All Episodes

December 24, 2025 50 mins

The heart of ungoverning is going after expertise - eradicating expertise - and replacing it with the power of the great ruler.

Russ Muirhead

Russell Muirhead is the Robert Clements Professor of Democracy and Politics and the co-director of the Political Economy Project at Dartmouth University. He's also the co-author, with Nancy Rosenblum, of Ungoverning: The Attack on the Administrative State and the Politics of Chaos

Patrick McQuestion joins to help introduce the episode. Patrick is a  PhD student in his fourth year at the University of Notre Dame studying political science and peace studies, and also the co-host of the Global Stage Podcast

The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 

Read the full transcript here.

Key Highlights

  • Introduction - 0:20
  • What is Ungoverning? 9:00
  • The Fourth Branch - 32:29
  • Other Examples of Ungoverning 36:28
  • Ungoverning and Democracy - 46:59

Links:

Learn more about Russell Muirhead

Learn more about his book Ungoverning: The Attack on the Administrative State and the Politics of Chaos

Learn more about Patrick McQuestion

Learn more about the Kellogg Institute.

Support the show

Mark as Played

Advertise With Us

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!

Dateline NBC

Dateline NBC

Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com

Stuff You Should Know

Stuff You Should Know

If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2026 iHeartMedia, Inc.