Where To Return As A Prodigal Child

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Ever person working on recovery ultimately becomes a returning prodigal child. But what to do when you have no where to return to. 

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
It's time again for Doc Jock, your addiction
lifeguard podcast.
I am Dr.
Jock DeBerker, a psychologist,licensed professional counselor,
and addiction specialist.
If you are suffering fromaddiction, misery, trauma,
whatever it is, I'm here tohelp.
If you're in search of help totry to get your life back
together, join me here at DocJock, your addiction lifeguard,

(00:22):
the addiction recovery podcast.
I wanted to be real clear aboutwhat this podcast is intended
for.
It is intended for entertainmentand informational purposes but

(00:45):
not considered help.
If you actually need real helpand you're in need of help,
Please seek that out.
If you're in dire need of help,you can go to your nearest
emergency room or you can checkinto a rehab center or call a
counselor like me and talk aboutyour problems and work through
them.
But don't rely on a podcast tobe that form of help.

(01:06):
It's not.
It's just a podcast.
It's for entertainment andinformation only.
So let's keep it in that light.
All right.
Have a good time.
Learn something and then get thereal help that you need from a
professional.
Everybody's heard the story ofthe prodigal son.

(01:30):
I'm assuming you have.
The son that went to his fatherand said that he wanted his
inheritance so that he could goout and drink and sleep with
prostitutes.
And he did that and then cameback to his father after he'd
lost everything and told hisfather that he understood why he

(01:52):
was what he was doing was wrongand that he had learned didn't
expect his father to necessarilytake him back or do anything for
him but he just wanted to say iget it now and his father
celebrated him upon his returnand that's kind of a very
condensed version of the storyum but my my uh point of telling
you that is not to explain thestory of the prodigal son, but

(02:15):
it's to explore the idea of whathappens when you are a prodigal
son and you have no place toreturn to.
And there are many people whohave that as a problem.
And when the story is theprodigal son, but it could be
the prodigal daughter too.
It doesn't make any differenceif you're a son or a daughter
and you go out and begin a lifeof self-destruction but the idea

(02:40):
is that you have some place toreturn to and what happens when
you don't have a place to returnto where do you go what happens
and sometimes there are those ofus who don't have fathers to
return to because they've passedaway or they've disappeared we
don't know where they are or inother cases where they just flat
out reject us and seem to notcare or are disconnected in some

(03:03):
way.
And so the concept of theprodigal son returning and he
has nowhere to return to, orperhaps he doesn't have a
prodigal father to return to,but rather he has a prodigal
mother, right?
So the prodigal son returns tothe prodigal mother.
And it's interesting that thebiblical story was centered

(03:27):
around the idea of the prodigalfather And, you know, the
analogy there, it's the metaphorfor the relationship you have
with God, right?
And so God the Father.
And God is always beingportrayed as the father figure.
So that's the basis of thebiblical part of that story is

(03:47):
the prodigal father figure.
as a replication of God, therelationship of you with God.
But if you have a relationshipwith your parents and they
reject you when you return, whatdo you do?
Likewise, if you return and theprodigal parents are not

(04:11):
available to you, they'remissing, dead, or whatever,
where do you go?
So the place to go is always aquestion that comes up.
And sometimes in my working withclients, it's a difficult
question because the issues thata lot of people have is that the

(04:32):
relationship they have withtheir parent is one that is not
good.
And so returning is returning towhat?
I have clients whose parentswere abusive, and then when they
return...
The prodigal father doesn't actlike a prodigal father.
He acts like he did before.
And it's not a loving, caringrelationship.
It's one of continuation of thatabuse or neglect or whatever.

(04:56):
And it's kind of frustrating formy clients who deal with that as
I work with individuals thathave these problematic
relationships.
You know, the idea of going outand becoming a prodigal son or
prodigal daughter is one that'salways a story of destruction.
Loss, chaos, you know, drugs,alcohol will do that to you.

(05:22):
And it's a difficult thing toreturn saying, you know, I've
changed now.
It's part of like in the stepnine where you're going out and
trying to make amends.
Maybe you feel like as theperson who is the prodigal son
or daughter that you were doingthings that were incredibly
destructive and you feel guiltyand ashamed of it and you don't

(05:43):
want to return because you're soembarrassed or ashamed that you
don't want to return back to,quote unquote, the scene of the
crime, if you will.
And it's sad because you neverknow what relationship of
healing is like, because youdon't hear it.
I counsel people on both sidesof that.
And I myself has suffered bothsides of that as well, being the

(06:05):
prodigal son, as well as theprodigal father myself.
And it's a difficult situation,especially for men, because I
think the leadership qualitiesthat we would love to be able to
say that we have for alloccasions, sometimes it's beyond
us.
And being a And not having had areception that was a good

(06:28):
reception upon return, it'schallenging.
Well, let's just say it thatway.
And if you're in that positionwhere you have no relationship
with your father or your mother,or you have a very difficult
challenge, strained relationshipwith your father or your mother,
it can be a real challenge toaccept the fact that, you know,
this relationship has beenforever changed and damaged.

(06:52):
And I certainly felt that as aparent.
As a young man trying to make myreturn and it being rejected
over and over again and beingcast out, the damage that I did
early in my life came back tobecome the understanding of what
my parents believed of me.

(07:13):
And returning was too late inthe instance of my mother who
had passed away unbeknownst tome.
So there was no return there andthen being rejected by my own
father.
And so the answer that we wouldfind if you have faith and you
believe in God is that, well,then when you return, you have a

(07:34):
father.
Now, I heard this recently fromsomebody who I was working with
who said, you know, I don't havea father is what they said to
their mother.
And the answer that they gotfrom their mother was, well, you
have to pray because you have afather and you have to pray to
that father.
And it was interesting becausethe conversation was one that

(07:56):
was based on the idea that themother, who really wasn't being
a very good mother through thisperson's life for her son, and
the answer of well, you know,you have a father, you just have
to pray to him, was very empty.
And this is a person that I wastalking to who walked in faith,
right?
So he believed in God.

(08:17):
But it seemed to him that thiswas a kind of dismissal, if you
will, of his feelings around nothaving a father.
You know, you have a father.
No, well, I don't.
In the natural, here on earth, Idon't.
But the one of a relationshipwith a supernatural father, you

(08:42):
know, God, while he had faith,was one that seemed empty.
And it was fascinating to watchhim kind of noodle this through,
because at first I thought,well, you know what?
That is the answer that we givepeople.
You know, God loves you, andthat is the father figure that
you can lean on.
But your relationship in thenatural here is, on earth with

(09:04):
your father, if it's strainedand stressed and damaged or
abusive, you have a badrelationship with a father
figure.
And like the individual I wasworking with, that was his case,
and then his father died.
And there was no ability toconnect in a positive way to a
father figure.
So the mother saying, well, youdo have a father, you just have

(09:27):
to pray to him, was one thatreally, it kind of rang hollow
because Praying to a fatherfigure was not something that he
was going to probably do andbelieve it because he hadn't
worked through the issues thathe had with his father in a
therapeutic setting, right?
And that's where we began thework was around the idea of how

(09:47):
do we fix and restore myself andthe feelings and reconcile my
feelings and work through myfeelings of resentment or
contempt that I have for thisman who was abusive and then
died.
So, you know, you do have afather.
Of course, I believe that as aChristian.
I believe that.
But it's not one that youunderstand.

(10:07):
So the message I would give tosomeone who said, I don't have a
good relationship.
And so I feel like in myredemption, my rising from the
ashes as the phoenix did, is onethat just is not going to
include me being able toreconcile a relationship with a

(10:30):
father figure.
And that's kind of sad thatthat's where you're stuck
because I don't know that peoplereally can move past that once
they get there.
And so trying to figure out howdo you reconcile that
relationship.
Well, you know, I have workedwith individuals who have tried
different things to resolve theissues that they have with their

(10:51):
fathers.
Sometimes they're successful.
Sometimes they are not.
And much like my story, when Itried to do that, it really just
amounted to nothing.
It got nowhere.
And so I've been trying tofigure out how to reconcile that
relationship.
But the relationship that thatman, my father, had with, or has
had, whichever, he's stillalive, with his grandchildren...

(11:12):
that he knows of and those thathe's never met doesn't know
about is not there.
The relationship he had with hisdaughter was not there.
And so it's not like myexperience with him was a
reflection of just me.
But even with that, the evidenceof that being clearly there, it
did not change my viewpoint of adifficult relationship and an

(11:34):
understanding of a fatherfigure.
It took something more thanthat.
And the people that I work withwho have that struggle, they
need something more.
than just an acceptance of thefact that they did not have that
relationship with their father.
It took much more than that.
And the things that we'remissing in that relationship are
things that you can't get back.

(11:54):
Some of us have father figuresin our life, maybe an uncle or a
grandparent.
There might be a school teacher,a coach, next door neighbor,
somebody who is very fatherlytowards us.
As a father myself, I, you know,with children, being a father
for so long, it's like myinstinct is to kind of move into

(12:17):
that role.
But the strained relationshipsthat we have with our children,
depending on what's going onwith them, can make that
difficult and problematic too.
And I certainly have that in mylife.
So it's a challenge.
So as I'm working with somebodywho's trying to work through the
issues, the thing that being aprodigal son means that you were

(12:40):
destructive early in your life,right?
Or maybe it was at the midpointof your life, at some point in
your life.
Let's just say that.
And so you had this destructivebehavior, this destructive
streak, and you engaged in thesedestructive ways, damaging
things, opportunities, people,your future, your health,
whatever it is.

(13:00):
And you have redeemed yourselfin that way.
Like you've come out of that.
You've moved into recovery,right?
You're clean.
You're sober.
You're stable.
You're consistent.
And the signs of that are there.
You're employed.
You're going to college.
You're going to school.
You're finishing your highschool diploma.
You're working and you haveresponsibilities.

(13:21):
Maybe you got into arelationship.
Maybe you have childrenyourself.
so there are indications andsigns of this uh redemption this
change and those of us who havebeen able to do that it's a gift
right but to break the curse ofthe uh inability to transition
to a fully to a prodigal sonreturning to the father to the

(13:42):
family saying i understand iunderstand now what you were
trying to teach me and you havea place to come back to We have
to find that in other ways, andit may not be possible for your
family to do that becausethey're not there or they're
rejecting or whatever.

(14:04):
So the relationships that wehave in our lives, whether
you're a prodigal son or aprodigal daughter...
the value of establishingrelationships in your life that
can help you gain and get intothat place where you feel like
the connection to other people.
These people are the ones thatare important to you, and you

(14:25):
invest in that relationship, theones that are important to you.
I certainly have that with myfather-in-law.
It's quite interesting.
I'm not a small guy.
I'm not a huge guy, but, youknow, 6'2", 200 pounds.
I'm a fairly sizable guy.
And my father-in-law is biggerthan me physically.
And he's, you know, he's afather figure because he's a

(14:49):
father, right?
He's my wife's father.
And it's funny, we're notsignificantly different in age
because I got married later inlife.
But he has the ability to turnme into, instantaneously to turn
me into like a 12, 13, 14 yearold.
When he places his hand on myshoulder and he asks me, how you

(15:09):
doing boy?
And I'm like, oh, you know, it'sjust, I instantly turn into a 13
year old and it's every time.
And it's been going on for thelast 18 years.
He's been able to do that.
And that's because I look at himand I see, I see the father that
he is, right?
I can feel that presence.

(15:31):
That's the important part abouta prodigal father is the
presence of of that fatherpresence exuding.
It's radiating off of you.
And there are people like that.
Now, when I was younger, I hadpeople that would do that for
me.
They would see me and men andwomen who were mothers and

(15:52):
fathers would see me and theywere age appropriate to be a
mother or father.
And they would try to They wouldtry to reach me.
They would try to help me.
There were many people in mylife that tried to do that.
Unfortunately, because I wascoming from the family I came
from, much like many people thatI try to help in my practice, my

(16:13):
clients, they have a history ofabandonment, abuse, emotional
abuse, verbal abuse, whatever.
that has taught them to nottrust that type of an authority
figure.
And it drives our behaviors.
And with me, it certainly did.
And I run into this all thetime.
I'm sure some of you out therewho are listening feel the same

(16:33):
way, that there was a fatherfigure that tried to enter into
your life and did try to help.
And you perhaps absorbed some ofit.
They always left an impressionon me.
But ultimately, we tend to pushthem away because it's not my
father it's not my mother and sothat attitude of rejection and

(16:55):
in particular with people whohave addiction issues certainly
do that trust is a big issueright so trying to take on these
father figure roles that theydid in my life, I learned from
each one of them.
And it was interesting becauselater in life, when I got into a
different place and I wasgetting more stable, I

(17:17):
unfortunately could not reachout to any of these people
because they all passed, right?
They're so old that I They'regone, most of them.
And some of them, I haveabsolutely no way of finding
them because I didn't maybe payattention to even what their
last name was.
But it's funny.

(17:37):
I remember each one of themvividly.
Now, I hear this same kind ofstory from my clients who talk
about these kinds ofexperiences.
The men and women who walk inand they're in their 30s, 40s,
50s, sometimes 60s.
There's always a story of atleast one person who who was

(17:57):
trying to be fatherly towardsthem and they tended to reject
it.
I have had that happen to me asI have tried to extend myself
out to individuals in a fatherlytype way who are not clients and
I've had that rejected.
I do not see that as a negative.

(18:21):
I'm tending to soil to prepareit for growth.
That's kind of how I see it.
I'm not expecting to see thefull growth cycle of the plant
that is being, the seed that hasplanted.
I'm not expecting to see thefruit being born from that
growth.
I don't necessarily expect that.
And I know that when I'm sayingsomething or doing something, I

(18:43):
can see the reaction, but I cansee the rejection too.
That's fine.
But I know the seed was planted.
And that person carried thatseed.
And until it starts raining andthe sun is shining down on it,
warming the soil, which may takeyears before that happens,
you're not going to necessarilysee the results of it.

(19:03):
And I think and I would hopethat those individuals who have
tried to extend that out to mehave felt that same way.
But on the other end of it, theindividual who is receiving
that, you know, being able totake that on as an individual
who's living in chaos, living inthat chaotic existence of

(19:25):
destruction and coming out ofit, um if you have people around
you they could be friends theycould be a spouse it could be
your own children let themrejoice in that change right so
taking it on much like when theprodigal son returns to his
family and he sees his fatherthe words from his father are

(19:50):
with arms open i've been waitingfor you welcome i'm glad you're
back even though you've been outto being destructive.
You know, if your wife, ifyou're going to rehab, for
example, and you're the prodigalson to your wife, you know, and
you come back and you say, youknow, I've gone to rehab, I've

(20:11):
worked on this.
You must be able to receive thegifting that that recovery gives
you.
Right.
So you have to embrace thatperson when they say, I'm proud
of you or I'm glad that you didthis.
I'm glad you're back.
I'm glad that I have thedifferent, better version of you
that I wanted.

(20:32):
Some people.
They experience a loss, and it'scatastrophic in that loss.
They lost their spouse.
They lost their parents.
They lost siblings.
They've been cut off.
Maybe it's irreparable.
You can't repair it.
It's okay.
And as we say, when we'reextending forgiveness and we're

(20:52):
receiving it, you must forgive.
Scripturally, we are mandated toforgive.
Right?
But there's nothing that saysthat you have to reconcile...
with a person, you know, ifpossible, yes.
But it's not a commandment.

(21:13):
It's not mandatory.
Maybe that damage is just somuch that you wish them well and
you forgive them and you letthat anger go, but you can't
have that relationship.
Maybe there are people like thatin your life, and that's okay.
But the prodigal needs to havesome people that will rejoice in
their salvation and theirredemption.
And so finding that way torejoice in that is a challenge,

(21:37):
but not impossible but you as asa prodigal son or daughter you
must know how to receive it andmany people have that challenge
they don't know how to receiveit your ability to forgive self
in these destructive ways isjust as important as the other
person being able to forgive youand so as a prodigal when you

(21:59):
return it's important themessage is as follows i want you
to know i have learned that thisdestruction I engaged in was
wrong.
I want you to know I've learned.
You know, you may not accept meinto your life again, but I
think it's important that youunderstand I learned.

(22:19):
And many times that message ishard to give.
It's hard to say it.
It's just, it's very difficultto say it.
But when you do, the result thatyou get many times unexpectedly
is an unconditional acceptance,right?
It's I was waiting for this.
That's what you would hear fromthat sometimes.

(22:41):
Not every time, but many times.
It's like, I've been waiting forthis.
You know, we all love anunderdog, right?
We all, the person that's justreally, there's so many movies
about the underdog, the personthat was down and out and they
struggled and they overcame.
I'm reminded of the HillbillyElegy movie.

(23:04):
the J.D.
Vance thing.
I mean, that's what that was,like mom and grandma and J.D.
Vance.
It's a story of redemption andthe sad and tragic, horrible
story that can ensue with allthe damage.
So being able to have thathappen, but as a prodigal, being
able to receive it is reallywhat it's all about.

(23:27):
So whether you have a distantand challenging experience with
a father figure or a motherfigure and you had to move away
from that just you know I havein both my mother and father
just tragic horrible treatmentand both my sister and I but
then being able to come out andkind of rebound from that but it

(23:49):
does affect you and where isdamage is caused by it and our
own destruction but when youreturn and you say I understand
now like I'm a changed man or achanged woman that's an
important part And hopefullyyou'll be able to find the
strength to be able to do thatand to say that and to live that

(24:10):
existence as a prodigal son or aprodigal daughter.
And if you have no family tocome back to, believe me, there
are people in your life who arewaiting for the prodigal to
return.
It may not be your parents.
It may be somebody else.
But there is always somebody whowill be there and say, wow, it's

(24:36):
amazing how much you'veovercome.
I'm astounded.
I'm proud of you.
um you will always have thatafter you've kind of done that
con that thing of returning as aprodigal then maybe you can work
on your relationship if you havefaith with your relationship
with god and you can becomeaccepting of that and knowing

(25:00):
that the father figure thechallenge of the father figure
can be overcome as well andfinding that love and acceptance
Because anytime anybody getsinto recovery is a good time.
And it's something to be proudof and to have as a sign of
honor.

(25:21):
Well, that was a quick episodefor me.
I hope you've enjoyed thisepisode of Doc Shock, Your
Addiction Lifeguard.
I certainly have enjoyed havingthe time to be able to talk to
you about these things.
If you have suggestions or youwant to be on the show and you
want to tell your story, pleasereach out to me.

(25:42):
I'd love to hear your story.
And remember, if you arestruggling with addiction,
please go get help.
It's not worth ending your lifeto save your addiction.
That's crazy.
It's not how many times you falldown.
It's how many times you get backup.
And you get back up one moretime, and it's life.
You're going to be living.
So please go out and get help.

(26:04):
And until the next episode, thisis Dr.
Jacques DeBruker, Doc Jacques,saying thanks for listening, and
I'll catch you next time.
See you.