February 19, 2025 • 53 mins
Ever wondered how turning 40 could be a profound milestone filled with wisdom and unexpected lessons? Join us for an enriching conversation with Melissa Schillingford, a dynamic entrepreneur and business consultant from Hudson Valley, New York. She shares her inspiring journey from a nonprofit career to empowering organizations impacted by the criminal legal system. Melissa opens up about her passion for serving others while balancing a flexible lifestyle, and provides actionable insights into optimizing processes for more impactful work. Her story is a testament to the transformative power of nonprofit work and the significance of maintaining personal fulfillment alongside professional achievements.
Taking a nostalgic walk through Melissa's memories, we uncover how her childhood in East Flatbush and East New York shaped her professional path. From the hustle of her entrepreneurial parents to the cultural shocks of moving to Long Island, these experiences sowed the seeds for her dedication to community work. Growing up with foster siblings and witnessing the dedication of social workers fueled her desire to contribute positively to society. This heartfelt narrative blends cultural nuances and family dynamics, illustrating how early life experiences can influence our careers and aspirations.
Celebrate the unique journey of embracing life at 40, as we explore the twists and turns of managing media influence and cultural expectations in parenthood. Listen to humorous anecdotes and reflective stories about navigating societal pressures and setting boundaries during postpartum recovery. From a surprise birthday in Mexico to the maze of unsolicited parenting advice, we highlight the challenges of balancing personal well-being with societal expectations. Join us as we unpack the societal norms that shape our lives, all while cherishing the rewarding journey of reaching this milestone with grace and wisdom.
Melissa Shillingford - Make Ideas Work
https://makeideaswork.org/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Carlene (00:05):
hi, I'm carlene and this is diva.
Tonight we're doing somethingnew.
This is a series devoted toturning 40, the milestone
birthday, and celebratingeverything it is to be a woman
at 40, you know, like careerdriven mom, all the good things
(00:27):
that come with that milestone.
I think it's that part of lifethat I think you finally are
like, yeah, I get it, I get it.
Now you know what I mean.
Or there's hurdles along theway.
But right across is Melissa,and she is an entrepreneur, a
business consultant, a mom, awife, and she's in New York,
(00:53):
actually Hudson Valley, new Yorkright.
Melissa (00:56):
Yep, that's right.
That's where I currently live.
Yeah, yeah.
Carlene (01:00):
Okay.
So for those who don't know you, I see you worked in nonprofit
for a little bit and then youchanged over.
So what was the deciding factor?
Melissa (01:11):
Honestly, there's a lot of the deciding factor, but
the sole purpose, the underlyinglike common denominator, is
really to serve people.
And I continue to serve peopleas a nonprofit consultant, as an
entrepreneur.
So, yes, so I spent my goodness.
I was working in nonprofitssince, I wanna say since I
(01:34):
started college back in 2001.
And that was my first job and Ialways felt like I had a
purpose to serve people, to giveback.
And so throughout college,throughout graduate school,
after graduate school, Icontinued to work in nonprofits.
But then, more recently, Idecided to pivot because I
(01:55):
needed flexibility, but also Iwanted flexibility in my
lifestyle and flexibility in theway I work with and serve
nonprofits, as opposed to onlyworking with not one
organization.
I want to be able to serve manyat once.
And so this is how I decided todo it Right as a nonprofit
(02:19):
consultant.
Carlene (02:19):
So so nonprofit is like a broad term.
It could be nonprofit in themedical sector, in media, in
radio, like what.
What was your, the sector thatyou worked in?
Melissa (02:37):
So, primarily, my main focus has always been or I
would say for the most part hasbeen in serving people who have
been impacted by the criminallegal system and so providing or
organizing leadership trainings, advocacy trainings that really
help them advocate forthemselves right and help them
(02:58):
advocate for the policy changeand develop their leadership
skills so that they can have animpact in their own communities
in the ways that they felt youknow were necessary.
And so that was the main groupof folks that I served.
I, you know, worked in acollege setting at one point
where I launched fellowshipprograms that helped college
(03:18):
students serve people who wereformerly incarcerated, and then
I also just developedcohort-based programs since then
.
So it's an intersection of likeserving that community and also
developing leadership skillsand providing trainings as well.
So that was a sector that I wasin and currently, through my
business, make Ideas Work.
(03:39):
I help organizations who aredoing like dope work.
I help their staff work smarter, not harder, you know what I'm
saying.
So I provide them with thetraining, the tools and also
consult with them on like howcan we, how can they do the work
more efficiently so that theycan focus on the impact that
they're having, so that they canbuild a relationship, so that
(04:00):
they can, you know, help raisefunds and not be so caught up in
the day-to-day routines thatit's really dropped, that
they're, you know, drowning in,and so I just help them work
efficiently in that way.
Carlene (04:12):
You know that saying work harder, not smarter, I
never really-.
Melissa (04:15):
Work smarter, not harder.
Carlene (04:18):
Yeah, work smarter, not harder.
So I never really understoodthat, but I think in my research
online, youtube is our bestfriend.
It's planning ahead, reallyplanning your day, organization,
which is easier said than done,and so I guess you help people
in that sector organize, planahead and do things in a more
(04:41):
efficient way.
Like you have an eight hour dayand like how do you tackle like
so many things, right, you know?
Melissa (04:48):
Colleen, I never even thought about that Like right
now.
As you said, I was like youknow, like working smarter, not
hard, as a lifestyle.
It really is a lifestyle, as amindset.
I didn't get there.
I wasn't always like that,right, like I learned the hard
way.
I was that person who waitedthe last minute to do things.
I was that person who wouldwake up in the middle of the
(05:10):
night to respond to emails orjust work all day and night.
You know what I'm saying.
And at the same time, I realizedthat it had a personal impact
on me, right.
Like I felt like I wasoperating from a space of
scarcity.
I was always like exhausted Iwas, I didn't.
I was always anxious andstressed out, you know.
(05:31):
And so when I'm like that, thenthe people I work with are like
you know, like what's up withyou, right?
And then when I'm like that,the people in my household are
like what's up with you?
Like what's up with the mommyand what's up with you know, my,
you know my husband's like yo,what's up with you all the time,
you know.
And so when people are like yo,what's going on?
And you're like, well, I'mstressed.
And why am I stressed.
(05:52):
It's because I'm you know,these things are happening to me
.
And so when things werehappening to me, I was like no,
I and I need to make thingshappen right and in a certain
order.
And so once I made that pivotof like I cannot allow things
and people to take up my timeand energy and I need to be in
(06:13):
control of that.
That's when I was like that'sthe strategy of like, how to
reclaim my time, that's how Ireclaim my energy, that's how I
like plan things ahead and thepower in that.
Carlene (06:26):
So, yeah, it's a battle.
I am still procrastinating withcertain things, but I started
watching some more videos and,like you know, baby steps,
because I think in worksometimes I want everything to
be perfect, but there's no suchthing.
And so I think hearing you saythat, like when you're tired and
stressed and you're constantlygoing like everything affects
(06:50):
you, you do things like how youeat and how you sleep, and
everything affects you as aperson and who you want to be
Right, and so it's one of thosethings where I think it's one
day at a time right.
Melissa (07:03):
One of those things where I think it's one day at a
time.
Right, it's one day at a time.
It's also one step at a time,you know, and it's the baby
steps that really matter, andit's the baby steps that really
add up to the major thing youmentioned.
You know, perfection, and I'velike perfection is so overrated.
You're saying it's like yeah,perfection also is one of the
(07:24):
reasons why people, a lot ofpeople, procrastinate, because
it's like oh, I want to learnsome more about this before I do
this, or I want to buy all ofthis in order for me to do that,
you know, and it's like I wantto get it perfect in order for
me to do it.
And I'm like no, let's get thatperfection out of it, because
the only thing that's perfect isGod, you know, and so we cannot
.
We have to really understandlike we are imperfect.
(07:46):
And once we know that and we,once we like really get that,
like the best thing to do islike, just do it.
And then you learn as you do itand you're like oh well, that
didn't work out.
Let me try.
Every failure, every step is a,it's a lesson.
You know this and that's how Isee things, you know, and that's
why so many folks are like howdo you do this and why do you?
(08:07):
You know, like how.
And I'm just like I might bethat risk taker, but I don't
want to spend too much timewishing I had done something.
I just want to like do it, youknow what I'm saying, yeah, and
learn from that and then likepivot and figure it out.
Carlene (08:27):
You know life should be fun Like let's just not worry
about perfection and just do it, right, right, easier said than
done, but to your point, oh mygosh.
You just said just do it, whichis the whole Nike slogan and
everything Right.
Just do it.
It never gets old.
So I always say this toeverybody it's not where you are
, like the path to where you are, like where you are in your
(08:48):
career now.
There's a reason you got here,you took steps to get there.
So where, where did you grow up, melissa?
Melissa (08:55):
My goodness, like there's a lot of things that
people don't know about me, likewhat I am now, right, but the
path to get here, I mean likewhere I grew up.
So I grew up in both Brooklyn,new York, and in Hempstead.
I'm going to say, and this isimportant, is that I grew up,
(09:18):
you know, like my parents arestraight from Haiti.
I grew up as in a household ofa family, of of love and care
and always, always giving.
And the thing then, that's whenI knew that I always wanted to
give to others, right, but also,what's coming to me is when I,
when we lived in Brooklyn and welived in like it was a two
(09:40):
bedroom apartment and it was asix of us I have four, I have
three siblings it was a twobedroom apartment and it was a
six of us.
I have four, I have threesiblings, but in this two
bedroom apartment, there wasnever only the six of us living
in that apartment.
You know, it was my aunt and mygrandmother.
You know there was alwaysextended family that was living
with us, and so my parentsalways opened their doors, like
(10:02):
till this day, you know, butthey always made something out
of nothing, you know, and so weused to live in East Flatbush
and then we moved to East NewYork and this was like I was
excited to live in that areabecause now we live in the
Brownstone in East New York.
The first place I lived in EastFlatbush was an apartment
building right Like maybe sixfloors and we lived on like the
(10:24):
main floor and, yeah, it was anice area.
It was a decent area.
I love the culture because itfelt very comfortable.
It's very diverse, heavy on theCaribbean community, lots of
black and brown folks at thattime.
Now it's very different in thatwhere we live, so anyway, so
that was there and then we movedto East New York.
(10:46):
Now East New York, that areawhere we moved to, is
predominantly Puerto Ricans andDominicans and so we felt like
we were actually the minoritiesthere.
It was different.
And we went.
We moved from an apartmentbuilding to now like a two.
What's it?
A duplex.
Carlene (11:06):
Right, right yeah.
Melissa (11:08):
And we had a backyard, we had our own backyard, you
know.
And the streets, I mean like.
Whenever I think about thistime in my life, I think about
playing double dutch, you know,and tag in the streets, you know
.
Oh, my goodness, I just thinkabout like it was.
So it was too hot to stayindoors.
We didn't have the ACs, so wehad to play outside situation
(11:30):
and everybody on the block cameoutside.
We would go, like to the park.
I think about the people whowere selling the ICs in the
streets, like it was a wholevibe, you know, like I just
that's what I remember.
But also, to bring it back toin terms of like, how I got here
during all of that, somethingthat sticks out in my memory is
seeing my parents.
I remember them making carfresheners how do you call it
(11:56):
Like car fresheners.
Yeah, so they would make themout of like cardboard, right.
So they will find likecardboard boxes.
They would collect cardboardboxes, okay, and they would buy
fabric and then they would addpotpourri to the fabric and then
they would cover all thecardboard and the fabric I mean
the potpourri, yeah, and thenthey will just hang it in the
(12:20):
car and they would sell them forlike $5.
It was like $5 or $2 for $8 orsomething that it's probably
most likely that's what it was,and they were like selling that,
selling that, and I rememberseeing my father in the kitchen
just make them late at nightwith a hot gun and everything.
But that's when I I thinkthat's when I saw like that
(12:40):
hustle, you know, saying it'slike my mother.
She was the one who would work.
My mother worked at a in thehotel industry.
She was a housekeeper.
From as long as I rememberright, she recently retired but
she was a housekeeper.
My father did not work becausehe was physically disabled from
the job.
He was working in the factoriesin New Jersey and then he
(13:03):
became physically disabled, thathouse like.
I remember vividly, like seeingthat, and I feel like I may have
helped my father make some ofthose.
I might be making that part upin my mind, but my spirit is
like I was with him.
Maybe that's my entrepreneurialspirit is like I was with my
dad in the kitchen, like helpinghim with that.
Yeah, and, yeah, and, and thenfrom there we lived there for
(13:25):
three years and then when I was10, we moved out to Hempstead,
long Island.
And when we moved out to LongIsland it was interesting
because the idea for us ingeneral, when you think about at
that time and we're like, oh,we moved to Long Island first of
all, it was a surprise but Ireally thought we like it was
like the Bel Airs, you know,like that's what I thought we
done moved up.
Yeah, really thought we werelike it was like the Bel-Airs,
you know, like that's what Ithought we done moved up.
(13:46):
I thought we were going to allthe things.
And then first day of schoolcame and it was like, oh,
there's, there's no one whitehere.
There's like oh my God, justlike me.
So it was a very it was verydifferent environment, but
Hempstead was cool.
You know that's where I spentmost of my upbringing in
(14:06):
Hempstead.
So that's a little bit about mybackground.
That's where I spent most of mychildhood.
Carlene (14:12):
Oh, ok, yeah, so more of like a visual, but like when
you went to school and you wentto, I guess, college, what did
you study?
Like, what made you get intononprofit?
I mean, obviously it seems likethat entrepreneurial spirit
came from your parents and I canrelate to that too, for sure, I
think, like my dad, my dad's anentrepreneur, so there's always
(14:35):
been that desire to do thingson my own.
I never really followed thepack, so I don't know if you
could relate to that.
I felt like the odd one out andI think as I got older now that
I'm 40, like yourself, Irealize a lot of things, like
the way my brain is wired andthe way I do certain things.
(14:57):
I just felt like I never fitinto what do you call it?
The crowds, like you know whatI mean, like in high school and
stuff.
So I don't know how you feltabout that.
But like working in nonprofit,getting back to that, what led
you to there?
What did you study in school?
Like I mean in college, like Imean honestly like OK.
Melissa (15:17):
So the other thing I took my mention earlier that my
parents always opened up theirhomes and there was always six
of us plus.
I mean, since I was seven, myparents had foster kids in the
house.
So I also had foster siblings,and so I was like, you know,
around this time, I don't know,like folks will always ask, oh,
(15:38):
what do you want to be when yougrow up?
And I don't know, I don't know.
But there will always be acaseworker or a social worker
who will come by just to checkon the children.
And I was like, you know, itseems like a positive thing to
do, right, yeah?
And so I was like that's what Iwant to do, that's what I want
(16:02):
to be, you know, and that's allI knew.
That's what I want to do.
So what I studied in school isnot, honestly, anything.
What I'm doing now.
I didn't know.
And I went to John Jay forundergrad.
I went there and I studieddeviant behavior and social
control and I don't even knowhow I think I got.
(16:23):
I studied that because it waslike psychology, sociology and
anthropology all at once.
I was like, okay, I didn't knowwhat to do you know it's like a
called like undecided majorright.
Yeah, it was something it waslike the most vague thing, the
closest I can get to social work.
I don't, I can't even tell youhow I ended up at John Jay, but
John Jay chose me, I went thereand I ended up there and then
(16:47):
during my junior year, one of myclasses got canceled and the
thing is that it took me twohours to go.
I didn't live on campus, therewas no John Jay's a commuter
school, and so it takes me twohours to get there and two hours
to get back of commuter school,and so it takes me two hours to
get there and two hours to getback.
And so when there's a classthat is canceled, if it's like
during the day, I have to waitaround or do figure something
(17:10):
out, because I can't just, youknow, like go home.
So when it was canceled, Iended up in a program fair, like
there was a fair that washappening on campus Let me go
check it out by happenstance.
And then I came across thisprogram that would prepare
undergraduate students forgraduate program for not even
graduate program, let me take astab at for PhDs, ok, and I was
(17:33):
just like what now?
Huh, I was like that's a thing,and I didn't even saw that as
an opportunity to like considerwhat's next.
I wasn't even thinking about,like I was thinking about,
what's next, but it reallyenlightened me to explore beyond
what I was thinking at thattime.
And so I went through thisprogram called the McNair
(17:56):
Scholars Program and changed mylife.
But I ended up actually stayingat John Jay for an extra
semester because I needed tocomplete some for that program.
But because of that program Iwas able to apply for graduate
school and ended up going to agraduate school in the Midwest a
big 10 school on a full ride.
(18:16):
Wow.
Carlene (18:18):
And so amazing.
Melissa (18:19):
So I was like yes, I was like the first one in my
entire family to like make that,to make that move, and it was
great.
It was lonely but I survived it, that's.
That's a whole differentconversation, colleen, oh my
gosh.
Carlene (18:35):
Wow, it was lonely.
Melissa (18:37):
Oh, I mean like this was real out there because you
know, like you're on campus,You're homesick.
Carlene (18:44):
Yeah, you don't get to go home OK.
Melissa (18:46):
You don't get to go home, and so, like you don't get
to go home, and so you createyour own sense of family out
there.
So then I created my own senseof family, my community.
I found, you know, I found my,my, my, my people, my people,
and at the same time, because Idid not party enough in
undergraduate school, I kind ofmade up for that when I went to
(19:10):
graduate school.
Carlene (19:11):
So I partied a lot.
Melissa (19:11):
You know what I'm saying, I went in and you know
it was a different environmentfor me, so I struggled out there
.
But yeah, like that wholeexperience, there's a lot of
trauma that I went through, notpersonally but intellectually,
because, like this was a PWI, itwas a different experience, and
it's like now you're PWI.
What do you mean?
(19:32):
A PWI is a predominantly whiteinstitution, so it's a
predominantly white school.
Oh, okay, wow, yeah, beenthrough were very diverse up to
this point, and so the racism Ihad been through were very
diverse up to this point, and sothe racism on the campus was
very loud.
It was very much felt and alsoimpacted, how you know, like how
(19:52):
I thought and everything and soit was a lot happening.
Carlene (19:56):
When you go to like post-secondary, I think, like
you say, it's a lonely place.
I guess you felt lonely becauseof the race, the race factor,
like there's not a lot of people, there's not a mixture, like I
think you feel like there's asense of belonging when there's
people that you can relate to orfamiliar faces or something
Right.
But for me too, I think, when Iwent to university as well, I
(20:21):
thought it would be differentfor some odd reason.
I think it's what you see inthe movies and it makes like
higher education, this placewhere you're going to meet
people who are educated, whohave a different way of thinking
, and like there's moreopen-minded people.
And I don't know if Inecessarily found that, like I
(20:42):
found my two of my closestfriends, but I had some
professors that were like theywere brutally honest and to the
point where it kind of gave melike a little self-doubt in a
way.
Like it's where you're like.
My number one professor said tome like he's like you didn't
take anything else, and I waslike here I am, I'm like.
Well, she kept saying that I'mlike I need to drop this.
Like he's like you didn't takeanything else and I was like
here I am.
(21:02):
I'm like, well, she kept sayingthat.
I'm like I need to drop thisclass.
Yeah, it's going to kill my GPA.
Like you know what I mean.
Like when you hear the brutalhonesty from a teacher and I
think that's like the teacher inme, like helping others.
Like you know how you saidaccess service.
So when she said that but it'slike you said so like how I felt
, and I felt like again.
Melissa (21:44):
I've always been with my family up to this point and
now I'm away from them, yeah,and I was also like in a
relationship and then like nowwe're in this long distance
relationship.
So it was a lot.
But also it is that it is thatlevel of brutal honesty that
just I was young and I hadbelieved a lot of the false
(22:07):
statements or themicroaggressions that were
happening, you know, and I feltlike like if that happened now,
I would like no you're sayingbecause this is, this is me in
40, but at 20 I was stilldeveloping.
I didn't know who I was at thattime.
You know I'm still trying tolike find out who I am and you
know I'm still developing andI'm trying to figure out a lot.
(22:30):
And then so when you're toldand now in this space that's
supposed to resemble the world,oh, you're not good enough or
why you're here and you know allthese things, and you're like
start questioning yourself andthen you know it hurt your
self-esteem.
I didn't really.
You know like it wasn't untilafter the fact, until I was like
30 and going through counseling, and I was like, oh shoot, I
(22:53):
actually had panic attacks.
I was actually like I feltanxious a lot of times going
through that and I didn't havethe language to even name that
because counseling or anxiety orall of that was not part of my
vocabulary before and duringgraduate school.
So I had to navigate throughall of that complexity of
(23:14):
navigating all of those emotionsagain alone, I was suffering in
silence in some ways.
And also like just questioning,also like just questioning my
own worth, Just literallyquestioning my own worth,
Walking around with that.
So it was heavy, but now likethat, ain't gonna fly.
You know what I'm saying.
If I could tell that20-year-old girl like listen
(23:38):
you're made for.
You know you're put on thisearth for a reason.
Yeah, fix your crown.
You got this.
Carlene (23:48):
Yeah, you're saying yeah for sure, yeah, for sure, I
think.
I think, like you said, it'sanother time in life.
But now that you're 40 and youhave a little bit more
self-awareness and like you'veobviously gotten through a lot
of obstacles right, and yeah, weboth have, I think we all do in
(24:08):
life and I think whoever'slistening can relate.
If you're 40 or you know 40plus, it becomes that time when
you're there's still gonna belike hurdles along the way, but
it's how you deal with it, howyou handle it in the long run,
right.
And and so I think you saidthis is interesting.
(24:28):
I'm going to bring this up.
I don't know if you remember,but you said you celebrated
turning 40 on your 39th birthday.
So I wanted to ask you whatthat?
What do you mean by that?
Melissa (24:39):
no, I literally did and it was by accident.
Yeah, yeah, but like, oh mygoodness, like for the longest I
had been planning my 40thbirthday in my head.
All right, okay, the way Iwanted to have.
Like, I wanted to have a fetand I'm still going to have a
fet.
I don't know how and when, butI'm gonna have a fet and I want
to celebrate my 40th birthday,you know, before I'm 41, and
maybe I celebrate it again whenI'm 41 plus one and when.
(25:01):
But I'm gonna have a fit and Iwant to celebrate my 40th
birthday, you know, before I'm41 and maybe I celebrate it
again when I'm 41 plus one youknow what I'm saying.
yeah, but I'm gonna, but that'show I wanted to celebrate it.
So, but I think, when I wasturning 39, my goodness, like in
my mind, I think I was just soready to turn 40.
And I was.
I remember you were, wow, I wasso ready, I.
(25:23):
There's something about I don'tknow like it representing own,
like owning yourself you knowwhat I'm saying Like becoming
who you are, like fullyblossoming, like I'm no longer
second guessing and so.
But the other thing, too, isthat there's something about me
in my 30s, like, where peoplewill still talk to me or look at
(25:46):
me as if I was younger.
You know what I'm saying.
But now I can say, like I'm 40.
You know what I'm saying?
Like there's something about 39where people are 38 and younger
and folks like treat you likeyou're a lot younger, but once
I'm 40, it's like I'm here, likeI've arrived oh, it's like whoa
40.
Carlene (26:03):
Some people are like whoa, you're 40, you don't look
at, or like you know you lookyounger than that, or like 40 is
the new 30.
There's so many things with 40,and so did you have a 40th
birthday?
Yeah, okay.
Melissa (26:17):
So all that to say all that say, my husband threw like
a surprise 40th birthday for meon my 39th.
But then it wasn't so much as asurprise because I ended up,
when he was planning it, likethere was a specific I'm a
planner, right, he's not.
And so I wanted to see my.
(26:39):
My mother was going to make aspecial meal for me for my
birthday.
So I was like I really want togo to my mom's house.
And he was like no, we're goingto his mom's house.
And I'm just like, oh, likelike it's my birthday, why can't
you just like, why can't wejust go to my mom's house and
then go to your mom's house,like it's you know?
And so I got so upset with himand so, and then he was like
(27:07):
because it's a surprise.
it's supposed to be like, oh, Ishould have just let it be, you
know, but like, for me, likedetails matter, but anyway, all
that's the same, he threw a verysmall, intimate 40th birthday
for me it perfect and a goodfriend of mine.
We also went to Mexico for my40th birthday.
So I was like, listen, I needthis.
(27:28):
You know, whether I'm 39 or 40,we're still going to celebrate.
It's all good.
That was my 40th, it was me my39th.
It was good, it was really good.
So when, by the time my 40thcame, my actual 40th birthday, I
can't tell you what I did.
I honestly, I can't.
I did absolutely.
Carlene (27:46):
And that's what I did, okay.
Melissa (27:47):
And it's the complete opposite from, like, when I
turned 25, I wanted to turn up.
You know what I'm saying.
When I turned like 30, I wantedto turn up, but, yeah, yeah, I
wanted just to be still, Iwanted to enjoy peace.
I think I may have gone to thespa, but I just I didn't have, I
didn't work that week.
I I just wanted to not have anyresponsibilities but like don't
(28:13):
do dishes on the birthday.
Carlene (28:14):
I'm like I don't do dishes on my birthday like
relaxing nothing, you know.
Yeah, that's it.
Melissa (28:20):
So that's how it was, but I think that is what set the
tone for like, the followingmonths.
Like I'm new to 40, you know mybirthday was in October, so I'm
new to it but I would say thatI love my peaceful moments, like
I just I love just waking upearly and just an hour and a
(28:42):
half to myself, reading, praying, meditating, before I start the
day.
I realize I have more patience,I realize I have more like I
don't know, like it's justthere's a level of peace that I
really enjoy and I don't know ifit's me maturing, I don't know.
Carlene (28:56):
Is it Well?
I mean, you're a mom too, right, and so is it like before the
kids get up, and like your timefor yourself.
Melissa (29:04):
Well, it's interesting that you say that, because
that's probably why I ended upwhere I started doing that,
because last year, I think so, apart of what I do too is I do
some workshops around burnoutand time and energy management
and all of that.
And I was like, by the timeDecember, like I told myself I
(29:26):
I'm not going to do any workafter October and November.
And then it became December andI'm like yo, why do I feel this
way?
I felt so depleted I meantdepleted when I, the moment I
woke up, the first thing I woulddo is go straight to getting
the kids ready, then go straightto work, and then the kids will
come home and I get them readyand then spend some time with my
husband and then, like, do alittle bit of work and then go
straight to bed and then repeatall over.
(29:47):
So with that kind of schedule, Ihad no time to myself, I was
not pouring into myself at all,and so I nearly had a breakdown.
But then I think it was more solike a breakthrough, because I
realized that I was burnt out.
I was legit burnt out because Iwas not pouring into myself.
Here I am like pouring intoeverybody else except myself.
(30:10):
And then I was like you knowwhat?
Like, let me just, I have to,like it's not, it's a
non-negotiable anymore.
Like so now, even if I, eventhough I wake up early, it's
just like, if I don't wake upearly and like have that time
for myself, you know it.
You're saying like everybodyfeels it, like I feel it, I'm
(30:31):
like something is off, whathappened or what didn't happen?
I was like you know what?
I did not point to myself today, I did not.
Carlene (30:38):
Your morning routine.
I guess it's really important.
Yeah, I have to.
Melissa (30:42):
Because otherwise I'm pouring into everybody else and
not to myself, and that all I'mgiving myself is an hour and a
half.
That's it.
Carlene (30:49):
But even when you're tired, you still feel like it
helps, like even when you are,you know, yes.
Melissa (30:56):
Especially when I'm tired, I have to Like again,
like if, if anything, at least30 minutes, like this morning.
I was like yo, I don't know.
Like all week it was like withmy legs were aching and then it
was like my thighs were achingand then my abs were aching.
So now this morning it was myback and my shoulders that were
aching and I had a headache.
(31:16):
So it felt like it was justlike creeping up all week.
So I woke up with all of thisin pain.
I was like yo, I'm cancelingtoday, like I had to sleep.
And I asked my husband I waslike yo, can you just get the
kids ready?
I'll be there in like 30minutes or so.
So, with that being said, I wasnot able to have my usual
routine because I was likehurting, yeah.
(31:38):
And then he got them ready andI was like okay, I'm good to get
up.
I had my coffee, got the kidsout the door, but I was like you
know what, before I check myemail, I'm going to give 15
minutes to myself in just puresilence, just 15.
I didn't do the whole 30, but Iwas like just 15 minutes, put
(31:58):
on some meditation, music andjust be still.
And then I was like all right,let's go.
I need to.
You know I'm ready for the day.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Diva Tonight.
Glamour for your ears.
This is 40, A FemalePerspective with host Carleen.
Carlene (32:13):
Yeah, you know what, even if it's not the meditation,
but even a moment of quiet.
But I've been gettingdistracted by my phone as of
late and now I'm like, oh, Ihave to get back and like not go
on my phone first thing in themorning and like just take that
time, like you said.
So no, the me time is crucial,it totally is.
(32:33):
And yeah, meditation has beenaround a long time and I did a
nine week workshop.
That was hard for me.
It was like three hours out ofmy day, you know, right after
work and like every Monday at630, it was like you know.
But once I did it I was likethis is helpful you know, and I
experienced meditationdifferently.
Melissa (32:54):
You know what I'm saying, because it's not for me,
it's.
It's being just being, stilljust being in tune.
Sometimes I play meditationmusic.
I might ask Alexa to play somemeditation music for me.
I might put on some gospel, Imight just put on something
that's not like going to roughup During the day, I might get
amped up and change the playlist, but for that 15 minutes I'm
(33:15):
just like.
Sometimes I play no music.
You know, it's just me.
I might journal, I might read,but it's just me.
Carlene (33:20):
I might journal, I might read, I might, but it's
just about me feeding my soul atthat moment yeah, and I think I
think that's the one thing Ihaven't talked about it is um,
in this series it is not justthe, I guess, the mental health
aspect not too much focusing,but just even health itself and
and that because I guess youknow it just depends on where
you are in your life, at 40 youknow, and and it's true.
(33:43):
So the time that you spendalone in the morning is so
important and I, even if I falloff of it, I watch like a
podcast, like the Mel Robbinspodcast he's like, you know,
she's like sometimes you getannoyed with her, but it's like
like, OK, now you're right.
You know like, wake up earlier,drink a glass of water.
(34:05):
You know all these remindersthat we have to give ourselves
because we're so programmedRight and so it really is
important, though, like you said, and the thing is that for me,
I like personally, witheverything that's happened with
like politically is pretty heavy.
Melissa (34:26):
I used to like, when I drink my cup when I woke up,
got the kids ready I will alsodrink coffee and watch the news
at the same time.
So I will start my day with thenews.
And now I can't, like I don'teven have to turn on the news to
even know what's happening,like I can, just it's like it's
all around me.
So that was another reason whyI was like you know, I need to
be still before my energy orbefore I'm affected by all the
(34:49):
news.
You know what I'm saying,because it can be overwhelming
and I'm the kind of person thatcan internalize that.
And then, like somebody callsme while I'm internalizing it
and I'm like taking it out onthem, like what you want?
You know I'm angry, I'm pissed,you know, and it's like I'm not
pissed, like I'm not mad at you, yeah, but it's just like I
need to like get all of thisenergy out so, so like I had to
(35:12):
manage that.
So that was a huge part as tolike why I needed to clock that
time out, because I was like Iset that foundation before I'm
all triggered.
Carlene (35:25):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Part of your day, oh my gosh, Ithink it's so true, though I
think even late at night.
Apparently it's not good towatch it late at night too, but
I'm like I feel like if I don'twatch the news, like I don't
know what's going on.
But, like you said, it'severywhere.
It doesn't matter Social media,it doesn't matter where you're,
(35:45):
you're going to get theinformation right.
Melissa (35:47):
I go to the gym and it's on the screens.
I'm just like oh my gosh.
Yeah, I want to see anything,it's just, oh yeah, I get to
overstimulated by it.
So now it's like I want to bein control of when I'm ready to
watch the news, when I want tosee the news.
Carlene (36:07):
yeah, so that's, almost like.
I don't want to I can't.
Melissa (36:10):
So it's, it's a lot, and you're right like it's
important to stay informed, butit's like I will become informed
when I'm ready, right, I'malready like I see everything
that's happening.
It's, I see it, I know it, butI want to be in control in terms
of, like, what is coming my way, right?
And we got to filter thatinformation because there's a
(36:32):
lot of fake news out there.
Carlene (36:33):
There's a lot of it, you know oh, that's a
controversial thing they'resaying about the fake news,
right, but I think if somebodytold me this, it's like the news
, certain things are considereda distraction, right, like in a
way.
But we could go through a wholething with that.
So, yeah, but yeah, it's crazy.
(36:54):
We are living in a crazy timeright now, and so anything you
can do to calm the storm, calmyour mind, so that it doesn't
affect you, stress wise, it'strue.
Like I mean, I'm in Canada,you're in the US, but like we're
supposed to be like, but we'reaffected as well.
Yeah, yeah, I, we are.
(37:16):
Yeah, totally, the whole thingright now.
That's happening.
It's, it's unsettling in a in away, because I work in an
industry where the change couldhappen.
Like it's on pause right now,but I'm not going to go straight
into it.
But yeah, whatever happens willdefinitely affect Canadians too
.
So it's just a matter of time.
We'll see how it goes, right.
Melissa (37:38):
And, at the same time, it's like being mindful of what
is it that we can put ourenergy towards.
You know what do we have thecapacity to do right now.
You know right, right, don't we?
So sometimes, you know what canyou control and what don't you
have control and what you know,what communities can you join
and how effective can you be?
Carlene (37:58):
Right, and that whole positive mindset.
You know, the one thing wedidn't talk about is your family
.
And you know, there's one storythat you told me.
I don't know if you want toshare that story, but I thought
it was so powerful when you werehaving your son in the hospital
and like, I don't even know ifyou want to talk about that, but
(38:20):
yeah, I thought that story wasvery powerful because I think a
lot of women who have kids canrelate.
Oh, you know what I mean, orwhat do you call it.
Oh, how do I say that?
Melissa (38:31):
yeah, so just your son , so you have a son, and then do
you have more than one child,or yeah, yeah, I have a son and
a daughter, oh, and so this isthe story about the level of
pain.
Carlene (38:43):
Yeah, ok so, oh right, that's a little oh yeah, I'm
like there's so many differentyeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa (38:54):
So giving birth to my son was my first child and I was
supposed to have a scheduledC-section and so he was to see
schedule C-section was going tobe on March 28th, which is seven
months before my birthday, andI specifically told March 28th
because my birthday is onOctober 28th.
(39:14):
So I was like, okay, we can,you know, be seven months apart.
Yay, but when I was gettingready to go to the hospital, I
was like I don't know if Ireally want to do this, like
something just told me, likejust give them a call and just
see if you know, just havenatural birth and just try it
out.
You know, it's like all right,fine.
So I called and they're like,yeah, you can wait.
(39:34):
And that was the first time Iactually got that type of
response Fast forward, got thattype of response Fast forward.
I went to a learning house, ateaching hospital.
I went to a teaching hospital,a major teaching hospital in New
York, where I ended up givingbirth.
Now, the moment that we went in, okay, first of all, when they
had to like inject that needlehere or whatever I do not like
(39:58):
needles, okay, I've never likedneedles.
Yes, I was like 30 years old.
I still cry when I get needles.
I do not like needles.
And so when the doctors askedme what's my plan, I was like
epidural, because I don't wantto feel any pain.
I don't want to feel anyneedles, anything.
This intern kept poking me,couldn't find my vein and I'm
like yo, I'm going to go at youLike I'm having, I'm in labor,
(40:21):
and he couldn't find it like fora solid 10, 15 minutes trying
to find my vein to like pop it.
So that was the first likefrustrating thing, cause I'm
like I'm literally in labor, sofine, whatever.
So now they're preparing,they're trying to catch me, get
my doctor, and then my waterbroke, okay, and the
anesthesiologist arrived, butnow they can't give me the
(40:42):
epidural because my water justbroke.
So my water broke, and so nowthey're like all right, so I
guess it's time You're going tohave to push and I'm like all
right, fine, so I'm pushingagain.
I just wanted epidural from thebeginning, so I did not want to
feel any pain.
I didn't want to feel any.
This is how much of a like Idon't want to say a wimp, but I
(41:07):
really don't like pain.
I didn't want to feel anyneedle and I really didn't want
to give natural birth.
I just want, I just want.
I didn't want to, but here I am, we're going to do this, right,
yeah yeah.
So, pushing and pushing,pushing, my son comes out and my
, my son arrives, and the nextthing they know is that they
realize that I am torn downthere in that area and so they
(41:27):
have to stitch me up.
I'm like, oh my God, I got todo needles now, you know like
can we do this tomorrow Like?
no, we got to do it right nowbecause we don't want to take
the risk of infection.
So I'm like I literally justgave birth and they're like oh,
just put him on your chest,because you know you won't even
think about the pain.
And I'm like yeah.
I don't understand.
(41:48):
I do not like pain.
Right.
And first of all, I just gavebirth naturally with no epidural
.
So I insisted, I was like, no,I do not want my son on my chest
, like I don't like pain andit's too much for me right now.
(42:09):
And they insisted, I'm like allright, fine, whatever.
So they put him on my chest,they put some topical cream on
me, all right, didn't even allowit to settle and they started
stitching and I felt everysingle stitch.
My husband, you know like,grabbed my son and I was like,
see, like they don't, they'renot listening, like I did not
want him on my chest and theydidn't allow, you know,
anesthesia to topical anesthesiato kick in.
So I felt everything and whatthat made me realize was one
(42:33):
they made assumptions that I cantolerate pain, right yeah.
And they were rushing thatwhole process and I don't know
why they were rushing, but Ifelt everything.
And then, like my husband,who's a tall black man, didn't
know how to advocate, for me orfor him, you know like we're
both thinking, of course, likewe're going to do what the
(42:53):
doctors say because they are inthe right, right, but they
weren't.
I should not have had to sufferin that way.
Carlene (43:00):
Yeah, wow, yeah.
It's like I think in the moment, like you just don't know how
to react or what, like you knowyou're just help me out here.
You know what I mean.
And hearing that story again,it's like if only they would
listen.
And I think that's what a lotof people feel like in the
medical system.
Like you're always having toadvocate for yourself and then
(43:25):
sometimes no one's hearing youwhen you're saying like I don't
like needles, like I'm the sameway I don't like needles either.
I don't like pain.
You know there's some of usthat don't have a high tolerance
for pain.
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa (43:37):
I specifically said I don't want him on my chest Right
Cause like it's too much goingon right now.
Like I don't want him on mychest Right Because it's too
much going on right now.
Like I don't want him on mychest right now.
I didn't even know that was athing.
Yeah, yeah, not right now.
Like you're about to sew me up,like I don't want him on my
chest at this moment.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
You know there is a time for bonding, and right now.
Melissa (43:56):
I can only do one thing at a time, and so this is
the other thing Like, I get thatthey're the experts, but what's
the difference between, likeyou know, like, delaying my
bonding time with my son?
You know, because of yourtheory.
You know like, oh, if you puthim on chest to chest, you know
all this?
Listen, I was still able tomilk, I was still able, like,
waiting 10, 15 minutes.
(44:17):
Yeah, I didn't make thatsignificant of a significant
difference, you know.
And so, like, the other thingtoo is our identities, and I
mentioned that my husband is atall black man.
Because when you're in aninstitution, like you know, the
hospital, you know, if headvocated for me, first of all,
no one's teaching.
You know, before you give birth, oh, how to advocate at that
(44:37):
time.
You know saying, oh, to packyour bags.
And you know, when the baby isborn, it's gonna look pale and
yada, yada, yada, but no onesays, hey, this is how you
advocate for your wife.
And so if he advocated for me,what would that look like?
They would get, you know,security on him.
You know saying like, if theysay you listen to her, she
(44:58):
doesn't want the baby on herchest, or like wait, like, hold
up like let's put the the, youknow, let's wait for the cream
to settle, you know, but.
But you know, but the secondround, when we had our second
child, that we were in a fairand you're like listen, you know
how to advocate now and then itwas, and it was a completely
(45:19):
different experience.
It was a different hospital,yeah, completely different
experience, and it was perfect.
Everything was just perfect.
Carlene (45:27):
It's a learning experience, right?
You're first time parents.
You're nervous, those are.
See, that's the thing.
It's always everything thatthey don't tell you.
Like I'm sure, like your momdidn't even tell you, like our
parents didn't don't even tellus those things, like you know
what I mean, like you don'tlearn those.
I don't know if I'm not, Ishouldn't assume but I don't
know if your mom ever told youabout giving birth.
(45:50):
Like it's always the untoldstories, right?
Melissa (45:53):
yeah, I mean we've had stories about giving birth, but
I, you know every story it's.
It's just that it's thatperson's story, right, it's
going to be very different fromsomebody else.
But after that happened to meagain, another expectation was
for me to continue to be supermom not even continue, but to be
super mom.
(46:14):
Okay.
Like, let me set the stage foryou, carlene.
Okay, yeah, and I just gavebirth.
I'm sold.
You know, like I have stitchesin an area that I don't usually
have stitches.
I gave him Vicodin, okay.
So now I'm like taking Vicodinwhenever it's necessary.
I'm in pain, I have to sit on adonut, and we're learning how
(46:35):
to be parents and we weren'tmarried at the time and so I'm
over here like trying to figureout when is my milk going to
come, how is he going to latch?
Things about work, you know,about my body, me being a mom,
just a lot happening.
And at the same time, I had somany folks coming into my house,
(46:55):
loved ones coming into my house.
Oh my gosh, I need to nurse.
How, how come you didn't feedthe baby?
I'm like yo, the baby's good.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, all that level ofpressure, like why are you
walking like that?
And I'm like yo, you know, likeit was a lot.
I felt like I didn't get thatlevel of nurture and support
(47:17):
that I really needed and I don'tknow, I don't again, I don't
know if it's because it's it'slike maybe folks assume because
of my personality that I'll begood.
I got this.
But that's not always the case.
And for my second child, mydaughter, I made sure that I was
like I don't want anybodycoming to the, to the hospital,
I don't want anyone coming tothe house for the first two
weeks.
(47:37):
I need time for my family toadjust first before folks come
in judging, criticizing advisingall of the things.
I was like no, yeah, Again,prioritizing us first.
Carlene (47:52):
Yes, yeah, I think that's the thing too, like I had
to say it.
In the Caribbean culture it'salways like why didn't you do
this?
Or like you know, there'salways someone else has an
opinion and like we have to justlike let it be, but at the same
time it's like you know whatit's too much, yeah, yeah, this
sounds really overwhelming.
(48:13):
I don't think I've heard anyonesay oh my goodness yeah, it's
like when you're sick too, okay,just make sure you have the
ginger tea with honey and lime.
I'm like, yes, you know thatthing when COVID happened and I
got that cough, and I'm like I'mso tired of everybody being
like drink hot water, make sureyou put lime in it.
(48:34):
I'm like, yeah, I've been doingthat, but the cough is still
here.
It's been you know, what I meanand I'm just like, I am doing it
, I am drinking it, I am.
I have been drinking the teawith the honey and the lemon
lime.
It's totally different thanwhat you're talking about, but
I'm not a mob so I can't relate.
But it's like another thingwhen, when everyone is like
giving you advice and you'relike, yeah, I know, listen,
(48:58):
they're trying to be helpful.
But in Caribbean culture, inour culture, it's like sometimes
it's it's not helpful andsometimes you're just like I
don't know.
Melissa (49:07):
Yeah yeah, yeah, it can be overwhelming sometimes,
it can like again, I know it'sfrom a good place.
you know, like he's like.
He says like you, sometimes youjust gotta like from caribbean
folks, you just gotta take itlike I guess of course I will, I
will you know.
And take it Like I guess ofcourse I will, I will you know.
And then it's like, if y'alljust listen, the one advice I
will never forget and me and myhusband we laugh about this, and
(49:29):
this was a serious advice mydaughter, we think at the time,
like, looking back at it, shemay have had COVID.
She was a toddler, Like COVIDwas a thing in the other, like
in China, but didn't yet.
Oh, I was trapped here, but shehad the symptoms.
But anyway, I have to say theadvice that we were told from a
family was oh yeah, just put herpee pee on her forehead.
(49:50):
We're not going to put urine onher forehead, I'm sorry.
No, that's not happening.
That's not happening.
Carlene (49:55):
Wow, ok, I don't think I've ever heard that.
Ok, okay, I don't think.
Melissa (49:59):
I've ever heard that.
Okay, wow.
And so I was like yeah.
So I was like I know you, Imean.
Carlene (50:09):
Well, I know it's coming from a good place.
I know it was a bit much, oh mygosh.
The, the, the, the advice, youknow what I mean there's.
There's a lot of differentthings that people give you,
depending on the culture, whenyou have a child, right, and
even in Italian families, but Ithink, I think, what you you
definitely shared there is, likeit's hard to be a parent.
You know what I mean.
It's, it's the one job that youhave that I guess you get paid
(50:32):
in different ways, but it's ahard job, right, and so, yeah,
yeah.
Melissa (50:37):
Yeah, it's something that you know like someone told
me that kids didn't ask to behere.
So my, my goal is to makememories, not to feel the hurt
or the pain that I are, and forthem to enjoy their youth.
You know, saying like be ableto, and it's yeah and just.
(51:00):
I just want to raise goodcitizens, that's all you know
what I'm saying.
It is hard as heck, but at thesame time, like it's hard out
here.
It's hard, but you know, likethere there are folks who have
fewer resources than I have andwho are doing an amazing job.
(51:21):
You know what I'm saying, andso yeah.
Carlene (51:24):
Well, that's the powerful thing, Melissa.
I think it's important that youknow everyone shares their
journey and like how challengingit can be.
But it's kind of likeinteresting to hear that
perspective too, because I thinkfor me, like you know, when you
turn 40, like you have two kidsbut I don't have any of my, I
remember telling my dad about mycondition, like I'm not gonna
(51:46):
say what's going on, but andthen you have, when you're 40,
you have less time, right, andso I just remember my dad
telling me how he would like ifI did have kids, and I was just
like you've never actually saidanything about that, like he
never pressured me.
So it was just interesting nowat this age that he brought that
(52:06):
up.
And I always think it's sointeresting, like how parents
are and I'm like, oh so you, youdid want me to have kids.
You just never like pushed meor anything Like you'd always
push me from doing a business ifI had a business idea and I it
didn't go.
Well, you know what I mean.
But like, yeah, it's kind oflike when, when your, your time
is limited, it kind of putsthing into perspective, right,
(52:29):
and so that's my perspectivewith that.
But hearing you talk about likeyour challenges too, like
nothing is ironclad either way,and I think, yeah, it's just
society either way.
And I think, yeah, it's justsociety, right, and like family
and everything.
So, yeah, I'm Carlene and thisis Diva Tonight with Melissa
Schillingford Is that how yousay it?
All right, amazing.
(52:53):
Thank you so much for sharingyour journey.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:57):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat diva underscore tonight.
hi, I'm carlene and this is diva.
Tonight we're doing somethingnew.
This is a series devoted toturning 40, the milestone
birthday, and celebratingeverything it is to be a woman
at 40, you know, like careerdriven mom, all the good things
(00:27):
that come with that milestone.
I think it's that part of lifethat I think you finally are
like, yeah, I get it, I get it.
Now you know what I mean.
Or there's hurdles along theway.
But right across is Melissa,and she is an entrepreneur, a
business consultant, a mom, awife, and she's in New York,
(00:53):
actually Hudson Valley, new Yorkright.
Melissa (00:56):
Yep, that's right.
That's where I currently live.
Yeah, yeah.
Carlene (01:00):
Okay.
So for those who don't know you, I see you worked in nonprofit
for a little bit and then youchanged over.
So what was the deciding factor?
Melissa (01:11):
Honestly, there's a lot of the deciding factor, but
the sole purpose, the underlyinglike common denominator, is
really to serve people.
And I continue to serve peopleas a nonprofit consultant, as an
entrepreneur.
So, yes, so I spent my goodness.
I was working in nonprofitssince, I wanna say since I
(01:34):
started college back in 2001.
And that was my first job and Ialways felt like I had a
purpose to serve people, to giveback.
And so throughout college,throughout graduate school,
after graduate school, Icontinued to work in nonprofits.
But then, more recently, Idecided to pivot because I
(01:55):
needed flexibility, but also Iwanted flexibility in my
lifestyle and flexibility in theway I work with and serve
nonprofits, as opposed to onlyworking with not one
organization.
I want to be able to serve manyat once.
And so this is how I decided todo it Right as a nonprofit
(02:19):
consultant.
Carlene (02:19):
So so nonprofit is like a broad term.
It could be nonprofit in themedical sector, in media, in
radio, like what.
What was your, the sector thatyou worked in?
Melissa (02:37):
So, primarily, my main focus has always been or I
would say for the most part hasbeen in serving people who have
been impacted by the criminallegal system and so providing or
organizing leadership trainings, advocacy trainings that really
help them advocate forthemselves right and help them
(02:58):
advocate for the policy changeand develop their leadership
skills so that they can have animpact in their own communities
in the ways that they felt youknow were necessary.
And so that was the main groupof folks that I served.
I, you know, worked in acollege setting at one point
where I launched fellowshipprograms that helped college
(03:18):
students serve people who wereformerly incarcerated, and then
I also just developedcohort-based programs since then
.
So it's an intersection of likeserving that community and also
developing leadership skillsand providing trainings as well.
So that was a sector that I wasin and currently, through my
business, make Ideas Work.
(03:39):
I help organizations who aredoing like dope work.
I help their staff work smarter, not harder, you know what I'm
saying.
So I provide them with thetraining, the tools and also
consult with them on like howcan we, how can they do the work
more efficiently so that theycan focus on the impact that
they're having, so that they canbuild a relationship, so that
(04:00):
they can, you know, help raisefunds and not be so caught up in
the day-to-day routines thatit's really dropped, that
they're, you know, drowning in,and so I just help them work
efficiently in that way.
Carlene (04:12):
You know that saying work harder, not smarter, I
never really-.
Melissa (04:15):
Work smarter, not harder.
Carlene (04:18):
Yeah, work smarter, not harder.
So I never really understoodthat, but I think in my research
online, youtube is our bestfriend.
It's planning ahead, reallyplanning your day, organization,
which is easier said than done,and so I guess you help people
in that sector organize, planahead and do things in a more
(04:41):
efficient way.
Like you have an eight hour dayand like how do you tackle like
so many things, right, you know?
Melissa (04:48):
Colleen, I never even thought about that Like right
now.
As you said, I was like youknow, like working smarter, not
hard, as a lifestyle.
It really is a lifestyle, as amindset.
I didn't get there.
I wasn't always like that,right, like I learned the hard
way.
I was that person who waitedthe last minute to do things.
I was that person who wouldwake up in the middle of the
(05:10):
night to respond to emails orjust work all day and night.
You know what I'm saying.
And at the same time, I realizedthat it had a personal impact
on me, right.
Like I felt like I wasoperating from a space of
scarcity.
I was always like exhausted Iwas, I didn't.
I was always anxious andstressed out, you know.
(05:31):
And so when I'm like that, thenthe people I work with are like
you know, like what's up withyou, right?
And then when I'm like that,the people in my household are
like what's up with you?
Like what's up with the mommyand what's up with you know, my,
you know my husband's like yo,what's up with you all the time,
you know.
And so when people are like yo,what's going on?
And you're like, well, I'mstressed.
And why am I stressed.
(05:52):
It's because I'm you know,these things are happening to me
.
And so when things werehappening to me, I was like no,
I and I need to make thingshappen right and in a certain
order.
And so once I made that pivotof like I cannot allow things
and people to take up my timeand energy and I need to be in
(06:13):
control of that.
That's when I was like that'sthe strategy of like, how to
reclaim my time, that's how Ireclaim my energy, that's how I
like plan things ahead and thepower in that.
Carlene (06:26):
So, yeah, it's a battle.
I am still procrastinating withcertain things, but I started
watching some more videos and,like you know, baby steps,
because I think in worksometimes I want everything to
be perfect, but there's no suchthing.
And so I think hearing you saythat, like when you're tired and
stressed and you're constantlygoing like everything affects
(06:50):
you, you do things like how youeat and how you sleep, and
everything affects you as aperson and who you want to be
Right, and so it's one of thosethings where I think it's one
day at a time right.
Melissa (07:03):
One of those things where I think it's one day at a
time.
Right, it's one day at a time.
It's also one step at a time,you know, and it's the baby
steps that really matter, andit's the baby steps that really
add up to the major thing youmentioned.
You know, perfection, and I'velike perfection is so overrated.
You're saying it's like yeah,perfection also is one of the
(07:24):
reasons why people, a lot ofpeople, procrastinate, because
it's like oh, I want to learnsome more about this before I do
this, or I want to buy all ofthis in order for me to do that,
you know, and it's like I wantto get it perfect in order for
me to do it.
And I'm like no, let's get thatperfection out of it, because
the only thing that's perfect isGod, you know, and so we cannot
.
We have to really understandlike we are imperfect.
(07:46):
And once we know that and we,once we like really get that,
like the best thing to do islike, just do it.
And then you learn as you do itand you're like oh well, that
didn't work out.
Let me try.
Every failure, every step is a,it's a lesson.
You know this and that's how Isee things, you know, and that's
why so many folks are like howdo you do this and why do you?
(08:07):
You know, like how.
And I'm just like I might bethat risk taker, but I don't
want to spend too much timewishing I had done something.
I just want to like do it, youknow what I'm saying, yeah, and
learn from that and then likepivot and figure it out.
Carlene (08:27):
You know life should be fun Like let's just not worry
about perfection and just do it, right, right, easier said than
done, but to your point, oh mygosh.
You just said just do it, whichis the whole Nike slogan and
everything Right.
Just do it.
It never gets old.
So I always say this toeverybody it's not where you are
, like the path to where you are, like where you are in your
(08:48):
career now.
There's a reason you got here,you took steps to get there.
So where, where did you grow up, melissa?
Melissa (08:55):
My goodness, like there's a lot of things that
people don't know about me, likewhat I am now, right, but the
path to get here, I mean likewhere I grew up.
So I grew up in both Brooklyn,new York, and in Hempstead.
I'm going to say, and this isimportant, is that I grew up,
(09:18):
you know, like my parents arestraight from Haiti.
I grew up as in a household ofa family, of of love and care
and always, always giving.
And the thing then, that's whenI knew that I always wanted to
give to others, right, but also,what's coming to me is when I,
when we lived in Brooklyn and welived in like it was a two
(09:40):
bedroom apartment and it was asix of us I have four, I have
three siblings it was a twobedroom apartment and it was a
six of us.
I have four, I have threesiblings, but in this two
bedroom apartment, there wasnever only the six of us living
in that apartment.
You know, it was my aunt and mygrandmother.
You know there was alwaysextended family that was living
with us, and so my parentsalways opened their doors, like
(10:02):
till this day, you know, butthey always made something out
of nothing, you know, and so weused to live in East Flatbush
and then we moved to East NewYork and this was like I was
excited to live in that areabecause now we live in the
Brownstone in East New York.
The first place I lived in EastFlatbush was an apartment
building right Like maybe sixfloors and we lived on like the
(10:24):
main floor and, yeah, it was anice area.
It was a decent area.
I love the culture because itfelt very comfortable.
It's very diverse, heavy on theCaribbean community, lots of
black and brown folks at thattime.
Now it's very different in thatwhere we live, so anyway, so
that was there and then we movedto East New York.
(10:46):
Now East New York, that areawhere we moved to, is
predominantly Puerto Ricans andDominicans and so we felt like
we were actually the minoritiesthere.
It was different.
And we went.
We moved from an apartmentbuilding to now like a two.
What's it?
A duplex.
Carlene (11:06):
Right, right yeah.
Melissa (11:08):
And we had a backyard, we had our own backyard, you
know.
And the streets, I mean like.
Whenever I think about thistime in my life, I think about
playing double dutch, you know,and tag in the streets, you know
.
Oh, my goodness, I just thinkabout like it was.
So it was too hot to stayindoors.
We didn't have the ACs, so wehad to play outside situation
(11:30):
and everybody on the block cameoutside.
We would go, like to the park.
I think about the people whowere selling the ICs in the
streets, like it was a wholevibe, you know, like I just
that's what I remember.
But also, to bring it back toin terms of like, how I got here
during all of that, somethingthat sticks out in my memory is
seeing my parents.
I remember them making carfresheners how do you call it
(11:56):
Like car fresheners.
Yeah, so they would make themout of like cardboard, right.
So they will find likecardboard boxes.
They would collect cardboardboxes, okay, and they would buy
fabric and then they would addpotpourri to the fabric and then
they would cover all thecardboard and the fabric I mean
the potpourri, yeah, and thenthey will just hang it in the
(12:20):
car and they would sell them forlike $5.
It was like $5 or $2 for $8 orsomething that it's probably
most likely that's what it was,and they were like selling that,
selling that, and I rememberseeing my father in the kitchen
just make them late at nightwith a hot gun and everything.
But that's when I I thinkthat's when I saw like that
(12:40):
hustle, you know, saying it'slike my mother.
She was the one who would work.
My mother worked at a in thehotel industry.
She was a housekeeper.
From as long as I rememberright, she recently retired but
she was a housekeeper.
My father did not work becausehe was physically disabled from
the job.
He was working in the factoriesin New Jersey and then he
(13:03):
became physically disabled, thathouse like.
I remember vividly, like seeingthat, and I feel like I may have
helped my father make some ofthose.
I might be making that part upin my mind, but my spirit is
like I was with him.
Maybe that's my entrepreneurialspirit is like I was with my
dad in the kitchen, like helpinghim with that.
Yeah, and, yeah, and, and thenfrom there we lived there for
(13:25):
three years and then when I was10, we moved out to Hempstead,
long Island.
And when we moved out to LongIsland it was interesting
because the idea for us ingeneral, when you think about at
that time and we're like, oh,we moved to Long Island first of
all, it was a surprise but Ireally thought we like it was
like the Bel Airs, you know,like that's what I thought we
done moved up.
Yeah, really thought we werelike it was like the Bel-Airs,
you know, like that's what Ithought we done moved up.
(13:46):
I thought we were going to allthe things.
And then first day of schoolcame and it was like, oh,
there's, there's no one whitehere.
There's like oh my God, justlike me.
So it was a very it was verydifferent environment, but
Hempstead was cool.
You know that's where I spentmost of my upbringing in
(14:06):
Hempstead.
So that's a little bit about mybackground.
That's where I spent most of mychildhood.
Carlene (14:12):
Oh, ok, yeah, so more of like a visual, but like when
you went to school and you wentto, I guess, college, what did
you study?
Like, what made you get intononprofit?
I mean, obviously it seems likethat entrepreneurial spirit
came from your parents and I canrelate to that too, for sure, I
think, like my dad, my dad's anentrepreneur, so there's always
(14:35):
been that desire to do thingson my own.
I never really followed thepack, so I don't know if you
could relate to that.
I felt like the odd one out andI think as I got older now that
I'm 40, like yourself, Irealize a lot of things, like
the way my brain is wired andthe way I do certain things.
(14:57):
I just felt like I never fitinto what do you call it?
The crowds, like you know whatI mean, like in high school and
stuff.
So I don't know how you feltabout that.
But like working in nonprofit,getting back to that, what led
you to there?
What did you study in school?
Like I mean in college, like Imean honestly like OK.
Melissa (15:17):
So the other thing I took my mention earlier that my
parents always opened up theirhomes and there was always six
of us plus.
I mean, since I was seven, myparents had foster kids in the
house.
So I also had foster siblings,and so I was like, you know,
around this time, I don't know,like folks will always ask, oh,
(15:38):
what do you want to be when yougrow up?
And I don't know, I don't know.
But there will always be acaseworker or a social worker
who will come by just to checkon the children.
And I was like, you know, itseems like a positive thing to
do, right, yeah?
And so I was like that's what Iwant to do, that's what I want
(16:02):
to be, you know, and that's allI knew.
That's what I want to do.
So what I studied in school isnot, honestly, anything.
What I'm doing now.
I didn't know.
And I went to John Jay forundergrad.
I went there and I studieddeviant behavior and social
control and I don't even knowhow I think I got.
(16:23):
I studied that because it waslike psychology, sociology and
anthropology all at once.
I was like, okay, I didn't knowwhat to do you know it's like a
called like undecided majorright.
Yeah, it was something it waslike the most vague thing, the
closest I can get to social work.
I don't, I can't even tell youhow I ended up at John Jay, but
John Jay chose me, I went thereand I ended up there and then
(16:47):
during my junior year, one of myclasses got canceled and the
thing is that it took me twohours to go.
I didn't live on campus, therewas no John Jay's a commuter
school, and so it takes me twohours to get there and two hours
to get back of commuter school,and so it takes me two hours to
get there and two hours to getback.
And so when there's a classthat is canceled, if it's like
during the day, I have to waitaround or do figure something
(17:10):
out, because I can't just, youknow, like go home.
So when it was canceled, Iended up in a program fair, like
there was a fair that washappening on campus Let me go
check it out by happenstance.
And then I came across thisprogram that would prepare
undergraduate students forgraduate program for not even
graduate program, let me take astab at for PhDs, ok, and I was
(17:33):
just like what now?
Huh, I was like that's a thing,and I didn't even saw that as
an opportunity to like considerwhat's next.
I wasn't even thinking about,like I was thinking about,
what's next, but it reallyenlightened me to explore beyond
what I was thinking at thattime.
And so I went through thisprogram called the McNair
(17:56):
Scholars Program and changed mylife.
But I ended up actually stayingat John Jay for an extra
semester because I needed tocomplete some for that program.
But because of that program Iwas able to apply for graduate
school and ended up going to agraduate school in the Midwest a
big 10 school on a full ride.
(18:16):
Wow.
Carlene (18:18):
And so amazing.
Melissa (18:19):
So I was like yes, I was like the first one in my
entire family to like make that,to make that move, and it was
great.
It was lonely but I survived it, that's.
That's a whole differentconversation, colleen, oh my
gosh.
Carlene (18:35):
Wow, it was lonely.
Melissa (18:37):
Oh, I mean like this was real out there because you
know, like you're on campus,You're homesick.
Carlene (18:44):
Yeah, you don't get to go home OK.
Melissa (18:46):
You don't get to go home, and so, like you don't get
to go home, and so you createyour own sense of family out
there.
So then I created my own senseof family, my community.
I found, you know, I found my,my, my, my people, my people,
and at the same time, because Idid not party enough in
undergraduate school, I kind ofmade up for that when I went to
(19:10):
graduate school.
Carlene (19:11):
So I partied a lot.
Melissa (19:11):
You know what I'm saying, I went in and you know
it was a different environmentfor me, so I struggled out there
.
But yeah, like that wholeexperience, there's a lot of
trauma that I went through, notpersonally but intellectually,
because, like this was a PWI, itwas a different experience, and
it's like now you're PWI.
What do you mean?
(19:32):
A PWI is a predominantly whiteinstitution, so it's a
predominantly white school.
Oh, okay, wow, yeah, beenthrough were very diverse up to
this point, and so the racism Ihad been through were very
diverse up to this point, and sothe racism on the campus was
very loud.
It was very much felt and alsoimpacted, how you know, like how
(19:52):
I thought and everything and soit was a lot happening.
Carlene (19:56):
When you go to like post-secondary, I think, like
you say, it's a lonely place.
I guess you felt lonely becauseof the race, the race factor,
like there's not a lot of people, there's not a mixture, like I
think you feel like there's asense of belonging when there's
people that you can relate to orfamiliar faces or something
Right.
But for me too, I think, when Iwent to university as well, I
(20:21):
thought it would be differentfor some odd reason.
I think it's what you see inthe movies and it makes like
higher education, this placewhere you're going to meet
people who are educated, whohave a different way of thinking
, and like there's moreopen-minded people.
And I don't know if Inecessarily found that, like I
(20:42):
found my two of my closestfriends, but I had some
professors that were like theywere brutally honest and to the
point where it kind of gave melike a little self-doubt in a
way.
Like it's where you're like.
My number one professor said tome like he's like you didn't
take anything else, and I waslike here I am, I'm like.
Well, she kept saying that I'mlike I need to drop this.
Like he's like you didn't takeanything else and I was like
here I am.
(21:02):
I'm like, well, she kept sayingthat.
I'm like I need to drop thisclass.
Yeah, it's going to kill my GPA.
Like you know what I mean.
Like when you hear the brutalhonesty from a teacher and I
think that's like the teacher inme, like helping others.
Like you know how you saidaccess service.
So when she said that but it'slike you said so like how I felt
, and I felt like again.
Melissa (21:44):
I've always been with my family up to this point and
now I'm away from them, yeah,and I was also like in a
relationship and then like nowwe're in this long distance
relationship.
So it was a lot.
But also it is that it is thatlevel of brutal honesty that
just I was young and I hadbelieved a lot of the false
(22:07):
statements or themicroaggressions that were
happening, you know, and I feltlike like if that happened now,
I would like no you're sayingbecause this is, this is me in
40, but at 20 I was stilldeveloping.
I didn't know who I was at thattime.
You know I'm still trying tolike find out who I am and you
know I'm still developing andI'm trying to figure out a lot.
(22:30):
And then so when you're toldand now in this space that's
supposed to resemble the world,oh, you're not good enough or
why you're here and you know allthese things, and you're like
start questioning yourself andthen you know it hurt your
self-esteem.
I didn't really.
You know like it wasn't untilafter the fact, until I was like
30 and going through counseling, and I was like, oh shoot, I
(22:53):
actually had panic attacks.
I was actually like I feltanxious a lot of times going
through that and I didn't havethe language to even name that
because counseling or anxiety orall of that was not part of my
vocabulary before and duringgraduate school.
So I had to navigate throughall of that complexity of
(23:14):
navigating all of those emotionsagain alone, I was suffering in
silence in some ways.
And also like just questioning,also like just questioning my
own worth, Just literallyquestioning my own worth,
Walking around with that.
So it was heavy, but now likethat, ain't gonna fly.
You know what I'm saying.
If I could tell that20-year-old girl like listen
(23:38):
you're made for.
You know you're put on thisearth for a reason.
Yeah, fix your crown.
You got this.
Carlene (23:48):
Yeah, you're saying yeah for sure, yeah, for sure, I
think.
I think, like you said, it'sanother time in life.
But now that you're 40 and youhave a little bit more
self-awareness and like you'veobviously gotten through a lot
of obstacles right, and yeah, weboth have, I think we all do in
(24:08):
life and I think whoever'slistening can relate.
If you're 40 or you know 40plus, it becomes that time when
you're there's still gonna belike hurdles along the way, but
it's how you deal with it, howyou handle it in the long run,
right.
And and so I think you saidthis is interesting.
(24:28):
I'm going to bring this up.
I don't know if you remember,but you said you celebrated
turning 40 on your 39th birthday.
So I wanted to ask you whatthat?
What do you mean by that?
Melissa (24:39):
no, I literally did and it was by accident.
Yeah, yeah, but like, oh mygoodness, like for the longest I
had been planning my 40thbirthday in my head.
All right, okay, the way Iwanted to have.
Like, I wanted to have a fetand I'm still going to have a
fet.
I don't know how and when, butI'm gonna have a fet and I want
to celebrate my 40th birthday,you know, before I'm 41, and
maybe I celebrate it again whenI'm 41 plus one and when.
(25:01):
But I'm gonna have a fit and Iwant to celebrate my 40th
birthday, you know, before I'm41 and maybe I celebrate it
again when I'm 41 plus one youknow what I'm saying.
yeah, but I'm gonna, but that'show I wanted to celebrate it.
So, but I think, when I wasturning 39, my goodness, like in
my mind, I think I was just soready to turn 40.
And I was.
I remember you were, wow, I wasso ready, I.
(25:23):
There's something about I don'tknow like it representing own,
like owning yourself you knowwhat I'm saying Like becoming
who you are, like fullyblossoming, like I'm no longer
second guessing and so.
But the other thing, too, isthat there's something about me
in my 30s, like, where peoplewill still talk to me or look at
(25:46):
me as if I was younger.
You know what I'm saying.
But now I can say, like I'm 40.
You know what I'm saying?
Like there's something about 39where people are 38 and younger
and folks like treat you likeyou're a lot younger, but once
I'm 40, it's like I'm here, likeI've arrived oh, it's like whoa
40.
Carlene (26:03):
Some people are like whoa, you're 40, you don't look
at, or like you know you lookyounger than that, or like 40 is
the new 30.
There's so many things with 40,and so did you have a 40th
birthday?
Yeah, okay.
Melissa (26:17):
So all that to say all that say, my husband threw like
a surprise 40th birthday for meon my 39th.
But then it wasn't so much as asurprise because I ended up,
when he was planning it, likethere was a specific I'm a
planner, right, he's not.
And so I wanted to see my.
(26:39):
My mother was going to make aspecial meal for me for my
birthday.
So I was like I really want togo to my mom's house.
And he was like no, we're goingto his mom's house.
And I'm just like, oh, likelike it's my birthday, why can't
you just like, why can't wejust go to my mom's house and
then go to your mom's house,like it's you know?
And so I got so upset with himand so, and then he was like
(27:07):
because it's a surprise.
it's supposed to be like, oh, Ishould have just let it be, you
know, but like, for me, likedetails matter, but anyway, all
that's the same, he threw a verysmall, intimate 40th birthday
for me it perfect and a goodfriend of mine.
We also went to Mexico for my40th birthday.
So I was like, listen, I needthis.
(27:28):
You know, whether I'm 39 or 40,we're still going to celebrate.
It's all good.
That was my 40th, it was me my39th.
It was good, it was really good.
So when, by the time my 40thcame, my actual 40th birthday, I
can't tell you what I did.
I honestly, I can't.
I did absolutely.
Carlene (27:46):
And that's what I did, okay.
Melissa (27:47):
And it's the complete opposite from, like, when I
turned 25, I wanted to turn up.
You know what I'm saying.
When I turned like 30, I wantedto turn up, but, yeah, yeah, I
wanted just to be still, Iwanted to enjoy peace.
I think I may have gone to thespa, but I just I didn't have, I
didn't work that week.
I I just wanted to not have anyresponsibilities but like don't
(28:13):
do dishes on the birthday.
Carlene (28:14):
I'm like I don't do dishes on my birthday like
relaxing nothing, you know.
Yeah, that's it.
Melissa (28:20):
So that's how it was, but I think that is what set the
tone for like, the followingmonths.
Like I'm new to 40, you know mybirthday was in October, so I'm
new to it but I would say thatI love my peaceful moments, like
I just I love just waking upearly and just an hour and a
(28:42):
half to myself, reading, praying, meditating, before I start the
day.
I realize I have more patience,I realize I have more like I
don't know, like it's justthere's a level of peace that I
really enjoy and I don't know ifit's me maturing, I don't know.
Carlene (28:56):
Is it Well?
I mean, you're a mom too, right, and so is it like before the
kids get up, and like your timefor yourself.
Melissa (29:04):
Well, it's interesting that you say that, because
that's probably why I ended upwhere I started doing that,
because last year, I think so, apart of what I do too is I do
some workshops around burnoutand time and energy management
and all of that.
And I was like, by the timeDecember, like I told myself I
(29:26):
I'm not going to do any workafter October and November.
And then it became December andI'm like yo, why do I feel this
way?
I felt so depleted I meantdepleted when I, the moment I
woke up, the first thing I woulddo is go straight to getting
the kids ready, then go straightto work, and then the kids will
come home and I get them readyand then spend some time with my
husband and then, like, do alittle bit of work and then go
straight to bed and then repeatall over.
(29:47):
So with that kind of schedule, Ihad no time to myself, I was
not pouring into myself at all,and so I nearly had a breakdown.
But then I think it was more solike a breakthrough, because I
realized that I was burnt out.
I was legit burnt out because Iwas not pouring into myself.
Here I am like pouring intoeverybody else except myself.
(30:10):
And then I was like you knowwhat?
Like, let me just, I have to,like it's not, it's a
non-negotiable anymore.
Like so now, even if I, eventhough I wake up early, it's
just like, if I don't wake upearly and like have that time
for myself, you know it.
You're saying like everybodyfeels it, like I feel it, I'm
(30:31):
like something is off, whathappened or what didn't happen?
I was like you know what?
I did not point to myself today, I did not.
Carlene (30:38):
Your morning routine.
I guess it's really important.
Yeah, I have to.
Melissa (30:42):
Because otherwise I'm pouring into everybody else and
not to myself, and that all I'mgiving myself is an hour and a
half.
That's it.
Carlene (30:49):
But even when you're tired, you still feel like it
helps, like even when you are,you know, yes.
Melissa (30:56):
Especially when I'm tired, I have to Like again,
like if, if anything, at least30 minutes, like this morning.
I was like yo, I don't know.
Like all week it was like withmy legs were aching and then it
was like my thighs were achingand then my abs were aching.
So now this morning it was myback and my shoulders that were
aching and I had a headache.
(31:16):
So it felt like it was justlike creeping up all week.
So I woke up with all of thisin pain.
I was like yo, I'm cancelingtoday, like I had to sleep.
And I asked my husband I waslike yo, can you just get the
kids ready?
I'll be there in like 30minutes or so.
So, with that being said, I wasnot able to have my usual
routine because I was likehurting, yeah.
(31:38):
And then he got them ready andI was like okay, I'm good to get
up.
I had my coffee, got the kidsout the door, but I was like you
know what, before I check myemail, I'm going to give 15
minutes to myself in just puresilence, just 15.
I didn't do the whole 30, but Iwas like just 15 minutes, put
(31:58):
on some meditation, music andjust be still.
And then I was like all right,let's go.
I need to.
You know I'm ready for the day.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Diva Tonight.
Glamour for your ears.
This is 40, A FemalePerspective with host Carleen.
Carlene (32:13):
Yeah, you know what, even if it's not the meditation,
but even a moment of quiet.
But I've been gettingdistracted by my phone as of
late and now I'm like, oh, Ihave to get back and like not go
on my phone first thing in themorning and like just take that
time, like you said.
So no, the me time is crucial,it totally is.
(32:33):
And yeah, meditation has beenaround a long time and I did a
nine week workshop.
That was hard for me.
It was like three hours out ofmy day, you know, right after
work and like every Monday at630, it was like you know.
But once I did it I was likethis is helpful you know, and I
experienced meditationdifferently.
Melissa (32:54):
You know what I'm saying, because it's not for me,
it's.
It's being just being, stilljust being in tune.
Sometimes I play meditationmusic.
I might ask Alexa to play somemeditation music for me.
I might put on some gospel, Imight just put on something
that's not like going to roughup During the day, I might get
amped up and change the playlist, but for that 15 minutes I'm
(33:15):
just like.
Sometimes I play no music.
You know, it's just me.
I might journal, I might read,but it's just me.
Carlene (33:20):
I might journal, I might read, I might, but it's
just about me feeding my soul atthat moment yeah, and I think I
think that's the one thing Ihaven't talked about it is um,
in this series it is not justthe, I guess, the mental health
aspect not too much focusing,but just even health itself and
and that because I guess youknow it just depends on where
you are in your life, at 40 youknow, and and it's true.
(33:43):
So the time that you spendalone in the morning is so
important and I, even if I falloff of it, I watch like a
podcast, like the Mel Robbinspodcast he's like, you know,
she's like sometimes you getannoyed with her, but it's like
like, OK, now you're right.
You know like, wake up earlier,drink a glass of water.
(34:05):
You know all these remindersthat we have to give ourselves
because we're so programmedRight and so it really is
important, though, like you said, and the thing is that for me,
I like personally, witheverything that's happened with
like politically is pretty heavy.
Melissa (34:26):
I used to like, when I drink my cup when I woke up,
got the kids ready I will alsodrink coffee and watch the news
at the same time.
So I will start my day with thenews.
And now I can't, like I don'teven have to turn on the news to
even know what's happening,like I can, just it's like it's
all around me.
So that was another reason whyI was like you know, I need to
be still before my energy orbefore I'm affected by all the
(34:49):
news.
You know what I'm saying,because it can be overwhelming
and I'm the kind of person thatcan internalize that.
And then, like somebody callsme while I'm internalizing it
and I'm like taking it out onthem, like what you want?
You know I'm angry, I'm pissed,you know, and it's like I'm not
pissed, like I'm not mad at you, yeah, but it's just like I
need to like get all of thisenergy out so, so like I had to
(35:12):
manage that.
So that was a huge part as tolike why I needed to clock that
time out, because I was like Iset that foundation before I'm
all triggered.
Carlene (35:25):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Part of your day, oh my gosh, Ithink it's so true, though I
think even late at night.
Apparently it's not good towatch it late at night too, but
I'm like I feel like if I don'twatch the news, like I don't
know what's going on.
But, like you said, it'severywhere.
It doesn't matter Social media,it doesn't matter where you're,
(35:45):
you're going to get theinformation right.
Melissa (35:47):
I go to the gym and it's on the screens.
I'm just like oh my gosh.
Yeah, I want to see anything,it's just, oh yeah, I get to
overstimulated by it.
So now it's like I want to bein control of when I'm ready to
watch the news, when I want tosee the news.
Carlene (36:07):
yeah, so that's, almost like.
I don't want to I can't.
Melissa (36:10):
So it's, it's a lot, and you're right like it's
important to stay informed, butit's like I will become informed
when I'm ready, right, I'malready like I see everything
that's happening.
It's, I see it, I know it, butI want to be in control in terms
of, like, what is coming my way, right?
And we got to filter thatinformation because there's a
(36:32):
lot of fake news out there.
Carlene (36:33):
There's a lot of it, you know oh, that's a
controversial thing they'resaying about the fake news,
right, but I think if somebodytold me this, it's like the news
, certain things are considereda distraction, right, like in a
way.
But we could go through a wholething with that.
So, yeah, but yeah, it's crazy.
(36:54):
We are living in a crazy timeright now, and so anything you
can do to calm the storm, calmyour mind, so that it doesn't
affect you, stress wise, it'strue.
Like I mean, I'm in Canada,you're in the US, but like we're
supposed to be like, but we'reaffected as well.
Yeah, yeah, I, we are.
(37:16):
Yeah, totally, the whole thingright now.
That's happening.
It's, it's unsettling in a in away, because I work in an
industry where the change couldhappen.
Like it's on pause right now,but I'm not going to go straight
into it.
But yeah, whatever happens willdefinitely affect Canadians too
.
So it's just a matter of time.
We'll see how it goes, right.
Melissa (37:38):
And, at the same time, it's like being mindful of what
is it that we can put ourenergy towards.
You know what do we have thecapacity to do right now.
You know right, right, don't we?
So sometimes, you know what canyou control and what don't you
have control and what you know,what communities can you join
and how effective can you be?
Carlene (37:58):
Right, and that whole positive mindset.
You know, the one thing wedidn't talk about is your family
.
And you know, there's one storythat you told me.
I don't know if you want toshare that story, but I thought
it was so powerful when you werehaving your son in the hospital
and like, I don't even know ifyou want to talk about that, but
(38:20):
yeah, I thought that story wasvery powerful because I think a
lot of women who have kids canrelate.
Oh, you know what I mean, orwhat do you call it.
Oh, how do I say that?
Melissa (38:31):
yeah, so just your son , so you have a son, and then do
you have more than one child,or yeah, yeah, I have a son and
a daughter, oh, and so this isthe story about the level of
pain.
Carlene (38:43):
Yeah, ok so, oh right, that's a little oh yeah, I'm
like there's so many differentyeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa (38:54):
So giving birth to my son was my first child and I was
supposed to have a scheduledC-section and so he was to see
schedule C-section was going tobe on March 28th, which is seven
months before my birthday, andI specifically told March 28th
because my birthday is onOctober 28th.
(39:14):
So I was like, okay, we can,you know, be seven months apart.
Yay, but when I was gettingready to go to the hospital, I
was like I don't know if Ireally want to do this, like
something just told me, likejust give them a call and just
see if you know, just havenatural birth and just try it
out.
You know, it's like all right,fine.
So I called and they're like,yeah, you can wait.
(39:34):
And that was the first time Iactually got that type of
response Fast forward, got thattype of response Fast forward.
I went to a learning house, ateaching hospital.
I went to a teaching hospital,a major teaching hospital in New
York, where I ended up givingbirth.
Now, the moment that we went in, okay, first of all, when they
had to like inject that needlehere or whatever I do not like
(39:58):
needles, okay, I've never likedneedles.
Yes, I was like 30 years old.
I still cry when I get needles.
I do not like needles.
And so when the doctors askedme what's my plan, I was like
epidural, because I don't wantto feel any pain.
I don't want to feel anyneedles, anything.
This intern kept poking me,couldn't find my vein and I'm
like yo, I'm going to go at youLike I'm having, I'm in labor,
(40:21):
and he couldn't find it like fora solid 10, 15 minutes trying
to find my vein to like pop it.
So that was the first likefrustrating thing, cause I'm
like I'm literally in labor, sofine, whatever.
So now they're preparing,they're trying to catch me, get
my doctor, and then my waterbroke, okay, and the
anesthesiologist arrived, butnow they can't give me the
(40:42):
epidural because my water justbroke.
So my water broke, and so nowthey're like all right, so I
guess it's time You're going tohave to push and I'm like all
right, fine, so I'm pushingagain.
I just wanted epidural from thebeginning, so I did not want to
feel any pain.
I didn't want to feel any.
This is how much of a like Idon't want to say a wimp, but I
(41:07):
really don't like pain.
I didn't want to feel anyneedle and I really didn't want
to give natural birth.
I just want, I just want.
I didn't want to, but here I am, we're going to do this, right,
yeah yeah.
So, pushing and pushing,pushing, my son comes out and my
, my son arrives, and the nextthing they know is that they
realize that I am torn downthere in that area and so they
(41:27):
have to stitch me up.
I'm like, oh my God, I got todo needles now, you know like
can we do this tomorrow Like?
no, we got to do it right nowbecause we don't want to take
the risk of infection.
So I'm like I literally justgave birth and they're like oh,
just put him on your chest,because you know you won't even
think about the pain.
And I'm like yeah.
I don't understand.
(41:48):
I do not like pain.
Right.
And first of all, I just gavebirth naturally with no epidural
.
So I insisted, I was like, no,I do not want my son on my chest
, like I don't like pain andit's too much for me right now.
(42:09):
And they insisted, I'm like allright, fine, whatever.
So they put him on my chest,they put some topical cream on
me, all right, didn't even allowit to settle and they started
stitching and I felt everysingle stitch.
My husband, you know like,grabbed my son and I was like,
see, like they don't, they'renot listening, like I did not
want him on my chest and theydidn't allow, you know,
anesthesia to topical anesthesiato kick in.
So I felt everything and whatthat made me realize was one
(42:33):
they made assumptions that I cantolerate pain, right yeah.
And they were rushing thatwhole process and I don't know
why they were rushing, but Ifelt everything.
And then, like my husband,who's a tall black man, didn't
know how to advocate, for me orfor him, you know like we're
both thinking, of course, likewe're going to do what the
(42:53):
doctors say because they are inthe right, right, but they
weren't.
I should not have had to sufferin that way.
Carlene (43:00):
Yeah, wow, yeah.
It's like I think in the moment, like you just don't know how
to react or what, like you knowyou're just help me out here.
You know what I mean.
And hearing that story again,it's like if only they would
listen.
And I think that's what a lotof people feel like in the
medical system.
Like you're always having toadvocate for yourself and then
(43:25):
sometimes no one's hearing youwhen you're saying like I don't
like needles, like I'm the sameway I don't like needles either.
I don't like pain.
You know there's some of usthat don't have a high tolerance
for pain.
Yeah, yeah.
Melissa (43:37):
I specifically said I don't want him on my chest Right
Cause like it's too much goingon right now.
Like I don't want him on mychest Right Because it's too
much going on right now.
Like I don't want him on mychest right now.
I didn't even know that was athing.
Yeah, yeah, not right now.
Like you're about to sew me up,like I don't want him on my
chest at this moment.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
You know there is a time for bonding, and right now.
Melissa (43:56):
I can only do one thing at a time, and so this is
the other thing Like, I get thatthey're the experts, but what's
the difference between, likeyou know, like, delaying my
bonding time with my son?
You know, because of yourtheory.
You know like, oh, if you puthim on chest to chest, you know
all this?
Listen, I was still able tomilk, I was still able, like,
waiting 10, 15 minutes.
(44:17):
Yeah, I didn't make thatsignificant of a significant
difference, you know.
And so, like, the other thingtoo is our identities, and I
mentioned that my husband is atall black man.
Because when you're in aninstitution, like you know, the
hospital, you know, if headvocated for me, first of all,
no one's teaching.
You know, before you give birth, oh, how to advocate at that
(44:37):
time.
You know saying, oh, to packyour bags.
And you know, when the baby isborn, it's gonna look pale and
yada, yada, yada, but no onesays, hey, this is how you
advocate for your wife.
And so if he advocated for me,what would that look like?
They would get, you know,security on him.
You know saying like, if theysay you listen to her, she
(44:58):
doesn't want the baby on herchest, or like wait, like, hold
up like let's put the the, youknow, let's wait for the cream
to settle, you know, but.
But you know, but the secondround, when we had our second
child, that we were in a fairand you're like listen, you know
how to advocate now and then itwas, and it was a completely
(45:19):
different experience.
It was a different hospital,yeah, completely different
experience, and it was perfect.
Everything was just perfect.
Carlene (45:27):
It's a learning experience, right?
You're first time parents.
You're nervous, those are.
See, that's the thing.
It's always everything thatthey don't tell you.
Like I'm sure, like your momdidn't even tell you, like our
parents didn't don't even tellus those things, like you know
what I mean, like you don'tlearn those.
I don't know if I'm not, Ishouldn't assume but I don't
know if your mom ever told youabout giving birth.
(45:50):
Like it's always the untoldstories, right?
Melissa (45:53):
yeah, I mean we've had stories about giving birth, but
I, you know every story it's.
It's just that it's thatperson's story, right, it's
going to be very different fromsomebody else.
But after that happened to meagain, another expectation was
for me to continue to be supermom not even continue, but to be
super mom.
(46:14):
Okay.
Like, let me set the stage foryou, carlene.
Okay, yeah, and I just gavebirth.
I'm sold.
You know, like I have stitchesin an area that I don't usually
have stitches.
I gave him Vicodin, okay.
So now I'm like taking Vicodinwhenever it's necessary.
I'm in pain, I have to sit on adonut, and we're learning how
(46:35):
to be parents and we weren'tmarried at the time and so I'm
over here like trying to figureout when is my milk going to
come, how is he going to latch?
Things about work, you know,about my body, me being a mom,
just a lot happening.
And at the same time, I had somany folks coming into my house,
(46:55):
loved ones coming into my house.
Oh my gosh, I need to nurse.
How, how come you didn't feedthe baby?
I'm like yo, the baby's good.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, all that level ofpressure, like why are you
walking like that?
And I'm like yo, you know, likeit was a lot.
I felt like I didn't get thatlevel of nurture and support
(47:17):
that I really needed and I don'tknow, I don't again, I don't
know if it's because it's it'slike maybe folks assume because
of my personality that I'll begood.
I got this.
But that's not always the case.
And for my second child, mydaughter, I made sure that I was
like I don't want anybodycoming to the, to the hospital,
I don't want anyone coming tothe house for the first two
weeks.
(47:37):
I need time for my family toadjust first before folks come
in judging, criticizing advisingall of the things.
I was like no, yeah, Again,prioritizing us first.
Carlene (47:52):
Yes, yeah, I think that's the thing too, like I had
to say it.
In the Caribbean culture it'salways like why didn't you do
this?
Or like you know, there'salways someone else has an
opinion and like we have to justlike let it be, but at the same
time it's like you know whatit's too much, yeah, yeah, this
sounds really overwhelming.
(48:13):
I don't think I've heard anyonesay oh my goodness yeah, it's
like when you're sick too, okay,just make sure you have the
ginger tea with honey and lime.
I'm like, yes, you know thatthing when COVID happened and I
got that cough, and I'm like I'mso tired of everybody being
like drink hot water, make sureyou put lime in it.
(48:34):
I'm like, yeah, I've been doingthat, but the cough is still
here.
It's been you know, what I meanand I'm just like, I am doing it
, I am drinking it, I am.
I have been drinking the teawith the honey and the lemon
lime.
It's totally different thanwhat you're talking about, but
I'm not a mob so I can't relate.
But it's like another thingwhen, when everyone is like
giving you advice and you'relike, yeah, I know, listen,
(48:58):
they're trying to be helpful.
But in Caribbean culture, inour culture, it's like sometimes
it's it's not helpful andsometimes you're just like I
don't know.
Melissa (49:07):
Yeah yeah, yeah, it can be overwhelming sometimes,
it can like again, I know it'sfrom a good place.
you know, like he's like.
He says like you, sometimes youjust gotta like from caribbean
folks, you just gotta take itlike I guess of course I will, I
will you know.
And take it Like I guess ofcourse I will, I will you know.
And then it's like, if y'alljust listen, the one advice I
will never forget and me and myhusband we laugh about this, and
(49:29):
this was a serious advice mydaughter, we think at the time,
like, looking back at it, shemay have had COVID.
She was a toddler, Like COVIDwas a thing in the other, like
in China, but didn't yet.
Oh, I was trapped here, but shehad the symptoms.
But anyway, I have to say theadvice that we were told from a
family was oh yeah, just put herpee pee on her forehead.
(49:50):
We're not going to put urine onher forehead, I'm sorry.
No, that's not happening.
That's not happening.
Carlene (49:55):
Wow, ok, I don't think I've ever heard that.
Ok, okay, I don't think.
Melissa (49:59):
I've ever heard that.
Okay, wow.
And so I was like yeah.
So I was like I know you, Imean.
Carlene (50:09):
Well, I know it's coming from a good place.
I know it was a bit much, oh mygosh.
The, the, the, the advice, youknow what I mean there's.
There's a lot of differentthings that people give you,
depending on the culture, whenyou have a child, right, and
even in Italian families, but Ithink, I think, what you you
definitely shared there is, likeit's hard to be a parent.
You know what I mean.
It's, it's the one job that youhave that I guess you get paid
(50:32):
in different ways, but it's ahard job, right, and so, yeah,
yeah.
Melissa (50:37):
Yeah, it's something that you know like someone told
me that kids didn't ask to behere.
So my, my goal is to makememories, not to feel the hurt
or the pain that I are, and forthem to enjoy their youth.
You know, saying like be ableto, and it's yeah and just.
(51:00):
I just want to raise goodcitizens, that's all you know
what I'm saying.
It is hard as heck, but at thesame time, like it's hard out
here.
It's hard, but you know, likethere there are folks who have
fewer resources than I have andwho are doing an amazing job.
(51:21):
You know what I'm saying, andso yeah.
Carlene (51:24):
Well, that's the powerful thing, Melissa.
I think it's important that youknow everyone shares their
journey and like how challengingit can be.
But it's kind of likeinteresting to hear that
perspective too, because I thinkfor me, like you know, when you
turn 40, like you have two kidsbut I don't have any of my, I
remember telling my dad about mycondition, like I'm not gonna
(51:46):
say what's going on, but andthen you have, when you're 40,
you have less time, right, andso I just remember my dad
telling me how he would like ifI did have kids, and I was just
like you've never actually saidanything about that, like he
never pressured me.
So it was just interesting nowat this age that he brought that
(52:06):
up.
And I always think it's sointeresting, like how parents
are and I'm like, oh so you, youdid want me to have kids.
You just never like pushed meor anything Like you'd always
push me from doing a business ifI had a business idea and I it
didn't go.
Well, you know what I mean.
But like, yeah, it's kind oflike when, when your, your time
is limited, it kind of putsthing into perspective, right,
(52:29):
and so that's my perspectivewith that.
But hearing you talk about likeyour challenges too, like
nothing is ironclad either way,and I think, yeah, it's just
society either way.
And I think, yeah, it's justsociety, right, and like family
and everything.
So, yeah, I'm Carlene and thisis Diva Tonight with Melissa
Schillingford Is that how yousay it?
All right, amazing.
(52:53):
Thank you so much for sharingyour journey.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:57):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat diva underscore tonight.
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