Felipe Smith: Manga, Comics, and Storytelling – Part 1

Writer and artist Felipe Smith joins Dave for an in-depth, two-part conversation exploring his career and acclaimed work on MBQ, Peepo Choo, TMNT, and All-New Ghost Rider. They dive into Felipe’s early inspirations growing up in Argentina, including Simon Bisley and Frank Frazetta. Felipe talks his groundbreaking achievement as the first Western artist to create a serialized manga in Japan, the intense demands of life as a mangaka, and the contrasts between U.S. and Japanese comic industries.

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Episode Transcript

(00:08):
Welcome back to Direct Edition, a podcast about nothing and
everything. I'm your host Dave.
Today's interview is going to bea 2 parter.
My guest is Felipe Smith, a longtime comics creator known for in
the States at least for all new ghostwriter Robbie Reyes, Co
creator with Trad Moore also worked on the TMNT animated

(00:30):
series in the early 2000s. But he holds a very special
place in manga history as the first westerner to be published
in Japan on a monthly series which was Pipochu.
He also did MBQ with Tokyo Pop. He's a fantastic artist and a
great guy, somebody that has a lot of things to say about

(00:55):
comics in general, but the mangaside of it.
He also has a podcast with his buddy called Cringe Musume, his
Co host and friend DJ 5 Duck What up Duck, which is great.
Links are in the description below for that.
You're going to learn more aboutthat.
But if you're interested in Japan and what it's like living
there is a gaijin. It's a great podcast, humorous

(01:17):
but also full of great information.
I want to give a special shout out to Wayshack for connecting
me, but when I reached out to Felipe, I told him that we had
actually met at least once, if not twice.
We both lived a bunch of lives and in a previous life when I
was a little more of a partier, I go to LA a lot, and we met at
the Meltdown, which is one of the most historic and storied

(01:40):
comic stories of all time. Shout out to Josh, who used to
work there, a buddy of mine. He definitely introduced us.
And I think also maybe the firsttime I met Felipe, I was
introduced by my buddy Joe Benitez.
So there was a little bit of that history, but we didn't
really get to know each other that well.
So once again, thank you. A special shout out to Wishak

(02:02):
for connecting us, and a specialshout out to Felipe for being a
part of this. This is a long interview.
We talked for about two hours and 10 minutes, and a lot of
great stories were shared by Felipe.
A lot of great insight if you'rea comics creator or if you're
just into interested in what it's like living in Japan.
And that's really one of the reasons why I wanted to speak to

(02:25):
Felipe. I appreciate his comics and his
art. I also appreciate his viewpoints
on those four years that he spent handing in 1218 pages a
week of of artwork for people. Chew.
Unfortunately, this is a long out of print, but if you can
find copies of one of the three volumes, it's it's wild, it's

(02:45):
fun, it's crazy, and it's just it's a delight to read.
Unfortunately, yeah, a lot of a lot of Felipe's work is out of
print. But you can check out all new
ghostwriter Robbie Reyes is a great character and Trad Moore's
art on those first five issues is fantastic.
And Felipe, it's a great storyteller as you'll see here.
So because this is such a long episode, I will not talk any

(03:05):
longer. And I'll let you get to
listening to me and Felipe Smith.
Good morning, everybody. Today's special guest comes a
well from a long journey all theway from Akron, OH around the
world. Now in LA, the creator of MBQ
Pipochu Co, creator of Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider along with

(03:27):
Trad Moore worked in animation on TMNT and also has a he's a
fellow podcaster with his friendDJ 5 Duck with a podcast called
Cringe Musume Musume. You got.
It Felipe Smith. Felipe, how are you?
All right, All right. Happy to be here.
How you doing? Yeah, good.
You know, you know, back when I started writing my list of

(03:51):
interviews I wanted to do, I remember meeting you a long time
ago, and I think I was high, butI still remember it.
I, I wrote your name down. And finally, thanks to John
Waveshack, we got connected and I'm glad to have you as my
guest. So happy to be here.
Yeah, thank you. So I, you know, you're, I have a

(04:12):
little like notes here of your journey of where you've lived
in, in the world. And I know you were born in, in
Akron, OH, but you mostly, you grew up in Buenos Aires, right?
That's right. Yeah.
Like I left Akron when I was 5. My whole family, we moved to
Buenos. It's Argentina.
And then from age 5 to age 18, Idid all my schooling in

(04:33):
Argentina and then came back to the US for college and I went to
Chicago. Right, right in Argentina.
What was your first exposure to American comics?
Was there any? Yeah, at well, I was a late,
late Comer to comics, so I was already around 13 or 14.
I knew comic book characters, but I knew them from the

(04:56):
cartoons. So I knew like, you know, Spider
Man and his amazing friends withFirestar and and Iceman and
then, you know, X-Men. And those I found out, actually
the X-Men I found out about through the Spider Man.
There's one episode where it wasSpider Man was amazing friends.
And then Wolverine was there andyeah, yeah.
And then Juggernaut was the enemy and then they finally get

(05:19):
the helmet off of him. And then so that's how I learned
who the X-Men were. But it was all through cartoons
from the 80s. My first comic was the first
comic that had an impact on me. I remember it, man.
I always mess. It's either Mad Dog or Red Dog.
I think it's Mad Dog. It's Mad Dog.
Yeah, with the. The hockey mask.

(05:40):
And he's got a jersey with the little red dog on it.
So it is Mad Dog. Yeah, but it's a red dog.
And that's why I keep thinking red dog.
OK. And he had camel pants and like.
And then it was a, the comic I saw while I was in Argentina.
Access to American comics was there's not much access to.
Them at all? And, and also comic shops, there

(06:03):
weren't comic shops everywhere. Eventually in high school I
learned that there was one in downtown.
So I would take me like 2 hours to get there, but I'd go there
and and look, you know, and justlook at stuff.
Also because the prices were exorbitant because they were all
imported. So like, you know, it was not.
So I would go there to look at the art because that's the only,
there's no Internet, there's none of that.

(06:23):
So like, if I wanted to look at cool art, comic art and stuff,
I'd have to go there and like, you know, I'd stare at the
covers and I'd kind of like try to memorize it.
So I'd get back home and try to draw what I was looking at is a
whole other thing, right? There's no like, save jpg or
none of that. Right, right.
Save the jpg in here. But I think Mad Dog was the
first comic and I that I really struck me and it was just, it

(06:49):
was just the character who was like a mercenary, you know,
killer just like drops into a building and just takes
everybody out. He's got like 2 Uzis and he's
got like a, like a Rambo knife. And it was all silent, but you
could tell exactly what was going on and like, it was really
like choreographed very nicely. And that really struck me.
I was like, yo, because as a kidmy, my mom was like, comics are

(07:13):
for dumb people, right? She's like, she wouldn't buy me
any comics. She's like, no.
And I would get, you know, illustrated kids books, which
was cool because I think style wise for art, like I kind of had
a different foundation than most, maybe a lot a lot more
comic artists. They kind of they see spider man

(07:33):
or they see something and it's just lights a fire in them that
like kind of lasts their whole trajectory as an artist and it
really informs their style and stuff.
For me. I was looking at a lot of like,
you know, watercolor illustrations and like, you
know, like kind of kids book type stuff.
No no real like action, more like expression and cute stuff

(07:53):
and kind of like funny or or kooky type of art.
Each page is almost like you canit's it's got to be all
storytelling in just that one image.
Exactly. Yeah.
And so then when I saw comics, Ihad a friend who collected them.
I was like, oh, snap. And then it was that.
And then it was the X-Men, and it was the Uncanny X-Men written

(08:16):
by Mick Claremont, maybe Claremont.
Yeah. And the artist was Mark
Silvestri. OK.
It was Mark Silvestri before. He kind of like, he's got a
different style now than he did in the 80s when he was doing
X-Men. He was a lot like looser, kind
of like. And also Rick Leonardi was
another artist. That's right.
Same thing. Uncanny X-Men, they both had

(08:38):
kind of like, they had the anatomy and all the proportions
and stuff of comics, but they also had like a like, kind of
like a loose, like kind of like nice line weight, kind of a
little bit animated, a little bit realistic, like kind of
flowed back and forth in betweenthings.
And I thought that was awesome. And then of course, then I
discovered, you know what a lot of people my age, it was, you

(09:02):
know, it was a bunch of different art styles that I was
like, oh, there's a lot you can do.
So, you know, there was Frank Miller, there was Jim Lee, there
was Todd McFarlane, Rob Liefeld.Like the whole pouch, like
gritting teeth, like lines everywhere, Just giant muscles
and pouches and gigantic machineguns and stuff.

(09:24):
Like all that stuff. Yeah, guns.
That that no human could hold. Yeah, like all that stuff.
I was the right age for all thathype.
Like, it got me. It got me really like, you know,
pumped about comics. And then, of course, you know,
Ninja Turtles, right? Like when I saw the comics, like
I saw I tell my friend, like I, I was lucky to work on the, the

(09:45):
2012 show and I went in doing storyboard revisions and ended
up doing character design for the show for about 3 years.
The show went on for five. But I, I, I, I the our, our, our
show director Cyril Nielli, who basically, you know, hired me on

(10:07):
and everybody else. It was a, it was a show with 106
artists. It was a big, big crew.
It was everything character designers, board artists,
layout, effects, textures, because it was ACG show, you
know, just a lot of different moving parts, you know, modelers
that would model the, the Super like detail, intense, like turns

(10:28):
we would do for the characters. And so, you know, he, I think he
was kind of the perfect guy to run this show.
He grew up with turtles. He grew up working at his
parents's pizza shop. He had a family pizza shop.
Like, I mean, you know, he was in Philly, so close to New York,
like everything. I mean, like, if if you were to
hire a guy to do a show to like pay homage to, like, you know,

(10:52):
all the iterations at that pointthat there had been of Ninja
Turtles and someone who really understood it, a real fan of the
comics, like Cyril Nelly was theguy.
And I learned a lot on that show.
But I I always tell him, like I had the bet that the the
ultimate best scenario for NinjaTurtle discovery as a kid,
because I must have been like 8 or 9 when I discovered, you

(11:14):
know, the cartoon was coming outand then, you know, the live
action movie. And I think I might have even
seen because I was in Argentina,I might have seen the live
action movie before the cartoon or around the same time.
But I love the cartoon. It was goofy and whatever was
for kids, but I was a kid, so I like I thought it was awesome.
And those designs, man, I, I still draw Ninja Turtles and

(11:34):
it's insane. Like it's still like those
shapes and that combination of things is still appealing to me,
You know, at my age now, which is crazy, but I saw it as a kid.
It was the best thing. I just drew that.
That was my life. You know, the toys were awesome.
And then around the time where you get to be like, you know,

(11:54):
that turn 12, you know, you're getting close to being a
teenager. All of a sudden now you're like,
you're too cool for school. You're like, that's for babies,
You know, whatever. And that's when I, I visited my
cousins in the US. It's my first time back in the
US since I was 5. I turned 12.
And I remember that summer because it was, I learned that
there was a Ninja Turtles comic.I had no idea.

(12:17):
And when I saw it, it blew my mind.
My cousin was like, you ever read the comics?
And I'm like, there's comics andthey're like, yeah, he's like
they're all it's, it's like it'sviolent and there's blood and
like, and there's killing and, and it's, it's gritty and dark
and I was like my head was exploding.
And then I saw it. And dude, my favorite Ninja
Turtle was always RAF. And now they all had red

(12:38):
bandanas, which I blew my mind. It was Team RAF, you know, and
I, you know, so now I was in with the comics and like, you
know, and that's when I started getting into comics a lot.
It was also the Ninja Turtle comics, so I drew those that
summer had other highlights. I discovered that there was a
Transformers movie which I did not know about.
Blew my mind. That first scene when those

(12:59):
Autobots get taken out, like right away, like just head
exploded. I found out there was AGI Joe
movie, which I also saw. That's right, I saw Gremlins 2.
I was a big Gremlins, yeah. Gremlins 2 like a fucking movie.
RoboCop. Two same summer total recall.
Yeah. Oh, so this is 80?

(13:20):
9 or 9089. Yeah.
Chucky that come out I saw that movie like again, I saw I mean
to me that was kind of like a brain expanding summer back in
the US and like seeing all thesethings so so yeah, going back to
your original question, which was comics, I totally took it
like. No, but that's great, that

(13:41):
story, all of that. But yeah, Ninja Turtles and then
like X-Men, both the Uncanny with like Silvestri and and
Leonardi, then Jim Lee's Uncanny.
I think it was Uncanny also withJim Lee.
It might have been just. Oh, yeah.
Yeah. No, it was it.
That succession was Ramita Junior, Leonardi Silvestri Lee.

(14:02):
Yeah. OK, and it was still uncanny.
So that and then I can't forget this Simon Bisley.
Simon Bisley kind of like I discovered all these guys, which
for many reasons, they're awesome.
Like, I, I got some, some Todd McFarlane kind of thing also
that like really, you know, kindof put me on the path to certain
things, not just like artistically, but also like

(14:25):
contracts with publishers and those types of things.
I was hearing this stuff from McFarlane when I was like 13.
And man, he was like furious about it.
And that was back when they had like the bullpen, like letters
in the back where people were trashing McFarlane about his
style and like, he doesn't know anatomy, he doesn't know this
blah, blah. And and they would allow that
kind of like. Sure, they let that.

(14:45):
Shit talking now, you know, you'd find that you'd get that,
that kind of, you know, energy in the back of the book.
Sometimes the editors would get angry and they would allow
McFarlane to talk. Yeah, it would be a dialogue
between the editor. And then they would put that out
there because, again, no Internet, none of that stuff.
That was the only place where you could do something like
that. But.
But yeah, once I saw the Ninja Turtles comic and then and then

(15:09):
eventually Bisley and then Bisley and Ninja Turtles.
That's right. I was just, you know, at that
point I was in college and I waslike, like Bisley was my, that
was my artist. Like I saw these other guys and
they were awesome. And then when I saw Bisley and
like his acrylic paintings that the first time I saw him, you
know, back then there was no CG because Toy Story hadn't come

(15:32):
out. So that kind of seeing like CG
generated light refracting, reflecting, like kind of shapes
that kind of look like plastic, but not.
And there's none of that, at least for me until like Toy
Story. But Bisley's paintings were the
closest thing where I'm like, isthis photos of clay, like

(15:54):
figures lit very like, you know,like curious girl, like really
like harshly lit like I'm like, this is a drawing, but like, I
don't see any lines. You know, I didn't know about
painting. Like, I started immediately, I
started wanting to learn how to paint and.
And that was the whole thing. I posted a drawing I found or a
painting, an acrylic painting that I did when I was like 18 or

(16:17):
19. It was a Ninja Turtle painting.
And it was done kind of in a busily style.
I I can shoot it. I can show it to you.
Like, it's. Yeah, Yeah.
Like I hadn't seen this drawing in decades.
And I was. And then it reminded me how much
I was like, all about the biz and like his painting style.
Then I discovered Rosetta. Oh well.

(16:38):
And, and then I was like, oh, because I wanted to learn how to
paint. I went to a workshop, I was 15.
And the guy at the workshop, youknow, he, he basically it was a
workshop that a guy had, he rented out like a studio space.
And then he would have like highschool kids and like adults and
just to kind of a very group of people who wanted to do
different things. So some people wanted to paint,
other people wanted to draw withgraphite, you know, a bunch of

(17:00):
stuff. So he would teach multiple
different kind of like, skills depending on what people wanted.
Yeah. And so I just told them, like,
you know, this, I'm like, I Bisley, This is why I want to do
this. And he was like, oh, OK.
And he's like, do you know aboutFrazetta?
And I'm like, no, who's that? I'm like, I just Bisley right
here. And he's like, I think you'll
like Frazetta. And then he pulled out some art

(17:21):
books. Sure.
And my mind was blown. I'm like, yo, this is what
Bisley's doing. He's like, he's doing his own
version of this. But you know, the layouts, the
whole like, you know, central piece of like someone you know
fighting and then in the bottom you got like things wrapping
around, you got like a big goon or something in the back.
You got a loincloth half naked woman at the feet.

(17:41):
Yeah, it's. A hug in the leg, you know,
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Giant axes and, you know, all
the mounds of, of, of slain enemies at the bottom, you know,
yeah. So that type of stuff really got
me into comics and. That makes sense.
I mean, especially with Bisley coming, you know, on strong in

(18:01):
the late 80s, early 90s, what wewere seeing in America with, you
know, you see the Lobo stuff. But like you said, body count,
you know, with RAF and Casey Jones doesn't look like, I mean,
I always looked at busily thinking like this is what fine
artists look like when they are a gruff dude.
I didn't know he was like this big dude and was always like

(18:24):
kind of like a drunken brawler type human.
But that's what his art reflectsit.
It's almost like a like his he'sa character and this is his art.
How about, you know, what do youthink?
Do you do you find that like artkind of tends to reflect the
artist pretty pretty clearly, like once you get to know him
and stuff? I think certain artists do.

(18:45):
I think some of the artists takeon, you know, when I look at
they take on their influences asmuch as as as they are their own
person, but they are. But then I find, yes, there are
people that really do reflect what they look like and what
their personalities like and howthey carry themselves.
And I don't mean that in a negative way.

(19:06):
I'm like, like you. I, I only know you really from
like friends, but also from likewatching you on your podcast.
But your art style is a lot of who you are, but also you you
gave me a huge piece of insight about 10 minutes ago thinking
about your art style in People Chew.

(19:28):
You said you had to internalize all of the stuff you were seeing
because you didn't buy it. So your imagination took your
style of what you were seeing, and it seems like your
imagination just did the rest ofit, which is.
For people chew. For everything like the way your
art looks like, you're telling me, like you have to memorize
what the stuff looks like, and then you're going home and

(19:49):
drawing it as a kid and your imagination's filling in the
blanks. And that's your style is where
your imagination. And you know what?
Yeah. I didn't mean to cut you off on
it. No, no, no.
I've been thinking about that lately, like.
All right, so a lot of my artistfriends, they have certain
movies or certain animations or whatever that like those are

(20:11):
their like favorite of all time and they'll have like a
mandatory viewing however many times a year.
So, and sometimes it's one time a year, sometimes you know, once
a month or whatever, right? For whatever reason, which I
can't understand, I've thought about it, tried to figure it
out. I there's things that I like and
I for some reason I time capsuled them.

(20:33):
I'm just like, yo, I remember when I was this old and I love
this thing. And I don't know if it's fear of
like not of it not being the same or not how I remember it or
whatever, but I'd never go back.Like there's movies I love.
I just don't, I don't want to watch them.
I mean, like it's not a fear of anything.
Like I, I, I've also invested inlike I've been writing a couple

(20:56):
different series ideas for the last couple of years and usually
I would stick to 1 and just do it.
But this was like these ideas hit me at the same time and I
realized that they're they're different stories.
They're related theme wise, but they're telling different
things. So I had to make them separate
stories. And as I write them, they start

(21:16):
becoming more and more their ownthing because they do have their
differences, even though they started from the same point,
right? Sure.
So that's also kept me very busybecause as a as an artist and
just as a person, like since I was a kid, I just cared about
drawing, getting good at drawing.
And then eventually around the time of MB Qi was like when I

(21:38):
discovered manga and stuff and Isaw that there was thing there
were things that were nothing like American comics that had a
huge audience. I was like, yeah, the first
moment I thought, hey, I can write stories too.
I don't just have to be the person drawing them.
I can come up with ideas about things I want to tell that I can
do. And that's how MBQ, I'd never
seen a comic like MBQ before. You know, those existed in in

(22:02):
the USI mean that I think indie comics.
Well, it's about all. Your stuff, right?
They, you know, they showed you like real, the real life and
surroundings of the artist himself and all these things,
right? And when I saw that, I, I, I saw
it, it was Japan. And so I was like, well, I need
to learn Japanese because this is the industry where they do
that stuff. They tell stories about their
own life. Like I could tell looking at the

(22:23):
comic, this artist has to live in this neighborhood because
it's constantly in the comic. So like, there has to be some
kind of significance to this place, to the artist himself,
other than the story, because the story is just about a
person, right? So, so that's what got me on my,
you know, voyage to learning Japanese.

(22:44):
And you know, and also I'd gone to like like a Wizard World
Chicago. That was like the Comic Con in
Chicago. It's C2E2 now, which I haven't
been to, but I'd like to go. I showed my work, I showed a
bunch of stuff. I looking at it, it was, it was
technically it was proficient already, even though I was
young. Like I can look at it now and
like, you know, it's not you look at your old work, you're

(23:05):
like, that sucks, but you also know what level it's at.
So like, it wasn't like I couldn't publish, but they were
like, Nah, you know, whatever. When I discovered manga, I
started doing stuff already likethat and it wasn't for kids.
It had like, you know, adult themed stuff happening and there
was cursing and cursing. When you wouldn't find cursing
in comics. This is early 2000s.

(23:26):
You just wouldn't. I remember seeing one of the
first comics I saw were cursing in it and dialogue that sounded
like the normal people you wouldencounter on the street was a
Gemma Food comic, which is goingback to like indie.
Right? Like I didn't know that whole
scene even existed. I mean, I didn't even think
anything. I didn't even think there would
be something like that. Like Argentine comics were like

(23:47):
that growing up. They were super just real, just
just filthy. It makes me think too, like I'm
trying to think the first comic that I could think of that had
Sin City maybe and then mainstream, even though it was
indie Walking Dead. And that's, that's early 2000s,
like you said, Right, right, right.

(24:09):
Yeah, and things things changed,sure.
And also like, I guess the thingwith comics for me is because I,
I don't know why I'm making up excuses now.
I guess I didn't, I didn't like grow up with comics and then I
discovered them and then I did that and then just kind of took
it somewhere else, got into animation.
But like, I have my moments where I like, I pop in and out

(24:30):
of comics. Like I don't stay up on what's
going on. Like, you know, where I've got
many friends who do, they're always, no matter when they're
reading some series or they're doing something, I'll pop in,
I'll ask, you know, friends or somebody that I know, like they
understand, like the type of stuff that I'm into.
And they'll, they'll hit me withlike a couple things, you know,
like, oh, check this out. Check this out.

(24:51):
But yeah, the whole indie thing,I had no idea.
And then even like manga in Japan, like, you know, when I
was over there, I was looking atwhat was going on.
I had my things that I liked that I would get at.
Like, you know, there's Mandaraki like a used bookstore
in LA, like I think it was like Torrance or something like that

(25:11):
and that that Japanese friends would drive me down and look for
books there. There was also West LA like the
Sattell area where I used to work at the karaoke.
There was another like Japanese bookstore.
So I would buy like older so they would be from the 90s or
2000s. Like it would be, you know,
maybe probably on average a decade earlier than the time I

(25:34):
was living in when I was gettingthem.
And then I would get, if I'd find a creator that I liked, I
would get, I would start lookingfor more recent stuff.
But, you know, that's kind of what I had.
Then I went to Japan and then I while working, I was seeing what
was going on. But then I came back from Japan
and then kind of like, no more manga.
Like I just kind of like just kind of zip that clothes and

(25:58):
like. RIP the Band-Aid off and never
looked like. Yeah.
So I don't know. I don't know if you've spoken to
any artists that are similar in that way or not.
You know, I, I mean, I feel likeWishak's a little bit like that.
You know, he doesn't read a lot,and then he reads a bunch and
then he reads this and he's reading stuff that's older, but
he's more into manga than than American comics, which, you

(26:20):
know, I completely understand. Yeah, Yeah.
Oh, 100. Percent.
I'm like to talk to Waishak. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, John.
John definitely talks more aboutenjoying manga.
I mean, he was telling me I think recently, like he's still
reading through Slam Dunk and he's still enjoying, you know?
You like the the pacing and thisthe character development.

(26:40):
Yeah, I think the storytelling in manga is such an interesting,
like if we're just balancing it against just a North American
style of storytelling, not even just in comics, but if we're
talking about across the board, manga is such an interesting
thing because, yeah, you pick upa book and it's like you don't
put it down until you're done reading it.
Like, that's it. Like it's hard to put a a

(27:03):
bookmark literally in a manga. Yeah.
So for for those of the those ofmy listeners that don't know
about you, you were the first Westerner to be published doing
a week a monthly manga in Japan.Like you, you went in to to use
the phrase you were in the shit.Yeah, duck in trying to avoid

(27:27):
shrapnel and bullets and everything and and.
You know, the kayfabe interview really covers, I mean, you guys
did almost five hours and, you know, cringe Musume, we'll talk
about that in a little bit. But just I wanted to know, like,
going in and moving to Japan, what was the first, like,

(27:48):
biggest culture shock that took you a while to get used to in
daily life and then also working?
Well, the first thing was just the minute I got out of the
airplane. I've mentioned this before, but
how quiet the airport was. There's thousands of people in
there and it's like a library. And I was like, whoa.

(28:09):
And then I left the airport and wherever I went, it was just
generally way quieter than LA anywhere.
And and then, you know, more andmore things, just everyday life
stuff is very different. The the page.
I guess I'm covering auditory things right now because that's
what I'm thinking of. But like, OK, quiet in the

(28:30):
airport, but then TV is just screaming at you non-stop, like
screaming at you in a high pitched voice, you know, like
just, it's just, it's all like that.
And and it's just that's entertainment.
That's I realized later, like, you know, being Japanese, living

(28:50):
in Japan, we're, you know, just maneuvering Japanese society has
a lot of stresses. And there's a lot that's
expected of you socially as a, as a, as a member of Shakai Jing
or like a member of society in Japan, right?
So. You know, they, they work really
hard. There's a lot of stress.
So like, I, I realize that the way the city looks in Tokyo, the

(29:14):
ways TV and radio sounds, it's all meant to keep you high
energy, like keep you pumped andplugged in and go in and not,
and not getting bummed out aboutanything, but just.
That's why everything's cute andflashy and yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah. It's just a device to keep, to
keep people. Going and stop you from thinking

(29:34):
about the things that are reallyweighing on you.
Yeah, it's and it, you know, andit works.
You know, you go out and drink after work every night and then,
you know, the next morning everybody's going to but, you
know, coffee and just like, you know, and one thing that's a
huge phrase is gamba Tikulasai. Gamba Tikulasai.
There's not like a perfect translation in English, but it's

(29:56):
like it, it, it means try your best.
It means work hard, you know, try hard, you know, you know,
it's also a supportive thing to say, like, OK, you're going to
work hard, you're going to try hard, You're going to do this
thing that's tough. But like we're we're behind you
and that's why we're saying this.
You'll hear it a million times, especially if you're working in

(30:18):
Japan. You're going to hear it multiple
times a day. You know, sometimes if somebody
asks you how you're doing, you just tell them like Gambatiro
Gandhi, Gambati Mas, like, I'm working hard, I'm trying.
That's very, that's something that's like really appreciated
and respected in Japan. And if you're there's a word for
it, Gambadi Hassan. Gambadi Hassan is a person that

(30:39):
always tries hard and always does their best.
And so that's really that's really respected and
appreciated. I think it's a necessity to
appreciate those things in a, ina society that works the way it
does. And, and you know, after World
War 2, like they, the reason they were able to rise so
quickly and, and build everything is because they just

(31:00):
took that attitude. They're like, no, Japan has to,
we need to get our stuff together.
We can't be crying about anything.
We can't be dwelling on any of this stuff.
We got it. We just got to work overtime and
build up and everybody has to doit.
And we'll all have a social contract where we all work hard
non-stop and we celebrate this work ethic.
And then that's how it happened.So being a manga artist in Japan

(31:23):
is pretty much that too. You're a manga artist.
You're not just a manga artist, you're a sensei.
You're a master. You are.
If you're Felipe Smith, the manga artist, you're Smisu
sensei, Right. And I thought, what?
And it's like respected, like people will call you sensei,
like people you just met once they find out you're an artist,

(31:44):
a comic artist. Oh, sensei, you know, that's
yeah, yeah. So it's like, so I thought, wow,
like, you know, that's and it's every person.
Because the other thing is in Japan, everybody understands
manga. Everybody's read manga.
A lot of people never stop reading manga.
It's why it's the biggest comic book industry in the world is

(32:04):
because everybody, it's, it's, it's ingrained in the culture to
read. It's not frowned upon at all.
Not at all. It's normal, it's common.
And The thing is, part of the reason why it's not frowned upon
is because anything you can think of is a genre for comics.
So it could be history, baseball, medicine, drama stuff,
you know? Then all the shonen you can have

(32:26):
all the stuff we have in American comic books, all the
action, adventure and mystery and sci-fi and all that stuff
they have. But then they also have, you
know, manga about a nurse, mangaabout a doctor, not manga about
whatever, an athlete, a race cardriver, a normal person that
doesn't do anything spectacular.They have tons of those.

(32:48):
And those, some of those are themost popular because more
people, I mean, statistically more people can relate to guy
working a clerk job at like at a711 and having, you know, a
relationship problems with the his girl, then an alien that,

(33:08):
you know, shoots lasers out of his eyes and, you know, is
faster than a speeding bullet and whatever.
You know, statistically more people would be like, man, this
is me for one of those books. Yeah, I think that creates a
larger audience because there's those people, a lot of those
people maybe don't care about the the alien that saves
humanity, but they do care aboutthe stuff they're going through

(33:30):
in their life. You know, like I feel like the
girl, like the shojo manga, likethe the girl like romance kind
of comics, which I always found frustrated, frustrating.
When I started learning Japanese, my girlfriend at the
time was Japanese, worked at me at the at the karaoke bar.
She liked Nana and like ParadiseKiss and like all these comics

(33:54):
that are like shojo manga, you know, and they had real like
interesting styles, very stylized really.
You know, these characters were like, you know, like 18 heads
tall, super slender. You know, they have like all
these, you know, every other scene they would be wearing
something different. So I get the appeal of that,
right. But I found these characters to
be so upsettingly, like dumb. And I'll explain what I mean.

(34:20):
Like, they would see a situationwhere I'm thinking, if you're a
reader, you're looking at this character, like, don't do that.
That's stupid. And to me, the interesting
stories were stories where the character somehow pulls
something out of the bag that you couldn't come up with or you
wouldn't expect. And yet that's got you.
And like, you know, a lot of thesin in, like, adult comics that

(34:41):
I read in Japan, they were riddled with things where you're
like, you're not understanding what's going on until you
understand. And that makes them great.
That's great storytelling. It's like if you can have your
reader trust that you're taking them somewhere with an actual
ending and a meaning to what's going on, and then having that
trust you totally throw them fora loop and have them super

(35:04):
confused. That's entertainment.
And then when you get the payoff, then you're like, OK,
this is a creator. I I'm behind this person.
Yeah, I didn't see that. I didn't see that coming.
I didn't see that coming. Yeah, but for this shojo manga
stuff. And, I mean, it might have been
meant for, like, younger girls. I don't know.
But I would read these things. And I'm like, why is this
character so dumb and walking into every trap and falling for

(35:28):
everything that's going to make them suffer?
And I remember asking my girlfriend, and she said, well,
that's kind of the point of these stories.
It's for the reader to not to not feel bad about themselves.
Oh. Shit, I all right, that makes
sense. I mean, look, if there's like a

(35:49):
manga for everybody, there has to be a manga for the idiots.
Yeah, she's like this is these manga are good because and I'll
get into Boys Love manga becauseit's kind of a similar thing.
She said this these mangas, the reader can feel like they know
better than the protagonist and so they can feel like, oh, poor,

(36:11):
you know, noob, they don't know better.
Like I remember I went through that once, but you know, I'm so
it's kind of a different thing. You know, I found that
infuriating because I was like, no, don't they don't go there
stupid, but I think that's kind of the entertainment and that
type of manga the the boys love this thing.
The reason I brought that up is because, again, as a westerner

(36:33):
who hadn't grown up with manga, when I saw boys love and there's
all these dudes, you know, it's,it's this dude romance and
they're kissing and having sex and all this stuff.
My assumption as a know nothing westerner was OK gay guys read
this and I, you know, because it's like, well, it's the
stories about their life and what they find.

(36:54):
No, it's it's straight women. Yeah, Yep.
The most part. That's why there's so much of
it. And I'm like, but then that, you
know, it, it, it, it exploded my, my simple brain because I'm
like, why? How do they see themselves in
this? So I had to ask a Japanese girl
who could give me some information that I needed

(37:14):
because I wasn't understanding this.
And they said no. Like if you're a straight girl,
you like cute handsome guys thatgo to the tea shop and eat their
little Strawberry Shortcake while wearing like some awesome
insert whatever, like designer brand of, of suit jacket and tie

(37:36):
and whatever. Like you get to see like a
really well put together, handsome, tall, broad
shouldered, perfect hair guy. But then there's no girl you're
going to get angry at because she's taking him from it's, it's
just another guy. That's just as all the positive
things I just said about and nowyou get to like, have your cake

(37:57):
and eat it because there's no like.
Woman competing? Yeah, there's no competition
whatsoever. No competition, you just and I
still, I thought, well, I guess I understand, but it still felt
real weird to me. You know, like just mentally
it's like, OK, what? Like what is this?
Well, and there's, you know, there's your cultural

(38:18):
differences, but also what you illustrated here by these kind
of points makes me really sad for American comics even more
because like you hear a lot of American creators or people
criticizing their books because there's too much personality.
I don't want your personality inmy superhero.

(38:40):
And it's like, This is why manga's so successful is because
they're taking things about their personality and throwing
them into a book. 100%. And like you said, you can find
stuff that anything relate to anything cooking.
So I was in Tokyo for the first time last year for three weeks
and absolutely loved it. Going back at the end of this

(39:02):
year, the thing that blew my mind, even though Ed talked
about it and all these people that he brought on, you've
talked about it like I'm on the subway and I grew up in New
York, so I took the subway for along time.
Not just the differences in quiet, but the fact that I'm
mostly taller than everybody on there.
And I look to my left and somebody's on their phone

(39:24):
reading a manga. I look to my right, somebody's
reading a manga. I see a business mind.
I'm just like, this is utopia when it comes to how I view
comics. This is what I would love to
see. You know, everybody in America
just reading comics wherever unabashedly.
But that's unfortunately not thecase.
I mean, this might be a hot take.
I don't think it's a hot take. I just think it's what it is.

(39:45):
Like I think the comics book code where they decided certain
genres are just not they shouldn't be printed because of
kids and whatever and making a, a, an art medium specifically
driven towards 1 demographic, which in this case is children.
Then you cut off the legs of anything else that could happen,

(40:07):
which is what Japan did not do. You know, like the.
Because yeah, I've been seeing also in the news, you know, I
think the big two have been, youknow, in a lot of headlines
where they're like pushing certain ideologies or whatever
through their their staple characters and all this stuff.
So, you know, long time fans arelike, why are you doing
political stuff in in a medium that I enjoy that.

(40:28):
And you know, a lot of people, you know, they want comics
because they want fantasy and kind of like.
Sure, an escape. Escapism.
You know, in a way, right, But you could do all those things,
just you don't have to do them with the superhero.
It's just that because basicallywe're of a majority superhero
industry now, these writers findthat, well, I got to put my my

(40:50):
takes or my ideas. I'm going to have to do them
through this and let me let me find a cool way to do it.
If we had the option of just saying no, you can write.
You can write a story about being whoever you are in
whatever situation you are, and then you have a style that's
appealing and a story that's engaging.
That's it. You don't need capes, you don't

(41:11):
need powers, you don't need anything supernatural.
You know, it's just that the thereadership we have now, which is
I talked to friends in Japan andyou know, Japanese manga artists
and I've told them like, you know, industry wise, you know,
we've got in general, last time I checked at least, it might be

(41:31):
different now, but a series that's has had a good month will
sell. You know, we're talking like, I
don't know, like Batman, X-Men or Spider Man or Walking Dead or
just something that like blows up.
Obviously I'm I'm not current onwhat's going on or I would have
thrown some titles that are would make more sense to the

(41:53):
point I'm trying to get to. But the idea is that a series
that's doing really well, last time I checked they're selling
in that month 100,000 copies about it, like if you.
Throw in 100. If you throw in like, I remember
there was a Star Wars series that came out through Marvel, if
I'm not mistaken, and they had like 100 variant covers from

(42:18):
like industry heavy hitters, notjust like, oh, you know, we've
got this new artist. Let's give him variance by like
everybody. And it was Star Wars with this
huge thing. And so people were buying
multiple copies because they wanted, you know, the, the word
Eminem and they wanted the Paul Pope and they wanted like just
people who just never, you neversee him doing something.

(42:40):
All of a sudden they're doing stuff there.
So people are buying multiple copies.
And I think still, I think with all that and it being Star Wars
and everything, I think it may it, it sold like 250,000 copies
of that number one with all the variants.
So, but we've got a population of like 340 if not more million

(43:00):
people in this country, right? So it's like that.
That's not a significant percentage of people who read
comics. No, you know, not at all.
I mean the literacy. Rate too Japan.
I mean, I remember this just thead alone for people to before it
came out was run on morning weekly.
Yes, people right there. So like I got the the the the

(43:23):
first issue of morning too. I got the actual cover of the
magazine. So which I went nuts because I
went I walked around all of Tokyo, going to every 711 AMP
Austin area and just taking a photo of my cover.
That was that was like when thathappened.
I was like, Yo, I'm like, I'm never going back to the states.
I was like, because who has their cover on everything like

(43:44):
that? Yeah.
And like in every every physicalshop.
You know, not because, not in our lifetimes.
Maybe. Maybe Todd McFarlane might have
been the last person to achieve that.
Yeah, yeah. So like, if if we think about
it, like the first ad for peopleto was put in morning 2, it had
a double page spread, which was awesome.
They really wanted people to check out the book because, you

(44:05):
know, they brought in a foreigner to do it.
Like they, you know, so really fortunate.
I was in a fortunate situation. That AD had to have been seen by
like 3,200,000 people. It's crazy.
Because it's a weekly that it, it lasts all week and it, and
it's, and it's seen, you know, Imean, the readership for those

(44:27):
magazines is in the millions. It's everywhere, those books,
those those weeklies. So you know the series coming
out not 3,000,000, no, no 3,000,000 nothing.
So I'll be but you. But like, that ad is just the
idea that like, there's so many people who tune into something.
Yeah, we don't. We don't have it.
Yeah, we don't have that. I think part of the reason why

(44:49):
is just because we've limited our genres technically, you
know, with Image or any other publisher, you can really, you
can tell whatever story you want.
There is no limit. I don't there, there aren't
editors now who are going to tell you no.
Yeah, they'll let you do it. And maybe if you can't market it
correctly, they'll let you fail because most people aren't even
aware that you there would be a comic that doesn't have a single

(45:13):
punch thrown or, or any kind of action or high stakes something,
you know, 'cause here it's like it's a comic.
It's got to be fantastic and over the top.
I mean, or else why am I doing this, you know?
And the The funny thing is, is the people don't know that
certain movies that have made, you know, a lot of money or, you
know, won awards or been turned into TV shows that aren't

(45:35):
superhero movies are based off comics and that don't have that
flavor to it. You know, you know, road to
Perdition is one that I always think of, you know, which was a
Tom Hanks, a beautiful movie history of violence, which was
made into a Cronenberg movie. You know, like those types of
books that don't have a single superhero, you know, like the

(45:56):
violence is real grounded. But even if, you know, you think
about it, if this country treated comics in the way that
Japan treats manga, the two guysthat would probably be the most
famous people on the planet or in this country would be Los
Bros would be Jaime and and Beto.

(46:17):
Because when you think about it like they're making a comic that
crosses every genre that exists from wrestling to science
fiction to everyday life. And it's like those guys would
be they. Yeah, they would be gods in this
country if they were treated like Manga Koh were.
Yeah. And it makes, it makes me
incredibly sad. But you know I mean.

(46:39):
I I think I, I think it, it, it can, let me put it this way,
like, at least, Yeah. I mean, this is an example right
here. We're doing a video where, you
know, you have no idea who, who can see this.
People have access to it very easily for free.
In terms of what the format willbe like, whether comics will

(47:00):
expand its readership somehow, which because it's also a
cultural thing, I don't know if the US has so much of A reading
culture as Japan. Not.
Anymore, you know, and then in Tokyo specifically, you know,
there's a lot of train, I mean, not just Tokyo, but there's a
lot of train travelling going on.
So it's something to do while you're on the train.
And so it's just become a thing,right?

(47:21):
But people read in general, not just comics.
They'll read more newspapers, magazines and stuff than than
the average American will, whereI think we're more of like ATV
culture. Sure.
And now TV is kind of shifting, you know, like regular, like
kind of like legacy media stuff,whether it's late night talk

(47:41):
shows or like the news or even sitcoms and stuff.
It's kind of it gets changing. It's more online now and it's
more, I wouldn't even say yeah, yeah, podcasts are have been
especially the last couple yearswhere people were like kind of
locked in, you know, it that it made it, it definitely created a
boom. But yeah, I'm wondering comic

(48:04):
wise, like you, you know, you got web comics, you've got, you
can find them everywhere. I wonder what would be like an
impetus to have it like. Blow up again.
'Cause you know, like, like anime, for instance, right?
Like when, when in manga, even when I got into it, this was
like early, like 2001 is when I went into that Japanese

(48:26):
bookstore and I saw the manga section and I was like, what is
this? And then I, I looked through
everything and I saw so many styles that I'd never even seen.
And like the majority of them were not what was reflected on
the anime that America was licensing.
And I'm like, wait a minute, we're we have an idea of what
anime and manga is based on a style that was chosen somehow to

(48:47):
represent something that's way, way wider.
And so like my whole thing whiledoing NBQ was like, yo, manga,
this format is great. And once I saw that format, I
was like, I need to learn this language because it made the
most sense to me to have the pacing be the way it is, to have
stories evolve and keep going for volumes, to have the genres

(49:08):
be as varied as anything in life.
You know, like, that just made sense to me.
Which kind of like, you know, itmade sense for me to learn a new
language and a new culture, especially because, like, over
here, I just felt like I couldn't do what I wanted to do
right. But now I meet people, you know,

(49:28):
I'm at my table at a convention or something.
I'll have a, a cringe musume like QR code, like kind of
sticky thing. And I ask people, you know, are
you interested in Japan? You know, And pretty much
everybody's like, yes, that's mind blowing to me now.
Like they're like, yeah. And I'm like, oh, I got, I do a
I've got a YouTube channel with a buddy of mine.

(49:48):
We talk about Japan, pop culture, manga, anime, music,
everything, you know, relationships, food, like just
in general, my friend. Yeah.
Yakuza, right? Yeah.
And, and it's surprising to me people are like, yeah.
And they just like subscribe to the channel right away.
Whereas like, you know, I, I remember a time when I would
talk about anime or manga and stuff and people were like,

(50:09):
what? My God, I don't know, like
they'd know Dragon Ball, you know, maybe.
And like, they weren't into it. They're like, oh, that's that
cartoon where they just like punch for 5 minutes straight and
like, nothing happens. Like that's kind of how people
saw it. And now, you know, we're talking
20 plus years later, So more popular than ever grew up with

(50:29):
all these animes. They grew up reading manga,
actually reading manga. And so like, I guess the future
I saw happening when I when I when Tokyo Pop was doing their
books and you would go to Barnesand Noble, the border borders,
which one of those is gone? I don't know which ones.
It is Borders, I think Borders is gone.
Yeah, OK. I would walk in and you'd see

(50:52):
all the kids sitting in the manga aisle reading manga.
Yeah. And when I saw that, I'm like,
no, this is what it is. Like.
They're not reading comics, but they are reading this.
I feel like this is where thingsare headed.
And yeah, you know. Well, think, think of all the
things that have been. I mean, for me, I didn't really
get into it like I wanted to. After interviewing Jim Rugg for

(51:16):
the first time, I made a point to like, OK, I'm going to get
into manga. And I, you know, I, I've seen
Akira, you know, that's my exposure as a young person.
And then having friends that were into like Vampire Hunter D,
you know, stuff like that. But nobody put manga in front of
me. And then I picked up the first
two volumes of Dragon Ball, not Z, but Dragon Ball.

(51:37):
And I'm reading Toriyama for thefirst time and I'm like, Oh my
God. Not only is this great from a
cartooning standpoint, it's horny as fuck.
And it's funny, you know, it's like all of these things.
And I'm just like, man, I reallyneed to turn my focus a little
bit harder, right? And, you know, over the last
year and a half, like getting into Danny Warren Johnson stuff

(51:58):
and he's so influenced by by manga and, you know, reading
more Otomo. And then I, I end up there at
the end of last year for three weeks and I'm like, oh, this is
what I've been missing. Like this is what I've been
missing. This whole culture that
celebrates a medium that I have been made fun of for as a kid

(52:20):
for liking. Right.
You know. Yeah, yeah.
It's like it's really striking, right?
Like you're like when you see it.
Yeah. That's that was my moment when I
moved to LA and I went into Mitsuo Market and they had a
book section. I walked in, I saw that that was
it. That changed me.
It changed that that walking through that door like changed

(52:43):
me like it changed my my perception of what like the the
medium was, which I was always into.
Sure. But I'd kind of after art
school, like I went to, I went to the School of the Art
Institute of Chicago, that's that museum school in Chicago.
So like, which is great. Like I could see all this real

(53:03):
fine art like Picasso paintings and Renar and Monet and Degas
and all this stuff. And I'll at the time I was also
learning how to, you know, learning anatomy, figure
drawing, painting, all this stuff.
But all my teachers were like, what you're into is absolute
trash. And it's not art by any means
like that. That's just commercial garbage.

(53:23):
And so like, you know, in my mind, I was like, OK, well, I
understood like I, I, there wereskills that I could learn at
this school, which is what I wasinterested in doing.
I had no idea. There weren't, there weren't
really any trade schools for comics or anything that I knew
about. There was like the Joe Hubert
School for comics. And then SV, like I know

(53:46):
Savannah School of Art and Design has like a sequential art
thing, but like, I don't know ifthey had that even when I went
to college. But I'm like, OK, well, I'm
going to learn how to paint and all this fine art stuff that I
got to learn to pass, but I wantto do comics and, and then after
art school, I was just kind of like, I couldn't get any work.

(54:07):
My fine art degree meant 0 dude to anybody.
And, and I quickly started working at like postal centers
and restaurants and just doing whatever.
And then I'm like, well, what amI going to do with this art?
Comics wasn't a thing. Like I again, I went to the
convention, showed my work and they were like, you know, and

(54:27):
when and when I saw that manga stuff, I'm like, OK, it's this.
And I'm also going to have to like learn another language and
figure this stuff out. Like it.
That's how like hardcore I was about it.
Like I saw that. I'm like, yo, they're doing
comics about like this silly stuff and there's volumes of it,
which means people read it and they're into it.
I'm like, this is this is the market, you know, like I'm

(54:50):
pretty sure I could probably find something I can tell here
that would find an audience. I mean, that might have been me
being naive, but like, you know,I mean it.
Didn't matter, it worked. Lucky.
What's that? It worked.
It doesn't matter if it was naive.
I mean, you're like, you're like, I'm going to trick an
entire culture of people into thinking that it's OK to have a

(55:10):
foreigner do this, and then you did it.
And it's like, oh, Oh, yeah, of course they did it, you know?
I mean. I mean, that's the thing about
this book people chew. It's, you know, you can tell
some of your ideal, the ideas ofbeing a foreigner in a foreign
land is the genesis of this book, obviously, because he's
he's coming over there thinking like, hey, I can, I can speak

(55:33):
Japanese. Right, right.
Yeah. And also just assuming that
because your favorite things in the world come from a certain
place, everybody from that placeappreciates them just as much as
you. Right, which is?
Is not the case. You can find people who do, but
it's funny the the idea for people to I got from being a

(55:58):
guest at an anime convention. Oh really?
Like. Before I even went to Japan or
anything. Yeah, I think it was like anime
Iowa or something. It was like a real small con I
had. I was doing MBQ at the time or
finishing MBQ and they invited me and, and it was in a hotel
and like they had like separate rooms in the hotel where the

(56:19):
convention would happen. And it was great.
Like those small conventions I always pretty much enjoyed
because you know, like it's likea smaller roster of, you know,
guests, you know, it's a little bit more intimate like because
it's kind of people just hangingout and you're just talking to
people and whatever. And like it was cool.
And so there were cosplayers andthings and this is like 2005 ish

(56:43):
or something, right? So cosplay wasn't even what it
is right now where you go. You don't even need to go to an
anime con to see crazy anime cosplay.
You just go to San Diego Comic Con or whatever.
You'll see, you know a lot of it.
But I remember seeing they wouldhave rooms where they would play
like anime. Again, this is pre streaming or

(57:03):
nothing. So it's like they would just
project them on VHS or DVD and people would sit in the room and
watch. They would watch like 3 episodes
of one thing or another. Yeah, 'cause that was the only
way to see it. That was the only.
Way to do it. And it was like people were
pumped and they're just sitting there and cheering.
It was something completely different.
And and I remember seeing peoplein cosplay talking to each other

(57:24):
like having dialogue in Japanese.
And at that time, I already worked at the carrier I had, I'd
already worked at the karaoke for three years.
I spoke Japanese and I understood the excitement of
like liking Japanese stuff and wanting to be able to understand
Japanese and, and do things like, you know, the characters

(57:45):
you see in your favorite thing or whatever.
So I'm seeing these kids do thatand you know, their Japanese was
super weird because it was basedoff of anime.
It was learned from anime. It wasn't real Japanese that
Japanese people use. It had it had all the gestures
and weird stuff from a cartoon, which is confusing because
Japanese people do use some of the gestures that you will see

(58:07):
in anime. They mix.
They mix things like I'll make an example, like people will do
this thing that's a real like forced, that's like a cartoon
weird cartoon thing. But they'll do it.
They'll do, they'll do it like you, they messed up on
something. Ah, go, man, go.
Man, you'll do that. Yeah, Yeah.
So you see that in the cartoon. If you're learning from a
cartoon, you're like, well, I guess they do this because they

(58:29):
show real things. They show real places.
So it's like, oh, OK, it's a realistic depiction.
But then people don't high 5 in Japan.
They don't hug. They don't really even
handshake. They'll bow.
They don't, you know, like if it's a foreigner, they'll
they'll they'll have a handshakebecause they know that's the
thing foreigners do. But in the cartoons you'll see
them do all sorts of stuff like that, high fiving and hugging

(58:51):
their favorite friend or whatever.
So it's got a mix of things thatcan confuse.
If you're purely deducing what Japanese reality is from a
cartoon, you're going to be. It's like learning English from
Mickey Mouse and and Goofy. And you're going.
To sound real weird. And speaking, Hey, what's going
on? Doing that stuff like.

(59:13):
Actually, I speak a lot like JarJar Binks, so I don't know what
you're talking about. I know that's how we do it here,
but when you were signed up, I didn't mean to interrupt, but
when you were saying that, it's almost like if you were to learn
English from music but speak andsong lyrics.
Right. You know, yeah, yes.
It was like I saw that and then I thought, wow, because I

(59:36):
completely understood their excitement and I also understood
that like what they're saying iswrong.
In my end, Japanese wasn't like it wasn't where it is now, but
like I already knew. I knew enough.
I was to to for conversation andyou know, I'm like, wow, that's
just weird. And then it it gave me the idea
for Milton and then, you know, the whole series.

(59:56):
Then, you know, I had Mortimoto Rockstar was the young yakuza
who's the foil of Milton. He's the he's the exact, you
know, it's like the the Japaneseversion of just T cosplays with,
you know, the gang, like West Coast gang violence and.
You know, all that type of stuffwas all those gangster movies

(01:00:17):
and. Yeah, Well, they create, I mean,
rap, especially the West Coast stuff, even though those guys
are going through real stuff, they're all characters.
They were all, you know, rap is full of their.
I mean, I've, I've talked about this with Sanford Green.
It's like rap rappers are superheroes because they they do
kind of have alter egos and theyare characters of themselves.

(01:00:38):
I mean, that's why we love the Wu Tang Clan.
They're amazing. Also, each one of them is a
character. Also, a lot of those, I see it
definitely in the, the East Coast rappers, big fans of, of,
of classic comic characters. Oh yeah, they'll put it in their
lyrics. They'll, you know, they'll
devise it, you know, IMF DOOM, you know, they'll, they'll work

(01:01:00):
it into their persona somehow, or like they'll have it in their
album covers. Yeah, it's part of the, it's
part of their. That's one of the few, I think,
wrestling, pro wrestling, and I'm sure Ed would have agreed
with this, pro wrestling and rap, or one of the few pieces of
American culture that really embraced the superhero comics,
all of that stuff. Right.

(01:01:20):
Yeah, and definitely kept it going and I.
Didn't grow up with either of those growing up in Argentina.
So I discovered that in college because I had buddies who were
into wrestling and were into comics and into rap.
And then like I, you know, and they would play certain songs
for me. And the lyrics were about like,
you know, Fantastic Four, Spiderman or about what they're going

(01:01:43):
to do to you when, when you, when you fight.
And then it's they're bringing out all these like comic book
kind of references and stuff and, and just their monikers,
you know, just using, you know, Johnny Blaze and all these lanes
instead. MF Doom.
Yeah, yeah. So, so yeah, I found that
interesting. And hip hop in general, I found

(01:02:03):
that it just had a lot of elements of like childhood
things. Yeah, they held on to their, you
know, even if it was they were singing about, you know, rough
life that they were living or whatever, they still held on to
that child like innocence that we all kind of hold on to with
the things that we we love or the things that influence us to

(01:02:24):
do what we love. You know what what I found
interesting about people true too.
I mean, like you're, you're yourstyle is there's a lot of
cartooning going on, which makesmore great comics, but you do
things with faces, you contort them.
You make the sweat is very uncomfortable in, in, in in

(01:02:46):
people's shoe. It's and, and I, I, I, I think
from what I know about you, whatwe've talked about is like your
love of cartoons and animation really shines through,
specifically this book, because everything feels like it's
turned up to, to 11, you know, like, you know, like if

(01:03:07):
somebody's in pain, sweat is unbearable and the look on their
face is unbearable. Did you, because I, I, you know,
I'm not a student of manga, but did you get a lot of people like
talking to you about that? Like, oh, this is a little bit
more unique than we're used to in.
Japan where? In Japan, Yeah, Not at all.

(01:03:31):
No, because. No, because there's tons of that
in Japan. There's there's tons of yeah,
like I remember my editor telling me, yeah, this, he
really liked that about my, my style for the story.
And he's like, yeah, like reallylean into that.
Like he's like, this is hilarious.
And I've always liked really expressive stuff.
I mean, that going back to SimonBisley, like, that's one of the

(01:03:53):
things I liked about his work was that it was all like, like
it was just like super veins popping.
Like, oh. Yeah, you don't.
Veins on top of veins. Yeah, veins on top of veins.
A lot of these characters, they're just in flexing poses,
you know, like if you ever seen like Flex Magazine or like Mr.
Olympia type stuff, you know, there's certain like poses that

(01:04:14):
like Busy's characters were likeholding poses.
Like just like they're holding like a gun, but they're really
flexing their biceps. Like it's just they're.
Clenching their asses and they're flexing their biceps.
Yeah, yeah. And like, I mean, that's also in
the 80s and 90s thing like 90s was about it being extreme and

(01:04:36):
stuff like that. I'm, I'm really into that.
I need to get more and back intothat type of stuff.
Like I feel like there's like a like a visceral kind of like
energy to like depicting things in that, in that fashion.
You know, it could be silly sometimes and it's definitely
over the top, but like over the top makes things very clear.

(01:04:56):
It helps with comedy, but also, which is something I I didn't
people chew as well, is when yourein it in and make some a real
quiet moment where things aren'tsuper.
What do you call it? Stylized and then more realistic
and whatever you you feel a difference?
Yeah, the explosion of of the outlandish.

(01:05:18):
Right. So, you know, it's kind of a a
nice trick to kind of like blow things, you know, push things
certain in a certain direction and then draw it back in with
like something very kind of likesubtle or a quiet thing.
And then like that kind of actually impacts you more when
you're used to all this stuff. But yeah, there's a lot of

(01:05:40):
comic, there's a lot of gag comics in Japan.
That's why I wasn't told like, you know, all this is
interesting is because that's like classic Japanese gag comic
stuff like the, the crazy face, eyes popping out, drool and
tears and sweating and all thosethings.
Like I, I always, I've always liked, you know, it's like the

(01:06:03):
Tex Avery cartoon stuff with thewolf with the eyes and the
tongue popping out. You know, it's like that stuff I
always liked as a kid. I think it's effective.
People understand it, you know, they, they get it right away.
It's a real, it's like a cheat. It's an easy way to tell, to
tell someone. Yeah.
And so, you know, if you go the extra mile, then you can, you
know, bring out comedy and kind of devise like a visual language

(01:06:26):
that you're that you and your reader understand.
So then you can, because I thinkin, in general comics is just
how quickly can you get the reader to be on the same page
with you in terms of how you convey meaning.
Like, and a lot of what manga is, is like it's symbols.
It's like very simple, kind of like distilled, you know, like

(01:06:48):
the eyes, like the two things and the, you know, like, you
know, this character is super happy and is enjoying life and
all you needed was like 3 littlethings.
You know, you make a little triangle for the mouth that
they're extra happy. Yeah, yeah.
But it's very simple and it's just, it's like, it's kind of
like the Japanese written language, like Kanji or the
Chinese characters or like it's just there's symbols that mean

(01:07:12):
things. And when you see the symbol,
it's the symbol immediately you have this in your head.
So if you can do that visually with things, it's kind of the
same, you know, I don't know if that makes sense.
It does. And it got me thinking about how
like, as reserved as a society they are, they as an art form,
Japanese really understand how to convey emotion and convey a

(01:07:34):
lot of things that Americans just can't or won't or don't
want to or too afraid to. Because society has told us in
this country that your emotions don't fucking matter, you know?
Yeah, I mean, I think my theory and I'll, I'll bring it back to
what we were talking about. Creators kind of embodying their

(01:07:55):
art or looking like their art orvice versa, their art looking
like them or, you know, so #1 that's what got me into manga
and wanting to learn Japanese was just seeing the the scope of
communication both visually. And then and I assume that like

(01:08:16):
written wise there is going to be just as complementary to like
this crazy, very easy to understand art, right?
And which is the case. And then every artist is
different how they use their written versus their, you know,
drawn storytelling. But because Japan expects so
much of people and you're supposed to behave in a certain

(01:08:38):
way where they're everyone's supposed to behave the same way
for an artist, like manga is very extreme.
It's a, it's a lot of things that are done in manga would be
just be considered taboo social.But in manga, it's fine because
it's a story. And like, in some ways I think

(01:08:59):
about this, right? Like, sometimes you can have a
story that's like, definitely not the norm.
It's kind of out there. It's kind of crazy.
And you're not sure how people will take it, right?
And that might be the first stage of like, self censorship,
which my editor in Japan told me, don't ever do that.

(01:09:20):
But in order not to do that, youhave to trust your editor to
like understand where you're going with stuff and what you're
doing. And so like the relationship
between the edit and artist is pretty, it's pretty deep in a
lot of ways like it. And they kind of they feel you
out and they, and by what I meanby that is like they're trying

(01:09:43):
to figure out who you are and ifit's a good connection and
you're doing a lot of name, likethe thumbnails and stuff that
you don't just say shake hands and have a series you're doing.
You're doing a lot of work with this editor until you until you
become like a well oiled machineor at least close to it.
And then you start, there's a lot of back and forth.
There's tons of meeting meetings.

(01:10:04):
They love meeting. There's meetings.
Anytime they're awake, they wantto do meeting meetings.
And so you're going to have like, you will have an 8 hour
meeting, no problem about your comic, which which I thought was
amazing. And I thought this is like such
a great opportunity. I've never, you know, this is
crazy. And I've had really good
editors. I've, I've been lucky, I've had
the editors I've had on both in the US and in Japan have been

(01:10:28):
like above and beyond, like really invested in, in, in the
work and also invested in me as an artist to try to help me out
and like, show me ways of doing stuff and, you know, great.
Awesome. But in Japan, it did get to a
point where it was like, OK, this editor is so hardcore that,

(01:10:49):
like, I can't keep up. And this is my series and I
can't keep up. Like, that's how hardcore it is
over there. And like, I don't know, I
considered myself someone prettyhardcore myself as an artist,
you know, like willing to just go like the extra mile, do all
this stuff, even, you know, learn another language or
culture moved somewhere else, just was by myself working hard

(01:11:13):
and still, and I might, it mighthave been those things way like
kind of wearing me down all these things.
It takes a lot. But then there, you know, you
got this editor that's just likepractically uncompromising.
That's just like, no, we can make this better.
And it's like, like we can, but like, I am going to die.
Like I need like I need to sleep.

(01:11:34):
I need to, you know, But of course you can't.
I couldn't really even say that because there's thousands of
people doing that. It's just that and on a weekly
basis, not a monthly 1. So it's like, what am I going to
be complaining about here? I should just be quiet and I'm
about to go outside. Try hard, work hard, you know.
All right, thank you for watching that long interview

(01:11:55):
indeed, but full of just great stories and honestly, I'm going
to pat myself on the back. Great conversation.
Not that I did a lot of talking,but Felipe did.
You could check out his YouTube channel Cringe Musume with DJ 5
Duck. Easy to click down below and
just do it or just CRINGMUS, CRINGMUSUME, cringe Musume.

(01:12:23):
You can follow Felipe on socials.
All of that stuff is in the description below.
Just click away. He's not doing any cons for the
rest of the year, but you can definitely see him in San Diego
probably next year and some, youknow, LA stuff.
For my part, if you're new here,please subscribe.
Lots of stuff like this coming around the bend.
I did a lot of Japan videos on my other YouTube channel, West

(01:12:45):
Coast Avengers. But most of the guests that I'm
talking to on this podcast that I know or at least know
peripherally have some connection to Japan.
Daniel Warren Johnson. Scheme.
Richards, Sean. Japan Book.
Hunter Felipe, you know it it there's, there's a lot of that
cross pollination of nations andthat rhymes, even though it

(01:13:06):
probably doesn't make any sense anyway, if you're new here,
please do subscribe. You can rate it on Spotify by
gaming a star rating. You can leave comments on
Spotify. You can rate it on Apple with a
star rating or leave a what you would call it a review on
YouTube. You can hit the like button,
comment all that stuff, share iton your your social network or,

(01:13:28):
you know, send it over to somebody who shared on Reddit,
send it to a bulletin board. Anyway, look, it's been a long
day. Three hours of talking to to
Felipe. Overall, lots of stuff going on
in my head. I'll see you next week on Direct
EDITION.