February 14, 2025 • 46 mins
The Pole Runner: A Veteran’s Marathon for Mental Wellness
In this episode of Do Hard Things, we sit down with Michael Pickings, a 42-year-old Navy veteran whose story is a powerful testament to resilience, mental toughness, and transformation. From excelling as a long-distance runner in high school to serving as an FMF corpsman in the Navy, Michael has lived a life defined by endurance, discipline, and the relentless pursuit of growth.
But Michael’s journey hasn’t been without its struggles. Battling bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, and insomnia, he has faced some of life’s darkest moments. With the unwavering support of his wife, Sherconja, and their six children, Michael has fought to rebuild his life—turning to faith, exercise, and self-reflection as his anchors.
Through his experiences, he has become a mental health advocate, using his platform to inspire others to carry their burdens with courage. As the founder of Dragonz MMA, he has helped others push past their limits. More recently, he’s taken up pole running, a deeply symbolic practice where he physically carries the weight of his burdens, proving that no load is too heavy when approached with resilience.
In This Episode, We Cover:
- Michael’s journey from high school track star to Navy corpsman
- The mental health battles he has faced and how he overcame them
- How his wife and family played a critical role in his healing process
- The story behind pole running and its significance in his transformation
- His mission to inspire others through fitness, faith, and self-discipline
Connect with Michael Pickings:
- TikTok: @thepolerunner
- Facebook: #thepolerunner
- Facebook Reels: Michael Pickings
- YouTube: The Log Runner
Join the Movement:
If you found this episode inspiring, share it with someone who needs to hear Michael’s story. Don’t forget to subscribe, leave a review, and follow Do Hard Things
Welcome to the Do Hard Things Podcast with your host Jay Tiegs, Are you ready to amplify and improve your life? Then you are in the right place. On this podcast we have unfiltered conversation with inspiring people who take on challenges and share with us, the wisdom from their journey. We talk about how doing hard things adequately enable all of us to deal with life's struggles and challenges and ultimately improve the quality of our lives.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
All right, Welcome back everybody to another
episode of the Do Our Thingspodcast, Today's guest.
I'm super excited to talk tothe one and only pole runner who
is the founder of the PoleRunner Nation.
His name is Michael Pickings,and this is the awesome thing
about social media.
I happen to find you on TikTok.
(01:05):
I've been really inspired byyour content and Michael is a
true testament to resilience,perseverance and the power of
transformation.
Michael Pickings he's 42 yearsold.
He's a Navy veteran, dedicatedadvocate for mental health
awareness.
He's a graduate of Idabel HighSchool and in 2001, Michael
(01:27):
excelled as a long distancerunner, participating in
multiple grueling track eventsthat taught him the importance
of endurance and discipline.
Similar background After highschool, Michael joined the
military, serving as a corpsmanand later as an FMF corpsman,
and he excelled.
He was known for hisexceptional fitness here, in top
honors during his training atCamp Pendleton, ultimately
(01:48):
stationed in Japan where hisrunning prowess was widely
recognized.
Michael's journey hasn't beenwithout his own challenges.
He has experiences from hisexperience in war, and some of
the challenges and impact ofmental health struggles brought
him to some of life's darkestmoments darkest moments.
(02:09):
He's faced some challenges, butyet his story of hope and
determination and his unwaveringsupport from his wife has
enabled him to overcome thesechallenges, and Michael's
mission now is to shine a lighton mental health, sharing his
incredible story to inspireothers to overcome their own
challenges, and I'm excited tohave you here, Michael.
So what am I missing from theintro?
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Well, nothing much.
You pretty much hit it all onthe button the military, the
life afterwards.
I struggled after the military,of course, like you said and I
mean it was it was hard.
As a matter of fact, I just Ijust now got back on track last
(02:51):
year After a terrible episodeand it's been going on since I
got out in 2007.
So it's been going on that long.
It took me that long to getmyself, get my mind completely
right and stuff, to get myselfget my mind completely right and
stuff.
So it's been a long road for mein and out of the, you know, va
(03:16):
, mental health hospitals andthings of that such.
And you know I'm just nowgetting my life back on track
with my kids and stuff.
I'm able to spend time withthem and go see them on their
sports and the things that theydo.
So that's enjoyable.
My wife is enjoying me a lotmore now because she's, like you
know, I done made some bigchanges.
So she's happy for the changesthat I've made and tried to do.
(03:39):
So you know, the family life isgreat.
Now my mind is getting better.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
That's good and I'd like to get into that in uh in
the interview today.
But, um, just to kind of paintthe picture for um, you know how
I found you.
I guess I want to start offwith uh, what is pole runner
nation and your content thatyou've been creating, and what
are some of your goals andobjectives?
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Well, uh, pole running is, uh, is taking
something that that you deem isis hard, like, uh, let's say,
you're going through adepression or something like
that and instead of the weightbeing on the inside of you,
you're putting the weight on theoutside of you, something that
you can carry, something thatyou can physically see, and
you're just taking that.
Like I just take my pole and Ijust I run until I don't have
(04:26):
any more problems, or I run itso my mind is straight and it's
just about doing something hard.
It don't even have to be a pole.
Some people do weighted vests,some people just do heavy
lifting or, you know,calisthenics or something like
that, just something that youcan put forth, the effort to do
to make your mind a little bitstronger.
(04:48):
So you know, I'm just trying toreach out to people that might
be going through some things,and you know we're all going
through a lot of things andstuff.
So you know people can relateto it and you know that's why I
enjoy inspiring and peopleinspire me when they, you know,
leave me comments and stuff likethat.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Yeah, so what exactly are you training for and how
are you going about it?
Because every time I see you onTikTok you're like I think, if
I remember correctly, you'retraining for a marathon, and
just describe the pole thatyou're carrying.
You're not carrying a fishingpole.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
No, you know what?
That pole was cut down from alight pole in my yard when we
moved here and it's just sittingout in my yard and and one day
I just I picked it up and I waslike, I was like how far.
I was like uh, I'm wonderinghow far can I go with this thing
.
So you know, it just startedthat, um, but yeah, what's the
(05:39):
other question?
Because I get, uh, yeah, justjust describe.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
I want you to just describe the poll and what
you're doing, because, uh, it'shard to uh, oh, okay, kind of
imagine.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
So paint the pole and what you're doing, because it's
hard to kind of imagine.
So paint a picture of whatyou're doing.
Yeah, the pole is 62 pounds.
I just weighed it like a weekor so ago.
It's 62 pounds, and I'm notreally training for anything.
I'm setting goals in my mind.
So I tried to do a marathon runwith it, because I did a half
(06:09):
marathon run with it the 13miles and I was looking for
something a little bit moreharder and stuff.
So I was like you know what Iwant to?
Can I run a marathon with it?
And um, I did the marathon.
I felt short, I I went to 19miles and, uh, I know I did it a
little bit early because I hadit set for February 22nd.
(06:29):
I think that I was going toactually do it, but I felt good
that day and so I was like youknow what, let me just might as
well go do it.
So, but I only made it 19 miles.
Of course, I posted it on my,on my TikTok, and I was
devastated.
I was really devastated.
I thought I could push it out,but I couldn't do it.
(06:51):
And then I'm also training forI'm trying to do the McGinnis
record for one hour push-ups,push-ups in one hour, but I'm
going to start training on thatonce I get the marathon run out
the way so I can focus on thepush-up, One lofty goal at a
(07:11):
time.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yes, so it's a 62-pound cut piece of telephone
pole.
I mean you look like a prettybig dude and carrying it is like
hanging off of your shoulder.
It just looks painful it is.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Then, uh, it takes, uh, because I, uh, I have to put
some towels under my shoulderbecause, uh, when you run with
it for a while it weighs down onyou and then, uh, uh, it
squishes the towels.
So the towels start out likethis right here, but you, you
know, by the time the run itstarts getting lower and lower
and there's not that muchcushion.
(07:52):
So when I did my 19-mile run, Iput a pillow, I taped a pillow
to my pole, but it offered somecomfort and stuff like that,
because when I just had thetowels on there, I have to set
the poles down.
Set the pole down to switchover the towels and then switch
over.
I had to pick the log back upand put it on the other shoulder
(08:13):
.
So you know, that was, um, thatwas some trying stuff, cause
you know, once you put the poledown, 62 pounds isn't much.
But when you're tired after arun and stuff like that, you
know, sitting it down andpicking it back up, switching
over tiles, takes a bit out ofyou.
So I tried to tape a pillow toit and that helped out,
especially when I'm running Icould just uh, pick the pole up
(08:35):
and just switch sides with it.
That way I could keep, uh, keeprunning.
Um, my only problem is when I'mrunning down these roads is
people have their dogs out.
So, you know, sometimes I haveto stop running and you know, as
a runner, once you get going itis hard stopping and restarting
(08:58):
after that.
So I have to continue with somedogs in the pole and then, you
know, it gets my shoulder sore,uh, so, um, yeah, and then you
know, it got got a little bit ofbruising.
I thought my shoulder had been,uh, you know, getting used to
it after a while, but, um,depending on how long that I run
(09:22):
, uh, it still uh, bruises up myshoulder pretty bad, no matter
what cushion I have up underthere.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Yeah, it's a lot of weight, a lot of pressure and
you're running on top of that.
So that is one.
I don't know.
It's an incredible feat, and towatch your videos, you know
when you're in it like it.
Just it looks challenging forsure.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
It is especially with the heels.
The heels are terrible.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Now, what um?
You did 19 miles of the day.
How, how long did it take youto complete 19 miles?
And how, how long did it takeyou to do the half marathon?
Just for reference.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Okay, um, well, uh, just to give a little background
, because one of my legs I toremy hamstring, like completely
tore it, and the VA never fixedit, so I can't do a full stride.
So in my video you'll hear medragging my left leg and stuff.
(10:25):
It's a nuisance, but I can't doa full stride so it's like
little choppy steps so it takesme a little bit longer.
But I started at 19 miles.
I started at eight o'clock Ithink I got finished.
I think it was around 11, 1130,somewhere around there.
(10:45):
The half marathon, it took me.
Marathon, it took me, it tookme, I think, about two hour two
and a half hours, almost three,uh, somewhere around there.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
Um, um, but uh, that's pretty quick for carrying
a 62 pound telephone pole.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
It's pretty good yeah , that's what my, that's what my
wife asked, because, uh, shewas, I started around I always
started around eight and she'ssupposed to meet me after she
got through with her hair andher hair only took a couple
hours or something around thereand uh, she had called me.
I was like, yeah, I'm almost totown.
That was on my 13 mile run anduh, she's like you're already
(11:28):
there.
I was like I was like, yeah,I'm almost there, I'm almost
there, but you know, it took mea while to build that up, though
.
It took me a while.
So I want to time.
I want to actually time,because I don't never time it
when I run, but I'm going totime a three mile one, and then
I'm going to time a six mile oneand then I want to try to
(11:48):
actually time time, uh, the half, uh, the half marathon, um,
cause I never really time it, oranything like that.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Well, it sounds like you got a pretty good pace going
.
Uh, pretty impressive.
Uh, timing for for what you'redoing, it's, it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But you know I always had goodendurance and stuff.
So, yeah, I always had goodendurance.
I didn't ever know that I wasgood at long-distance running
until middle school and when mycoach put me out there, I didn't
ever know that I was actuallygood at long distance.
(12:25):
I had the lung, the wind, windcapacity to do that until, uh, a
coach in seventh grade had, youknow, put me out on a track and
, you know, did a, a mile and uh, I did pretty good in it.
So, uh, that was the first timeI ever knew that I was good at
something.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
so, yeah, yeah, no, that's awesome.
So you're doing, um, you're,you're doing this pole running
and it's become a uh, just apersonal challenge for you.
How has it helped you overcomesome of the challenges and how
is it related to mental health?
Like what, what?
Why are you doing this?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Well, man, it, it really helps out my, uh, my
mental health, like, uh, like Itold you, uh, uh, it took, it
takes, um, it takes out what Ihave on my inside, like the
depression, the ptsd andeverything.
And when I look at that poll,that's, that's all my problems,
right there, that poll is I, Iput all my problems into that,
(13:25):
into that poll, and I know thatif I put all my problems into
that, into that pole, and I knowthat if I can physically carry
my problems, and you know, if Icould do that mentally, and just
you know, if I have a six milerun set and I could finish that
run with, uh, with the pole, uh,I know that I can, you know,
beat my, you know, whatevermental health that I got going
(13:48):
on that day.
So, every day, like I have to,I have to put some, I have to
take what's on the inside andmake it a physical thing and,
you know, try to conquer it thatway.
That way it's not all balled upinside my head and you know,
and you know it takes away from,you know, the happiness that I
(14:08):
could experience for that day.
So, um, yeah, it, just that'swhat I do is just, you know, I
make it a physical problem, thatway I could deal with it,
because if it's a mental problemor something like that, it's
hard for me to actually dealwith it.
You know, just sitting here andyou know, just dwelling on it.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
So that's one thing I love about like endurance,
sports and the type of physicalfitness that you're only focused
on the task at hand, like youdon't have time to ruminate or
think about anything else.
It really gets you really,really present in the moment,
and that's what I suspect ishappening for you as you're
trying to, you know, do thisvery difficult and challenging
(14:51):
thing.
You know when you're, whenyou're, you know carrying this
thing for 13, 19,.
You know, goal of a marathon,like you're just focused on the
task at hand and the sense ofaccomplishment that that comes
with that, which is, which ispretty cool.
Oh yeah, when I finished a run,oh, yeah, when I finish a run.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
oh yeah, when I finish a run, it's nothing like
that personal accomplishment,man.
It feels good.
When I have something set in mymind and I complete it, man, it
makes my day that just muchmore better and stuff.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
So yeah, that that personal goal is is important
for people to set now, whenpeople in your community see you
running with this pole, doesanyone do?
Do they honk at you?
Do they say anything like what?
Speaker 2 (15:39):
yeah, yeah, they honk .
Uh, a lot of people slow down,you know they slow down to a
creep, you know while they're intheir car and I know they're
just curious and stuff like that.
As a matter of fact, when Ifirst time I went to town
because I'm usually in thecountry, so you know the country
(16:00):
people are usually used to meseeing.
You know seeing it and stuff.
So when I ran to town my firsttime, there was a guy outside
fixing his lawnmower and he waslike you know, I done been in
this city for 50-something yearsand I've seen everything, but
I've never seen a person runwith a log on their back.
(16:22):
I was like, well, yeah, it'slike you're seeing it now.
So he was like, where are youcoming from?
I was like, well, it's likeyou're seeing it now.
So he was like, where are youcoming from?
I was like about 12 miles nearthe race car track and stuff.
He was like, man, that's a longway.
I was like, yeah, I was like Idon't want to talk too long
because I don't want to run outof breath right now, but I'll go
ahead and finish.
And then there was a lady at arestaurant.
(16:47):
She actually came out on my19-mile run.
She actually came out and saidthat I could stop by her
restaurant and get a free meal,or if I need some water or free
coffee or something like that.
They've been really supportiveof me.
When they do see me, they'vebeen, you know, really
supportive of me.
Uh, when they do see me.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
No, it's so awesome.
I mean, as many years have Ibeen out on a bicycle or running
?
You know you get all sorts ofpeople like what, are you lost?
Why are you out here?
If it's like really coldtemperature, like are you, are
you homeless?
You know, I can't imagine whatpeople are saying seeing you
with a pole.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
It's hilarious.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, they, they are what they're thinking it's
hilarious.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yeah, they are.
They're mostly curious about it.
One dude had turned around andhe was like man, I just need to
know, was you okay?
He was like I didn't want toleave you out here and I was
like yeah, I'm okay, man.
And my wife was like he's okay,he just does this crazy stuff
every now and then Don't worryabout him, he's okay, he just
(17:47):
does this crazy stuff every nowand then Don't worry about him.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
That's awesome.
It's great that people stillcare enough to make sure that
you're okay.
Now I mentioned Idabel.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
High School.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Where are you from?
I didn't catch where you'reactually at.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Well, I was born in Idabel, but I went to school my
first time going to school Iwent to school in a small town
called Tum, Oklahoma, and then Itransferred to Hayworth,
oklahoma, and then I transferredto Foreman, arkansas, and I
went there around the fifth,sixth grade and that's where I
stayed at.
After that I'd have beenOklahoma.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
Okay, so you're in Oklahoma now.
Yeah, no, I'd have builtOklahoma, okay so you're in
Oklahoma now?
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah, no, I'm in Arkansas now, but Oklahoma is
where I'm from.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Okay, so born and grew up in Oklahoma, and now you
find yourself in Arkansas.
Yes, awesome, you're not toofar from me, so we'll have to
get together for training.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Oh yeah, because I go to Missouri, because my kids
have, um you know, sports upthere, so I go up there uh
pretty often to go watch them,uh, to go watch them play yeah,
that's great.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
I head down to arkansas.
Arkansas is a beautiful state.
It's a, it's a playground for,like outdoors, so so many great
things to do down there.
So let's talk about, um, if youdon't mind, maybe some of the
the, the mental healthchallenges that that you've had
because you know I, I'vedefinitely had them myself.
A lot of people that arelistening.
I mean it's uh, it's, it's.
(19:20):
It's far more prevalent um thanpeople realize.
I love talking about this.
If you could, you could maybeshare with us, like, you know,
what has your journey been withyour own mental health?
And maybe, like, what was thebig turning point that's enabled
you to be more resilient andnavigate your mental health
better than you had before?
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Like I said, I had got out of the military on a
personality disorder, um, aboutuh, 2004, 2005, somewhere around
there.
Um, I started, uh, I starteddownfalling for some reason,
like right after I got out, theright back, after I came back
(20:02):
from the, from the war cause Iwas only there for a couple of
months because I was actually Iwas down in the Philippines and
was doing an exercise down inthe Philippines and they had
asked us if anyone would want tovolunteer to go for medical
support up there and of course,nobody raised their hand.
(20:23):
Nobody raised their hand,nobody raised their hand.
So, uh, they had bought kind ofvoluntold me to go and I, I
think when you, when you'regoing to war, it you know you
have to be mentally prepared togo.
It's like, uh, you know, somepeople train, you know, you know
, for actual combat before theygo.
(20:45):
So me just being in, I call itparadise to hell.
You know, that took a lot outof me and then I had some head
trauma because I was knockedunconscious more times than I
can count.
So after I had got back, um, Ijust wasn't right.
(21:08):
Um, they had started sending meto um in my, in my hm1 at that
time had noticed it and hestarted sending me, uh, to the
doctor.
He told me to start going tosee a psychiatrist and stuff and
I started going.
Uh, of course I couldn't carrymy weapon anymore.
They took that away and it wasjust a downfall after that and I
(21:36):
was just I couldn't remember alot of things.
I was getting more angry.
I was getting more depressed.
As a matter of fact, I startedcutting, I started
self-mutilating while I was inthe military and I did.
I crushed my wrist bone realbad because I had hit a door
(21:56):
like a metal door and I crushedmy wrist real bad.
And I just couldn't control myanger, I couldn't control my
depression, I couldn't controlmy thoughts, I couldn't control
remembering things because mymemory started fading and they
just decided that it would bebetter for me just to go ahead
(22:18):
and get out.
They gave me an honorabledischarge but they put me out in
like a couple, two weeks orthree weeks and that's the
fastest I ever seen somebody getout of military because I
didn't even have enough to, Ididn't have enough time to even
uh get my, my life set up backback at home.
So when I got back home andstuff like that.
(22:42):
Uh, I didn't have anything.
I didn't know what to do or howto get started or anything like
that, and the military wasn'tpaying me for my mental health.
Then Of course I didn't knowhow to get things started.
But after I had got out man,everything, just I don't know
everything my mental health justtotally took over man and I
(23:06):
could not get myself right tosave my life.
I could not get myself right.
It was just a crazy.
It was just crazy time and Iwas in and out of the mental
health hospital severaldifferent times because of
suicide, or I was cutting myself, or like I'll go to a city or
(23:29):
state and I don't know how I gotthere and I turn myself into
the VA.
Just let them know.
Like I don't even know how Igot here, you guys.
And or homicidal, suicidalthoughts and stuff like that,
nightmares, insomnia, you prettymuch name it, it, it it took
(23:50):
over and the thing is about it.
Uh, the doctors didn't know howto actually treat me because I
had so many things going on.
Um, on top of the mental healthstuff, they said I had a
traumatic brain injury as well.
So, um, that kind of you know,threw things off and stuff, and
(24:12):
I had got married a couple timesas a fact, you know this is my
fourth marriage right herebecause you know I just could
not.
I couldn't get it right.
I couldn't, I disappeared oryou know I was living a wild
lifestyle that I just didn'tcare.
I didn't feel safe being in onelocation if that makes sense.
(24:32):
I get anxiety being in onelocation.
People started to get to knowme and stuff like that.
I started to disappear.
I leave all my clothes,everything that I own.
As a matter of fact, I wentdown to Houston.
I was homeless in Houston forabout six, eight months because
(24:53):
I just wanted to disappear.
I could have called home orsomething like that, but I just
wanted to be by myself and stuff.
It took me all the way from 2007, when I got out, all the way up
until 2024 to actually getmyself right.
And you know I had to get theright doctor as well.
(25:16):
She put me on the rightmedication.
She was pretty much patientwith me.
You know I could talk to herabout anything, because I was
scared to talk to the VA,because I talked to them one
time and they sent the police tomy house.
It was like, and the policecame, it was like three or four
units.
I was like, and I looked out thewindow, I was like, I was like
(25:36):
man, there's a lot of policeoutside.
And you know, they came up andthey was like, yeah, the VA
called, you know, for a healthand wellness check.
I was like it took all you guysto come check, come check on me
.
And so I was nervous the wholetime I was nervous, I was trying
not to, you know, act a certainway or something like that it
(25:57):
was.
It was.
It was just a terrifying momentfor me, cause I was going
through a lot of stuff then and,uh, I didn't want my mind to
black out or anything like that,because I couldn't control my
blackouts then.
So, yeah, it's been an uphillbattle for me and I'm just
(26:18):
thankful that I made it through,because my cousin, he was going
through the same thing and hedidn't make it.
So, you know, I'm just gladthat I was able to, you know,
get to this point.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Well, I appreciate you sharing and thank you for
your service, you know, to ourcountry and that, as a corpsman,
I can't imagine.
You know what you've seen andyour experiences combined with
the.
You know you said that youalready had some head injuries
and things like that.
That's a, that's a, obviouslythat's that's going to cause
(26:52):
some challenges.
So you've you face someincredibly dark times, no doubt.
And then, on top of that, likethe rapid transition from the
military, like I retired fromfrom the military after 27 years
of service.
After 27 years of service, andeverything was pretty.
I mean, I, in the grand schemeof things, it was just me just
trying to find myself.
A lot of veterans struggle withthat.
(27:13):
Who, who aren't dealing withthe mental health challenges.
So, trying to navigate that ontop of mental health, I can't
even imagine what you knowwithout the support and
camaraderie and um, you knowthat that that you had.
It had to be an incrediblydifficult time.
What's pulled you back from thebrink?
You know it sounds like you'rein a really good spot now.
(27:37):
What are some of the thingsthat have enabled you to, you
know, move forward and I guess,for lack of a better term just
like stabilize and lead a morenormal life.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Well, first off, of course, I got the right doctor
and she, she actually listenedto me and she done put me on
some some good medication for,you know, for first off, but
it's not so bad that it makes medrowsy all day, where it's like
I'm zombie, you know, for firstoff, but it's not so bad that
it makes me, uh, drowsy all day,where it's like I'm zombie, you
(28:12):
know.
And, um, of course, um, when,uh, I was about to commit
suicide, uh, last year, man, Iprayed, I prayed and I, you know
, I was praying the year, theyears before, man, I dropped
down outside and I, I'd pray andit seemed like it was never
getting answered.
It was never getting answered.
I get upset with God and stufflike that, and you know I do a
(28:36):
lot of wild talk and you know Icould never, you know, my
spirituality wasn't really good.
My relationship, you know, withGod really wasn't good.
You know, I started blaming himfor a lot of stuff, but God
really wasn't good.
You know, I started blaming himfor a lot of stuff and but
right before I pulled, right,before I was going to pull the
trigger last year, like I, justI gave prayer one more time, you
(29:00):
know, one more try and likebelieve it or not, like my, it
seemed like a weight was liftedoff of me that time, Like I
never I always said that I neverfelt spiritual or I never felt
God or you know, I never felt,you know, that type of
connection.
(29:21):
But you know, that time I, youknow, I felt it and then you
know, it stuck with me and stuff, I felt it and it stuck with me
.
That really helped me out.
To know that.
It helped me out where I couldcontrol it a little bit better.
I was able to control myself alittle bit better.
(29:42):
My wife, she was going through alot of stuff Like she said she
was walking on eggshells all thetime around me and stuff she
didn't know what to what toexpect.
Sometimes, when I go off, likeI don't remember, and stuff like
that, and she said I havemultiple personalities and stuff
(30:05):
like that, and sometimes, whenit happens, she has like a to-go
bag and she has to rush out thehouse with the keys and she'll,
you know, she'll, you know, runto the car and stuff like that,
and, um, you know all the stuffthat I put her through, I
started actually realizing, youknow that, uh, that I have to do
(30:33):
better with her because shedon't stick beside me through,
you know, all this thing forabout 15 years.
So, you know, really giving hermy best and actually trying,
because sometimes I look backand I was like, was I really
trying?
Was, you know, did I just givein too easy?
Or, you know, was I reallytrying to make myself better
personally?
And sometimes I don't think Iwas so.
(30:57):
With that, my wife's support,trying to do better for her, God
, and also working out, andworking out then made a pretty
big difference in my life.
I used to do it, but you know,I work out for, you know, two,
(31:17):
three months and then I quit.
I gained weight all the wayback, and then I get depressed
again and then I start back andit's like yo-yoing effect all
the time with me and I can neverget anything constant though.
And then I start back and it'slike yo-yoing effect all the
time with me and I can never getanything constant though.
Right now it's just I'm tryingto base my life on consistency
(31:37):
and have some consistency aboutmyself and set goals for myself
right now.
So all those things puttogether, you know it made a
pretty good circle for me andstuff, and you know it's been
been pretty good so far.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, so, uh, a deeper connection with, uh, with
God, you know, um, realizingthat, um, there's other people
relying on me, you know, right,and and your relationship with
your wife being consistent.
Realizing that, uh, you know,when you're not working out that
you're kind of slipping, itkind of leads to, you know,
backsliding a little bit.
(32:14):
Uh, those are some prettypowerful indicators and I just
applaud you for having thecourage to share that with us
and and just to continue tocontinue the, the, the fight, if
you will.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
Oh yeah, I'm going.
I'm going to try to continue.
I don't ever want to fall backinto that dark space again.
I'm afraid of getting back inthere because I was so close to
being the end of me last time.
I'm trying to stay focused thistime.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
That's good.
I think you have a powerfulstory to tell, and the statistic
of the number of veterans thatare taking their life it's
really alarming and it's a greatreminder that the fight is
ongoing and oftentimes, peopleare fighting in silence.
People, people are fighting insilence.
(33:10):
So I appreciate you sharingyour story and it's a it's a
tremendous testimony of ofovercoming uh in in in
resilience, and I just wish youall the best of luck on this
journey.
I think I think, uh, when I,when I saw your, your, your
videos, I'm like, oh man, I gotto talk to Michael, like there's
just, I just appreciate, um,the message that that you're
(33:31):
spreading, and I think morepeople need to hear your, uh,
your story.
What advice would you givesomeone that is having some
mental health uh, uh challenges,like, like, like you've had to
to move?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Well, first, uh, uh, you know, seek help, uh, as much
as you can, um, and then, uh,you know, always, never, never,
give up in the fight, because alot, of, a lot of us want to
want to give up at some point intime because, you know, it just
seems like we can't do nothingright, or we're always doing
things wrong, or, you know, wedon't, we, we just can't get our
(34:06):
life going at that time.
So sometimes it takes a littlebit of time and it takes a
little bit of effort on our partand we can't give up on
ourselves.
As soon as you give up onyourself, then there's nothing
like losing hope.
When you don't have hope andstuff like that, there's nothing
(34:30):
else to fight for after that.
When you don't have, no, youknow nothing, no hope for
yourself and stuff like that,and I always look to conquer
something, and even if it's justyour mind or you know, it's
just becoming a better person or, you know, becoming a better
(34:54):
husband or wife or somethinglike that.
You know I always try to put mythoughts on another person.
So, you know, I always want totry to for my wife and stuff.
I always want to try to for mywife and stuff.
I always want to try to bebetter for her and stuff.
So I can't afford to, you know,fall into a depression, you
(35:17):
know for long, or you know feelsorry for myself and stuff like
that, because I have, you know,responsibility, you know to her,
you know to her, um, so youknow you just got to find some,
find some worth in your life andeverybody has some, some
self-value, some self-worthabout themselves.
And once you figure it, youknow figure it out and stuff,
(35:40):
then you know you can, you cancome, you know you can overcome
it.
It's, it's difficult and a lotof people give up, but but
you've got to find some strengthwithin yourself to keep going.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Nazi death camps, numerous Nazi death camps in
World War II, and talks about.
You know what is the?
What would?
What would cause people tocontinue to fight, you know,
versus just tapping out, and hecould see the difference right
away.
He knew when someone was goingto fall out.
I want to say fall out, youknow they would either succumb
to disease or you know just the,just the most diabolical, like
horrendous things that you couldever imagine.
You know, was was done to thosepeople in the, in the camps?
(36:30):
Uh, but it's just, it'sremarkable how resilient people
can be when they are, when theyhave that level of hope, or they
have something to live for andfight for.
And I don't know what it is,but I feel like every human on
this planet that I've everinteracted with has some type of
(36:51):
challenge or a series ofchallenges that they have to
overcome.
That's unique to them and itdoesn't always seem fair, but I
feel it's like the ultimate testand how we show up to that test
, you know, uh requiresresilience and and, um, yeah,
(37:13):
there's some, there's somethingto it I don't know what it is
but, um, hope and havingsomething, and, and often we'll
do more for others than we willourselves.
You know you get connected toGod like there's gotta be
meaning, and reasoning justbeyond ourself and I think if
you can tap into that, that cangive you the motivation and the
will to press on, even in themost horrific conditions.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Yes, uh, cause I done a lot of people at the uh the
thing that I go to, uh a lot ofpeople done uh seen my changes
and you know they uh a couple ofthem, a few people came to me
and said, man, we can really seesome changes in you.
And they told me that itmotivates them to.
(37:55):
You know, try to overcome youknow their problem Because they
say we know where you came from,so you know we know if we can,
if you can, you know, do that,then you know they can do it as
well.
So just giving somebody themotivation and inspiration to
overcome their problems, itmeans a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
I talk about that quite a bitin my teachings Be the
lighthouse, right.
This is why you should shareyour journey and share the
challenges that you're goingthrough, because you never know
who you're going to inspire andthat in itself, you know, I, I
like I said, maybe, maybe that'sGod's uh next mission for you
(38:43):
is to just share your owncompelling story of overcoming
these challenges and maybethat's through, you know,
carrying a pole, for you know amarathon, maybe it's a 50K after
that, maybe it's anotherchallenge after that and
inspiring others to do the same.
And I just love the fact thatyou know you're demonstrating.
(39:03):
You know that pole is like yourphysical burden and challenge
and that you can carry it Rightand it's a hard thing to do, but
we can carry it, and we cancarry it much further than we
think that we can.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
Oh yeah, yeah, People are stronger than than what
they think they are.
That's the, the resilient, likeyou had talked about being
resilient man People are is moreresilient than they give
themselves credit for, is moreresented than they give
themselves credit for Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
What message do you want anyone listening to this to
take away?
What would be the overarchingtheme and message that you're
trying to get out there?
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Like I had said in one of my videos, man, it
doesn't matter if you're in thedarkness, it doesn't matter if
you have a hill to go up in, nomatter how steep the hill is, no
matter how much weight that youhave on your shoulders or
burden that you're carrying, youknow you can always conquer.
(40:03):
We're built to conquer ourproblems.
We're built to overcome anysituation that we have.
You know, any burden or anysituation, bad situation that we
have going on in our lives.
We're not, you know, we're notmade.
We're not made weak, eventhough people might, you know,
(40:24):
go through a lot of stuff thatmight bring them down, and you
know they, they might, might beweak in the moment.
It was like, but when you're, Ilike to say when you, when
you're at your weakest, you'reat your strongest because you
have a lot to overcome and aslong as you got that fight in,
you, man, is, you can overcomeit.
So never give up on yourself.
Uh, Never stop trying, becauseonce you stop trying, then you
(40:48):
know you're giving up onyourself.
So just never give up onyourself.
There's always a tomorrow,there's always a next day.
So just get by the day and whentomorrow comes, then worry
about tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
I love it, man.
So what's next for you?
What are your objectives forthis year with running and the
pole running?
Speaker 2 (41:09):
What's next for you?
What are, what are yourobjectives for this year with
running and the pole running?
Well, uh, I want to try forthat, uh to finish that, that
marathon run.
Um, I'm going to give myself acouple of months uh to uh to get
it done.
Uh, when I did the 19 miles, Ikind of didn't do it right Cause
, uh, uh, most runners told meto carb load the day before I
(41:33):
had fasted two days prior tothat run.
I was running on fumes thatwhole run.
I'm going to eat right the daybefore the other day.
I'm going to try to actuallycomplete it this time After that
(41:55):
.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
That would make sense .
Why you hit the wall at 19?
Because roughly around 18 milesin.
That's when all of yourglycogen stores are gone and
that's when you hit the wall ina marathon.
So that would make sense ifyou're fasted so credibly.
You made it that far past it.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Yeah, know, right, I know, I know yeah, because
people's like did you uh?
Some people messaged me likedid you, uh, did you eat and you
know stuff like that.
I was like no, I was like Ifasted, I was on my two-day fast
and you know, when you fast,you wake up, you know, like a
day or two later you got allthis energy and stuff.
And you know I, you fast, youwake up, you know, like a day or
two later you got all thisenergy and stuff and you know, I
(42:31):
was running and stuff like thatand I was fine, but uh, yeah, I
had hit, hit that wall and uh,I couldn't go no more after that
I couldn't do it, but, uh, I'mgonna finish it, um, and then,
uh, I'm gonna do that, thatguness one-hour push-ups,
probably around September,october, and then I got one more
(42:55):
long pole run because I reallywant to go.
I think it's about 60 miles toone town that I want to go to,
but I want to have a uh, I'mtrying to get some shirts made
uh to or like uh, mental health,awareness and military and you
(43:17):
know, got you know uh,supporting all these different
uh types of of things that'sgoing on.
So it's going to be likeawareness run.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Let us know when you're doing that and we'll
definitely push it out in ourcommunity and our channels for
sure.
That's awesome Love to supportyou.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Okay, I appreciate that Really do.
Speaker 1 (43:39):
Yeah, well, we're going to go ahead and move
toward the exit of the door hereon the interview, but is there
anything else that I failed toask that you'd like to get out
there to everyone?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
No, no, you did good, man.
This is my first interview, soI didn't interview, so I don't.
Everything seemed nice to me,it was really nice being on your
podcast and I enjoyed talkingwith you and I appreciate the
support and everything that youthat you've done, so Well, I I
(44:13):
appreciate you spreading themessage, cause it's a very
important message.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
I think what you're doing is awesome, so I want to
continue to encourage you to bethat lighthouse and just share.
You know.
I think that's going to giveyou the strength, because
there's no doubt, like for allof us, there's going to be
continued challenges goingforward.
If there's anything that I cando for you or our community can
do for you, we'd definitely lovefor you to share your journey
with us.
I just appreciate you takingthe time to being here and
(44:42):
sharing, hopefully, your firstinterview, but one of many is
because I think what you'redoing is awesome and more people
need to know about it.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Okay, I appreciate that man.
It means a lot to me.
It really does.
Speaker 1 (44:55):
How can people get connected with you and support
you?
Speaker 2 (45:00):
Well, of course, my TikTok is the Pole Runner.
You can hit me up on there.
I do have a YouTube it's calledthe.
Hit me up on there.
I do have a a YouTube that'scalled the uh the log runner.
On YouTube, though, um, I putmore.
I put more other stuff onYouTube, cause, you know, uh,
tiktok is kind of sensitiveabout you know different things.
(45:21):
So, uh, there's more things onmy YouTube.
And then on Facebook, uh, youcan do hashtag uh the pole
runner or hashtag the log runner, and some of my reels will pop
up on there.
So those are my three outlets,pretty much media.
Speaker 1 (45:43):
We'll get those links .
We'll put them in the shownotes so, for anyone that wants
to connect with you, they canconnect with you in the show
notes.
So, michael, I with you in theshow notes.
So, michael, I appreciate youso much.
I'm eager to see you know we're, uh, how far you can take that
poll and just thank you so muchfor spending your time with us
today.
Speaker 2 (45:59):
I appreciate it, man.
Thanks again.
Speaker 1 (46:03):
All right out there in the Jordan Things Nation.
We appreciate you.
Keep doing hard things and wewill catch you in the next
episode.
Make sure you go to the shownotes and connect with Michael,
and we'll see you guys soon,peace.
All right, Welcome back everybody to another
episode of the Do Our Thingspodcast, Today's guest.
I'm super excited to talk tothe one and only pole runner who
is the founder of the PoleRunner Nation.
His name is Michael Pickings,and this is the awesome thing
about social media.
I happen to find you on TikTok.
(01:05):
I've been really inspired byyour content and Michael is a
true testament to resilience,perseverance and the power of
transformation.
Michael Pickings he's 42 yearsold.
He's a Navy veteran, dedicatedadvocate for mental health
awareness.
He's a graduate of Idabel HighSchool and in 2001, Michael
(01:27):
excelled as a long distancerunner, participating in
multiple grueling track eventsthat taught him the importance
of endurance and discipline.
Similar background After highschool, Michael joined the
military, serving as a corpsmanand later as an FMF corpsman,
and he excelled.
He was known for hisexceptional fitness here, in top
honors during his training atCamp Pendleton, ultimately
(01:48):
stationed in Japan where hisrunning prowess was widely
recognized.
Michael's journey hasn't beenwithout his own challenges.
He has experiences from hisexperience in war, and some of
the challenges and impact ofmental health struggles brought
him to some of life's darkestmoments darkest moments.
(02:09):
He's faced some challenges, butyet his story of hope and
determination and his unwaveringsupport from his wife has
enabled him to overcome thesechallenges, and Michael's
mission now is to shine a lighton mental health, sharing his
incredible story to inspireothers to overcome their own
challenges, and I'm excited tohave you here, Michael.
So what am I missing from theintro?
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Well, nothing much.
You pretty much hit it all onthe button the military, the
life afterwards.
I struggled after the military,of course, like you said and I
mean it was it was hard.
As a matter of fact, I just Ijust now got back on track last
(02:51):
year After a terrible episodeand it's been going on since I
got out in 2007.
So it's been going on that long.
It took me that long to getmyself, get my mind completely
right and stuff, to get myselfget my mind completely right and
stuff.
So it's been a long road for mein and out of the, you know, va
(03:16):
, mental health hospitals andthings of that such.
And you know I'm just nowgetting my life back on track
with my kids and stuff.
I'm able to spend time withthem and go see them on their
sports and the things that theydo.
So that's enjoyable.
My wife is enjoying me a lotmore now because she's, like you
know, I done made some bigchanges.
So she's happy for the changesthat I've made and tried to do.
(03:39):
So you know, the family life isgreat.
Now my mind is getting better.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
That's good and I'd like to get into that in uh in
the interview today.
But, um, just to kind of paintthe picture for um, you know how
I found you.
I guess I want to start offwith uh, what is pole runner
nation and your content thatyou've been creating, and what
are some of your goals andobjectives?
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Well, uh, pole running is, uh, is taking
something that that you deem isis hard, like, uh, let's say,
you're going through adepression or something like
that and instead of the weightbeing on the inside of you,
you're putting the weight on theoutside of you, something that
you can carry, something thatyou can physically see, and
you're just taking that.
Like I just take my pole and Ijust I run until I don't have
(04:26):
any more problems, or I run itso my mind is straight and it's
just about doing something hard.
It don't even have to be a pole.
Some people do weighted vests,some people just do heavy
lifting or, you know,calisthenics or something like
that, just something that youcan put forth, the effort to do
to make your mind a little bitstronger.
(04:48):
So you know, I'm just trying toreach out to people that might
be going through some things,and you know we're all going
through a lot of things andstuff.
So you know people can relateto it and you know that's why I
enjoy inspiring and peopleinspire me when they, you know,
leave me comments and stuff likethat.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Yeah, so what exactly are you training for and how
are you going about it?
Because every time I see you onTikTok you're like I think, if
I remember correctly, you'retraining for a marathon, and
just describe the pole thatyou're carrying.
You're not carrying a fishingpole.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
No, you know what?
That pole was cut down from alight pole in my yard when we
moved here and it's just sittingout in my yard and and one day
I just I picked it up and I waslike, I was like how far.
I was like uh, I'm wonderinghow far can I go with this thing
.
So you know, it just startedthat, um, but yeah, what's the
(05:39):
other question?
Because I get, uh, yeah, justjust describe.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
I want you to just describe the poll and what
you're doing, because, uh, it'shard to uh, oh, okay, kind of
imagine.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
So paint the pole and what you're doing, because it's
hard to kind of imagine.
So paint a picture of whatyou're doing.
Yeah, the pole is 62 pounds.
I just weighed it like a weekor so ago.
It's 62 pounds, and I'm notreally training for anything.
I'm setting goals in my mind.
So I tried to do a marathon runwith it, because I did a half
(06:09):
marathon run with it the 13miles and I was looking for
something a little bit moreharder and stuff.
So I was like you know what Iwant to?
Can I run a marathon with it?
And um, I did the marathon.
I felt short, I I went to 19miles and, uh, I know I did it a
little bit early because I hadit set for February 22nd.
(06:29):
I think that I was going toactually do it, but I felt good
that day and so I was like youknow what, let me just might as
well go do it.
So, but I only made it 19 miles.
Of course, I posted it on my,on my TikTok, and I was
devastated.
I was really devastated.
I thought I could push it out,but I couldn't do it.
(06:51):
And then I'm also training forI'm trying to do the McGinnis
record for one hour push-ups,push-ups in one hour, but I'm
going to start training on thatonce I get the marathon run out
the way so I can focus on thepush-up, One lofty goal at a
(07:11):
time.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yes, so it's a 62-pound cut piece of telephone
pole.
I mean you look like a prettybig dude and carrying it is like
hanging off of your shoulder.
It just looks painful it is.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Then, uh, it takes, uh, because I, uh, I have to put
some towels under my shoulderbecause, uh, when you run with
it for a while it weighs down onyou and then, uh, uh, it
squishes the towels.
So the towels start out likethis right here, but you, you
know, by the time the run itstarts getting lower and lower
and there's not that muchcushion.
(07:52):
So when I did my 19-mile run, Iput a pillow, I taped a pillow
to my pole, but it offered somecomfort and stuff like that,
because when I just had thetowels on there, I have to set
the poles down.
Set the pole down to switchover the towels and then switch
over.
I had to pick the log back upand put it on the other shoulder
(08:13):
.
So you know, that was, um, thatwas some trying stuff, cause
you know, once you put the poledown, 62 pounds isn't much.
But when you're tired after arun and stuff like that, you
know, sitting it down andpicking it back up, switching
over tiles, takes a bit out ofyou.
So I tried to tape a pillow toit and that helped out,
especially when I'm running Icould just uh, pick the pole up
(08:35):
and just switch sides with it.
That way I could keep, uh, keeprunning.
Um, my only problem is when I'mrunning down these roads is
people have their dogs out.
So, you know, sometimes I haveto stop running and you know, as
a runner, once you get going itis hard stopping and restarting
(08:58):
after that.
So I have to continue with somedogs in the pole and then, you
know, it gets my shoulder sore,uh, so, um, yeah, and then you
know, it got got a little bit ofbruising.
I thought my shoulder had been,uh, you know, getting used to
it after a while, but, um,depending on how long that I run
(09:22):
, uh, it still uh, bruises up myshoulder pretty bad, no matter
what cushion I have up underthere.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Yeah, it's a lot of weight, a lot of pressure and
you're running on top of that.
So that is one.
I don't know.
It's an incredible feat, and towatch your videos, you know
when you're in it like it.
Just it looks challenging forsure.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
It is especially with the heels.
The heels are terrible.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Now, what um?
You did 19 miles of the day.
How, how long did it take youto complete 19 miles?
And how, how long did it takeyou to do the half marathon?
Just for reference.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Okay, um, well, uh, just to give a little background
, because one of my legs I toremy hamstring, like completely
tore it, and the VA never fixedit, so I can't do a full stride.
So in my video you'll hear medragging my left leg and stuff.
(10:25):
It's a nuisance, but I can't doa full stride so it's like
little choppy steps so it takesme a little bit longer.
But I started at 19 miles.
I started at eight o'clock Ithink I got finished.
I think it was around 11, 1130,somewhere around there.
(10:45):
The half marathon, it took me.
Marathon, it took me, it tookme, I think, about two hour two
and a half hours, almost three,uh, somewhere around there.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
Um, um, but uh, that's pretty quick for carrying
a 62 pound telephone pole.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
It's pretty good yeah , that's what my, that's what my
wife asked, because, uh, shewas, I started around I always
started around eight and she'ssupposed to meet me after she
got through with her hair andher hair only took a couple
hours or something around thereand uh, she had called me.
I was like, yeah, I'm almost totown.
That was on my 13 mile run anduh, she's like you're already
(11:28):
there.
I was like I was like, yeah,I'm almost there, I'm almost
there, but you know, it took mea while to build that up, though
.
It took me a while.
So I want to time.
I want to actually time,because I don't never time it
when I run, but I'm going totime a three mile one, and then
I'm going to time a six mile oneand then I want to try to
(11:48):
actually time time, uh, the half, uh, the half marathon, um,
cause I never really time it, oranything like that.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Well, it sounds like you got a pretty good pace going
.
Uh, pretty impressive.
Uh, timing for for what you'redoing, it's, it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But you know I always had goodendurance and stuff.
So, yeah, I always had goodendurance.
I didn't ever know that I wasgood at long-distance running
until middle school and when mycoach put me out there, I didn't
ever know that I was actuallygood at long distance.
(12:25):
I had the lung, the wind, windcapacity to do that until, uh, a
coach in seventh grade had, youknow, put me out on a track and
, you know, did a, a mile and uh, I did pretty good in it.
So, uh, that was the first timeI ever knew that I was good at
something.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
so, yeah, yeah, no, that's awesome.
So you're doing, um, you're,you're doing this pole running
and it's become a uh, just apersonal challenge for you.
How has it helped you overcomesome of the challenges and how
is it related to mental health?
Like what, what?
Why are you doing this?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Well, man, it, it really helps out my, uh, my
mental health, like, uh, like Itold you, uh, uh, it took, it
takes, um, it takes out what Ihave on my inside, like the
depression, the ptsd andeverything.
And when I look at that poll,that's, that's all my problems,
right there, that poll is I, Iput all my problems into that,
(13:25):
into that poll, and I know thatif I put all my problems into
that, into that pole, and I knowthat if I can physically carry
my problems, and you know, if Icould do that mentally, and just
you know, if I have a six milerun set and I could finish that
run with, uh, with the pole, uh,I know that I can, you know,
beat my, you know, whatevermental health that I got going
(13:48):
on that day.
So, every day, like I have to,I have to put some, I have to
take what's on the inside andmake it a physical thing and,
you know, try to conquer it thatway.
That way it's not all balled upinside my head and you know,
and you know it takes away from,you know, the happiness that I
(14:08):
could experience for that day.
So, um, yeah, it, just that'swhat I do is just, you know, I
make it a physical problem, thatway I could deal with it,
because if it's a mental problemor something like that, it's
hard for me to actually dealwith it.
You know, just sitting here andyou know, just dwelling on it.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
So that's one thing I love about like endurance,
sports and the type of physicalfitness that you're only focused
on the task at hand, like youdon't have time to ruminate or
think about anything else.
It really gets you really,really present in the moment,
and that's what I suspect ishappening for you as you're
trying to, you know, do thisvery difficult and challenging
(14:51):
thing.
You know when you're, whenyou're, you know carrying this
thing for 13, 19,.
You know, goal of a marathon,like you're just focused on the
task at hand and the sense ofaccomplishment that that comes
with that, which is, which ispretty cool.
Oh yeah, when I finished a run,oh, yeah, when I finish a run.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
oh yeah, when I finish a run, it's nothing like
that personal accomplishment,man.
It feels good.
When I have something set in mymind and I complete it, man, it
makes my day that just muchmore better and stuff.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
So yeah, that that personal goal is is important
for people to set now, whenpeople in your community see you
running with this pole, doesanyone do?
Do they honk at you?
Do they say anything like what?
Speaker 2 (15:39):
yeah, yeah, they honk .
Uh, a lot of people slow down,you know they slow down to a
creep, you know while they're intheir car and I know they're
just curious and stuff like that.
As a matter of fact, when Ifirst time I went to town
because I'm usually in thecountry, so you know the country
(16:00):
people are usually used to meseeing.
You know seeing it and stuff.
So when I ran to town my firsttime, there was a guy outside
fixing his lawnmower and he waslike you know, I done been in
this city for 50-something yearsand I've seen everything, but
I've never seen a person runwith a log on their back.
(16:22):
I was like, well, yeah, it'slike you're seeing it now.
So he was like, where are youcoming from?
I was like, well, it's likeyou're seeing it now.
So he was like, where are youcoming from?
I was like about 12 miles nearthe race car track and stuff.
He was like, man, that's a longway.
I was like, yeah, I was like Idon't want to talk too long
because I don't want to run outof breath right now, but I'll go
ahead and finish.
And then there was a lady at arestaurant.
(16:47):
She actually came out on my19-mile run.
She actually came out and saidthat I could stop by her
restaurant and get a free meal,or if I need some water or free
coffee or something like that.
They've been really supportiveof me.
When they do see me, they'vebeen, you know, really
supportive of me.
Uh, when they do see me.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
No, it's so awesome.
I mean, as many years have Ibeen out on a bicycle or running
?
You know you get all sorts ofpeople like what, are you lost?
Why are you out here?
If it's like really coldtemperature, like are you, are
you homeless?
You know, I can't imagine whatpeople are saying seeing you
with a pole.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
It's hilarious.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, they, they are what they're thinking it's
hilarious.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yeah, they are.
They're mostly curious about it.
One dude had turned around andhe was like man, I just need to
know, was you okay?
He was like I didn't want toleave you out here and I was
like yeah, I'm okay, man.
And my wife was like he's okay,he just does this crazy stuff
every now and then Don't worryabout him, he's okay, he just
(17:47):
does this crazy stuff every nowand then Don't worry about him.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
That's awesome.
It's great that people stillcare enough to make sure that
you're okay.
Now I mentioned Idabel.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
High School.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Where are you from?
I didn't catch where you'reactually at.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Well, I was born in Idabel, but I went to school my
first time going to school Iwent to school in a small town
called Tum, Oklahoma, and then Itransferred to Hayworth,
oklahoma, and then I transferredto Foreman, arkansas, and I
went there around the fifth,sixth grade and that's where I
stayed at.
After that I'd have beenOklahoma.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
Okay, so you're in Oklahoma now.
Yeah, no, I'd have builtOklahoma, okay so you're in
Oklahoma now?
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah, no, I'm in Arkansas now, but Oklahoma is
where I'm from.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Okay, so born and grew up in Oklahoma, and now you
find yourself in Arkansas.
Yes, awesome, you're not toofar from me, so we'll have to
get together for training.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Oh yeah, because I go to Missouri, because my kids
have, um you know, sports upthere, so I go up there uh
pretty often to go watch them,uh, to go watch them play yeah,
that's great.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
I head down to arkansas.
Arkansas is a beautiful state.
It's a, it's a playground for,like outdoors, so so many great
things to do down there.
So let's talk about, um, if youdon't mind, maybe some of the
the, the mental healthchallenges that that you've had
because you know I, I'vedefinitely had them myself.
A lot of people that arelistening.
I mean it's uh, it's, it's.
(19:20):
It's far more prevalent um thanpeople realize.
I love talking about this.
If you could, you could maybeshare with us, like, you know,
what has your journey been withyour own mental health?
And maybe, like, what was thebig turning point that's enabled
you to be more resilient andnavigate your mental health
better than you had before?
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Like I said, I had got out of the military on a
personality disorder, um, aboutuh, 2004, 2005, somewhere around
there.
Um, I started, uh, I starteddownfalling for some reason,
like right after I got out, theright back, after I came back
(20:02):
from the, from the war cause Iwas only there for a couple of
months because I was actually Iwas down in the Philippines and
was doing an exercise down inthe Philippines and they had
asked us if anyone would want tovolunteer to go for medical
support up there and of course,nobody raised their hand.
(20:23):
Nobody raised their hand,nobody raised their hand.
So, uh, they had bought kind ofvoluntold me to go and I, I
think when you, when you'regoing to war, it you know you
have to be mentally prepared togo.
It's like, uh, you know, somepeople train, you know, you know
, for actual combat before theygo.
(20:45):
So me just being in, I call itparadise to hell.
You know, that took a lot outof me and then I had some head
trauma because I was knockedunconscious more times than I
can count.
So after I had got back, um, Ijust wasn't right.
(21:08):
Um, they had started sending meto um in my, in my hm1 at that
time had noticed it and hestarted sending me, uh, to the
doctor.
He told me to start going tosee a psychiatrist and stuff and
I started going.
Uh, of course I couldn't carrymy weapon anymore.
They took that away and it wasjust a downfall after that and I
(21:36):
was just I couldn't remember alot of things.
I was getting more angry.
I was getting more depressed.
As a matter of fact, I startedcutting, I started
self-mutilating while I was inthe military and I did.
I crushed my wrist bone realbad because I had hit a door
(21:56):
like a metal door and I crushedmy wrist real bad.
And I just couldn't control myanger, I couldn't control my
depression, I couldn't controlmy thoughts, I couldn't control
remembering things because mymemory started fading and they
just decided that it would bebetter for me just to go ahead
(22:18):
and get out.
They gave me an honorabledischarge but they put me out in
like a couple, two weeks orthree weeks and that's the
fastest I ever seen somebody getout of military because I
didn't even have enough to, Ididn't have enough time to even
uh get my, my life set up backback at home.
So when I got back home andstuff like that.
(22:42):
Uh, I didn't have anything.
I didn't know what to do or howto get started or anything like
that, and the military wasn'tpaying me for my mental health.
Then Of course I didn't knowhow to get things started.
But after I had got out man,everything, just I don't know
everything my mental health justtotally took over man and I
(23:06):
could not get myself right tosave my life.
I could not get myself right.
It was just a crazy.
It was just crazy time and Iwas in and out of the mental
health hospital severaldifferent times because of
suicide, or I was cutting myself, or like I'll go to a city or
(23:29):
state and I don't know how I gotthere and I turn myself into
the VA.
Just let them know.
Like I don't even know how Igot here, you guys.
And or homicidal, suicidalthoughts and stuff like that,
nightmares, insomnia, you prettymuch name it, it, it it took
(23:50):
over and the thing is about it.
Uh, the doctors didn't know howto actually treat me because I
had so many things going on.
Um, on top of the mental healthstuff, they said I had a
traumatic brain injury as well.
So, um, that kind of you know,threw things off and stuff, and
(24:12):
I had got married a couple timesas a fact, you know this is my
fourth marriage right herebecause you know I just could
not.
I couldn't get it right.
I couldn't, I disappeared oryou know I was living a wild
lifestyle that I just didn'tcare.
I didn't feel safe being in onelocation if that makes sense.
(24:32):
I get anxiety being in onelocation.
People started to get to knowme and stuff like that.
I started to disappear.
I leave all my clothes,everything that I own.
As a matter of fact, I wentdown to Houston.
I was homeless in Houston forabout six, eight months because
(24:53):
I just wanted to disappear.
I could have called home orsomething like that, but I just
wanted to be by myself and stuff.
It took me all the way from 2007, when I got out, all the way up
until 2024 to actually getmyself right.
And you know I had to get theright doctor as well.
(25:16):
She put me on the rightmedication.
She was pretty much patientwith me.
You know I could talk to herabout anything, because I was
scared to talk to the VA,because I talked to them one
time and they sent the police tomy house.
It was like, and the policecame, it was like three or four
units.
I was like, and I looked out thewindow, I was like, I was like
(25:36):
man, there's a lot of policeoutside.
And you know, they came up andthey was like, yeah, the VA
called, you know, for a healthand wellness check.
I was like it took all you guysto come check, come check on me
.
And so I was nervous the wholetime I was nervous, I was trying
not to, you know, act a certainway or something like that it
(25:57):
was.
It was.
It was just a terrifying momentfor me, cause I was going
through a lot of stuff then and,uh, I didn't want my mind to
black out or anything like that,because I couldn't control my
blackouts then.
So, yeah, it's been an uphillbattle for me and I'm just
(26:18):
thankful that I made it through,because my cousin, he was going
through the same thing and hedidn't make it.
So, you know, I'm just gladthat I was able to, you know,
get to this point.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Well, I appreciate you sharing and thank you for
your service, you know, to ourcountry and that, as a corpsman,
I can't imagine.
You know what you've seen andyour experiences combined with
the.
You know you said that youalready had some head injuries
and things like that.
That's a, that's a, obviouslythat's that's going to cause
(26:52):
some challenges.
So you've you face someincredibly dark times, no doubt.
And then, on top of that, likethe rapid transition from the
military, like I retired fromfrom the military after 27 years
of service.
After 27 years of service, andeverything was pretty.
I mean, I, in the grand schemeof things, it was just me just
trying to find myself.
A lot of veterans struggle withthat.
(27:13):
Who, who aren't dealing withthe mental health challenges.
So, trying to navigate that ontop of mental health, I can't
even imagine what you knowwithout the support and
camaraderie and um, you knowthat that that you had.
It had to be an incrediblydifficult time.
What's pulled you back from thebrink?
You know it sounds like you'rein a really good spot now.
(27:37):
What are some of the thingsthat have enabled you to, you
know, move forward and I guess,for lack of a better term just
like stabilize and lead a morenormal life.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Well, first off, of course, I got the right doctor
and she, she actually listenedto me and she done put me on
some some good medication for,you know, for first off, but
it's not so bad that it makes medrowsy all day, where it's like
I'm zombie, you know, for firstoff, but it's not so bad that
it makes me, uh, drowsy all day,where it's like I'm zombie, you
(28:12):
know.
And, um, of course, um, when,uh, I was about to commit
suicide, uh, last year, man, Iprayed, I prayed and I, you know
, I was praying the year, theyears before, man, I dropped
down outside and I, I'd pray andit seemed like it was never
getting answered.
It was never getting answered.
I get upset with God and stufflike that, and you know I do a
(28:36):
lot of wild talk and you know Icould never, you know, my
spirituality wasn't really good.
My relationship, you know, withGod really wasn't good.
You know, I started blaming himfor a lot of stuff, but God
really wasn't good.
You know, I started blaming himfor a lot of stuff and but
right before I pulled, right,before I was going to pull the
trigger last year, like I, justI gave prayer one more time, you
(29:00):
know, one more try and likebelieve it or not, like my, it
seemed like a weight was liftedoff of me that time, Like I
never I always said that I neverfelt spiritual or I never felt
God or you know, I never felt,you know, that type of
connection.
(29:21):
But you know, that time I, youknow, I felt it and then you
know, it stuck with me and stuff, I felt it and it stuck with me
.
That really helped me out.
To know that.
It helped me out where I couldcontrol it a little bit better.
I was able to control myself alittle bit better.
(29:42):
My wife, she was going through alot of stuff Like she said she
was walking on eggshells all thetime around me and stuff she
didn't know what to what toexpect.
Sometimes, when I go off, likeI don't remember, and stuff like
that, and she said I havemultiple personalities and stuff
(30:05):
like that, and sometimes, whenit happens, she has like a to-go
bag and she has to rush out thehouse with the keys and she'll,
you know, she'll, you know, runto the car and stuff like that,
and, um, you know all the stuffthat I put her through, I
started actually realizing, youknow that, uh, that I have to do
(30:33):
better with her because shedon't stick beside me through,
you know, all this thing forabout 15 years.
So, you know, really giving hermy best and actually trying,
because sometimes I look backand I was like, was I really
trying?
Was, you know, did I just givein too easy?
Or, you know, was I reallytrying to make myself better
personally?
And sometimes I don't think Iwas so.
(30:57):
With that, my wife's support,trying to do better for her, God
, and also working out, andworking out then made a pretty
big difference in my life.
I used to do it, but you know,I work out for, you know, two,
(31:17):
three months and then I quit.
I gained weight all the wayback, and then I get depressed
again and then I start back andit's like yo-yoing effect all
the time with me and I can neverget anything constant though.
And then I start back and it'slike yo-yoing effect all the
time with me and I can never getanything constant though.
Right now it's just I'm tryingto base my life on consistency
(31:37):
and have some consistency aboutmyself and set goals for myself
right now.
So all those things puttogether, you know it made a
pretty good circle for me andstuff, and you know it's been
been pretty good so far.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, so, uh, a deeper connection with, uh, with
God, you know, um, realizingthat, um, there's other people
relying on me, you know, right,and and your relationship with
your wife being consistent.
Realizing that, uh, you know,when you're not working out that
you're kind of slipping, itkind of leads to, you know,
backsliding a little bit.
(32:14):
Uh, those are some prettypowerful indicators and I just
applaud you for having thecourage to share that with us
and and just to continue tocontinue the, the, the fight, if
you will.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
Oh yeah, I'm going.
I'm going to try to continue.
I don't ever want to fall backinto that dark space again.
I'm afraid of getting back inthere because I was so close to
being the end of me last time.
I'm trying to stay focused thistime.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
That's good.
I think you have a powerfulstory to tell, and the statistic
of the number of veterans thatare taking their life it's
really alarming and it's a greatreminder that the fight is
ongoing and oftentimes, peopleare fighting in silence.
People, people are fighting insilence.
(33:10):
So I appreciate you sharingyour story and it's a it's a
tremendous testimony of ofovercoming uh in in in
resilience, and I just wish youall the best of luck on this
journey.
I think I think, uh, when I,when I saw your, your, your
videos, I'm like, oh man, I gotto talk to Michael, like there's
just, I just appreciate, um,the message that that you're
(33:31):
spreading, and I think morepeople need to hear your, uh,
your story.
What advice would you givesomeone that is having some
mental health uh, uh challenges,like, like, like you've had to
to move?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Well, first, uh, uh, you know, seek help, uh, as much
as you can, um, and then, uh,you know, always, never, never,
give up in the fight, because alot, of, a lot of us want to
want to give up at some point intime because, you know, it just
seems like we can't do nothingright, or we're always doing
things wrong, or, you know, wedon't, we, we just can't get our
(34:06):
life going at that time.
So sometimes it takes a littlebit of time and it takes a
little bit of effort on our partand we can't give up on
ourselves.
As soon as you give up onyourself, then there's nothing
like losing hope.
When you don't have hope andstuff like that, there's nothing
(34:30):
else to fight for after that.
When you don't have, no, youknow nothing, no hope for
yourself and stuff like that,and I always look to conquer
something, and even if it's justyour mind or you know, it's
just becoming a better person or, you know, becoming a better
(34:54):
husband or wife or somethinglike that.
You know I always try to put mythoughts on another person.
So, you know, I always want totry to for my wife and stuff.
I always want to try to for mywife and stuff.
I always want to try to bebetter for her and stuff.
So I can't afford to, you know,fall into a depression, you
(35:17):
know for long, or you know feelsorry for myself and stuff like
that, because I have, you know,responsibility, you know to her,
you know to her, um, so youknow you just got to find some,
find some worth in your life andeverybody has some, some
self-value, some self-worthabout themselves.
And once you figure it, youknow figure it out and stuff,
(35:40):
then you know you can, you cancome, you know you can overcome
it.
It's, it's difficult and a lotof people give up, but but
you've got to find some strengthwithin yourself to keep going.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Nazi death camps, numerous Nazi death camps in
World War II, and talks about.
You know what is the?
What would?
What would cause people tocontinue to fight, you know,
versus just tapping out, and hecould see the difference right
away.
He knew when someone was goingto fall out.
I want to say fall out, youknow they would either succumb
to disease or you know just the,just the most diabolical, like
horrendous things that you couldever imagine.
You know, was was done to thosepeople in the, in the camps?
(36:30):
Uh, but it's just, it'sremarkable how resilient people
can be when they are, when theyhave that level of hope, or they
have something to live for andfight for.
And I don't know what it is,but I feel like every human on
this planet that I've everinteracted with has some type of
(36:51):
challenge or a series ofchallenges that they have to
overcome.
That's unique to them and itdoesn't always seem fair, but I
feel it's like the ultimate testand how we show up to that test
, you know, uh requiresresilience and and, um, yeah,
(37:13):
there's some, there's somethingto it I don't know what it is
but, um, hope and havingsomething, and, and often we'll
do more for others than we willourselves.
You know you get connected toGod like there's gotta be
meaning, and reasoning justbeyond ourself and I think if
you can tap into that, that cangive you the motivation and the
will to press on, even in themost horrific conditions.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Yes, uh, cause I done a lot of people at the uh the
thing that I go to, uh a lot ofpeople done uh seen my changes
and you know they uh a couple ofthem, a few people came to me
and said, man, we can really seesome changes in you.
And they told me that itmotivates them to.
(37:55):
You know, try to overcome youknow their problem Because they
say we know where you came from,so you know we know if we can,
if you can, you know, do that,then you know they can do it as
well.
So just giving somebody themotivation and inspiration to
overcome their problems, itmeans a lot to me.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
I talk about that quite a bitin my teachings Be the
lighthouse, right.
This is why you should shareyour journey and share the
challenges that you're goingthrough, because you never know
who you're going to inspire andthat in itself, you know, I, I
like I said, maybe, maybe that'sGod's uh next mission for you
(38:43):
is to just share your owncompelling story of overcoming
these challenges and maybethat's through, you know,
carrying a pole, for you know amarathon, maybe it's a 50K after
that, maybe it's anotherchallenge after that and
inspiring others to do the same.
And I just love the fact thatyou know you're demonstrating.
(39:03):
You know that pole is like yourphysical burden and challenge
and that you can carry it Rightand it's a hard thing to do, but
we can carry it, and we cancarry it much further than we
think that we can.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
Oh yeah, yeah, People are stronger than than what
they think they are.
That's the, the resilient, likeyou had talked about being
resilient man People are is moreresilient than they give
themselves credit for, is moreresented than they give
themselves credit for Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
What message do you want anyone listening to this to
take away?
What would be the overarchingtheme and message that you're
trying to get out there?
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Like I had said in one of my videos, man, it
doesn't matter if you're in thedarkness, it doesn't matter if
you have a hill to go up in, nomatter how steep the hill is, no
matter how much weight that youhave on your shoulders or
burden that you're carrying, youknow you can always conquer.
(40:03):
We're built to conquer ourproblems.
We're built to overcome anysituation that we have.
You know, any burden or anysituation, bad situation that we
have going on in our lives.
We're not, you know, we're notmade.
We're not made weak, eventhough people might, you know,
(40:24):
go through a lot of stuff thatmight bring them down, and you
know they, they might, might beweak in the moment.
It was like, but when you're, Ilike to say when you, when
you're at your weakest, you'reat your strongest because you
have a lot to overcome and aslong as you got that fight in,
you, man, is, you can overcomeit.
So never give up on yourself.
Uh, Never stop trying, becauseonce you stop trying, then you
(40:48):
know you're giving up onyourself.
So just never give up onyourself.
There's always a tomorrow,there's always a next day.
So just get by the day and whentomorrow comes, then worry
about tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
I love it, man.
So what's next for you?
What are your objectives forthis year with running and the
pole running?
Speaker 2 (41:09):
What's next for you?
What are, what are yourobjectives for this year with
running and the pole running?
Well, uh, I want to try forthat, uh to finish that, that
marathon run.
Um, I'm going to give myself acouple of months uh to uh to get
it done.
Uh, when I did the 19 miles, Ikind of didn't do it right Cause
, uh, uh, most runners told meto carb load the day before I
(41:33):
had fasted two days prior tothat run.
I was running on fumes thatwhole run.
I'm going to eat right the daybefore the other day.
I'm going to try to actuallycomplete it this time After that
(41:55):
.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
That would make sense .
Why you hit the wall at 19?
Because roughly around 18 milesin.
That's when all of yourglycogen stores are gone and
that's when you hit the wall ina marathon.
So that would make sense ifyou're fasted so credibly.
You made it that far past it.
That's awesome.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Yeah, know, right, I know, I know yeah, because
people's like did you uh?
Some people messaged me likedid you, uh, did you eat and you
know stuff like that.
I was like no, I was like Ifasted, I was on my two-day fast
and you know, when you fast,you wake up, you know, like a
day or two later you got allthis energy and stuff.
And you know I, you fast, youwake up, you know, like a day or
two later you got all thisenergy and stuff and you know, I
(42:31):
was running and stuff like thatand I was fine, but uh, yeah, I
had hit, hit that wall and uh,I couldn't go no more after that
I couldn't do it, but, uh, I'mgonna finish it, um, and then,
uh, I'm gonna do that, thatguness one-hour push-ups,
probably around September,october, and then I got one more
(42:55):
long pole run because I reallywant to go.
I think it's about 60 miles toone town that I want to go to,
but I want to have a uh, I'mtrying to get some shirts made
uh to or like uh, mental health,awareness and military and you
(43:17):
know, got you know uh,supporting all these different
uh types of of things that'sgoing on.
So it's going to be likeawareness run.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Let us know when you're doing that and we'll
definitely push it out in ourcommunity and our channels for
sure.
That's awesome Love to supportyou.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Okay, I appreciate that Really do.
Speaker 1 (43:39):
Yeah, well, we're going to go ahead and move
toward the exit of the door hereon the interview, but is there
anything else that I failed toask that you'd like to get out
there to everyone?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
No, no, you did good, man.
This is my first interview, soI didn't interview, so I don't.
Everything seemed nice to me,it was really nice being on your
podcast and I enjoyed talkingwith you and I appreciate the
support and everything that youthat you've done, so Well, I I
(44:13):
appreciate you spreading themessage, cause it's a very
important message.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
I think what you're doing is awesome, so I want to
continue to encourage you to bethat lighthouse and just share.
You know.
I think that's going to giveyou the strength, because
there's no doubt, like for allof us, there's going to be
continued challenges goingforward.
If there's anything that I cando for you or our community can
do for you, we'd definitely lovefor you to share your journey
with us.
I just appreciate you takingthe time to being here and
(44:42):
sharing, hopefully, your firstinterview, but one of many is
because I think what you'redoing is awesome and more people
need to know about it.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Okay, I appreciate that man.
It means a lot to me.
It really does.
Speaker 1 (44:55):
How can people get connected with you and support
you?
Speaker 2 (45:00):
Well, of course, my TikTok is the Pole Runner.
You can hit me up on there.
I do have a YouTube it's calledthe.
Hit me up on there.
I do have a a YouTube that'scalled the uh the log runner.
On YouTube, though, um, I putmore.
I put more other stuff onYouTube, cause, you know, uh,
tiktok is kind of sensitiveabout you know different things.
(45:21):
So, uh, there's more things onmy YouTube.
And then on Facebook, uh, youcan do hashtag uh the pole
runner or hashtag the log runner, and some of my reels will pop
up on there.
So those are my three outlets,pretty much media.
Speaker 1 (45:43):
We'll get those links .
We'll put them in the shownotes so, for anyone that wants
to connect with you, they canconnect with you in the show
notes.
So, michael, I with you in theshow notes.
So, michael, I appreciate youso much.
I'm eager to see you know we're, uh, how far you can take that
poll and just thank you so muchfor spending your time with us
today.
Speaker 2 (45:59):
I appreciate it, man.
Thanks again.
Speaker 1 (46:03):
All right out there in the Jordan Things Nation.
We appreciate you.
Keep doing hard things and wewill catch you in the next
episode.
Make sure you go to the shownotes and connect with Michael,
and we'll see you guys soon,peace.
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