Episode 30: Shaka Zulu - Legacy of the Zulu King - Drinking Our Way Through History

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
["Shaka Laka"].
Hey, man, hi, you know what'sshocking?
No, shaka, wow.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Is he right?
Yeah, it's Shaka.
Hahaha.
Oh, you know what?
I didn't look up.
What If Boom Shaka Laka is forShaka Zulu, is it?
I just said I didn't look it up.
Well, hahaha.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
That was your first mistake.
My computer just went black.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
Oh what the fuck?
Are you serious?
Yeah it, just so you know whatI watched.
What Epic rap battles ofhistory Do they have?
One with Shaka Zulu, shaka Zuluand Julius Caesar.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Hahaha, hahaha, it's who the fuck won Gotta be Shaka,
you know.

Speaker 3 (00:56):
I think it was, I feel I don't know.
It's good Back and forth though.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
It was a toss-up.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I remember when.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
I would watch epic rap battles of history, just not
.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
No, you gotta say it right.

Speaker 1 (01:09):
Epic rap battles of history.

Speaker 3 (01:11):
Okay, so I was gonna bring that up because I'll
introduce it again.
Is they go?

Speaker 1 (01:15):
I'm a rap battle, oh headshot.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
Hahaha, it's a calm growl now.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
That's awesome you can't even understand what
they're saying.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Wait, are they still doing that?
Yeah, bro, are they still doingrap?
Battles of history.
They're still popping shit out,dude.

Speaker 3 (01:27):
No, shit and they got great like graphics and
videography and everything dudeShout-outs and doubts, man, it's
making history.
So fabulous.
Yeah Well, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Drinking Our Way
Through History, where we coverthe legendary people, places,
spectacles and events thathistory has to offer, while

(01:47):
enjoying a thick pour of winetoday.
Thick, I am Cooper and I am Ian.

Speaker 2 (01:54):
Congratulations.
Thank you, and you know what Iwould congratulate our listeners
on what's that Well?
Cooper, I'm so glad you asked.
Thank you, so much.
I would congratulate them onhitting that like button,
hitting that five star reviewbutton, hitting that subscribe
button and, if you're on Spotify, hitting that follow button.

Speaker 1 (02:15):
Do that yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:18):
Now in today's episode, we will be discussing
Shaka Zulu and the rise of theZulu Kingdom.
Shaka Zulu was a great Zuluking and conqueror.
He transformed the small Zulutribe into a formidable and
centralized kingdom through hismilitary innovations and tactics

(02:38):
.
During his brief reign, morethan a hundred chieftains were
brought into the Zulu Kingdom.
He implemented a significantchange in warfare by introducing
a new weaponry like the shortstabbing spear, and reorganized
his warriors into disciplinedformations.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
I love how innovative that was at the time.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
It's like let's take the stabbing spear bro, and
let's cut it in half, honestly,and give you two.

Speaker 3 (03:07):
It literally reshaped the entire continent of Africa.
Why couldn't?

Speaker 2 (03:11):
we have been born back then, Like gravity wasn't
even around.
You know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (03:18):
Like gravity was in the round of the 1800s.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
Well, they were just floating around everywhere.
We all know that.

Speaker 3 (03:24):
Shaka's military strategies were highly effective
and allowed the Zulu army toconquer and assimilate
neighboring tribes, expandingthe Zulu Kingdom's influence.
Shaka also implemented socialand administrative reforms
within the Zulu society,including changes in social
structure, land distribution andmilitary organization, and

(03:45):
became one of the mostinfluential monarchs in African
history.

Speaker 1 (03:49):
What a shaka, what a shaka.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
You can expect that a lot today.

Speaker 3 (03:55):
Shaka's devastating reign led to what we call the
mephicane, known to the Westernworld as the crushing, where up
to two million people werekilled in a 15 year period.

Speaker 2 (04:09):
I saw a lot of motherfuckers to die in 15 years
and we'll get into it.

Speaker 3 (04:15):
Obviously, it lasted through 15 years, so a lot of
suffering happened through this.
Now we kind of need to talkabout the sources here, because
in African culture it's not likewe're looking at European
history here, where everythingis documented and written down
and diaried.
There are literally no writtendown sources.

Speaker 2 (04:39):
There are no first-person stories, no
first-hand resources is what I'mthinking about.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Historians, archaeologists goback to verbal tales and random
accounts from European tradersthat were already there and that
we already have.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
And, as we all know, verbal accounts are just very
credible.

Speaker 3 (05:03):
Well, they talk about the conflicting stories from
the European traders and theEuropean people who were there
to what the local people hadalso said.
They've done their homework andthey've come up with
commonalities and all thedifferences.
Now the main sources that we'reusing are the biography channel
documentary, the People'sProfile Documentary, extra

(05:24):
History Docu-Series and alsoSouthAfricaHistorycom.
So that's where we're kind ofcoming up from today.
So, yeah, this shit's crazyShaka was a insanely like.
Grabbed the life by a, you know, grabbed the fucking bull by

(05:46):
the horns.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
Yeah, grabbed the bull by the balls Balls.
That's what I'm going for.
I'm just trying, as if theballs are there, you're going
for the balls Grabbing the bullby the balls not by the horns.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
Tugging and pulling little twist clockwise and
counterclockwise, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
So, Cooper, where do all things begin To start?
At the beginning.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
So to start out, so different yeah to start Same
same, but different.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
So, to start out, let's go ahead and discuss who
these Zulu people were.
Right, they were a smallertribe on the eastern side of
South Africa that functionedwith an economy revolving around
cattle.
Yes, yeah, yeah, it's like Ihave millions, millions of what,
thank you?

Speaker 3 (06:26):
for the description.
We've got to put it plainly,you know that's how they work.

Speaker 2 (06:30):
I'm here for.

Speaker 1 (06:31):
I'm here for the people.

Speaker 2 (06:32):
I'm here for the people, you know, the
non-scholars.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
So I'm doing great, yeah, yeah, no that.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
actually, that sounds very healthy.
That's got to stay in.
Yeah, yeah, that sounds good.
That has to stay in whilecoming out.
You're right, yeah, like you.
And when you were 16, when youcame out to the whole family, it
was a beautiful moment.

Speaker 3 (06:59):
Fucking fuck you.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
Anyway.
So, yeah, they had this economythat revolved around cattle.
They were a relatively peacefulpeople, and warfare was more of
like a ritual deal rather thana destructive force, right, they
would typically meet atpredetermined locations, maybe
throw a few spears here andthere, and would rarely ever get
close enough for hand-to-handcombat, which resulted in

(07:22):
minimal casualties, right, sovery few people would die.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
Yeah, the bloodshedding of like modern
warfare, of what we see todayand also European history, and
like the Civil War of Americaand all the great wars that
didn't exist in America, it wasa lot of a healthier conflict.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
Interesting, Interesting, interesting.
So instead of the winning sideraping, pillaging and conquering
the losing side's land, theside would give up some
reasonable amount of territoryor some cattle, and then they'd
call it a day right.

Speaker 3 (07:57):
Yeah, it was pretty cordial.

Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, like it was very respectful, very honorable.
Maybe there were some injuries,maybe there were some
casualties, but nothing crazy.
All of this would be changedonce Shaka comes into power.
So Shaka would actually end upchanging the weapons, the
tactics and the way that warswere fought and then
subsequently won.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Now.
Shaka was born July of 1787 asthe illegitimate son of Zenzan
Kakhona oh you practiced that.

Speaker 1 (08:27):
You practiced that.

Speaker 3 (08:30):
So these names are.
There's going to be somemispronunciations through this.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
But that was good though.
Thank you, that's what I thinkyou got nailed it on the head
yeah, okay, we'll keep going.

Speaker 3 (08:41):
You said it with confidence, Thank you.
That's all that matters at theend of the day Now.
Zenzan Kakhona was the ruler ofthe Zulu, which at the time was
considered an insignificant andsmall chieftain.
Shaka's mother was Nandi, whowas the daughter of a Lengenny
Tree chief, so she had someroyalty in her blood as well.

Speaker 2 (08:59):
He was the daughter of a Lengenny Tree, Not a chief
a Lengenny Chief.

Speaker 3 (09:05):
Now Shaka's actual name.
Okay, this one, I didn'tpractice Sighiri Kansanza
Kakhona.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
It's the same, except for it has a Kha in front of it
there we go, so it's the samelast name Yep, we'll go yep, but
he is commonly known toeveryone as Shaka.

Speaker 3 (09:23):
So how do you get Shaka from Sighiri?
You don't Nope?
Shaka directly translates tointestinal beetle.
Did you just want to like praythat up with me I?

Speaker 2 (09:39):
don't know.
I was in quotes, I felt theneed.
Maybe I was wrong, sorry, Itried.

Speaker 3 (09:46):
So here's why Sighiri is known as Shaka.
Shaka's parents were notmarried during conception, and
it is believed that he wasconceived through the act of
ukulolukabunga.
It's ukulabunga there we go Now, which is where unmarried
couples can do all the foreplayand oral sex that they'd like
without actual penetration, buthis parents decided to just go

(10:08):
with the tip.
Just the tip just swim in theshallows, and that was to bring
Shaka into the world.

Speaker 2 (10:17):
How are babies made Cooper?

Speaker 3 (10:19):
Well, you know, when a mommy and a daddy love each
other very much.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
They call the Stork Foundation, and then the Storks
call, and then they bring down ababy and drop it, and then the
Storks come and watch them Bang.
That's how it's done.
It's a public event.
It's a public event.

Speaker 1 (10:34):
The Storks fucking get off, man.

Speaker 2 (10:36):
The Storks are actually the horniest creatures
on the planet.
Little did we know.

Speaker 3 (10:39):
Now, since Shaka had been conceived outside of a
traditional marriage, his fatherdenied being the father and
tried to claim that Nandi wasnot pregnant but suffering from
an intestinal condition causedby the Isaka beetle.
Despite his attempts to denypaternity, shaka's father
eventually installed Nandi ashis third wife, so Shaka's name

(11:01):
stems from the Isaka beetle'sclaim.

Speaker 2 (11:04):
his father tried to make.
That's so funny.
Think about that in modern dayterms.
If our dad was just like, no,no, it was rape, and then they
just named us rape.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, basically that's it.

Speaker 3 (11:22):
Except there was a beetle.

Speaker 1 (11:23):
Right right.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Way better than rape.
I'd prefer a beetle over arapiny.

Speaker 3 (11:27):
No no, no, no, you have a stomach issue caused by a
Yorkie.

Speaker 2 (11:31):
Yeah, it's like.

Speaker 3 (11:32):
And now your name is Yorkie.
So the relationship between hismother and father seems to have
been an unhappy one, and itended with his father driving
Nandi and him into exile.
So Nandi took Shaka to seeksanctuary with the Lengenie
people, nandi's native people,his mom's native people.
But this was far from asanctuary, because Shaka was

(11:55):
growing up fatherless and, dueto all of the confusion of his
birth, he was subject toamelioration and bullying by the
Lengenie boys and also notrecognized as the rightful heir
to his father's throne of theTsubu chief Chiefs it.
And like this is like through.
I think they were there forlike three or four years and it

(12:15):
was just they were.
They were shunned, they werethe ugly stepchildren of the
group.
They were given enough to live,but there was no like
friendships or anything Like.
They sheltered them in a way,but then they like they were.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
Yeah, I don't know it's just too strong.
But, to be clear, like storiesof Shaka's childhood have only
come down to us by word of mouth, and eventually, around 1802,
shaka and his mother weresupposedly they were taken to
what is it?
The M-Tentois?
M-tentois, yeah, the M-Tentoispeople the most, which happened
to be the most powerful tribe inthe region.

(12:48):
When he was about 15, to livewith his mother's aunt.
So he was taken there to livewith his mother's aunt.
Yeah, now, dengasueo, dengasueo, dengasueo.
That's what I just said.

Speaker 3 (13:00):
It's about the inflection.

Speaker 2 (13:01):
The infossis on the right salabel.
Yeah, so to speak.
Okay, how did you say it?
Dengasueo, dengasueo, oh, putthe emphasis on the weio.
Okay, so Dengasueo was thechief of the M-Tatoa people and
welcomed them graciously.
Dengasueo had also become chief.
Through like very fiercewarfare and clever diplomacy.
He had built up a federation ofmore than 50 tribes.

(13:23):
50 tribes.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
That's a lot.

Speaker 2 (13:25):
That's a lot, yeah.
So Shaka spent his early yearsas a herd boy with the M-Tatoa.
Thank you for putting thepronunciation every single time.
Because I am going to need that, I do what I can.
So Shaka spent his early yearsas a herd boy with the M-Tatoa
looking after the preciouscattle.
But everyone soon came torealize that Shaka had more

(13:47):
talent than the average boy.
I want to be a real boy.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
And a real boy he was .

Speaker 2 (13:53):
Yes, Throughout the next eight years, Shaka grew
into manhood and was becomingrecognized as a fierce fighter
in hand-to-hand combat.
Now Dengasueo took Shaka underhis wing and taught him the art
of warfare, warrior ship, how todistinguish himself in battle
and probably a lot of politicalskills as well.

Speaker 3 (14:16):
Yeah, because there is a story that I didn't put in
here, but Dengasueo, there's alot of raids for cattle between
tribes, sometimes because that'smoney.
It's money and it's also asource of life, because it was
food and it was milk.
Now we use paper.
Yes, we do, amongst otherthings with money.

Speaker 2 (14:36):
Cocaine, yeah, lots of cocaine, specifically cocaine
.
It's got to be a lot of cocaine.

Speaker 3 (14:39):
Chetan fentanyl.
I hear they're going to startusing too.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
Ah, fentanyl.
That's why we got to import somuch.
It's like OK, so cocaine is thedime and fentanyl is now the
quarter.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
Yeah, maybe like the half dollar.
Yeah, yeah, you know.
Yeah, so now there's a raidthat Denguezweyo had Shaka go on
with a few men to raid somecattle from this tribe, right.
Well, denguezweyo was moreabout the traditional way of
fighting and essentially scaringthese people away and then

(15:10):
taking the cattle.
But Shaka was an absolute ornothing and so he wanted to
absolutely destroy these peoplewho he was raiding, killed them
all, and he did.
And then Denguezweyo got pissedat him and kind of laid into
him when he got back, but hestill took cattle and then he
still kept promoting him throughthe raid.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
He's like well, money is money.
We're like don't do it again,don't do it again, don't do it
again, don't say a dog.
You know what?

Speaker 3 (15:36):
I'm saying Like that was not cool.
That was not cool, but thanksfor the cattle.

Speaker 2 (15:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:41):
The Shaka was tall and powerfully built.
His skill and bravery gave hima natural upper hand against
others in his age group and hewas developing thirst for power,
Thirsty motherfucker.
He was so good at Zulu stickfighting that he was only
challenged by boys who had notyet heard of his reputation.
So people just get to the pointwhere it's like no one around

(16:03):
you is going to take the fight.
But as soon as you get thathomeboy from fucking Florida,
they're like I don't know whothis fucking guy is, and then he
comes and fights you and thenyou kill him.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
Yeah, murder him with a Zulu stick.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
Now around the age of 23,.
Denguezweyo drafted Shaka intothe M-Tatwa regiment, where he
not only found truecompanionship amongst the other
men, which he had neverexperienced growing up, but also
found a passion for battle.
He had a lot of pent-up anger.
He did, he was well I mean,like I said, he was mistreated
for a long time.

Speaker 2 (16:33):
Yeah, bullied his whole life.
It's that classic story.
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (16:37):
And his dad was a royal dick.
He also had stepbrothers too,who, like it was just Did.

Speaker 2 (16:42):
He put his ball sack on their drum set.
Well, he ruled him for a littlewhile.

Speaker 3 (16:47):
Oh, he put.

Speaker 2 (16:47):
Basically the same thing.

Speaker 3 (16:48):
Exactly the same thing I think Honestly.
Maybe a couple of dick slapshere and there?
Yeah, one or two.
So he climbed the ranks at anextremely fast pace within
Denguezweyo's army and becameone of his favorite commanders,
soon becoming his commander inchief to the Ibuto, which is the
entire military regiment.
In this commander position,Shaka became captivated in

(17:10):
strategy and battle tactics.
Militarism became his way oflife War.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
War, war, war, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:20):
What's it good for?
Absolutely everything.
What, Wait?
What is it War?
What is it good for?
Kevin always sings it, Sing itI can't.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
I just want to watch you sing it, you're so cute
You're so cute when you'retrying, thanks, so I do it again
.
So Shaka took the a sega, asega, yeah, ok.
So Shaka took the a sega, whichis the traditional type of
spear that was designed for longdistance throwing but really
had no practical use for upclose fighting, and he turned it

(17:52):
into a short handled stabbingspear and he called it the iklua
.

Speaker 3 (17:59):
OK, I wanted to just hear how you pronounce it.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
I want to say iklua.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
So here's.
So it's called ikwa.
Oh, that's way easier.
Why is there?

Speaker 2 (18:07):
an.

Speaker 3 (18:07):
L, because it's in Africa.

Speaker 2 (18:09):
Well, they're wrong.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
Talk about taking an L.

Speaker 3 (18:12):
This is why he named it the ikwa Because of the noise
, because of the noise.
I remember that, that fuckingstab people Because it sounds
hick as in.
It goes in.
And then the wha, as you'repulling it out of somebody's gut
.

Speaker 2 (18:27):
He goes.
Well, you know, what that tellsyou Is that he killed somebody
with it before he named it.

Speaker 3 (18:31):
Oh sure, he probably tried out this fucking weapon on
the guys he was stealing thecattle from.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
Yeah, because he's one of those no survivors types.
Yeah, yeah, no survivor type.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
No survivors types.
Oh, no survivors type.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Ok, I thought you said nosurvivor type and I go he's
pretty, he survived a lot.
Yeah, no, he definitely did.

Speaker 2 (18:52):
The people he came against died Not so much, they
did not survive.
You could say he came upon them.
I'm not a survivor.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yeah, I killed Pashaka.

Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (19:02):
I think, that should be a song.

Speaker 2 (19:03):
Ikwa.
So he saw that throwing spearis highly disadvantageous.
Right, like a man could throwthe spear, and sometimes Mrs
Mark, then the enemy could pickup that same spear and throw it
right back at him.
That and you also don't have aweapon anymore Because you just
threw your fucking weapon.
Yeah, so each of these men tomove up to their opponents in
close formation with their bodylength, cow hide shields forming

(19:25):
an almost impenetrable barrierto anything thrown at them.
And think of the Spartans kindof, when you.

Speaker 3 (19:32):
Yeah, yeah, like the phalings.

Speaker 2 (19:34):
Yeah, like the phalings.

Speaker 3 (19:35):
Spartan phalings, and it's just like a simple tactic
too.
It's because, when it works.
Because, during this none ofthe other tribes were like
familiar with this kind ofwarfare.

Speaker 2 (19:45):
Because nobody had tried to literally decimate
their competition before.

Speaker 3 (19:49):
Yeah, it was.
He's an absolute, like it'seither decimation or nothing.
Yeah, now, the battle formationthat Shaka gets the most
attention for is a crescentshaped formation called the bull
horn.
Shaka did not invent thistactic, as many people believe
he did, but he's credited bymost historians with perfecting

(20:09):
it.
The main force of the bull hornwas known as the chest that sat
in the middle.
It attacked the enemy head on,pinning them into a position and
engaging in melee combat.
So just hand to hand, beatingthe shit out of them with their
little.
You know, maki sticks withtheir with their quick.
Now, the warriors who made upthe chest were senior veterans.

(20:31):
They were the toughest bad assmotherfuckers.
They were just stout dudes.
Well, the enemy was pinned downand occupied with the chest.
The horns would flank bothsides of the enemy and encircle
them.
The horns would creep throughthe tall grass and bush very
quietly, and then Shaka wouldyell out a command to let them
know that they were close enoughto stand and charge at full

(20:52):
force.
How scary.
Yeah, now, by flanking theenemy with young and fast junior
warriors, the chest coulddestroy the trapped enemy.
Now, lastly, the loins, ofcourse, got out of loins, right,
that's the most important part,they were a large reserve of
warriors that were hidden behindthe chest formation, with their

(21:12):
backs actually turned to thebattle, so that they would not
lose any confidence in going upand fighting and either flee or
unnecessarily engage in thebattle.
By being so revved up and, likeI'm, going to go fuck them up.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
That's my brother.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
So they would just sit there waiting for a
commander who sat in front ofthem watching the battle, and
then he would tell like OK, goto the right flank, go to the
right horn, go to the left horns, like back up the middle.
So they would just engagewherever the enemy threatened to
break out of the encampment.

Speaker 2 (21:45):
I don't think I've ever heard of another example of
an army having their backsturned Like that's kind of a
cool little tidbit.
Yeah, yeah, that's very, veryinteresting yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:56):
I don't think I have not heard of it.
There's nothing that we'vetalked about.

Speaker 2 (21:58):
No definitely nothing we've talked about.
And shout out to 30 episodesthat we have not talked about 30
episodes.

Speaker 1 (22:04):
30 episodes ADHD.

Speaker 2 (22:08):
We both have ADHD, so fucking bad, jesus Christ.

Speaker 3 (22:11):
Now, before shock had perfected this battle tactic,
men were basically free tocharge and throw spears as they
pleased right, kind of like amob mentality of people with
centralized focus but a lack ofeffective tactics.
The beautiful thing about thehorns formation was that it was
simple.
Simple.
Every man knew that they werewhat they were supposed to do
and it didn't take muchcoordination, which was super

(22:34):
helpful in chaotic conditions.
So if you're the chest, youcharge.
If you're the horns, you getaround their flank, if you're
the longs, you go where you'reneeded within those two
positions.
Not too hard, like anybody canfigure that out, right.
Yeah, another major change inthe tactics of fighting and
battle was to leave no man alive.
Shaka Zulu believed that TenguSueo's policy of leaving the

(22:56):
defeated retreating soldiersalive to fight another day was
way too kind.
Way too kind.
Shaka wanted complete victoryand we're going to get more into
this in a little bit of aspecific battle.
Of what he did, he was anabsolutist, he was a tyrant, he
was a mean motherfucker,effective.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
He was mean.
Yeah, we don't always talkabout nice people here on the
podcast.
So in the year 1816, Shaka'sfather died and Shaka's half
brother assumed power of theZulu people.
Tengu Sueo saw this as anopportunity to gain control over
Zulu and lent Shaka themilitary support necessary to

(23:38):
assassinate his half brother andallow Shaka to make himself
chieftain of the Zulu, whilestill remaining loyal to Tengu
Sueo.

Speaker 3 (23:47):
Which is very important, because this is how
he starts building his empire.

Speaker 2 (23:52):
So Shaka had become Tengu Sueo's favorite commander
and it seems as though hegranted an unusual amount of
freedom to Shaka, which Shakatook and began conquering and
assimilating the neighboringchieftains, including the
Lengeni, which were the peoplefrom his childhood that had
humiliated and fucking bulliedhim and shit which must have

(24:14):
been so satisfying.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
I was just about to say that Such a satisfying
moment.

Speaker 2 (24:19):
I love to see people get there come up and Somebody
had to have gotten punched inthe face.
I'm imagining that they didn'tstop it punching them in the
face.
Quik, quik.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
So when Shaka came into power over the Zulu people,
they controlled just over 100square miles, and Zulu was just
an obscure tribe numbering about1500 people.
That's kind of crazy, though.
1500 people controlling 100square miles Kind of wild.
Yeah, that's literally 15people per mile, africa's huge.

Speaker 3 (24:50):
And it's so big, yeah , so much room.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Yes.
So by the time Shaka's regimeended, after 12 years, he had
turned the small Zulu clan intothe most powerful empire in
South Africa by conquering morethan 20,000 square miles of land
, with over a quarter millionpeople submitting to his

(25:14):
authority.
So plain and simple, it wasindeed a rule of fear.

Speaker 3 (25:20):
Yeah, he was mean.
He was mean.
So, while Shaka would enterinto friendly alliances with
neighboring tribes, he wouldrule his own people with
absolute authority In a massivedisplay of public executions.
It is said that Shaka orderedthe clubbing to death of anyone

(25:40):
who threatened him or mightoppose him in the future.
Lot of paranoia in his mindset,as well.
I mean, I guess there's not alot of trust to be going around
as people are just dying off andthis and that and the other,
yeah, yeah, and twice the times,and it's all for the cattle,
bro, all for the cattle.

Speaker 2 (26:01):
Well, I mean, nowadays it's all about the
money.
You know, got to get that guap,got to get that crop.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (26:07):
Got to get that guap got to get that crop, that's a
rap song.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
I'd say it can note Shaka.

Speaker 3 (26:15):
So get that guap guap cow hide.
What's up, mer?

Speaker 2 (26:23):
So the first rate in information about Shaka comes
from two white adventurers, ofcourse.
Of course, nathaniel Isaacs andHenry Francis Fan, two very,
very sus characters.
Yeah, sus as fuck.
And for those of us who areolder than 40, sus means suspect
.

Speaker 1 (26:44):
Suspicious.

Speaker 2 (26:52):
God, dude, what you got the group over there, what's
?

Speaker 3 (26:54):
up.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Your name's Cooper, not Cooper.
We are still getting over ourchest congestion that we had
last week.
It's horrible.

Speaker 1 (27:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
So Don't go away Now.
Nathaniel Isaacs was about 16or 17 years old and only spent
about four months with ShakaKind of crazy and then went off
to become a slave trader Classicwhites and Finn was probably on
the run from the law and endedup marrying four women and
having 12 kids.

Speaker 3 (27:23):
Yeah, in South Africa Also called classic whites.

Speaker 2 (27:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we do that, jesus.

Speaker 3 (27:31):
Did.
We did that Well also keep inmind.
I didn't explain this, but inSouth Africa, polygamy was also
common.

Speaker 1 (27:39):
Norm.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
Just like Northern Greenland with Peter Freyken
Good old Freyken.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
I love the poop sickle.
I love the poop sickle.
What was that?

Speaker 2 (27:49):
episode like four or something.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
That was pretty early on right, it was like within
the first 10,.
I think yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
God, what a banger, what a banger.
So historians say that Isaacsand Finn colluded to vilify
Shaka and make him out to be amythological monster.
Of course Shaka was no angel,but within the diary of Henry
Francis Finn, historians havefound several contradictions
between his writings and thestories of the local people.

(28:15):
Today, Zulu people don't seeShaka as a fierce war mongering
animal.
They actually see him as theman who brought them together.

Speaker 3 (28:26):
Yeah, and these two guys.
So there is no actual like theyfabricated a lot of shit.
Yeah, White people alteringhistory.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
Yeah, exactly Like.

Speaker 3 (28:40):
Mr Finn over here is trying to sell a fucking book.
No Right, he's trying to make aprofit.
And then the other guy fucking,nathaniel Isaacs.

Speaker 2 (28:49):
Some of that yellow journalism.

Speaker 3 (28:50):
Yeah, exactly, nathaniel Isaacs is just like
whatever and he wants to saywhatever he wants because most
of fucking England or Europe andall that it's not going to come
to South Africa unless they'rethere for a bunch of resources
which we'll get into lateriPhones, iphones.

(29:12):
As Shaka was becoming more andmore powerful, there came a
threat from another chieftainwho had just as strong an
ambition, named Chief Zawade.
From the north, from the north,from the north Beyond the wall,
I don't know why Just throwinga lot of weird inflections out
there.
No, I like it.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
No, the inflection is good.
The inflection is good, cooper,you're learning from me.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
Now Zawade was the leader of the Andwande tribe.
Now Zawade at the time was morepowerful than Shaka and Shaka
definitely knew that.
He was not ready to face Zawadeimmediately.
So he consolidated his defensesby moving to a new fucking
capital at oh God Quabolaueo.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
Yeah, that one Quabolaueo.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
Yeah, let's say it with confidence here.
Cooper, re-read that and justsay it with confidence.
Quabolaueo.

Speaker 3 (30:09):
I think you did it well enough.
Okay, cool, cool, cool.
So he knew that Zawade would.
He would be after him soon, sohe named this new capital the
Place of Killings.
What, that's where I want tolive.
Sounds like there's good realestate.
Oh, it's brutal, because healso, like fucking, murders his
own people.
Now, by establishing this newcapital, he was buying time to
build up his army, and in early1818, zawade attacked Shaka at

(30:35):
his new capital.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
Okay, Now, Denguezueo Shaka's mentor died in this
attempted invasion of rivalchieftain Zawade.
How did you say it?
Zawade, Zawade, Zawade, like asoft D.
That's all I got.
This is soft D.

Speaker 3 (30:55):
You're so proud of yourself aren't you?

Speaker 2 (30:58):
So?
According to Henry FrancisFlynn, denguezueo's death was
the result of Shaka's betrayaland lust for power, but this
accusation lacks testimony fromliterally anybody else.
However, it is a fact that whenDenguezueo fought his last
battle against Zawade, shaka didnot arrive at the scene until

(31:19):
after Zawade had capturedDenguezueo, so it was kind of
like he was late to the party.

Speaker 3 (31:25):
Yeah, yeah and yeah like.
So in the reason, like I put in, according to Henry Francis
Flynn, is because in his diarything that he published, he he's
out there to vilify.
Why do I?

Speaker 2 (31:37):
feel like Shaka just slapped the shit out of Henry
one time.

Speaker 3 (31:42):
And Henry was like they don't actually know if they
met.

Speaker 2 (31:45):
They don't even know if they met.
Maybe it was like one of hischieftains or something.

Speaker 3 (31:49):
Yeah, he thinks that the historians believe that
Henry Francis Flynn just knew ofShaka because he was very and
he decided to insert himself inthe middle.

Speaker 2 (31:59):
Yeah, he knew that Shaka was extremely powerful.

Speaker 3 (32:01):
He knew that he was conquering all these tribes and
taking up all this land.
And he's like.
I want to insert myself hereand I'm going to write that book
and make him whatever characterI want.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
What's crazy is the dude 17.

Speaker 3 (32:12):
That's nope, that's Isaac's.

Speaker 2 (32:14):
Oh, how old was Flynn ?
Was he a little bit older, likeF, five years older?

Speaker 3 (32:18):
So, yeah, okay, so he's still like 23.
Yeah, nothing crazy yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:21):
Nothing crazy.
So where was Shaka whenDenguezweyo was captured, right?
No one is certain.
Obviously, these are legendspassed down by word of mouth.
Henry Francis Flynn would haveyou believe that there was some
kind of coup, but historiansbelieve that he was simply
fighting elsewhere during thebattle and could not protect
Denguezweyo, which I'm kind ofon that side too, because it
sounds to me like I mean, as adude with daddy issues myself, I

(32:44):
mean I wouldn't want my fatherto be a figure to die.

Speaker 3 (32:48):
Exactly, and that's the biggest thing is like yeah,
he very much like.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
This is the first community that that Shaka has
actually felt a member of, andthen he was put into this
position of leadership.
I don't think he's going tojust turn on Denguezweyo because
he's power hungry.

Speaker 1 (33:03):
I think he respects Denguezweyo.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
Yeah, so after Denguezweyo's capture.
So what headed him?
In an attempt to prevent the MTots will regimen from winning.
But Shaka managed to keep theforces intact to defeat and
drive out Zawade and the end endHuawei people Right.
So Shaka used many tactics todrive out the end Huawei people,

(33:26):
tactics outside of his bullhornbattlefield strategy, such as
leaving small numbers of cattleout in the open as a trap.
That's kind of sick.

Speaker 1 (33:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
Yeah, when the end Wanda soldiers would attempt to
kill and consume these cattle,shaka would spring a trap of
Zulu warriors to ambush them.
He would send Zulu men into theend Huawei camps to stab the
enemy warriors in their bedswhile sleeping.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
Yeah, he did anything that was like.

Speaker 1 (33:54):
I'm just going to massacre.

Speaker 2 (33:55):
They're not going to fucking expect this, yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
And he knew that Zawade was stronger than him.
He had more men than.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
Shaka and Denguezweyo .
If you get in a fight with aman who's 400 pounds in all
muscle, you kick him in theballs.
Yes, you kick him in the balls.
That's the only option.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
If you have a gun, you should shoot him.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yeah, well, yes, if you have a gun you should shoot
him.
Or if you got a quick.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
You could give him a quick and you're fine.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
So, after the tactful victory, the leaderless and to
a state began to collapse, andShaka immediately assumed
leadership and swore vengeancefor the fall in Denguezweyo.
He began.

Speaker 2 (34:33):
He's like my father, my father.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
I'm not an intestinal beetle.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
It's kind of funny, I think.
Zulu translates to heaven.
So essentially is what we'recalling his intestinal beetle in
heaven, oh it's intestinal.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
It's not an intestinal beetle in heaven.
It's an intestinal beetle, it'sjust a bunch of intestines
floating around and they're justswimming through them.
They're just like yes this isbeautiful Nice weather we're
having there, frank.
They're like oh, thank you howare you intestines?
My intestines are good.
How are you intestines?

Speaker 3 (35:10):
They're good.
So, after Shaka swore vengeancefor the fall in Denguezweyo, he
began conquering surroundingchieftains, himself, adding
their forces and resources tohis own, and continued building
up the Zulu kingdom, a warriorculture that literally had never
existed before, and changedthem from being these herdsmen

(35:31):
of the plains to conquerors.

Speaker 2 (35:34):
There's so much death happening, and I feel like
anytime we've talked about thismuch death, it always revolves
around one thing the Christians.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
But this time it doesn't.
It's so nice that it's not areligious warfare.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
It's not religious at all.

Speaker 3 (35:49):
This is very refreshing.

Speaker 2 (35:50):
That's crazy, that's a good point.
I didn't even think about that.
It's like there's no Christians.
Should that just be the titleof the episode?

Speaker 3 (35:57):
Shaka Zulu.
The death of millions, Not byreligion.

Speaker 2 (36:00):
Without Christians, no Christians, no crusades here.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
We're terrible people .

Speaker 3 (36:12):
So Shaka's vengeance and the war he was about to
bring would lead to a period ofunparalleled chaos and
devastation.
And Zulu, they called it theemphakane.
In English we call it thecrushing.

Speaker 2 (36:27):
I got to say the English version is a little
better to me, it's a little morepowerful, it is the emphakane
or the crushing Sounds likesomething.

Speaker 3 (36:36):
Kratos would say.
Now, however, before delvinginto the crushing, it's crucial
to explore why warfare escalatedinto genocide and why the
region was on the brink of chaosat the slightest hint of
conflict.
Much of this complexity stemmedfrom European influence and not

(36:57):
because the Europeans wereinstigating it.
In fact, there was actuallymany Europeans who attempted to
aid the situation.
However, the stark differencesin wealth, technology and
societal structures betweenEuropeans and the local
population inadvertentlydestabilized the region merely
by their presence.

(37:17):
So it's kind of like just whenRoanoke Roanoke, when they went
over and then they pissed offthe tribes because they were
trading in one area.
They caused all this littledestabilizing doing a whole.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
Oh, it's like, you know, it's funny is it's kind of
like the Red Dead Redemption 2storyline where there's those
two families and the gang triesto get in the middle of it, you
know, and they're looking forthem because they want the money
they want the gold.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sameshit, different toilets.

Speaker 3 (37:46):
Cowboys and Shakazula Basically same thing.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
Yeah, essentially.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
Now, the surge in European trade introduced new
goods, triggering a populationboom that heightened competition
for land.
Simultaneously, european shipstraded for cattle to replenish
their food supplies, inflatingthe value of cattle, which
caused more raids amongst tribes.

(38:11):
Additionally, european traderssought ivory, which necessitated
the hunting of elephants, whichdemanded significant
coordination among groups ofpeople, because those are some
big motherfuckers.
Some suggest that this demandfor ivory contributed to the
more organized and significantlymore lethal tactics implemented

(38:32):
by Shaka.
Amidst these challenges, adrought caused the more water
dependent crops to fail,resulting in a famine.
So many famines happen.

Speaker 3 (38:42):
There's always a fucking famine.
It just ruins everything.
It's.

Speaker 2 (38:44):
Africa, dude.
It's where the locusts wereborn, I mean let's be, honest
here.
Consequently, the natal areawas teetering on the edge of
catastrophe due to thesecumulative pressures.

Speaker 3 (38:57):
So, it was very fragile ground.

Speaker 2 (38:59):
Yeah, like there was all sorts of different shit
happening in that toilet.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
Yeah yeah.
Lots of shit was spinningaround.
Now Shaka continued to expand.
That was nice.

Speaker 2 (39:08):
Lots of shit was spinning around.
I like that.
I like that.
That was quick, that was good.
That was good.

Speaker 3 (39:14):
Shaka continued expanding his territory and
brought in neighboring tribeswith diplomacy when possible,
but would often force tribes tojoin the Zulu Kingdom.
It was either you're going tojoin and you're going to be
happy about it, and if you don'twant to join, we're going to
kill every single man who is afighting agent.
Take all the women and kids.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
It's kind of like when people tried to convert
other people to Christianity orany other religion on the planet
.

Speaker 3 (39:39):
But this was more for a very real life, practical
reason.
Yeah, but this was likeassimilation for the demand of
building an empire for the sakeof his unsecurity and wealth.

Speaker 2 (39:49):
At the end of the day , cooper call it what it is
practical genocide.
Holy shit, it's so fucked up.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
That's not true at all.
Exactly what this is.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
Exactly what no, no, that's exactly what Shaka
thought this was.
It's still fucked up.
We need to make that very clear.
This is a fucked up situation,but, yeah, practical genocide.

Speaker 3 (40:13):
So, like we said earlier, when Shaka defeated an
enemy, he would set out todestroy that enemy completely.
Once he had killed off theenemy's army, he would then
march his men into the enemyvillage and kill all the men of
the fighting age, assimilatingonly the women and the children
into the Zulu tribe.

Speaker 2 (40:29):
It's just, it's like I know your paws gone, but we
got a tent for you Once again,once again.

Speaker 3 (40:36):
ladies and gentlemen, there's never been a better
time to be alive than right now.
Dude, I'm saying You're inUkraine or in Gaza or in Israel
or actually still even in Africa.
Yeah, honestly, if you were togo online and type in active war
zones right now.
There are 32 to 33 countries inan active war right now, so as

(40:58):
long as you're not in one ofthose, there's never been a
better time to be alive, may theodds be ever in your favor by
chance of birth.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
Yeah, literally, literally.

Speaker 3 (41:07):
What a dream Swimming in the right pair of nuts.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
I mean.
But think about it though backthen, like there was probably a
lot more than 30 wars going on.

Speaker 1 (41:14):

Speaker 3 (41:15):
Like back then, so we're still technically 30 is a
low number for the world.
Well, this is early 1800s, sowe're talking Napoleon going on
right now.
Which?

Speaker 2 (41:26):
is like that counts as like seven.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
Let's be honest, yeah .

Speaker 2 (41:30):
Well, that counts as like seven, because he was
fucking up a lot of differentcountries.

Speaker 3 (41:34):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So they called themselves withthe boars and they had an
interesting proposition, becausethey were Dutch and then
Napoleon was happening, and thenNapoleon took over all the
Dutch people and then the Dutchwas no longer country, and yet
then the people that were inAfrica that were Dutch were

(41:58):
claimed by the English or theBritish I'm sorry and then they
were just kind of like in thisweird purgatory stance for a
while.

Speaker 2 (42:07):
You know, you're so damn knowledgeable, you're so
damn knowledgeable.

Speaker 3 (42:11):
And they didn't even know if they were going to be
assimilated back into their ownfucking country, because
Napoleon was doing all of hisshit.
God, I'm so moist.

Speaker 2 (42:17):
Yeah, sorry, anyway, so I'm so moist.
So anyways, like we saidearlier, good old Zawade was
making plans to destroy Shaka inthe Zulu Kingdom Shaka was
building.
Zawade made his second attemptby sending his entire army into
Zululand in April of 1818.

(42:38):
Even though Zawade had evenmore manpower, shaka had the
perfect strategy to exhaust thelarge army.
Shaka simply retreated his menand drew Zawade's forces deep
into Zulu territory.
How does that sound familiar?
Scorched earth policy?
Yeah, russia.

Speaker 3 (42:57):
Except they weren't scorched in the earth.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
No, they were just dipping.
Yeah, they were just packing up, they would go.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
Yeah, exactly, they were like because there was
little communities and stufflike that and they would.

Speaker 2 (43:08):
It wasn't always great, it was like hey, if you
stay here, you're probably goingto die.

Speaker 3 (43:11):
Come with us.
Oh no, it was like you aregoing to leave, because you are
not allowed to leave any kind ofresources for these people.
Oh, okay, yeah, and this is ina very, very quick time.
This is I'm not talking monthsor anything when I say they're
retreating.
This is like in a 24 hourperiod 24, 48 hour period.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
Okay yeah.
And since Zawade's army wasfatigued, he positioned about
5,000 of his warriorsstrategically on a hill in the
path of the approaching enemy.
Zawade, seeking this as an easyvictory due to his numerical
superiority, decided to go aheadand charge ahead.
Shaka took note of this andsent a faction of his men out

(43:53):
from the hill in order todistract a large portion of
Zawade's army away from the hill.
But Zawade's men who were stillcharging the hill still
outnumbered Shaka.
Surprisingly, this was anadvantage to Shaka.
Zawade's men were getting inthe way of each other as they
climbed up the hill and werestarting to reach the top of the

(44:14):
hill in more of a disorganizedmob rather than an organized
army.
That's kind of like when in theAlamo, like they're all tightly
packed.

Speaker 3 (44:23):
Bro, I was thinking the same shit when I was writing
this.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:26):
It's kind of like the Alamo.
That's crazy Wow.

Speaker 3 (44:30):
Now this uphill climb and the disorganization made
the long-throwing spear Zawade'smen carried up the hill
completely useless.
They basically like turn intowalking sticks.
Yeah at this point.

Speaker 2 (44:41):
I'd be using it as a fucking walking stick.
I hope I'm at least six rowsback, though I got to.
I give me a little time toprepare.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
Yeah no.
The Zulu counter attacked,charging down the hill and
crashed into the enemy line withtheir short stabbing spears,
causing the enemy to retreat andstampede backwards down the
hill.
Just complete chaos from theenemy right here yeah, zawade's
men.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
Well, it's an uphill battle.

Speaker 3 (45:05):
Literally, this is where that term came from.
No, I have no idea where thatterm came from.

Speaker 2 (45:09):
Probably something along the same lines the Battle
of Hagenkort, that's what I'mtalking about.

Speaker 3 (45:13):
That's what the Hagenkort Shaka then gathered
his men back into formation atthe top of the hill and waited.
Zawade's men charged up thathill five fucking times that day
, and each time they werethwarted by the smaller force.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
You know what?
I think I was thinking ofHagenkort, not the Alamo, when I
brought that up.
I think I was thinking ofHagenkort because in the Alamo
it was more like from behindthey were getting shot.
Alamo.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
Alamo was Travis Scott's concert.
Yeah.
And then Hagenkort is adownhill like clusterfuck of
knights wearing too much armorand a lot of mud.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:47):
It's like a mixture of the two.
Yeah, al Alamonkort.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
It's called Don't Run Too Fast because the people in
the front are going to fuck itup.
Yeah, now, zawade's men werestarting to seriously fatigue at
this point, and some of the menwould actually slip off to go
to this river that was about amile away to drink some water
and cool off, because the sunwas hotter than fuck that day,
let me take a bath.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
Honestly, draw a bath for me, please, but we're going
to go chill with the hippos broMeanwhile each dude.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
There were probably fucking hippos in that river too
.
Of course there were.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
Yeah, they're just chilling, bro Now.
Meanwhile, each time the Zuluscame back to the formation at
the top of the hill, they wereable to refresh themselves with
the supplies that Shaka hadhidden at the top of the hill.
Because smart yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
I mean, he had it all stacked up, so the Zulus were
actually winning the day, butShaka was of course still
outnumbered.
Shaka looked out to thedistance and saw a signal fire,
so the division force that hehad used earlier to lure some of
Zuade's men were actuallyletting him know that the enemy
who was chasing them were ontheir way.

(46:57):
So that's very, very smart.

Speaker 3 (46:59):
Yeah, they were circling back around like,
alright, we're not going tocatch these guys.
We need to actually go help outZuade and kill Shaka, Because
that's the whole point.
Why are we chasing these random50 dudes?

Speaker 2 (47:08):
Yeah, yeah.
So Shaka knew that he had toshatter Zuade's army before this
enemy faction returned andstrengthened the enemy numbers.
The Zulus were feeling somefatigue themselves and had lost
a fair amount of men during eachclash, but of course Shaka was
prepared.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
What did he have, ian ?
He had the lions.
Oh my God, the lions, the lions, not my dyslexic ass almost
saying lions.

Speaker 3 (47:40):
I was literally about to be like.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
I was about to be like.
I literally read this scriptand I do not remember him
sending a faction of lions athis enemy.
No, he had the lions.
There was the fresh, ready tofight lion faction, sitting in a
depression on the backside ofthe hill that Zuade was unaware
of.
I mean, he's battling inunfamiliar territory.

(48:02):
This is Shaka's homeland.

Speaker 3 (48:04):
Well, kind of yeah, basically His foster homeland.

Speaker 2 (48:07):
There you go, yeah.
So Shaka called for thebullhorn formation and filled
the horns with the fresh men.
Seeing this large force appearas if from nowhere, Zuade's army
began to panic.
Pinned by the chest rememberthe chest and encircled by the
horns remember the horns thislast column of the enemy was

(48:30):
crushed and sent survivorsfleeing.
When we say crushed, that meansthat they were fucking murdered,
yeah, destroyed just decimated,decapitated, shaka sent a small
contingent of men to kill anyenemy they could find taking
water at the river, while hismain force pursued the bulk of
the fleeing army.
But as the group of enemy menthat had gone off to chase the

(48:54):
diversionary force began toclose in, shaka was forced to
call off the chase.
Neither side took a prisonerand at the end of this one day,
nearly 2,000 Zulus lay dead, asdid 7,500 of Zuade's men, but

(49:14):
not Zawade.
He had managed to flee, fucker.
Alright, dude, it's always good.
Now remember these-.

Speaker 1 (49:19):
Cause he's hanging out in the back.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
He's hanging out in the back in the comfort of his
tent, probably by the river,getting water and watching
hippos fuck.
Shhh, something like that.
Yeah, he's watching.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
Animal Planet, but live Now.
Keep in mind these people ofZawade's men, like the army that
he was commanding was theAndondway, so the people that
had previously raided and killedDenguezweyo.
Yes, so they are very muchstill around.
There's still a very largerival tribe, and there's fucking
beef.
There's some serious beef.

Speaker 1 (49:49):
And I'm not talking cattle.

Speaker 3 (49:51):
But there's so much cattle there's so much cattle,
so much cattle.
See, zawade was not popularamong a lot of the other tribes
in the region and as theneighboring tribes began to
slowly ally themselves withShaka after this crushing defeat
, it helped Shaka bolster hisnumbers as an army and just as a

(50:12):
nation, essentially, but Zawadedid not give up.
After 18 months of minorscrimmages, zawade, leading the
Andondway, and the Zulus came toa head one final time.

Speaker 1 (50:26):
The Zulus were able to trap One final time.
Finish them, finish him.

Speaker 3 (50:32):
Now this is crazy.
So the Zulus were able to trapthe Andondway by a river and
separated the men on either sideof the river, so diminishing
the fighting force of theAndondway people.
After two days of fiercefighting, the Andondays were
scattered across the land.
Now Shaka saw this as anopportunity and marched his Zulu

(50:54):
army to the Andondway capitalbefore the news of their army's
defeat could reach them.
So as he and his men approachedfrom the distance, he had the
Zulu men begin to sing Andondwayvictory songs.

Speaker 1 (51:09):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (51:10):
And when the Andonday people came out to greet them
in anticipation of celebration,they were instead met by a swift
fucking slaughter.
I'm so fucked up, so fucked up.
They fucking massacred thisentire capital of people.
Now, once again, zawade managedto escape that sleaky bastard,

(51:33):
except his mother did not.
Shaka locked her in a housewith jackals and hyenas to eat
her alive, and then he fuckingset the hut on fire so that all
that was left was just trash.
Oh my God yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
So he killed all the hyenas and jackals.

Speaker 3 (51:50):
Uh, you know, it didn't, it didn't clarify.
Well, you think he let him out?
I don't know no probably moreabout the principle.
It's Shaka man, it's Shaka.
So Shaka ordered his army toshock in awe.
Sorry, shock in awe, shakaordered his army to destroy the
Anduande homeland in a mannerthat would prevent them from
ever being able to rebuild thereagain.

(52:12):
So it wasn't just about likeassimilating these people, it
was you're done, you're gone,yeah, and will murder you, yeah.
This truly shattered theAnduande state, scattering them
all over the land.
From fleeing this battle,zawande commanders fled north,
where actually, like so one ofthe commanders?
He fled up north andestablished his own fucking

(52:34):
kingdom, such as uh, which wascalled the Shengan Kingdom in
Gaza.
They traveled way north.
Yeah, they traveled likeliterally longer than the
continent.

Speaker 2 (52:45):
This takes place in southern Africa.
Yes, and then they went up toGaza.
That's crazy.
Yeah, we all know where Gaza isnowadays, nowadays.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
And if you don't?

Speaker 2 (52:52):
read a fucking news article.

Speaker 3 (52:55):
It's pretty popular these days, yeah, unfortunately.

Speaker 2 (52:58):
By the year 1821, shaka had successfully expanded
Zulu land to 9,000 square miles,conquering and diplomatically
obtaining land that was trulyfruitful to the Zulus.
It was about this time that theZulus became very wealthy,
especially in cattle, which, asstated before, was basically the
lifeblood of their economy.
Shaka built his forces into theterror of the land through

(53:22):
strict drilling and discipline.
According to the Shaka Zuludocumentary from the biography
channel, if a warrior lost theirspear in a battle, shaka would
place his spear on top of thewarrior's foot and begin to spin
the spear very slowly, whilecalmly saying things such as why

(53:43):
would you lose your spear?

Speaker 1 (53:45):
How will you fight and defend yourself without your
spear?
Your enemy could pick it up andtry to kill you or one of your
comrades.
Do you see that you areweakening my power as king?
How come you lost your spear?

Speaker 3 (54:03):
So scary, it's fucking dead.
All while he's generally aspear into your foot, I was
reading that and got scared.
I was reading that and gotscared.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
So Shaka also forbade his armies to wear sandals so
they could toughen their feetBarefoot.
Motherfuckers.
He would make them run barefootthrough thorny ground so that
when they faced battle theywould have no problem with their
mobility or speed.
It's kind of like if we've everwatched Naked and Afraid when
they're in Africa and it's justthorny ground and they're just

(54:32):
picking fucking thorns out oftheir feet nonstop.
That's exactly what it is.
Yep, I'm a Naked and Afraidenthusiast.
I think that's a great show.
Is that your porn hub?
We all know those contestantswere fucking Cooper.
We all know it.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
They just turned off the camera.
Is that where you get off?
Is the imagination of, like thetest talking?
It's just so much more natural.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I getthat More primitive.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
I really like it when there's two dudes that are
partners.

Speaker 3 (54:58):
So anyway, I'm sure you do Now listen to the noises
I'm hearing coming from yourroom.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
Just a whole bunch of hee-haw.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
Why is there a donkey ?
Why wouldn't there be Cooper?
We're in Africa, baby.

Speaker 3 (55:14):
Are there?
Are there donkeys in Africa?
Mules maybe?

Speaker 2 (55:16):
I thought those were Middle Eastern things they have
horses?

Speaker 3 (55:19):
I don't think so.
Oh fuck it.
They hit zebras.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
Yes, that was a zebra .
This whole time it's off camera.

Speaker 1 (55:28):
Okay, I don't.
I don't know what they're doing.

Speaker 3 (55:29):
They got stripes.
I can't see where they're at.

Speaker 2 (55:32):
Colorblind Cooper.
They blend into the surroundingarea, so the thorny field that
they trained on was produced byspreading an African acacia bush
over the ground.
These are the bushes that thepeople in Naked and Afraid would
hide in to hide from the lionsFor fucking clarifying this.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
If anybody watches that show, they'll understand.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
They'll get it.
So when he first instructedthis training, he told the men
take your shoes off and you willdance until the thorns are flat
.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
I want to see no thorn uncrushed.

Speaker 3 (56:08):
There were.
I really love your Africanaccent.

Speaker 2 (56:10):
That's not an African accent, that's a badass accent.
Oh okay, yeah, don't make itracial.

Speaker 3 (56:14):
It's not, it's fucking.
Just knowing You're making itracial by do not doing the
accent right what?

Speaker 2 (56:20):
You want me to be up here and go well, when in Jim
Bob way like, and that's I soundlike a fucking American.
That's, that's my best attemptyou can say I'm saving myself
from the embarrassment.

Speaker 3 (56:29):
You just say take your shoes off.

Speaker 1 (56:31):
No, that's racist, that's, that's immediately
racist.

Speaker 2 (56:34):
That's immediately too far.

Speaker 1 (56:35):
Those whole segments being taken out.
You're a bald white man.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Definitely cultured.
I've been to Italy.

Speaker 2 (56:46):
One of the most white , non-white areas on the planet.
Got it, man.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
Got it.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
It's like the South Africa of Europe.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
So anyway he is fucking sick.

Speaker 2 (57:00):
Okay, arthur Morgan made me sad.
Literally made me so sad.
So there were two men who endedup questioning this kind of
training.
Right, they were like I don'tcare about the thorns, this is
fucked up.
And so Shaka immediately hadthese men clubbed in the head
until they were dead.
Just fucking done, dunta, justGonski.

Speaker 3 (57:22):
Now, this tactic was another way to make sure that,
when an enemy army churned andretreated wearing their sandals,
the barefooted Zulu could catchthem with ease and efficiently
finish them off, couldn't?

Speaker 2 (57:35):
couldn't they have just, oh, I don't know worn
sandals or no.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
The point is, because they're wearing sandals, you're
not able to run as fast.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
Okay okay, okay, okay , okay, it's adding up.

Speaker 2 (57:47):
It's adding up.

Speaker 3 (57:47):
Yeah, exactly, they became their own war dogs.
They became their own Roman wardogs.
Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Now, the more victory Shaka won, the more cruel he became.
Women, children and the oldwere killed.
No one was spared.
Shaka's war cry was victory ordeath.
He would keep his men enlistedin the army and ordered them

(58:11):
continuously to go on militarycampaigns until he thought that
they had earned the right towear the headring of manhood,
which was called the encyclical.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Yeah well, which is another word for cock ring?
I don't think so.
No, it's a cock.

Speaker 3 (58:27):
It's a headband.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
Oh, a headband Going around the going around the head
of the oh, my God Sorry it's anentire country that's going to
hate you.

Speaker 1 (58:36):
Yeah, that's fine, it's a continent, by the way.

Speaker 3 (58:39):
Now.
According to I'm going to stopthis right now no, according to
YouTube's extra historydocu-series, through Shaka's
military campaigns, he had builta true empire and exerted
influence far beyond the regionshe could control.
However, his actions had aprofound impact on the tribes he
displaced, the refugees he leftbehind and the warriors he

(59:03):
uprooted from their homes andspread out like a virus across
Africa.
Herpes, oh, oh, okay, I guessit's my herpes.

Speaker 1 (59:11):
Technically, I guess you're not wrong Probably spread
at a similar rate.

Speaker 3 (59:15):
you know, all of these men who had seen the Zulu
fight adopted the Zulu way ofwar and as they fled the now
mighty Zulu, they inflicted thesame brutality on those around
them.
This was the Mephacani.
This was the crushing thecrushing.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
The causes of the crushing were multifaceted and
complex.
While Shaka Zulu's expansionistpolicies and military campaigns
played a role in triggeringconflicts and displacements,
other factors such asenvironmental pressures, the
slave trade, of course, and thedestabilizing effects of

(59:55):
European colonization, alsocontributed to this.
So, as Shaka Zulu's kingdomexpanded, neighboring tribes
were displaced or absorbed,leading to waves of migration
and conflicts among differentgroups vying for resources and
territory.
The upheaval resulted inwidespread chaos, devastation

(01:00:17):
and the displacement ofcountless communities across
Southern Africa.
The repercussions of thecrushing reverberated across the
region, leading to theformation of new alliances, the
collapse of establishedsocieties and the reshaping of
political landscapes.
It significantly altered thesocial and political dynamics of

(01:00:41):
Southern Africa, leaving alasting impact on the affected
communities and their histories.
The tribes escaping the Zulueither perished or established
their own kingdoms usingsimilarly violent tactics
learned from the Zulu, but, ofcourse, at a great cost.
Over the next 15 years, theSouthern half of Africa

(01:01:05):
witnessed the deaths of onemillion to two million people
due to these refugees carving adestructive path across the land
.

Speaker 3 (01:01:17):
It's so insane what this caused.

Speaker 1 (01:01:21):
It's the ripple effect.

Speaker 3 (01:01:22):
Yeah, it's crazy, yeah, it's just, it's sad, it's
insanely sad, and it's also whatwe still like what's still
happening today and to it's thehuman condition, it's absolutely
the human condition of survival.

Speaker 2 (01:01:36):
Well, get this.

Speaker 3 (01:01:37):
So this is, in a way, the same kind of thing that
happened in sometime in the1700s, with American slaves
being shipped back to Africa.
So get this.
There was a ship where I don'tknow where this supported from I
think it might have been it wasin one of the Southern states,
I think and it was some fuckingwhite dude's idea that we're

(01:02:01):
like, we're going to send theslaves back to Africa.
Now this is generations afterthe actual Africans had been
stolen and kidnapped from Africato be brought over.

Speaker 2 (01:02:10):
Those poor dudes had no idea what the fuck they were
getting into.

Speaker 3 (01:02:14):
So it was what they did when they gave all these
fucking old slaves guns and justdropped them off on West Africa
shorelines.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
Well, at least they had guns.

Speaker 3 (01:02:24):
Well, you know what they fucking did?
What they used those guns,thousands of guns, and they went
to tribes and they did theexact same thing the whites did
to the slaves, to the tribes inAfrica, and started slaving
around people and built theirown little militia empires.

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
The warlords.

Speaker 3 (01:02:42):
Which is why you see these warlord factions all over
Africa and why everything is sodisorganized.

Speaker 2 (01:02:47):
I did not know that.
That was the reason I honestlyI mean that specifically is not
the reason, the reason, but it'sa contributing factor.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
Like.
So this example of the refugeescarving this destructive path
across Africa because of thisripple effect that Zulu did to
all of these people anddisplaced them, is the same
thing that happened in NorthernAfrica from America, which
probably, if did, there was asimilar thing that probably
happened from Europeans, thathappened from the Middle Eastern
.

Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
That's very, very interesting.
I never really honestly, to becompletely frank I didn't
realize that we had sent peopleback.

Speaker 3 (01:03:20):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, we yeah, there were attempts,
random shit, to just happen thisis just like a random ripple
thing, Right right, right, right, right.

Speaker 2 (01:03:28):
But it's important to talk about because I mean, fuck
, I didn't know.
Yeah, I'm sure there's plentyof people who had no idea, and
that's a very interestingcontributing factor, because you
send a bunch of people backwith fucking shotguns and 22
rifles to an area that usescrossbows and spears and short
spears.
That's the only thing that'sgoing to happen.
A superior, physically superiorpeople comes in.

(01:03:51):
They're going to take over.

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
Yeah 100%.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
Yeah, it's going to happen.
They have the weapons to do it.

Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
And also at that time Napoleon's fighting and he's in
Egypt as well and he's, youknow, shooting.
He wasn't even shooting shit atthe pyramids, but according to
the movie he was.
There's displacement.
That's happening all overfucking Africa.

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
That still pisses me off, oh God.

Speaker 3 (01:04:11):
I know it's tragic what history did to Africa?

Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
Well it's tragic what humans did to humans.

Speaker 3 (01:04:20):
Yeah, at the end of the day, that's very true,
because it just sucks.
It really does.

Speaker 2 (01:04:24):
We're all just as smart as the next fella, so to
speak, and it sucks that this isour.
I mean it's.
I mean you look at it, this isa completely different topic for
a completely different podcast,and that's fine.
I'll just say it briefly.
But you look at primates.
It is built into our geneticsto dominate, right?
Sure, but that's still tragiconce you get to the level of

(01:04:44):
sentience that humans are Right.
It's just we should be smartenough not to do that.
Yeah, but we do it anyway.
We give into that animalisticinstinct of we need to be in
charge.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
Yeah, and it sucks.
And one thing to keep in mindis that it's not like we were
dumber back then.
We had the same exact brainthat we have now.
Yeah, we've had the same exactbrain for thousands of years.

Speaker 2 (01:05:01):
If anything, we're dumber now, because we don't
have to use our brains as much Iwould actually.

Speaker 1 (01:05:05):
There are smarter people now?

Speaker 2 (01:05:07):
Yes, but on average I would say we're probably dumber
now.

Speaker 3 (01:05:10):
I don't know about that, because illiteracy, I
guess.
Reading, sure, and I'm thinkingmore.

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
I guess common sense Like ask a random American to
practice.
I guess practical knowledge Aska random American to build a
fire.
80% of them can't Well a match.

Speaker 3 (01:05:25):
I feel like that one's pretty.

Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Well, if you have a match, yes, but I'm not giving
them a match.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
I'm saying build a fire, you mean like two sticks.

Speaker 3 (01:05:30):
Yeah, build the fucking fire, yeah.
And if, like Flint and all thatshit, create the fire, yeah,
maybe, exactly.
Yeah, you're right, you'reright, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:05:36):
Yeah, but I mean and I'm sure 80% of these people
could do it we're getting offtopic for sidebarring.

Speaker 3 (01:05:40):
We are totally getting off topic.
Sorry about the sidebar.

Speaker 2 (01:05:42):
I think it's an important subject.
We're wine drunk, it's okay, wecan talk about these things.
So back to the story.

Speaker 3 (01:05:49):
In the biography channel documentary they state
that after a campaign, shakawould ask his commanders who did
not behave well in battle, whohid behind their shield or who
hung back during the fight.
Yeah, dangerous question.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:06:06):
Because you know what's happening after that.
The commanders would then namethe men who acted cowardly and
would then have them put todeath in front of the whole army
by standing in front of adesignated tree called the
Cowards.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
Bush.
Yeah, and it's not pubic hair,ladies and gentlemen, that is a
actual bush.

Speaker 3 (01:06:23):
I don't know why you keep calling my bush Cowards
Bush, just because you can't seeanything more than this If I'm
a dick out of it doesn't meanthat you have to keep calling it
the Cowards.

Speaker 2 (01:06:30):
Bush.
It's a bush with a littlestrawberry on the tip.

Speaker 3 (01:06:33):
I'm a grower, not a shower, all right, okay, okay,
and you did not arouse me, soyou don't know.
He had the men raise theirhands in the air and he would
plunge the shortened stabbingspear into your chest cavity
through the side of their ribsWith this kind of consequence.
It only took a few men beingexecuted for the rest of the

(01:06:55):
army to realize it was a betterdeal for them to join in the
fight and just to act at thebest of their ability and hope
for the best.

Speaker 2 (01:07:01):
Or at least fucking pretend you know.

Speaker 3 (01:07:03):
at least do their best to like get to the front
line, I think it's just yeah,you're just gonna go, you're
gonna just, you're just gonnafight, because you're standing
there and it's more of like Iwouldn't.

Speaker 2 (01:07:12):
I'm a coward dude, I am not a fighter.
I would, I would run and runfar.

Speaker 3 (01:07:19):
Yeah, but here's the other part of this is that it
wasn't just you dying, it wasyour family dying too, yeah,
your fan.
So these warriors would comeback from battle who were acting
cowardly, to find theirchildren beaten to death with
clubs, to find their wives rapedand murdered and dismembered
Like it wasn't just you.
So it didn't take much of thistoo.

(01:07:39):
Really enforce all of the men.
Of course there was always theone, the two, whatever, but then
that person's bloodline wasgone.
Mm yeah, mm-hmm, yep.
Fun times in Africa.

Speaker 2 (01:07:53):
Yeah, yeah.
Singing and dancing traditionswere extremely important to the
Zulu's, and especially to Shaka.
Let's go ahead and take thingsin a completely different
direction.
Yeah, we're gonna divert hatshere, but then I know, we just
dismembered your why, but do youwanna?

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
dance little boy, we're gonna come back here real
quick to death, don't worry yeahit'll happen soon.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
So he was very strict with everyone in attendance at
these gatherings.
If a man coughed while he wasspeaking, he'd be hit in the
head with a club, which meanshe'd be killed, like we would
have died three times duringthis podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:08:26):
Oh, he'd be so dead.
Yeah, god, could you imaginejust being sick?

Speaker 2 (01:08:30):
Yeah, god, like what if you have a cold?

Speaker 3 (01:08:32):
I would, just would stand in the back, bury your
head in the sand.

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
Yeah, yeah.
I'd stand in the back and justbe like hh, hh, hh, hh, yeah.
Now, if someone made him laughwhile he was trying to make a
serious speech, that personwould be hit in the head with a
club.
That's so fucked up.
He's like ha, ha, ha.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
Fucking kill him, get his ass, get his ass.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
So, basically, he ruled his people with an iron
fist.
One of the most fearedlocations by his people was
known as execution rock, whichwas the definitive symbol of
Chaka's rule of terror amongsthis own people.
It is said that half a dozenpeople a day could be taken to
execution rock, to be thrown offinto a river where they would

(01:09:18):
then be eaten alive byCrocodiles.

Speaker 3 (01:09:23):
Yes, Crocodiles, crocodiles.
Now, the thing about thisspecific cliff is that it was
not tall enough to kill you, butno, it broke you, though it
broke you, and at the bottom isjust a mad amount of crocodiles.

Speaker 2 (01:09:38):
I have a really bad image in my mind of the exact
height that cliff would need tobe.
Same, yeah, same.

Speaker 3 (01:09:43):
Yeah, and it's like it's about two, three stories
high.

Speaker 2 (01:09:45):
Yeah, and it's like you're broken, but you're not
but you're going.
Yeah, and then the gators comeand they start gator rolling
your ass.

Speaker 3 (01:09:54):
Yeah and oh, Just ripping you apart each oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
We truly are alive and the best time to be alive
ladies and gentlemen, as long asyou're not at war right now.

Speaker 3 (01:10:03):
Now on the political side of Shaka.
He actually did a good job atbringing different tribes
together.
He was known to be a cleverdiplomat and a farsighted
politician.
Shaka would form alliances withneighboring chieftains without
any bloodshed and buildopportunistic relationships,
just as any good politicianwould do.

(01:10:24):
He would station his men andwomen throughout the Zulu
Kingdom depending on their age,gender and rank.
This built a sense of communityfor all of them.

Speaker 2 (01:10:34):
And commonality.

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
And commonality exactly, and like just coming
together to fight for the ZuluKingdom and build that empire
together and hopefully you don'tlose your head in the process.

Speaker 2 (01:10:44):
You just or get your head beaten in with a glove, you
just don't make eye contact.

Speaker 3 (01:10:48):
Or the Now, when one of the Just don't make eye
contact.
When one of the male warriorswas allowed to marry, a female
would be given to the warrior asa wife.
Sex was prohibited until thattime.
If you were caught having sexbefore you were allowed to marry
, you would be put to deathalong with a woman.

(01:11:09):
That's kind of ironic, isn't it?

Speaker 2 (01:11:11):
It's just Yep, which is.
It's very ironic, consideringthe fact that he was the
intestinal beetle.
Yeah, in heaven, in heaven,yeah, no, he is intestinal
beetle heaven.

Speaker 3 (01:11:22):
He is intestinal beetle heaven.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
He must have had some strong intestines, but that is
very, very ironic given his ownfamilial history.
Maybe, ladies and gentlemen,that kind of ties into why he
was so strong on this aspectBecause he was given a shite
life and because Could be Ofthat.
So maybe he was feeling alittle bit.

Speaker 3 (01:11:42):
But instead of just like, hey, we're gonna build a
home for the bastard kids, he'slike we're gonna kill your
parents completely.
Yeah, and you in the womb.

Speaker 2 (01:11:55):
Well, I mean, that's the easiest place to kill a baby
.
Yeah, yeah, Speaking of babymaking, oh and baby taking.
Shaka never had children.
He actually dreaded producing alegitimate heir.
He never married and womenfound pregnant by him were then
put to death.

Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:12:14):
And what he turned into his father.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
He turned into me.
It was an intestinal beetle.
I swear to God.

Speaker 2 (01:12:20):
So in one story, a woman accused Shaka of being the
father of her newborn infant.
That dumb ass woman, jesusChrist, why would she ever do
that, anyway?
So yeah, she accused him ofbeing the father of her newborn
infant.
So Shaka took the infant andthrew it high into the air and
let the infant hit the ground,where the baby died on impact.

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:12:45):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
He then had the mother put to death on the spot.
Therefore, his households werenot dominated by wives, but by
stern senior women of the royalfamily.

Speaker 3 (01:12:56):
Yeah, that would do some of the politicianing with
him and care to his needs thisand that and the other, but no
wives.
Why would anybody fuck him?

Speaker 2 (01:13:06):
I mean, I think Jesus , I don't think he had a choice,
so he's just gonna fuck you andthen, oh, he didn't pull out,
so I guess you're dead man.

Speaker 3 (01:13:15):
Yeah, yeah, that's all you gotta say.

Speaker 1 (01:13:19):
We kind of suck for the most part.

Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Now, according to Donald R Morris in the Washing
of the Spears, eight years intoShaka's reign in 1824, things
began to change.
The first warning sign was thearrival of a party of British
adventurers in Portnadel,including Henry Francis Finn
this fucking guy.
He had heard about Shaka andthe Zulu wealth and came to

(01:13:45):
trade for ivory minerals andother exotic goods.
But the true root of theirarrival was to build a colonial
settlement.
Of course, of course.

Speaker 2 (01:13:55):
We just like building shit on other people's stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:13:57):
Now this is like a very complex thing.
It's not just like one whitedude showed up and was like I
want this land here.

Speaker 1 (01:14:03):
No, yeah, there's a lot of shit already happening
here.

Speaker 3 (01:14:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:14:07):
This is just a very big sum up.
I'm sure to the leadership itseemed like a good idea.
I mean, there's tons ofresources here.
It seems like they don't knowabout the resources yet.
They don't know about theresources they know about the
ivory.

Speaker 3 (01:14:17):
Yeah, elephants, that's about it, and that there
was.
That's enough Potential trade.
It's so complex.

Speaker 2 (01:14:24):
Exotic goods.
Enough for that kind of thingto be built.

Speaker 3 (01:14:27):
That's what we're called Yep.
So now, like many nativeleaders who come into contact
with colonialism, who make thebig mistake of being too
interested in the white man,shaka became fascinated with the
white's arrivals.
No, remember, this is,according to Donald Ormore's
says, the washing of the spirits.
Of course, ok.
Now these.

(01:14:48):
Shaka doesn't seem the kind tojust get like enthralled with
these guys, so it's questionableat the very least, and so
apparently he did becomeenthralled with him, according
to this guy.
But at the same time, shaka wasaware that this was potentially
not good.
He had a feeling that one daythe Zulus would pay the price
for that.
So, he did come into contactwith whites, but as far as

(01:15:11):
actually like Henry Francis Finn, there's, the only person that
says that those two cametogether was Henry Francis Finn,
and that's where Morris, in hisbook the Washing of Spears,
derives this factual quote.
Unquote factual information.

Speaker 2 (01:15:29):
Right, Right.
So during Henry Francis Flynn'sstay there was an assassination
attempt on Shaka's life.

Speaker 3 (01:15:36):
This is still within the book.
Yeah, this is just kind of likewe don't know.
That's the problem.
We don't really know.

Speaker 2 (01:15:42):
It's African history.
It's very hard to know.

Speaker 3 (01:15:45):
This is just.
It's enough in the researchthat it's just like this story
is told.

Speaker 2 (01:15:49):
But we're like eh you know, take it with a grain of
salt.
So he was stabbed in the armand the stomach.
Flynn helped treat the wounds.
Which bullshit I'm callingbullshit right there?
No way, oh yeah, just keepgoing.
Yeah, yeah.
So he helped treat the woundsand Shaka believed that it was
the European's medicine that hadsaved his life and wanted to

(01:16:09):
express his thanks.
When British saw this moment ofweakness, they seized it for
their own gain.
They convinced Shaka to forfeitsome land for a permanent
settlement, including Port Natal, modern Durban.
This formed the foundations ofthe first British colony in the

(01:16:30):
area.

Speaker 3 (01:16:31):
Colonialism wasn't the only thing that Shaka was
worried about.
In fact, he was truly wasn'tworried about the new foreigner
settling quite yet.
What he feared the most waswitchcraft, because that's
witchcraft was actually huge inAfrica.

Speaker 2 (01:16:47):
Yeah, Was it.
Was it referred to as voodoo?
I actually think it was yeah, Ithink that their version of
witchcraft was voodoo Voodoo,what they called it, I think,
and I could be wrong about that,but I'm pretty sure I don't
know the origins, but it's thatsounds correct.
Well, I know that voodoo hasAfrican origins.
Yeah, yeah, maybe it's the samething.
I know that voodoo dolls.
I know that they didn't call itwitchcraft, though.

Speaker 3 (01:17:09):
So the Zulu people in Shaka himself believe that he
was the living embodiment ofsomething spiritual and holy and
that if someone with maliciousintent were to truly harm Shaka,
it would by all means be ofwitchcraft.
They believe that this could bedone by simply stealing
something that Shaka had touched, or even his own hair shavings.

(01:17:31):
So this problem, this is, it'sgot to be voodoo.
You were probably right.
If a precious item was stolen,the Zulu people in Shaka believe
that the enemy would curseShaka to bad fate and the curse,
and then in turn curse the Zulupeople as well.
Now, regardless of these fears,shaka's empire was stable and
efficient.
In 1827, at the height of Zulupower, shaka moved to the

(01:17:54):
capital of Kuaakusa, the moderntown of Stanka.
Now, at this point, he held20,000 square miles of Zulu land
.
So, to make progress, the man'smaking moves.
He's doing things Like a moneymoves mogul moves, baby.
He is scared of the witchcraftof the voodoo.
I would be too.
Yeah, and Henry Francis Flynn isa twat.

(01:18:15):
That's that's, that's Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:18:22):
No, I mean, you're not wrong.

Speaker 3 (01:18:24):
That's my professional opinion, Mr Finn.
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:18:29):
So it all seemed pretty groovy for Shaka, but
personal tragedy quickly changedeverything and turned him into
a mad man.
The shit is, he literally loseshis fucking mind.
He was already pretty insane,but he was like holding it
together up until here.
I feel like like any guy who'sgonna do the things that he has
done up until this point has ashit missing.

Speaker 1 (01:18:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:18:52):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
So in the fall of 1827, Shakawas out hunting when he received
the news that his mother, Nandi, had died.
There are rumors that Shaka hadactually killed his mother
himself, but that's really all.
They were just rumors.
One story states that hismother was raising one of

(01:19:14):
Shaka's sons without him knowing, and once Shaka found out, he
went into a blind rage,violently attacking and killing
her.
Historians believe, throughcontemporary sources, that this
was all just propaganda and putout after the fact, and that his
mother actually just died ofdysentery.

Speaker 3 (01:19:32):
Yeah, which is?

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
more, or dysentery.

Speaker 3 (01:19:34):
Yeah, dysentery, which is definitely more
believable because it's veryunlikely that he would have
killed his mother, just like therumors of him building
Dengaswayo.

Speaker 2 (01:19:43):
Yeah, she literally stuck with him his whole fucking
life, exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:19:45):
He's not gonna fucking.
Yeah Now, shaka was a ruthlessleader, to say the least, but
when his mother, nandi, died, hesimply went fucking mad.
Yeah, her death broughtdevastating consequences for all
of Zulu land.
He commanded that the wholenation mourn her death, or it
was, and I wrote it three monthshere.

(01:20:06):
It was for a year.
Wow, for one whole year.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
Wow, I mean, I do the same thing for mom, yeah, but
I'd be like, hey, all youbitches here's kind of maybe
taking like here's maybe takingthe step too far.

Speaker 3 (01:20:17):
No one was allowed to cultivate their land, to grow
new crops or consume milk, whichwas a very significant thing to
keep the Zulu people alive.

Speaker 2 (01:20:27):
Kind of a weird, kind of a weird, weird thing to
choose Now this outpouring ofgrief led to absolute atrocity.

Speaker 3 (01:20:34):
One example was that his mother's funeral, shaka had
his mother's handmaidens legsand arms broken and then buried
them alive with her in order tolook after her and serve her in
the afterlife.

Speaker 2 (01:20:48):
Yeah, I'm sure they held no grudges.
I'm sure they held no grudges.

Speaker 3 (01:20:51):
None at all Going into that afterlife.
This is kind of like anEgyptian thing too.

Speaker 2 (01:20:55):
Well, yeah, they would bury, like the Pharaoh's,
cats or pets with them.
They would bury their servantswith them, that kind of a thing.

Speaker 3 (01:21:02):
Another thing that he would do that is in the
People's documentary, I believeis that he would if a cow got
pregnant, he would wait untilthat cow gave birth and then he
would kill the father and themother, so the calf could
understand living without aparent and mourning the same way
.

Speaker 2 (01:21:20):
Yeah, cows need to know.
No, seriously, cows need toknow who the fuck those cows.
Yeah, they need to understandloss.
Okay, and us Americans, we dothat best Slaughterhouse,
slaughterhouse.

Speaker 3 (01:21:35):
We know it, we know it, deep cutting Eminem, there.

Speaker 2 (01:21:39):
Thank you, that's not Eminem, it's Eminem's friends.

Speaker 3 (01:21:43):
He's on all the songs .
He's on some of the songs yeah,you're right.

Speaker 2 (01:21:46):
There was turmoil and violence spreading throughout
his kingdom.
Anyone who was considered to beimproperly mourning his mother,
found without tears in theireyes cultivating land for crops,
or caught consuming milk, wereput to death.
Think about this, think aboutthis.
You're just a farmer a hundredmiles away from all this

(01:22:07):
bullshit and you're just like,well, the wheat's not gonna grow
unless I tell my land.
I'm gonna go out there.
I'm gonna tell my land.
This group of warriors comes up.
Hey, what are you doing?
He's like well, I'm just tryingto tell my land so I can feed
the village and send you guys.
And they're like, no, killed.
Now, no one knows how to farm,you know what I mean.

(01:22:28):
Exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:22:28):
That's what's fucked up is you're killing all of your
food providers.
This whole shit leads to afamine.

Speaker 1 (01:22:32):
I bet it does.
I bet it does, and then, thelocusts come out and it's the
Bible 2.0.

Speaker 2 (01:22:38):
Yes, so it is said that he had thousands of people
put to death during this time.

Speaker 3 (01:22:45):
Oh no, it couldn't have been biblical it.
Could you know why there was noChristians?
Well, there's just there's nowhite people in South Africa.

Speaker 1 (01:22:52):
Well, there was.
What was his name?
Very, very the.

Speaker 3 (01:22:54):
Dutch and Francis Flynn.
Francis Flynn was there.
Okay, so.

Speaker 1 (01:23:00):
God was with them through Francis.

Speaker 2 (01:23:03):
That's actually St Francis.
We all just got it wrong thiswhole time.
That is St Francis, sorry.
So basically, it is said thathe did have thousands of people
put to death, right, but it'sunknown how many were actually
killed, and the specific reasonsfor those killings is unknown.
But it's really, in my opinion,because he went back to it,

(01:23:25):
fucking crazy.
Now, whether this largeestimate is directly tied to
improper mourning or if therewere other political,
opportunistic reasons for thedeaths, it still shows Chaka's
brutality.

Speaker 3 (01:23:37):
Yeah, and this is like he loses his kingdom.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:23:41):
This is like when he became Enemy tries became to
raid into Zulu land.

Speaker 2 (01:23:45):
thousands end up being murdered and the Zulu
kingdom kind of started tobecome a little bit unstable,
kind of like the kings head yeahbecause you can't control an
empire this way.
No, no, stop throwing crops,unless you're stalling or you
have access to unlimited amountsof spaghetti.

(01:24:06):
It's the only way.

Speaker 1 (01:24:08):
That's the only way Chef Boyardee will save us all
the apocalypse.

Speaker 3 (01:24:13):
Now, koo was developed to overthrow Chaka and
his claim to the throne.
This Koo was devised by his ownblood, his half brothers,
dengene and Emlange.
Now, while Zulu land wasordered to mourn for the year,
chaka had sent out a largemajority of his army to enforce
the mourning.

(01:24:33):
This is why all the people weredying Now, which did leave him
by himself vulnerable, and hishalf brothers seized this
opportunity.

Speaker 2 (01:24:44):
Dude, it's always family.
Do you think?
If we grew up back then, one ofus was royal and one of us was
second in line, we would havekilled each other?
Yes, really, I was about to saysomething like really nice and
sweet.
I was going to be like, no, I'dbe loyal to you, I'd be like
your best right hand man, man,and then when you died, then
shit would get wild.
I'd kill your whole family.

Speaker 3 (01:25:01):
You just think we would fuck them.
But we wouldn't have made it towhere we are.
We would have gotten pissed offat each other when we were
teenagers.

Speaker 2 (01:25:08):
Ooh, that's true, because that's when most of this
shit happens for these people.
Yeah, I forget I forget.

Speaker 1 (01:25:13):
Life expectancy's are way different.

Speaker 2 (01:25:16):
If we were 16 and 21 at the time.

Speaker 1 (01:25:18):
So dead, so fucking dead.
You threw a bircher knife at meone time.

Speaker 2 (01:25:21):
I mean, I mean, shit got real.

Speaker 3 (01:25:23):
So I guess you're right.
Now it's September of 1828,danganay, and is that not?
Dagonay, dagonay.

Speaker 2 (01:25:32):
In the pronunciation.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think you're right.
Ok, so Dagonay, yeah, his twohalf brothers, all right, these
gas holes, these little glassholes.
These gas holes, they foundShaka alone in his home and
stabbed him to death with thevery weapon that he had
developed to help build hisempire.

Speaker 2 (01:25:49):
Honestly, I'm OK with that.

Speaker 3 (01:25:51):
Now, according to South Africa history online, as
the great king Shaka's lifeebbed away, he called out to his
brother, Danganay brother, youkill me thinking you will rule,
but the Swallows will do that.
And his wedding met by.
That was the white people,because they made their houses
out of mud like the Swallows.

(01:26:11):
Now, according to members ofhis family, Shaka's last words
were are you stabbing me?
Kings of the earth, you willcome to an end through killing
one another.

Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Yeah, I'm sure he was so aware of being able to
complete full sentences witheloquency while he was being
stabbed to death.
I'm sure that this is veryaccurate and true.

Speaker 3 (01:26:36):
No, I think, actually it probably is, I do,
interesting.
I do because he's very, very,very, very, very, very, very,
very, very true, but it ispositive also mañana and he
never然後, I think, it posed as apositive.
He's a mentor and an iyi forhim and, unfortunately, for all

(01:27:10):
of these sense of easilyяв or並only I don't know, let you
extremelywant to throw out aSounds good that people are
going to come in and steal hisshit so that they can hurt him
through voodoo magic.

Speaker 1 (01:27:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:15):
And all of this Like he's.
It happens a lot throughhistory of very powerful people
getting nervous, scared and verylike what are the what's word?
I'm thinking Not schizophrenic,paranoid, paranoid, yeah, of
everyone around them and justfreaks the fuck out.
And so he's thought of this.

(01:27:36):
He's like you kill me.
Yeah, I am the only one holdingthis shit together.
I am the iron fist that rules.
All that keeps this together.

Speaker 2 (01:27:46):
Basically it's a long winded way of saying and that
is ironic because the wind wastaken from him but a long winded
way of saying you're fucked.

Speaker 3 (01:27:53):
Yeah, and is what Chaka most likely meant by this
was saying that the white peoplewill come and they will rule.
You have no chance for successwhen I am dead, and you will all
blame each other for what is tocome.

Speaker 2 (01:28:06):
God, that's kind of eerie, yeah, like when you think
about where Africa is currentlyat, because he was exactly
right.
Yeah, he was not.
He was exactly right, he wasnot wrong.

Speaker 3 (01:28:16):
He saw these white people coming out of the shore
bringing in guns, taking overtheir limbs inch by inch, inch
by inch, inch by inch, tellinghim to go fucking hon-elefants
and shit for their own fuckingpleasure, and sees like there
are forces that are larger thanus and they will come and take
all.
I am the only thing holdingthis together and protecting you
.
Yeah, you might not like me,but I am keeping this shit
together.

Speaker 2 (01:28:35):
Yeah, talk about significant.
Maybe if he hadn't lost hisshit.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
Yeah he shouldn't have mourned for so long.

Speaker 2 (01:28:40):
Granted, he was still a tyrant.
Let's not get that mistaken.
The guy was not a good man.

Speaker 3 (01:28:45):
Here's kind of what I equate this to is when we took
out Saddam Hussein.
Okay, yeah, saddam Hussein isnot a good guy.

Speaker 2 (01:28:53):
No, Not a good, no, a terrible guy, but he was the
head.

Speaker 3 (01:28:57):
He kept ISIS and all of these other fucking terrorist
organizations out from Baghdador Iran, Iraq, right.

Speaker 2 (01:29:06):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:29:06):
Iran, iran.
And we went in.
We were like none of ithappened, you had nothing to do
with it.
But you're a bad guy and weneed to win, so we're going to
kill you.

Speaker 2 (01:29:16):
Yeah, he was a very, what's the word?

Speaker 3 (01:29:19):
Dictator.

Speaker 2 (01:29:19):
No philosophic victory.
A symbol he was a symbolicvictory.
Yeah, and he was a badmotherfucker.
No, he was not a good fuckingguy.
He was very responsible forthings that killed thousands of
Americans.
But what I'm saying?

Speaker 3 (01:29:33):
is like they came in and they killed him because they
knew that he was not goodanymore.
It's like he was an absolutetyrant at this point.
Right, yes, they came in,killed Chaka, but they had no
fucking plan.
No, because there were largerforces at work that work that he
was able to keep at bay.
Yeah, now that's gone.

Speaker 1 (01:29:51):
Same.

Speaker 3 (01:29:51):
Thing with Saddam Hussein.

Speaker 2 (01:29:55):
Yeah, you cut off the head of the hydro.
10 more calm to take its place,exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:29:59):
There is now a power vacuum.
Yes, and that's what happensbecause of this Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 (01:30:05):
History lesson.
So, after killing Chaka, thebrothers quickly buried his body
in a grain pit nearby and,having died without an heir,
dingane claimed the throne.
Yeah, so Dingane tried tojustify this assassination to
the Zulu people by telling themthat Chaka had become an unruly
tyrant and needed to be put down.

(01:30:26):
Was he wrong?
Not necessarily.
Did he actually have a plan?
That's to be decided.
He possibly had said that hekilled his brother to stop the
killings and Zululand, but hesoon set off on his own killing
spree, destroying any possibleopposition from Chaka's
followers.

Speaker 3 (01:30:44):
This is kind of like when Alexander ended up taking
the throne after Philip diedyeah.
Yeah, and then he crushed allthe opposition that was trying
to thwart his power.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:30:53):
Yeah.
So the Purge was no quickkilling of a selected group of
people.
It ended up lasting for manyyears afterwards, and Dingane
became a tyrant himself.
Chaka's prophecy of whitesettlers moving in quickly
became true.
Within a decade, foreign whitesettlers were coming in and

(01:31:13):
colonizing Zululand, so heforeshadowed the whole shit.
The guy was smart.
He knew what the fuck was goingto happen.
Just because he was Mad doesnot mean dumb.

Speaker 3 (01:31:23):
Right.
I will definitely a thousandpercent agree with that Right.
Mad does not mean dumb.
No, you're an asshole and yousuck and everyone fucking hates
you.

Speaker 2 (01:31:29):
Sometimes Mad means you're too smart and you
overthink and then you go crazy,and I think that that's the
case with Zulu.
Is he or, sorry, chaka, is thathe was?
He went crazy because he wastoo smart and then the mom dying
kind of over tipped it.

Speaker 3 (01:31:43):
It's like what happened when Kanye's mom died
and then he started hating Jews.
Rest in Yee.
But just I'm sorry, I totallysay that that was way too far.
That was way too far.

Speaker 2 (01:31:56):
I thought of it on the spot and I just said it was
very impulsive, but I want totake that back on the record.
Jesus Christ.

Speaker 1 (01:32:07):
Yeah, jesus Christ, jesus Christ, I don't know what
the fuck?

Speaker 2 (01:32:11):
I'm sorry, I'm not, I need to.

Speaker 1 (01:32:13):
Who are?

Speaker 2 (01:32:13):
you.
I just apologize for fucking upand then I fucked up again
right after.

Speaker 1 (01:32:18):
Oh God.

Speaker 3 (01:32:20):
Now, just over 50 years after Chaka had been
murdered, tensions between theBritish colonizing colonists and
the Zulus reached a boilingpoint.
Boo boo, boo, boo, boo, boo,and on January 22nd 1879, the
first major battle in theAnglo-Zulu war took place the
battle of Insula One in slow onit's in.

Speaker 1 (01:32:40):
This is on lovely.
Hold on, hold on.
I can do this.
You do great the battle of ison the one.

Speaker 3 (01:32:49):
There we go.
Yep, thank you, I'm so proud ofyou.

Speaker 1 (01:32:51):
Thank you, that was really fucking hard.

Speaker 2 (01:32:53):
And I really had confidence because I had
practiced it for 20 seconds andI just got it wrong.
You're so good.

Speaker 3 (01:32:59):
Dude, these are hard.
Now at this point, the Zulupeople had obtained firearms and
were prepared to take on theBritish.
The Zulu army, still utilizingChaka's military tactics, took
on the British forces head onand won Nice.
This is actually one of theonly instances in British
history where a civilizationthat was not up to their

(01:33:20):
technological level.

Speaker 2 (01:33:21):
What is quote?
Unquote developed.

Speaker 3 (01:33:24):
Yeah, up, not to technological military strategy.
Yeah, you good, you got it.
You right, they fucking beathim, beat him off Now.
Out of 1700 British militarymen, only 400 survived this
battle.
That's a lot of casualties.
That's a lot of fuckingcasualties, especially for
people with guns.
And this is like I am very muchhigh-leveling this shit,

(01:33:48):
because there is a whole thingthat goes into the British
takeover of South America orSouth Africa that is revolved in
colonization, getting control,post-napoleonic wars and then
finding diamonds.
And then the slave trade comesin heavy.
Well, not really slave trade,but more of like slave operated

(01:34:10):
mines in Africa.
We're no longer kidnapping you.

Speaker 2 (01:34:12):
We're just making you work.
Yeah, not slave trade, but justslave.

Speaker 3 (01:34:16):
Yes, yeah, exactly, slave labor.
It was a victorious moment forZulu land because they had just
beaten the British, but it wasnot to last.
After six more months ofbattles, the British brought
more men and more advancedweaponry and defeated the Zulu
empire.
Today, there are mixed views onChaka Zulu.
He is either viewed as the Zuluhero, king of Kings, or he is

(01:34:39):
viewed as a blood thirsty tyrant.
Nevertheless, chaka Zulu left asignificant and lasting legacy
in several aspects.
He revolutionized warfare inSouthern Africa by introducing
new tactics, weaponry like theshort stabbing spear, and
reorganized his warriors intodisciplined formations, making

(01:35:00):
the Zulu army highly effectiveand influential.

Speaker 2 (01:35:04):
Under Chaka's rule, the Zulu kingdom expanded
significantly through conquestsand assimilation of neighboring
tribes, creating a centralizedand powerful kingdom in the
region.
His military tactics, socialreforms and administrative
changes left a lasting mark onthe traditions, social structure

(01:35:25):
and identity of the Zulu people.
However, while celebrated forhis military prowess, debates
persist about the harshness ofhis methods and the impact of
his campaign on neighboringtribes, reflecting the
complexity of his legacy.

(01:35:46):
Overall, chaka Zulu isremembered as a formidable
military strategist, a unifierof the Zulu people and a figure
whose reign significantlyimpacted the history and culture
of Southern Africa and beyond.

Speaker 1 (01:36:08):
And that is Chaka Zulu.
Ladies and gentlemen, woo Shakano baby.

Speaker 3 (01:36:13):
He is such a fascinating character.

Speaker 2 (01:36:16):
Honestly, dude, I knew a lot about Chaka Zulu.
We've talked about him beforeyou and I and he is just
fascinating.
He's fucked up.
Don't get us wrong, we're notglorifying this man, but we are
saying the guy was smart, theguy was insanely good at
military strategy, the guy wasgreat at fucking politics.

(01:36:39):
He just went batshit crazy andfucked up.

Speaker 3 (01:36:43):
And he's really where he became a fucking tyrant,
yeah.
And where you have to kind ofput your mindset is, especially
since this is early 1800s nottoo long ago, right, but in
South Africa early 1800s itmight as well.
It's kind of like the 1300s ofEurope, right.

Speaker 1 (01:37:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:37:01):
They are 500 years behind in tribal it is tribal,
it is very much so.
Village based it is very muchso.
Their fucking money was cattleguys, come on.

Speaker 3 (01:37:09):
And I have this idea, and I don't know if this is
right, but, like, obviously,africa is the cradle of humanity
right, yeah yeah, I believe.
I think.
I think that the reason whyEurope was Europe and Asia
specifically over by China likeor not by China, but by Japan
and China on the coastal regions, where Mongolia and all of them

(01:37:32):
were in Korea right why thoseareas were able to advance
themselves culturally and as asociety and technologically
faster is because of densepopulations.
With Africa it is more of atribal based and very spread out
small communities.

Speaker 2 (01:37:52):
Yeah, and the smartest man in that community
is not the smartest man within100 miles.
And whereas in Mongolia, or inEurope, or in China or wherever
civilization was developing, thesmartest man within 100 miles
was the smartest man in amillion people, whereas in
Africa, the smartest man within100 miles was the smartest man
within a thousand people.

Speaker 3 (01:38:14):
Yes, yes, I think that's right.
It's what you're saying.
What I'm saying is like there'sa lot more smart people dense
in a densely packed areatogether.

Speaker 2 (01:38:24):
That means the smartest is a lot smarter in
those areas because of thatdensity.

Speaker 3 (01:38:28):
Yeah, and you just say that like the smartest
person is now within this like amillion miles.

Speaker 2 (01:38:34):
I feel like you went backwards.
No, no, no, I said what you'rethinking.
Okay, I promise All right.

Speaker 3 (01:38:40):
So yeah, that's kind of my concept idea of this and I
don't know this is just whatwhen I'm going through this,
what's the?

Speaker 2 (01:38:45):
theory of the development of humanity.

Speaker 3 (01:38:46):
Yeah, and I'm like why?
Because I'm researching thisand I didn't look this up,
obviously, but I'm like why thefuck is Africa so behind on
everything?
Obviously, there'ssignificantly horrible things
that people did to Africa andAfricans said to each other at
the same time, just like everyEuropean said to themselves, and
Asians said to themselves, andwe did, the and also the
indigenous people of the NativeAmericans said to themselves,

(01:39:09):
and also South.

Speaker 2 (01:39:10):
America, Everybody was fighting all the time.
I don't think any civilizationthat has never left the tribal
mentality has progressed in asense that they can conquer
other people that are not of thetribal mentality.
As soon as you become amentality of civilization which
is very different from tribal,keep in mind that is very, very
different from tribal.

Speaker 3 (01:39:31):
That's what I'm saying.
That's why Europe was able toadvance so much quicker at a
much earlier age was becausethey were more condensed.
And there's smart people playExactly A lot of subtle that are
talking to each other, andartists and the Renaissance and
all that that's going on whileyou got Africa that's so spread
out.

Speaker 2 (01:39:47):
Yeah, the smartest man in the village.
The smartest man in the villageis probably a lot dumber than
the smartest man in the city.

Speaker 1 (01:39:52):
Yes, exactly Is what I think.
Exactly, we are on the samepage.

Speaker 2 (01:39:57):
We are saying the same thing.
This is us, me and Cooper,figuring out that we're not
arguing.

Speaker 3 (01:40:03):
It does take a conversation to get there.

Speaker 1 (01:40:05):
Sometimes we got to get there, but we are saying the
same.

Speaker 2 (01:40:07):
Thing.
You bring up a very interestingpoint, because I've always
wondered a very similar thingwhy is it that this entire
planet relies on Africa soheavily for all of these
materials that we need and yetAfrica is quote unquote and I
don't want to seem rude here butit is the less progressed part

(01:40:31):
of the planet.
It's because we kept them therebecause we became smart enough.

Speaker 3 (01:40:37):
I hate to say that word smart, because that's not a
positive thing.
We were able to disrupt thesystem there.
We were, we were able toprevent them from ever
capitalizing on their ownresources?
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:40:49):
Because, if they had, they'd be the number one
superpower on the planet.
Africa would be the mostpowerful continent on the planet
.
They would because they haveeverything we need.
They have everything we needfor iPhones.
They have everything we needfor all of these different
technological advances that arehappening.
There's a reason, when youGoogle African minds, that they
are fucked up.
Look at the diamond mines, lookat the Ruby mines.
Look at everything happening.

Speaker 3 (01:41:10):
There's a reason they're called blood diamonds.

Speaker 2 (01:41:12):
Exactly, exactly, and Cooper and I can make light of
these situations because theyhappened 200 years ago, but the
problem is that shit is Systemicand it's still happening.
It is systemic and it is stillhappening Exactly.
That's a very big point that Ithink that we need to bring up
at the tail end of this, becauseShaka Zulu is one example of

(01:41:35):
how powerful these people inAfrica can become when they
become united.
Well, nowadays, what happens?
We keep them separated, we keepthem in tribal wars, and this
is obviously leading on toconspiracy theorist ideals.

Speaker 3 (01:41:49):
We can do a whole episode on this If you guys
really want to see a more highlevel overview as to what
analysis.
What happened to the end of theZulus and why they died and the
blood diamonds that started tohappen and the slave trade that
was there and then the fuckingBrits that came down.
Really go and watch the oh god,what is it called?

(01:42:11):
The docu-series, the extrahistory docu-series on YouTube
about Shaka Zulu.
Just got this animationwalkthrough of everything, but
in the part three and four theyget very descriptive at a high
level of the British and Europecoming down and then how they

(01:42:34):
systematically divided theAfrican tribes and pitted them
against each other.

Speaker 2 (01:42:39):
That's an interesting topic that I think maybe we
could cover.

Speaker 3 (01:42:42):
It's so political man .
It is, it is, it is veryconvoluted.

Speaker 1 (01:42:45):
There's so many people?
Yeah, we could cover that.

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
But it's not necessarily content, it's not
necessarily something that'svery exciting, but it's very
interesting to people whoactually want to know about that
stuff.
It takes a lot of names I havea question, though.
Yeah, South Africa is arguablythe most advanced part of Africa
these days.
Correct, the country of SouthAfrica.
Yeah, do you think that thatmight be kind of a rippling

(01:43:09):
effect and this is just aquestion that I just thought of
on the spot Do you think thatthis might be a rippling effect
from the fact that Shaka Zuluwas able to unite so many people
because he was in South Africaand then the British came in and
it's kind of a working of bothfactors into?
At least a bigger part of SouthAfrica.

Speaker 3 (01:43:32):
I think he was more of a hurdle, because a hurdle
for how civilized and advancedthey are today.

Speaker 2 (01:43:40):
So you think if reason, quote unquote he had
stayed alive and he had, quoteunquote, beat the British which
I don't know if that wouldhappen or not no, it's just like
Columbus discovering theAmericas.

Speaker 3 (01:43:51):
Okay, it was a matter of time that this was going to
happen.
Well, it's just so weird,because why it's so populated
now and does so well is becauseof diamonds.
Yeah, the discovery of diamondsand money is what made South
Africa more of a first worldcountry.

Speaker 2 (01:44:14):
Well, that's why we put so much emphasis on cattle
being their currency.

Speaker 3 (01:44:17):
Yeah, well, because at the time that's what it was.

Speaker 2 (01:44:20):
Well, I mean, but think about the things they
didn't have any need for, thethe battles that were caused
because of cattle, because theystarted giving cattle to the
English, and that led toeconomic struggles between yeah,
the inflation of cattle andthen all that.
It all boils down to what MoneyExactly?
Oh man, oh man, oh man.
Yeah, yeah, this is such afascinating topic, man.

Speaker 3 (01:44:44):
It really is In the early to late 1900s.
We can oh, I got.

Speaker 2 (01:44:50):
What's up?
I don't know what that did.

Speaker 3 (01:44:52):
I don't know either.
I guess we'll find out and youcan look up CIA operations
within Africa as well, to keepthem disorganized.
So the CIA has done a bunch offucking shit.
We're actually going to do anepisode at some point talking
about God.
I can't remember the fruitcompany, but it's a South

(01:45:13):
African or South American fruitcompany.
They destabilized the entirefucking country.

Speaker 2 (01:45:17):
South.

Speaker 3 (01:45:18):
American.
Yeah, and I think it's over.
It's like a banana company.

Speaker 2 (01:45:22):
Oh, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:45:23):
And the CIA.
It's bad Like America hasfucked over the world.

Speaker 2 (01:45:27):
Yeah, there's a reason America is the number one
fucking country is because weput ourselves into places that
destabilize countries I wouldn'tsay we're the number one
anymore, but I would say that weare the powerhouse for sure.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:45:41):
I mean there's, that's a very quote unquote
biggest and baddest.

Speaker 2 (01:45:44):
But I see what you're saying.
I see the point you're tryingto make yeah, the economic
powerhouse.

Speaker 3 (01:45:49):
I should say that we are is because of a lot of
things that were done throughback, like door shit, which is
so ironic.

Speaker 2 (01:45:57):
You think about human evolution and it's like the
fuck wads of history are theones who always come out on top.
Isn't that so messed up?
Doesn't that go against everymovie, every movie that we've
ever watched, where the goodguys come out on top?
Yeah, but meanwhile, like sure,we came across and we left the
British because the British werekind of fucking us over, but we

(01:46:20):
like over compensated.

Speaker 3 (01:46:22):
We lifted our truck Taxation without representation
was a scam.
That was a fucking scam for usto secede from the British
Empire because they werefighting world fucking wars for
us.
Yeah, we should have beenpaying our fucking taxes to,
yeah, and then.

Speaker 1 (01:46:40):
But I'll be damned if I pay taxes for tea.
This is Boston.
This is Boston.
We're getting out talking.

Speaker 3 (01:46:49):
Ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for sticking
through that with us.
Follow all of our shit.
You can find us ondrinkingourwaythroughhistorycom.
Once again, we are taking abreak in January.
We have to.
What fucking we're going tocome?
We're going to have episodesthrough December, but we will be
taking a little break inJanuary because we deserve it.

Speaker 2 (01:47:10):
30 episodes, come on, guys, we did 30 episodes every
week full time jobs with fulltime jobs and full time side
hustles, and we did the podcastanyway.
Yes, so that's that we deservea little bit of a break and
we're going to fucking take it.
Cooper's going to Ireland.

Speaker 3 (01:47:28):
I'm going to go to Ireland for two weeks.

Speaker 2 (01:47:31):
It's Ireland, by the way.

Speaker 3 (01:47:32):
Ireland or.

Speaker 2 (01:47:32):
Ireland, ireland, and I'm very excited for you.
I'm so happy that you've beento Ireland.
I'm honestly, like low key,super jealous that you're going.
We'll go.

Speaker 3 (01:47:41):
I would love to go one day.

Speaker 2 (01:47:43):
But yeah, super, super cool for you.
So we will be taking that breakin January.
So if there's a couple weekswithout an episode, don't worry,
we're going to come back withsome fucking bangers.

Speaker 3 (01:47:53):
We're so excited for one.
I'm just the the the storyCooper has this thing.

Speaker 2 (01:47:58):
Cooper has this thing that we're doing.
We won't get into it.

Speaker 3 (01:48:00):
We won't get into it yet.
We won't talk about it yet.

Speaker 2 (01:48:02):
I'm so excited he just banged the table.
Cooper is very, very stokedabout it because obviously he is
very passionate about thissubject and, honestly, like I'm
less passionate about thissubject, but I am good.
Hold on, hold on.
I am very passionate about itnow because of how excited
Cooper is.
So when we come back in Januaryat the end of it, be ready for
some cool shit.

Speaker 3 (01:48:23):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:48:29):
I'm excited about this far because I have a
feeling that this is going to bea longer episode.
Thank you.
You are a champion.
You are a formidable opponentupon any battlefield and I
appreciate the shit out of you.
Cooper does too.
He works so hard on thispodcast.
If you, if you do anything andyou leave a review, talk about

(01:48:49):
how awesome Cooper is, becausehe really, really deserves it,
and we appreciate every singleone of you who has listened.
If you made it this far, you'refucking awesome and you have
our gratitude, cooper.
Thanks, doll.

Speaker 3 (01:49:01):
Stay, beautiful bitches, because we fucking love
you, we fucking love you.

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Episode 30: Shaka Zulu - Legacy of the Zulu King

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 30: Shaka Zulu - Legacy of the Zulu King