Who you are is not a democracy with Natalie Davison and Yves Doucet

Yves Doucet (Dovico CEO) and Natalie Davison (Marrow Marketing)

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
So this is the podcast and I think I've been,
I'm going to entitle it.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
MMM.
MMM.

Speaker 1 (00:12):
Who you are is not a democracy.
When you told me that there's,okay.
So I'm here.
My name is eve.
Sorry.
Even does that.
And this is Natalie Davidson.
It's actually Davison.
Oh, sorry.
Yeah, it's actually eve.
Yes.
I know.
I got you.

(00:33):
No you don't.
But I've heard people say itlike, yeah, yeah.
We can start again or no, we'regoing to do, I'm here with nat.
Natalie Davidson.
Davidson.
David.
Dave is Dave David Davidson.
Davidson Davidson.
Yeah.
Is that better?
Davidson Davidson's.
Everybody thinks there's asecond d.
That's the popular name.

(00:55):
And Davidson is a rarer, yeah,yeah, yeah.
But you're rare.
You're rare.
The rare air of courage.
Oh yeah.
I like that.
That's you.
Yeah.
They're rare air of courage.
You are.
Okay.
So, um, this podcast should betitled Fire.
No, no, it's okay.

(01:17):
So yeah, this is our podcastthat okay.
You write who you like meaningme or you or anybody else.
Right.
And the, uh, the whole, uh,light discussion about like that
we give our vote away.
Like we, we, we, we actually askpeople who we are.
Right.
And when you said that to metoday, I bet.

(01:38):
Wow.
Right?
Like, yeah, it's like who youare is not a democracy that you
don't devote.
Like you don't, you don't, well,you should and you should not,
but yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I think too often we, we do,we, I mean it's really, really
hard to ignore feedback aboutyourself particularly, but the
content of your character, butyou know, yeah, it's hard.

(02:00):
Yeah, of course.
It's hard when somebody comesand has, you know, has to weigh
in on who you are as a person.
I think it's very hard to lookaway from.
Uh, but it's kind of importantbecause I don't you think that
when you get that, who youthink, where do they get off?
Right?
Like where do they, like whatgives them permission to tell me
about my character?
Yeah.

(02:21):
I definitely, I default now, Idon't know if this is, does,
it'd be interesting to figureout whether this is a gendered
thing in our culture.
Like whether girls are raised,girls are raised to be nice and
compliant.
Yeah.
Boys are raised or havetraditionally been raised to be
leaders.
Yeah.
And so I don't know if it'snecessarily more of a gender
thing or a social construct ornot, but you know, we're raised

(02:44):
as, especially as girls to bepleasant and compliant and to
make sure nobody around youfeels uncomfortable at any given
time.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:54):
So many things I could tell you right now, but
I'm not[inaudible] do you, doyou agree that the

Speaker 3 (03:00):
women in our society race that work traditionally?

Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah, I know there's no doubt about it that men are
raised to go hunt, right.
To go kill the near or killed amoose.
Right.
And men, women are there to keepthe peace, right.
If you want to be kinder or morecommunity oriented and yeah,
there's no doubt about thatwithout, without generalizing
because the problem withgeneralizing is like you pay put
everybody in that and I hate anAPP suite and that back to our

(03:25):
topic, right.
You are not part of generalgeneral people like you are in
individual.
Yes.
Like, right, so a week wecategorize, so yeah.
So maybe it is a gender thingthat we were raised differently.
Right.
So I totally agree with that.
That were, we do raise,especially my generation, like
I'm fun dating back a few moreyears in you like a lot to

(03:46):
scupper yes.
Yeah.
And a so we were raiseddifferently.
Yeah.
It was worse and no faults toour parents or to the society is
just what we knew at that time.
Right.

Speaker 3 (03:56):
Yeah, absolutely.
I think everybody is doing thebest they can with the
information that absolutely.
We're doing the best we canright now.
Yeah.
Think I'm sure my kids all talkabout my generation eventually
and my grandkids will think thatmy generation is completely
backward.
But you know, having been raisedin or you genex yeah, no, no,
you're Melien.
Yeah, man.
I'm not a millennial.
I'm going to Gen X.

(04:16):
I'm this inbetween.
Um, that's so suiting for you.
Yeah.
Right.
This is in between awkward time.
So I, I'm 1980, so I kind ofcross in that I heard as the
term is all recently.
I don't know, nothing's reallylike caught on as a label for a
generation.
So it's, but we're in that kindof middle time.

(04:37):
But what's interesting is, youknow, we were still raised in
fairly traditional gender roles,like similar to yours and, uh,
so you're raised as a, you know,as a girl to be pleasant and
compliant and you know, notargue too much and not push too
hard.
And um, girls who stand up forwhat they want can get some
pretty negative stereotypes.
Turn up though.
Have you had that[inaudible]story of my life?

(05:01):
Um, yeah.
You know,

Speaker 1 (05:03):
wait like people meet like me, like my age, my age
group, my agenda.

Speaker 3 (05:08):
Well, I think so for sure.
But like, if we want to even goback in time in time, go back in
time to like high school and youknow, if you want, if you want
boys to like you or you want tobe popular, even in those ages,
yeah.
You generally, you gotta be cooland not rock the boat.
Um, and when I was going throughuniversity, the same kind of
thing, it was still a timewhere, um, this was the late

(05:31):
nineties, you know, as women,the women who really stood up
and call themselves feminists inthe late nineties, early two
thousands, that was a reallycourageous thing to do.
And I would argue, not acceptedamong my peer group at the time,
like the people that I spendtime with.
And so it's really been anevolution for me to be able to
get more and more in touch withwho I am and more and more

(05:54):
confident to be able toeventually, you know, today call
myself feminist and um, and tobe able to kind of lean into
some of these values that Ididn't feel comfortable I would
have, I would not have satacross from, uh, a mentor of
mine who's of your gender andage three years ago and said

(06:15):
that I'm a feminist.
There's no way.
I didn't have enough sick insecurity and myself to be able
to say that.
And so I think it's really, thisisn't what you asked me about at
all, but it's a reallyinteresting thing to start to
explore and think about thesocial constructs in which were
raised and how they affect,

Speaker 1 (06:32):
but that is what I'm asking is how do you discover
who you are?
So I'm kind of curious to say tosee how you, like how do you,
how did you identify yourself asa feminist when you were in high
school?
Or did you not?

Speaker 3 (06:46):
I wouldn't have, I wouldn't know.
I wouldn't have.
So this is new for you?
Ah, yeah.
Yeah, 100%.
I mean, I certainly would havehad some similar values like
deep down inside.
Yeah.
But I wouldn't have had thecourage or confidence to
articulate them out loud andspeak them out loud.
Not at all.
So I would say like, yeah,three, three or four years ago,
I still wouldn't have said thatout loud.
I would have definitely keptthat one to myself and uh, been

(07:08):
a little more focused on, um,presenting in this conversation
in the way that I felt youwanted me to.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
But this is interesting, right?
I, I've been looking at wordsand you'll never guess what I
did.
Actually, I took a, a tick yourcomment this morning that you
like, I was doing apresentation, they would just
don't want to share this side.
Sorry.
Yeah.
And you said you should go intothe next speech, you know,
because this guy came to thenext meet, I forget his name and
you had to go out and markbought it and he had no agenda

(07:36):
and you just put, this is youragenda on the wall.
What do you want to talk about?
Well, they just did that.
Okay.
All right.
We Dalton the student and I go,I went there totally unprepared
with nothing to speak of.
And I said, okay, you're goingto pick the agenda.
And I said, I have, I can talkfor 15 minutes on a topic.
So for topics, give me fourwords and they just yelled at
forwards.
Cool.
And you have to try this.

(07:57):
This is beautiful.
Yeah.
It's this and that.
It's a stress.
It's, in other words, the firstword was, um, motivation, um,
ambition, snack.

Speaker 3 (08:12):
Oh my gosh, that's what your podcast should be.
Motivation, ambition, snacks,success.
[inaudible].
Right.
You can cut it into foursegments.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
Um, like we're talking about you are, you are
who you are as a person.
That, and it helped me identifywho I was because if I went
there with, while these are thestories that I remember for
books, I read, well it's notgoing to flow well because I'm
trying to string that together.
Yeah.
But I totally went there andsaying, well, this is who I am
and accept who I am exceptwhite, my age.
I except my, you know, my, my,my, my status like steps and I

(08:46):
let it go.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I guess you're just going tothat.
That's okay.

Speaker 3 (08:50):
Thank you so much.
Like you're in a creative stateand those moments.
Yeah.
Right.
And you reset my day thismorning, so I just want to

Speaker 1 (08:56):
thank you so much for that.
Yeah.
We had coffee this morning andthen you've said, yeah, messaged
me and said, hey, let's do apodcast and here we are.
Here we are.
So I, um, so getting back tolike, if you look at the word
feminist, right?
You know, it's kind ofinteresting because it means
something to you and it needssomething to me.
But then we attached the meaningof that word to the other

(09:19):
person's interpretation of theword.
That's what we're scared of.
Yeah.
What do we think it is?
Right?
Yeah.
It's the weight that you put onthe word feminist.
Right?

Speaker 3 (09:27):
So my, uh, I have a family member who I love very
much that probably disagreeswith me on every fundamental
matter.
Like when it comes, we all likeno on a whole other level, like
on a whole other level.
And, uh, you know, God love him.
I mean, I know he loves medeeply and he's so generous and

(09:47):
um, and I'm a very importantperson in his life.
But a few years ago I didn'tidentify myself out loud as a
feminist yet at that point, butI had, um, I'd shared an ad.
It's an old Lego at, and I thinkyou've probably seen me share it
before.
It's a little girl innon-gendered clothing.
You only know this little girl,she has two pigtails to read

(10:08):
pigtails.
It's from 1984 and she's gotblue jeans on and a striped tee
shirt and she's got lego.
And back then Lego was justlego.
There wasn't a bill girls linein the boys line.
It was just lego.
It was just multicolored blocksthat you built stuff with is
this little girl is holding herlego creation of like just

(10:29):
regular primary colors and itsays what it is is beautiful.
And then it talks about thecreation that this kid made.
And it was such a great ad thenand it's still a great ad now.
And so I'd shared it right afterthe u s election.
Okay.
Uh, right after the women'smarch when people who maybe
didn't agree with the women'smarch, we're feeling really

(10:49):
inflamed and reactive towardfeminists.
And so I shared this, this adcompletely unrelated and I said,
I look at this beautiful littlefeminist and this family member
unfriended me on Facebook andfriended me on Facebook, like
freaked out on my Facebook.
Um, unfriended me, has notreacted me three years later.

(11:12):
We still see each other atfamily functions, still buys me
birthday gifts, but, um, willnot have an online relationship
with me, uh, because that wasso, so offensive to him.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
So, so like how does that, like

Speaker 3 (11:27):
what weight do you put on that vote?
Yes.
So he doesn't get a vote, but hedid, he did before, right?
Like once upon a time he did geta vote and that's the problem.
So that's why I, you know, Ididn't feel comfortable assuming
these identities in such a largeway and I definitely wouldn't
have felt comfortable speakingout because they didn't have
enough security in, um, myself.

(11:50):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think that's such a greattagline

Speaker 1 (11:54):
when somebody attacks your character that way and say,
well, I'm sorry you don't get avote.
Yeah, right.
Yeah.
Like you're talking to yourself,but you can actually say that,
that we talked about that.
How do you, how do you unfriendsomeone face to face, right.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
And I think there is likethere's power in doing that and
we talked about that a, thatthere's power in and saying,
okay, well sorry, you're notgoing to vote right on why I

(12:18):
believe I am right.
You don't get a vote.
And I too, I'm taking that voteout.
Right?

Speaker 3 (12:23):
Yeah, exactly.
And then that's it.
It's like, you know who makes upthis community of you, right?
Oh yeah.
I like that though.
It's community of humanity.
Well who makes up at, I meanreally you should or the people
you love the most are the peoplethat are closest to you.
So, you know, I have like a lotof weird moments where I'm like,
Ooh, this is kind of creepy.
So this morning, like, and whenI say that like creepy

(12:45):
coincidences, so somethinghappens and I'm like, what?
You're going to call me creepy?
Because I thought, oh yeah,right.
No, you're definitely notcreepy.
But I had these creepy momentswhere something will happen and
then all these other things willhappen and I'm like, Ooh, like
am I psychic?
What's happening right now?
So I had a this morning, youknow, we were talking about this
particular situation and youwere telling me something was

(13:07):
bothering you.
And I was, and I said to you,um, you know who you are is like
the, it's not a democracy.
People don't get a vote.
Right.
Who was crazy was I went, uh,after that and I just opened my
Facebook to scroll for a coupleof minutes and I have, um, a
friend, acquaintance from agroup that I'm in.
She, she lives in Boston and shejust released her book and I

(13:30):
haven't, I have, I don't have ityet.
I haven't read it yet.
I'm so excited too.
I'm so proud of her.
She's getting traction likecrazy.
She was, uh, I think she wassecond on the, on the bestseller
list last week after MichelleObama.
Like, oh my God.
Oh yeah.
It's going huge.
Right?
So it's a, her name is LauraGassner.
Otting in her book is calledlimitless.

(13:51):
Limitless.
But this morning I'm one of thehost of good morning and good
morning America on Instagramquoted the book.
Oh Wow.
And the quote that I'm going toget wrong right now cause I
don't have Instagram in front ofme, was about not giving people
a vote and who you are gotta beShit.
Sad, serious, please.
And so I like literally within,it wasn't even 20 minutes later.

(14:14):
Oh, isn't that wild?
It's not really, I think it's

Speaker 1 (14:18):
amazing actually.
It gets like if you, once youtake away the votes of people
that are defining who you are,you, you start to be aware, you
start to actually resonatedifferently.
You start to like, you start tolook differently and you start
to observe differently.
Your, it was, all these thingsare there.
We just don't see them.
Yeah.
Right.
Because they're blocked by thepeople who are taking our votes

(14:41):
away.
Yes.
Right.
So we've guys were not aligned.
Whatever sounds yeah.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
That's so true.
Anyway, I couldn't believe thatthat quote was there.
So now I'm even like crazy or toget this book right now.
Um, yeah.
So I'm

Speaker 1 (14:52):
so excited.
I'm so pumped to read it.
I just felt like I can tell you,well, you know, when you, when
you're like digitally, here's mymorning thought and then
somebody's written it in theirbook, feel like she's my soul
sister.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Really, really cool.
So, um, yeah.
So what was the question again?
I don't know if we're talkingabout the phrase, you don't get

(15:12):
a vote, you don't get a vote oreven the better phrases.
You get a vote.
I get the vote.
Yeah.
You get a vote, like meetingpeople and you say, okay, you
get a vote today.
Right?
Because there's some people,like I find that I like, I would
totally receive your criticismon my character or from, you
know, full of bs or somethingpositively.
It's kind of interesting, right?

(15:33):
I wouldn't do that foreverybody, but I would certainly
took it from you.
I hope that we've have enoughpsychological safety in our
relationship and I would saythat we, you know, we, I think,
yeah, that chuck and likewise.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You've definitely call me out ona couple of things and jab you,
and they've changed the gameevery time, every time.
We need to say, hey, you know,you're not seeing this.

(15:54):
Yeah.
Go try this.
It's always, it always works.
Yeah.
So it's like who are thosepeople that are actually see
you?
Yeah.
Like really see you and they'renot seeing it through the lens
of themselves.
They just see, oh, maybe that'sit.
Right.
They're not doing it to boostertheir eye, their ego or
whatever.
Right.
They're doing it to basically,um, and it's not like, it's kind

(16:15):
of interesting because peoplewere arguing, I'm telling you
these things about you, so yourservice of yourself and like
your content.
This, I really do.
Like this is my big thing.
Like in order to prove my givingadvice to make yourself feel
better, that's what peopleaccused.
Yeah.
No.
So what I do right, to makemyself write to about my
narrative that I'm not enoughand I'm just sharing with the

(16:36):
family.
That's my narrative.
That's who I like.
That's my, my story.
That I tell myself in the backthe back secrets in my life.
Right.
And, um, what I do to make thatright is I give unsolicited
advice, right.
Until you say, I don't want tobe your friend anymore,
therefore I become the shame ofthe family.
So unsolicited advice when yougive that out, it usually is a

(16:58):
reaction to you making yourself,right.
So you can be wrong.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I, uh, I really struggle withreceiving unsolicited advice.
Like I, I don't get a lot of it,but it's like definitely a
trigger for me.
And the way that I handlesomething that really like
emotionally throws me over theedge is I over analyze and
research it.
So I tried to find data thatsupports what I feel so that I

(17:22):
can validate myself.
So I did a bunch of research onunsolicited advice in the fall
and I was going through a hardtime personally.
And, uh, you know, in hindsight,I mean, I think that I was just
going through a very hard time.
Personally, I have lost mygrandfather.
I was feeling a little bit lost.
And so I had created the waythat I was energetically showing
up in our conversations, justcreated that comfort level for

(17:45):
people.
And so they would show upthinking they needed to fix me
cause I wasn't like I normallywas, but I was like, well I
don't need to be the same wayI've read.
Like in hindsight like I need, Ineed some range.
So, um, so anyway, I did want toresearch about it.
Unsolicited advice as a powermove.
Is that what you're telling methis morning when you said, um,
I was afraid that you show up afull full of, I'm going to say

(18:10):
for myself, I think that's whatyou said because we had a talk
and then it, it had a meaningfulimpression on you when I was
going to come back and say, whoare you?
Here's some more of my, youknow,[inaudible] it means you're
going to send me on a journeyfor the next month of like self
discovery, which is the mostamazing, beautiful thing and

(18:31):
also exhausting.
It's exhausting.
So we had, we haven't had coffeein six weeks and like felt like
my entire world, our last coffeeyou were like, hey, try this
thing to help you with thisproblem you have.
And I was like, that soundshorrible and phone notable and I
don't want to do it.
And then I did it and my wholeworld exploded in the most
positive, beautiful ways.

(18:52):
But that's even exhausting.
So yeah, so that's why I'msaying so we have to keep like
six weeks between her.
You have that tendency with me,they just meet me once every six
weeks.
So if you could do some workafterwards.
Well yeah, like it's hard work away.
Like when you think about this,like your reef, you're changing
your, not only your your brain,but your thinking, your whole

(19:14):
like it's like it's thatexperience when say everything
you believed in this is not trueanymore.
That's the feeling.
Right.
I know I've had, like I had donespieling in front of the judge
that said okay, everything youbelieved in justice and fairness
principles upon which youthought society was Milton.
Not True.

(19:35):
Well, I was my perception at thetime.
Yeah.
Well I was just like, forexample, we think we have a
justice system, but we don't, wehave a, we have a way to, you
know, resolve disputes.
It's not a justice system, it'sa way to just iron out the best
possible or the worst possibleand come up to someone, right?
Truthfully, the end of the day,there's just like a lot of
people that want to punch theclock and go the heck home and

(19:57):
that, that affects people'sentire ally's.
Somebody wants to get home fordinner, kind of crazy when you
think about it.
So it is exhausting, right?
To Re to say, okay, to do thework, like you're doing the work
is the exhausting part.
Like you have to think, well,how does this work?
How does this, like, yeah, it'sexhausting.

(20:17):
But I will say this, ifanybody's listening, if
anybody's even listening, if wepublish this cause we're just
chit chatting.
So dear world, if you'relistening, um, it's the most
exhausting when it's the newest.
And so like, you know, you and Iboth know, I mean for our, our
listeners can't see, but I'm notthe fittest lady in the room or

(20:39):
a gentleman in the room.
But, um, I, you know, my habits,my lifestyle habits are not
great.
Like I'm not a habit.
Obviously have habits.
You have lots of habits.

Speaker 3 (20:49):
Well, I'm not like a by the book, like nobody's gonna
write as self help book on myhabits.
Let me tell you.
So, you know, I'm not like up at5:00 AM and journaling and doing
all the things that they should,that society tells us that we
should do.
And maybe that's just not, itmight not be 30 days to get to
vote on who to shed to Tuesday.

(21:09):
Um, but when Ricardo, yeah,there you go.
Right.
It's better than oatmeal.
I don't, I like avocado, but notoatmeal.
So, but this habit of doing thework, yeah.
It's, it's not even like a habitbecause I don't have in my
schedule, I'm going to do thework on myself for half an hour

(21:29):
a day.
It's, it's more of, um, it'sjust a shifted state that I live
in.
So, and again, I would say like,I lost my job in 2005 and 15.
Whoops.
When you get old.
Whole entire decade.
Yeah.
So four years ago, I lost my jobin 2015.
It was my whole identity.
I definitely wasn't a feministback then and um, and that was

(21:53):
my crashing down, you know, thatwas my standing in front of the
judge kind of moment.
And uh, I had to rebuild mywhole identity from nothing.
And yeah, I took a year off.
I took a year off of my life.
I didn't work.
I didn't, I just survived andkept my kids alive and we, you

(22:14):
know, I did like I did a lot offun stuff with my kids.
I played with my kids.
It was basically my therapy.
And so I took a year off ofeverything to try and figure out
what the heck.
So that year was exhaustingbecause I was the first year of
the work and then year two ofthe work was still hard and
that's when I met you, but itwasn't as hurt.
Right.
And then year three of the work,you know, wasn't as hard.

(22:37):
And now I look for the work.
So literally if you haven'theard from me and why all of a
sudden I'm like, okay, we're duefor a coffee because yeah,
because I'm now in as well.
Cause I get into this now I'mlike, okay, I'm going to state
that I'm comfortable in.
So we who's going to push me outof out of the state that I'm in?
Will you are going to, so isthat a habit?
Um, I guess yeah we should callit a habit, but I think it's

(23:01):
again more of a state because Isee it's like a, almost a
craving.
Like it's like a, okay, I needto hush.
Okay.
Habits are cravings.
Okay.
Yeah.
Well that's exactly what eighthabits are.
Hubs.
It becomes so powerful that youcannot imagine your life without
that habit.
Okay.
Right.
That's what habits far and youhave amazing habits.

(23:24):
You just don't have the habitsthat people or that you, I both
find like you, you're givingthat vote, right?
You believe like I don't believeyou don't have a, I know you
have habits because I know you,first of all, I know you're very
successful.
I know that too.
And I know you have habits so Ijust want you to remove that and
think of habits differently.
Their cravings, habits orcravings.

(23:45):
Right?

Speaker 1 (23:46):
Like for me, like if I had to choose my car in my
bike, I'm crying in the cock.
Yeah, right.
Yeah, yeah.
I have a creative habit.
I have a creative habit forsure.
Then.
Yeah.
So yeah, you have createdhabits.
You have the habit of calling uppeople that push you.
You have, uh, you have, you havethis habit of going towards your

(24:06):
fear, which is a wonderful,great habit.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Which makes you, you and I like,yeah.
Yeah.
You have great habits.
Like you do have great habitswhich brought you where you are
today.
Like he have a successfulcompany and like you do amazing
work for the community and yourfamily, yourself and your
partner and say, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (24:30):
[inaudible] you guys like you guys are going to be
like, let's move this to a threeweek, three week, six week
coffee.
I'm going to, I'm going,

Speaker 1 (24:39):
no, not in my mind.
I'm thinking in my, kind ofinteresting because like we
said, we have to lose weight,but really what we have to lose
is our narrative.
Yeah.
Has nothing to do with weight.
Right.
If you, if we lose that littlevoice that we have that keeps us
telling you that we're not asgood at someone.
Right?
Like, like you're saying, I'm, Idon't have the habits are like

(25:00):
where have they habits a littleOlympian?
Like,

Speaker 3 (25:03):
like I'm like, I would say actually what, you
know from what you just reframedfor me, maybe I'm, I don't have
the habits is a bit of an excuseor something that I can say to
give myself the freedom.
So I don't, I'm not at my idealweight.
I haven't been since you'veknown me, you've like, we
haven't, you know, that hasn'tbeen my state and my state
though has been this idea of I'mtoo busy to do that.

(25:27):
So I'm, I'm still, I've beenstuck in this idea of survival
mode for, since I lost my job.
And the last time I was thin waswhen I lost my job.
And, uh, it's just this reallyinteresting thing where I've
almost got this narrative thatyour help, unlike discovering on
this podcast as we're talking,but I am realizing now I've got
this narrative of, of the factthat I think of in survival mode

(25:50):
and everything's going to fallapart tomorrow.
It's almost like I'm storingfood for winter.
Like a bear.
Yeah.
In a way.

Speaker 1 (25:58):
I don't know if that's what you're doing but
your narrative.
Yeah.
Wow.
Yeah.
But if you put that like the,the cravings that you have for
these habit like phoning peopletoo and then going like, I am
totally amazed at the courageyou had to go and do the things
you do to reset your brain.
If you do that, the rest isgoing to follow.
Like it's, it's totally gonnafollow.

(26:19):
What matters most in life isyour brain.
Like your body is just a vehiclefor your brain, doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 (26:25):
It's like, you know, I don't know if you feel the
same way, but it was like thatkind of rock bottom moment.
The thing I feared the mostafter it happened.
I, I haven't been afraid ofanything since.
Isn't that interesting?
Right.
It has maybe like little fears,but I don't, not really afraid
of anything.
Like anything could happentomorrow and I'd be like, yeah,

(26:47):
what's the plan?
It's the most amazing feeling.
Yeah.
I'm sure this things my, I mean,there's like legitimate things
I'm afraid of.
I don't want to come across aslike, you know, overly
dismissive.
Obviously I don't mind.
I have my family and my childrenand I want everybody to be
healthy and well, but I mean,the stuff that used to scare me.

(27:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:09):
It's interesting when you reach that, when you get
that moment that it's righthere.
Yeah.
Like it's like you get, that'sthe moment, right?
So, ah, right.
And you get it, you get like,yeah.
It's, it's, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:22):
Interesting.
Yeah.
And so in our work, well, you'vebeen through our program, the
marketing labs.
That's Fab.
It's a wonderful program.
I changed so many of my habits.
That's like my, um, you know,my, my great accomplishment
professionally so far I wouldsay like, is that that idea
coming to life.

(27:43):
And of course I'm a wonderfulbusiness partner, Cara, who, who
brought that to life with me.
But my job is to think of thething and then she brings the
thing to life, right?
Yep.
So, um, and so that really, whenI think back on the lab, so many
other things we teach in aladder.
So in alignment with what we'retalking about right now, so
we're saying, yeah, you know,you're, you're not a democracy.

(28:04):
Yeah.
Like we talk about the buyerpersona in marketing as same
thing.
Your organization is also not ademocracy.
And it's just really confusingsometimes for people because we
want all this customer feedbackand customer feedback.
Super important.
But again, not every customershould have the equally weighted
vote and what your organizationdoes.
And if all of the employees andall of the customers get an

(28:27):
equally weighted vote, you'renever going to make progress.
So very interesting.
Very easy for me to talk aboutwhen it comes to organizations
and companies harder when itcomes to individuals, but it's
the same concept.
Same content.
Hundred percent.
Yeah.
Because like what our companies,collections of humans.
Yeah.
Collections of people and it'ssame thing.

(28:47):
Right.
And it's harder because there'smore opinions and voices and
things at the table, but that'swhere your values come in and
you really need to be unshakableand who, yeah, who you are as an
organization

Speaker 1 (29:02):
like and then, and then finding, letting fee per
fine them themselves insideorganizations is what you're
about.
Right.
It's like when I took the lab isI is I had to define who I am
with the corporation of what wedidn't.
Dover Kohl, right.
Who, what is my brand?
What is my narrative?
Who, who gets to vote on who iseve.
That's very scary when you dolike I'm starting to do Facebook

(29:23):
live.
I know you said I should do moreFacebook live and that yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:26):
Try so that on Facebook live and I'm trying to
see you smile and laugh in theway that you really smile and
laugh.
Yeah.
And it's like it's the, it's theeve, the unfiltered like what
what I see now when we'resitting here as friends talking.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:43):
It is tough.
It's hard.
It's harder I should say.
Then they are recording,editing.
Changing.
Changing.
I like the little like Instagramyou can change the color.
Yeah.
Like I like that.
Yeah.
Right.
Paint, paint on my face.
Right.
You don't wear makeup justsaying, but you know, I put a
little, you know, failed duringthat little dog ears.

(30:04):
Smoothed out the little wrinkleTyler.

Speaker 3 (30:08):
Yeah.
Okay.
You just, Facebook glide by itsvery nature requires a whole
level of vulnerability just todo it right.
To do live video in the firstplace.
Yeah.
You are in vulnerable place.
You are like all kinds of thingsgo wrong.
We had a, we had a problemtoday.
We were in our um, marketinglabs private group today.

(30:28):
The grip, the lab that we'redoing now.
And um, I went to adjust thelight cause I didn't like the
way my face looked and I turnedit off.

Speaker 1 (30:38):
So we had to do with you to start a new video.

Speaker 3 (30:41):
So you've, stuff like that can happen.
And it really, again, itrequires that level of self
trust that are achieved afterlosing my job where you're just
like, well who cares?
You know?
So did you get to that pointafter you lost the job and you
said, you know what, like I'malready naked anyway.
Might as well like show myheart.

(31:02):
Is that what you is that Iwasn't that easy for sure.
It's, it's, it's gradual andit's ever evolving.
So it's like, um, the day we metyeah.
Get masterminds at 2016 yeah.
Wow.
17 1616 k.
So that was a 2016 yeah, thatwas my first like speaking

(31:22):
engagements.
Yeah.
You were wonderful.
Yeah, I have.
Yeah.
So I was terrified that, yeah,

Speaker 1 (31:26):
I decided you were, you weren't going to get a vote.
You were, you were going to geta vote in my life.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
Oh, I always so much fun that day.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That I was never so scared.
Okay.
So first of all, imagine this.
So I had lost my job, which waslike, you know, I wasn't like a
high job, like a high rankingjob.
I had like just kind of aregular job and I had lost that
and then taken a whole year off.
And so by that time I wasreally, really, my idea of my

(31:53):
self worth was very like tiny.
Like I had this very small kindof box in which I thought I
could operate and it was a very,I can't even explain it.
Um, but I'd spent that year offdoing all this work trying to
help my son with his anxiety.
And so I was studying all kindsof things about attachment and
human connection.
And the idea was, I've nevertalked about this before, but

(32:17):
the idea was I was going to tryand help my son, but what I
didn't realize as I transformedmy entire philosophy on business
and I probably don't my entirecareer out of that year off
trying to understand humanattachment and, and did it
affect your son?
Yeah.
So I mean that, yeah, that thatyear was like, you know, we

(32:40):
were, he was, he did really,really well after that year.
So this day at masterminds thatwhen we met, um, oh my gosh.
So Marcel asked me to be, tospeak it in Marcel's, our friend
that was running the event, heasked me to speak at this event
and I'll never forget God lovehim.
He was only like 24 at the timeand only still 24.
I think it's going to see, I'llsay that each forever.

(33:02):
And He, um, you know, you werehis mentor and he had gotten all
of his mentors who are going tocome speak at this event.
And he calls me and he's like,Hey, I've got this event coming
up.
And so I was like, oh, he's justgoing to ask me to sponsor it
because I was working out andyou know, you, I figured that's
all the call was about and hadmet him one time and he said,

(33:24):
ah, he's so like, you know, allthese CEOs that are, my mentors
are speaking in it.
And I'm like, oh.
And uh, and he's like, and youcan see the poster online.
So as he's talking to me, I'mnot even listening.
I'm googling it and I seeyourself and it's, I don't even
know what dove because softwareis, but I'm just like, oh my
God, he's a CEO of a softwarecompany.
Right.

(33:46):
Right.
And then, you know, we had, uh,eve Woodrow was on the poster,
then he ended up not speakingwith CEO of alongside and I was
like, and then, uh, Dan Martelland, uh, Mark Black who is a
professional speaker for aliving.
And like, I was just, I wasliterally, you know, I was like,
okay, I really like to sponsorthis if weekend and, you know,
thinking in my mind, and thenMarcel goes, um, you know,

(34:09):
there's not a lot of diversityin this lineup.
I love him for that.
He does that.
Yeah.
And so he goes, so can you, canyou be the diversity?
But I'm not really likediversity.
I'd be like, Oh, you know what Imean?
One girl, like, like, it'sgotten more diverse as we go,
but so I was the token woman,like though he thought about it.
No, no, it's good.

(34:30):
It's absolutely good that hethought about it 100%.
I think the world doesn't needanymore.
We call them manels panels ofmen middles.
So he should be balanced.
Um, but it should be balanced inmore ways than just, you know,
white men and women.
Like we need all the pieces.
But, but absolutely.
But I've always teased him eversince.
Cause you know, I was the tokengirl so it was my, it was my

(34:51):
first time speaking and I was soscared because I thought what
does anybody want to hear?
And they're all coming to seethese guys, the CEO guys and
what, what is this going to be?
And I have never stressed aboutanything more than that talk
that you were the best onethere.
Yeah.
It was the scariest, scariestthing I've ever done in

(35:13):
detaining.
And you were funny, you werefull of life, life hacks and
life lessons and you spoke toyour heart and it came like, it
really resonated with me likeyeah, thank you.
Yeah, I didn't get to hear yourscause I was backstage almost
vomiting, scared to come onafter you breathing in a paper

(35:33):
bag.
I just heard your soothing voiceand I thought, oh, these people,
I don't know.
I'm the opposite of you.
And[inaudible] I caught you.
So sense like I'm so not zen,but yeah.
Okay, cool.
I'll take it.
That was, I mean that wasdefinitely, I said, guess that
day even though like the thoughtof it made me want to throw up,

(35:54):
um, because I was really tryingto say yesterday and so that
was, yeah, that was the probablyscariest.
Yes.
I've ever said.
And I've said yes to like a lotof bigger things.
Um, but I can't think of it.
Yes.
That's been scarier than thatthat day.
And uh, it was the mostimpactful for sure.
I think it was the, yes, thatchanged at all and get the F it

(36:17):
was like, well, if I can dothat.
It's interesting because if youwere to let your mind say, well,
I'm just a token woman, I'm notgoing to go just because of
that.
Yeah.
You and I got the opportunity tobe where like, do you do a
speaking engagement?
Right.
And so we, we label things,right.
Well, it's important to be thetoken woman or the token person

(36:38):
of color or whatever, when thereneeds to be, when it's actually
really important to be that andto be willing and be open to
that because otherwise, what ifthere isn't one?
Right.
So those things have to, youknow, they have to happen but
then we have to push for more.
So, and you're absolutely right.
And so now if Marcel at thatsame event that I, I've spoken
at twice, there's been anotherone since then.

(36:59):
There's been three events.
So it's now in its fourth year.
If Marcel said, hey, I amrunning it this year and look,
I've picked all men, would yoube the token woman?
Like no way.
Yeah, I see what you mean.
You have to, and that's not whathe did.
Masterminds, now it's, it'sbalance.
This year there was, there wasall kinds of different diversity

(37:21):
there.
So it's really grown that way.
Yeah.
I'm looking forward to it nextyear again.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, but it's been really, youknow, an interesting thing.
And so that that moment and sothese little moments you don't
even, so the reason we got tothat moment was Marcel, I didn't
even know me.
And what really happened was thewas the day before he asked me,
um, I was working with my friendChris Fariah, set a Hamilton,

(37:45):
um, through a company kitestring that we were both with at
the time and at Chrysalis was aflight amongst, into, to do a
social media workshop.
And I was like setting it allup.
Like I was the backgroundcoordinator because that had
been my role in life.
And so I had organized it andbooked the venue and gotten a
sponsor and we've sold, we getthe seats filled and everything

(38:08):
was was great.
And Chris was going to come inand he got ill and he couldn't
come.
And I found out the day before.
And so he was like, I'm notcoming.
And I was like, well, there'slike 50 people coming and look.
Your son came and uh, and therewas no slide deck or anything

(38:30):
yet.
Like I had to do the wholething.
And so I said, okay, well Iguess I'm going to do it.
And I went to do a tech check atthe location and one of the
people who worked there, I said,I'm just making sure everything
works because Chris isn't comingand it's just me and I just
really want to triple check.
And this man looked at me and hesaid, don't you think you should

(38:50):
email the participants and makesure you warn them that Chris
wasn't coming?
I think a lot of them areprobably just coming to see him.
And I said, no, I don't think Ishould.
Yeah.
Because I thought they wouldn'tcome.
I'm not doing that.
And so he, um, and so I did it.
I did a three hour workshop, myfirst workshop of my life on one

(39:11):
day preparation again, soterrified.
It went really, really well.
And Marcel happened to be theaudience that day.
So that's how I met him.
So then the next day he callssays, I'm doing this event.
Will you speak at it?
Because he had seen me speak atthe thing.
And now, I mean, you know, Imake most of my living speaking.
Okay.
I didn't know that.

(39:31):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
Like a, a very small percentageof our time is spent working
with agency clients, like a verysmall, it's almost all either
workshops, the lab teaching oractual speaking engagements.
Yes.
But that's basically how I makea living.
So we're kind of running out oftime.
Oh, are we?

Speaker 1 (39:49):
Yeah.
Oh, so what was there a timelimit while they typically say
30 minutes and then people cankind of do

Speaker 3 (39:56):
who's they?
Who are we giving them both to?
Well Jesse.
Oh, so like, ah, I bet you'rethe boss around here.
I am.
We can talk as long as, and Idon't know what it is,

Speaker 1 (40:09):
but we're going to do with it.
So like, yeah.
So I just kind of like want totalk about line, one last
question about, so we talked alot about being you and who he
gave devotes, do and how youlistened to not listen to people
and listen to the people thatyou want to listen to.
Right.
And that's such an importantcriteria in moving forward in
your life.
Right?
Yeah.

(40:29):
So, um, yeah.
So who you give the vote to,right.
It's not a democracy, it's aguy.
I love that.
I love that saying you don't geta vote.
I love that.
Absolutely love that.
And, uh,

Speaker 3 (40:43):
I think it's also important if I could add
something, is to remember what avote is also, because when we
were talking about this morningwas really obvious, right.
So the, so our conversation wasaround somebody in your life who
directly gave you unsolicitedfeedback about your characters
and person.
Yeah.
And, uh, that's definitely avote or the person trying to
have a vote.

(41:04):
Right?
Oh, right.
I prison trying to get a vote.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Trying to, yeah.
Lobbying maybe more than one,say lobbying, lobbying to get 15
volts.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, and so that's avote, um, or earn attempted vote
or whatever it is.
But like, you know, what arethose other moments where you're
getting people and maybe theperson doesn't even want to vote

(41:25):
or no, you, but like I'mthinking particularly about
social and what we're you, yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Cause I know you talked aboutmarket with

Speaker 1 (41:31):
that too, right?
People like attacking you on,you're on this post, right?
Yeah.
For example, right.
We talked a lot about verythorny and difficult issues,
feminism and you know, a light.
Yeah.
Representations and yeah.
Who you are.

Speaker 3 (41:46):
Yeah.
There's lots of people who, youknow, who, who don't wanna work
with somebody who would identifyas a feminist and like, uh, what
I've learned is the sooner I canget that out of my mouth, the
sooner they can go away from me.
So, you know what I mean?
So it hurts a legit like,

Speaker 1 (42:01):
well that's interesting.
So you, when you say this is whoI am, this is what I stand for.
Yeah.
Like immediately giving them thechance to self select
essentially.
Yeah.
You're saying, okay, well youdon't stand for that so you can
go away.
It's like saying you, I practiceyoga.
Yeah.
So therefore, if you think yourguy's bad for you because it's
against your artistic reviews orsomething, right, then you, you

(42:24):
don't have to like me, you don'thave to be my friend.
Right.

Speaker 3 (42:28):
Yeah.
You don't have to, if it makesthem comfortably disagree often.
Yeah.
Aki got right now only lead withthings that are like, you know,
I'm willing to really, did youstand for it to stand on?
Yeah, exactly.
There's lots of things that I'mwilling to talk about.
Look, I have a friend who I wentto university with who is
absolutely, he's brilliant.
So he was, um, you know, we tooka lot of political science

(42:50):
classes together.
He was definitely a top, topstudent.
He's well educated, articulate,spends more time understanding
and following politics thananybody I know and was like that
at a very young age.
He's so intelligent.
However, in recent years in our,you know, as we've aged in our

(43:10):
life, experiences has kind ofgone into different directions.
Um, he, he has very differentviews than me politically,
politically.
He's very, um, again, we're notAmerican.
He is very pro Trump.
He is very pro conservative, uh,to the point that, and he posts
about it a lot online to thepoint that I personally wouldn't
be comfortable engaging with anyof his posts because he gets so,

(43:34):
um, inflammatory with people whodo bathe him.
Yeah.
That it's not, it's notproductive.
However, I recently shared anarticle about Alexandra
Abkhazia, Cortez Avc, who's thepolitician from Brooklyn.
Okay.
The, uh, the girl from New Yorkwho's the Latina waitress

(43:58):
turned, um, turned politician.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I see.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
She's amazing.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So the AAOS EOC for short, soshe's wild.
Right.
So her energy, amazing.
Yeah.
Um, the way she communicates isamazing.
I mean, everything about her iseverything I want to believe in
Sienna politician.
And so it was kind of early onwhen she had just been elected

(44:20):
and I shared something and hecommented and he goes, you have
to be kidding me, Natalie.
You have to be, do not tell methat you support this woman.
And so I said, Hey, I'm alwaysopen to a, an edge, a great
conversation where we respecteach other.
And you know, if you have factsthat I don't have brains, like

(44:41):
I'd love to hear them.
And so we took it off of myposts.
We went into like DNS and wetalked for about an hour and he
said, you know, I think there'ssome things you may not know.
Okay.
And I think you may not know in,in his position, and I am in no
position to weigh in on this.
But he said, you know, I thinkthat you need to understand
where some of this funding comesfrom and these things in this

(45:01):
thing and whatever.
And the conversation was veryrespectful and, um, because I
set a boundary, it was veryclear that I was not going to
have a conversation where I wasnot able to process the
information and learn newthings.
And so, you know, he shared newinformation with me.
I don't know where I landed onit.
Um, but I think that we need tolook at all politicians

(45:23):
objectively and understand thatthey're, you know, there's, it's
not always what it seems.
And so I really appreciatedthat.
So it's an interesting thing.
Like I have a lot of space forpeople who want to have educated
debate about certainconversations.
A conversation.
Yeah.
But there's things that are notopen to, there's not, not open
to conversation.
The things that I will just notbend on that are super important

(45:47):
to me.
That's not one of them.
And so I can have aconversation, but the other
things where I am ready to plantmy flag, I see them as soon as I
can so that people know, uh, ifI'm not for them.
That's totally,

Speaker 1 (45:58):
yeah.
And that's part of living in thesocial world, right?
Not even like if you're not onFacebook, but if you just social
world, like you have to be ableto plank your fly and say, well,
okay, like we're not having adebate here.
You're just attacking.
Yeah.
Like you know, like somebodycommented on my Facebook, I
forget what it was and theysaid, get a life or something
when you yes.
And I said, okay, thanks for thereminder.

(46:19):
I'll do, I'm going to go get alife now.
Go take some great classes.
Yeah.
Hopefully that don't get, youdidn't give that guy out?
No.
My God, no.
Okay, good.
No, I, I take, this is the one Ido on Facebook.
Sometimes I'll go pick a fightbecause I think fights are
interesting because I'm a guyand was brought up differently
or just said, so fights his way,the way that men express
themselves.
So I take it as that.

(46:40):
I don't take it as a personalfight, so, so I'll just post
something that I stand for.
And then there's some, somepeople may, it could be
language, it could be politics.
It's about climate change.
I very strong opinions of what Istand for and who I am.
And I respect other people forhaving all of your opinions, but
I don't respect is when theycome back and they hit me with

(47:00):
that.
Right.
So when I do get a hit of like,you know, something like insults
or character or like, just likethe comments that are not, I
picked that fight online.
Right.
Yeah.
And uh, it's kind of aninteresting thing when I do that
for me because I say, okay,that's interesting.
Who, because I, this is a thing,right?

(47:21):
If they shut you up, this iswhat I believe is they shut you
up.
They win.
Right?
If they piss you off, they win.
Right?
That's what I believe.
Okay.
Shut you up and Piss you off.
So if I'm upset, yeah, and Iunfriend you because I'm upset
at you.
Okay.
They win.
Yeah.

(47:41):
Interesting.
So then I say, okay, how can Irise above this?
I gotta be kinder, more loving,more caring.
When you say pick a fight, it'snot really like what we're
picturing when we see people whoactually have own like no drag
down fights on the Internet,right?
Oh No, no, no, no, no, no.
It's on the rising above it.
I'm trying to figure out whatI'm trying to discover.
What his fear his, yeah.

(48:02):
And sometimes I'd language forexample, that's a big issue in
New Brunswick, but like languageand French, a lot of people who
are posting things againstFrench being bilingual is
because they're, they're afraid.
He may have lost a job.
They may have like this fear.
It's[inaudible].
It's real fear, right?
That they may not be able toearn a living.
Like it's a real fear.
It doesn't justify, you know,um, putting people in

(48:25):
categories.
Right.
But it does, it is a fear.
It doesn't choose somebody whodoesn't have that fear.
Right.
Yeah.
Right, right, right.
Well you can't rationalize feefor your fears.
Fear.
Yeah.
So yeah.
So then you tried to rise abovethe fear and give them hope.
So sometimes I'll say, well, youknow, I, I feel your fear.
I understand that this is scary.

(48:45):
I understand.
I understand because I've beenscared of being afraid not to
earn a living.
Right.
And uh, sorry, rise it up.
Right.
And then see if we can have aconversation.
Most of the time it like the,when I, when I hit them with
love and compassion andkindness, yeah.
They don't come back.
Very evolved.
Have you trying so hard toevolve?

(49:07):
Well, there are certain peopleor accounts online that
definitely will activate myfear.
I guess my fear, it usuallymanifests itself in the form of
judgment.
So of course I feel very judgyagainst a certain people.
And when I catch myself in thatstate, I'm like, why is this

(49:28):
bothering me?
And it's usually because again,it's unsolicited advice.
So it's, you know, it's, it'spreaching at the world about how
they should, uh, do businessparents be as a human dah, Dah,
Dah, Dah.
It's not personal.
It's not, hey Natalie, youshould do this differently.
It's literally like aproclamation, Hey, this is why
I'm great.

(49:49):
And so I find sometimes those,in those moments, I, I can feel
very judgmental and I've reallytaken to, um, unfollowing people
that make me feel that way sothat I can just, again, because
I'm giving them a vote, if I'mgiving them my attention.
But nobody can make you feelanything.
Well that's the point.
It's you are making new friendslike, yeah, that's right.

(50:10):
And so by taking some space forthat, I can hopefully take the
time to work on those issues.
I totally agree with you.
I'm not giving this person thatvote.
Yeah, I'm just rising above it.
You could get to vote.
That's why I love the word.
You don't get to vote, by theway, on whether or not I'm a
good person or not.
Right.
You don't get to judge me.
Yeah.
Right.
The only one person I think canjudge and it's up there and we

(50:30):
won't go into that, but nobodygets to be the judge if of the
people of whether or not theyhave integrity or values or
whatever.
Like you're, yeah.
Nobody gets to judge who youare.
Yeah.
Or unless you, unless you'veleft them, unless you give that
vote away.
And you do that through ourfears though, in a way.
Right.
We do that through like, yeah.

(50:51):
Yes.
Right.
What if they're right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's the big thing.
Yeah.
It's nuts because they're not anexpert on you.
You're the expert at.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
If they're right about youactually.
So what, like tomorrow's a newday.
Yeah.
So different.
So different.
Yeah.
It's, and it's reallyinteresting.
I think we waste a lot of timeand energy and the goodness on

(51:16):
worrying about their own boats.
So I give'em, I read this bookcalled Man's search for meaning
by Viktor Frankl.
Yes.
Amazing Book.
I read it because I was at thisseminar and uh, uh, baron, who
was the guru master there, heasked who read, read the book,
and I'd raise my hand like alittle child wanting to be
picked right into here.

(51:36):
So he picked me.
It was so excited.
So when I ran up to this stage,how many people are in the room
at 75 people but full of people.
A lot of people would read thebook and I said, yeah.
He said, can you give me asynopsis?
So I went into my, you know, myeaves and deliberation and blah,
blah, blah.
He says, he looks at me andsays, you're weird.
Go sit down and read the bookagain.

(52:00):
And you paid this guy.
Like how much, well, don't saythe same amount of money, even.
Not Insane.
It's not like, yeah, it's like,it's not that bad actually.
Yeah.
I can't wait til I'm asuccessful Seo and I can see
that same thing.
And I read the book and he wasabsolutely right.
Right.
He was absolutely right that Imissed part of the Synopsis

(52:22):
Report.
I basically, we, we hear orrelearn what we want to learn at
a time and I wasn't ready tolearn anything else.
Right.
So he, so Victor Franklin says,the only thing, and this is ray
so close to my heart that cannever be taken away from you.
Right.
Because I lost everything.
I like my cars, I lost my, likemy job, my title, I lost money.

(52:45):
Like I everything.
Right.
The only thing that nobody canever take away from you is your
choice of how to react to life.
Yeah.
Right.
And in that choice is themeaning of life.
Yeah.
And I thought, yeah, that's justlike, that's it, right.
In that choice, you're givingthe vote in that choice, having

(53:06):
a moment.
Oh, sure.
So the other day as laying inbed with my son in our pajamas
in the morning, just like havinga slow morning, my son George,
and a picture I have my morningand I said, I was just chatting
with them and I said, him,

Speaker 3 (53:26):
you know what's so special about you?
Tell me what do you think'sdifferent about you?
And he's like, oh, it's that Iknow the meaning of life.
Oh my God.
And I, it's like, how old is he?
He's 10 10.
However, when he said it'sbecause I know the meaning of
life, I was reminded that hetold me when he was eight that
he knew the meaning of life.
And so I was like, I wonder ifthis is going to be the same

(53:48):
answer.
And I said, oh, what's themeaning of life, you know,
played it.
Yeah.
And he goes, oh, it's potential.
Yeah.
Rush is what you just said.
Yeah.
Right.
He gets it.
He, yeah, I know you might haveseen in a movie, I don't know,
like, I don't know, but he, uh,but he, you know, stuck with it
for the last two years and hethinks it's his gift that he

(54:10):
gets that, which is this thecoolest thing?
Yeah.
For him to walk here in theworld thinking that, okay, I
like, I don't like, I'm justgetting it now and I'm like 60.
So, yeah.
So, you know, he's packed a lotof life experience.
And of those 10 years though,I'll tell you that much.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We had a really rough go when hewas little and uh, and he's

(54:31):
turned it around himself.
I mean, he was, uh, he had, um,anxiety challenges and
undiagnosed learning disabilityand Adhd.
Wow.
Both of them had undiagnosedlearning disabilities and Adhd,
but he had, but his fearmanifested into very explosive
anxiety.
And uh, so he had a lot oftrouble at school when he was
like as young as five.

(54:52):
Yeah.
And he didn't have any sense ofbelonging or affiliation.
Yeah.
And so when you want to talkabout fight or flight, the way
that that would manifest thenthat child was, it was just
something else.
And so I had to go to the schoolon this every day to intervene
into these crazy situations thatwere just absolutely wild.

(55:14):
And yes, I took a year off andtried to figure out attachment
and all that stuff, but hechanged his life.
Yeah.
That year he did.
And so did you though, Matt?
Natalie?
Yeah.
Cool.
Well thank you.
But like, ultimately I could doeverything if this child didn't
do the work too.
And so when he says the meaningof life is potential, like he

(55:36):
might have seen that in a movie,but there's certainly life
experience to back it up.
He's lived at, he understandsthat he didn't think he could be
more and then he is more andit's really special.
I'm going to share it.

Speaker 1 (55:50):
Sorry, what year?
When my daughter, right, so youknow, my story lost everything.
Oh 3 million box and devastated.
Can't pay the bills likeeverybody saying I should go
bankrupt train.
And my daughter at the time wasapplying for CSUS is a job in
[inaudible] is like the highestlevel of security you need at
your through 12 differentinterviews with your SMP and

(56:10):
everything.
And they need to view everybody,your family, your friends,
everybody.
And she was up for a job as thisis happening in my life.
And I'm thinking, oh my God,she's never going to get a job.
Well, they never interviewed meand she got the job and she's no
longer at CSUs.
I can share this.
Right.
And, um, what a month ago I hada chance like, am I going to

(56:34):
lose it here?
I had a chance to ask.
I wish I asked.
She shared we're having dinnerand wine and it was a nice
dinner and she says, you know, Inever got to share this with
you.
But they did ask me.
Right.
Has Your Dad change because helost all that money.
Has Your Dad changed because hefought 10 years and now he's
like, almost bankrupting rollsoff this money.

(56:57):
And she said, yeah, yeah.
He changed so many things andhe's a better man.
Right?
Yeah.
So my last little thing to youis, um, what I see in your son
potential.
He got that from you.

(57:18):
He got that from your habits.

Speaker 4 (57:22):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (57:22):
And you expressed it as that potential.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Yeah.
They watch what they watch.
People Watch what you do, right?
Yeah.
They watch your habits.
They watched your cravings, theywatch your craving to become
you.
So you think you're at thelowest.
I thought I was the lowest ofRomania.
My library cry here.

(57:43):
Right?
Yeah.
And here's my daughter lookingat me with totally different
eyes.

Speaker 3 (57:48):
Yeah.
Yeah.
What a lesson.
Yeah.
That is, yeah.
And yeah, the stuff we think weneed to reach our potential.
Yeah.
Right.
Like money and status.
And again, not to discount thatthose things are like important
people who are born with withnothing and you know, have a
very hard time getting ahead.
Like I don't want to discountthat, but absolutely.

(58:10):
Yeah.
Isn't that amazing in the momentwhere you felt like all, all of
that with stripped from you andyour daughter saw and that's it
only improvement.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Gimme like to me when that, when she said that I
thought, okay, success.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
Because like our reactions whenyou get down to like life
happens to you, your reactionsis the only thing you control.
And your son saw that and yougot out.
Right.
And the irony being that he,hmm.

Speaker 3 (58:38):
Needed to learn to control reactions.
Like isn't that like doublesdown?
Because that is exactly, it wasthe reactions that were the
problem.
Yeah.
And so I'll never forget, I hada few good friends that were
teachers in his school at thetime.
Thank God.
That's what got me through.
They weren't, unfortunately,these teachers are amazing and
they're thinking they're allamazing, but some make a big

(58:58):
impact.
They're not all amazing.
Yeah.
Like I guess like everythingelse.
Oh I had this one particularhair, horrible one, but the rest
are great.
Um, so I had a few good friendsthat were teaching in the school
at the time, so I at least knewsomebody who was keeping an eye
when they could.
But he was in a situation wherethis he, yeah.
These reactions in him, Ipersonally believe activated

(59:18):
this teachers' greatest fears.
Wow.
And so then she started, um,yeah, she started not being the
person that I think she is.
Cause I think she's a reallygood person.
Yeah.
And I think that he, um, justshowed her aside of herself, she
didn't like, yeah.
And so then now he representedthat side of herself and, and

(59:39):
then it just got worse and worseand worse.
So those two where he'd walkinto the school, her stress
would spike.
It was, it was a disaster.
But, um, you know, he needed tolearn to manage his, his
reactions and needed to outmanage that one teacher.
He needed to be at five.
Yeah.
Better than the adults, which isjust, I mean, you know, at the

(59:59):
end, like the year didn't endwell that that reaction wasn't
managed that year.
So, so it didn't happen.
But eventually, and he's still,he's not perfect.
He still has struggles with someof the summer, but like, yeah,
he works on it and, and youknow, he's, he came home
yesterday and he got a yellow,so they have behavior system,
right.
So yellow means that you'rebeing warned that you get a red,

(01:00:22):
then you have to stay in thenext day at lunch and reflect on
your behavior.
And so he got a yellow and Idon't think he's had a yellow
all year.
And so he got a yellow and hecomes home, he's like, mom, I
got a yellow today.
And I'm like, buddy, like,what's wrong?
What's going on?
And then I have these moments oflike, this was my wildest dream.
Like a yellow would have been mywildest dreams back then would

(01:00:46):
have been like, and here we arethe only one all year and we're
reflecting and he's thinkinglike, you know, how can I make
this better?
And I, I apologize to my teachermom, and I told her that I, you
know, it's embarrassing, myoverreaction and whatever, and I
was like, okay, I'm glad youhandled it.
But it's just, it's justamazing.
And he's catching himself.
That's what he's doing.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,yeah.
So, so I get a little bitdistracted about what I was

(01:01:09):
saying was I had a couple ofgood friends that worked in the
school at the time, whenever Iwill never forget.
It was particularly tough day.
And my one friend texted me thatnight and she was like, just so
you know, this boy is going tobe an adult like no other.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's learning to managesomething so much bigger than
most adults can.

(01:01:29):
Yeah.
Because you know that that firein him was so big.

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
He's learning too.
Yeah, he's, yeah.
He's learned to understand whohe is.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Then back to the question ofright, so he picked you.
Yeah.
You mean as a mom?
No.
He picked you out because notall moms are picked to get our
vote.
Mm.
Oh, too shy to get info.
Yeah.

(01:01:53):
That's what he's doing to you.

Speaker 3 (01:01:55):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's, yeah.
Yeah.
It's pretty cool guy.
I mean, he's an identical twin.
His brother is equally cool

Speaker 1 (01:02:01):
in case in case this is the future in that list.
Maybe we'll have to listeners,maybe my daughters are free.
There you go.
But, uh, but yeah, it's prettycool.
Thank you for having me.
It was great.
So remember those words, youknow who you are, not a
democracy.
Yes.
Yeah.
And use this.

(01:02:22):
You get a vote.
I like that.
Yeah.
And you get a vote.
You get my vote that wementioned is limitless now in
the covers yellow and dying toreact to going down.
Cool.
So if you want to vote withNatalie, you have to be kind.
You have to stand for something.
Respect is one of them.
All of these Asley, right?
Yeah.
It's a short list.

(01:02:43):
And a friend her on Facebookfollow her marrow labs.
Yeah.
It's just all right.
Narrow.
Okay.
Yeah.
Or just Natalie.
Natalie Davidson.
Davidson.
Don't friend requests me if youwant to sell me stuff.
Yeah, but that's not respect.
No.
Yeah, you're not gonna.

(01:03:04):
You know what?
I'm going to get a yes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I get a lot of those like, andthen they ask you, oh, what's
your name?
Please friend me on Facebook.
Like, what's your name?
Where are you from?
Well, it's right there.
Like it's someone you're excitedthat wants to be your friends.
They run crest you.
You're like, Whoa, that's great.
11 I'm so excited.

(01:03:24):
We're going to be friends again.
And then they're like, I've gotthis thing you might want to
buy.
Your hair's gonna be so shiny.
I don't get that a lot.
I get a lot of like, who areyou?
That's loud.
But I'm going to just give you alittle Kudos, a little Kudos for
the marketing line for if youpermit me.
So I did think monitor GuyMarketing lab, which helped me
figure out my brand, mynarrative, my who I am, you

(01:03:46):
know, who I surround myself,wait where I stand for, which is
great, but also great hacks,rate tips.
And one of them was Facebooklive.
Right.
So I do, I have Facebook liveand I've been, I've shared this
with you and since I've beendoing, I do approximately one,
maybe two a week if I can.
It takes a lot of energy andI'll get there eventually.
Okay.
My them guru.
And um, and uh, but when I dothem, I've noticed a big spike

(01:04:09):
in the number of followers thatI get that I use.
Yeah.
Like, uh, it's used to be, let'ssay a hundred, like a one or two
a day or a week maybe.
Right.
Maybe one or two a week frombeing generous.
Yeah.
And it stall there and, and nowit's probably hundreds of week a
week.
He was wild.
Yeah.
And I think it's the only thingI've changed.
The only thing I've changed hisFacebook clutter the, I mean the

(01:04:31):
Facebook algorithm definitelyfavors lines that it wants to
share more with more people, butwhen you're lying, you just,
you're with them or you.
Yeah, yeah, with the person.
And the cool thing for theviewer is that, I've always said
this about isis.
You know, before you could justdo Facebook live and you had to
do record a video, I've alwayssaid this about video and
content, is that you're givingyour ideal customer or audience

(01:04:54):
or the person you want toconnect with the person you
don't know, you're giving them achance to get to know you, but
in the place that they want to.
So like if I'm on my couchsnuggling with my jog and
scrolling through Facebook and Idiscover somebody new and I get
to read their content or watch avideo or whatever that is, I'm
doing that in a place where I'mnaturally relaxed, positive,

Speaker 3 (01:05:18):
and I'm already like really, you know, connected in
some more likely if I followthem after that.
It's just a positiverelationship.
Yeah.
So that's what I always kind oftry to remind people is like,
think even deeper about contentand think about like, you know,
if that person's like consumingthese videos in the comfort of
their own home or at their deskat work, or where is that?

(01:05:39):
And it really gives them achance to get to know you in the
safest possible way for them.
The psychological safety issuper high for them.
You're taking all thevulnerability.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so then once they finally doreach out or connect with you or
one of buy your product orservice or email you or whatever
it is, it's a deeper connectionbecause they feel like they know
you and, um, and they're alreadymuch more comfortable and ready

(01:06:00):
to share better.
So yeah, I think we have to gobecause we have to go eat a
black rock, get in trouble,black rabbit, the black rabbit
rabbit, and then we're going toeat there.
And then that can let me downto, you know where that comes
from.
Right.
From Alice in Wonderland andMiss Rabbit Hole, the rabbit, my
favorite place to go.