February 28, 2024 • 34 mins
Have you ever considered that your DNA might hold the key to understanding your relationships? This episode features the relationship technology expert Tac Williams, who brings his wealth of knowledge to our exploration of genetics and its profound impact on how we connect with others. Tac opens up about his personal journey through a tumultuous past relationship, providing an earnest backdrop to our discussion on attraction, individuality, and the necessity of setting boundaries. Our conversation takes a turn towards the scientific, dissecting the role of genes like the serotonin transporter gene S-L-C-6-A-4 and the dopamine receptor genes DRD2 and DRD4, unraveling how these tiny biological factors may determine our sociability, mood regulation, and even risk-taking behaviors.
We venture deeper into the genetic labyrinth, examining the effects of vasopressin on social bonding and aggression. Tac and I aim to piece together the intricate puzzle of hormones, genes, and behavior, shedding light on the genetic 'on and off' switches that can be influenced by our environment, diet, and life experiences. Through these insights, we hope to arm you with a greater mindfulness of the undercurrents that shape our relationships. Whether we're discussing the complex interplay of genetics and parenting styles in response to a listener's question from Minneapolis, or delving into the nuances of our predispositions, this episode promises to offer a fresh lens through which to view the connections we hold dear. Join us for a profound journey into the science of social bonds and prepare to be enlightened about the genetic chords that weave through the tapestry of our interpersonal relationships.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
P23 Knowledge, access , power.
P23, wellness and Understandingat your fingertips P23.
And that's no cap.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Welcome back to Demystifying DNA, your Beacon in
the Fascinating World ofGenetics, where we break down
complex scientific concepts intounderstandable and engaging
content.
I'm your host, dr TiffanyMontgomery, scientist,
(00:46):
epidemiologist, not a medicaldoctor or psychiatrist, but I'm
still that curious lady helpingguide you through every step of
the way.
And today I'm accompanied by myinsightful co-host, tac
Williams, relationshiptechnology and computer
(01:07):
extraordinaire.
You all have met him before.
Welcome, tac.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
How's it going?
Dr Montgomery, thank you forhaving me back.
You know I enjoy joining thisplatform, especially with the
subject matter we're about tospeak on in a minute.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
And today's topic is all about relationships.
She said, dr Montgomery, howdoes that go?
What does relationship has todo with genetics, but allow me
to walk you through it.
You all know I love takingthings that are as simple as
every day and bringing itforward into a way that
(01:46):
translates to science.
I want you all to eat this,live this, breathe this and
enjoy it as much as I do.
So today's episode we're goingto just talk about genetics and
the factors that it plays intodifferent relationships.
I promise that we're going tohave a enlightening exploration
(02:08):
into how our genes influence themost intimate aspects of our
lives.
Our mission is to demystifygenetics, making it accessible
and relatable to everyone,whether you're a science
enthusiast or simply curiousabout genetics and how it plays
(02:28):
a role in your dailyinteractions and relationships.
We are here for it.
As we delve into the sciencebehind genetic influences on
relationships, we aim toilluminate the intricate ways in
which our DNA contributes tothe bonds we form, the
relationships we have and thepeople that we are.
(02:51):
Let's dive into this journeytogether, making the complex
world of genetics easy tounderstand for everyone.
So talk, I have to admit Itricked you here.
You thought it was a geneticspodcast, but you're more like my
human experiment.
Okay.
(03:11):
So we're, going to just ask youa couple of questions.
I want to know Well, what isnow?
I know you're not married, sowe're just going to just talk
about dating.
Okay, we're just going to talkabout the dating part of it.
What is your most memorablerelationship, Like just the best
(03:31):
relationship that you've everhad?
Tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
The best relationship I've ever had came to me after
I no longer had thatrelationship.
So it was the rear view mirrorand what was good about it?
What I remember most was wewere different.
(03:56):
We were just different, and Ithink that was my attraction.
I was attracted to thedifference because, in my mind,
when I get into relationships,while I want my lady or my woman
to be special to me and giveherself to me in the different
(04:22):
ways that women do affection,love, emotions, whatever I still
want to recognize her as anindividual.
And that relationship was athat was special.
That was a great one, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Now, that is interesting.
I got another question for youbecause first we just go through
some questions.
I promise it's going to relateto genetics, but I just want to
kind of talk you through somethings that may be relatable to
everyone.
So let's talk about your worstrelationship.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
My worst relationship .
I didn't have to wait until itwas over because I knew I had to
get out of that.
My worst relationship involvedphysical I'm not going to say
physical abuse, but it involvedsome physicality.
(05:26):
And what happened was I didn'tknow I was involved with someone
who didn't mind physicallygetting into it.
I came from a family where myfather physically abused my mom
when I was a younger child andas a result of that, that's why
(05:47):
they became divorced.
That's why my mom got divorcedfrom my dad.
My takeaway from that was that,you know, I don't hit women, I
don't put my hands on women.
And it was five of us boys andwe only had one sister.
She was the oldest, so it wasjust easy for me to process it
that way.
And when I got involved withthis one relationship, she put
(06:13):
her hands on me.
She did things like thatinvolved what some courts would
call weapons, you know.
And that was the worst for me,because there was nothing in me
looking for an excuse to becomelike that.
And I remember telling her oneday that when our relationship
(06:37):
is through, you're gonna getinvolved with somebody and
they're gonna be very happy togo hand in hand with you they
won't have an issue with it.
And I used to tell her mom andher brothers you know I could
just punch it in the stomach andit'd be all over with.
But why would I do it?
It's nothing in me that makesme wanna do that.
(06:58):
The other side of that was Iwasn't gonna stay in that
relationship.
So that was the worst for me,because I am not the type of man
that says because she hit me, Ihave the right to hit her.
My morality, when I think aboutthat, rises above the legality
(07:21):
of it.
So I'm not an individual who dothings based on how the law is
written.
So for me that was terrible.
That was I had to get out ofthat.
So that was the worst for me.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Wow, that was deep talk and I'm gonna say this at
the end of the show, but I wannatake a moment to say it now
Domestic violence is not okayand if you are in need of help
with domestic violence, whetheryou are a man, woman or child,
please call the NationalDomestic Violence Hotline at
(07:58):
1-800-799-7233.
They also have a text.
You can text the word START to887-88.
Thank you, todd, it's not okay.
So I want to make sure thatthere are resources out there,
(08:18):
because we do have people whodeal with aggression, we do have
people who deal with domesticviolence in different ways and
we want to make sure that theyunderstand that there's support
available.
So I wanted to do that to notforget or to get help right away
.
But when you're in a situationlike that, where there is
(08:42):
aggression, there is abuse,there is hostility, what
recommendations would you havefor somebody in a situation like
that?
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Well, I'm always a believer that your situation or
circumstances, things thathappen to you, have a tendency
to reveal you.
So, in most cases, when you'rein a committed relationship and
I've never been married I'vebeen engaged before, not married
though it's like a processbegins.
(09:14):
So you know what is thatprocess?
Well, you know, for me, youremove yourself from that
situation.
That's how I look at that.
I am not a believer that.
You know.
You just started hitting peoplewhen you got to me, because I
don't walk around with thehitting signals saying hit me.
(09:35):
You know, there's nothing aboutme, I just don't do it.
So for me, I would say beginthe process of removing yourself
from there and doing thatprocess.
You will see that monster pokehis head out again or not, I'm
not sure, but that's just whatit is for me.
(09:56):
I can't tolerate it.
I don't have any tolerance forit.
So, yeah, I might stand inrelationship itself for a minute
, but make no mistake about it,I'm beginning the process, and
that's what happened in thatcase.
While I was still in therelationship, I went inside the
lease for apartment.
I had the keys and the nexttime it became like that, I just
(10:18):
went to my new apartment that Ihad already signed the lease
for a year, and you know we gottogether a little bit after that
, but that's her putting herhands on me was something that I
had nothing to do with, Icouldn't even control, that was
something that was in her and sofor me you remove yourself from
(10:40):
it.
I'm just with the removal plan.
I don't have a version thatsays he just loves you.
There's too many other waysthat he can love you.
She just loves you.
There's too many other waysthat she can love.
Like I said, if I could justhit it in the stomach like every
time I could just bang you inyour stomach, but I didn't do it
.
I didn't even want to do it.
So my mind is removal.
(11:01):
I'm sorry, I don't.
There's not a class to takewhere I'm a, I'm a buy-in about.
He just slapped you once, orshe just meets you once or
without, but to me it's removal.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
And I think you hit some key points there, todd.
You have to have yourboundaries and know when it's
time to just remove yourselffrom the situation and have your
escape plan.
So where your exit plan?
I think that you did an amazingjob summing that up.
So I appreciate you for sharingand being so open with us,
because that is something that'sdifficult to talk about and you
(11:37):
don't hear.
A lot of men talk about beingabused in situations, and they
are.
There are women who who hitbecause guess what?
They have the same genes thatwe're going to be talking about
later that men have, and some ofthese genes in our bodies cold
for aggression, they cold forviolence, they cold for these
(12:01):
types of things.
And when you think aboutepigenetics and the environment
and the experiences that you gounder, it becomes a natural
transition to see how thesethings are happening.
But it's up to us to takecontrol of our genes, and that's
what this podcast is about.
That's what we're here for Totalk about understanding that
(12:24):
these things exist but, moreimportantly, how we empower
ourselves to change, control andprevent these things that are
happening.
So I just want to take a momentto thank you for your
candidness and your honesty inthe conversation.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Well, I want to say I appreciate you hearing me out
and yeah, I mean, you're welcomeand I have a brother, one of my
four brothers.
You know we were we're a yearapart and we stood in front of
the same set of circumstanceswhere my dad was physically
(13:03):
abused in my mom and that's whyI say to people it's not
necessarily what happens, it'show you process it, because he
was physically abusive towardsgirlfriends and I've said to him
before when we was growing uphow can you get your woman who
became his wife and still gothit, how can you do that after
(13:26):
what we saw as kids?
But I had to understand becauseI wasn't sophisticated enough
to understand that that twopeople can be put in front of
the same experience but theyprocess it different because of
their psychic persona and howthey make sense of it.
That's why when people try topeople do they try to impose a
(13:49):
will or say all of you shouldlook at it this way because all
of you stood in front of it.
It's not true, because it's notwhat happens as far as I'm
concerned, it's how you processit.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
And I think you're 100% correct.
That's why we have a quarterlaw, because it's how you
process it and we have to takeresponsibility for our actions.
I do have a comment from theaudience.
You know, today we're recordingwith a live studio audience and
so they have comments, theyhave questions, and one audience
(14:21):
member just commented thevulnerability is refreshing.
Tak accredited his non-violenceresponse to his experiences.
However, people get trappedinto the cycle and see violence
as a way of life.
I command Tak for hisself-control and ability to
refrain from violence.
(14:42):
This is DNA play a role in hisresponse versus the way others
react or respond?
That's a great question.
We appreciate you for sharingyour question, thank you.
We will say that his DNA playsa part as much as his aggressor
(15:05):
or attackers DNA plays a part.
There are several genes thatwe're going to talk about today
and, as a host, remember it's abig thing, right, we're just
kind of taking it piece by piece, little by little, and
understanding this thing as muchas we can.
Interpersonal relationships arecomplex and they are influenced
(15:26):
by a variety of factors,including genetics.
While genetics can play a rolein shaping certain aspects of
personality or behavior thataffect how individuals interact
with others.
It's important to note thathuman behavior is also
influenced by environmentalfactors and personal experiences
(15:46):
.
We're going to just go over afew genes and how they have been
studied in relation tointerpersonal relationships and
maybe after we talk about ECG,just to keep you all awake, I
ask Todd, give me an example ofa relationship where it is a
time where you felt this Okay,just to keep you all awake, and
(16:09):
then maybe we'll do somethingfun at the end.
Let me just see what I cancreate over here.
The first gene we're going totalk about is going to be
axotaxin receptor gene, oxtr.
Axotaxin is often referred toas the love hormone or bonding
(16:30):
hormone, because it is involvedin social bonding, trust,
empathy, breastfeeding.
Variations in the OXTR genehave been associated with
differences in social behavior,including how individuals form
and maintain relationships.
(16:52):
So, todd, give me a time whereyou felt your love hormone was
activated or your bondinghormone was activated Maybe a
girlfriend or a child, you cantell me about a parent and just
a quick example of when youthink that gene was activated.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
I've learned.
When I'm in someone's space,let's say, I'm physically
attracted to a woman, so I likewhat I see, it's eye candy at
that point, and somethinghappens through some interaction
, and now we're closer, we're inclose proximity.
Now, when I initially see awoman and I'm physically
(17:35):
attracted to a woman just fromthe eye candy, my hormones are
not activated.
I don't really physicallydesire that woman.
I'm basically enjoying what Isee because, like I said, it's
eye candy.
But when I'm in a closeproximity probably about five
(17:58):
inches to maybe 18 inches andI'm in there and all of a sudden
I feel excited, then I know I'mphysically attracted to her.
I don't think she's cute, Idon't think she's sexy from
across the room.
I'm really physically attracted.
What I typically do, though, isI wait until I'm around a
(18:21):
second or third time, and ifthat happens the second or third
time, then, unless she'smarried or she makes it clear
what's going on, and evensometimes, when they do, I say
something, because I have to getit off my chest.
See, I'm like this, I'm not aquarter, I can't drag it out,
just hurry up and tell me no, soI'm just keeping it.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Tak, we love your insight.
I'm going to keep putting youon the spot until you tell me to
stop.
I mean, it's so much goodinformation, so here's the next
one.
You ready?
Serotonin transporter geneS-L-C-6-A-4 is the nickname
Serotonin is a neurotransmitterinvolved in mood regulation and
(19:06):
social behavior.
Variations in this serotonintransporter gene have been
associated with differences insocial anxiety, attachment
styles you know you get thatgirlfriend is overly clingy mood
regulation, all of which canimpact interpersonal
(19:28):
relationships.
Give me an example where youfeel, or you remember or you
first thought about when wetalked about this serotonin
neurotransmitter being activated, where you're talking about
your mood and how you attach topeople or you feel anxious in
certain situations.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
So, yeah, so I've been in different.
I've been in differentrelationships where on the one,
it was pretty laid back, right.
I was like, okay, I was intoher, we interacted, just that,
just that that.
And then I've been in otherrelationships and it's like I
couldn't get enough.
I just couldn't get enough.
When we would leave, like we goout to dinner or something and
(20:12):
I drop off or whatever that is,I wanted to talk to her some
more.
I just could not get enough ofthis person and at one time I
was like is she playing me?
Is she like starving me ofemotions, or is she with the
house happening?
You know what I'm saying, likewhat's going on, and I'm not
talking about I couldn't getenough physicality or sexuality
(20:37):
from her.
I just wanted to be like withher.
It was crazy.
So those, those are kind of thevariants down, and that's not
typical of me, though, but whenit happens, yeah, that happens.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
So you can feel it.
So you're feeling these genesLike, here's the next one.
You ready?
I only have one more after thisone.
I'm not going to, I'm not goingto overpower you with these
genes, or maybe I will.
Let's see Double main receptorgenes.
We got the DRD2, the DRD4.
Those are two different genes.
(21:12):
Double main is aneurotransmitter associated with
reward and pleasure.
Genetic variations in doublemain receptor genes such as DRD2
and DRD4 have been linked topersonality traits related to
sociability.
So how social you are,sensational seeking.
(21:34):
So what kind of thrills, whatkind of how are you seeking to
activate your senses and risktaking?
Right?
How, how big of a risk are youwilling to take which can
influence as a personalrelationship?
So we talk about activatingthat reward and pleasure center,
(21:55):
right?
Tell me about the firstsituation or experience that
came to your mind when youthought about reward,
fulfillment, thrill, excitement.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I think I've recognized it as cooperation
Meaning when I'm around a womanand the conversation is being
we're holding the conversationor we're close proximity.
We may be in the gathering ofthree or five people If I'm
talking about a particular thingand and she may be discussing
(22:31):
something, if we start bouncingit off of each other, in other
words, something might be saidwhere nothing could be responded
, or to the nail, to the yay,and if she begins finding the
reason to say something positive, say something inclusive of her
thoughts, in that that sort ofbecomes like a short term reward
(22:54):
for this little interaction,this little social engineering.
And then what I do is you know,I don't drink and I don't smoke
, I mean there's just, I justdon't do it.
Whoever does it, wonderful, Ijust don't do it.
So what I typically do when thathappens to make sure I'm not
tripping is, the next time I getaround her I try to see what
that energy is and if she'sstill showing some reciprocity
(23:18):
or some some Stimulow feedbackto the things that I'm saying,
when she could choose to go adifferent direction or point it
somewhere else, then I startsaying, okay, I'm not tripping,
something's here.
So that's kind of the examplefor me, and once I start getting
that, you know I read this bookby I think his name is Charles
(23:39):
do Higg and he talks aboutforming a habit where, like you
said, there's the Q, there's theroutine and there's the reward,
or sometimes it's actually fouror five layers to that.
That's what I fall into and Ibecome, you know, aware or
cognizant of that for thatparticular person, and then
sometimes things happen.
So Talk.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
I just want to thank you again for sharing that,
because you're sharing thingsthat even I can relate to, so I
know that that people listen toour listeners.
Our audience, our friends aregrateful for this and they can
identify with a lot of it.
So one of our live studioaudience members have a question
(24:22):
for you and just calling withthe following question how does
my DNA affect the way I parentand, based on my DNA, with my
siblings parents the same way asI do?
And I joined the video this time, so it is something called
every genetics.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Dr Montgomery, epidemiotics could affect that
right.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Angie is calling and you know there is a number of
things is complicated.
It's just like saying will allof my siblings be the same
height?
Why don't we all look alike?
And, like talk said from aprevious episode, epigenetics,
right.
So the environment is going toplay a huge role in how we
(25:08):
process our genes, our behaviors, our foods, our height.
So it's not going to be exact.
Will you all have some similartraits?
Possibly.
But, Angie, go ahead and sharewith us your question and tell
us where you're calling from.
Hello, I'm Collin fromMinneapolis, Minnesota, and I
(25:29):
was wondering how my DNA affectsmy parenting style and if my
siblings would have similartraits or the same parenting
styles that I have.
And that is a great question.
We do see similarities, butthere is not a dedicated end-all
(25:49):
be-all to saying it's going tobe the same.
It's going to be a number offactors and remember, it's a
puzzle.
So you've got environment,you've got feelings, you've got
emotions, you've got lifeexperiences, and then you and
your siblings won't have theexact genes from the parents,
right?
So you're going to have partsfrom mom and dad, but you may
(26:12):
have different parts from momand dad.
So mom and dad are going togive each of you 50% of what
they've got, but it won't be thesame 50%.
Thank you for your call.
We'll let you continue to enjoyfrom our audience Talk.
That was a great question.
I didn't get any follow-upquestions from the audience, so
I'm going to go to the next gene, Vasopressin receptor gene
(26:36):
AVPR1A.
Vasopressin is another hormoneinvolved in social bonding and
aggression.
Genetic variations in thevasopressin receptor gene.
So when the hormone is secreted, released, it's got to be
picked up by something.
You see those puzzles and youknow how each piece kind of fits
(26:59):
together.
Would it surprise you to knowthat those are formed out of our
bodies, Like it's formed offthe concept of for everything
that your body produces, everyhormone that's secreted, every
enzyme that's secreted, there'sa specific shape to it.
That shape is attributed orcompromised.
That shape is attributed orcomprised of chemicals, such as
(27:28):
your CH and your CH.
You know our organic chart orour periodic chart, those
elements on there.
Those are giving us signals andso it's all about.
We separate it to make it moredigestible.
So you'll hear about biology,chemistry, physics, biochem, but
(27:50):
all of these things are workingtogether at one time in your
body and it is helping thingsidentify what picks up?
What am I attracted to?
How do I identify my receptoror my partner?
All of these things are alreadypre-programmed within us, Our
on switches, our off switches.
(28:11):
So you got to stay with me.
I promise you, over the nextcouple of episodes we're going
to unpack this and by the timewe get to episode 100.
You all will be like okay, Iget it, I get it, this is easy,
(28:31):
it's just going to startclicking, clicking, clicking
right.
All of these things kind of gotogether, and so we're talking
now about these hormones and howthey have the variations in the
genes, and then we're lookingfor the receptors.
These receptors are associatedwith differences in pair bonding
, so how they are received toeach other.
(28:53):
That is attributed to behavior,social recognition and
aggression, Like when we talkedabout the violence in the
relationship and that kind ofthing, all of which influence
interpersonal relationships.
So when you think about it interms of while I'm already
(29:17):
pre-coded for that, and then youadd your own life experiences
to it, and your own environment,and your own food, diet,
nutrition, your own toxins, yourown chemicals, if you choose to
drink or smoke or participatein other activities, or even if
(29:42):
you have prescription medicatedactivities.
These are all going to playinto those receptors and those
things that are alreadybiochemically happening within
your body.
So when you think about yoursocial bonding and aggression,
do you start to understand howthe genes that you're already
(30:04):
pre-wired for are getting thechance to express themselves in
these relationships?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
You know, thought, experience, time lens to, I
could say, wisdom is a drop.
You know, you start makingsense out of these things and
for me, I could see it.
I could see it happening.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
And I want people to start.
This is kind of where I am.
I want our audience, ourlisteners, our friends to start
thinking about everything thatthey're doing in terms of
relationships, including howtheir genetics play a part to it
, because when we're thinkingabout a problem or we're
(30:46):
thinking about something that wewant to solve, improve or make
better, we have to look at allof the things that contribute to
or become a factor in that, andthat includes our genetics.
Sometimes we think about ourparents or our previous
(31:07):
relationships.
We think about other thingsthat have happened to us in our
lives or even with our parents,and we start blaming mom or
blaming dad.
But when we are handling thesethings and we're talking about
how to improve theserelationships, I just want us to
(31:27):
be mindful that there's more atplay.
So thank you, toc, for sharingso much about your intimate life
and your relationships.
I'm going to invite you back aswe start thinking about
questions that other people mayhave or that our listeners email
us in.
Sometimes I get things in theDM.
(31:48):
I want to continue thisrelationship journey because I
think it's a lot to unpack.
So, as we conclude thisinsightful first step in our
journey through the genetic bondand how DNA shapes our
relationships.
We myself, your host, your girl, dr Symphony Montgomery, and
(32:11):
our co-host today and guest, tocWilliams, want to thank you for
being a part of today'sconversation.
Through this episode, weventured into the genetic
intricacies that underpin ourfamilial and romantic
relationships, shedding light onhow our genetic blueprints
(32:34):
influences our interactionsthroughout our life.
At DemystifyingDNA, our coremission is to make the
sophisticated realm of geneticsaccessible and comprehensible to
all, stripping away the jargonto reveal the fascinating truths
(32:56):
to connect us all at themolecular level.
We hope this episode hassparked your curiosity and
enhanced your understanding ofgenetic ties that bind us,
encouraging a deeperappreciation for the role of DNA
in shaping the essence of ourrelationships.
(33:17):
Stay engaged, keep questioningand continue to join us on
DemystifyingDNA, where we makethe wonders of genetics easy to
understand for everyone.
Together, let's explore themarvels of our genetic makeup
(33:38):
and how it influences everyfacet of our lives.
Remember we're here to guideyou through the genetic journey,
making science easy to consumeand meaningful.
And lastly, don't forget we arewith you every step of the way.
(34:00):
National Domestic ViolenceHotline 1-800-799-7233, or you
can text the wordSTART-S-T-A-R-T 288-788.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
P-23.
Knowledge, access, power, p-23,wellness and Understanding at
your fingertips.
P-23.
And that's no cap.
P23 Knowledge, access , power.
P23, wellness and Understandingat your fingertips P23.
And that's no cap.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Welcome back to Demystifying DNA, your Beacon in
the Fascinating World ofGenetics, where we break down
complex scientific concepts intounderstandable and engaging
content.
I'm your host, dr TiffanyMontgomery, scientist,
(00:46):
epidemiologist, not a medicaldoctor or psychiatrist, but I'm
still that curious lady helpingguide you through every step of
the way.
And today I'm accompanied by myinsightful co-host, tac
Williams, relationshiptechnology and computer
(01:07):
extraordinaire.
You all have met him before.
Welcome, tac.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
How's it going?
Dr Montgomery, thank you forhaving me back.
You know I enjoy joining thisplatform, especially with the
subject matter we're about tospeak on in a minute.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
And today's topic is all about relationships.
She said, dr Montgomery, howdoes that go?
What does relationship has todo with genetics, but allow me
to walk you through it.
You all know I love takingthings that are as simple as
every day and bringing itforward into a way that
(01:46):
translates to science.
I want you all to eat this,live this, breathe this and
enjoy it as much as I do.
So today's episode we're goingto just talk about genetics and
the factors that it plays intodifferent relationships.
I promise that we're going tohave a enlightening exploration
(02:08):
into how our genes influence themost intimate aspects of our
lives.
Our mission is to demystifygenetics, making it accessible
and relatable to everyone,whether you're a science
enthusiast or simply curiousabout genetics and how it plays
(02:28):
a role in your dailyinteractions and relationships.
We are here for it.
As we delve into the sciencebehind genetic influences on
relationships, we aim toilluminate the intricate ways in
which our DNA contributes tothe bonds we form, the
relationships we have and thepeople that we are.
(02:51):
Let's dive into this journeytogether, making the complex
world of genetics easy tounderstand for everyone.
So talk, I have to admit Itricked you here.
You thought it was a geneticspodcast, but you're more like my
human experiment.
Okay.
(03:11):
So we're, going to just ask youa couple of questions.
I want to know Well, what isnow?
I know you're not married, sowe're just going to just talk
about dating.
Okay, we're just going to talkabout the dating part of it.
What is your most memorablerelationship, Like just the best
(03:31):
relationship that you've everhad?
Tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
The best relationship I've ever had came to me after
I no longer had thatrelationship.
So it was the rear view mirrorand what was good about it?
What I remember most was wewere different.
(03:56):
We were just different, and Ithink that was my attraction.
I was attracted to thedifference because, in my mind,
when I get into relationships,while I want my lady or my woman
to be special to me and giveherself to me in the different
(04:22):
ways that women do affection,love, emotions, whatever I still
want to recognize her as anindividual.
And that relationship was athat was special.
That was a great one, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Now, that is interesting.
I got another question for youbecause first we just go through
some questions.
I promise it's going to relateto genetics, but I just want to
kind of talk you through somethings that may be relatable to
everyone.
So let's talk about your worstrelationship.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
My worst relationship .
I didn't have to wait until itwas over because I knew I had to
get out of that.
My worst relationship involvedphysical I'm not going to say
physical abuse, but it involvedsome physicality.
(05:26):
And what happened was I didn'tknow I was involved with someone
who didn't mind physicallygetting into it.
I came from a family where myfather physically abused my mom
when I was a younger child andas a result of that, that's why
(05:47):
they became divorced.
That's why my mom got divorcedfrom my dad.
My takeaway from that was that,you know, I don't hit women, I
don't put my hands on women.
And it was five of us boys andwe only had one sister.
She was the oldest, so it wasjust easy for me to process it
that way.
And when I got involved withthis one relationship, she put
(06:13):
her hands on me.
She did things like thatinvolved what some courts would
call weapons, you know.
And that was the worst for me,because there was nothing in me
looking for an excuse to becomelike that.
And I remember telling her oneday that when our relationship
(06:37):
is through, you're gonna getinvolved with somebody and
they're gonna be very happy togo hand in hand with you they
won't have an issue with it.
And I used to tell her mom andher brothers you know I could
just punch it in the stomach andit'd be all over with.
But why would I do it?
It's nothing in me that makesme wanna do that.
(06:58):
The other side of that was Iwasn't gonna stay in that
relationship.
So that was the worst for me,because I am not the type of man
that says because she hit me, Ihave the right to hit her.
My morality, when I think aboutthat, rises above the legality
(07:21):
of it.
So I'm not an individual who dothings based on how the law is
written.
So for me that was terrible.
That was I had to get out ofthat.
So that was the worst for me.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Wow, that was deep talk and I'm gonna say this at
the end of the show, but I wannatake a moment to say it now
Domestic violence is not okayand if you are in need of help
with domestic violence, whetheryou are a man, woman or child,
please call the NationalDomestic Violence Hotline at
(07:58):
1-800-799-7233.
They also have a text.
You can text the word START to887-88.
Thank you, todd, it's not okay.
So I want to make sure thatthere are resources out there,
(08:18):
because we do have people whodeal with aggression, we do have
people who deal with domesticviolence in different ways and
we want to make sure that theyunderstand that there's support
available.
So I wanted to do that to notforget or to get help right away
.
But when you're in a situationlike that, where there is
(08:42):
aggression, there is abuse,there is hostility, what
recommendations would you havefor somebody in a situation like
that?
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Well, I'm always a believer that your situation or
circumstances, things thathappen to you, have a tendency
to reveal you.
So, in most cases, when you'rein a committed relationship and
I've never been married I'vebeen engaged before, not married
though it's like a processbegins.
(09:14):
So you know what is thatprocess?
Well, you know, for me, youremove yourself from that
situation.
That's how I look at that.
I am not a believer that.
You know.
You just started hitting peoplewhen you got to me, because I
don't walk around with thehitting signals saying hit me.
(09:35):
You know, there's nothing aboutme, I just don't do it.
So for me, I would say beginthe process of removing yourself
from there and doing thatprocess.
You will see that monster pokehis head out again or not, I'm
not sure, but that's just whatit is for me.
(09:56):
I can't tolerate it.
I don't have any tolerance forit.
So, yeah, I might stand inrelationship itself for a minute
, but make no mistake about it,I'm beginning the process, and
that's what happened in thatcase.
While I was still in therelationship, I went inside the
lease for apartment.
I had the keys and the nexttime it became like that, I just
(10:18):
went to my new apartment that Ihad already signed the lease
for a year, and you know we gottogether a little bit after that
, but that's her putting herhands on me was something that I
had nothing to do with, Icouldn't even control, that was
something that was in her and sofor me you remove yourself from
(10:40):
it.
I'm just with the removal plan.
I don't have a version thatsays he just loves you.
There's too many other waysthat he can love you.
She just loves you.
There's too many other waysthat she can love.
Like I said, if I could justhit it in the stomach like every
time I could just bang you inyour stomach, but I didn't do it
.
I didn't even want to do it.
So my mind is removal.
(11:01):
I'm sorry, I don't.
There's not a class to takewhere I'm a, I'm a buy-in about.
He just slapped you once, orshe just meets you once or
without, but to me it's removal.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
And I think you hit some key points there, todd.
You have to have yourboundaries and know when it's
time to just remove yourselffrom the situation and have your
escape plan.
So where your exit plan?
I think that you did an amazingjob summing that up.
So I appreciate you for sharingand being so open with us,
because that is something that'sdifficult to talk about and you
(11:37):
don't hear.
A lot of men talk about beingabused in situations, and they
are.
There are women who who hitbecause guess what?
They have the same genes thatwe're going to be talking about
later that men have, and some ofthese genes in our bodies cold
for aggression, they cold forviolence, they cold for these
(12:01):
types of things.
And when you think aboutepigenetics and the environment
and the experiences that you gounder, it becomes a natural
transition to see how thesethings are happening.
But it's up to us to takecontrol of our genes, and that's
what this podcast is about.
That's what we're here for Totalk about understanding that
(12:24):
these things exist but, moreimportantly, how we empower
ourselves to change, control andprevent these things that are
happening.
So I just want to take a momentto thank you for your
candidness and your honesty inthe conversation.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Well, I want to say I appreciate you hearing me out
and yeah, I mean, you're welcomeand I have a brother, one of my
four brothers.
You know we were we're a yearapart and we stood in front of
the same set of circumstanceswhere my dad was physically
(13:03):
abused in my mom and that's whyI say to people it's not
necessarily what happens, it'show you process it, because he
was physically abusive towardsgirlfriends and I've said to him
before when we was growing uphow can you get your woman who
became his wife and still gothit, how can you do that after
(13:26):
what we saw as kids?
But I had to understand becauseI wasn't sophisticated enough
to understand that that twopeople can be put in front of
the same experience but theyprocess it different because of
their psychic persona and howthey make sense of it.
That's why when people try topeople do they try to impose a
(13:49):
will or say all of you shouldlook at it this way because all
of you stood in front of it.
It's not true, because it's notwhat happens as far as I'm
concerned, it's how you processit.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
And I think you're 100% correct.
That's why we have a quarterlaw, because it's how you
process it and we have to takeresponsibility for our actions.
I do have a comment from theaudience.
You know, today we're recordingwith a live studio audience and
so they have comments, theyhave questions, and one audience
(14:21):
member just commented thevulnerability is refreshing.
Tak accredited his non-violenceresponse to his experiences.
However, people get trappedinto the cycle and see violence
as a way of life.
I command Tak for hisself-control and ability to
refrain from violence.
(14:42):
This is DNA play a role in hisresponse versus the way others
react or respond?
That's a great question.
We appreciate you for sharingyour question, thank you.
We will say that his DNA playsa part as much as his aggressor
(15:05):
or attackers DNA plays a part.
There are several genes thatwe're going to talk about today
and, as a host, remember it's abig thing, right, we're just
kind of taking it piece by piece, little by little, and
understanding this thing as muchas we can.
Interpersonal relationships arecomplex and they are influenced
(15:26):
by a variety of factors,including genetics.
While genetics can play a rolein shaping certain aspects of
personality or behavior thataffect how individuals interact
with others.
It's important to note thathuman behavior is also
influenced by environmentalfactors and personal experiences
(15:46):
.
We're going to just go over afew genes and how they have been
studied in relation tointerpersonal relationships and
maybe after we talk about ECG,just to keep you all awake, I
ask Todd, give me an example ofa relationship where it is a
time where you felt this Okay,just to keep you all awake, and
(16:09):
then maybe we'll do somethingfun at the end.
Let me just see what I cancreate over here.
The first gene we're going totalk about is going to be
axotaxin receptor gene, oxtr.
Axotaxin is often referred toas the love hormone or bonding
(16:30):
hormone, because it is involvedin social bonding, trust,
empathy, breastfeeding.
Variations in the OXTR genehave been associated with
differences in social behavior,including how individuals form
and maintain relationships.
(16:52):
So, todd, give me a time whereyou felt your love hormone was
activated or your bondinghormone was activated Maybe a
girlfriend or a child, you cantell me about a parent and just
a quick example of when youthink that gene was activated.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
I've learned.
When I'm in someone's space,let's say, I'm physically
attracted to a woman, so I likewhat I see, it's eye candy at
that point, and somethinghappens through some interaction
, and now we're closer, we're inclose proximity.
Now, when I initially see awoman and I'm physically
(17:35):
attracted to a woman just fromthe eye candy, my hormones are
not activated.
I don't really physicallydesire that woman.
I'm basically enjoying what Isee because, like I said, it's
eye candy.
But when I'm in a closeproximity probably about five
(17:58):
inches to maybe 18 inches andI'm in there and all of a sudden
I feel excited, then I know I'mphysically attracted to her.
I don't think she's cute, Idon't think she's sexy from
across the room.
I'm really physically attracted.
What I typically do, though, isI wait until I'm around a
(18:21):
second or third time, and ifthat happens the second or third
time, then, unless she'smarried or she makes it clear
what's going on, and evensometimes, when they do, I say
something, because I have to getit off my chest.
See, I'm like this, I'm not aquarter, I can't drag it out,
just hurry up and tell me no, soI'm just keeping it.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Tak, we love your insight.
I'm going to keep putting youon the spot until you tell me to
stop.
I mean, it's so much goodinformation, so here's the next
one.
You ready?
Serotonin transporter geneS-L-C-6-A-4 is the nickname
Serotonin is a neurotransmitterinvolved in mood regulation and
(19:06):
social behavior.
Variations in this serotonintransporter gene have been
associated with differences insocial anxiety, attachment
styles you know you get thatgirlfriend is overly clingy mood
regulation, all of which canimpact interpersonal
(19:28):
relationships.
Give me an example where youfeel, or you remember or you
first thought about when wetalked about this serotonin
neurotransmitter being activated, where you're talking about
your mood and how you attach topeople or you feel anxious in
certain situations.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
So, yeah, so I've been in different.
I've been in differentrelationships where on the one,
it was pretty laid back, right.
I was like, okay, I was intoher, we interacted, just that,
just that that.
And then I've been in otherrelationships and it's like I
couldn't get enough.
I just couldn't get enough.
When we would leave, like we goout to dinner or something and
(20:12):
I drop off or whatever that is,I wanted to talk to her some
more.
I just could not get enough ofthis person and at one time I
was like is she playing me?
Is she like starving me ofemotions, or is she with the
house happening?
You know what I'm saying, likewhat's going on, and I'm not
talking about I couldn't getenough physicality or sexuality
(20:37):
from her.
I just wanted to be like withher.
It was crazy.
So those, those are kind of thevariants down, and that's not
typical of me, though, but whenit happens, yeah, that happens.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
So you can feel it.
So you're feeling these genesLike, here's the next one.
You ready?
I only have one more after thisone.
I'm not going to, I'm not goingto overpower you with these
genes, or maybe I will.
Let's see Double main receptorgenes.
We got the DRD2, the DRD4.
Those are two different genes.
(21:12):
Double main is aneurotransmitter associated with
reward and pleasure.
Genetic variations in doublemain receptor genes such as DRD2
and DRD4 have been linked topersonality traits related to
sociability.
So how social you are,sensational seeking.
(21:34):
So what kind of thrills, whatkind of how are you seeking to
activate your senses and risktaking?
Right?
How, how big of a risk are youwilling to take which can
influence as a personalrelationship?
So we talk about activatingthat reward and pleasure center,
(21:55):
right?
Tell me about the firstsituation or experience that
came to your mind when youthought about reward,
fulfillment, thrill, excitement.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
I think I've recognized it as cooperation
Meaning when I'm around a womanand the conversation is being
we're holding the conversationor we're close proximity.
We may be in the gathering ofthree or five people If I'm
talking about a particular thingand and she may be discussing
(22:31):
something, if we start bouncingit off of each other, in other
words, something might be saidwhere nothing could be responded
, or to the nail, to the yay,and if she begins finding the
reason to say something positive, say something inclusive of her
thoughts, in that that sort ofbecomes like a short term reward
(22:54):
for this little interaction,this little social engineering.
And then what I do is you know,I don't drink and I don't smoke
, I mean there's just, I justdon't do it.
Whoever does it, wonderful, Ijust don't do it.
So what I typically do when thathappens to make sure I'm not
tripping is, the next time I getaround her I try to see what
that energy is and if she'sstill showing some reciprocity
(23:18):
or some some Stimulow feedbackto the things that I'm saying,
when she could choose to go adifferent direction or point it
somewhere else, then I startsaying, okay, I'm not tripping,
something's here.
So that's kind of the examplefor me, and once I start getting
that, you know I read this bookby I think his name is Charles
(23:39):
do Higg and he talks aboutforming a habit where, like you
said, there's the Q, there's theroutine and there's the reward,
or sometimes it's actually fouror five layers to that.
That's what I fall into and Ibecome, you know, aware or
cognizant of that for thatparticular person, and then
sometimes things happen.
So Talk.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
I just want to thank you again for sharing that,
because you're sharing thingsthat even I can relate to, so I
know that that people listen toour listeners.
Our audience, our friends aregrateful for this and they can
identify with a lot of it.
So one of our live studioaudience members have a question
(24:22):
for you and just calling withthe following question how does
my DNA affect the way I parentand, based on my DNA, with my
siblings parents the same way asI do?
And I joined the video this time, so it is something called
every genetics.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Dr Montgomery, epidemiotics could affect that
right.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Angie is calling and you know there is a number of
things is complicated.
It's just like saying will allof my siblings be the same
height?
Why don't we all look alike?
And, like talk said from aprevious episode, epigenetics,
right.
So the environment is going toplay a huge role in how we
(25:08):
process our genes, our behaviors, our foods, our height.
So it's not going to be exact.
Will you all have some similartraits?
Possibly.
But, Angie, go ahead and sharewith us your question and tell
us where you're calling from.
Hello, I'm Collin fromMinneapolis, Minnesota, and I
(25:29):
was wondering how my DNA affectsmy parenting style and if my
siblings would have similartraits or the same parenting
styles that I have.
And that is a great question.
We do see similarities, butthere is not a dedicated end-all
(25:49):
be-all to saying it's going tobe the same.
It's going to be a number offactors and remember, it's a
puzzle.
So you've got environment,you've got feelings, you've got
emotions, you've got lifeexperiences, and then you and
your siblings won't have theexact genes from the parents,
right?
So you're going to have partsfrom mom and dad, but you may
(26:12):
have different parts from momand dad.
So mom and dad are going togive each of you 50% of what
they've got, but it won't be thesame 50%.
Thank you for your call.
We'll let you continue to enjoyfrom our audience Talk.
That was a great question.
I didn't get any follow-upquestions from the audience, so
I'm going to go to the next gene, Vasopressin receptor gene
(26:36):
AVPR1A.
Vasopressin is another hormoneinvolved in social bonding and
aggression.
Genetic variations in thevasopressin receptor gene.
So when the hormone is secreted, released, it's got to be
picked up by something.
You see those puzzles and youknow how each piece kind of fits
(26:59):
together.
Would it surprise you to knowthat those are formed out of our
bodies, Like it's formed offthe concept of for everything
that your body produces, everyhormone that's secreted, every
enzyme that's secreted, there'sa specific shape to it.
That shape is attributed orcompromised.
That shape is attributed orcomprised of chemicals, such as
(27:28):
your CH and your CH.
You know our organic chart orour periodic chart, those
elements on there.
Those are giving us signals andso it's all about.
We separate it to make it moredigestible.
So you'll hear about biology,chemistry, physics, biochem, but
(27:50):
all of these things are workingtogether at one time in your
body and it is helping thingsidentify what picks up?
What am I attracted to?
How do I identify my receptoror my partner?
All of these things are alreadypre-programmed within us, Our
on switches, our off switches.
(28:11):
So you got to stay with me.
I promise you, over the nextcouple of episodes we're going
to unpack this and by the timewe get to episode 100.
You all will be like okay, Iget it, I get it, this is easy,
(28:31):
it's just going to startclicking, clicking, clicking
right.
All of these things kind of gotogether, and so we're talking
now about these hormones and howthey have the variations in the
genes, and then we're lookingfor the receptors.
These receptors are associatedwith differences in pair bonding
, so how they are received toeach other.
(28:53):
That is attributed to behavior,social recognition and
aggression, Like when we talkedabout the violence in the
relationship and that kind ofthing, all of which influence
interpersonal relationships.
So when you think about it interms of while I'm already
(29:17):
pre-coded for that, and then youadd your own life experiences
to it, and your own environment,and your own food, diet,
nutrition, your own toxins, yourown chemicals, if you choose to
drink or smoke or participatein other activities, or even if
(29:42):
you have prescription medicatedactivities.
These are all going to playinto those receptors and those
things that are alreadybiochemically happening within
your body.
So when you think about yoursocial bonding and aggression,
do you start to understand howthe genes that you're already
(30:04):
pre-wired for are getting thechance to express themselves in
these relationships?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
You know, thought, experience, time lens to, I
could say, wisdom is a drop.
You know, you start makingsense out of these things and
for me, I could see it.
I could see it happening.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
And I want people to start.
This is kind of where I am.
I want our audience, ourlisteners, our friends to start
thinking about everything thatthey're doing in terms of
relationships, including howtheir genetics play a part to it
, because when we're thinkingabout a problem or we're
(30:46):
thinking about something that wewant to solve, improve or make
better, we have to look at allof the things that contribute to
or become a factor in that, andthat includes our genetics.
Sometimes we think about ourparents or our previous
(31:07):
relationships.
We think about other thingsthat have happened to us in our
lives or even with our parents,and we start blaming mom or
blaming dad.
But when we are handling thesethings and we're talking about
how to improve theserelationships, I just want us to
(31:27):
be mindful that there's more atplay.
So thank you, toc, for sharingso much about your intimate life
and your relationships.
I'm going to invite you back aswe start thinking about
questions that other people mayhave or that our listeners email
us in.
Sometimes I get things in theDM.
(31:48):
I want to continue thisrelationship journey because I
think it's a lot to unpack.
So, as we conclude thisinsightful first step in our
journey through the genetic bondand how DNA shapes our
relationships.
We myself, your host, your girl, dr Symphony Montgomery, and
(32:11):
our co-host today and guest, tocWilliams, want to thank you for
being a part of today'sconversation.
Through this episode, weventured into the genetic
intricacies that underpin ourfamilial and romantic
relationships, shedding light onhow our genetic blueprints
(32:34):
influences our interactionsthroughout our life.
At DemystifyingDNA, our coremission is to make the
sophisticated realm of geneticsaccessible and comprehensible to
all, stripping away the jargonto reveal the fascinating truths
(32:56):
to connect us all at themolecular level.
We hope this episode hassparked your curiosity and
enhanced your understanding ofgenetic ties that bind us,
encouraging a deeperappreciation for the role of DNA
in shaping the essence of ourrelationships.
(33:17):
Stay engaged, keep questioningand continue to join us on
DemystifyingDNA, where we makethe wonders of genetics easy to
understand for everyone.
Together, let's explore themarvels of our genetic makeup
(33:38):
and how it influences everyfacet of our lives.
Remember we're here to guideyou through the genetic journey,
making science easy to consumeand meaningful.
And lastly, don't forget we arewith you every step of the way.
(34:00):
National Domestic ViolenceHotline 1-800-799-7233, or you
can text the wordSTART-S-T-A-R-T 288-788.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
P-23.
Knowledge, access, power, p-23,wellness and Understanding at
your fingertips.
P-23.
And that's no cap.
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On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!