February 14, 2025 • 42 mins
In this episode of Divergent Paths, I sit down with Juliana Allen, a somatic healing coach, civil service executive director, and mother, to explore the deep and often complex journey of discovering neurodivergence later in life. Juliana shares her personal experience of being diagnosed with ADHD as an adult, unraveling years of masking, perfectionism, and societal expectations that never quite fit.
We discuss the impact of late diagnoses, the struggles of existing in systems not built for neurodivergent people, and the emotional weight of learning how to work with your brain instead of against it. Juliana’s story is one of empowerment, resilience, and the importance of breaking down rigid structures that stifle authenticity.
If you’ve ever felt like a zebra in a pack of horses—navigating a world that wasn’t designed for you—this episode will resonate. Tune in for an insightful conversation about self-discovery, somatic healing, and redefining success outside of neurotypical norms.
🔹 Follow Juliana on Instagram: @reclaimwithjuliana 🔹 Connect with Divergent Paths Consulting on Instagram and BlueSky: @divergentpathsconsulting
🎧 Listen now and join the conversation!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Society is not open to functioning differently.
(00:07):
I am highly productive, but the way that I do things is just different than the way some typical neurotypical people will do stuff.
And how can I still show up as me in these systems and structures that weren't built for us?
(00:36):
Welcome to Divergent Paths, the podcast where we explore unique journeys, neurodivergent experiences, and the ways we can challenge conventional thinking to create a more inclusive world.
I'm your host, Dr. Regina McMenomy. I am a doctor, but not that kind of doctor. And this is a podcast, not medical advice.
I'm thrilled to welcome Juliana Allen to the show. Juliana is a somatic healing coach, a civil service executive director, and a mom.
(01:05):
Juliana shares her story of discovering how her ADHD was linked to many other experiences and complications she experienced throughout her life.
So stay tuned and thanks for listening to Divergent Paths.
Is fashion like a special interest of yours? Is this something that was like a persistent interest that caused you kind of to start the shop and have that as part of what you did?
(01:31):
Honestly, no. No, it wasn't. I started the boutique. So prior to that, I was in physical therapy, actually.
And then I had my first kiddo. And I went shopping. Six weeks postpartum.
Which, yeah, if nobody tells you, that is an awful idea. Bad idea. Yeah. Like, whatever. It's not a good idea. Yeah. Your body is still so much in transition at that point.
(02:03):
There's so much going on. Like, oh, yeah. Your hormones and everything, right? And I went shopping and I remember being in the mall in the dressing room and I just start crying because I was like, nothing fits.
I feel this way and that way. And like just sitting there crying in the dressing room with my newborn baby. And I just was like, I'm going to make a store that's going to be different.
(02:25):
And so a year later, I opened up, opened this size and your clothing boutique. And that's, that's really how that happened.
That's amazing. Yeah, a lot of ideas, a lot of passions. And that's, that's what stuck at that point in time. So nice.
I mean, I, you know, we're talking about neurodivergence and that's definitely one of the things that sort of happens for our, you know, creative and unique brains is something stick.
(02:53):
That might be surprising.
But it was a wonderful time. I really, I don't have any, I have very fond memories of that time and it was honestly really kind of where I found myself and found my voice like through, it was almost like through empowering, trying to empower other people.
(03:15):
And it was really helpful for me to be able to like, finally figure out who I was and be able to use my voice. So it was a, I'm really, I really am proud of that.
Proud of the boutique and the foundation and everything. So it's, it's been closed now for a couple years, but still doesn't feel, feel like it, but it has been. I know I still have to remind myself sometimes.
(03:39):
I'm in the area and I'm like, oh no, actually, no, it was time. It was time to close it down and yeah, it was, it was for a season.
I mean, you know, we have these messed up ideas about of success, right? We have these ideas that things have to persist in order for it to be a success and that's, that's one of the things I really want people to like change their mindsets about like, that's not,
(04:06):
success isn't one thing. There are many ways to be successful and that there are times in your life where, you know, like I, I mentioned before we started recording that my old podcast used to be about was about video games and I don't play video games anymore.
I don't, I don't really do that, but, but for there was a time where it was really important. It was the big thing and that podcast was great and we did a lot and I think it was a really successful thing that I did. And when I started this podcast, there was a little morning for me and I'm not doing that one anymore.
(04:38):
You know, like that was when I fell in love with podcasting, but you know, now we know, you know, this is the new phase.
It's interesting to, I know we haven't touched on neurodivergence too much yet, but I definitely have ADHD and you know, at that point I didn't know that.
And so there was this narrative in my head that I was failing because I wanted to do something different.
(05:03):
And you know, I kind of lost my, I didn't necessarily lose my passion for it, but it switched. And the way that I, the way that I was passionate about doing it was just not, it wasn't realistic.
There was this whole feeling like a failure because I gave up or I decided I got bored and I quit or something. That was the narrative that I said and that was a narrative that I heard from other people too. Not everybody, but some people.
(05:37):
Yeah, I mean there's always critics when you, when you stop doing something or you make choices, you know, for your mental health sometimes you're always going to have somebody who's like, but you should be doing this or whatnot or people who still hold that older version of you as who you are.
Right. And that's, that's a hard thing to do. So, so was it through when when when did you first then start to suspect that you are ADHD, or that you were neurodivergent.
(06:05):
No, I was a long story. How much time do we have? No, I'm kidding. So I actually was diagnosed with OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder when I was about 10 years old, which we're talking early 90s here.
Yeah, that's when girls wouldn't have been diagnosed with ADHD.
(06:26):
None of that, none of that. And you know, I don't, I OCD ADHD it all kind of falls in all. Yeah, yeah, it's all neurodivergence, it's all neurodivergence. Yeah. Yeah. So the ADHD really didn't come out until I think I was only diagnosed about a year ago, which is fascinating really but
like in hindsight, I look at my life and I like, oh, that's why, you know, and there's so many of these things because I, you know, the OCD since I was 10, I struggled for a long time with an eating disorder.
(07:00):
And for me that two are very related because it was for control. Yeah, it was control and you know, I, I feel everything very intensely and very deeply in like I didn't have a filter. Right. Like, I couldn't filter out all the information that was being thrown at me, you know, familiar.
(07:22):
Very familiar. Yes. Yeah. So like the eating disorder was a really big part of my way to cope with it and turns out I just had undiagnosed ADHD, and yeah, it's, it's an interesting thought like what would have happened if it was a little bit more known.
Right, if they would have understood that the presentations were different. You know, and sometimes they're not like there there are plenty of, you know, female identified or assigned female birth, people who present hyperactive you know like classic classically
(07:59):
so to quote, unquote, hyperactive, but there's also like for me my hyperactivity has never been physically manifested. It has always been in my brain my brain is very active.
And, you know, and that that was the difference and that's, it's hard to see that. Right. And it's hard to identify that unless you really do kind of dive in and talk to somebody and kind of get to the root of some of those.
(08:26):
It's so interesting now how there's all of all of us in our 30s 40s 50s whatever.
Oh, turns out.
Inner circles are all, all, all, I know I have I have people who are like but I do that too, and I'm not and I'm like hey babe I love you but we're friends.
(08:56):
We tend to find each other. We tend to just seek each other out.
No, not intentionally. I just, not intentionally. It's just, you know, you may you make sense I know you probably heard. This is not my metaphor but you're a zebra in a pack of horses right so like, you know, when you're neurodivergent,
(09:18):
you, you're very similar to in many fashions to a horse but you're a zebra so you look a little different, you're, you know, size a little different and your hair is a little weird or you know whatever, whatever it is but you're trying to be a horse and
you can't quite be a horse and can't quite figure out why running with that pack of horses is not really working for you until you're like, oh, I'm not a horse.
(09:42):
I am a zebra in fact I'm a zebra. Right. And so, like that idea of the zebras in the pack find each other, right, because they know they understand and like, you know, they, they, they start to conform to, you know, to, to each other they start to,
you know, kind of not conform that's not the right word. They connect with each other based on, you know, on their difference, rather than on their, their performance of trying to look like a horse.
(10:12):
So, it does make perfect sense.
Yes, it really does. There's so yeah, almost all my friends, and then I think that's also interesting because, like I've, you know, now, now that I know this, I kind of observe how, like my relationships work, and how like conversations will go and having a conversation
(10:34):
with a neurotypical human is very different than my close knit group of friends that are all neurodivergent and we can be having like 20 conversations at one time, right. Yep. And always go back to it and it sometimes is a bit challenging to be in close relationship
with people that are not neurodivergent because they just, it's not how their brain works and it's right and then and then things that you think, at least this is my experience things that were were normal and, and supportive like, I would always.
(11:11):
It was years before I learned that for neurotypical or neuro normative, you know, people, it's rude to tell a story of your own in response to their story, like the what
you, I can tell you exactly how the same thing has impacted me.
(11:35):
I still don't think that's rude.
I think it's rude. Yes, it shows.
Let me just tell you, it shows compassion and empathy, and it's like, I can understand where you are coming from. Yes, I am going to fight that one because I don't think that's true.
(11:57):
Yeah, I agree. I am, I am a little more mindful of it now, where I will often say, is it okay if I share a story.
Yes, especially if it's somebody who I don't have a really strong rapport with like with my close friends like, like, none of us do that because we all know.
(12:18):
We know exactly what we're doing and we've had this discussion about like, oh, there are a subset of people who think that this is, you know, rude or, you know, centering yourself in the conversation.
So we've already had those conversations but when I'm talking with someone who isn't that, you know, I don't have that rapport with I will check in and say, you know, I'm hearing some similarities to my life.
(12:42):
Do you want to hear a story that might relate to it, or are you looking for a different kind of feedback, like, you know, to take a step to say or what they might need in the conversation versus what is easy for me to just kind of like, present to them.
That's a really good idea actually. Good job. Thanks.
(13:06):
Yeah, maybe I should do that too. Nice work.
I mean it's just, it took it took fumbling, it took you know I have.
I have lost neuro typical friends, like, because of, of how I how I present and how I work so you know I'm getting to that after.
(13:31):
Yeah, it's, it's an interesting thing like,
yeah, trying to fit in in places that are not designed for neurodivergent people, it's really exhausting and an interesting, interesting thing, you know, to try to, like, okay I'm supposed to ask these questions I'm not supposed to do this okay be quiet like
(13:57):
I'm supposed to interrupt you and like those things it's it's a, it takes a lot of more mental energy to be able to like conform yourself almost exactly. Yeah.
Yeah, that's that's we did an episode recently about masking and that's that's largely, that's largely the effect that masking has on me masking is a very draining experience.
(14:20):
And I was in that episode about how when I first was diagnosed I didn't think I'm asked at all, and then I started to realize there was only the mask.
In many ways, and that I get to who I really was I had to kind of strip away layers that I had like built up in terms of protect protection.
Yeah, that's, that's hard to because it's like having a brain that doesn't work typically it's like we were, I think in general most of us weren't taught how to understand who we really are.
(14:51):
No, and so we put the mask on and we conform to what we're supposed to be and
it's hard. It's hard to figure out like, okay well who am I underneath that mask. Right.
Yeah, it's definitely some time and yeah, yeah.
Did you have big revelations did you have big things that sort of came out of your unmasking or that is a lovely way to put that yeah.
(15:26):
So I was super disconnected from my body. Right. Well I imagine with the, with the OCD and the eating disorder. Those are processes of disconnection right both of them are taking you away from the somatic experience yeah.
Yeah, and so I was just very, you know, I was a talking head, walking around having no idea what my body was actually saying to me. And, you know, after I had my second kiddo May 2020, which I feel like is enough said, wow, just in and of itself to
(15:57):
have a child pandemic right like don't do that. If you want, actually if you want your entire world to unravel. Have a kid have an infant in the middle of a worldwide pandemic yes.
But yeah, my everything started that really unraveled then, and I like, you know, it got to the point where I could not hold it in anymore. I couldn't, I could not mask anymore.
(16:27):
There was too much stress with the business with the nonprofit that I had with my partner and my kids. And it all just started to like unravel, and it got to the point where it's like okay my body is screaming at me.
I can't talk myself out of it.
Right. Yeah, the, the amount of talk therapy I did it's just like, I was like, I have done 25 years of talk therapy. Why don't I feel better. Well, when you do talk therapy, and you're high masking your your performing therapy, you're not so good at it.
(17:04):
I was so good at it too man.
Yeah, plus.
I was so frustrated I was like why don't I feel better, like, want to curl up and just really just stay there. Yes, be there. Yeah. And, you know, it wasn't until I found like somatic therapy that I was like, oh, right.
(17:27):
I have a body and it tells me things right. Yeah. And I was so scared to be in the body. Yes, because I didn't want to hear what it was going, what I like knew it was going to tell me right like there's always these things you're like I know what's in there
but I am going to talk my way through it. I'm going to put a mask, I'm going to be exactly who I was taught I was supposed to be.
(17:51):
And then everything falls apart. Right. Like, I'm so thankful everything fell apart but it was a, it was a look at your, it was a come to Jesus kind of moment I guess right.
Way to say it. I mean that's in, you know, that is a that is a perfect description, like in terms of like a cultural ideology, right, like, okay, I'm what is, what is real here, what what is real what can what do I need to step away from, what do I need to have as my,
(18:22):
my big moments of understanding and breaking through, you know, who I am.
I think like as people identifying as women like we are taught to like you you get in your box.
You smile in that box, and you don't come out of that. Right.
And neurodivergence, like, it is literally impossible for us to be in boxes but we're that's what we're supposed to be doing. And when that starts to really come through it's, it's pretty big.
(18:59):
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a revolutionary thing. The number of relationships I have lost the, the changes that have happened in my life, the, the changes I had to make to my work life are all.
They were all completely unexpected and came directly out of the diagnosis, and my, my relationship with my body change when I went on my, when I went on ADHD medications, because I had never had a regulated nervous system, and.
(19:35):
Oh my gosh, when I first started meds for the ADHD, I was like,
Oh, this is how people feel. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding? Are you serious? I've been 40 years.
Yeah.
And you need to tell me that other people don't feel the need to, like, it's just,
(20:04):
yep, I know it's just it's just, it's, it's shockingly, it's a shockingly different life.
And, you know, having that that regulation and, and then starting to notice, and that's what the last year in part has been for me is starting to notice the things that off that upset my nervous system, because when you're living in a state of dysregulation constantly, there's no way to know what's setting you off, right, because you can't take that information in right.
(20:39):
When you're constantly off, you can't take that information in so then all of a sudden I was like, Oh, I, I stopped drinking caffeine. I stopped drinking alcohol, not entirely but mostly, mostly.
Primarily, I started noticing the foods that were better for me to eat and foods that were not foods that you know activated certain responses in my body that I wouldn't have picked up on before I had the medication because I just, you know, they just weren't there.
(21:09):
They were there but I couldn't, I couldn't hear them, like, that's what I said, like, I'm not once I started the medication, I'm not my ADHD is still there, I still have a baby of squirrels that you know bounce around in my brain constantly, but now I can actually like
talk to them and can say, Okay, you are the squirrel that needs attention right now versus whatever just decided to bubble to the top.
(21:40):
So that's a typical job, right, like I go into an office, and I do things right like that's a typical job right now. And before I started ADHD meds, it was, I was dying, like, I was dying, and then guess what I started meds, and I made a list.
And then I did the list.
(22:03):
I said, I need to do the list.
I said this to one of my co workers and they were like, Yeah, that's what people do.
That's not a failure.
(22:34):
I can see so many things at once I can see so many possibilities I can see so many opportunities and so many things that can be done but at the same time, that is also a constant sense of overwhelm, right, like, there are so many possibilities and so many paths
there are so many roads that, like being able to focus down a little more on that is really a beautiful thing because because I have such an array of options right and then I can, I can just choose instead of feeling that that overwhelming
(23:09):
sensation that I needed to do all of the things I don't feel like I need to do all of the things anymore and that is, that's a huge shift. Yeah, same here, it's, you know, just the understanding of this is, this is who I am.
Right. And, you know, not attaching any judgment to it not attaching any shame to it but just being like this is the way my brain works. Yeah, and this is what this is what I mean, in order to be my most authentic self.
(23:47):
And that's okay. Yeah, like I think there's also so much stigma around meds and that bothers me too because, oh, so I mentioned the obsessive compulsive disorder like meds completely changed my life, like, almost instantly it was the same with the ADHD meds
where it was like, it didn't take it away, but it was, it was that little switch for me that was like, oh, okay, that's irrational, like I can, I don't have to wash my hands 20 times, I got it, you know I can wash my hands one time.
(24:20):
Right. That's okay. Right. You know, it was a, it was a very similar experience with the ADHD meds where it was like, very quick like, huh.
Yeah. And it didn't take away any of who I am. I think that was a fear of mine too I was like, I like who I am. I think I'm fun, I can like do all the things, or none of the things too.
(24:42):
So it was. Yeah. Yeah, big advocate for it for sure. Yeah. Yep. I am. I am too. And when I went in to talk to my primary care physician after I had my diagnosis because I didn't, I didn't go through her to get diagnosed
I had the kind of insurance I was had the privilege to have the kind of insurance that I could just go to the assessment office and get the assessment done and go through all that on my own because I was almost positive at, so I was 48 when I was when I'm like okay I need to get
(25:18):
diagnosed, and I had my assessment done a few days after my 49th birthday so like right after I turned 49 I had my assessment. And I knew that walking into my primary care physicians office who I was positive didn't have a deep understanding of ADHD
in fact she still calls it ADD so like I know that because she still refers to it as ADD and I'm like that's cute but we all get the age, some way or another, everybody's age.
(25:49):
And I knew that it was like unlikely that she had any deep understanding of ADHD and so when I brought in the report that had been verified by three different psychologists and had, you know, all of the details, and I'd sent it to her and she was you know she read
all this and the first thing she said to me is well not all adults with ADHD need to be medicated. And I was like, great, but, but let's let's look at my life okay I am, I'm 49. I am in a, you know, high level administration position at any university.
(26:25):
I'm a mom, I am, you know, x, y, z, and I am suffering in every aspect of my life right now, every aspect of my life is a struggle. And I think it has to do with me being undiagnosed for my entire life and unmedicated for, you know, almost 50 years.
And I was like, no, this is a long time, because had I gone into her with all of that success because when I walked into my assessment there, the psychologist like I can't wait to talk to you and I'm like, okay.
(26:59):
Why.
And he said well it's not, you know, it's not usual for us to get someone your age with your success, who has not been diagnosed like like you being undiagnosed with multiple college degrees with a high level career, like, you know, most, most people with
(27:21):
the level of ADHD you have would have fallen apart earlier than this.
So I was like, okay, great.
Not really sure.
Thank you. I think I'm not sure what's supposed to be but he you know and he's like imagine if you'd had the support, imagining if you had the support that goes with the diagnosis.
(27:45):
And I was like, it that was really for forming for me to get the diagnosis because it means it's going to be easier road for my child right like, like, we know we're clear, we understand, you know, so yeah.
Yeah, I, I've done a lot of things too. And it's like, I don't like how that is used as.
(28:09):
That's an interesting, interesting proof of non proof of neurotypical or neuronal behavior right.
I can do plenty with it. Right. Totally.
Right. It's like I can do it but that doesn't mean that it was like my job, like, I can do it. Right. Yeah, was I miserable. Yes. Was I playing on hard mode was I, you know, yeah, yeah.
(28:35):
I feel like a total failure off the time. Yes, because it was. Yeah, I don't like that. Now I know I was, I was like wow at the first I was like oh well that's, you know, yeah I did do all that with all this and then I was like this really probably
wasn't the best way to introduce me to the fact that I had ADHD.
(28:56):
I'm in the medical field might have been a little gentler about this. Yeah, seriously. Yeah, but, um, but I'm still, I am still glad that it that I got that I got it but, um, you know, at the same time I'm like well, yeah, this could have been presented differently.
The person that evaluated me for my for my ADHD I had known because we had done, I had done therapy with them like years prior. And they said, like the first thing they said to me was, oh I thought you were already were diagnosed.
(29:29):
Right. Yeah, Lord people.
Yeah, I was posting tic tocs and I posted a tick tock right after and I was crying because you know, you know somebody on threads recently asked, what did you feel when you got your late diagnosis. And I said, relieved grief, like, like, I was relieved to have it but I also was grieving
(29:50):
and I was so sad and I was, I recorded a tick tock video of myself crying in the parking lot right after I got the diagnosis, and like three of my friends who saw that messaged me and we're like, you, you didn't know.
I know I was like can one person act surprised, like one person in my life. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, no and everybody's like already.
(30:14):
I was that same thing where it's like I thank you, I think. Right. Thank you. Maybe not right exactly at the same time I'm like, why wouldn't you. Well, I guess like telling somebody you don't want to like tell somebody because I have told people I'm like, hey, you know this is YouTube,
and they know they don't, unless they've gotten there on their own. They don't really take to it. Also valid. Yes. Okay, because that yeah because like my entire circle of course we all have ADHD like, but some of them don't.
(30:46):
So that's okay. Yeah, exactly. And it's, you know, people will either find their way or not and they'll live on hard mode, you know their whole life and that's not my responsibility to alleviate that from them. But, but I want, I want to, I want them to understand.
But I also know that they, they're on their own path. Yes, they are. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it's everyone and we're all grown ups we can make our own choices for sure but it's a did you know that your brain can actually like, focus on like one thing, the priority thing.
(31:19):
Fascinating. You have this opportunity, there is this capability for you so.
Yes, yes.
Do you think there are still, there are still challenges though that you end up facing right with even diagnosed or even diagnosed and even Medicaid in there are still challenges that you face.
(31:42):
Yeah, I think a lot of us the masking, like, society is not super open, I guess, to functioning differently. Like, I am highly productive. Right.
(32:04):
Medicated or unmedicated even like I can be very productive. But the way that I do things is just different than the way some typical neurotypical people will do stuff, and you know I love looking at systems and structures like once my current like, how are we
going to look at all this and, you know, patterns, and it's like how, how can we support people better overall in the system in the structures when they aren't like fitting in that little box that we need right fitted.
(32:37):
You know those are, it's obviously more questions and answers on that but I think that, you know, that's been an area of struggle for me because like with the work that I currently do it's a lot of like politics and government, and
very rigid structures, very rigid.
Yes, and I'm sitting in these meetings and I'm like, how on earth do people fit into these boxes, and, you know, I'm there, right there, but it's a it's a weird thing because I, I would bet that there are a lot more people like me.
(33:12):
And I think we need more people like myself in these kind of, you know, government roles at this point in our life.
You don't fit, you don't fit easily. And so it's trying to like work through that and, you know, how can I still show up as me.
Yep.
(33:33):
In these systems and structures that weren't built for. They weren't built for us, like, exactly. Yeah, one there.
They're not built for a lot of people, they're built.
They're built to be structures. Yeah.
You know, I have a good friend of mine she's like it's working exactly how it was designed to work. Like, it's not broken.
(33:55):
How do we move forward you know, which I think a lot of us are asking in general right now. So yeah I think those are big questions that that plague a lot of us and, and those of us that are neurodivergent.
We can see that big picture in a way that a lot of people can't or choose not to.
(34:17):
It makes that even harder, right, it makes looking at those structures and the damage that they're doing to so many people, even harder, it makes it makes the world hard, the world is hard right now.
It is a difficult place to be.
So that's, that's definitely, you know, part and parcel of what this journey feels like.
(34:39):
Right.
Yeah, I don't know where to take that either. You know it's, yeah.
It's the systems and the structures aren't built for neurodivergence, they're not built for.
It's just really anybody other than one group of people. Right. Any difference at all. And any, any, any difference at all is not is not supported. Yeah.
(35:02):
No, and it's really interesting then, like, because I'm you know I'm at these these meetings and I'm just like, looking around and I'm just, it's fascinating, really, just how everybody like lines up and does the thing they're supposed to do.
And I'm over here just like what if we didn't do that. Right.
(35:23):
Yeah, I don't know I like to push a little bit you know. Yeah, I do too, and I have been, you know, I don't play politics well it's one of the reasons why I didn't really do very well in higher ed.
Because I don't play the politics, and I don't. And, and now I know that that I'm, I'm likely autistic, and, and I just miss those those social structures, I didn't understand that I went from, you know, the main campus of my university to an outreach
(36:00):
center on the smaller campus. And I didn't understand that the person who gave me my job at the smaller campus wanted to be my dissertation chair because she never said it.
Right.
She didn't communicate and tell me. Anyway, I didn't like I didn't know I didn't I didn't pick up on like these breadcrumbs that have been left for me. And so I didn't pick her as my chair I picked somebody else who had a more established
(36:29):
reputation in and around the areas that I was writing about, and I didn't do that to a front her. I just, I didn't, I didn't know and then and then when somebody else came in and they're like oh well yeah well she expected to work with you and then didn't so that's why
I got shafted on jobs from then on because yeah, this unmet expectation had happened and I had, I had no idea. And, you know, it's things like that I didn't pick up on any of that stuff and that was, she was, you know, she was probably neurodivergent
(37:01):
as well and, but but stronger playing, playing in the system because there are people can adapt more to to the systems and then continue to support them. Right.
And I'm just like I want to go into with a sledgehammer and I want to break all the walls down and I want to see what I want the rebel, I want the rebel and I want to like, yeah, rebuild something right.
(37:22):
Same. Yeah, I 100% 100% and yeah, so it's, and then there's the flip side of it right where it's like, oh, need a job, right, work and so it's.
You still have to work within it like it's, it's, I don't know, it's such a tricky damn systems.
(37:44):
Right. I like systems to be flexible just you know very much neurodivergent thing.
I didn't understand that people didn't think that way until I got in it, you know, it's like, oh, you like it like this, like you like it to be rigid and like hard and difficult. Yeah. Yeah, no flexibility and confining.
(38:07):
Yeah, yeah, no, I don't want things to be confining.
Things to be open. And that is not a. Yeah, that is not a thing.
Yeah. So with your, with your sort of later diagnosis and and coming to this part of your journey late in life, if you were to be able to talk to your younger self.
(38:28):
What, what might you say to your younger self that isn't hey you have ADHD, but is like some reassurance you might give your younger.
I would tell her there's nothing wrong with her.
And that just like her brain is different.
(38:49):
But that's nothing wrong with it.
Like, I have a almost eight year old who has ADHD also and you know I can, I can see it in him where, like I know he wants to fit in. Right. And, I mean, he knows that he doesn't right because his brain works different.
(39:11):
And, you know, it's like I just want that younger version of me, and also my children to know that it's like, just because you're different doesn't mean something's wrong.
And that can cross so many different areas of life right like I don't, it doesn't matter how you, how you stray from this picture of what you're supposed to be. You're different. Right. There's nothing wrong with you.
(39:41):
And that's, that's what I would wanted to tell tell younger me because it was. I remember being in kindergarten, and I cried every single day in school.
Oh, every single day because I was so sensitive, and like somebody would get hurt on the playground. And it's, you know, knocked me over for the rest of the day and I couldn't focus.
(40:06):
I was one little boy who got who got hurt, and my mom still tells me the story she's like you made me call his mom that night to make sure he was okay.
Oh, yeah, it's just like the.
And just came at me right there was no, there's no filter there's no yeah you feel all the feelings yeah yeah everything and if you're feeling it, I'm feeling it.
(40:28):
And it's, it can be a lot. So I would, you know, I think just a lot of reassurance that, you know, we're all.
We're all different but we're all great just the way we are, you know, and absolutely.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
(40:49):
Yeah, break the box. Right. Exactly. That's like a route breakdown of walls.
I think that's where we're.
I love patterns and love all that stuff it's like there's just with how many of us have had these later in life realizations on multiple different things it's.
(41:12):
I just I see it, I see a switch happening I see.
A big change.
Big change. Yeah, for sure.
Well thank you for for chatting with me I really appreciate it. Where can our listeners find you if they want to learn more about you.
Yeah, Instagram and for now tick tock, as long as still here. Instagram is the best place though and I'm on there as reclaim with Julie on that.
(41:40):
My Instagram. Yeah. Awesome.
Yes, thank you. You're welcome.
That was such a great conversation. Many thanks to Juliana for joining me on the show today and sharing her story full of joy and empowerment through her diagnosis.
(42:01):
Please follow Juliana on Instagram at reclaim with Juliana, all one word.
Thanks for listening. Make sure to subscribe to this podcast wherever you listen, like and leave a review and share with your friends.
Follow us on Instagram and blue sky at divergent paths consulting no spaces.
And until next time, stay spicy.
Society is not open to functioning differently.
(00:07):
I am highly productive, but the way that I do things is just different than the way some typical neurotypical people will do stuff.
And how can I still show up as me in these systems and structures that weren't built for us?
(00:36):
Welcome to Divergent Paths, the podcast where we explore unique journeys, neurodivergent experiences, and the ways we can challenge conventional thinking to create a more inclusive world.
I'm your host, Dr. Regina McMenomy. I am a doctor, but not that kind of doctor. And this is a podcast, not medical advice.
I'm thrilled to welcome Juliana Allen to the show. Juliana is a somatic healing coach, a civil service executive director, and a mom.
(01:05):
Juliana shares her story of discovering how her ADHD was linked to many other experiences and complications she experienced throughout her life.
So stay tuned and thanks for listening to Divergent Paths.
Is fashion like a special interest of yours? Is this something that was like a persistent interest that caused you kind of to start the shop and have that as part of what you did?
(01:31):
Honestly, no. No, it wasn't. I started the boutique. So prior to that, I was in physical therapy, actually.
And then I had my first kiddo. And I went shopping. Six weeks postpartum.
Which, yeah, if nobody tells you, that is an awful idea. Bad idea. Yeah. Like, whatever. It's not a good idea. Yeah. Your body is still so much in transition at that point.
(02:03):
There's so much going on. Like, oh, yeah. Your hormones and everything, right? And I went shopping and I remember being in the mall in the dressing room and I just start crying because I was like, nothing fits.
I feel this way and that way. And like just sitting there crying in the dressing room with my newborn baby. And I just was like, I'm going to make a store that's going to be different.
(02:25):
And so a year later, I opened up, opened this size and your clothing boutique. And that's, that's really how that happened.
That's amazing. Yeah, a lot of ideas, a lot of passions. And that's, that's what stuck at that point in time. So nice.
I mean, I, you know, we're talking about neurodivergence and that's definitely one of the things that sort of happens for our, you know, creative and unique brains is something stick.
(02:53):
That might be surprising.
But it was a wonderful time. I really, I don't have any, I have very fond memories of that time and it was honestly really kind of where I found myself and found my voice like through, it was almost like through empowering, trying to empower other people.
(03:15):
And it was really helpful for me to be able to like, finally figure out who I was and be able to use my voice. So it was a, I'm really, I really am proud of that.
Proud of the boutique and the foundation and everything. So it's, it's been closed now for a couple years, but still doesn't feel, feel like it, but it has been. I know I still have to remind myself sometimes.
(03:39):
I'm in the area and I'm like, oh no, actually, no, it was time. It was time to close it down and yeah, it was, it was for a season.
I mean, you know, we have these messed up ideas about of success, right? We have these ideas that things have to persist in order for it to be a success and that's, that's one of the things I really want people to like change their mindsets about like, that's not,
(04:06):
success isn't one thing. There are many ways to be successful and that there are times in your life where, you know, like I, I mentioned before we started recording that my old podcast used to be about was about video games and I don't play video games anymore.
I don't, I don't really do that, but, but for there was a time where it was really important. It was the big thing and that podcast was great and we did a lot and I think it was a really successful thing that I did. And when I started this podcast, there was a little morning for me and I'm not doing that one anymore.
(04:38):
You know, like that was when I fell in love with podcasting, but you know, now we know, you know, this is the new phase.
It's interesting to, I know we haven't touched on neurodivergence too much yet, but I definitely have ADHD and you know, at that point I didn't know that.
And so there was this narrative in my head that I was failing because I wanted to do something different.
(05:03):
And you know, I kind of lost my, I didn't necessarily lose my passion for it, but it switched. And the way that I, the way that I was passionate about doing it was just not, it wasn't realistic.
There was this whole feeling like a failure because I gave up or I decided I got bored and I quit or something. That was the narrative that I said and that was a narrative that I heard from other people too. Not everybody, but some people.
(05:37):
Yeah, I mean there's always critics when you, when you stop doing something or you make choices, you know, for your mental health sometimes you're always going to have somebody who's like, but you should be doing this or whatnot or people who still hold that older version of you as who you are.
Right. And that's, that's a hard thing to do. So, so was it through when when when did you first then start to suspect that you are ADHD, or that you were neurodivergent.
(06:05):
No, I was a long story. How much time do we have? No, I'm kidding. So I actually was diagnosed with OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder when I was about 10 years old, which we're talking early 90s here.
Yeah, that's when girls wouldn't have been diagnosed with ADHD.
(06:26):
None of that, none of that. And you know, I don't, I OCD ADHD it all kind of falls in all. Yeah, yeah, it's all neurodivergence, it's all neurodivergence. Yeah. Yeah. So the ADHD really didn't come out until I think I was only diagnosed about a year ago, which is fascinating really but
like in hindsight, I look at my life and I like, oh, that's why, you know, and there's so many of these things because I, you know, the OCD since I was 10, I struggled for a long time with an eating disorder.
(07:00):
And for me that two are very related because it was for control. Yeah, it was control and you know, I, I feel everything very intensely and very deeply in like I didn't have a filter. Right. Like, I couldn't filter out all the information that was being thrown at me, you know, familiar.
(07:22):
Very familiar. Yes. Yeah. So like the eating disorder was a really big part of my way to cope with it and turns out I just had undiagnosed ADHD, and yeah, it's, it's an interesting thought like what would have happened if it was a little bit more known.
Right, if they would have understood that the presentations were different. You know, and sometimes they're not like there there are plenty of, you know, female identified or assigned female birth, people who present hyperactive you know like classic classically
(07:59):
so to quote, unquote, hyperactive, but there's also like for me my hyperactivity has never been physically manifested. It has always been in my brain my brain is very active.
And, you know, and that that was the difference and that's, it's hard to see that. Right. And it's hard to identify that unless you really do kind of dive in and talk to somebody and kind of get to the root of some of those.
(08:26):
It's so interesting now how there's all of all of us in our 30s 40s 50s whatever.
Oh, turns out.
Inner circles are all, all, all, I know I have I have people who are like but I do that too, and I'm not and I'm like hey babe I love you but we're friends.
(08:56):
We tend to find each other. We tend to just seek each other out.
No, not intentionally. I just, not intentionally. It's just, you know, you may you make sense I know you probably heard. This is not my metaphor but you're a zebra in a pack of horses right so like, you know, when you're neurodivergent,
(09:18):
you, you're very similar to in many fashions to a horse but you're a zebra so you look a little different, you're, you know, size a little different and your hair is a little weird or you know whatever, whatever it is but you're trying to be a horse and
you can't quite be a horse and can't quite figure out why running with that pack of horses is not really working for you until you're like, oh, I'm not a horse.
(09:42):
I am a zebra in fact I'm a zebra. Right. And so, like that idea of the zebras in the pack find each other, right, because they know they understand and like, you know, they, they, they start to conform to, you know, to, to each other they start to,
you know, kind of not conform that's not the right word. They connect with each other based on, you know, on their difference, rather than on their, their performance of trying to look like a horse.
(10:12):
So, it does make perfect sense.
Yes, it really does. There's so yeah, almost all my friends, and then I think that's also interesting because, like I've, you know, now, now that I know this, I kind of observe how, like my relationships work, and how like conversations will go and having a conversation
(10:34):
with a neurotypical human is very different than my close knit group of friends that are all neurodivergent and we can be having like 20 conversations at one time, right. Yep. And always go back to it and it sometimes is a bit challenging to be in close relationship
with people that are not neurodivergent because they just, it's not how their brain works and it's right and then and then things that you think, at least this is my experience things that were were normal and, and supportive like, I would always.
(11:11):
It was years before I learned that for neurotypical or neuro normative, you know, people, it's rude to tell a story of your own in response to their story, like the what
you, I can tell you exactly how the same thing has impacted me.
(11:35):
I still don't think that's rude.
I think it's rude. Yes, it shows.
Let me just tell you, it shows compassion and empathy, and it's like, I can understand where you are coming from. Yes, I am going to fight that one because I don't think that's true.
(11:57):
Yeah, I agree. I am, I am a little more mindful of it now, where I will often say, is it okay if I share a story.
Yes, especially if it's somebody who I don't have a really strong rapport with like with my close friends like, like, none of us do that because we all know.
(12:18):
We know exactly what we're doing and we've had this discussion about like, oh, there are a subset of people who think that this is, you know, rude or, you know, centering yourself in the conversation.
So we've already had those conversations but when I'm talking with someone who isn't that, you know, I don't have that rapport with I will check in and say, you know, I'm hearing some similarities to my life.
(12:42):
Do you want to hear a story that might relate to it, or are you looking for a different kind of feedback, like, you know, to take a step to say or what they might need in the conversation versus what is easy for me to just kind of like, present to them.
That's a really good idea actually. Good job. Thanks.
(13:06):
Yeah, maybe I should do that too. Nice work.
I mean it's just, it took it took fumbling, it took you know I have.
I have lost neuro typical friends, like, because of, of how I how I present and how I work so you know I'm getting to that after.
(13:31):
Yeah, it's, it's an interesting thing like,
yeah, trying to fit in in places that are not designed for neurodivergent people, it's really exhausting and an interesting, interesting thing, you know, to try to, like, okay I'm supposed to ask these questions I'm not supposed to do this okay be quiet like
(13:57):
I'm supposed to interrupt you and like those things it's it's a, it takes a lot of more mental energy to be able to like conform yourself almost exactly. Yeah.
Yeah, that's that's we did an episode recently about masking and that's that's largely, that's largely the effect that masking has on me masking is a very draining experience.
(14:20):
And I was in that episode about how when I first was diagnosed I didn't think I'm asked at all, and then I started to realize there was only the mask.
In many ways, and that I get to who I really was I had to kind of strip away layers that I had like built up in terms of protect protection.
Yeah, that's, that's hard to because it's like having a brain that doesn't work typically it's like we were, I think in general most of us weren't taught how to understand who we really are.
(14:51):
No, and so we put the mask on and we conform to what we're supposed to be and
it's hard. It's hard to figure out like, okay well who am I underneath that mask. Right.
Yeah, it's definitely some time and yeah, yeah.
Did you have big revelations did you have big things that sort of came out of your unmasking or that is a lovely way to put that yeah.
(15:26):
So I was super disconnected from my body. Right. Well I imagine with the, with the OCD and the eating disorder. Those are processes of disconnection right both of them are taking you away from the somatic experience yeah.
Yeah, and so I was just very, you know, I was a talking head, walking around having no idea what my body was actually saying to me. And, you know, after I had my second kiddo May 2020, which I feel like is enough said, wow, just in and of itself to
(15:57):
have a child pandemic right like don't do that. If you want, actually if you want your entire world to unravel. Have a kid have an infant in the middle of a worldwide pandemic yes.
But yeah, my everything started that really unraveled then, and I like, you know, it got to the point where I could not hold it in anymore. I couldn't, I could not mask anymore.
(16:27):
There was too much stress with the business with the nonprofit that I had with my partner and my kids. And it all just started to like unravel, and it got to the point where it's like okay my body is screaming at me.
I can't talk myself out of it.
Right. Yeah, the, the amount of talk therapy I did it's just like, I was like, I have done 25 years of talk therapy. Why don't I feel better. Well, when you do talk therapy, and you're high masking your your performing therapy, you're not so good at it.
(17:04):
I was so good at it too man.
Yeah, plus.
I was so frustrated I was like why don't I feel better, like, want to curl up and just really just stay there. Yes, be there. Yeah. And, you know, it wasn't until I found like somatic therapy that I was like, oh, right.
(17:27):
I have a body and it tells me things right. Yeah. And I was so scared to be in the body. Yes, because I didn't want to hear what it was going, what I like knew it was going to tell me right like there's always these things you're like I know what's in there
but I am going to talk my way through it. I'm going to put a mask, I'm going to be exactly who I was taught I was supposed to be.
(17:51):
And then everything falls apart. Right. Like, I'm so thankful everything fell apart but it was a, it was a look at your, it was a come to Jesus kind of moment I guess right.
Way to say it. I mean that's in, you know, that is a that is a perfect description, like in terms of like a cultural ideology, right, like, okay, I'm what is, what is real here, what what is real what can what do I need to step away from, what do I need to have as my,
(18:22):
my big moments of understanding and breaking through, you know, who I am.
I think like as people identifying as women like we are taught to like you you get in your box.
You smile in that box, and you don't come out of that. Right.
And neurodivergence, like, it is literally impossible for us to be in boxes but we're that's what we're supposed to be doing. And when that starts to really come through it's, it's pretty big.
(18:59):
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a revolutionary thing. The number of relationships I have lost the, the changes that have happened in my life, the, the changes I had to make to my work life are all.
They were all completely unexpected and came directly out of the diagnosis, and my, my relationship with my body change when I went on my, when I went on ADHD medications, because I had never had a regulated nervous system, and.
(19:35):
Oh my gosh, when I first started meds for the ADHD, I was like,
Oh, this is how people feel. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding? Are you serious? I've been 40 years.
Yeah.
And you need to tell me that other people don't feel the need to, like, it's just,
(20:04):
yep, I know it's just it's just, it's, it's shockingly, it's a shockingly different life.
And, you know, having that that regulation and, and then starting to notice, and that's what the last year in part has been for me is starting to notice the things that off that upset my nervous system, because when you're living in a state of dysregulation constantly, there's no way to know what's setting you off, right, because you can't take that information in right.
(20:39):
When you're constantly off, you can't take that information in so then all of a sudden I was like, Oh, I, I stopped drinking caffeine. I stopped drinking alcohol, not entirely but mostly, mostly.
Primarily, I started noticing the foods that were better for me to eat and foods that were not foods that you know activated certain responses in my body that I wouldn't have picked up on before I had the medication because I just, you know, they just weren't there.
(21:09):
They were there but I couldn't, I couldn't hear them, like, that's what I said, like, I'm not once I started the medication, I'm not my ADHD is still there, I still have a baby of squirrels that you know bounce around in my brain constantly, but now I can actually like
talk to them and can say, Okay, you are the squirrel that needs attention right now versus whatever just decided to bubble to the top.
(21:40):
So that's a typical job, right, like I go into an office, and I do things right like that's a typical job right now. And before I started ADHD meds, it was, I was dying, like, I was dying, and then guess what I started meds, and I made a list.
And then I did the list.
(22:03):
I said, I need to do the list.
I said this to one of my co workers and they were like, Yeah, that's what people do.
That's not a failure.
(22:34):
I can see so many things at once I can see so many possibilities I can see so many opportunities and so many things that can be done but at the same time, that is also a constant sense of overwhelm, right, like, there are so many possibilities and so many paths
there are so many roads that, like being able to focus down a little more on that is really a beautiful thing because because I have such an array of options right and then I can, I can just choose instead of feeling that that overwhelming
(23:09):
sensation that I needed to do all of the things I don't feel like I need to do all of the things anymore and that is, that's a huge shift. Yeah, same here, it's, you know, just the understanding of this is, this is who I am.
Right. And, you know, not attaching any judgment to it not attaching any shame to it but just being like this is the way my brain works. Yeah, and this is what this is what I mean, in order to be my most authentic self.
(23:47):
And that's okay. Yeah, like I think there's also so much stigma around meds and that bothers me too because, oh, so I mentioned the obsessive compulsive disorder like meds completely changed my life, like, almost instantly it was the same with the ADHD meds
where it was like, it didn't take it away, but it was, it was that little switch for me that was like, oh, okay, that's irrational, like I can, I don't have to wash my hands 20 times, I got it, you know I can wash my hands one time.
(24:20):
Right. That's okay. Right. You know, it was a, it was a very similar experience with the ADHD meds where it was like, very quick like, huh.
Yeah. And it didn't take away any of who I am. I think that was a fear of mine too I was like, I like who I am. I think I'm fun, I can like do all the things, or none of the things too.
(24:42):
So it was. Yeah. Yeah, big advocate for it for sure. Yeah. Yep. I am. I am too. And when I went in to talk to my primary care physician after I had my diagnosis because I didn't, I didn't go through her to get diagnosed
I had the kind of insurance I was had the privilege to have the kind of insurance that I could just go to the assessment office and get the assessment done and go through all that on my own because I was almost positive at, so I was 48 when I was when I'm like okay I need to get
(25:18):
diagnosed, and I had my assessment done a few days after my 49th birthday so like right after I turned 49 I had my assessment. And I knew that walking into my primary care physicians office who I was positive didn't have a deep understanding of ADHD
in fact she still calls it ADD so like I know that because she still refers to it as ADD and I'm like that's cute but we all get the age, some way or another, everybody's age.
(25:49):
And I knew that it was like unlikely that she had any deep understanding of ADHD and so when I brought in the report that had been verified by three different psychologists and had, you know, all of the details, and I'd sent it to her and she was you know she read
all this and the first thing she said to me is well not all adults with ADHD need to be medicated. And I was like, great, but, but let's let's look at my life okay I am, I'm 49. I am in a, you know, high level administration position at any university.
(26:25):
I'm a mom, I am, you know, x, y, z, and I am suffering in every aspect of my life right now, every aspect of my life is a struggle. And I think it has to do with me being undiagnosed for my entire life and unmedicated for, you know, almost 50 years.
And I was like, no, this is a long time, because had I gone into her with all of that success because when I walked into my assessment there, the psychologist like I can't wait to talk to you and I'm like, okay.
(26:59):
Why.
And he said well it's not, you know, it's not usual for us to get someone your age with your success, who has not been diagnosed like like you being undiagnosed with multiple college degrees with a high level career, like, you know, most, most people with
(27:21):
the level of ADHD you have would have fallen apart earlier than this.
So I was like, okay, great.
Not really sure.
Thank you. I think I'm not sure what's supposed to be but he you know and he's like imagine if you'd had the support, imagining if you had the support that goes with the diagnosis.
(27:45):
And I was like, it that was really for forming for me to get the diagnosis because it means it's going to be easier road for my child right like, like, we know we're clear, we understand, you know, so yeah.
Yeah, I, I've done a lot of things too. And it's like, I don't like how that is used as.
(28:09):
That's an interesting, interesting proof of non proof of neurotypical or neuronal behavior right.
I can do plenty with it. Right. Totally.
Right. It's like I can do it but that doesn't mean that it was like my job, like, I can do it. Right. Yeah, was I miserable. Yes. Was I playing on hard mode was I, you know, yeah, yeah.
(28:35):
I feel like a total failure off the time. Yes, because it was. Yeah, I don't like that. Now I know I was, I was like wow at the first I was like oh well that's, you know, yeah I did do all that with all this and then I was like this really probably
wasn't the best way to introduce me to the fact that I had ADHD.
(28:56):
I'm in the medical field might have been a little gentler about this. Yeah, seriously. Yeah, but, um, but I'm still, I am still glad that it that I got that I got it but, um, you know, at the same time I'm like well, yeah, this could have been presented differently.
The person that evaluated me for my for my ADHD I had known because we had done, I had done therapy with them like years prior. And they said, like the first thing they said to me was, oh I thought you were already were diagnosed.
(29:29):
Right. Yeah, Lord people.
Yeah, I was posting tic tocs and I posted a tick tock right after and I was crying because you know, you know somebody on threads recently asked, what did you feel when you got your late diagnosis. And I said, relieved grief, like, like, I was relieved to have it but I also was grieving
(29:50):
and I was so sad and I was, I recorded a tick tock video of myself crying in the parking lot right after I got the diagnosis, and like three of my friends who saw that messaged me and we're like, you, you didn't know.
I know I was like can one person act surprised, like one person in my life. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, no and everybody's like already.
(30:14):
I was that same thing where it's like I thank you, I think. Right. Thank you. Maybe not right exactly at the same time I'm like, why wouldn't you. Well, I guess like telling somebody you don't want to like tell somebody because I have told people I'm like, hey, you know this is YouTube,
and they know they don't, unless they've gotten there on their own. They don't really take to it. Also valid. Yes. Okay, because that yeah because like my entire circle of course we all have ADHD like, but some of them don't.
(30:46):
So that's okay. Yeah, exactly. And it's, you know, people will either find their way or not and they'll live on hard mode, you know their whole life and that's not my responsibility to alleviate that from them. But, but I want, I want to, I want them to understand.
But I also know that they, they're on their own path. Yes, they are. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it's everyone and we're all grown ups we can make our own choices for sure but it's a did you know that your brain can actually like, focus on like one thing, the priority thing.
(31:19):
Fascinating. You have this opportunity, there is this capability for you so.
Yes, yes.
Do you think there are still, there are still challenges though that you end up facing right with even diagnosed or even diagnosed and even Medicaid in there are still challenges that you face.
(31:42):
Yeah, I think a lot of us the masking, like, society is not super open, I guess, to functioning differently. Like, I am highly productive. Right.
(32:04):
Medicated or unmedicated even like I can be very productive. But the way that I do things is just different than the way some typical neurotypical people will do stuff, and you know I love looking at systems and structures like once my current like, how are we
going to look at all this and, you know, patterns, and it's like how, how can we support people better overall in the system in the structures when they aren't like fitting in that little box that we need right fitted.
(32:37):
You know those are, it's obviously more questions and answers on that but I think that, you know, that's been an area of struggle for me because like with the work that I currently do it's a lot of like politics and government, and
very rigid structures, very rigid.
Yes, and I'm sitting in these meetings and I'm like, how on earth do people fit into these boxes, and, you know, I'm there, right there, but it's a it's a weird thing because I, I would bet that there are a lot more people like me.
(33:12):
And I think we need more people like myself in these kind of, you know, government roles at this point in our life.
You don't fit, you don't fit easily. And so it's trying to like work through that and, you know, how can I still show up as me.
Yep.
(33:33):
In these systems and structures that weren't built for. They weren't built for us, like, exactly. Yeah, one there.
They're not built for a lot of people, they're built.
They're built to be structures. Yeah.
You know, I have a good friend of mine she's like it's working exactly how it was designed to work. Like, it's not broken.
(33:55):
How do we move forward you know, which I think a lot of us are asking in general right now. So yeah I think those are big questions that that plague a lot of us and, and those of us that are neurodivergent.
We can see that big picture in a way that a lot of people can't or choose not to.
(34:17):
It makes that even harder, right, it makes looking at those structures and the damage that they're doing to so many people, even harder, it makes it makes the world hard, the world is hard right now.
It is a difficult place to be.
So that's, that's definitely, you know, part and parcel of what this journey feels like.
(34:39):
Right.
Yeah, I don't know where to take that either. You know it's, yeah.
It's the systems and the structures aren't built for neurodivergence, they're not built for.
It's just really anybody other than one group of people. Right. Any difference at all. And any, any, any difference at all is not is not supported. Yeah.
(35:02):
No, and it's really interesting then, like, because I'm you know I'm at these these meetings and I'm just like, looking around and I'm just, it's fascinating, really, just how everybody like lines up and does the thing they're supposed to do.
And I'm over here just like what if we didn't do that. Right.
(35:23):
Yeah, I don't know I like to push a little bit you know. Yeah, I do too, and I have been, you know, I don't play politics well it's one of the reasons why I didn't really do very well in higher ed.
Because I don't play the politics, and I don't. And, and now I know that that I'm, I'm likely autistic, and, and I just miss those those social structures, I didn't understand that I went from, you know, the main campus of my university to an outreach
(36:00):
center on the smaller campus. And I didn't understand that the person who gave me my job at the smaller campus wanted to be my dissertation chair because she never said it.
Right.
She didn't communicate and tell me. Anyway, I didn't like I didn't know I didn't I didn't pick up on like these breadcrumbs that have been left for me. And so I didn't pick her as my chair I picked somebody else who had a more established
(36:29):
reputation in and around the areas that I was writing about, and I didn't do that to a front her. I just, I didn't, I didn't know and then and then when somebody else came in and they're like oh well yeah well she expected to work with you and then didn't so that's why
I got shafted on jobs from then on because yeah, this unmet expectation had happened and I had, I had no idea. And, you know, it's things like that I didn't pick up on any of that stuff and that was, she was, you know, she was probably neurodivergent
(37:01):
as well and, but but stronger playing, playing in the system because there are people can adapt more to to the systems and then continue to support them. Right.
And I'm just like I want to go into with a sledgehammer and I want to break all the walls down and I want to see what I want the rebel, I want the rebel and I want to like, yeah, rebuild something right.
(37:22):
Same. Yeah, I 100% 100% and yeah, so it's, and then there's the flip side of it right where it's like, oh, need a job, right, work and so it's.
You still have to work within it like it's, it's, I don't know, it's such a tricky damn systems.
(37:44):
Right. I like systems to be flexible just you know very much neurodivergent thing.
I didn't understand that people didn't think that way until I got in it, you know, it's like, oh, you like it like this, like you like it to be rigid and like hard and difficult. Yeah. Yeah, no flexibility and confining.
(38:07):
Yeah, yeah, no, I don't want things to be confining.
Things to be open. And that is not a. Yeah, that is not a thing.
Yeah. So with your, with your sort of later diagnosis and and coming to this part of your journey late in life, if you were to be able to talk to your younger self.
(38:28):
What, what might you say to your younger self that isn't hey you have ADHD, but is like some reassurance you might give your younger.
I would tell her there's nothing wrong with her.
And that just like her brain is different.
(38:49):
But that's nothing wrong with it.
Like, I have a almost eight year old who has ADHD also and you know I can, I can see it in him where, like I know he wants to fit in. Right. And, I mean, he knows that he doesn't right because his brain works different.
(39:11):
And, you know, it's like I just want that younger version of me, and also my children to know that it's like, just because you're different doesn't mean something's wrong.
And that can cross so many different areas of life right like I don't, it doesn't matter how you, how you stray from this picture of what you're supposed to be. You're different. Right. There's nothing wrong with you.
(39:41):
And that's, that's what I would wanted to tell tell younger me because it was. I remember being in kindergarten, and I cried every single day in school.
Oh, every single day because I was so sensitive, and like somebody would get hurt on the playground. And it's, you know, knocked me over for the rest of the day and I couldn't focus.
(40:06):
I was one little boy who got who got hurt, and my mom still tells me the story she's like you made me call his mom that night to make sure he was okay.
Oh, yeah, it's just like the.
And just came at me right there was no, there's no filter there's no yeah you feel all the feelings yeah yeah everything and if you're feeling it, I'm feeling it.
(40:28):
And it's, it can be a lot. So I would, you know, I think just a lot of reassurance that, you know, we're all.
We're all different but we're all great just the way we are, you know, and absolutely.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
(40:49):
Yeah, break the box. Right. Exactly. That's like a route breakdown of walls.
I think that's where we're.
I love patterns and love all that stuff it's like there's just with how many of us have had these later in life realizations on multiple different things it's.
(41:12):
I just I see it, I see a switch happening I see.
A big change.
Big change. Yeah, for sure.
Well thank you for for chatting with me I really appreciate it. Where can our listeners find you if they want to learn more about you.
Yeah, Instagram and for now tick tock, as long as still here. Instagram is the best place though and I'm on there as reclaim with Julie on that.
(41:40):
My Instagram. Yeah. Awesome.
Yes, thank you. You're welcome.
That was such a great conversation. Many thanks to Juliana for joining me on the show today and sharing her story full of joy and empowerment through her diagnosis.
(42:01):
Please follow Juliana on Instagram at reclaim with Juliana, all one word.
Thanks for listening. Make sure to subscribe to this podcast wherever you listen, like and leave a review and share with your friends.
Follow us on Instagram and blue sky at divergent paths consulting no spaces.
And until next time, stay spicy.
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