October 29, 2025 • 31 mins
Why it is so important to have structure around you while you work your recovery.
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
I'm again for Dr.
Addiction Life Guard podcast.
I am Dr.
Doctor Burger Psychologist,License Professional California
Addiction Special.
You are suffering fromaddiction, injury, trauma,
whatever it is.
I'm here to help.
You're in search of help.
Try to get your life backtogether.
Join me here at Dr.
(00:21):
Addiction Life Guard, theAddiction Recovery Podcast.
I wanted to be real clear aboutwhat this podcast is intended
for.
It is intended for entertainmentand informational purposes, but
not considered help.
If you actually need real helpand you're in need of help,
(00:42):
please seek that out.
If you're in dire need of help,you can go to your nearest
emergency room or you can checkinto a rehab center or call a
counselor like me and talk aboutyour problems and work through
them.
But don't rely on a podcast tobe that form of help.
It's not.
It's just a podcast.
It's for entertainment andinformation only.
(01:03):
So let's keep it in that light,alright?
Have a good time, learnsomething, and then get the real
help that you need from aprofessional.
Hey everybody, it's me, DocShock, again.
I wanted to have a little talkwith you about something that uh
(01:29):
comes up really regularly for mein my practice with my clients,
but um it's it's the avenue ofhow in the world do you put
structure around recovery,especially if you um have never
been to rehab, or if you havebeen to rehab, what and you're
getting out, uh see you're in alot of structure when you're in
(01:49):
rehab.
That's the whole point of it,right?
Uh structure and function.
So what do you do when you getout into the wild amongst the
citizens, you know, thecivilians?
What do you do?
Where's the structure?
And and uh if we if we go alongwith the idea that isolation is
addiction's best friend, uhyou're just gonna start
(02:11):
isolating again.
I see it all the time.
All the time.
Clients get out of rehab, ormaybe they never went, but
they're out there on the streetswhere they can actually use.
And guess what happens?
They start using pretty quickly.
Um, so what's the structure?
Well, the structure is isgroups.
Um, smart recovery, AA, NA, uh,OA, SA, any of the A's, and or
(02:36):
anything else that's like theA's.
Um, any other, you know, non-Agroup, it's a structured
formatted group.
So what do they do in the 12steps?
The 12 steps, right?
That's the whole point of it.
It's not just about sitting in aroom and talking to people, um,
and that's certainly a big partof it, but it's the steps.
(02:58):
And so there's a commonmisconception about what the
steps are.
And I'm not going to go overeach step.
I you can listen to my otherpodcast about that.
I don't want to specificallytalk about individual steps.
I just want to talk about thestep props process, the whole
step process.
That's what I wanted to talkabout.
So what is it?
You know, if you if you've neverbeen to a meeting, and believe
(03:18):
it or not, I run into addictsall the time who have never been
to a meeting.
Uh, some of them won't evenconsider it because they think
it's like too religious or it'sjust AA.
But that's really not what thesteps are.
That's not what the steps are.
The steps you can you can readabout the steps.
Um, Russell Brand had a greatbook called Recovery, where each
(03:39):
chapter is a step.
And he talks about the work thatyou do in the steps, and he
talks about his work in thesteps.
And a lot of times the work inthe steps was not done with
another person, uh, it was doneoutside of that relationship,
the other person being asponsor.
And so that's the structure,right?
You go to meetings, you becomeaccountable because you're in
(04:00):
the meeting.
And if you are doing it theright way, you're talking in the
meetings.
And when you're talking in themeetings, you're now developing
relationships.
The other thing that's veryimportant in uh meetings is
finding a sponsor.
So now we're we're gettingcloser and closer and closer to
that confines of structure.
(04:23):
So um sometimes, you know, Imean, the the steps were written
a long time ago, back in the30s.
Um, so they would a lot ofpeople see them as like they're
outdated, or it's it's not evenreally that important.
It's like an option.
And you know, for for me, it'snot an option.
You you must do it.
And they're not outdated.
(04:45):
Moral functioning andaccountability and the action
behind those ideas is neveroutdated.
You know, I mean, for goshsakes, people are reading Marcus
Aurelius from the Roman Empire,and they're finding it very
relevant today.
So is it outdated?
No.
In reality, they're apsychological and spiritual
(05:06):
roadmap for healing, not justabstinence.
It's it's the spiritual roadmap.
And it's the thing that allowsyou through psychology and
spirituality to gain thefoothold and change.
But if you compare what happensin sobriety versus what happens
in abstinence, you know, youcompare white knuckling it uh in
(05:28):
sobriety, that's not sobriety,that's abstinence versus
transformational recoverythrough the step work, because
that's really what this is.
You're transforming yourself,you're transforming who you
think you are and what you thinkis going on.
So when you're doing your stepwork, you have to be honest, you
(05:48):
have to be open, you have to bevulnerable, you have to be uh
allowing someone to bear witnessto what you're doing.
That's why we use sponsors and agood sponsor.
And if you're listening to thisand you are a sponsor, you must
work the steps.
And that must be the priority inthat work with the person that
you're meeting with who's asponsee.
You must work the steps, and youmust have a structured way of
(06:13):
doing that.
Um the the people who publish uhall the material for AA amongst
all those publications is aworkbook for doing step work.
And you can get others that arenot part of that um that
publication, the people who havehave written all kinds of
(06:33):
material about working thesteps.
But you know what?
Don't do the step work just byreading it and going, oh, this
is step one.
My life has become unmanageable.
Okay, let me think about that.
No, no, no, no.
Do it like you would if you weregoing to school, taking a class.
Like get that workbook out andstart working on it.
Um, but one of the things that'sin uh the workbook that I really
(06:53):
like is the vocabulary we use.
And there's a great um sectionof all the words that you could
apply for the things that youare, you know, liar, thief,
manipulator, abuser, um, youknow, all the negative stuff.
And then right next to it is theopposite positive.
And when you're trying to figureout just who you are, how bad
(07:15):
it's gotten, you can take a lookat this.
Two full pages with um it's fourcolumns, so it's two, you know,
one negative and one positive,but it's it's four, it's four
columns of two entire pages in abook of all the negative and
positive words.
Can't miss them when you'redoing that.
(07:35):
But understand it's the stepsaren't about perfection.
You're not gonna get to be, youknow, some exalted perfect form
of your own being.
It's about progression.
They you're taking the brokenpieces and you're putting them
back in order.
Now, sometimes the things thatyou've done um really are bad,
(07:57):
and you know, it's harder to getthrough that.
But the steps are not aboutbecoming a perfect person at the
end of it, it's really abouthaving the structure to be able
to do it because you've got todo that psychological and
spiritual work.
So, what why is it important tohave that kind of structure
around you?
Addiction thrives in chaos.
You've heard me say that many,many times.
(08:19):
Recovery thrives in structureand accountability.
If you answer to no one, anotherperson, to yourself, to God, to
nothing.
You answer to no one, you're notgonna get very far in recovery.
So the steps give a directionwhen emotions are foggy and
distorted and you're feelingreally horrible about things.
(08:40):
The steps give you that focus,they give you that direction to
follow as you're working throughit.
That's and they're in sequentialorder.
And the order is a good one, Ithink, actually.
Um, if I were to write them, Idon't think I would have changed
the order of them.
But without that structure,relapse skyrockets because
there's no grounding, there'snothing there.
(09:03):
Um, the most difficult time Ihave with clients that come into
my office are the ones that areum complete atheists, and it's
like, wow, you don't you youdon't have any higher calling
kind of accountability, and it'sreally tough.
Um, the best that I can do withthose clients is start to make
(09:25):
them accountable.
So they uh unfortunately I haveto make them answer to me, which
is not the most comfortableposition to be in, um, because
there's a there's a line you'regetting close to as a therapist
that you you know you're you'reuh it's an authority that you
don't want to exercise in a cloover a client, but they they
respond to nothing and nobody.
There's no accountability.
(09:46):
But without that without thestructure, they're not gonna get
very far.
So it to help you get back intofocus and and and follow that
direction, you really have tohave something to hang on to.
So the 12 steps are important.
Um, so the steps are kind oflike a a rescue protocol, you
know.
(10:06):
When you're when when I wouldroll up on a scene and I I've
got to do a rescue, it doesn'tmatter if it's a water rescue or
a first aid rescue or whatever,you're doing assessing, and then
maybe you're deciding whetheryou need to just, you know, if
you could just reach out tothem, so you just reach to them,
or you are going further whereyou're actually getting out into
(10:27):
the water, swimming out to them,but uh reach and then pull them
towards you, and then give themsupport, and then get them out
of the water.
If you skip one of those steps,someone's gonna drown.
And so it's not a good idea toskip those steps.
Now, the the problem about thestep work is that the emotional
(10:53):
honesty and the accountabilityis something that really, really
is important.
So the first three steps areabout like your life is a mess
and you can't do this byyourself.
That's the whole focus of thatfirst three steps.
Um steps four through nine,that's kind of where the work
is, if you will.
(11:13):
Um, because the first threesteps are about surrendering,
right?
So I surrender.
Now what?
Okay, now I gotta do the work.
So the whole focus is on takingmoral inventory, admitting the
wrongs, making amends, you know,so it's about self-reflection
and understanding, but it's alsoabout re-engaging in morality.
(11:36):
Um, you know, we we as people,we have our own moral compass in
our hand, and we have to decidewhere does our morality come
from.
And what what I found is withclients uh working on recovery
is that they've lost their way,but it's not immediate.
You don't go from you know zeroto a thousand miles an hour in a
(12:00):
second, it takes a while to getthere.
And so there's a buildup ofwrongdoing.
This bad decision led to thisbad decision, which led to this
bad decision, and they kind ofexponentially grow.
And you know, when we're workingon uh getting into recovery,
realizing that you've lost a lotof things in the in the process
(12:24):
of getting there, you've lost inyour addiction, you've lost a
lot of things.
Maybe you lost a relationshipwith a loved one.
Um, you become estranged, maybeyou self self-eliminated from a
relationship, or you just blewit up.
Um, committing crimes is apretty regular part of it.
And if you certainly if you're adrug addict, you most likely
(12:45):
have engaged in criminalactivity.
And sometimes that becomes uh anoccasional thing, and sometimes
it's a daily thing.
Um if you're an alcoholic, youknow, there's a lot of social
destruction that seems to go on.
There's also a lot of money lossgoing on, no matter what the
addiction.
So you might have lost somethings, because that's pretty
much how you move into recovery,is you've lost the one thing you
(13:07):
didn't want to lose.
So the admitting those wrongsand making amends, that's the
the last step, step nine in thein the four through nine.
Making amends is trying tofigure out how to um mend the
fences either with the person orif you can't do it with them
because they refuse or whatever,then within yourself.
(13:28):
So it's an emotional detox, it'scleaning out the resentment and
the shame and the denial thatgoes on in the process of of
spiraling down further andfurther and further into
addiction.
So the accountability is reallyimportant, but the cleansing of
the resentment, the shame, thedenial, I kind of look at it as
(13:48):
like if you had a really badinfection, you had a cut on your
arm or your leg or something,and it got really infected, it's
not gonna heal until you get ridof the infection.
So I look at the damage that'sgoing on in your life, that's
what you need to cleanse.
That's what you need to cleanout, and that's the resentment,
(14:10):
shame, denial, manipulation,destruction.
You know, you gotta clean thatout before you can heal.
Um so the accountability helpsyou with something, it helps
build humility which dismantlesthe ego-driven thinking that
goes on in your addiction.
Now remember, I've said in thesepodcasts over and over and over
(14:34):
again um ca you know, chaos andand destruction happens.
So the only way you can defendthat in this distorted mind that
you have is to use your ego, touse your arrogance.
You you it's like a weapon, youweaponized arrogance.
(14:54):
Um, so the the the ego-driventhinking is a problem, and you
need to engage in the moemotional.
When I'm sitting here in my inmy uh practice and I'm talking
to somebody, there's a lot ofthere's a lot of sadness,
there's a lot of tears, there'sa lot of resentment that uh self
self-resentment for actionstaken, things happening.
(15:16):
There's a lot of that that goeson.
So the humility de uh dismantlesthe ego-driven thinking.
Um if you speak the words, theylose their power, the bad
things.
So um it's really interestingwhen people commit crimes and
they're being questioned, uh,interrogated by the police and
(15:39):
questioned, the police arehoping that the person after a
while will get to the pointwhere they just are tired of of
lying.
Now, if if you're a psychopathor a really severe sociopath,
you're probably not going to dothis.
But the normal person, theperson without those personality
defects and disorders, they'regonna say it, and they're gonna
(16:00):
say it, they're gonna say it,they're gonna keep feeling it
every time they say it, andeventually they're gonna just
say, Okay, yeah, I didn't meanto kill her, or I didn't mean to
burn the house down, or I didn'tmean to.
And that's what happens withinterrogation many times, and
that's a technique that policeuse, to um, they're they're
playing on the person'semotional responses to things
and and get them out of the ego,the arrogance, um, and into that
(16:23):
that shame that you feel withhumility uh at what you've done.
So you can't heal what yourefuse to feel, and you can't
feel what you refuse to face.
If you speak the words that youdread, many times they will lose
a bit their their power.
(16:44):
So let it you know, let it rip.
So you've worked for a longtime, perhaps, hopefully, in the
step process.
And and by the way, uh just toframe this, I should have
probably said this in thebeginning.
Uh for me, uh I really like tosee somebody spend six to twelve
(17:04):
months working the steps.
I mean, preferably um a month,but I know for a lot of sponsors
that's an an extremely longtime.
But to really work the steps,now in that process, you know,
you can you can be abstainingfrom drugs and alcohol, and you
can be, you know, further alongin your recovery than three
months in saying I have to turnmyself over to a higher power.
(17:27):
Yeah, I understand that.
But the step process is oneabout function and understanding
and learning, right?
So you're it's an intellectualpursuit as well as an emotional
pursuit.
It's not just emotional.
Um, so I you know, I I I wantsomebody to spend a significant
amount of time doing it.
When you go to rehab, they'regonna work the steps, and you're
(17:49):
there for 30 or 45 or 60 or 90or 120 days.
You know, the longer you're inthere, the more work you're
gonna do on the steps.
But you know, I've many peoplecome out of uh residential
treatment in rehab and they'llsay, Well, I worked the steps in
rehab.
It's like, okay, well, we'regonna we're gonna really work
the steps this time.
Well, what do you mean?
(18:10):
Well, that was for 30 days.
Now I know you were in thereseven days a week, 168 hours a
week, but you're out here in thereal world.
So this is where you know, youryour forced structure is now
gone.
So we need to really work thesteps.
And I like it when I see peoplewho are sponsors, you know,
(18:31):
really emphasize that.
And it's even more important ifyou never went to residential
treatment, because the onlystructure you're probably
experiencing in at this time inyour uh in your life in that
recovery, is in the rooms andwith that sponsor.
So it's really important then.
So connection and community ispart of the step work too.
(18:55):
So step 10 through 12 um isabout you know that ongoing
reflection and then contributingto the recovery of other people,
that service part.
Now, not to be confused withwhen you go to, let's say you go
to AA, you walk in, and somebodysays, hey, you know, you should
(19:17):
get a service job.
Okay, a service job is settingup the chairs or you know,
starting the coffee or orgetting books out or or
something, right?
Or cleaning up the chairs or youknow, making sure the room's
clean.
That's not what I mean byservice um uh when it comes to
the 12 steps.
What I mean by service is youbecoming a sponsor.
(19:39):
And I'm gonna talk about that ina minute because that's that's
the last step.
But step 10 through 12,fostering that ongoing
reflection and service as partof your recovery.
So the emphasis um the with withthis is really in the connection
that keeps recovery alive.
What is a life uh is um sorry,let me try that again.
(20:01):
Isolation is addiction's bestfriend.
That's my trademarked uhcopyrighted phrase.
Isolation is addiction's bestfriend.
Isolation kills the connectionwith other people because we
like to use and we like to use alot, and people generally don't
want to be around us when we'reusing a lot because we cause
(20:23):
problems.
So we just learn to kind ofisolate and we're full of shame
and embarrassment, and so we arenot going to do it in front of
people.
In addition to that, besides theshame and embarrassment, you
also want to get trapped in yourbrain, you want to keep working
on that problem that's you'retrying to cope with.
You want to contain it, and soyou don't want people asking you
(20:46):
any questions or talking to youin that in that moment.
So that's when we isolate.
So you recover by giving awaywhat is freely given to you, and
this is part of that connectionand community.
So, in that last step, going outand spreading the good news, um
(21:06):
you know, recovery can befurther enhanced, and many
people take it on almost as asecond career, it's like become
their mission that they want toum they want to do they want to
contribute to helping people,they see in other people the
suffering that they have doneand they don't like it, and they
(21:28):
want to help somebody overcomethat.
There is a cost for that becauseif the person is not successful
at getting into recovery, ormaybe they overdose, they go to
prison, uh, ultimately thedestruction that you were trying
to help them get through andaway from, they get overcome by
it and they lose.
(21:49):
And I can tell you from personalexperience with client after
client, uh, you know, every yearthere's a client that either
ends up in jail, ends up inprison, ends up with some
physical problem that doesn't goaway, or they die.
And the secondary thing for methat's problematic is
estrangement from relatives ordivorce.
(22:11):
Um, those also are very, veryharmful and very long-lasting
traumas.
So i if you're trying to helpsomebody overcome, and that's
you've taken that on as a duty,it can be uh a painful process
sometimes.
But on the other hand, when theyget into recovery, extremely
rewarding.
So the tie in spiritual growthum and and emotional growth and
(22:37):
and psychological growth um isis when you do service to
others.
If you can, not everybody is iskind of wired for that, they
don't have the the the brain forthat, but serving others is part
of your self-healing.
So let's talk about the 12-stepprocess and therapeutic models.
(23:03):
Okay, the 12-steps are nottherapy.
Uh uh sponsors are nottherapists, nor should you
pretend to be, nor should youtry to be.
Um, you are not.
Unless you've been clinicallytrained, uh, you're not really
equipped for it, and it's reallynot even something you should be
(23:25):
doing, because you may be doingmore harm than good because you
have world real worldexperience, but you don't really
understand the clinical aspectof it, and what are you seeing?
So it can become very, veryproblematic and and can be
dangerous at times because youmight you might miss something
or screw something up.
So there's a there's adistinction between uh therapist
(23:46):
and a sponsor.
So let me let me compare 12steps and therapeutic models,
okay?
Cognitive behavioral therapy,CBT, is a style of therapy um
that is uh typically it's alittle more short term, uh, six,
(24:06):
eight, ten sessions typically,um cognitive behavioral therapy.
So what you're thinking and howyou're behaving, and you're
working to put those together.
So you're restructuringdistorted thinking, and that's
the whole purpose of cognitivebehavioral therapy, which it's
kind of goes very similarly withuh dialectic behavioral therapy,
(24:27):
DBT.
Um, that's more about yourself-talk rather than your
actual behaviors uh or thinking,but it's more about talking.
But anyway, so CBT isrestructuring distorted
thinking.
Well, that's kind of like stepsfour and ten, isn't it?
Um and if you don't know thesteps well enough to know those,
um let's just I'm gonna give youthe assignment of you need to
(24:51):
look at them so you can see whatI'm talking about.
Now, there's another form oftherapy, EMDR or trauma work,
um, where you're desensitizingtriggers and and guilt, the
responses of guilt.
And when you're when you're uhdesensitizing those, EMDR, eye
movement, desensitization andreprocessing, and then trauma
(25:14):
work, which is um just you knowworking specifically on trauma
and the somatic response, thebody response to trauma, you're
desensitizing your uh trigger,your guilt.
You're desensitizing yourself sothat you're reprocessing
something.
That's like steps five andeight.
Um mindfulness, train uhmindfulness therapy is like step
(25:37):
11.
The conscious contact,meditation, humility, being
aware of self and others, andtrying to be very, very focused
in on that is the mindfulnessthing.
Now, if you are not apsychologist or a counselor, um
(25:58):
you you really should not beteaching mindfulness because
it's an actual uh type oftherapy.
So I'm against the armchairtherapists who try to take the
stuff on.
But the steps really the stepsmerge science and spirituality
(26:18):
for whole person healing.
Okay, so you you got thespiritual aspect in the
beginning, like a higher power.
Can't do this by myself.
That's at the very at the verybeginning.
That's that's one through three.
Four through ten four through uhnine is more about understanding
uh yourself.
So it's turning it's in insteadof looking at the world saying
(26:41):
there's chaos in my world, and Ican't do this by myself.
So you're external, you'relooking externally, that's one
through three.
Four through nine is lookinginternally and looking at self
and evaluating self.
And then uh 10, 11, and 12 isabout the mindfulness part of it
and going out and engaging in uhothers and and and helping
(27:04):
others.
So um there's there's a lot ofthings that you can do in
recovery to get into recovery,and certainly recovery is not a
cookie-cutter thing, it's justwhatever your recovery looks
like, but it's not aboutchecking boxes, all right.
So doing the steps isn't like,oh, I did step one and I did
(27:27):
step two.
You know, it's not checkingboxes, it's about transforming
through a process and engagingin the process.
If you skip the steps, you'regonna probably skip a lot of the
healing.
Because you know, as atherapist, I'm a private
practice therapist.
I see people in my office, Imight see them once a week,
(27:49):
sometimes twice.
Uh uh at times I've seen peoplethree times a week, but that
doesn't usually last long term.
That's one hour.
If it's once a week, that's onehour.
You're in my office, you'rereally feeling it, you're really
engaging in it.
Well, you got 167 hours to getthrough before you come back to
my office.
So that's why it's important tohave structure around you in
(28:11):
recovery every day, every singleday.
If you're that first year, man,every day you're engaging in
recovery.
But if you skip the steps,you're gonna skip the healing.
So I really want you to find asponsor and a group and start
wherever they are, okay?
Wherever that is, you can dothat.
(28:32):
And I know, you know, across theworld, thanks to COVID, the one
positive thing that came out ofCOVID is the awareness that,
hey, we are a community and weare everywhere.
And so meetings are online.
No matter what the language, nomatter the location, if you have
access to the internet, you cango to meetings if you can't get
(28:54):
to them in person.
So if you're listening to thisin some other country, man, be a
be a uh 12-step AANA tourist.
I really encourage people to dothat.
For us in the United States, Iregularly have my clients tune
in to um or law, you know, tryto get into or log on to uh AA
meetings or NA meetings inEngland, in the Netherlands, if
(29:18):
they can find oneEnglish-speaking, um, New
Zealand, Australia, um, anywherethere's, you know, the United
States, Canada, any place thatthere's an English-speaking
meeting and you speak English,go do it.
See what you see.
Learn some things.
But just you gotta find asponsor.
So you gotta be accountable.
You gotta have structure.
You're never gonna get thereotherwise.
(29:40):
So please.
Um don't try to to if you'restruggling, reach out.
Don't try to rescue yourself.
You can't.
Um I'm a li I was a lifeguardfor a long time.
If I'm if I'm in need of likeassistance and I'm in the water
drowning, I'm looking for thatlifeguard to come and get me.
Uh I'm not gonna try to savemyself.
(30:02):
Uh if I can't, you know, it'snot possible.
So I'm gonna rely on otherpeople.
And so if you are a clinician ora practitioner of of clinical
services with somebody, man, Iand I get them all the time.
Um you you need some help, butyou gotta surrender to the
process.
Alright.
This is Doc Shock, hoping thatyou liked this podcast.
(30:26):
If you did, please like andsubscribe.
And if you want to reach out tome, you can.
You can reach me through mywebsite, wellspringmindbody.com,
send me an email, you can callme, leave me a message, and let
me know what's going on withyou.
But hey, first and foremost, ifyou need help, get me a rehab,
go see a doctor, go tocounseling, seek out some help
(30:49):
for your problems before theyovercome you and kill you.
There's no point in you losingyour life just because you're
trying to save your addiction.
Save yourself.
So I hope you enjoyed thispodcast.
And until the next podcast, thisis Doc Shock, your addiction
lifeguard, saying, See ya.
I'm again for Dr.
Addiction Life Guard podcast.
I am Dr.
Doctor Burger Psychologist,License Professional California
Addiction Special.
You are suffering fromaddiction, injury, trauma,
whatever it is.
I'm here to help.
You're in search of help.
Try to get your life backtogether.
Join me here at Dr.
(00:21):
Addiction Life Guard, theAddiction Recovery Podcast.
I wanted to be real clear aboutwhat this podcast is intended
for.
It is intended for entertainmentand informational purposes, but
not considered help.
If you actually need real helpand you're in need of help,
(00:42):
please seek that out.
If you're in dire need of help,you can go to your nearest
emergency room or you can checkinto a rehab center or call a
counselor like me and talk aboutyour problems and work through
them.
But don't rely on a podcast tobe that form of help.
It's not.
It's just a podcast.
It's for entertainment andinformation only.
(01:03):
So let's keep it in that light,alright?
Have a good time, learnsomething, and then get the real
help that you need from aprofessional.
Hey everybody, it's me, DocShock, again.
I wanted to have a little talkwith you about something that uh
(01:29):
comes up really regularly for mein my practice with my clients,
but um it's it's the avenue ofhow in the world do you put
structure around recovery,especially if you um have never
been to rehab, or if you havebeen to rehab, what and you're
getting out, uh see you're in alot of structure when you're in
(01:49):
rehab.
That's the whole point of it,right?
Uh structure and function.
So what do you do when you getout into the wild amongst the
citizens, you know, thecivilians?
What do you do?
Where's the structure?
And and uh if we if we go alongwith the idea that isolation is
addiction's best friend, uhyou're just gonna start
(02:11):
isolating again.
I see it all the time.
All the time.
Clients get out of rehab, ormaybe they never went, but
they're out there on the streetswhere they can actually use.
And guess what happens?
They start using pretty quickly.
Um, so what's the structure?
Well, the structure is isgroups.
Um, smart recovery, AA, NA, uh,OA, SA, any of the A's, and or
(02:36):
anything else that's like theA's.
Um, any other, you know, non-Agroup, it's a structured
formatted group.
So what do they do in the 12steps?
The 12 steps, right?
That's the whole point of it.
It's not just about sitting in aroom and talking to people, um,
and that's certainly a big partof it, but it's the steps.
(02:58):
And so there's a commonmisconception about what the
steps are.
And I'm not going to go overeach step.
I you can listen to my otherpodcast about that.
I don't want to specificallytalk about individual steps.
I just want to talk about thestep props process, the whole
step process.
That's what I wanted to talkabout.
So what is it?
You know, if you if you've neverbeen to a meeting, and believe
(03:18):
it or not, I run into addictsall the time who have never been
to a meeting.
Uh, some of them won't evenconsider it because they think
it's like too religious or it'sjust AA.
But that's really not what thesteps are.
That's not what the steps are.
The steps you can you can readabout the steps.
Um, Russell Brand had a greatbook called Recovery, where each
(03:39):
chapter is a step.
And he talks about the work thatyou do in the steps, and he
talks about his work in thesteps.
And a lot of times the work inthe steps was not done with
another person, uh, it was doneoutside of that relationship,
the other person being asponsor.
And so that's the structure,right?
You go to meetings, you becomeaccountable because you're in
(04:00):
the meeting.
And if you are doing it theright way, you're talking in the
meetings.
And when you're talking in themeetings, you're now developing
relationships.
The other thing that's veryimportant in uh meetings is
finding a sponsor.
So now we're we're gettingcloser and closer and closer to
that confines of structure.
(04:23):
So um sometimes, you know, Imean, the the steps were written
a long time ago, back in the30s.
Um, so they would a lot ofpeople see them as like they're
outdated, or it's it's not evenreally that important.
It's like an option.
And you know, for for me, it'snot an option.
You you must do it.
And they're not outdated.
(04:45):
Moral functioning andaccountability and the action
behind those ideas is neveroutdated.
You know, I mean, for goshsakes, people are reading Marcus
Aurelius from the Roman Empire,and they're finding it very
relevant today.
So is it outdated?
No.
In reality, they're apsychological and spiritual
(05:06):
roadmap for healing, not justabstinence.
It's it's the spiritual roadmap.
And it's the thing that allowsyou through psychology and
spirituality to gain thefoothold and change.
But if you compare what happensin sobriety versus what happens
in abstinence, you know, youcompare white knuckling it uh in
(05:28):
sobriety, that's not sobriety,that's abstinence versus
transformational recoverythrough the step work, because
that's really what this is.
You're transforming yourself,you're transforming who you
think you are and what you thinkis going on.
So when you're doing your stepwork, you have to be honest, you
(05:48):
have to be open, you have to bevulnerable, you have to be uh
allowing someone to bear witnessto what you're doing.
That's why we use sponsors and agood sponsor.
And if you're listening to thisand you are a sponsor, you must
work the steps.
And that must be the priority inthat work with the person that
you're meeting with who's asponsee.
You must work the steps, and youmust have a structured way of
(06:13):
doing that.
Um the the people who publish uhall the material for AA amongst
all those publications is aworkbook for doing step work.
And you can get others that arenot part of that um that
publication, the people who havehave written all kinds of
(06:33):
material about working thesteps.
But you know what?
Don't do the step work just byreading it and going, oh, this
is step one.
My life has become unmanageable.
Okay, let me think about that.
No, no, no, no.
Do it like you would if you weregoing to school, taking a class.
Like get that workbook out andstart working on it.
Um, but one of the things that'sin uh the workbook that I really
(06:53):
like is the vocabulary we use.
And there's a great um sectionof all the words that you could
apply for the things that youare, you know, liar, thief,
manipulator, abuser, um, youknow, all the negative stuff.
And then right next to it is theopposite positive.
And when you're trying to figureout just who you are, how bad
(07:15):
it's gotten, you can take a lookat this.
Two full pages with um it's fourcolumns, so it's two, you know,
one negative and one positive,but it's it's four, it's four
columns of two entire pages in abook of all the negative and
positive words.
Can't miss them when you'redoing that.
(07:35):
But understand it's the stepsaren't about perfection.
You're not gonna get to be, youknow, some exalted perfect form
of your own being.
It's about progression.
They you're taking the brokenpieces and you're putting them
back in order.
Now, sometimes the things thatyou've done um really are bad,
(07:57):
and you know, it's harder to getthrough that.
But the steps are not aboutbecoming a perfect person at the
end of it, it's really abouthaving the structure to be able
to do it because you've got todo that psychological and
spiritual work.
So, what why is it important tohave that kind of structure
around you?
Addiction thrives in chaos.
You've heard me say that many,many times.
(08:19):
Recovery thrives in structureand accountability.
If you answer to no one, anotherperson, to yourself, to God, to
nothing.
You answer to no one, you're notgonna get very far in recovery.
So the steps give a directionwhen emotions are foggy and
distorted and you're feelingreally horrible about things.
(08:40):
The steps give you that focus,they give you that direction to
follow as you're working throughit.
That's and they're in sequentialorder.
And the order is a good one, Ithink, actually.
Um, if I were to write them, Idon't think I would have changed
the order of them.
But without that structure,relapse skyrockets because
there's no grounding, there'snothing there.
(09:03):
Um, the most difficult time Ihave with clients that come into
my office are the ones that areum complete atheists, and it's
like, wow, you don't you youdon't have any higher calling
kind of accountability, and it'sreally tough.
Um, the best that I can do withthose clients is start to make
(09:25):
them accountable.
So they uh unfortunately I haveto make them answer to me, which
is not the most comfortableposition to be in, um, because
there's a there's a line you'regetting close to as a therapist
that you you know you're you'reuh it's an authority that you
don't want to exercise in a cloover a client, but they they
respond to nothing and nobody.
There's no accountability.
(09:46):
But without that without thestructure, they're not gonna get
very far.
So it to help you get back intofocus and and and follow that
direction, you really have tohave something to hang on to.
So the 12 steps are important.
Um, so the steps are kind oflike a a rescue protocol, you
know.
(10:06):
When you're when when I wouldroll up on a scene and I I've
got to do a rescue, it doesn'tmatter if it's a water rescue or
a first aid rescue or whatever,you're doing assessing, and then
maybe you're deciding whetheryou need to just, you know, if
you could just reach out tothem, so you just reach to them,
or you are going further whereyou're actually getting out into
(10:27):
the water, swimming out to them,but uh reach and then pull them
towards you, and then give themsupport, and then get them out
of the water.
If you skip one of those steps,someone's gonna drown.
And so it's not a good idea toskip those steps.
Now, the the problem about thestep work is that the emotional
(10:53):
honesty and the accountabilityis something that really, really
is important.
So the first three steps areabout like your life is a mess
and you can't do this byyourself.
That's the whole focus of thatfirst three steps.
Um steps four through nine,that's kind of where the work
is, if you will.
(11:13):
Um, because the first threesteps are about surrendering,
right?
So I surrender.
Now what?
Okay, now I gotta do the work.
So the whole focus is on takingmoral inventory, admitting the
wrongs, making amends, you know,so it's about self-reflection
and understanding, but it's alsoabout re-engaging in morality.
(11:36):
Um, you know, we we as people,we have our own moral compass in
our hand, and we have to decidewhere does our morality come
from.
And what what I found is withclients uh working on recovery
is that they've lost their way,but it's not immediate.
You don't go from you know zeroto a thousand miles an hour in a
(12:00):
second, it takes a while to getthere.
And so there's a buildup ofwrongdoing.
This bad decision led to thisbad decision, which led to this
bad decision, and they kind ofexponentially grow.
And you know, when we're workingon uh getting into recovery,
realizing that you've lost a lotof things in the in the process
(12:24):
of getting there, you've lost inyour addiction, you've lost a
lot of things.
Maybe you lost a relationshipwith a loved one.
Um, you become estranged, maybeyou self self-eliminated from a
relationship, or you just blewit up.
Um, committing crimes is apretty regular part of it.
And if you certainly if you're adrug addict, you most likely
(12:45):
have engaged in criminalactivity.
And sometimes that becomes uh anoccasional thing, and sometimes
it's a daily thing.
Um if you're an alcoholic, youknow, there's a lot of social
destruction that seems to go on.
There's also a lot of money lossgoing on, no matter what the
addiction.
So you might have lost somethings, because that's pretty
much how you move into recovery,is you've lost the one thing you
(13:07):
didn't want to lose.
So the admitting those wrongsand making amends, that's the
the last step, step nine in thein the four through nine.
Making amends is trying tofigure out how to um mend the
fences either with the person orif you can't do it with them
because they refuse or whatever,then within yourself.
(13:28):
So it's an emotional detox, it'scleaning out the resentment and
the shame and the denial thatgoes on in the process of of
spiraling down further andfurther and further into
addiction.
So the accountability is reallyimportant, but the cleansing of
the resentment, the shame, thedenial, I kind of look at it as
(13:48):
like if you had a really badinfection, you had a cut on your
arm or your leg or something,and it got really infected, it's
not gonna heal until you get ridof the infection.
So I look at the damage that'sgoing on in your life, that's
what you need to cleanse.
That's what you need to cleanout, and that's the resentment,
(14:10):
shame, denial, manipulation,destruction.
You know, you gotta clean thatout before you can heal.
Um so the accountability helpsyou with something, it helps
build humility which dismantlesthe ego-driven thinking that
goes on in your addiction.
Now remember, I've said in thesepodcasts over and over and over
(14:34):
again um ca you know, chaos andand destruction happens.
So the only way you can defendthat in this distorted mind that
you have is to use your ego, touse your arrogance.
You you it's like a weapon, youweaponized arrogance.
(14:54):
Um, so the the the ego-driventhinking is a problem, and you
need to engage in the moemotional.
When I'm sitting here in my inmy uh practice and I'm talking
to somebody, there's a lot ofthere's a lot of sadness,
there's a lot of tears, there'sa lot of resentment that uh self
self-resentment for actionstaken, things happening.
(15:16):
There's a lot of that that goeson.
So the humility de uh dismantlesthe ego-driven thinking.
Um if you speak the words, theylose their power, the bad
things.
So um it's really interestingwhen people commit crimes and
they're being questioned, uh,interrogated by the police and
(15:39):
questioned, the police arehoping that the person after a
while will get to the pointwhere they just are tired of of
lying.
Now, if if you're a psychopathor a really severe sociopath,
you're probably not going to dothis.
But the normal person, theperson without those personality
defects and disorders, they'regonna say it, and they're gonna
(16:00):
say it, they're gonna say it,they're gonna keep feeling it
every time they say it, andeventually they're gonna just
say, Okay, yeah, I didn't meanto kill her, or I didn't mean to
burn the house down, or I didn'tmean to.
And that's what happens withinterrogation many times, and
that's a technique that policeuse, to um, they're they're
playing on the person'semotional responses to things
and and get them out of the ego,the arrogance, um, and into that
(16:23):
that shame that you feel withhumility uh at what you've done.
So you can't heal what yourefuse to feel, and you can't
feel what you refuse to face.
If you speak the words that youdread, many times they will lose
a bit their their power.
(16:44):
So let it you know, let it rip.
So you've worked for a longtime, perhaps, hopefully, in the
step process.
And and by the way, uh just toframe this, I should have
probably said this in thebeginning.
Uh for me, uh I really like tosee somebody spend six to twelve
(17:04):
months working the steps.
I mean, preferably um a month,but I know for a lot of sponsors
that's an an extremely longtime.
But to really work the steps,now in that process, you know,
you can you can be abstainingfrom drugs and alcohol, and you
can be, you know, further alongin your recovery than three
months in saying I have to turnmyself over to a higher power.
(17:27):
Yeah, I understand that.
But the step process is oneabout function and understanding
and learning, right?
So you're it's an intellectualpursuit as well as an emotional
pursuit.
It's not just emotional.
Um, so I you know, I I I wantsomebody to spend a significant
amount of time doing it.
When you go to rehab, they'regonna work the steps, and you're
(17:49):
there for 30 or 45 or 60 or 90or 120 days.
You know, the longer you're inthere, the more work you're
gonna do on the steps.
But you know, I've many peoplecome out of uh residential
treatment in rehab and they'llsay, Well, I worked the steps in
rehab.
It's like, okay, well, we'regonna we're gonna really work
the steps this time.
Well, what do you mean?
(18:10):
Well, that was for 30 days.
Now I know you were in thereseven days a week, 168 hours a
week, but you're out here in thereal world.
So this is where you know, youryour forced structure is now
gone.
So we need to really work thesteps.
And I like it when I see peoplewho are sponsors, you know,
(18:31):
really emphasize that.
And it's even more important ifyou never went to residential
treatment, because the onlystructure you're probably
experiencing in at this time inyour uh in your life in that
recovery, is in the rooms andwith that sponsor.
So it's really important then.
So connection and community ispart of the step work too.
(18:55):
So step 10 through 12 um isabout you know that ongoing
reflection and then contributingto the recovery of other people,
that service part.
Now, not to be confused withwhen you go to, let's say you go
to AA, you walk in, and somebodysays, hey, you know, you should
(19:17):
get a service job.
Okay, a service job is settingup the chairs or you know,
starting the coffee or orgetting books out or or
something, right?
Or cleaning up the chairs or youknow, making sure the room's
clean.
That's not what I mean byservice um uh when it comes to
the 12 steps.
What I mean by service is youbecoming a sponsor.
(19:39):
And I'm gonna talk about that ina minute because that's that's
the last step.
But step 10 through 12,fostering that ongoing
reflection and service as partof your recovery.
So the emphasis um the with withthis is really in the connection
that keeps recovery alive.
What is a life uh is um sorry,let me try that again.
(20:01):
Isolation is addiction's bestfriend.
That's my trademarked uhcopyrighted phrase.
Isolation is addiction's bestfriend.
Isolation kills the connectionwith other people because we
like to use and we like to use alot, and people generally don't
want to be around us when we'reusing a lot because we cause
(20:23):
problems.
So we just learn to kind ofisolate and we're full of shame
and embarrassment, and so we arenot going to do it in front of
people.
In addition to that, besides theshame and embarrassment, you
also want to get trapped in yourbrain, you want to keep working
on that problem that's you'retrying to cope with.
You want to contain it, and soyou don't want people asking you
(20:46):
any questions or talking to youin that in that moment.
So that's when we isolate.
So you recover by giving awaywhat is freely given to you, and
this is part of that connectionand community.
So, in that last step, going outand spreading the good news, um
(21:06):
you know, recovery can befurther enhanced, and many
people take it on almost as asecond career, it's like become
their mission that they want toum they want to do they want to
contribute to helping people,they see in other people the
suffering that they have doneand they don't like it, and they
(21:28):
want to help somebody overcomethat.
There is a cost for that becauseif the person is not successful
at getting into recovery, ormaybe they overdose, they go to
prison, uh, ultimately thedestruction that you were trying
to help them get through andaway from, they get overcome by
it and they lose.
(21:49):
And I can tell you from personalexperience with client after
client, uh, you know, every yearthere's a client that either
ends up in jail, ends up inprison, ends up with some
physical problem that doesn't goaway, or they die.
And the secondary thing for methat's problematic is
estrangement from relatives ordivorce.
(22:11):
Um, those also are very, veryharmful and very long-lasting
traumas.
So i if you're trying to helpsomebody overcome, and that's
you've taken that on as a duty,it can be uh a painful process
sometimes.
But on the other hand, when theyget into recovery, extremely
rewarding.
So the tie in spiritual growthum and and emotional growth and
(22:37):
and psychological growth um isis when you do service to
others.
If you can, not everybody is iskind of wired for that, they
don't have the the the brain forthat, but serving others is part
of your self-healing.
So let's talk about the 12-stepprocess and therapeutic models.
(23:03):
Okay, the 12-steps are nottherapy.
Uh uh sponsors are nottherapists, nor should you
pretend to be, nor should youtry to be.
Um, you are not.
Unless you've been clinicallytrained, uh, you're not really
equipped for it, and it's reallynot even something you should be
(23:25):
doing, because you may be doingmore harm than good because you
have world real worldexperience, but you don't really
understand the clinical aspectof it, and what are you seeing?
So it can become very, veryproblematic and and can be
dangerous at times because youmight you might miss something
or screw something up.
So there's a there's adistinction between uh therapist
(23:46):
and a sponsor.
So let me let me compare 12steps and therapeutic models,
okay?
Cognitive behavioral therapy,CBT, is a style of therapy um
that is uh typically it's alittle more short term, uh, six,
(24:06):
eight, ten sessions typically,um cognitive behavioral therapy.
So what you're thinking and howyou're behaving, and you're
working to put those together.
So you're restructuringdistorted thinking, and that's
the whole purpose of cognitivebehavioral therapy, which it's
kind of goes very similarly withuh dialectic behavioral therapy,
(24:27):
DBT.
Um, that's more about yourself-talk rather than your
actual behaviors uh or thinking,but it's more about talking.
But anyway, so CBT isrestructuring distorted
thinking.
Well, that's kind of like stepsfour and ten, isn't it?
Um and if you don't know thesteps well enough to know those,
um let's just I'm gonna give youthe assignment of you need to
(24:51):
look at them so you can see whatI'm talking about.
Now, there's another form oftherapy, EMDR or trauma work,
um, where you're desensitizingtriggers and and guilt, the
responses of guilt.
And when you're when you're uhdesensitizing those, EMDR, eye
movement, desensitization andreprocessing, and then trauma
(25:14):
work, which is um just you knowworking specifically on trauma
and the somatic response, thebody response to trauma, you're
desensitizing your uh trigger,your guilt.
You're desensitizing yourself sothat you're reprocessing
something.
That's like steps five andeight.
Um mindfulness, train uhmindfulness therapy is like step
(25:37):
11.
The conscious contact,meditation, humility, being
aware of self and others, andtrying to be very, very focused
in on that is the mindfulnessthing.
Now, if you are not apsychologist or a counselor, um
(25:58):
you you really should not beteaching mindfulness because
it's an actual uh type oftherapy.
So I'm against the armchairtherapists who try to take the
stuff on.
But the steps really the stepsmerge science and spirituality
(26:18):
for whole person healing.
Okay, so you you got thespiritual aspect in the
beginning, like a higher power.
Can't do this by myself.
That's at the very at the verybeginning.
That's that's one through three.
Four through ten four through uhnine is more about understanding
uh yourself.
So it's turning it's in insteadof looking at the world saying
(26:41):
there's chaos in my world, and Ican't do this by myself.
So you're external, you'relooking externally, that's one
through three.
Four through nine is lookinginternally and looking at self
and evaluating self.
And then uh 10, 11, and 12 isabout the mindfulness part of it
and going out and engaging in uhothers and and and helping
(27:04):
others.
So um there's there's a lot ofthings that you can do in
recovery to get into recovery,and certainly recovery is not a
cookie-cutter thing, it's justwhatever your recovery looks
like, but it's not aboutchecking boxes, all right.
So doing the steps isn't like,oh, I did step one and I did
(27:27):
step two.
You know, it's not checkingboxes, it's about transforming
through a process and engagingin the process.
If you skip the steps, you'regonna probably skip a lot of the
healing.
Because you know, as atherapist, I'm a private
practice therapist.
I see people in my office, Imight see them once a week,
(27:49):
sometimes twice.
Uh uh at times I've seen peoplethree times a week, but that
doesn't usually last long term.
That's one hour.
If it's once a week, that's onehour.
You're in my office, you'rereally feeling it, you're really
engaging in it.
Well, you got 167 hours to getthrough before you come back to
my office.
So that's why it's important tohave structure around you in
(28:11):
recovery every day, every singleday.
If you're that first year, man,every day you're engaging in
recovery.
But if you skip the steps,you're gonna skip the healing.
So I really want you to find asponsor and a group and start
wherever they are, okay?
Wherever that is, you can dothat.
(28:32):
And I know, you know, across theworld, thanks to COVID, the one
positive thing that came out ofCOVID is the awareness that,
hey, we are a community and weare everywhere.
And so meetings are online.
No matter what the language, nomatter the location, if you have
access to the internet, you cango to meetings if you can't get
(28:54):
to them in person.
So if you're listening to thisin some other country, man, be a
be a uh 12-step AANA tourist.
I really encourage people to dothat.
For us in the United States, Iregularly have my clients tune
in to um or law, you know, tryto get into or log on to uh AA
meetings or NA meetings inEngland, in the Netherlands, if
(29:18):
they can find oneEnglish-speaking, um, New
Zealand, Australia, um, anywherethere's, you know, the United
States, Canada, any place thatthere's an English-speaking
meeting and you speak English,go do it.
See what you see.
Learn some things.
But just you gotta find asponsor.
So you gotta be accountable.
You gotta have structure.
You're never gonna get thereotherwise.
(29:40):
So please.
Um don't try to to if you'restruggling, reach out.
Don't try to rescue yourself.
You can't.
Um I'm a li I was a lifeguardfor a long time.
If I'm if I'm in need of likeassistance and I'm in the water
drowning, I'm looking for thatlifeguard to come and get me.
Uh I'm not gonna try to savemyself.
(30:02):
Uh if I can't, you know, it'snot possible.
So I'm gonna rely on otherpeople.
And so if you are a clinician ora practitioner of of clinical
services with somebody, man, Iand I get them all the time.
Um you you need some help, butyou gotta surrender to the
process.
Alright.
This is Doc Shock, hoping thatyou liked this podcast.
(30:26):
If you did, please like andsubscribe.
And if you want to reach out tome, you can.
You can reach me through mywebsite, wellspringmindbody.com,
send me an email, you can callme, leave me a message, and let
me know what's going on withyou.
But hey, first and foremost, ifyou need help, get me a rehab,
go see a doctor, go tocounseling, seek out some help
(30:49):
for your problems before theyovercome you and kill you.
There's no point in you losingyour life just because you're
trying to save your addiction.
Save yourself.
So I hope you enjoyed thispodcast.
And until the next podcast, thisis Doc Shock, your addiction
lifeguard, saying, See ya.
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