June 20, 2025 • 32 mins
This episode isn’t polished. It’s not prepped. It’s just raw. We hit record and asked each other honest questions about our marriage, no script, no filters. What unfolded was a vulnerable, improvised conversation about love, fears, cultural differences, and everything in between. If you’re single and wondering what actually matters in a marriage, beyond the lists and bios, this is for you. Real talk, real lessons, and maybe a few surprises that’ll shift how you think about compatibility and connection.
Got a dilemma or story? The Single Muslim Hotline is here for you! We’ll play your anonymous messages in future episodes and offer real talk. Drop us a voice note 👇🏻
https://www.speakpipe.com/DiaryOfAMatchmaker
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Assalamu alaikum, I'm Hiba.
And I'm Zaid, you're listeningto Diary of a Matchmaker.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
A podcast that will take you into our world as
matchmakers.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
We'll share our experiences and offer advice for
the single Muslim.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
So let's dive in.
Bismillah, assalamu alaikumeveryone, welcome to another
episode.
My name is Zaid and on theother mic is my wife and co-host
.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
Hiba Assalamu alaikum .
Speaker 2 (00:26):
So alhamdulillah, we had a relatively short courting
phase it was about a month and ahalf and during that time we
got to know each other prettywell.
I'd say we spent a lot of timetalking, asked each other a lot
of questions and, yeah, ofcourse, we had a great time, but
we realized that obviously wecouldn't meet each other.
It was all virtual.
So if we were serious aboutthis, there was a lot we had to
(00:49):
cover.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
So, inshallah, we're going to reflect on that journey
and hopefully you guys takeaway some nuggets from that.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I feel, actually, that it was a blessing that we
were you could say courtingvirtually, you could say
courting virtually like if wewere at the same place and we
were meeting.
Then we might have just spentthe time I don't know sipping
coffee and talking about theweather or silly stuff or no,
like there was a sense ofurgency, I guess yes, I think
(01:18):
the urgency was the fact that wehad a scheduled date to meet in
person and we had been talkingso long prior to that.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
So we had to make a decision like are we serious?
And if we are serious, then wehave to tie the knot, because
that was that was going to bethe opportunity for us to meet,
and I don't know if you wouldhave had another opportunity to
meet after that yeah, you'reright so if you guys don't know
the details of the story, go toepisode one and listen to that
episode.
(01:47):
But um so tell me what's onething you were secretly worried
about before getting married,but didn't admit until later
maybe the cultural differences.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
I wasn't worried about it, like I was excited to
marry into a different culture,but I also was like stepping
into an unknown territory for me.
To me, Okay.
And also I knew how kind yourmom was.
But still, I was moving to anew country, to a new family.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You hardly knew her, though you spoke to her like
once you told me about her.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Okay and uh, just leaving my family and leaving my
, my country, and just moving toa new, across the ocean, a new
continent that fear.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I can understand new family being alone here.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
I don't know anyone here.
New culture that felt too muchAt one point.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
So I sold myself pretty well.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
You sold yourself pretty well, we were very
compatible.
I'm like how often is thisGonna come around?
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Yeah, alhamdulillah, everything turned out to be A
blessing.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yeah, okay Cool what about you?
For me.
Uh, the one fear I had, I wouldsay, was um the language
barrier, um english.
What I mean?
Obviously you're fluent English, but it wasn't your first
language and I think, beyondthat, it was just acceptance
(03:29):
into your family.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Like.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I'm a brown guy.
I don't speak Arabic.
Arabs usually don't marry brownpeople.
It's not really culturallyacceptable.
So I think if there was onefear, it would have been
acceptance.
Okay, yeah, I'll be honest.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
I hope reality proved you wrong, of course I stayed
with your parents for five weeks.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Yeah, your parents have been more than nice to me.
يبخت من زار وخفف.
Oh, yes.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
To any non-Arabic speakers.
It means like light guest is agood guest, like don't overstay
your welcome yes, that was oneproverb I learned and I said
frequently okay, question foryou what is one thing you think
you missed out by not marrying abrown girl?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
oh, easy the food food the food.
Obviously I do miss my foodsometimes but like you're
deprived of your food.
True, however it's, it's ablessing, because, uh, desi food
isn't exactly the healthiestfood yeah, exactly, exactly know
, everybody knows that the bestdiet out there is the
(04:44):
Mediterranean diet.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
So I lucked out, but I do still miss my chicken curry
and my butter chicken.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
But here you got three things.
First of all, you're a goodcook.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, I can cook.
All right yeah.
I make a killer dalmachniyou've made it once in your life
, but it was killer.
You think you deserve the goldmedal or something.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
I nailed it though no , but I cook some dishes like
three hours but I cook some desidishes and on top of that your
mom lives across the street andshe's a great cook.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
She's an awesome.
She hates having us over.
Okay, that's an exaggeration,yeah we just came back, but and
there are a lot of like friendsaround us who make great food
yes, but I can't go to myfriend's house all the time and
say give me desi food, becausemy wife doesn't know how to cook
desi food.
Okay, I guess, anyways, um,okay, how about?
(05:45):
For you was all right.
Here's a good question.
Sure, was it aversion towardsarab men that made you look
outside your culture?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
oh god be honest um no, not really, because I was
like out of.
That's a different question now, but I was engaged to an Arab
man before, so I don't have.
It's not like I'm averse toArab men.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
But do I prefer not marrying an Arab man?
Yes, am I happy I didn't marryan Arab man?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yes, Okay, care to elaborate?
On the point that you prefernon-arab men well, I don't want
people to hate.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I don't want arab listeners to hate me.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
You're supposed to be open and transparent on this
podcast.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Okay, I guess, I guess, um.
So I'm not generalizing.
I don't like to generalize, butsome arab men, some cultures,
are known to be a little bitcontrolling.
Uh, some are narrow-minded.
Again, I'm not generalizing I'mout of myself.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Stop trying to caveat your points, just say it okay,
I'm out of myself.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Uh, yeah, um, yeah, just closed-mindedness,
controlling, not adventurous,just routine.
They love routine, stuck intheir own ways or like you know
what.
The word I'm looking for ishard to change.
They don't like to change.
And some of them can't admitwhen they're wrong.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, I actually can agree to some of those points
based on what I'm seeing as amatchmaker Arab men.
I've said this in a previousepisode Arab men are the hardest
to work with.
I can just think of a veryrecent example.
So yeah, I can always seecertain patterns, like you said,
(07:39):
controlling, sometimes sexistor misogynistic in some cases,
but there is like this recurringpattern with out of men that I
always see yeah, but I'm sureyou find this also in other
cultures.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
But because this is my culture, I'm familiar with my
culture, so I'm able toidentify this in my culture okay
, all right.
Okay, I want an honest answerto this one.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Okay, I'm always honest.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
I know, okay, did you reply to my message?
Just because I have a fair skin.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
That played a part.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Oh wow, that was easy .
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah, I'll be honest, guys are driven by two things
Food and physical beauty.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Simple creatures.
Simple creatures.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
And obviously I didn't see a burger when I saw
your profile.
I saw your face and you have apretty face and I'm attracted to
fair-skinned girls.
So, yes, that did play a part.
And so I think and most guyswould probably agree to this
that guys start with the profilepicture first and then they
probably go to the profile and,um, and I'm pretty sure I did
(08:43):
that, and when I saw that youhad a interest in the arts and
that you were, uh, that youloved classical music, I'm like
this is it?
I mean like that wasn't likethe the, the seal, right, but
like all, right, this is enoughfor me to want to continue
(09:04):
conversations, okay, and rest ishistory okay, so if I get a tan
tomorrow, will you change yourmind?
I don't think you'll turn brownskin.
You won't turn into like anindian pakistani if you get a
tan actually I'll, I'll get red,I'll burn, burn.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Yeah, my skin will burn.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Okay, all right, all right.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Okay, guys, I hope this is not too weird for you.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Were your parents initially resistant to me
because I was from anotherculture?
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Honestly, no, I wouldn't lie.
No, they weren't, because Imade them fall in love with you
before they even met you.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
But I don't speak arabic.
I'm not.
I'm not arab, I'm not evenwhite.
I don't make the arab food well, arab men don't cook anyway.
So that's true, okay so let'sexclude that point.
Yeah, so I didn't have any ofthe typical factors that would
work in your favor.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Maybe if it was somebody else then they would
have questioned it, but meparticularly.
They trust my judgment, likeespecially once I became older,
they really trust my judgment.
We have this relationship oflike just openness, friendship,
you could say.
And of course they asked mequestions.
They made sure this and thatit's not.
(10:34):
Like I just told them, oh,there's this guy and I'm going
to marry this guy, and they werelike okay, congratulations.
No, of course they askedquestions and made sure that
this is the right decision.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Was there any resistance to you moving to
Canada?
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Not resistance?
Just what is the right word.
Sadness.
Okay, there was sadness BecauseI only have one sister.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
She's married.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
She lives an hour away from my parents.
My parents are in their old ageand I'm very close to my
parents, so it was just sadness,just the emptiness they're
going to feel.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
But no, there was a resistance.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
On the contrary, Okay , yeah, okay, some fun.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Enough with the contrary.
Okay, yeah, okay.
Some fun.
Enough with the seriousquestions, some fun.
What is one thing you did toimpress me that?
Now, if you look back on it,you'll think it was so
unnecessary or like it was silly.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
One thing I did to impress you.
I don't think anything I did toimpress you was silly.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Not necessarily silly , but like unnecessary or like
it was extra, I guess.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Everything I did was intentional, as far as I recall.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
So I'll give a few examples.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I remember writing Arabic poetry on a card and
giving it to you I remember wefirst met in chicago.
Yes, I remember that.
I remember um buying a book, uh, from one of your favorite
mufassers oh, that's a greatbook.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
That's a lemakshari, oh my god.
Yes, so it wasn't easy to findit was not, it was not easy to
find.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
So all these small things were intentional, um,
because I wanted, because to mea gift should be sentimental and
it should have some deep valueto it.
So, um, everything.
I can't think of any sillything, or like even thinking
back now, that was, you know,silly.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Actually, any gift, that was silly, I mean actually,
this is something I've alwaysadmired about you, like your
gifts are intentional, whichshows me that you listen, that
you're not just getting a giftfor the sake of like getting a
gift, but it's something youknow I'm excited for, looking
like it would mean something tome, so, yeah, that's great.
Uh, okay, actually that's a tipfor you girls if you're talking
(13:16):
to this guy, you're, you're inyour courting phase, you're
engaged um, just uh, observewhat kind of gifts he gives you.
Are they like, do they carry ameaning, or?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
yeah, that's a good point is he listening or or not,
I guess okay, what was atotally unexpected compatibility
factor between us that you onlydiscovered after marriage?
Speaker 1 (13:41):
uh, that's a very good question.
I would say love forintellectual discussions.
I mean, we had a lot ofdiscussions when we were
courting, but they weren'tintellectual, they were more
geared like to assesscompatibility so they were about
(14:03):
our lives, our personalities,our like preferences and goals
and stuff.
But after we got married and westarted, like I don't know,
watching lectures together,attending conferences uh,
watching politics and beinginvolved in many different
(14:24):
projects, so and every time wewould have a discussion and I
just love the thought processthat we go through and like how
we agree sometimes, how wedisagree sometimes, how we have
different outlooks, sometimes onspecific matters.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
So, yeah, I really love that like yeah, I remember
those days when we were watchingbayena videos or we would just
watch other youtube videos andstuff and then we would just
have a conversation about whatwe saw.
Yeah, I remember those days.
That was fun.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
Yeah, that was fun actually a lot of like clients
they put on their registrationforms.
Something they're looking foris someone who can have
conversations and discussions ondifferent uh, like on a variety
of topics, someone who enjoysintellectual discussions and
long, long conversations andstuff.
(15:17):
Like there's a substance you'renot just talking about.
Okay, what are we cookingtomorrow?
Where are we going?
I don't know how our financialsare doing, like yeah, those
things get old it gets stressfulsometimes yeah, for sure uh,
okay, an awkward question.
(15:38):
What was your mom's firstreaction when you told her about
me, before she met me, beforewe spoke, or anything?
Speaker 2 (15:46):
you were an immigration scam, yeah sounds
like your mom yeah, mom wasconvinced that you were using me
for immigration purposes and uh, yeah, that, uh, I thought mom
was joking first, but then I sawthe look on her face and I'm
like, okay, mom thinks I'mreally getting scammed here.
(16:07):
And you know, like, yeah, I wasjust about to say that the idea
isn't that far fetched, becausethese things happen.
Actually, it happens the otherway around, where the guy
usually scams the girl, yeah and, but you never know, it could
also happen to guys too.
I'm sure those, thosesituations happen, yeah, and,
but you never know it could alsohappen to guys too.
I'm sure those, thosesituations happen.
So, yeah, I had to schedule aSkype call and then she got to
(16:29):
talk to you and she felt at ease, and then we got the ball
rolling for our nikah and thatwas it.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
So you didn't have like to convince her.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Not really.
I think you won her over on theSkype call somehow.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I don't know what you said.
I was so nervous on that callbecause it felt like an
interrogation.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, but you never know, maybe once I get my
passport, things will change.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Yeah, maybe.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Never say never.
Hey, if you have a story totell, we'd love to have you on
here.
You'll find a safe space oflisteners who can understand
what you're going through.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
What's something about being married that no one
prepared you for?
Speaker 1 (17:23):
The fact that I have to cook every single day.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
You were used to cooking, though.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Yeah, but I used to cook like a large pot of
muzadara or whatever to be ableto eat it for like six, seven
days.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Oh.
God, oh, and one more thing Idon't require a new dish every
single day.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
No, oh, okay Actually .
And one more thing I don'trequire a new dish every single
day.
No, oh, okay Actually.
That's the thing.
It's not about marriage itself,but it's about the cultural
differences.
So I didn't know that you guyseat lunch and eat dinner.
Yes, and it has to be adifferent food, different type
of food, different dish.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
We don't have this in the Middle East.
We have breakfast, which isusually light unless it's a
weekend, and we have lunch.
We don't have dinner oh my godwe and, like you, if somebody in
the family gets hungry in theevening, you have a light snack,
a sandwich, fruit or tea orsomething, but we don't have
dinner and the main meal of theday is lunch.
(18:22):
But you guys have lunch andhave dinner like this is too
much for for a wife to do no man, I can't believe you guys don't
have dinner.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Yeah, it's actually healthier, is it?
Speaker 1 (18:34):
of course it is because you should go to bed
light.
That's why you have the mainmeal, something in the evening
yeah, like I don't know, fruit,a snack, but not the meal.
Like you guys have this themain meal of the day is dinner
that's true.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah, dinner should be light, you're right.
Okay, question for you if youwere giving advice to someone
who's overthinking their list,what would our story help them
realize?
Speaker 1 (19:08):
That perfection doesn't exist.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Yeah, you can ask for everything you want, but you're
not going to get somebody whomeets all of that, who checks
all those boxes.
It just doesn't exist, justlike you don't check anyone's
boxes all of their boxes.
But, I feel like this is acliche that we've repeated like
(19:33):
100 times so far, but I reallycan't think of a better way to
say it.
If you are clear on your values,values, then let that guide
your decision, because no one isgonna fulfill every desire you
want in a spouse okay but if themost important things are there
(19:55):
, then the other things could becompromised on, and a lot of
things we think we want rightnow are circumstantial, like for
example for example, you wantsomebody who's like financially
established, who's who like it'salready there that drives me
nuts but that's circumstantial,because somebody could get there
(20:16):
if they have the drive and theambition we just ran into that
situation recently actually yeahand it really drives me crazy
how girls want the finishedproduct some don't generalize,
I'm
Speaker 2 (20:28):
not generalizing, but , come on, we've seen it on more
than one occasion, right, wheregirls like sometimes, in some
cases, explicitly put on theform that I want a guy who earns
80k, 80k plus, and so whatdrives me crazy is that there's
an not with all girls, but agood number of girls that I've
(20:48):
come across as a professionalmatchmaker that just don't show
a willingness to support right,whether the guy is, you know,
striving to become a businessowner, is in school, unemployed,
whatever it might be.
Where, where is thatwillingness to support,
especially given, and in all thecases that I'm talking about
(21:09):
right now, these girls wereworking right, these girls are
earning a decent income so youcan contribute and support
financially.
It's not to say that the thedad is going to become a
stay-at-home dad, but you're notgoing to end up homeless.
You're not going to end.
You dad is going to become astay-at-home dad, but you're not
going to end up homeless.
You're not going to live in ashoebox.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Yeah, but what if the woman wants actually to have a
family, start a family soon, andshe doesn't want?
Speaker 2 (21:31):
to Within the first year of marriage.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Some of them are in their 30s and they don't have a
lot of time to waste.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
So maybe the guy just needs a year or two years to
finish his certification, tofinish his graduate program, to
to take his licensing exam, ormaybe he's just taking a year
off work just to pursue abusiness idea.
What's wrong with that?
Nothing's wrong with that sowhere is the support?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
girls.
I think this is not coming froma place of lack of support, but
it's coming from a desire or aneed for stability.
Girls in general, they seekstability and they need that
sense of security.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
So if a guy has a plan, okay, so, given
entrepreneurship is a risk.
But let's take a moretraditional example is a risk.
But let's take a moretraditional example.
Guy is in grad school, or maybehe.
He just finished grad schooland he is studying for his exam.
He's not working, he's studyingfor his exams, he's still
trying to.
You know, he's got a ton ofstudent debt.
He has a plan laid out forfinancial stability, right, a
(22:37):
plan forward, a career path.
What about that situation?
Why not support the guy throughthat?
Speaker 1 (22:44):
maybe he just needs another year.
So I'm not excusing that, I'mjust trying to understand it
okay because to a girl she mightthink okay.
I admire his aspiration, hisambition but, there's no
guarantee he's gonna pass theexam or he's gonna land a job
soon after, so there's alwaysuncertainty.
Though yes, even if he doesrequires a leap of faith it does
(23:07):
it does.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
And for a girl to come in and say that I want
everything to be safe and secure, right like I want the nest to
be just perfectly made for mewhere there are no risks, is a
bit unrealistic marriagerequires a certain level of
faith, like you said, but she'snot asking for a mansion, she's
I'm not asking for a mansion,but an unrealistic level of
(23:32):
security, I think I don't thinkit's unrealistic I look, girls.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
People are different.
I myself, for example, Iwouldn't shy away from this kind
of risk.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Right.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Like, if the guy was like, let's say, for example, if
you were the kind of person whohas that energy and drive and I
want to grow and I want towhatever, but you were like in
between jobs, then that would beenough for me.
But people are different.
Some people need that stability, need that sense of security
(24:08):
that I'm not entering into amarriage that's just starting
with a risk.
It doesn't necessarily meanthat.
What?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
risk.
I don't understand what riskthere is if he has finished
graduate school, so he has hisdegree.
He just needs to take hislicensing exam.
He has a plan laid out for him,so I don't see the risk there.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
I don't see a risk, but maybe some girls do.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
What risk?
I don't understand.
I see the same level of risk ifthe guy is currently employed
and he could get laid offtomorrow.
I mean, his company coulddownsize and he could get laid
off.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
You're starting from like a level down.
You could say how many peopledo you know who have degrees but
are unemployed?
Many people, or are working, asI don't know, uber drivers,
drivers which there is nothingwrong with that and they have
degrees so that's what I'msaying.
Having a degree doesn'tnecessarily mean that you are
(25:12):
that you have job security notnecessarily that's what I'm
saying.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Having a degree doesn't necessarily mean job
security so there's a riskeither way.
That's the point that I'mmaking, so why not take that
leap of faith?
Speaker 1 (25:24):
there is a lesser risk if the guy's already
working, or he's at leastsomehow, is established right.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
So I guess so that so they're trying to minimize risk
okay and yeah, especially ifthey're planning on having
children even year number two,but again, in many situations
the girl is also working, so Istill don't see the level of
risk, Unless she has completelymade up her mind 100% that the
(25:55):
day she signs that Nikahcontract she's going to be a
stay-at-home mom, which I rarelyever see.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Some women we see do want to have a traditional role
yes, in time, though in time notlike right off the bat yeah,
but if you are entering amarriage with the expectation
that you are going to work, thenit, like it, might cause
problems in the future.
If you are envisioning amarried life where you are
(26:24):
taking a traditional role.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
It's going to create problems.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
Yes, you want to become a traditional wife.
You want to have a traditionalrole, but you are starting your
marriage with the expectationthat you're going to work until
he makes it.
Yeah, so yeah.
Do you see the contradiction?
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I don't, I don't, I honestly don't.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Maybe I'm missing something um try it again okay,
I'm a woman, I want to have atraditional life okay where you
stay at home.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
this is take care of the home.
Exactly this is my vision formy marriage.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Okay, yeah, but I am marrying a guy who currently
doesn't work and I'm going to beworking until he can support a
family.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
There's no guarantee he's going to get there and you
don't know how long it's goingto get.
You don't know if this is gonnacause cause us to delay having
children.
You don't know what's gonnahappen and I want to have a
traditional life right.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
But in many cases guys who have gone to school,
who have a plan laid out forward, they will be able to get there
because they've already put inthe work and they know exactly
how many years it will take toget to a certain level of income
(27:50):
, whether you're a CPA or adoctor, lawyer, whatever it
might be.
So that kind of mindset and wayof thinking is not really
grounded.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
You know, somebody mentioned it once, I think I saw
it in a comment and itresonated with me.
If we are talking about acouple who are in their early
20s, then sure they can affordto do that build themselves,
build themselves together, startfrom scratch, all of all of
that.
Delay having children, but ifwe're talking about people who
(28:24):
are already in their mid-30s,it's not exactly realistic.
Too late until he makes it.
And until when are we going tohave children?
When are we going to?
Speaker 2 (28:36):
How many cases do you see of guys finishing graduate
school in their late 30s, mid tolate 30s?
Speaker 1 (28:42):
No, some of them have been graduated like, have
graduated a long before a longtime before but they are still
not established In many cases,generally speaking.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
generally speaking and we've been doing this work
for a long time Generallyspeaking, a guy in his mid 30s,
mid to late 30s- is earning adecent income and is pretty well
settled into their career yeah,maybe yes, how did we end up
here?
I don't know, because you knowit's a sensitive topic for me,
(29:15):
so I don't know.
I think that the recentsituation was just on my mind
and so, but anyways, thequestion we were asking each
other was uh, advice to someonewho's overthinking their list.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Oh, and what would our story help them realize?
Okay, so that was my advice.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Perfection doesn't exist for me, my advice would be
that you can plan all you want.
You can envision your marriageand your spouse the way you want
.
Plan all you want.
You can envision your marriageand your spouse the way you want
, but Allah has a plan for you.
You can think you're going tomarry some Victoria's Secret
supermodel or whatever it mightbe, but what you need to
(29:56):
understand is that Allah hassomeone better in mind for you,
and your job is to be flexible,is to be reliant on Him, is to
make your intentions sincere andpure and to put in the work,
because, at the end of the day,allah is going to show you the
(30:20):
door, but you have to walkthrough it Right, and you don't
know where those windows ofopportunity will come from, how
they might present themselves.
But you have to be ready forthat moment, and the way you can
get ready is through ways thatwe've talked about in many, many
episodes which isself-assessment, understanding
your values, etc.
Etc.
Etc.
(30:40):
You can go back to previousepisodes and and listen to that,
but if you're not doing thework and if you're not prepared
for that moment when Allahpresents you with someone, then
you could be missing out, right,exactly.
So, um, just realize that Allahhas a plan for you.
Maybe the plan is that youdon't get married, right, and I
hope that you know that doesn'thappen to, and I hope that you
(31:01):
know that doesn't happen to you,and I hope everybody is blessed
with a spouse.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Yeah, I think.
Just to reiterate what you justsaid do the self-work.
Don't wait for somebody to cometo start doing the self-work,
Because they're not going towait for you to be ready.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
We're not talking about financial readiness and
all of that Right, becauseeverybody thinks like getting
ready for marriage means, oh, Ihave to have a job, I have to
have a place, and yes, thosethings are important, but that's
not everything there'ssomething more important, there
are more important things.
You can have all those things,all those superficial things I
don't want to call themsuperficial things, because they
are important, but you can haveall those things, but if you
(31:49):
don't know yourself, if youdon't understand your values,
then you are setting yourself upfor major problems.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Yeah, yeah, sorry I cut you off, you were saying
something, just yeah, I think Ialready said it do the self-work
, start working on yourselfearly, so when the right person
comes, you'll be fully prepared,for sure yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Inshallah, we hope you guys benefited from this
episode and, as always, feelfree to comment and if you want
to come on the podcast and sharea story, um, whatever it might
be, maybe it's um through yourcourting phase or, uh, an
experience you had on one of theapps.
Whatever it might be, we'd loveto hear your story.
(32:24):
And how can people reach out tous, hiba?
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yeah, just shoot us an email at halalmatchca and we
would love to have you.
I think other listeners wouldalso feel inspired by your story
.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Inshallah Until next time.
Assalamu alaikum, assalamualaikum.
Assalamu alaikum, I'm Hiba.
And I'm Zaid, you're listeningto Diary of a Matchmaker.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
A podcast that will take you into our world as
matchmakers.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
We'll share our experiences and offer advice for
the single Muslim.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
So let's dive in.
Bismillah, assalamu alaikumeveryone, welcome to another
episode.
My name is Zaid and on theother mic is my wife and co-host
.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
Hiba Assalamu alaikum .
Speaker 2 (00:26):
So alhamdulillah, we had a relatively short courting
phase it was about a month and ahalf and during that time we
got to know each other prettywell.
I'd say we spent a lot of timetalking, asked each other a lot
of questions and, yeah, ofcourse, we had a great time, but
we realized that obviously wecouldn't meet each other.
It was all virtual.
So if we were serious aboutthis, there was a lot we had to
(00:49):
cover.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
So, inshallah, we're going to reflect on that journey
and hopefully you guys takeaway some nuggets from that.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I feel, actually, that it was a blessing that we
were you could say courtingvirtually, you could say
courting virtually like if wewere at the same place and we
were meeting.
Then we might have just spentthe time I don't know sipping
coffee and talking about theweather or silly stuff or no,
like there was a sense ofurgency, I guess yes, I think
(01:18):
the urgency was the fact that wehad a scheduled date to meet in
person and we had been talkingso long prior to that.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
So we had to make a decision like are we serious?
And if we are serious, then wehave to tie the knot, because
that was that was going to bethe opportunity for us to meet,
and I don't know if you wouldhave had another opportunity to
meet after that yeah, you'reright so if you guys don't know
the details of the story, go toepisode one and listen to that
episode.
(01:47):
But um so tell me what's onething you were secretly worried
about before getting married,but didn't admit until later
maybe the cultural differences.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
I wasn't worried about it, like I was excited to
marry into a different culture,but I also was like stepping
into an unknown territory for me.
To me, Okay.
And also I knew how kind yourmom was.
But still, I was moving to anew country, to a new family.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You hardly knew her, though you spoke to her like
once you told me about her.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Okay and uh, just leaving my family and leaving my
, my country, and just moving toa new, across the ocean, a new
continent that fear.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I can understand new family being alone here.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
I don't know anyone here.
New culture that felt too muchAt one point.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
So I sold myself pretty well.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
You sold yourself pretty well, we were very
compatible.
I'm like how often is thisGonna come around?
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Yeah, alhamdulillah, everything turned out to be A
blessing.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yeah, okay Cool what about you?
For me.
Uh, the one fear I had, I wouldsay, was um the language
barrier, um english.
What I mean?
Obviously you're fluent English, but it wasn't your first
language and I think, beyondthat, it was just acceptance
(03:29):
into your family.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Like.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I'm a brown guy.
I don't speak Arabic.
Arabs usually don't marry brownpeople.
It's not really culturallyacceptable.
So I think if there was onefear, it would have been
acceptance.
Okay, yeah, I'll be honest.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
I hope reality proved you wrong, of course I stayed
with your parents for five weeks.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Yeah, your parents have been more than nice to me.
يبخت من زار وخفف.
Oh, yes.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
To any non-Arabic speakers.
It means like light guest is agood guest, like don't overstay
your welcome yes, that was oneproverb I learned and I said
frequently okay, question foryou what is one thing you think
you missed out by not marrying abrown girl?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
oh, easy the food food the food.
Obviously I do miss my foodsometimes but like you're
deprived of your food.
True, however it's, it's ablessing, because, uh, desi food
isn't exactly the healthiestfood yeah, exactly, exactly know
, everybody knows that the bestdiet out there is the
(04:44):
Mediterranean diet.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
So I lucked out, but I do still miss my chicken curry
and my butter chicken.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
But here you got three things.
First of all, you're a goodcook.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, I can cook.
All right yeah.
I make a killer dalmachniyou've made it once in your life
, but it was killer.
You think you deserve the goldmedal or something.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
I nailed it though no , but I cook some dishes like
three hours but I cook some desidishes and on top of that your
mom lives across the street andshe's a great cook.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
She's an awesome.
She hates having us over.
Okay, that's an exaggeration,yeah we just came back, but and
there are a lot of like friendsaround us who make great food
yes, but I can't go to myfriend's house all the time and
say give me desi food, becausemy wife doesn't know how to cook
desi food.
Okay, I guess, anyways, um,okay, how about?
(05:45):
For you was all right.
Here's a good question.
Sure, was it aversion towardsarab men that made you look
outside your culture?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
oh god be honest um no, not really, because I was
like out of.
That's a different question now, but I was engaged to an Arab
man before, so I don't have.
It's not like I'm averse toArab men.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
But do I prefer not marrying an Arab man?
Yes, am I happy I didn't marryan Arab man?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yes, Okay, care to elaborate?
On the point that you prefernon-arab men well, I don't want
people to hate.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I don't want arab listeners to hate me.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
You're supposed to be open and transparent on this
podcast.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Okay, I guess, I guess, um.
So I'm not generalizing.
I don't like to generalize, butsome arab men, some cultures,
are known to be a little bitcontrolling.
Uh, some are narrow-minded.
Again, I'm not generalizing I'mout of myself.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Stop trying to caveat your points, just say it okay,
I'm out of myself.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Uh, yeah, um, yeah, just closed-mindedness,
controlling, not adventurous,just routine.
They love routine, stuck intheir own ways or like you know
what.
The word I'm looking for ishard to change.
They don't like to change.
And some of them can't admitwhen they're wrong.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, I actually can agree to some of those points
based on what I'm seeing as amatchmaker Arab men.
I've said this in a previousepisode Arab men are the hardest
to work with.
I can just think of a veryrecent example.
So yeah, I can always seecertain patterns, like you said,
(07:39):
controlling, sometimes sexistor misogynistic in some cases,
but there is like this recurringpattern with out of men that I
always see yeah, but I'm sureyou find this also in other
cultures.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
But because this is my culture, I'm familiar with my
culture, so I'm able toidentify this in my culture okay
, all right.
Okay, I want an honest answerto this one.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Okay, I'm always honest.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
I know, okay, did you reply to my message?
Just because I have a fair skin.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
That played a part.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Oh wow, that was easy .
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah, I'll be honest, guys are driven by two things
Food and physical beauty.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Simple creatures.
Simple creatures.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
And obviously I didn't see a burger when I saw
your profile.
I saw your face and you have apretty face and I'm attracted to
fair-skinned girls.
So, yes, that did play a part.
And so I think and most guyswould probably agree to this
that guys start with the profilepicture first and then they
probably go to the profile and,um, and I'm pretty sure I did
(08:43):
that, and when I saw that youhad a interest in the arts and
that you were, uh, that youloved classical music, I'm like
this is it?
I mean like that wasn't likethe the, the seal, right, but
like all, right, this is enoughfor me to want to continue
(09:04):
conversations, okay, and rest ishistory okay, so if I get a tan
tomorrow, will you change yourmind?
I don't think you'll turn brownskin.
You won't turn into like anindian pakistani if you get a
tan actually I'll, I'll get red,I'll burn, burn.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Yeah, my skin will burn.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Okay, all right, all right.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Okay, guys, I hope this is not too weird for you.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Were your parents initially resistant to me
because I was from anotherculture?
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Honestly, no, I wouldn't lie.
No, they weren't, because Imade them fall in love with you
before they even met you.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
But I don't speak arabic.
I'm not.
I'm not arab, I'm not evenwhite.
I don't make the arab food well, arab men don't cook anyway.
So that's true, okay so let'sexclude that point.
Yeah, so I didn't have any ofthe typical factors that would
work in your favor.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Maybe if it was somebody else then they would
have questioned it, but meparticularly.
They trust my judgment, likeespecially once I became older,
they really trust my judgment.
We have this relationship oflike just openness, friendship,
you could say.
And of course they asked mequestions.
They made sure this and thatit's not.
(10:34):
Like I just told them, oh,there's this guy and I'm going
to marry this guy, and they werelike okay, congratulations.
No, of course they askedquestions and made sure that
this is the right decision.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Was there any resistance to you moving to
Canada?
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Not resistance?
Just what is the right word.
Sadness.
Okay, there was sadness BecauseI only have one sister.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
She's married.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
She lives an hour away from my parents.
My parents are in their old ageand I'm very close to my
parents, so it was just sadness,just the emptiness they're
going to feel.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
But no, there was a resistance.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
On the contrary, Okay , yeah, okay, some fun.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Enough with the contrary.
Okay, yeah, okay.
Some fun.
Enough with the seriousquestions, some fun.
What is one thing you did toimpress me that?
Now, if you look back on it,you'll think it was so
unnecessary or like it was silly.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
One thing I did to impress you.
I don't think anything I did toimpress you was silly.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
Not necessarily silly , but like unnecessary or like
it was extra, I guess.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Everything I did was intentional, as far as I recall.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
So I'll give a few examples.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I remember writing Arabic poetry on a card and
giving it to you I remember wefirst met in chicago.
Yes, I remember that.
I remember um buying a book, uh, from one of your favorite
mufassers oh, that's a greatbook.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
That's a lemakshari, oh my god.
Yes, so it wasn't easy to findit was not, it was not easy to
find.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
So all these small things were intentional, um,
because I wanted, because to mea gift should be sentimental and
it should have some deep valueto it.
So, um, everything.
I can't think of any sillything, or like even thinking
back now, that was, you know,silly.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Actually, any gift, that was silly, I mean actually,
this is something I've alwaysadmired about you, like your
gifts are intentional, whichshows me that you listen, that
you're not just getting a giftfor the sake of like getting a
gift, but it's something youknow I'm excited for, looking
like it would mean something tome, so, yeah, that's great.
Uh, okay, actually that's a tipfor you girls if you're talking
(13:16):
to this guy, you're, you're inyour courting phase, you're
engaged um, just uh, observewhat kind of gifts he gives you.
Are they like, do they carry ameaning, or?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
yeah, that's a good point is he listening or or not,
I guess okay, what was atotally unexpected compatibility
factor between us that you onlydiscovered after marriage?
Speaker 1 (13:41):
uh, that's a very good question.
I would say love forintellectual discussions.
I mean, we had a lot ofdiscussions when we were
courting, but they weren'tintellectual, they were more
geared like to assesscompatibility so they were about
(14:03):
our lives, our personalities,our like preferences and goals
and stuff.
But after we got married and westarted, like I don't know,
watching lectures together,attending conferences uh,
watching politics and beinginvolved in many different
(14:24):
projects, so and every time wewould have a discussion and I
just love the thought processthat we go through and like how
we agree sometimes, how wedisagree sometimes, how we have
different outlooks, sometimes onspecific matters.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
So, yeah, I really love that like yeah, I remember
those days when we were watchingbayena videos or we would just
watch other youtube videos andstuff and then we would just
have a conversation about whatwe saw.
Yeah, I remember those days.
That was fun.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
Yeah, that was fun actually a lot of like clients
they put on their registrationforms.
Something they're looking foris someone who can have
conversations and discussions ondifferent uh, like on a variety
of topics, someone who enjoysintellectual discussions and
long, long conversations andstuff.
(15:17):
Like there's a substance you'renot just talking about.
Okay, what are we cookingtomorrow?
Where are we going?
I don't know how our financialsare doing, like yeah, those
things get old it gets stressfulsometimes yeah, for sure uh,
okay, an awkward question.
(15:38):
What was your mom's firstreaction when you told her about
me, before she met me, beforewe spoke, or anything?
Speaker 2 (15:46):
you were an immigration scam, yeah sounds
like your mom yeah, mom wasconvinced that you were using me
for immigration purposes and uh, yeah, that, uh, I thought mom
was joking first, but then I sawthe look on her face and I'm
like, okay, mom thinks I'mreally getting scammed here.
(16:07):
And you know, like, yeah, I wasjust about to say that the idea
isn't that far fetched, becausethese things happen.
Actually, it happens the otherway around, where the guy
usually scams the girl, yeah and, but you never know, it could
also happen to guys too.
I'm sure those, thosesituations happen, yeah, and,
but you never know it could alsohappen to guys too.
I'm sure those, thosesituations happen.
So, yeah, I had to schedule aSkype call and then she got to
(16:29):
talk to you and she felt at ease, and then we got the ball
rolling for our nikah and thatwas it.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
So you didn't have like to convince her.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Not really.
I think you won her over on theSkype call somehow.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I don't know what you said.
I was so nervous on that callbecause it felt like an
interrogation.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, but you never know, maybe once I get my
passport, things will change.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Yeah, maybe.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Never say never.
Hey, if you have a story totell, we'd love to have you on
here.
You'll find a safe space oflisteners who can understand
what you're going through.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
What's something about being married that no one
prepared you for?
Speaker 1 (17:23):
The fact that I have to cook every single day.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
You were used to cooking, though.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Yeah, but I used to cook like a large pot of
muzadara or whatever to be ableto eat it for like six, seven
days.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Oh.
God, oh, and one more thing Idon't require a new dish every
single day.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
No, oh, okay Actually .
And one more thing I don'trequire a new dish every single
day.
No, oh, okay Actually.
That's the thing.
It's not about marriage itself,but it's about the cultural
differences.
So I didn't know that you guyseat lunch and eat dinner.
Yes, and it has to be adifferent food, different type
of food, different dish.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
We don't have this in the Middle East.
We have breakfast, which isusually light unless it's a
weekend, and we have lunch.
We don't have dinner oh my godwe and, like you, if somebody in
the family gets hungry in theevening, you have a light snack,
a sandwich, fruit or tea orsomething, but we don't have
dinner and the main meal of theday is lunch.
(18:22):
But you guys have lunch andhave dinner like this is too
much for for a wife to do no man, I can't believe you guys don't
have dinner.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Yeah, it's actually healthier, is it?
Speaker 1 (18:34):
of course it is because you should go to bed
light.
That's why you have the mainmeal, something in the evening
yeah, like I don't know, fruit,a snack, but not the meal.
Like you guys have this themain meal of the day is dinner
that's true.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah, dinner should be light, you're right.
Okay, question for you if youwere giving advice to someone
who's overthinking their list,what would our story help them
realize?
Speaker 1 (19:08):
That perfection doesn't exist.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Yeah, you can ask for everything you want, but you're
not going to get somebody whomeets all of that, who checks
all those boxes.
It just doesn't exist, justlike you don't check anyone's
boxes all of their boxes.
But, I feel like this is acliche that we've repeated like
(19:33):
100 times so far, but I reallycan't think of a better way to
say it.
If you are clear on your values,values, then let that guide
your decision, because no one isgonna fulfill every desire you
want in a spouse okay but if themost important things are there
(19:55):
, then the other things could becompromised on, and a lot of
things we think we want rightnow are circumstantial, like for
example for example, you wantsomebody who's like financially
established, who's who like it'salready there that drives me
nuts but that's circumstantial,because somebody could get there
(20:16):
if they have the drive and theambition we just ran into that
situation recently actually yeahand it really drives me crazy
how girls want the finishedproduct some don't generalize,
I'm
Speaker 2 (20:28):
not generalizing, but , come on, we've seen it on more
than one occasion, right, wheregirls like sometimes, in some
cases, explicitly put on theform that I want a guy who earns
80k, 80k plus, and so whatdrives me crazy is that there's
an not with all girls, but agood number of girls that I've
(20:48):
come across as a professionalmatchmaker that just don't show
a willingness to support right,whether the guy is, you know,
striving to become a businessowner, is in school, unemployed,
whatever it might be.
Where, where is thatwillingness to support,
especially given, and in all thecases that I'm talking about
(21:09):
right now, these girls wereworking right, these girls are
earning a decent income so youcan contribute and support
financially.
It's not to say that the thedad is going to become a
stay-at-home dad, but you're notgoing to end up homeless.
You're not going to end.
You dad is going to become astay-at-home dad, but you're not
going to end up homeless.
You're not going to live in ashoebox.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Yeah, but what if the woman wants actually to have a
family, start a family soon, andshe doesn't want?
Speaker 2 (21:31):
to Within the first year of marriage.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
Some of them are in their 30s and they don't have a
lot of time to waste.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
So maybe the guy just needs a year or two years to
finish his certification, tofinish his graduate program, to
to take his licensing exam, ormaybe he's just taking a year
off work just to pursue abusiness idea.
What's wrong with that?
Nothing's wrong with that sowhere is the support?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
girls.
I think this is not coming froma place of lack of support, but
it's coming from a desire or aneed for stability.
Girls in general, they seekstability and they need that
sense of security.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
So if a guy has a plan, okay, so, given
entrepreneurship is a risk.
But let's take a moretraditional example is a risk.
But let's take a moretraditional example.
Guy is in grad school, or maybehe.
He just finished grad schooland he is studying for his exam.
He's not working, he's studyingfor his exams, he's still
trying to.
You know, he's got a ton ofstudent debt.
He has a plan laid out forfinancial stability, right, a
(22:37):
plan forward, a career path.
What about that situation?
Why not support the guy throughthat?
Speaker 1 (22:44):
maybe he just needs another year.
So I'm not excusing that, I'mjust trying to understand it
okay because to a girl she mightthink okay.
I admire his aspiration, hisambition but, there's no
guarantee he's gonna pass theexam or he's gonna land a job
soon after, so there's alwaysuncertainty.
Though yes, even if he doesrequires a leap of faith it does
(23:07):
it does.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
And for a girl to come in and say that I want
everything to be safe and secure, right like I want the nest to
be just perfectly made for mewhere there are no risks, is a
bit unrealistic marriagerequires a certain level of
faith, like you said, but she'snot asking for a mansion, she's
I'm not asking for a mansion,but an unrealistic level of
(23:32):
security, I think I don't thinkit's unrealistic I look, girls.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
People are different.
I myself, for example, Iwouldn't shy away from this kind
of risk.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Right.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Like, if the guy was like, let's say, for example, if
you were the kind of person whohas that energy and drive and I
want to grow and I want towhatever, but you were like in
between jobs, then that would beenough for me.
But people are different.
Some people need that stability, need that sense of security
(24:08):
that I'm not entering into amarriage that's just starting
with a risk.
It doesn't necessarily meanthat.
What?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
risk.
I don't understand what riskthere is if he has finished
graduate school, so he has hisdegree.
He just needs to take hislicensing exam.
He has a plan laid out for him,so I don't see the risk there.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
I don't see a risk, but maybe some girls do.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
What risk?
I don't understand.
I see the same level of risk ifthe guy is currently employed
and he could get laid offtomorrow.
I mean, his company coulddownsize and he could get laid
off.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
You're starting from like a level down.
You could say how many peopledo you know who have degrees but
are unemployed?
Many people, or are working, asI don't know, uber drivers,
drivers which there is nothingwrong with that and they have
degrees so that's what I'msaying.
Having a degree doesn'tnecessarily mean that you are
(25:12):
that you have job security notnecessarily that's what I'm
saying.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Having a degree doesn't necessarily mean job
security so there's a riskeither way.
That's the point that I'mmaking, so why not take that
leap of faith?
Speaker 1 (25:24):
there is a lesser risk if the guy's already
working, or he's at leastsomehow, is established right.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
So I guess so that so they're trying to minimize risk
okay and yeah, especially ifthey're planning on having
children even year number two,but again, in many situations
the girl is also working, so Istill don't see the level of
risk, Unless she has completelymade up her mind 100% that the
(25:55):
day she signs that Nikahcontract she's going to be a
stay-at-home mom, which I rarelyever see.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Some women we see do want to have a traditional role
yes, in time, though in time notlike right off the bat yeah,
but if you are entering amarriage with the expectation
that you are going to work, thenit, like it, might cause
problems in the future.
If you are envisioning amarried life where you are
(26:24):
taking a traditional role.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
It's going to create problems.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
Yes, you want to become a traditional wife.
You want to have a traditionalrole, but you are starting your
marriage with the expectationthat you're going to work until
he makes it.
Yeah, so yeah.
Do you see the contradiction?
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I don't, I don't, I honestly don't.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Maybe I'm missing something um try it again okay,
I'm a woman, I want to have atraditional life okay where you
stay at home.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
this is take care of the home.
Exactly this is my vision formy marriage.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Okay, yeah, but I am marrying a guy who currently
doesn't work and I'm going to beworking until he can support a
family.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
There's no guarantee he's going to get there and you
don't know how long it's goingto get.
You don't know if this is gonnacause cause us to delay having
children.
You don't know what's gonnahappen and I want to have a
traditional life right.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
But in many cases guys who have gone to school,
who have a plan laid out forward, they will be able to get there
because they've already put inthe work and they know exactly
how many years it will take toget to a certain level of income
(27:50):
, whether you're a CPA or adoctor, lawyer, whatever it
might be.
So that kind of mindset and wayof thinking is not really
grounded.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
You know, somebody mentioned it once, I think I saw
it in a comment and itresonated with me.
If we are talking about acouple who are in their early
20s, then sure they can affordto do that build themselves,
build themselves together, startfrom scratch, all of all of
that.
Delay having children, but ifwe're talking about people who
(28:24):
are already in their mid-30s,it's not exactly realistic.
Too late until he makes it.
And until when are we going tohave children?
When are we going to?
Speaker 2 (28:36):
How many cases do you see of guys finishing graduate
school in their late 30s, mid tolate 30s?
Speaker 1 (28:42):
No, some of them have been graduated like, have
graduated a long before a longtime before but they are still
not established In many cases,generally speaking.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
generally speaking and we've been doing this work
for a long time Generallyspeaking, a guy in his mid 30s,
mid to late 30s- is earning adecent income and is pretty well
settled into their career yeah,maybe yes, how did we end up
here?
I don't know, because you knowit's a sensitive topic for me,
(29:15):
so I don't know.
I think that the recentsituation was just on my mind
and so, but anyways, thequestion we were asking each
other was uh, advice to someonewho's overthinking their list.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Oh, and what would our story help them realize?
Okay, so that was my advice.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Perfection doesn't exist for me, my advice would be
that you can plan all you want.
You can envision your marriageand your spouse the way you want
.
Plan all you want.
You can envision your marriageand your spouse the way you want
, but Allah has a plan for you.
You can think you're going tomarry some Victoria's Secret
supermodel or whatever it mightbe, but what you need to
(29:56):
understand is that Allah hassomeone better in mind for you,
and your job is to be flexible,is to be reliant on Him, is to
make your intentions sincere andpure and to put in the work,
because, at the end of the day,allah is going to show you the
(30:20):
door, but you have to walkthrough it Right, and you don't
know where those windows ofopportunity will come from, how
they might present themselves.
But you have to be ready forthat moment, and the way you can
get ready is through ways thatwe've talked about in many, many
episodes which isself-assessment, understanding
your values, etc.
Etc.
Etc.
(30:40):
You can go back to previousepisodes and and listen to that,
but if you're not doing thework and if you're not prepared
for that moment when Allahpresents you with someone, then
you could be missing out, right,exactly.
So, um, just realize that Allahhas a plan for you.
Maybe the plan is that youdon't get married, right, and I
hope that you know that doesn'thappen to, and I hope that you
(31:01):
know that doesn't happen to you,and I hope everybody is blessed
with a spouse.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Yeah, I think.
Just to reiterate what you justsaid do the self-work.
Don't wait for somebody to cometo start doing the self-work,
Because they're not going towait for you to be ready.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
We're not talking about financial readiness and
all of that Right, becauseeverybody thinks like getting
ready for marriage means, oh, Ihave to have a job, I have to
have a place, and yes, thosethings are important, but that's
not everything there'ssomething more important, there
are more important things.
You can have all those things,all those superficial things I
don't want to call themsuperficial things, because they
are important, but you can haveall those things, but if you
(31:49):
don't know yourself, if youdon't understand your values,
then you are setting yourself upfor major problems.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Yeah, yeah, sorry I cut you off, you were saying
something, just yeah, I think Ialready said it do the self-work
, start working on yourselfearly, so when the right person
comes, you'll be fully prepared,for sure yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Inshallah, we hope you guys benefited from this
episode and, as always, feelfree to comment and if you want
to come on the podcast and sharea story, um, whatever it might
be, maybe it's um through yourcourting phase or, uh, an
experience you had on one of theapps.
Whatever it might be, we'd loveto hear your story.
(32:24):
And how can people reach out tous, hiba?
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yeah, just shoot us an email at halalmatchca and we
would love to have you.
I think other listeners wouldalso feel inspired by your story
.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Inshallah Until next time.
Assalamu alaikum, assalamualaikum.
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