbonation
process? Are there any?
I mean, I drink a ton of sparkling water.
I really do. So like is.
There anything I should worry about there?

(25:55):
I don't think so. I mean, OK, I, you know, it's
just not that much, you know, the carbonation process is like
not that big of a deal. And you know, it's, it's pretty,
it's pretty good. I wouldn't worry too much about
it. Yeah.
I mean, I've, I, I used to drinka lot of soda, unfortunately,
and I I cut that out in my early20s and, you know, I had to

(26:16):
replace it with something and they didn't come out with
lollipop until, you know, much later in my life.
So now, now that it's here, that's what I drink.
Like, you know, the fiber is cool, but I don't drink it
necessarily for the fiber. I think it's it, it just helps
me kind of get some more fluid into my body.
And I think, you know, having something flavored is totally

(26:39):
understandable. I drink a lot of tea.
I love tea. That's that's my go.
To I watch tea, green tea or whatever.
Whole shebang. Yeah.
If I'm feeling adventurous, I'lldo puer, right?
And then if I'm, you know, I sometimes I'll do a matcha if
I'm feeling fancy. Yeah, right.
Then there's these really great green teas from Japan that, you
know, you can really feel like, wow, there was like care made

(27:01):
into them. These like, soil ceremonial
grade green teas. And it's just, it's wild to me.
Like they know they know tea, right?
That's that's how I. Feel what's what's your
background? I'm so bad at guessing.
I'm Vietnamese. You're.
Vietnamese. OK, Got it, Got it.
Yeah. I feel like, I feel like that
Asian culture, though, they really do have a better
relationship with food. Japan in particular, I I think

(27:23):
there's a real respect to food where it's not just for
functionality. You know what?
Actually. Exactly.
And I and I look at, I look at countries in Europe and I look
at these small little bodegas and the way people shop and the
way people eat. It's almost like they're either
shopping and eating for that dayor maybe a couple days.

(27:45):
And here in America and and I amso guilty of this.
You know me. Too.
It's like we shop with Costco and buy $400.00 worth of stuff
and have two refrigerators and afreezer and we've got enough
food to like last through the winter.
But that's terrible. That's really terrible that that
concept of the way European countries and like these small

(28:08):
little cities and towns that you're going to the bodega and
you're buying tonight's meal andyou're eating it.
That's just so much healthier. Sure, sure.
And you know, I have, I have a huge, I have a theory about
that, that OK, which is that, you know, a of course, like
Europe is a lot smaller. Yeah, yeah.
Distances doesn't take much to get from, you know, village A to

(28:30):
village B. It's been, they've been there
for like about at least 1000 years.
You know, each country in the United States, you know, the
history is really built around this idea of like go West, you
know, manifest destiny and you know, when it comes to that food
became really about survival, right?
How do you preserve it? You know, how do you make sure

(28:50):
like you get that dried like bison meat?
You know, it's, it's all about like it's very utilitarian,
utilitarian, That's what it's very utilitarian.
And and we, I think we, we adopted that like unconsciously
like that just became like the sort of our philosophy was like,
get it done right. Like I don't care where it came

(29:11):
from. I don't care if it's raccoon
meat for all, you know, like I need to survive because I'm out
West. I'm in, you know, you know,
desert town, Cowboys city, right?
And you know, I need to go like 200 miles on my horseback.
I don't I don't really give a rat's ass about like how it was
made. And so I think we've just like

(29:32):
garnered this sort of feeling for that versus like these
countries settle down, go out. This is like a ceremony.
This is like, let's like the food we we, we love and it's
important to love food. I think that's the other thing
is we don't, we don't really make tasty food.
Yeah. You know, like we work really
hard to like make it tasty. But it's like, you know, it's

(29:53):
not like crafting like this, like 42 hour broth, pork broth
to make ramen, right. It's not like, let's like let
this age for five years, Yeah. And then let's let's give it a
shot. Yeah.
And again, those, those those Asian cultures definitely are
way better than that. What about salt?
What, what are your thoughts on salt?
And is that something that, I mean, I know the body needs

(30:16):
needs a certain amount of salt, but I feel like salt's another
killer. Yeah, yeah, it's crazy.
I mean, certainly there's like alot of medical research around
that where like, you know, if you're only really for people
who have like, poor kidney function.
But I think like, at the end of the day, like if you hit a
certain limit, at some point your body just can't take it

(30:36):
anymore, right? Like just like any other system,
you can't just dump like if you dumped a bunch of salt in the
river, everything dies like, Andso that kind of gives you an
indication of what could happen,right?
And you know, there's a lot of different forms of salt.
I think we take it for granted, this idea of like salt's just
salt. They're like, apparently if you
get salt from let's say like soysauce or miso, there's all these

(31:00):
compounds in there that are produced during the fermentation
process that actually help with cardiovascular conditions.
And they also, they improve the flavor in such a way you don't
need extra salt. I mean, it's just like, and the
same goes with some cheeses too.And, and, and so like, I think a
lot of that has to do with the fact that we don't, we don't do

(31:20):
a lot of fermentation in this, in this country.
Fermentation is like the basis for a lot of cuisine.
Really good, right? Like Kim, So good.
Like kimchi. Kimchi.
Yup, and then you know you got your sauerkraut from the.
German sauerkraut, yeah. Yeah, like, that's huge.
The French, like, love to let things sit and die.
So yeah, whether it's meat or cheese.

(31:43):
I actually, I actually eat a lotof kimchi.
That's kind of part of my thingsthat that that I consume.
I'll have to add sauerkraut to the mix and I and I do that
because I've read that that really helps the microbiome and
that kind of helps with gut health and those bacterias and
those organisms. OK, OK, good stuff.
All right, people, let me give it.

(32:04):
Let me give a recap of where we are.
Get rid of sugar. Sugar's number one.
Keep an eye on that. Add fiber to the mix, right,
that's a good one. And movement, of course, is a
non food, but get out there, move.
Get off your ass and get out there.
Move to get your 10,000 steps infermented foods.
You're a fan of fermented foods.OK, there we go.

(32:25):
And and then you don't have a particular like you're not
vegetarian, vegan, Mediterranean.
Do you have any real quote UN quote diet you subscribe to?
You know, like I, I used to be really, I, I used to like have
like these really big focus likeobsessions with certain types of
eating. And I found that, you know, what

(32:45):
happens is, you know, I don't know if this is true for
everyone else, but I got stressed out.
Like it just became like anotherthing on my list, right?
It just occupied my mind too much.
And at some point I was just, I,I said, you know what, let's,
let's see if there's anything I ascribe to.
It's like, how do I feel? Like, let me just sit down.
I do a lot of meditation like that's, that's the my go to, to

(33:07):
sort of get my, my, my worldviewkind of, you know, settle down
and, and after I eat, I'll meditate really.
And I'll just be like, yeah. And it took.
The only reason I did this is because during so I I walked
from California to Louisiana when I was 22.
Wait, you walked. From California to Louisiana,

(33:29):
Yeah. What are you, Forrest Gump?
What was that about? Yeah, so my dad died of a
stroke. Oh my gosh.
Yeah. When I Yeah, yeah.
In college, it. It should be because I was like,
yeah, because he was a doctor. He was 62.
He was a doctor. And I was like, no shit.
Like, you can know all this stuff about how the body works.

(33:50):
Yeah, but you, you cannot. You can't save yourself.
What happened what what caused him to pass it so early?
You know, it's, it's crazy. I mean, I don't know.
We, we, we don't know. We really don't know.
I think, you know, the doctors told us, oh, he had like thin
blood vessels. But I was like, I mean.
Did he have a heart? Did he have a?
Was it heart related? Did he have a heart attack then?

(34:12):
I just like, something burst in his head and in your brain.
Yeah, an aneurysm. And then just like, and then he
fell down the stairs and then that was it, man.
It's like, so anything can happen, right?
Yeah. So that, that, that told me
like, hey, I got to, I got to dosomething.
I've been sitting on my butt forfour years, you know, in
college. And so I, I said, so when I

(34:34):
graduated, I, I, I was able to speak in front of my department.
So I, I studied chemistry. And so my big thing was like,
yeah, my dad died. I'm going to walk now.
Like, sayonara. Wow.
Were you doing it to kind of like, I don't know, honor him or
bring awareness to something? Play definitely to honor him for

(34:55):
sure, because he's, he actually spent a lot of his life like
partially paralyzed. So he didn't get to do all the
things he he wanted to do. He was a he, he was a big
traveller right when when beforeI was born.
So I, I, I took it upon myself to say like, you know, I might
as well I've been thinking aboutthis for a while.
I want to see the country, I want to meet people.

(35:15):
I, I, I got to get out of my books, you know what I'm saying?
And I did that. And one of the really
interesting things during that time was anytime I ate like
crap, I would walk. I could only walk like 5 miles,
like my legs couldn't do it. Anytime I ate really good I was
going 20-30 miles easy. Easy.

(35:36):
It was such a, it was such a stark difference and I just
thought to myself, there's no way in hell that it's just, it's
just the food has does somethingto you.
Absolutely. And it's hard to notice when
you're just sitting. OK, that's the thing.
That's very interesting. So so did you.
When was this? When did you do this walk?

(35:57):
Yeah. So this was in 2012.
Wow. OK, So did you document this on
social media and like, were you were you showing your thing?
And then and then how do you even do that?
Like did you go through neighborhoods?
Did you go on the highway? Just straight to the desert.
I mean, I was following a couplehighways here and there and then

(36:17):
Texas, I was just like took AI just like to go right.
And I, I got through like some of these really amazing small
towns like Marfa. If you ever look up Marfa,
Texas, it's this like artist commune like that's like in the
middle of the desert. And so you get to see parts of
the world that you know, you never, you never want even think
about when you're in the car. And I think that was that was my

(36:39):
new worldview was like what I see in the car is no, is nothing
like it would be on the ground with boots on the ground.
So how many hours a day were youwalking?
I think it was like I'd tap out at 8 and, you know, I'd, I'd
need to just like, I, I decided like I didn't want to do 12.
I think some people can like hustle pretty fast, but I think

(37:00):
that would, that was ruining my,my, my muscles.
Yeah, I I do. Like I'd wake up, you know, I'd
eat my breakfast of like like 2 lbs of oat.
Like you got to like, that's thething.
I was shoveling like 3004 thousand calories and I was
still losing weight. That's that was so crazy.

(37:20):
Like I just could. I could not put on pounds my
friend. OK, action.
That's the that shows the power of walking.
It does. I felt a.
Lot about walking, a lot about steps.
I mean, I wear a Fitbit and an Apple Watch because I have trust
issues, but like, that's amazing, man, man.
Oh my God. And then what would you do?
Just sleep in the in hotels every night like.

(37:42):
I slept on the side of the road.I slept on the side of the road.
And, and then the other thing. No.
And then this is the crazier thing.
I didn't bring any money. So I had this whole philosophy,
right? No, So there's, there's all
these, all these, there's a bunch of these monks in, in, in
Buddhism that their whole thing was like, they would only walk
as long as like the world provided.

(38:03):
And so I took on the same philosophy and I was like, let's
see, let's see. It's my experiment.
I'm a scientist, right? Like this is my experiment.
And so I just was like, let's see what happens.
And the craziest thing was that people would stop their car,
they'd say hi to me and ask me what I was doing.
And then they'd give me a 20. I didn't even ask.
I literally was not asking for money.

(38:23):
I never asked for money, but people, it was the craziest
thing. People would, or I'd meet people
in towns and small towns and they would, they would be like,
hey, do you need a hotel? Sure.
Like let me get you one down theroad.
Or they would invite me into their house.
We'd have a meal. Serious.
I'm serious. I'm dead serious.
Like I'm not. To me, it was, it was a light at

(38:44):
the at the end of that tunnel oflike, there's hope in this
country like. Yeah, yeah.
We, we are brainwashed. I hate to say it, but like the
idea that like we live in a world where we have enemies.
Yeah, Of course that makes it easier to manipulate us.
But like, if you, of course, if you talk to the person next door
and you bring with them, you're like, honest, authentic self.

(39:06):
Yeah, it opens doors like I it's.
Amazing. Holy shit.
Wait, tell me the route again. From where to where?
So I it, so I went to college atUC Irvine, OK UC California,
Irvine, there's a dormitory dormitory complex called Mill
Earth. I started at the Shire and

(39:28):
that's, that's where I, I used to hang out there with all my,
my good friends. And then I, I walked, you know,
through California to the east side into Arizona, a little bit
of New Mexico, that little Panhandle all the way through
Texas. That is huge state.
That was like 3 months of my walk, right?
Yeah, like it's like 880 miles. It's crazy.

(39:49):
And then I, I, I ended up in Louisiana in New Orleans, OK.
And that's, that's the, that's the city that my dad came when
he when he first moved here at the United States.
My God, that's amazing. So the total, what was the total
mileage do you remember? It was 2000 so I took some
detours, like if you go straighton the 10 it's like 1900 but

(40:10):
like so 2. 1000 miles. How long was the whole process?
It was six months. I I took 6.
Months. Yeah, six months, this.
Is insane and and you literally of that six months you slept on
the side of the road many a night yeah what about clothes
and shoes and like socks and like.
This is a funny story. Ryan, this is insane.

(40:34):
People have to revisit it, Revisit.
It was not in the deep shallow dive pre podcast questionnaire.
We went from shallow to deep, you know?
Yeah. Dude, we yeah.
Definitely. Yeah, this isn't.
Oh, shoot, yeah, no, I mean, honestly, I I thripped it most
of my clothes, right? Like, you know, you get like a

(40:54):
shirt for a dollar. I mean, it's really.
Nice, So you had some money withyou?
No, that was just the money thatpeople.
That's the money people gave you?
Yeah, dude, what? Was there any days you didn't
eat? Because you didn't have if for
some reason people would like again, stop and give me like
lunches, they'd give me food. I got a couple.

(41:15):
I got a lot of sandwiches, mate.Man, like it was.
I really appreciate those people.
This is incredible. This is incredible.
And then did you document this with your phone or anything like
that? Is there like, did you turn it
into a documentary or anything? Like that, I mean, I have AI
have like a little post somewhere on like there's an old
website called Instructables, which is all about like do it

(41:38):
yourself stuff. And I, I can send that to you as
a link. But you know, I, I honestly, I
did a little bit of blogging, but my whole, my whole point was
like no phone, no phone, no music, no distractions.
It was like, I'm 100% in it. I have to do this 8 hours a day
and like just live with. My you weren't even listening to

(41:58):
anything. Nope, it was just me.
Dude this is insane Oh my God. What about your mom or siblings?
Were were they like what are youdoing?
Oh, my mom tried to bribe me. She was like, can you not do
this? Like I will give you money to
like backpack Europe or something, like more

(42:18):
conventional, right. And she kept, she kept doing it
in the first couple months. So he's like, I'll get you a bus
ticket and, and you can come home.
I was like, no, I, you know, I, I've come to the point where
I've hit rock bottom or, or veryclose to it and I was like, if I
don't do this, like. Were you going through some?
Were you going? I mean, I know your dad's
passing, but like, were you going through something?

(42:41):
And you don't have to get into. Whatever.
No, I mean no, of course no, I mean I, I, I think for me it was
this, this idea of like, you know, I, I was a great student,
you know, my parents always wanted to be a doctor.
I was like, no, I'm not going tobe a doctor.
I'm going to forge my own path. And that path was more about
like, like APHD in chemistry, which I, I ended up like

(43:02):
dropping out of, by the way. There's a whole other story
there. But the idea there was, I felt,
I felt confined by the idea thatwhat was really important was
like getting a job, getting married, you know, and like
going through the whole motion because I felt like there was,
it was like a story being given to me of like, this is how

(43:23):
you're supposed to live. And so when my dad died, I was,
I was really, I ended up, so I ended up going to Burning Man
twice, OK, You know, before he died and after he died.
And those two experiences taughtme like there's a lot more going
on in the world and it's, you got to disconnect from it,
right? That's the thing.
Like we're, we're so plugged in into like the stories and the

(43:46):
voices and the ideas that, you know, whether it's like you
said, geopolitical or economic and it's, it's, it's too, it's
too, it's to make you afraid. Like I, I realized this, I lived
in fear, whether that was like true fear of like death or it
was, it was like a, or a simulated fear like, oh, I'm
going to lose all my money if I'm not good enough or, you

(44:08):
know, the economy is shit. So like nothing can, can work
out. And I, and I told myself like
there's, there's got to be a wayto break out of that.
And, and, and that, that to me was like the first step,
ironically, right? Like it was just like, you know
what, F it, I'm going to walk, I'm going to see.
And in my head I was like, my God, a people are genuinely

(44:29):
good. That's amazing.
Generally good like that was what I took out.
Of that's I mean to to get the the win of humanity is generally
good. That's incredible.
That's incredible. So when you got to New Orleans,
you didn't walk back, did you? You ended.
Up No I I'd saved enough to get a flight back.

(44:52):
This is amazing. Freaking why.
Did not know Forrest Gump was coming on the podcast today.
This is incredible. Wow, what a what a We took a
left at Albuquerque, pun intended there.
Exactly. Let me ask you this.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We've gone in a different
direction, but I love it. I'm going to bring it back to
food in a second. But like have you ever tried

(45:13):
like ayahuasca or some of those syllabon something like
mushrooms? Syllabi.
Psilocybin. Yeah, definitely.
Yeah. So I'm sure, like if I say it's
on the podcast, I'm sure you'll be fine.
But you know, I, when I was living in Washington, I, I
learned how to grow them. But I, I did take LSD while I

(45:34):
was at Burning Man that sort of helped catalyze that be able to,
you know, approach that walk from, you know, from a more
courageous. What?
What? You know, obviously I've heard
LSD. I don't even know what that
really is. Is it a what?
Isn't it a? Powder, dude, it's like nothing.
It's so little. Like they literally have to
like, put it on a stamp in orderto like, actually measure it out

(45:57):
because it's like micrograms. Micrograms are enough to cause
hallucination. Yeah.
So yeah, I mean, I, so you, I can tell you.
You did LSD, a Burning Man, OK? There was obviously so many
visual stimulations at Burning Man from what I've never been.
I mean, what was, what did you feel?
So the craziest thing, and I, I was not anticipating this

(46:18):
because it was like it was in the middle of like some rave
party, but I, I was like, you know what, I'm just going to sit
here and meditate. And the craziest thing was like
under the influence, I could visualize a perfect Buddhist
mandala. I don't know if you've seen
those. They're like extremely complex
and there's a lot of detail and they look like, they look like
fortresses basically. And I, I was able to like see it

(46:41):
completely and I was like, how the hell is this happening?
So I was playing around with different like, and it was, it
was weird. Like you get this feeling of
like time changing or reversing.That's like a really strange
phenomenon. Definitely there's a lot of
visuals, but I think they're more like distractions.
I realized like the voice in my head wasn't me.
I think that was the biggest take away.
It was like, because you can like people outside of you or

(47:04):
things outside of you can influence that voice.
Like I realized like if you're really afraid or if like you're
watching TV or something like that, it gets in there.
And I was like, I'm just the onethat's listening to all that
like, and I was like, and I havecontrol.
I I can actually. But you could hear that voice
talking to you when you took theLSD.
Yeah. And I, I separated from it.

(47:26):
I was like, interesting. That's not me.
Yeah, that's actually, that's actually like, that's just like
brain chemistry. Like I'm actually the one that's
listening to it and the one that's seeing everything and,
and watching everything occur. And I was like, oh, and I can, I
can respond not reactively, but I can proactively say like this
is how I want to approach every moment.

(47:48):
Got it, got it. Interesting.
What were you just sitting down or like when you're on LSD?
D What's that protocol? You know, everyone's got their
own way of doing it, right? And I think I don't, I for me,
it was very spontaneous to just like settle down even in the
chaos of like, you know, techno music and raves and all sorts of
things like, and hot girls everywhere, like barely clothed,

(48:11):
right. And it was like, I was like,
that's, that's just distraction.Like that's just like, that's
just like the lights in the mirror.
Like what's real and true is like whatever's happening right
here. And I was, and I think that
helped me kind of make that, well, we'll go back to food,
right? And make that connection to food
was like, I can feel what the hell is going on here.
And as so long as I'm not distracted by the world of like

(48:35):
pornography or women or, you know, television or whatever it
is, I can, I can pay attention. And then the message is there.
It's always telling you like, what's good, you know?
And was that a spontaneous decision to do that on the spot?
Or did you go to Burning Man? Thinking I'm going to try LSD.
No, I think there was there was an opportunity.

(48:57):
And yeah, it's, you know, I can tell you is my.
I realized my life is kind of all over the place.
I love it when I was. Yeah.
Real dude, This is real talk man.
I. Please, real talk, real talk.
So when I was, yeah. So when I was a kid in high
school, I was one of those nerds, right?
And I did science fairs and thatsort of thing.
And I did science camp. And one of the science camps,

(49:19):
they gave me the opportunity to meet a bunch of these Nobel
laureates at this dinner, this, like, big fancy dinner.
And one of them was like, I can't, I can barely remember his
name right now, but he invented a way to make DNA basically to
clone it, to clone the day, right?
He was the guy, He was the guy who invented it.
And the, his story was that he dropped LSD one day while he was

(49:43):
like driving home. And he was like, holy shit,
that's how you do it. Like he put all the pieces
together because they, they've been trying to figure this out
for decades. And he was like, Oh yeah, just
do this, this and this. And we just got to find that.
And I, I thought that was so fat.
And I ended up meeting him there.
And I was like, holy shit, like,and you know what my project was

(50:04):
on LSDI was I, I, I was, I was presenting, I had this whole
freaking this fucking molecule, this giant molecule I built and
like this model of LSD and like it, it, it's like carved
something in my brain. I was like, I, there's something
important for me to hear about this thing, you know, 'cause
there's just too many weird coincidences.

(50:26):
And that's the thing like that. A lot of my life has been just
these coincidences because like,I meet this one person and then
I have to do this one thing and then all of a sudden everything
shows up as if it's supposed to.That is incredible, man.
That is. Wow, OK is crazy.
I love it all right, but the butthe ayahuasca or or suicide.

(50:46):
I mean, I have friends that keeptrying to get me to do that
stuff and especially me. You know, I don't know how much
of deep shallow dive you've consumed, but you know, I, I get
into a lot of things and gosh, this is going to be like episode
360 something. So I've talked about a lot of
things and I'm super open about absorbing new experiences.

(51:09):
And so I do have two friends in particular who are like, you
will get so much out of doing these.
They're they're big. One's big on ayahuasca, one's
big on the, the mushroom psilocybin.
I guess I don't know man, I'm such a chicken shit about stuff,
I'm like. I'll tell you what, as a
scientist, right, Like, as a scientist, if you're going to do

(51:31):
any of those three, yeah, between ayahuasca, LSD and
psilocybin, I recommend psilocybin only because it has
been part of our, like, ancient history, 1-2.
It's a lot easier to dose. Like ayahuasca is like all or
nothing. Like you got to like knock it
out of the ballpark or you're going to be sick for for weeks.
Yeah, yeah. And.

(51:51):
Then LSD is like you can't turn it off like you're in it for 8
hours and if you get a bad trip,you're stuck.
It's it feels like hell, right? You don't want to do that.
You don't want to do that. OK, so Simon, two hours tops.
You can control it. You can, you can micro dose and
just get like I would say start with micro dosing because to me
like that gives you some idea oflike, oh, like things are a

(52:15):
little more malleable than you think, but it doesn't blow you
out of the water. You're like, holy shit, I got to
face death now. Like it's at my doorstep because
like, you know, like, you know, until you're ready for that,
like that's, that's like kind ofinsane.
Brian, this is awesome. Oh my God, talk about a freaking
curveball I love. Left and then left.

(52:36):
Yeah, exactly. All right, let me.
All right, let's get back into the two more things.
What are your thoughts? This is so funny.
I'm gonna jump from this to whatare your thoughts on, like, beef
jerky and cured meats? Talk about a topic.
Change. Talk about change.
I think I'm the first podcaster to go from LSD to beef jerky and

(52:59):
cured meats. Yeah, and it all makes sense.
It's under the theme. I would say, you know, there's a
really tricky, because I'd say those, those nitrates and
nitrites really do mess things up.
I I, I mean, I think everyone goes both ways.
Like it's the same thing with those the, the sodium benzoate,
right? Like, OK, we've got to have them

(53:20):
so that the meat doesn't like give you Botulism.
Like that's horrible. We don't want want to kill kids.
Like, yeah, of course. Like I, I think that's bottom
line. That's what I think is the the
perspective in the food industryand especially food scientists.
Like, we don't want to kill anyone, OK.
Yeah, Yeah. But is that actually something
that is going to serve us long term?

(53:41):
I got you. Into adulthood.
I got you. Into old age, right.
OK. And I don't think so.
I don't. Think so.
So are are a lot of food scientists like maybe torn
internally because they get intoit thinking I'm going to create
these wonderful things that are going to improve humanity.
And then fundamentally, you start working for a monster

(54:03):
company and and and your whole goal is to drive six cents out
of the the price of the beef jerky.
Yeah, God, man, that's probably tough, right?
It's, it's pretty, it's pretty bleak.
I mean, for me, I, I think I'm trying to carve a different path
in the industry, right? And it's, it's really hard,
like, I mean, there's a lot of systems against you.

(54:23):
And so I, I, I see my colleagues, you know, brilliant
people and they, they are, they really give a shit.
Like, I mean, these are not people who didn't, you don't go
through 10 years. Like, if I didn't give a shit, I
would go and be, you know, you know, stockbroker and I would
make my millions and probably like burn myself out to death,
right? Like I can do that.

(54:44):
I could probably do that. I have the IQ for it, but I
don't want to do that. Like I want to have meeting.
I want to provide meeting. And so for me, I think cut the
bottom line ends up being like, where are all the jobs?
And the only people who can provide jobs are the ones that
know how to cut the bottom line.Yeah.
I mean, so, so tell us your business, your food, food
consultant, food scientist, consulting business, like give

(55:07):
us an average client like who hires you and then what do they
hire you for? Yeah, so, I mean, I, I, my whole
thing has always been about, youknow, making healthy food like I
and, and at least within the parameters that we can in our
American food system, do our best.
And so a lot of the clients thatI see, we do a lot of beverages,

(55:28):
like functional beverages, supplements, and we'll do a lot
of a lot of it's just like tweaking flavors, right?
Like there's foods that already exist, you know, things with
like mushroom powder or noatropics, you know, and they
just taste like garbage. So we got to figure out a way
to, you know, make it palatable because people don't, I mean, at
the end of the day. And this is like survey after

(55:50):
survey after survey. Hey, they, they buy things for
taste and flavor. Yeah, right.
For for better or worse. My all right, fine.
I can at least like, hide, like decent things underneath, you
know, protein bars, like you're mentioning protein shakes.
We'll do a lot of that. And, you know, it's, it's,
again, you kind of know how the sausage is made on the back end.
And yeah, it's hard. It's, it's really hard to, to

(56:14):
make a difference in impact. I think there's a lot of spin.
There's a lot of marketing, a lot of very powerful forces.
Absolutely, Absolutely. Getting hired by startups or mid
sized companies or bigger companies, Who's kind of the
bread and butter for you? Yeah, definitely startups.
You know, I, I've had a few big companies, but like they've got

(56:34):
a line like I'm not here to workfor PepsiCo or.
Yeah, OK, got it, Got. It or or, you know, Taco Bell,
like, you know, and I'm sure I'msure if I gave it my full shot,
I could probably win some clientwork that way.
But I mean, again, like, I've got to live with myself.
Yeah. And it's, it's really hard to
think like if I'm making food that I wouldn't eat myself.

(56:56):
That's a problem, right? To me The the the the the where
where all of the all of the the Venn diagram.
By the way, just so people heardthat properly, but Brian said if
I'm making food that I wouldn't eat myself, that's a problem.
I love that dude. I love I I love the integrity in
that statement. That's that's amazing.

(57:16):
That's amazing. Oh man, what a doozy of that
episode. This one's fantastic.
Listen, man, I really, I, I, I first of all, I, I just, I
appreciate your, your authentic nature in general, but just even
opening up about all of that, I honestly, obviously I didn't
know any of that and wasn't expecting any of that.

(57:37):
But you know what, man, you brought a, you brought such a
real component to this conversation that I hope, I hope
your, your credibility was already there.
But with me, it's cemented even more because of just how real
you were about the stuff. We didn't even intend to talk
so. Anyway, I have to say I

(57:59):
appreciate Ray. I mean, I I don't necessarily do
this for anyone, right? Like for me, it's like,
obviously you get it and you youappreciate it and I take this
towel like me saying it like impacts makes.
It absolutely, Matt, absolutely.And you know what I mean.
I lost my dad 10 years ago. So anyone that wants to talk
anything related to losing a parent, especially a father,

(58:22):
that's that's what we've both gone through.
I'm all for that 24/7. Here's what here's what we'll
do. I am feeling I'm gonna get a
bunch of questions help, probably LSD related questions
but also maybe some food relatedquestions.
Maybe. You're you're a legend, dude.
You're awesome. I want to already.
I want to already, I want to have you back on.

(58:44):
And I actually have a bunch of other.
I'm going through a process where I'm really trying to like,
again, help people make sense oftheir food intake, their
geopolitical intake, their everything intake.
So if you're up for it, I'll gather questions.
I'll put some questions on my own and then maybe we'll do a
secondary episode and kind of really dive into some specifics.

(59:07):
Yeah, definitely. You know, it's funny, like it
really got into my my dad actually, I just lost my mom
last year and I'm actually go, dude, I'm going to Breaman again
this year. I haven't been in 14 years.
So whatever you we do next episode, we can definitely we
can speak to that. Well, then you know what?
We'll do an episode when you getback from Burning Man so you can

(59:29):
give us your thoughts on LSD Part 2 that you're probably
going to. Oh, man.
All right, listen, dude, you andI are friends, man.
You and I are friends. I appreciate it.
All right, everybody, I hope youguys enjoyed really 2 episodes
in one and I'll put all of Brian's information in in

(59:49):
obviously the show notes. If anybody needs consulting
work, actually, I'm going to talk to you a little bit.
I've got this liquid vitamin business that I need to reboot
and I'm going to talk to you on that.
But anyway, man, I really appreciate it.
Call spade a spade and thank you, Brian.
Thank you, Ray. Super fun.
It was a pleasure. Yeah.
All right, buddy, hang on the line a second.

(01:00:10):
All right, everybody, we'll talkto you soon.
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EP#371 | GUEST | What’s Really in Your Food? A Food Scientist Exposes the Truth with Dr. Bryan Quoc Le

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}EP#371 | GUEST | What’s Really in Your Food? A Food Scientist Exposes the Truth with Dr. Bryan Quoc Le