March 3, 2025 • 52 mins
Prepare yourself for a captivating journey into the life of Michael Swango, a man whose medical aspirations turned sinister. Once a promising physician, Swango's dark obsession with death took him on a harrowing global path filled with deceit, manipulation, and an alarming loss of life. In this gripping episode, we navigate through the shadows of his medical career—unraveling a web of chaos as patients mysteriously died under his care.
Swango's story raises uncomfortable questions about trust within the medical profession and the failures that allow evil to masquerade as healing. Through profound insights and a narrative rich with emotional depth, you will discover how a thorough investigation illuminated the complexities of his actions. As we uncover how institutional negligence perpetuated a cycle of malpractice, the dialogue extends beyond Swango's chilling tale to provoke deep thoughts about accountability and reform in healthcare.
Join us as we explore this crucial topic, featuring expert commentary and eye-opening observations on the delicate balance between trust and safety in medicine. You won't want to miss this engaging discussion—subscribe and immerse yourself in the staggering realities of one of medicine's most shocking cases!
References:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1118552/
https://murderpedia.org/male.S/s/swango-michael.htm
https://www.oxygen.com/license-to-kill/season-1/international-serial-killer (2019, Season 1 Episode 8)
Dr. Death. Life of Serial Killer Michael Swango. Author: Jack Smith
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Stay safe, and stay suspicious...trust, after all, is a delicate thing!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Amanda.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Hi Jenna, hello how are you?
Doing.
I am great.
How are you Good?
Speaker 1 (00:11):
I'm excited to welcome everyone to episode six.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome Episode six.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Yay Part two of episode five listen, we have our
brand new, and it's my fault,but we have a brand new section
of the podcast that I'mentitling corrections section.
Yeah, okay.
So those of you who downloaded,like if you set your podcasts
(00:43):
on automatic download, blessyour hearts.
We love that for you.
However, however, um, therewere, there were a little bit of
a.
There was a little, there was alot of a glitch.
Okay, the editor I don't knowwhat she was doing.
Anyway, it was bad.
So if you are listening toepisode five and we're talking
on top of each other, just stop,don't torture yourself just,
(01:06):
yeah, and just know if youdelete it, there's a better
version available that's nottrue for episode one.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That's only true for episode five.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, no, but this time you get a chance to get a
clean, nicely edited once.
I figured out what I was doingum episode, so just don't
despair.
We know that happened.
Thank you to those of you wholet us know.
Um.
But yeah, if so, if, if thesound quality is really bad,
just delete it and re-downloadand you'll be golden and thank
(01:38):
you for your patience, as we hadpublished and then pulled it
and then edited, yeah, andbasically my mom called me.
She's like what the heck?
And it pulled us.
It sounds like I was like, ohmy goodness, Okay, Thanks mom
for listening.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I hadn't gotten to that part yet.
I was listening to it in thelobby for my appointment and I
was like I think it sounds great.
So I hadn't gotten to the trainwreck part yet.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, it was like a yeah.
Anyway, it was a thing, wefixed it, so don't despair.
Dear listeners, thanks forsticking with us.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
As one of my students says yeah, it's just trial and
error, guys.
Trial and error.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Trial and error.
Um.
The second correction in thissection is to our dear friend
Richard, who was our firstmedical mishap writer and he
wrote in about the mishap wherehe basically schnarfed a polo up
his nose, um, polo being a likea lifesaver size mint for those
(02:43):
of us in the US.
Anyway, he wrote that he couldyou know that one would suck and
crew on a mint.
And I was like, oh, that mustbe a British thing.
And basically he pointed out tome you goon, crew was meant to
be chew, so it really wasn't amystery.
(03:04):
Crew was meant to be chew, soit really wasn't a mystery.
Apparently the British alsosuck and chew on their mints,
just like the rest of the world.
So I apologize, dear Richardand the rest of the UK, for
assuming there was somethingreally mysterious and special
about the way that you guys suckon mints.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
In your defense.
It was written like crew, buthave an r.
That brings me to a questionthat has nothing to do with this
podcast, but I've alwayswondered this is, and I don't, I
don't know how to okay, sosometimes they will just like
add an r at the end.
You probably know the answer tothis because you're dear old
(03:46):
mama, but like so, the name emmawill be like emmer, is that?
What is that?
Speaker 1 (03:53):
um, yeah, that's vernacular, depending where
you're from.
In the uk they sometimes add afew consonants to just like help
with that when I'm listening toan audiobook.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
It will.
That will happen likefrequently, and I'm like what is
it with this r thing?
I don't hate it, but I'm likeis it?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
is her name emmer, or is it emma?
Say that it's a common languageseparated by some ocean, um,
and a lot of consonants.
So, yeah, we're gonna.
We're just gonna take it as wetake each word as it comes and I
love it yeah, I'm here for it.
I appreciate richard pointingout that it wasn't crew, it was
(04:33):
chew.
I kind of, I kind of like chewour crew better.
I was like I do too.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
I'm gonna go with crew, and that's why I thought
with the addition of the r thing, I was like maybe crew was
supposed to be chew I don't know, I'm gonna crew me mint um,
anyway, richard, thanks againfor sending your story.
It was hilarious, yeah I lovedit.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
um also speaking of uh places across the pond from
the us, we have listeners inaustria and ab Abu Dhabi now hey
guys, welcome to the pod.
So I would like to say to ourfriends in Abu Dhabi.
(05:24):
So there you go.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Snaps for Jenna Keep it coming people from the
international areas.
Thank you Also.
Did you guys know my friendcould speak so many languages?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I can speak many languages badly, so that is what
I bring to the table here.
But, amanda, I am on the edgeof my seat about this dude that
we talked about last week.
Can you tell us what's in storefor us today?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
yes, I can.
Um, before we start, I'll justuh, throw out some trigger
warnings for this episode, whichinclude miscarriage and, of
course, murder.
Um, references will be postedin the show notes and the book
that I had referenced I don'tknow three or four times last
(06:29):
time and never told anyone.
Um, that book was titled drdeath life of serial killer
michael swango and the authorwas jack smith.
So that will be there with theother references that I used.
So, where we left off, lastweek, the FBI had learned of
(06:49):
Swango and started to build acase against him, specifically
for fraudulently entering a VAwith inaccurate credentials.
Ooh.
No bueno, mm-mm.
So we are in February of 1994,and the FBI was tipped off that
(07:10):
Swango was located in Atlantawhere he had been working as a
chemist at a wastewater plantpoison the water supply.
The FBI contacted the facilityand informed them of Swango's
past and shockingly, notshockingly he was fired on July
(07:34):
22nd, Yikes, Despite a diligentinvestigation, slow bureaucracy
meant that they couldn't get awarrant for his arrest issued
until October 27th.
However, Swango opted to takethe advice of Dr Miller, If we
remember from the last case whathe had told him you know go off
to some far away place thatneeds doctors desperately.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
The guy with no conscience that was like oh okay
, you suck, um, why don't youtake it to the third world
country?
That doesn't he's like you know?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
yeah, third world country, that doesn't.
He's like you know, yeah, youcan't work here, but why don't
you just go somewhere where theyneed you more?
You know that places you're notup to par here, but maybe
somewhere else, like I have somany
issues with that so thatnovember um, he took that advice
of dr miller and he was off tozimbabwe where he used forged
documents to get a job at MeneLutheran Mission Hospital.
(08:26):
He found the job through anoverseas job agency called
Options.
The agency's main mission wasto fill medical positions with
American doctors.
And when he arrived in Zimbabwehe was asked by the director
why would you choose to come toa rural area and make
(08:47):
substantially less money?
I mean swan yeah yeah sus sussus.
That's what the kids are saying.
Um, so you'd make way lessmoney.
It's remote.
And swango simply replied Ilove Africa.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Oh, do you how?
What do you know about Africa?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Yeah, so the more the director got to know Swango and
witness his work in the field,he realized that he seemed
highly unprepared for even verybasic medical tasks.
And when questioned about thisseemingly lack of preparedness,
swango chalked it up to havingpractice in the field of
neurosurgery.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Okay, so he didn't have much experience outside of
that very prestigious field Forall of the basics.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Yeah, for the bread and butter.
So he was ordered to do fivemonths rotation as an intern at
mipillo hospital in bulloway tostrengthen his skills, which
good on the hospital, right,they're like well, you can stay,
like let's get you some skills.
You just work as an intern, getstronger, yeah, yeah.
(09:57):
And by all accounts he had madefriends and done well during
this rotation, though of coursethere were still skeptics of why
he chose to be there in thefirst place.
Yep, as they should be.
After the five months were over,he went back to Mine Lutheran
Mission Hospital, but Swango hadplanned to return to Bulaway
where, you know, he made friendsonce his contract was finished.
(10:18):
So his plans to return would behalted because, you know, he
just couldn't keep up the act ofbeing a good old boy any longer
.
His dark obsession with deathhad a stronger pull.
Patients once again, sadly,began dying under mysterious
circumstances.
He was witnessed givingpatients unknown medications in
(10:40):
their IVs, as well as extratreatments that they didn't need
, just as it was in America.
The nursing staff began tonotice that he was up to no good
.
Patients cheated death whileunder the care of Soango.
Some left paralyzed, otherswere not so lucky and
unfortunately passed away.
Again, these were patients whowere dying unexpectedly for
(11:03):
reasons completely unrelated towhy they were at the hospital in
the first place.
That's disgusting.
Despite the growing pile ofevidence, hospital
administrators didn't want tobelieve that the American doctor
was truly causing theseproblems intentionally and,
despite the suspicions, no firmconclusions could be made due to
the lack of autopsies.
(11:23):
That's so hard.
That's so hard.
Oh no, unfortunately for her.
I mean not only losing yourchild that's nearly full term
(11:46):
but she was also under Swango'scare.
Oh no, medical staff treatedthe pain with medication and
worked to remove the fetalremains from the womb.
The procedure was noted to beroutine and completed without
any complications.
However, just days later shewas found deceased.
Oh, any complications.
However, just days later shewas found deceased.
(12:06):
The medical director, dr Shiri,began to question medical staff
about the procedure obtainingtestimonies.
It was reported to him by anurse that Swango had injected
the patient with something.
Dr Shiri's seriousness inobtaining testimonies opened the
door for nursing staff to beabsolutely transparent about
(12:28):
their growing concerns.
They shared many stories of theextra treatments and patient
reports of being injected withmedications that they presumed
were unneeded.
Dr Shaziri also collectedtestimonials from these patients
, which is amazing, those thatwere lucky enough to be alive
still, for instance, a patientthat woke up to Swango giving
(12:50):
him a shot that left himparalyzed.
Oh my goodness.
Dr Shaziri was deeply disturbedby everything that he had
learned.
Obviously Fearful that he wouldcontinue his reign of terror,
he transferred Swango to theneighboring Mizumi mission
hospital.
Until they could figure outwhat to do, which I don't know
if that was the best answer.
(13:10):
To just transfer him somewhereelse?
But yeah, just get him out ofhere.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
I mean it was something.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, yeah, dr Shaziri contacted the Lutheran
Church headquarters and alertedthe medical director of what had
been going on.
Contacted the Lutheran Churchheadquarters and alerted the
medical director of what hadbeen going on, and the medical
director also wasted no time inalerting authorities, who
obtained a warrant to searchSwango's living quarters.
There they found a stockpile ofpharmaceuticals, syringes and
(13:37):
various chemicals, and with thathis license to practice in
Zimbabwe was temporarilysuspended, with privileges
revoked until an investigationcould clear him of any
wrongdoing.
The investigation was completedin October and he was
terminated from Mine MissionHospital.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I mean that's the very least that should happen.
I mean the guy should have beenarrested for, yeah, wrongfully
misrepresenting himself andtreating these patients.
But okay, carry on.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Okay, Swango then went to the only other place
that he knew in Zimbabwe.
Back to Bulawayo he reconnectedwith a friend, Ian, that he had
met during his five-monthrotation.
He told Ian the shocking storyof how he was so wrongfully
fired from Minet Hospital.
Ian just couldn't believe itand directed him to a human
(14:33):
rights lawyer that he knewconfidently that he was treated
misfairly.
Swango linked up with thelawyer, who also believed there
was a case for discrimination asthe only American doctor at the
brandis it was discrimination,normally, that if you were
american you could do no wrong.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
So, come on, guys, they were like oh, you're an
american doctor, you, you arethe be-all, end-all of doctors,
and he abused that.
And so now they're using it tosay oh, he wasn't given the
benefit of the doubt because hewas an american doctor.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Oh, that's, that's, that's rich, okay so ian also
went to the director of mipelohospital and urged him to
restore swango's privileges sothat he could practice there.
The director was pretty leeryabout the story and contacted dr
shaziri to see why Swango hadactually had his privileges
(15:29):
revoked.
That's good for him yeah.
Yep, so good on you.
Shaziri advised against hiringSwango and said that things were
still under investigation so hecouldn't really discuss any
details with him, and so,unfortunately, the director of
Mipelo Hospital assumed that itwas just a personal dispute
rather than medical negligence,and swango's rights were
(15:52):
restored and he was hired atmipelo hospital amanda, do you
know what they say about theword assume?
Speaker 1 (15:59):
if you assume, what happens?
Speaker 2 (16:03):
is that when um you know you're making, you're an
ass out of you and me.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Oh, shame me that whole thing, but honestly I mean
I'm not trying to make light ofthis, but it's like obviously
they couldn't conceive thatsomeone would have nefarious
intents or just be like thisridiculously unqualified and
carry on.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
And right.
They want this educatedAmerican doctor to help their
patients.
They don't want to just assumehe's there with ill intentions.
Like you said Exactly, there'sa lack of resources in there,
he's charismatic?
Yeah, unfortunately, they wantto believe that they usually are
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, he's really good.
Yeah, unfortunately, theyusually are Mm-hmm.
(16:51):
Yeah, he's really good atplaying the victim Any whoozles.
So he's at Mapillo Hospital nowand his killing spree would
begin only weeks after starting.
Oh, it was even easier for himto perform these heinous acts at
Mapilo because he had 24-houraccess, leaving little to no
(17:12):
witnesses.
Mysterious deaths occurred leftand right, most overlooked due
to the busy nature of thehospital.
However, there would be a turnin the story when a journalist
tracked Swango down at MipeloHospital.
He was mid-request of theswitchboard to page Swango so
(17:33):
that he could interview him when, much to his surprise, swango
was right behind him.
Swango asked him who they wereand what they wanted, and they
explained that they were ajournalist, and Swango
immediately backed away with hisarms in the air, proclaiming I
can't answer that.
You have to talk to my lawyer.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And then he just ran away oh, methinks thou just
protest really dramatically, andand therefore, uh, though thou
hast something to hide, oh, mygoodness, talk to my lawyer.
Bye like what?
Speaker 2 (18:08):
oh, that's so obvious .
So hospital staff were leftstaring like what the hell just
happened and the journalist, notwanting to leave with nothing,
found the director and beganinterviewing him on whether or
not he was aware that swango wasunder investigation for several
deaths.
Obviously unaware this, thedirector initiated his own
(18:29):
internal investigation and I'msure you can guess what happened
next Swango was told that hisservices were no longer needed
at the hospital and he was firedBye-bye, oh my god, can you
imagine?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Your own hospital is like outed by the press and
you're like wait, what thisguy's what?
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Okay, guess he shouldn't have assumed it was
just a little.
That's the ass part of you andme.
Yeah, oh man, uh, yeah, so itwas all now all over the news
that the american doctor wasaccused of experimenting on
patients.
Swango, of course, stuck withthe story that he was framed and
he returned to Bulaway where hehad an established
(19:14):
relationships with those friends.
So Ian fully took him under hiswing.
He totally believed that he wasbeing pitted against and was
like I got you, bro, which goodon you, you, ian, to be a good
friend.
I have a friend, ian, ian, youare actually a very good friend,
so shout out to my ian.
(19:34):
But anyway, um, so swango, uh,then started staying with the
mother of a gal, leanne, that hehad previously met through Ian.
Leanne was moving anyway andthought, you know, it might be
(19:56):
nice to have the company at homewith her mom, and her mom
agreed.
She did, of course, see Swangoall over the news and asked Ian,
are you sure about him?
And Ian assured Lynette, who'sLeanne's mom, that he was being
framed and he's a good guy.
So it's all good, nothing'sgoing to happen.
Things went generally well withthe living situation.
At first Lynette noted oddbehaviors, but anytime things
(20:20):
got weird, swango would justapologize, and so she just ended
up brushing it off.
Swango then met his newest loveinterest, joanna, while at
dinner with mutual friends, andJoanna was recently divorced and
had a couple of children.
Their relationship progressedpretty quickly as he offered to
(20:40):
help with the kids because youknow, he doesn't have a job.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
So he's got time.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
What else are you going to do, dude?
Yeah, so Joanna would drop thechildren off at Lynette's house
when she went to work and Swangowould watch them.
But the more often that Swangowas around, the more ill that
they became.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
No, please tell me, Amanda, that this man is not
poisoning the children.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
And they weren't the only ones falling violently ill.
There were times where Lynettewould fall suddenly ill and of
course suspected Swango ofmessing with her food or drink,
but these times were so far andfew between she chalked it up to
having bouts of the flu.
She's like kind of like hisex-girlfriend or fiancée from
the last episode.
It's like am I going crazy orare you actually messing with me
(21:27):
, as he did?
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Last episode it's like am Igoing crazy or are you actually
messing with me, right?
Um, so lynette's maids, on theother hand, had other ideas.
They were certain that he wastampering with the food in the
home and later shared an examplethat there was a brand new jar
of peanut butter and the sealhad been tampered with, as if
something was pushed down intothe peanut butter.
(21:47):
The maids were extremelyconcerned with Swango living
there and began sleeping insideof the main house, and they
shared that Swango would get upin the middle of the night and
stand outside of Lynette's doorJust standing there oh weird.
They would make throat-clearingnoises or start humming to
(22:11):
alert him that like, like, hey,we're still awake and we're
paying attention to what you'redoing, and then he would like
quickly go back to his room.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
like nothing to see here bye.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Thank god for them freaking weirdo.
Yeah, they shared the oddbehavior with lynette and she
asked him to leave, thankfully,and he was apparently so pissed
that he couldn't mess with heranymore and or that he was
kicked out undecided that hedecided to tamper with her car
instead and he poured a largeamount of sugar into her gas
(22:39):
tank.
What a shithead.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Oh, oh, my god, yeah, no, oh, he needs.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
So now he's kicked out.
He's kicked out of lynette'shouse and so now he goes to live
with joanna full-time.
His days consisted of loungingaround joanna's house until one
day he received a phone callfrom the police, who informed
him that they wanted tointerview him in person.
Of course, of course I'll showup for an interview, you know,
but it's going to have to be thenext day because I'm pretty
busy watching children right now.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Yeah, it's pretty busy poisoning people and yeah,
okay.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
So the police agreed shockingly and they were like,
okay, come in.
They agreed on August 29th andthe story he told Joanna was you
know, I just really need to getaway from it all.
And that he wanted to plan ahiking trip to a national park.
And, as the understandinggirlfriend that she was, she
(23:40):
agreed that you know that willbe really good for you and
dropped him off at a Zimbabweanbus station.
Oh man, and is this where welose him again?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
I don't know, but it's time for a chart note Chart
note that was more like a wolfor coyote howling than a nice
musical segue.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Sorry about that I know I loved that.
Welcome to the chart notesegment where we learn about
what's happening in medicine andhealthcare.
Okay, so on back-to-back chartnotes.
So you know, I googled hottopics in healthcare today and I
found an alarming amount ofarticles on mistrust that
(24:28):
patients have for medicalprofessionals.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
What Say it isn't so.
That's what the premise of thiswhole show is.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
I know I said, hmm, that seems like an appropriate
topic for this case, Because,hello, how can we say it's easy
to trust when we had a MichaelSwango going around poisoning
people, Right?
I mean, granted, this was along time ago, but anyway.
Um, however, the route andmistrust and veering of patients
that I chose to focus on is howpeople are turning to social
(24:57):
media platforms such as Tik TOKfor health information and
guidance.
Yes, this is not a new idea.
However, you know how long havewe heard of people Googling
their symptoms Guilty?
But how are we to trust thatthe answers we're finding are
reliable?
And just because one's person,one person's experience, was
(25:17):
shared online doesn't mean thatwill be the trajectory or
experience that others will have.
Right, Because everybody'sdifferent and studies show that
many young people prefer to usesocial media in place of those
traditional search engines likeGoogle to seek answers, which I
was kind of like that seems alittle more dangerous.
Right, Because now we just havea Joe Schmo like me being like
(25:40):
hey, I had this surgery and thisis what happened to me you know
like no medical knowledge inthat area at all.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Exactly, and you know , anecdotal evidence is not as
powerful as, you know,full-blown studies, but it's
more powerful when I mean, evenif you weren't online, if you
talked to your auntie, who youknow had the same thing, and she
said this is awful, whatever,you're going to go with that
instead of maybe that was anoutlier situation, uh, yeah,
(26:13):
yeah so I found a little studyum so we have a rose dimitrianus
dimitrianus um.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
She is a third year medical student at the
University of Chicago.
Pritz Pritzker, pritzker.
That just caught me off guard,like I tripped on a curb on a
sidewalk, sorry yeah, andthere's a lot of consonants
there, I'm just gonna goPritzker.
Pritzker School of Medicine andother UChicago researchers
(26:48):
recently published a new studywhich systematically analyzed
health information on TikTok tosee if they could identify
trends, such as how muchmisinformation is out there and
does it come from specific typesof content creators?
They found that nearly half ofthe videos contained non-factual
information, with a largeproportion of misleading videos
(27:10):
coming from non-medicalinfluencers, like we already
talked about, of course, thereare endless amounts of health
conditions that can be searched,so the researchers opted to
focus on hashtag sinus talk fora more manageable analysis.
For a more manageable analysis,they focused on this specific
(27:30):
healthcare condition andperformed their search during a
single 24-hour period.
To limit the effects ofTikTok's ever-shifting
algorithms, they searched theapp using specific hashtags
related to sinusitis, includinghashtag sinusitis, hashtag sinus
and hashtag sinus infection.
The researchers found thatnearly 44% of the videos
(27:54):
contained non-factualinformation, with a significant
proportion coming fromnon-medical influencers, who
were more likely to spreadmisleading content.
Medical professionals' videoswere generally of higher quality
, containing less misinformation, which I was like.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
44 that's a high, a high percentage, but at least
it's less than him I know I'malso like, okay, so if we could
just figure out who the medicalprofessionals really are.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
I know, because if I made a TikTok right now, I could
say I'm whoever you could sayyou're a medical professional.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
No one's going to know that You're not a medical
sinus professional.
Right, exactly.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
So many areas, so the researchers highlighted the
dangers of health misinformation, such as ineffective or
dangerous treatments beingpromoted, which could lead to
confusion and harm.
For example, a trend of puttinggarlic up the nose for sinus
relief could cause harm despiteappearing harmless and then
increasing emergency visits toget garlic clothes out of one's
(29:04):
binaries they just need thatlittle tweezer that Richard
talked about.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Never mind the polo.
What about the garlic?
Okay, yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
The study emphasized the importance of critically
evaluating health information onsocial media and consulted
trusting Nope Consulting trustedhealth healthcare providers.
It also suggested that medicalprofessionals should be more
active on social media to helpcombat misinformation and
improve the quality of healthcontent available online, which
is a great, a great idea.
(29:37):
If you have time for that andyou want to be on social media,
yeah.
So I'd like to just take alittle special moment here to
shout out to our ENT colleagues,because we work closely with
you guys and we love you guys,love you, love you guys.
Special shout out to shannonand gretchen love you guys,
(29:59):
emily and isaac.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Okay, yeah, okay, okay, back to the story.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Okay, yeah this is where swango falls off the grid
for a couple weeks again andresurfaces in zambia, zambia,
why did I say zambia?
Yeah oh okay, I just like, waslike, felt like I said zombie
for a second okay sorry it'sgetting late at night and my
(30:29):
brain is getting squirrely.
so he resurfaces in Zambia andhe has a job at the university
teaching hospital.
If you're geographicallychallenged like me, I had to
look up a lot of maps for this.
(30:49):
So, for reference, zambia is alittle over 20 hours from
Bulawayo.
That's really far away.
When I lived in Washington, Iwas 26 hours away from Minnesota
, so I don't know, I feel likethat was a good distance.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah, that's a long ways away.
Yeah, I don't know, I feel likethat was a good distance.
Yeah, that's a long ways away,yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
So after about two months of working there, the
hospital had learned of Swango'spending charges he was facing
from a bulletin that was sentout by Zimbabwe to all of the
countries in Southwest Africa.
Oh wow, officially fired onNovember 19th 1996.
And knowing that he'd need torelocate again, and far away
(31:32):
from the Southern region ofSouthern Africa that he had been
reigning terror on, he reachedout to another medical placement
company, where he secured aposition at a medical facility
in Saudi Arabia.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Oh, no, and and for reference again for those of us
that are geographicallychallenged.
Saudi Arabia is about 154 hoursaway by car and a 10 and a half
hour flight from South Africa um, if you were american trained
(32:13):
because now they have peoplethat saudis that are, um they
have sent for training inamerica and europe and whatever.
But at the time in the 90s,they didn't send people over
seats.
So if you came with a trainingfrom america you were like, oh
you know, play somehow over thetraining of people who had
trained in the Middle Eastlocally.
(32:36):
So so he was already kind of ona pedestal when he applied
there.
Karina sorry.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
No, thank you for sharing that.
I'm so sorry if you guys canhear this, but my dog just
started snoring, so it's betterthan barking.
But just enjoy the ambiance inthe background.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
We're boring your dog , okay, no she's tired from
daycare.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
's a girl, okay anyway, um.
So I'd like to also point outthat we're talking about the
mid-90s here, so it's not likepeople are opening up a social
media app or a news outlet appon their phone and learning of
this monster, leaving this trailof death behind him, like, like
you said, he's already beingset a tier above, even though he
(33:25):
shouldn't be, and they justdon't have the outreach with
social media like we do now.
So Swango was set to start atRoyal Hospital in Duran in March
of 1997.
And this is where I'd like totake a moment to thank the Saudi
government for a policy thatthey had in place.
(33:47):
The policy was that all visashad to be issued in a visitor's
home country.
This meant that Swango wouldhave to go back to the United
States to get a Saudi visa towork.
So Swango tried to argue thatthis policy you know, saying I
can get the visa in South Africa.
It's much closer for me totravel than go back to the
(34:09):
United States.
But they did not budge.
So this guy was eitherdesperate beyond belief or
absolutely insane, because hechose to fly back to the U?
S to get the work visa.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
There you go.
I will say they are prettyresolute in their rules.
I mean, they have a definitehierarchy of who comes from
where, how much you get paid,what you can do, based on your
country of origin.
So that doesn't surprise me.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
On June 27th 1997, he landed at O'Hare International
Airport in Chicago where he wasdetained by immigration
officials and his passport wasconfiscated.
Investigators knew that theywould need more evidence to have
a Loctite case against him formurder.
But they had plenty of evidenceagainst him to charge him with
(35:01):
forgery.
But they had plenty of evidenceagainst him to charge him with
forgery.
They knew that the sentence forforgery would be short but that
it would probably buy themenough time to continue
gathering that evidence thatthey needed and knowing all the
while that he'd be safely lockedbehind bars.
Yeah.
(35:23):
So, facing the threat ofextradition to Zimbabwe, he
agreed to plead guilty to thelong-standing forgery charges
against him.
He entered a guilty plea fordefrauding the government in
March of 1998.
Just a few months later, inJuly, he was convicted and
sentenced to three and a halfyears in prison.
While Swango might havebelieved that he'd soon be
released and could pass the timein prison with hot meals and
television, he was mistaken.
(35:45):
While he was safely locked up,investigators were building a
case that would ensure a muchlonger sentence for his other
crimes.
Documents were uncovered andbodies were exhumed
(36:11):
no-transcript.
Just as Swango was nearing theend of his three and a half year
sentence, he was paid a visitby these agents, who presented
the mounting evidence againsthim.
He was hit with three counts ofmurder and several other lesser
charges, and was formallyindicted on these charges on
July 17th.
Of course, he initially plednot guilty, which is the same
(36:34):
approach he had taken when hewas accused of poisoning his
co-workers in the 1980s.
However, prosecutors made itvery clear what was at stake.
If convicted, swango could facethe death penalty in New York
or be extradited to Zimbabwe,where he was likely to receive
harsher punishment.
Yeah.
(36:56):
It's unclear whether he feareddeath or the prospect of being
imprisoned in Zimbabwe, butunder the pressure, he once
again relented and agreed toplead guilty.
Ultimately, swango wassentenced to three consecutive
life sentences for three murdercharges, without the possibility
of parole.
(37:16):
While he was formally convictedof three murders, it is
suspected that there wereupwards of 60 murders.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
Oh my god 60?
Speaker 2 (37:27):
Right, that's so many .
And now, in his 70s, swangoremains imprisoned at ADX
Florence, which is a maximumsecurity federal penitentiary in
Colorado where inmates havelittle to no contact with other
inmates and or staff.
He actually requested to betransferred to ADX because he
(37:49):
believed it would be safer forhim to live out the rest of his
years there fearing what otherinmates might do to him.
Because, you know, he has otherexperience with being imprisoned
and apparently he had facedthreats from former fellow
inmates when he was imprisonedbefore.
Huh wonder why.
Yeah, um, I didn't know this.
(38:10):
Maybe I should have known this,but adx is home to some of the
world's most notorious criminals, including mexican drug kingpin
el chapo shoe bomber, richBomber.
Richard Reed and BostonMarathon Bomber Jahar Sarni.
Ah, dang it, jahar Sarniho.
(38:31):
Yes, you guys.
I even put a pronunciation keyin there for me, tripped on the
sidewalk again.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Those are baddies.
Baddies, I know baddies, I knowbad bad, bad, bad.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Since his incarceration, he has remained
largely silent because he's abig anyway, refusing all
interviews, requests or anyother inquiries into his life
behind bars.
Despite pleading guilty to thecharges that led to his
indictment, swango continued topresent himself as a victim of
(39:08):
unjust persecution and seemsdetermined to maintain that
narrative until his death,because he's a big puke bag.
Oh, come on, dude.
So unfortunately, since he'schoosing to remain silent, we'll
probably never get a chance tounderstand why he did what he
did.
You know we often try todissect if it was the old nature
(39:33):
versus nurture situation, butby all accounts, he had a
seemingly normal childhood.
His parents were divorced andhis mom did odd things like wrap
their Christmas presents inpaper bags and just stuck them
under the tree.
But is that enough for someoneto turn into a serial killer?
I mean, they had presents.
I mean no, you had Christmaswith presents, so it sounds
(39:54):
pretty fortunate to me.
He also has two other siblingsthat didn't grow up to be serial
killers.
So there's that he alwaysseemed to have an obsession with
death and dying from hisoverzealous enthusiasm for
deadly EMT calls, standing byhis patients coded without
offering a helping hand, Hisfascination with making gory
(40:17):
scrapbooks and his darkobsession of mixing chemical
concoctions to experiment on hiscolleagues and patients with,
it's like.
Was he just obsessed with theeffects that the chemicals may
or may not have on people, orwas his motive always to kill?
He was also known for beingmanipulative and invasive, often
(40:38):
trying to cover up his actionsand any wrongdoing.
Soango's killings spannedseveral states in the US and
several countries, suggestingthat his actions were not
isolated incidents but part of alarger pattern.
Professionals, includingpsychologists and criminologists
, believe that Swango'smotivations were driven by a
desire for control, power andperhaps even a fascination with
(41:02):
death, and have pointed out thathe has demonstrated classic
signs of a medical serial killer.
so it's just scary that someonewho could use their trusted
position to inflict harm whileevading suspicion like eek yeah
the darkness within, yeah, thedarkness within swango is
(41:24):
difficult for the rest of us allto comprehend, which is a good
thing, and we can only hope thatthere aren't many others like
him working in our clinics andhospitals this is amanda.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
This is such an interesting case because, I mean
, not everybody that goes intothe medical profession, it does
it for an altruistic reason.
But like what?
What do you think it was thatum gave, that, spurred him on,
(42:00):
that, gave him their the reasonfor doing what he did?
Because I don't understand, Ijust don't get it like yeah why
would?
Speaker 2 (42:10):
you yeah I think that he just like had a wire twisted
weird upstairs because he wasso obsessed with death and dying
, and I do think that he truly Imean he was really good at
chemistry.
He won chemistry awards.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
Yeah, he seemed to be so intelligent.
How?
Can someone not?
Intelligent, who was interestedin healthcare and and putting
all that it took to get thathealthcare, education and
graduate.
How can they?
What was in it for him?
(42:51):
What was he getting out of itto kill these people?
Speaker 3 (42:57):
I honestly think that he just was like here's my new
recipe.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
I'm going to see what it does to you.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
Kinda I don't know, it seemed like he was
indiscriminate.
It was like it could be mypatients, it could be my
co-workers.
Like he wasn't just like tryingto come up with a cure for
something that didn't go well.
He was just like, oh, checkthis, I can poison my co-workers
at the same time as, like, killmy patients I I've never heard
(43:30):
yeah, I've never heard of a caselike this.
I've never heard of a guy likethis I had never heard of him.
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I highly doubt he'll ever hear this, but if you do,
we're on the patient side andyou're a puke oh my goodness,
well, you did such a good jobresearching this and presenting
this and we really appreciatethat.
Speaker 1 (43:52):
And, um, again, this was I can't believe, given the
the reach that this guy had, theamount of murders and
poisonings and things that he'sdone.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
But I haven't heard of this, but thank you and I
just always think, like all thesecond chances, like this guy
was almost stopped so many times.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
God.
And then we're like oh well,you know, you're not good enough
for us soil because you're abit of an ass, but maybe you can
go overseas and spread yourincompetence there.
But the problem was, it wasn'tincompetence, it was
maliciousness.
Mm-hmm, you know?
Yeah, it was evil.
It was just pure evil.
(44:38):
Yeah, it's been sick.
Well great, I mean you know,know.
No, we need to know thesethings.
Um, and I appreciate youbringing that up, um, I'm gonna
lighten the mood by uh readinganother medical mishap I'm so
excited for this this is amedical mishap listener email.
(45:05):
Today's medical mishap is fromKevin, he writes thank you so
much for starting this podcast.
I truly appreciate your humorand the research you do to bring
these cases to our attention.
You've given me something tolook forward to on Wednesdays
now.
Yay, happy holidays, thanks,kevin.
Yay, kevin, attention.
(45:25):
You've given me something tolook forward to on wednesdays
now.
Yeah, thanks, kevin.
Um, he says I'm writing about amedical mishap that happened
many years ago, but it stillmakes me laugh to this day.
My sweet elderly grandma, jean,saw an ent physician for her
recurring sinusitis and an earinfection.
He prescribed her a rinsesolution for her sinuses and
drops for her recurringsinusitis and an ear infection.
He prescribed her a rinsesolution for her sinuses and
drops for her ear, withinstructions to come back in two
(45:48):
weeks for a follow-up visit.
Her sinuses were clear twoweeks later, but the ear
infection had gotten worse.
The ENT was puzzled and askedJean if she'd used the drops as
he'd prescribed.
She was adamant that she'dfollowed instructions to a T and
pulled the paper withinstructions from her purse.
Doctor, I've been putting thisin my rectum three times daily
(46:12):
for ten days, but my ear isstill plugged, confused and
perhaps horrified let's hopehorrified, the doctor grabbed
the prescription from her handsand read it over carefully.
The note read instill fivedrops three times daily in the R
period ear.
Oh my gosh.
(46:36):
So of course we never let herlive that down.
That is so funny.
Never let her live that down,that is so funny.
It's still a source of smilesand laughter as we remember our
grandma at our familyget-togethers over the years.
Oh bless, I will say this was atime when patients unwaveringly
followed the physician'sinstructions to a t and would
(46:57):
never question what the doctorsays.
I think that this has changedover recent years and that's a
positive thing, but listening tosome of your cases, it seems we
still have a way to go.
Thank you for doing what you doand keep the episodes coming oh
my gosh kevin.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
No, thank you, thank you kevin, oh, bless your heart.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
That was our right ear, yeah, rear.
So she's putting ear drops inher butt.
Oh no.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
Anyway.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
I'm sorry, ties into our chart note for today too.
Speaker 2 (47:29):
Again, shout out to our ENT colleagues Don't ever
write R dot ear.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Bless her heart.
Can you imagine howuncomfortable the treatment was
and ineffective, absolutely, andshe's like.
Well, who am I to question the?
Doctor.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
And she's like, yes, of course I've been following
these directions to a D.
Oh, bless your heart, GrandmaJean.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
That's my favorite.
Rest in peace.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
Yeah, so Okay, well, all best.
And please.
Yeah, so okay, well, all right,jenna.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
Yeah, what can our listeners expect to hear next
week?
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Oh well, next week we're covering an episode
entitled Nefarious Nurses theLethal Lovers of Alpine Manor.
Oh, stay tuned, listeners.
Entitled nefarious nurses thelethal lovers of alpine manor.
(48:33):
Oh, stay tuned, listeners, itgets pretty interesting next
week.
Um, don't miss a beat.
Subscribe and follow doctoringthe truth wherever you enjoy
your podcasts, for stories thatshock, intrigue and educate
trust after all, is a delicatething.
We want to spend, we want tosend.
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A special thank you to oursubscriber.
(48:55):
Sandy show is the missing.
Is that what I'm saying?
Scow Show.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Scow Sandy Huh.
Speaker 1 (49:03):
Scow Huh.
Speaker 2 (49:05):
Scow Scow.
Just read it like a S-K-O-WScow Scow Did I say it.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
Okay, you did, sandy Scow.
Okay, thank you for support ofour podcast, sandy Scow.
Sandy, because she's subscribedto our podcast, will get to
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Oh boy, uh-huh, you too cansubscribe to our podcast for as
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(49:33):
Your subscription will get youa shout-out on the show and a
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In addition, we're looking forother ways to bring our
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So click the link under therating view and subscribe today.
You can also text us directlyon our website at
(49:55):
doctoringthetruthatbuzzsproutcomand definitely email us your
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And don't forget to download.
We don't get credit unless youdownload rate and review, so we
(50:19):
can be sure download folks, ifyou heard that download,
download, download even if youdon that Download, download,
download.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Download, even if you don't listen to it, just
download it.
Yeah, you can just download.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
Tell me, I mean, you want to listen, but yeah,
download.
Speaker 2 (50:30):
I hope you want to listen but if you don't just
download it, Listen to it later.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Yeah, if you don't have time just download and then
listen later.
So if you do that, that we canbe sure to bring you more
content each week until thenstay safe and stay suspicious.
Bye adios I know I've also.
Amanda.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Hi Jenna, hello how are you?
Doing.
I am great.
How are you Good?
Speaker 1 (00:11):
I'm excited to welcome everyone to episode six.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome Episode six.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Yay Part two of episode five listen, we have our
brand new, and it's my fault,but we have a brand new section
of the podcast that I'mentitling corrections section.
Yeah, okay.
So those of you who downloaded,like if you set your podcasts
(00:43):
on automatic download, blessyour hearts.
We love that for you.
However, however, um, therewere, there were a little bit of
a.
There was a little, there was alot of a glitch.
Okay, the editor I don't knowwhat she was doing.
Anyway, it was bad.
So if you are listening toepisode five and we're talking
on top of each other, just stop,don't torture yourself just,
(01:06):
yeah, and just know if youdelete it, there's a better
version available that's nottrue for episode one.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That's only true for episode five.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, no, but this time you get a chance to get a
clean, nicely edited once.
I figured out what I was doingum episode, so just don't
despair.
We know that happened.
Thank you to those of you wholet us know.
Um.
But yeah, if so, if, if thesound quality is really bad,
just delete it and re-downloadand you'll be golden and thank
(01:38):
you for your patience, as we hadpublished and then pulled it
and then edited, yeah, andbasically my mom called me.
She's like what the heck?
And it pulled us.
It sounds like I was like, ohmy goodness, Okay, Thanks mom
for listening.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I hadn't gotten to that part yet.
I was listening to it in thelobby for my appointment and I
was like I think it sounds great.
So I hadn't gotten to the trainwreck part yet.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, it was like a yeah.
Anyway, it was a thing, wefixed it, so don't despair.
Dear listeners, thanks forsticking with us.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
As one of my students says yeah, it's just trial and
error, guys.
Trial and error.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Trial and error.
Um.
The second correction in thissection is to our dear friend
Richard, who was our firstmedical mishap writer and he
wrote in about the mishap wherehe basically schnarfed a polo up
his nose, um, polo being a likea lifesaver size mint for those
(02:43):
of us in the US.
Anyway, he wrote that he couldyou know that one would suck and
crew on a mint.
And I was like, oh, that mustbe a British thing.
And basically he pointed out tome you goon, crew was meant to
be chew, so it really wasn't amystery.
(03:04):
Crew was meant to be chew, soit really wasn't a mystery.
Apparently the British alsosuck and chew on their mints,
just like the rest of the world.
So I apologize, dear Richardand the rest of the UK, for
assuming there was somethingreally mysterious and special
about the way that you guys suckon mints.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
In your defense.
It was written like crew, buthave an r.
That brings me to a questionthat has nothing to do with this
podcast, but I've alwayswondered this is, and I don't, I
don't know how to okay, sosometimes they will just like
add an r at the end.
You probably know the answer tothis because you're dear old
(03:46):
mama, but like so, the name emmawill be like emmer, is that?
What is that?
Speaker 1 (03:53):
um, yeah, that's vernacular, depending where
you're from.
In the uk they sometimes add afew consonants to just like help
with that when I'm listening toan audiobook.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
It will.
That will happen likefrequently, and I'm like what is
it with this r thing?
I don't hate it, but I'm likeis it?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
is her name emmer, or is it emma?
Say that it's a common languageseparated by some ocean, um,
and a lot of consonants.
So, yeah, we're gonna.
We're just gonna take it as wetake each word as it comes and I
love it yeah, I'm here for it.
I appreciate richard pointingout that it wasn't crew, it was
(04:33):
chew.
I kind of, I kind of like chewour crew better.
I was like I do too.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
I'm gonna go with crew, and that's why I thought
with the addition of the r thing, I was like maybe crew was
supposed to be chew I don't know, I'm gonna crew me mint um,
anyway, richard, thanks againfor sending your story.
It was hilarious, yeah I lovedit.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
um also speaking of uh places across the pond from
the us, we have listeners inaustria and ab Abu Dhabi now hey
guys, welcome to the pod.
So I would like to say to ourfriends in Abu Dhabi.
(05:24):
So there you go.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Snaps for Jenna Keep it coming people from the
international areas.
Thank you Also.
Did you guys know my friendcould speak so many languages?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I can speak many languages badly, so that is what
I bring to the table here.
But, amanda, I am on the edgeof my seat about this dude that
we talked about last week.
Can you tell us what's in storefor us today?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
yes, I can.
Um, before we start, I'll justuh, throw out some trigger
warnings for this episode, whichinclude miscarriage and, of
course, murder.
Um, references will be postedin the show notes and the book
that I had referenced I don'tknow three or four times last
(06:29):
time and never told anyone.
Um, that book was titled drdeath life of serial killer
michael swango and the authorwas jack smith.
So that will be there with theother references that I used.
So, where we left off, lastweek, the FBI had learned of
(06:49):
Swango and started to build acase against him, specifically
for fraudulently entering a VAwith inaccurate credentials.
Ooh.
No bueno, mm-mm.
So we are in February of 1994,and the FBI was tipped off that
(07:10):
Swango was located in Atlantawhere he had been working as a
chemist at a wastewater plantpoison the water supply.
The FBI contacted the facilityand informed them of Swango's
past and shockingly, notshockingly he was fired on July
(07:34):
22nd, Yikes, Despite a diligentinvestigation, slow bureaucracy
meant that they couldn't get awarrant for his arrest issued
until October 27th.
However, Swango opted to takethe advice of Dr Miller, If we
remember from the last case whathe had told him you know go off
to some far away place thatneeds doctors desperately.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
The guy with no conscience that was like oh okay
, you suck, um, why don't youtake it to the third world
country?
That doesn't he's like you know?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
yeah, third world country, that doesn't.
He's like you know, yeah, youcan't work here, but why don't
you just go somewhere where theyneed you more?
You know that places you're notup to par here, but maybe
somewhere else, like I have somany
issues with that so thatnovember um, he took that advice
of dr miller and he was off tozimbabwe where he used forged
documents to get a job at MeneLutheran Mission Hospital.
(08:26):
He found the job through anoverseas job agency called
Options.
The agency's main mission wasto fill medical positions with
American doctors.
And when he arrived in Zimbabwehe was asked by the director
why would you choose to come toa rural area and make
(08:47):
substantially less money?
I mean swan yeah yeah sus sussus.
That's what the kids are saying.
Um, so you'd make way lessmoney.
It's remote.
And swango simply replied Ilove Africa.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Oh, do you how?
What do you know about Africa?
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Yeah, so the more the director got to know Swango and
witness his work in the field,he realized that he seemed
highly unprepared for even verybasic medical tasks.
And when questioned about thisseemingly lack of preparedness,
swango chalked it up to havingpractice in the field of
neurosurgery.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Okay, so he didn't have much experience outside of
that very prestigious field Forall of the basics.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Yeah, for the bread and butter.
So he was ordered to do fivemonths rotation as an intern at
mipillo hospital in bulloway tostrengthen his skills, which
good on the hospital, right,they're like well, you can stay,
like let's get you some skills.
You just work as an intern, getstronger, yeah, yeah.
(09:57):
And by all accounts he had madefriends and done well during
this rotation, though of coursethere were still skeptics of why
he chose to be there in thefirst place.
Yep, as they should be.
After the five months were over,he went back to Mine Lutheran
Mission Hospital, but Swango hadplanned to return to Bulaway
where, you know, he made friendsonce his contract was finished.
(10:18):
So his plans to return would behalted because, you know, he
just couldn't keep up the act ofbeing a good old boy any longer
.
His dark obsession with deathhad a stronger pull.
Patients once again, sadly,began dying under mysterious
circumstances.
He was witnessed givingpatients unknown medications in
(10:40):
their IVs, as well as extratreatments that they didn't need
, just as it was in America.
The nursing staff began tonotice that he was up to no good
.
Patients cheated death whileunder the care of Soango.
Some left paralyzed, otherswere not so lucky and
unfortunately passed away.
Again, these were patients whowere dying unexpectedly for
(11:03):
reasons completely unrelated towhy they were at the hospital in
the first place.
That's disgusting.
Despite the growing pile ofevidence, hospital
administrators didn't want tobelieve that the American doctor
was truly causing theseproblems intentionally and,
despite the suspicions, no firmconclusions could be made due to
the lack of autopsies.
(11:23):
That's so hard.
That's so hard.
Oh no, unfortunately for her.
I mean not only losing yourchild that's nearly full term
(11:46):
but she was also under Swango'scare.
Oh no, medical staff treatedthe pain with medication and
worked to remove the fetalremains from the womb.
The procedure was noted to beroutine and completed without
any complications.
However, just days later shewas found deceased.
Oh, any complications.
However, just days later shewas found deceased.
(12:06):
The medical director, dr Shiri,began to question medical staff
about the procedure obtainingtestimonies.
It was reported to him by anurse that Swango had injected
the patient with something.
Dr Shiri's seriousness inobtaining testimonies opened the
door for nursing staff to beabsolutely transparent about
(12:28):
their growing concerns.
They shared many stories of theextra treatments and patient
reports of being injected withmedications that they presumed
were unneeded.
Dr Shaziri also collectedtestimonials from these patients
, which is amazing, those thatwere lucky enough to be alive
still, for instance, a patientthat woke up to Swango giving
(12:50):
him a shot that left himparalyzed.
Oh my goodness.
Dr Shaziri was deeply disturbedby everything that he had
learned.
Obviously Fearful that he wouldcontinue his reign of terror,
he transferred Swango to theneighboring Mizumi mission
hospital.
Until they could figure outwhat to do, which I don't know
if that was the best answer.
(13:10):
To just transfer him somewhereelse?
But yeah, just get him out ofhere.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
I mean it was something.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, yeah, dr Shaziri contacted the Lutheran
Church headquarters and alertedthe medical director of what had
been going on.
Contacted the Lutheran Churchheadquarters and alerted the
medical director of what hadbeen going on, and the medical
director also wasted no time inalerting authorities, who
obtained a warrant to searchSwango's living quarters.
There they found a stockpile ofpharmaceuticals, syringes and
(13:37):
various chemicals, and with thathis license to practice in
Zimbabwe was temporarilysuspended, with privileges
revoked until an investigationcould clear him of any
wrongdoing.
The investigation was completedin October and he was
terminated from Mine MissionHospital.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I mean that's the very least that should happen.
I mean the guy should have beenarrested for, yeah, wrongfully
misrepresenting himself andtreating these patients.
But okay, carry on.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Okay, Swango then went to the only other place
that he knew in Zimbabwe.
Back to Bulawayo he reconnectedwith a friend, Ian, that he had
met during his five-monthrotation.
He told Ian the shocking storyof how he was so wrongfully
fired from Minet Hospital.
Ian just couldn't believe itand directed him to a human
(14:33):
rights lawyer that he knewconfidently that he was treated
misfairly.
Swango linked up with thelawyer, who also believed there
was a case for discrimination asthe only American doctor at the
brandis it was discrimination,normally, that if you were
american you could do no wrong.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
So, come on, guys, they were like oh, you're an
american doctor, you, you arethe be-all, end-all of doctors,
and he abused that.
And so now they're using it tosay oh, he wasn't given the
benefit of the doubt because hewas an american doctor.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Oh, that's, that's, that's rich, okay so ian also
went to the director of mipelohospital and urged him to
restore swango's privileges sothat he could practice there.
The director was pretty leeryabout the story and contacted dr
shaziri to see why Swango hadactually had his privileges
(15:29):
revoked.
That's good for him yeah.
Yep, so good on you.
Shaziri advised against hiringSwango and said that things were
still under investigation so hecouldn't really discuss any
details with him, and so,unfortunately, the director of
Mipelo Hospital assumed that itwas just a personal dispute
rather than medical negligence,and swango's rights were
(15:52):
restored and he was hired atmipelo hospital amanda, do you
know what they say about theword assume?
Speaker 1 (15:59):
if you assume, what happens?
Speaker 2 (16:03):
is that when um you know you're making, you're an
ass out of you and me.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Oh, shame me that whole thing, but honestly I mean
I'm not trying to make light ofthis, but it's like obviously
they couldn't conceive thatsomeone would have nefarious
intents or just be like thisridiculously unqualified and
carry on.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
And right.
They want this educatedAmerican doctor to help their
patients.
They don't want to just assumehe's there with ill intentions.
Like you said Exactly, there'sa lack of resources in there,
he's charismatic?
Yeah, unfortunately, they wantto believe that they usually are
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, he's really good.
Yeah, unfortunately, theyusually are Mm-hmm.
(16:51):
Yeah, he's really good atplaying the victim Any whoozles.
So he's at Mapillo Hospital nowand his killing spree would
begin only weeks after starting.
Oh, it was even easier for himto perform these heinous acts at
Mapilo because he had 24-houraccess, leaving little to no
(17:12):
witnesses.
Mysterious deaths occurred leftand right, most overlooked due
to the busy nature of thehospital.
However, there would be a turnin the story when a journalist
tracked Swango down at MipeloHospital.
He was mid-request of theswitchboard to page Swango so
(17:33):
that he could interview him when, much to his surprise, swango
was right behind him.
Swango asked him who they wereand what they wanted, and they
explained that they were ajournalist, and Swango
immediately backed away with hisarms in the air, proclaiming I
can't answer that.
You have to talk to my lawyer.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And then he just ran away oh, methinks thou just
protest really dramatically, andand therefore, uh, though thou
hast something to hide, oh, mygoodness, talk to my lawyer.
Bye like what?
Speaker 2 (18:08):
oh, that's so obvious .
So hospital staff were leftstaring like what the hell just
happened and the journalist, notwanting to leave with nothing,
found the director and beganinterviewing him on whether or
not he was aware that swango wasunder investigation for several
deaths.
Obviously unaware this, thedirector initiated his own
(18:29):
internal investigation and I'msure you can guess what happened
next Swango was told that hisservices were no longer needed
at the hospital and he was firedBye-bye, oh my god, can you
imagine?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Your own hospital is like outed by the press and
you're like wait, what thisguy's what?
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Okay, guess he shouldn't have assumed it was
just a little.
That's the ass part of you andme.
Yeah, oh man, uh, yeah, so itwas all now all over the news
that the american doctor wasaccused of experimenting on
patients.
Swango, of course, stuck withthe story that he was framed and
he returned to Bulaway where hehad an established
(19:14):
relationships with those friends.
So Ian fully took him under hiswing.
He totally believed that he wasbeing pitted against and was
like I got you, bro, which goodon you, you, ian, to be a good
friend.
I have a friend, ian, ian, youare actually a very good friend,
so shout out to my ian.
(19:34):
But anyway, um, so swango, uh,then started staying with the
mother of a gal, leanne, that hehad previously met through Ian.
Leanne was moving anyway andthought, you know, it might be
(19:56):
nice to have the company at homewith her mom, and her mom
agreed.
She did, of course, see Swangoall over the news and asked Ian,
are you sure about him?
And Ian assured Lynette, who'sLeanne's mom, that he was being
framed and he's a good guy.
So it's all good, nothing'sgoing to happen.
Things went generally well withthe living situation.
At first Lynette noted oddbehaviors, but anytime things
(20:20):
got weird, swango would justapologize, and so she just ended
up brushing it off.
Swango then met his newest loveinterest, joanna, while at
dinner with mutual friends, andJoanna was recently divorced and
had a couple of children.
Their relationship progressedpretty quickly as he offered to
(20:40):
help with the kids because youknow, he doesn't have a job.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
So he's got time.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
What else are you going to do, dude?
Yeah, so Joanna would drop thechildren off at Lynette's house
when she went to work and Swangowould watch them.
But the more often that Swangowas around, the more ill that
they became.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
No, please tell me, Amanda, that this man is not
poisoning the children.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
And they weren't the only ones falling violently ill.
There were times where Lynettewould fall suddenly ill and of
course suspected Swango ofmessing with her food or drink,
but these times were so far andfew between she chalked it up to
having bouts of the flu.
She's like kind of like hisex-girlfriend or fiancée from
the last episode.
It's like am I going crazy orare you actually messing with me
(21:27):
, as he did?
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Last episode it's like am Igoing crazy or are you actually
messing with me, right?
Um, so lynette's maids, on theother hand, had other ideas.
They were certain that he wastampering with the food in the
home and later shared an examplethat there was a brand new jar
of peanut butter and the sealhad been tampered with, as if
something was pushed down intothe peanut butter.
(21:47):
The maids were extremelyconcerned with Swango living
there and began sleeping insideof the main house, and they
shared that Swango would get upin the middle of the night and
stand outside of Lynette's doorJust standing there oh weird.
They would make throat-clearingnoises or start humming to
(22:11):
alert him that like, like, hey,we're still awake and we're
paying attention to what you'redoing, and then he would like
quickly go back to his room.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
like nothing to see here bye.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Thank god for them freaking weirdo.
Yeah, they shared the oddbehavior with lynette and she
asked him to leave, thankfully,and he was apparently so pissed
that he couldn't mess with heranymore and or that he was
kicked out undecided that hedecided to tamper with her car
instead and he poured a largeamount of sugar into her gas
(22:39):
tank.
What a shithead.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Oh, oh, my god, yeah, no, oh, he needs.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
So now he's kicked out.
He's kicked out of lynette'shouse and so now he goes to live
with joanna full-time.
His days consisted of loungingaround joanna's house until one
day he received a phone callfrom the police, who informed
him that they wanted tointerview him in person.
Of course, of course I'll showup for an interview, you know,
but it's going to have to be thenext day because I'm pretty
busy watching children right now.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Yeah, it's pretty busy poisoning people and yeah,
okay.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
So the police agreed shockingly and they were like,
okay, come in.
They agreed on August 29th andthe story he told Joanna was you
know, I just really need to getaway from it all.
And that he wanted to plan ahiking trip to a national park.
And, as the understandinggirlfriend that she was, she
(23:40):
agreed that you know that willbe really good for you and
dropped him off at a Zimbabweanbus station.
Oh man, and is this where welose him again?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
I don't know, but it's time for a chart note Chart
note that was more like a wolfor coyote howling than a nice
musical segue.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Sorry about that I know I loved that.
Welcome to the chart notesegment where we learn about
what's happening in medicine andhealthcare.
Okay, so on back-to-back chartnotes.
So you know, I googled hottopics in healthcare today and I
found an alarming amount ofarticles on mistrust that
(24:28):
patients have for medicalprofessionals.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
What Say it isn't so.
That's what the premise of thiswhole show is.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
I know I said, hmm, that seems like an appropriate
topic for this case, Because,hello, how can we say it's easy
to trust when we had a MichaelSwango going around poisoning
people, Right?
I mean, granted, this was along time ago, but anyway.
Um, however, the route andmistrust and veering of patients
that I chose to focus on is howpeople are turning to social
(24:57):
media platforms such as Tik TOKfor health information and
guidance.
Yes, this is not a new idea.
However, you know how long havewe heard of people Googling
their symptoms Guilty?
But how are we to trust thatthe answers we're finding are
reliable?
And just because one's person,one person's experience, was
(25:17):
shared online doesn't mean thatwill be the trajectory or
experience that others will have.
Right, Because everybody'sdifferent and studies show that
many young people prefer to usesocial media in place of those
traditional search engines likeGoogle to seek answers, which I
was kind of like that seems alittle more dangerous.
Right, Because now we just havea Joe Schmo like me being like
(25:40):
hey, I had this surgery and thisis what happened to me you know
like no medical knowledge inthat area at all.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Exactly, and you know , anecdotal evidence is not as
powerful as, you know,full-blown studies, but it's
more powerful when I mean, evenif you weren't online, if you
talked to your auntie, who youknow had the same thing, and she
said this is awful, whatever,you're going to go with that
instead of maybe that was anoutlier situation, uh, yeah,
(26:13):
yeah so I found a little studyum so we have a rose dimitrianus
dimitrianus um.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
She is a third year medical student at the
University of Chicago.
Pritz Pritzker, pritzker.
That just caught me off guard,like I tripped on a curb on a
sidewalk, sorry yeah, andthere's a lot of consonants
there, I'm just gonna goPritzker.
Pritzker School of Medicine andother UChicago researchers
(26:48):
recently published a new studywhich systematically analyzed
health information on TikTok tosee if they could identify
trends, such as how muchmisinformation is out there and
does it come from specific typesof content creators?
They found that nearly half ofthe videos contained non-factual
information, with a largeproportion of misleading videos
(27:10):
coming from non-medicalinfluencers, like we already
talked about, of course, thereare endless amounts of health
conditions that can be searched,so the researchers opted to
focus on hashtag sinus talk fora more manageable analysis.
For a more manageable analysis,they focused on this specific
(27:30):
healthcare condition andperformed their search during a
single 24-hour period.
To limit the effects ofTikTok's ever-shifting
algorithms, they searched theapp using specific hashtags
related to sinusitis, includinghashtag sinusitis, hashtag sinus
and hashtag sinus infection.
The researchers found thatnearly 44% of the videos
(27:54):
contained non-factualinformation, with a significant
proportion coming fromnon-medical influencers, who
were more likely to spreadmisleading content.
Medical professionals' videoswere generally of higher quality
, containing less misinformation, which I was like.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
44 that's a high, a high percentage, but at least
it's less than him I know I'malso like, okay, so if we could
just figure out who the medicalprofessionals really are.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
I know, because if I made a TikTok right now, I could
say I'm whoever you could sayyou're a medical professional.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
No one's going to know that You're not a medical
sinus professional.
Right, exactly.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
So many areas, so the researchers highlighted the
dangers of health misinformation, such as ineffective or
dangerous treatments beingpromoted, which could lead to
confusion and harm.
For example, a trend of puttinggarlic up the nose for sinus
relief could cause harm despiteappearing harmless and then
increasing emergency visits toget garlic clothes out of one's
(29:04):
binaries they just need thatlittle tweezer that Richard
talked about.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Never mind the polo.
What about the garlic?
Okay, yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
The study emphasized the importance of critically
evaluating health information onsocial media and consulted
trusting Nope Consulting trustedhealth healthcare providers.
It also suggested that medicalprofessionals should be more
active on social media to helpcombat misinformation and
improve the quality of healthcontent available online, which
is a great, a great idea.
(29:37):
If you have time for that andyou want to be on social media,
yeah.
So I'd like to just take alittle special moment here to
shout out to our ENT colleagues,because we work closely with
you guys and we love you guys,love you, love you guys.
Special shout out to shannonand gretchen love you guys,
(29:59):
emily and isaac.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Okay, yeah, okay, okay, back to the story.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Okay, yeah this is where swango falls off the grid
for a couple weeks again andresurfaces in zambia, zambia,
why did I say zambia?
Yeah oh okay, I just like, waslike, felt like I said zombie
for a second okay sorry it'sgetting late at night and my
(30:29):
brain is getting squirrely.
so he resurfaces in Zambia andhe has a job at the university
teaching hospital.
If you're geographicallychallenged like me, I had to
look up a lot of maps for this.
(30:49):
So, for reference, zambia is alittle over 20 hours from
Bulawayo.
That's really far away.
When I lived in Washington, Iwas 26 hours away from Minnesota
, so I don't know, I feel likethat was a good distance.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Yeah, that's a long ways away.
Yeah, I don't know, I feel likethat was a good distance.
Yeah, that's a long ways away,yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
So after about two months of working there, the
hospital had learned of Swango'spending charges he was facing
from a bulletin that was sentout by Zimbabwe to all of the
countries in Southwest Africa.
Oh wow, officially fired onNovember 19th 1996.
And knowing that he'd need torelocate again, and far away
(31:32):
from the Southern region ofSouthern Africa that he had been
reigning terror on, he reachedout to another medical placement
company, where he secured aposition at a medical facility
in Saudi Arabia.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Oh, no, and and for reference again for those of us
that are geographicallychallenged.
Saudi Arabia is about 154 hoursaway by car and a 10 and a half
hour flight from South Africa um, if you were american trained
(32:13):
because now they have peoplethat saudis that are, um they
have sent for training inamerica and europe and whatever.
But at the time in the 90s,they didn't send people over
seats.
So if you came with a trainingfrom america you were like, oh
you know, play somehow over thetraining of people who had
trained in the Middle Eastlocally.
(32:36):
So so he was already kind of ona pedestal when he applied
there.
Karina sorry.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
No, thank you for sharing that.
I'm so sorry if you guys canhear this, but my dog just
started snoring, so it's betterthan barking.
But just enjoy the ambiance inthe background.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
We're boring your dog , okay, no she's tired from
daycare.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
's a girl, okay anyway, um.
So I'd like to also point outthat we're talking about the
mid-90s here, so it's not likepeople are opening up a social
media app or a news outlet appon their phone and learning of
this monster, leaving this trailof death behind him, like, like
you said, he's already beingset a tier above, even though he
(33:25):
shouldn't be, and they justdon't have the outreach with
social media like we do now.
So Swango was set to start atRoyal Hospital in Duran in March
of 1997.
And this is where I'd like totake a moment to thank the Saudi
government for a policy thatthey had in place.
(33:47):
The policy was that all visashad to be issued in a visitor's
home country.
This meant that Swango wouldhave to go back to the United
States to get a Saudi visa towork.
So Swango tried to argue thatthis policy you know, saying I
can get the visa in South Africa.
It's much closer for me totravel than go back to the
(34:09):
United States.
But they did not budge.
So this guy was eitherdesperate beyond belief or
absolutely insane, because hechose to fly back to the U?
S to get the work visa.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
There you go.
I will say they are prettyresolute in their rules.
I mean, they have a definitehierarchy of who comes from
where, how much you get paid,what you can do, based on your
country of origin.
So that doesn't surprise me.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
On June 27th 1997, he landed at O'Hare International
Airport in Chicago where he wasdetained by immigration
officials and his passport wasconfiscated.
Investigators knew that theywould need more evidence to have
a Loctite case against him formurder.
But they had plenty of evidenceagainst him to charge him with
(35:01):
forgery.
But they had plenty of evidenceagainst him to charge him with
forgery.
They knew that the sentence forforgery would be short but that
it would probably buy themenough time to continue
gathering that evidence thatthey needed and knowing all the
while that he'd be safely lockedbehind bars.
Yeah.
(35:23):
So, facing the threat ofextradition to Zimbabwe, he
agreed to plead guilty to thelong-standing forgery charges
against him.
He entered a guilty plea fordefrauding the government in
March of 1998.
Just a few months later, inJuly, he was convicted and
sentenced to three and a halfyears in prison.
While Swango might havebelieved that he'd soon be
released and could pass the timein prison with hot meals and
television, he was mistaken.
(35:45):
While he was safely locked up,investigators were building a
case that would ensure a muchlonger sentence for his other
crimes.
Documents were uncovered andbodies were exhumed
(36:11):
no-transcript.
Just as Swango was nearing theend of his three and a half year
sentence, he was paid a visitby these agents, who presented
the mounting evidence againsthim.
He was hit with three counts ofmurder and several other lesser
charges, and was formallyindicted on these charges on
July 17th.
Of course, he initially plednot guilty, which is the same
(36:34):
approach he had taken when hewas accused of poisoning his
co-workers in the 1980s.
However, prosecutors made itvery clear what was at stake.
If convicted, swango could facethe death penalty in New York
or be extradited to Zimbabwe,where he was likely to receive
harsher punishment.
Yeah.
(36:56):
It's unclear whether he feareddeath or the prospect of being
imprisoned in Zimbabwe, butunder the pressure, he once
again relented and agreed toplead guilty.
Ultimately, swango wassentenced to three consecutive
life sentences for three murdercharges, without the possibility
of parole.
(37:16):
While he was formally convictedof three murders, it is
suspected that there wereupwards of 60 murders.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
Oh my god 60?
Speaker 2 (37:27):
Right, that's so many .
And now, in his 70s, swangoremains imprisoned at ADX
Florence, which is a maximumsecurity federal penitentiary in
Colorado where inmates havelittle to no contact with other
inmates and or staff.
He actually requested to betransferred to ADX because he
(37:49):
believed it would be safer forhim to live out the rest of his
years there fearing what otherinmates might do to him.
Because, you know, he has otherexperience with being imprisoned
and apparently he had facedthreats from former fellow
inmates when he was imprisonedbefore.
Huh wonder why.
Yeah, um, I didn't know this.
(38:10):
Maybe I should have known this,but adx is home to some of the
world's most notorious criminals, including mexican drug kingpin
el chapo shoe bomber, richBomber.
Richard Reed and BostonMarathon Bomber Jahar Sarni.
Ah, dang it, jahar Sarniho.
(38:31):
Yes, you guys.
I even put a pronunciation keyin there for me, tripped on the
sidewalk again.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Those are baddies.
Baddies, I know baddies, I knowbad bad, bad, bad.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Since his incarceration, he has remained
largely silent because he's abig anyway, refusing all
interviews, requests or anyother inquiries into his life
behind bars.
Despite pleading guilty to thecharges that led to his
indictment, swango continued topresent himself as a victim of
(39:08):
unjust persecution and seemsdetermined to maintain that
narrative until his death,because he's a big puke bag.
Oh, come on, dude.
So unfortunately, since he'schoosing to remain silent, we'll
probably never get a chance tounderstand why he did what he
did.
You know we often try todissect if it was the old nature
(39:33):
versus nurture situation, butby all accounts, he had a
seemingly normal childhood.
His parents were divorced andhis mom did odd things like wrap
their Christmas presents inpaper bags and just stuck them
under the tree.
But is that enough for someoneto turn into a serial killer?
I mean, they had presents.
I mean no, you had Christmaswith presents, so it sounds
(39:54):
pretty fortunate to me.
He also has two other siblingsthat didn't grow up to be serial
killers.
So there's that he alwaysseemed to have an obsession with
death and dying from hisoverzealous enthusiasm for
deadly EMT calls, standing byhis patients coded without
offering a helping hand, Hisfascination with making gory
(40:17):
scrapbooks and his darkobsession of mixing chemical
concoctions to experiment on hiscolleagues and patients with,
it's like.
Was he just obsessed with theeffects that the chemicals may
or may not have on people, orwas his motive always to kill?
He was also known for beingmanipulative and invasive, often
(40:38):
trying to cover up his actionsand any wrongdoing.
Soango's killings spannedseveral states in the US and
several countries, suggestingthat his actions were not
isolated incidents but part of alarger pattern.
Professionals, includingpsychologists and criminologists
, believe that Swango'smotivations were driven by a
desire for control, power andperhaps even a fascination with
(41:02):
death, and have pointed out thathe has demonstrated classic
signs of a medical serial killer.
so it's just scary that someonewho could use their trusted
position to inflict harm whileevading suspicion like eek yeah
the darkness within, yeah, thedarkness within swango is
(41:24):
difficult for the rest of us allto comprehend, which is a good
thing, and we can only hope thatthere aren't many others like
him working in our clinics andhospitals this is amanda.
Speaker 1 (41:36):
This is such an interesting case because, I mean
, not everybody that goes intothe medical profession, it does
it for an altruistic reason.
But like what?
What do you think it was thatum gave, that, spurred him on,
(42:00):
that, gave him their the reasonfor doing what he did?
Because I don't understand, Ijust don't get it like yeah why
would?
Speaker 2 (42:10):
you yeah I think that he just like had a wire twisted
weird upstairs because he wasso obsessed with death and dying
, and I do think that he truly Imean he was really good at
chemistry.
He won chemistry awards.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
Yeah, he seemed to be so intelligent.
How?
Can someone not?
Intelligent, who was interestedin healthcare and and putting
all that it took to get thathealthcare, education and
graduate.
How can they?
What was in it for him?
(42:51):
What was he getting out of itto kill these people?
Speaker 3 (42:57):
I honestly think that he just was like here's my new
recipe.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
I'm going to see what it does to you.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
Kinda I don't know, it seemed like he was
indiscriminate.
It was like it could be mypatients, it could be my
co-workers.
Like he wasn't just like tryingto come up with a cure for
something that didn't go well.
He was just like, oh, checkthis, I can poison my co-workers
at the same time as, like, killmy patients I I've never heard
(43:30):
yeah, I've never heard of a caselike this.
I've never heard of a guy likethis I had never heard of him.
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I highly doubt he'll ever hear this, but if you do,
we're on the patient side andyou're a puke oh my goodness,
well, you did such a good jobresearching this and presenting
this and we really appreciatethat.
Speaker 1 (43:52):
And, um, again, this was I can't believe, given the
the reach that this guy had, theamount of murders and
poisonings and things that he'sdone.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
But I haven't heard of this, but thank you and I
just always think, like all thesecond chances, like this guy
was almost stopped so many times.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
God.
And then we're like oh well,you know, you're not good enough
for us soil because you're abit of an ass, but maybe you can
go overseas and spread yourincompetence there.
But the problem was, it wasn'tincompetence, it was
maliciousness.
Mm-hmm, you know?
Yeah, it was evil.
It was just pure evil.
(44:38):
Yeah, it's been sick.
Well great, I mean you know,know.
No, we need to know thesethings.
Um, and I appreciate youbringing that up, um, I'm gonna
lighten the mood by uh readinganother medical mishap I'm so
excited for this this is amedical mishap listener email.
(45:05):
Today's medical mishap is fromKevin, he writes thank you so
much for starting this podcast.
I truly appreciate your humorand the research you do to bring
these cases to our attention.
You've given me something tolook forward to on Wednesdays
now.
Yay, happy holidays, thanks,kevin.
Yay, kevin, attention.
(45:25):
You've given me something tolook forward to on wednesdays
now.
Yeah, thanks, kevin.
Um, he says I'm writing about amedical mishap that happened
many years ago, but it stillmakes me laugh to this day.
My sweet elderly grandma, jean,saw an ent physician for her
recurring sinusitis and an earinfection.
He prescribed her a rinsesolution for her sinuses and
drops for her recurringsinusitis and an ear infection.
He prescribed her a rinsesolution for her sinuses and
drops for her ear, withinstructions to come back in two
(45:48):
weeks for a follow-up visit.
Her sinuses were clear twoweeks later, but the ear
infection had gotten worse.
The ENT was puzzled and askedJean if she'd used the drops as
he'd prescribed.
She was adamant that she'dfollowed instructions to a T and
pulled the paper withinstructions from her purse.
Doctor, I've been putting thisin my rectum three times daily
(46:12):
for ten days, but my ear isstill plugged, confused and
perhaps horrified let's hopehorrified, the doctor grabbed
the prescription from her handsand read it over carefully.
The note read instill fivedrops three times daily in the R
period ear.
Oh my gosh.
(46:36):
So of course we never let herlive that down.
That is so funny.
Never let her live that down,that is so funny.
It's still a source of smilesand laughter as we remember our
grandma at our familyget-togethers over the years.
Oh bless, I will say this was atime when patients unwaveringly
followed the physician'sinstructions to a t and would
(46:57):
never question what the doctorsays.
I think that this has changedover recent years and that's a
positive thing, but listening tosome of your cases, it seems we
still have a way to go.
Thank you for doing what you doand keep the episodes coming oh
my gosh kevin.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
No, thank you, thank you kevin, oh, bless your heart.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
That was our right ear, yeah, rear.
So she's putting ear drops inher butt.
Oh no.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
Anyway.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
I'm sorry, ties into our chart note for today too.
Speaker 2 (47:29):
Again, shout out to our ENT colleagues Don't ever
write R dot ear.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Bless her heart.
Can you imagine howuncomfortable the treatment was
and ineffective, absolutely, andshe's like.
Well, who am I to question the?
Doctor.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
And she's like, yes, of course I've been following
these directions to a D.
Oh, bless your heart, GrandmaJean.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
That's my favorite.
Rest in peace.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
Yeah, so Okay, well, all best.
And please.
Yeah, so okay, well, all right,jenna.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
Yeah, what can our listeners expect to hear next
week?
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Oh well, next week we're covering an episode
entitled Nefarious Nurses theLethal Lovers of Alpine Manor.
Oh, stay tuned, listeners.
Entitled nefarious nurses thelethal lovers of alpine manor.
(48:33):
Oh, stay tuned, listeners, itgets pretty interesting next
week.
Um, don't miss a beat.
Subscribe and follow doctoringthe truth wherever you enjoy
your podcasts, for stories thatshock, intrigue and educate
trust after all, is a delicatething.
We want to spend, we want tosend.
We don't want to spend, we wantto send.
A special thank you to oursubscriber.
(48:55):
Sandy show is the missing.
Is that what I'm saying?
Scow Show.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Scow Sandy Huh.
Speaker 1 (49:03):
Scow Huh.
Speaker 2 (49:05):
Scow Scow.
Just read it like a S-K-O-WScow Scow Did I say it.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
Okay, you did, sandy Scow.
Okay, thank you for support ofour podcast, sandy Scow.
Sandy, because she's subscribedto our podcast, will get to
choose a topic for an upcomingepisode.
Oh boy, uh-huh, you too cansubscribe to our podcast for as
low as $3 a month.
(49:33):
Your subscription will get youa shout-out on the show and a
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In addition, we're looking forother ways to bring our
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So click the link under therating view and subscribe today.
You can also text us directlyon our website at
(49:55):
doctoringthetruthatbuzzsproutcomand definitely email us your
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doctoringthetruth at gmailcom,and be sure to follow us on
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And don't forget to download.
We don't get credit unless youdownload rate and review, so we
(50:19):
can be sure download folks, ifyou heard that download,
download, download even if youdon that Download, download,
download.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Download, even if you don't listen to it, just
download it.
Yeah, you can just download.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
Tell me, I mean, you want to listen, but yeah,
download.
Speaker 2 (50:30):
I hope you want to listen but if you don't just
download it, Listen to it later.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Yeah, if you don't have time just download and then
listen later.
So if you do that, that we canbe sure to bring you more
content each week until thenstay safe and stay suspicious.
Bye adios I know I've also.
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