October 21, 2025 • 42 mins
You can’t unring a bell. After a DNA surprise is uncovered, after contact is made with newfound relatives, what’s done is done. Which is why some people are hesitant to dig into the truth. You never know what’s waiting for you on the other side. In this week’s episode, Jeremy shares why he didn’t decide to take his test to confirm the identity of his biological father until his daughters Googled his family. After a tumultuous childhood fraught with instability and abuse, he couldn’t bear the thought of rejection.
Jeremy also reveals what happens when he finally decided to take that test and make contact with his paternal family.
Thank you for sharing your story, Jeremy.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Even my grandmother, who I nevermet, Mildred, my father's
mother, knew. And I found out that like my
father's mother, my grandmother Mildred, and my aunt, my
father's sister, offered to takeme and raise me from this attic
mother that my father had an affair with.
(00:23):
Now, granted, you know, back in the 70s that probably wouldn't
have been an easy task because things were different back then.
But to know that because I always wanted someone to save
me. Like, like I said, I found out
through my DNA search just a fewyears ago, all these relatives
on my mother's side that I neverknew existed that lived well
into my 20s. And that's really painful to
(00:46):
know that there are people out there that you're that is your
blood, but they can't save you or they won't, or they don't
know to save you. I didn't even know to call them
and say, can I please live with you?
Because I didn't know they existed.
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that delves into the
world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
(01:06):
I'm your host, Alexis ourselves.In July 2021, my life took a
surprising turn when I found outthat I'm an NPE, a person who
has experienced a non paternal event.
In other words, my biological father isn't who I thought he
was. Join me as we explore the
(01:27):
stories of NP, ES, adoptees and donor conceived people and their
families. Get ready to unravel the
astonishing journeys that begin with a simple DNA test.
This is DNA surprises. You can't unring a bell after a
DNA surprise is uncovered, aftercontact is made with new found
(01:51):
relatives. What's done is done, which is
why some people are hesitant to dig into the truth in the 1st
place. You never know what's waiting
for you on the other side. In this week's episode, Jeremy
shares why he didn't decide to take his test to confirm the
identity of his biological father until his daughters
(02:14):
googled his family. After a tumultuous childhood
fraught with instability and abuse, he couldn't bear the
thought of rejection. Jeremy also reveals what happens
when he finally decided to take that test and make contact with
his paternal family for the first time.
Before we begin this episode, I do want to mention that there is
(02:37):
discussion of childhood abuse and suicide.
Thank you for sharing your story, Jeremy.
My name is Jeremy and I am 54 and born and raised in
Baltimore. Thank you for having me on as I
tell this story. While there is a lot of trauma
in the beginning, there can be alove story ending to adna
(03:01):
surprise story and mine is one of those.
It continues to evolve. I was raised by a mother who's
an addict, single mother, pills and boos.
She was married a lot. My last name has been changed
multiple times as they adopted me into the family.
This new husband she had, my name's been changed like 4
(03:22):
times. Spent the first seven or eight
years in a very small 2 bedroom apartment in Baltimore City.
I don't recall a lot of of men there but I was very young.
I was told that a lot of men were in and out of the apartment
with her, and to be honest, during those very early years,
(03:43):
as an adult now, the only thing I can recall is that I probably
was stuck to her leg like Velcro.
You know, It was just me and heragainst the world, no one else.
No siblings, no father, no grandparents.
My grandmother was in the picture a little bit, but I can
(04:06):
recall times of being left at the kitchen table in this little
apartment for hours while she made me eat some crazy liver and
onions kind of thing that no kidwould want to eat and the
torture with that. I've seen pictures of me years
ago as a small child, black and blue.
I recently reached out to one ofthose husbands that she had.
(04:30):
When I reached out to him, he was a very, very nice man.
I asked him what had happened during my childhood.
They were married for about 6 months.
He told me where I was around a year old.
Her addiction is what broke up their marriage.
And I asked him, did you ever witness any abuse?
And unfortunately he said yes tothe point that I begged her to
let me take you to the hospital.And when I'm talking to him, I
(04:55):
was like, you know, that tracks.That makes sense, you know.
But then I started going like this, wait, what year was that?
Wait, I was one years old and she's beating me to the point of
hospitalization again. It kind of tracks.
She married again when I was 8 years old, which is still the
last name I have today. That marriage maybe lasted 10
years. That's when I recall a lot of
(05:17):
the horrific beatings. I I I recall like maybe an 8
year old birthday with a fat lip.
As a young child I would have tohelp her drive the car so she
would show up multiple times if she had to pick me up from
somewhere. Maybe my grandmother's or some
school function. Sunglasses on at night to hide
her blurry eyes of course. Slurred speech and it was pretty
(05:40):
common for me in the passenger seat to bring my left arm over
and quietly turn the steering wheel a little bit up so we
wouldn't rear into the parked car where we're heading towards.
She'd always slap my hand away and then in 5 minutes later I
would be doing again. I've done a lot of therapy and
(06:01):
and a lot of folks out there listening this probably can
agree and and understand. Single mother only child an
addict you get something called an attachment wound or a mother
wound. So when a baby does not connect
at that crucial time during its infancy with his with his
(06:21):
mother, he ends up searching forthe rest of his life.
And that's what I still do to this day.
So when I was running away as anearly teenager and teenager, I
would run to friends houses and basically just get mothered by
their mother. And I would eat it up.
Oh my God, it was so good. I'd have to sleep on sofas or in
(06:41):
a sleeping bag on the floor. As a teenager, I worked at a
local hospital in Baltimore and ended up working with a lot of,
like, soccer moms who had, you know, kids that were much older
than me. And they finally found out what
was going on, too. And I would spend a lot of time
at their houses running away. My mother would somehow find out
(07:01):
where I was, would scream and yell on the phone to the mom who
was taking me in for the week ortwo.
Where's my son? I know you have him.
Not fun. Did.
You ever ask her about your biological father?
And what did she say? Yeah.
You know what, it's funny. She would, when I was old
(07:22):
enough, probably preteen or teen, she would tell me his name
and the fact that she was in touch with him through lawyers.
So if I go back to the beginning, she had an affair
with a married man, someone she worked with, the person who
owned the business that she worked at and while she was
pregnant. And again, this is all second
(07:44):
hand knowledge I've learned frommy siblings that I've just
discovered that we'll get into. They told me a lot about my
childhood as they learned it from our father and their
mother. When she was pregnant with me,
she tried to commit suicide twice with me inside of her, all
to get his attention, try to leave his wife.
(08:06):
She would show up at their housewhile my siblings were five and
three. I think at the time when I was
born, at least two of my siblings screaming at the top of
her lungs. Why won't you see your son?
The police were called. She just is unwell and and and
is always a a negative factor ina lot of people's lives.
(08:26):
I learned a lot about my childhood from my new siblings.
I learned after I was born from them and their mother that she
was committed into a mental ward.
I don't know who took care of methen.
And I'll be honest, the suicide thing, I learned that maybe
three years ago and that took mesome time to get past that was
(08:47):
that was a tough one. I say, I say in the book that
I'm writing, my mother had a my mother got pregnant out of
leverage, not out of love, whichisn't fun because you just end
up asking a lot of why questionsabout your existence and your
identity and and all that. So you came to learn all of this
(09:09):
from your siblings after you found them growing up.
She told you his name and that she had contact with him through
the courts. So was there never any like
encouragement of you reaching out to him or him being in your
(09:29):
life to your knowledge you know at that time?
Yeah, she asked me a lot if you ever want, she would always say
if you ever want to reach out tohim, I can get in touch with him
and listen, you don't want me, Idon't want you.
I mean, fuck off. I can't comprehend at that age
when she would tell me these things as a preteen and a
teenager to get up enough courage to even begin that
(09:54):
journey. I'm the child, you know, and,
and a lot through this journey and you'll find out a lot of
things were asked of me, like why didn't you reach out?
Why didn't you do this? Why didn't you?
And I'm, I'm the kid, you put meon this earth.
It was your choice, you know, and some people in my life who
(10:15):
have made those statements stilldon't get it.
So no, no, there's no way up. And I mean, even in my 30s and
40s, I would tell my story at a party or something, you know,
just say, what was your childhood like?
And I'd tell them and they were like, you never want to ask,
reach out for your father. And I'm like, fuck no.
No, no, no. But it's more like she.
(10:37):
So she didn't truly offer. She kind of parentified you and
made it your responsibility, butshe didn't say I'm going to take
you to go meet your father. No, she never did.
Wow. You're bringing up something I
never thought of. She probably would have thought
that I would have wanted to go to him and be with him and and
leave her all alone. I never even thought about it
(10:59):
the way you just said that. Yeah, she she just said if you
ever want to, you make up your mind and I can make it happen.
Maybe, you know. Yeah, that's funny that you
asked that. Thank you for that insight.
You probably are familiar with IFS or parts work, internal
family systems and that whole parentified.
You know, there are parts to me like a performer part.
(11:19):
You know, I'm a musician back here and there is no better high
than to be on stage for me. I mean, if I can get the
adoration and the love that I missed as a child through music,
where I can take something in myhead and have many, many, many
people see it and appreciate it.Oh my God, that's like, there's
like 50 mothers in the audience in this bar for me right now,
(11:42):
you know, and then there's otherparts that are like protector
parts, you know, the one that shuts down and goes, I can't
deal with this at all. I'm, I'm, I'm running, you know,
you know, and, and, and I've learned there's a lot more parts
out there than I'm trying to integrate in this moment.
So. Absolutely.
Absolutely. So you had a very tumultuous
(12:03):
childhood, to say the least. I mean, just horrific abuse from
your mother and men in and out of your life, and no connection
to who you know as your biological father.
You've got a name. What happens next?
Like take me through maybe how you got to the place of wanting
(12:26):
to learn more. Finally ran away for the last
time in my teens again, slept onmany sofas.
And you know, I'll say one thing.
And the reason why my mother wasin touch with my father through
lawyers is that he held some money, a small amount for me for
school. So I ended up going to a
Catholic High School here in Baltimore, which was phenomenal
(12:47):
for me to get me on the right path.
And then four years of state school, which again was
phenomenal for me to have determination and wanted to make
something of myself. So I'm in college marketing.
I worked at a hospital in Baltimore and ended up running
into this young girl, her name is Tammy, and she was a physical
(13:11):
therapy intern there and 33 years later we're here.
She's my rock. I don't know anyone in this
world that can put up with me the way she does and all of my
baggage. We had kids, 2 girls, and I said
(13:32):
to myself, I'm going to do everything different than my
mother did raising me. And of course, what do I do?
I go to the extreme, the other end of the spectrum, and I'm
like this Uber helicopter parent.
No crumbs on your face, no dirt on your hands to the nicest
clothes. You get everything you want the
second you want it. So So that's how I was as a
(13:55):
parent. It got even worse during girl
teenage years, as you can imagine, just trying to protect
the girls from everything, whichwas not a reality.
And then when my girls were 19 and 17, my birthday's in July.
And for the last few years, we would go and eat crabs like we
do in Baltimore, like everyone does in Baltimore.
And they finally said, how come we know nothing about you?
(14:21):
We don't know your family, we don't have grandparents on your
side. We have no cousins.
There's just you. We know nothing about you.
And I said, all right, well, you're old enough and I'm dying
to tell you. And I told him about my mother,
you know, as any 1917 year old can understand, not a very nice
person. My mother was and left home
(14:42):
early. And then this, I picked up my
phone and I said, listen, this is what the Internet tells me
about my father. It's his picture and his name.
And they picked up their phone and they found my two brothers
and my sister within two minuteswhile we're eating crabs.
This is your brother. This is your other brother, and
this is your sister. Now, I know the first question
(15:03):
everyone's going to ask is you could have done a Google search
and done that yourself. Yeah, I could have.
But there's no way in hell I'm going to go down that road and
risk getting rejected because rejection and abandonment.
My mother rejected me for her addiction, and my father
abandoned me at birth because hewas married.
(15:26):
So my life is spent not getting rejected or abandoned.
And the performer in me, luckilyI learned this, this part came
out as a young kid. I can charm really well.
And my motto is, is I'm going tocharm you before you reject me.
So I will do everything it takesto connect with you as quickly
as possible, unhealthy or not, just to feel secure.
(15:50):
You could be the lady behind thecounter at the restaurant or
something, you know what I mean?That's just how my brain is
wired. How did you feel when they
pulled up that information and you saw these real people on
their phones? Well, of course I went like
white as a ghost. I immediately saw a resemblance.
The kids saw a resemblance, which, you know, I'll say this a
(16:14):
lot. When you finally see someone in
this world that you look like oryou share eyebrows with or eye
color or hair or whatever it is and you've never experienced
that before, it is amazing, likeabsolutely amazing.
Someone like me and others out there, they have an identity
crisis. My last name is just the fourth
(16:35):
marriage my mother had. You know, I don't know any of
her side of the family. That's a whole nother podcast of
finding out the fact that there was all these relatives on her
side of the family, but she was the black sheep.
So I never met any of them and more importantly, none of them
saved me. None of them took me into their
house in Baltimore because you don't do that back then.
(16:56):
You brush everything under the rug.
So yeah, I was blown away. And this is July of 2019.
So for the next 6 months I sit on this information and I
cyberstalk the fuck out of my siblings and luckily they're
absolutely amazing. Everything I find is beautiful
and my wife everyday and I have a conversation about what are we
going to do? What are we going to do?
And you know, there's one side of me saying I have every right
(17:18):
to know where I come from and I have every right to meet my
blood. And the other part of me is if
this destroys that family, you have to go to your grave with
this. At the end of December, early
January of 2020, I had made a decision not to contact them
because, I mean, something like this ruins families.
(17:38):
It does. And I'm not going to do that.
You know, I would say to my wife, I'm blessed.
I have two kids. I got a wife, I got a good
career. I got a house in a roof over my
head. What do I need?
But apparently you need more in this life.
So like I said, I'm a musician. I played a wedding in 2020, in
January of 2020. And at the reception, I overhear
(18:00):
this friend of a friend talking about the high school she went
to. And since I cyberstalked my
siblings, I knew the high schoolthey went to, and it's the same
high school. And I said to Emily, you went to
the school? Yeah.
Well, did you know this family? And I gave them the family's
last name of my brothers and sister.
Yeah. I graduated with so and so and
so. And so, of course, I went white
(18:22):
again. It's a whole new like, what do I
do with this kind of information?
And then a bottle of wine later,she convinced me that I had
every right to contact them. And so I did the whole spit in a
cup through ancestry and connected all the dots in the
tree and and everything was exactly like I had figured out
over the Internet anyway. Ask is is did you decide to take
(18:44):
adna test to really just solidify?
Yes, and it was really just for more of a CYA in case because,
you know, this could get really controversial.
I spent days in front of the computer going, Oh my God, this
is my grandmother. Oh my God, this is my
grandfather. This is my great, great, great
grandfather. And I'm this percentage Jewish
(19:06):
more than I ever thought I knew.And and I have Russian Jews in
my family and Polish Jews. And it was such a beautiful
foundation to start understanding who I am and where
I come from. And I hadn't even met them yet.
So anyway, you know what happenswhen you turn your profile from
private to public on like an Ancestry?
(19:27):
It starts pinging folks and theyget emails.
So turn my profile from private to public.
I had missed a bunch of messagesthrough Ancestry from someone.
And this someone was named Kathyand she's my cousin.
Never had cousins growing up. And she's, you know, she's
(19:50):
putting stuff in ancestry like through the message saying like,
hey, I think we're related if you want to contact me.
And then like an hour later, I still hadn't looked at my phone.
She sends another one saying I'mpretty sure I know how we're
related. If you want to, you know,
contact me. And then by the third message,
when I finally looked at my phone, she was like, yeah, I
think I know how we're related. I'm pretty sure, so we should
(20:11):
probably talk. And she had figured out that her
uncle, my siblings father, my father has a sister, which is
Kathy's mother, that she figuredout that there was a child at a
wedlock, you know. So I finally contacted her
through Ancestry that Monday night and we talked for like 3
hours till like one in the morning.
It was amazing. I can't explain to you what it's
(20:32):
like to have a conversation withsomeone that has your same blood
and you've never had a conversation with anyone like
that in the 50 years you've beenon this earth.
And she's so beautiful and she'slike, do you want to meet?
And I'm like, are you fucking kidding me?
Like, what are you doing now? I know it's like 1:00 AM, but
you know, maybe there's a bar open-ended up having dinner the
next night and her sister, my other cousin, came along and I
(20:56):
was a a few minutes late. And I walk into the my
neighborhood kind of restaurant bar here in Baltimore that we
were at all the time. Everyone knows us and the place
is packed. And there's these two beautiful
women, these two gorgeous Jewishwomen at this table.
And I knew it was them and this crowd.
And we're crying and drinking and trying to eat.
(21:18):
And then they're kicking us out as they're putting the tables
up, the chairs up on the tables next to us as they're closing
down. I told them at the end of the
night, listen, I, I have to do this the right way, which means
I have to contact my father first before things may.
I don't want things to backfire.I don't want things.
I don't want anyone to come to me and say, you did this first
(21:39):
and you're a scam and all that. So I got his e-mail address and
contacted him the next day and said, hey, my name is so and so,
my mother's so and so. And I recently joined the
ancestry and can see your entirefamily, wink, wink.
And I'm sure they can see me too.
(22:01):
Wink, wink, 20 minutes later, e-mail me back.
I'm freaking the fuck out. I'm like Tammy, I can't read
this. Please read this.
I was sure it was going to be like fuck off.
You know, I, you know, you wouldunderstand this every step that
I'm telling you every and, and, and it's going to continue as I
(22:21):
tell the story. Every the every little thing,
every e-mail, every contact could be a rejection, you know,
and I have to weigh the fact that this may not work out.
And how am I going to come back from it?
If I had gotten rejected by thisfamily, I don't know how I would
have come back from that easily.You know this is my blood.
(22:43):
Right. And without the connection to
your mother or anyone else, likeyou're putting a lot of stake in
that. I don't want to be alone in this
world, you know, right. He replies and says, you know,
it's been a it's been a long time.
If you can give me some time, like a couple days to digest all
this, I'll be in touch. And we had a phone call a couple
days later. It was horrible.
(23:05):
He was such a Dick. I mean, I know he doesn't mean
to be. He's very business like and like
he's 80, you know, and that's how, you know, a lot of 80 year
olds are. And he asks stupid questions
like, I thought you would have reached out in your 20s.
Why didn't you? And again, I'm like, I'm the
kid. I feel like I'm the only one
that understands that when I saythat I'm the kid, you're the
(23:28):
parent. It's not your responsibility.
You put me here. I'll I'll never understand why
he asked that. And I said that.
I think I said something just like that.
I told him about the abuse on the phone and I knew in my heart
right away that he didn't know about it.
He just knew my mother was crazyand if he was going to save his
(23:50):
marriage, he had to get my mother out of his life.
And I do believe he didn't know.And come to find out soon after
that, he went into therapy. He spent the next 18 months in
therapy until we met. He didn't meet me for 18 months.
Was he still in Baltimore? Yeah, he splits his time between
Baltimore and Florida like a bunch of old people do.
The next day, which was January 16th of 2020, which is my gotcha
(24:13):
day that my siblings tell me every year.
This is when we got you like a dog.
But I love it. They they had found out and sent
me ancestry message and all three of my siblings wrote it
together and it was phenomenal. They said stuff like, we're all
(24:38):
going to figure this out together.
You know, they use the word likeawe or, or the word together or,
you know, they said we're close as siblings.
Like, they don't hate each other, you know, which is,
again, everything I wished they would be, you know, close and
they would talk. They said, we're very grateful
that you did this and we hope tohear from you soon.
(25:01):
Was so positive. And, you know, it took me like
20 minutes to digest it. I take it downstairs to Tammy,
my wife in her office and I collapse on the floor.
She thought someone died and I'mholding the phone up going.
They use words like together andall of us and you know, all
(25:21):
these other words that that created a unity theme in their
letter. And my wife's like, you're
crazy. This is happy news, you know,
But again, I mean teacher. That's a lot to take in.
Yeah, when you search for something like this or you want
it your whole life, you know, listen, I get trauma made me who
(25:43):
I am and and I've learned a lot.My vulnerability is a gift and,
and, and and I'm I'm grateful for all of it, but doing it
alone was miserable, was absolutely miserable.
And I wished I had some siblingsto just put my head on their
shoulder after a beating or to ask them why is this happening
(26:03):
to me or us as why is mom this way?
You know that none of that was answered for me.
So I replied back to the ancestry e-mail about an hour
and a half later after I picked my mushy stuff up off the floor.
And Tammy and I put together a response that was coherent
through all my tears. And I said something like, you
know, thank you so much for reaching out.
(26:24):
This is a dream of mine. I can imagine how trauma,
traumatizing, or, or how crazy all this is for all of us.
I tried to be inclusive too in my writing for all of us.
I said, you know, this has been quite a roller coaster ride for
me during a time of indescribable uncertainty.
(26:46):
And that sentence is something my siblings always go back to
when they when they tell the story, because I can't explain
to you how scary this process was.
I can't explain to you it takes every ounce of bravery inside of
you to do something like this because most of the time it
doesn't end up well. But you know, I do believe my
(27:10):
vulnerability. I do believe the fact that I
came to this family with my heart on my sleeve.
And listen, I'm sure they lookedme up on the Internet and they
wanted to know if this was a scam or not.
Yeah. And my profile on the Internet
is is nice enough that they wouldn't think anything bad.
This was five years ago. So we spent the next many
(27:30):
months, unfortunately, during COVID, which ruined everything
because we couldn't see each other.
We had planned to make all thesetravel arrangements to meet and
we just had to do it over Zoom or Webex.
We would get to know each other.It took my sister a little bit
longer to contact me, but my brothers contacted me right
away. A lot of face times my sister
(27:51):
took about 3 months, which was was devastating for me because
you know, someone like me, they,they, if they don't connect
quickly, they feel useless or orrejected or something.
You know what I mean? But I learned that, you know,
everyone has their own process during these types of events.
(28:12):
And you can't expect someone to move 1000 miles an hour like I
do all the time. You can't expect everyone else
to move the same speed during their process.
It's one of the first major things I learned during this in
therapy. So I was able to say to myself,
oh, you know, my sister is taking a little bit longer than
the brothers, but she's maybe working things out with her
(28:32):
mother because she's really close to her mother.
And it took a long time to to beOK with all that.
It took my father 18 months to meet me and he was in therapy
because of the guilt he has overthe the abuse.
First of all, like this is this is a remarkable story just in,
(28:54):
in how resilient you are. I mean, I like kind of hate it
when people call me resilient because it's like, you shouldn't
have had to go through all of the things that you've been
through you. Shouldn't have resilient?
But but but it is a story of resilience.
Did your siblings have any inkling that you existed or was
this a total surprise to them? Like I I guess I'm wondering if
(29:18):
your father ever disclosed anything to them?
Did his wife know? Like what did you learn there?
Yeah, I did learn a lot from my siblings about my youth, which
is funny, from from their motherand our father.
So their mother knew of the affair.
Their mother knew that there wasa baby out of wedlock because my
mother was at their house screaming and yelling outside on
(29:40):
their front lawn. Other adults in the family
during that time, like my aunt, my cousin's mother, Kathy's
mother, they knew too. Even my grandmother, who I never
met, Mildred, my father's motherknew.
And I found out that like my father's mother, my grandmother
(30:01):
Mildred, and my aunt, my father's sister, offered to take
me and raise me from this attic mother that my father had an
affair with. Now, granted, you know, back in
the 70s that probably wouldn't have been an easy task because
things were different back then.But to know that because I
(30:22):
always wanted someone to save me.
Like, like I said, I found out through my DNA search just a few
years ago, all these relatives on my mother's side that I never
knew existed that lived well into my 20s.
And that's really painful to know that there are people out
there that your that is your blood, but they can't save you
or they won't or they don't knowto save you.
(30:45):
I didn't even know to call them and say, can I please live with
you? Because I didn't know they
existed. Right, right.
So my siblings didn't know and when their parents divorced,
they just said they were gettingdivorced over the many
infidelities that our father had.
And, and to answer your next question, I'm sure is coming is
yeah, they were really pissed attheir parents that they weren't
(31:09):
told there was a sibling out there.
My, my, my siblings have never used the word half brother.
Never. They say brother.
And and they know the words I like to hear.
They know what I need to feel secure because, you know, it's
been five years. And I'll be honest, like in the
beginning, I was 10% sure they were not going to go anywhere
(31:33):
and 90% sure they were going to be like, well, this was fun, but
we're out. This is only temporary.
And then over the years, it's gotten bigger.
Now I'm at like 9095% sure they're unconditionally going to
love me forever. But I need to hold on to that 5%
because I just need to be ready to put my wall up and block the
(31:56):
rejection when it comes. I need to have a plan.
Yeah, if, if it comes. It's not gonna come.
But unfortunately, you know, ourbrains are wired so much in
trauma that that's how it thinks.
That really doesn't sound like. It's going to.
Which is amazing. How much time have you spent in
the what ifs? Because I think it's a natural
(32:20):
thing, right, to spend the time wondering, what if my
grandmother had been able to save me?
But I also think that that can just wear you down, right?
Because you can't go back in time.
So how much time did you spend on that and where are you sort
of out with it now? Well, I still have what ifs, you
know, 50 years of wiring in yourbrain isn't just fixed
(32:42):
overnight, you know, and this family wasn't going to fix it
all. I mean, I'm an intensive therapy
and have been for the last five years.
I have like 4 therapists and I use psychedelics, which are
amazing in a therapeutic environment to rewire your brain
and neuroplasticity. I thoroughly believe in it.
Listen, what if this person tookme in?
What if I contacted my father early?
(33:04):
What if I grew up with my siblings?
I mean, I know it sounds so clicheish, but I wouldn't be who
I am today. I wouldn't have met my wife.
I wouldn't have my children. All of me and my siblings could
have hated each other by now if we had met early.
I mean, now we meet and, and ourbrains are, are, are mature and
(33:24):
we're adults and we can put aside, you know, stupid stuff
and immature stuff and really get to the point of healing.
Yeah. What ifs are.
I mean, listen, I always wanted to be a rock star.
What if I met Tammy at 21 and broke it off because my dream
was to go to LA and make it? I mean, honestly, I probably
would have been dead by now because, you know, somebody
(33:47):
wired like me is going to constantly be running for that
next tie of adoration and love. And of course, that's going to
involve some unhealthy behaviorsas well.
Yeah. What if they're still there?
They are. They're just fewer and far
between. And, you know, you learn.
I mean, I study Buddhism now, which is amazing.
Have you had any contact with your mother?
(34:08):
Does she know that you are in contact with your family?
No. So besides, when my grandmother
passed in my 30s and I had to help her with the Funeral
arrangements, it's been 30 some odd years.
She's never seen her grandchildren except maybe once
when they were babies. They're grown, they're graduated
from college, one's getting married.
(34:30):
She's missed it all. The very first time I met my
father was at a restaurant and his new wife was there of the
last like 20 some odd years, wouldn't even look at me.
And I'm describing as I talk to my father, I'm describing more
of the abuse and he's telling meabout what he remembers from
that time, how he met my mother,etcetera, etcetera.
(34:53):
And I, you know, I'm bawling theentire, I mean, I must have
bawled the first dozen times we met.
And he goes to the bathroom and I look at her and I say, please
look at me. Like, please acknowledge my
existence in this world. You know, I've been a secret my
(35:14):
entire life. Will you please just look at me?
And she finally did and broke down.
But it was one of the first times in this journey that I
stood up for myself, you know, and I said, I'm here and don't
brush me. Don't put me under the rug
anymore. Don't brush me under the rug.
I'm here. There were, you know, there were
many times after that. There was one specific time
(35:36):
later that year or the next yearwhere my father and I had lunch
alone, just the two of us. And he spent most of the lunch
saying these words, I'm not going to abandon you.
I'm not going to abandon you over and over and over again
until he believed that I believed it.
And by like the 12th time, of course, I'm losing it, bawling
my eyes out. This family has done a wonderful
(35:59):
job of not only facing the secrets they have in their
family, but understanding my pain and giving me what I need.
Another example of that is like I'm covered in tattoos.
Most of my tattoos are about this journey as well as my
childhood. But this family held this huge
(36:20):
Hebrew naming ceremony for me where they gave me my Hebrew
name and it was a huge thing, rituals.
And I'm in my underwear laying in this sand circle and there's
eucalyptus and all these prayers.
And they gave me my Hebrew name,which is it's called Amiasov or
(36:41):
AMI. Everyone calls me AMI for short.
And it means beloved son come tounite.
And this family will say that while I always thought I found
them so I could heal, they'll say it's the opposite.
You're healing this family. You're, you're making us think
(37:02):
about what it means to be familyand have blood and talk about
your emotions. And I still don't get it.
Amazing. I still don't get it.
It's, it's a honestly, I, I've, I've talked to a lot of people
who have found family and I don't know how many I've really
spoken to that have been so welcomed.
(37:25):
Like at that level, that's really, really special.
Yeah, I mean, now, you know, remember it's been, it's, it
wasn't easy, you know, and maybeI'm welcome, but reluctantly in
the beginning. But I showed up.
I showed up as a real person with, with real emotions and
like everyone would say to me inthe family, why are you doing
this? And I said because I discovered
(37:47):
I had siblings and I want siblings.
I discovered my blood, you know,and that means so much when you
don't know your blood and my life has changed.
I mean, I know who I am, I know where I come from.
You know, not everyone in the family is as close to me as
others. And it takes a long time to
accept that because I thought I would walk into this family and
(38:11):
they would love me at 10,000 miles an hour like I fell in
love with them. And it doesn't happen that way.
The best part is learning how todeal with that because it's a
life skill and you know not everything is going to work out
the way you want it to as fast as as you want it to.
That's true. Now your daughters are the ones
who kind of made this happen. What has their reaction been to
(38:32):
this and and your Tammy as well?Yeah, so Tammy is definitely
involved more than the girls because the girls are on her own
or in college and stuff. But we have taken some family
vacations together. When I am out in Phoenix, my
oldest brother's out there and the girls will come out for
their spring break and spend a lot of time with my brother and
(38:53):
my sister-in-law out there. My family welcomes the girls so
beautifully. One of them's getting married
and, and the siblings are invited, but the girls, they
step back and they're letting mego through this journey.
I will say this for any spouse that's going through this with
their spouse, like if you're thethe spouse of someone that's
(39:14):
going through it like me, Tammy felt left out like for a lot, a
lot of times. And it's, it's understandable.
I mean, I am consumed with this journey early on.
It's it I eat, sleep and drink it, you know?
And she graciously took a step back while also making sure I
was mentally well during it all.But it's worked out.
(39:35):
I couldn't have done this without intensive therapy.
I couldn't have done this without a beautiful family, a
stable family and a stable marriage.
Because you can't do it alone. It's, it's, it's too big.
It's a beautiful love story and it's got a lot of bumps in the
road. But whose life doesn't you know?
(39:55):
What advice do you have for a parent who may be keeping a
relationship with a biological parent from their child?
Don't keep the secret secrets kill families.
It might be hard, but again, if the foundation of family is
there and love is there, When I heard my brother speak and he
(40:16):
uses the same inflection in me, it is.
It is a beautiful thing. The first time they said they
loved me. I have all these firsts the
first time, my niece said. Uncle, you know, all these
beautiful firsts are just indescribable.
They really are. And what advice do you have for
someone who's just uncovering their DNA surprise story?
(40:39):
Don't do it alone, take it slow.You have every right to find out
your story and like I said before, everyone will have their
process of meeting you or not meeting you unfortunately.
But if it's a happy story, just remember that everyone has their
(41:02):
own baggage and has nothing to do with you.
Like if you're starting a journey like this, all the shit,
everything that went down has nothing to do with you.
None of it's your fault. It's going to feel like it's.
Important. You're going to blame yourself
all the time and why won't this person love me or why won't this
person call me? I wish the best for anyone who
(41:24):
has to deal with this, but having a strong support system
behind you and not doing it alone is very important.
Very important SO. I think that reminder that it's
not about you, other people's reactions are not about you is
so important. Well, Jeremy, thank you so much
for joining me on the podcast and bravely sharing your story
(41:47):
today. You have been through so much in
your life, but to see you kind of emerge with this positivity
and gratefulness and just a positive outlook moving forward
is really inspiring. Well, thank you so much for
having me. Thanks again to Jeremy for
sharing his story. If you have Adna surprise that
you'd like to share, please submit your story at
(42:08):
dnasurprises.com and for early ad free access to episodes, join
me over on patreon@patreon.com/DNA
Surprises. Until next time.
This episode of DNA Surprises was hosted, produced and edited
by me Alexis Ourselt. It was mixed and mastered by
(42:31):
Josh Ourselt of Siren Recording Studios.
Even my grandmother, who I nevermet, Mildred, my father's
mother, knew. And I found out that like my
father's mother, my grandmother Mildred, and my aunt, my
father's sister, offered to takeme and raise me from this attic
mother that my father had an affair with.
(00:23):
Now, granted, you know, back in the 70s that probably wouldn't
have been an easy task because things were different back then.
But to know that because I always wanted someone to save
me. Like, like I said, I found out
through my DNA search just a fewyears ago, all these relatives
on my mother's side that I neverknew existed that lived well
into my 20s. And that's really painful to
(00:46):
know that there are people out there that you're that is your
blood, but they can't save you or they won't, or they don't
know to save you. I didn't even know to call them
and say, can I please live with you?
Because I didn't know they existed.
Welcome to DNA Surprises, a podcast that delves into the
world of unexpected DNA discoveries.
(01:06):
I'm your host, Alexis ourselves.In July 2021, my life took a
surprising turn when I found outthat I'm an NPE, a person who
has experienced a non paternal event.
In other words, my biological father isn't who I thought he
was. Join me as we explore the
(01:27):
stories of NP, ES, adoptees and donor conceived people and their
families. Get ready to unravel the
astonishing journeys that begin with a simple DNA test.
This is DNA surprises. You can't unring a bell after a
DNA surprise is uncovered, aftercontact is made with new found
(01:51):
relatives. What's done is done, which is
why some people are hesitant to dig into the truth in the 1st
place. You never know what's waiting
for you on the other side. In this week's episode, Jeremy
shares why he didn't decide to take his test to confirm the
identity of his biological father until his daughters
(02:14):
googled his family. After a tumultuous childhood
fraught with instability and abuse, he couldn't bear the
thought of rejection. Jeremy also reveals what happens
when he finally decided to take that test and make contact with
his paternal family for the first time.
Before we begin this episode, I do want to mention that there is
(02:37):
discussion of childhood abuse and suicide.
Thank you for sharing your story, Jeremy.
My name is Jeremy and I am 54 and born and raised in
Baltimore. Thank you for having me on as I
tell this story. While there is a lot of trauma
in the beginning, there can be alove story ending to adna
(03:01):
surprise story and mine is one of those.
It continues to evolve. I was raised by a mother who's
an addict, single mother, pills and boos.
She was married a lot. My last name has been changed
multiple times as they adopted me into the family.
This new husband she had, my name's been changed like 4
(03:22):
times. Spent the first seven or eight
years in a very small 2 bedroom apartment in Baltimore City.
I don't recall a lot of of men there but I was very young.
I was told that a lot of men were in and out of the apartment
with her, and to be honest, during those very early years,
(03:43):
as an adult now, the only thing I can recall is that I probably
was stuck to her leg like Velcro.
You know, It was just me and heragainst the world, no one else.
No siblings, no father, no grandparents.
My grandmother was in the picture a little bit, but I can
(04:06):
recall times of being left at the kitchen table in this little
apartment for hours while she made me eat some crazy liver and
onions kind of thing that no kidwould want to eat and the
torture with that. I've seen pictures of me years
ago as a small child, black and blue.
I recently reached out to one ofthose husbands that she had.
(04:30):
When I reached out to him, he was a very, very nice man.
I asked him what had happened during my childhood.
They were married for about 6 months.
He told me where I was around a year old.
Her addiction is what broke up their marriage.
And I asked him, did you ever witness any abuse?
And unfortunately he said yes tothe point that I begged her to
let me take you to the hospital.And when I'm talking to him, I
(04:55):
was like, you know, that tracks.That makes sense, you know.
But then I started going like this, wait, what year was that?
Wait, I was one years old and she's beating me to the point of
hospitalization again. It kind of tracks.
She married again when I was 8 years old, which is still the
last name I have today. That marriage maybe lasted 10
years. That's when I recall a lot of
(05:17):
the horrific beatings. I I I recall like maybe an 8
year old birthday with a fat lip.
As a young child I would have tohelp her drive the car so she
would show up multiple times if she had to pick me up from
somewhere. Maybe my grandmother's or some
school function. Sunglasses on at night to hide
her blurry eyes of course. Slurred speech and it was pretty
(05:40):
common for me in the passenger seat to bring my left arm over
and quietly turn the steering wheel a little bit up so we
wouldn't rear into the parked car where we're heading towards.
She'd always slap my hand away and then in 5 minutes later I
would be doing again. I've done a lot of therapy and
(06:01):
and a lot of folks out there listening this probably can
agree and and understand. Single mother only child an
addict you get something called an attachment wound or a mother
wound. So when a baby does not connect
at that crucial time during its infancy with his with his
(06:21):
mother, he ends up searching forthe rest of his life.
And that's what I still do to this day.
So when I was running away as anearly teenager and teenager, I
would run to friends houses and basically just get mothered by
their mother. And I would eat it up.
Oh my God, it was so good. I'd have to sleep on sofas or in
(06:41):
a sleeping bag on the floor. As a teenager, I worked at a
local hospital in Baltimore and ended up working with a lot of,
like, soccer moms who had, you know, kids that were much older
than me. And they finally found out what
was going on, too. And I would spend a lot of time
at their houses running away. My mother would somehow find out
(07:01):
where I was, would scream and yell on the phone to the mom who
was taking me in for the week ortwo.
Where's my son? I know you have him.
Not fun. Did.
You ever ask her about your biological father?
And what did she say? Yeah.
You know what, it's funny. She would, when I was old
(07:22):
enough, probably preteen or teen, she would tell me his name
and the fact that she was in touch with him through lawyers.
So if I go back to the beginning, she had an affair
with a married man, someone she worked with, the person who
owned the business that she worked at and while she was
pregnant. And again, this is all second
(07:44):
hand knowledge I've learned frommy siblings that I've just
discovered that we'll get into. They told me a lot about my
childhood as they learned it from our father and their
mother. When she was pregnant with me,
she tried to commit suicide twice with me inside of her, all
to get his attention, try to leave his wife.
(08:06):
She would show up at their housewhile my siblings were five and
three. I think at the time when I was
born, at least two of my siblings screaming at the top of
her lungs. Why won't you see your son?
The police were called. She just is unwell and and and
is always a a negative factor ina lot of people's lives.
(08:26):
I learned a lot about my childhood from my new siblings.
I learned after I was born from them and their mother that she
was committed into a mental ward.
I don't know who took care of methen.
And I'll be honest, the suicide thing, I learned that maybe
three years ago and that took mesome time to get past that was
(08:47):
that was a tough one. I say, I say in the book that
I'm writing, my mother had a my mother got pregnant out of
leverage, not out of love, whichisn't fun because you just end
up asking a lot of why questionsabout your existence and your
identity and and all that. So you came to learn all of this
(09:09):
from your siblings after you found them growing up.
She told you his name and that she had contact with him through
the courts. So was there never any like
encouragement of you reaching out to him or him being in your
(09:29):
life to your knowledge you know at that time?
Yeah, she asked me a lot if you ever want, she would always say
if you ever want to reach out tohim, I can get in touch with him
and listen, you don't want me, Idon't want you.
I mean, fuck off. I can't comprehend at that age
when she would tell me these things as a preteen and a
teenager to get up enough courage to even begin that
(09:54):
journey. I'm the child, you know, and,
and a lot through this journey and you'll find out a lot of
things were asked of me, like why didn't you reach out?
Why didn't you do this? Why didn't you?
And I'm, I'm the kid, you put meon this earth.
It was your choice, you know, and some people in my life who
(10:15):
have made those statements stilldon't get it.
So no, no, there's no way up. And I mean, even in my 30s and
40s, I would tell my story at a party or something, you know,
just say, what was your childhood like?
And I'd tell them and they were like, you never want to ask,
reach out for your father. And I'm like, fuck no.
No, no, no. But it's more like she.
(10:37):
So she didn't truly offer. She kind of parentified you and
made it your responsibility, butshe didn't say I'm going to take
you to go meet your father. No, she never did.
Wow. You're bringing up something I
never thought of. She probably would have thought
that I would have wanted to go to him and be with him and and
leave her all alone. I never even thought about it
(10:59):
the way you just said that. Yeah, she she just said if you
ever want to, you make up your mind and I can make it happen.
Maybe, you know. Yeah, that's funny that you
asked that. Thank you for that insight.
You probably are familiar with IFS or parts work, internal
family systems and that whole parentified.
You know, there are parts to me like a performer part.
(11:19):
You know, I'm a musician back here and there is no better high
than to be on stage for me. I mean, if I can get the
adoration and the love that I missed as a child through music,
where I can take something in myhead and have many, many, many
people see it and appreciate it.Oh my God, that's like, there's
like 50 mothers in the audience in this bar for me right now,
(11:42):
you know, and then there's otherparts that are like protector
parts, you know, the one that shuts down and goes, I can't
deal with this at all. I'm, I'm, I'm running, you know,
you know, and, and, and I've learned there's a lot more parts
out there than I'm trying to integrate in this moment.
So. Absolutely.
Absolutely. So you had a very tumultuous
(12:03):
childhood, to say the least. I mean, just horrific abuse from
your mother and men in and out of your life, and no connection
to who you know as your biological father.
You've got a name. What happens next?
Like take me through maybe how you got to the place of wanting
(12:26):
to learn more. Finally ran away for the last
time in my teens again, slept onmany sofas.
And you know, I'll say one thing.
And the reason why my mother wasin touch with my father through
lawyers is that he held some money, a small amount for me for
school. So I ended up going to a
Catholic High School here in Baltimore, which was phenomenal
(12:47):
for me to get me on the right path.
And then four years of state school, which again was
phenomenal for me to have determination and wanted to make
something of myself. So I'm in college marketing.
I worked at a hospital in Baltimore and ended up running
into this young girl, her name is Tammy, and she was a physical
(13:11):
therapy intern there and 33 years later we're here.
She's my rock. I don't know anyone in this
world that can put up with me the way she does and all of my
baggage. We had kids, 2 girls, and I said
(13:32):
to myself, I'm going to do everything different than my
mother did raising me. And of course, what do I do?
I go to the extreme, the other end of the spectrum, and I'm
like this Uber helicopter parent.
No crumbs on your face, no dirt on your hands to the nicest
clothes. You get everything you want the
second you want it. So So that's how I was as a
(13:55):
parent. It got even worse during girl
teenage years, as you can imagine, just trying to protect
the girls from everything, whichwas not a reality.
And then when my girls were 19 and 17, my birthday's in July.
And for the last few years, we would go and eat crabs like we
do in Baltimore, like everyone does in Baltimore.
And they finally said, how come we know nothing about you?
(14:21):
We don't know your family, we don't have grandparents on your
side. We have no cousins.
There's just you. We know nothing about you.
And I said, all right, well, you're old enough and I'm dying
to tell you. And I told him about my mother,
you know, as any 1917 year old can understand, not a very nice
person. My mother was and left home
(14:42):
early. And then this, I picked up my
phone and I said, listen, this is what the Internet tells me
about my father. It's his picture and his name.
And they picked up their phone and they found my two brothers
and my sister within two minuteswhile we're eating crabs.
This is your brother. This is your other brother, and
this is your sister. Now, I know the first question
(15:03):
everyone's going to ask is you could have done a Google search
and done that yourself. Yeah, I could have.
But there's no way in hell I'm going to go down that road and
risk getting rejected because rejection and abandonment.
My mother rejected me for her addiction, and my father
abandoned me at birth because hewas married.
(15:26):
So my life is spent not getting rejected or abandoned.
And the performer in me, luckilyI learned this, this part came
out as a young kid. I can charm really well.
And my motto is, is I'm going tocharm you before you reject me.
So I will do everything it takesto connect with you as quickly
as possible, unhealthy or not, just to feel secure.
(15:50):
You could be the lady behind thecounter at the restaurant or
something, you know what I mean?That's just how my brain is
wired. How did you feel when they
pulled up that information and you saw these real people on
their phones? Well, of course I went like
white as a ghost. I immediately saw a resemblance.
The kids saw a resemblance, which, you know, I'll say this a
(16:14):
lot. When you finally see someone in
this world that you look like oryou share eyebrows with or eye
color or hair or whatever it is and you've never experienced
that before, it is amazing, likeabsolutely amazing.
Someone like me and others out there, they have an identity
crisis. My last name is just the fourth
(16:35):
marriage my mother had. You know, I don't know any of
her side of the family. That's a whole nother podcast of
finding out the fact that there was all these relatives on her
side of the family, but she was the black sheep.
So I never met any of them and more importantly, none of them
saved me. None of them took me into their
house in Baltimore because you don't do that back then.
(16:56):
You brush everything under the rug.
So yeah, I was blown away. And this is July of 2019.
So for the next 6 months I sit on this information and I
cyberstalk the fuck out of my siblings and luckily they're
absolutely amazing. Everything I find is beautiful
and my wife everyday and I have a conversation about what are we
going to do? What are we going to do?
And you know, there's one side of me saying I have every right
(17:18):
to know where I come from and I have every right to meet my
blood. And the other part of me is if
this destroys that family, you have to go to your grave with
this. At the end of December, early
January of 2020, I had made a decision not to contact them
because, I mean, something like this ruins families.
(17:38):
It does. And I'm not going to do that.
You know, I would say to my wife, I'm blessed.
I have two kids. I got a wife, I got a good
career. I got a house in a roof over my
head. What do I need?
But apparently you need more in this life.
So like I said, I'm a musician. I played a wedding in 2020, in
January of 2020. And at the reception, I overhear
(18:00):
this friend of a friend talking about the high school she went
to. And since I cyberstalked my
siblings, I knew the high schoolthey went to, and it's the same
high school. And I said to Emily, you went to
the school? Yeah.
Well, did you know this family? And I gave them the family's
last name of my brothers and sister.
Yeah. I graduated with so and so and
so. And so, of course, I went white
(18:22):
again. It's a whole new like, what do I
do with this kind of information?
And then a bottle of wine later,she convinced me that I had
every right to contact them. And so I did the whole spit in a
cup through ancestry and connected all the dots in the
tree and and everything was exactly like I had figured out
over the Internet anyway. Ask is is did you decide to take
(18:44):
adna test to really just solidify?
Yes, and it was really just for more of a CYA in case because,
you know, this could get really controversial.
I spent days in front of the computer going, Oh my God, this
is my grandmother. Oh my God, this is my
grandfather. This is my great, great, great
grandfather. And I'm this percentage Jewish
(19:06):
more than I ever thought I knew.And and I have Russian Jews in
my family and Polish Jews. And it was such a beautiful
foundation to start understanding who I am and where
I come from. And I hadn't even met them yet.
So anyway, you know what happenswhen you turn your profile from
private to public on like an Ancestry?
(19:27):
It starts pinging folks and theyget emails.
So turn my profile from private to public.
I had missed a bunch of messagesthrough Ancestry from someone.
And this someone was named Kathyand she's my cousin.
Never had cousins growing up. And she's, you know, she's
(19:50):
putting stuff in ancestry like through the message saying like,
hey, I think we're related if you want to contact me.
And then like an hour later, I still hadn't looked at my phone.
She sends another one saying I'mpretty sure I know how we're
related. If you want to, you know,
contact me. And then by the third message,
when I finally looked at my phone, she was like, yeah, I
think I know how we're related. I'm pretty sure, so we should
(20:11):
probably talk. And she had figured out that her
uncle, my siblings father, my father has a sister, which is
Kathy's mother, that she figuredout that there was a child at a
wedlock, you know. So I finally contacted her
through Ancestry that Monday night and we talked for like 3
hours till like one in the morning.
It was amazing. I can't explain to you what it's
(20:32):
like to have a conversation withsomeone that has your same blood
and you've never had a conversation with anyone like
that in the 50 years you've beenon this earth.
And she's so beautiful and she'slike, do you want to meet?
And I'm like, are you fucking kidding me?
Like, what are you doing now? I know it's like 1:00 AM, but
you know, maybe there's a bar open-ended up having dinner the
next night and her sister, my other cousin, came along and I
(20:56):
was a a few minutes late. And I walk into the my
neighborhood kind of restaurant bar here in Baltimore that we
were at all the time. Everyone knows us and the place
is packed. And there's these two beautiful
women, these two gorgeous Jewishwomen at this table.
And I knew it was them and this crowd.
And we're crying and drinking and trying to eat.
(21:18):
And then they're kicking us out as they're putting the tables
up, the chairs up on the tables next to us as they're closing
down. I told them at the end of the
night, listen, I, I have to do this the right way, which means
I have to contact my father first before things may.
I don't want things to backfire.I don't want things.
I don't want anyone to come to me and say, you did this first
(21:39):
and you're a scam and all that. So I got his e-mail address and
contacted him the next day and said, hey, my name is so and so,
my mother's so and so. And I recently joined the
ancestry and can see your entirefamily, wink, wink.
And I'm sure they can see me too.
(22:01):
Wink, wink, 20 minutes later, e-mail me back.
I'm freaking the fuck out. I'm like Tammy, I can't read
this. Please read this.
I was sure it was going to be like fuck off.
You know, I, you know, you wouldunderstand this every step that
I'm telling you every and, and, and it's going to continue as I
(22:21):
tell the story. Every the every little thing,
every e-mail, every contact could be a rejection, you know,
and I have to weigh the fact that this may not work out.
And how am I going to come back from it?
If I had gotten rejected by thisfamily, I don't know how I would
have come back from that easily.You know this is my blood.
(22:43):
Right. And without the connection to
your mother or anyone else, likeyou're putting a lot of stake in
that. I don't want to be alone in this
world, you know, right. He replies and says, you know,
it's been a it's been a long time.
If you can give me some time, like a couple days to digest all
this, I'll be in touch. And we had a phone call a couple
days later. It was horrible.
(23:05):
He was such a Dick. I mean, I know he doesn't mean
to be. He's very business like and like
he's 80, you know, and that's how, you know, a lot of 80 year
olds are. And he asks stupid questions
like, I thought you would have reached out in your 20s.
Why didn't you? And again, I'm like, I'm the
kid. I feel like I'm the only one
that understands that when I saythat I'm the kid, you're the
(23:28):
parent. It's not your responsibility.
You put me here. I'll I'll never understand why
he asked that. And I said that.
I think I said something just like that.
I told him about the abuse on the phone and I knew in my heart
right away that he didn't know about it.
He just knew my mother was crazyand if he was going to save his
(23:50):
marriage, he had to get my mother out of his life.
And I do believe he didn't know.And come to find out soon after
that, he went into therapy. He spent the next 18 months in
therapy until we met. He didn't meet me for 18 months.
Was he still in Baltimore? Yeah, he splits his time between
Baltimore and Florida like a bunch of old people do.
The next day, which was January 16th of 2020, which is my gotcha
(24:13):
day that my siblings tell me every year.
This is when we got you like a dog.
But I love it. They they had found out and sent
me ancestry message and all three of my siblings wrote it
together and it was phenomenal. They said stuff like, we're all
(24:38):
going to figure this out together.
You know, they use the word likeawe or, or the word together or,
you know, they said we're close as siblings.
Like, they don't hate each other, you know, which is,
again, everything I wished they would be, you know, close and
they would talk. They said, we're very grateful
that you did this and we hope tohear from you soon.
(25:01):
Was so positive. And, you know, it took me like
20 minutes to digest it. I take it downstairs to Tammy,
my wife in her office and I collapse on the floor.
She thought someone died and I'mholding the phone up going.
They use words like together andall of us and you know, all
(25:21):
these other words that that created a unity theme in their
letter. And my wife's like, you're
crazy. This is happy news, you know,
But again, I mean teacher. That's a lot to take in.
Yeah, when you search for something like this or you want
it your whole life, you know, listen, I get trauma made me who
(25:43):
I am and and I've learned a lot.My vulnerability is a gift and,
and, and and I'm I'm grateful for all of it, but doing it
alone was miserable, was absolutely miserable.
And I wished I had some siblingsto just put my head on their
shoulder after a beating or to ask them why is this happening
(26:03):
to me or us as why is mom this way?
You know that none of that was answered for me.
So I replied back to the ancestry e-mail about an hour
and a half later after I picked my mushy stuff up off the floor.
And Tammy and I put together a response that was coherent
through all my tears. And I said something like, you
know, thank you so much for reaching out.
(26:24):
This is a dream of mine. I can imagine how trauma,
traumatizing, or, or how crazy all this is for all of us.
I tried to be inclusive too in my writing for all of us.
I said, you know, this has been quite a roller coaster ride for
me during a time of indescribable uncertainty.
(26:46):
And that sentence is something my siblings always go back to
when they when they tell the story, because I can't explain
to you how scary this process was.
I can't explain to you it takes every ounce of bravery inside of
you to do something like this because most of the time it
doesn't end up well. But you know, I do believe my
(27:10):
vulnerability. I do believe the fact that I
came to this family with my heart on my sleeve.
And listen, I'm sure they lookedme up on the Internet and they
wanted to know if this was a scam or not.
Yeah. And my profile on the Internet
is is nice enough that they wouldn't think anything bad.
This was five years ago. So we spent the next many
(27:30):
months, unfortunately, during COVID, which ruined everything
because we couldn't see each other.
We had planned to make all thesetravel arrangements to meet and
we just had to do it over Zoom or Webex.
We would get to know each other.It took my sister a little bit
longer to contact me, but my brothers contacted me right
away. A lot of face times my sister
(27:51):
took about 3 months, which was was devastating for me because
you know, someone like me, they,they, if they don't connect
quickly, they feel useless or orrejected or something.
You know what I mean? But I learned that, you know,
everyone has their own process during these types of events.
(28:12):
And you can't expect someone to move 1000 miles an hour like I
do all the time. You can't expect everyone else
to move the same speed during their process.
It's one of the first major things I learned during this in
therapy. So I was able to say to myself,
oh, you know, my sister is taking a little bit longer than
the brothers, but she's maybe working things out with her
(28:32):
mother because she's really close to her mother.
And it took a long time to to beOK with all that.
It took my father 18 months to meet me and he was in therapy
because of the guilt he has overthe the abuse.
First of all, like this is this is a remarkable story just in,
(28:54):
in how resilient you are. I mean, I like kind of hate it
when people call me resilient because it's like, you shouldn't
have had to go through all of the things that you've been
through you. Shouldn't have resilient?
But but but it is a story of resilience.
Did your siblings have any inkling that you existed or was
this a total surprise to them? Like I I guess I'm wondering if
(29:18):
your father ever disclosed anything to them?
Did his wife know? Like what did you learn there?
Yeah, I did learn a lot from my siblings about my youth, which
is funny, from from their motherand our father.
So their mother knew of the affair.
Their mother knew that there wasa baby out of wedlock because my
mother was at their house screaming and yelling outside on
(29:40):
their front lawn. Other adults in the family
during that time, like my aunt, my cousin's mother, Kathy's
mother, they knew too. Even my grandmother, who I never
met, Mildred, my father's motherknew.
And I found out that like my father's mother, my grandmother
(30:01):
Mildred, and my aunt, my father's sister, offered to take
me and raise me from this attic mother that my father had an
affair with. Now, granted, you know, back in
the 70s that probably wouldn't have been an easy task because
things were different back then.But to know that because I
(30:22):
always wanted someone to save me.
Like, like I said, I found out through my DNA search just a few
years ago, all these relatives on my mother's side that I never
knew existed that lived well into my 20s.
And that's really painful to know that there are people out
there that your that is your blood, but they can't save you
or they won't or they don't knowto save you.
(30:45):
I didn't even know to call them and say, can I please live with
you? Because I didn't know they
existed. Right, right.
So my siblings didn't know and when their parents divorced,
they just said they were gettingdivorced over the many
infidelities that our father had.
And, and to answer your next question, I'm sure is coming is
yeah, they were really pissed attheir parents that they weren't
(31:09):
told there was a sibling out there.
My, my, my siblings have never used the word half brother.
Never. They say brother.
And and they know the words I like to hear.
They know what I need to feel secure because, you know, it's
been five years. And I'll be honest, like in the
beginning, I was 10% sure they were not going to go anywhere
(31:33):
and 90% sure they were going to be like, well, this was fun, but
we're out. This is only temporary.
And then over the years, it's gotten bigger.
Now I'm at like 9095% sure they're unconditionally going to
love me forever. But I need to hold on to that 5%
because I just need to be ready to put my wall up and block the
(31:56):
rejection when it comes. I need to have a plan.
Yeah, if, if it comes. It's not gonna come.
But unfortunately, you know, ourbrains are wired so much in
trauma that that's how it thinks.
That really doesn't sound like. It's going to.
Which is amazing. How much time have you spent in
the what ifs? Because I think it's a natural
(32:20):
thing, right, to spend the time wondering, what if my
grandmother had been able to save me?
But I also think that that can just wear you down, right?
Because you can't go back in time.
So how much time did you spend on that and where are you sort
of out with it now? Well, I still have what ifs, you
know, 50 years of wiring in yourbrain isn't just fixed
(32:42):
overnight, you know, and this family wasn't going to fix it
all. I mean, I'm an intensive therapy
and have been for the last five years.
I have like 4 therapists and I use psychedelics, which are
amazing in a therapeutic environment to rewire your brain
and neuroplasticity. I thoroughly believe in it.
Listen, what if this person tookme in?
What if I contacted my father early?
(33:04):
What if I grew up with my siblings?
I mean, I know it sounds so clicheish, but I wouldn't be who
I am today. I wouldn't have met my wife.
I wouldn't have my children. All of me and my siblings could
have hated each other by now if we had met early.
I mean, now we meet and, and ourbrains are, are, are mature and
(33:24):
we're adults and we can put aside, you know, stupid stuff
and immature stuff and really get to the point of healing.
Yeah. What ifs are.
I mean, listen, I always wanted to be a rock star.
What if I met Tammy at 21 and broke it off because my dream
was to go to LA and make it? I mean, honestly, I probably
would have been dead by now because, you know, somebody
(33:47):
wired like me is going to constantly be running for that
next tie of adoration and love. And of course, that's going to
involve some unhealthy behaviorsas well.
Yeah. What if they're still there?
They are. They're just fewer and far
between. And, you know, you learn.
I mean, I study Buddhism now, which is amazing.
Have you had any contact with your mother?
(34:08):
Does she know that you are in contact with your family?
No. So besides, when my grandmother
passed in my 30s and I had to help her with the Funeral
arrangements, it's been 30 some odd years.
She's never seen her grandchildren except maybe once
when they were babies. They're grown, they're graduated
from college, one's getting married.
(34:30):
She's missed it all. The very first time I met my
father was at a restaurant and his new wife was there of the
last like 20 some odd years, wouldn't even look at me.
And I'm describing as I talk to my father, I'm describing more
of the abuse and he's telling meabout what he remembers from
that time, how he met my mother,etcetera, etcetera.
(34:53):
And I, you know, I'm bawling theentire, I mean, I must have
bawled the first dozen times we met.
And he goes to the bathroom and I look at her and I say, please
look at me. Like, please acknowledge my
existence in this world. You know, I've been a secret my
(35:14):
entire life. Will you please just look at me?
And she finally did and broke down.
But it was one of the first times in this journey that I
stood up for myself, you know, and I said, I'm here and don't
brush me. Don't put me under the rug
anymore. Don't brush me under the rug.
I'm here. There were, you know, there were
many times after that. There was one specific time
(35:36):
later that year or the next yearwhere my father and I had lunch
alone, just the two of us. And he spent most of the lunch
saying these words, I'm not going to abandon you.
I'm not going to abandon you over and over and over again
until he believed that I believed it.
And by like the 12th time, of course, I'm losing it, bawling
my eyes out. This family has done a wonderful
(35:59):
job of not only facing the secrets they have in their
family, but understanding my pain and giving me what I need.
Another example of that is like I'm covered in tattoos.
Most of my tattoos are about this journey as well as my
childhood. But this family held this huge
(36:20):
Hebrew naming ceremony for me where they gave me my Hebrew
name and it was a huge thing, rituals.
And I'm in my underwear laying in this sand circle and there's
eucalyptus and all these prayers.
And they gave me my Hebrew name,which is it's called Amiasov or
(36:41):
AMI. Everyone calls me AMI for short.
And it means beloved son come tounite.
And this family will say that while I always thought I found
them so I could heal, they'll say it's the opposite.
You're healing this family. You're, you're making us think
(37:02):
about what it means to be familyand have blood and talk about
your emotions. And I still don't get it.
Amazing. I still don't get it.
It's, it's a honestly, I, I've, I've talked to a lot of people
who have found family and I don't know how many I've really
spoken to that have been so welcomed.
(37:25):
Like at that level, that's really, really special.
Yeah, I mean, now, you know, remember it's been, it's, it
wasn't easy, you know, and maybeI'm welcome, but reluctantly in
the beginning. But I showed up.
I showed up as a real person with, with real emotions and
like everyone would say to me inthe family, why are you doing
this? And I said because I discovered
(37:47):
I had siblings and I want siblings.
I discovered my blood, you know,and that means so much when you
don't know your blood and my life has changed.
I mean, I know who I am, I know where I come from.
You know, not everyone in the family is as close to me as
others. And it takes a long time to
accept that because I thought I would walk into this family and
(38:11):
they would love me at 10,000 miles an hour like I fell in
love with them. And it doesn't happen that way.
The best part is learning how todeal with that because it's a
life skill and you know not everything is going to work out
the way you want it to as fast as as you want it to.
That's true. Now your daughters are the ones
who kind of made this happen. What has their reaction been to
(38:32):
this and and your Tammy as well?Yeah, so Tammy is definitely
involved more than the girls because the girls are on her own
or in college and stuff. But we have taken some family
vacations together. When I am out in Phoenix, my
oldest brother's out there and the girls will come out for
their spring break and spend a lot of time with my brother and
(38:53):
my sister-in-law out there. My family welcomes the girls so
beautifully. One of them's getting married
and, and the siblings are invited, but the girls, they
step back and they're letting mego through this journey.
I will say this for any spouse that's going through this with
their spouse, like if you're thethe spouse of someone that's
(39:14):
going through it like me, Tammy felt left out like for a lot, a
lot of times. And it's, it's understandable.
I mean, I am consumed with this journey early on.
It's it I eat, sleep and drink it, you know?
And she graciously took a step back while also making sure I
was mentally well during it all.But it's worked out.
(39:35):
I couldn't have done this without intensive therapy.
I couldn't have done this without a beautiful family, a
stable family and a stable marriage.
Because you can't do it alone. It's, it's, it's too big.
It's a beautiful love story and it's got a lot of bumps in the
road. But whose life doesn't you know?
(39:55):
What advice do you have for a parent who may be keeping a
relationship with a biological parent from their child?
Don't keep the secret secrets kill families.
It might be hard, but again, if the foundation of family is
there and love is there, When I heard my brother speak and he
(40:16):
uses the same inflection in me, it is.
It is a beautiful thing. The first time they said they
loved me. I have all these firsts the
first time, my niece said. Uncle, you know, all these
beautiful firsts are just indescribable.
They really are. And what advice do you have for
someone who's just uncovering their DNA surprise story?
(40:39):
Don't do it alone, take it slow.You have every right to find out
your story and like I said before, everyone will have their
process of meeting you or not meeting you unfortunately.
But if it's a happy story, just remember that everyone has their
(41:02):
own baggage and has nothing to do with you.
Like if you're starting a journey like this, all the shit,
everything that went down has nothing to do with you.
None of it's your fault. It's going to feel like it's.
Important. You're going to blame yourself
all the time and why won't this person love me or why won't this
person call me? I wish the best for anyone who
(41:24):
has to deal with this, but having a strong support system
behind you and not doing it alone is very important.
Very important SO. I think that reminder that it's
not about you, other people's reactions are not about you is
so important. Well, Jeremy, thank you so much
for joining me on the podcast and bravely sharing your story
(41:47):
today. You have been through so much in
your life, but to see you kind of emerge with this positivity
and gratefulness and just a positive outlook moving forward
is really inspiring. Well, thank you so much for
having me. Thanks again to Jeremy for
sharing his story. If you have Adna surprise that
you'd like to share, please submit your story at
(42:08):
dnasurprises.com and for early ad free access to episodes, join
me over on patreon@patreon.com/DNA
Surprises. Until next time.
This episode of DNA Surprises was hosted, produced and edited
by me Alexis Ourselt. It was mixed and mastered by
(42:31):
Josh Ourselt of Siren Recording Studios.
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