April 22, 2025 • 53 mins
By Grabthar’s hammer, you shall be avenged!
The 1999 film Galaxy Quest was almost tailor made for the Guy sisters and their dad–all lifelong Trekkers. The sci-fi satire pokes gentle fun at Star Trek, lightly skewering everything from the story tropes to the actors to the fans, all while offering a lovely tribute to folks who get really enthusiastic about their favorite media. The film also does one of our favorite things: it takes the craft of sci-fi storytelling seriously without taking itself seriously. But as Tracie points out in her analysis, the rosy depiction of fandom in Galaxy Quest is partially a product of its time, since gatekeeping, cruelty, and vitriol have become synonymous with fandom in the intervening years.
Never give up; never surrender–and take a listen!
This episode was edited by Resonate Recordings.
Our theme music is "Professor Umlaut" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
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We are Tracie Guy-Decker and Emily Guy Birken, known to our family as the Guy Girls.
We have super-serious day jobs. For the bona fides, visit our individual websites: tracieguydecker.com and emilyguybirken.com
We're hella smart and completely unashamed of our overthinking prowess. We love movies and tv, science fiction, comedy, and murder mysteries, good storytelling with lots of dramatic irony, and analyzing pop culture for gender dynamics, psychology, sociology, and whatever else we find.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I want to talk about the way that this movie portrays
and thinks about, and themessages it conveys about,
fandom.
I think a lot of these spoofmovies end up sort of shitting
on fans, and this doesn't at all.
It's very gentle andappreciative of fans and I
really I like that.
Have you ever had something youlove dismissed because it's
(00:20):
just pop culture, what othersmight deem stupid shit?
You know matters.
You know what's worth talkingand thinking about, and so do we
.
So come overthink with us as wedelve into our deep thoughts
about stupid shit.
I'm Tracy Guy-Decker and you'relistening to Deep Thoughts
(00:40):
About Stupid Shit, because popculture is still culture, and
shouldn't?
You know what's in your head?
On today's episode, I'll besharing my deep thoughts about
the 1999 film Galaxy Quest withmy sister, emily Guy-Burken, and
with you.
Let's dive in.
Okay, I know you've seen this.
I think maybe we've seen ittogether.
Tell me what's in your headabout Galaxy Quest.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I think I remember it pretty well.
So the things that I like stickin my head are I think it's
Justin Long who's the fan who istrying to and his mom's like no
, you have to take the trash outnow.
Yeah, so that moment, like, wasjust so delightful.
And then there's a point where,like they're, I'm like well,
(01:25):
how can you tell how old theyare?
Yeah, no.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
The actual line it says oh, could they be the
minors?
And Tony Shalhoub's charactergoes yeah, they're only three
years old.
And Alan Rickman's charactergoes minors, not minors.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
And then Alan Rickman , just being a delight to like.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Where are you?
Speaker 2 (01:47):
going To see if there's a pub.
And then also there's a pointwhere Tim Allen's character's
shirt gets torn off and AlanRickman's character's just like
oh yeah, of course, now he'sshirtless, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
So like these little jokes arewhat I remember from it.
(02:08):
I remember it feeling seen bythis movie in that like we were
never super fans of Star Trekgrowing up, but we grew up with
it.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
We were fans, though.
I mean, dad took us to aconvention, do you remember?
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Yeah, I remember.
So it felt like this movie wasfor us in a lot of ways, because
it was not only, like you know,fans are actually pretty cool
because like that Justin Longcharacter is how they're able to
survive but it also winked atlike how ridiculous this thing
(02:47):
that we love is.
And we love it anyway, and Ijust remember dad being tickled
by it Particularly, we'rerecording this on the 12th
anniversary of when we lost dad,so like it feels appropriate
that we're talking about ittoday, because I just remember
(03:08):
dad giggling, like when dad wasreally, really amused by
something.
His laugh was just soinfectious, yeah, yeah.
So tell me, why are we talkingabout it?
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Yeah Well, all the things you just said.
I think we're talking about itnow in part because I recently
saw a fan or a listener whocommented on our Apple podcast
site and said I wonder if thehosts would ever tackle Star
Trek.
And we see you, listener.
(03:40):
Thank you for the suggestionand also I am totally
intimidated by tackling StarTrek.
It's just so so big and so muchink has been spilled talking
about it and so many iterationsand versions of it that it feels
too big, certainly for a singleepisode, and so looking at
(04:03):
Galaxy Quest, which was lookingat Star Trek, felt like a way to
sort of move in that directionin a chunk.
I could handle a little bit.
So that's kind of why it cameto the top of the list right now
, and some of the things I wantto talk about you've already
sort of started pointing to.
I want to talk about the waythat this movie portrays and
(04:23):
thinks about and the messages itconveys about fandom.
I think a lot of these spoofmovies end up sort of shitting
on fans and this doesn't at all.
It's very gentle andappreciative of fans and I
really I like that.
I like that.
That's kind of what you werenaming about sort of feeling
seen.
So I want to talk about that.
I want to talk about the metastorytelling, the way that it's
(04:44):
commenting on Star Trek and itdoes that in so so many ways,
and not just Star Trek, other TVscience fiction shows that get
a lot of you know, that sort ofdedicated fan base, but I think
Star Trek in particular, and itdoes that sort of meta
conversation in a lot of ways.
I think a similar actual filmmight be Scream.
(05:06):
In terms of the metaconversation I need to do Scream
at some point.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I would like for you to do that.
But the way that it sort ofexplicitly names some of the
tropes and therefore sort ofcritiques but also comments on,
but then also uses, I think, orsubverts in some way, I think is
really really interesting.
It does it through casting, itdoes it through dialogue, it
does it through plot devices.
(05:31):
So I want to sort of tacklethat a little bit or point to it
.
It also looks at gender a bitin the film, in the meta
conversation about what washappening in Star Trek, and so I
want to talk about gender, aswe often do, and in casting,
like casting Sigourney Weaver asthe only real female character
of any.
Well, there's a Thermion, butanyway.
(05:53):
And then finally I want to talkabout sort of the power of story
in our lives, because I thinkthere's a powerful lesson about
that through Alan Rickman'scharacter and his interaction
with one of the aliens, but justin general.
So those are kind of thebuckets that I'll get to in our
conversation.
Before we get there, let meremind you and our listeners of
(06:15):
the basic plot.
I'm going to keep it relatively.
I know I say this every time,but I think I actually can.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
I've heard that before.
I've been burned by you before.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
I'm going to sketch it out briefly.
So we meet the cast of this nowoff the air TV show called
Galaxy Quest.
They're at a convention andmost of the cast are backstage
waiting to come on to beintroduced.
They're waiting for JasonNesbitt, who is played by Tim
(06:49):
Allen.
He played the commander, so theCaptain Kirk equivalent, whose
name was the Galaxy Questcharacter's name is Peter Quincy
Taggart.
The actor's name is JasonNesbitt, played by Tim Allen.
They're waiting for him to showup.
So the cast is Gwen waiting forhim to show up.
So the cast is Gwen, who isplayed by Sigourney Weaver, Gwen
(07:12):
DeMarco.
There's Sir Alexander Dayne,played by Alan Rickman, who
plays the sort of Spockcharacter with like alien head
makeup Think like NextGeneration Star Trek kind of.
There's Tony Shalhoub who playsFred Kwan, who was the tech
sergeant, and then Tommy Weber,who played Laredo, who was a
child protege pilot in theoriginal show.
(07:33):
Now he's a grown up, he's theWesley Crusher.
He's the Wesley Crusher, Right,but a black guy.
Which Star Trek?
I guess we had that withNichelle Nichols in the original
.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
In the original.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
Well, and then we had Geordi LaForge Right.
Yes, thank you for reminding meof LeVar.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Burton, levar Burton.
Thank you, I couldn't think ofthe actor's name.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Yeah, so they're all being introduced by a guy, guy
Fliegman, played by Sam Rockwell, who actually turns out had
been like an extra on oneepisode, but he was the one
introducing them.
He was the red shirt, like theone who died.
Yeah, but he was introducingthem at the convention.
Jason finally shows up, timAllen character finally shows up
(08:15):
and he just kind of likewaltzes in and they get
introduced and we see them.
So we see things.
They know each other reallywell.
So Alan Rickman's character ishaving a panic attack and Tim
Allen's character is like am Itoo late for Alex's panic attack
?
And nope, still happened Anyway.
So it's clear they've beendoing this for a while.
They go from appearance toappearance and Jason, tim
(08:36):
Allen's character, just eats itup.
He believes all of the stuffand we see the movie makers show
us that he's really grooving onit.
He has all of the stuff and wesee, like the movie makers show
us that he's like reallygrooving on it, like he has a
really big ego as a result ofthe way the fans kind of gush
over him.
So we see them at theconvention.
Jason overhears in the bathroomsome guys kind of making fun of
(08:57):
him and noting how he just hasno idea that his friends can't
stand him.
And so then he gets real shortwith some fans, specifically
actually Justin Long's Brandon,who like wants to ask very
technical questions, like inepisode 51, the blah, blah, blah
, blah, blah.
Like he wants to like an answerbecause there's some like
continuity problem in thescience, that he wants to ask
(09:20):
Jason, who is very short withhim and is like look, kid, it's
just a TV show, so fast forward.
Jason's hungover and these guysshow up who act real weird.
They're wearing uniforms andthey talk real funny.
Enrico Colantoni plays Mathisar.
(09:42):
He's the leader and he sort ofsays like your help is
desperately needed.
And he introduces himself weare Thermians from the whatever
sector Like he names the placein space that they're from and
Jason thinks it's a like a gigthat he agreed to and it turns
out they're actually aliens.
(10:02):
So, all hungover, jason like ison the bridge of this actual
ship that's based on the showand he like is supposed to be
negotiating a peace with thisbad guy, saris, and instead he's
like throw all the weapons athim and then he like leaves when
they send him home.
They send him home on theequivalent of the like
(10:23):
transporter, but it's not.
It doesn't look like it did inthe original Star Trek.
It actually like is this likegoo that like envelops him and
then shoots him through space.
So he lands back at his homeand he's like shaking.
So he goes to find hiscastmates and is like it's real,
it's real, you know, you guysgot to come with me.
And anyway they spurn him.
(10:45):
And then they're like maybe weshould just take the gig.
And one of them is like wait,do you think this was a gig?
Like there's money.
And so then they go with himbecause the Thermians have come
back to say Sarah survived andwe need your help.
So they're like you're nottaking this gig without us.
So they all go and now thereare these actors on this actual
(11:06):
spaceship and they're fighting areal bad guy.
The Thermians have beenreceiving our television
transmissions, which they haveno concept of pretend or lying,
and so they receive them asquote-unquote historical
documents.
We learned that their societywas in disarray, but they've
(11:30):
remade their entire societybased on the model of galaxy
quest.
And the actors are like surelyyou have theater on your planet?
Like I mean, surely you don'tthink gilligan's island is
documents?
And all of the Thermians likeget this sad face.
And they're like those poorpeople it's just such a great
gag.
(11:50):
And like the person throughwhom Thormians have learned what
lying is and they like areterrible at the things that
(12:11):
their characters would haveexcelled at, and so that's like
humbling and also interestingfor them.
Meanwhile there's this metaconversation going on about the
old show.
So Sigourney Weaver, hercharacter Gwen, was like and I
think this is a bit of a commenton Nichelle Nichols' character
(12:31):
a little bit where, like, herjob was to talk to the computer
and to repeat what the computersaid, like.
So at one point even one of theother ones I think it's Tommy,
the Wesley Crusher equivalent,says you know, that's getting
really annoying, and she's likeI have one job on this ship, one
and I'm going to do it.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
And she also like, has like a push-up bra and is
like boobs.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Well, right, yes, so her uniform, like they all zip
up the center and hers in theoriginal, was always like the
zipper was not up to her neck,it was down a little bit to show
off a little decolletage.
And then in the course of themovie we're watching, it gets
like her uniform gets likeripped and the zipper comes down
(13:17):
and so we're seeing like bigportions of her bra.
That's the same maroon as partof the uniform.
So, yes, there's a lot of boobwhich is in the movie we're
watching.
Yeah, as much as it is in likethe original TV show.
So when they realize like howbad this is, at one point they
(13:38):
had run away at like full turbo,which is not designed to do
that, and they broke the shipand so they need to go find a
new beryllium sphere which islike the power source.
That's how they end up on thatplanet with the miners who are
not miners, and therein lies alot of the sort of commentary
(13:58):
and meta.
So, guy, who's the was an extraand just was like happy to be a
part of the show now isterrified, he's gonna die
because he's like he's the redshirt.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
and so, like the shuttle lands on this ship and
Tony Shalhoub's character goesto open the door and Guy is like
what are you doing?
Is there even air?
You don't know.
And then he takes a deep breathand holds his breath and Tony
Shalhoub's character is likeseems okay.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Tony Shalhoub is a delight.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
He is so great in this film.
He's so great in this film sothey get this fear.
There's a lot of commentarythat like points to like guys,
like did you guys even watch theshow?
Like we can't do that, we can'tjust go talk to these aliens.
So they get this fear, they getit all set up and then the bad
(14:56):
guys.
This is all out of order, butat some point the bad guys are
on the ship.
We see interactions.
We see lots of interactionswhere we learn about the
Thermian society and the waysthat these aliens have
interacted with the historicaldocuments I'm putting quotes
around that and the characters.
There's one character from thealiens, quelek is his name, and
(15:24):
he idolized Alan Rickman'scharacter and Alan Rickman we
have seen, hates that.
This is what he's known for.
He hates having been typecast.
He has a Shakespearean trainingand he hates that he's been
typecast as this alien.
And there's this line that thecharacter always said by
Grapthar's hammer, you shall beavenged.
And he's like.
We see him at the verybeginning saying I will not say
the line and at one point Quelekstarts to say it to him and
(15:48):
he's like stop, don't, justdon't.
And you can see that Quilek islike so hurt by that, like I'm
so sorry I won't whatever Quileksays to him at one point I hope
this isn't too far, but I'vealways thought of you as a
father, because I didn't haveone and Quilek ends up getting
shot and he's dying and Alexsays the line to him in all
(16:14):
sincerity and you see thecharacter, the actor I don't
know who played Quelek, but Iguess I can look it up.
Patrick Breen plays Quelek andyou can see him being comforted
by having his idol say thisfamous line to him as he's dying
, like famous line to him ashe's dying.
(16:36):
And then alex actually like isso pissed off and like wants to
avenge this young person, thisyoung alien that he actually
like starts attacking the, thebad guys, and like kills a bunch
of them.
So they managed to get throughthis because j accidentally
swapped communicators withBrandon, who is a teenaged fan
(16:58):
who is very into it, and soBrandon and his friends there
are three or four others all geton the line and they're like
helping Jason and Gwen movethrough the ship, based on their
understanding of this fictionalship.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
There's that point where there's like the chopping
thing.
The chompers they call themyeah yeah, and I remember
Sigourney Weaver going you'vegot to be kidding me, yeah yeah,
why is this?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
even here, and at one point, when they get through
that bit, it's like these bighammers that are just like
crushing in alternate directionsthat they have to sort of work
their way through.
And when they get to the end,there's this flame that spurts
up and she's like whoever wrotethis episode should be killed,
or something like that.
So Brandon and his friends helpGwen and Jason, like do all
(17:47):
that we learn about the Omega 13, which nobody really knows what
it is, because the writersnever actually said Brandonon.
Some people think it's a hugebomb that will totally destroy
the entire universe.
Brandon and his friends thinkit's actually a matter
rearranger.
That will give you a 13 second.
Like jump you back 13 secondsinto the past.
The very end they managed tothrough through skill, like
(18:12):
Tommy has been practicing bywatching the old episodes to see
how to work the navigation.
They managed to actually beatSaris the bad guy and blow up
his ship, but at the last minutehe actually transported or
whatever onto their ship.
Saris did, saris did.
(18:33):
They're all celebrating thatthey've won.
They're going to go home.
They actually have set a coursefor Earth.
And then Tony Shalhoub'scharacter, fred, comes in onto
the bridge and he startsshooting everybody.
And then he like hits a buttonand it's actually Saris, having
used some sort of cloaking thing.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
So Mathisar and Jason activate the omega 13, go back
as far as the, the captain, theleader of the thermians.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Okay, they go back 13 seconds and jason's able to
prevent saris successfully, likeshooting everybody.
Then they crash the thermionseparate with like a little
shuttle and the ship crash,lands into the convention.
And then they all step out ontothe stage like there's a dude
(19:24):
who just like opportunistically,like picks up the microphone
and introduces them as they comeout, mm-hmm, and saris has
survived.
He comes out and jason happensto have a ray gun and shoots him
and he like explodes and thefans just go wild and we see
gwen and jason kiss and like yay, everything's great and one of
(19:44):
the thermians.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Yes, because I remember sam rockwell, because
when they start kissing and thenlike tentacles are coming out
and he's like, oh, oh, no,that's not okay.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Yeah, that happened a little earlier, when Tony
Shalhoub, when, um, thatcharacter, fred is able, he
doesn't think he can do whatneeds to be done and he does it.
And and this female Thermionher name is Lalani or something,
I'm probably saying Laliari,laliari, played by missy pile.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
She, yeah, she, she's into it I guess, and then she
goes with him and stays on earth, she goes with him and then.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
So the last two like two minutes of the film galaxy
quest is being brought back fornew adventures with all of them,
including guy, who is now thelike chief security officer or
something which, by the way,when everybody was being shot in
the first version before the 13second backup, guy was the only
one who didn't get shot it's areverse red shirt yeah, so we
(20:42):
see that the the show has beenrevived and now includes Guy,
and Laliari is there?
she's, that's the character'stheme played by Jane Doe, so
that's it.
Okay, it wasn't, it's never,it's never.
Anyway, that's the basic plot.
Mixed in there is all of thiscommentary about, like we said
(21:03):
along the way, you know,sigourney Weaver's character
saying like whoever wrote thisshould be shot.
It doesn't make any sense and,as you noted when, when you were
remembering, there's one pointwhere jason is like fighting
this rock monster and ends upwith his shirt off, and so alex
says to him of course youmanaged to get your shirt off,
and I don't remember what thecontext is, but gwen says to
(21:26):
jason, like that's rich, comingfrom someone who slept with
every cerulean slave girl thatever you know or whatever you
know.
So there's a lot of commentaryon some of the things that
people talk about about startrek, including in yeah,
including the like, the ideathat william shatner has an ego,
because it's it's like what'sinteresting.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
It's not just about the show, or even just the show
and the fans, it's also likewhat we know about the actors.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Yeah, yeah.
So all of that is really,really interesting.
So in talking about that metapiece, I want to talk about some
of the choices that ourfilmmakers made, right?
So I think in the writing theycomment on the tropes that we
saw in the show and then theysubvert them or they lean back
(22:12):
into them, and I think that'sreally interesting, like the
fact that Guy is the only onewho doesn't get shot, which
they've been talking the wholetime about.
The fact that we had expendablecrew members in Star Trek
episodes.
Like we knew, if there's a guywe never met before wearing a
red shirt, he's probably goingto die, right, like that was a
thing, that was a pattern thatwe knew and they talk about it
(22:34):
and then they subvert it, whichis really interesting.
And even the way the guy's likehave you even seen the show?
That reminds me of Scream,right, like, and things that
we've talked about before.
Actually, when we talk abouthorror, if you know what genre
you're in, you make differentchoices.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Yeah, in you make different choices.
Yeah, well, and also I feellike there's a little bit of
commentary on star trek, thenext generation and patrick
stewart who, like he wasshakespearean trained,
shakespearean trained, and hedid not think it would last.
So like, if I remembercorrectly, like he tried, he
didn't really get to know hiscastmates.
Everyone thought he was a dickthe first year and I think he
didn't even like get a long-termapartment or something Because
(23:12):
he didn't think it was going tolast.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
There's no way this will last, yeah, yeah, yeah.
There was also like the castingchoices, right?
So Sigourney Weaver, who wehave talked about in Alien, and
her role in Alien.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
And Ghostbusters.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
And Ghostbusters.
Yes, true, I think.
(23:53):
For me, alien, because it's setin space, feels the more
relevant echo with her casting,and there's something really
ripe for me about Weaver beingcast in this role versus her
role in Alien which was sono-nonsense and gritty and, as
we talked about, she was stillthe gorgeous woman that she is,
but was not hypersexualized notat all whereas this character is
self-consciouslyhypersexualized, like there's
commentary on it, and so I thinkthere's something really
interesting in that.
That doing that to and withsigourney weaver, who has this
(24:14):
anchor in science fiction in adifferent role, so like
reminding us that it is not bychoosing her part of the meta
commentary is that thehypersexualization of a female
character in space is notrequired, I think, even though
she is in this movie well, and Ifeel like there's also there's
(24:36):
an echo to like sigourney weaveris a really intimidating,
impressive person and she'sblonde in this, isn't she?
Speaker 2 (24:47):
yes, and like, always fully made up and like the
boobs, and I'm thinking aboutlike nails, like nails, yeah,
yeah.
She's very hyper feminine, hypersexualized, yeah, and I feel
like there's a commentary inthere also about the very
well-known story about NichelleNichols, after the first season
of Star Trek, wanted to quitbecause she felt like she was
(25:07):
being marginalized and tokenized, because she was Like she was
wearing they made her wear ashort skirt.
All she did was repeat thingsvery much like the Gwen
character in this, and it wasactually Martin Luther King who
convinced her to stay because hewas saying you don't know who
you are inspiring.
And so Nichelle Nichols wasalso a very intimidating and
(25:31):
impressive individual, like shewas so much more than this
pretty Black woman who actedlike a secretary Right In the
show.
And it kind of gets to thosedecisions that people from
marginalized communities have tomake when taking roles
(25:54):
marginalized communities have tomake when taking roles.
And we also know that WhoopiGoldberg was inspired by
Nichelle Nichols because shewent on to become Guinan on Star
Trek, the Next.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Generation.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Even though she's known as a comedian.
But she loved that there was aBlack woman on the bridge of the
Enterprise and she wanted thattoo.
So like it's.
It's so much like there's somuch in there yeah, it's very
ripe.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
It's very ripe.
Yeah, it definitely is.
I think it's also, when I thinkabout casting not just weaver
but the other like this wasreally an all-star cast at the
time in 99 and, like rockwell,was not yet an oscar but, he
goes on to win an Oscar and,like he does, a really great job
.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
She's a phenomenal actor In many ways.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Guy is, I don't know, sort of the heart, because it's
through him that we get a lotof the commentary on the show.
I mean it's also through Gwenand Jason.
But he actually will sort ofsay explicitly like this is how
it works in the show which iskind of.
It was a great choice, I think,in terms of storytelling to have
(26:58):
this guy who was a hanger on tocome along to then give us some
exposition but also some ofthat meta commentary, and
Rockwell's just a great actor,so that also really helped.
So, and Tim Allen was at theheight of his popularity in 1999
.
It was before he revealed whata nutjob he is, rickman is and
(27:18):
was and has been.
I mean, I think it was beforehe became Severus Snape, but he
was already sort of a well-knownface in Hollywood.
So, like, I think the castingwas really really powerfully
(27:39):
good and gave us those sort ofas you say, the actors are sort
of tropes, right, like Shaloob'sKwan.
Fred Kwan is like the only onewho, after the initial transport
, is not freaking out.
He's like whoa, that was athing.
He's just totally chill, thatwas a thing.
He's just totally chill andlike, like at one point he like
talks to the bridge he's like,because he's supposed to be like
scotty, like um, the theengineer, the chief engineer.
He's like so we could do thisthing, and what do you think?
(28:03):
And they're like yeah, let's dothat.
And he's like right again.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Come on, guys, group hug well, the the other thing is
like, because there's a pointwhere he's, when he's not sure
he can do like like thetransport or whatever it is, and
I think it's Alan Rickman, Idon't remember Someone's like
you always had your lines, youalways were so professional,
like you can do this.
And these fandoms, these peoplewho it's a gig but they take it
(28:28):
seriously, they take the craftseriously, but not themselves.
He is exactly that Right, right, and even though because you've
got the Alan Rickman characterwho thinks this is beneath him,
(28:50):
right, and then you've got theTim Allen character who thinks
this represents how excellent.
He is Like his merit His likeyou know he His worth, his worth
Because, like you know, he'sCaptain Jason Nesmith or
whatever.
No, he's Captain Peter.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Quincy Taggart, peter Quincy Taggart.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Yeah, and when it's just a show and like in between
them is the Tony Shalhoubcharacter who just recognizes
this is a gig.
But I am.
I'm going to give it my allbecause I was hired for this.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Right, right, yeah, yeah, I think that's right.
I think that's right.
That I feel like a little bitgives with one hand and takes
with the other is the way thatour movie talks about sort of
the treatment of romance andshipping in the original
backstory TV show, right, so atone point, like early, early on,
(29:47):
we see Jason sort of hit onGwen and she's like it was cute
when I didn't know you.
But then when they think they'regoing to die, he says Gwen,
I've always.
And then he doesn't say it andthen they don't die and she's
like what were you going to say?
And at the very like when theyget off the ship and Saris is
(30:09):
dead and they're on the stage atthe back at the convention, he
kisses her dramatically and shelikes it, she's into it and you
know the fans go wild and Ithink by having her spurn him in
the beginning, that feels likecommentary on the ways that you
(30:32):
know the RPF real people, people, fiction, kind of shipping that
people end up doing for actors,and even the shipping that we
do for characters, this sort oflike they're, it's convenient,
and so we sort of create aromance in our, in our mind,
whether or not it actually makessense for the characters, but
then they end up together, andso that's why it feels like give
(30:54):
with one hand and take with theother.
So I kind of wish if insteadthey had just sort of hugged and
it felt more platonic.
I think this movie would havebeen like chef's kiss almost
perfect.
That really, like on rewatch,bothers me.
The other thing, the otherthing about this, now that I am
(31:15):
a part of very active fandoms Idon't think that it would have
been the Gwen and Jason shipping.
I was just thinking that itwould have been Alex and Jason,
alex and Jason shipping.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I was just thinking that because, like, the slash
fiction comes from Kirk andSpock yes, exactly which?
And like, if you're not aware.
So slash fiction means when youpair two same-sex characters,
and the way they would do thatis because they would say it was
Spock slash Kirk or Kirk slashSpock, whereas if it was just
friendship they would do anampersand Kirk and Spock.
(31:52):
And so, like, the term slashcame to mean any, and so I
learned about the term slashwhen I was in the X-Files fandom
and there would be Mulder andSkinner, so it would be Mulder
slash Skinner, which I've never,I mean like Mitch Pelleggi, but
I didn't get it at the time.
Things change, I didn't get itat the time.
Things change.
Anyway, but you are right, andif they made it I don't know,
(32:17):
maybe not, but I feel like maybeif they made it now, there
would still be the hitting on,but you'd see, at least the fans
would be like I thought I saw alittle something between you
two.
Yeah, maybe, although my mostvivid memory about going to that
Star Trek convention, because Iwould have been what 10, 11?
You were about 13, 14?
(32:37):
.
Something like that.
Yeah, I was about then.
It was after the one with thewhales came out, the movie with
the whales which Four, Four, andthere was a woman asking it
because William Shatner wasthere, yeah, and he was taking
questions.
And a woman got up from theback like, and then came like
all the way to the front.
(32:57):
I remember her and he was like,oh whoa, and she was asking
about the romantic tensionbetween the 20th century woman
that is there in that film thatyou know it's Kirk's, you know,
lover of the day and, like I asa kid, remember being like, wow,
she's really intense about this.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
Yeah, I vaguely remember her, you know, it's
funny that you say if it weremade today, because one of the
things that I think about if itwere made today is, I think, now
.
One of the things I named was Ithink this film is very gentle
with fans Like Brandon, theteenage fan, and his friends
(33:40):
save the universe, basically,and they're basically good
people Like, I think, all of thefans.
We kind of get the sense thatthey're just, they're good
people who just really lovesomething.
Yeah, yeah, this film being madein 99, sort of at the very
early stages of, like, theinternet, where we were still
using AOL chat rooms fandom haschanged as a result of the
(34:03):
internet and social media andI'm not sure that one can tell a
story about fandoms and sort ofbe like yeah, they're just
basically good people who reallylove them.
Yeah that's true Even in thefandoms, of which we are a part.
There's some vitriol thatpeople direct at one another if
(34:25):
they disagree aboutinterpretations, foundations of
the show.
You know like they're decidedlylike camps and, as with any
politics where the stakes areactually quite low, the politics
are vicious, and that's a piecethat I think in some ways like
(34:46):
harkens back to a gentler time.
So I both appreciate that ourmovie makers of the movie Galaxy
Quest in 99 did not shit onfans.
I also think that they wereportraying a fandom that was
less susceptible to the kinds ofvitriol because it was less
(35:09):
connected, less interconnected,less immediately connected than
we are today with Tumblr andTwitter and all of the other
ways that we keep in touch withDiscord servers and whatnot.
The way that we keep in touchwith one another these days,
that ends up in such likevitriolic clicky kinds of
community Like, not even justinter-fandom.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Intra-fandom, int.
Inter-fandom in tra-fandom, intra-fandom.
Yeah, one thing that is comingup for me, though, is so I said,
like you know, we weren't superfans of star trek, but you know
why I said that?
Because I'm a girl, and so eventhen there was gatekeeping
about nerd culture Like, oh, youlike Star Trek.
Well, you know name blah, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah, like
(36:00):
you know, and in the way thatany woman who is interested in
something that is male coded, orneeds to credential herself,
needs to credential herself.
And the fact that Justin Long isare all his friends.
Boys, no, there's one girl.
There's one girl.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
She doesn't have a name, yeah, or I mean I'm sure
she has a name, but we don'tlearn it.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
So intra-fandom vitriol is also like we gets to
this realization that I've hadover the past few years that
every human community is amicrocosm of the human community
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Yeah, I think that that might be right.
Yeah, there was, you're right,there was absolutely gatekeeping
even in 99.
I think it didn't have the samekind of reach and scale because
of the ways in which ourcurrent interconnectedness
through the internet.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
You know, other than going to that convention, I had
no way of interacting with theStar Trek fandom.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Right, right, well especially when we were children
.
Children.
Speaker 2 (37:38):
Yes, but even as a like I was an X-Files fan, Like
I would have called myself anX-Files fan.
I did not interact with thefandom, in part because, like,
it just never occurred to me toget into fan fiction I just I
just didn't, I just didn't thinkabout it.
And so because and that's oftenthe entry point into fandom,
(37:59):
right, but you can't avoid it.
Now, you know, just being onsocial media, you are exposed to
fandom I mean, you could avoidit if you wanted to.
But okay, if you are someone wholikes, if you like a who likes,
if you like a show a lot, ifyou like a show.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, anyway, yeah.
So those are some interestingthings about.
So I think you're pointing outthe fact that there was
gatekeeping that is gendered andracialized.
I will note that this film doesnot pass the Bechdel test, so
the Bechdel test as a reminder,listeners is from Alison Bechdel
(38:34):
.
We ask ourselves threequestions Are there at least two
named female characters?
So they actually have names, dothey talk to one another?
And do they talk to one anotherabout something other than a
man or a boy?
And we do have two named femalecharacters, but they don't talk
to one another.
So there'swen, and then there'slalari, the thermion, who, who
(38:55):
ends up with fred, and theydon't talk to one another.
And what's interesting is thatlike there's a degree to which,
like that's the case, becausethat was the case with star trek
, but on the other hand, ourfilmmakers self-consciously,
intentionally, like broke a lotof those things but, gender was
not one of the ones that theyfelt the need to do.
(39:17):
And we see female fans at theconvention dressed like Gwen's
character.
She even poses for pictureswith them.
And they witness the exchangewhere she says I thought it was
cute when I didn't know you.
And then Jason looks at themand they all kind of giggle and
wave.
So it's still like they'restill doing the thing, even as
(39:39):
they watch their idol snub him,so, which in some ways feels
like an accurate portrayal ofthe way humans behave, and in
other ways I want more like so.
If I were to make a galaxyquest-esque movie today, I would
(40:00):
have a lot more femalecharacters and I would have them
like talk about this, likewhat's great and what's shitty
you know, so that's the thingthat I just I just wanted to
name, you know, especially sinceyou brought up the gate, the
gendered and and racializedpieces of the gatekeeping.
But the last thing that I I kindof pointed to, and then I'll
(40:22):
just I just want to sort ofspell out a little more that I
think that this film reallytakes seriously, is the power of
story to comfort and to createand build community like, and
the way that people cometogether on it, like, in some
ways this is a another story offound family, right?
(40:44):
I mean, so many movies that'swhat it's about, or at least
movies that you and I seem to bedrawn to.
That was one of dad's favoritethings and in some ways this is
another one of those.
Because they come togetheragain, this cast who knows each
other in some ways very well andlike kind of just tolerate each
other, but they really like,they work together toward common
cause, ie their own survival,and end up like, really like
(41:07):
coming to appreciate one anotheragain.
And it was the stories thatthey were telling that helped
them do that, this dying friendor acquaintance even.
(41:31):
But who idolized him and doingthat?
And you had, before we startedrecording, you had a related
anecdote that you wanted toshare about that.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
So that Hammer of Grapthor thing by Grapthor's
Hammer, whatever, reminded me ofsomething I remember seeing.
It's probably been 20 years ago.
Vh1 used to have the behind themusic TV show and often they
would go and look at like onehit wonders and so many one hit
wonders were like, resentful ofthe one hit because they're
serious musicians, they've beencreating art all this time and
people only, like they doconcerts and people only want to
(42:06):
hear the hits, that's all theycare about.
And if I remember correctly, itwas Biz Markie, who wrote you
Got what I Need, who said likeI'll play that all day long,
every day.
I made something that everybodyloves.
I made something that madepeople feel good.
I did that and so I'm going toplay that for them because
(42:28):
that's what they want to hear,even though he went on to make
lots of other music.
And I just so appreciated thatway of looking at it because I
can totally understand theresentment of like you know you
do something and it takes off,especially if it's a lot of
times these one-hit wonders werejust like they threw it
(42:48):
together in a week.
Our friend of the show, scottKenimore, talks about his first
book, the Zen of Zombie.
He wrote in like three weeksand it sold immediately, even
though the soulful, like all him, like kind of
semi-autobiographical stuff thathe poured his heart and soul
into nobody was interested inand there's something that hurts
about that.
But at the same time it's likerecognizing that you've done
(43:10):
something that resonates withother people.
Recognizing that you've donesomething that resonates with
some, with with other people,and what a gift and privilege
that is, even if it's not whatyou wanted.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
Recognizing that it's not necessarily about you as
the artist the way you said itbefore we started recording was
that there are some things thatare for you as the artist and
there are some things that arefor them your fans and that's a
moment that alex has as Quellickas dying.
It's not for Alex anymore, it'sfor Quellick.
And I think that reallyresonated when you said that.
(43:38):
That's why I'm lifting it backup.
I just was naming that, youknow.
I think that's something thatour filmmakers kind of are
recognizing about Star Trekright and sort of putting on
display for us about Star Trek,about the power of story and
storytelling to move us and tobring us together.
So, I think that's part of whyit feels so delightful to you
(44:02):
and me who care so much aboutstory and storytelling yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
I do want to.
Before you wrap up, there's oneother thing that I really
associate with this film, oneother thing that I really
associate with this film withour dad, which is I feel like I
had a conversation with dadabout how, even though the
Thermians appear very human-like, that the movie did a good job
in showing us something alien intheir complete inability to
(44:28):
understand deception or pretendor lying.
And I feel like we had aconversation, I don't know, but
about how such a smalldifference because it really
does feel like a smalldifference can make a huge
difference in how you interactwith the world and the way that
you do things.
And it reminded me of there'sone of the famous Next
(44:51):
Generation episodes, shaka, whenthe Walls Fell.
I don't think that's what theepisode's called, but there's a
race.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
That's the phrase that he keeps.
They only speak in metaphor.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
They speak in metaphor, and I remember talking
to dad about that and we werelike, how do you have scientific
discoveries if you speak inmetaphor?
And I remember talking about anatom and I remember like
talking about like an atom, likehow would you describe an atom
with you know something orbitingand like.
I remember thinking of likewhen I was really little and dad
could like spin me around sothat I like and so that would be
(45:23):
the metaphor you know what it'sreally fascinating we don't
have time for is that I all.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
Language is metaphor, right?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
Yes, a cell like in our bodies, cell is so named
because when they finally saw iton our microscope it reminded
the scientist of monk's roomsyeah, yeah, yeah anyway and so
that piece of it I just rememberbeing part of what dad loved
about this movie yeah becauseit's taking the science fiction
seriously, even as it's likecompletely making did take that
science fiction seriously Likealiens aren't going to look like
(46:15):
us, yeah, but we need them tolook like us.
And so, yeah, well, that's whythere's the tentacles when
Lelari and Fred are getting iton Right, right and Sam Rockwell
is so uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (46:27):
Yeah, yeah, guys just like oh, oh, oh, don't oh it's
really funny, so, but that'sthat.
Speaker 2 (46:34):
That's the sort of thing that I think like when we
talk about.
You know, take the craftseriously, but not yourself.
Speaker 1 (46:40):
You know, thinking through the, the to the logical
consequences of a society thatis entirely truthful, right,
right, even the fact that theythought that Gilligan's Island
was real, like that it was likeit's for comic effects but
actually like it helps likefully paint the picture.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Yes, yeah, and that's the kind of thing I feel like
dad loved about sci-fi, like hereally loved when it was just
like oh, how would that changethe way people did things?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
Yeah, all right, well , let me see if I can wrap up
our highlights and then you canfill in anything I miss.
So we talked a lot about howthis movie, galaxy Quest,
creates a commentary on StarTrek, and it's multi-layered.
So it's about Star Trek, thefiction that we, you know from
the 60s, that we watch, but it'salso about the interactions of
(47:33):
the fans with that TV show andit's also about the actors who
played the various characters,and it tackles not just the
classic original Star Trek butalso some of the other
iterations, with some of thethings that show up.
It does it with casting, itdoes it with storytelling, it
does it with some of the actualplot devices that happen, and so
(47:58):
it names the tropes, itsubverts them or it leans into
them, but it does itselfconsciously and with a wink,
which is very it's.
It's delightful.
It's delightful.
One of the things that it getsit's that it's very gentle with
fans and fandom in ways thatother spoofs, like Spaceballs
for instance, are not Right.
(48:20):
So I mean, we hear Jason sayit's just a TV show, get over it
.
But it's not, it's real, andbecause these kids love it so
much, they save the universe,right, and so there's a hug that
it gives to fandom, which weboth wondered if it would still
give that hug if it were madetoday.
Because, as you noted, eventhen there was gatekeeping and
(48:42):
today, given theinterconnectedness of the world
and the immediacy of ourcommunication, that gatekeeping
and faction creation is onlymore so and is only exacerbated
and more vitriolic.
I spent some significant timetalking about the casting of
Sigourney Weaver and what thatsort of does, in sort of
(49:03):
thinking about gender in sciencefiction, because of Weaver's
earlier famous role as Ripley inAlien, wherein she is not
hypersexualized, versus her asthis Gwen, whose character is
hypersexualized, and sort of theconversation that having Weaver
(49:23):
in that role plays we alsotalked about.
You know, I named the fact theromance between Gwen and Jason
feels a little bit of a letdownin terms of the other commentary
that we get from this film,like I wish that there had been
more of a platonic comingtogether for the two of them so
(49:44):
that we could have not forceGwen back into that thing that
we saw her reject earlier.
We also named that today theshipping would not be between
the straight couple.
Well, there would be shipping,but there would also be shipping
.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
Well, there would have been shipping in 1999 too.
They just weren't willing totalk about it Totally.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
Because there was in the 60s for Kirk and Spock, oh
yeah, so that sort of feels likea piece that is missing.
(50:25):
That would have absolutely beena part of it.
Oh yeah, yeah, who their art isfor and that while there is art
that the artists make, artistsmakes for themselves and that
that's important, there's alsoalmost like what the artist owes
the person who is moved bytheir art.
Or maybe owed is the wrong way,but sort of the opportunity to
(50:47):
kind of lean into that and andand and do good and and move
other people.
That we see happen, sort of ina specific moment for Alan
Rickman's character, alex, whensomeone who idolized his TV show
character is dying and youbrought in Bismarck Key as an
example of what that can looklike.
Speaker 2 (51:07):
I remember being like dude you are so sweet, I love
you.
When he was like I'll play thatall day long.
People want to hear it.
I want to play it, Justrecognizing that you have
brought joy and that joy issomething that you can continue
to provide, even if you're tiredof the song.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
Yeah, and then where we finally landed, was you
noting the ways in which our dadappreciated our movie makers
taking the science fictionseriously, and sort of the
questions that then spin out thestory?
So this is a society that hasno concept of lying or even
pretend that is radicallytruthful.
(51:51):
And what happens then?
How do they receive fiction?
And that led us to aconversation that we can't
finish about metaphor and aspecific TNG episode, shaka when
the Walls Fell, but also justthe idea that, like we can't get
away from metaphor, which Icould talk about for another
three hours to be honest, but Iwon't, but I won't.
(52:11):
Did I forget anything?
We have like two minutes, theonly thing is.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
I'm just bringing in how there's layers of the
casting of Sigourney Weaver asGwen, that kind of harken back
to Nichelle Nichols as Uhura andthe difficult position that
marginalized actors findthemselves in.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, yeah, cool.
So thanks for coming with me onthis Galaxy Quest.
Where are we going with ourdeep thoughts next week?
Speaker 2 (52:42):
Los Angeles, I'm going to be bringing you my deep
thoughts about Pretty Woman.
Speaker 1 (52:48):
Oh, okay, well, I look forward to hearing about
them.
All right, I'll see you then Atour Patreon there's a link in
(53:10):
the show notes.
Or leave a positive review soothers can find us and, of
course, share the show with yourpeople.
Thanks for listening.
Our theme music is ProfessorUmlaut by Kevin MacLeod from
Incompetechcom.
Find full music credits in theshow notes.
Thank you to ResonateRecordings for editing today's
(53:31):
episode.
Until next time, remember popculture is still culture, and
shouldn't you know what's inyour head?
I want to talk about the way that this movie portrays
and thinks about, and themessages it conveys about,
fandom.
I think a lot of these spoofmovies end up sort of shitting
on fans, and this doesn't at all.
It's very gentle andappreciative of fans and I
really I like that.
Have you ever had something youlove dismissed because it's
(00:20):
just pop culture, what othersmight deem stupid shit?
You know matters.
You know what's worth talkingand thinking about, and so do we
.
So come overthink with us as wedelve into our deep thoughts
about stupid shit.
I'm Tracy Guy-Decker and you'relistening to Deep Thoughts
(00:40):
About Stupid Shit, because popculture is still culture, and
shouldn't?
You know what's in your head?
On today's episode, I'll besharing my deep thoughts about
the 1999 film Galaxy Quest withmy sister, emily Guy-Burken, and
with you.
Let's dive in.
Okay, I know you've seen this.
I think maybe we've seen ittogether.
Tell me what's in your headabout Galaxy Quest.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I think I remember it pretty well.
So the things that I like stickin my head are I think it's
Justin Long who's the fan who istrying to and his mom's like no
, you have to take the trash outnow.
Yeah, so that moment, like, wasjust so delightful.
And then there's a point where,like they're, I'm like well,
(01:25):
how can you tell how old theyare?
Yeah, no.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
The actual line it says oh, could they be the
minors?
And Tony Shalhoub's charactergoes yeah, they're only three
years old.
And Alan Rickman's charactergoes minors, not minors.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
And then Alan Rickman , just being a delight to like.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Where are you?
Speaker 2 (01:47):
going To see if there's a pub.
And then also there's a pointwhere Tim Allen's character's
shirt gets torn off and AlanRickman's character's just like
oh yeah, of course, now he'sshirtless, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
So like these little jokes arewhat I remember from it.
(02:08):
I remember it feeling seen bythis movie in that like we were
never super fans of Star Trekgrowing up, but we grew up with
it.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
We were fans, though.
I mean, dad took us to aconvention, do you remember?
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Yeah, I remember.
So it felt like this movie wasfor us in a lot of ways, because
it was not only, like you know,fans are actually pretty cool
because like that Justin Longcharacter is how they're able to
survive but it also winked atlike how ridiculous this thing
(02:47):
that we love is.
And we love it anyway, and Ijust remember dad being tickled
by it Particularly, we'rerecording this on the 12th
anniversary of when we lost dad,so like it feels appropriate
that we're talking about ittoday, because I just remember
(03:08):
dad giggling, like when dad wasreally, really amused by
something.
His laugh was just soinfectious, yeah, yeah.
So tell me, why are we talkingabout it?
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Yeah Well, all the things you just said.
I think we're talking about itnow in part because I recently
saw a fan or a listener whocommented on our Apple podcast
site and said I wonder if thehosts would ever tackle Star
Trek.
And we see you, listener.
(03:40):
Thank you for the suggestionand also I am totally
intimidated by tackling StarTrek.
It's just so so big and so muchink has been spilled talking
about it and so many iterationsand versions of it that it feels
too big, certainly for a singleepisode, and so looking at
(04:03):
Galaxy Quest, which was lookingat Star Trek, felt like a way to
sort of move in that directionin a chunk.
I could handle a little bit.
So that's kind of why it cameto the top of the list right now
, and some of the things I wantto talk about you've already
sort of started pointing to.
I want to talk about the waythat this movie portrays and
(04:23):
thinks about and the messages itconveys about fandom.
I think a lot of these spoofmovies end up sort of shitting
on fans and this doesn't at all.
It's very gentle andappreciative of fans and I
really I like that.
I like that.
That's kind of what you werenaming about sort of feeling
seen.
So I want to talk about that.
I want to talk about the metastorytelling, the way that it's
(04:44):
commenting on Star Trek and itdoes that in so so many ways,
and not just Star Trek, other TVscience fiction shows that get
a lot of you know, that sort ofdedicated fan base, but I think
Star Trek in particular, and itdoes that sort of meta
conversation in a lot of ways.
I think a similar actual filmmight be Scream.
(05:06):
In terms of the metaconversation I need to do Scream
at some point.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I would like for you to do that.
But the way that it sort ofexplicitly names some of the
tropes and therefore sort ofcritiques but also comments on,
but then also uses, I think, orsubverts in some way, I think is
really really interesting.
It does it through casting, itdoes it through dialogue, it
does it through plot devices.
(05:31):
So I want to sort of tacklethat a little bit or point to it
.
It also looks at gender a bitin the film, in the meta
conversation about what washappening in Star Trek, and so I
want to talk about gender, aswe often do, and in casting,
like casting Sigourney Weaver asthe only real female character
of any.
Well, there's a Thermion, butanyway.
(05:53):
And then finally I want to talkabout sort of the power of story
in our lives, because I thinkthere's a powerful lesson about
that through Alan Rickman'scharacter and his interaction
with one of the aliens, but justin general.
So those are kind of thebuckets that I'll get to in our
conversation.
Before we get there, let meremind you and our listeners of
(06:15):
the basic plot.
I'm going to keep it relatively.
I know I say this every time,but I think I actually can.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
I've heard that before.
I've been burned by you before.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
I'm going to sketch it out briefly.
So we meet the cast of this nowoff the air TV show called
Galaxy Quest.
They're at a convention andmost of the cast are backstage
waiting to come on to beintroduced.
They're waiting for JasonNesbitt, who is played by Tim
(06:49):
Allen.
He played the commander, so theCaptain Kirk equivalent, whose
name was the Galaxy Questcharacter's name is Peter Quincy
Taggart.
The actor's name is JasonNesbitt, played by Tim Allen.
They're waiting for him to showup.
So the cast is Gwen waiting forhim to show up.
So the cast is Gwen, who isplayed by Sigourney Weaver, Gwen
(07:12):
DeMarco.
There's Sir Alexander Dayne,played by Alan Rickman, who
plays the sort of Spockcharacter with like alien head
makeup Think like NextGeneration Star Trek kind of.
There's Tony Shalhoub who playsFred Kwan, who was the tech
sergeant, and then Tommy Weber,who played Laredo, who was a
child protege pilot in theoriginal show.
(07:33):
Now he's a grown up, he's theWesley Crusher.
He's the Wesley Crusher, Right,but a black guy.
Which Star Trek?
I guess we had that withNichelle Nichols in the original
.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
In the original.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
Well, and then we had Geordi LaForge Right.
Yes, thank you for reminding meof LeVar.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Burton, levar Burton.
Thank you, I couldn't think ofthe actor's name.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Yeah, so they're all being introduced by a guy, guy
Fliegman, played by Sam Rockwell, who actually turns out had
been like an extra on oneepisode, but he was the one
introducing them.
He was the red shirt, like theone who died.
Yeah, but he was introducingthem at the convention.
Jason finally shows up, timAllen character finally shows up
(08:15):
and he just kind of likewaltzes in and they get
introduced and we see them.
So we see things.
They know each other reallywell.
So Alan Rickman's character ishaving a panic attack and Tim
Allen's character is like am Itoo late for Alex's panic attack
?
And nope, still happened Anyway.
So it's clear they've beendoing this for a while.
They go from appearance toappearance and Jason, tim
(08:36):
Allen's character, just eats itup.
He believes all of the stuffand we see the movie makers show
us that he's really grooving onit.
He has all of the stuff and wesee, like the movie makers show
us that he's like reallygrooving on it, like he has a
really big ego as a result ofthe way the fans kind of gush
over him.
So we see them at theconvention.
Jason overhears in the bathroomsome guys kind of making fun of
(08:57):
him and noting how he just hasno idea that his friends can't
stand him.
And so then he gets real shortwith some fans, specifically
actually Justin Long's Brandon,who like wants to ask very
technical questions, like inepisode 51, the blah, blah, blah
, blah, blah.
Like he wants to like an answerbecause there's some like
continuity problem in thescience, that he wants to ask
(09:20):
Jason, who is very short withhim and is like look, kid, it's
just a TV show, so fast forward.
Jason's hungover and these guysshow up who act real weird.
They're wearing uniforms andthey talk real funny.
Enrico Colantoni plays Mathisar.
(09:42):
He's the leader and he sort ofsays like your help is
desperately needed.
And he introduces himself weare Thermians from the whatever
sector Like he names the placein space that they're from and
Jason thinks it's a like a gigthat he agreed to and it turns
out they're actually aliens.
(10:02):
So, all hungover, jason like ison the bridge of this actual
ship that's based on the showand he like is supposed to be
negotiating a peace with thisbad guy, saris, and instead he's
like throw all the weapons athim and then he like leaves when
they send him home.
They send him home on theequivalent of the like
(10:23):
transporter, but it's not.
It doesn't look like it did inthe original Star Trek.
It actually like is this likegoo that like envelops him and
then shoots him through space.
So he lands back at his homeand he's like shaking.
So he goes to find hiscastmates and is like it's real,
it's real, you know, you guysgot to come with me.
And anyway they spurn him.
(10:45):
And then they're like maybe weshould just take the gig.
And one of them is like wait,do you think this was a gig?
Like there's money.
And so then they go with himbecause the Thermians have come
back to say Sarah survived andwe need your help.
So they're like you're nottaking this gig without us.
So they all go and now thereare these actors on this actual
(11:06):
spaceship and they're fighting areal bad guy.
The Thermians have beenreceiving our television
transmissions, which they haveno concept of pretend or lying,
and so they receive them asquote-unquote historical
documents.
We learned that their societywas in disarray, but they've
(11:30):
remade their entire societybased on the model of galaxy
quest.
And the actors are like surelyyou have theater on your planet?
Like I mean, surely you don'tthink gilligan's island is
documents?
And all of the Thermians likeget this sad face.
And they're like those poorpeople it's just such a great
gag.
(11:50):
And like the person throughwhom Thormians have learned what
lying is and they like areterrible at the things that
(12:11):
their characters would haveexcelled at, and so that's like
humbling and also interestingfor them.
Meanwhile there's this metaconversation going on about the
old show.
So Sigourney Weaver, hercharacter Gwen, was like and I
think this is a bit of a commenton Nichelle Nichols' character
(12:31):
a little bit where, like, herjob was to talk to the computer
and to repeat what the computersaid, like.
So at one point even one of theother ones I think it's Tommy,
the Wesley Crusher equivalent,says you know, that's getting
really annoying, and she's likeI have one job on this ship, one
and I'm going to do it.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
And she also like, has like a push-up bra and is
like boobs.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Well, right, yes, so her uniform, like they all zip
up the center and hers in theoriginal, was always like the
zipper was not up to her neck,it was down a little bit to show
off a little decolletage.
And then in the course of themovie we're watching, it gets
like her uniform gets likeripped and the zipper comes down
(13:17):
and so we're seeing like bigportions of her bra.
That's the same maroon as partof the uniform.
So, yes, there's a lot of boobwhich is in the movie we're
watching.
Yeah, as much as it is in likethe original TV show.
So when they realize like howbad this is, at one point they
(13:38):
had run away at like full turbo,which is not designed to do
that, and they broke the shipand so they need to go find a
new beryllium sphere which islike the power source.
That's how they end up on thatplanet with the miners who are
not miners, and therein lies alot of the sort of commentary
(13:58):
and meta.
So, guy, who's the was an extraand just was like happy to be a
part of the show now isterrified, he's gonna die
because he's like he's the redshirt.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
and so, like the shuttle lands on this ship and
Tony Shalhoub's character goesto open the door and Guy is like
what are you doing?
Is there even air?
You don't know.
And then he takes a deep breathand holds his breath and Tony
Shalhoub's character is likeseems okay.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Tony Shalhoub is a delight.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
He is so great in this film.
He's so great in this film sothey get this fear.
There's a lot of commentarythat like points to like guys,
like did you guys even watch theshow?
Like we can't do that, we can'tjust go talk to these aliens.
So they get this fear, they getit all set up and then the bad
(14:56):
guys.
This is all out of order, butat some point the bad guys are
on the ship.
We see interactions.
We see lots of interactionswhere we learn about the
Thermian society and the waysthat these aliens have
interacted with the historicaldocuments I'm putting quotes
around that and the characters.
There's one character from thealiens, quelek is his name, and
(15:24):
he idolized Alan Rickman'scharacter and Alan Rickman we
have seen, hates that.
This is what he's known for.
He hates having been typecast.
He has a Shakespearean trainingand he hates that he's been
typecast as this alien.
And there's this line that thecharacter always said by
Grapthar's hammer, you shall beavenged.
And he's like.
We see him at the verybeginning saying I will not say
the line and at one point Quelekstarts to say it to him and
(15:48):
he's like stop, don't, justdon't.
And you can see that Quilek islike so hurt by that, like I'm
so sorry I won't whatever Quileksays to him at one point I hope
this isn't too far, but I'vealways thought of you as a
father, because I didn't haveone and Quilek ends up getting
shot and he's dying and Alexsays the line to him in all
(16:14):
sincerity and you see thecharacter, the actor I don't
know who played Quelek, but Iguess I can look it up.
Patrick Breen plays Quelek andyou can see him being comforted
by having his idol say thisfamous line to him as he's dying
, like famous line to him ashe's dying.
(16:36):
And then alex actually like isso pissed off and like wants to
avenge this young person, thisyoung alien that he actually
like starts attacking the, thebad guys, and like kills a bunch
of them.
So they managed to get throughthis because j accidentally
swapped communicators withBrandon, who is a teenaged fan
(16:58):
who is very into it, and soBrandon and his friends there
are three or four others all geton the line and they're like
helping Jason and Gwen movethrough the ship, based on their
understanding of this fictionalship.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
There's that point where there's like the chopping
thing.
The chompers they call themyeah yeah, and I remember
Sigourney Weaver going you'vegot to be kidding me, yeah yeah,
why is this?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
even here, and at one point, when they get through
that bit, it's like these bighammers that are just like
crushing in alternate directionsthat they have to sort of work
their way through.
And when they get to the end,there's this flame that spurts
up and she's like whoever wrotethis episode should be killed,
or something like that.
So Brandon and his friends helpGwen and Jason, like do all
(17:47):
that we learn about the Omega 13, which nobody really knows what
it is, because the writersnever actually said Brandonon.
Some people think it's a hugebomb that will totally destroy
the entire universe.
Brandon and his friends thinkit's actually a matter
rearranger.
That will give you a 13 second.
Like jump you back 13 secondsinto the past.
The very end they managed tothrough through skill, like
(18:12):
Tommy has been practicing bywatching the old episodes to see
how to work the navigation.
They managed to actually beatSaris the bad guy and blow up
his ship, but at the last minutehe actually transported or
whatever onto their ship.
Saris did, saris did.
(18:33):
They're all celebrating thatthey've won.
They're going to go home.
They actually have set a coursefor Earth.
And then Tony Shalhoub'scharacter, fred, comes in onto
the bridge and he startsshooting everybody.
And then he like hits a buttonand it's actually Saris, having
used some sort of cloaking thing.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
So Mathisar and Jason activate the omega 13, go back
as far as the, the captain, theleader of the thermians.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Okay, they go back 13 seconds and jason's able to
prevent saris successfully, likeshooting everybody.
Then they crash the thermionseparate with like a little
shuttle and the ship crash,lands into the convention.
And then they all step out ontothe stage like there's a dude
(19:24):
who just like opportunistically,like picks up the microphone
and introduces them as they comeout, mm-hmm, and saris has
survived.
He comes out and jason happensto have a ray gun and shoots him
and he like explodes and thefans just go wild and we see
gwen and jason kiss and like yay, everything's great and one of
(19:44):
the thermians.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Yes, because I remember sam rockwell, because
when they start kissing and thenlike tentacles are coming out
and he's like, oh, oh, no,that's not okay.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Yeah, that happened a little earlier, when Tony
Shalhoub, when, um, thatcharacter, fred is able, he
doesn't think he can do whatneeds to be done and he does it.
And and this female Thermionher name is Lalani or something,
I'm probably saying Laliari,laliari, played by missy pile.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
She, yeah, she, she's into it I guess, and then she
goes with him and stays on earth, she goes with him and then.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
So the last two like two minutes of the film galaxy
quest is being brought back fornew adventures with all of them,
including guy, who is now thelike chief security officer or
something which, by the way,when everybody was being shot in
the first version before the 13second backup, guy was the only
one who didn't get shot it's areverse red shirt yeah, so we
(20:42):
see that the the show has beenrevived and now includes Guy,
and Laliari is there?
she's, that's the character'stheme played by Jane Doe, so
that's it.
Okay, it wasn't, it's never,it's never.
Anyway, that's the basic plot.
Mixed in there is all of thiscommentary about, like we said
(21:03):
along the way, you know,sigourney Weaver's character
saying like whoever wrote thisshould be shot.
It doesn't make any sense and,as you noted when, when you were
remembering, there's one pointwhere jason is like fighting
this rock monster and ends upwith his shirt off, and so alex
says to him of course youmanaged to get your shirt off,
and I don't remember what thecontext is, but gwen says to
(21:26):
jason, like that's rich, comingfrom someone who slept with
every cerulean slave girl thatever you know or whatever you
know.
So there's a lot of commentaryon some of the things that
people talk about about startrek, including in yeah,
including the like, the ideathat william shatner has an ego,
because it's it's like what'sinteresting.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
It's not just about the show, or even just the show
and the fans, it's also likewhat we know about the actors.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Yeah, yeah.
So all of that is really,really interesting.
So in talking about that metapiece, I want to talk about some
of the choices that ourfilmmakers made, right?
So I think in the writing theycomment on the tropes that we
saw in the show and then theysubvert them or they lean back
(22:12):
into them, and I think that'sreally interesting, like the
fact that Guy is the only onewho doesn't get shot, which
they've been talking the wholetime about.
The fact that we had expendablecrew members in Star Trek
episodes.
Like we knew, if there's a guywe never met before wearing a
red shirt, he's probably goingto die, right, like that was a
thing, that was a pattern thatwe knew and they talk about it
(22:34):
and then they subvert it, whichis really interesting.
And even the way the guy's likehave you even seen the show?
That reminds me of Scream,right, like, and things that
we've talked about before.
Actually, when we talk abouthorror, if you know what genre
you're in, you make differentchoices.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Yeah, in you make different choices.
Yeah, well, and also I feellike there's a little bit of
commentary on star trek, thenext generation and patrick
stewart who, like he wasshakespearean trained,
shakespearean trained, and hedid not think it would last.
So like, if I remembercorrectly, like he tried, he
didn't really get to know hiscastmates.
Everyone thought he was a dickthe first year and I think he
didn't even like get a long-termapartment or something Because
(23:12):
he didn't think it was going tolast.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
There's no way this will last, yeah, yeah, yeah.
There was also like the castingchoices, right?
So Sigourney Weaver, who wehave talked about in Alien, and
her role in Alien.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
And Ghostbusters.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
And Ghostbusters.
Yes, true, I think.
(23:53):
For me, alien, because it's setin space, feels the more
relevant echo with her casting,and there's something really
ripe for me about Weaver beingcast in this role versus her
role in Alien which was sono-nonsense and gritty and, as
we talked about, she was stillthe gorgeous woman that she is,
but was not hypersexualized notat all whereas this character is
self-consciouslyhypersexualized, like there's
commentary on it, and so I thinkthere's something really
interesting in that.
That doing that to and withsigourney weaver, who has this
(24:14):
anchor in science fiction in adifferent role, so like
reminding us that it is not bychoosing her part of the meta
commentary is that thehypersexualization of a female
character in space is notrequired, I think, even though
she is in this movie well, and Ifeel like there's also there's
(24:36):
an echo to like sigourney weaveris a really intimidating,
impressive person and she'sblonde in this, isn't she?
Speaker 2 (24:47):
yes, and like, always fully made up and like the
boobs, and I'm thinking aboutlike nails, like nails, yeah,
yeah.
She's very hyper feminine, hypersexualized, yeah, and I feel
like there's a commentary inthere also about the very
well-known story about NichelleNichols, after the first season
of Star Trek, wanted to quitbecause she felt like she was
(25:07):
being marginalized and tokenized, because she was Like she was
wearing they made her wear ashort skirt.
All she did was repeat thingsvery much like the Gwen
character in this, and it wasactually Martin Luther King who
convinced her to stay because hewas saying you don't know who
you are inspiring.
And so Nichelle Nichols wasalso a very intimidating and
(25:31):
impressive individual, like shewas so much more than this
pretty Black woman who actedlike a secretary Right In the
show.
And it kind of gets to thosedecisions that people from
marginalized communities have tomake when taking roles
(25:54):
marginalized communities have tomake when taking roles.
And we also know that WhoopiGoldberg was inspired by
Nichelle Nichols because shewent on to become Guinan on Star
Trek, the Next.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Generation.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Even though she's known as a comedian.
But she loved that there was aBlack woman on the bridge of the
Enterprise and she wanted thattoo.
So like it's.
It's so much like there's somuch in there yeah, it's very
ripe.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
It's very ripe.
Yeah, it definitely is.
I think it's also, when I thinkabout casting not just weaver
but the other like this wasreally an all-star cast at the
time in 99 and, like rockwell,was not yet an oscar but, he
goes on to win an Oscar and,like he does, a really great job
.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
She's a phenomenal actor In many ways.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Guy is, I don't know, sort of the heart, because it's
through him that we get a lotof the commentary on the show.
I mean it's also through Gwenand Jason.
But he actually will sort ofsay explicitly like this is how
it works in the show which iskind of.
It was a great choice, I think,in terms of storytelling to have
(26:58):
this guy who was a hanger on tocome along to then give us some
exposition but also some ofthat meta commentary, and
Rockwell's just a great actor,so that also really helped.
So, and Tim Allen was at theheight of his popularity in 1999
.
It was before he revealed whata nutjob he is, rickman is and
(27:18):
was and has been.
I mean, I think it was beforehe became Severus Snape, but he
was already sort of a well-knownface in Hollywood.
So, like, I think the castingwas really really powerfully
(27:39):
good and gave us those sort ofas you say, the actors are sort
of tropes, right, like Shaloob'sKwan.
Fred Kwan is like the only onewho, after the initial transport
, is not freaking out.
He's like whoa, that was athing.
He's just totally chill, thatwas a thing.
He's just totally chill andlike, like at one point he like
talks to the bridge he's like,because he's supposed to be like
scotty, like um, the theengineer, the chief engineer.
He's like so we could do thisthing, and what do you think?
(28:03):
And they're like yeah, let's dothat.
And he's like right again.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Come on, guys, group hug well, the the other thing is
like, because there's a pointwhere he's, when he's not sure
he can do like like thetransport or whatever it is, and
I think it's Alan Rickman, Idon't remember Someone's like
you always had your lines, youalways were so professional,
like you can do this.
And these fandoms, these peoplewho it's a gig but they take it
(28:28):
seriously, they take the craftseriously, but not themselves.
He is exactly that Right, right, and even though because you've
got the Alan Rickman characterwho thinks this is beneath him,
(28:50):
right, and then you've got theTim Allen character who thinks
this represents how excellent.
He is Like his merit His likeyou know he His worth, his worth
Because, like you know, he'sCaptain Jason Nesmith or
whatever.
No, he's Captain Peter.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Quincy Taggart, peter Quincy Taggart.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Yeah, and when it's just a show and like in between
them is the Tony Shalhoubcharacter who just recognizes
this is a gig.
But I am.
I'm going to give it my allbecause I was hired for this.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Right, right, yeah, yeah, I think that's right.
I think that's right.
That I feel like a little bitgives with one hand and takes
with the other is the way thatour movie talks about sort of
the treatment of romance andshipping in the original
backstory TV show, right, so atone point, like early, early on,
(29:47):
we see Jason sort of hit onGwen and she's like it was cute
when I didn't know you.
But then when they think they'regoing to die, he says Gwen,
I've always.
And then he doesn't say it andthen they don't die and she's
like what were you going to say?
And at the very like when theyget off the ship and Saris is
(30:09):
dead and they're on the stage atthe back at the convention, he
kisses her dramatically and shelikes it, she's into it and you
know the fans go wild and Ithink by having her spurn him in
the beginning, that feels likecommentary on the ways that you
(30:32):
know the RPF real people, people, fiction, kind of shipping that
people end up doing for actors,and even the shipping that we
do for characters, this sort oflike they're, it's convenient,
and so we sort of create aromance in our, in our mind,
whether or not it actually makessense for the characters, but
then they end up together, andso that's why it feels like give
(30:54):
with one hand and take with theother.
So I kind of wish if insteadthey had just sort of hugged and
it felt more platonic.
I think this movie would havebeen like chef's kiss almost
perfect.
That really, like on rewatch,bothers me.
The other thing, the otherthing about this, now that I am
(31:15):
a part of very active fandoms Idon't think that it would have
been the Gwen and Jason shipping.
I was just thinking that itwould have been Alex and Jason,
alex and Jason shipping.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I was just thinking that because, like, the slash
fiction comes from Kirk andSpock yes, exactly which?
And like, if you're not aware.
So slash fiction means when youpair two same-sex characters,
and the way they would do thatis because they would say it was
Spock slash Kirk or Kirk slashSpock, whereas if it was just
friendship they would do anampersand Kirk and Spock.
(31:52):
And so, like, the term slashcame to mean any, and so I
learned about the term slashwhen I was in the X-Files fandom
and there would be Mulder andSkinner, so it would be Mulder
slash Skinner, which I've never,I mean like Mitch Pelleggi, but
I didn't get it at the time.
Things change, I didn't get itat the time.
Things change.
Anyway, but you are right, andif they made it I don't know,
(32:17):
maybe not, but I feel like maybeif they made it now, there
would still be the hitting on,but you'd see, at least the fans
would be like I thought I saw alittle something between you
two.
Yeah, maybe, although my mostvivid memory about going to that
Star Trek convention, because Iwould have been what 10, 11?
You were about 13, 14?
(32:37):
.
Something like that.
Yeah, I was about then.
It was after the one with thewhales came out, the movie with
the whales which Four, Four, andthere was a woman asking it
because William Shatner wasthere, yeah, and he was taking
questions.
And a woman got up from theback like, and then came like
all the way to the front.
(32:57):
I remember her and he was like,oh whoa, and she was asking
about the romantic tensionbetween the 20th century woman
that is there in that film thatyou know it's Kirk's, you know,
lover of the day and, like I asa kid, remember being like, wow,
she's really intense about this.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
Yeah, I vaguely remember her, you know, it's
funny that you say if it weremade today, because one of the
things that I think about if itwere made today is, I think, now
.
One of the things I named was Ithink this film is very gentle
with fans Like Brandon, theteenage fan, and his friends
(33:40):
save the universe, basically,and they're basically good
people Like, I think, all of thefans.
We kind of get the sense thatthey're just, they're good
people who just really lovesomething.
Yeah, yeah, this film being madein 99, sort of at the very
early stages of, like, theinternet, where we were still
using AOL chat rooms fandom haschanged as a result of the
(34:03):
internet and social media andI'm not sure that one can tell a
story about fandoms and sort ofbe like yeah, they're just
basically good people who reallylove them.
Yeah that's true Even in thefandoms, of which we are a part.
There's some vitriol thatpeople direct at one another if
(34:25):
they disagree aboutinterpretations, foundations of
the show.
You know like they're decidedlylike camps and, as with any
politics where the stakes areactually quite low, the politics
are vicious, and that's a piecethat I think in some ways like
(34:46):
harkens back to a gentler time.
So I both appreciate that ourmovie makers of the movie Galaxy
Quest in 99 did not shit onfans.
I also think that they wereportraying a fandom that was
less susceptible to the kinds ofvitriol because it was less
(35:09):
connected, less interconnected,less immediately connected than
we are today with Tumblr andTwitter and all of the other
ways that we keep in touch withDiscord servers and whatnot.
The way that we keep in touchwith one another these days,
that ends up in such likevitriolic clicky kinds of
community Like, not even justinter-fandom.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Intra-fandom, int.
Inter-fandom in tra-fandom, intra-fandom.
Yeah, one thing that is comingup for me, though, is so I said,
like you know, we weren't superfans of star trek, but you know
why I said that?
Because I'm a girl, and so eventhen there was gatekeeping
about nerd culture Like, oh, youlike Star Trek.
Well, you know name blah, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah, like
(36:00):
you know, and in the way thatany woman who is interested in
something that is male coded, orneeds to credential herself,
needs to credential herself.
And the fact that Justin Long isare all his friends.
Boys, no, there's one girl.
There's one girl.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
She doesn't have a name, yeah, or I mean I'm sure
she has a name, but we don'tlearn it.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
So intra-fandom vitriol is also like we gets to
this realization that I've hadover the past few years that
every human community is amicrocosm of the human community
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Yeah, I think that that might be right.
Yeah, there was, you're right,there was absolutely gatekeeping
even in 99.
I think it didn't have the samekind of reach and scale because
of the ways in which ourcurrent interconnectedness
through the internet.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
You know, other than going to that convention, I had
no way of interacting with theStar Trek fandom.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Right, right, well especially when we were children
.
Children.
Speaker 2 (37:38):
Yes, but even as a like I was an X-Files fan, Like
I would have called myself anX-Files fan.
I did not interact with thefandom, in part because, like,
it just never occurred to me toget into fan fiction I just I
just didn't, I just didn't thinkabout it.
And so because and that's oftenthe entry point into fandom,
(37:59):
right, but you can't avoid it.
Now, you know, just being onsocial media, you are exposed to
fandom I mean, you could avoidit if you wanted to.
But okay, if you are someone wholikes, if you like a who likes,
if you like a show a lot, ifyou like a show.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, anyway, yeah.
So those are some interestingthings about.
So I think you're pointing outthe fact that there was
gatekeeping that is gendered andracialized.
I will note that this film doesnot pass the Bechdel test, so
the Bechdel test as a reminder,listeners is from Alison Bechdel
(38:34):
.
We ask ourselves threequestions Are there at least two
named female characters?
So they actually have names, dothey talk to one another?
And do they talk to one anotherabout something other than a
man or a boy?
And we do have two named femalecharacters, but they don't talk
to one another.
So there'swen, and then there'slalari, the thermion, who, who
(38:55):
ends up with fred, and theydon't talk to one another.
And what's interesting is thatlike there's a degree to which,
like that's the case, becausethat was the case with star trek
, but on the other hand, ourfilmmakers self-consciously,
intentionally, like broke a lotof those things but, gender was
not one of the ones that theyfelt the need to do.
(39:17):
And we see female fans at theconvention dressed like Gwen's
character.
She even poses for pictureswith them.
And they witness the exchangewhere she says I thought it was
cute when I didn't know you.
And then Jason looks at themand they all kind of giggle and
wave.
So it's still like they'restill doing the thing, even as
(39:39):
they watch their idol snub him,so, which in some ways feels
like an accurate portrayal ofthe way humans behave, and in
other ways I want more like so.
If I were to make a galaxyquest-esque movie today, I would
(40:00):
have a lot more femalecharacters and I would have them
like talk about this, likewhat's great and what's shitty
you know, so that's the thingthat I just I just wanted to
name, you know, especially sinceyou brought up the gate, the
gendered and and racializedpieces of the gatekeeping.
But the last thing that I I kindof pointed to, and then I'll
(40:22):
just I just want to sort ofspell out a little more that I
think that this film reallytakes seriously, is the power of
story to comfort and to createand build community like, and
the way that people cometogether on it, like, in some
ways this is a another story offound family, right?
(40:44):
I mean, so many movies that'swhat it's about, or at least
movies that you and I seem to bedrawn to.
That was one of dad's favoritethings and in some ways this is
another one of those.
Because they come togetheragain, this cast who knows each
other in some ways very well andlike kind of just tolerate each
other, but they really like,they work together toward common
cause, ie their own survival,and end up like, really like
(41:07):
coming to appreciate one anotheragain.
And it was the stories thatthey were telling that helped
them do that, this dying friendor acquaintance even.
(41:31):
But who idolized him and doingthat?
And you had, before we startedrecording, you had a related
anecdote that you wanted toshare about that.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
So that Hammer of Grapthor thing by Grapthor's
Hammer, whatever, reminded me ofsomething I remember seeing.
It's probably been 20 years ago.
Vh1 used to have the behind themusic TV show and often they
would go and look at like onehit wonders and so many one hit
wonders were like, resentful ofthe one hit because they're
serious musicians, they've beencreating art all this time and
people only, like they doconcerts and people only want to
(42:06):
hear the hits, that's all theycare about.
And if I remember correctly, itwas Biz Markie, who wrote you
Got what I Need, who said likeI'll play that all day long,
every day.
I made something that everybodyloves.
I made something that madepeople feel good.
I did that and so I'm going toplay that for them because
(42:28):
that's what they want to hear,even though he went on to make
lots of other music.
And I just so appreciated thatway of looking at it because I
can totally understand theresentment of like you know you
do something and it takes off,especially if it's a lot of
times these one-hit wonders werejust like they threw it
(42:48):
together in a week.
Our friend of the show, scottKenimore, talks about his first
book, the Zen of Zombie.
He wrote in like three weeksand it sold immediately, even
though the soulful, like all him, like kind of
semi-autobiographical stuff thathe poured his heart and soul
into nobody was interested inand there's something that hurts
about that.
But at the same time it's likerecognizing that you've done
(43:10):
something that resonates withother people.
Recognizing that you've donesomething that resonates with
some, with with other people,and what a gift and privilege
that is, even if it's not whatyou wanted.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
Recognizing that it's not necessarily about you as
the artist the way you said itbefore we started recording was
that there are some things thatare for you as the artist and
there are some things that arefor them your fans and that's a
moment that alex has as Quellickas dying.
It's not for Alex anymore, it'sfor Quellick.
And I think that reallyresonated when you said that.
(43:38):
That's why I'm lifting it backup.
I just was naming that, youknow.
I think that's something thatour filmmakers kind of are
recognizing about Star Trekright and sort of putting on
display for us about Star Trek,about the power of story and
storytelling to move us and tobring us together.
So, I think that's part of whyit feels so delightful to you
(44:02):
and me who care so much aboutstory and storytelling yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
I do want to.
Before you wrap up, there's oneother thing that I really
associate with this film, oneother thing that I really
associate with this film withour dad, which is I feel like I
had a conversation with dadabout how, even though the
Thermians appear very human-like, that the movie did a good job
in showing us something alien intheir complete inability to
(44:28):
understand deception or pretendor lying.
And I feel like we had aconversation, I don't know, but
about how such a smalldifference because it really
does feel like a smalldifference can make a huge
difference in how you interactwith the world and the way that
you do things.
And it reminded me of there'sone of the famous Next
(44:51):
Generation episodes, shaka, whenthe Walls Fell.
I don't think that's what theepisode's called, but there's a
race.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
That's the phrase that he keeps.
They only speak in metaphor.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
They speak in metaphor, and I remember talking
to dad about that and we werelike, how do you have scientific
discoveries if you speak inmetaphor?
And I remember talking about anatom and I remember like
talking about like an atom, likehow would you describe an atom
with you know something orbitingand like.
I remember thinking of likewhen I was really little and dad
could like spin me around sothat I like and so that would be
(45:23):
the metaphor you know what it'sreally fascinating we don't
have time for is that I all.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
Language is metaphor, right?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
Yes, a cell like in our bodies, cell is so named
because when they finally saw iton our microscope it reminded
the scientist of monk's roomsyeah, yeah, yeah anyway and so
that piece of it I just rememberbeing part of what dad loved
about this movie yeah becauseit's taking the science fiction
seriously, even as it's likecompletely making did take that
science fiction seriously Likealiens aren't going to look like
(46:15):
us, yeah, but we need them tolook like us.
And so, yeah, well, that's whythere's the tentacles when
Lelari and Fred are getting iton Right, right and Sam Rockwell
is so uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (46:27):
Yeah, yeah, guys just like oh, oh, oh, don't oh it's
really funny, so, but that'sthat.
Speaker 2 (46:34):
That's the sort of thing that I think like when we
talk about.
You know, take the craftseriously, but not yourself.
Speaker 1 (46:40):
You know, thinking through the, the to the logical
consequences of a society thatis entirely truthful, right,
right, even the fact that theythought that Gilligan's Island
was real, like that it was likeit's for comic effects but
actually like it helps likefully paint the picture.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Yes, yeah, and that's the kind of thing I feel like
dad loved about sci-fi, like hereally loved when it was just
like oh, how would that changethe way people did things?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
Yeah, all right, well , let me see if I can wrap up
our highlights and then you canfill in anything I miss.
So we talked a lot about howthis movie, galaxy Quest,
creates a commentary on StarTrek, and it's multi-layered.
So it's about Star Trek, thefiction that we, you know from
the 60s, that we watch, but it'salso about the interactions of
(47:33):
the fans with that TV show andit's also about the actors who
played the various characters,and it tackles not just the
classic original Star Trek butalso some of the other
iterations, with some of thethings that show up.
It does it with casting, itdoes it with storytelling, it
does it with some of the actualplot devices that happen, and so
(47:58):
it names the tropes, itsubverts them or it leans into
them, but it does itselfconsciously and with a wink,
which is very it's.
It's delightful.
It's delightful.
One of the things that it getsit's that it's very gentle with
fans and fandom in ways thatother spoofs, like Spaceballs
for instance, are not Right.
(48:20):
So I mean, we hear Jason sayit's just a TV show, get over it
.
But it's not, it's real, andbecause these kids love it so
much, they save the universe,right, and so there's a hug that
it gives to fandom, which weboth wondered if it would still
give that hug if it were madetoday.
Because, as you noted, eventhen there was gatekeeping and
(48:42):
today, given theinterconnectedness of the world
and the immediacy of ourcommunication, that gatekeeping
and faction creation is onlymore so and is only exacerbated
and more vitriolic.
I spent some significant timetalking about the casting of
Sigourney Weaver and what thatsort of does, in sort of
(49:03):
thinking about gender in sciencefiction, because of Weaver's
earlier famous role as Ripley inAlien, wherein she is not
hypersexualized, versus her asthis Gwen, whose character is
hypersexualized, and sort of theconversation that having Weaver
(49:23):
in that role plays we alsotalked about.
You know, I named the fact theromance between Gwen and Jason
feels a little bit of a letdownin terms of the other commentary
that we get from this film,like I wish that there had been
more of a platonic comingtogether for the two of them so
(49:44):
that we could have not forceGwen back into that thing that
we saw her reject earlier.
We also named that today theshipping would not be between
the straight couple.
Well, there would be shipping,but there would also be shipping
.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
Well, there would have been shipping in 1999 too.
They just weren't willing totalk about it Totally.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
Because there was in the 60s for Kirk and Spock, oh
yeah, so that sort of feels likea piece that is missing.
(50:25):
That would have absolutely beena part of it.
Oh yeah, yeah, who their art isfor and that while there is art
that the artists make, artistsmakes for themselves and that
that's important, there's alsoalmost like what the artist owes
the person who is moved bytheir art.
Or maybe owed is the wrong way,but sort of the opportunity to
(50:47):
kind of lean into that and andand and do good and and move
other people.
That we see happen, sort of ina specific moment for Alan
Rickman's character, alex, whensomeone who idolized his TV show
character is dying and youbrought in Bismarck Key as an
example of what that can looklike.
Speaker 2 (51:07):
I remember being like dude you are so sweet, I love
you.
When he was like I'll play thatall day long.
People want to hear it.
I want to play it, Justrecognizing that you have
brought joy and that joy issomething that you can continue
to provide, even if you're tiredof the song.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
Yeah, and then where we finally landed, was you
noting the ways in which our dadappreciated our movie makers
taking the science fictionseriously, and sort of the
questions that then spin out thestory?
So this is a society that hasno concept of lying or even
pretend that is radicallytruthful.
(51:51):
And what happens then?
How do they receive fiction?
And that led us to aconversation that we can't
finish about metaphor and aspecific TNG episode, shaka when
the Walls Fell, but also justthe idea that, like we can't get
away from metaphor, which Icould talk about for another
three hours to be honest, but Iwon't, but I won't.
(52:11):
Did I forget anything?
We have like two minutes, theonly thing is.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
I'm just bringing in how there's layers of the
casting of Sigourney Weaver asGwen, that kind of harken back
to Nichelle Nichols as Uhura andthe difficult position that
marginalized actors findthemselves in.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, yeah, cool.
So thanks for coming with me onthis Galaxy Quest.
Where are we going with ourdeep thoughts next week?
Speaker 2 (52:42):
Los Angeles, I'm going to be bringing you my deep
thoughts about Pretty Woman.
Speaker 1 (52:48):
Oh, okay, well, I look forward to hearing about
them.
All right, I'll see you then Atour Patreon there's a link in
(53:10):
the show notes.
Or leave a positive review soothers can find us and, of
course, share the show with yourpeople.
Thanks for listening.
Our theme music is ProfessorUmlaut by Kevin MacLeod from
Incompetechcom.
Find full music credits in theshow notes.
Thank you to ResonateRecordings for editing today's
(53:31):
episode.
Until next time, remember popculture is still culture, and
shouldn't you know what's inyour head?
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