April 1, 2025 • 43 mins
A phone call that changes everything. A seemingly impossible challenge. Hours instead of months to prepare. When mezzo-soprano Deborah Humble received that unexpected call from the Sydney Symphony Orchestra, she faced a career-defining decision: step onto the stage of the Sydney Opera House that very evening to perform Gustav Mahler's Second Symphony—a piece she had never fully sung before—or walk away from the opportunity of a lifetime.
What followed was a whirlwind day of frantic preparation, from retrieving a discarded concert dress from a garbage bag in her car trunk to a 45-minute crash course with her vocal coach. With barely enough time to warm up, Deborah found herself standing before a sold-out audience at the Sydney Opera House, performing in a concert that was not only being live-streamed globally but also recorded by Deutsche Grammophon for worldwide release.
The stakes couldn't have been higher. The pressure more intense. Yet amid the chaos, Deborah found clarity in a simple thought: "Simone wouldn't have asked you to step up if she didn't think you could do it." With the support of conductor Simone Young and drawing on decades of professional experience, Deborah delivered a performance that earned her a standing ovation and secured her place in Sydney Opera House history.
This remarkable story transcends the world of classical music, offering powerful insights about preparation meeting opportunity, managing self-doubt, and having the courage to take calculated risks. As Deborah reflects, "We are capable of doing what we have spent our whole lives working towards." Her experience reminds us that behind every "overnight success" lies years of dedication, discipline, and determination—qualities that prepare us to seize extraordinary moments when they unexpectedly arrive.
Ready to be inspired by a tale of remarkable courage under pressure? Listen as Deborah reveals what it truly takes to rise to an impossible occasion when everything is on the line.
Find out more about Deborah Humble on her website.
Listen to the recording here.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Digitally Curious Today, something that
has nothing to do with AI.
It's a tale that sounds like itwas pulled straight from a
Hollywood script, but it's real.
Imagine this You're enjoying aquiet evening with friends,
sipping wine and catching up.
The next morning, your phonerings and within hours, you're
(00:22):
on stage at the Sydney OperaHouse performing Gustav Mahler's
Second Symphony in front of asold-out audience, live-streamed
to the world and recorded for aglobal release.
Oh, and you've never sung thefull piece before.
This is exactly what happenedto mezzo-soprano Deborah Humble
in July 2022.
Her story is one of courageunder pressure, quick thinking
(00:45):
and trusting your instincts wheneverything feels impossible.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
In her, own words, this is madness.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
I had never seen, heard or sung the last part of
the symphony, but she did it,and what followed was an
unforgettable night that becamepart of the history of one of
the world's most iconic venues.
In this episode, deborah takesus behind the scenes of that
whirlwind day, from rummagingthrough a garbage bag for an old
(01:14):
concert dress to navigating thechaos backstage at the Opera
House.
She shares how she overcameself-doubt and leaned into her
years of experience to pull offwhat seemed impossible.
Stay tuned for an inspiringconversation about what it means
to rise to the occasion whenlife throws you into the deep
end.
This is Deborah Humble's Mahlermoment.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
The chief conductor of the Sydney Symphony Orchestra
, simone Young.
She was talking to themezzo-soprano from America and
Michelle's voice alarmed her atthis function.
It was talking to themezzo-soprano from America and
Michelle's voice alarmed her atthis function.
It was hoarse.
She was so alarmed that she washeard to say we need Debbie.
Get me Debbie right now.
My telephone rang how would youlike to sing the mezzo-soprano
(01:59):
solo in Marla tonight?
She said look, there's no timeto explain.
Let me be honest.
It's you or nothing.
It was a day in July 2022 and Iwas up in Brisbane.
And I was up there because in acouple of months time, I was
going to sing the mezzo-sopranosolo in Marla's third symphony
(02:21):
and the conductor, simon Hewitt,had asked me to go up and do a
little bit of pre-publicity andrun through the score with him,
and I was very happy to do thatand doubly delighted because
Simon was a friend of mine and Ihadn't seen him for many years.
We knew each other from beingcontracted at the Hamburg State
(02:43):
Opera.
At the same time, I was acontracted mezzo-soprano
principal and Simon was actuallySimone Young's assistant
conductor and I was veryfriendly with him and his wife
and I had never met theirchildren.
I hadn't seen them for a longtime, so it was a very nice
opportunity to catch up withthem.
So after finishing our tasksfor the day, I went back to
(03:06):
their home and we had a mealtogether and we opened a nice
bottle of wine and such was thegood time that we were having
and the atmosphere that Mariasuggested perhaps we should open
a second bottle of wine and Isaid, absolutely, why not?
I didn't have any concertengagements for at least a
fortnight so I could relax andhave a good time.
(03:30):
But, unbeknownst to me, while Iwas enjoying that second bottle
of wine with my friends, therewas some drama unfolding in
Sydney at the Opera House.
So following the firstperformance of a sold-out run of
Gustav Mahler's Second Symphony, which was to celebrate the
(03:52):
reopening of the Opera Houseconcert hall after a couple of
years of very extensiverenovations, the chief conductor
of the Sydney SymphonyOrchestra, simone Young, was at
a post-concert function and shewas talking to the mezzo-soprano
from America, michelle de Young, and Michelle's voice alarmed
(04:15):
her.
At this function.
It was hoarse and Simone wasvery worried about what tomorrow
would bring, and I later readin a review by Pilkall Day in
the Australian Book Review thatshe was so alarmed that she was
heard to say we need Debbie, getme Debbie right now.
(04:42):
So the next morning my telephonerang and on the other end of
the line was Melissa King.
Melissa is the Director ofArtistic Planning for the Sydney
Symphony Orchestra, a lovelylady, always enthusiastic and
jolly.
And I said hi, melissa.
And she said where are you inthe world, miss Humble?
I said well, I'm in Brisbane,been rehearsing for Mahler 3.
(05:05):
Right, she said lovely.
Well, how would you like to singthe mezzo-soprano solo in
Mahler 2?
And I was so excited becauseI've done Symphony No.3 and I've
done Symphony no 8, and I neverhad the opportunity to do
Symphony No.2 and I thought howwonderful that would be.
(05:27):
And I fully expected her tocome up with a date maybe in
2024, maybe 2025,.
Organisations like thisorganise their planning at least
a couple of years in advance.
So I said I'd love to do that.
And when are you thinking?
So I said I'd love to do that.
And when are you thinking?
(05:47):
And there was a split secondsilence and she said well, how
about tonight?
And my first thought was don'tbe ridiculous.
I thought tonight.
And then I suddenly rememberedthat these performances were
taking place, and the reason Irecord that is because, a couple
of weeks before all of thishappened, simone Young had
(06:08):
chosen me to be one of thesingers involved in the final
acoustic testing at the concerthall, and the mezzo-soprano solo
, which is called Urlicht, wasone of the pieces that she'd
asked me to prepare to sing,along with something, I think,
from the Verdi Requiem andsomething from the Bach Mass in
(06:28):
B minor.
So there was a variety ofthings there, and so, whilst I
was somewhat familiar with thefirst part of Mahler II, I had
never seen, heard or sung thelast part of the symphony.
So unfortunately, there was noway that I could say yes and I
(06:53):
couldn't fulfill Melissa'srequest.
The problem was that Melissawasn't going to take no for an
answer.
She said look, there's no timeto explain, but let me be honest
, it's you or nothing.
(07:13):
Please get on a plane and wewill sort everything else out
when you get here.
So a lot of thoughts are goingthrough my mind, really.
The first and foremost one ishow can you sort out the fact
that I don't know the music?
I mean, I can't sing somethingI don't know in front of a
couple of thousand peopletonight.
(07:34):
That's impossible.
I then thought well, you know, Ihave nothing to wear.
I didn't bring a concert dresswith me on this trip.
I didn't even have a nice pairof shoes.
I had wine last night.
I didn't sleep very well insomebody else's house, could I
even sound good tonight?
(07:55):
So I made all these excuses andshe said look, just get on the
plane.
And then I had a, I guess whatbecame my pivotal thought.
And the pivotal thought wasSimone Young wouldn't have asked
you to step up.
She wouldn't ask you to do thisif she didn't think you could
(08:19):
do it.
And I let that thought sit withme for a couple of minutes and
then I thought well, maybe I cando this.
So I changed the flight and Igot on a plane and, with the
benefit of the technology that'savailable to us these days, I
(08:41):
downloaded the score onto myiPad and a recording of the
music onto my iPhone, and I saton the plane for the best part
of 90 minutes and went throughthe part of the music that I
didn't know, all the time, sortof thinking, maybe, maybe this
is possible.
And when we landed in Sydney,there had been a lady sitting
(09:03):
next to me on the plane and sheasked me what I'd been so
focused on doing throughout thejourney and I said well, it
seems like I'm going to besinging at the opera house
tonight at very, very shortnotice, and so I've been
learning the music.
And she said you're kidding,right?
I said I'm'm not kidding andshe wished me luck and I said to
(09:26):
her well, yeah, I may well needit.
So after I landed, I took ataxi to where my car was parked,
because I had remembered thatin the boot of my car was a
garbage bag full of clothes thatI had recently earmarked for
the op shop.
(09:46):
And I knew that in that bag wasa blue sequined off the peg
concert gown that I didn't likeanymore, wasn't wearing and was
a bit too small for me.
I thought, so I opened the boot, rummaged around, got out that
dress and shoved it in my handluggage.
(10:08):
Then what next?
So I thought well, I better goaround to my coach, and I've got
an hour, the best part of anhour.
She wasn't answering the phone,but she lived nearby and I knew
she'd probably be at home.
So I rushed around there andbreathlessly knocked on the door
.
I opened the door and she saidwhat are you doing here?
(10:30):
You know, our rehearsal, nextrehearsal, next meeting together
is not for a couple of days.
I said, yes, I know, but I needyou to teach me the Mahler two
solos in the next 45 minutes.
And Sharlene is a very calmperson, very in control, very
knowledgeable, very professional, and she was wearing an apron.
(10:52):
She'd obviously been cookingthe dinner.
She wiped her hands on theapron.
She said go into the music room, I'll just go and turn off the
oven.
And we didn't have any time forsmall talk, but we launched
straight into the parts of themusic that I was not familiar
with and we just had time to doeverything through about once
(11:16):
and then it was time to go.
So she called out her husbandand she said I'd like you to
drive Debbie down to the operahouse please.
And I was doing the walk alongthe concourse with wobbly knees.
Really, I remembered the samewalk that I'd done exactly 20
years earlier, when I had donemy debut at the Opera House with
(11:38):
Opera Australia, which was anabsolute dream come true, and I
thought to myself you know,you've learned a lot in 20 years
.
You've done the hard work,you've made the investment and
it's time to do this.
You know you can do this, and Itold myself that the only thing
(12:03):
that was going to get in my waywas doubt, really.
So to cast the doubt aside andjust do the best you can.
And the other thing I thoughtwas you know, perhaps this
doesn't have to be perfect.
I'm a bit of a perfectionist,but you know, people probably
don't expect this to be perfect.
Let's, let's do a good as jobof this, as as as you can.
(12:27):
So once I got into the operahouse, of course things just
took off.
There wasn't much time, it wasmaybe, maybe an hour, and you
know, people were saying here'shair and makeup over there and
here's a black folder and thelibrarian's coming to give you
the music.
And this is your dressing room.
Simone will come and see you ina minute.
What size shoes do you wear?
(12:49):
Because I had no shoes, I justhad sneakers with me and things
took off fairly quickly.
And then a Woolworths bag, agreen Woolworths bag, full of
size 40 shoes, was delivered tomy dressing room and I was
thinking where have these shoescome from?
All black, all sensible.
(13:09):
So it seemed that the ladieschorus had been approached and
anyone with size 40 feet, hadbeen asked to voluntarily put
their shoes in a bag so I couldchoose a pair.
So I kept thinking all throughthe performance there's someone
sitting up there in the choirstalls in stockinged feet
probably.
So I never got to meet the ladywhose shoes I chose, but thank
(13:31):
you very much.
And then someone walked past meand said oh, you know, fantastic
, you're saving the day.
Tonight's an ABC ivy broadcastlive and it's going to be
available throughout the world.
And I'm like what?
I'm sure Melissa didn't tell methat on the telephone this
(13:53):
morning.
Okay, so, yeah, okay, a littlebit of panic setting in then, so
I decided I wouldn't botherwith hair and makeup, I'd do an
extra 15 minutes of warmup andpractice.
And then somebody else walkedpast and said, as if this was no
consequence whatsoever oh, and,by the way, deutsche Grammophon
(14:14):
are recording this live for afuture CD release.
So the situation is gettingmore and more surreal, really,
and I'm thinking well, don'tthink about that, because in
essence, I suppose we're alwaystaught that it doesn't really
matter if one or two people arelistening or if thousands of
people are listening.
You do your best regardless.
(14:35):
And it is what it is.
So Simone came into the dressingroom and she was very
business-like and I realisedthat this is not easy for her
either.
I mean, she's in charge ofsoloists, choir, orchestra.
It's a stressful situation,it's an important situation for
the Sydney Symphony Orchestraand I thought, you know, don't
(14:56):
let her down, it's stressful forher too.
So we went through the musiclittle bits and pieces and we
had a talk through, and then itwas really time.
So I put on this ill-fittingdress that I really didn't like
and the chorus lady's shoes, Iscraped my hair back into a
ponytail, someone put somepowder on my face and I went for
(15:17):
what's actually quite a longwalk up to the stage and I was
yeah, my heart was racing by thetime I got to the side of the
stage and as we walked onto thestage and you know, the audience
were there and I could I smiledat the audience, as you do, and
I could see that there was notone spare seat, and I heard a
(15:40):
voice behind me, which wasSimone, and she said don't panic
, just watch me.
And I thought, okay, yeah,don't panic.
So I walked onto the stage and Isat on the soloist chair that
had been put there for me andthat was on her right-hand side,
and I sat down and I opened thefolder that I'd been given by
(16:00):
the symphony librarian and Iimmediately anticipated a
problem, because I opened themusic to follow, as you do when
you're singing in a symphony oran oratorio, and there was only
my music there.
Now, this was a bit of aproblem because I didn't know
the symphony.
I didn't know, I didn't haveany context, so I didn't know am
(16:21):
I going to be sitting here forfive minutes, 15 minutes, 50
minutes?
I had no idea.
So that's problem number one.
And then I saw a second problem,or anticipated another problem,
and that was that the firstthing I sing in that symphony
starts on an unaccompanied D andI don't have perfect pitch.
(16:43):
So I can't, I can't pull a Dout of midair perfectly.
I can work it out though, ifI've got some context and I know
what key the previous sectionof music finishes in.
But it wasn't there.
So two problems, and at thismoment I'm thinking, oh gosh,
(17:06):
it's just one thing afteranother.
All the time I'm thinking this,I'm aware that thousands of
people are potentially lookingat me, so I'm trying to maintain
a calm demeanour.
Anyway, I heed Simone's adviceand I try not to panic and I
watch her very closely and atsome point and I still can't I
really don't know how long itwas that I sat there.
(17:27):
To be honest, in fact I havevery little recollection of the
performance as a whole, butSimone was conducting and at
some point she made a gesturewhich clearly meant get up now.
So I stood up and then I heardanother whisper and it said
stand on the green cross.
And I knew, of course, fromexperience that that would have
something to do with theplacement of microphones for the
(17:48):
recording.
And I looked down and indeedthere was a very small green
cross taped to the floor.
So I took a little step ontothe green cross and then I heard
silence and thought okay, it'smy turn.
But of course I had no ideawhat this note was that I was
supposed to pluck out of thinair, and I guess it was only a
(18:11):
second, maybe two seconds ofhesitation, and I heard Simone
hum very, very quietly and Ithought, oh, you're my hero.
And I started to sing.
That went quite well, and so,with a heart that was very much
(18:33):
pounding, I sat down at the endof that section and I hesitated
to relax enough to look into theaudience, and just right in
front of me, in about the secondor third row, was somebody I
knew, and he winked at me.
He smiled and gave me a wink,and this little gesture of
encouragement made me feel a lotbetter actually.
(18:54):
And so I sat there and keptwatching carefully, waiting to
discover when the next moment Ishould get up and sing was and
that part was with chorus andwith the soprano soloist, nicole
Carr and I hadn't even had timeto say hello to Nicole before
(19:15):
the show, and I mean it musthave been stressful for her too,
because singers that come in atthe last minute can sometimes
be a bit of a liability, and itmeans you have to concentrate
even harder than perhaps younormally would.
Look, everything went quitewell.
Simone later told me that I'dsung one wrong note, but that it
(19:36):
fitted in with the harmony, sothat should be okay.
I remember thinking, if that'sthe worst thing that's happened
today, then I'm extremely luckyand extremely relieved.
And then she told me I would besinging the next three
performances this week and bytomorrow night she did expect
that one wrong note to becorrected.
And look, the audience jumpedto their feet with appreciation.
(19:59):
The streamers were coming downfrom the ceiling and I suddenly
realised now that that was allover, that I had just become
part of the history of this veryfamous building, that in fact
it was later mentioned in thebroadcast that it was actually
the second most important eventin the building's history, the
(20:20):
first, of course, being theopening of the Opera House when
Joan Sutherland sang.
So it was a really big momentand I tried to be present at
that point and just enjoy theexperience that had happened.
So it was a very big night andI went home.
(20:42):
There was, you know, I didn'tsleep much, adrenaline levels
were very high.
And then people started ringingand messaging from all over the
world and I had another momentof recognition that, okay, this
was a significant event and it'sbeen successful.
I ended up doing four out ofthe five performances.
(21:02):
That's how it unfolded.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
It's a great story and there's a lot of things to
unpick there and every time Ihear it there are new things
that come up.
What struck me when yourecounted the story just then
was that everyone else aroundyou was calm Singing teacher
Simone, your friend in theaudience.
They had incredible faith inwhat you were doing.
Did you at any point questionyour own ability, like I can't
(21:25):
do this?
And if you did, at what pointdid you go?
No, I've got this.
Oh, I absolutely questioned itas soon as I got the phone call.
I can't do this.
And if you did, at what pointdid you go?
No, I've got this.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Oh, I absolutely questioned it.
As soon as I got the phone call, I thought this is madness.
I mean, this is crazy.
I have stepped in at the lastminute for things quite a bit.
It's sort of a tradition inEurope.
They don't have understudies,and so very often you get called
up, so I've done things thatI've never stood in at the last
(21:53):
minute for something that Ididn't know.
Luckily, on this occasion, youcan use the music, and I'm a
pianist as well, and so I'm agood musician and I have the
skill of being able to sightread.
Now, without this skill, none ofwhat I've just told you being
(22:13):
able to sight read Now, withoutthis skill, none of what I've
just told you would have beenremotely possible, in fact.
And so once I had opened thescore and had a look, I knew
that it was possible.
And then I think it's just acase of saying well, you've got
to make a decision, you've madethe decision, you've said yes,
and so from now on, doubt mustbe cast aside in order for this
(22:35):
to work and, let's face it,nerves play a part.
So, in order to be as calm aspossible, you just have to have
self-belief and belief, as yousay in the people around you,
and I was very lucky to haveSimone Young as the conductor.
We've been working together for20 years, so we know each other
well and, like I said, I knewshe wouldn't have asked me if
(22:56):
she didn't think I could do it,but I also knew that if there
was anyone that I wanted by myside for this occasion, then she
was the person and she steppedup to the mark on several
occasions that night and reallyhelped me get there.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
The first time I heard you tell the story, my
corporate mind kicked in and Ithought this is a story that
corporates need to hear, becauseit has all the elements of
teamwork and rehearsal andpreparation and belief.
And Simone obviously is theleader.
She's, in many ways, the coachas well.
She has all of the orchestra,all of the chorus, all of the
soloists at her command.
She's also having to make adecision.
(23:36):
The night before that she hadto replace a player and I'm sure
people out there that arecoaches and knowing to
substitute someone on they haveto understand whether they'll be
able to perform at the samelevel.
So talk me through how Simone'sleadership, not just on the
night but leading up to that,really gave you confidence.
And I love the couple of littlethings you mentioned where she
(23:58):
just whispered watch me and thenshe hummed the note.
Little things like that reallyshow that a leader is just
wanting the best out of theirteam and in this case, the
orchestra and the chorus.
Talk me through how herleadership really impacted your
performance.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Well, in all those ways that you've mentioned.
But also, simone is one of thebest conductors in the world.
So this is a woman, this is aconductor that knows this
repertoire intimately and knowsexactly what she's doing.
She also has a very closerelationship with the Sydney
Symphony Orchestra.
She's their chief conductor.
(24:33):
She works with them severaltimes a year and, don't forget,
the orchestra has never playedthis with me in the solo either,
and so their teamwork wasreally important too.
So I can see when I watch backon the television footage that
they are also watching her andwatching me, and everyone's
(24:54):
trying to make music.
You know, musicians are reallygood at teamwork and trying to
get the best result possible.
So I had every confidence inher, and she knows my work well.
There probably wasn't anybodyelse in the country, to be fair,
who could step into a Mahlersymphony at the last moment.
(25:18):
Who would know it?
Because it's not repertoire.
That's done very often inAustralia, done a lot, a lot in
Europe, but not much inAustralia.
So there was probably sometruth to Melissa's comment to me
earlier in the day, where it'syou or nothing.
So they were kind of desperatetoo, to be honest, and so, yeah,
(25:41):
I was their best bet, and shewas there to support me all the
way.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
So one detail you missed out on the story that I'd
like you to recount is the factthat not one detail you missed
out of the story that I'd likeyou to recount is the fact that
not only were you there the weekbefore in essentially testing
the Opera House's new acousticsfor those on the podcast or
watching this the Opera Housefor many years has had an
inferior sound quality becauseof the way it was built and you
look back on, if you go to theWikipedia entry, you'll
understand why.
The opera and the concert hallswere not perfectly designed for
(26:10):
the type of music that wasperformed.
So I think it was closed fortwo years.
They essentially destroyed theorchestra pit and rebuilt it all
.
So what you're all doing isreally testing the acoustics.
So you had a whole week ofdoing that and you were there
with Simone you did mention.
On the way out you gave acheeky comment.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
I'd been there, I'd sung these excerpts over and
over and over and over.
At the top of the concert hallthere are things that look like
large pink fingernails and theywere the new acoustic
soundboards and they can changeangle and they can also go up
and down.
So we were testing all of that.
As you say, a few rows had beentaken out, the orchestra pit
(26:45):
had been enlarged and, as I say,I know Simone quite well, but I
hadn't seen her for the wholeperiod during COVID.
So it was a kind of a nicereconnection and I was thinking
of that day as a bit like are-audition actually.
Anyway, on the way out she wasvery complimentary and thanked
me for coming and I kind of gaveher a nudge on the arm and
(27:07):
rather cheekily said you know,if you get into any problem with
these performances, just giveme a call.
Of course, I never expectedanything to eventuate and I look
back now and I think, havingsaid that, I should have had
perhaps had a look at the secondhalf of the symphony, but I
didn't.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Well, I think you were prepared for a career in
singing, and certainly workingwith Simone.
If you had your time again, ifyou had an extra week or perhaps
you knew that you were going toperform when you were doing the
rehearsal how would you haveapproached it differently?
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Oh well, I would have learnt the music in advance and
I would have practised.
I'm a bit of an over-preparerbecause I believe that as a
performer it's quite.
You know, I still get quitenervous sometimes singing in
front of you, know thousands ofpeople, and I think the only way
to temper the nerves really isto know your stuff so well that
(28:00):
that is not something that youneed to worry about, and then
you're sort of free, if you like, to worry about anything else
that might go wrong or anythingelse.
I would have prepared,especially had I known that
Deutsche Grammophon, which isthe most famous classical
recording label in the world,was going to be recording the
performance for release.
(28:20):
I mean, it's not ideal to doyour first recording with
Deutsche Grammophon on aone-take live performance on
essentially three hours notice,but they had to approve it,
simone had to approve it, theorchestra had to approve it and
it was approved.
Is it perfect?
No, I listened to it and Ithink, given a bit of time,
(28:44):
could have done that a bitbetter or sounded a bit better,
but it is what it is.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
What do you think people can learn from this
experience?
So I'm a corporate, I'm alawyer, I'm a marketer.
Listening to this, what canthey take away from your
experience?
Speaker 2 (28:58):
That's a really good question because often I think,
what has opera got to do withcorporate or business?
Why are people so interested?
I think there's a lot ofcomparisons we can make and the
first one is preparation.
In our careers we all put inthe hard yards, you know, we all
do the study, we do the 10,000hours, I think, if you like to
become an expert perhaps in ourfields.
(29:20):
But I think it's about a lotmore than just putting in the
work.
I have this formula, I'vealways had this formula, which
was preparation plus opportunityequals success, and I've always
believed in that.
When an opportunity presentsitself, are we ready, and not
just with our field of knowledge, but are we ready mentally, are
(29:44):
we ready to sort of take a leapof faith?
And we can only do that.
We can only step up and dosomething that challenges our
comfort zone, if you like,challenges our idea of what we
normally do, if we actually knowour stuff.
So I think that's one thing.
You know, I looked at that dayin retrospect as sort of like
(30:05):
cashing in on an investment thatI'd made, you know, a really
long-term investment that wasactually finally going to pay
off in a way, because deep down.
I think we all know if we cando something or not.
And then it's just a case of inmy case, you have to do it in
public a case of mentally beingable to control yourself the
(30:31):
nerves, the adrenaline, and I'vehad a lot of practice of that
too.
It's not easy, but it'spossible.
I mean resilience, grit,determination, courage.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
So self-belief, I think, is a really important
thing.
How have you developed yourself-belief?
I mean, it's all very well tosay you're an amazing singer,
you're fantastic, you'veobviously been on these stages,
but how do you keep yourself incheck and just have that
undeniable belief in yourability to literally go on stage
with no notice?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
I think the honest answer is that we all doubt
ourselves really.
I mean, self-belief issometimes an external thing as
well.
We all like to project the factthat we believe in ourselves
and that we're competent andcapable and ready, but deep down
, I think it's human nature tohave doubts and times of
(31:23):
self-reflection.
But again, I think on thisoccasion it was the realization
that other people believed in me.
And if these people really andtruly at the top of their
profession, if they believed inme, then the only person
stopping me from doing thiswould be me not believing in
(31:44):
myself.
And and you know it's time, youknow we're getting to the stage
now, after 30 years in theprofession.
If you can't do it now, whenare you going to be able to do
it really?
So let's just do this.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Being adaptable, I think is important in business,
because things change, marketschange, customers change.
How do you stay resilient, notknowing what's coming next?
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Yeah, look, resilience is something I think
that builds up over many, manyyears.
I mean, the last time we talked, we're in the middle of a
lockdown in 2021.
And I honestly believe that Imay never sing again, and so
this was one of the first jobsback and so, in some respects,
doubly difficult, because Ihadn't really performed for a
(32:29):
couple of years.
You know it was a long timesince I had done anything, let
alone something of this scale,so there was also a bit of that
to overcome.
But I was so excited, really,that things were recovering, a
profession was recovering, thatI think that played a part in my
(32:50):
thought process too, when Ithink about it, because I
thought, imagine, going fromthinking I'm never going to sing
again, the industry is is dead,life as we knew it is over to
come and sing back at yourfavorite venue with your
favorite mentor and conductor inthis rather exceptional
circumstance.
(33:11):
So resilience, yeah, you are thesum of all your experiences bad
and good experiences, and infact, the negative experiences
probably build your resiliencemore, and I've had plenty of
those in my career.
You know there've been plentyof setbacks, plenty of times
where things didn't go as Iwould like them to go and you
(33:33):
know, as an opera singer I'vehad to move around the world.
I've had to learn differentlanguages, lived in different
countries and I think you knowall of that.
It can be a financiallyunstable profession.
All of these things, if youlike, lead to a moment where you
just you know.
Everything led to that.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Corporate's always asking about risk management,
and this story is about riskmanagement from getting that
phone call, initial reactionbeing no, this is insanity.
Through to going to the singingteacher, and I love that she
just said look, I'll just turnthe stove off and let's get on
with this.
Talk me through your own riskmanagement of this opportunity.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Yeah.
Well, the honest answer is, Ididn't really have time to think
about it.
But the truth is, isn't itreally that it didn't have to go
this way?
There was another way thiscould all have gone.
I could have said, well, Icould have said no, and in
retrospect that would have beena great shame.
Well, I could have said no andin retrospect that would have
been a great shame.
Or I could have said yes and itcould have gone badly.
(34:34):
So, deep down again, I think itall comes from the gut.
You know, deep down.
You know, if you say yes, thenyou have to think that you can
pull it off, and that risk haspaid off a hundredfold for me,
really, because that wassuccessful.
I've been asked to do otherthings at short notice.
You know, sometimes there's apart of me that thinks why
(34:54):
didn't you ask me to do it inthe first place?
The Sydney Symphony Orchestraand Simone have employed me
every year since then andcontinue to do so into the
future.
I now have my name on the frontof a recording with the best
classical music label in theworld.
A lot of young people arecoming to me and saying this is
(35:17):
amazing.
How can I improve my skill setso that one day I might be able
to do what you did.
And that's really importantbecause that's part of what I
see as a legacy, if you like.
It's training or helping thenext generation that are coming
through to see that these areall things that can be
(35:39):
achievable.
So, just after that, I don'tteach anymore because I haven't
got time at the moment, but Ihad quite a few students at the
time post-COVID, during COVID,and they started coming to
lessons and the first thing I'ddo was five minutes of sight
reading training with them all,regardless of whether they had
instrumental background or not.
And they're like why are wedoing this?
I said, well, one day you'llfind out.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
So one other thing that I think corporates would
love to hear your view on iscollaboration and trust.
Clearly, this was a real-timecollaboration and you had to
have a lot of trust in a numberof people.
Just walk me through how thatcollaboration panned out and who
you had to trust and what levelof trust you had to invest in
these people.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
Being an opera singer is quite interesting because in
many respects, it's about you.
So in order to learn music, youhave to shut yourself in a
practice room for sometimesmonths at a time and learn the
work, and that has to be donejust by you.
And very often when you get upon stage you know there will be
a review and it will review you.
(36:40):
So it can be often about you,but the essence of making music
is not about just one person,it's about lots of people.
And so on this night I was alsoaware that, whilst everyone was
focused on me and getting methrough this, that I was just a
(37:02):
very, very small cog in thisvery important occasion, and I
thought what a shame it wasreally that all the attention
was on getting me through this.
It was a huge night for theSydney Symphony Orchestra.
It was a huge night for theSydney public the reopening of
their iconic opera house.
(37:23):
A huge night for Simone it wasthe first time that they'd ever
recorded an Australian orchestraand it was the first time that
they'd ever recorded anAustralian orchestra.
And it was the first time thatSimone Young had ever recorded
for Deutsche Grammophon, whichis a huge feather in their cap
and a testament to theirworld-class status and music
making, you know, and alsobefitting of such an event as
(37:45):
this one.
But yeah, it was about so muchmore than me.
But I couldn't have done itwithout, as you say, without
this team of people.
And, let's face it, the bestmusic making comes about when
everyone works together.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
I realised that something was happening when
people kept hitting my websitelooking for your podcast and I
reverse engineered because Iwent to the YouTube.
I did a Google search, foundthe live stream.
I'm watching you from London onthe stage of the Sydney Opera
House performing, but thecredits down there didn't have
you listen.
I thought that's strange.
She's performing but someoneelse is credited.
I wonder what's happened.
(38:21):
And I realized what washappening was people were going
who's Deborah Humble?
Because what led them to thepodcast that we did and what led
them to hit the website waspeople going.
Who is Deborah Humble.
Who is this person that'ssinging instead of another
performer?
So I got a sense, thousands ofmiles away, that something had
happened and slowly you told thestory and I've heard the story
(38:44):
several times now and that's whyI thought this is a story that
we need to capture the fullstory, warts and all and get
some learnings from it.
Because I think corporates needto hear this, that it's also
something they can see.
They've heard the story, theycan see the performance, they
can see that it worked, so thatrehearsal and preparation, trust
, collaboration all comestogether and they can literally
(39:05):
see it happen in the one package.
So I think that's a reallyimportant story.
What have you taken away fromthis?
What will you do differently asa result of this experience?
Speaker 2 (39:15):
No, I don't think I'd do anything differently.
I think.
What it's shown me, though, isthat there's no such thing as an
overnight success.
A lot of people say, oh, you'vebeen so lucky, so I don't
really.
I've never really believed inthe whole luck thing.
Yes, of course, there areopportunities that sometimes
(39:37):
come, that are unexpected, but,as I go back to my formula,
preparation plus opportunityequals success.
No such thing as an overnightsuccess.
We are the result.
We are capable of doing what wehave spent our whole lives
business lives, artistic livesworking towards, and I don't
(40:00):
think there's any shortcut tothat.
You know, lots and lots ofsingers have a very nice voice,
lots and lots of singers havefantastic technique, but, I
think, to be truly successfulwhatever that means to the
individual, of course andsuccess means different things
to different people I think thatit's, it's a package, it's the
(40:24):
sum of all these other things,you know mental resilience,
determination, discipline.
It takes a lot of discipline tosit in a room for six months and
things mental resilience,determination, discipline.
It takes a lot of discipline tosit in a room for six months
and learn 300 pages in a foreignlanguage.
It's kind of isolating too, andthe teamwork doesn't come out
until much later the fun part,if you like.
(40:46):
But yeah, I think we are thesum of many, many, many, many
different skills, so it sort ofshowed me that it had all been
worthwhile.
I wouldn't like to do too manyof these things, I have to say.
I'd still much rather be veryprepared, but I think that
calculated risk can reap resultsif you've done the groundwork.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Now, final thought.
I know that Simone mentioned toyou that you got one note wrong
.
So that aside, Simone, thatnight was your boss.
What was the feedback from theboss the moment you came on
stage?
Speaker 2 (41:24):
Well, the feedback started while we're still on the
stage actually, because, ofcourse, there was standing
ovation for this big event.
As I say, there were coloredstreamers and it was you know it
was.
It was a really momentous endto this highly publicized
concert and Simone turned to meand grasped her hands together
(41:46):
and bowed and it was a very itwas grateful bow.
I could see that she was sayingyou know, thank you very much
for doing this.
You know you've saved the day,you really have saved the day,
You've saved this event, andthank you so much.
It was a gesture that perhapsyou wouldn't normally expect to
(42:08):
receive.
It was a very grateful gestureand at that moment I thought you
know, regardless of how I thinkit went or how I think it
sounds in the future, how Ithink it looks in the future,
I've done something that wasworthwhile and our relationship
is such that I was just veryhappy, that she was happy and
(42:30):
that I'd been able to dosomething for her, for the
orchestra and for the event as awhole.
And, of course, once we got offthe stage, she was right.
Well, you know, I'd like you tofix up that note tomorrow and
then sing the further all therest of the performances please.
So she wouldn't have also askedme to do that if she hadn't
(42:51):
thought it had been okay.
Speaker 1 (42:53):
So in a way that night was an audition for the
other, following three nights.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
I guess so, although I also think they wouldn't have
liked to go through that thenext night with somebody else.
Of course, with a bit of notice, you can start flying people in
from different places, butthere is absolutely no reason
why I shouldn't be singing themezzo solo in Mahler too, given
a bit of preparation, or not?
So, yeah, she was very happy tohave me on.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Final thought what should people take away from
this experience?
Speaker 2 (43:24):
That if you don't let doubt get in the way, you can
achieve anything you want to.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
Deborah Humple.
Thank you again for your time.
Congratulations on yourcontinued success.
Thanks, andrew.
Speaker 3 (43:34):
Thank you for listening to Digitally Curious.
You can find all of ourprevious shows at
digitallycuriousai.
Andrew's new book, digitallyCurious your simple guide to
navigating the future of AI andbeyond, is available at
digitallycuriousai.
You can find out more aboutAndrew and how he helps
(43:56):
corporates become more digitallycurious with keynote speeches
and C-suite workshops atdigitallycuriousai you.
Welcome to Digitally Curious Today, something that
has nothing to do with AI.
It's a tale that sounds like itwas pulled straight from a
Hollywood script, but it's real.
Imagine this You're enjoying aquiet evening with friends,
sipping wine and catching up.
The next morning, your phonerings and within hours, you're
(00:22):
on stage at the Sydney OperaHouse performing Gustav Mahler's
Second Symphony in front of asold-out audience, live-streamed
to the world and recorded for aglobal release.
Oh, and you've never sung thefull piece before.
This is exactly what happenedto mezzo-soprano Deborah Humble
in July 2022.
Her story is one of courageunder pressure, quick thinking
(00:45):
and trusting your instincts wheneverything feels impossible.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
In her, own words, this is madness.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
I had never seen, heard or sung the last part of
the symphony, but she did it,and what followed was an
unforgettable night that becamepart of the history of one of
the world's most iconic venues.
In this episode, deborah takesus behind the scenes of that
whirlwind day, from rummagingthrough a garbage bag for an old
(01:14):
concert dress to navigating thechaos backstage at the Opera
House.
She shares how she overcameself-doubt and leaned into her
years of experience to pull offwhat seemed impossible.
Stay tuned for an inspiringconversation about what it means
to rise to the occasion whenlife throws you into the deep
end.
This is Deborah Humble's Mahlermoment.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
The chief conductor of the Sydney Symphony Orchestra
, simone Young.
She was talking to themezzo-soprano from America and
Michelle's voice alarmed her atthis function.
It was talking to themezzo-soprano from America and
Michelle's voice alarmed her atthis function.
It was hoarse.
She was so alarmed that she washeard to say we need Debbie.
Get me Debbie right now.
My telephone rang how would youlike to sing the mezzo-soprano
(01:59):
solo in Marla tonight?
She said look, there's no timeto explain.
Let me be honest.
It's you or nothing.
It was a day in July 2022 and Iwas up in Brisbane.
And I was up there because in acouple of months time, I was
going to sing the mezzo-sopranosolo in Marla's third symphony
(02:21):
and the conductor, simon Hewitt,had asked me to go up and do a
little bit of pre-publicity andrun through the score with him,
and I was very happy to do thatand doubly delighted because
Simon was a friend of mine and Ihadn't seen him for many years.
We knew each other from beingcontracted at the Hamburg State
(02:43):
Opera.
At the same time, I was acontracted mezzo-soprano
principal and Simon was actuallySimone Young's assistant
conductor and I was veryfriendly with him and his wife
and I had never met theirchildren.
I hadn't seen them for a longtime, so it was a very nice
opportunity to catch up withthem.
So after finishing our tasksfor the day, I went back to
(03:06):
their home and we had a mealtogether and we opened a nice
bottle of wine and such was thegood time that we were having
and the atmosphere that Mariasuggested perhaps we should open
a second bottle of wine and Isaid, absolutely, why not?
I didn't have any concertengagements for at least a
fortnight so I could relax andhave a good time.
(03:30):
But, unbeknownst to me, while Iwas enjoying that second bottle
of wine with my friends, therewas some drama unfolding in
Sydney at the Opera House.
So following the firstperformance of a sold-out run of
Gustav Mahler's Second Symphony, which was to celebrate the
(03:52):
reopening of the Opera Houseconcert hall after a couple of
years of very extensiverenovations, the chief conductor
of the Sydney SymphonyOrchestra, simone Young, was at
a post-concert function and shewas talking to the mezzo-soprano
from America, michelle de Young, and Michelle's voice alarmed
(04:15):
her.
At this function.
It was hoarse and Simone wasvery worried about what tomorrow
would bring, and I later readin a review by Pilkall Day in
the Australian Book Review thatshe was so alarmed that she was
heard to say we need Debbie, getme Debbie right now.
(04:42):
So the next morning my telephonerang and on the other end of
the line was Melissa King.
Melissa is the Director ofArtistic Planning for the Sydney
Symphony Orchestra, a lovelylady, always enthusiastic and
jolly.
And I said hi, melissa.
And she said where are you inthe world, miss Humble?
I said well, I'm in Brisbane,been rehearsing for Mahler 3.
(05:05):
Right, she said lovely.
Well, how would you like to singthe mezzo-soprano solo in
Mahler 2?
And I was so excited becauseI've done Symphony No.3 and I've
done Symphony no 8, and I neverhad the opportunity to do
Symphony No.2 and I thought howwonderful that would be.
(05:27):
And I fully expected her tocome up with a date maybe in
2024, maybe 2025,.
Organisations like thisorganise their planning at least
a couple of years in advance.
So I said I'd love to do that.
And when are you thinking?
So I said I'd love to do that.
And when are you thinking?
(05:47):
And there was a split secondsilence and she said well, how
about tonight?
And my first thought was don'tbe ridiculous.
I thought tonight.
And then I suddenly rememberedthat these performances were
taking place, and the reason Irecord that is because, a couple
of weeks before all of thishappened, simone Young had
(06:08):
chosen me to be one of thesingers involved in the final
acoustic testing at the concerthall, and the mezzo-soprano solo
, which is called Urlicht, wasone of the pieces that she'd
asked me to prepare to sing,along with something, I think,
from the Verdi Requiem andsomething from the Bach Mass in
(06:28):
B minor.
So there was a variety ofthings there, and so, whilst I
was somewhat familiar with thefirst part of Mahler II, I had
never seen, heard or sung thelast part of the symphony.
So unfortunately, there was noway that I could say yes and I
(06:53):
couldn't fulfill Melissa'srequest.
The problem was that Melissawasn't going to take no for an
answer.
She said look, there's no timeto explain, but let me be honest
, it's you or nothing.
(07:13):
Please get on a plane and wewill sort everything else out
when you get here.
So a lot of thoughts are goingthrough my mind, really.
The first and foremost one ishow can you sort out the fact
that I don't know the music?
I mean, I can't sing somethingI don't know in front of a
couple of thousand peopletonight.
(07:34):
That's impossible.
I then thought well, you know, Ihave nothing to wear.
I didn't bring a concert dresswith me on this trip.
I didn't even have a nice pairof shoes.
I had wine last night.
I didn't sleep very well insomebody else's house, could I
even sound good tonight?
(07:55):
So I made all these excuses andshe said look, just get on the
plane.
And then I had a, I guess whatbecame my pivotal thought.
And the pivotal thought wasSimone Young wouldn't have asked
you to step up.
She wouldn't ask you to do thisif she didn't think you could
(08:19):
do it.
And I let that thought sit withme for a couple of minutes and
then I thought well, maybe I cando this.
So I changed the flight and Igot on a plane and, with the
benefit of the technology that'savailable to us these days, I
(08:41):
downloaded the score onto myiPad and a recording of the
music onto my iPhone, and I saton the plane for the best part
of 90 minutes and went throughthe part of the music that I
didn't know, all the time, sortof thinking, maybe, maybe this
is possible.
And when we landed in Sydney,there had been a lady sitting
(09:03):
next to me on the plane and sheasked me what I'd been so
focused on doing throughout thejourney and I said well, it
seems like I'm going to besinging at the opera house
tonight at very, very shortnotice, and so I've been
learning the music.
And she said you're kidding,right?
I said I'm'm not kidding andshe wished me luck and I said to
(09:26):
her well, yeah, I may well needit.
So after I landed, I took ataxi to where my car was parked,
because I had remembered thatin the boot of my car was a
garbage bag full of clothes thatI had recently earmarked for
the op shop.
(09:46):
And I knew that in that bag wasa blue sequined off the peg
concert gown that I didn't likeanymore, wasn't wearing and was
a bit too small for me.
I thought, so I opened the boot, rummaged around, got out that
dress and shoved it in my handluggage.
(10:08):
Then what next?
So I thought well, I better goaround to my coach, and I've got
an hour, the best part of anhour.
She wasn't answering the phone,but she lived nearby and I knew
she'd probably be at home.
So I rushed around there andbreathlessly knocked on the door
.
I opened the door and she saidwhat are you doing here?
(10:30):
You know, our rehearsal, nextrehearsal, next meeting together
is not for a couple of days.
I said, yes, I know, but I needyou to teach me the Mahler two
solos in the next 45 minutes.
And Sharlene is a very calmperson, very in control, very
knowledgeable, very professional, and she was wearing an apron.
(10:52):
She'd obviously been cookingthe dinner.
She wiped her hands on theapron.
She said go into the music room, I'll just go and turn off the
oven.
And we didn't have any time forsmall talk, but we launched
straight into the parts of themusic that I was not familiar
with and we just had time to doeverything through about once
(11:16):
and then it was time to go.
So she called out her husbandand she said I'd like you to
drive Debbie down to the operahouse please.
And I was doing the walk alongthe concourse with wobbly knees.
Really, I remembered the samewalk that I'd done exactly 20
years earlier, when I had donemy debut at the Opera House with
(11:38):
Opera Australia, which was anabsolute dream come true, and I
thought to myself you know,you've learned a lot in 20 years
.
You've done the hard work,you've made the investment and
it's time to do this.
You know you can do this, and Itold myself that the only thing
(12:03):
that was going to get in my waywas doubt, really.
So to cast the doubt aside andjust do the best you can.
And the other thing I thoughtwas you know, perhaps this
doesn't have to be perfect.
I'm a bit of a perfectionist,but you know, people probably
don't expect this to be perfect.
Let's, let's do a good as jobof this, as as as you can.
(12:27):
So once I got into the operahouse, of course things just
took off.
There wasn't much time, it wasmaybe, maybe an hour, and you
know, people were saying here'shair and makeup over there and
here's a black folder and thelibrarian's coming to give you
the music.
And this is your dressing room.
Simone will come and see you ina minute.
What size shoes do you wear?
(12:49):
Because I had no shoes, I justhad sneakers with me and things
took off fairly quickly.
And then a Woolworths bag, agreen Woolworths bag, full of
size 40 shoes, was delivered tomy dressing room and I was
thinking where have these shoescome from?
All black, all sensible.
(13:09):
So it seemed that the ladieschorus had been approached and
anyone with size 40 feet, hadbeen asked to voluntarily put
their shoes in a bag so I couldchoose a pair.
So I kept thinking all throughthe performance there's someone
sitting up there in the choirstalls in stockinged feet
probably.
So I never got to meet the ladywhose shoes I chose, but thank
(13:31):
you very much.
And then someone walked past meand said oh, you know, fantastic
, you're saving the day.
Tonight's an ABC ivy broadcastlive and it's going to be
available throughout the world.
And I'm like what?
I'm sure Melissa didn't tell methat on the telephone this
(13:53):
morning.
Okay, so, yeah, okay, a littlebit of panic setting in then, so
I decided I wouldn't botherwith hair and makeup, I'd do an
extra 15 minutes of warmup andpractice.
And then somebody else walkedpast and said, as if this was no
consequence whatsoever oh, and,by the way, deutsche Grammophon
(14:14):
are recording this live for afuture CD release.
So the situation is gettingmore and more surreal, really,
and I'm thinking well, don'tthink about that, because in
essence, I suppose we're alwaystaught that it doesn't really
matter if one or two people arelistening or if thousands of
people are listening.
You do your best regardless.
(14:35):
And it is what it is.
So Simone came into the dressingroom and she was very
business-like and I realisedthat this is not easy for her
either.
I mean, she's in charge ofsoloists, choir, orchestra.
It's a stressful situation,it's an important situation for
the Sydney Symphony Orchestraand I thought, you know, don't
(14:56):
let her down, it's stressful forher too.
So we went through the musiclittle bits and pieces and we
had a talk through, and then itwas really time.
So I put on this ill-fittingdress that I really didn't like
and the chorus lady's shoes, Iscraped my hair back into a
ponytail, someone put somepowder on my face and I went for
(15:17):
what's actually quite a longwalk up to the stage and I was
yeah, my heart was racing by thetime I got to the side of the
stage and as we walked onto thestage and you know, the audience
were there and I could I smiledat the audience, as you do, and
I could see that there was notone spare seat, and I heard a
(15:40):
voice behind me, which wasSimone, and she said don't panic
, just watch me.
And I thought, okay, yeah,don't panic.
So I walked onto the stage and Isat on the soloist chair that
had been put there for me andthat was on her right-hand side,
and I sat down and I opened thefolder that I'd been given by
(16:00):
the symphony librarian and Iimmediately anticipated a
problem, because I opened themusic to follow, as you do when
you're singing in a symphony oran oratorio, and there was only
my music there.
Now, this was a bit of aproblem because I didn't know
the symphony.
I didn't know, I didn't haveany context, so I didn't know am
(16:21):
I going to be sitting here forfive minutes, 15 minutes, 50
minutes?
I had no idea.
So that's problem number one.
And then I saw a second problem,or anticipated another problem,
and that was that the firstthing I sing in that symphony
starts on an unaccompanied D andI don't have perfect pitch.
(16:43):
So I can't, I can't pull a Dout of midair perfectly.
I can work it out though, ifI've got some context and I know
what key the previous sectionof music finishes in.
But it wasn't there.
So two problems, and at thismoment I'm thinking, oh gosh,
(17:06):
it's just one thing afteranother.
All the time I'm thinking this,I'm aware that thousands of
people are potentially lookingat me, so I'm trying to maintain
a calm demeanour.
Anyway, I heed Simone's adviceand I try not to panic and I
watch her very closely and atsome point and I still can't I
really don't know how long itwas that I sat there.
(17:27):
To be honest, in fact I havevery little recollection of the
performance as a whole, butSimone was conducting and at
some point she made a gesturewhich clearly meant get up now.
So I stood up and then I heardanother whisper and it said
stand on the green cross.
And I knew, of course, fromexperience that that would have
something to do with theplacement of microphones for the
(17:48):
recording.
And I looked down and indeedthere was a very small green
cross taped to the floor.
So I took a little step ontothe green cross and then I heard
silence and thought okay, it'smy turn.
But of course I had no ideawhat this note was that I was
supposed to pluck out of thinair, and I guess it was only a
(18:11):
second, maybe two seconds ofhesitation, and I heard Simone
hum very, very quietly and Ithought, oh, you're my hero.
And I started to sing.
That went quite well, and so,with a heart that was very much
(18:33):
pounding, I sat down at the endof that section and I hesitated
to relax enough to look into theaudience, and just right in
front of me, in about the secondor third row, was somebody I
knew, and he winked at me.
He smiled and gave me a wink,and this little gesture of
encouragement made me feel a lotbetter actually.
(18:54):
And so I sat there and keptwatching carefully, waiting to
discover when the next moment Ishould get up and sing was and
that part was with chorus andwith the soprano soloist, nicole
Carr and I hadn't even had timeto say hello to Nicole before
(19:15):
the show, and I mean it musthave been stressful for her too,
because singers that come in atthe last minute can sometimes
be a bit of a liability, and itmeans you have to concentrate
even harder than perhaps younormally would.
Look, everything went quitewell.
Simone later told me that I'dsung one wrong note, but that it
(19:36):
fitted in with the harmony, sothat should be okay.
I remember thinking, if that'sthe worst thing that's happened
today, then I'm extremely luckyand extremely relieved.
And then she told me I would besinging the next three
performances this week and bytomorrow night she did expect
that one wrong note to becorrected.
And look, the audience jumpedto their feet with appreciation.
(19:59):
The streamers were coming downfrom the ceiling and I suddenly
realised now that that was allover, that I had just become
part of the history of this veryfamous building, that in fact
it was later mentioned in thebroadcast that it was actually
the second most important eventin the building's history, the
(20:20):
first, of course, being theopening of the Opera House when
Joan Sutherland sang.
So it was a really big momentand I tried to be present at
that point and just enjoy theexperience that had happened.
So it was a very big night andI went home.
(20:42):
There was, you know, I didn'tsleep much, adrenaline levels
were very high.
And then people started ringingand messaging from all over the
world and I had another momentof recognition that, okay, this
was a significant event and it'sbeen successful.
I ended up doing four out ofthe five performances.
(21:02):
That's how it unfolded.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
It's a great story and there's a lot of things to
unpick there and every time Ihear it there are new things
that come up.
What struck me when yourecounted the story just then
was that everyone else aroundyou was calm Singing teacher
Simone, your friend in theaudience.
They had incredible faith inwhat you were doing.
Did you at any point questionyour own ability, like I can't
(21:25):
do this?
And if you did, at what pointdid you go?
No, I've got this.
Oh, I absolutely questioned itas soon as I got the phone call.
I can't do this.
And if you did, at what pointdid you go?
No, I've got this.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Oh, I absolutely questioned it.
As soon as I got the phone call, I thought this is madness.
I mean, this is crazy.
I have stepped in at the lastminute for things quite a bit.
It's sort of a tradition inEurope.
They don't have understudies,and so very often you get called
up, so I've done things thatI've never stood in at the last
(21:53):
minute for something that Ididn't know.
Luckily, on this occasion, youcan use the music, and I'm a
pianist as well, and so I'm agood musician and I have the
skill of being able to sightread.
Now, without this skill, none ofwhat I've just told you being
(22:13):
able to sight read Now, withoutthis skill, none of what I've
just told you would have beenremotely possible, in fact.
And so once I had opened thescore and had a look, I knew
that it was possible.
And then I think it's just acase of saying well, you've got
to make a decision, you've madethe decision, you've said yes,
and so from now on, doubt mustbe cast aside in order for this
(22:35):
to work and, let's face it,nerves play a part.
So, in order to be as calm aspossible, you just have to have
self-belief and belief, as yousay in the people around you,
and I was very lucky to haveSimone Young as the conductor.
We've been working together for20 years, so we know each other
well and, like I said, I knewshe wouldn't have asked me if
(22:56):
she didn't think I could do it,but I also knew that if there
was anyone that I wanted by myside for this occasion, then she
was the person and she steppedup to the mark on several
occasions that night and reallyhelped me get there.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
The first time I heard you tell the story, my
corporate mind kicked in and Ithought this is a story that
corporates need to hear, becauseit has all the elements of
teamwork and rehearsal andpreparation and belief.
And Simone obviously is theleader.
She's, in many ways, the coachas well.
She has all of the orchestra,all of the chorus, all of the
soloists at her command.
She's also having to make adecision.
(23:36):
The night before that she hadto replace a player and I'm sure
people out there that arecoaches and knowing to
substitute someone on they haveto understand whether they'll be
able to perform at the samelevel.
So talk me through how Simone'sleadership, not just on the
night but leading up to that,really gave you confidence.
And I love the couple of littlethings you mentioned where she
(23:58):
just whispered watch me and thenshe hummed the note.
Little things like that reallyshow that a leader is just
wanting the best out of theirteam and in this case, the
orchestra and the chorus.
Talk me through how herleadership really impacted your
performance.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Well, in all those ways that you've mentioned.
But also, simone is one of thebest conductors in the world.
So this is a woman, this is aconductor that knows this
repertoire intimately and knowsexactly what she's doing.
She also has a very closerelationship with the Sydney
Symphony Orchestra.
She's their chief conductor.
(24:33):
She works with them severaltimes a year and, don't forget,
the orchestra has never playedthis with me in the solo either,
and so their teamwork wasreally important too.
So I can see when I watch backon the television footage that
they are also watching her andwatching me, and everyone's
(24:54):
trying to make music.
You know, musicians are reallygood at teamwork and trying to
get the best result possible.
So I had every confidence inher, and she knows my work well.
There probably wasn't anybodyelse in the country, to be fair,
who could step into a Mahlersymphony at the last moment.
(25:18):
Who would know it?
Because it's not repertoire.
That's done very often inAustralia, done a lot, a lot in
Europe, but not much inAustralia.
So there was probably sometruth to Melissa's comment to me
earlier in the day, where it'syou or nothing.
So they were kind of desperatetoo, to be honest, and so, yeah,
(25:41):
I was their best bet, and shewas there to support me all the
way.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
So one detail you missed out on the story that I'd
like you to recount is the factthat not one detail you missed
out of the story that I'd likeyou to recount is the fact that
not only were you there the weekbefore in essentially testing
the Opera House's new acousticsfor those on the podcast or
watching this the Opera Housefor many years has had an
inferior sound quality becauseof the way it was built and you
look back on, if you go to theWikipedia entry, you'll
understand why.
The opera and the concert hallswere not perfectly designed for
(26:10):
the type of music that wasperformed.
So I think it was closed fortwo years.
They essentially destroyed theorchestra pit and rebuilt it all
.
So what you're all doing isreally testing the acoustics.
So you had a whole week ofdoing that and you were there
with Simone you did mention.
On the way out you gave acheeky comment.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
I'd been there, I'd sung these excerpts over and
over and over and over.
At the top of the concert hallthere are things that look like
large pink fingernails and theywere the new acoustic
soundboards and they can changeangle and they can also go up
and down.
So we were testing all of that.
As you say, a few rows had beentaken out, the orchestra pit
(26:45):
had been enlarged and, as I say,I know Simone quite well, but I
hadn't seen her for the wholeperiod during COVID.
So it was a kind of a nicereconnection and I was thinking
of that day as a bit like are-audition actually.
Anyway, on the way out she wasvery complimentary and thanked
me for coming and I kind of gaveher a nudge on the arm and
(27:07):
rather cheekily said you know,if you get into any problem with
these performances, just giveme a call.
Of course, I never expectedanything to eventuate and I look
back now and I think, havingsaid that, I should have had
perhaps had a look at the secondhalf of the symphony, but I
didn't.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Well, I think you were prepared for a career in
singing, and certainly workingwith Simone.
If you had your time again, ifyou had an extra week or perhaps
you knew that you were going toperform when you were doing the
rehearsal how would you haveapproached it differently?
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Oh well, I would have learnt the music in advance and
I would have practised.
I'm a bit of an over-preparerbecause I believe that as a
performer it's quite.
You know, I still get quitenervous sometimes singing in
front of you, know thousands ofpeople, and I think the only way
to temper the nerves really isto know your stuff so well that
(28:00):
that is not something that youneed to worry about, and then
you're sort of free, if you like, to worry about anything else
that might go wrong or anythingelse.
I would have prepared,especially had I known that
Deutsche Grammophon, which isthe most famous classical
recording label in the world,was going to be recording the
performance for release.
(28:20):
I mean, it's not ideal to doyour first recording with
Deutsche Grammophon on aone-take live performance on
essentially three hours notice,but they had to approve it,
simone had to approve it, theorchestra had to approve it and
it was approved.
Is it perfect?
No, I listened to it and Ithink, given a bit of time,
(28:44):
could have done that a bitbetter or sounded a bit better,
but it is what it is.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
What do you think people can learn from this
experience?
So I'm a corporate, I'm alawyer, I'm a marketer.
Listening to this, what canthey take away from your
experience?
Speaker 2 (28:58):
That's a really good question because often I think,
what has opera got to do withcorporate or business?
Why are people so interested?
I think there's a lot ofcomparisons we can make and the
first one is preparation.
In our careers we all put inthe hard yards, you know, we all
do the study, we do the 10,000hours, I think, if you like to
become an expert perhaps in ourfields.
(29:20):
But I think it's about a lotmore than just putting in the
work.
I have this formula, I'vealways had this formula, which
was preparation plus opportunityequals success, and I've always
believed in that.
When an opportunity presentsitself, are we ready, and not
just with our field of knowledge, but are we ready mentally, are
(29:44):
we ready to sort of take a leapof faith?
And we can only do that.
We can only step up and dosomething that challenges our
comfort zone, if you like,challenges our idea of what we
normally do, if we actually knowour stuff.
So I think that's one thing.
You know, I looked at that dayin retrospect as sort of like
(30:05):
cashing in on an investment thatI'd made, you know, a really
long-term investment that wasactually finally going to pay
off in a way, because deep down.
I think we all know if we cando something or not.
And then it's just a case of inmy case, you have to do it in
public a case of mentally beingable to control yourself the
(30:31):
nerves, the adrenaline, and I'vehad a lot of practice of that
too.
It's not easy, but it'spossible.
I mean resilience, grit,determination, courage.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
So self-belief, I think, is a really important
thing.
How have you developed yourself-belief?
I mean, it's all very well tosay you're an amazing singer,
you're fantastic, you'veobviously been on these stages,
but how do you keep yourself incheck and just have that
undeniable belief in yourability to literally go on stage
with no notice?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
I think the honest answer is that we all doubt
ourselves really.
I mean, self-belief issometimes an external thing as
well.
We all like to project the factthat we believe in ourselves
and that we're competent andcapable and ready, but deep down
, I think it's human nature tohave doubts and times of
(31:23):
self-reflection.
But again, I think on thisoccasion it was the realization
that other people believed in me.
And if these people really andtruly at the top of their
profession, if they believed inme, then the only person
stopping me from doing thiswould be me not believing in
(31:44):
myself.
And and you know it's time, youknow we're getting to the stage
now, after 30 years in theprofession.
If you can't do it now, whenare you going to be able to do
it really?
So let's just do this.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Being adaptable, I think is important in business,
because things change, marketschange, customers change.
How do you stay resilient, notknowing what's coming next?
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Yeah, look, resilience is something I think
that builds up over many, manyyears.
I mean, the last time we talked, we're in the middle of a
lockdown in 2021.
And I honestly believe that Imay never sing again, and so
this was one of the first jobsback and so, in some respects,
doubly difficult, because Ihadn't really performed for a
(32:29):
couple of years.
You know it was a long timesince I had done anything, let
alone something of this scale,so there was also a bit of that
to overcome.
But I was so excited, really,that things were recovering, a
profession was recovering, thatI think that played a part in my
(32:50):
thought process too, when Ithink about it, because I
thought, imagine, going fromthinking I'm never going to sing
again, the industry is is dead,life as we knew it is over to
come and sing back at yourfavorite venue with your
favorite mentor and conductor inthis rather exceptional
circumstance.
(33:11):
So resilience, yeah, you are thesum of all your experiences bad
and good experiences, and infact, the negative experiences
probably build your resiliencemore, and I've had plenty of
those in my career.
You know there've been plentyof setbacks, plenty of times
where things didn't go as Iwould like them to go and you
(33:33):
know, as an opera singer I'vehad to move around the world.
I've had to learn differentlanguages, lived in different
countries and I think you knowall of that.
It can be a financiallyunstable profession.
All of these things, if youlike, lead to a moment where you
just you know.
Everything led to that.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Corporate's always asking about risk management,
and this story is about riskmanagement from getting that
phone call, initial reactionbeing no, this is insanity.
Through to going to the singingteacher, and I love that she
just said look, I'll just turnthe stove off and let's get on
with this.
Talk me through your own riskmanagement of this opportunity.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Yeah.
Well, the honest answer is, Ididn't really have time to think
about it.
But the truth is, isn't itreally that it didn't have to go
this way?
There was another way thiscould all have gone.
I could have said, well, Icould have said no, and in
retrospect that would have beena great shame.
Well, I could have said no andin retrospect that would have
been a great shame.
Or I could have said yes and itcould have gone badly.
(34:34):
So, deep down again, I think itall comes from the gut.
You know, deep down.
You know, if you say yes, thenyou have to think that you can
pull it off, and that risk haspaid off a hundredfold for me,
really, because that wassuccessful.
I've been asked to do otherthings at short notice.
You know, sometimes there's apart of me that thinks why
(34:54):
didn't you ask me to do it inthe first place?
The Sydney Symphony Orchestraand Simone have employed me
every year since then andcontinue to do so into the
future.
I now have my name on the frontof a recording with the best
classical music label in theworld.
A lot of young people arecoming to me and saying this is
(35:17):
amazing.
How can I improve my skill setso that one day I might be able
to do what you did.
And that's really importantbecause that's part of what I
see as a legacy, if you like.
It's training or helping thenext generation that are coming
through to see that these areall things that can be
(35:39):
achievable.
So, just after that, I don'tteach anymore because I haven't
got time at the moment, but Ihad quite a few students at the
time post-COVID, during COVID,and they started coming to
lessons and the first thing I'ddo was five minutes of sight
reading training with them all,regardless of whether they had
instrumental background or not.
And they're like why are wedoing this?
I said, well, one day you'llfind out.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
So one other thing that I think corporates would
love to hear your view on iscollaboration and trust.
Clearly, this was a real-timecollaboration and you had to
have a lot of trust in a numberof people.
Just walk me through how thatcollaboration panned out and who
you had to trust and what levelof trust you had to invest in
these people.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
Being an opera singer is quite interesting because in
many respects, it's about you.
So in order to learn music, youhave to shut yourself in a
practice room for sometimesmonths at a time and learn the
work, and that has to be donejust by you.
And very often when you get upon stage you know there will be
a review and it will review you.
(36:40):
So it can be often about you,but the essence of making music
is not about just one person,it's about lots of people.
And so on this night I was alsoaware that, whilst everyone was
focused on me and getting methrough this, that I was just a
(37:02):
very, very small cog in thisvery important occasion, and I
thought what a shame it wasreally that all the attention
was on getting me through this.
It was a huge night for theSydney Symphony Orchestra.
It was a huge night for theSydney public the reopening of
their iconic opera house.
(37:23):
A huge night for Simone it wasthe first time that they'd ever
recorded an Australian orchestraand it was the first time that
they'd ever recorded anAustralian orchestra.
And it was the first time thatSimone Young had ever recorded
for Deutsche Grammophon, whichis a huge feather in their cap
and a testament to theirworld-class status and music
making, you know, and alsobefitting of such an event as
(37:45):
this one.
But yeah, it was about so muchmore than me.
But I couldn't have done itwithout, as you say, without
this team of people.
And, let's face it, the bestmusic making comes about when
everyone works together.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
I realised that something was happening when
people kept hitting my websitelooking for your podcast and I
reverse engineered because Iwent to the YouTube.
I did a Google search, foundthe live stream.
I'm watching you from London onthe stage of the Sydney Opera
House performing, but thecredits down there didn't have
you listen.
I thought that's strange.
She's performing but someoneelse is credited.
I wonder what's happened.
(38:21):
And I realized what washappening was people were going
who's Deborah Humble?
Because what led them to thepodcast that we did and what led
them to hit the website waspeople going.
Who is Deborah Humble.
Who is this person that'ssinging instead of another
performer?
So I got a sense, thousands ofmiles away, that something had
happened and slowly you told thestory and I've heard the story
(38:44):
several times now and that's whyI thought this is a story that
we need to capture the fullstory, warts and all and get
some learnings from it.
Because I think corporates needto hear this, that it's also
something they can see.
They've heard the story, theycan see the performance, they
can see that it worked, so thatrehearsal and preparation, trust
, collaboration all comestogether and they can literally
(39:05):
see it happen in the one package.
So I think that's a reallyimportant story.
What have you taken away fromthis?
What will you do differently asa result of this experience?
Speaker 2 (39:15):
No, I don't think I'd do anything differently.
I think.
What it's shown me, though, isthat there's no such thing as an
overnight success.
A lot of people say, oh, you'vebeen so lucky, so I don't
really.
I've never really believed inthe whole luck thing.
Yes, of course, there areopportunities that sometimes
(39:37):
come, that are unexpected, but,as I go back to my formula,
preparation plus opportunityequals success.
No such thing as an overnightsuccess.
We are the result.
We are capable of doing what wehave spent our whole lives
business lives, artistic livesworking towards, and I don't
(40:00):
think there's any shortcut tothat.
You know, lots and lots ofsingers have a very nice voice,
lots and lots of singers havefantastic technique, but, I
think, to be truly successfulwhatever that means to the
individual, of course andsuccess means different things
to different people I think thatit's, it's a package, it's the
(40:24):
sum of all these other things,you know mental resilience,
determination, discipline.
It takes a lot of discipline tosit in a room for six months and
things mental resilience,determination, discipline.
It takes a lot of discipline tosit in a room for six months
and learn 300 pages in a foreignlanguage.
It's kind of isolating too, andthe teamwork doesn't come out
until much later the fun part,if you like.
(40:46):
But yeah, I think we are thesum of many, many, many, many
different skills, so it sort ofshowed me that it had all been
worthwhile.
I wouldn't like to do too manyof these things, I have to say.
I'd still much rather be veryprepared, but I think that
calculated risk can reap resultsif you've done the groundwork.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Now, final thought.
I know that Simone mentioned toyou that you got one note wrong
.
So that aside, Simone, thatnight was your boss.
What was the feedback from theboss the moment you came on
stage?
Speaker 2 (41:24):
Well, the feedback started while we're still on the
stage actually, because, ofcourse, there was standing
ovation for this big event.
As I say, there were coloredstreamers and it was you know it
was.
It was a really momentous endto this highly publicized
concert and Simone turned to meand grasped her hands together
(41:46):
and bowed and it was a very itwas grateful bow.
I could see that she was sayingyou know, thank you very much
for doing this.
You know you've saved the day,you really have saved the day,
You've saved this event, andthank you so much.
It was a gesture that perhapsyou wouldn't normally expect to
(42:08):
receive.
It was a very grateful gestureand at that moment I thought you
know, regardless of how I thinkit went or how I think it
sounds in the future, how Ithink it looks in the future,
I've done something that wasworthwhile and our relationship
is such that I was just veryhappy, that she was happy and
(42:30):
that I'd been able to dosomething for her, for the
orchestra and for the event as awhole.
And, of course, once we got offthe stage, she was right.
Well, you know, I'd like you tofix up that note tomorrow and
then sing the further all therest of the performances please.
So she wouldn't have also askedme to do that if she hadn't
(42:51):
thought it had been okay.
Speaker 1 (42:53):
So in a way that night was an audition for the
other, following three nights.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
I guess so, although I also think they wouldn't have
liked to go through that thenext night with somebody else.
Of course, with a bit of notice, you can start flying people in
from different places, butthere is absolutely no reason
why I shouldn't be singing themezzo solo in Mahler too, given
a bit of preparation, or not?
So, yeah, she was very happy tohave me on.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Final thought what should people take away from
this experience?
Speaker 2 (43:24):
That if you don't let doubt get in the way, you can
achieve anything you want to.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
Deborah Humple.
Thank you again for your time.
Congratulations on yourcontinued success.
Thanks, andrew.
Speaker 3 (43:34):
Thank you for listening to Digitally Curious.
You can find all of ourprevious shows at
digitallycuriousai.
Andrew's new book, digitallyCurious your simple guide to
navigating the future of AI andbeyond, is available at
digitallycuriousai.
You can find out more aboutAndrew and how he helps
(43:56):
corporates become more digitallycurious with keynote speeches
and C-suite workshops atdigitallycuriousai you.
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