March 4, 2024 • 36 mins
As the world spun on its axis, grappling with the chaos of the first three months of 2024 Abshiro, Bonni, and Dahabe – sat down to untangle the year's most complex threads.
Embracing the precipice of a new year, we share our collective aspirations, recognizing the need to step beyond well-worn paths and into spaces where dialogue and discomfort nurture growth. We champion the pursuit of diverse perspectives, the call to activism, and the personal revolutions that await when we dare to break from routine. Join us as we set forth into 2024 with a compass calibrated toward kindness, community, and a yearning to carve out a legacy of empathy and understanding in a world that all too often forgets.
Visit our IG page at https://www.instagram.com/dc_overcoffee/ to join the conversation!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
As-salamu alaikum, welcome to Difficult
Conversations where we tackletaboo topics in a safe space
through empowerment andeducation.
The information on this podcastis for informational purposes
only and should not beconsidered professional mental
health advice.
Welcome back to DifficultConversations.
(00:25):
My name is Abshiro.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
My name is.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Bonnie, my name is Dahave.
We are back for another season,we are kicking off season three
, and we decided just to takethis time to kind of look back
on 2023, kind of go through whatwe've learned, some major
events that have happened, andwhat we each took away from it,
(00:50):
and what we hope to gain or whatwe hope to achieve in 2023.
2024.
2024.
Yeah, I feel like I'm going tokeep saying 2023 for the next
two months.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
And writing it too.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, so one of the major things that have happened
this year, and yesterday I wasjust going through and looking
at some major events.
So one of the things is likefor example, in May King Charles
was coronated.
I don't know if you guysremember that.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
She's like I don't care I don't remember she's like
I don't care.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Did you guys also know that affirmative action
ended in June?
Yeah, last year the whole OceanGate Titanic thing.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
That happens oh yes, yes Okay.
And then in October we have theIsrael and Hamas war, where
Hamas attacked Israel, and thenit we're still 90 days and of
everything that's happened andover 20,000, over 22,000 now
(02:01):
Palestinians have died and57,000 or more have been injured
.
And then there's also otherconflicts in Congo and Sudan and
just a lot of heavy things andwars and atrocities that are
going on around the world.
So what are we feeling aboutthat and, I guess, what has it
(02:27):
taught you throughout all?
Speaker 3 (02:30):
of it.
You want to go for a spani?
Sure, I'm still thinking on myown.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
It's interesting that we're talking about this
because I actually just had towrite down like a note to myself
and I kind of just posted it onmy social media about how I've
put humanity on a pedestal for avery long time, like when, you
know, when I was in middleschool and high school and
(02:56):
elementary school even welearned about the Holocaust and
we kind of just said I thought Ican't hear myself, I can hear
you, okay, cool.
I thought that we had evolvedpast a lot of like the things
our ancestors or humanity'sancestors have done.
(03:17):
And then the last since October7th.
I think what it's taught me isthat we really have not.
We're as dark and as barbaricas we've ever been and I know
that's a kind of heavy thing tosay.
But and then also I think we'remore and more getting
(03:38):
desensitized to violence.
Being able to see a Child, youknow, in pain, hurt that one up
to bits, loan up to bits, andthen scrolling past and then
moving on To the rest of my day,my life, and going back and
(03:58):
hugging my child like it's nobig deal, it's making me realize
like I am getting every daymore and more desensitized to
like.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I feel like to like, for me personally, like I feel
like I'll have moments where,like, I'll go through Instagram
and just See everything out inthe open and I have a couple
Palestinians that I follow thatare on the ground, you know, for
example, like the sun and Salahand stuff like that, and for me
(04:29):
, I think it has allowed me toGet more in tune with my faith
and it just it really likesoftens your heart too and it
and it's, it's not.
It makes you question when,like, their resilience and their
faith and where all that iscoming from.
And I think you we've all seenon tiktok and Instagram where
(04:52):
people are saying, okay, what isthis?
Where is the faith coming from?
Where is the Resilience?
And it has allowed a lot ofpeople to kind of research
actually Islam and be like, okay, what are these people
believing in?
That, in the face of all ofthis that's going on, they're
able to say you know what?
I don't care what you have, Idon't care the tanks that you
have, I don't care the militarypower or the support that you
(05:15):
have.
I am still.
You know, I'm gonna resist andstand in front of you.
And I think that I was listeningto a lecture yesterday by Omar
Suleiman and he was saying, likea lot of people have not people
who are going through thissituation in Gaza, but people
that are like Witnessing thisand like all the stuff and all
(05:39):
the tragedies that are going on,and they're saying, okay, where
is Allah in all of this?
You know and he made a reallygood point that they're not the
people on the ground are.
They're not the ones that areasking that.
You know that question, we arethe ones that are asking that
question.
And the fact that, even thoughthey're going through, they're
(06:01):
still saying, you know,alhamdulillah, they're still
saying Inna lilai wa inna lirajroon and stuff like that, and
it was a very powerful reminder.
And he was basically saying,like the question is not where
is Allah, the question is, thequestion is where are you?
You know, what are you doing?
What's your part in all of this?
You know, because on the day ofjudgment, you know mil qiyamah,
(06:21):
when Allah swt, like, will askyou and say, okay, when this
atrocity was going on, what didyou do?
Right, did you make dua?
Like the least we could do ismake dua for them.
You know, and did we do that?
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yeah, I think the question that you ask is what
did 2023 has taught you or whatbrought for you?
I think for me I don't rememberthe first six months of 2023.
I'm just kind of moving throughlife as Automatic as you can
think of.
I think the last six months hasbeen really difficult in
general, just the way the worldis currently functioning as well
(06:59):
and just working in the fieldof Mental health.
You kind of get exposed to alot of stuff and you notice more
things, and I think the otheraspect of that, one of the
things that I'm noticing in thelast 90 days or so, is the idea
of what is social justice meansfor me as a person, specifically
(07:20):
being an Oromo person, and asan Oromo, our Social justice
conversation, being Oromo itself, is a political conversation
from the land that I'm from, andand so For me it's kind of
tapping into that.
It's like for being an Oromoperson, this is my blood to talk
about Justice and pain,difficulty, because my people
(07:42):
also go through similar ofGenocide that has not been even
talked about it in the way thatother just genocides has talked
about.
So it's kind of getting thatexposure to know that when I can
take be able to kind ofUnderstand the difficulty that's
happening in the world, takinga step back to kind of under,
(08:03):
not kind of fuel me, to Blunt,sight me and shut me down when
enough, like you said earlier,upshadow where we get
desensitized to.
You said, or Bonnie said, I Getthat I get desensitized.
But I also realized that as partof me being Oromo and black and
having such a very like intointersectionality, as being who
(08:26):
I am, I need to know thatthere's lengths of.
I have to pace myself becausethis fight is not going to be
like One conversation that Ihave and I kind of move on from
and I recognize to kind of say,oh, this is happening, but it's
not going to be like 90-dayconversation, is going to be the
rest of my life, the rest ofthe next generation Conversation
(08:48):
.
How do I feel myself to take astep back and still have those
complex conversations and notbeing shying away from saying,
oh, that is very difficultconversation, I can't talk about
it, or that I'm seeing too much, I'm gonna need to take a break
from it.
I can't because myintersectionality does not allow
me to take a break right,there's no way that if I walk
(09:10):
around thinking that I can besheltered and not being touched
by it, but I will be because,again, I'm Oromo, I'm black, I'm
Muslim.
All these identities place asignificant role to you how I
function in the world so how doyou like?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
how do you create that balance?
Because I think there's a fineline between like Saying, okay,
this is going on, let's talkabout it, and then having it
weigh on you and be so heavy.
How do you create that balance?
Speaker 3 (09:39):
You talk about it, you do what we're doing right
now, right.
And then the balance is thatyou go back to what you said
about Islam.
Islam is all about balance.
Islam is Islam has always beenabout talking about the
difficulty that happened priorto historical event and, for
example, salah Dina Yubi andwhen the crusaders are happening
(10:01):
is worse than what we're seeingright now, right.
And we have to tap intohistorical event and then even
talking about Algeria genocide,that it happened with French,
that there was about millionpeople are dying, right, and
those historical event kind oftapping into like wait a minute,
this is not the first time thishappened, this is a historical
(10:22):
event.
But for me to find a balance islike how do I tap into those
historical Freedom fighters andsaying, wait, how did they do it
Right?
I'm feeling lost here.
How can I function through this?
Speaker 1 (10:35):
And it brings back the point you were making
earlier, bonnie, about, like,have we learned anything?
The fact that we keep, like youmentioned, the elderly, uh,
massacre, um and a lot of otherum things in history?
Are we really progressing?
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Yeah, I mean, I feel like you guys are more
optimistic than I am right now,and maybe you guys caught me in
the wrong time.
But I feel like it goes back tothat like almost like half a
century, every half a century orso, the same things happen to
different people right Todifferent group of people.
(11:12):
And then we think, looking back, like I said, reading from the
history books, we can tell or wewe supposedly can tell um
what's right and wrong and andand plain language you know and
um, but when you're in it andyou're standing there and you're
(11:33):
just, you're in it, you're meand the historical time that
it's happening and you're sayingthat.
Imagine the idea of saying stopkilling people or ceasefire
being a political statementright and people being divided
on that are like.
Is people seeing an image of a?
You know, we keep saying menand like children and women as
(11:57):
of the men, the innocent mendon't matter right.
Like, because that's what.
That's what the media tries todo, is like oh, if we talk about
the women and the children,people's heart strings will be
tugged, but if so, let's justignore the innocent men that are
dying to like, but we see theseinnocent men I mean by default,
we've already, we've alreadykind of villainized the men.
(12:20):
So we, we see, this meant thesemen that are strip naked and
that are blindfolded and thatare tied behind their hand and
they're being tortured live.
And then there are people withguns on on TikTok singing songs
and kicking them and beatingthem right.
So brave of those people, bythe way.
And then we see these thingsand then we're like, oh we, we
(12:44):
go to the comment section or yousee a child that has like their
face blown off and their braincoming out, and you see, go to
the comments and you will findnot one, not two, not three, 10,
20, 30, 40, 50 people trying tocome up with an angle why this
is happening.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Yeah, it's not justifying, to justify it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
And I don't care, right, I don't care if this is a
Palestinian child, I don't careif this is an Oromo child.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
I don't care if this is a black child.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
I don't care if this is an Israeli child, a Parisian
child, it doesn't matter.
It's a human being.
Yeah, it's a human man, it's ahuman child, it's a human woman.
Like it happens anywhere in theworld, when it happens in China
, when it happens, it happensanywhere.
Everybody should be outraged.
Some people, at some point, aretrying to find an angle and it
(13:33):
kills me, like I'm like, wheredid we get here?
But then, but then, 50 yearsfrom now, when we write it down
in the history books and then weread it, and then our
grandchildren are going to belike Wow, this was a tragedy.
How did people let it happen.
They read that and then they dothe same thing all over again.
We're doing the same thing allover again and it's just like
(13:55):
where did the late like?
Where did the history?
Speaker 3 (13:58):
books go.
What are you saying is that wedon't learn from history.
We don't learn from history.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
And we act like and I'm sorry to go back to your
question about where do you findthat balance?
It's like for me it's not rightnow, it's not even about
finding balance.
I'm just having my eyes wideopen and bringing humanity back
to from the pedestal that I putit on and being like, oh, we're
so much better, we were doing somuch, and you know, we've
(14:23):
progressed so much.
We have we're so advanced.
I think our technology might bebetter.
I think for me, like it makessense.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
And the way like I try to make meaning and make
sense of it is like there is alife after this right, that
there's an Akhira, that there'sa day of judgment and stuff like
that, and so it's almost like a.
You know, when you, I don'tknow, it's called gingilcha.
You know, like when you putstuff in um what is that called
in English.
It's like, it's like this uh, Idon't know when you separate
(14:56):
the rocks, yeah, you separatelike the rocks from the pebbles
I don't know what it's called.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
Shifter, shifter, shifter, shifter.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
Yeah, so for me it's like, when these things happen,
it's almost as like a siftingprocess.
You know, like for us, um.
Even for example, in the Quran,allah swt says do you think
that you're going to get Jannaheasily?
You know, you think that you'regoing to without going through
tests and trials and umtribulations and all that stuff.
It's not.
It's not an easy thing to sayyeah, allah, give me Jannah.
(15:27):
You know, um, and so that's whatI personally find comfort in,
and you know, even though allthese people are, you know,
dying and going through all ofthese atrocities, at the end of
the day there is an Akhira,there is going to be justice and
there's going to be a reckoningyou know and so that's what I
find solace in yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
I think when Bonnie said that I'm going to try to
put people, not put the humanity, in the pedestal, the pedestal
was never supposed to be there,right?
And I think the fact that ofwhat you're saying is related to
the fact, like when Allah saysin the mad usra, usra, right,
even even that statement, it'slike we forget that.
(16:09):
Like ease comes with the usra,like it's like a sandwich
without the challenge, that easedoesn't come.
Yeah, right, you don'tappreciate it.
You don't appreciate it, youwon't notice it.
And I think Allah knows thebalance and the hope, but we
have to have a hope in Allah,right, not the humanity, but to
Allah and to say that he has aplan.
(16:30):
He's like one of his name is AlHakim, right, and if you can go
back and understand what AlHakim is, the wiser, the word,
the one with the wisdom hecreated all of this, and
sometimes going into tapping tothat, is that Gingilcha, that's
where you're looking for, likeit's inside that, all that
things that we're trying to siftthrough it, and it's like, oh,
that's where the hope that I'mlooking for, and not from the
(16:53):
humanities, more like from yourchildren, from your friends,
from your neighbors, from thepeople that you have emotional
connection to the hope isthrough them and the way that
they kind of try to kind ofbring you back from this very
cynical state that we're putourselves into saying, hey, it's
not that dark.
I'm going to try to bring youback in this space where we have
(17:14):
to kind of feel it andsometimes we don't have a feel
for ourselves.
We have to kind of lean on toone another, saying I know you
don't have the hope today, butI'll carry it for you.
Here is some of the hope thatyou may need for next week and
so that that you can kind of geta little bit of perspective.
And sometimes we have to zoomout right Because we're so
zoomed into the difficulty andthe strategies of this incident
(17:36):
that's happening simultaneously.
It's like how do I zoom out alittle bit?
How do I get clarity Cause,right now everything feels foggy
.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
And I think also one of the things outside of hope
and outside of all of thesethings is that action Like I am
realizing that one and I feellike I am the, the like there's
the you know positive hope inlike all these things.
And then there's, like this,the real, we don't we have to
(18:04):
bring that in some time.
But I feel like I don't mean tobe like the doomsday person, but
like the systems that you knowof the world, realizing that,
like they're not perfect, noteven close right, the leaders
are not as smart as we give themcredit to be.
So I think my hope is yes, it'swith a law in.
(18:29):
You know, make, make a lot ofthe while you pray and you know
all of these things, and for me,even you know, I, I I started
taking Islamic study classesbecause I wanted to learn a
little bit more.
I kind of just wanted to dive alittle bit more into the Dean
Because I needed some spacewhere I feel certainty.
Right, but outs, when you walkoutside of that, I think it's
(18:53):
more of like Challenging thatthose leaderships making sure
that, like you, are raising thenext generation so that they
don't forget not just they don'tforget, but they do better when
you're interacting with people,making sure that they see your
humanity as much as you seetheirs.
Like making I I have.
(19:13):
I'm the kind of person that'slike I Just match people's
energy normally, like you'renice to me, I'm nice to you.
You're up to me, you'll get itback.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
You know what I?
Speaker 2 (19:24):
mean I'm that person.
But now I am trying to be like,okay, move with kindness, move
with the space of like, justgiving people an unlimited
benefit of the doubt, withoutlike getting them into my
boundary, but just like beinglike I'll give you the benefit
of the doubt.
I'll give you the benefit ofthe doubt and be kind to you
(19:46):
regardless.
Oh, you are to me, you're, youknow, whatever, whatever I'll be
, I'll give you the benefit ofthe doubt and be kind to you and
nice to you, and so that maybeyou know, you get to match my
energy instead of me matchingyours.
That way we create some sort oflike Connection, because you're
only responsible for my action.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
So like if we create some sort of connection and some
sort of like, just touchingeach other's humanity, right
Like, and then Technically,you're very hopeful.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
I think that statement right there?
I don't know.
Yeah, yeah, I just by thatstatement.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
I think you are Um, but I'm like, no, that's too
much of me giving you a benefitthat you've done once and twice
and yeah, but going back to ourleaders.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
I think that, um, whatever leadership that we have
currently in the world, it's areflection of us.
Yeah right, it's a reflectionof our own Issues and
backgrounds, or whatever,because at the end of the day,
we put them up there and theydon't have power if we don't
give them.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
I don't agree.
I don't see even necessarily wewe put them up.
I think capitalism put them upthere, I think money put them up
there and I think we are usedas an, as a guinea pig to come
up guinea pig to kind of make itseem like we did that.
But if, if I was thebillionaires, put them out there
because they get out of so muchwealth, out of this whole
experience.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
But the thing is, though, I feel like, even in
capitalism, right, as a people,I feel like we have more
strength than we give ourselvescredit for, you know, because
it's it's all based onconsumerism, right, like, for
example, with the whole likeboycott and stuff like that.
That's going on, um, and Iremember reading an article
where, uh, you know how likethere was in the red sea, how it
(21:39):
was like unsafe for the shipsor whatever, and then, right
after that was going on, bp hadPushed their prime minister to
call for a ceasefire.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
Because he invests a lot of money into it, exactly,
but it, it's, it's he's money,money.
I'm telling you about us, butwe are the consumers, though
what?
Okay, so you have to identifywho are the consumers, based on
um, I think it depends, right, Ihave to say it depends in the
situation, because there are agroup of people who are
(22:11):
consuming based on need.
There are people who don'tactually care at all, regardless
what this capitalism,regardless who's getting hurt,
and there is that.
And there are people who arenew to this and they're learning
and try to understand how theycan navigate.
So it depends on the situation,but majority aspect, you write
yes, consumerism does.
We are part of that, but at thesame time, I think where that
(22:33):
hope comes in is that the thepeople who's learning and trying
to understand.
Am I buying things that I don'tneed?
Is this thing that I'm buyingaffecting the people who's
getting hurt?
And it raises awareness.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Yeah, I I kind of I feel like there's a merge of two
things that I feel.
One is that, yes, like, moneywalks and people listen to money
more than, like, you know whatwe say and what we feel and what
we care about, um, so if wewithhold our money, our leaders
will listen, but at the sametime, like I said, the systems
(23:09):
of the world are broken and theway we are already so programmed
and into um our attention spamis shorter than it's ever been
in history.
We are, we consume more nowthan we've ever consumed in
history.
We then, at the same time,where there's a deficit of, like
, resources, right, so people,sometimes they don't have the
(23:31):
choice, like, for example,people that are in, um, uh,
state-funded.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
State-funded programs .
Speaker 2 (23:40):
There's a limit to what they can buy and what they
can use.
So they don't have the choicebut to buy whatever that they're
given to buy.
So those things might not bethings that you know they want
to support.
They don't have the luxury tonot support.
In addition, if you guys noticed, there has been laws that have
(24:01):
been getting implemented, stateafter state after state, where
it is now getting to be illegalto boycott certain plate.
You know certain companies toboycott certain uh items coming
from certain certain countries,and it's I don't know how.
That's not an infringement onthe first amendment.
(24:22):
But at the same time, laws arebeing passed to infringe on
people's Ability to to boycottor to not boycott.
Literally, people are gettingtheir grants withdrawn, people
are getting fired from jobs,people are like losing their
scholarships, people are losing,you know, getting expelled or
suspended from schools.
So so there are there moneytalks, but then how?
(24:43):
How much Are you willing tolike?
It's okay to not go toStarbucks, that will hurt, yeah,
but then the big moves that youwant to make, you can't make
because there are laws that areshackled.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Yeah, but even how much?
But how much are you ready toget get comfortable with
discomfort, right?
Yeah, that's the thing.
That's what you're asking rightthere, connie, that's a level.
Yeah, how much are you willingto get?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
uncomfortable.
Can you imagine, in the SilverRights era, when people are like
, nah, I'm not gonna take thebuses, I don't have a car, but
I'll walk the 20 mile, right,like that is the commitment that
you need.
But we don't have thatcommitment because for months,
for years now, our attentionspam has been like shortened by
TikTok, instagram and all ofthese things, and we've been so
(25:26):
like um, programmed, programmedinto being so vain, right Like
and like wanting and thinkingand being so independent
thinkers and like individualthinkers and very like
self-centered.
Mimi, mimi, I, I, I, selfie,selfie and then so then what's
the solution?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
Like what?
What do you guys think are someways that I guess will help,
even if it's one by 1%?
Speaker 2 (25:48):
one get out of this polarized mind state Like it's
not, everything is a politicalstatement.
Yeah, not everything is apolitical statement.
Not everything is, like um, apolitical issue.
Some things, you can cross theboundary.
You can cross the border andlike have the same um, have a
conversation on outside of thepolitical spectrum that you are
(26:09):
in.
So like not don't let yourpolitical stance stand in like
the bigger picture, biggerconflicts that are going on, um
to I feel like no little, nomovement is too little.
No little boycott is too littlebecause it will add up three.
Read Like there was this.
There's this girl on TikTok.
(26:30):
It's so funny Not on TikTokcoming on, and she's on TikTok,
but I follow her on Instagramthat she posts articles every
day for people to read and everyday she repost the same thing
and she's like only two peopleread the whole article.
And there's a saying that ifyou want to hide something from
people, put it in a book.
(26:51):
So read like read, read, readabout from people that you don't
agree with.
Read from people that you agreewith.
Read from people you knowthings that you don't know about
.
So that way you're not easilymanipulated.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yeah, I think for me I would say find a way to build,
foster, you know, community andtalk about difficult stuff and
not being shying away from theconversation, that, even if it
makes you uncomfortable, I thinkit's okay to kind of step back
and say why does this make mefeel uncomfortable, why am I
kind of avoiding theconversation?
And I think, at the end of theday, we are meant to be in
(27:28):
collective environment.
We are built that way as ahuman being and if you, if we
want to kind of dismantle thissystem that has conditioned us
to a certain way, is for us tokind of create in the community
that we can kind of foster thosechallenges, foster those
difficulties that we're having,and not trying to kind of get
comfortable with this level oflife that we're leading.
(27:50):
Kind of maintaining, like whatI just said earlier at the
beginning, is like I don'tremember the first six months of
2023.
It's because, case in point, Iwas just moving like a robot,
like not even taking a step backand try to reflect if
anything's are happening orgetting back in like activism,
for example, like creatingcommunities, and there's a lot
(28:11):
in Minneapolis specifically forus.
It's like we are so comfortablejust sitting and doing the main
thing that we forget to like goto protests, go to volunteer,
our other social justice ofcommunities.
I think those are the thingsthat, plus what Bonnie said,
would kind of help us to get outof this like way of where we
are and even challenge theaspect that humanity's put a
(28:33):
soul, that we have put it on andto say, well, according to this
community, that I've made surethat's part of that.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
I think the conversation piece is like,
really, really important and,like you said, bonnie, kind of
stretching your hand across theaisle and just having
conversations that areuncomfortable For one, it does
expand your horizons and thenthe other person, too, does
expand their horizons.
So, to wrap up, I would justlike to kind of go through what
(29:02):
you guys's hopes are for 2024.
What is one thing that youwould like to achieve?
Like me, I'm kind of late on mywhole 2024 planning.
So I got this.
I don't know if you guys haveseen this like big, huge
calendar.
It's probably been on your feed, I think it's by like Jesse
Seltzer or something like that,but it's like 365 days all laid
(29:25):
out on one big thing, and so,like you see your whole year
plastered, can you send?
Speaker 3 (29:34):
it to me I will, I will.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Mine, I ordered it and it's coming.
But but his big thing is thatlike try to do like little
things, like every two months orso, like try to do like a mini
vacation or like a mini likedisrupt your routine.
So it kind of gets you get toyour mindset out of like the
mundane that you were talkingabout.
Um, yeah, so what is one thingyou would like to do this year?
(30:01):
Like have a big event and if youhaven't thought about it, it's
fine, we can come back to it.
Maybe another episode, but onebig.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
I thought about it and then one little, who has it?
I don't make.
What one thing is that I don'tmake new year's resolution?
I make more like personal umgrowth mindset.
Where I go into this year isjust more about taking a risk on
myself, um, just just taking arisk on and the things that I've
kind of afraid to do.
(30:28):
So give me one of that.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
One thing.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
I want to do a solo traveling.
Okay, I do, and I think that'sthe biggest one Do you have
where I do, but I don't want tosay it?
Okay, and I want to do a solotraveling, regardless what
happened.
And I think I want to get outof that mindset of, I think if
once I break that mold of doingthat one thing, I think that
(30:52):
would be the key to for a lot ofthe things that I want to do
this year.
Okay, bonnie.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
This year I am trying to like.
So I have my year divided upinto mind, body, spirit, and so,
wait, sorry, what did I say?
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Mind, so body, spirit , and I don't know, I forgot
what.
The fourth one is Physical.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Physical, okay.
So I want to be able to, oh,social, social, sorry.
I want to be able to take careof those things.
You know, and I have plans tobe able to take care of those
things and to advance on thosethings and to be better in 2024
than I have been in 2023 and theyears before.
(31:43):
So, like, spirit-wise, like Isaid, I want to be able to get
reconnected with my faith bytaking, like, some study classes
and like reading the O'Reanmoreand like having that programmed
into my schedule and to myday-to-day life.
You know, going to the gym, youknow, like a resolution another
year, another plan, and likeyou know, and doing other things
(32:05):
, doing social things, doingmore, being more active and like
being, you know, having morerelationships.
I've been very I know thismight sound like a whatever, but
I've been an introvert foralmost five years now, like I
had a or we're rubbing off onyou I literally.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I think we're very selective.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Yeah, oh, and her introvertedness.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Yeah, I mean I'm not introverted when it comes to the
people that I already have inmy circle, it's just when it
comes to outside of my.
I'm an ambivert, so but thatleans a little bit towards being
an introvert and I'm trying toget a little bit more out of my
comfort zone and meet new peopleand create new social circles
and, like you know, blah, blah,blah.
So I've kind of divided my yearup into focusing on these two,
(32:55):
four spaces.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Give me one event, one thing.
It could be a big event, itcould be like a small.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
I'm planning on graduating again this year, and
then I'm supposed to oh, let'sstop it all.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
My wife.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Anyway, and hopefully I will, I won't say this.
I won't say this.
Oh, I'll start some sort ofbusiness.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Inshallah, inshallah.
So I think for me, if I wantthis year to be the year where I
don't limit myself in terms ofyou know, certain plans that I
want to do, whether it'sbusiness or personal, and I want
to kind of not put things upwhere, like, because sometimes,
(33:49):
you know, I feel like you'd makea goal and you're like, oh
really, like, is that reallyrealistic, you know, is that
something really that you can do?
And I want to get out of thatmindset because I feel like, for
a long time, that is what hasheld me back in terms of trying
to achieve certain things andlike I'll start something and
(34:11):
then it won't, like I won'tfinish because I've already kind
of made myself believe that youtalk yourself out of it.
I talk myself out of it right.
So that's one of my biggestthings and, inshallah, I hope to
make a lot of changes in termsof family, business and stuff
like that and kind of just goingon my own.
One big event that I want to dothis year is I want to either
(34:36):
go to Ethiopia, like on a familyvisit in maybe August, and also
I want to do a Umrah in.
December, maybe inshallah.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
That's gonna be amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Both are big milestones, big milestones, but
I feel like it's either one orthe other, so I need to.
Once my calendar comes in, I'llupdate you guys, okay.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Wait, like December, like December 2024?
Yeah, or August 2020.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Why did?
Speaker 2 (35:04):
I just ask that it's January yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
So yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That's amazing.
Thank you for sharing ladies.
That's like incredible ways tohopefully.
Maybe we can do a recap at theend of the year.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
Yeah, check through what happened.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Yeah, and I love that .
We are all very ambitiouspeople individually and very
passionate about our goals, sohopefully that sustains for the
rest of it.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
If you decide to go to Umrah, I might come with you.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Put it on your calendar, All right well thank
you guys for listening to us, asalways.
Please comment on our Instagrampage, send us an email.
We love to always hear from youguys.
What did you think this year?
How did it go for you?
What are some things that youhope to achieve this year?
(35:59):
We're always here, so pleaseupdate us.
Send us an email.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yep.
Assalamu alaikum, wa alaikumsalam, this has been difficult
conversations.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I can't.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Join the conversation in the comment section or on
our social media pages.
We do not have all the answers,and our biggest goal is to kick
off the conversation and get itstarted.
May Allah SWT accept ourefforts and use this for
catalysts of change.
As-salamu alaikum, welcome to Difficult
Conversations where we tackletaboo topics in a safe space
through empowerment andeducation.
The information on this podcastis for informational purposes
only and should not beconsidered professional mental
health advice.
Welcome back to DifficultConversations.
(00:25):
My name is Abshiro.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
My name is.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Bonnie, my name is Dahave.
We are back for another season,we are kicking off season three
, and we decided just to takethis time to kind of look back
on 2023, kind of go through whatwe've learned, some major
events that have happened, andwhat we each took away from it,
(00:50):
and what we hope to gain or whatwe hope to achieve in 2023.
2024.
2024.
Yeah, I feel like I'm going tokeep saying 2023 for the next
two months.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
And writing it too.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, so one of the major things that have happened
this year, and yesterday I wasjust going through and looking
at some major events.
So one of the things is likefor example, in May King Charles
was coronated.
I don't know if you guysremember that.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
She's like I don't care I don't remember she's like
I don't care.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Did you guys also know that affirmative action
ended in June?
Yeah, last year the whole OceanGate Titanic thing.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
That happens oh yes, yes Okay.
And then in October we have theIsrael and Hamas war, where
Hamas attacked Israel, and thenit we're still 90 days and of
everything that's happened andover 20,000, over 22,000 now
(02:01):
Palestinians have died and57,000 or more have been injured
.
And then there's also otherconflicts in Congo and Sudan and
just a lot of heavy things andwars and atrocities that are
going on around the world.
So what are we feeling aboutthat and, I guess, what has it
(02:27):
taught you throughout all?
Speaker 3 (02:30):
of it.
You want to go for a spani?
Sure, I'm still thinking on myown.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
It's interesting that we're talking about this
because I actually just had towrite down like a note to myself
and I kind of just posted it onmy social media about how I've
put humanity on a pedestal for avery long time, like when, you
know, when I was in middleschool and high school and
(02:56):
elementary school even welearned about the Holocaust and
we kind of just said I thought Ican't hear myself, I can hear
you, okay, cool.
I thought that we had evolvedpast a lot of like the things
our ancestors or humanity'sancestors have done.
(03:17):
And then the last since October7th.
I think what it's taught me isthat we really have not.
We're as dark and as barbaricas we've ever been and I know
that's a kind of heavy thing tosay.
But and then also I think we'remore and more getting
(03:38):
desensitized to violence.
Being able to see a Child, youknow, in pain, hurt that one up
to bits, loan up to bits, andthen scrolling past and then
moving on To the rest of my day,my life, and going back and
(03:58):
hugging my child like it's nobig deal, it's making me realize
like I am getting every daymore and more desensitized to
like.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I feel like to like, for me personally, like I feel
like I'll have moments where,like, I'll go through Instagram
and just See everything out inthe open and I have a couple
Palestinians that I follow thatare on the ground, you know, for
example, like the sun and Salahand stuff like that, and for me
(04:29):
, I think it has allowed me toGet more in tune with my faith
and it just it really likesoftens your heart too and it
and it's, it's not.
It makes you question when,like, their resilience and their
faith and where all that iscoming from.
And I think you we've all seenon tiktok and Instagram where
(04:52):
people are saying, okay, what isthis?
Where is the faith coming from?
Where is the Resilience?
And it has allowed a lot ofpeople to kind of research
actually Islam and be like, okay, what are these people
believing in?
That, in the face of all ofthis that's going on, they're
able to say you know what?
I don't care what you have, Idon't care the tanks that you
have, I don't care the militarypower or the support that you
(05:15):
have.
I am still.
You know, I'm gonna resist andstand in front of you.
And I think that I was listeningto a lecture yesterday by Omar
Suleiman and he was saying, likea lot of people have not people
who are going through thissituation in Gaza, but people
that are like Witnessing thisand like all the stuff and all
(05:39):
the tragedies that are going on,and they're saying, okay, where
is Allah in all of this?
You know and he made a reallygood point that they're not the
people on the ground are.
They're not the ones that areasking that.
You know that question, we arethe ones that are asking that
question.
And the fact that, even thoughthey're going through, they're
(06:01):
still saying, you know,alhamdulillah, they're still
saying Inna lilai wa inna lirajroon and stuff like that, and
it was a very powerful reminder.
And he was basically saying,like the question is not where
is Allah, the question is, thequestion is where are you?
You know, what are you doing?
What's your part in all of this?
You know, because on the day ofjudgment, you know mil qiyamah,
(06:21):
when Allah swt, like, will askyou and say, okay, when this
atrocity was going on, what didyou do?
Right, did you make dua?
Like the least we could do ismake dua for them.
You know, and did we do that?
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yeah, I think the question that you ask is what
did 2023 has taught you or whatbrought for you?
I think for me I don't rememberthe first six months of 2023.
I'm just kind of moving throughlife as Automatic as you can
think of.
I think the last six months hasbeen really difficult in
general, just the way the worldis currently functioning as well
(06:59):
and just working in the fieldof Mental health.
You kind of get exposed to alot of stuff and you notice more
things, and I think the otheraspect of that, one of the
things that I'm noticing in thelast 90 days or so, is the idea
of what is social justice meansfor me as a person, specifically
(07:20):
being an Oromo person, and asan Oromo, our Social justice
conversation, being Oromo itself, is a political conversation
from the land that I'm from, andand so For me it's kind of
tapping into that.
It's like for being an Oromoperson, this is my blood to talk
about Justice and pain,difficulty, because my people
(07:42):
also go through similar ofGenocide that has not been even
talked about it in the way thatother just genocides has talked
about.
So it's kind of getting thatexposure to know that when I can
take be able to kind ofUnderstand the difficulty that's
happening in the world, takinga step back to kind of under,
(08:03):
not kind of fuel me, to Blunt,sight me and shut me down when
enough, like you said earlier,upshadow where we get
desensitized to.
You said, or Bonnie said, I Getthat I get desensitized.
But I also realized that as partof me being Oromo and black and
having such a very like intointersectionality, as being who
(08:26):
I am, I need to know thatthere's lengths of.
I have to pace myself becausethis fight is not going to be
like One conversation that Ihave and I kind of move on from
and I recognize to kind of say,oh, this is happening, but it's
not going to be like 90-dayconversation, is going to be the
rest of my life, the rest ofthe next generation Conversation
(08:48):
.
How do I feel myself to take astep back and still have those
complex conversations and notbeing shying away from saying,
oh, that is very difficultconversation, I can't talk about
it, or that I'm seeing too much, I'm gonna need to take a break
from it.
I can't because myintersectionality does not allow
me to take a break right,there's no way that if I walk
(09:10):
around thinking that I can besheltered and not being touched
by it, but I will be because,again, I'm Oromo, I'm black, I'm
Muslim.
All these identities place asignificant role to you how I
function in the world so how doyou like?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
how do you create that balance?
Because I think there's a fineline between like Saying, okay,
this is going on, let's talkabout it, and then having it
weigh on you and be so heavy.
How do you create that balance?
Speaker 3 (09:39):
You talk about it, you do what we're doing right
now, right.
And then the balance is thatyou go back to what you said
about Islam.
Islam is all about balance.
Islam is Islam has always beenabout talking about the
difficulty that happened priorto historical event and, for
example, salah Dina Yubi andwhen the crusaders are happening
(10:01):
is worse than what we're seeingright now, right.
And we have to tap intohistorical event and then even
talking about Algeria genocide,that it happened with French,
that there was about millionpeople are dying, right, and
those historical event kind oftapping into like wait a minute,
this is not the first time thishappened, this is a historical
(10:22):
event.
But for me to find a balance islike how do I tap into those
historical Freedom fighters andsaying, wait, how did they do it
Right?
I'm feeling lost here.
How can I function through this?
Speaker 1 (10:35):
And it brings back the point you were making
earlier, bonnie, about, like,have we learned anything?
The fact that we keep, like youmentioned, the elderly, uh,
massacre, um and a lot of otherum things in history?
Are we really progressing?
Speaker 2 (10:51):
Yeah, I mean, I feel like you guys are more
optimistic than I am right now,and maybe you guys caught me in
the wrong time.
But I feel like it goes back tothat like almost like half a
century, every half a century orso, the same things happen to
different people right Todifferent group of people.
(11:12):
And then we think, looking back, like I said, reading from the
history books, we can tell or wewe supposedly can tell um
what's right and wrong and andand plain language you know and
um, but when you're in it andyou're standing there and you're
(11:33):
just, you're in it, you're meand the historical time that
it's happening and you're sayingthat.
Imagine the idea of saying stopkilling people or ceasefire
being a political statementright and people being divided
on that are like.
Is people seeing an image of a?
You know, we keep saying menand like children and women as
(11:57):
of the men, the innocent mendon't matter right.
Like, because that's what.
That's what the media tries todo, is like oh, if we talk about
the women and the children,people's heart strings will be
tugged, but if so, let's justignore the innocent men that are
dying to like, but we see theseinnocent men I mean by default,
we've already, we've alreadykind of villainized the men.
(12:20):
So we, we see, this meant thesemen that are strip naked and
that are blindfolded and thatare tied behind their hand and
they're being tortured live.
And then there are people withguns on on TikTok singing songs
and kicking them and beatingthem right.
So brave of those people, bythe way.
And then we see these thingsand then we're like, oh we, we
(12:44):
go to the comment section or yousee a child that has like their
face blown off and their braincoming out, and you see, go to
the comments and you will findnot one, not two, not three, 10,
20, 30, 40, 50 people trying tocome up with an angle why this
is happening.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Yeah, it's not justifying, to justify it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
And I don't care, right, I don't care if this is a
Palestinian child, I don't careif this is an Oromo child.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
I don't care if this is a black child.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
I don't care if this is an Israeli child, a Parisian
child, it doesn't matter.
It's a human being.
Yeah, it's a human man, it's ahuman child, it's a human woman.
Like it happens anywhere in theworld, when it happens in China
, when it happens, it happensanywhere.
Everybody should be outraged.
Some people, at some point, aretrying to find an angle and it
(13:33):
kills me, like I'm like, wheredid we get here?
But then, but then, 50 yearsfrom now, when we write it down
in the history books and then weread it, and then our
grandchildren are going to belike Wow, this was a tragedy.
How did people let it happen.
They read that and then they dothe same thing all over again.
We're doing the same thing allover again and it's just like
(13:55):
where did the late like?
Where did the history?
Speaker 3 (13:58):
books go.
What are you saying is that wedon't learn from history.
We don't learn from history.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
And we act like and I'm sorry to go back to your
question about where do you findthat balance?
It's like for me it's not rightnow, it's not even about
finding balance.
I'm just having my eyes wideopen and bringing humanity back
to from the pedestal that I putit on and being like, oh, we're
so much better, we were doing somuch, and you know, we've
(14:23):
progressed so much.
We have we're so advanced.
I think our technology might bebetter.
I think for me, like it makessense.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
And the way like I try to make meaning and make
sense of it is like there is alife after this right, that
there's an Akhira, that there'sa day of judgment and stuff like
that, and so it's almost like a.
You know, when you, I don'tknow, it's called gingilcha.
You know, like when you putstuff in um what is that called
in English.
It's like, it's like this uh, Idon't know when you separate
(14:56):
the rocks, yeah, you separatelike the rocks from the pebbles
I don't know what it's called.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
Shifter, shifter, shifter, shifter.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
Yeah, so for me it's like, when these things happen,
it's almost as like a siftingprocess.
You know, like for us, um.
Even for example, in the Quran,allah swt says do you think
that you're going to get Jannaheasily?
You know, you think that you'regoing to without going through
tests and trials and umtribulations and all that stuff.
It's not.
It's not an easy thing to sayyeah, allah, give me Jannah.
(15:27):
You know, um, and so that's whatI personally find comfort in,
and you know, even though allthese people are, you know,
dying and going through all ofthese atrocities, at the end of
the day there is an Akhira,there is going to be justice and
there's going to be a reckoningyou know and so that's what I
find solace in yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
I think when Bonnie said that I'm going to try to
put people, not put the humanity, in the pedestal, the pedestal
was never supposed to be there,right?
And I think the fact that ofwhat you're saying is related to
the fact, like when Allah saysin the mad usra, usra, right,
even even that statement, it'slike we forget that.
(16:09):
Like ease comes with the usra,like it's like a sandwich
without the challenge, that easedoesn't come.
Yeah, right, you don'tappreciate it.
You don't appreciate it, youwon't notice it.
And I think Allah knows thebalance and the hope, but we
have to have a hope in Allah,right, not the humanity, but to
Allah and to say that he has aplan.
(16:30):
He's like one of his name is AlHakim, right, and if you can go
back and understand what AlHakim is, the wiser, the word,
the one with the wisdom hecreated all of this, and
sometimes going into tapping tothat, is that Gingilcha, that's
where you're looking for, likeit's inside that, all that
things that we're trying to siftthrough it, and it's like, oh,
that's where the hope that I'mlooking for, and not from the
(16:53):
humanities, more like from yourchildren, from your friends,
from your neighbors, from thepeople that you have emotional
connection to the hope isthrough them and the way that
they kind of try to kind ofbring you back from this very
cynical state that we're putourselves into saying, hey, it's
not that dark.
I'm going to try to bring youback in this space where we have
(17:14):
to kind of feel it andsometimes we don't have a feel
for ourselves.
We have to kind of lean on toone another, saying I know you
don't have the hope today, butI'll carry it for you.
Here is some of the hope thatyou may need for next week and
so that that you can kind of geta little bit of perspective.
And sometimes we have to zoomout right Because we're so
zoomed into the difficulty andthe strategies of this incident
(17:36):
that's happening simultaneously.
It's like how do I zoom out alittle bit?
How do I get clarity Cause,right now everything feels foggy
.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
And I think also one of the things outside of hope
and outside of all of thesethings is that action Like I am
realizing that one and I feellike I am the, the like there's
the you know positive hope inlike all these things.
And then there's, like this,the real, we don't we have to
(18:04):
bring that in some time.
But I feel like I don't mean tobe like the doomsday person, but
like the systems that you knowof the world, realizing that,
like they're not perfect, noteven close right, the leaders
are not as smart as we give themcredit to be.
So I think my hope is yes, it'swith a law in.
(18:29):
You know, make, make a lot ofthe while you pray and you know
all of these things, and for me,even you know, I, I I started
taking Islamic study classesbecause I wanted to learn a
little bit more.
I kind of just wanted to dive alittle bit more into the Dean
Because I needed some spacewhere I feel certainty.
Right, but outs, when you walkoutside of that, I think it's
(18:53):
more of like Challenging thatthose leaderships making sure
that, like you, are raising thenext generation so that they
don't forget not just they don'tforget, but they do better when
you're interacting with people,making sure that they see your
humanity as much as you seetheirs.
Like making I I have.
(19:13):
I'm the kind of person that'slike I Just match people's
energy normally, like you'renice to me, I'm nice to you.
You're up to me, you'll get itback.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
You know what I?
Speaker 2 (19:24):
mean I'm that person.
But now I am trying to be like,okay, move with kindness, move
with the space of like, justgiving people an unlimited
benefit of the doubt, withoutlike getting them into my
boundary, but just like beinglike I'll give you the benefit
of the doubt.
I'll give you the benefit ofthe doubt and be kind to you
(19:46):
regardless.
Oh, you are to me, you're, youknow, whatever, whatever I'll be
, I'll give you the benefit ofthe doubt and be kind to you and
nice to you, and so that maybeyou know, you get to match my
energy instead of me matchingyours.
That way we create some sort oflike Connection, because you're
only responsible for my action.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
So like if we create some sort of connection and some
sort of like, just touchingeach other's humanity, right
Like, and then Technically,you're very hopeful.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
I think that statement right there?
I don't know.
Yeah, yeah, I just by thatstatement.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
I think you are Um, but I'm like, no, that's too
much of me giving you a benefitthat you've done once and twice
and yeah, but going back to ourleaders.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
I think that, um, whatever leadership that we have
currently in the world, it's areflection of us.
Yeah right, it's a reflectionof our own Issues and
backgrounds, or whatever,because at the end of the day,
we put them up there and theydon't have power if we don't
give them.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
I don't agree.
I don't see even necessarily wewe put them up.
I think capitalism put them upthere, I think money put them up
there and I think we are usedas an, as a guinea pig to come
up guinea pig to kind of make itseem like we did that.
But if, if I was thebillionaires, put them out there
because they get out of so muchwealth, out of this whole
experience.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
But the thing is, though, I feel like, even in
capitalism, right, as a people,I feel like we have more
strength than we give ourselvescredit for, you know, because
it's it's all based onconsumerism, right, like, for
example, with the whole likeboycott and stuff like that.
That's going on, um, and Iremember reading an article
where, uh, you know how likethere was in the red sea, how it
(21:39):
was like unsafe for the shipsor whatever, and then, right
after that was going on, bp hadPushed their prime minister to
call for a ceasefire.
Speaker 3 (21:48):
Because he invests a lot of money into it, exactly,
but it, it's, it's he's money,money.
I'm telling you about us, butwe are the consumers, though
what?
Okay, so you have to identifywho are the consumers, based on
um, I think it depends, right, Ihave to say it depends in the
situation, because there are agroup of people who are
(22:11):
consuming based on need.
There are people who don'tactually care at all, regardless
what this capitalism,regardless who's getting hurt,
and there is that.
And there are people who arenew to this and they're learning
and try to understand how theycan navigate.
So it depends on the situation,but majority aspect, you write
yes, consumerism does.
We are part of that, but at thesame time, I think where that
(22:33):
hope comes in is that the thepeople who's learning and trying
to understand.
Am I buying things that I don'tneed?
Is this thing that I'm buyingaffecting the people who's
getting hurt?
And it raises awareness.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Yeah, I I kind of I feel like there's a merge of two
things that I feel.
One is that, yes, like, moneywalks and people listen to money
more than, like, you know whatwe say and what we feel and what
we care about, um, so if wewithhold our money, our leaders
will listen, but at the sametime, like I said, the systems
(23:09):
of the world are broken and theway we are already so programmed
and into um our attention spamis shorter than it's ever been
in history.
We are, we consume more nowthan we've ever consumed in
history.
We then, at the same time,where there's a deficit of, like
, resources, right, so people,sometimes they don't have the
(23:31):
choice, like, for example,people that are in, um, uh,
state-funded.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
State-funded programs .
Speaker 2 (23:40):
There's a limit to what they can buy and what they
can use.
So they don't have the choicebut to buy whatever that they're
given to buy.
So those things might not bethings that you know they want
to support.
They don't have the luxury tonot support.
In addition, if you guys noticed, there has been laws that have
(24:01):
been getting implemented, stateafter state after state, where
it is now getting to be illegalto boycott certain plate.
You know certain companies toboycott certain uh items coming
from certain certain countries,and it's I don't know how.
That's not an infringement onthe first amendment.
(24:22):
But at the same time, laws arebeing passed to infringe on
people's Ability to to boycottor to not boycott.
Literally, people are gettingtheir grants withdrawn, people
are getting fired from jobs,people are like losing their
scholarships, people are losing,you know, getting expelled or
suspended from schools.
So so there are there moneytalks, but then how?
(24:43):
How much Are you willing tolike?
It's okay to not go toStarbucks, that will hurt, yeah,
but then the big moves that youwant to make, you can't make
because there are laws that areshackled.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Yeah, but even how much?
But how much are you ready toget get comfortable with
discomfort, right?
Yeah, that's the thing.
That's what you're asking rightthere, connie, that's a level.
Yeah, how much are you willingto get?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
uncomfortable.
Can you imagine, in the SilverRights era, when people are like
, nah, I'm not gonna take thebuses, I don't have a car, but
I'll walk the 20 mile, right,like that is the commitment that
you need.
But we don't have thatcommitment because for months,
for years now, our attentionspam has been like shortened by
TikTok, instagram and all ofthese things, and we've been so
(25:26):
like um, programmed, programmedinto being so vain, right Like
and like wanting and thinkingand being so independent
thinkers and like individualthinkers and very like
self-centered.
Mimi, mimi, I, I, I, selfie,selfie and then so then what's
the solution?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
Like what?
What do you guys think are someways that I guess will help,
even if it's one by 1%?
Speaker 2 (25:48):
one get out of this polarized mind state Like it's
not, everything is a politicalstatement.
Yeah, not everything is apolitical statement.
Not everything is, like um, apolitical issue.
Some things, you can cross theboundary.
You can cross the border andlike have the same um, have a
conversation on outside of thepolitical spectrum that you are
(26:09):
in.
So like not don't let yourpolitical stance stand in like
the bigger picture, biggerconflicts that are going on, um
to I feel like no little, nomovement is too little.
No little boycott is too littlebecause it will add up three.
Read Like there was this.
There's this girl on TikTok.
(26:30):
It's so funny Not on TikTokcoming on, and she's on TikTok,
but I follow her on Instagramthat she posts articles every
day for people to read and everyday she repost the same thing
and she's like only two peopleread the whole article.
And there's a saying that ifyou want to hide something from
people, put it in a book.
(26:51):
So read like read, read, readabout from people that you don't
agree with.
Read from people that you agreewith.
Read from people you knowthings that you don't know about
.
So that way you're not easilymanipulated.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yeah, I think for me I would say find a way to build,
foster, you know, community andtalk about difficult stuff and
not being shying away from theconversation, that, even if it
makes you uncomfortable, I thinkit's okay to kind of step back
and say why does this make mefeel uncomfortable, why am I
kind of avoiding theconversation?
And I think, at the end of theday, we are meant to be in
(27:28):
collective environment.
We are built that way as ahuman being and if you, if we
want to kind of dismantle thissystem that has conditioned us
to a certain way, is for us tokind of create in the community
that we can kind of foster thosechallenges, foster those
difficulties that we're having,and not trying to kind of get
comfortable with this level oflife that we're leading.
(27:50):
Kind of maintaining, like whatI just said earlier at the
beginning, is like I don'tremember the first six months of
2023.
It's because, case in point, Iwas just moving like a robot,
like not even taking a step backand try to reflect if
anything's are happening orgetting back in like activism,
for example, like creatingcommunities, and there's a lot
(28:11):
in Minneapolis specifically forus.
It's like we are so comfortablejust sitting and doing the main
thing that we forget to like goto protests, go to volunteer,
our other social justice ofcommunities.
I think those are the thingsthat, plus what Bonnie said,
would kind of help us to get outof this like way of where we
are and even challenge theaspect that humanity's put a
(28:33):
soul, that we have put it on andto say, well, according to this
community, that I've made surethat's part of that.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
I think the conversation piece is like,
really, really important and,like you said, bonnie, kind of
stretching your hand across theaisle and just having
conversations that areuncomfortable For one, it does
expand your horizons and thenthe other person, too, does
expand their horizons.
So, to wrap up, I would justlike to kind of go through what
(29:02):
you guys's hopes are for 2024.
What is one thing that youwould like to achieve?
Like me, I'm kind of late on mywhole 2024 planning.
So I got this.
I don't know if you guys haveseen this like big, huge
calendar.
It's probably been on your feed, I think it's by like Jesse
Seltzer or something like that,but it's like 365 days all laid
(29:25):
out on one big thing, and so,like you see your whole year
plastered, can you send?
Speaker 3 (29:34):
it to me I will, I will.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Mine, I ordered it and it's coming.
But but his big thing is thatlike try to do like little
things, like every two months orso, like try to do like a mini
vacation or like a mini likedisrupt your routine.
So it kind of gets you get toyour mindset out of like the
mundane that you were talkingabout.
Um, yeah, so what is one thingyou would like to do this year?
(30:01):
Like have a big event and if youhaven't thought about it, it's
fine, we can come back to it.
Maybe another episode, but onebig.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
I thought about it and then one little, who has it?
I don't make.
What one thing is that I don'tmake new year's resolution?
I make more like personal umgrowth mindset.
Where I go into this year isjust more about taking a risk on
myself, um, just just taking arisk on and the things that I've
kind of afraid to do.
(30:28):
So give me one of that.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
One thing.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
I want to do a solo traveling.
Okay, I do, and I think that'sthe biggest one Do you have
where I do, but I don't want tosay it?
Okay, and I want to do a solotraveling, regardless what
happened.
And I think I want to get outof that mindset of, I think if
once I break that mold of doingthat one thing, I think that
(30:52):
would be the key to for a lot ofthe things that I want to do
this year.
Okay, bonnie.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
This year I am trying to like.
So I have my year divided upinto mind, body, spirit, and so,
wait, sorry, what did I say?
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Mind, so body, spirit , and I don't know, I forgot
what.
The fourth one is Physical.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Physical, okay.
So I want to be able to, oh,social, social, sorry.
I want to be able to take careof those things.
You know, and I have plans tobe able to take care of those
things and to advance on thosethings and to be better in 2024
than I have been in 2023 and theyears before.
(31:43):
So, like, spirit-wise, like Isaid, I want to be able to get
reconnected with my faith bytaking, like, some study classes
and like reading the O'Reanmoreand like having that programmed
into my schedule and to myday-to-day life.
You know, going to the gym, youknow, like a resolution another
year, another plan, and likeyou know, and doing other things
(32:05):
, doing social things, doingmore, being more active and like
being, you know, having morerelationships.
I've been very I know thismight sound like a whatever, but
I've been an introvert foralmost five years now, like I
had a or we're rubbing off onyou I literally.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I think we're very selective.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Yeah, oh, and her introvertedness.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Yeah, I mean I'm not introverted when it comes to the
people that I already have inmy circle, it's just when it
comes to outside of my.
I'm an ambivert, so but thatleans a little bit towards being
an introvert and I'm trying toget a little bit more out of my
comfort zone and meet new peopleand create new social circles
and, like you know, blah, blah,blah.
So I've kind of divided my yearup into focusing on these two,
(32:55):
four spaces.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Give me one event, one thing.
It could be a big event, itcould be like a small.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
I'm planning on graduating again this year, and
then I'm supposed to oh, let'sstop it all.
Speaker 3 (33:15):
My wife.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
Anyway, and hopefully I will, I won't say this.
I won't say this.
Oh, I'll start some sort ofbusiness.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Inshallah, inshallah.
So I think for me, if I wantthis year to be the year where I
don't limit myself in terms ofyou know, certain plans that I
want to do, whether it'sbusiness or personal, and I want
to kind of not put things upwhere, like, because sometimes,
(33:49):
you know, I feel like you'd makea goal and you're like, oh
really, like, is that reallyrealistic, you know, is that
something really that you can do?
And I want to get out of thatmindset because I feel like, for
a long time, that is what hasheld me back in terms of trying
to achieve certain things andlike I'll start something and
(34:11):
then it won't, like I won'tfinish because I've already kind
of made myself believe that youtalk yourself out of it.
I talk myself out of it right.
So that's one of my biggestthings and, inshallah, I hope to
make a lot of changes in termsof family, business and stuff
like that and kind of just goingon my own.
One big event that I want to dothis year is I want to either
(34:36):
go to Ethiopia, like on a familyvisit in maybe August, and also
I want to do a Umrah in.
December, maybe inshallah.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
That's gonna be amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Both are big milestones, big milestones, but
I feel like it's either one orthe other, so I need to.
Once my calendar comes in, I'llupdate you guys, okay.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Wait, like December, like December 2024?
Yeah, or August 2020.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Why did?
Speaker 2 (35:04):
I just ask that it's January yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
So yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That's amazing.
Thank you for sharing ladies.
That's like incredible ways tohopefully.
Maybe we can do a recap at theend of the year.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
Yeah, check through what happened.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Yeah, and I love that .
We are all very ambitiouspeople individually and very
passionate about our goals, sohopefully that sustains for the
rest of it.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
If you decide to go to Umrah, I might come with you.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Put it on your calendar, All right well thank
you guys for listening to us, asalways.
Please comment on our Instagrampage, send us an email.
We love to always hear from youguys.
What did you think this year?
How did it go for you?
What are some things that youhope to achieve this year?
(35:59):
We're always here, so pleaseupdate us.
Send us an email.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yep.
Assalamu alaikum, wa alaikumsalam, this has been difficult
conversations.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I can't.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Join the conversation in the comment section or on
our social media pages.
We do not have all the answers,and our biggest goal is to kick
off the conversation and get itstarted.
May Allah SWT accept ourefforts and use this for
catalysts of change.
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