October 10, 2025 • 39 mins
Episode Summary:
In this enlightening episode of "Did She Really Say That?", host Katrina van Oudheusden welcomes Dr. Jacquelyn Cawley, an osteopathic family physician and a leader in personal and professional transformation. They discuss the challenges and triumphs of being a woman in business and delve into Dr. Jackie's journey from corporate healthcare to entrepreneurial success. The episode highlights the importance of authentic self-discovery and the power of transformative growth.
Dr. Jacquelyn’s Journey: Dr. Jackie shares her transition from being a family physician to a healthcare executive, and eventually an entrepreneur. Her pivotal moments, including a significant personal injury, inspired her current path.
Leadership and Self-Expression: Both Katrina and Dr. Jackie discuss the constraints women often face in corporate environments, emphasizing the importance of embracing one's true self.
Healing and Transformation: Dr. Jackie explains how her personal recovery journey led to a deeper understanding of the importance of mindfulness and self-care in achieving one’s goals.
Building a Business: Advice for aspiring entrepreneurs, focusing on learning from others, understanding one's foundational message, and the role of mindset.
Mindfulness and Mindset: The duo talk about maintaining a growth and openness mindset, the importance of self-care, and owning one's personal and professional journey.
Dr. Jacquelyn Cawley is an esteemed osteopathic family physician and thought leader in personal and professional transformation. With over three decades of experience in healthcare and leadership, she founded the Delan Institute for Growth and Wellness, where she guides individuals through transformative processes to achieve their fullest potential.
Delan Institute Website: - Access free resources including the "You Are Enough" transformation guide.
YouTube Channel: Dr. Jackie offers a wealth of videos on topics like communication, change management, and personal growth.
Dr. Jackie's Book: Power Up: Seven Transformational Steps to Own Your Power and Feel More Joy in Your Life.
Subscribe to "Did She Really Say That?" for more inspiring episodes featuring remarkable women making a difference in the world of business and beyond.
Thanks for listening! If you are enjoying our podcast, leave a comment below. We love hearing from our fans and other female entrepreneurs! We are collaborating to make business better for every woman! Feel free to share this podcast on your favorite social platform. And if you are listening on any of the podcast platforms, we would love it if you could post a 5-star review. Please, help us get our message out! Together, we discover how each woman has the power to unlock another woman when we are open about what we are redefining as women in business.
About Your Host: Katrina van Oudheusden
Former Chef at Walt Disney World® Resort, Restaurateur, Speaker, and CEO of Truth Bomb Marketing. Katrina is a sought-after consultant for small business growth among female entrepreneurs.
She created a revolutionary business training method called ‘CreatHER™ Business Rewire’. Weaving together time, money, and business growth by preventing burnout and strengthening female leadership skills.
Alongside the CreatHER™ Planner, women are finally experiencing less stress in all areas of their lives. When the focus begins with HERself, women discover a freedom to dream big, increase revenue, and design a marketing strategy that works for them.
CreatHer Money Revolution: http://creathersummit.com
Blog: https://truthbombmarketing.com/blog
CreatHER Planner: https://truthbombmarketing.com/creather-planner-2026
CreatHER Reset: truthbombmarketing.com/reset
CreatHER Business Rewire: https://truthbombmarketing.com/creather-business-rewire/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Well, welcome to Did she really say that?
A podcast that says, you know what, it's time to change the
conversation for US women. Sometimes our business looks
vastly different than what we'retold it should look like.
And y'all know how I am about y'all about the word should.
We should really stop shooting all over the place.
So I am here because we're goingto have a fun conversation
(00:23):
around what advice you might want to be considering as you
open your business. Some of the mindfulness and
mindset that isn't often addressed as a female business
owner. And so I'm super excited for
this conversation with Doctor Jackie Callaway because this is
about you and I really want you to listen in.
Ladies, if you don't know me, I'm your host, Katrina
(00:45):
Vonatusen, and I'm super excitedto bring to you Doctor Jackie.
She is an ostropathic. Did I say that right?
Yeah. Osteopathic family physician,
Otter, Healthcare executive and thought leader and personal and
professional transformation. With over 30 years of
experience, she has LED transformative change in a
(01:07):
variety of healthcare. Super important.
I just said healthcare organizations developing
numerous leadership programs, which is desperately needed and
has mentored hundreds of individuals in achieving their
fullest potential. That is something often ladies,
we are all we're all looking at what is our true authentic self.
So as the founder and executive chief officer of the Deline, did
(01:28):
I say that correctly too? Fine.
Yep. All right, Deline is tradition
for growth and Wellness. Doctor Callaway is dedicated
helping people live with purposeand confidence.
Ladies, we want to listen up. So, Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for joining us here in today's episode of Did She
Really Say That? It's an honor to have you here.
Well, thank you, Katrina. I'm really excited to be here
(01:49):
today. I love what you're doing with
the podcast and your work. Thank you so much.
I mean, this is a fun conversation because I want to
dive into. So were you always in business?
Did you kind of do a corporate space?
Looks like you've done some, youknow, different organizations.
So what what is some advice? I guess you could say, let's
let's start there. It's like, what?
How did you get into this, this business you're in?
(02:13):
So I, I'm a family physician by my training.
And so I started out as a healer, wasn't expecting to be
in leadership positions, didn't expect to have an MBA and be in
business and open my own business.
Those are not things on my To DoList when I first got started.
But I quickly, I, I don't know, I just was focused on being a
doctor, trying to get through medical school and, you know, do
(02:35):
that kind of thing. So you know, when, when, when I
got my degree and I started working within, it was in
probably within six months that medical directorship became
available. And so I raised my hand and I
said, sure, I'll do it. I'll step into a leadership
role. I don't know what I'm doing, but
sure, I can improve things. And I always want that focus of
how to improve processes of care, how to change care
(02:58):
delivery to better meet family and patient needs.
Just my whole goal was around transforming healthcare delivery
in general and also helping people organize themselves,
particularly other providers andphysicians to do the same.
And so I suddenly ended up in a leadership position, continued
to move through the healthcare executive leadership, corporate
(03:18):
ladder, continued to get different higher, higher level
positions and was doing great. And was I completely satisfied
with everything that I was doingin my life?
No, I always felt that there wasthis bit of a disconnect between
the corporate world and the way that healthcare, like many
(03:40):
organizations very higher, you know, hierarchical and and very,
very masculine power model. So that I was living in and I
can even share like one day whenthe aha moment came to me on
that one, But but it felt like adisconnect to me.
So I started looking for what else could I do?
(04:00):
So I was always looking at self development books and self help
books and thinking about being ACEO of my own company someday,
always thinking about it in the corporate healthcare world.
Oh, I'll be a, I'll lead a hospital, I'll lead a health
system. So it was always around that.
But then a couple of years ago Ihad this very strange incident
(04:21):
that happened to me. I got up, I stood up, I fell and
fainted, basically unaware that this was going to happen with no
warning. Broke my neck, had to get rushed
to the trauma center where I knew everybody.
So it was OK. They saw me coming in on the
stretcher. I'm like God, but you know, so I
knew I was in good hands. But I ended up with two
surgeries, four or five days in the hospital, six weeks out of
(04:43):
work rods in my neck, a lot of hardware.
And so it took a while for me torecover.
And during that recovery process, what I really learned
was what it was most important to me and most essential to me
going forward. And I think that that helped me
to truly find my voice and understand what it is that I
(05:05):
wanted for the future. And I knew it wasn't going to
stay in corporate healthcare anddo the same old, same old for
the rest of my life. And, and so I was kind of
planning my out strategy for an early retirement so that I could
write a book, which I'd always wanted to do.
But this incident gave me a whole lot more focus on luck,
which came, you know, which I was able to publish this last
year. And it helped me come up with
(05:29):
sort of a construct that I coulduse for myself as far as
personal growth in moving past this incident to where I wanted
to be as my genuine, authentic person.
You know, using my voice and speaking about what was really
important to me and sharing thatwith others and trying to help
others do the same. And so get back to work.
Two months later, my boss calls me into her office and
(05:52):
eliminates my position. So now I'm on the last track of
moving in. And I, I mean, yeah, I probably
manifested it. I, I do understand that it's all
good. But it, it did allow me to move
a little bit more quickly towards opening my business and
getting a sense of what I wantedto do next and to write that
book and get it published. And so that's how it all got
(06:14):
started. And there was so much I didn't
know about owning and operating your own business when I got
started. So it's been a huge learning
opportunity for me over this past year, a year and a half.
Yeah, so before we dive into that, and I think this is going
to be a really like, I know it'sa valuable conversation.
I want to step back to that aha moment because I feel like there
was an intuition that was going on there.
(06:36):
So you talked about, you know, you're in this environment that
feels very masculine. That feels like, and I'm
listening to you talk about like, I want to bring, you know,
together a more collaborative healthcare system.
I want to bring, yeah, I want toteach organization, but teach
like, patient care, like true care for what I'm hearing from
you. And yet I feel like you're
butting up against that wall. So what was that aha moment you
(06:59):
had that 'cause you mentioned itand I was like, oh, wait, we're
coming back to that. Oh yeah.
OK, so I when I was in my, I waslike 404142 years old.
I had just gotten appointed to be president of the medical
staff of the largest hospital inthe state of Maine.
Now I was the first woman to ever be in that role and I was
(07:19):
the first osteopathic physician.So it when it's when, when the
leadership opportunities came for me, I, I always had to lean
into them, right step into them.So this was a beautiful summer
day. I was chairing the meeting for
the medical staff that day. I had on this beautiful flowy
lavender gown, not gown. I mean, it was a dress, but it
was kind of a long dress, a maxidress.
(07:41):
And it was just really flowy andreally pretty.
And I felt on top of the world. And I remember pulling up to the
hospital, I got out of my car. I had this sense of power that
just searched through my whole being and I was like, I am ready
for this meeting. I am psyched for today.
This is a great world. I'm so excited to to go in there
and do what I do well, which is I facilitate groups, I bring
(08:04):
people together, I can get people to consensus.
And so I was really excited. I walk into the boardroom, big
boardroom, corporate looking thing.
I go to sit at the top of the table.
The president of the medical of the hospital comes into the
room, senior executive and looksat me and he's like, oh, that's
(08:25):
an interesting outfit today. And then people were and I was
like, all of a sudden this senseof power that I had walking in
and feeling so me and so ready for this meeting just came
crumbling down. And I'm like, I can't wear like
a pretty lilac dress to chair a meeting as a physician leader.
(08:47):
Like, what's wrong with that? And I look around the room and
I'm one of very few women in theroom, and everyone's very
corporate looking in their dark suits and all vineyards.
And I can tell you. And so the meeting went fine.
Everything went fine. The work I'd done.
I did a good job at facilitatingthe meeting.
All the goals were met. But I remember walking out of
(09:08):
that meeting feeling like my power had gotten stripped away
from me. And I after that, I started
thinking about my clothes, like I was wearing armor or an outfit
to work every day, started wearing the dark suits and the,
you know, the power suits and the, the whole 9 yards.
(09:28):
And, and I never wore another dress like that to those
meetings again because I felt like, oh, I can't do that.
I can't be successful in this man's world unless I suit up and
look like everybody else, They're not going to take me
seriously. And that was a like, looking
back on that, I'm really sad. I wish I had said to myself, you
go, girl, you rock that outfit and like you feel good about it.
(09:51):
But I let, I let society or I let the culture of that
organization, you know, strip that powerful moment away from
me, which is sad. Yeah.
And how many of you that are listening can resonate to that?
There's something I'm almost positive because I as you're
talking, I'm like, yeah, I've had moments like that too,
(10:12):
right? Where as a woman, you're coming
in, you're feeling like really good about yourself.
Like there is this sense of like, I got this, I know what
I'm at. And then just one phrase wording
something and the the tonality behind that.
Can. Start to strip away everything
that we feel like we've worked for, right?
(10:32):
And like we, we got to these positions, we've got to these
levels of in these environments by being our true selves.
And then once we're our true selves at that leadership poll,
we're asked to, like you said, put on the armor, change your
look, conform to the. So it's almost like as you get
up into a leader, you get less of yourself, which is really
weird because as a leader you want more of yourself.
(10:56):
Right. It's almost a contradiction in
that in that way. And I think what I would do is I
would go back and work with my team and, you know, I would be
with my teams and those that I was overseeing and I'd, I'd do
the things that I'd want to withthat group.
But if I was going to manage up and I had to go to a board
meeting or present to the seniorexecutives, I had to play that
(11:16):
game. I felt like I had to play that
game. And looking back now, I
recognize that it was because I let self doubt.
And yeah, I let that kind of saying, paternalistic kind of
person take over and I, I just gave away my power.
(11:37):
And like, I hate to see women dothat, but it does happen that we
do that sometimes We we cede ourpower to others in authority or
who we think are, you know, our authority.
Yeah, well, and it's interestingbecause I can hear the self
development you've gone through too, like the personal journey
you've gotten from that point. And that's why you can reflect
bucked on and say, hey, you know, it's they're going to say
(11:58):
whatever they're going to say. And how you react to it is
really your own power to that conversation.
And you know that I think that'sthe growth of us as women is
just saying, you know what, thisis who I am.
You're going to say whatever you're going to say.
And this is is and I have a thisis who I am, right?
And another thing that caught myeye is the colour behind you on
(12:19):
your logo is purple. Is that play into that whole
kind of aha moment for you? Yeah, purple's one of my
favorite colours and it just, you know, for me, it kind of
represents the divine in just thinking about that
transformative energy, you know,that the universe has out there
for us. And, and so I gravitated to
(12:41):
purple. I mean, I've always liked the
color anyway, but it was very interesting because for years
all I would wear is, you know, Gray and dark blue, black, lot
of black, lot of Gray. And, you know, it's like, it's
so funny because now I want purple and I want yellow and I
want orange or, you know, just brighter colors to reflect a
(13:03):
little bit better. What kind of a mood am I in
today? But yeah, the, the purple is
definitely representative, you know, that that was that's that
stayed with me and was a big part of part of my reflection
when I was going through my recovery process.
Yeah. So and let's talk about that
recovery process because I feel like that's your bridge into the
(13:24):
business. So what was it that you kind of
contemplated or what? Because it's almost like it was
created a safe space, like you're in your downtime.
There's nothing else for you to do but to think.
Lots of thinking so. Kind of like a little bit like
that process. Yeah, so, so when that happened
(13:46):
to me, it really, I mean, it traumatized me because when I
look back, it's like I could have, I could have severed my
spinal cord and then paralyzed. I could have severed my spinal
cord and died, you know, I, I could have hit my head and even
worse and, you know, just been dead at that point.
So the fact that I can walk and do more things than I thought I
(14:09):
could do is great. Yeah.
My range of motion, etcetera is,is off and I can't do everything
I want to. And I have to like be good about
receiving help, which I hate. But but during that process,
that's what I came in. It's like, OK, you have to
receive. You just can't give, give, give
all the time. And it's OK to receive.
You're not weak by receiving. And when I started to look back
(14:31):
and recognize decisions I've made through my life and what I
had done or hadn't done yet, I came to the realization that I
had created some of my own internal glass ceilings and I
had had patterns in the way thatI had made decisions that held
me back from being all that I could be.
(14:52):
And when I started to really diginto that, I understood that it
came from being in a dysfunctional family growing up,
being the person that was, I wasthe eldest, I was the people
pleaser. I was the one that took care of
everything, you know, So and I carried all of that into my life
and into my job. And, and because of that, I, you
(15:14):
know, going through that process, it was enlightening,
exciting and sad like all at thesame time because you're going
through this like physical recovery, right?
My bones are healing, etcetera. But I was also going through
this really emotional and mentalchange and spiritual change at
(15:36):
the same time. And when I, when I got to the
other side of that and really decided what I wanted to do, it
was like, OK, I got to write a book.
And I want to help other people go through this process so it
doesn't have to be as painful, you know, And as long as maybe
mine was, maybe I can help to streamline that for folks.
(15:56):
And I think what, what one of the things that I really took
away is that when you're going through a trauma, like whatever
your trauma happens to be, it's not always just the physical,
it's the mental and emotional and spiritual aspects of it.
And you have to pay attention toall of those.
And so that's where I came up with my idea for the book
because it like, as I went through that process, I was
(16:19):
thinking, what do I do to help other people, you know, in this
way? And so came up with a framework
to try to, you know, share that with others and try to take all
this complex ideas and thoughts and process and put it into
something that was a little bit more simplified for people to
follow on their own. So what was the book that you
(16:39):
wrote? Excuse me?
You keep mentioning the book andso I'm trying.
To listen, I forgot to bring it with me in the room.
It's called power up. 7 transformational steps to own
your power and feel more joy in your life.
So power up is an an acronym. So each letter stands for a step
in the process. You know, as you move through
the book and, and my husband, what's so funny because my
(17:03):
husband's like, you're not goingto make any money.
What you think you're going to be on the New York Times best
selling list? I'm like, no, but it's going to
be for me, it's like a work of love.
And I can share that. And if it helps 10 people, it's
great. And if it helps 150 people,
that's great. But for me, it's more of the
framework itself on working withindividuals to try to help them
(17:24):
as they're growing, as they're looking to develop into their
most authentic, best version of themselves or, you know, really
be able to get to their full potential.
And so that's where the company came from too.
So I so Dylan, Dylan is a Gaelicword, so silly, different
(17:44):
spelling, but Dylan is a Gaelic word for butterfly.
And in Gaelic, it's like an electricity.
And for me, that was kind of like around transformation as a
butterfly and, and just that whole energy aspect of it with
it being like this golden butterfly and Gaelic.
And then Dalene is a, a name which means free spirit.
(18:06):
So for me, when I put those two concepts together of
transformational growth and being a free spirit and thinking
about getting to who you truly are like inside authentically,
for me, all of that sort of cametogether and that's how I ended
up with that name. And it was also afraid to put my
own name out there initially. Well, and I think that's.
(18:28):
Beautiful too. So because I think sometimes
we're in the world of business and we get a lot of marketing
recommendations and everyone says use your name, but I think
there's a beauty in having a brand that is bigger than you.
And that's what Dylan sounds like to me is it's not just you,
it's a transformation for everyone you work with, everyone
(18:51):
they work with. It's that ripple effect, It's
that butterfly effect really like flap the wing, create that
that flutter in the world and see how that, you know, spreads
out. So I think in and respect, I
love that you actually put the intention that it was meaningful
to you for what you're creating.Otherwise it becomes kind of
(19:11):
like your ego with the name. Right.
And that was the thing that the other thing that I kept
grappling with because I got to tell you like when they
eliminated my position, even though I have been working
towards eliminating my position in a strategic plan for the
following year, like my ego is so bruised.
My ego just did not like that atfall, you know.
(19:32):
So that was like, that was one of the things I also had to
recover from was like, get over yourself and your ego, you know
it's and just have fun and do the work.
Yeah. And it's a transformation for
yourself, right. So it is I think in in choosing
the name and choosing and letting go and choosing to
redefine and recreate yourself, that is your transformation.
(19:52):
And so you are the the center ofyour butterfly effect, right.
So it starts with you. And as you're diving in, as you
kind of were sharing back in thebeginning, we talked about, you
know, the some of the challengesyou transitioned from corporate
space, which I know is 1 type ofbusiness structure.
And then you started your own business.
So what were some of the things you wish somebody had told you
(20:14):
before you jumped in and just said, hey, I'm running a
business? So I wish someone had said to
me, hey, maybe study a little bit about what made other people
so successful and like watch that a little bit and think
about their systems. Like how did they go about this?
Because I just, I again, probably from an ego
perspective, but I was so successful in the work that I've
(20:35):
done in healthcare that I said, oh, I can do the best, you know,
I understand business and strategy and business plans and,
you know, ROI and all of that. So I can go out and I can go
ahead and do this. And I think that I didn't know
what I didn't know. I didn't understand how
important really getting your foundation was and truly
(20:56):
understanding, you know, what's my message?
Who do I want to attract? How do I go about doing that?
How do I use the technology? Because the technology was a big
barrier for me also. So I ended up, you know,
bringing someone outsourcing a fair amount of stuff in order to
help me set up a website, figureout social media posting and
marketing and all of those kind of things.
And so it's been a great, I'm just listening to you.
(21:20):
I love to learn new things. So it's OK, but but I really
like going back. I wish someone just said you got
this, it's going to be OK. Go slow to get started with, you
know, as far as understanding the foundation that you have to
build in the kind of mindset that you need to have as an
entrepreneur and own your own business and, you know, study
(21:40):
what other people have done, just like you did with medicine.
Let me because that's what we did, right?
It's like you learn to somebody else how to do it, become an
expert over time. But I didn't apply that same
discipline, I guess, to what I was doing as a business owner
isn't. That crazy that we're actually
shown how to be an entrepreneur as an employee when we are in
(22:01):
that kind of like apprenticeshiplearning process, like watch
somebody see how they do it, geta feel for it, then do it
yourself kind of a thing. And it's like, because the same
thing happened to me. Everything that I like process
and like as soon as I became an entrepreneur, like that doesn't
apply to me that I don't. But it's such a reflection,
right, of of what we we build inbusiness.
(22:22):
So yeah, it's all learning processes.
Any of your like, who are some of your best mentors?
Once you started kind of figuring that out, what who are
some of the people that you kindof started to follow and mimic?
You know, I, if you look at likeTony Robbins and Dean Grazio,
and I mean, they, they've got like a really good way of taking
(22:44):
again, complex things and kind of making it a little bit more
focused and simple. So I think that that's been a
help for me. And just seeing like Gabby
Bernstein, for example, you know, she's written a lot of
different books, has gone through a lot of different
things in her life. So just like watching how she
developed her brand, how she went from having just, you know,
(23:07):
small groups of people to tons of people, you know, when she's
doing a, a webinar and you know,just some of the techniques and,
and things that she learns and uses.
You know, so it's been like looking out and watching other
women who are doing some similarcoaching or written books,
etcetera. You're just kind of seeing what
their paths have been and, and just see how can I, how do I
(23:31):
integrate that into, into the work that I'm doing?
I honestly, Katrina, I haven't had there haven't been very many
women that could just go hang out and have a cup of coffee
with and say, Hey, tell me how you, you know, other outside of
healthcare. Like I, I know people who've
been CEO of different places in healthcare, but I don't know
that journey just seems different than this.
(23:55):
This work for sure. It, it is.
I mean, I can relate to that too.
When I left the kitchen, the corporate space, and I stepped
into the world of entrepreneurship, I mean, one of
the things that really became transparent is like, I can't
talk to all these culinary chefsabout building a business
because it's not in their world,in it's note, not a desire for
theirs. So I think as, as women, one of
(24:16):
the things that became really important to me was networking,
really trying to find other women groups and organizations
or even just different networking groups to kind of
like, I don't know what I don't know is kind of my process,
right? But I think that that kind of
becomes part of the overall gamethat we start to, to play with
(24:37):
as an entrepreneur because it isever evolving.
I mean, each business, every person I've walked worked with
over the last 15 years, no business looks exactly alike.
Shocking but true. Right, because there's.
Nuances to it, there's little shifts around that.
So, yeah, so on this conversation, so you've built
the business, you're starting tobuild the foundation, you're
(24:58):
getting things going. Is there anything around mindset
and mindfulness that as women that are listening to hear that
you feel like we should, we should know?
We do. Thanks for asking that question,
Katrina. So mindset I think is, is
critically important. You know, if you're going to if
you're going in this direction and you want to have your own
business and you want to be thatentrepreneur or just any vision
(25:22):
or dream that you have. I think it's really important to
have a mindset that's one field of curiosity and growth and
openness because you never know life's going to hit you like I
never expected. You know, I think life just
happens sometimes. And so, you know, I think
staying open and curious and saying, oh, isn't that
interesting? You know, and trying to say
(25:42):
like, how do I learn from this? How do I grow from this?
What am I like, what am I supposed to understand about
this? What's the lesson?
So I think that that growth mindset is really important
because so many of us are afraidof failure or what seems like
failure at the time. It's not failure like it's data,
it's just information to use to keep moving forward and
(26:02):
adjusting what you've done. But I think we put these labels
on it, you know, so if you, if you're afraid of failure, if
you're afraid of being vulnerable, like I, you know, I
mean, putting a book out there made me vulnerable, you know,
and, and I have way more that I could be vulnerable about that I
should have. But I think that having an open
mindset is really important for the growth to happen and just,
(26:26):
you know, understanding that life will transpire and
everything's going to be OK and you've got it.
So just stay open. And I think from a mindfulness
perspective, I think a lot of women do not spend enough time
on self-care. I know that that was true for
me, especially when I had like 2small children or even
teenagers. And like even now, like my kids
are 30 and 27 and I just, you know, I'm still, I'm still very
(26:50):
much a mom. You just always kind of have.
To be there. Stop being a mom.
I mean, yeah, I'm still a 16 year old child to my mom.
I've never grown up in her eyes,so I'm OK with.
That so it's, so I think that self-care is a place that we
don't spend a lot of time on andconsidering mindfulness, not
just as as like a nice thing to do, like go do yoga.
(27:12):
Isn't that a nice thing to do for my mind and body?
It's not that it's, I think it'sreally about being present and
in the moment and inside, like grounding with yourself and
staying true to yourself and listening to the inner wisdom
that's inside of us and, and just being present and in that
moment space. Because to me that is such a
(27:33):
huge amount of self. Like what constitutes Wellness
and self-care is really allowingyourself to be quiet, especially
today with everything. I mean, like we're always
connected to our devices and it's just noise coming in 24/7
and you can't even believe half of it anymore with AI.
So it's like so important to like break away from that and
(27:55):
just, you know, whether it's being in nature or taking a few
deep breaths and being present and being grounded and just
being in your body and allowing yourself to quiet down so you
can listen to what's most important, you know, inside.
Yeah, and I think when you talk mindfulness or you talk about
even self-care as women, it feels like it's like, oh, I go
get my hair done, I'm gonna go get my nails done.
It's like. It's mindfulness.
(28:17):
Yeah, right. 5 minutes of mindfulness, we're good to go.
And it, it feels so rushed, but I like what you said, you know,
it's about getting present. It's being right here in this
moment, right here in this conversation and not worried
about everything else that's going on around you.
And cuz there's something even for our listeners right now,
(28:39):
there's something they're getting from this conversation.
And whether unconsciously you'repicking it up or consciously
you're picking it up, there is something that Doctor Jackie is
saying that you needed to hear, hence why you're listening to
this particular episode, becausethere's a a piece when talking
to Doctor Jackie, right? And you can feel it.
(29:01):
I can feel I'm just sitting across from her and I know we're
on camera, but she just radiatesthis really calmness around her.
And I think that's when you lookat, you know, what does it look
like to be a woman in business, but has a calmness around what's
all going on and a sense of peace around what you're
creating, right? And I think that's that's where
(29:23):
all of us want to go as women. So anyways, so where do you draw
in terms of that and just life around you, where do you draw
your inspiration from? What?
What kind of I mean, you're working with clients, you're
building a business, where do you get your inspiration from?
So one of the ways that I practice mindfulness is walking.
(29:46):
It's movement. So I love yoga and y'all do that
a few times a week. But being every day I'm out, I
get out in nature and just looking at the world around me
and allowing myself to almost become like meditating while I'm
moving and just being in nature and just being open and all of a
sudden like things will just popinto my mind.
(30:06):
Oh, I should try this. Oh, wouldn't this be a cool
topic to write on what have you?So that's one place that I draw
my inspiration from. The other place that I draw my
inspiration from is interacting with other people, you know, so,
so I had an event in for summer solstice and I had, you know, a
little over 20 people there. It's the sitting and being with
(30:27):
others and holding space for them as their moving through
whatever work development they're they're doing.
And I learn so much, you know, I'm there as the teacher, but I
learn so much by interacting with other people and listening
to their stories and listening to, you know, what they want to
(30:48):
do with their lives, etcetera, or where they're getting stuck.
And that I always walk away withlike 6 other things I want to do
after I have these interactions with people.
Because I really do find that itinspires me listening to their
stories and seeing them overcomeobstacles or seeing the vision
in their eyes and where they want to go and saying Oh my
(31:09):
gosh, yeah, I got to help that person, what else can I do?
You know? So those are two the two places
I think that I most draw my inspiration from working with
other people. I'm kind of naturally an
extroverts, so I love that, but then having that quiet space
with nature and just allowing allowing things to come to me.
So you've mentioned so far, so, so far listeners in the audience
(31:31):
in here, she said some really great things so far.
And did she really say that? Because she's probably pushed a
lot of your beliefs and challenged them in a lot of way.
So what is it that if someone wanted to work with you, what
does that look like? What is it?
You talked about events, you've talked about coaching.
So what is or who is your ideal individual that your company you
like to work with? So the the ideal kind for me is
(31:54):
someone who is, you know, midlife has desires or things
that they want to achieve, but have never really felt like it's
the time or the opportunity thatthey're feeling kind of stuck.
So in the stuck, might be they're just feeling stuck or
sometimes it could be life's places you will interest in
(32:15):
places like your job gets eliminated or what have you get
divorced. You know, you have to move
whatever. But these transitional times
come up where you're either feeling stuck or you're kind of
in this transition and you need to move forward.
So what I like to do is help people rediscover what's most
essential or important to them. So spending some time with them
to really get them clear on their values and what they're
(32:38):
passionate about and help them to figure out where they want to
go moving forward as far as any dreams or aspirations that they
have for the future, for their future self.
And then helping them to identify where they are now,
where they want to go and build a road map to help them get to
that other spot, place and help them also uncover just like I
(33:00):
did. You know, as I was going through
my healing, I uncovered some of the reasons that I didn't
achieve some of the things I wanted to.
And it was because I was in these old patterns.
And so once I understood what those patterns were and I
brought that level of self-awareness up, I could do
something about it. So that's what I like to do with
people as well as help them become more self aware of where
(33:23):
they may be getting in their ownway, in what patterns they have
or narratives that they've told themselves experienced the world
with. And then help them reframe that
so that they can talk to themselves in a different way
and be able to see those possibilities moving forward and
be able to, you know, manifest what it is that they want for
their future self and being there to like, I don't see.
(33:48):
So there's two things. I think one thing that's
different about me, Katrina is like, I'm a doctor.
So there's the neurocognitive science behind this and and
there's, you know, all of that body of work.
And then I'm also person who's kind of gone through this.
So I understand emotionally kindof what that whole process is
(34:08):
like. And so I think of myself more as
a guy that like, I don't, you know, like, come on, let's go,
let's win. You know, versus for me as a
healer, I feel like I'm more like a guide or a facilitator
because the work is done by the individual.
Like I can't do the work for somebody else, right?
They have to do the work. But being able to be there with
(34:31):
them and walk with them when they're going through this, just
like with healing, you know, with diagnosing cancer with
somebody or heart disease or whatever it happens to be or
could just be a cold. But being able to be there with
that person, I feel like I do the same thing in this line of
business. It's just in a slightly
different way, but being that fine.
I like that language you're using.
(34:51):
So there is that sense of a healer, there is that sense of
that guide. And I think with what you've
created as your business, that really makes a lot of it aligns
really well. Like, it makes sense in that
kind of ways, how you describe yourself because, you know, we
could say, yeah, you're a leaderand teacher, but I feel like
those words don't quite fit for who you are because like you
(35:14):
said, they have to do the work. We all have to do the work
ourselves. Like, there's no magic pill for
for this, right? It is a personal transformation.
It is that butterfly. It is, you know, the catalyst of
moving from who you know yourself to be into your true
authentic self, and that's whereyou what the company dileen and
(35:35):
what you offer is really at the stand out.
So how can they learn more aboutyou connect with you?
So I know that you have a YouTube channel that they can
it's going to be in our show notes that they can click on to
learn more about you. And then also you have a free
guide. I believe I'm going to double
check, yes. So if you go, yeah, if you go to
dileeninstitute.com, you'll see on the website there is
(36:00):
something called a You are Enough transformation guide.
And so that's something that people can download.
And so, and pretty soon I have one that's just on mindfulness
tips as well. But but this is just, it's kind
of like getting started in that whole process of understanding
yourself and understanding that you just being used all you need
(36:21):
to be. That is perfect.
So we forget that. I think I, I know that I have in
the past, but that would be something that people, you know,
can just download and they can learn a little bit about me on
the website as well. And then on the YouTube channel,
I have it a fair amount of content there, something that's
to do with the book, which is like a chapter by chapter on
(36:41):
virtual book club. But I also have some playlists
that are there on things like communication skills and change
management and, you know, just just, you know, basic skills
like that as well or content, ifyou will, that are that's out
there. It's all free, Yeah.
Doctor Jack, you just lit up. You're like, there's all this
awesome stuff over there on my. YouTube channel like please go.
(37:02):
Feel free to check out it's likefor those listeners that are not
watching us here on the video, you know, when you see someone
light up on a podcast about their content, there is
something beautiful that they'vedone and it has been an A work
of art for them and from their hearts to put that up there.
So definitely the in the show links down below, everywhere
you're you're watching this, there's going to be her website,
(37:23):
there's going to be her YouTube channel.
Direct links to you are enough so that you can just take
advantage of that because this is your opportunity inside of
did she really say that to understand that women are
redefining the world of businessand shifting and really wanting
to help guide that transformational profit process.
And not only that, Doctor Jackie's like, get to know
(37:44):
yourself, right? If you're going to be into the
world of change, you're probablystuck in transition, Doctor
Jackie. So many is just like, yeah,
let's walk you through that, right?
Let me guide you through this process.
Let's get clear on who you are and what the next part of your
journey is going to look like. So, yeah, this has been a
(38:04):
beautiful conversation. I mean, everything that you've
shared from just the design of your brand, the business, your
aha moments, they all created this moment right here within
this episode. So Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for being a guest and beingon here.
Is there any last words of wisdom that you'd like to share
with our audience before we wrapup?
(38:26):
Well, I just want to say thank you Katrina.
This is really fun. I love this session.
It was great for me as well, just for people to don't go
back. Just be bold, be you, and do
great things because the world needs you.
All right, all you did she really say that listeners out
(38:46):
there, you know that this is your opportunity to to give a
rating support Doctor Jackie, share this out.
Listen, share with your girlfriends, somebody out there
that needs to hear this. And this is how we support each
other and create a beautiful world of collaboration as we
grow together, work together. And Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for being on this episode with us.
Thank you.
Well, welcome to Did she really say that?
A podcast that says, you know what, it's time to change the
conversation for US women. Sometimes our business looks
vastly different than what we'retold it should look like.
And y'all know how I am about y'all about the word should.
We should really stop shooting all over the place.
So I am here because we're goingto have a fun conversation
(00:23):
around what advice you might want to be considering as you
open your business. Some of the mindfulness and
mindset that isn't often addressed as a female business
owner. And so I'm super excited for
this conversation with Doctor Jackie Callaway because this is
about you and I really want you to listen in.
Ladies, if you don't know me, I'm your host, Katrina
(00:45):
Vonatusen, and I'm super excitedto bring to you Doctor Jackie.
She is an ostropathic. Did I say that right?
Yeah. Osteopathic family physician,
Otter, Healthcare executive and thought leader and personal and
professional transformation. With over 30 years of
experience, she has LED transformative change in a
(01:07):
variety of healthcare. Super important.
I just said healthcare organizations developing
numerous leadership programs, which is desperately needed and
has mentored hundreds of individuals in achieving their
fullest potential. That is something often ladies,
we are all we're all looking at what is our true authentic self.
So as the founder and executive chief officer of the Deline, did
(01:28):
I say that correctly too? Fine.
Yep. All right, Deline is tradition
for growth and Wellness. Doctor Callaway is dedicated
helping people live with purposeand confidence.
Ladies, we want to listen up. So, Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for joining us here in today's episode of Did She
Really Say That? It's an honor to have you here.
Well, thank you, Katrina. I'm really excited to be here
(01:49):
today. I love what you're doing with
the podcast and your work. Thank you so much.
I mean, this is a fun conversation because I want to
dive into. So were you always in business?
Did you kind of do a corporate space?
Looks like you've done some, youknow, different organizations.
So what what is some advice? I guess you could say, let's
let's start there. It's like, what?
How did you get into this, this business you're in?
(02:13):
So I, I'm a family physician by my training.
And so I started out as a healer, wasn't expecting to be
in leadership positions, didn't expect to have an MBA and be in
business and open my own business.
Those are not things on my To DoList when I first got started.
But I quickly, I, I don't know, I just was focused on being a
doctor, trying to get through medical school and, you know, do
(02:35):
that kind of thing. So you know, when, when, when I
got my degree and I started working within, it was in
probably within six months that medical directorship became
available. And so I raised my hand and I
said, sure, I'll do it. I'll step into a leadership
role. I don't know what I'm doing, but
sure, I can improve things. And I always want that focus of
how to improve processes of care, how to change care
(02:58):
delivery to better meet family and patient needs.
Just my whole goal was around transforming healthcare delivery
in general and also helping people organize themselves,
particularly other providers andphysicians to do the same.
And so I suddenly ended up in a leadership position, continued
to move through the healthcare executive leadership, corporate
(03:18):
ladder, continued to get different higher, higher level
positions and was doing great. And was I completely satisfied
with everything that I was doingin my life?
No, I always felt that there wasthis bit of a disconnect between
the corporate world and the way that healthcare, like many
(03:40):
organizations very higher, you know, hierarchical and and very,
very masculine power model. So that I was living in and I
can even share like one day whenthe aha moment came to me on
that one, But but it felt like adisconnect to me.
So I started looking for what else could I do?
(04:00):
So I was always looking at self development books and self help
books and thinking about being ACEO of my own company someday,
always thinking about it in the corporate healthcare world.
Oh, I'll be a, I'll lead a hospital, I'll lead a health
system. So it was always around that.
But then a couple of years ago Ihad this very strange incident
(04:21):
that happened to me. I got up, I stood up, I fell and
fainted, basically unaware that this was going to happen with no
warning. Broke my neck, had to get rushed
to the trauma center where I knew everybody.
So it was OK. They saw me coming in on the
stretcher. I'm like God, but you know, so I
knew I was in good hands. But I ended up with two
surgeries, four or five days in the hospital, six weeks out of
(04:43):
work rods in my neck, a lot of hardware.
And so it took a while for me torecover.
And during that recovery process, what I really learned
was what it was most important to me and most essential to me
going forward. And I think that that helped me
to truly find my voice and understand what it is that I
(05:05):
wanted for the future. And I knew it wasn't going to
stay in corporate healthcare anddo the same old, same old for
the rest of my life. And, and so I was kind of
planning my out strategy for an early retirement so that I could
write a book, which I'd always wanted to do.
But this incident gave me a whole lot more focus on luck,
which came, you know, which I was able to publish this last
year. And it helped me come up with
(05:29):
sort of a construct that I coulduse for myself as far as
personal growth in moving past this incident to where I wanted
to be as my genuine, authentic person.
You know, using my voice and speaking about what was really
important to me and sharing thatwith others and trying to help
others do the same. And so get back to work.
Two months later, my boss calls me into her office and
(05:52):
eliminates my position. So now I'm on the last track of
moving in. And I, I mean, yeah, I probably
manifested it. I, I do understand that it's all
good. But it, it did allow me to move
a little bit more quickly towards opening my business and
getting a sense of what I wantedto do next and to write that
book and get it published. And so that's how it all got
(06:14):
started. And there was so much I didn't
know about owning and operating your own business when I got
started. So it's been a huge learning
opportunity for me over this past year, a year and a half.
Yeah, so before we dive into that, and I think this is going
to be a really like, I know it'sa valuable conversation.
I want to step back to that aha moment because I feel like there
was an intuition that was going on there.
(06:36):
So you talked about, you know, you're in this environment that
feels very masculine. That feels like, and I'm
listening to you talk about like, I want to bring, you know,
together a more collaborative healthcare system.
I want to bring, yeah, I want toteach organization, but teach
like, patient care, like true care for what I'm hearing from
you. And yet I feel like you're
butting up against that wall. So what was that aha moment you
(06:59):
had that 'cause you mentioned itand I was like, oh, wait, we're
coming back to that. Oh yeah.
OK, so I when I was in my, I waslike 404142 years old.
I had just gotten appointed to be president of the medical
staff of the largest hospital inthe state of Maine.
Now I was the first woman to ever be in that role and I was
(07:19):
the first osteopathic physician.So it when it's when, when the
leadership opportunities came for me, I, I always had to lean
into them, right step into them.So this was a beautiful summer
day. I was chairing the meeting for
the medical staff that day. I had on this beautiful flowy
lavender gown, not gown. I mean, it was a dress, but it
was kind of a long dress, a maxidress.
(07:41):
And it was just really flowy andreally pretty.
And I felt on top of the world. And I remember pulling up to the
hospital, I got out of my car. I had this sense of power that
just searched through my whole being and I was like, I am ready
for this meeting. I am psyched for today.
This is a great world. I'm so excited to to go in there
and do what I do well, which is I facilitate groups, I bring
(08:04):
people together, I can get people to consensus.
And so I was really excited. I walk into the boardroom, big
boardroom, corporate looking thing.
I go to sit at the top of the table.
The president of the medical of the hospital comes into the
room, senior executive and looksat me and he's like, oh, that's
(08:25):
an interesting outfit today. And then people were and I was
like, all of a sudden this senseof power that I had walking in
and feeling so me and so ready for this meeting just came
crumbling down. And I'm like, I can't wear like
a pretty lilac dress to chair a meeting as a physician leader.
(08:47):
Like, what's wrong with that? And I look around the room and
I'm one of very few women in theroom, and everyone's very
corporate looking in their dark suits and all vineyards.
And I can tell you. And so the meeting went fine.
Everything went fine. The work I'd done.
I did a good job at facilitatingthe meeting.
All the goals were met. But I remember walking out of
(09:08):
that meeting feeling like my power had gotten stripped away
from me. And I after that, I started
thinking about my clothes, like I was wearing armor or an outfit
to work every day, started wearing the dark suits and the,
you know, the power suits and the, the whole 9 yards.
(09:28):
And, and I never wore another dress like that to those
meetings again because I felt like, oh, I can't do that.
I can't be successful in this man's world unless I suit up and
look like everybody else, They're not going to take me
seriously. And that was a like, looking
back on that, I'm really sad. I wish I had said to myself, you
go, girl, you rock that outfit and like you feel good about it.
(09:51):
But I let, I let society or I let the culture of that
organization, you know, strip that powerful moment away from
me, which is sad. Yeah.
And how many of you that are listening can resonate to that?
There's something I'm almost positive because I as you're
talking, I'm like, yeah, I've had moments like that too,
(10:12):
right? Where as a woman, you're coming
in, you're feeling like really good about yourself.
Like there is this sense of like, I got this, I know what
I'm at. And then just one phrase wording
something and the the tonality behind that.
Can. Start to strip away everything
that we feel like we've worked for, right?
(10:32):
And like we, we got to these positions, we've got to these
levels of in these environments by being our true selves.
And then once we're our true selves at that leadership poll,
we're asked to, like you said, put on the armor, change your
look, conform to the. So it's almost like as you get
up into a leader, you get less of yourself, which is really
weird because as a leader you want more of yourself.
(10:56):
Right. It's almost a contradiction in
that in that way. And I think what I would do is I
would go back and work with my team and, you know, I would be
with my teams and those that I was overseeing and I'd, I'd do
the things that I'd want to withthat group.
But if I was going to manage up and I had to go to a board
meeting or present to the seniorexecutives, I had to play that
(11:16):
game. I felt like I had to play that
game. And looking back now, I
recognize that it was because I let self doubt.
And yeah, I let that kind of saying, paternalistic kind of
person take over and I, I just gave away my power.
(11:37):
And like, I hate to see women dothat, but it does happen that we
do that sometimes We we cede ourpower to others in authority or
who we think are, you know, our authority.
Yeah, well, and it's interestingbecause I can hear the self
development you've gone through too, like the personal journey
you've gotten from that point. And that's why you can reflect
bucked on and say, hey, you know, it's they're going to say
(11:58):
whatever they're going to say. And how you react to it is
really your own power to that conversation.
And you know that I think that'sthe growth of us as women is
just saying, you know what, thisis who I am.
You're going to say whatever you're going to say.
And this is is and I have a thisis who I am, right?
And another thing that caught myeye is the colour behind you on
(12:19):
your logo is purple. Is that play into that whole
kind of aha moment for you? Yeah, purple's one of my
favorite colours and it just, you know, for me, it kind of
represents the divine in just thinking about that
transformative energy, you know,that the universe has out there
for us. And, and so I gravitated to
(12:41):
purple. I mean, I've always liked the
color anyway, but it was very interesting because for years
all I would wear is, you know, Gray and dark blue, black, lot
of black, lot of Gray. And, you know, it's like, it's
so funny because now I want purple and I want yellow and I
want orange or, you know, just brighter colors to reflect a
(13:03):
little bit better. What kind of a mood am I in
today? But yeah, the, the purple is
definitely representative, you know, that that was that's that
stayed with me and was a big part of part of my reflection
when I was going through my recovery process.
Yeah. So and let's talk about that
recovery process because I feel like that's your bridge into the
(13:24):
business. So what was it that you kind of
contemplated or what? Because it's almost like it was
created a safe space, like you're in your downtime.
There's nothing else for you to do but to think.
Lots of thinking so. Kind of like a little bit like
that process. Yeah, so, so when that happened
(13:46):
to me, it really, I mean, it traumatized me because when I
look back, it's like I could have, I could have severed my
spinal cord and then paralyzed. I could have severed my spinal
cord and died, you know, I, I could have hit my head and even
worse and, you know, just been dead at that point.
So the fact that I can walk and do more things than I thought I
(14:09):
could do is great. Yeah.
My range of motion, etcetera is,is off and I can't do everything
I want to. And I have to like be good about
receiving help, which I hate. But but during that process,
that's what I came in. It's like, OK, you have to
receive. You just can't give, give, give
all the time. And it's OK to receive.
You're not weak by receiving. And when I started to look back
(14:31):
and recognize decisions I've made through my life and what I
had done or hadn't done yet, I came to the realization that I
had created some of my own internal glass ceilings and I
had had patterns in the way thatI had made decisions that held
me back from being all that I could be.
(14:52):
And when I started to really diginto that, I understood that it
came from being in a dysfunctional family growing up,
being the person that was, I wasthe eldest, I was the people
pleaser. I was the one that took care of
everything, you know, So and I carried all of that into my life
and into my job. And, and because of that, I, you
(15:14):
know, going through that process, it was enlightening,
exciting and sad like all at thesame time because you're going
through this like physical recovery, right?
My bones are healing, etcetera. But I was also going through
this really emotional and mentalchange and spiritual change at
(15:36):
the same time. And when I, when I got to the
other side of that and really decided what I wanted to do, it
was like, OK, I got to write a book.
And I want to help other people go through this process so it
doesn't have to be as painful, you know, And as long as maybe
mine was, maybe I can help to streamline that for folks.
(15:56):
And I think what, what one of the things that I really took
away is that when you're going through a trauma, like whatever
your trauma happens to be, it's not always just the physical,
it's the mental and emotional and spiritual aspects of it.
And you have to pay attention toall of those.
And so that's where I came up with my idea for the book
because it like, as I went through that process, I was
(16:19):
thinking, what do I do to help other people, you know, in this
way? And so came up with a framework
to try to, you know, share that with others and try to take all
this complex ideas and thoughts and process and put it into
something that was a little bit more simplified for people to
follow on their own. So what was the book that you
(16:39):
wrote? Excuse me?
You keep mentioning the book andso I'm trying.
To listen, I forgot to bring it with me in the room.
It's called power up. 7 transformational steps to own
your power and feel more joy in your life.
So power up is an an acronym. So each letter stands for a step
in the process. You know, as you move through
the book and, and my husband, what's so funny because my
(17:03):
husband's like, you're not goingto make any money.
What you think you're going to be on the New York Times best
selling list? I'm like, no, but it's going to
be for me, it's like a work of love.
And I can share that. And if it helps 10 people, it's
great. And if it helps 150 people,
that's great. But for me, it's more of the
framework itself on working withindividuals to try to help them
(17:24):
as they're growing, as they're looking to develop into their
most authentic, best version of themselves or, you know, really
be able to get to their full potential.
And so that's where the company came from too.
So I so Dylan, Dylan is a Gaelicword, so silly, different
(17:44):
spelling, but Dylan is a Gaelic word for butterfly.
And in Gaelic, it's like an electricity.
And for me, that was kind of like around transformation as a
butterfly and, and just that whole energy aspect of it with
it being like this golden butterfly and Gaelic.
And then Dalene is a, a name which means free spirit.
(18:06):
So for me, when I put those two concepts together of
transformational growth and being a free spirit and thinking
about getting to who you truly are like inside authentically,
for me, all of that sort of cametogether and that's how I ended
up with that name. And it was also afraid to put my
own name out there initially. Well, and I think that's.
(18:28):
Beautiful too. So because I think sometimes
we're in the world of business and we get a lot of marketing
recommendations and everyone says use your name, but I think
there's a beauty in having a brand that is bigger than you.
And that's what Dylan sounds like to me is it's not just you,
it's a transformation for everyone you work with, everyone
(18:51):
they work with. It's that ripple effect, It's
that butterfly effect really like flap the wing, create that
that flutter in the world and see how that, you know, spreads
out. So I think in and respect, I
love that you actually put the intention that it was meaningful
to you for what you're creating.Otherwise it becomes kind of
(19:11):
like your ego with the name. Right.
And that was the thing that the other thing that I kept
grappling with because I got to tell you like when they
eliminated my position, even though I have been working
towards eliminating my position in a strategic plan for the
following year, like my ego is so bruised.
My ego just did not like that atfall, you know.
(19:32):
So that was like, that was one of the things I also had to
recover from was like, get over yourself and your ego, you know
it's and just have fun and do the work.
Yeah. And it's a transformation for
yourself, right. So it is I think in in choosing
the name and choosing and letting go and choosing to
redefine and recreate yourself, that is your transformation.
(19:52):
And so you are the the center ofyour butterfly effect, right.
So it starts with you. And as you're diving in, as you
kind of were sharing back in thebeginning, we talked about, you
know, the some of the challengesyou transitioned from corporate
space, which I know is 1 type ofbusiness structure.
And then you started your own business.
So what were some of the things you wish somebody had told you
(20:14):
before you jumped in and just said, hey, I'm running a
business? So I wish someone had said to
me, hey, maybe study a little bit about what made other people
so successful and like watch that a little bit and think
about their systems. Like how did they go about this?
Because I just, I again, probably from an ego
perspective, but I was so successful in the work that I've
(20:35):
done in healthcare that I said, oh, I can do the best, you know,
I understand business and strategy and business plans and,
you know, ROI and all of that. So I can go out and I can go
ahead and do this. And I think that I didn't know
what I didn't know. I didn't understand how
important really getting your foundation was and truly
(20:56):
understanding, you know, what's my message?
Who do I want to attract? How do I go about doing that?
How do I use the technology? Because the technology was a big
barrier for me also. So I ended up, you know,
bringing someone outsourcing a fair amount of stuff in order to
help me set up a website, figureout social media posting and
marketing and all of those kind of things.
And so it's been a great, I'm just listening to you.
(21:20):
I love to learn new things. So it's OK, but but I really
like going back. I wish someone just said you got
this, it's going to be OK. Go slow to get started with, you
know, as far as understanding the foundation that you have to
build in the kind of mindset that you need to have as an
entrepreneur and own your own business and, you know, study
(21:40):
what other people have done, just like you did with medicine.
Let me because that's what we did, right?
It's like you learn to somebody else how to do it, become an
expert over time. But I didn't apply that same
discipline, I guess, to what I was doing as a business owner
isn't. That crazy that we're actually
shown how to be an entrepreneur as an employee when we are in
(22:01):
that kind of like apprenticeshiplearning process, like watch
somebody see how they do it, geta feel for it, then do it
yourself kind of a thing. And it's like, because the same
thing happened to me. Everything that I like process
and like as soon as I became an entrepreneur, like that doesn't
apply to me that I don't. But it's such a reflection,
right, of of what we we build inbusiness.
(22:22):
So yeah, it's all learning processes.
Any of your like, who are some of your best mentors?
Once you started kind of figuring that out, what who are
some of the people that you kindof started to follow and mimic?
You know, I, if you look at likeTony Robbins and Dean Grazio,
and I mean, they, they've got like a really good way of taking
(22:44):
again, complex things and kind of making it a little bit more
focused and simple. So I think that that's been a
help for me. And just seeing like Gabby
Bernstein, for example, you know, she's written a lot of
different books, has gone through a lot of different
things in her life. So just like watching how she
developed her brand, how she went from having just, you know,
(23:07):
small groups of people to tons of people, you know, when she's
doing a, a webinar and you know,just some of the techniques and,
and things that she learns and uses.
You know, so it's been like looking out and watching other
women who are doing some similarcoaching or written books,
etcetera. You're just kind of seeing what
their paths have been and, and just see how can I, how do I
(23:31):
integrate that into, into the work that I'm doing?
I honestly, Katrina, I haven't had there haven't been very many
women that could just go hang out and have a cup of coffee
with and say, Hey, tell me how you, you know, other outside of
healthcare. Like I, I know people who've
been CEO of different places in healthcare, but I don't know
that journey just seems different than this.
(23:55):
This work for sure. It, it is.
I mean, I can relate to that too.
When I left the kitchen, the corporate space, and I stepped
into the world of entrepreneurship, I mean, one of
the things that really became transparent is like, I can't
talk to all these culinary chefsabout building a business
because it's not in their world,in it's note, not a desire for
theirs. So I think as, as women, one of
(24:16):
the things that became really important to me was networking,
really trying to find other women groups and organizations
or even just different networking groups to kind of
like, I don't know what I don't know is kind of my process,
right? But I think that that kind of
becomes part of the overall gamethat we start to, to play with
(24:37):
as an entrepreneur because it isever evolving.
I mean, each business, every person I've walked worked with
over the last 15 years, no business looks exactly alike.
Shocking but true. Right, because there's.
Nuances to it, there's little shifts around that.
So, yeah, so on this conversation, so you've built
the business, you're starting tobuild the foundation, you're
(24:58):
getting things going. Is there anything around mindset
and mindfulness that as women that are listening to hear that
you feel like we should, we should know?
We do. Thanks for asking that question,
Katrina. So mindset I think is, is
critically important. You know, if you're going to if
you're going in this direction and you want to have your own
business and you want to be thatentrepreneur or just any vision
(25:22):
or dream that you have. I think it's really important to
have a mindset that's one field of curiosity and growth and
openness because you never know life's going to hit you like I
never expected. You know, I think life just
happens sometimes. And so, you know, I think
staying open and curious and saying, oh, isn't that
interesting? You know, and trying to say
(25:42):
like, how do I learn from this? How do I grow from this?
What am I like, what am I supposed to understand about
this? What's the lesson?
So I think that that growth mindset is really important
because so many of us are afraidof failure or what seems like
failure at the time. It's not failure like it's data,
it's just information to use to keep moving forward and
(26:02):
adjusting what you've done. But I think we put these labels
on it, you know, so if you, if you're afraid of failure, if
you're afraid of being vulnerable, like I, you know, I
mean, putting a book out there made me vulnerable, you know,
and, and I have way more that I could be vulnerable about that I
should have. But I think that having an open
mindset is really important for the growth to happen and just,
(26:26):
you know, understanding that life will transpire and
everything's going to be OK and you've got it.
So just stay open. And I think from a mindfulness
perspective, I think a lot of women do not spend enough time
on self-care. I know that that was true for
me, especially when I had like 2small children or even
teenagers. And like even now, like my kids
are 30 and 27 and I just, you know, I'm still, I'm still very
(26:50):
much a mom. You just always kind of have.
To be there. Stop being a mom.
I mean, yeah, I'm still a 16 year old child to my mom.
I've never grown up in her eyes,so I'm OK with.
That so it's, so I think that self-care is a place that we
don't spend a lot of time on andconsidering mindfulness, not
just as as like a nice thing to do, like go do yoga.
(27:12):
Isn't that a nice thing to do for my mind and body?
It's not that it's, I think it'sreally about being present and
in the moment and inside, like grounding with yourself and
staying true to yourself and listening to the inner wisdom
that's inside of us and, and just being present and in that
moment space. Because to me that is such a
(27:33):
huge amount of self. Like what constitutes Wellness
and self-care is really allowingyourself to be quiet, especially
today with everything. I mean, like we're always
connected to our devices and it's just noise coming in 24/7
and you can't even believe half of it anymore with AI.
So it's like so important to like break away from that and
(27:55):
just, you know, whether it's being in nature or taking a few
deep breaths and being present and being grounded and just
being in your body and allowing yourself to quiet down so you
can listen to what's most important, you know, inside.
Yeah, and I think when you talk mindfulness or you talk about
even self-care as women, it feels like it's like, oh, I go
get my hair done, I'm gonna go get my nails done.
It's like. It's mindfulness.
(28:17):
Yeah, right. 5 minutes of mindfulness, we're good to go.
And it, it feels so rushed, but I like what you said, you know,
it's about getting present. It's being right here in this
moment, right here in this conversation and not worried
about everything else that's going on around you.
And cuz there's something even for our listeners right now,
(28:39):
there's something they're getting from this conversation.
And whether unconsciously you'repicking it up or consciously
you're picking it up, there is something that Doctor Jackie is
saying that you needed to hear, hence why you're listening to
this particular episode, becausethere's a a piece when talking
to Doctor Jackie, right? And you can feel it.
(29:01):
I can feel I'm just sitting across from her and I know we're
on camera, but she just radiatesthis really calmness around her.
And I think that's when you lookat, you know, what does it look
like to be a woman in business, but has a calmness around what's
all going on and a sense of peace around what you're
creating, right? And I think that's that's where
(29:23):
all of us want to go as women. So anyways, so where do you draw
in terms of that and just life around you, where do you draw
your inspiration from? What?
What kind of I mean, you're working with clients, you're
building a business, where do you get your inspiration from?
So one of the ways that I practice mindfulness is walking.
(29:46):
It's movement. So I love yoga and y'all do that
a few times a week. But being every day I'm out, I
get out in nature and just looking at the world around me
and allowing myself to almost become like meditating while I'm
moving and just being in nature and just being open and all of a
sudden like things will just popinto my mind.
(30:06):
Oh, I should try this. Oh, wouldn't this be a cool
topic to write on what have you?So that's one place that I draw
my inspiration from. The other place that I draw my
inspiration from is interacting with other people, you know, so,
so I had an event in for summer solstice and I had, you know, a
little over 20 people there. It's the sitting and being with
(30:27):
others and holding space for them as their moving through
whatever work development they're they're doing.
And I learn so much, you know, I'm there as the teacher, but I
learn so much by interacting with other people and listening
to their stories and listening to, you know, what they want to
(30:48):
do with their lives, etcetera, or where they're getting stuck.
And that I always walk away withlike 6 other things I want to do
after I have these interactions with people.
Because I really do find that itinspires me listening to their
stories and seeing them overcomeobstacles or seeing the vision
in their eyes and where they want to go and saying Oh my
(31:09):
gosh, yeah, I got to help that person, what else can I do?
You know? So those are two the two places
I think that I most draw my inspiration from working with
other people. I'm kind of naturally an
extroverts, so I love that, but then having that quiet space
with nature and just allowing allowing things to come to me.
So you've mentioned so far, so, so far listeners in the audience
(31:31):
in here, she said some really great things so far.
And did she really say that? Because she's probably pushed a
lot of your beliefs and challenged them in a lot of way.
So what is it that if someone wanted to work with you, what
does that look like? What is it?
You talked about events, you've talked about coaching.
So what is or who is your ideal individual that your company you
like to work with? So the the ideal kind for me is
(31:54):
someone who is, you know, midlife has desires or things
that they want to achieve, but have never really felt like it's
the time or the opportunity thatthey're feeling kind of stuck.
So in the stuck, might be they're just feeling stuck or
sometimes it could be life's places you will interest in
(32:15):
places like your job gets eliminated or what have you get
divorced. You know, you have to move
whatever. But these transitional times
come up where you're either feeling stuck or you're kind of
in this transition and you need to move forward.
So what I like to do is help people rediscover what's most
essential or important to them. So spending some time with them
to really get them clear on their values and what they're
(32:38):
passionate about and help them to figure out where they want to
go moving forward as far as any dreams or aspirations that they
have for the future, for their future self.
And then helping them to identify where they are now,
where they want to go and build a road map to help them get to
that other spot, place and help them also uncover just like I
(33:00):
did. You know, as I was going through
my healing, I uncovered some of the reasons that I didn't
achieve some of the things I wanted to.
And it was because I was in these old patterns.
And so once I understood what those patterns were and I
brought that level of self-awareness up, I could do
something about it. So that's what I like to do with
people as well as help them become more self aware of where
(33:23):
they may be getting in their ownway, in what patterns they have
or narratives that they've told themselves experienced the world
with. And then help them reframe that
so that they can talk to themselves in a different way
and be able to see those possibilities moving forward and
be able to, you know, manifest what it is that they want for
their future self and being there to like, I don't see.
(33:48):
So there's two things. I think one thing that's
different about me, Katrina is like, I'm a doctor.
So there's the neurocognitive science behind this and and
there's, you know, all of that body of work.
And then I'm also person who's kind of gone through this.
So I understand emotionally kindof what that whole process is
(34:08):
like. And so I think of myself more as
a guy that like, I don't, you know, like, come on, let's go,
let's win. You know, versus for me as a
healer, I feel like I'm more like a guide or a facilitator
because the work is done by the individual.
Like I can't do the work for somebody else, right?
They have to do the work. But being able to be there with
(34:31):
them and walk with them when they're going through this, just
like with healing, you know, with diagnosing cancer with
somebody or heart disease or whatever it happens to be or
could just be a cold. But being able to be there with
that person, I feel like I do the same thing in this line of
business. It's just in a slightly
different way, but being that fine.
I like that language you're using.
(34:51):
So there is that sense of a healer, there is that sense of
that guide. And I think with what you've
created as your business, that really makes a lot of it aligns
really well. Like, it makes sense in that
kind of ways, how you describe yourself because, you know, we
could say, yeah, you're a leaderand teacher, but I feel like
those words don't quite fit for who you are because like you
(35:14):
said, they have to do the work. We all have to do the work
ourselves. Like, there's no magic pill for
for this, right? It is a personal transformation.
It is that butterfly. It is, you know, the catalyst of
moving from who you know yourself to be into your true
authentic self, and that's whereyou what the company dileen and
(35:35):
what you offer is really at the stand out.
So how can they learn more aboutyou connect with you?
So I know that you have a YouTube channel that they can
it's going to be in our show notes that they can click on to
learn more about you. And then also you have a free
guide. I believe I'm going to double
check, yes. So if you go, yeah, if you go to
dileeninstitute.com, you'll see on the website there is
(36:00):
something called a You are Enough transformation guide.
And so that's something that people can download.
And so, and pretty soon I have one that's just on mindfulness
tips as well. But but this is just, it's kind
of like getting started in that whole process of understanding
yourself and understanding that you just being used all you need
(36:21):
to be. That is perfect.
So we forget that. I think I, I know that I have in
the past, but that would be something that people, you know,
can just download and they can learn a little bit about me on
the website as well. And then on the YouTube channel,
I have it a fair amount of content there, something that's
to do with the book, which is like a chapter by chapter on
(36:41):
virtual book club. But I also have some playlists
that are there on things like communication skills and change
management and, you know, just just, you know, basic skills
like that as well or content, ifyou will, that are that's out
there. It's all free, Yeah.
Doctor Jack, you just lit up. You're like, there's all this
awesome stuff over there on my. YouTube channel like please go.
(37:02):
Feel free to check out it's likefor those listeners that are not
watching us here on the video, you know, when you see someone
light up on a podcast about their content, there is
something beautiful that they'vedone and it has been an A work
of art for them and from their hearts to put that up there.
So definitely the in the show links down below, everywhere
you're you're watching this, there's going to be her website,
(37:23):
there's going to be her YouTube channel.
Direct links to you are enough so that you can just take
advantage of that because this is your opportunity inside of
did she really say that to understand that women are
redefining the world of businessand shifting and really wanting
to help guide that transformational profit process.
And not only that, Doctor Jackie's like, get to know
(37:44):
yourself, right? If you're going to be into the
world of change, you're probablystuck in transition, Doctor
Jackie. So many is just like, yeah,
let's walk you through that, right?
Let me guide you through this process.
Let's get clear on who you are and what the next part of your
journey is going to look like. So, yeah, this has been a
(38:04):
beautiful conversation. I mean, everything that you've
shared from just the design of your brand, the business, your
aha moments, they all created this moment right here within
this episode. So Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for being a guest and beingon here.
Is there any last words of wisdom that you'd like to share
with our audience before we wrapup?
(38:26):
Well, I just want to say thank you Katrina.
This is really fun. I love this session.
It was great for me as well, just for people to don't go
back. Just be bold, be you, and do
great things because the world needs you.
All right, all you did she really say that listeners out
(38:46):
there, you know that this is your opportunity to to give a
rating support Doctor Jackie, share this out.
Listen, share with your girlfriends, somebody out there
that needs to hear this. And this is how we support each
other and create a beautiful world of collaboration as we
grow together, work together. And Doctor Jackie, thank you so
much for being on this episode with us.
Thank you.
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