May 23, 2025 • 16 mins
What if everything you thought you knew about the legal and financial systems was designed to keep you trapped in an invisible matrix? That's the provocative question at the heart of Don Kalam's philosophy, which we unpack in this mind-expanding episode.
We dive deep into Kalam's controversial "unplugging from the matrix" concept from his Dream Keepers radio podcast, exploring alternative perspectives on law, finance, and personal sovereignty that exist at the fringes of mainstream thought. From the fascinating "straw man theory" (the idea that the government creates a corporate entity in your name at birth) to the ancient Roman concept of "Capitis Diminutio Maxima" and its supposed connection to the use of all-capital letters in legal documents, we examine these unconventional ideas with both curiosity and critical thinking.
The episode also unpacks the "letter rogatory" and its bold claims about courts functioning as for-profit corporations rather than institutions of justice. We discuss why these ideas appeal to people who feel disenfranchised by complex systems they don't fully understand, while also highlighting the potential risks of taking these concepts at face value without proper legal consultation.
What emerges from our discussion isn't necessarily a roadmap for "escaping the system," but rather an invitation to develop critical awareness about the structures that shape our lives. The real value may not be in the specific actions Kalam recommends, but in how he encourages listeners to question assumptions, conduct independent research, and become more engaged citizens. Whether you're intrigued or skeptical, this conversation will leave you thinking more deeply about personal sovereignty and institutional transparency in an increasingly complex world.
Ready to challenge your assumptions? Listen now, and don't forget to share your thoughts on these provocative theories. Which aspects make you curious to learn more, and which ones set off your skepticism alarm? We'd love to hear your perspective!
https://www.skool.com/donkilam/about
https://www.skool.com/donkilam/about
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey everyone, Welcome back for another deep dive.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Glad to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Today we're looking at this whole unplugging from
the matrix concept.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Sounds a little out there, right.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
I know, I know.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Unplugging from the matrix.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Yeah, but specifically how it's presented
by this guy, don Kalam, on hisDream Keepers radio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Right, so we're talking about, like this,
alternative perspective on lawand finance and personal
sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Exactly Like even how to manage your own finances
outside of, like the regularbanking system.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
That's a big one for him yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
And he gets into some pretty interesting legal stuff
too.
He does Like historical stuffthat you know I'd never even
heard of before.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Right, like a lot of this stuff, it's like almost
hidden history.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Yeah, like he talks about the importance of using
all copy S in legal documents.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Oh yeah, and like how that's connected to this
ancient Roman legal term.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Copitis, diminutio maxima.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Right, exactly.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
It's like something out of a Harry Potter spell.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
But he claims it has like real legal implications
today.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
And then there's this whole thing about the letter
rogatory.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Yeah, that one's fascinating.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Like he claims that courts are actually operating as
for profit corporations.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
That's a pretty bold statement it is.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
But you know we're here to sort of like unpack all
of this, Separate the fact fromthe fiction.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
you know.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Exactly so let's let's start with like who is Don
Kalam for people who haven'theard of him?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Well, he's this kind of like radio personality.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
you could say yeah, like a talk show host.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Right, but his focus is very much on these sort of
like fringe ideas.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Yeah, alternative perspective.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Well finance government.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Right, it's all about like individual freedom and
taking back control.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's the core of it .
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Yeah, so when he talks about unplugging from the
matrix, what does he actuallymean?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Well, it's like a metaphor, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
He's talking about separating yourself from systems
of control.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Like the systems that we kind of take for granted.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
The ones we're all plugged into without even
realizing it Right, like thelegal system, the financial
system.
Exactly, and for him it's allabout like reclaiming your
individual power and autonomy.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Okay, so how do you actually do that?
How do you unplug?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Well, that's where it gets a little complicated.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
I bet.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
He's got some very specific ideas about how to do
that.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Like legally how to separate yourself.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Right, he talks about , like you know, becoming a
private citizen, americannational.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
I've heard that term before, but I don't really
understand what it means.
Yeah, it's a bit of a legalgray area.
So is it like you're renouncingyour citizenship or something?
Speaker 2 (02:24):
No, not exactly.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
He claims it's more about like reclaiming your
original sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Okay, so it's like you're still American, but
you're operating under adifferent set of rules.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
That's the general idea.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
This is really interesting, but I'm already
kind of confused.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah, I know it's a lot to take in.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
But let's try to break it down a little bit Sure.
So to take in, but let's try tobreak it down a little bit Sure
.
So one of the things Don Kalamtalks about is this idea that a
person is basically acorporation.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Right the straw man theory.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
The straw man.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Yeah, have you ever heard of that?
Speaker 1 (02:52):
I think so, but remind me.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
So the idea is that, like when you're born, the
government creates this likeseparate legal entity.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Yeah, using your name , but in all cap, yes, oh so,
like my birth certificate, hasmy name in all cap.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yes, right, and that's supposedly like the name
of this corporate entity okay,so wait, they're saying there's
like two of me in a legal sense.
Yeah, there's like the real meand then there's this like
corporate straw man version ofyou and that's who the
government actually interactswith that's what they claim is
blowing my mind and they saythis straw man is used as
collateral for government debt.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
What.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Yeah, like because the US is a bankrupt country.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Because of fiat currency.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Exactly Because the dollar isn't backed by anything
tangible.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
So they need something to use as collateral.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And they claim that's where the straw man comes in.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Wow, I've never thought about it like that
before.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
It's a pretty wild theory, right it is.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I mean, I'm not sure I buy it, but it's definitely
interesting.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
I think that's the point, you know.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
To get us thinking.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Exactly To challenge our assumptions about how these
systems work.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So OK, we've got this straw man idea.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
And then there's the whole thing about all capies
being connected to this ancientRoman legal concept, right
Capitis diminutio maxima, whichDon Kalam pulls straight from
Black's Law Dictionary, by theway.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So it's a real legal term.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Oh yeah, it's in there.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
But what does it actually mean?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Well, it basically means diminishing of status.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Diminishing of status .
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Like in Roman law, there were different levels of
legal status.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
OK.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
And the most severe level was called Capitis
Diminutio Maxima.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
And that meant like you lost all your rights, pretty
much Like becoming a slave.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Exactly.
You were no longer considered aperson under the law.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
Wow, that's heavy.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah, and Don Kalam suggests that writing a person's
name in all capis.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
Like on a legal document.
Represents this CapitisDiminutio Maxima, is basically
treating us like slaves.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
That's his interpretation.
That's a pretty extremeinterpretation it is, but you
know he's trying to make a point.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
About how this system is rigged against him.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
How we've lost our sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Okay, I'm starting to see where he's coming from.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But again, it's a very specific interpretation of
this legal concept.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
And it's probably not one that most legal scholars
would agree with.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Right, it's definitely on the fringe.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
But it's thought provoking for sure.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
That's what makes it so fascinating.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
OK, so we've got the straw man.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
We've got the capitis diminutio maxima.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And then there's this letter rogatory that Don Kalam
keeps talking about.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Ah yes, the letter rogatory.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Which is apparently a real document.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Oh yeah, it's a real thing.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
And people actually use it in court cases.
Some people do, but it makessome pretty wild claims about
how courts operate.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
It does.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Like what kind of claim?
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Well, for example, it claims that courts are actually
for-profit corporations.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
So they're not really there to uphold justice.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
According to the letter rogatory no.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
They're just businesses looking to make money
.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
That's the claim.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
And how do they do that?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Well, it suggests that they're securitizing cases.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Securitizing.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Like turning them into financial instruments.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Wait.
So they're making money off ofour legal troubles.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
That's what the letter rogatory alleges.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
That's crazy, and it also mentions a connection
between the courts and the IMF.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Right this whole idea of like a global financial
conspiracy.
So it's basically saying thatthe entire legal system is
corrupt.
That's the gist of it.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
This is making me kind of paranoid.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
I know it can be a bit unsettling.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
So is the letter rogatory like a legitimate legal
strategy?
It's hard to say.
I mean some people use it.
They do, but I'm guessing mostlawyers would probably advise
against it.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
I would imagine so.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Because it's based on these like fringe
interpretations of the law.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Exactly.
Okay, so we've got this wholestraw man thing, the Capitis
Dominutio Maxima, the letterrogatory and this idea of
becoming a private citizen tosomehow escape it all.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Am I getting that right?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
You've got the key players for sure.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
It's a lot to take in .
Speaker 2 (06:53):
And, to be honest, some of it sounds pretty
far-fetched.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I know right, it's like a conspiracy theory buffet.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
But I think what's important here is that Don
Kalam's ideas get peoplethinking critically about the
systems they're a part of.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Even if you don't agree with everything he says.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
He's making us question things.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
And maybe do a little research of our own.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Right Like.
Is there any truth to thisstraw man theory?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
What about this Capitis Diminutio?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
Maxima thing Is the letter rogatory a valid legal
strategy.
These are all questions worthexploring.
Ok, so we've laid out some ofthe core concepts from Don Kalam
and this whole unplugging fromthe matrix idea.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Where do we go from here?
Well, I think it's important tolook at some specific examples
of what Don Colm suggests peopleactually do to unplug Right
Like what are the practicalsteps he recommends?
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Because he gives some pretty specific instructions.
He does.
And I think understanding thosewill help us evaluate how
practical and potentially riskyhis advice might be.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Exactly so let's dive into that.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Sounds good.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
So like let's say, you're like really intrigued by
this whole unplugging thing.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Yeah, and you're like okay, I want to try this out.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Right, you're ready to unplug from the matrix?
Speaker 1 (08:02):
What do you actually do?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Well, Don Kalam, he gives some pretty specific
instructions.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Does he really?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Like what kind of instructions?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Like how to interact with like legal documents and
government officials using likeparticular phrases and legal
jargon.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Like magic words.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Kind of.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
He's really big on sending these like very formal
sounding letters.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Oh, I've heard about those.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Yeah, like affidavits and notices.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
They're a big part of this whole private citizen
thing right.
It's like you're putting thegovernment on notice.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
That you're operating under a different set of rules.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Okay, so what are some examples of things he tells
people to do?
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Well, one of the most common ones is refusing to use
zip codes on mail.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Really.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Zip codes.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
He argues that zip codes are like a tool for the
government to track and controlyou.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Like it links you to that straw man entity.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
So by not using a zip code, you're like breaking that
connection.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
That's the idea.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Does it actually work though?
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Well.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
That's debatable.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
I mean, does the mail still get delivered?
It might, it might not, itmight not.
The Postal Service might havetrouble delivering it.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Okay, but legally speaking, does it actually do
anything?
Speaker 2 (09:17):
I mean there's no legal basis for this idea that
zip codes somehow bind you tothe straw man.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Or that by not using them you suddenly have like
special legal status.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
So it's more like a symbolic gesture.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I think that's a fair way to put it.
It seems like a lot of DonKalam's advice is like that Kind
of like walking this fine linebetween like unconventional
legal strategies.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
And what some people might call conspiracy theories.
Right, it's a tricky balance.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
And, to be fair, a lot of his followers genuinely
believe they're like reclaimingtheir freedom.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
And exposing these like hidden truths about the
legal system.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Yeah, they really see it as like waking up from the
matrix.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
And it's easy to see how these ideas could be
appealing.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Especially to people who feel like disillusioned or
powerless.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Like, the system isn't working for them.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Exactly, and you know , Don Kalam is a charismatic
speaker.
He presents these complex ideasin a way that's like
captivating and seeminglyempowering.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
He makes it sound like there's a simple solution.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Yeah, like a secret formula to break free.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
But, as we've discussed, there's a real risk
in taking these ideas at facevalue.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And acting on them without really understanding the
law.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Right, because you could end up in a situation
where you think you're makingthis like clever legal maneuver.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
But you're actually just creating a mess for
yourself.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah, it's like trying to fix your own plumbing
based on a YouTube video.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
You might think you know what you're doing.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
But you could end up flooding your house.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
And when it comes to the legal system, the
consequences could be far moreserious than a flooded basement.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
That's for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
So I guess the question is what's the takeaway
here?
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Should people just ignore everything?
Speaker 1 (10:55):
Don Colum says and just stick with the conventional
system.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
I don't think it's about ignoring his ideas
altogether.
I think what's valuable is thathe encourages critical thinking
.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
And he gets people questioning the systems we often
take for granted.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Like why are things the way they are?
So it's not necessarily aboutbelieving everything he says.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
But more about using his ideas as a springboard.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
For further research.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And understanding.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Like.
Maybe listening to him sparksyour curiosity about certain
legal concepts.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Makes you question how the financial system really
works.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
That's a good thing.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
It prompts you to learn more.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Do your own research.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Form your own conclusions.
So, in a way, don Kalam isacting as a catalyst.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
For people to become more informed and engaged
citizens.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Even if they don't agree with everything he says.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
That's a great way to put it.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
He's stirring the pot .
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Getting people to think outside the box.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
And hopefully motivating them to become more
active participants in shapingtheir own lives.
That's the goal.
Okay, I'm starting to see thebigger picture here.
Yeah, it's not about literallyunplugging from society.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
Or becoming some kind of legal outlaw Right.
It's more about developing acritical awareness.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Of the systems we're a part of.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
And making informed choices about how we want to
interact with them.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
So it's about empowerment but through
knowledge not through somesecret legal loophole.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And that's a much more sustainable and realistic
approach.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
It is.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
So if someone's really intrigued by these ideas
and they want to learn more,where should they start?
That's a good question.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I think the key is to approach this with a healthy
dose of skepticism.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And to diversify your sources of information.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Don't just rely on one person's interpretation.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Even if they sound really convincing.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
So read up on the legal concepts Don Kalam
mentions.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Research.
The letter rogatory.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Maybe even consult with a legal professional.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
To get a more grounded perspective.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, like a reality.
Check Exactly and remembercritical thinking is your best
tool in navigating this kind ofinformation.
It's essential.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
This has been really insightful.
We've unpacked a lot here.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
I feel like I have a better understanding of what Don
Kalam is all about.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
I think so too.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
But I also have a lot more questions.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
And that's a good thing.
It means you're thinkingcritically.
So, as we wrap up this deepdive, what's the one thing you
want our listeners to walk awaywith?
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Well, I think for me the big takeaway is like
approach this whole unpluggingfrom the matrix idea with a
critical but open mind.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
OK.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
You know, Don Kalam raises some interesting points,
even if his interpretations area bit unconventional.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Yeah, definitely not mainstream thinking.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
But that's what makes it so thought provoking it is.
It's about sparking curiosity,encouraging research and,
ultimately, empowering yourselfwith knowledge.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
So don't just take everything at face value.
Right Dig deeper, exploredifferent perspective.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
And form your own conclusions.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
And I think it's important to add that, if you're
considering any of the specificactions Don Kalam suggests.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Like refusing to use zip codes or sending those legal
notices.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Right.
It's crucial to consult withqualified legal and financial
professionals.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
They can provide a more grounded perspective and
help you avoid any potentialpitfalls.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, it's like having a guide when you're
venturing into unfamiliarterritory.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You might be adventurous and want to explore,
but it's always wise to havesomeone who knows the lay of the
land.
That's a great analogy.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
And ultimately, I think that's what this whole
deep dive boils down to.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Becoming more aware more informed and more engaged
in shaping your own life.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Beautifully said.
So as we resurface from thisdeep dive into Don Kalam's
unplugging from the matrix ideas, the question remains what does
it all mean for you?
Does it spark a desire to learnmore about the legal and
financial systems?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Does it challenge your assumptions about how those
systems work?
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Maybe it even motivates you to take a more
active role in shaping your ownrelationship with those systems.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Whatever your takeaway, I encourage you to
keep exploring, keep questioningand keep learning.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
That's the perfect note to end on.
This deep dive is just thebeginning of your journey.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
Keep diving.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
Keep discovering.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
And keep those critical thinking skills sharp.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Until next time, happy exploring.
Hey everyone, Welcome back for another deep dive.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Glad to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Today we're looking at this whole unplugging from
the matrix concept.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Sounds a little out there, right.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
I know, I know.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Unplugging from the matrix.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Yeah, but specifically how it's presented
by this guy, don Kalam, on hisDream Keepers radio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Right, so we're talking about, like this,
alternative perspective on lawand finance and personal
sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Exactly Like even how to manage your own finances
outside of, like the regularbanking system.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
That's a big one for him yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
And he gets into some pretty interesting legal stuff
too.
He does Like historical stuffthat you know I'd never even
heard of before.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Right, like a lot of this stuff, it's like almost
hidden history.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Yeah, like he talks about the importance of using
all copy S in legal documents.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Oh yeah, and like how that's connected to this
ancient Roman legal term.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Copitis, diminutio maxima.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Right, exactly.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
It's like something out of a Harry Potter spell.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
But he claims it has like real legal implications
today.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
And then there's this whole thing about the letter
rogatory.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Yeah, that one's fascinating.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Like he claims that courts are actually operating as
for profit corporations.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
That's a pretty bold statement it is.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
But you know we're here to sort of like unpack all
of this, Separate the fact fromthe fiction.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
you know.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Exactly so let's let's start with like who is Don
Kalam for people who haven'theard of him?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Well, he's this kind of like radio personality.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
you could say yeah, like a talk show host.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Right, but his focus is very much on these sort of
like fringe ideas.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Yeah, alternative perspective.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Well finance government.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Right, it's all about like individual freedom and
taking back control.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's the core of it .
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Yeah, so when he talks about unplugging from the
matrix, what does he actuallymean?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Well, it's like a metaphor, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
He's talking about separating yourself from systems
of control.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Like the systems that we kind of take for granted.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
The ones we're all plugged into without even
realizing it Right, like thelegal system, the financial
system.
Exactly, and for him it's allabout like reclaiming your
individual power and autonomy.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Okay, so how do you actually do that?
How do you unplug?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Well, that's where it gets a little complicated.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
I bet.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
He's got some very specific ideas about how to do
that.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Like legally how to separate yourself.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Right, he talks about , like you know, becoming a
private citizen, americannational.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
I've heard that term before, but I don't really
understand what it means.
Yeah, it's a bit of a legalgray area.
So is it like you're renouncingyour citizenship or something?
Speaker 2 (02:24):
No, not exactly.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
He claims it's more about like reclaiming your
original sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Okay, so it's like you're still American, but
you're operating under adifferent set of rules.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
That's the general idea.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
This is really interesting, but I'm already
kind of confused.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah, I know it's a lot to take in.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
But let's try to break it down a little bit Sure.
So to take in, but let's try tobreak it down a little bit Sure
.
So one of the things Don Kalamtalks about is this idea that a
person is basically acorporation.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Right the straw man theory.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
The straw man.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Yeah, have you ever heard of that?
Speaker 1 (02:52):
I think so, but remind me.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
So the idea is that, like when you're born, the
government creates this likeseparate legal entity.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Yeah, using your name , but in all cap, yes, oh so,
like my birth certificate, hasmy name in all cap.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yes, right, and that's supposedly like the name
of this corporate entity okay,so wait, they're saying there's
like two of me in a legal sense.
Yeah, there's like the real meand then there's this like
corporate straw man version ofyou and that's who the
government actually interactswith that's what they claim is
blowing my mind and they saythis straw man is used as
collateral for government debt.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
What.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Yeah, like because the US is a bankrupt country.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Because of fiat currency.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Exactly Because the dollar isn't backed by anything
tangible.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
So they need something to use as collateral.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And they claim that's where the straw man comes in.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Wow, I've never thought about it like that
before.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
It's a pretty wild theory, right it is.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I mean, I'm not sure I buy it, but it's definitely
interesting.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
I think that's the point, you know.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
To get us thinking.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Exactly To challenge our assumptions about how these
systems work.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So OK, we've got this straw man idea.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
And then there's the whole thing about all capies
being connected to this ancientRoman legal concept, right
Capitis diminutio maxima, whichDon Kalam pulls straight from
Black's Law Dictionary, by theway.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So it's a real legal term.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Oh yeah, it's in there.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
But what does it actually mean?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Well, it basically means diminishing of status.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Diminishing of status .
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Like in Roman law, there were different levels of
legal status.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
OK.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
And the most severe level was called Capitis
Diminutio Maxima.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
And that meant like you lost all your rights, pretty
much Like becoming a slave.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Exactly.
You were no longer considered aperson under the law.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
Wow, that's heavy.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah, and Don Kalam suggests that writing a person's
name in all capis.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
Like on a legal document.
Represents this CapitisDiminutio Maxima, is basically
treating us like slaves.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
That's his interpretation.
That's a pretty extremeinterpretation it is, but you
know he's trying to make a point.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
About how this system is rigged against him.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
How we've lost our sovereignty.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Okay, I'm starting to see where he's coming from.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But again, it's a very specific interpretation of
this legal concept.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
And it's probably not one that most legal scholars
would agree with.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Right, it's definitely on the fringe.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
But it's thought provoking for sure.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
That's what makes it so fascinating.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
OK, so we've got the straw man.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
We've got the capitis diminutio maxima.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And then there's this letter rogatory that Don Kalam
keeps talking about.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Ah yes, the letter rogatory.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Which is apparently a real document.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Oh yeah, it's a real thing.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
And people actually use it in court cases.
Some people do, but it makessome pretty wild claims about
how courts operate.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
It does.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Like what kind of claim?
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Well, for example, it claims that courts are actually
for-profit corporations.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
So they're not really there to uphold justice.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
According to the letter rogatory no.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
They're just businesses looking to make money
.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
That's the claim.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
And how do they do that?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Well, it suggests that they're securitizing cases.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Securitizing.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Like turning them into financial instruments.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Wait.
So they're making money off ofour legal troubles.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
That's what the letter rogatory alleges.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
That's crazy, and it also mentions a connection
between the courts and the IMF.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Right this whole idea of like a global financial
conspiracy.
So it's basically saying thatthe entire legal system is
corrupt.
That's the gist of it.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
This is making me kind of paranoid.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
I know it can be a bit unsettling.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
So is the letter rogatory like a legitimate legal
strategy?
It's hard to say.
I mean some people use it.
They do, but I'm guessing mostlawyers would probably advise
against it.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
I would imagine so.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Because it's based on these like fringe
interpretations of the law.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Exactly.
Okay, so we've got this wholestraw man thing, the Capitis
Dominutio Maxima, the letterrogatory and this idea of
becoming a private citizen tosomehow escape it all.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Am I getting that right?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
You've got the key players for sure.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
It's a lot to take in .
Speaker 2 (06:53):
And, to be honest, some of it sounds pretty
far-fetched.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I know right, it's like a conspiracy theory buffet.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
But I think what's important here is that Don
Kalam's ideas get peoplethinking critically about the
systems they're a part of.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Even if you don't agree with everything he says.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
He's making us question things.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
And maybe do a little research of our own.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Right Like.
Is there any truth to thisstraw man theory?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
What about this Capitis Diminutio?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
Maxima thing Is the letter rogatory a valid legal
strategy.
These are all questions worthexploring.
Ok, so we've laid out some ofthe core concepts from Don Kalam
and this whole unplugging fromthe matrix idea.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Where do we go from here?
Well, I think it's important tolook at some specific examples
of what Don Colm suggests peopleactually do to unplug Right
Like what are the practicalsteps he recommends?
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Because he gives some pretty specific instructions.
He does.
And I think understanding thosewill help us evaluate how
practical and potentially riskyhis advice might be.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Exactly so let's dive into that.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Sounds good.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
So like let's say, you're like really intrigued by
this whole unplugging thing.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Yeah, and you're like okay, I want to try this out.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Right, you're ready to unplug from the matrix?
Speaker 1 (08:02):
What do you actually do?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Well, Don Kalam, he gives some pretty specific
instructions.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Does he really?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Like what kind of instructions?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Like how to interact with like legal documents and
government officials using likeparticular phrases and legal
jargon.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Like magic words.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Kind of.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
He's really big on sending these like very formal
sounding letters.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Oh, I've heard about those.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Yeah, like affidavits and notices.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
They're a big part of this whole private citizen
thing right.
It's like you're putting thegovernment on notice.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
That you're operating under a different set of rules.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Okay, so what are some examples of things he tells
people to do?
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Well, one of the most common ones is refusing to use
zip codes on mail.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Really.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Zip codes.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
He argues that zip codes are like a tool for the
government to track and controlyou.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Like it links you to that straw man entity.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
So by not using a zip code, you're like breaking that
connection.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
That's the idea.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Does it actually work though?
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Well.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
That's debatable.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
I mean, does the mail still get delivered?
It might, it might not, itmight not.
The Postal Service might havetrouble delivering it.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Okay, but legally speaking, does it actually do
anything?
Speaker 2 (09:17):
I mean there's no legal basis for this idea that
zip codes somehow bind you tothe straw man.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Or that by not using them you suddenly have like
special legal status.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
So it's more like a symbolic gesture.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
I think that's a fair way to put it.
It seems like a lot of DonKalam's advice is like that Kind
of like walking this fine linebetween like unconventional
legal strategies.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
And what some people might call conspiracy theories.
Right, it's a tricky balance.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
And, to be fair, a lot of his followers genuinely
believe they're like reclaimingtheir freedom.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
And exposing these like hidden truths about the
legal system.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Yeah, they really see it as like waking up from the
matrix.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
And it's easy to see how these ideas could be
appealing.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Especially to people who feel like disillusioned or
powerless.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Like, the system isn't working for them.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Exactly, and you know , Don Kalam is a charismatic
speaker.
He presents these complex ideasin a way that's like
captivating and seeminglyempowering.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
He makes it sound like there's a simple solution.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Yeah, like a secret formula to break free.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
But, as we've discussed, there's a real risk
in taking these ideas at facevalue.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And acting on them without really understanding the
law.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Right, because you could end up in a situation
where you think you're makingthis like clever legal maneuver.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
But you're actually just creating a mess for
yourself.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah, it's like trying to fix your own plumbing
based on a YouTube video.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
You might think you know what you're doing.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
But you could end up flooding your house.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
And when it comes to the legal system, the
consequences could be far moreserious than a flooded basement.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
That's for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
So I guess the question is what's the takeaway
here?
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Should people just ignore everything?
Speaker 1 (10:55):
Don Colum says and just stick with the conventional
system.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
I don't think it's about ignoring his ideas
altogether.
I think what's valuable is thathe encourages critical thinking
.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
And he gets people questioning the systems we often
take for granted.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Like why are things the way they are?
So it's not necessarily aboutbelieving everything he says.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
But more about using his ideas as a springboard.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
For further research.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And understanding.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Like.
Maybe listening to him sparksyour curiosity about certain
legal concepts.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Makes you question how the financial system really
works.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
That's a good thing.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
It prompts you to learn more.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Do your own research.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Form your own conclusions.
So, in a way, don Kalam isacting as a catalyst.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
For people to become more informed and engaged
citizens.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Even if they don't agree with everything he says.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
That's a great way to put it.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
He's stirring the pot .
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Getting people to think outside the box.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
And hopefully motivating them to become more
active participants in shapingtheir own lives.
That's the goal.
Okay, I'm starting to see thebigger picture here.
Yeah, it's not about literallyunplugging from society.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
Or becoming some kind of legal outlaw Right.
It's more about developing acritical awareness.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Of the systems we're a part of.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
And making informed choices about how we want to
interact with them.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
So it's about empowerment but through
knowledge not through somesecret legal loophole.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And that's a much more sustainable and realistic
approach.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
It is.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
So if someone's really intrigued by these ideas
and they want to learn more,where should they start?
That's a good question.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I think the key is to approach this with a healthy
dose of skepticism.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And to diversify your sources of information.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Don't just rely on one person's interpretation.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Even if they sound really convincing.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
So read up on the legal concepts Don Kalam
mentions.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Research.
The letter rogatory.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Maybe even consult with a legal professional.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
To get a more grounded perspective.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, like a reality.
Check Exactly and remembercritical thinking is your best
tool in navigating this kind ofinformation.
It's essential.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
This has been really insightful.
We've unpacked a lot here.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
I feel like I have a better understanding of what Don
Kalam is all about.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
I think so too.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
But I also have a lot more questions.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
And that's a good thing.
It means you're thinkingcritically.
So, as we wrap up this deepdive, what's the one thing you
want our listeners to walk awaywith?
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Well, I think for me the big takeaway is like
approach this whole unpluggingfrom the matrix idea with a
critical but open mind.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
OK.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
You know, Don Kalam raises some interesting points,
even if his interpretations area bit unconventional.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
Yeah, definitely not mainstream thinking.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
But that's what makes it so thought provoking it is.
It's about sparking curiosity,encouraging research and,
ultimately, empowering yourselfwith knowledge.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
So don't just take everything at face value.
Right Dig deeper, exploredifferent perspective.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
And form your own conclusions.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
And I think it's important to add that, if you're
considering any of the specificactions Don Kalam suggests.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Like refusing to use zip codes or sending those legal
notices.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Right.
It's crucial to consult withqualified legal and financial
professionals.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
They can provide a more grounded perspective and
help you avoid any potentialpitfalls.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Yeah, it's like having a guide when you're
venturing into unfamiliarterritory.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
You might be adventurous and want to explore,
but it's always wise to havesomeone who knows the lay of the
land.
That's a great analogy.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
And ultimately, I think that's what this whole
deep dive boils down to.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Becoming more aware more informed and more engaged
in shaping your own life.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Beautifully said.
So as we resurface from thisdeep dive into Don Kalam's
unplugging from the matrix ideas, the question remains what does
it all mean for you?
Does it spark a desire to learnmore about the legal and
financial systems?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Does it challenge your assumptions about how those
systems work?
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Maybe it even motivates you to take a more
active role in shaping your ownrelationship with those systems.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Whatever your takeaway, I encourage you to
keep exploring, keep questioningand keep learning.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
That's the perfect note to end on.
This deep dive is just thebeginning of your journey.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
Keep diving.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
Keep discovering.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
And keep those critical thinking skills sharp.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Until next time, happy exploring.
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