July 20, 2025 • 33 mins
Welcome to episode 37 of the Designing with Love podcast! In this episode, I had the pleasure of interviewing Sakina Brandford, an instructional designer in the corporate industry and recent graduate of the Master of Science in Instructional Design program at Grand Canyon University.
The journey from classroom teaching to corporate instructional design can seem daunting, but it's entirely possible with the right education, strategy, and mindset. In this revealing conversation, recent GCU graduate Sakina Brandford shares her successful transition story just one week into her new role as an instructional design specialist in the oil and gas industry.
Sakina provides a candid look at how GCU's program structure supported her success as a working professional, allowing her to focus on one course at a time while building skills that immediately transferred to the workplace. She shares a crucial insight that helped her stand out in the job market: deliberately creating diverse portfolio pieces across multiple industries rather than focusing solely on educational projects. This strategic approach demonstrated versatility to potential employers and expanded her employment opportunities beyond education.
What does the corporate instructional design world really expect from new hires? Sakina reveals that employers want candidates who already know industry-standard software like Articulate Storyline and can hit the ground running. She describes how her interview process included specific technical questions and how some companies even require candidates to design sample courses during the hiring process. For those still in their master's program, she offers practical advice on building a professional network through LinkedIn, seeking certification programs, and leveraging free resources from professional organizations.
The conversation also explores how AI is transforming the field, from voice-overs to multi-language translations, while balancing concerns about proprietary information. Sakina's journey demonstrates that with proper preparation and a strategic approach, career changers can successfully navigate the transition from education to corporate instructional design. Whether you're currently pursuing your degree or contemplating a career shift, this episode offers valuable insights from someone who has recently made the leap.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jackie Pelegrin (00:01):
Hello and welcome to the Designing with
Love podcast.
I am your host, Jackie Pelegrin, where my goal is to bring you
information, tips and tricks asan instructional designer.
Hello, GCU students, alumni andfellow educators, Welcome to
episode 37 of the Designing withLove podcast.
(00:21):
Today, I have the pleasure ofinterviewing Sakina Branford,
who completed her master'sdegree in instructional design
at GCU.
Welcome, Sakina, Thank you.
Thank you, I'm glad to be here.
Yes, me too.
So when did you earn yourmaster's degree in instructional
design from GCU?
I earned my master's degree inJanuary of this year, 2025, at
(00:47):
the conclusion of ourinstructional design capstone
course, great, wonderful, and Ibelieve you had a chance to come
to Phoenix and come tograduation in person.
So how was that for you?
Did you like that?
Sakina Brandford (01:01):
I really enjoyed it.
I wish I could have stayed alittle bit longer, but I loved.
You know, coming to the campus,I was able to see a little bit
of the campus at the arena.
I was there with my husband anddaughter and we really enjoyed
the ceremony.
It was super exciting.
Everyone, of course, graduationeveryone's super excited.
(01:24):
It was great to be in a roomwith so many educators and
getting an advanced degreefinally yes, Several years being
in the profession.
Jackie Pelegrin (01:38):
That's great, I love it.
And being able to come inperson, there's nothing like
that.
So that's great.
Oh, yeah, yeah, and hopefullyyou'll have a chance to come
back to Phoenix when it's coolerbecause it's warming up.
It's already in the hundredsnow.
You know it's almost June.
We're in the hundreds now, sowe're triple digits.
So hopefully when it cools offusually around, I would say that
(01:59):
, like around Halloween, likelate October, is when it starts
to get really nice.
And so, yeah, hopefully, maybein the fall you can come back
and visit when it's nice andcool.
Come come up and visit GrandCanyon and things like that.
There's so many great things todo up North, so it's a lot of
fun.
Sakina Brandford (02:16):
So yeah, yeah, definitely, I would like.
Jackie Pelegrin (02:18):
to yeah, and then we can maybe go do
something fun.
So that would be great,wonderful.
So what aspects of the programdid you enjoy the most?
When you were taking theclasses and everything?
Sakina Brandford (02:32):
Well, first I would say I really enjoy that
GCU caters to full time workingadults, so I felt like being
able to take one course at atime and concentrate on that one
course.
It really helped me besuccessful in the program.
After about the second course,I was adjusted to the new
(02:57):
schedule and knew exactly whenassignments and discussions were
due.
Assignments and discussionswere due and, like I said, it
really allowed me to besuccessful because I had started
a master's program many yearsago through another university
and I wanted to take one courseat a time.
(03:19):
But due to the structure of theprograms at that time and it
was completely online as well,but I was unable to really
complete it in the time framethat they really required if I
was doing one course at a timefor nine weeks.
Oh, I see, enjoyed being at GCUand being an online student in
(03:44):
the IB program.
I feel like it really isstructured well.
With all the courses one afteranother, you really they build
on each other and you aregaining skills over time course.
(04:09):
It really sets you up forsuccess if you really try to use
some of those tips and thingsthat you learned in the first
course throughout the rest ofthe program because they really
are helpful from, I would say,even looking at some of the job
postings.
That's one of the assignmentsthat we had in the very first
couple of courses.
Jackie Pelegrin (04:25):
Yes, I remember that.
Sakina Brandford (04:35):
Yes, and if you really just kind of peek
into those things in jobpostings throughout your time in
the program, it helps you toknow what skills that employers
are looking for and it canmotivate you along the way when
you're working on yourassignments.
Jackie Pelegrin (04:46):
Yeah in the master's program.
That's great.
So it helps to kind of pavethat path for you and see what
you need to do to get towardsthat dream job that you want,
and yeah, that's really helpful.
Yeah, and you're you're evenutilizing you.
I would imagine you wereutilizing the skills that you
learned in each course rightaway, so it's not like you had
(05:10):
to wait years right to applythem.
You were able to do that on thespot because of the
project-based method, of the waythe courses are laid out in the
program, right.
Sakina Brandford (05:20):
I definitely like the fact that they were
project based and I tried tofocus on, I would say, corporate
instructional design and eventhough I was an educator, I was
very familiar with education butwanting to be more marketable
(05:41):
to businesses and corporations,to be more marketable to
businesses and corporations, Idecided to take on projects in
the program that were, I mean, Ihad some education-based, but I
wanted to be more broad with myprojects and think about
industry training.
I love that.
Jackie Pelegrin (06:02):
Yeah, I've heard that from other students
in the program too that I've hadclasses with or that I've
interviewed here on the podcastthat they realized early on that
they needed to be diversifiedand what they were doing their
projects on, and not justfocusing on, maybe, the area
that they were most familiarwith, but branching out with.
(06:26):
But branching out, yeah, reallylooking at those areas, because
then if you just stay in onelane per se, as they say, and
then all your artifacts aregoing to be based upon that, but
then if you find a really greatjob in another area, then that
employer may say oh well, youhave great artifacts, but
they're all focused on this andwhat does your diverse portfolio
look like?
And so that can be.
That can be hard because itseems like a lot of employers
(06:47):
want to see that diversity andwant to see that you're able to
expand out into differentindustries and look at those
areas as well.
Sakina Brandford (06:58):
Especially since instructional design will
at least a big chunk of it doesfocus on adult learning, and so
you want to be able to show yourskills, um, and how you are
able to structure courses foradults versus, uh, k-12 right
even, or even higher ed, um,because it's different.
Jackie Pelegrin (07:21):
It's different right, yeah, it's it's.
Every segment is is differentand what their their needs are
and how you approach it right,how you even approach the Addy
model or the Sam model it's alldifferent and how we go about
approaching that.
Because I've worked in highereducation for a long time but I
also worked in corporate for alittle while and just seeing the
(07:43):
difference between those twowas interesting.
There were some similaritiesbut there were also some key
differences in how theyapproached instructional design
and like utilizing the ABC modelto write objectives.
They did that when I worked inthe higher education spectrum
but did corporate, you know, andhelped employ and do an
(08:05):
employee training.
But then when I went to work atGCU and I was like, oh, they
don't use the ABC method towrite and start to write
objectives, so it was kind ofinteresting.
And so having to kind of shiftmy mindset and go from employee
training and development in thatcorporate education world and
then having to shift tocurriculum design and higher
(08:27):
education was a shift for me.
So, yeah, so it's interestinghow each one is unique and how
they go about doing that andeven, like you know, military
and other nonprofit and thingslike that.
I know some people that work inthose industries and it's
different there too, and so.
(08:48):
But it's very interestingbecause instructional design
kind of came out of that needfor training the military in
World War II.
So it's very interesting thehistory of it and how it's
evolved over time and been ableto kind of take that and bring
it into different industries.
Sakina Brandford (09:05):
So it's pretty neat yeah it is and the fact
that you know people who are inthe field are still referring to
the ADDIE model and use it asthe standard.
Even though there are manydesign processes that have
deviated from the ADDIE model,they still consider the ADDIE
(09:25):
model and when you look at a lotof job postings, they do list
the ADDIE model there, eventhough they may not really use
it so rigid and they use otheragile processes.
It's amazing that it has really, you know, stuck the test of
time and people feel like it's areally good model.
(09:49):
I had a colleague once he movedinto K-12 after retiring as an
instructional designer and hetold me that he actually took
courses under the guy whodeveloped the AdDIE model before
it was even called the ADDIEmodel, so he was really proud of
(10:10):
that.
Wow, that's amazing.
Yeah, it is, and so it reallyhas stood the test of time with
many other learning theories,because there's so many, so many
right, absolutely, that's true,great.
Jackie Pelegrin (10:30):
So what kind of work do you currently do,
sakina, right now?
Sakina Brandford (10:34):
I just recently landed um one of my
first full-time roles ininstructional design as an
instructional design specialist,with a company that supports
the oil and gas industry.
Oh wow, that's exciting.
It is, it is.
And so going from K-12classroom teacher to in the
(10:57):
corporate world is definitely ashift in change.
And I'm still I'm only withinthe first week of this job and
you know I keep pinching myselflike, wow, this is a really I
really did a whole, you know,career change.
It's kind of funny, but yeah itshows it's possible right,
Right, right.
(11:18):
So they kind of started me outwith a small project.
I did some AI, used AIvoiceover to update a course,
and then I'm going to bestarting another course for
security officer training.
So I'll have to do some designand use.
I'm using Articulate Storyline.
(11:38):
So I'll definitely encouragefolks in the program to really
try to learn those industriessoftwares that a lot of
companies are using, becausethey are really looking for
folks that are, you know, theyreally understand how to use the
(11:59):
software.
Jackie Pelegrin (12:01):
Right, because they don't really have the time
to do the training on thesoftware.
They want someone that can comein and not necessarily know
every single feature of it, butat least know enough to where
you can create engaging contentand not have to spend two weeks
learning the software.
Right, because they want you tohit the ground running, pretty
(12:21):
much aside from training andthings like that and learning
about the company, but they theyreally want you to kind of be
up and running pretty quicklyRight, right.
Sakina Brandford (12:31):
Yeah, so they, you know they want someone who
can, like you said, go ahead andget started designing those
courses, putting content.
A lot of companies still have alot of content on PowerPoint or
documents and they are tryingto upgrade to more e-learning
and so, even though they mayhave a lot of e-learning courses
(12:53):
already, there is still contentthat they're getting from their
SMEs that could be, you know,on PowerPoint that they're
needing or wanting to convertover, and the company that I
work for they're global, globalcompanies, so I'm working with
SMEs that are working indifferent parts of the world, so
(13:14):
it's really interesting.
Jackie Pelegrin (13:16):
Wow, that's exciting, you know.
It's interesting too becausewhen companies have their
materials on PowerPoint and thenotion has been, when people
aren't familiar withinstructional design, they think
that we can just take aPowerPoint and we can just
upload it, convert it, and noproblem, we can.
And I've even heard some peoplein the company I work for that
(13:39):
aren't instructional designersand don't really understand what
we do.
And one person said to me well,captivate is like a glorified
PowerPoint.
And I'm like, no, it's not,it's more than that.
And so I corrected him and I'mlike with all due respect, you
know, and I so when I showed himsome of the things I had done
on Captivate and Storyline andthings like that, and he's like,
(14:00):
oh, there's more to that.
And I was like, yes, it's notjust Glorify and PowerPoint,
there's more than that.
So you just can't take aPowerPoint and then plop it into
something and call it a donedeal.
There's so much more to itadding that interactivity to it
and things like that thatPowerPoint doesn't have a lot of
time, so you know that'sexciting.
(14:22):
Yeah, so you're creating a good, robust catalog for them of
different training and coursesthat they can be able to access
anytime on the go, right, sothat's great.
Sakina Brandford (14:34):
Yeah, and as an instructional designer,
you're going to continuouslylearn because technology is
going to advance and change andthere's additional software like
Camtasia and Beyond and videomore video editing software that
(14:56):
is integrated into all theprojects and so it's just
learning.
A lot you know, even you knowbeyond the things that we.
Some of the projects that Imade at GCU and a lot of the
software that I used was veryfamiliar and similar, but
(15:17):
technology advances, so you haveto be willing to try to learn
more and more, just to keep upwith the trends.
Jackie Pelegrin (15:26):
Right, that's so true, and you mentioned a
little bit about AI earlier.
So are there any other specificareas in which you're expanding
your knowledge and skills inthe field, now that you're in
the field and you're in aninstructional design position?
Now You're in the field andyou're in an instructional
design position now.
Sakina Brandford (16:07):
Well, for some of the portfolio work samples,
I did use Copilot to gather someof that information, but on the
job, you know differentcompanies now they have their
proprietary information.
They want to keep it privateand in-house, and so they are
purchasing their own AI tools touse.
(16:29):
I haven't really gotten to anyof those tools on the job yet.
They are taking the storylinefiles and the other video files
and translating them intomultiple languages across the
world, and so they use AI forthat.
That's exciting.
(16:51):
That storyline is also movinginto that area as well, where
they can translate the course inmultiple languages right within
the articulate software.
Jackie Pelegrin (17:01):
That's amazing.
I love that.
It's yeah, it's amazing how AIis really transforming all
aspects of our lives right, andinstructional design is one of
them where it's it's yeah, it'schanging so much.
It's amazing how you can takethat and translate something.
Just, you know, take somethingthat's in English and translate
(17:22):
it to any language you want.
Wow, that's amazing.
And that's neat too that youmentioned that they have that.
They're they're working ongetting a proprietary type of
closed AI system, which is whatwe have where I work, because we
don't want the curriculumgetting out there or any other
of our types of information.
That's proprietary, like youmentioned.
(17:43):
So I can see a lot of companiesdoing that and having a closed
system where you know you canuse the AI and it's not going to
.
None of the information isgoing to get out on the web
because once it gets out there,it's hard to get it back.
Sakina Brandford (17:57):
So it's important, Right, and I mean
personally I've been just alittle bit apprehensive about
using, so it's important.
I have embraced using AI alittle bit more, but I am very
(18:22):
cautious of my own informationthat I'm feeding into AI.
I try not to.
I mean some people are likegoing all in and they may pay
for the chat, GBC programs.
I mean I currently don't do anyof that, so I don't want to put
anything input into AI that Idon't want shared with the rest
(18:44):
of the world forever.
Jackie Pelegrin (18:46):
Right, exactly so you're very cautious.
I'm the same way, I'm verycautious about what I share too.
Sakina Brandford (18:52):
Yeah, yes, but you know I do hope that it does
make work efficient.
I have spoken to some fellowinstructional designers with the
certification program that Iwent through and she was saying
that she uses it for design andit has made her work a lot
(19:16):
faster and easier to get through, so it saves a lot of time.
Jackie Pelegrin (19:22):
That's great, yeah.
And it's great too because youcan use it for other things,
like like email.
I use it for email.
Sometimes, like if I look at anemail and I'm like, oh, you
know, maybe that could use sometweaking a little bit, I'll take
the email and I'll put it inour proprietary AI software and
I'll say, can you kind of polishthis a little bit?
And just where it still has myvoice, but it's maybe polished a
(19:45):
little bit, maybe a littleshorter, because sometimes I
tend to kind of put too muchdetail on my emails and I'm like
, okay, I need to shorten thisup a little bit.
Or just even for this podcast.
I do some things too with thatand have it help me write
outlines and then just tweak ita little bit, make sure it's
accurate.
But it's really neat becauseit's a great way to get those
(20:07):
first draft ideas and thingslike that and I use it with my
SMEs as well, with programdesign and and things like that
and trying to get thatinformation.
Sakina Brandford (20:16):
So it's really exciting to have that you know
so, yes, and and I guess it'sbest not to be afraid of it Just
use it, but know that it needs,it still needs the human touch,
it still needs to be edited andreviewed, and use it to help
you in your work?
Jackie Pelegrin (20:36):
Right, exactly, great.
So what are some tips andadvice that you can share with
those who are currently in themaster's program in
instructional design at GCU?
Sakina Brandford (20:48):
As I mentioned before, definitely take
advantage of many of thosethings that you learn in the
very first course.
Some of those things weregetting to know what the job
postings look like so you canprepare yourself while you're in
the program.
And speaking of the jobpostings, I would recommend, if
(21:08):
you are not already on LinkedInor Indeed, go ahead and get a
profile and you I started reallyslowly, you know making
connections with others onLinkedIn, but it really helps
when you build up your networkon LinkedIn so that whenever you
(21:28):
are actively applying for jobs,recruiters out there will
actually see your, see yourposts or see your profile.
So I would start working onthat right away so you can build
up you know connections atleast above 500.
So you know people will be ableto see you, see your profile.
(21:54):
And, other than that,professional organizations.
I had a little bit of time thispast year, since I resigned from
my full-time teaching job inthe summer to be more prepared
for the transition intoinstructional design.
I started looking at thedifferent professional
organizations and the differentsoftware companies and some of
their webinars or trainings thatthey would offer for free and
(22:17):
that really helped inunderstanding what was happening
in the field and readingarticles, even if you don't have
time to attend webinars ordon't want to pay for them,
looking at their articles andlooking for you know those
organizations that allow you to.
(22:40):
You know those organizationsthat allow you to gain some
part-time jobs.
I think you, jackie, mentionedUpwork to me and I did look at
Upwork for jobs and so I do havea profile there and I think
that helps.
And I would say, look at thoselocal career fairs or anyone in
(23:01):
your local network that couldhelp you with your resume, get
it reviewed and just be readyfor it, because that, for me at
least, I definitely wanted to bejob ready, I definitely wanted
to gain employment in the field,employment in the field.
(23:23):
So I think all of those thingsreally helped me to get my foot
in the door and learn from otherinstructional designers.
They're your source ofinformation, right.
Jackie Pelegrin (23:32):
Really building that network right, Because you
want to go beyond what you'relearning from your instructor or
your professor in the classesand want to be able to actually
see what's going on in the fieldout there.
Sakina Brandford (23:44):
So many of the discussion posts we had had us
searching for different articles, different things that were
happening in the field and howto actually design our courses.
(24:08):
I know micro learning wassomething that I really enjoyed
learning about, and so many ofthose discussion posts when you
were doing your research.
It lends itself to seeing whatwas happening in the field and
what's going on with differentprofessional organizations or
those experts out there that are, you know, trying to teach
(24:30):
others in the field on the bestpractices.
So everything that we learn inthe program you're definitely
going to use.
So, and I really want to advisepeople to get help from your
professors.
You know, don't don't try tostruggle too much, because
(24:50):
everyone was very helpful.
Um, if you just reach out andso that that's one thing that I
I had learned I had a greatsuccess advisor that really
helped as well, always checkedon me, and so in UCIL library,
when I first started out in theprogram, I did reach out to the
(25:10):
library staff.
They will help you with some ofthe research projects if you
ask.
Jackie Pelegrin (25:16):
And so I wanted to take full advantage of the
opportunities that were offeredat the university and so I would
really advise others to do thesame and, like you said, the
library and, yeah, reallyutilizing that, because I think
(25:38):
sometimes I went through anonline program myself with my
master's in instructional designand sometimes you can feel a
little isolated with the program, going to school online, and so
(25:59):
having that connection andsupport is so vital to success
with an online program.
And, like you said, being ableto, you know, dip your toes and
things while you're in theprogram and and things like that
is so important, because somany times, programs are built
to where they want to teach youall the theory, but where's the
practice in it, so you need tohave theory and practice
simultaneously, right?
So, um, being able to have that, yeah, so that way you build
your confidence and and so thatthat's that's wonderful.
(26:20):
I love that.
Sakina Brandford (26:20):
Yeah, so that way you build your confidence
and and so that that's that'swonderful.
I love that Great.
And it's not easy to do when,especially when you have a
full-time job.
And so if, if and this was alittle bit harder for me I,
toward the end of the program,try to, you know, build more of
a a working connection withother folks in the cohort, of a
(26:41):
working connection with otherfolks in the cohort.
That can be difficult becauseeveryone is busy and have their
own lives, but if you can find acouple of people that you can
link up with or converse with ondifferent projects, it will be
helpful because you guys cangive each other advice and give
you know, real, authenticfeedback on some of your work
samples for you or yourassignments, or you turn them in
(27:05):
, but that's helpful.
But it can be very difficult asa full-time employee with a
family, and so you do the bestyou can.
But those are some of thethings that I definitely
recommend folks to do whilethey're in the program.
Jackie Pelegrin (27:24):
That's great.
Thanks, Sakina.
So before we wrap up, are thereany other ideas or thoughts you
wanted to share with theaudience?
Sakina Brandford (27:34):
I would say I've given some of the tips and
things that you know I did andthe other thing I guess that I
did that may be a littledifferent from others.
I did seek out a certificationprogram in instructional design.
I know some of the professionalorganizations.
(27:55):
They will offer a course onCaptivate or a course on
Articulate Storyline and you canuse Udemy or even some of those
LinkedIn courses to help youwith some of the software.
So if you want to really getout there and land a job where
(28:19):
you won't have to teach yourselfhow to use some of the tools,
you'll have a little bit of ahead start.
You're not going to knoweverything, of course, but
(28:43):
you'll be able to be confidentin your interviews.
The current job that I have.
Jackie Pelegrin (28:46):
I was asked in the interview specific questions
about our articulate storylineto make sure that I was actually
using and had used the program.
So, wow, so it's good to beprepared and and know the
software and even the models andtheories, right, because you
just never know what they'regoing to ask you, true?
Sakina Brandford (29:01):
Very true, how you would.
Actually, I'm hearing that someum, some folks are asked,
they're given some content andthey are actually having to put
a um, a design, a course, andonce you get further into, uh,
(29:23):
the level two or three of thestage of interviews, they're
asking people to take thiscontent, design this course and
present it to us in theinterview.
Jackie Pelegrin (29:31):
Wow, that's great.
I like that because it reallyit allows you to showcase your
knowledge and skills and thatyou don't just have, it's not
simply a degree, it's somethingwhere you have really learned
the knowledge and the skills andthose what they call the KSAs
right Knowledge, skills andabilities.
Yeah, that's great, Wow.
(29:52):
And that's good to be preparedfor, because you don't want to
be caught off guard and go oh no, I don't know how to answer
that question or I wouldn't knowhow to do that.
So, yeah, that's good, I lovethat, yeah.
Sakina Brandford (30:06):
With practice.
You're going to have thoseinterviews too, right?
I definitely had those too, butthe more interviews you have,
the more confident and theeasier they are.
Right.
The more confident and theeasier they are.
Jackie Pelegrin (30:18):
Right.
So just to keep doing theinterviews.
And if one doesn't work out,just keep going right and try
not to be disappointed in it,because the right one will come
along.
Sakina Brandford (30:28):
And that's what happened with you.
Jackie Pelegrin (30:32):
So you got the right one and it sounds like
you're able to really expandyour knowledge and skills even
more so.
So that's great, wonderful.
Well, thank you, sakina, foryour time.
I appreciate it and again,congratulations on the job and I
it sounds like you're going togo really far with this position
and and then also with otherareas too.
As you get more familiar withwith things and you get more
(30:55):
comfortable, then it sounds likeyou'll be able to do a lot in
the field.
So it's great.
Sakina Brandford (31:00):
All right, thank you, and thank you again.
I do look forward to, you know,getting back into education at
some point and teaching otherssome of the skills that I have
learned as an instructionaldesigner as well as a former
educator, because I'm still verymuch passionate about education
(31:24):
and preparing future educatorsin the profession.
So those are some of the thingsI'm also looking forward to.
Jackie Pelegrin (31:31):
That's great.
I love that.
Yeah, maybe in the companyyou're working for, you can
eventually go in to doprofessional development for the
employees and things like that.
And then, yeah, you're on chowand teach the next generation.
That's a fun experience.
I enjoy doing it myself, so Ithink you would enjoy it as well
.
Yes, thank you, thank you.
(31:54):
Thank you, sakina, appreciateit.
Thank you for taking some timeto listen to this podcast
episode today.
Your support means the world tome.
If you'd like to help keep thepodcast going, you can share it
with a friend or colleague,leave a heartfelt review or
offer a monetary contribution.
Every act of support, big orsmall, makes a difference and
(32:16):
I'm truly thankful for you.
Hello and welcome to the Designing with
Love podcast.
I am your host, Jackie Pelegrin, where my goal is to bring you
information, tips and tricks asan instructional designer.
Hello, GCU students, alumni andfellow educators, Welcome to
episode 37 of the Designing withLove podcast.
(00:21):
Today, I have the pleasure ofinterviewing Sakina Branford,
who completed her master'sdegree in instructional design
at GCU.
Welcome, Sakina, Thank you.
Thank you, I'm glad to be here.
Yes, me too.
So when did you earn yourmaster's degree in instructional
design from GCU?
I earned my master's degree inJanuary of this year, 2025, at
(00:47):
the conclusion of ourinstructional design capstone
course, great, wonderful, and Ibelieve you had a chance to come
to Phoenix and come tograduation in person.
So how was that for you?
Did you like that?
Sakina Brandford (01:01):
I really enjoyed it.
I wish I could have stayed alittle bit longer, but I loved.
You know, coming to the campus,I was able to see a little bit
of the campus at the arena.
I was there with my husband anddaughter and we really enjoyed
the ceremony.
It was super exciting.
Everyone, of course, graduationeveryone's super excited.
(01:24):
It was great to be in a roomwith so many educators and
getting an advanced degreefinally yes, Several years being
in the profession.
Jackie Pelegrin (01:38):
That's great, I love it.
And being able to come inperson, there's nothing like
that.
So that's great.
Oh, yeah, yeah, and hopefullyyou'll have a chance to come
back to Phoenix when it's coolerbecause it's warming up.
It's already in the hundredsnow.
You know it's almost June.
We're in the hundreds now, sowe're triple digits.
So hopefully when it cools offusually around, I would say that
(01:59):
, like around Halloween, likelate October, is when it starts
to get really nice.
And so, yeah, hopefully, maybein the fall you can come back
and visit when it's nice andcool.
Come come up and visit GrandCanyon and things like that.
There's so many great things todo up North, so it's a lot of
fun.
Sakina Brandford (02:16):
So yeah, yeah, definitely, I would like.
Jackie Pelegrin (02:18):
to yeah, and then we can maybe go do
something fun.
So that would be great,wonderful.
So what aspects of the programdid you enjoy the most?
When you were taking theclasses and everything?
Sakina Brandford (02:32):
Well, first I would say I really enjoy that
GCU caters to full time workingadults, so I felt like being
able to take one course at atime and concentrate on that one
course.
It really helped me besuccessful in the program.
After about the second course,I was adjusted to the new
(02:57):
schedule and knew exactly whenassignments and discussions were
due.
Assignments and discussionswere due and, like I said, it
really allowed me to besuccessful because I had started
a master's program many yearsago through another university
and I wanted to take one courseat a time.
(03:19):
But due to the structure of theprograms at that time and it
was completely online as well,but I was unable to really
complete it in the time framethat they really required if I
was doing one course at a timefor nine weeks.
Oh, I see, enjoyed being at GCUand being an online student in
(03:44):
the IB program.
I feel like it really isstructured well.
With all the courses one afteranother, you really they build
on each other and you aregaining skills over time course.
(04:09):
It really sets you up forsuccess if you really try to use
some of those tips and thingsthat you learned in the first
course throughout the rest ofthe program because they really
are helpful from, I would say,even looking at some of the job
postings.
That's one of the assignmentsthat we had in the very first
couple of courses.
Jackie Pelegrin (04:25):
Yes, I remember that.
Sakina Brandford (04:35):
Yes, and if you really just kind of peek
into those things in jobpostings throughout your time in
the program, it helps you toknow what skills that employers
are looking for and it canmotivate you along the way when
you're working on yourassignments.
Jackie Pelegrin (04:46):
Yeah in the master's program.
That's great.
So it helps to kind of pavethat path for you and see what
you need to do to get towardsthat dream job that you want,
and yeah, that's really helpful.
Yeah, and you're you're evenutilizing you.
I would imagine you wereutilizing the skills that you
learned in each course rightaway, so it's not like you had
(05:10):
to wait years right to applythem.
You were able to do that on thespot because of the
project-based method, of the waythe courses are laid out in the
program, right.
Sakina Brandford (05:20):
I definitely like the fact that they were
project based and I tried tofocus on, I would say, corporate
instructional design and eventhough I was an educator, I was
very familiar with education butwanting to be more marketable
(05:41):
to businesses and corporations,to be more marketable to
businesses and corporations, Idecided to take on projects in
the program that were, I mean, Ihad some education-based, but I
wanted to be more broad with myprojects and think about
industry training.
I love that.
Jackie Pelegrin (06:02):
Yeah, I've heard that from other students
in the program too that I've hadclasses with or that I've
interviewed here on the podcastthat they realized early on that
they needed to be diversifiedand what they were doing their
projects on, and not justfocusing on, maybe, the area
that they were most familiarwith, but branching out with.
(06:26):
But branching out, yeah, reallylooking at those areas, because
then if you just stay in onelane per se, as they say, and
then all your artifacts aregoing to be based upon that, but
then if you find a really greatjob in another area, then that
employer may say oh well, youhave great artifacts, but
they're all focused on this andwhat does your diverse portfolio
look like?
And so that can be.
That can be hard because itseems like a lot of employers
(06:47):
want to see that diversity andwant to see that you're able to
expand out into differentindustries and look at those
areas as well.
Sakina Brandford (06:58):
Especially since instructional design will
at least a big chunk of it doesfocus on adult learning, and so
you want to be able to show yourskills, um, and how you are
able to structure courses foradults versus, uh, k-12 right
even, or even higher ed, um,because it's different.
Jackie Pelegrin (07:21):
It's different right, yeah, it's it's.
Every segment is is differentand what their their needs are
and how you approach it right,how you even approach the Addy
model or the Sam model it's alldifferent and how we go about
approaching that.
Because I've worked in highereducation for a long time but I
also worked in corporate for alittle while and just seeing the
(07:43):
difference between those twowas interesting.
There were some similaritiesbut there were also some key
differences in how theyapproached instructional design
and like utilizing the ABC modelto write objectives.
They did that when I worked inthe higher education spectrum
but did corporate, you know, andhelped employ and do an
(08:05):
employee training.
But then when I went to work atGCU and I was like, oh, they
don't use the ABC method towrite and start to write
objectives, so it was kind ofinteresting.
And so having to kind of shiftmy mindset and go from employee
training and development in thatcorporate education world and
then having to shift tocurriculum design and higher
(08:27):
education was a shift for me.
So, yeah, so it's interestinghow each one is unique and how
they go about doing that andeven, like you know, military
and other nonprofit and thingslike that.
I know some people that work inthose industries and it's
different there too, and so.
(08:48):
But it's very interestingbecause instructional design
kind of came out of that needfor training the military in
World War II.
So it's very interesting thehistory of it and how it's
evolved over time and been ableto kind of take that and bring
it into different industries.
Sakina Brandford (09:05):
So it's pretty neat yeah it is and the fact
that you know people who are inthe field are still referring to
the ADDIE model and use it asthe standard.
Even though there are manydesign processes that have
deviated from the ADDIE model,they still consider the ADDIE
(09:25):
model and when you look at a lotof job postings, they do list
the ADDIE model there, eventhough they may not really use
it so rigid and they use otheragile processes.
It's amazing that it has really, you know, stuck the test of
time and people feel like it's areally good model.
(09:49):
I had a colleague once he movedinto K-12 after retiring as an
instructional designer and hetold me that he actually took
courses under the guy whodeveloped the AdDIE model before
it was even called the ADDIEmodel, so he was really proud of
(10:10):
that.
Wow, that's amazing.
Yeah, it is, and so it reallyhas stood the test of time with
many other learning theories,because there's so many, so many
right, absolutely, that's true,great.
Jackie Pelegrin (10:30):
So what kind of work do you currently do,
sakina, right now?
Sakina Brandford (10:34):
I just recently landed um one of my
first full-time roles ininstructional design as an
instructional design specialist,with a company that supports
the oil and gas industry.
Oh wow, that's exciting.
It is, it is.
And so going from K-12classroom teacher to in the
(10:57):
corporate world is definitely ashift in change.
And I'm still I'm only withinthe first week of this job and
you know I keep pinching myselflike, wow, this is a really I
really did a whole, you know,career change.
It's kind of funny, but yeah itshows it's possible right,
Right, right.
(11:18):
So they kind of started me outwith a small project.
I did some AI, used AIvoiceover to update a course,
and then I'm going to bestarting another course for
security officer training.
So I'll have to do some designand use.
I'm using Articulate Storyline.
(11:38):
So I'll definitely encouragefolks in the program to really
try to learn those industriessoftwares that a lot of
companies are using, becausethey are really looking for
folks that are, you know, theyreally understand how to use the
(11:59):
software.
Jackie Pelegrin (12:01):
Right, because they don't really have the time
to do the training on thesoftware.
They want someone that can comein and not necessarily know
every single feature of it, butat least know enough to where
you can create engaging contentand not have to spend two weeks
learning the software.
Right, because they want you tohit the ground running, pretty
(12:21):
much aside from training andthings like that and learning
about the company, but they theyreally want you to kind of be
up and running pretty quicklyRight, right.
Sakina Brandford (12:31):
Yeah, so they, you know they want someone who
can, like you said, go ahead andget started designing those
courses, putting content.
A lot of companies still have alot of content on PowerPoint or
documents and they are tryingto upgrade to more e-learning
and so, even though they mayhave a lot of e-learning courses
(12:53):
already, there is still contentthat they're getting from their
SMEs that could be, you know,on PowerPoint that they're
needing or wanting to convertover, and the company that I
work for they're global, globalcompanies, so I'm working with
SMEs that are working indifferent parts of the world, so
(13:14):
it's really interesting.
Jackie Pelegrin (13:16):
Wow, that's exciting, you know.
It's interesting too becausewhen companies have their
materials on PowerPoint and thenotion has been, when people
aren't familiar withinstructional design, they think
that we can just take aPowerPoint and we can just
upload it, convert it, and noproblem, we can.
And I've even heard some peoplein the company I work for that
(13:39):
aren't instructional designersand don't really understand what
we do.
And one person said to me well,captivate is like a glorified
PowerPoint.
And I'm like, no, it's not,it's more than that.
And so I corrected him and I'mlike with all due respect, you
know, and I so when I showed himsome of the things I had done
on Captivate and Storyline andthings like that, and he's like,
(14:00):
oh, there's more to that.
And I was like, yes, it's notjust Glorify and PowerPoint,
there's more than that.
So you just can't take aPowerPoint and then plop it into
something and call it a donedeal.
There's so much more to itadding that interactivity to it
and things like that thatPowerPoint doesn't have a lot of
time, so you know that'sexciting.
(14:22):
Yeah, so you're creating a good, robust catalog for them of
different training and coursesthat they can be able to access
anytime on the go, right, sothat's great.
Sakina Brandford (14:34):
Yeah, and as an instructional designer,
you're going to continuouslylearn because technology is
going to advance and change andthere's additional software like
Camtasia and Beyond and videomore video editing software that
(14:56):
is integrated into all theprojects and so it's just
learning.
A lot you know, even you knowbeyond the things that we.
Some of the projects that Imade at GCU and a lot of the
software that I used was veryfamiliar and similar, but
(15:17):
technology advances, so you haveto be willing to try to learn
more and more, just to keep upwith the trends.
Jackie Pelegrin (15:26):
Right, that's so true, and you mentioned a
little bit about AI earlier.
So are there any other specificareas in which you're expanding
your knowledge and skills inthe field, now that you're in
the field and you're in aninstructional design position?
Now You're in the field andyou're in an instructional
design position now.
Sakina Brandford (16:07):
Well, for some of the portfolio work samples,
I did use Copilot to gather someof that information, but on the
job, you know differentcompanies now they have their
proprietary information.
They want to keep it privateand in-house, and so they are
purchasing their own AI tools touse.
(16:29):
I haven't really gotten to anyof those tools on the job yet.
They are taking the storylinefiles and the other video files
and translating them intomultiple languages across the
world, and so they use AI forthat.
That's exciting.
(16:51):
That storyline is also movinginto that area as well, where
they can translate the course inmultiple languages right within
the articulate software.
Jackie Pelegrin (17:01):
That's amazing.
I love that.
It's yeah, it's amazing how AIis really transforming all
aspects of our lives right, andinstructional design is one of
them where it's it's yeah, it'schanging so much.
It's amazing how you can takethat and translate something.
Just, you know, take somethingthat's in English and translate
(17:22):
it to any language you want.
Wow, that's amazing.
And that's neat too that youmentioned that they have that.
They're they're working ongetting a proprietary type of
closed AI system, which is whatwe have where I work, because we
don't want the curriculumgetting out there or any other
of our types of information.
That's proprietary, like youmentioned.
(17:43):
So I can see a lot of companiesdoing that and having a closed
system where you know you canuse the AI and it's not going to
.
None of the information isgoing to get out on the web
because once it gets out there,it's hard to get it back.
Sakina Brandford (17:57):
So it's important, Right, and I mean
personally I've been just alittle bit apprehensive about
using, so it's important.
I have embraced using AI alittle bit more, but I am very
(18:22):
cautious of my own informationthat I'm feeding into AI.
I try not to.
I mean some people are likegoing all in and they may pay
for the chat, GBC programs.
I mean I currently don't do anyof that, so I don't want to put
anything input into AI that Idon't want shared with the rest
(18:44):
of the world forever.
Jackie Pelegrin (18:46):
Right, exactly so you're very cautious.
I'm the same way, I'm verycautious about what I share too.
Sakina Brandford (18:52):
Yeah, yes, but you know I do hope that it does
make work efficient.
I have spoken to some fellowinstructional designers with the
certification program that Iwent through and she was saying
that she uses it for design andit has made her work a lot
(19:16):
faster and easier to get through, so it saves a lot of time.
Jackie Pelegrin (19:22):
That's great, yeah.
And it's great too because youcan use it for other things,
like like email.
I use it for email.
Sometimes, like if I look at anemail and I'm like, oh, you
know, maybe that could use sometweaking a little bit, I'll take
the email and I'll put it inour proprietary AI software and
I'll say, can you kind of polishthis a little bit?
And just where it still has myvoice, but it's maybe polished a
(19:45):
little bit, maybe a littleshorter, because sometimes I
tend to kind of put too muchdetail on my emails and I'm like
, okay, I need to shorten thisup a little bit.
Or just even for this podcast.
I do some things too with thatand have it help me write
outlines and then just tweak ita little bit, make sure it's
accurate.
But it's really neat becauseit's a great way to get those
(20:07):
first draft ideas and thingslike that and I use it with my
SMEs as well, with programdesign and and things like that
and trying to get thatinformation.
Sakina Brandford (20:16):
So it's really exciting to have that you know
so, yes, and and I guess it'sbest not to be afraid of it Just
use it, but know that it needs,it still needs the human touch,
it still needs to be edited andreviewed, and use it to help
you in your work?
Jackie Pelegrin (20:36):
Right, exactly, great.
So what are some tips andadvice that you can share with
those who are currently in themaster's program in
instructional design at GCU?
Sakina Brandford (20:48):
As I mentioned before, definitely take
advantage of many of thosethings that you learn in the
very first course.
Some of those things weregetting to know what the job
postings look like so you canprepare yourself while you're in
the program.
And speaking of the jobpostings, I would recommend, if
(21:08):
you are not already on LinkedInor Indeed, go ahead and get a
profile and you I started reallyslowly, you know making
connections with others onLinkedIn, but it really helps
when you build up your networkon LinkedIn so that whenever you
(21:28):
are actively applying for jobs,recruiters out there will
actually see your, see yourposts or see your profile.
So I would start working onthat right away so you can build
up you know connections atleast above 500.
So you know people will be ableto see you, see your profile.
(21:54):
And, other than that,professional organizations.
I had a little bit of time thispast year, since I resigned from
my full-time teaching job inthe summer to be more prepared
for the transition intoinstructional design.
I started looking at thedifferent professional
organizations and the differentsoftware companies and some of
their webinars or trainings thatthey would offer for free and
(22:17):
that really helped inunderstanding what was happening
in the field and readingarticles, even if you don't have
time to attend webinars ordon't want to pay for them,
looking at their articles andlooking for you know those
organizations that allow you to.
(22:40):
You know those organizationsthat allow you to gain some
part-time jobs.
I think you, jackie, mentionedUpwork to me and I did look at
Upwork for jobs and so I do havea profile there and I think
that helps.
And I would say, look at thoselocal career fairs or anyone in
(23:01):
your local network that couldhelp you with your resume, get
it reviewed and just be readyfor it, because that, for me at
least, I definitely wanted to bejob ready, I definitely wanted
to gain employment in the field,employment in the field.
(23:23):
So I think all of those thingsreally helped me to get my foot
in the door and learn from otherinstructional designers.
They're your source ofinformation, right.
Jackie Pelegrin (23:32):
Really building that network right, Because you
want to go beyond what you'relearning from your instructor or
your professor in the classesand want to be able to actually
see what's going on in the fieldout there.
Sakina Brandford (23:44):
So many of the discussion posts we had had us
searching for different articles, different things that were
happening in the field and howto actually design our courses.
(24:08):
I know micro learning wassomething that I really enjoyed
learning about, and so many ofthose discussion posts when you
were doing your research.
It lends itself to seeing whatwas happening in the field and
what's going on with differentprofessional organizations or
those experts out there that are, you know, trying to teach
(24:30):
others in the field on the bestpractices.
So everything that we learn inthe program you're definitely
going to use.
So, and I really want to advisepeople to get help from your
professors.
You know, don't don't try tostruggle too much, because
(24:50):
everyone was very helpful.
Um, if you just reach out andso that that's one thing that I
I had learned I had a greatsuccess advisor that really
helped as well, always checkedon me, and so in UCIL library,
when I first started out in theprogram, I did reach out to the
(25:10):
library staff.
They will help you with some ofthe research projects if you
ask.
Jackie Pelegrin (25:16):
And so I wanted to take full advantage of the
opportunities that were offeredat the university and so I would
really advise others to do thesame and, like you said, the
library and, yeah, reallyutilizing that, because I think
(25:38):
sometimes I went through anonline program myself with my
master's in instructional designand sometimes you can feel a
little isolated with the program, going to school online, and so
(25:59):
having that connection andsupport is so vital to success
with an online program.
And, like you said, being ableto, you know, dip your toes and
things while you're in theprogram and and things like that
is so important, because somany times, programs are built
to where they want to teach youall the theory, but where's the
practice in it, so you need tohave theory and practice
simultaneously, right?
So, um, being able to have that, yeah, so that way you build
your confidence and and so thatthat's that's wonderful.
(26:20):
I love that.
Sakina Brandford (26:20):
Yeah, so that way you build your confidence
and and so that that's that'swonderful.
I love that Great.
And it's not easy to do when,especially when you have a
full-time job.
And so if, if and this was alittle bit harder for me I,
toward the end of the program,try to, you know, build more of
a a working connection withother folks in the cohort, of a
(26:41):
working connection with otherfolks in the cohort.
That can be difficult becauseeveryone is busy and have their
own lives, but if you can find acouple of people that you can
link up with or converse with ondifferent projects, it will be
helpful because you guys cangive each other advice and give
you know, real, authenticfeedback on some of your work
samples for you or yourassignments, or you turn them in
(27:05):
, but that's helpful.
But it can be very difficult asa full-time employee with a
family, and so you do the bestyou can.
But those are some of thethings that I definitely
recommend folks to do whilethey're in the program.
Jackie Pelegrin (27:24):
That's great.
Thanks, Sakina.
So before we wrap up, are thereany other ideas or thoughts you
wanted to share with theaudience?
Sakina Brandford (27:34):
I would say I've given some of the tips and
things that you know I did andthe other thing I guess that I
did that may be a littledifferent from others.
I did seek out a certificationprogram in instructional design.
I know some of the professionalorganizations.
(27:55):
They will offer a course onCaptivate or a course on
Articulate Storyline and you canuse Udemy or even some of those
LinkedIn courses to help youwith some of the software.
So if you want to really getout there and land a job where
(28:19):
you won't have to teach yourselfhow to use some of the tools,
you'll have a little bit of ahead start.
You're not going to knoweverything, of course, but
(28:43):
you'll be able to be confidentin your interviews.
The current job that I have.
Jackie Pelegrin (28:46):
I was asked in the interview specific questions
about our articulate storylineto make sure that I was actually
using and had used the program.
So, wow, so it's good to beprepared and and know the
software and even the models andtheories, right, because you
just never know what they'regoing to ask you, true?
Sakina Brandford (29:01):
Very true, how you would.
Actually, I'm hearing that someum, some folks are asked,
they're given some content andthey are actually having to put
a um, a design, a course, andonce you get further into, uh,
(29:23):
the level two or three of thestage of interviews, they're
asking people to take thiscontent, design this course and
present it to us in theinterview.
Jackie Pelegrin (29:31):
Wow, that's great.
I like that because it reallyit allows you to showcase your
knowledge and skills and thatyou don't just have, it's not
simply a degree, it's somethingwhere you have really learned
the knowledge and the skills andthose what they call the KSAs
right Knowledge, skills andabilities.
Yeah, that's great, Wow.
(29:52):
And that's good to be preparedfor, because you don't want to
be caught off guard and go oh no, I don't know how to answer
that question or I wouldn't knowhow to do that.
So, yeah, that's good, I lovethat, yeah.
Sakina Brandford (30:06):
With practice.
You're going to have thoseinterviews too, right?
I definitely had those too, butthe more interviews you have,
the more confident and theeasier they are.
Right.
The more confident and theeasier they are.
Jackie Pelegrin (30:18):
Right.
So just to keep doing theinterviews.
And if one doesn't work out,just keep going right and try
not to be disappointed in it,because the right one will come
along.
Sakina Brandford (30:28):
And that's what happened with you.
Jackie Pelegrin (30:32):
So you got the right one and it sounds like
you're able to really expandyour knowledge and skills even
more so.
So that's great, wonderful.
Well, thank you, sakina, foryour time.
I appreciate it and again,congratulations on the job and I
it sounds like you're going togo really far with this position
and and then also with otherareas too.
As you get more familiar withwith things and you get more
(30:55):
comfortable, then it sounds likeyou'll be able to do a lot in
the field.
So it's great.
Sakina Brandford (31:00):
All right, thank you, and thank you again.
I do look forward to, you know,getting back into education at
some point and teaching otherssome of the skills that I have
learned as an instructionaldesigner as well as a former
educator, because I'm still verymuch passionate about education
(31:24):
and preparing future educatorsin the profession.
So those are some of the thingsI'm also looking forward to.
Jackie Pelegrin (31:31):
That's great.
I love that.
Yeah, maybe in the companyyou're working for, you can
eventually go in to doprofessional development for the
employees and things like that.
And then, yeah, you're on chowand teach the next generation.
That's a fun experience.
I enjoy doing it myself, so Ithink you would enjoy it as well
.
Yes, thank you, thank you.
(31:54):
Thank you, sakina, appreciateit.
Thank you for taking some timeto listen to this podcast
episode today.
Your support means the world tome.
If you'd like to help keep thepodcast going, you can share it
with a friend or colleague,leave a heartfelt review or
offer a monetary contribution.
Every act of support, big orsmall, makes a difference and
(32:16):
I'm truly thankful for you.
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