S.1 Ep.12: The Recognition of Unity

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
hello and welcome to episode 12 of dualistic unity i am andrew and i'm going to be playing the part
of ray again all right so we're just chatting about some work related things uh we both have
full-time jobs if people forget that sometimes i always get that question like what do you what
do you do for work like is this this tic-tac your job and i'm like if yeah no no i have i

(00:24):
have a full-time job one day it it will be these types of things will be but i do enjoy having the
balance for now like it's not something there are there are things that come up which we were
just discussing that are just like this is so inefficient like you know there's better ways
to do this or whatever and a lot of times when you're involved like i it's like a pretty typical

(00:48):
nine-to-five job in digital advertising and there are times when people just fill that time because
they're supposed to fill that time and i think there's been a shift to being more efficient since
everyone at least in my industry pretty much is works remote and works from home so there's not as
much of that like you need to fill the eight hours and i fully take advantage of that i go on lots of

(01:12):
walks throughout the day and when when there's some down time find other things to do and i
have other things to do so i'm never you know bored with that but yeah it is interesting the
society that we've sort of built with this expectation of just it's just like people
say it's the way things are and ray you mentioned that i was expressing that in videos more recently

(01:35):
just how just a lot of it doesn't make any sense and like it doesn't have to be this way there
was no rules saying that this is how things were supposed to turn out or had to turn out
just how they happened to turn out but it's not necessarily how it was supposed to not that it
isn't supposed to be this way or right or wrong or anything like that those are perceptions as we've

(01:57):
discussed plenty of times but yeah it you start to ask more questions i think the deeper you go
yeah well i mean it'd be like you know you work really hard on building yourself a hut
say in the woods and then you work hard you build it you're like yeah this makes sense and then you
walk into the hut and there's a rave going on you're like what the hell just happened

(02:18):
how is this happening inside what should be a fairly you know simple and quiet hut and it's just
because somewhere in the process of building that hut we lost track of what we were doing we got
carried away we you know started you know working on distraction or we started wanting
to feel better than the other people working on the hot and it became a whole game and so
despite the fact that from the outside it should all be very simple on the inside

(02:41):
we've all just got lost in the habit of being in the hut and whatever that means right and so
despite the fact that it is still the same life it's always been we've just piled so much more
on top of it and we get caught up in the image we want to be and we completely lose track of
building the hut we can lose track of exactly how how badly we're putting this house together

(03:05):
or how badly this thing is organized and that's why everything's falling apart that's why we
consistently have a wider and wider gap between the rich and the poor because it's badly organized
it's not that the system is bad it's that the mentality that created sustains and runs that
system continues to be poison we can't do anything with it because as long as there's a profit

(03:25):
center to our society there's always going to be the temptation to cut corners there's
always going to be the temptation to water down the the the product to basically make
it worse and worse and worse so you'll buy more and more and more because profit is the incentive
right so as long as we're greedy as long as we're gladness it doesn't matter we can't do anything

(03:45):
with it but we don't talk about that we're like no no no we just got to change the economy we just
have to change the monetary policy we just have to change the regulations for the banks it's like
no we don't this isn't about the economy this isn't about the monetary system this is about us
not being able to get over this this idea that we need more and more and more
right so it's just it's our system in a nutshell um in all facets it doesn't matter what it

(04:12):
is i mean look at the infrastructure problem happening in states right now
right that infrastructure didn't happen that problem didn't happen over overnight that
happened over a very long time and it's not like the infrastructure hasn't been crumbling it just
wasn't a priority compared to all of the other things that were more sensational and entertaining
yeah it's almost like we've built this idea of the peak and of like the pinnacle of being like you

(04:37):
said like rich and famous and i don't think people like take enough time in their lives to actually
think about what their peak or pinnacle would look like because i've taken some time to do that and
being rich and famous is not it like there are so many other parts to life and existence than

(04:59):
that and for whatever reason that is where our society has sort of fallen upon and i
actually um had a guy on my podcast yesterday his name is eric he's from uh canada he lives
in the canadian rockies and he creates content uh of his family they're a big outdoors family
he homeschools them he has a two four and seven year old i think and he actually kind of reminded

(05:25):
me of you a little bit yeah i think he's maybe in his early or mid-thirties um but they create
a lot of uh like outdoors content like he'll put a little microphone on his kids and just like film
them and we talked a lot about you know creating and and his whole thing is he doesn't want it to
you know take away from his time with his family so he's never he's very much not like the type

(05:47):
of person who stages content at all it's just like he just makes videos with his family and
shares them online so it's awesome but we're talk we got into the discussion of money and
he is also into bitcoin and cryptocurrency and he was talking about how he lives he does the
content and they have built up a pretty good following but he also is snow patroller on the

(06:12):
side and has a certain amount of income coming in i think he said his family lives on around like
60 to seventy thousand uh canadian dollars a year and we were talking about investing in bitcoin i
was talking about how i'm i'm pretty risk tolerant when it comes to those things
because i'm young and i don't have many responsibilities and it's like why not

(06:33):
but his perspective was kind of similar but in the sense that he already feels like he has enough he
is fully fulfilled in everything that he does so he's dumped a lot of money into this stuff because
his thought is he believes in this and he thinks they can go somewhere and he already is fulfilled
so he doesn't need that money but if he is correct and it were to hit then it would be cool and there

(06:59):
are all these things in his community that he would want to be able to use the money for so
it's almost like when you feel fulfilled in your life without the money and the extra stuff
it allows you the freedom to end up taking risks on certain things to end up getting money but
not it's not like that let go to receive type thing it's like you don't need it so for him he he

(07:23):
was very open about his money and he was talking about how he's put over the last four years
six six figures into cryptocurrency and in his head that money's gone he doesn't he doesn't
need it he's okay without it because he's already completely fulfilled in his day-to-day life with
his family what he does on a day-to-day basis he doesn't need that money so it's just there and

(07:46):
see what happens if it runs up great but i think taking the time to have that sort of perspective
isn't all that common in our society but if you were to be able to take that time all of a sudden
you'd realize like maybe not everyone listening to this or everyone out there feels like they
would have enough if they were to take the time to really see it but i think a lot of people a

(08:09):
lot more people than maybe feel like they do would have that feeling of fulfillment if they just take
took a second to take a step back and realize all of that and not be so tied into this societal
dance that we've discussed a lot on the last podcast like how there's just these pinnacles
that are just completely made up and because the majority is striving for that everyone's just like

(08:34):
oh they just hop in with it and they're like guess i gotta do that too
yeah well that's it it's funny that i kind of take the same mentality with uh
if somebody's like you know can i borrow 10 bucks if if i can't spare it my answer is no
if i can spare it my answer's yes but immediately upon lending that person 20 bucks or 10 bucks

(08:56):
i just assume it's gone right if i can't let it out i don't blend it out if i can lend it out
then i just assume it's not coming back and if it does cool but that's the whole point right and so
to me it's an investment in that person it's an investment in the world it's like i have enough
here you do something with it right and i that mentality is ultimately what we're talking about

(09:16):
here i mean i can't tell you how many times over the last 15 years of my life i have tried to come
up with some way to to help people who don't have enough who who are trying to get to a point where
they can take that time to live their life where they can just have enough to live and exist and
be happy and the rest of the time just work on themselves right but it's very difficult to do

(09:38):
that because things are so skewed in our society you have people who have too much and you have
people who don't have enough and so how do we get to a point where those of us who have enough
can distribute it to people who don't without the middleman otherwise known as the government
or charity or business taking a chunk out to satisfy themselves how can we just immediately

(09:59):
distribute it to the people who need it and this is where cryptocurrency immediately tickles my
fancy and gets me wondering like how how can we use something like blockchain technology to
keep track of everybody's needs how can we use blockchain technology to distribute wealth across
everybody so everybody has enough and then the rest of the time we can you know talk about our
insights and share information and grow as people and do all of that and i mean if we wanted to it's

(10:23):
not like it'd be difficult to do i mean so you and i started a community discord for dualistic unity
for the audience to to have a chance to meet and chat talk to one another without us being
necessarily in the middle well as that grows and those people start to talk more and more and more
we're ultimately going to end up making a bit of a profit off of that we're going to be able to

(10:43):
put to make some money off the advertisements well the money off the advertisements can immediately
go into community projects that help the people who help generate that income that help people
who are part of that community right why can't we do the same with everything else i mean this is
ultimately what i envisioned with our patreon campaign or podcast sponsorships or youtube

(11:03):
monetization you and i only need so much and then after that we can put it all back out into the
universe which as we've discussed is still you and i it's still reinvesting in our own life it's just
in the long term it's in the bigger ripple right and so there's a mentality there and and what's

(11:25):
nice about that mentality is that as soon as we have enough what happens our schedule decreases
we can literally take more time to ourselves and give to other people as a result of doing so
and so i think that if we were to work at that collectively if each person were to have the time
like you said to just figure out what's enough for them what's their peak right and then to allow

(11:48):
the community that's with them to help them get there or rising tide lifts all boats right and
then they can go back into helping others somebody else achieve their peak but it has to be you know
a peak based on self-honesty and self-awareness it can't just be society says i should be this right
and that that's often the case i mean how often have you seen people buying things whether it's

(12:10):
clothing or jewelry or anything else simply to match the image of the celebrity that's selling it
yeah all the time i've i've made videos specifically about that i made one last
winter about how it's like an interesting paradox when people buy things to impress other people and

(12:32):
in reality you know like they get a really nice car or you know gucci anything and it's all like
that stuff's not higher quality than anything else you can buy ever it's just got a name on
it and they do it to impress other people and look a certain way but the type of people who
they're impressing are probably also trying to impress other people so it's like they just feel

(12:56):
this sort of distaste for you having that stuff that they don't have and then the other people
who aren't impressed by it and are i don't know have more of a impression based on you know like
the content of your character or something don't give a [ __ ] and they might see you and be like
why are you doing that man like what's what's going on like is everything all

(13:19):
right inside like what are you trying to make up for inside through these material items
so it's it's an interesting paradox where i think people think it's achieving this certain thing
and in reality i don't know if it really is i can't it it an external cannot give you value

(13:41):
it just doesn't right what you do with the external sure could be a reflection of your value
right that's that's about it though i mean like it doesn't matter if you have
a fancy car or a functional car if you're just using the car to get something done
right that's the whole point like somebody's gonna look at you for spending half a million dollars on

(14:01):
the car just to drive to the grocery store and go you know you could have fed how many people
with the extra money it cost you to get that car i'm gonna go to the grocery store and i'll get
there just as fast or you might pass me and get there 10 minutes or 10 seconds faster woo you
know like it's just really not that big a deal but it just comes down to the fact that our priorities
are so skewed we just don't understand that value is not something that we can measure like our

(14:27):
value is expressed in what we do it's expressed in our potential up until then it's not something
that we can measure or evaluate or anything else and we really do get this idea that if we just
have an idea of our value that's the same as as having an indication of what our value is and it's
not until we get over that we're always going to look for things to validate us we're always

(14:50):
going to look for those those externals to try and pad the whole that we're creating for ourselves
yeah and even i was just thinking about this even if you stayed on the sort of selfish approach with
how you spend your money like i find it very fascinating there's so many people out there
doing things day to day that they don't enjoy and yet the way that they could have some semblance of

(15:14):
freedom and maybe not have to do that thing that they hate so much is through save how like having
money set aside like people almost don't i feel like people don't even think about that side of
it where they could not spend money on dumb [ __ ] and actually begin to cultivate and live a life
that they enjoy like even in my case i have been in like the position i'm in i'm a senior account

(15:42):
manager and my salary is plenty high enough to sustain my lifestyle and have money left over
to save and whatnot but so i've i've talked to my boss i've been like i'm not pushing for promotion
just a heads up because i would have to like in you know more or less words than that i said it
in a way that was not making it seem like i i want to do less work straight up but like

(16:05):
i have other things in my life that i enjoy and if i were to be pushing for promotion
and to get promoted which involves a 15 pay increase i would have to sacrifice these other
things that i enjoy doing i would probably have to go from you know spending x hours
a day to maybe you know at least 30 percent more hours a day in order to take on another

(16:26):
project to prove that i'm ready for promotion or whatever but i know that what i have right now is
more than enough i i have been able to take a step back and be like i don't need that extra 15
000 or what percent a year to you know sacrifice the amount of time because there's part another

(16:48):
part of big part of my life that i really enjoy doing so if people were to realize that if they
were even just on the selfish side of it like to save more and really figure out what actually adds
value to their life and not spending money to try and cultivate this perception that
they want people to have about them through what they own and all these material items

(17:12):
then they may be able to begin living a life they actually enjoy more and maybe take you know some
extra time off in between jobs or something and go and if maybe they've always wanted to travel
but they haven't been able to it's like that can allow you the freedom to do that and not
live such a miserable existence that you're constantly complaining about and then at the

(17:33):
same time you're spending money on dumb [ __ ] to impress people you know you don't even like so it
just a lot of it just doesn't make much sense i feel like right and well and we get to a point
or at least as we grow up we start to realize it doesn't make sense and unfortunately that's where
the banks and businesses have figured out well we need to get to them before that point
so when they're 18 19 let's offer them a student loan let's give them a credit card let's give them

(17:58):
you know easy access to money they haven't earned watch them piss that away and then they have to
scramble more and more throughout their life to try and keep up to it on top of the bad habit of
overspending so now we have a system that's like here's more and more and more and more credit
don't worry we got your back and we just keep feeding the monster more and more and more because
we lack in ourselves and there are parasites that are willing to feed off of that right

(18:23):
and that's you know where the argument tends to go towards the system trying to keep us down or
those in power trying to work against us and i i just want to reiterate again that this is
largely just because of the environment that we've created that we give those people the
chance to flourish because the environment we're in reinforces their behavior right like we we

(18:46):
reward people for being greedy because our society gives them the ability to continuously
hoard more if we were to remove that ability we would find that that behavior to be less
less prevalent but we encourage that behavior from a very young age we encourage it in everything get
more and more for yourself you know the more you have the more valuable you are and so when

(19:07):
you have a system that traps us in that and then makes you invest in that to the point where if
you were to wake up and go yeah i don't want to value all this anymore it's like well you still
have that credit card payment you still have those mortgages you still have that lease you still have
that contract you signed and we know that you did all that in a state of confusion but that's
not our problem and so that's it you have to start working against that you have to start going okay

(19:31):
i'm just going to cut up these credit cards right i'm not going to use that i'm going to go
the hard way for a little while so i can clear the slate which is technically what the economy
should have done back in 2008 right like all of those companies that were too big to fail
should have failed and we should have picked up the pieces and started from there
but we always try to avoid the pain and so we sustain the pain

(19:53):
yeah i feel like with the mentality of kind of the hoarding and stuff it it comes down to
the mentality if someone still thinks which i think is vast fast fast fast majority people
that they are just this human then and they're not anyone else it's like great to have you know

(20:17):
empathy for others in a way of like you know kind of thinking about putting yourself in their shoes
even if you can't necessarily understand that you would be them if everything you know was traded
essentially so if you still think that you're just this human and you're very much separate from
everyone and not this deeper eye that we all are in the awareness of the universe then it's it's

(20:40):
a lot i feel like it's a lot tougher to get to that place so it's almost like that has to precede
this and since realizing this even you know as recently as i have it's it's become a lot clearer
to me and it just makes sense that because like i walk through the street now in new york i see

(21:00):
everyone way differently than i did four months ago like significant like i see that is that is me
that is me passing me on the street like they just have forgotten and whatever but for whatever
reason they they don't know that but that is me so it becomes clear and there's still obviously you

(21:23):
know i don't i'm not gonna give up everything and like walk around the streets naked and homeless
but it's like it's it's much clearer in that sense so it's not like giving things away or
you know giving a homeless person some money it's like i am helping myself it is still being sort of

(21:44):
selfish almost in the sense because i'm everything so i am being selfish but that self is the entire
universe omniverse everything so yeah it's selfish but it's not limited to this
perception of separateness it's selfish in that the opposite of separateness that i'm everything

(22:10):
yeah yeah exactly that's because it's the abandonment of self right it's like oh i have
no borders anymore i should take care of all of me right and that's that's pretty much it um but
you're right it's the inside that ultimately is going to to reinforce the behavior like
the environment changing the environment isn't enough as we can see from all of the legislation

(22:31):
and and the rules that they're trying to make around you know say uh carbon emissions are our
example our perfect example you know creating a carbon tax isn't going to fix the problem i mean
uh look at tesla right tesla creates uh electric cars and they don't make any profit whatsoever on
their electric cars what they do is they end up getting carbon credits because they're creating

(22:52):
electric cars and then they sell those carbon credits to the car companies that are creating
oil-based cars so the car companies that are polluting the environment buy the credits
from tesla so they can continue to pollute the environment and tesla comes out looking like
they're saving the world right so is that for real holy [ __ ] i did not know that oh my god

(23:15):
so again it comes down to the superficial isn't isn't ever going to solve the problem we have
to look deeper we have to look at ourselves we have to look at the system that we're continuing
to to perpetuate which is not transparent obviously like if all of a sudden you find
out something like that well no doubt you're starting to wonder what else you're not know
you don't know about and it's because the system is designed to make sure you don't know

(23:37):
right it's made sure so they can do those back room deals and they can do you know the additions
to the infrastructure bill for example like the biden's infrastructure build where it's like oh
we're focusing on america's infrastructure by the way if you use cryptocurrency and you want
to trade over ten thousand dollars we want all your personal info it's like that has nothing to
do with infrastructure why is that in there right and that's the point though is that the system

(24:02):
isn't transparent the system is made to cut corners the system is designed for the people
who are in power to do whatever they want and and you would have to be on the ball
all the time looking through each and every bit of legislation that was passing to even have an idea
of what was happening and that wouldn't even be enough because of how much is happening

(24:22):
right and any system that's that complex and not been that convoluted shouldn't be and the
only reason it is is because it's a visual and the people in power want it to continue to be habitual
that's it it's something that's going to change but so here's the thing right we we keep talking
about this and we're doing this podcast we're encouraging this conversation we're trying to get

(24:43):
people involved and that is a part of this change it's the biggest part of this change in my opinion
somebody who was voicing this to me recently um that it's very difficult to go out to the world
and talk to people about this stuff because most of the time people are focused on on you know what
car they drive or what how much money they make or where they live or how it identifies their value

(25:06):
and so how do you have conversations with any meaning with people who are in that mentality
and i was trying to respond that well you just do your best i mean if you don't value those things
that's great don't avoid those people just try to be as patient as you can because you're embodying
another state of mind you are giving them the opportunity to see something or feel something

(25:27):
that they're not used to feeling and just in doing that you're creating a small ripple
but because the dominant narrative is so egotistical here we are having this
conversation and and we're encountering a lot of awkwardness we're encountering a lot of resistance
because we're on the one side that that's kind of turning the tide we're on the

(25:50):
on the other side of the tide turning so yeah it's going to be difficult for us right now it's going
to be difficult for us to continue to have this conversation in the face of all of the opposition
because that opposition is just habitual and it's been ongoing for such a long time
but it started somewhere right we started in tribal society we started in a more unitary

(26:11):
mentality it took the ego time to twist us it took the ego time to travel from person to person
to person to reinforce itself structurally into the into the bedrock of how we run our society it
took time it took thousands of years for us to get this lost it's going to take some time for us to
wake up it's going to take some more time for the ripples to start to spread but they are spreading

(26:32):
over the last 20 years i've just been watching this conversation go from being ridiculed to being
acceptable to being wanted more and more people want to have this conversation now that's so
encouraging to me i mean out of 10 people i meet it used to be 10 people who would run maybe a half
person out of every thousand right would say yeah let's talk about that now it's two three out of

(26:54):
ten people have some interest not not in realizing we're all god because that's going pretty deep
admittedly but in realizing they're not what they think and realizing that their suffering is
largely exacerbated by the illusion that they're caught up in people want to talk about that now
and that leads to the realization that if you're not what you think you're everything as we said

(27:17):
right that selfishness can go all the way back to unity but it's just it's just in spreading the
awareness like you know this is just a ride this is just an illusion it's not what it appears to be
right and then that's it and that's what we're doing and the environment will change as a result
yeah certainly yeah i think it's so important when you mention perceptions and just being

(27:38):
and you know this is one of the core things that we talk about but just being mindful
of your perceptions i made a video yesterday when i was walking i was feeling i've been
making more just like talk just like kind of ranting for a minute or two and less structured
which i've been enjoying i've been enjoying mixing in different types of videos and some
longer where it's like less structured my pauses and whatever whereas in the past it's historically

(28:04):
just been strictly jump cuts and just like very much you know edited so it's like you
know quick there's no hesitations or whatever so i've been mixing in both and i think i
i saw a video recently that was talking about just like creator strategies and whatnot
and it's not i don't think a formula that is exact that everyone needs to follow but it mentioned how

(28:24):
as a creator building sort of a community posting you know maybe one or two out of every 10 that you
you think are like you know quicker more like viral focus type videos and then the other eight
are more like longer form just like more less in produced in a way that you know it probably won't

(28:45):
go viral because it doesn't have all those tick tock you know check boxes or whatever
so i've just been incorporating more of those just like when i'm walking something will hit me so
anyway yesterday i was kind of cold on my walk and i was like am i feeling colder
because i'm telling myself that i'm cold like this is just a feeling i'm not even cold cold
is just a word we use to describe a certain type of feeling i'm just feeling a certain way but is

(29:10):
am i exacerbating that feeling by thinking that and i think there's so many situations
you know when someone feels like they're in you know a difficult situation or a shitty
situation or a tough situation and that's not to say that those don't occur they certainly do and
you can label it however you want to label it it doesn't technically really matter how you label it

(29:31):
but at the end of the day your perception of it can potentially be exacerbating that situation
and making it worse than it actually is because you keep telling yourself how bad it is and it
goes back to your brain trying to latch on to and confirm like using that sort of confirmation bias

(29:53):
to uh confirm all of your beliefs about the way that things are so it's that's a huge part of our
society and you have a certain belief about the way things are your brain's just gonna keep trying
to confirm it's gonna start picking things out that's why you know you see or start looking for
a red car online that you want to buy all of a sudden all the cars you see are red you're like

(30:15):
did all these red cars are driving into my life no they're always there but you were just conf you
know you've been thinking about it so your brain's confirming that they're out there because you want
to purchase it or whatever and it goes for so many things but just being mindful and it's going to
happen it's always going to happen but just being able to take that split second to catch yourself
and it's it's pretty much universally applicable and i think it happens throughout probably

(30:40):
everyone's day like hundreds if not thousands if not tens of thousands of times a day that we have
perceptions about things that are exacerbating the way they actually are like things just are
and we layer on thoughts like there is no good or bad but thinking makes it so it's sort of the same
type of realm in that sense yeah absolutely and and it's really important to keep that in mind

(31:04):
because right now um a lot of the uh private coaching sessions that that people have been
arranging with me have been revolving around what's what's going on in the world economically
in terms of climate change carbon tax credits uh coronavirus all of this and people are panicking
admittedly because it feels like everything's kind of falling apart and and those with

(31:28):
let's say less than honest intentions in power are trying to solidify their grip on what's
happening they're trying to solidify their control of our lives in every aspect whether it's monetary
or otherwise like i was saying about biden's infrastructure bill is a perfect example and so
people are starting to panic they're starting to to view the world as being

(31:50):
increasingly encroaching on their lives and it's because we hear about this stuff every day
because we we hear about more and more how afraid people are and and how much the powers that be
are doing to try and solidify their own power and so the common perception is oh we're screwed
they're going to take over our lives and it's important to remember just because you perceive

(32:16):
them making a power grab doesn't mean it's because they feel like they're in power
if i was in power i would want you to view me as being all-powerful i would want you to view
me as being in total control of you of you being a victim because there's no way i can have that much
power over the world the world's too big there's too many influences there's too many players right
so i would want you to view me that way straight up but the other point is that if i was in power

(32:41):
and i was suddenly making big moves to establish more power that's not me making power moves that's
me desperately scrambling because the system that i created over decades is falling apart
right like the rise of cryptocurrency again is a perfect example the powers that be aren't happy
about that they can't control it they're trying but then more cryptocurrencies pop up i mean

(33:01):
look at uh this whole thing with identifying uh transactions over ten thousand dollars on bitcoin
well that's great for bitcoin what about ravencoin which trashes the address as soon as you send a
transaction it's designed to be anonymous what's the system going to do about that
right so it can't compensate for everything but it tries and so we're just watching that but

(33:24):
it's important to remember that it's not what it appears to be it's not that the system is getting
more control it's that they're losing control and they're trying desperately to solidify that
control because they don't know what the future holds you know i i actually have a kind of a
fun theory if we're talking about um ripples and vibrations and and common mentality have

(33:45):
you noticed that all these billionaires seem to really want to get off the planet lately
they have yeah i think it's because we're growing their their place isn't here they're feeling more
and more out of place there's nowhere else to go right that mentality is not it's not going
to survive into the future it just won't yeah i'm uh i can't remember if before the first episode we

(34:10):
decided that covid was a topic we're gonna stay off of okay should we stay off of it you think
um and the only reason and i want to say okay we'll include this in the podcast the
reason that we don't get into the coronavirus conversation is quite simply because there's

(34:31):
too much rhetoric on each side it's just that both sides of the argument are exaggerating
for the point of making their their point and so like the other day i was saying that
comparing a mask mandate to nazi germany is a lot like comparing coronavirus to smallpox
they're both exaggerations right coronavirus is not smallpox it doesn't kill 30 of the population

(34:58):
right and a mass mandate isn't that big of a deal at the end of the day you're just being
asked to be more considerate around people who may be panicking or afraid that they're going
to catch something that's really not that big a deal i mean we do things all the time for the
sake of consideration we create bike lanes on the road like it's really not that big a deal and you
can complain oh you're crowding my car but i mean it's safer for the bikers and so we can see that

(35:21):
and so we just do it but until we can get to a point where we're talking about this honestly and
more importantly until we get to a point where the argument is absent of uh monetary incentive
there's really no argument we can have that's going to go anywhere because
there's too much vested interest in either side being right there's too much vested interest in

(35:42):
the other side being wrong and until then until we can actually just come to the point where we're
all in an equal playing field field and deciding what's best for us as a species what's best for
me as an individual and what are the actual facts what is the decision that i'm making here
it's very difficult to have this conversation and and i mean that because there's no transparency

(36:04):
as with everything in the system there's just no transparency i'm not saying get vaccinated and i'm
not saying don't get vaccinated what i'm saying is that it's a personal choice but that it's
important to remember that we can't compare apples and oranges you can't compare the current vaccine
to previous vaccines and you can't compare the current pandemic to previous pandemics because

(36:26):
everything is different the society that we're in is different the virus itself is different our
means of of living day-to-day has changed we can work remotely now that changes the playing field
like the argument that everybody should be getting back to work now that we've got this under control
is again the result of an inherent bias in the system to get us go out and driving the economy

(36:47):
again so until we can come to terms with all of these influences it's very difficult to have
this conversation yeah certainly um yeah i think something else that has always been a part of my
life and questioning and things is just when it comes to you know political conversations just

(37:08):
the idea that i feel like with our conversations it's it's like a separate sort of thing and
i think we're able to see because i feel like everyone feels a need to identify with a certain
side or feels a need to identify someone else in a certain side and because of this polarization with

(37:32):
i think which i think i mean i see in the us has gotten very polarizing especially in the last 10
years or so it's gotten kind of out of control to a degree and i think with our conversations like
we're just able to see that both sides had like the understanding through which they come to ideas

(37:56):
is flawed like the root of it is flawed so that means that no matter what side
us comes out of that sort of route is going to be flawed so both sides sure both sides have some
unders like things that are maybe you know best or whatever but both sides also have things that

(38:17):
they're vastly incorrect about like both sides like it's it's all there's things on both sides
and and i i see this very often that people almost won't even have an opinion on something until they
know what their side opinion is on it and i find it fascinating that we almost have have waited and

(38:44):
i noticed this all the time now with with crossing the street stop lights in new york like the like i
never wait for the walk sign like i look both ways no cars i walk there's a crowd of people on the
corner like just kind of standing there and i'm like this is becoming almost like you're not in
control like you are allowing everything else like everything work it's always like a give and take

(39:10):
but it's more and more you know that lack of need for awareness and just allowing everything else to
do everything for you and it's like it's we're getting to that with cars like autonomous vehicles
just being able to sit there and so i find it anyway going back to that with like the
polarization of you know the political spectrum i don't i don't think we need to get too deep into

(39:31):
this realm but i just find it fascinating that a lot of times i'll see people not have an opinion
or have their own personal opinion and then they hear what their side has
and all of a sudden they completely change it and they're like very aggressive on the other side
and they they will deny ever having the other opinion because their side doesn't

(39:51):
agree with that i just find that to be very fascinating and just the group think aspects of
it and the lack of i don't know a degree personal responsibility and and whatnot and i'm seeing it
more and more it's just like especially being in a place like new york there's just so much going on
all the time that i'm noticing more and more of it's pretty pretty interesting to see yeah

(40:13):
when it's the rhetoric right like the rhetoric is what's dangerous on both sides and and see
my my perception on the whole thing is this and i avoid the conversation because in all honesty
it's not a conversation you can have rationally most of the time right but if you wanted to be
vaccinated because you have concerns about your health perhaps that you don't want your health

(40:38):
most of the time or or perhaps you're in an age range where you're at a greater risk and you think
that it's going to um buoy your immune system and allow you the the opportunity to protect yourself
better that's fine that's a personal decision and i think that that's that's a decision that
you should make depending on the considerations within your life but then we look back at say the
actual you know say mortality rate or the actual hospitalization rate and we realize that it's only

(41:03):
high for certain age ranges it's only high for certain people with certain medical conditions or
multiple medical conditions and so those people should consider the vaccine with an entirely
different lens than say somebody who is 20 to 30 years old with no prior medical conditions that
person may not feel that the vaccine is in fact their best bet against beating the virus that they

(41:27):
may they may in fact think of their immune system because of their age because of their medical
history because of you know the way that they live the way that they eat or whatever it is they just
feel that that's the better the the better bet for going against this coronavirus that person should
be able to make that decision based on those considerations as well but what we're doing as
we've done with everything is just say here's a solution it applies to everybody and everybody's

(41:50):
doing it then we're good to go and we're taking out everybody's personal responsibility and
making their own choice we're taking out informed consent right which is the entire point is that
we've created something for you that's a tool that's going to help protect you do you want
to use it it's not you must use it because that argument doesn't even make sense it would make

(42:12):
sense if if the vaccine stop transmission it would make sense if the vaccine stopped transmission
it would make total sense that you know you're putting people at risk if you're not vaccinated
because you're carrying around a virus that you could otherwise get rid of but the vaccine doesn't
stop transmission and it doesn't kill the virus it's not like the smallpox vaccine right it's not

(42:34):
the same thing at all so vaccinated people are still carrying the virus they've admitted this
so vaccinated people are still carrying the virus why are unvaccinated people the danger because an
unvaccinated person if they get sick they're going to show symptoms for the most part so
we're going to be able to identify that they're sick that they have coronavirus but a vaccinated

(42:56):
person doesn't show symptoms so now you've got people who are vaccinated have breakthrough cases
and they're spreading it around the world and nobody knows nobody could tell right so
all we've really done is is made made it so that way certain people are allowed to carry the virus
that's what we've done yeah yeah i mean the arguments i hear with it are always

(43:21):
that you know you're not being considerate of everyone else but as you just mentioned it's like
it's it's always just nitpicking to fit
your agenda whatever side that you're on to fit your narrative and just willfully leaving off very
very important details on the side of whatever side you're trying to take like the details on

(43:46):
the other side that it's just like there's there's no give and take anymore no you know
i don't know active communion in any of this it's just you know my way or the highway on both sides
and it's i think yeah with especially just with the narratives that i see on i mean i don't have

(44:09):
a tv so i don't really watch anything which i've been told is my you know my first world
white privilege not having a tv and not you know having to watch the news but you know i i let
those slide um but yeah it's fascinating just the narratives that you see and how they evolve

(44:30):
even from where they begin with to you know deepen what they want to happen in a certain way
absolutely well and and they know human nature right like we we've been marketing and we've
been building the uh the pr side of things for like 100 years we know very much how humans
interact with one another and admittedly when uh covet first came out when there was word of

(44:54):
it spreading nobody knew anything about it and so there was justifiably a response of fear and
panic because nobody knew anything about it nobody knew what it was we were getting word they could
transmit over over tabletops and then it would you know jump from people it was just it was all a
bunch of uncertainty and so everybody panicked and everybody kind of locked down and that's fine that

(45:15):
makes sense that is an appropriate response in my opinion to something that's potentially fatal
but then it was okay well it's actually okay it's not that and it's not that and it's not that but
just stay afraid just stay panicking and it didn't matter how much new information
was coming out of it it was still you know no this could kill you this could kill you i heard

(45:38):
dear god it was jon stewart who compared coronavirus to hitler and it's like really
like that don't you think that's a bit extreme and what's funny is that he was doing it
in derision to make fun of the people who are anti-vaxx comparing the vaccine mandate to hitler
and it's like okay but neither coronavirus nor the mandate are hitler let's let's make this perfectly

(46:01):
clear there's a very big difference between those things and killing millions of people
and that's what i mean about the argument going nowhere right is that as soon as you're in that
kind of rhetoric you're not talking rationally anymore you're just dealing with one side of fear
versus the other side of fear and that that's all it is right so it comes down to the fact

(46:22):
that we have to just come to terms with the fact that it's still a personal choice to live or die
that is the point at the end of the day my life is mine if i want to put it at risk whether
it's skateboarding bungee jumping or getting a vaccine or not getting a vaccine that's up to me

(46:42):
it always has been up to me but the argument that we're having collectively
right now which is very very dangerous is that the collective informs the individual
rather than the individuals create the collective it goes against everything that the united states
was meant to symbolize and and start was that we're a nation of free people creating a country

(47:05):
as opposed to a country telling us how to live right it's the exact opposite we're going back
towards you know fascism and dictatorship we're going back towards irresponsibility
which is the problem that we've been having more and more over the last several decades and so
like we've been saying this conversation is a big part of how we are going to change as a culture

(47:25):
going forward because this conversation is all about living in the grey area we don't want people
to decide one way or another which is why we've avoided this conversation about coronavirus for
12 episodes is because we don't choose a side we're not even choosing a side here we're not
telling you one way or another what you should do we are saying that it's your right to choose

(47:47):
one way or another and that only your right to choose is the point because you can't tell other
people what to do and expect them to do it you just can't and if you're going to do that then you
can't you can't complain when there's conflict and people calling you a fascist or a dictator that's
just how it goes and likewise for people who are anti-vaccine it's okay to make the choice that you

(48:09):
don't want to have a vaccine you don't have to go to the extremes of saying that you know it's going
to kill you if you get it you're an idiot if you get it you know you're you're subjecting to the
system you're a sheep you can be a rational person and still believe in medical technology there's
not a problem with that you can question medical technology or you can believe in it

(48:30):
it's the same argument we've been having for years it's like oxycontin
right at one point oxycontin was introduced by the pharmaceutical company says you know it's
going to save people look it's a wonder drug and then all of a sudden oh we have teenagers that are
committing suicide and are getting hooked on this right away right and it's just it's like anything
else it's it's a pharmaceutical drug there's a profit behind it you have to weigh the the pros

(48:52):
and cons you have to weigh the risks for yourself and decide if it's more harm than help or or vice
versa and in doing that you decide the path of your life but that's all this argument should be
about that that's all it should be like if there's if there is medical technology that's available
and you're afraid and you believe the technology works use it you shouldn't be ridiculed for that

(49:16):
on the other hand if you don't want to use it you shouldn't be ridiculed for that either
yeah i find it very fascinating just when it comes to judgment
and i see it a lot you know tying it into spiritual community you know the spiritual ego
and whatnot and people like acting a certain way and judging people because they aren't

(49:38):
you know as awake as them or as woke as them or whatever and i just find that so funny and i
you know at the same time i find it to be an interesting
paradox because i like that you can take it as far as you want so like say there's someone acting
a certain way who's who's just like you know someone labels them as a sheep and then there's

(50:03):
like a spiritual person who comes along and you know says how they are just so you know asleep
asleep at the wheel they don't see what's going on whatever but then if someone else comes along
and is like i also see that but i don't judge them and then they start judging the spiritual
person for having an ego and then there's like another person who's like judging that person

(50:28):
it's like this vicious cycle that could go on forever until you realize that they're all you
and then there's there is no judgment to be cast but i find it very fascinating and like until
you see fully that you are them and you are like you're them and if if even though it feels like

(50:51):
maybe you're not if if everything was traded you would be doing the same thing you would be
making the same judgments you would be acting the same way as the initial person all these
things and but i i i find it very fascinating on both sides of things the judgment or even
you know the people who are personal choice and you know anti-vaccine or whatever then judging

(51:15):
people for wearing a mask and it's like that's not affecting you at all why do you give a [ __ ] if
they're wearing a mask inside what happened to choice exactly i find that to be the hypocrisy
across the board when it comes to and i made i i responded in a q a on instagram about that once
the idea of people who are you know pro-choice or not in certain ways like both sides have people

(51:42):
you know certain topics they are pro-choice on but across the board you know you may be pro-choice on
your thing that your side agrees on you know when it comes to having to take the vaccine
your pro-choice but then when it comes to something the other side is pro-choice on like
something like abortion or drugs then all of a sudden you're not pro-choice and then on the

(52:04):
other side you're pro-choice with abortion and drugs on the other side you're not pro-choice
when it comes to vaccine and it's like is anyone taking a step back here and
seeing how [ __ ] hypocritical all of this is like you can't have one without the you know
like it's just it's blows my mind and i think i uh i responded to a q a because a lot of people ask

(52:26):
me like my thoughts on vaccine and covet and a lot of times i stay out of it but sometimes i'm like f
i'll get into it and i started that one with like i don't mean to ruffle everyone's feathers here
but everyone's a little bit hypocritical when it comes to a lot of these topics yeah absolutely
i just i'm focused on myself and how i feel about things and so that's that's really all i see and

(52:50):
until that stops being true i can't talk to you about anything right i'm just going to continue
to sell validated there's nothing i can do about that but yeah it's interesting and admittedly like
to our listeners who are probably wondering why we haven't discussed kobit up until now um quite
honestly it's because of the system that we live in it's because the world that we live in and

(53:11):
and it's such it's such a dangerous conversation to have which is really the point right it's
really the problem at the end of the day is that it is a mindful to get into this conversation
there is a consideration in having this conversation in how quickly people become vilified
for even just questioning what is happening like look at what recently happened with trevor noah

(53:33):
trevor noah was doing a report on the omicron strain and he mentioned that medical professionals
are finding omicron is less uh harmful to us it's an easier strain for the immune system
to handle though it is easier to transmit and the ceo of i think it was pfizer came out they're like

(53:53):
well no no don't worry the vaccine is gonna you really need the vaccine the vaccine is definitely
gonna help you you gotta keep taking the vaccine and trevor noah's response was maybe the person
who's getting you know 100 million dollar paycheck out of this isn't the person that we should be
listening to in terms of you know what's best for our body that's all he said was that this
person has a bias well he just got called out by everybody like they just went for his head and it

(54:19):
was just because he was questioning the dominant narrative that was being invested in by people who
were afraid and people who were afraid always look for somebody to point the finger at right that's
that's a common trait when we're afraid we want to blame somebody for our fear right when we're
afraid we want to point the finger and then that's that's what ended up happening it was

(54:40):
just the act of questioning is enough to have you branded as a disturber of the peace
and that's largely why we don't talk about this on here that's why we haven't been getting into this
conversation because while we're building this while we're doing our thing i still need a job
yeah yeah i feel like and yeah at the end of the day like as important it is to discuss all these

(55:07):
things there are certain things that people's perceptions just come into and you know that's
why i'm not maybe posting a video of our religion every single day i dabble in it here and there
and it's fun to do it sometimes but if i did it every day it would just be kind of a headache and
it's like you know there is a give and take and an upside and a downside that you're able to see with

(55:31):
everything and as important as it is i think for people to question everything i i think there's a
level that i feel comfortable with and that level grows and grows every day pretty much but you know
it's still like yeah i could i could post about it every day but i don't you know we could talk about
these things every podcast episode but we don't it's not necessary and there are just so much so

(55:57):
much identity involved in these conversations and the more identity that gets involved in things the
i don't know a little bit more careful you have to be quite frankly and the amount of time you have
to spend just wondering if it's if it's worth your effort and energy and is we may you know we've

(56:21):
gotten through a lot of stuff without discussing this in 11 episodes so i think we're doing
just fine but i even i had a guy last week on my podcast who does food content we were talking
about you know hate comments and whatever and i'm like how do you get any hey count you post food
that's that's like slightly healthier than the original thing to help people promote a healthier

(56:45):
lifestyle and potentially make it easier for them to lose weight if they if they so want to or just
eat really good food that's a little bit healthier for them and he's like yeah well when it comes to
food people are closely and we got to the point of discussing identity and how closely identified
they are with their food and especially when it comes to cultural foods is where he gets the most

(57:09):
like hate comments because he'll make it in a way that is not the typical way that people make it
so that it's you know a little bit healthier he swaps out a couple things here and there
still tastes really good but you know even he gets comments on there like this is so wrong
like who do you think you are and it's like he's making food recipes out here like you gotta be
[ __ ] me like this is insane but yeah it comes back to identity and when people are very much

(57:36):
identified with side and i think that comes into politics a lot and religion and food here and
there but the the closer people identify with something and the more fear that they have like
providing that identity or kind of underlying fear they have that goes along with that
identity that if they were to question it a lot of overwhelming fear would come into their life

(58:02):
the more angry they get when you question it because i was actually something else i was i was
uh my cousin follows me on tick tock i actually sent her our podcast because um i think she'd
really like it but she it's not religious has kind of gotten out of that and and she i noticed
she commented on one of my religion videos and i was texting her about identity and how

(58:26):
everyone has a little bit of doubt when it comes to certain beliefs and they just like everyone
has that little bit of doubt and if you question that doubt they get very angry about it because
they don't want to question it so when it gets questioned for them they don't want to go down
that route and it leads to them coming at you and your character because you are doing what they

(58:52):
are afraid of doing because again that high level of fear comes in as soon as it's questioned
as soon as you know their doubt gets you know blown up a little bit all of a
sudden they become very afraid because they are relying on that to you know settle their fears

(59:14):
yeah and that's the real pandemic at the end of the day like we're going to talk about the real
plague that humanity's going through it's it's this this investment in our certainty
that's just gotten out of hand and then that's all it is and i think that that is the real problem
pandemic economy climate change all of that aside how we deal with all of those problems are are

(59:40):
distorted by our over investment in identity and certainty right until we can address that until
that tide starts to change in our society we're always going to end up in these childish arguments
with people who aren't even able to see what we're arguing about because their own their own
value is is wrapped up in it right they'll have they won't have ears to hear right it's like in

(01:00:03):
isaiah they say you'll have eyes but you will not perceive you'll have ears but you will not hear
exactly the point right is that it's like we're speaking different languages
and it's because our focuses are different if i'm focused on my illusion
everything that comes through is twisted by that illusion it doesn't matter what it is right and

(01:00:24):
until i can see past the illusion i can't hear you i can just hear my interpretation of you
and that's what we need to work on which is why again the this podcast is is so good in terms of
not choosing a side one way or another we're not advocating against
society or or the system we're not advocating for the system we're talking about being reasonable

(01:00:46):
in the establishment and the maintenance of that system we're talking about being realistic and how
big that system can be and how much influence it should have over our life like all we're
ever talking about in this is being reasonable living in the gray area taking responsibility
and maintaining a state of awareness so we're not getting overly caught up and spreading this
plague of ego as it were without meaning to and as soon as we can come to that terms well

(01:01:10):
or to that that point well then all of a sudden the ripples that we're making change they change
entirely and all of a sudden those people who at one point couldn't hear us realize that the
sound has changed that's coming through their illusion like they can see there's something
that's not working the same way that's the one thing i've definitely realized in my life is that
as i'm less involved with my ego and i talk to people who are still looking at me through theirs

(01:01:34):
they don't respond the same way to me because i'm not responding the same way to them
and so all of a sudden it's like what i'm doing is so out of alignment with the illusion that
they're invested in that they have to question the illusion they're like why isn't this fitting
why doesn't this person care that i'm judging them like why doesn't this person
care that i keep trying to you know put them down and validate myself why don't they get why

(01:01:56):
are they still smiling and stuff like that it's just all of a sudden it has a ripple because it
makes them uncomfortable enough to question their perception that would never happen if
you were to go question your perception why don't you see they won't listen to you they
can't right because you're you're making it about you instead of allowing them to make it above them
yeah yeah certainly and i think when it comes to you know the communication of these ideas and

(01:02:23):
perceptions i think i really enjoy that we're you know expressing all these things because
what something else i wanted brought up was um i listened to at least like the audiobook
version of the gospel of thomas and it was like i i resonated with a lot of it but like a lot
of them were still i was like i could maybe see where he's coming from with this one like

(01:02:46):
just because i understand these things that we talk about these things so much but like
you know five six months ago a year ago like none of this would have made any sense whatsoever and
but at the same time i think there's like almost i mean there's an infinite amount of ways that
someone could perceive it but there's kind of like two main ways like the literal or the metaphorical

(01:03:09):
and if you take it literally i think that's where christianity was sort of built was all
of his messages were taken literally and they were never meant to be taken literally so i was able to
unders because i knew they weren't literal going in so i wasn't even trying to understand them
literally but i could see i was like oh that's where christianity got that sort of thing and it's

(01:03:33):
like how did they take that to be literally and that's why so many things don't make sense and we
have so many like i don't know silly stories out there because the way that he spoke the way that
jesus spoke was very much i don't think supposed to be taken literally but if you take it literally
it comes out with some crazy stories and but at the same time like even where i'm at right

(01:03:57):
now i was not able to fully grasp everything he was saying i would have to go back and listen
a few times and if i wasn't paying very close attention it was not even no chance whatsoever
for sure well and there's such a big gap in language right like we're talking about a
scroll that was that was literally you know found and has been translated but it's not like it was

(01:04:20):
intact right so we're doing the best we can with with essentially an almost dead language
trying to interpret it into english and the symbolism and the metaphors that we would use
and so it's it's very difficult it's kind of like reading um the daotech right like depending on
the translation of that book that you find it will mean an entirely different thing to you right like

(01:04:42):
i've read translations where reading the archer which is probably one of my favorite passages
of that book i walked away going what because it just it didn't it wasn't translated by somebody
who understood what the hell they were talking about they were just translating the words as
they as they understood them they didn't have the understanding of what the message was right which

(01:05:04):
is always the point like i've had people all the time come to my videos and they'll quibble about
a word that i used or an expression that i used and it's like well that's not quite accurate it's
like nothing if it's language of course it's not accurate the question is is the meaning coming
across or are you allowing the meaning to come across or are you quibbling on the words to avoid

(01:05:26):
the insight are you quibbling on the words to make it about me rather than what i'm saying right and
that's that's always the case all of our stuff gets twisted by that even this podcast i guarantee
yeah yeah everyone has their own unique perception and so there's no way and i made a video today
just about you know that idea which we've talked about a bunch that you know there's multiple

(01:05:48):
versions of you that exist inside of everyone's mind so like why try and live based on all those
versions it's completely futile and impossible quite frankly like it logically doesn't make any
sense to live based on that because you can't there's only one there's only one of you but
everything that you ever say or communicate gets twisted by people's perceptions so for

(01:06:10):
us talking about things that you know very much aren't words you know reality isn't words it's
yeah it's it's not the easiest thing to express in words because it's never does it justice and
we can only do our best to communicate it and you know people have ears to hear great but at
the same time like i don't feel too much pressure to feel like i'm responsible for their perception

(01:06:35):
as well like that that is their call and and if they get it great if not that's okay too
uh it'll come but uh when you brought up alan watts i was actually wanted to talk about him
for a sec because to me it seemed like especially more recently listening to his stuff because i
was listening to stuff like i don't know the last few years and only recently did it really

(01:07:00):
start to click more like there was a while where i would listen to it and i was like i don't
really know what he's trying like what he's saying here like it was too too much for me
but now it all very much makes sense so to me it seems like he was someone
who really got it but at the same time like people talk about him and i've seen his daughter

(01:07:20):
interviewed talking about how you know he was a big drinker and he kind of he understood that
this was all a play in a game and like very much not serious at all so like there's nothing there's
absolutely nothing wrong with like drinking all the time but at the same time do you think
and and you've mentioned this too with like jim carrey how seems like he got it but it maybe is

(01:07:46):
like has maybe lost some of the luster that he had a little while ago do you think that it's just
because you always for situations like that like you have to stay sort of on the ball
and as soon as you you know start wavering from that or bringing in sort of more identity into

(01:08:09):
it it can i don't know shield or fog up that sort of clarity to a degree so i was curious your take
just on both of those people because they're two people who i have you know a lot of respect for
and have listened to a ton of their talks and speeches just about these concepts for a while

(01:08:30):
i think that's interesting because it kind of follows up what you were saying about not
if you get it great right if you don't get it that's on you i'm just out here throwing seeds
and it took me a long time to get to that point because when we're talking about this stuff when
you as you witnessed uh last week when you talk to god as it were all of a sudden you come out of it

(01:08:54):
with a whole other level of responsibility with a whole other
perspective of what's happening you feel yourself connected to everything else around you and so
you want to go and talk to people about this you almost feel like this like this responsibility
to participate right and unfortunately that part that responsibility can end up feeling

(01:09:14):
very serious and that seriousness can take its toll on you um and so this is why i always say
it's so important to keep it light it's really important to keep it light and it's because
you can become hyper aware of your ego and learn to keep it compartmentalized but
then never get over it you're always just compartmentalizing it's like oh that's my ego self

(01:09:39):
this is where i'm this is who i am when i'm not identifying as that and and it's
just constant work it's the constant work of not identifying with my self-image including
as a teacher including as you know somebody who's enlightened or aware or anything i mean
there can't be an intention to this conversation and as soon as you have an intention it loses

(01:09:59):
all of its fun it loses all of his energy and it's it's enthusiasm and that is the danger in becoming
a public speaker that's the danger in having this conversation and even doing this podcast
is the idea that you start to take yourself too seriously you start to take your role
in the whole and in this ripple too seriously and it just becomes it becomes another religion right

(01:10:21):
it becomes another discipline and it can't be because that's that's not how we want to live
right it's really not and so when you do take it that seriously it's very very difficult to
shed that like it's funny you almost learn to shed one weight but then you end up carrying the weight
of everything as a result and if you're doing that it's because you have an idea of that of

(01:10:42):
that everything and you're still holding on to it which is what we were saying earlier is that
things are never what they appear right things are never what they appear to be and and that
insight in itself will bring you straight back to reality right back to uncertainty in the present
moment doesn't matter what your narrative is doesn't matter what you think is happening
there's way more involved it doesn't matter what the superficial is there are infinite layers

(01:11:06):
behind it and as soon as you're willing to accept that you end it back in the present where you're
not in control and there's no way to carry right but it's really important to remember that is that
things are not what they appear and i think in terms of alan watts a lifetime with
the vietnam war and everything that was happening with the hippie movement and everything else
there was a big push for for kind of like a new renaissance in consciousness and a lot

(01:11:30):
of people put pressure on watts to be something that i don't think he ever really wanted to be
and i think that he started to to take that on to some degree which is why later in his life
he took off and went and spent some time in the woods right he was just like no i i need to go
i need to look at the squiggly for a bit and get away from all of this and i think that that helped
him i found he he started laughing a lot more again right it wasn't quite so um so cerebral

(01:11:54):
but that's the point is that if it starts to get serious it's because you're creating weight
right you're you're investing in a narrative of yourself or the world it doesn't matter but you're
still creating another illusion even if that illusion is based on your recognition of truth
yeah yeah yeah i find that uh just all the time when i get start getting caught

(01:12:18):
up in things i just remember that they're just perceptions of how things are and it's always
here now and that i think is the most beautiful thing about all this that we talk about is
it's it's you're never missing anything it's always here now so you think you know you
missed a certain opportunity to be present it's like this is the opportunity the moment you're

(01:12:39):
thinking that you're missing the opportunity of being present you're being present in that moment
and it's here now always so whenever i start getting caught up in like feeling a certain way
i just remember that i'm aware of that feeling i'm aware of that perception i am aware
of that thought i'm not that thought i'm not that perception i am not that feeling i am just the

(01:13:02):
awareness of it i am everything and nothing i am nowhere or now here and and it's it's yeah it's
just it's a constant thing like because i i do get caught up all the time in that and it's just about
remembering oh yeah there's another perception there's another thought that i'm having and
and the more that i catch it the easier it becomes every single time it's like it is

(01:13:26):
very much a practice and it's never you know it's never that they're never going to be there but
that's part of this experience it's part of being human and i think something that i've learned
throughout is just to not judge myself along the way like if i do get and i talk about this a lot
in our workshops and stuff too it's like because i do i will get caught up in certain you know

(01:13:50):
perceptions of myself and judgments of myself and no matter what thing i'm doing if i get caught up
in judgment and then i start judging my judgment that's just doing the same thing and and i can
break that cycle by not judging my judgment in that in that moment and being okay allowing myself
you know the grace and and the the slack giving cutting myself some slack and understanding it

(01:14:16):
this is by design the way that things are like it's for the experience it's not about
enjoying every moment it's about experiencing every moment and enjoyment and good and bad and
and you know negative feelings are all just perceptions they are never the truth everything
just is we're just experiencing things every single moment and there is no single moment it

(01:14:41):
just is it's eternal it's it's right here and now always so it's like no matter how deep you go into
belief systems or identification or perceptions it's always that one step of becoming aware
of what you're doing and realizing that you're here now and that's it

(01:15:02):
yeah and what's funny is that so we talk about you know god or or the recognition of unity and
that impression of infinite intelligence that goes with that or the experience of infinite
intelligence that goes with that and that feeling has inspired people for you know thousands of

(01:15:23):
years to go out and and try to spread the word of god in one form or another and on
real and not realizing it that form of spreading the word is actually doing the opposite right it's
forcing it's controlling it's creating an idea it's perpetuating an identity so if anything
spreading the word of god is doing the work of the devil if you want to look at it that way right

(01:15:45):
it's so inked out it's so in control it's sowing ego so the real work of devotion to god is exactly
what you're saying it's the constant act of letting go it's the constant act of being present
it's the constant act of coming back to reality to be in god right and that's what spreads that's

(01:16:06):
what changes the world and people are so keen to get an idea of what's my life purpose i want
to align with source energy i want to align with god i want to create a new world a new earth right
5d whatever you want to call it right it's like great stop trying to do that now you're doing it

(01:16:29):
right and that's the counterintuitive part is that we want to change the world but the world
will change automatically the more present we become right because the world we live in is a
result of how not present we are right and that's it so there is only it's a one-step process not
just individually but collectively it's just doing it over and over and over again in the one moment

(01:16:50):
that is existence yeah and that whole idea of the new earth or 5d like those are very obviously just
more ideas and perceptions and belief systems like it's just it's just shifted from one thing
to another but it's a belief in you know the greater goodness and trying to ch and it goes

(01:17:15):
back to you know being the change versus trying to change everything and and understanding that
you know like we were talking about last week when someone's smoking a cigarette and someone
tells them not to like yeah smoking a cigarette might not be great for you but telling people how
to live also isn't great for you so it's it's like as much as but that's what people think when they

(01:17:38):
think of you know changing the world they're like i have this understanding that cigarettes are bad
so i need to spread it out to everyone or i have this understanding that we are all unity
so i need to you know force everyone else and i think there's a difference you know between us
having conversations like this and making videos as you know dropping seeds or pointers or whatever

(01:18:02):
just sharing it like i don't i don't advertise my videos as being advice or trying to help people
like when people ask like why i do it i just like i like making videos and sharing things like i
it's not even that i and sometimes i'll say like yeah i enjoy you know helping people because i i
see myself in them and i see i know what it was like going through extreme bouts of you

(01:18:26):
know social anxiety and whatnot and and so i i'm on the other side now so of course i want to share
things that helped me get there but it's not the intention isn't having the goal of helping someone
it's just sharing things because all i know at the end of the day is understanding this helped me
it helped me and i share it odds are it'll probably help someone else but it's not the

(01:18:49):
expectation that i have going into it and if it doesn't help a single other person that's okay too
they can they can leave it be now i'm not forcing anyone to follow me i'm not forcing anyone to
watch the video or like it or comment or anything it's all up to them and if they feel like it cool
that's right this is me just taking care of my part of what is yeah carry on you know unless

(01:19:13):
you'd like to get involved in which is cool welcome to the party right and and that's it is
people have to decide for themselves and we want people to decide for themselves we don't want this
to be a sales pitch we don't want to be like hey follow us we'll lead you to god because that's
that's the last thing that anybody needs it's just another idea of god and just another idea that you

(01:19:33):
don't know the way or can't find it yourself right and so it's just a conversation it's just having
it for the sake of having it and people who want to participate will or or they won't but what
inspires me about this process and what everything about everything that we've been doing here
is that we're coming up with ways to find uh or to create places for people to have this discussion

(01:19:56):
right like our patreon is a good place people come and they'll join us for our live streams or
the free live groups that we do people will come and they'll join in the conversation and that's
been super helpful to me and everybody who's been joining us but now we have the discord uh server
that's coming out so people can connect with one another not just you and i and then of course
later on we're going to be doing other events like at some point as this grows and we can start to

(01:20:19):
put some financing into it into some other public events things that actually draw people together
that are not online that's going to create new venues for insight it's going to create new
opportunities for change more opportunities for people of of like mind in the moment to
just connect and allow things to spread on their own right and it's just to exercise that faith

(01:20:41):
in in themselves which is essentially the point so that inspires me when i see this growing the way
it is when i see our youtube channel consistently getting more views and our podcast getting more
views and our tick tock channels getting more views and people commenting not just viewing
but asking questions wanting to be involved wanting to participate in the conversation

(01:21:02):
that's that is the change that's happening right that that's it you're seeing it it's
just not happening as fast as we would like it to or that we we think it should but again things are
never what they appear to be it's happening a lot faster than we think a lot faster the revolution
will not be televised right yeah and and the speed which changes is all just perception as well right

(01:21:27):
it's all happening now but yeah something i really just enjoy about our platforms and
there's certainly a lot of other people who just you know enjoy creating content and just doing
it for the sake of doing it having conversations for the sake of having conversations but i think
something kind of runs rampant in our societies having a reason for the doing you know the

(01:21:50):
means to an end or ends to means or reason or you know ultimate goal of where they see something
going and i think you know i think we've so far very much stayed on the path of like you know we
chat every monday for an hour or two and we record it and then we post it and that's it like we don't

(01:22:11):
have a we name everything and i do the timestamps afterwards like based on what we talked about
we don't create those and then talk about those things it all happens after the fact that na rey
names the episode after the fact after we figure out go back and figure out what the hell we just

(01:22:32):
talked about for two hours so keeping that in mind it keeps it helps to keep things light like
you were mentioning before and and even for you know just in my experience with things like i have
more clearly understood as i mentioned a few times that i just really enjoy making content
i enjoy making videos so i've been doing it more and more for the sake of doing it and

(01:22:53):
then inevitably things will happen like i know for sure that this is going to be in a much different
place than it in a year from now than it is right now and some people label that as you know like
we are attracting that and we have you know law of assumption working in our favor because you
know we think these things are going to happen but it's like those things are are just holding on to

(01:23:18):
a belief or perception or earth want that you that stems from feeling separate like you
have things that happen to you separately from you know from everyone and and that's
not the case but the more that you do this and the more that we do this and we are manifesting this

(01:23:39):
thing here now we are doing it as i'm saying these words simultaneously there's no disconnect
or separation in me these words coming out and us having this conversation to us manifesting
this sort of community it's happening right now as we speak so i think that's one of you know
the coolest parts about it is there's no we have no expectation even in our workshops too we have

(01:24:04):
a topic and that's about it it's like there's nothing more we don't prep really beforehand
you know you keep your announcements and make sure to cover certain things and i'm i'm kind
of there for the conversation and and it goes and i think both of our workshops have gone
you know incredibly well i think they'll provide a lot of people with a lot of value over the next

(01:24:27):
you know years and years to come so but and it's also kind of weird that we're not doing
a workshop tomorrow it's like been on my schedule for the last two months um but they'll they'll be
back soon enough but yeah i just really enjoy how light we keep things and how this is just
conversation for the sake of having a conversation there is no expectation and no inherent need that

(01:24:49):
we feel like we need to get out of it as well it's just doing for the sake of doing exactly which is
why it's so effective right in my opinion it's the reason that it comes across so clearly is because
we're not bringing our intentions into it like i'm not trying to create a new world because

(01:25:11):
whatever mentality i'm in right now doesn't have the ability to comprehend what that future will be
right that that's the point i'm just in this part of that wave right as the wave crests and
it builds it's going to create itself as it goes and so we're not trying to create
anything in the future we're not trying to create any kind of impact it's just having it right we're

(01:25:33):
just embodying the mentality that we're talking about during all of these events and as a result
i find the events the workshops especially get really really into the point without being all
preachy and and superior about it right like we're talking about it like we're weighing
things together like krishnamurti used to say right i'm not a teacher we're just talking about

(01:25:55):
things that are important to both of us and that's that's really it right i'm not teaching
you anything we're just discussing and we'll see where it goes from there right and that's
that's very much why i i find this conversation to be so important is because it is its own point
which is what life should be life should be its own point and if that's the insight we're always

(01:26:18):
embodying if that's the point that we're always driving home then this is doing everything that i
could ever wanted to do um and admittedly we're just going to keep doing it because i've been
doing it for 20 years by myself it's neat to have you know a partner in crime to do this with me
and now more and more people jumping on board and getting involved and as a result actually before

(01:26:42):
we get too far from this point i just wanted to mention to everybody that season two is coming up
in january and we are going to be introducing a new segment uh the dualistic unity round table
where we will have four maybe five guests on per episode and we're gonna basically just
go around on a topic talk about it from everybody's different perspective and see

(01:27:03):
what kind of insights that we can find so if you are a content creator or if this is something
that you would be interested in participating in do go to our website at dualisticunity.com
you will find a menu item called be our guest just fill in your information let us know that
you're interested and we will get back to you there's a number of dates that you can choose from
just let us know what your availability is likewise i just wanted to make an announcement

(01:27:26):
because i actually went through and tallied up how much content we've created with this podcast
with this episode we're at about 17 and a half hours of podcast alone and then with our patreon
we have over eight hours of additional content on our patreon page and that just continues to grow
so we're rapidly approaching 30 hours of just conversation it's just going to continue to build

(01:27:52):
and a large part of that is the enthusiasm of our listeners continuing to to encourage
us to keep going and submitting their questions submitting their their comments and on the last
note the q a episode is coming up so if you do have questions and you want us to address them
let us know and we'll get to them yes yeah i'm looking forward to that episode those are always

(01:28:13):
very fun because they're very targeted questions and as much you know value this may provide people
and just us having conversations when it's more direct it can be very cool as well just another
avenue um and going back to like the doing it for the sake of doing it i filmed i haven't posted it
yet but i filmed a video i just walked around uh washington square park isn't too far for me

(01:28:37):
it's it's one of the main parks like pretty well known in new york and it's always pretty busy and
there's basically a fountain in the middle so it's like a circle and i just walked around
the circle filming myself for three minutes which is basically the extent of a tick
tock that it can be and i just talked about the act of filming it it was kind of like a
meta video and talked about how even though you know all of my videos for

(01:29:02):
me walking around you are filming pretty much i was i was talking about how you know i am
walking around this this fountain right now with my phone in front of my face just like doing
circles and probably there are people all around and they are probably having perceptions about me
potentially passing judgment whatever like this dude just holding his phone in front of his face

(01:29:24):
and i was talking about it in the sense of what we talked about a lot in in the action of it and
the doing of it and i was talking about how you know i've now filmed a thousand videos probably
walking around new york but but what i have found is that no one has ever come up to me while i'm
filming anything and said anything about like what are you doing man like why are you filming right

(01:29:49):
now like no one ever i probably passed thousands of people and it's never happened and and so i was
talking about how the act in itself can be very beneficial if you deal with things like you know
even beyond social anxiety just anxiety of sort of being in public and what people think of you even
just like walking around which i know that people deal with a lot so like through that you initially

(01:30:14):
will feel very uncomfortable when you're doing that if you just hold your phone in front of your
face and start talking walking past people who are all sitting there kind of like just watching
people walk by so they're all probably passing some sort of judgment who will you know god knows
what it is actually but um what what i've found is sometimes i will be a tiny bit uncomfortable

(01:30:37):
when i start it's much less so now than it used to be when i first started doing it but eventually
you just keep doing it and the discomfort begins to settle more and more and more and as you keep
going it just begins to settle so i finished off talking about like when you become are able to
become comfortable in that feeling of discomfort there's no more discomfort and as discomfort

(01:31:01):
arises if you can face it which is the only way to truly qualm and uh settle those feelings
it begins to settle down and then as it comes up you face it you get comfortable in it and all of
a sudden there isn't really much discomfort left to have and and it's through doing it so i kind of

(01:31:22):
made a video talking about it while i was doing it it was kind of like that meta sort of idea but
um yeah i think i think can be incredibly helpful and i've just been trying to film more of just
like little rants about stuff and especially something like that i'll probably just
start filming more and just like this is me walking through new york through a crowd of

(01:31:44):
people filming myself started out a little bit uncomfortable i'm not as uncomfortable anymore
i can feel it settling as i'm speaking you know give it a shot if you have feelings like this
absolutely it's uh it's not your typical sales pitch that our society would make which is if

(01:32:04):
you're uncomfortable around people here are things that you can do to change your environment to
make yourself less uncomfortable right what you're saying is you know that's only going
to last until you feel like you're out of control again go through the discomfort find your balance
suddenly discomfort's no longer something you can feel you have to fear be uncertain be completely

(01:32:25):
honest about the fact that you really don't know anything other than you are here now
everything else is a guess everything else is speculation at best an assumption
which can be useful can be very useful like i'm going to build a house i'm going to assume that
the land i'm building it on isn't just going to collapse into the into a hole in the ground
it's totally possible but i'm going to assume it's not because i'm trying to build the house

(01:32:49):
right now if it did well at least i'm aware that anything could happen so i'm not overly invested
in that outcome in that house being finished right it's a reasonable expectation that it's
going to get finished but you know heaven forbid something could go wrong that's all we're talking
about we're always just talking about being reasonable at the end of the day we're just saying
just don't don't over commit to any one end result making you happy

(01:33:12):
and you will pretty much always be in a state where happiness is possible
yeah yeah something i keep coming back to the uh like crosswalk situation but something i was
thinking about was that beliefs there's it's okay to have beliefs and we always kind of have beliefs
in things to a degree but it's when we take them as truth and feel the need to defend them that

(01:33:36):
it becomes you know a sort of type of situation so i was just thinking with the crosswalk thing
like you can either with the crossblock have a belief in yourself and your eyesight or a belief
in the crosswalk signals and having a belief in the crosswalk signals that'll get you
a certain place until there are other factors in play like a car running through a red light and

(01:34:03):
all of a sudden there's a walk sign and you don't even bother trusting your eyes because you have
all all of your belief as truth in the crosswalk and in the stop versus walk side and as soon
as that walk goes you have your blinders on and you go you get smacked by a car and you're dead
and if you only had that belief in yourself and that true faith in yourself you don't even need

(01:34:27):
a crosswalk you can just look both ways and whether it says walk or don't you know you
won't get hit by a car because you have that faith in yourself then you have to believe in anything
outside of you and i think that kind of ties into a lot of different types of situations because
people like to put their beliefs in other things but the only thing that it ever comes back to is

(01:34:49):
all you ever have to realize all you need to do is have that faith in yourself and
it'll be just fine yeah right well and but with that goes goes the acceptance that we might die
right like that's that's we have to accept that i mean that's the biggest problem that we have in
our culture for the most part is our resistance to the resistance to the idea that people are going

(01:35:10):
to die right like we really just want to avoid that like we label styrofoam packing peanuts
don't eat these if we're at that point there are some people that maybe aren't going to make it
and i'm just saying that if they need instructions on not eating styrofoam the chances of them making

(01:35:31):
it very far are pretty slim and we're not exactly helping them by making everything easier on them
they should have some challenges they should maybe take a bite of that styrofoam and go ugh
no that's not a thing and then they learn from it but you know just telling people what to do
and what not to do doesn't encourage them to be intelligent it doesn't encourage them to be
responsible and it doesn't encourage them to make decisions that would promote long life which is

(01:35:53):
the problem we're child proofing everything and as a result we end up with a planet full of children
yeah and that whole idea of allowing people to fail like i as usual not going to name names but
you know people and certain people in my life i've had discussions about this about you know

(01:36:14):
one person not really allowing someone else to fail and kind of doing things for them all the
time with the fear that you know they won't get to a certain place and then you know the years go by
and they're still doing those things and feeling like they need to because they never allowed
that person to learn that lesson five or ten years ago so now they still haven't learned that lesson

(01:36:38):
because they didn't allow them to learn that lesson so now they feel like they still need to
do those same things because they know but if they had just let them learn lesson then they wouldn't
have to continue doing it and some lessons are harder to learn than others some lessons really
you feel like you know the world's crashing down on you but a lot of people you know as long as you

(01:37:01):
know it doesn't kill this human you think you are then you know you're chilling but a lot of people
have to go through some [ __ ] like that and to to really understand it and if there's always someone
there as their you know safety or uh you know flotation device or something then they're never
gonna learn that and then they're always gonna need a flotation device and until they actually

(01:37:27):
learn that and then the more that that happens the more pressure and the more potential for a larger
and larger quote unquote failure to happen whereas if you just allow them to kind of naturally
occur and allow that those failures those smaller failures to happen then they'll learn from that

(01:37:47):
but they're not going to learn from it by having that you know flotation device next to them their
entire life so true there's there is a another pandemic happening in our culture and it's the
uh the rate of occurrences where children aren't leaving the home that they're just staying into
their 30s and their parents not wanting to view themselves as bad parents are letting that happen

(01:38:13):
allowing them to just continue to to wallow in comfort and not face any challenges and
not face any discomfort and grow as a person and then all of a sudden in their 30s and their 40s
they're completely irresponsible they have no sense of personal value or meaning or
accomplishment or anything and they're wallowing through depression they're wallering through
social anxiety they're judging themselves they're doing like i can't tell you how many clients i've
had who have gone through this not not just the the person who's living at home but the parents

(01:38:38):
after the fact or during the fact going i don't know how to deal with this it's like
well you kind of put yourself here and you put yourself here by trying to avoid
hardship and discomfort you know it's like if you're in your early 20s move out
move out and get a roommate if you have to or or whatever find a cheap shitty apartment do

(01:38:59):
it the hard way you'll learn from it at least at least then 10 years down the road when you have
a better apartment or you've found your way into a different situation you have some context there
you move into a slightly better apartment and all of a sudden your old shitty apartment informs
your perspective of your new apartment all of a sudden you're like whoa i have an extra bathroom
or oh my god there's a room i can live in now like aside from my couch things like that these are all

(01:39:23):
character building things not only that but moving into the place meeting your landlord getting a job
meeting your bills doing all that i mean these are all things that are unpleasant nobody wants to go
through them in our our society especially because as we mentioned at the beginning
it's kind of pointless but you will learn about yourself through those things you will learn how

(01:39:44):
to grow as a person how to face things when you don't know what's coming and so if you're not
actively out there trying to embrace that uncertainty if you're not actively out there just
challenging yourself you're going to end up in a position where you don't have the strength when
the challenge does arise in earnest and that's something that i tell my daughter all the time
it's like by a certain age you should want to move out and it's not that you can't come home it's

(01:40:12):
that you should want to try not to just for your own sake right if you fail yeah okay come home
you know it's the same if you don't have family to lean on often if you fail and you can't pay your
rent you will find a friend who will let you crash on a couch or something like that but all of those
experiences are vital to you recognizing exactly how much you can go through exactly how much you

(01:40:34):
can take and exactly how much you can learn from those experiences it's so important to do that
and and we avoid it largely for our own reasons i mean admittedly when you're comfortable at home
you don't want to leave and when parents are are invested in the idea that your happiness with them
is indicative of how good a parent they are that becomes toxic too right because i love my daughter

(01:40:58):
and i'm i am my daughter's friend whenever i can be except when you know letting her off easy on
something is actually hurting her in the long run in which case i have to take it on myself to go
it doesn't matter if i'm liked or not for this this is ultimately what's going to help her in
the long run and so i have to do that in myself i have to face that insecurity in myself in order to

(01:41:19):
do something positive which is what we've been saying through this whole episode right is that
ultimately the cure for this disease of the ego is awareness and self-honesty right vulnerability
and the the the willingness to be uncertain and to just be where you are without some vested interest
in evaluating yourself or some vested interest in getting somewhere and that's that's what we're

(01:41:41):
talking about if the dualistic unity podcast is about anything it's just clearing the distortion
yeah it was going to bring up that idea of building faith in yourself and just that whole
scenario you just discussed it's allowing the child to build the faith in themselves and it was
the same sort of example i was using as well is that that faith in yourself is so key and when you

(01:42:04):
go through something and you have to you know live in a shittier apartment than you're used to or or
whatever then you build that sort of understanding that you may build an understanding that you don't
need as much as you once thought that you did and you can you can survive without it and especially
as you go as far as like you did going into the forest you really understand like oh yeah

(01:42:28):
i have opportunities to like make money doing x y and z but i don't need all of that because
i know how i can live and and even you know you don't necessarily people listening have to go to
extremes like that but you can if you take a step back and really just make a conscious effort to
understand what you actually enjoy doing like what actually brings you joy and happiness and

(01:42:54):
peace in your day-to-day life and you may realize that a lot of the things that you're striving for
a lot of the things that you want a lot of those things that you think are you know peak success
aren't what you actually want and aren't what you actually value and then all of a sudden
you know you're making x amount of money it may feel like you're making more because you're not
spending it on all the things that you have been told you know are the pinnacles of success or

(01:43:20):
show other people that you have value because you know like those billboards i put out in
soho you are perfectly whole and complete exactly as you are right now if you
really understand that there aren't as many feelings of lack where you feel like you need
to spend all this money and all of a sudden you have more to do with things you actually

(01:43:42):
enjoy and maybe you can start living your life a little bit differently than you were but
yeah through i think there's you know the two sides of it of understanding what you actually
enjoy and and value in your life and then also understanding you're also completely fulfilled
here and now always in in the doing as life experiencing itself so through understanding those

(01:44:09):
two key things there's there's not nearly as much lack or sense of you know desire to get all
these things in order to prove this value because there's nothing to prove anymore you have nothing
to prove to anyone you're already whole and complete exactly exactly since uh we'll wrap up

(01:44:29):
here shortly but i wanted to make a point based on what you were just saying because i recently had
a discussion with somebody on one of my posts and their point was very much that we have to expect
people to live up to certain standards we have to do our own inner work but then we have to create
organizations that demand other people within cult within society agree with that worker also

(01:44:52):
participate in that work so coalitions against racism coalitions against poverty coalitions
against government corruption things like that and well that's important and and that's true
those coalitions if filled with people who are egotistical aren't going to do anything good or at
least not anything long-lasting and so the change has to be individual it has to start with us

(01:45:14):
right and that's that's the point is that as people start to experience life like you're saying
as they start to let go of the the things that they don't really need as they start to let go
of the illusions that they used to think propped them up those people make different decisions they
operate their businesses differently they talk to one another differently and as time progresses

(01:45:34):
they will raise their children differently and their their children will interact with their
friends differently and eventually society will start to emulate the mentality of that ripple as
it spreads and so just like with the legalization of cannabis now in 10 years time you're going to
see people growing up outside of that prohibition who are now in politics for example and informing

(01:45:57):
the political discussion without the paranoia that came from everything before when the prohibition
was happening on campus that's going to change our attitude towards cannabis as a substance and
that's something that's useful to society the same is true as we start to question our ego and start
to question all of these enticing little bubbles that society says are important to to our value

(01:46:17):
that's going to change society too all of a sudden 20 years down the road people who are invested
in questioning themselves and finding that state of uncertainty and peace within their own
existence are going to be making decisions that affect more people they are going to be creating
more sustainable ripples and more impactful ripples because they will have all of that time
behind them to refine their own piece right that's the thing is that if i were to talk to you when

(01:46:44):
i was going to say back in 2005 like that video if i talked to you back then you and i probably
wouldn't get along to the same degree as we do now because i was cocky there was a lot of me in there
for sure right and so over time how i've learned to to live has informed how i've learned to speak
and that's informed how i've learned to interact with people in my business and otherwise

(01:47:07):
and that's changed everything so we're always refining the ripple it's just a matter of getting
into the ripple it's a matter of discovering oh right i'm caught in an undercurrent i can
get out of that and ride the wave to shore right and that's that's very much what we're working on
yeah i feel like it always comes back to getting yourself out of the way and allowing things to

(01:47:28):
be and to flow and yeah it's interesting so when you were back in 2005 would you like what i'm just
curious like what was causing you to feel that sort of talking was it the the cockiness was it
the realizations that you were having and sort of because there was still some me in there that it

(01:47:52):
was like i'm having these understandings kind of that sort of thing there was definitely an element
of that because i came out of so many years of uh devaluing myself of basically putting myself down
and giving myself no value whatsoever and that all of a sudden they came out at the other end going
oh wow none of that's real and i just felt so good for realizing it that you start to identify

(01:48:15):
with that that new freedom right and so you can see it on my face when i'm talking in 2005 saying
i'm going to educate you and it's just like it's brutal like i can't stand watching that video
just because i'm just like oh stop doing that um but the information solid like the insights i'm
talking about are solid but it's the way it came across it's the way that i was looking at it from

(01:48:38):
my own point of view that was distorting how much of what i was saying i was actually able to embody
and that was it right like i look back at that video now and i go that's a great point please
stop saying it like that right like just you can say that without all of that that attitude of
wire people get this it's so simple and it's it's it's not simple it's just that at the time that's

(01:49:01):
how i needed to perceive it because i was very frustrated with the fact that i was the only
person talking about it amongst hundreds of people that i had interacted with like it was so rare to
talk to anybody about this like we're having this conversation now that it was very difficult to not
go home and think to yourself what a bunch of [ __ ] shape like it was just very difficult not
to do that and and of course that's just me being egotistical that's me going ah but now i'm clear

(01:49:26):
about it i'm all good and then you slowly start taking it in it's like right but i wasn't always
right right but but that doesn't mean anything about me as a person and so
you start so i always say there was a lot of me in it back then whereas now
there's very little me in it and it's just because
it's not mine there's no need to take credit for any of this right there's i'm not saying anything

(01:49:51):
that isn't always there and so that makes it a lot easier to keep it light it makes a lot
easier to kind of sit back and let people do their thing because i'm not trying to teach anything i
know for a fact that if i never came into their existence all they would need is themselves and
they'd find the same damn answers they would find the same insights and so that sets me free from

(01:50:11):
a lot of things i didn't feel that freedom back then i was very much trying to change the world
yeah so was it was it almost like you were having the understandings but because there is still
some me left in there was it that you weren't seeing yourself as much in

(01:50:31):
other people okay so there is still because of that because that for me that that's what's become
started to become clear very recently was just like very much seeing myself so there's not really
any other to judge because they're all they're all me so it would i find and i still get caught up in

(01:50:53):
that for sure it's not to say that i i never do and i never you know catch myself and whatnot but
but the more you know the deeper i go into this and the more conversations that we have and
the more just experiences i have in day-to-day life the more clear it becomes that you know i
i am them and they you know things got traded i would be i would be them and i am them

(01:51:17):
yeah exactly and and this is easier when people are are more similar to you as you currently are
right when you meet people who are empathetic for example you're like yeah there i am right when
you meet somebody who's abusing their power and hurting somebody as a result it's very difficult
to go ah there i am right and and that's what i was running across as i was looking at the world

(01:51:41):
like like we've been talking about in this episode and i was seeing the narrative that i was assuming
i was seeing the evil in the the story that i i was holding on to based on the light that i
was experiencing in myself i could see all of the entanglements in the world around me
and it became i got to address this right and and so there was a vested interest in fixing it there

(01:52:03):
was a vested interest in the idea of what was best for everybody and so of course that doesn't work
and it just it ended up driving those people that i was different from even farther away i had to to
find a way to to recognize that i'm not my idea of myself even the positive end and that's what
i was dealing with back then it was you know i'm not my negative self also not my positive self

(01:52:26):
that's the point right and i really had to get to that point i really had to take into the fact
that i'm hitler i mean at the end of the day that all of the evil that's ever been
done was done by my awareness all the good that's ever been done is likewise done by my
awareness and this is what watts was saying it's like if you understand that black be gets white
right then you'll get this and that's what confuses people it's like you know

(01:52:49):
both sides aren't sides right they're the whole we just see it as one side or the other and and
so the deeper we get into that the easier it is to see ourselves in other people but it
gets difficult when we're talking about monsters you know because we look at the superficiality
of the monster instead of the very long journey it took for that monster to become what they are

(01:53:10):
and then when you do that you start to go right we were all that blank slate as a child we were
all in a position of vulnerability where our our environment could have very much twisted us
it could have very much you know sent us on a different path and it's like you were saying
you know just just recognizing that if i was to replace myself with you adam for adam i

(01:53:31):
would be you and that that insight has a lot of layers right when you start getting past like
oh i would be jesus and i would be buddha and i would and you start getting into the darker side
of things right then you really have to test your opinions and your preferences and your assumptions
and your ideas of what's right and what's wrong and everything else that goes into the universe

(01:53:51):
it's like the christian idea that you know god is good and the devil is bad it's like
there is no there's no division the devil is just the part of god you don't understand
and so that that that's very much it so over time i've just recognized that i
i have everything from the best the best of humanity to the worst of humanity

(01:54:13):
in my awareness and as long as as i know that i can deal with anybody from any mentality without
judging them which doesn't mean i have to condone them but it changes how i interact with them
yeah i feel like that sort of it's hard to have that understanding when you're tied into belief
systems too like actually seeing yourself in another and having that sort of true empathy when

(01:54:40):
you have you know very dualistic belief systems like you know a lot of religion and cruciality
yeah like there there is a sense of oh i would never do that and it's like what
exactly would cause you to not do that if you had you know their upbringing and their everything was

(01:55:02):
interchanged like what what else is there what and i have those exactly when i have
those conversations it's you know people say like oh well it's my consciousness it's my you
know being my soul is not like like them and and it's hard you know it's hard i think for me to

(01:55:24):
get past that with people and just you know trying to explain that that's just another
concept that you that's just another belief that you have like what is you know what's proving that
and you know a lot of people they just settle on saying it doesn't have to be proven or you can't
disprove it i'm like there's so many [ __ ] things you can't disprove that doesn't prove

(01:55:46):
anything like when i get that with you know religious stuff and i'm like yeah i also
can't disprove that i have you know or you can't disprove that i have you know 17 toes right now
until i take my sock off or anything like that but yeah so it's it's uh there are certain points

(01:56:08):
where i'm just know when to when to stop and i i can see when people are just not willing
to question anymore and they want to settle on an answer and you know i've gotten better about not
pushing it beyond that sort of limit that they want to feel and that's good that's a

(01:56:31):
good sensitivity to have because if it's about you nothing's getting through anywhere right if you're
if they're threatened by you they're not listening they're not getting it's nothing's happening
there you're just wasting your time spinning your wheels nothing you might as well just go
and continue enjoying your life and you'll run across somebody who might want to listen to you
right but you know give them time because i mean i know if i were to go back to my 16 17 18 year

(01:56:55):
old self as who i am right now i wouldn't listen to me i know that it wouldn't matter
how good i am at talking about this i was just not in a mentality where i could have heard it
right and give me some time right and that's what happened enough time enough hardship enough enough
lessons and opportunities to find those lessons and then my life changed and so that's it it's

(01:57:18):
just putting yourself in the mix waiting to see what comes out of it and just continuing to do
that until you're no longer afraid of the mix and you no longer hold on to anything coming
out of it or going into it you're just in it as it you're a little tasmanian devil constantly right
that's pretty much it and you're just causing whirlwinds you're causing ripples and and you

(01:57:39):
don't see them you don't know where they're going you don't know what they're gonna do but you know
that the the core that they come from is about as pure and vibrant and full of energy as possible
and and that's it that's the only faith we have to have is is in that state that we're
in because that's faith in ourselves and and that is if anything i would say how we're going to see

(01:58:02):
you know the re-emergence of god as it were because god is just it's just a description
for for the whole recognizing the whole it's all it is right like we're talking about heaven
what are we talking about other than just awareness recognizing its nature
right as everything and that's it nothing to fear every every fruit in the garden is

(01:58:23):
yours that kind of thing right it's like you were saying walking around new york it's like
people are totally different it's like people are totally the same your perspective of them
is separate is different which means they're not anything you have to be afraid of anymore
they're not anything you have to judge anymore they're not something outside of yourself and so
your your interaction with them changes your perspective of them changes your
your mentality going into conversations with them changes and that changes them not

(01:58:48):
because it's deliberately changing them that's the difference between control and influence right but
because you are in fact a different uh aspect of their environment you've changed your peace
in the environment that's it it'd be like if you were part of their room and you suddenly
just transferred yourself from being a bookend to a radio playing music all of a sudden now

(01:59:09):
that music's changing their life it's affecting their environment it's going to change how they
act that's all we have to do is just change the role that we play in ourselves and that's
just letting go of our limitations and the idea of that role and then we're free and freedom spreads
yeah certainly every interaction we ever have or every single thing that we do is

(01:59:31):
changing things in one way or the other you know towards ourselves or away from ourselves as
if you as you've mentioned so many times and and it's exciting to sort of you know have those
understandings because it's like we're where i feel like simultaneously
insignificant and extremely significant in in that same exact sort of paradoxical

(01:59:56):
way and it just makes makes things very exciting and enjoyable absolutely right like every drop in
the ocean on its own seems insignificant but without them all there's no ocean
that's exactly the point so we've managed to to cap two hours again for this episode so we'll
uh we will wrap this up here because obviously we have so much more to talk about i mean season two

(02:00:20):
is going to be fantastic i just want to reiterate again for everybody if you want to be a member
of the round tables going into 2022 do go to our website fill in the form uh under be a guest and
just let us know that you want to talk about what your social media handles are and what you want to
talk about and then we'll get in touch with you as soon as we have an event that lines up with your

(02:00:40):
your specific topic of conversation and of course if you can join us on patreon we get
more and more content going on there all the time um we will be taking a short break uh during the
christmas holidays and around new year's but then we're going to be continuing our free live events
as well um and of course every third wednesday of the month we do our exclusive live stream
on patreon for our supporters we have another one coming up there in a couple of days i think

(02:01:04):
this wednesday so if you can join us there those conversations are always a lot of fun they're
always very fulfilling and i always feel inspired after the fact so i'm just going to wrap up that
there and i will let andrew wrap up this episode because i tend to babble all the way to the end
now i'll keep it short and sweet yeah if you can join us on patreon we do have that live stream
on wednesday very excited for that i think mary was the only one who was there last time

(02:01:29):
so mary we hope to see you there and anyone else who has become a part of
our patreon community very excited for that um and yeah thank you so much for tuning in
to the episode and we'll talk to you soon thanks everyone we'll see you next week

(02:01:50):
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