January 28, 2025 • 39 mins
"I knew it!" Or, "I had no idea." When it comes to DNA surprises, some people are completely blindsided. Others felt like they knew it all along. Danielle never felt like she fit in with her family. Her mother died when she was just three years old, and for the rest of her childhood, she was raised by her dad, who travelled often for work, and her aunt, her mother’s sister.
Danielle knew that her dad had difficulty conceiving her older half-sister with his first wife, and she questioned if they were biologically related. More than a decade after her dad died, another aunt gave her a letter he’d written to her, which described the sometimes tumultuous but genuine affection her parents had for one another - a confession of sorts?
When she learned that her sister had taken a consumer DNA test, Danielle finally had her chance to uncover the truth. After getting her results, doing extensive research, and learning surprising information from her mother’s best friend, she finally did.
Thank you Danielle, for sharing your story.
Listen to ad-free episodes at patreon.com/dnasurprises.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The saddest thing is I don't even think I was ever angry.
Maybe that'll come later. Maybe I'm the type that cries
first and feels angry later. I feel bad for my mom.
She was in her early 20s when she got married to someone who
couldn't have kids. And I don't think she knew what
that meant. You know, she didn't want kids
at that time. And maybe it just, she got in
(00:21):
too deep. I think there's layers to all of
this. There's so many layers to
people. It's so complicated, and I think
the more that we give people thechance to peel those layers back
and figure out why they really made the choices they did, then
we'll understand better and not be angry.
(00:42):
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that delves into the
world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
I'm your host Alexis, our salt. In July 2021, my life took a
surprising turn when I found outthat I'm an NPE, a person who
has experienced a non paternal event.
(01:04):
In other words, my biological father isn't who I thought he
was. Join me as we explore the
stories of NP, ES, adoptees, anddonor conceived people and their
families. Get ready to unravel the
astonishing journeys that begin with a simple DNA test.
This is DNA surprises. I knew it or I had no idea.
(01:33):
When it comes to DNA surprises, some people are completely
blindsided. Others felt like they knew it
all along. Danielle never felt like she fit
in with her family. Her mother died when she was
just three years old, and for the rest of her childhood she
was raised by her dad, who travelled often for work, and
(01:54):
her aunt, her mother's sister. Danielle knew that her dad had
difficulty conceiving her older half sister with his first wife,
and she questioned if they were biologically related.
More than a decade after her daddied, another aunt gave her a
letter he'd written to her, which described the sometimes
tumultuous relationship but genuine love her parents had for
(02:17):
one another. A confession of sorts.
When she learned that her sisterhad taken a consumer DNA test,
Danielle finally had her chance to uncover the truth.
After getting her results, doingextensive research, and learning
surprising information from her mother's best friend, she
finally did. Thank you Danielle for sharing
(02:41):
your story. My first name's Danielle and I
am from Brooklyn, NY and my age is 44.
My DNA surprise was finding out that my father who raised me
wasn't my genetic father. I think that I on some level
always had an idea that that wastrue, but it was very
(03:04):
complicated because my mom passed away from breast cancer
when I was 3 1/2. And my dad raised me along with
the help of my aunt and grandmother.
And I think this was a shock foreverybody that she died so
young. And I don't know if my dad maybe
(03:26):
maybe they would have told me, but I don't think so.
I do think he knew. I'm very close to believing that
he definitely knew. I just don't know if he knew who
or he knew the exact storyline of how it happened.
But he raised me with a lot of help from my aunt and my
(03:48):
grandmother. He traveled for work.
He was gone, you know, sometimesthree months at a time overseas
working in 3rd world countries to teach Planned Parenthood,
AIDS prevention. There were a lot of times that
he was gone, that it seems strange to me that he would
leave me behind. And he would always say it was
(04:11):
because there was children in other countries that needed
help. And I always pretended to
understand that as a little girl.
And my aunt who raised me has a daughter and helped raise me, I
should say. And they were good to me.
But I never felt like I fit in anywhere, not with my dad.
(04:32):
When he was home, I'd stay at the apartment with him and I
would feel a little lonely because I'd miss my aunt.
And her house was a little bit busier because she had her
daughter. And my uncle lived there also.
And he was very good to me. But I think there was always a
feeling of being misplaced. And I, I think it caused a lot
(04:54):
of issues for me. I had really bad anxiety as a
little girl. I was worried about dying,
getting sick, I was missing my dad.
But then when he would come back, I didn't want to go with
him. And I can honestly say I never
felt like I fit in where I was. Were your parents your mom and
(05:14):
dad? Were they married when you were
born? They were married when I was
born. I do believe that they were
having problems. I don't know exactly when that
started. But without giving too much of
my sister, my half sister who ended up not being related to me
at all, too much of her story, Ican start a little bit farther
(05:36):
back. My dad was married.
He was a Holocaust survivor. He wasn't in a concentration
camp, but he was born 1926 in the Czech Republic.
He moved to this country 1939 because of the war and when he
came here they went from being very wealthy to very poor.
He was living in Queens. He got married to another woman
(05:58):
who came here from Europe duringthe Holocaust for 1927 I think,
and that is my half sister's mom.
They did not have an easy time getting pregnant.
They were married for 10 years before she arrived.
His sperm count was low. That's what they had told all of
us, you know, as to why Alison was their only child and why it
(06:22):
took ten years for them to have her.
And it turns out that she is notgenetically his either.
So my mom met my dad when him and his first wife were
separated. Or I should say he left and they
got together before they were legally divorced.
(06:44):
She went for an interview with him and they ended up hitting it
off and they ended up to get married.
And I'm not saying this is the reason why, but my half sister's
mom killed herself. So that was a trauma for my
sister. And then she ended up living
with my mom and my dad, and thatwas when she was 16.
(07:10):
We were raised always thinking that we shared a dad.
I always had a feeling that I wasn't related to my sister as
much as I, you know, would have liked to be.
I just didn't see any at all similarities between us.
She was older than me, 20 plus years older, but I just couldn't
(07:30):
see anything. She's very musical, artistic, I
like the arts, but we are, she'sjust very different from me.
So I had been assuming this whole thing for a very long
time. And 1:00 trip my husband and I
took to visit my sister in Boston.
(07:51):
She had mentioned that she did Ancestry DNA because her
boyfriend who was sitting there at the time said he had done
Ancestry DNA and he found out all this cool stuff about
himself. He found out that he had some
Native American in him and like he wasn't all Italian like he
thought and it was really exciting.
So she's like, well, I did it because it sounded so exciting.
(08:13):
And it turns out I'm 100% Ashkenazi Jew, and that's not
surprising at all. So that was boring.
And that night when we went to sleep, because I had told my
husband about 50 times, I reallydon't think my dad was my
genetic dad, but I assumed he was hers.
I said, this is how I'll find out.
We went back to Brooklyn and I got a DNA, Ancestry DNA in the
(08:36):
mail and I sent it away. And this is the first time I'm
admitting this will be the firsttime that she hears that that
was actually the intention of doing Ancestry DNA.
It wasn't like most people that say I did Ancestry DNA and I
found out like, no, I did ancestry DNA because I heard
someone else in my family did itand I was pretty sure that was a
(08:57):
good way to find out. So at this point she still
believes that she is related to your father.
Is that correct? Yeah, she had no idea, 'cause I
think so many people look at their ancestry and they're like,
OK, it says I'm what I am and that's it, you know?
So yes, she is 100% Jewish, but that doesn't mean that those two
(09:20):
parents, just because it's a match ethnicity wise, is adna
match. But she didn't look farther into
it. She just let it go.
OK, so then you go back home andyou get a test.
What happens next? Everyone thought I was crazy.
I just would like to say that, you know everyone, it would have
(09:41):
been going on for years. It really got very strong.
My feelings when I had my first child's and I was 31 and I just
was so sure that something wasn't right.
I just felt like how could he really leave, you know?
Something was just strange to meand I know he needed to make
money and I know he was single parent, but and the other thing
(10:05):
that I should just say is that if he had trouble getting
pregnant when he was in his 20s,what would ever make anyone
believe that it would be easy for them to get pregnant when he
was in his 50s? So it was just also just common
sense. And then the last thing about it
is that I had heard stories thatmy mom had had an affair and I
(10:29):
actually heard the story from mysister and my half sister and I
didn't talk to her for a while because I just thought it was
cruel that she told me that because my mom wasn't there to
defend herself. Basically all of this just made
me realize. And then the tipping point was I
got a letter that one of my aunts, not the one who helped
(10:51):
raise me, my Aunt Una, my momma's other sister, gave to
me, that my dad had written to me when my mom died.
He was in Bangladesh. It says that on the top.
He typed it and he signed it. Love Dad.
And it was basically this letterjust telling me about my mom and
telling me what people would probably tell me about their
(11:14):
tumultuous relationship and how just like storms, they would
have these times where they would fight, but they would make
up and they would reaffirm theirlove for each other basically.
And I think he was trying to tell me that I wasn't his
because so many of the words andI didn't get this letter till I
(11:35):
was an adult. So many of the words were like
you were a part of my Rosemary. You were our our chance at a
happiness I wasn't able to give her.
There was a lot of this like tone and I knew from that letter
and he raised me. I mean, it was me and him.
I knew what he was saying and didn't have to say it.
And my aunt said absolutely not my sister, they were they're
(11:59):
Irish Catholic. My sister would never, she would
never have an affair. And I said OK.
And I said, well, my dad mentioned that she had had an
abortion. Oh, never.
Not Rosemary. No, no, she never would have.
And I think all of these things just confused me more and set me
back. How old were you when you got
(12:22):
the letter? I was already a mom and it was
just, it was all coming to like a head.
My aunt Una and I didn't have a very close relationship because
she had wanted to take me away from my dad.
She had threatened that she was going to take him to court
because my mom would have wantedher to have me.
(12:43):
And he, she wanted him to move to Long Island and he wanted to
stay in Brooklyn. And they ended up having a huge
falling out and they stopped talking and she stopped talking
to me. So when he died when I was 18,
my dad died when I was 18, suddenly he had a heart attack
in the car. She contacted me, but it took me
a while. You know, I just was like, now
(13:04):
you're going to come around. You know, you kind of abandoned
me because you didn't get along with him.
And she was like, well, you don't know everything.
And I was like, I don't want to know anything.
He's gone. And I don't know what you have
to say, but I just can't. I just didn't want to hear it.
But she claimed that after all that, getting that letter and
then me saying to her, were you going to tell me years ago that
(13:27):
he wasn't my dad? She said no, I wasn't going to
tell you that, so who knows? Do you believe that he was
trying to tell you as much as hecould in the letter without
telling you? I do, but then there's part of
me that feels like he was tryingto hide it too, mentioning an
abortion like is, you know, because we all lived in the same
place, we never left. And I think maybe just in case
(13:48):
he I ever heard something from someone, you know, just to make
sure that lined up. But I always thought it was
weird. Like, why would you tell me
that? Why did you tell me?
Yeah, that's like a really personal thing to share that if
it didn't have anything to do with you.
And I remember being like when you bulbs before you were born.
(14:08):
And I'm like, why? Why'd you do that?
You know, like, but whatever. I was just like, OK, you know,
fine. But I always remembered that
being weird. How many years went by between
you getting this letter and getting that internal sort of
affirmation that he may he may not be your biological father to
when you took the test? That letter was 31, The test was
(14:30):
36. So it took me a long time and I
tried everything. I mean, I contacted people
trying to understand more and I was at the point and I I feel so
bad that I'm saying this and she's going to hear this, but I
was like at the point I was going to take care from her
brush. I was like that sure.
By the time we visited her and it was kind of like a gift
(14:53):
because that night we're sittingthere and they tell me they did
ancestry and I was like, what? That's crazy because I literally
we joked around my husband and Ithat I was going to take some
kind of sample. But the weirdest thing is then
so we take this test and we're not linked.
And I called Ancestry DNA just to just to make sure.
(15:17):
And they were basically like, yeah, these are these are
usually not mistakes. Is this a possibility?
And I was like, yeah, it's definitely a possibility.
It was so confusing because I'm half Irish Catholic, like first
generation Brooklyn, like my mom's one of six kids and my dad
is an Eastern European Jew. But it lined up like it's true,
(15:42):
I'm a Jew. Like I was like, well, that part
lines up. Like I'm happy.
Like at least I know who I am. I called my mom's best friend
who I hadn't really had much relationship with, and I
basically begged her to explain more to me.
She said, yes, I know it's a lawyer.
I know she fell in love with a lawyer.
I heard they got pregnant, but she told me she had an abortion.
(16:04):
So there's this abortion piece that my dad was feeding me,
which I always thought was so weird.
And she was like, you know, I know your sister is probably not
your dad's. He came to this country in the
in 1939. It was during like the Holocaust
and they were on a boat and he got measles, mumps, rubella at
(16:25):
thirteen years old. And it left him low fertility.
So they went to a sperm donor. At that time it was rare, you
know, it was the 50s. And they mixed his sperm with
this donor. And Rosemary always told me
that's my mom and her best friend's name is Pam, that they
(16:47):
pretty much knew that Allison was not my dad's, but they
weren't 100% sure because you didn't know when you mixed.
But I think my dad was so smart.I mean, not just book smart,
really intuitive. And I know he knew.
I just know he knew with me. I know he knew with her he
couldn't have kids. He knew that.
(17:07):
And she said she got pregnant with this lawyer and she cried
to my dad like, this is how badly I want a baby.
And he said, OK, Rosemary, you have an abortion.
And then we'll go to the fertility doctors like I did
with Allison's mother. That was a story my mom told her
friends. So there was a pregnancy out of
(17:31):
wedlock, but she told him that she was going to have an
abortion, but she never did. Oh, I considered that.
I was from a donor and I did allthis research.
I would sit for hours on my way on the subway.
I would sit with a notebook, like trying to break down my
tree from ancestry. And I finally like found this
(17:52):
woman who's like, I'm going to try to help you.
I was like, whoever my dad is, is your cousin somewhere?
Second cousin, I'm from Brooklynand maybe you can help me.
Then I said, but I'm a don't probably from a donor.
So she's like, I have this cousin.
He lives in Seattle. He's a neurosurgeon, which is
(18:13):
like a dream for this hypochondriac girl.
And he donated sperm in the late70s.
And I was like, Oh my God, it's him.
So she asks him if I can write to him and he says yes.
And we write back and forth and he is so lovely.
And I was so happy. He had never had kids and he was
(18:34):
married and lives in Seattle. And lovely, lovely, Lovely
became a realtor after he retired from being a
neurosurgeon. My mom was a realtor and an
artist. But I just loved him so much.
And he was getting excited too, the crazy thing.
And he's like, all right, let's figure it out.
Let's do adna test. So I sent him ADNA test.
(18:57):
We both did it. And can I just tell you, I think
that this is one of the most upsetting things was finding out
that he wasn't. It is so strange.
The chance to have someone so lovely be my genetic father and
be able to meet him would have been so nice, but we were both
(19:19):
so disappointed. I Remember Me getting the
results and sending it to him and you know, he wrote me a
lovely letter basically saying whoever it is would be lucky and
he was just as disappointed as Iwas.
I'm. Sorry, it's.
OK. And I don't even know, I think
(19:39):
I'm probably just transferring my emotions on to that because
it doesn't make that much sense.But he was lovely.
And then the crazy thing is thatwoman, it was her cousin, it was
just on the wrong side. Then she's like, there's this
guy Leon, he was from Brooklyn. I think I met him at my bar
(20:02):
mitzvah. Like she wasn't sure.
And it just was a dead end. I couldn't find anything on him
and there was no links. He had never done Ancestry and
no one related, just like tightly related to him did.
And I gave up for so long. Did you tell your sister who you
always believed was your half sister?
What did she say? Well, she was on her own
(20:25):
journey. She found out a lot more, a lot
quicker than I did. She had like a million matches.
That's an exaggeration, but a lot.
And she found all these half siblings and they had all met
over those four years. And there I was with like zero
matches for the longest time andfinding like second cousins and
nothing, nothing stuck. And I realized pretty quickly
(20:49):
after what happened with Hal, that was the guy who I thought
was my genetic dad. I kind of realized I wasn't.
Maybe I wasn't from a donor, butI think I wanted to believe I
was from a donor because then I felt like they both wanted me
and they both did what they had to do to get me.
And there was a lot of shame in my realizing that I was a result
(21:14):
of an affair because Oh my God, the shame was so heavy.
And I it's so sick because it had nothing to do with anything
I could have possibly chosen. I was so defeated.
And then I was starting to get really nervous about medical
(21:34):
history. My son was having stomach
issues. And I just started to get myself
so nervous. I said, how could I leave this?
So I did 23andMe, it came back first cousins with this guy
Steven. And I wrote to him and he was
like, I know exactly who your father has to be.
He's my he's my cousin. He's from Brooklyn and his name
(21:58):
is Leon. And I was like, this is two
people saying this guy Leon, he gives me the 1st and the last
name. And I call my boss who I worked
for for like 25 years in Brooklyn Heights.
And she's like, oh, I know Leon.And I was like, you know him?
And she's like, yeah, I was like, I think he's my dad.
She goes, no way, that's crazy. And she's like, I'm pretty sure
(22:19):
he's still alive. So I call around and it turns
out he died. He had died 2017.
Another woman who knew him was like, well, he has a daughter
and she's a lawyer too. And anyway, so I ended up
writing to his daughter and I end up meeting her.
She's my half sister. And then she has a full brother
(22:40):
who I've never met. And then I actually have a
younger brother because Leon wasdivorced when my mom and him
were together. He was not married at the time.
And then he ended up getting married, a second marriage and
having us a son who's 4 1/2 years younger than me, I think.
And we actually went to the samecollege.
He's very nice. I've only spoken with him a few
(23:04):
times. What have you been able to learn
about him through his children and his wife?
His daughter has only the nicestthings to say about him, and
she's actually lovely. She lives in California.
She has a beautiful family. She's successful.
She loved her dad. When he got sick, she moved him
(23:25):
out from Brooklyn to California and took care of him.
She loved him so much that he just has to have been a great
guy. His son from his second
marriage, I think they had more of a tumultuous relationship.
I talked to him about it a few times and I just felt like it
was loaded and I didn't want to make him feel like he had to
(23:47):
tell me who his dad was. I think he was still dealing
with his dad's death at the timebecause don't forget, I think I
spoke to them 2020, that dad, their dad had only died like
three years earlier. And I think his son and him had
a little bit more of a complicated relationship.
So I didn't want to. And he's younger than me so I
was like looking out for him andI just didn't want to cause him
(24:09):
any headache. OK, so your mom's friend, she
told you that your mom had an affair with Leon the lawyer and
fell in love with him. She got pregnant.
Your dad asked her to get an abortion and then they could go
and do the donation route like they did with his first
(24:32):
daughter, but she didn't. Do you think that your dad
believed that she did go get an abortion and then go to his
clinic? No, he had to have known.
She didn't because he was, like I said, he was so smart.
I think he was just very understanding of the fact that
she wanted to have a baby and hewasn't able to provide that.
(24:53):
And I don't know if it was that she said, you know, why, why?
Why do I have to have an abortion?
This person won't be a part of our lives.
I won't tell him, you know, or Idon't know how it, I don't know.
And I don't even know if he knewI existed.
Because she left Brooklyn for a year.
She bought a house in Long Island and they lived there for
(25:16):
a year the year I was born, ironically.
And then she came back to Brooklyn with a baby.
So I don't know that he would have ever put two and two
together. Or maybe he did know, but his
second wife, who's still alive, his daughter and his son said
they know. He did not know.
Who knows? I'm not sure.
(25:38):
Bapart feels upsetting. I'll never know if he knew that
I existed because we worked on the same block for 15 years.
I went to college on the block he lived on.
I mean we had to have passed each other 7,000,000 times.
Not to mention I passed my half sibling probably in school.
(25:59):
Sure. I think so many of us in the
community have these like questions that we know that we
might never get answered right. I'll never know.
I'll never know what happened. I mean, literally, I just need
to accept that. And of course, my wish is that
someone will hear this podcast and say, well, actually I knew
(26:21):
them and this is what happened. But I know that's not going to
happen, or at least I don't think so.
But I will say the one of the only memories I have of my
parents together was not a greatmemory.
But we were in a car and all of a sudden they were fighting and
my mom must have opened the doorwhile it was moving and then
(26:42):
opened my back door and took me out.
And it was like out of a movie where someone's walking with
someone and someone's driving next to them and they were just
screaming at each other on the street.
I don't know where that street was.
I don't know what what the time frame was, but I remember it.
And it was one of the only timesI remember my dad crying.
I asked him about it when I was older.
(27:04):
I was like, was there ever a time that we were in the car?
And you and mom got in some horrible fight and she got out
of the car while it was moving and took me out of the car.
And he just cried. He was like, I can't believe you
remember that at 3 1/2 years old.
Like, what? Who remembers anything from 3
1/2? Like, what must have that memory
(27:26):
been to see her into your brain like that?
Like, I just think it shocked him.
But I wonder if that was the time where he said she said to
him she was dying. You know, maybe she said, you
know, this is who it was. Or I'm going to tell them.
Who knows? Who knows?
I don't know. I will say out of all of this,
(27:50):
the thing I take away is any child who's had trauma or
secrets being hidden from them, they become very intuitive.
They're able to, like, remember things that they need to
remember because no one's actually giving them answers.
They're going to map it out themselves.
They're going to figure it out, and they know so much more than
(28:11):
adults give them credit for. And the other thing is, I think
it's OK to have secrets, but I think what they did is denied
someone else their truth. So I could have gone my whole
life without knowing this. And not only would that have
been unfair because my dad also had a rare type of cancer,
because I would have thought that I would have gotten that,
(28:34):
but also because what if there was something I needed to know
for my children? And I am a warrior.
And I think that was really whatdrove my search.
And it was one of the first things I asked my half sister.
And she remembers it. I basically was like, OK, great.
Good to know. Any other things you want to
tell me about his health? You know, she was just like, OK,
(28:55):
I get it. Like, you really just want to
know if he ever had cancer. And I was like, yes, because I'm
so scared. My mom had cancer at 34.
You know, she died at 38. I'm so nervous.
And part of it was relief that he didn't because both my
parents had cancer. My dad had cancer when I was 6
and he beat it. But that would have, I felt like
(29:16):
cancer was like, I don't know, like an evil person after me.
It was so scary that he got it right after she did.
The last thing I'll say about what hurt me was realizing that
I was raised by no one who is myparent.
So I was like, no wonder I felt out of place.
(29:36):
And it was really interesting because in the end, I felt so at
place with my dad as an as a teenager and once you retired
and we were together and I had felt so out of place with my
aunt. But now looking back, she was
the only one related to me that raised me.
He wasn't related to me. I know an Ant on one side is
probably is only 25% genetics but that's more than anybody
(29:57):
else that was raising me had. I've spoken to some other people
who have had that experience where it turns out they were
raised by someone who was not genetically related to them at
all. How do you process that?
I feel bad for the people who also had to raise me.
I know that sounds complicated, but I feel bad for him because I
(30:20):
think he really wanted to hand me over.
And now in retrospect, I think it's because he thought I
belonged to them. Maybe he didn't even know if I
was the same religion as him or if I was, you know, maybe to put
me with my own, maybe to leave me there as much as possible
because he let them, you know, Ilike they, they taught me like
(30:43):
religion and things like that. And I don't think he knew.
I don't know if he knew like that whoever was my genetic
father had the same ethnicity ashim.
I don't know how in depth my momgot.
Maybe she never told him becausethat would make him liable for
not saying something. I don't know.
But knowing what I know, I feel bad for all of us, including
(31:05):
him, because even if he knew, hewas probably so scared to tell
me because it was just me and him and he would lose me or be
worried that he would lose me. And then for me, I feel bad
because I just felt so out of place.
And my aunt, I'm thankful that she helped.
I think that she did the best she could.
(31:26):
She had her own daughter, she had her own family.
She always tried to include me. The fact that I didn't fit in a
lot of the time was out of her control.
It's just because I didn't fit in anywhere, because I actually
didn't fit in, you know, I was, I was someone else's all
together. Without being able to get a lot
of answers from the players thatwere involved, what has helped
(31:50):
you process this? I think the thing that's helped
me process it is telling the story, because I think the shame
comes from feeling like you shouldn't tell anybody.
And I think it's important to just say it.
And I think anyone who is hidingsomething from someone that's
(32:13):
imperative to their medical health, to them knowing who they
are, should tell them because I think it frees everybody.
I think about sometimes, I know,breast cancers, a lot of
factors, but imagine the immenseweight my mother was carrying,
carrying this baby, giving birthto a baby that wasn't her
(32:35):
husband's, not being able to tell her best friends, wondering
if he'd always hold it against her.
What about when she was dying? Wondering if he would love me
the way she would love me. I just think it would have been
freeing for her to tell her family and her friends.
(32:56):
Yeah. Are you very open about it with
all of the people in your life? I tell my kids, yes, I tell them
exactly what happened because I don't want them to carry the
guilt of it because that's what happens.
You inherit guilt. And I feel bad for my sister's
mom's death because my mom, I'm not saying she played a part in
(33:20):
it, but might have been something that happened that
deepened my my sister's mom's depression.
And I think we inherit the guiltof the choices of our parents.
And I think the way to clear it is to admit it and say it and
let it out. That's really beautifully said.
(33:42):
Thank you for sharing that. What's next for you in your
journey? I.
Think I'm just going to not let it go, but I think I wanted to
do this because I just wanted todocument it.
I've always thought about writing about it and it's just
too many things because I don't know what the story would be.
(34:03):
Would it be the girl who lost her mother really young and was
always worried of getting sick? The girl who was raised like
Punky Brewster and Henry? That's how I always like me and
my dad used to watch that show like that.
Is that the story how we ended up having this amazing
relationship and we were too oddchoices like The Odd Couple of
(34:25):
parent and child? Or is it that I'm angry about
not knowing where I came from for most of my life?
I don't know even know what the story is, but here it is, all of
it out and I can maybe put it away a little bit.
Yeah, are you still angry? Saddest.
(34:45):
Things I don't even think I was ever angry.
Maybe that'll come later. Maybe I'm the type that cries
first and feels angry later. I feel bad for my mom.
She was in her early 20s when she got married to someone who
couldn't have kids. And I don't think she knew what
that meant. You know, she didn't want kids
at that time. And maybe it just, she got in
(35:06):
too deep. I think there's layers to all of
this. There's so many layers to
people. It's so complicated, and I think
the more that we give people thechance to peel those layers back
and figure out why they really made the choices they did, then
we'll understand better and not be angry.
(35:26):
I don't even know if that makes sense, but I felt bad for her.
I felt bad for everybody, including me, but I felt bad for
my dad. Can you imagine how that would
have felt coming here from another country when you're 13
because people want to kill you because you're Jewish and you
get on a boat and you get so sick that it means you can never
(35:48):
have kids in your life that are genetically yours?
I mean, what the hell? His story was like a horrible a
horrible saga. And then it didn't work out with
his first wife. She ends up committing suicide,
leaving him with the first daughter who isn't his.
I mean, who is? But genetically then he falls in
love with this young woman. What are the chances that she'd
(36:10):
die when she was 24 years younger than him, leaving him
with another child to raise thatwasn't his?
It's a. Lot.
Yeah, it's a lot. Like what did he ever do?
He would just sit. And at night sometimes he would
just sit there, no TV, Like he would watch the opera and then
he would just sit there with hislike martini.
(36:31):
And God knows what he was thinking now.
I wish I could ask him, but I didn't know.
What would you say is your most burning question around all of?
This what happened. I just want to know what
happened. I mean, honestly, the idea of
just being able to sit with one of my parents, the genetic ones,
(36:51):
the not genetic 1. It's really interesting how
profound that sense of not belonging was for you for so
much of your life. Do you feel like you have a
place where you belong now? Yes.
Because I made my own family andthank God.
(37:12):
And it's ironic. I married someone named Dan, and
my dad's name was Dan, the one who raised me.
So it's fun. Yeah.
The thing is like, I don't want anyone in my life to feel
responsible for the fact that I didn't feel like I belonged
because the feeling I had was inme.
It wasn't anyone else. It wasn't their fault.
(37:36):
I think I just couldn't figure it out.
I it took me a really long time to figure out what this feeling
was I felt and then I finally figured it out so I feel it was
cathartic. What advice do you have for a
parent who is keeping adna surprised from their child?
My advice is to tell the truth and to put the truth before any
(38:00):
feelings of vulnerability or fear because the child deserves
to know, and especially if they're going to find out
anyway. I feel like everybody finds out
anyway. I don't think people like us are
going to exist much longer because people are going to be
able to scan themselves and knowexactly where they come from.
Yes, and what advice do you havefor someone who just uncovered?
(38:25):
Adna surprise, that's easy. You're OK.
You're going to be OK, and that's it.
Danielle, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and
sharing your story with me today.
I'm so happy that you found a place.
Where you feel like you. Belong with your family and I
(38:47):
wish you the best. Thank you so much.
Thanks again to Danielle for sharing her story.
If you have Adna Surprise that you'd like to share, submit your
story at dnasurprises.com. And remember, join me over on
Patreon for early access to ad free episodes.
You can sign up over at patreon.com/DNA Surprises for as
(39:10):
little as $5 per month. Until next time, this episode of
DNA Surprises was hosted, produced and edited.
By me. Alexis Ourselt It was mixed and
mastered by Josh Ourselt of Siren Recording Studios.
The saddest thing is I don't even think I was ever angry.
Maybe that'll come later. Maybe I'm the type that cries
first and feels angry later. I feel bad for my mom.
She was in her early 20s when she got married to someone who
couldn't have kids. And I don't think she knew what
that meant. You know, she didn't want kids
at that time. And maybe it just, she got in
(00:21):
too deep. I think there's layers to all of
this. There's so many layers to
people. It's so complicated, and I think
the more that we give people thechance to peel those layers back
and figure out why they really made the choices they did, then
we'll understand better and not be angry.
(00:42):
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that delves into the
world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
I'm your host Alexis, our salt. In July 2021, my life took a
surprising turn when I found outthat I'm an NPE, a person who
has experienced a non paternal event.
(01:04):
In other words, my biological father isn't who I thought he
was. Join me as we explore the
stories of NP, ES, adoptees, anddonor conceived people and their
families. Get ready to unravel the
astonishing journeys that begin with a simple DNA test.
This is DNA surprises. I knew it or I had no idea.
(01:33):
When it comes to DNA surprises, some people are completely
blindsided. Others felt like they knew it
all along. Danielle never felt like she fit
in with her family. Her mother died when she was
just three years old, and for the rest of her childhood she
was raised by her dad, who travelled often for work, and
(01:54):
her aunt, her mother's sister. Danielle knew that her dad had
difficulty conceiving her older half sister with his first wife,
and she questioned if they were biologically related.
More than a decade after her daddied, another aunt gave her a
letter he'd written to her, which described the sometimes
tumultuous relationship but genuine love her parents had for
(02:17):
one another. A confession of sorts.
When she learned that her sisterhad taken a consumer DNA test,
Danielle finally had her chance to uncover the truth.
After getting her results, doingextensive research, and learning
surprising information from her mother's best friend, she
finally did. Thank you Danielle for sharing
(02:41):
your story. My first name's Danielle and I
am from Brooklyn, NY and my age is 44.
My DNA surprise was finding out that my father who raised me
wasn't my genetic father. I think that I on some level
always had an idea that that wastrue, but it was very
(03:04):
complicated because my mom passed away from breast cancer
when I was 3 1/2. And my dad raised me along with
the help of my aunt and grandmother.
And I think this was a shock foreverybody that she died so
young. And I don't know if my dad maybe
(03:26):
maybe they would have told me, but I don't think so.
I do think he knew. I'm very close to believing that
he definitely knew. I just don't know if he knew who
or he knew the exact storyline of how it happened.
But he raised me with a lot of help from my aunt and my
(03:48):
grandmother. He traveled for work.
He was gone, you know, sometimesthree months at a time overseas
working in 3rd world countries to teach Planned Parenthood,
AIDS prevention. There were a lot of times that
he was gone, that it seems strange to me that he would
leave me behind. And he would always say it was
(04:11):
because there was children in other countries that needed
help. And I always pretended to
understand that as a little girl.
And my aunt who raised me has a daughter and helped raise me, I
should say. And they were good to me.
But I never felt like I fit in anywhere, not with my dad.
(04:32):
When he was home, I'd stay at the apartment with him and I
would feel a little lonely because I'd miss my aunt.
And her house was a little bit busier because she had her
daughter. And my uncle lived there also.
And he was very good to me. But I think there was always a
feeling of being misplaced. And I, I think it caused a lot
(04:54):
of issues for me. I had really bad anxiety as a
little girl. I was worried about dying,
getting sick, I was missing my dad.
But then when he would come back, I didn't want to go with
him. And I can honestly say I never
felt like I fit in where I was. Were your parents your mom and
(05:14):
dad? Were they married when you were
born? They were married when I was
born. I do believe that they were
having problems. I don't know exactly when that
started. But without giving too much of
my sister, my half sister who ended up not being related to me
at all, too much of her story, Ican start a little bit farther
(05:36):
back. My dad was married.
He was a Holocaust survivor. He wasn't in a concentration
camp, but he was born 1926 in the Czech Republic.
He moved to this country 1939 because of the war and when he
came here they went from being very wealthy to very poor.
He was living in Queens. He got married to another woman
(05:58):
who came here from Europe duringthe Holocaust for 1927 I think,
and that is my half sister's mom.
They did not have an easy time getting pregnant.
They were married for 10 years before she arrived.
His sperm count was low. That's what they had told all of
us, you know, as to why Alison was their only child and why it
(06:22):
took ten years for them to have her.
And it turns out that she is notgenetically his either.
So my mom met my dad when him and his first wife were
separated. Or I should say he left and they
got together before they were legally divorced.
(06:44):
She went for an interview with him and they ended up hitting it
off and they ended up to get married.
And I'm not saying this is the reason why, but my half sister's
mom killed herself. So that was a trauma for my
sister. And then she ended up living
with my mom and my dad, and thatwas when she was 16.
(07:10):
We were raised always thinking that we shared a dad.
I always had a feeling that I wasn't related to my sister as
much as I, you know, would have liked to be.
I just didn't see any at all similarities between us.
She was older than me, 20 plus years older, but I just couldn't
(07:30):
see anything. She's very musical, artistic, I
like the arts, but we are, she'sjust very different from me.
So I had been assuming this whole thing for a very long
time. And 1:00 trip my husband and I
took to visit my sister in Boston.
(07:51):
She had mentioned that she did Ancestry DNA because her
boyfriend who was sitting there at the time said he had done
Ancestry DNA and he found out all this cool stuff about
himself. He found out that he had some
Native American in him and like he wasn't all Italian like he
thought and it was really exciting.
So she's like, well, I did it because it sounded so exciting.
(08:13):
And it turns out I'm 100% Ashkenazi Jew, and that's not
surprising at all. So that was boring.
And that night when we went to sleep, because I had told my
husband about 50 times, I reallydon't think my dad was my
genetic dad, but I assumed he was hers.
I said, this is how I'll find out.
We went back to Brooklyn and I got a DNA, Ancestry DNA in the
(08:36):
mail and I sent it away. And this is the first time I'm
admitting this will be the firsttime that she hears that that
was actually the intention of doing Ancestry DNA.
It wasn't like most people that say I did Ancestry DNA and I
found out like, no, I did ancestry DNA because I heard
someone else in my family did itand I was pretty sure that was a
(08:57):
good way to find out. So at this point she still
believes that she is related to your father.
Is that correct? Yeah, she had no idea, 'cause I
think so many people look at their ancestry and they're like,
OK, it says I'm what I am and that's it, you know?
So yes, she is 100% Jewish, but that doesn't mean that those two
(09:20):
parents, just because it's a match ethnicity wise, is adna
match. But she didn't look farther into
it. She just let it go.
OK, so then you go back home andyou get a test.
What happens next? Everyone thought I was crazy.
I just would like to say that, you know everyone, it would have
(09:41):
been going on for years. It really got very strong.
My feelings when I had my first child's and I was 31 and I just
was so sure that something wasn't right.
I just felt like how could he really leave, you know?
Something was just strange to meand I know he needed to make
money and I know he was single parent, but and the other thing
(10:05):
that I should just say is that if he had trouble getting
pregnant when he was in his 20s,what would ever make anyone
believe that it would be easy for them to get pregnant when he
was in his 50s? So it was just also just common
sense. And then the last thing about it
is that I had heard stories thatmy mom had had an affair and I
(10:29):
actually heard the story from mysister and my half sister and I
didn't talk to her for a while because I just thought it was
cruel that she told me that because my mom wasn't there to
defend herself. Basically all of this just made
me realize. And then the tipping point was I
got a letter that one of my aunts, not the one who helped
(10:51):
raise me, my Aunt Una, my momma's other sister, gave to
me, that my dad had written to me when my mom died.
He was in Bangladesh. It says that on the top.
He typed it and he signed it. Love Dad.
And it was basically this letterjust telling me about my mom and
telling me what people would probably tell me about their
(11:14):
tumultuous relationship and how just like storms, they would
have these times where they would fight, but they would make
up and they would reaffirm theirlove for each other basically.
And I think he was trying to tell me that I wasn't his
because so many of the words andI didn't get this letter till I
(11:35):
was an adult. So many of the words were like
you were a part of my Rosemary. You were our our chance at a
happiness I wasn't able to give her.
There was a lot of this like tone and I knew from that letter
and he raised me. I mean, it was me and him.
I knew what he was saying and didn't have to say it.
And my aunt said absolutely not my sister, they were they're
(11:59):
Irish Catholic. My sister would never, she would
never have an affair. And I said OK.
And I said, well, my dad mentioned that she had had an
abortion. Oh, never.
Not Rosemary. No, no, she never would have.
And I think all of these things just confused me more and set me
back. How old were you when you got
(12:22):
the letter? I was already a mom and it was
just, it was all coming to like a head.
My aunt Una and I didn't have a very close relationship because
she had wanted to take me away from my dad.
She had threatened that she was going to take him to court
because my mom would have wantedher to have me.
(12:43):
And he, she wanted him to move to Long Island and he wanted to
stay in Brooklyn. And they ended up having a huge
falling out and they stopped talking and she stopped talking
to me. So when he died when I was 18,
my dad died when I was 18, suddenly he had a heart attack
in the car. She contacted me, but it took me
a while. You know, I just was like, now
(13:04):
you're going to come around. You know, you kind of abandoned
me because you didn't get along with him.
And she was like, well, you don't know everything.
And I was like, I don't want to know anything.
He's gone. And I don't know what you have
to say, but I just can't. I just didn't want to hear it.
But she claimed that after all that, getting that letter and
then me saying to her, were you going to tell me years ago that
(13:27):
he wasn't my dad? She said no, I wasn't going to
tell you that, so who knows? Do you believe that he was
trying to tell you as much as hecould in the letter without
telling you? I do, but then there's part of
me that feels like he was tryingto hide it too, mentioning an
abortion like is, you know, because we all lived in the same
place, we never left. And I think maybe just in case
(13:48):
he I ever heard something from someone, you know, just to make
sure that lined up. But I always thought it was
weird. Like, why would you tell me
that? Why did you tell me?
Yeah, that's like a really personal thing to share that if
it didn't have anything to do with you.
And I remember being like when you bulbs before you were born.
(14:08):
And I'm like, why? Why'd you do that?
You know, like, but whatever. I was just like, OK, you know,
fine. But I always remembered that
being weird. How many years went by between
you getting this letter and getting that internal sort of
affirmation that he may he may not be your biological father to
when you took the test? That letter was 31, The test was
(14:30):
36. So it took me a long time and I
tried everything. I mean, I contacted people
trying to understand more and I was at the point and I I feel so
bad that I'm saying this and she's going to hear this, but I
was like at the point I was going to take care from her
brush. I was like that sure.
By the time we visited her and it was kind of like a gift
(14:53):
because that night we're sittingthere and they tell me they did
ancestry and I was like, what? That's crazy because I literally
we joked around my husband and Ithat I was going to take some
kind of sample. But the weirdest thing is then
so we take this test and we're not linked.
And I called Ancestry DNA just to just to make sure.
(15:17):
And they were basically like, yeah, these are these are
usually not mistakes. Is this a possibility?
And I was like, yeah, it's definitely a possibility.
It was so confusing because I'm half Irish Catholic, like first
generation Brooklyn, like my mom's one of six kids and my dad
is an Eastern European Jew. But it lined up like it's true,
(15:42):
I'm a Jew. Like I was like, well, that part
lines up. Like I'm happy.
Like at least I know who I am. I called my mom's best friend
who I hadn't really had much relationship with, and I
basically begged her to explain more to me.
She said, yes, I know it's a lawyer.
I know she fell in love with a lawyer.
I heard they got pregnant, but she told me she had an abortion.
(16:04):
So there's this abortion piece that my dad was feeding me,
which I always thought was so weird.
And she was like, you know, I know your sister is probably not
your dad's. He came to this country in the
in 1939. It was during like the Holocaust
and they were on a boat and he got measles, mumps, rubella at
(16:25):
thirteen years old. And it left him low fertility.
So they went to a sperm donor. At that time it was rare, you
know, it was the 50s. And they mixed his sperm with
this donor. And Rosemary always told me
that's my mom and her best friend's name is Pam, that they
(16:47):
pretty much knew that Allison was not my dad's, but they
weren't 100% sure because you didn't know when you mixed.
But I think my dad was so smart.I mean, not just book smart,
really intuitive. And I know he knew.
I just know he knew with me. I know he knew with her he
couldn't have kids. He knew that.
(17:07):
And she said she got pregnant with this lawyer and she cried
to my dad like, this is how badly I want a baby.
And he said, OK, Rosemary, you have an abortion.
And then we'll go to the fertility doctors like I did
with Allison's mother. That was a story my mom told her
friends. So there was a pregnancy out of
(17:31):
wedlock, but she told him that she was going to have an
abortion, but she never did. Oh, I considered that.
I was from a donor and I did allthis research.
I would sit for hours on my way on the subway.
I would sit with a notebook, like trying to break down my
tree from ancestry. And I finally like found this
(17:52):
woman who's like, I'm going to try to help you.
I was like, whoever my dad is, is your cousin somewhere?
Second cousin, I'm from Brooklynand maybe you can help me.
Then I said, but I'm a don't probably from a donor.
So she's like, I have this cousin.
He lives in Seattle. He's a neurosurgeon, which is
(18:13):
like a dream for this hypochondriac girl.
And he donated sperm in the late70s.
And I was like, Oh my God, it's him.
So she asks him if I can write to him and he says yes.
And we write back and forth and he is so lovely.
And I was so happy. He had never had kids and he was
(18:34):
married and lives in Seattle. And lovely, lovely, Lovely
became a realtor after he retired from being a
neurosurgeon. My mom was a realtor and an
artist. But I just loved him so much.
And he was getting excited too, the crazy thing.
And he's like, all right, let's figure it out.
Let's do adna test. So I sent him ADNA test.
(18:57):
We both did it. And can I just tell you, I think
that this is one of the most upsetting things was finding out
that he wasn't. It is so strange.
The chance to have someone so lovely be my genetic father and
be able to meet him would have been so nice, but we were both
(19:19):
so disappointed. I Remember Me getting the
results and sending it to him and you know, he wrote me a
lovely letter basically saying whoever it is would be lucky and
he was just as disappointed as Iwas.
I'm. Sorry, it's.
OK. And I don't even know, I think
(19:39):
I'm probably just transferring my emotions on to that because
it doesn't make that much sense.But he was lovely.
And then the crazy thing is thatwoman, it was her cousin, it was
just on the wrong side. Then she's like, there's this
guy Leon, he was from Brooklyn. I think I met him at my bar
(20:02):
mitzvah. Like she wasn't sure.
And it just was a dead end. I couldn't find anything on him
and there was no links. He had never done Ancestry and
no one related, just like tightly related to him did.
And I gave up for so long. Did you tell your sister who you
always believed was your half sister?
What did she say? Well, she was on her own
(20:25):
journey. She found out a lot more, a lot
quicker than I did. She had like a million matches.
That's an exaggeration, but a lot.
And she found all these half siblings and they had all met
over those four years. And there I was with like zero
matches for the longest time andfinding like second cousins and
nothing, nothing stuck. And I realized pretty quickly
(20:49):
after what happened with Hal, that was the guy who I thought
was my genetic dad. I kind of realized I wasn't.
Maybe I wasn't from a donor, butI think I wanted to believe I
was from a donor because then I felt like they both wanted me
and they both did what they had to do to get me.
And there was a lot of shame in my realizing that I was a result
(21:14):
of an affair because Oh my God, the shame was so heavy.
And I it's so sick because it had nothing to do with anything
I could have possibly chosen. I was so defeated.
And then I was starting to get really nervous about medical
(21:34):
history. My son was having stomach
issues. And I just started to get myself
so nervous. I said, how could I leave this?
So I did 23andMe, it came back first cousins with this guy
Steven. And I wrote to him and he was
like, I know exactly who your father has to be.
He's my he's my cousin. He's from Brooklyn and his name
(21:58):
is Leon. And I was like, this is two
people saying this guy Leon, he gives me the 1st and the last
name. And I call my boss who I worked
for for like 25 years in Brooklyn Heights.
And she's like, oh, I know Leon.And I was like, you know him?
And she's like, yeah, I was like, I think he's my dad.
She goes, no way, that's crazy. And she's like, I'm pretty sure
(22:19):
he's still alive. So I call around and it turns
out he died. He had died 2017.
Another woman who knew him was like, well, he has a daughter
and she's a lawyer too. And anyway, so I ended up
writing to his daughter and I end up meeting her.
She's my half sister. And then she has a full brother
(22:40):
who I've never met. And then I actually have a
younger brother because Leon wasdivorced when my mom and him
were together. He was not married at the time.
And then he ended up getting married, a second marriage and
having us a son who's 4 1/2 years younger than me, I think.
And we actually went to the samecollege.
He's very nice. I've only spoken with him a few
(23:04):
times. What have you been able to learn
about him through his children and his wife?
His daughter has only the nicestthings to say about him, and
she's actually lovely. She lives in California.
She has a beautiful family. She's successful.
She loved her dad. When he got sick, she moved him
(23:25):
out from Brooklyn to California and took care of him.
She loved him so much that he just has to have been a great
guy. His son from his second
marriage, I think they had more of a tumultuous relationship.
I talked to him about it a few times and I just felt like it
was loaded and I didn't want to make him feel like he had to
(23:47):
tell me who his dad was. I think he was still dealing
with his dad's death at the timebecause don't forget, I think I
spoke to them 2020, that dad, their dad had only died like
three years earlier. And I think his son and him had
a little bit more of a complicated relationship.
So I didn't want to. And he's younger than me so I
was like looking out for him andI just didn't want to cause him
(24:09):
any headache. OK, so your mom's friend, she
told you that your mom had an affair with Leon the lawyer and
fell in love with him. She got pregnant.
Your dad asked her to get an abortion and then they could go
and do the donation route like they did with his first
(24:32):
daughter, but she didn't. Do you think that your dad
believed that she did go get an abortion and then go to his
clinic? No, he had to have known.
She didn't because he was, like I said, he was so smart.
I think he was just very understanding of the fact that
she wanted to have a baby and hewasn't able to provide that.
(24:53):
And I don't know if it was that she said, you know, why, why?
Why do I have to have an abortion?
This person won't be a part of our lives.
I won't tell him, you know, or Idon't know how it, I don't know.
And I don't even know if he knewI existed.
Because she left Brooklyn for a year.
She bought a house in Long Island and they lived there for
(25:16):
a year the year I was born, ironically.
And then she came back to Brooklyn with a baby.
So I don't know that he would have ever put two and two
together. Or maybe he did know, but his
second wife, who's still alive, his daughter and his son said
they know. He did not know.
Who knows? I'm not sure.
(25:38):
Bapart feels upsetting. I'll never know if he knew that
I existed because we worked on the same block for 15 years.
I went to college on the block he lived on.
I mean we had to have passed each other 7,000,000 times.
Not to mention I passed my half sibling probably in school.
(25:59):
Sure. I think so many of us in the
community have these like questions that we know that we
might never get answered right. I'll never know.
I'll never know what happened. I mean, literally, I just need
to accept that. And of course, my wish is that
someone will hear this podcast and say, well, actually I knew
(26:21):
them and this is what happened. But I know that's not going to
happen, or at least I don't think so.
But I will say the one of the only memories I have of my
parents together was not a greatmemory.
But we were in a car and all of a sudden they were fighting and
my mom must have opened the doorwhile it was moving and then
(26:42):
opened my back door and took me out.
And it was like out of a movie where someone's walking with
someone and someone's driving next to them and they were just
screaming at each other on the street.
I don't know where that street was.
I don't know what what the time frame was, but I remember it.
And it was one of the only timesI remember my dad crying.
I asked him about it when I was older.
(27:04):
I was like, was there ever a time that we were in the car?
And you and mom got in some horrible fight and she got out
of the car while it was moving and took me out of the car.
And he just cried. He was like, I can't believe you
remember that at 3 1/2 years old.
Like, what? Who remembers anything from 3
1/2? Like, what must have that memory
(27:26):
been to see her into your brain like that?
Like, I just think it shocked him.
But I wonder if that was the time where he said she said to
him she was dying. You know, maybe she said, you
know, this is who it was. Or I'm going to tell them.
Who knows? Who knows?
I don't know. I will say out of all of this,
(27:50):
the thing I take away is any child who's had trauma or
secrets being hidden from them, they become very intuitive.
They're able to, like, remember things that they need to
remember because no one's actually giving them answers.
They're going to map it out themselves.
They're going to figure it out, and they know so much more than
(28:11):
adults give them credit for. And the other thing is, I think
it's OK to have secrets, but I think what they did is denied
someone else their truth. So I could have gone my whole
life without knowing this. And not only would that have
been unfair because my dad also had a rare type of cancer,
because I would have thought that I would have gotten that,
(28:34):
but also because what if there was something I needed to know
for my children? And I am a warrior.
And I think that was really whatdrove my search.
And it was one of the first things I asked my half sister.
And she remembers it. I basically was like, OK, great.
Good to know. Any other things you want to
tell me about his health? You know, she was just like, OK,
(28:55):
I get it. Like, you really just want to
know if he ever had cancer. And I was like, yes, because I'm
so scared. My mom had cancer at 34.
You know, she died at 38. I'm so nervous.
And part of it was relief that he didn't because both my
parents had cancer. My dad had cancer when I was 6
and he beat it. But that would have, I felt like
(29:16):
cancer was like, I don't know, like an evil person after me.
It was so scary that he got it right after she did.
The last thing I'll say about what hurt me was realizing that
I was raised by no one who is myparent.
So I was like, no wonder I felt out of place.
(29:36):
And it was really interesting because in the end, I felt so at
place with my dad as an as a teenager and once you retired
and we were together and I had felt so out of place with my
aunt. But now looking back, she was
the only one related to me that raised me.
He wasn't related to me. I know an Ant on one side is
probably is only 25% genetics but that's more than anybody
(29:57):
else that was raising me had. I've spoken to some other people
who have had that experience where it turns out they were
raised by someone who was not genetically related to them at
all. How do you process that?
I feel bad for the people who also had to raise me.
I know that sounds complicated, but I feel bad for him because I
(30:20):
think he really wanted to hand me over.
And now in retrospect, I think it's because he thought I
belonged to them. Maybe he didn't even know if I
was the same religion as him or if I was, you know, maybe to put
me with my own, maybe to leave me there as much as possible
because he let them, you know, Ilike they, they taught me like
(30:43):
religion and things like that. And I don't think he knew.
I don't know if he knew like that whoever was my genetic
father had the same ethnicity ashim.
I don't know how in depth my momgot.
Maybe she never told him becausethat would make him liable for
not saying something. I don't know.
But knowing what I know, I feel bad for all of us, including
(31:05):
him, because even if he knew, hewas probably so scared to tell
me because it was just me and him and he would lose me or be
worried that he would lose me. And then for me, I feel bad
because I just felt so out of place.
And my aunt, I'm thankful that she helped.
I think that she did the best she could.
(31:26):
She had her own daughter, she had her own family.
She always tried to include me. The fact that I didn't fit in a
lot of the time was out of her control.
It's just because I didn't fit in anywhere, because I actually
didn't fit in, you know, I was, I was someone else's all
together. Without being able to get a lot
of answers from the players thatwere involved, what has helped
(31:50):
you process this? I think the thing that's helped
me process it is telling the story, because I think the shame
comes from feeling like you shouldn't tell anybody.
And I think it's important to just say it.
And I think anyone who is hidingsomething from someone that's
(32:13):
imperative to their medical health, to them knowing who they
are, should tell them because I think it frees everybody.
I think about sometimes, I know,breast cancers, a lot of
factors, but imagine the immenseweight my mother was carrying,
carrying this baby, giving birthto a baby that wasn't her
(32:35):
husband's, not being able to tell her best friends, wondering
if he'd always hold it against her.
What about when she was dying? Wondering if he would love me
the way she would love me. I just think it would have been
freeing for her to tell her family and her friends.
(32:56):
Yeah. Are you very open about it with
all of the people in your life? I tell my kids, yes, I tell them
exactly what happened because I don't want them to carry the
guilt of it because that's what happens.
You inherit guilt. And I feel bad for my sister's
mom's death because my mom, I'm not saying she played a part in
(33:20):
it, but might have been something that happened that
deepened my my sister's mom's depression.
And I think we inherit the guiltof the choices of our parents.
And I think the way to clear it is to admit it and say it and
let it out. That's really beautifully said.
(33:42):
Thank you for sharing that. What's next for you in your
journey? I.
Think I'm just going to not let it go, but I think I wanted to
do this because I just wanted todocument it.
I've always thought about writing about it and it's just
too many things because I don't know what the story would be.
(34:03):
Would it be the girl who lost her mother really young and was
always worried of getting sick? The girl who was raised like
Punky Brewster and Henry? That's how I always like me and
my dad used to watch that show like that.
Is that the story how we ended up having this amazing
relationship and we were too oddchoices like The Odd Couple of
(34:25):
parent and child? Or is it that I'm angry about
not knowing where I came from for most of my life?
I don't know even know what the story is, but here it is, all of
it out and I can maybe put it away a little bit.
Yeah, are you still angry? Saddest.
(34:45):
Things I don't even think I was ever angry.
Maybe that'll come later. Maybe I'm the type that cries
first and feels angry later. I feel bad for my mom.
She was in her early 20s when she got married to someone who
couldn't have kids. And I don't think she knew what
that meant. You know, she didn't want kids
at that time. And maybe it just, she got in
(35:06):
too deep. I think there's layers to all of
this. There's so many layers to
people. It's so complicated, and I think
the more that we give people thechance to peel those layers back
and figure out why they really made the choices they did, then
we'll understand better and not be angry.
(35:26):
I don't even know if that makes sense, but I felt bad for her.
I felt bad for everybody, including me, but I felt bad for
my dad. Can you imagine how that would
have felt coming here from another country when you're 13
because people want to kill you because you're Jewish and you
get on a boat and you get so sick that it means you can never
(35:48):
have kids in your life that are genetically yours?
I mean, what the hell? His story was like a horrible a
horrible saga. And then it didn't work out with
his first wife. She ends up committing suicide,
leaving him with the first daughter who isn't his.
I mean, who is? But genetically then he falls in
love with this young woman. What are the chances that she'd
(36:10):
die when she was 24 years younger than him, leaving him
with another child to raise thatwasn't his?
It's a. Lot.
Yeah, it's a lot. Like what did he ever do?
He would just sit. And at night sometimes he would
just sit there, no TV, Like he would watch the opera and then
he would just sit there with hislike martini.
(36:31):
And God knows what he was thinking now.
I wish I could ask him, but I didn't know.
What would you say is your most burning question around all of?
This what happened. I just want to know what
happened. I mean, honestly, the idea of
just being able to sit with one of my parents, the genetic ones,
(36:51):
the not genetic 1. It's really interesting how
profound that sense of not belonging was for you for so
much of your life. Do you feel like you have a
place where you belong now? Yes.
Because I made my own family andthank God.
(37:12):
And it's ironic. I married someone named Dan, and
my dad's name was Dan, the one who raised me.
So it's fun. Yeah.
The thing is like, I don't want anyone in my life to feel
responsible for the fact that I didn't feel like I belonged
because the feeling I had was inme.
It wasn't anyone else. It wasn't their fault.
(37:36):
I think I just couldn't figure it out.
I it took me a really long time to figure out what this feeling
was I felt and then I finally figured it out so I feel it was
cathartic. What advice do you have for a
parent who is keeping adna surprised from their child?
My advice is to tell the truth and to put the truth before any
(38:00):
feelings of vulnerability or fear because the child deserves
to know, and especially if they're going to find out
anyway. I feel like everybody finds out
anyway. I don't think people like us are
going to exist much longer because people are going to be
able to scan themselves and knowexactly where they come from.
Yes, and what advice do you havefor someone who just uncovered?
(38:25):
Adna surprise, that's easy. You're OK.
You're going to be OK, and that's it.
Danielle, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and
sharing your story with me today.
I'm so happy that you found a place.
Where you feel like you. Belong with your family and I
(38:47):
wish you the best. Thank you so much.
Thanks again to Danielle for sharing her story.
If you have Adna Surprise that you'd like to share, submit your
story at dnasurprises.com. And remember, join me over on
Patreon for early access to ad free episodes.
You can sign up over at patreon.com/DNA Surprises for as
(39:10):
little as $5 per month. Until next time, this episode of
DNA Surprises was hosted, produced and edited.
By me. Alexis Ourselt It was mixed and
mastered by Josh Ourselt of Siren Recording Studios.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com