July 8, 2025 • 22 mins
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If you or someone you know is battling breast cancer, then this segment is for you. We discussed the heartbreaking story of MTV VJ Ananda Lewis who recently lost her battle with breast cancer and gave actionable steps for dealing with breast cancer.
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LINKS MENTIONED
Article by Ananda lewis on living with breast cancer - https://www.essence.com/lifestyle/ananda-lewis-breast-cancer/
Dr. Lakshmi Emory & Kevin Frazier Entertainment Tonight segment on Ananda Lewis's breast cancer and her death - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2IDmhGsJtE
National breast cancer organization resources - https://www.nationalbreastcancer.org/breast-cancer-resources/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
That doctor of anesthesiology?
What's that balloon show?
The red balloon.
Oh, pop the balloon.
I saw that Yo.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
He was like yeah, I'm a doctor.
They pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.
Ok, let's go ahead and bringout our next single guy.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
My name is Roman.
I just graduated from USF as adoctor for anesthesia.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Yo, it was like AK-47 in there.
Either all or most of the girlspopped their balloons.
Was it because of the time?
Oh, he wasn't as established inhis career.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I'm looking for someone a little bit more
seasoned in their career, alittle bit more financially
stable and things of that nature.
There's a lot of messages frommen who are saying you dodged a
bullet and I'm like I don't know.
Man, I'm just going to put thisout there.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
I was going to say the same thing.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
All right, y'all.
Welcome back to Docs Outsidethe Box everyone.
This is the podcast episode.
This is the Q&A segment.
We're going to put yourquestions and, yes, even some of
your frustrations, front andcenter.
I am Dr Nii Darko, traumasurgeon, podcaster since 2016.
Dr Renee, one more year, oreven less than a year, we're
(01:07):
going to be doing this for 10years.
Yes, mm-hmm, it's going to be adecade.
Every episode, y'all we arediving into topics that matter
to you, anything from financialfreedom, walking away from toxic
work cultures, which we bothknow about.
We're walking away from toxicwork cultures, which we both
know about, and I do want tostart encouraging people to
write in leaving voicemails.
(01:30):
So if you got something to say,leave us a voicemail, a DM, and
listen.
If you leave us a voicemail, ifyou leave us a DM or record in
some form or fashion, you mighthear your story featured here.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
So super excited.
If you leave a comment in anyof our posts, you might also
find yourself featured.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The other thing, too, that I want to say is I want to
encourage everybody who'slistening on DSP, so just the
audio version of this podcast.
I'm talking about Spotify,google Music, youtube Music,
apple, whatever it may be youcan still leave ratings.
So we really need the ratingsto help the show to grow.
So please leave us a rating.
If you're on YouTube, subscribeand also give us a thumbs up to
(02:19):
help with the algorithm.
So that's my little bit of anintro that I want to do.
So, dr Renee, how you doingwhat's up?
How you doing?
Speaker 2 (02:25):
I got bit by a spider .
I think I got bit by a spider.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
Why do you say that?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, what had happened was I went to my
locum's assignment and forwhatever reason, it was very
weird this time, but I reallythere weren't any patients.
So I went back to my hotel roomand it's Friday night and at
(02:53):
some point on Friday or Saturdaymorning, maybe end of the night
, I don't know I had this itchon my wrist and then I realized
I had a little raised bump orsomething and I thought, you
know, I was outside, maybe I gotbit by a mosquito, but it was
(03:14):
weird because it was like twothings side by side right, two
little bites side by side.
So I was like, oh, that's kindof weird.
Then my feet started tinglingall weekend long.
Then my feet started tinglingall weekend long Numbness,
tingling, burning, paresthesiasthe entire weekend.
And then I came home on Mondayand I said to you you know, my
(03:37):
feet are like tingling.
Like this is crazy, becausewhen I left on Friday feet were
fine.
You sure it's not syphilis.
Like this is crazy, becausewhen I left on Friday, you sure
it's not syphilis?
Tabies, dorsalis, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.
No, I had good proprioceptiveperception.
(03:59):
Work husband and if it'ssyphilis then, good luck to you
and your work husband Shut up me, my work husband, and so after
I said that to you, you're, likeyou know, check your back,
check your labs.
(04:20):
And I was like, okay, I justthought it was strange that the
onset was just so sudden.
And I was like, okay, I justthought it was strange that the
onset was just so sudden.
And then I looked at my wristand I was like, did I get bit by
a spider?
Is there like venom, somebody?
Speaker 1 (04:38):
tell me who's out there that does what doctor does
that?
Leave us a voice message or DMand we will.
That's, I think.
That's infectious disease ortoxicology, I think.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Tropical medicine.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Or ER, or ER, but ER does so much stuff they really
don't know.
I mean, there's a lot of stuff.
Well, I guess this is notesoteric, but anyway, that's how
I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
On a serious note, real quick, I do want.
No, no, I know, but from myserious take that I want to
start off this podcast.
I was listening to the lastepisode that came out.
We were covering the topicabout Ananda Lewis.
You know VJ, mtv VJ.
(05:25):
You know she lost her life tobreast cancer, mom.
You know that part.
I think, in my attempt to I'lleven tell you this I think I
should have put a little bitmore gravity, a little bit more
levity to it.
Is that the right word?
I needed to take it a bit moreseriously.
The reason why I'm saying thatis, guys, I did my residency at
(05:49):
Morehouse School of Medicine inGrady and in our five years of
general surgery residency I dida lot of breast surgery, a lot
of breast cancer work and I feltlike I shouldn't just I don't
know, I felt like I should haveadded a bit more, I should have
gave some resources,particularly since I did a lot
of this stuff.
Now, granted, I don't do breast, I haven't done breast surgery
(06:11):
in over 10 years, you know, anda lot has changed for the better
.
But you know, shout out to DrOkoli, shout out to the breast
cancer and the surgical oncologythat occurred at Grady Memorial
, because that really is likeit's God's work, right, you're
dealing with a lot of folks whohave cancer and particularly
with breast cancer.
You know you have a bigindigent population, immigrant
(06:34):
population, and a lot of timesthe resources aren't there to
treat them.
But I found this article thatshe put out there and, alfred,
if you can put this up, it'sfrom Essence Magazine and it's
an actual essay that she wrote,obviously before she passed away
, but the name of the article isAnanda Lewis, on living with
stage four breast cancer and hermessage for Black women,
(06:56):
prevention is the real cure.
And I know that a lot of stuffhas been going back and forth in
terms of, you know, did she gothrough the traditional methods?
If she had gone through thetraditional methods, would she
have, you know, lived longer,especially having a child, right
, would she have survived?
And there is, you know, thisarticle, I think, offers a
(07:19):
glimpse, you know, offers areally good glimpse into her
mind as to what she was thinkingabout.
Right, and I won't get into toomuch into it, but basically she
talks about, you know, she did,a combination of traditional
medicine as well asnontraditional medicine.
She talks about doing likehyperbaric chambers and trying
to get the toxins out of hersystem, but also, at the same
time, she talks about doingtraditional treatment and
ultimately running out of hersystem.
(07:39):
But also, at the same time, shetalks about doing traditional
treatment and ultimately runningout of money.
She said that that was the bighurdle for her is that she ran
out of money and that put herback Running out of money as
well, as COVID-19 put her backseveral years and when it was
time to get, when she got herinsurance back years later, you
(08:01):
know, it advanced and she wasbehind the eight ball.
But I encourage everyone toreally read this article to get
a little glimpse of what she'sthinking in her mind, because I
think it's super important.
You know, I think that I justshould have came from a
different perspective.
I should have read this articlebefore I started with what I
wanted to say.
From a different perspective, Ishould have read this article
before I started with what Iwanted to say.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
So you know, I I'll say in your defense I don't know
that we were actually going totalk about Ananda more than it
was.
Just it happened pretty closeto when we were going to record
and I bail me out, bail me out,and I'm not bailing you out.
(08:42):
This is actually what happened.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
That is a bailout.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
And I happen to say rest in peace, ananda Lewis.
So I got a call from Dr LucyMitchell who shout out she's
been on the show before, but Igot a call from her that same
week that that episode came outand she actually made me aware
(09:08):
that Ananda's sister is actuallya physician.
Her name is Dr Lakshmi Emeryand she did a Entertainment
Tonight segment with KevinFrazier about Ananda's you know
whole journey through breastcancer and her eventual death.
(09:30):
So we'll put that link in theshow notes as well, so that you
know if you're interested inwatching.
But she, you know she goes intokind of what was in Ananda's
mind as well, kind of theconflict, obviously, her sister
being a doctor.
(09:51):
Her sister also revealed thatshe herself had had breast
cancer and we know that Ananda'smom had also had breast cancer.
So there's a question ofwhether or not there, at least
in my mind, is there somegenetic component to this in
their family.
But she does talk about kind ofthe conflict that she had with
her sister and then just kind ofyou know, that moment of coming
(10:14):
to accepting that this is whatAnanda wanted.
You know that she wanted to beable to handle this in her own
way and her as a doctor, youknow being one way but also
being, you know, her sisterbeing supportive.
So she talks about that, sowe'll put that in the show notes
as well.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Well, I do have some actionable advice that I wanted
to bring up and it's very short.
I have five steps.
I always keep notes on thesethings because I want to make
sure I get my mind right.
But step one is get organizedwith your care team.
Right, so that's going to beeither your PCP, your surgical
oncologist, your breast surgeon,your radiation oncologist,
(10:56):
right, or just your oncologist,right your family, even
supportive care, right, they areall part of your care team.
Right, like the support groupsthat you're going to go to, you
need to be able to have peoplewho you can decompress to, who
have possibly gone through thesame thing that you're going
through.
Right, that's super important.
(11:17):
They are a part of your careteam.
So, yeah, that's a good point.
Um, number two I have preparedto ask the right questions.
Own the conversation right.
Like this is your health, andthis part, I think, is difficult
, right, because it's like, well, you know, I don't know what
questions to ask.
I don't feel confident enoughto um, to, to steer the
(11:38):
direction, to steer theconversation in my own, for my
own benefit.
I feel like I'm going to be ledthis way and I think that's
where you know making sure thatyou're getting organized with
your care team, making sureyou're talking with people
who've gone through this process, getting with support groups
Super important, right?
Because, as me and you bothknow, like if you don't ask the
(12:00):
right questions, sometimes youmay get led astray.
Super important, superimportant.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Or you're making decisions based on something
that you really don't understand, and that understanding the
information is just as, if notmore, important as, getting the
information right.
So if you have to tell your doc, listen, talk to me like I'm
(12:27):
four, then that's what you needto say.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, I think you get .
You feel like, well, they'regoing to look at me a certain
way if I ask that question, butit's like no, any doctor worth
his grain or her grain and saltshould be able to explain things
in a way that you understand.
I still have attendings rightnow who I work with directly,
who are horrible at explainingconcepts and I probably put
myself, you know, somewhere inthat range, but it's it's crazy.
(12:54):
It's crazy Like docs are notreally.
They're not good at that.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
No, we're not, really .
We're not necessarily taughthow to talk to patients.
We are taught that we have tospeak to patients, but we are
not necessarily taught how tospeak to patients, because much
of medical school is learningmedical jargon.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
I got prioritize emotional well-being and side
effect support right.
Like you got to be able.
This is something that I thinkshe was talking about in her
articles.
Like you know, you got to beable this is something that I
think she was talking about inher articles.
Like you know, I got to be ableto make sure that emotionally,
mental wise, that I'm on pointright.
I got to be ready to fight this.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Yeah, and that can be tough.
You know, I had a friend ofmine, you know this, and a
really close friend of mine, whohad breast cancer, was
diagnosed early 40s, and youknow there was a point at which
she had to have surgery, youknow, start going through the
(14:00):
chemo and everything, and youknow, her sister and her niece,
myself, you know, we all kind ofjust pitched in Her.
You know, for me and you were apart of this, nhi, it was being
on the phone when she went toappointments, you know, and just
(14:21):
being there when no one elsewas able to be there physically
with her.
And so I literally wouldrearrange my patient schedule so
that the time that she had herappointments with her doctor, at
least I was on the phone, youwere able to be on the phone.
So that worked.
(14:41):
And then the other thing hersister and her niece worked out
was a schedule where someonecould fly in and be with her
every single day, you know.
So I went out there for a week.
Her mom was out there, hersister, like she, had a rotating
schedule of people who wereable to be there with her
(15:05):
support.
Her, you know, she felt sick,she was nauseated, vomiting, you
know all kinds of GI symptomsyou know, and just helping her
kind of through this, so it canbe a very grueling thing.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
You know, the side effects are no joke.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Yeah, it can be very grueling.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
You need a lot of support from that.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
And sometimes you may have to do some lifestyle
changes to get through that.
That's a powerful tool, right?
That she talked about that also.
Yeah, and then, last but notleast, I'm gonna keep it quick
so we can continue to keep itmoving is think, and this is
what you mentioned think beyondyourself, right?
Genetics and family matter yeahright.
So it may not just you may notjust be, you know, patient zero
Right Like you just may happento be part of a whole.
(15:54):
You know pedigree of people whomay be carrying these genes
around, so it may be importantfor you to check that out and
make sure that you know youdon't have any of those genes
that make you a higher risk ofgetting this.
So just some steps to thinkabout, and then I do have some.
If you go to the show notes,there is something in there
where I have stuff you know fromthe National Breast Cancer
(16:17):
Organization.
It has some breast cancerresources in there.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
But it's just something I just wanted to add,
because I just, you know, whenyou just go back and you listen
to an episode, you're like yo,man, I, I could, I could have
shown up, but a little bit well,yeah, but I mean, we didn't
have a again, we, it wasn't ascheduled topic, um, but yeah,
no, I appreciate the nuance andI, I think everybody else will
appreciate the nuance.
You know, uh, it's not an easydiscussion to know.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
I just I think that the thing that I keep going back
is you know she has a son.
I think he's 14.
Um, that's crazy.
You know, not being with yourmom, you know, for a significant
portion of your life that is,that has to be very difficult
yeah that's to be very difficult, would you, would you ever?
Um?
(17:04):
What are your thoughts onleaving the world, knowing that
you have, like your kids arestill young, like particularly?
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Okay, let's not talk about that, because why are you
talking about that?
Damn, we talk hard.
I can't even think about it.
Don't make me think about that.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yeah, I think, I, I think, I think it's crazy, I
think, even just even thinkingabout you, right like the
thought of losing you.
You're my best friend, you know, you are like the hundredth
best co-host I've ever had.
It's like really me yeah, man,you think the ass won't stop
because you cry fuck out of here.
(17:49):
Okay, keep it moving.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
No, but not I literally can't even think about
that without like tearing up.
It's just, oh my god, like Ireally feel for ananda, because
one of the things that hersister said was that she wanted
to make it to her son'sgraduation.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
She did.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Her son was graduating from middle school,
eighth grade.
Yeah, and she, she made it tothe day.
They actually did not.
She didn't make it to thegraduation, but she made it to
the day.
They actually did not.
She didn't make it to thegraduation, but she made it to
the day and with everythinggoing on, she ended up passing
(18:36):
on that day and it's in theinterview.
You can hear it.
But she says that they gave theson the option of going or not
going and he chose to go.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
Go to where.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
The graduation.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
It was later that day , but she had died earlier in
the day.
She wanted to make it to theday of his graduation and she
was able to.
And I'm just like God, like youknow.
She literally left knowing shewas going to miss a milestone.
(19:14):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
So are you saying that she should have went
earlier?
Speaker 2 (19:21):
No, I'm saying how tormenting.
Was it tormenting for her, orwas she at peace?
Was tormenting, was ittormenting for her, or was it,
or was it or was she at peace?
I don't know, Like I don't knowhow I would feel, you know, I
(19:42):
don't know how I would feel,knowing you know that I'm, I've
made it to the milestone, I madeit to the day, but I won't get
to see my baby cross the stage.
You know what I'm saying.
It's like I don't know.
But don't bring up things likethat, Otherwise I cry.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
The reason I bring that up is just, you know,
leaving the world knowing thatyou left something on the table.
That's what I'm saying.
You know what I'm saying.
That's a tough one, right likewhen you like is there?
Is there a part where you'rejust like look, I'm out, you get
all my service?
Or is it like yo, I'm puttingall the cards on the table?
You give me chemo, hyperbaric,give me radiation, give me all
(20:27):
that I'm, I'm staying.
Yeah, do you seem like it's?
Speaker 2 (20:31):
I think I think there's a lot of suffering.
I think there is a point I hopeI hope that there is a point
that even even in this type ofscenario, I hope that there is a
point at which someone gets tobe at peace with knowing that
(20:51):
they are leaving this earth,knowing that their children will
be loved and cared for.
And I think that you know, atleast based on the conversation
that Kevin Frazier had withAnanda's sister, I think that
there was at least that peace ofmind that she felt like my son
(21:15):
is going to be in good hands,you know, and so I would hope
that she left this world atpeace and not tormented, right
Like?
Those are my own words, thoseare my own thoughts about
potentially how I might feel,but I hope that she was at peace
, yeah, so yeah, let's rest inpeace.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
And on the, on the Lewis, you know, thoughts and
prayers, teas and peas onceagain.
But, guys, you know to takesome action, go ahead and take a
look at those resources thatare in the show notes.
These are super important.
You know, if, let's say, you'renot going through this, you may
know somebody who might begoing through this and it'll be,
you know.
I think it'll be interesting.
(21:58):
It'll be very nice to pass thisalong to find out really small,
actionable steps that you cantake or that person can take if
they're going through thisprocess, especially if they feel
like they're going at it alone.
Love you, babe, love you on.
(22:19):
Love you, babe.
Love you, hearties.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Hearties.
All right, so let's talk aboutsomething a little bit different
.
All right, guys.
So we're going to end thissegment here, but stay tuned for
the next segment.
In the next segment, we'regoing to be talking about how Dr
Ne is going to break 20 minutesin a 5k and how he thinks he's
going to be benching 250 pounds.
So stay tuned.
That doctor of anesthesiology?
What's that balloon show?
The red balloon.
Oh, pop the balloon.
I saw that Yo.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
He was like yeah, I'm a doctor.
They pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.
Ok, let's go ahead and bringout our next single guy.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
My name is Roman.
I just graduated from USF as adoctor for anesthesia.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Yo, it was like AK-47 in there.
Either all or most of the girlspopped their balloons.
Was it because of the time?
Oh, he wasn't as established inhis career.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I'm looking for someone a little bit more
seasoned in their career, alittle bit more financially
stable and things of that nature.
There's a lot of messages frommen who are saying you dodged a
bullet and I'm like I don't know.
Man, I'm just going to put thisout there.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
I was going to say the same thing.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
All right, y'all.
Welcome back to Docs Outsidethe Box everyone.
This is the podcast episode.
This is the Q&A segment.
We're going to put yourquestions and, yes, even some of
your frustrations, front andcenter.
I am Dr Nii Darko, traumasurgeon, podcaster since 2016.
Dr Renee, one more year, oreven less than a year, we're
(01:07):
going to be doing this for 10years.
Yes, mm-hmm, it's going to be adecade.
Every episode, y'all we arediving into topics that matter
to you, anything from financialfreedom, walking away from toxic
work cultures, which we bothknow about.
We're walking away from toxicwork cultures, which we both
know about, and I do want tostart encouraging people to
write in leaving voicemails.
(01:30):
So if you got something to say,leave us a voicemail, a DM, and
listen.
If you leave us a voicemail, ifyou leave us a DM or record in
some form or fashion, you mighthear your story featured here.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
So super excited.
If you leave a comment in anyof our posts, you might also
find yourself featured.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The other thing, too, that I want to say is I want to
encourage everybody who'slistening on DSP, so just the
audio version of this podcast.
I'm talking about Spotify,google Music, youtube Music,
apple, whatever it may be youcan still leave ratings.
So we really need the ratingsto help the show to grow.
So please leave us a rating.
If you're on YouTube, subscribeand also give us a thumbs up to
(02:19):
help with the algorithm.
So that's my little bit of anintro that I want to do.
So, dr Renee, how you doingwhat's up?
How you doing?
Speaker 2 (02:25):
I got bit by a spider .
I think I got bit by a spider.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
Why do you say that?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, what had happened was I went to my
locum's assignment and forwhatever reason, it was very
weird this time, but I reallythere weren't any patients.
So I went back to my hotel roomand it's Friday night and at
(02:53):
some point on Friday or Saturdaymorning, maybe end of the night
, I don't know I had this itchon my wrist and then I realized
I had a little raised bump orsomething and I thought, you
know, I was outside, maybe I gotbit by a mosquito, but it was
(03:14):
weird because it was like twothings side by side right, two
little bites side by side.
So I was like, oh, that's kindof weird.
Then my feet started tinglingall weekend long.
Then my feet started tinglingall weekend long Numbness,
tingling, burning, paresthesiasthe entire weekend.
And then I came home on Mondayand I said to you you know, my
(03:37):
feet are like tingling.
Like this is crazy, becausewhen I left on Friday feet were
fine.
You sure it's not syphilis.
Like this is crazy, becausewhen I left on Friday, you sure
it's not syphilis?
Tabies, dorsalis, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.
No, I had good proprioceptiveperception.
(03:59):
Work husband and if it'ssyphilis then, good luck to you
and your work husband Shut up me, my work husband, and so after
I said that to you, you're, likeyou know, check your back,
check your labs.
(04:20):
And I was like, okay, I justthought it was strange that the
onset was just so sudden.
And I was like, okay, I justthought it was strange that the
onset was just so sudden.
And then I looked at my wristand I was like, did I get bit by
a spider?
Is there like venom, somebody?
Speaker 1 (04:38):
tell me who's out there that does what doctor does
that?
Leave us a voice message or DMand we will.
That's, I think.
That's infectious disease ortoxicology, I think.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Tropical medicine.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Or ER, or ER, but ER does so much stuff they really
don't know.
I mean, there's a lot of stuff.
Well, I guess this is notesoteric, but anyway, that's how
I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
On a serious note, real quick, I do want.
No, no, I know, but from myserious take that I want to
start off this podcast.
I was listening to the lastepisode that came out.
We were covering the topicabout Ananda Lewis.
You know VJ, mtv VJ.
(05:25):
You know she lost her life tobreast cancer, mom.
You know that part.
I think, in my attempt to I'lleven tell you this I think I
should have put a little bitmore gravity, a little bit more
levity to it.
Is that the right word?
I needed to take it a bit moreseriously.
The reason why I'm saying thatis, guys, I did my residency at
(05:49):
Morehouse School of Medicine inGrady and in our five years of
general surgery residency I dida lot of breast surgery, a lot
of breast cancer work and I feltlike I shouldn't just I don't
know, I felt like I should haveadded a bit more, I should have
gave some resources,particularly since I did a lot
of this stuff.
Now, granted, I don't do breast, I haven't done breast surgery
(06:11):
in over 10 years, you know, anda lot has changed for the better
.
But you know, shout out to DrOkoli, shout out to the breast
cancer and the surgical oncologythat occurred at Grady Memorial
, because that really is likeit's God's work, right, you're
dealing with a lot of folks whohave cancer and particularly
with breast cancer.
You know you have a bigindigent population, immigrant
(06:34):
population, and a lot of timesthe resources aren't there to
treat them.
But I found this article thatshe put out there and, alfred,
if you can put this up, it'sfrom Essence Magazine and it's
an actual essay that she wrote,obviously before she passed away
, but the name of the article isAnanda Lewis, on living with
stage four breast cancer and hermessage for Black women,
(06:56):
prevention is the real cure.
And I know that a lot of stuffhas been going back and forth in
terms of, you know, did she gothrough the traditional methods?
If she had gone through thetraditional methods, would she
have, you know, lived longer,especially having a child, right
, would she have survived?
And there is, you know, thisarticle, I think, offers a
(07:19):
glimpse, you know, offers areally good glimpse into her
mind as to what she was thinkingabout.
Right, and I won't get into toomuch into it, but basically she
talks about, you know, she did,a combination of traditional
medicine as well asnontraditional medicine.
She talks about doing likehyperbaric chambers and trying
to get the toxins out of hersystem, but also, at the same
time, she talks about doingtraditional treatment and
ultimately running out of hersystem.
(07:39):
But also, at the same time, shetalks about doing traditional
treatment and ultimately runningout of money.
She said that that was the bighurdle for her is that she ran
out of money and that put herback Running out of money as
well, as COVID-19 put her backseveral years and when it was
time to get, when she got herinsurance back years later, you
(08:01):
know, it advanced and she wasbehind the eight ball.
But I encourage everyone toreally read this article to get
a little glimpse of what she'sthinking in her mind, because I
think it's super important.
You know, I think that I justshould have came from a
different perspective.
I should have read this articlebefore I started with what I
wanted to say.
From a different perspective, Ishould have read this article
before I started with what Iwanted to say.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
So you know, I I'll say in your defense I don't know
that we were actually going totalk about Ananda more than it
was.
Just it happened pretty closeto when we were going to record
and I bail me out, bail me out,and I'm not bailing you out.
(08:42):
This is actually what happened.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
That is a bailout.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
And I happen to say rest in peace, ananda Lewis.
So I got a call from Dr LucyMitchell who shout out she's
been on the show before, but Igot a call from her that same
week that that episode came outand she actually made me aware
(09:08):
that Ananda's sister is actuallya physician.
Her name is Dr Lakshmi Emeryand she did a Entertainment
Tonight segment with KevinFrazier about Ananda's you know
whole journey through breastcancer and her eventual death.
(09:30):
So we'll put that link in theshow notes as well, so that you
know if you're interested inwatching.
But she, you know she goes intokind of what was in Ananda's
mind as well, kind of theconflict, obviously, her sister
being a doctor.
(09:51):
Her sister also revealed thatshe herself had had breast
cancer and we know that Ananda'smom had also had breast cancer.
So there's a question ofwhether or not there, at least
in my mind, is there somegenetic component to this in
their family.
But she does talk about kind ofthe conflict that she had with
her sister and then just kind ofyou know, that moment of coming
(10:14):
to accepting that this is whatAnanda wanted.
You know that she wanted to beable to handle this in her own
way and her as a doctor, youknow being one way but also
being, you know, her sisterbeing supportive.
So she talks about that, sowe'll put that in the show notes
as well.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Well, I do have some actionable advice that I wanted
to bring up and it's very short.
I have five steps.
I always keep notes on thesethings because I want to make
sure I get my mind right.
But step one is get organizedwith your care team.
Right, so that's going to beeither your PCP, your surgical
oncologist, your breast surgeon,your radiation oncologist,
(10:56):
right, or just your oncologist,right your family, even
supportive care, right, they areall part of your care team.
Right, like the support groupsthat you're going to go to, you
need to be able to have peoplewho you can decompress to, who
have possibly gone through thesame thing that you're going
through.
Right, that's super important.
(11:17):
They are a part of your careteam.
So, yeah, that's a good point.
Um, number two I have preparedto ask the right questions.
Own the conversation right.
Like this is your health, andthis part, I think, is difficult
, right, because it's like, well, you know, I don't know what
questions to ask.
I don't feel confident enoughto um, to, to steer the
(11:38):
direction, to steer theconversation in my own, for my
own benefit.
I feel like I'm going to be ledthis way and I think that's
where you know making sure thatyou're getting organized with
your care team, making sureyou're talking with people
who've gone through this process, getting with support groups
Super important, right?
Because, as me and you bothknow, like if you don't ask the
(12:00):
right questions, sometimes youmay get led astray.
Super important, superimportant.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Or you're making decisions based on something
that you really don't understand, and that understanding the
information is just as, if notmore, important as, getting the
information right.
So if you have to tell your doc, listen, talk to me like I'm
(12:27):
four, then that's what you needto say.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, I think you get .
You feel like, well, they'regoing to look at me a certain
way if I ask that question, butit's like no, any doctor worth
his grain or her grain and saltshould be able to explain things
in a way that you understand.
I still have attendings rightnow who I work with directly,
who are horrible at explainingconcepts and I probably put
myself, you know, somewhere inthat range, but it's it's crazy.
(12:54):
It's crazy Like docs are notreally.
They're not good at that.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
No, we're not, really .
We're not necessarily taughthow to talk to patients.
We are taught that we have tospeak to patients, but we are
not necessarily taught how tospeak to patients, because much
of medical school is learningmedical jargon.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
I got prioritize emotional well-being and side
effect support right.
Like you got to be able.
This is something that I thinkshe was talking about in her
articles.
Like you know, you got to beable this is something that I
think she was talking about inher articles.
Like you know, I got to be ableto make sure that emotionally,
mental wise, that I'm on pointright.
I got to be ready to fight this.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Yeah, and that can be tough.
You know, I had a friend ofmine, you know this, and a
really close friend of mine, whohad breast cancer, was
diagnosed early 40s, and youknow there was a point at which
she had to have surgery, youknow, start going through the
(14:00):
chemo and everything, and youknow, her sister and her niece,
myself, you know, we all kind ofjust pitched in Her.
You know, for me and you were apart of this, nhi, it was being
on the phone when she went toappointments, you know, and just
(14:21):
being there when no one elsewas able to be there physically
with her.
And so I literally wouldrearrange my patient schedule so
that the time that she had herappointments with her doctor, at
least I was on the phone, youwere able to be on the phone.
So that worked.
(14:41):
And then the other thing hersister and her niece worked out
was a schedule where someonecould fly in and be with her
every single day, you know.
So I went out there for a week.
Her mom was out there, hersister, like she, had a rotating
schedule of people who wereable to be there with her
(15:05):
support.
Her, you know, she felt sick,she was nauseated, vomiting, you
know all kinds of GI symptomsyou know, and just helping her
kind of through this, so it canbe a very grueling thing.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
You know, the side effects are no joke.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Yeah, it can be very grueling.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
You need a lot of support from that.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
And sometimes you may have to do some lifestyle
changes to get through that.
That's a powerful tool, right?
That she talked about that also.
Yeah, and then, last but notleast, I'm gonna keep it quick
so we can continue to keep itmoving is think, and this is
what you mentioned think beyondyourself, right?
Genetics and family matter yeahright.
So it may not just you may notjust be, you know, patient zero
Right Like you just may happento be part of a whole.
(15:54):
You know pedigree of people whomay be carrying these genes
around, so it may be importantfor you to check that out and
make sure that you know youdon't have any of those genes
that make you a higher risk ofgetting this.
So just some steps to thinkabout, and then I do have some.
If you go to the show notes,there is something in there
where I have stuff you know fromthe National Breast Cancer
(16:17):
Organization.
It has some breast cancerresources in there.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
But it's just something I just wanted to add,
because I just, you know, whenyou just go back and you listen
to an episode, you're like yo,man, I, I could, I could have
shown up, but a little bit well,yeah, but I mean, we didn't
have a again, we, it wasn't ascheduled topic, um, but yeah,
no, I appreciate the nuance andI, I think everybody else will
appreciate the nuance.
You know, uh, it's not an easydiscussion to know.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
I just I think that the thing that I keep going back
is you know she has a son.
I think he's 14.
Um, that's crazy.
You know, not being with yourmom, you know, for a significant
portion of your life that is,that has to be very difficult
yeah that's to be very difficult, would you, would you ever?
Um?
(17:04):
What are your thoughts onleaving the world, knowing that
you have, like your kids arestill young, like particularly?
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Okay, let's not talk about that, because why are you
talking about that?
Damn, we talk hard.
I can't even think about it.
Don't make me think about that.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yeah, I think, I, I think, I think it's crazy, I
think, even just even thinkingabout you, right like the
thought of losing you.
You're my best friend, you know, you are like the hundredth
best co-host I've ever had.
It's like really me yeah, man,you think the ass won't stop
because you cry fuck out of here.
(17:49):
Okay, keep it moving.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
No, but not I literally can't even think about
that without like tearing up.
It's just, oh my god, like Ireally feel for ananda, because
one of the things that hersister said was that she wanted
to make it to her son'sgraduation.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
She did.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Her son was graduating from middle school,
eighth grade.
Yeah, and she, she made it tothe day.
They actually did not.
She didn't make it to thegraduation, but she made it to
the day.
They actually did not.
She didn't make it to thegraduation, but she made it to
the day and with everythinggoing on, she ended up passing
(18:36):
on that day and it's in theinterview.
You can hear it.
But she says that they gave theson the option of going or not
going and he chose to go.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
Go to where.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
The graduation.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
It was later that day , but she had died earlier in
the day.
She wanted to make it to theday of his graduation and she
was able to.
And I'm just like God, like youknow.
She literally left knowing shewas going to miss a milestone.
(19:14):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
So are you saying that she should have went
earlier?
Speaker 2 (19:21):
No, I'm saying how tormenting.
Was it tormenting for her, orwas she at peace?
Was tormenting, was ittormenting for her, or was it,
or was it or was she at peace?
I don't know, Like I don't knowhow I would feel, you know, I
(19:42):
don't know how I would feel,knowing you know that I'm, I've
made it to the milestone, I madeit to the day, but I won't get
to see my baby cross the stage.
You know what I'm saying.
It's like I don't know.
But don't bring up things likethat, Otherwise I cry.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
The reason I bring that up is just, you know,
leaving the world knowing thatyou left something on the table.
That's what I'm saying.
You know what I'm saying.
That's a tough one, right likewhen you like is there?
Is there a part where you'rejust like look, I'm out, you get
all my service?
Or is it like yo, I'm puttingall the cards on the table?
You give me chemo, hyperbaric,give me radiation, give me all
(20:27):
that I'm, I'm staying.
Yeah, do you seem like it's?
Speaker 2 (20:31):
I think I think there's a lot of suffering.
I think there is a point I hopeI hope that there is a point
that even even in this type ofscenario, I hope that there is a
point at which someone gets tobe at peace with knowing that
(20:51):
they are leaving this earth,knowing that their children will
be loved and cared for.
And I think that you know, atleast based on the conversation
that Kevin Frazier had withAnanda's sister, I think that
there was at least that peace ofmind that she felt like my son
(21:15):
is going to be in good hands,you know, and so I would hope
that she left this world atpeace and not tormented, right
Like?
Those are my own words, thoseare my own thoughts about
potentially how I might feel,but I hope that she was at peace
, yeah, so yeah, let's rest inpeace.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
And on the, on the Lewis, you know, thoughts and
prayers, teas and peas onceagain.
But, guys, you know to takesome action, go ahead and take a
look at those resources thatare in the show notes.
These are super important.
You know, if, let's say, you'renot going through this, you may
know somebody who might begoing through this and it'll be,
you know.
I think it'll be interesting.
(21:58):
It'll be very nice to pass thisalong to find out really small,
actionable steps that you cantake or that person can take if
they're going through thisprocess, especially if they feel
like they're going at it alone.
Love you, babe, love you on.
(22:19):
Love you, babe.
Love you, hearties.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Hearties.
All right, so let's talk aboutsomething a little bit different
.
All right, guys.
So we're going to end thissegment here, but stay tuned for
the next segment.
In the next segment, we'regoing to be talking about how Dr
Ne is going to break 20 minutesin a 5k and how he thinks he's
going to be benching 250 pounds.
So stay tuned.
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