S.2 Ep.2: Developing Balance

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
hello and welcome to season two episode two of dualistic unity i am playing part of andrew today

(00:06):
and i am still playing the part of rey though at some point i'm just gonna start calling myself
something else maybe carl maybe next week it'll be the dualistic unity podcast with andrew and carl
sounds great yeah it was funny in in discord uh someone mentioned like imagine plot twists
like rey was andrew the entire time like it would i feel like that would be a possibility if we

(00:29):
didn't both have you know social media accounts or if it was just like a massive thing where we
completely changed names but even then like you know i have probably a thousand friends on there
who actually know me on like instagram and whatnot so that that would have been a difficult thing to
pull off but yeah yeah it would have been great pr stunt for sure all of a sudden you just pull

(00:53):
off and make a fake face and it's me yeah my wife would be terrified i'm sure so it's been a weird
week man i i gotta tell you because um not much going on in my life in general this week outside
of course all the fun stuff we've been doing here on dualistic unity we had the round table uh last
week which was great fun but my week has actually been fairly quiet so i've more or less just been

(01:17):
you know going going through my life and looking at the world and and that's been the focus of the
week for me i think that that's been very much what keeps tapping me on the shoulder is what's
happening in the world around us what what is going down going down in terms of climate change
in terms of the government in terms of everything that's happening with these continued lockdowns
and and more importantly what's happening in the relationships that we are all building or

(01:41):
failing to build with one another the fact that it is so very difficult for everybody to actually
see past their own insecurities or see past their own needs in order to actually recognize
the intentions of somebody else for what they are and so my daughter was talking to me about
this today and she's 14. so she's growing up in the world and and she was saying i don't

(02:01):
know what the future really holds and i had to sit down and actually say none of us do
i mean everything that we're experiencing right now is unprecedented we've never been
in this situation we've never covered the world as we do as a species right now we've never had
the degree of control and comfort and production and everything else that we
do and more importantly we've never faced the problems that we're facing collectively right now

(02:25):
uh in terms of again climate change or or even what's happening with in terms of resignations
and the economy as it's progressing and it's having problems get moving supplies around the
planet like these are all new things for us to deal with and it can be all very overwhelming
and so that's that's very much been the focus of this week for me seemingly enough despite the fact
that i don't watch the news and then i don't i don't have cable television or anything like that

(02:49):
it's just it kept coming up in one form or another i was talking to a client and they were dealing
very much the same thing so i wonder as you are in the beating heart of a metropolis and i am
not i live in a very small city by comparison to new york how are you finding things are going in
in the relationships that you're seeing around you how are you finding that things are going in

(03:12):
new york do you find people are more on edge that they're standing farther apart from one another
do you find that people are finding ways to come together or is it kind of a mix of both yeah i
think i think it's always a little bit it's kind of like a spectrum you know when i because i don't
watch the news either so i get all my information from like you know my my team at work has a 10

(03:32):
a.m meeting that's kind of how we all start our day and so like i get information like that like
that's how i heard about omicron variant probably like two weeks after it became a thing i was just
like oh yeah it's kind of going crazy and i'm like oh what's what are you talking about what's that
but i do notice one thing that kind of like uh i keep as my sort of barometer is how many people

(03:55):
outside in new york city are wearing masks and so like that number has gone up quite a bit so
like when i started to notice that i was like oh something must be must be going on but um yeah i
think i think even you know from the governmental side of things just from what i've heard because
like again like i'm not really watching the news a whole lot i i it seems like people are shifting

(04:21):
from the mindset of like conquering this sort of unconquerable thing to let's see how we can live
with things going on and that sort of shift you know i know we don't want to get too deep into
this sort of thing but um yeah i think it's it's you know i i s i'm starting to see mentality shift

(04:45):
at least in new york where it's like you know take the precautions that you can be smart the
degree that you can but like you know we've seen that there are implications of any decision that
is ever made um so let's you know do our best to survive with it at least that's what i've

(05:07):
sort of been seeing more of that's like a little bit different from you know early on in pandemic
absolutely it's funny actually that's one thing we were talking about
in another conversation prior to the podcast was the difference in perspective because admittedly
a lot of my perspectives in my life is informed by the awareness that i am awareness that that

(05:32):
this body is not me as a whole it's just a very temporary incarnation of me uh one of many and so
because i tend to think of the world that way the idea of dying doesn't necessarily have the same
pull on me and i know some people are going to say oh that's easy for you to say you're healthy but
the fact is is that i haven't actually have had a great history of being healthy in my life i i was

(05:54):
born with a great many problems and i still have um a great many things that i deal with day to day
but they're just things that i deal with that that's all it is like at any point i could die
at any point i could become very very sick and pass on and knowing that i am awareness knowing
that i'm everything that doesn't have the same pressure that it would otherwise i don't want to

(06:19):
necessarily isolate myself and hide from everybody because i know that there's a cost to that too
so there's almost a balance that we're being forced to find in this because at first
everybody was panicked like oh my god if i get it i'm going to die and now we're getting to the
point where it's like okay if i get it chances are i might get pretty sick or i might not at
this point it's kind of all uncertain so i'm just going to kind of do the best i can and show

(06:43):
consideration to everybody if you think about it that's what we should be doing all the time anyway
so i mean this is really just acted as kind of a way to to get us to be more grounded in our
perspective of what we're doing in our life and with everybody else i remember my wife was saying
like it's crazy to me that we used to always just you know go out to the grocery store and like
grab onto a cart not even thinking about whose hands have touched it right and and so now now

(07:06):
we we were almost um overly sensitive to all of that whereas before we had no sensitivity at all
so we're finding that balance and i think that it's interesting how
just as we do that individually it's almost like we're doing it collectively as well
we're refining that balance between there's always going to be a little bit of risk but
hiding from that risk has another cost in terms of our relationships in terms of our ability to

(07:29):
to get together with one another and actually you know feel like life is worth living because life
life that's lived in constant fear of death isn't really living that's just existing right
and that's that's something that unfortunately a lot of us have settled for in terms of just having
comfort and control we've kind of settled for this sense of you know tomorrow's going to be the same

(07:50):
as today and that's good enough and as you and i have said many times stagnation is the problem
yeah i think alan watts has talked about that a little bit just the idea of people living a
life fully you know for 50 years versus a life you know in constant fear and just like kind of living
by the society's blueprint until they're 100 like you know which one is better i think there is

(08:18):
it is up for debate and something i think that's fairly applicable this type of situation that i've
been thinking about recently is just the idea of suffering and like additional suffering on top of
the situation at hand and how thinking that things should be different than they are

(08:40):
adds this layer of suffering on top of you know already difficult situations
like you're able to see things for what they are not necessarily immediately label them as good as
good or bad just kind of sit in that uncertainty of like i don't know like this isn't i know this
isn't good or bad people will argue that you know certain things are good certain things are bad but

(09:04):
thinking that you know a certain situation like whether it's macro or micro like as the
way the world is right now thinking it should be different it's like there's a degree that
can foster change and growth and like sort of being that change but if you get too deep into
sort of like a pattern of resistance it just adds suffering like it's just additional weight

(09:28):
and suffering and the same thing is applicable to your personal life thinking that you know someone
close to you acted a certain way they acted that certain way like it's just a
situation that happened thinking that they should act differently will only cause you
more additional suffering yourself that you are self-inflicting they are not inflicting

(09:52):
that suffering on you it stems from you so i think settling in the understanding that things
are the way they are and we can continue to grow here and now like in the situation but if you're
constantly you know complaining wishing things were different you know just like this woe is me

(10:16):
mentality like all of these things all it's going to do like it's not going to cause anyone else
necessarily to change like that's not how people change and grow from complaining and
just like wallowing in this sort of idea that things should be completely different
it's like understanding that things are how they are like it's just the situation at hand

(10:40):
especially in your personal life like things are as they are most suffering stems from thinking
that they should be different and like that's a lot of times what it comes down to
absolutely and again i'll i'll disclose a little bit from my personal life here so
i have a condition called pigment dispersion glaucoma and as a result i've lost 80 percent

(11:03):
of the vision in my right eye and that's just something i have to deal with it's just it's
something that's deteriorating over time now when i first found that out i i fell into
despair i got really like down about the whole thing i started projecting into my future and
and all of that and then it isn't so basically it took what i was already going through and made it

(11:24):
infinitely worse because now i was dictating what was going to happen what my experience was going
to be what the future was already laid out for me and so i didn't allow myself to just find out
what was going to happen by letting it happen right i was telling myself what was going to
happen and it of course as we discussed in the last episode it's almost like because i can't

(11:46):
tell the future externally i can't say this is what's going to happen in my world around me i
try to tell myself what my future is based on what i i consider to be my own capabilities right and
at that time i was terrified and so in a state of fear i'm projecting my fear into the future
that's the path i'm seeing it's all based on that experience of fear i'm having then in there

(12:08):
whereas in a different state of mind if i'm not thinking as as much about myself and my
preferences and my opinions and my assumptions then all of a sudden the future is a much
different road it's something that has many more uh uncertainties and a lot more potential and it's
just because again i'm not adding to the suffering exactly like you're saying and then it's like like

(12:29):
we said before nothing is good or bad but thinking makes it so and that is definitely the case
yeah and and yeah i mean i've had situations recently happen where it's like
objectively you could say like oh not objectively but like you know most people would agree like

(12:49):
that sucks to go through that but like being able to sort of take that step back and see that like
it doesn't i'm just labeling it as that and like whenever i post things like things aren't good
or bad or things like that people will always like lay out all these examples
that are good or bad and like you know we even had um someone on one of our free zoom calls talked

(13:17):
they mentioned having cancer and you know that's a lot of times what people go to as an example
of like objectively bad and they they use it as an example where they actually like
learned a lot of things they went through a lot and like grew a lot through the situation like
they didn't end up dying from it they see life in a different way so it's like those situations

(13:39):
you know it's and that's a touchy one because people you know cling to that and they don't
like to hear you say like it's not objectively bad but nothing is and if you want to hold on to
the idea that you are going through this suffering like you don't deserve this you deserve
better even you know a lot of people bring that up with relationships but just specifically for

(14:02):
this example it's like thinking that things should be differently it already you know it already kind
of sucks having a situation like that so like thinking that it should be different is like
adding all these additional layers of suffering that aren't necessary and are self-perpetuated
so understanding that you know it isn't as objective as you think and being able to just

(14:28):
sit in it and realize like there could be some good from this but you're going to see you know
more good quote-unquote goods stem from it from not you know wallowing in that for as long and
actually be able to learn from the situation way more quickly if you don't you know feel bad for

(14:50):
yourself for you know a week or a month or a year straight and i think ray mentioned in the last
episode you can either feel guilty or you can learn but you can't do both i think that's
applicable to you know any time you're going through a difficult situation whether you think
it was your fault or not like wallowing in it feeling bad for yourself throwing a pity party

(15:14):
feeling guilty if you feel like it was your fault doesn't actually derive any benefit whatsoever
and it may exacerbate the situation where you know that's when that sort of snowball effect
happens and it's like oh nothing's going well in my life blah blah blah people start freaking out
because they they don't see it from a point of view of like clarity and they just keep

(15:37):
feeling bad for their self like resisting what's happening rather than seeing it as an opportunity
to make some changes that could you know stop that snowball from rolling down the hill and actually
like pivot their life in another direction that is you know you know you might label a positive
but just like in a different direction and use it as an opportunity to learn as opposed to just

(16:02):
following and feeling bad for yourself absolutely yeah well and it's interesting because we get
caught up in that idea of thinking about ourselves and then we suffer and so we double down on that
we're like i'm going to think about the suffering that is the result of my thinking about myself
so now there's more suffering so then we think about that suffering and it becomes this intricate

(16:23):
web of thinking about thinking trying to find a resolution to a problem that doesn't really exist
because it's all fictional right and so as i've gotten older what i've found especially being
married of course because you get into an argument you go out for a walk all you're thinking is i'm

(16:44):
right i'm rage right and of course you're still in conflict because there's the i at the root of that
i'm right and and over time you start to realize that what happens when that all passes when it
goes away when you can actually talk to your wife again or talk to the person that that you're
you know in conflict with again is that you've stopped thinking about yourself it's not that

(17:05):
the thoughts have resolved themselves you've just stopped making them important you've changed your
priority you're like i don't need to think about that that's just making things harder and so
now more often than not when i do end up in in a place where things just start going haywire i will
remind myself right the sooner i can stop thinking about myself the sooner this will all just start

(17:28):
to play out on its own and a big part of that is again questioning it whether it's good or bad
right from the start right but that's a practice that that getting to that clarity is something
that takes time as you know from your own journey i mean you weren't always thinking this way it was
very easy to fall on one side and feel sorry for yourself it wasn't always easy to question that
and so this actually leads me to a question that somebody else had asked and we talked about it a

(17:53):
bit previously in just a private chat but it seems like on this journey we forget who we
are we forget what we are we get caught up in this idea of who we are and all of the thought
and emotion and suffering that goes with that and then we have an opportunity to find clarity do you
think that we have to go through that journey of forgetting who we are in every incarnation

(18:21):
and do you think that it's necessary do you think that there are incarnations where we
we just start out remembering who we are whatever that might mean i'm curious to hear your thoughts
um i think you know anything's possible you know but i think in like environment
always plays a role in situations and it's not something where you you know maybe want to sit

(18:47):
and blame it once you are you know clear on things but i think coming into this society
that we have right now i think it would be a very difficult thing to come in not having
you know that idea of yourself because especially you know you start out as a child and children are

(19:09):
extremely vulnerable and they're basically sponges so unless you have someone who is like the only
person you interact with who sees that clearly you know and has sort of woken up then it's going
to be very difficult because like odds are you're going to interact with you know hundreds of other

(19:31):
people going through childhood and i think that's a massive part of that sort of like
buildup of the ego and that sort of uh process of the ego that uh i forgot her name talks about uh
like the nine stages of vigo or whatever it is but um yeah i think yeah as i mentioned like anything

(19:52):
is possible i think it's difficult in the environment and society that
we live in but i think there can be you know people who are maybe closer to it given their
environment or just naturally have a tendency to question things like i know for example just like

(20:13):
i i hear a lot of stuff about alan watson that he's just like a fascinating dude for me and i've
heard you know people talk about him and he he talked about himself as a child
how he was just like he questioned everything it was just very a very inquisitive child that like
you know things that didn't make sense cognitively he just questioned very at a very very young age

(20:37):
and so like maybe you know when he was born he was sort of like closer to that in whatever way um
but yeah that's that's kind of what i'm at i'd be super curious to know who were his influences
as a kid because i've often thought and specifically when the person asked

(20:58):
do we always go through this in order to remember who we are the first thing that
really dawned on me was that we never really remember who we are because that's not what's
happening it's not that we're remembering ourselves as a concept it's not like ah
that's me it's more like we have a moment of clarity and and it's like it's we just recognized

(21:19):
who we've always been right it's not even an idea so we're not remembering anything so technically
we we all start there right and then depending on the people that we interact with as you said and
yeah if you were to deal with one enlightened person in a vacuum for your entire existence
perhaps that's all that would be influencing you but you're dealing with other people and and

(21:42):
a lot of those people are egotistical and they're hurting you because they're hurting
themselves and so you have to go through all of that and so yeah it's it's very interesting that
it's almost like we just lose ourselves in the concepts because the people around us tell us
you're the concept you're the idea look we're all being ideas you be an idea right and then

(22:07):
as we start to get older as you start to get to you know towards your age or even if you do it
younger and you start questioning that idea the world around us that's built off of that game
that's actually built as a coping mechanism for the suffering created by our devotion to
those ideas right that world just starts to revolt um it's kind of like that uh

(22:29):
that movie with uh leonardo dicaprio there where they went into a dream
inception that was it um as soon as the dream became aware that they knew they were dreaming
it started to come for them right it's like you don't fit here that's kind of what the system
does as soon as you start to wake up to the fact that you're not your idea of yourself the system

(22:50):
goes whoa we can't we can't direct you anymore why aren't you listening to the carrot and stick
you don't fit here and and it's it's not like you're waving a flag or any or anything but
you might as well be just because you're not enticed by the same conversation you're not
drawn by the same fears and needs and so all of a sudden it's like you stand out

(23:12):
like a sore thumb and it's just because you get to that point where you're questioning and it
was jane levinger that you were talking about the ego stages um so that kind of begs the question is
if we are evolving as a society like if if just as individually we go through the stages of ego
development and now more and more of us are coming to the stage where we question our ego

(23:33):
and the validity of that ego and we embrace the uncertainty that goes with that questioning
is that indicative that our culture or our species as a whole is in fact moving in that direction
right are there enough of us to actually say for certain that's the direction that things are going
in and this is where i kind of get caught like i said i was talking to my daughter today there are

(23:56):
such polar opposites that are happening right now in terms of the government is increasingly trying
to get control over everything because that's what the government does and on the other hand
you have more and more states and countries legalizing cannabis and psilocybin mushrooms
those are two polar opposite things that are happening at the same time and so it

(24:17):
really makes it difficult to understand exactly what's happening as a whole
yeah yeah and going back to like the idea of remembering who we are it's almost like
not remembering who we are because i think what we are is just what is left when there isn't anything

(24:37):
to identify as so it's like remembering what we're not like remembering that we're not all of these
things that you know we've been conditioned into believing that we are it's like it's not learning
like i would say in the last year it's not that i've learned that many things it's that i've
unlearned a bunch of [ __ ] and like we're so as a society caught up in the idea of like learning

(25:02):
more and learning more and learning more and even you know outside of the school landscape like
i feel like we're just obsessed with like learning gaining more knowledge and i think i i feel like
it's more important to unlearn a lot of things and just like question those beliefs like you know
you know learn so much more from like questioning and sort of unlearning and realizing that you know

(25:28):
all those things you've learned about yourself and the way the world is like might not be
as true as you once thought they were so it's less so just like that remembering who you are because
i would say that even you know defining who you are isn't possible like we are always who we

(25:48):
are we are always what we are here and now so like we're always changing and always ourselves and i
was actually talking to a friend who i know her through just like social media stuff we've never
met in person but she was talking about he's going through some tougher stuff and i shared
just like because i think being open is important i was like oh yeah i'm going through like

(26:11):
all xyz right now too and like it's it's tough but like i don't know this is helpful but just
want you to let you know that you're not alone in this and and she was saying how like
you know she's 23 right now and just feels like she doesn't even know
herself and like know who she is and like feels like she isn't necessarily uh doesn't know to be

(26:36):
a functional adult and i was like well you know i think first of all that's being a functional
normal adult is extremely overrated like no one we just have these ideas of what we are and
and when it comes to knowing yourself i would argue that i think a lot of people get caught
up and this goes back to that idea of suffering of thinking things should be different than they

(27:00):
are getting caught up it's kind of similar in thinking that they should know who they are
or get caught up in like trying to know themselves and it's like this unachievable unattainable goal
of like knowing yourself that people say is the most important thing you can ever do it's the
most important thing you never know understand and i would argue that you can't so it's like you're

(27:25):
striving for something that's unachievable and as close as you think you can get is like you'll
never fully get there and at the same time we talk about this all the time especially more recently
that identity that you are trying to know and build up and like be so certain about
is the root of your suffering like knowing yourself having an idea a solid idea of yourself

(27:49):
is that root of your suffering so people say that like knowing yourself the most important thing you
can never do i would say i would argue it's like something you should stop striving to do and just
kind of relax into that uncertainty of i can't know who i am i can never know who i am because
i am me like the subject cannot be the object that which is known sort of deal like that my finger

(28:15):
can't touch itself tongue can't taste itself teeth can't bite itself you can't know yourself
so striving to is just striving for something that's unattainable and will only cause you
more suffering just like thinking things should be different than they are yeah
and it's funny because that is basically the only form of meditation that i do now

(28:38):
just reminding myself that there's no self to know there's no self to know and so i sit in this state
of ever deepening sensitivity to what i am that's what meditation is it's just allowing myself
to experience me right but without judgment without opinion without any kind of you know

(29:04):
i guess interference with that it's more or less just sitting back and allowing myself to feel
my existence for what it is and the deeper you go the more profound that seems to get but it's never
searching for yourself because every time you're searching for yourself you're always going to find
something that makes you feel just awesome and puts other people lower than you because every

(29:27):
concept is dualistic right as soon as you grasp for a concept there's a polar opposite to it
right and so you're always always creating more division you're always creating more conflict
you're always exacerbating the problem by grabbing onto an idea now that doesn't necessarily mean
that you can't use ideas i use them all the time i mean one of the things that used to help me when i

(29:49):
got out of my my funk and i stopped beating myself up and telling myself i was just a
terrible terrible person all the time was that i didn't get into the habit of boosting myself
up because that just felt weird too but i would do it almost in humor right like it would just be
you know well why do you want to go out and hang out or why should i go and hang out with you

(30:10):
tonight ray instead of going to this thing it's like because i'm awesome and i'm not taking that
seriously it's just funny right because it's so absurd especially given all the terrible things i
used to tell myself in the past right it's just humor you just treat it lightly because it's
it's fun that's what concepts are meant to to be they're meant to be useful right but as soon

(30:30):
as we start treating them as truth as soon as we start wrapping them around ourselves then again
we end up in a world of fiction right and in that world of fiction everything is split down
the middle it's always dualistic it's always black and white light and dark good and evil always and
so the only way out of that is to recognize the root and the root is the fiction of me

(30:54):
yeah that that whole idea of like being able to be humorous and just like not taking things seriously
i think that resonates a lot with me right now because i know we talked
uh i think it was friday and i kind of expressed to you how i've always been and i've talked about
this in discord as well just like very rigid and like kind of on that spiky sort of path

(31:19):
of like having very strict schedules goals like uh things that i want to achieve and accomplish
in my life and as opposed to like being a more on the wiggle side of things and the last few months
i've been much more on the wiggle side of things and you know very much not having structure and

(31:41):
so i've sort of come out of it i think and i've kind of seen both sides and realized like there
are necessities to both sides there are benefits to both sides and so when i first kind of like
woke up especially like when we started doing the podcast i was like i can relax into this

(32:01):
uncertainty i'm not certain about anything so like why sort of limit myself to a schedule
where that kind of like puts me on this sort of rigid path where like there are things that i
might miss along the way if i'm like scheduling things kind of like i i kind of equated it to
you know the idea of manifesting and when you're so focused on that like

(32:24):
destination you kind of miss the things all around you so i've just been sort of relaxing
into just the moment experiencing things and not really need it feeling this urge to like drive
towards something and i think now i've been able to see that and i've experienced it for a couple

(32:44):
months now where you know like i wasn't waking up early i was just kind of like going to bed when i
was tired which a lot of times ended up with me [ __ ] like i don't bring my phone to my bed so
i would be in my living room in my apartment like on my phone it's just like transferred into that
and so like because i wasn't strict and i was like oh yeah because i can just sleep until

(33:04):
eight o'clock i can go to bed at 12 and still get eight hours blah blah but uh what i've realized
is there's benefits to both and like getting and this is very recent like kind of getting back to
the scheduling side of things like the spiky side of things it's like
i have seen that there are lots of opportunities that i have in my life and they're much more

(33:29):
difficult it is more difficult to do a lot of the things you want to do throughout the day
without a schedule like if you have no schedule there will be a lot and i'm finding that yeah
like i'll post a few videos a day like i have some stuff scheduled throughout my week you know
our live things our patreon stuff our roundtables our podcasts and everything and obviously i work

(33:51):
every day like i work from you know nine to five basically but outside of that because i had such
little structure i wasn't necessarily holding myself even though i had an idea of like
stuff i wanted to get done and work on and whatever like i never would and the end of
the day would come and i'd be like [ __ ] like uh whatever it's it's fine but like i wouldn't beat

(34:13):
myself up at the same time which is like sort of part of my process of getting over is like
not judging myself for not accomplishing certain things and not feeling worse about
myself for not accomplishing things so now i've kind of like gone back and forth
realized there is a balance and i've always been for example more productive in the morning like

(34:35):
typically with work i would always show up when i was going into the office i would always you
know be the first one in the office and like get a lot of the stuff done that i wanted to get done
like for my personal work stuff and then so when people started coming in and bothering me i could
feel okay because i already got a lot of my stuff done so i've kind of realized that that it's okay

(34:56):
to have some structure and get stuff done without necessarily like still not exactly having like
set goals that i'm working towards but like i can still have a schedule throughout the day and like
do a bunch of [ __ ] throughout the day without feeling like i need to accomplish all these things

(35:17):
but there was a point you know last few months where i was feeling like i almost shouldn't have a
schedule because i'm like not being fully free and i'm restricting myself and it's like this strange
thing where i was thinking i was getting caught up in these ideas and ideas of like labeling things
is right or wrong and it's like none of them are right or wrong it's all about finding that balance

(35:39):
for you so now i think i'll probably be like you know churning out a lot more stuff which i
enjoy doing every moment of it but having that sort of schedule allows for a little bit more
of that freedom in the in like a different way but it's coming at it you know i've
kind of gone 360 degrees coming at it from a different perspective and mentality where

(36:06):
just like finishing this up early on in my career with work like three years ago i was just like
waking up early and doing all this stuff because yeah there were things i wanted to accomplish but
it was almost out of a fear of like or feeling of like needing to do it whereas now it's like
there's so many things i want to do that without a schedule i just wouldn't be able to do all of it

(36:28):
and now i'm coming at it with a mentality of like i get to do all this stuff and it's really cool
that i have all these opportunities in front of me now applying a schedule and now coming back to
like probably waking up at the same time i used to wake up at like 4 45 5 a.m so i had plenty of time
before work started to get all the stuff done that i wanted to now i'll probably go back to waking

(36:49):
up super early because i have all these things that i want to do and if i you know sleep till
eight or nine i'm just not going to have the time to do all of it so anyway that's what i'm going
through right now yeah it's balance i mean i've dealt with a number of clients who who tend to
fall in the on the one extreme end where they just don't feel like they can get enough done in a day

(37:12):
and so it's important to remember that you're never actually going to get everything done
ever until you die there's always going to be more to do the task list never ends and so you
kind of have to be reasonable about how much you're going to get done
from day to day um but it's it's true balance is is definitely something that you want to consider

(37:36):
and being able to have a schedule that you're using as more of a template than a discipline
is super useful like there are days where i'll have a task list and i just won't feel
like doing it so i don't and then the next day maybe i don't feel like doing it again
and i go yeah but i want to get that done so force myself and then the next day i'm just raring to go

(38:01):
and i finished three days worth of work that's just how it goes so the the the schedule itself
isn't setting the pace it's more or less just giving me a way to conveniently keep track
of how much i'm getting done and that's dependent on what i want to do
right it has to be dependent on what i want to do not what i should do we're not what other people

(38:23):
tell me to do not not what society dictates is what's best for me because none of that works
right that doesn't help you find balance that just helps you you know go towards another concept
that's going to help you cope for a little while before it starts creating conflict again right but
yeah it's just about being it's about being fluid in how often you're rigid right so it's

(38:46):
always that balance and sometimes you know it's it's just like in martial arts right
sometimes you want to be relaxed sometimes you don't it really depends on the situation
and so you're just feeling it out as you go yeah i'm definitely finding that sort of
balance and and it's been helpful to just not you know judge myself along the way and kind of like

(39:09):
taking things with grace as i go kind of like being able to have a sort of higher level view
of things and realize that you know day to day i might feel one way like today i just like
wasn't there's a number of things going on in my life and just like wasn't feeling
great overall and not like judging myself for not feeling great or necessarily even thinking

(39:35):
that i should feel great just being like i'm feeling this way a lot of it is because i am
you know identifying with things going on it's myself is getting involved like the idea of me
is getting involved in all these things like being able to see that and like i'm aware of it but it's
like i still don't feel great but like that's okay at least i'm aware of like what's actually

(39:59):
happening and not like what the [ __ ] is going on like i i wish i didn't feel this way like why do i
feel this way and like you know blaming anything outside of myself for that it's like coming back
to that sort of responsibility which isn't always super easy because it's a lot easier to
you know blame outside uh factors going on in your life and there's you know all sorts of reasons why

(40:25):
whatever and and at the end of the day like that doesn't benefit you at all and that's just going
to exacerbate that those issues that you're going through and and so at least if you're not feeling
great understanding that it's stemming from the idea of yourself that you're clinging to it might
not immediately like solve everything but at least it kind of like triggers that sort of like process

(40:52):
to begin as opposed to like you know maybe you start trekking up the mountain a little
bit instead of just like continuing to tumble down it almost is what i kind of think about
but yeah just being able to see it clearly and understand like sort of take that responsibility
and at the same time like not take it too seriously and understand that it's not gonna

(41:14):
last forever like it rarely lasts more than a day if it lasts too okay but a lot of times it's just
clinging to thoughts and like suffering is exacerbated by thoughts if not just like
straight up caused by thoughts and as soon as you stop thinking and thinking about how

(41:34):
horrible everything is you kind of look around and you're like oh things aren't so horrible
things are actually not nearly as bad my mind is just telling me that it was and once you're able
to get that idea of you and your mind out of the picture like things just are as they are there
are no labels and judgments left to make you feel bad you know so yeah that that helps me at least

(42:02):
absolutely well it clears the distortion right it's kind of it's funny it's kind of like you know
the the secret door on on the level it's oh right this has a root the fiction of me and and that's
that's the process and as you're finding is that as soon as you can identify that
yeah it doesn't make the problem go away but it's almost like the process of going through that

(42:24):
problem just becomes shorter like all of a sudden it's just like right this has a common route so i
just have to remember that and let that let it happen on its own because as soon as we start
to judge ourselves for getting stuck in that it's like oh i'm identifying again i should know better
we've just done it again we're stuck right and so the trick is just like i'm identifying again

(42:46):
and then not identifying with identification but reminding ourselves that it's actually habitual
that that is actually kind of the death throw of that habit popping up trying to re-establish
itself and if you're not paying attention to it if you're not giving it that energy so it can survive
you're actually cycling through it one more time to diminish it each and every time right so now

(43:10):
it's not a day or two before you feel better right it's an hour or five minutes or just a few seconds
and and it's really just keeps it comes down to just practice practice practice practice right
and all you're practicing is just getting out of your own way so it becomes again it becomes
self-refining and i i wonder about this because we talk about the individual in the collective

(43:34):
and what we're talking about is basically that identity over committed to his truth is the root
of our suffering at the end of the day and we're figuring that out collectively now we're looking
at cryptocurrency now we're looking at the rise of the dao and decentralized organizations and
all of that what i find very interesting is that those are all dependent on anonymity

(44:00):
those those structures are literally built on or the people who are using those structures
are learning to do so without identifying they're doing it with anonymous strings as their as their
addresses right and so that i wonder if that is almost another stage to our collective awakening
to the danger of identity yeah it's pretty fascinating how closely tied that sort of

(44:25):
movement is to this it's like very cool and it makes sense you know why the government
hates it so much and are doing everything they can throwing everything they can at it to
stop it because they are rooted in that sort of identification that sort of idea of control
that you know as long as everyone has an identity you know we can control things and as long as we

(44:50):
push this idea of valuing that identity we can you know remain
in control so something like you know cryptocurrency you hear just about how difficult
it is to you know mine and all the energy it takes up and all these things that they're just like

(45:10):
pushing this narrative just like they've pushed narratives in the past of things that they wanted
to be different you know when it comes to psychedelics for example like they needed
you know people to go to war they needed for at least in america like people to fight in vietnam
and to identify as you know defending america and it just didn't make sense to people who were

(45:35):
taking psychedelics you know a lot of the people a lot of the hippies and stuff just like weren't
identifying as this sort of script that they wanted to be identified with and so they put out
all this propaganda about how you know horrible it is and like you never know you can have
a horrible trip and you know die and go crazy and all this stuff that's still part of the stigma

(46:01):
today when it's just it's just rooted in that sort of identity because people weren't
identifying in a way that they wanted and that is what exacerbates this and it's funny because
that's what you know leads to things like war in the first place is that identity as
being different from another when we're all just like here on earth without and and have all these

(46:29):
imaginary borders that cause conflict and any sort of belief is sort of exacerbating and
you know reflecting that sort of root of identity and that's where it's all it all kind of stems
from that's our history in a nutshell right you and i are different i'm going to divide

(46:50):
and divide us with a line this line is real that's your side this is my side right and then you know
our children grow up and they maintain that same stupid game and then they have children of their
own a thousand years later my country is fighting your country and we're literally standing on the
same patch of ground saying that this side is is this country and this side is the other country

(47:14):
it's the funniest thing like um i used to live in ontario and i used to always find it really funny
to go down to the american border where you're literally standing on it you're like one foot's in
canada one foot's in the states because it doesn't actually make any sense it's not a real thing
right it's just arbitrarily decided this is where the dividing line is it's like okay like it

(47:34):
doesn't it's the same ground like we're standing on the same like nothing has changed from one side
to the other except how people identify and and and the rules based on that identification so
you identify as american you're going to follow american rules i identify as canadian i'm going
to follow canadian rules that's it that's that's the whole difference between crossing from one

(47:56):
side of that line to the other reality doesn't change at all it's just our fictional game
yeah i think a lot of people forget that those lines are all imaginary and like all of those sort
of like concepts even of like you know the idea of europe and asia being two separate continents

(48:17):
it's like it's all eurasia like there's no that line there's not actually a line like drawn in
the sand there it's just completely made up and i think that is kind of that is a massive thing that
that people don't exactly understand like if you talk about it they're gonna be like yeah obviously
it's imaginary but like in practice and in reality like they people forget and it's the same thing

(48:45):
with identity of like you know this human character it's like whether you take it
seriously or not it's like yeah there is a divide in a certain way that like you know one country
is on one side one is in the other but it's not the truth it's like the difference between taking
things seriously it's like existing in this you know dualistic illusion and taking it seriously

(49:10):
or not taking it seriously it's the same thing with you know
country borders it's the same thing with like people of different races different ethnicities
it's like even with skin color like there is an infinite number of skin colors there's not like
a line where it just changes it's like there is everything in between like i get in the

(49:33):
summer i get pretty tan and like i am a completely different shade in the summer versus in the winter
but like it's crazy that if it just kept going you know like i got really dark then it would like my
whole the whole idea of me would shift like if my skin became very dark it would like it would shift

(49:58):
so many things but it's like it's not actually changing any there isn't actually any distinctive
difference and it's crazy how many people take that as truth and because there's so many ideas
that come along with you know and so many stigmas that come along with you know all these things and

(50:20):
i've talked about like at some point maybe dyeing my hair like green or blue and just posting a
picture and just being like social experiment what is the first thing that you think of
when you see this picture and it's like question that cause it's not the truth it's your perception
of how you see someone with different colored hair like someone gets a piercing it's like all of a
sudden everyone has all these ideas about them and who they are that are different than what

(50:46):
they were and it's like those are all made up like if you actually take those seriously versus just
seeing them and just like not realizing that it doesn't actually change anything is like kind of
a different like a very distinctive difference of being you know existing in this society with

(51:08):
taking things like very seriously taking yourself very seriously versus like existing using andrew
or using the idea of rey as a tool and not take but not taking it as truth you know so
but that's a change of priority right now we have to stop trying to find the right way or
find the right person to be or find the right country to be or the right government to be

(51:33):
and we have to just be right and let everybody else be and figure that [ __ ] out for themselves
right and that we just don't know how to do that because we don't have any faith in one another
because we don't have faith in ourselves how can we we're a very limited idea that's constantly
afraid because of that idea so we we just assume everybody else is just as confused as we are

(51:57):
because we're confused and the world just limps along like that getting into battles for no good
bloody reason except for the fact that none of us are able to see one another as being
one and the same or at least connected and so yeah i find that that fascinating and
i think that the more we recognize this the more we are re-prioritizing right like what

(52:20):
i i really um so in the round table after we finished the round table we were talking
about the concept of a dao a decentralized organization with the specific purpose of doing
good not good but but doing something unifying in the world something that doesn't involve
a group that believes in one thing or identifies in one certain way but actually

(52:44):
looks at the intention behind certain projects and then just shares resources in accordance to to
those intentions and an agreement that's something we want to put our energy behind now if you had
a world full of people like that if you had a world full of groups that were just doing that
sharing their resources with other groups and just governing themselves you would essentially

(53:04):
have a global tribal society all of which would be slightly different than their neighbors according
to their own preferences and their own way of life and their environment and their culture and
everything else but still able to work with one another you wouldn't have these these hard lines
but then again without those hard lines those borders you also wouldn't need a standing army

(53:26):
right so things would start to change and so
what we're seeing now is not just us moving farther and farther away from identity
as truth but farther and farther away from greed and selfishness as truth because those go with
identity they are also the result of our confusion and i i get i love the fact that all of a sudden
now we have things like gaos that are coming into existence and i'm bringing up a dao specifically

(53:51):
here for our listeners who are wondering because uh dualistic unity is actually expanding
somewhat in our somewhat in our ambitions we're actually going to be exploring the idea
of very much forming a dao behind the intention of encouraging unifying projects and unifying groups
around the world in a way that doesn't depend on fiat currency doesn't depend on the system's

(54:14):
forms and registrations for charities and things like that it is actually just direct help from one
organization to another and you're all going to have a chance to be involved with that as it rolls
out throughout season two of course people who are on patreon are going to get the first word of how
things are going because they get access to early news but of course we'll share this with people

(54:35):
on discord as well and we're going to be talking about an upcoming season so definitely join us on
discord if you want to know more about the dao and the future of dualistic unity nfts because
not only are we talking about change personally in ourselves but we actually want to use that change
in order to encourage change in the world around us and i know for me it just makes sense because

(54:58):
i don't know anything about dallas and so i've spent the last week
learning about dows ignoring every thought i've had that i can't learn about dows because it's
it's not within my wheelhouse and that's kind of what i mean right just keep questioning yourself
keep questioning those limitations if you don't know go learn if you can't if you have if you
don't understand break it down to something simple until you do understand and then build from there

(55:20):
right so that's what this is as we grow individually we're growing collectively
and this this new project is just a part of that as is our new movie beyond transcendence
yeah very excited for both of those and yeah that idea of questioning the thoughts that come
up i think a lot of people never get to the point where they question those and realize that those

(55:45):
thoughts aren't the truth you know they never are and your mind is is always coming up with ideas
and perceptions about the way things are and the way you are that are not the truth and that was
one of the things like just simply questioning a couple of the things that i felt so sure about
myself i think i've talked about this in previous episodes but like that's what triggered me to

(56:09):
start posting content was just questioning a few ideas that i had about myself for like most of my
life at least through high school and like most of college like these ideas about myself that
you know i wasn't a good speaker i wasn't a good communicator i couldn't you know express ideas in

(56:30):
a way that could be understood well like those are the it's funny how just like opposite that
is what i do now like talking about all this stuff is like expressing ideas in different ways
and communicating things and speaking and just like talking all the time like i had all these
preconceived notions about myself that i just wasn't good at any of these things and wasn't

(56:55):
you know able to confidently express myself in different ways and as soon as i it was just like i
you know saw a recording of myself going through something and i had these perceptions and i
was able to see it from a different perspective and i was like oh [ __ ] like that maybe that's
not true and then i kind of went deeper into that and i was like oh oh wow oh my god oh holy

(57:20):
[ __ ] like i've been wrong this whole time like oh my god like that's crazy and then it
just like kind of snowballed from there but just taking the time like i think a lot of people have
at least one two maybe a handful of sort of limiting beliefs and i've read some books that are
kind of identifying these things and labeling them as certain things but it's just like perceptions

(57:45):
of yourself that you think are the truth and realizing that they aren't like whatever you think
they are like they're not the truth it's not like maybe they're the truth it's like no they're not
their perceptions their ideas their thoughts those are never the truth so realizing that you can like
question them and then like live through the understanding that they're not the truth can just

(58:10):
be just freeing enough that you start to you know act in a way that isn't through those perceptions
and then things start to change and then it kind of snowballs because then you're acting
in a different way and then you're like confirming different things like different
thoughts and all of a sudden it's not those you know limiting thoughts like oh
actually maybe and it's not that you need to have specific thoughts but it's like maybe you know

(58:36):
i'm not any of those things and i'm just here now existing and who knows what could happen
and kind of like settling into that uncertainty and relaxing into that uncertainty and just doing
you know whatever you want to do giving yourself a direction and and moving and seeing what happens
absolutely and actually i'm going to share a story of our own um from dualistic unity just

(58:59):
just to kind of show how that's the case so when you and i first talked in august and when we did
our first talk for my own youtube channel and then we decided we're going to do a podcast well
in that interim i was kind of wrestling back and forth because i know that the topics that we cover
are uh not always welcome by the majority or by the dominant mentality and so

(59:23):
i started thinking well how long could this podcast go on maybe we're gonna run out of
things to talk about maybe nobody's gonna have any interest you know we don't know
oh well screw it let's do it anyway and so we did and we've been doing this ever since
and with very little thought as to is the audience going to come along at first we
had a very small audience for the first two months and then things have just been picking up

(59:45):
really really fast just recently so much so that the dualistic unity podcast was actually listed on
feedspot's top 70 spiritual podcasts we got number 14 despite only being existence for four months
so it just goes to show that it's worth it to just find out it's worth it to just do it because you

(01:00:07):
want to do it and see where it goes you don't have to have that end result that you're shooting for
if each step of the journey is its own reward then it doesn't matter how it ends it ends up
in the end you've already benefited you've already grown and it just happens to be that when you are
doing that the end result usually ends up being just awesome maybe not at first but sometimes you

(01:00:30):
know a few a few failures down the road but you don't care about the failures because you don't
identify with them so it just becomes a longer and more epic journey just like dualistic unity
yeah certainly it's like just the act in itself of figuring it out like figuring out if you're
right or wrong is the success in itself it's like the initial action like that's

(01:00:55):
personally with content like it was just i realized that it was something that i wanted to do
and that's basically what it came down to i knew that you know if i didn't do it there
would be a point where i might regret it because the only reason i didn't want to do it is because
i was afraid of how people would judge me and like once i got over that it was like
just starting just putting myself out there just my first few videos like i succeeded

(01:01:21):
right there that was it and then i just kept rolling because i realized i enjoyed it
and you know people started to resonate with some of the stuff i was talking about and then you know
a year and a half later here we are but it's i think worth finding out and a lot of people never
find out and they're for whatever reason and even you know i've someone close to me who's like had

(01:01:44):
a tick tock draft in their drafts for they posted a couple tick tocks but like they've had
a draft and it's a really cool video it's like a compilation video and i'm like holy [ __ ] that's
awesome and they haven't posted it and it's been like three months and like why don't you post it
like i i almost can't even like i do i can put myself in their shoes and like remember that but

(01:02:07):
part of me almost can't because my mentality is like i would post that video and if it doesn't
do well i would like change a few things and just post it again i would post like 100 versions of it
because like i think it's that cool that one of them is gonna hit and that's what i would do is
just like put a bunch of [ __ ] out there like i make videos where i'm like uh i could have
said something a little bit better here but like we'll see how it does and i can just make another

(01:02:32):
video and say it a little bit differently in another way like down the road it's not even like
this has to be perfect or else all these people are gonna think xyz about me and like judge me in
a certain way it's like i'm gonna see what happens odds are it might resonate with a few people
if it does cool and i can always just tomorrow make another video and like say it in a little

(01:02:56):
bit of a different way or like you know whatever it is just switch it up but when you're not
living in that sort of like fear of judgment it's like you're in a state of freedom where you can
do anything like there isn't anything stopping you and especially when you get beyond the idea
of yourself and like the fiction of you that you think that you are and the sort of illusion that

(01:03:20):
you think that you are if you get beyond that it's like there isn't even what what is there
even to be afraid of or worry about like what that someone judges this idea of you that you know that
you aren't that that's all that they can see like whose fault is that it's not yours so like why
not do whatever you want with this experience that you have in front of you here and now yeah not my

(01:03:45):
circus not my monkeys right like that that's very much it and that's but it takes practice at first
i i know like i it's it's difficult because after a while it becomes reflexive like you start
thinking in a way where you're always defending your idea of yourself you're always relying on
your idea of yourself you're always and and of course you feel confused and so you double down

(01:04:06):
on that because everybody's telling you that's the exact thing you're supposed to do like what
oh you don't know what you should be doing you need a better identity you need a better sense
of identity you need higher self-esteem right and all of that just makes the confusion worse right
because it's it's putting you in a box that you're not and now you're trying to be that box and it's

(01:04:27):
bumping up against everything in reality which is fluid and you're no longer able to feel the flow
right and so when you start getting through that i often described it as
trying to crawl uphill through mud where it feels like you know you're working so hard to stop
thinking about yourself and you just keep getting sucked back into it and at that point it's so

(01:04:48):
important to remind yourself and i and i say this repeatedly i'm a bit of a broken record this way
just because you don't feel like you're making progress that doesn't mean you're not
right every step forward is a step forward even if it feels like a step backwards
as long as you just keep reminding yourself i'm still moving forward
right as soon as as soon as you think uh i'm not doing very well you're stuck again

(01:05:13):
that's all it is up until that point up until you start judging your progress you're still making
progress right and even if you judge your progress and you go i'm judging my progress
that's progress too right it just comes down to just recognizing it and then not telling
yourself a story about how you're doing just accepting that you don't know and you don't know

(01:05:36):
find out right and then when you find out don't assume you knew that you know what the result
was because i can't tell you how many times in my life something's gone badly for me and i went ah
great and then two years later i realized that experience opened a door for me in that moment
that it wouldn't have been there otherwise because i i wouldn't have learned from it

(01:05:57):
so it's so it's so important to just don't assume live in uncertainty try
don't identify with your failures and have faith in yourself you're always growing
yeah there's a level of freedom that comes with that uncertainty too when you're not constantly
judging everything that happens and it's funny you bring up that situation of something happening and

(01:06:21):
like you know getting caught up and judging it you know something happened to me recently
i've talked to you about it but yeah just like with yeah a situation where you know it seems
right now like it's just objectively bad but i just know that it isn't it's it's nothing it is
a situation that happened and here i am continuing to exist in that and and when you're not

(01:06:46):
feeling this urge to cling to an identity and judge everything through that identity
because that's all that judgment is is like stemming from relative to that identity however
you want to say it like oh you know i've had people post me say like how do you know that
identity is the root of suffering and it's like tell me one thing you're afraid of or one thing

(01:07:07):
you worry about that doesn't stem through or like pass through this idea of you that you think you
are it's like that's where that conversation ends typically so when you're able to exist
just like kind of in that flow of in the flow of not having that identity of yourself come with

(01:07:28):
you in every situation and just sort of be that doing like right now i am speaking i am the act of
speaking right now there is no separation between me and speaking that sort of idea is there's no
judgment what am i gonna judge the act of speaking like they're it's not my act of speaking it's just

(01:07:48):
the act of speaking what is there to judge in that it's a an event that's happening like there isn't
any but if it comes in that i am andrew and andrew is speaking all of a sudden there's all
of these things to throw judgment on so if you're able to live in that sort of uncertainty without
the need to judge everything and i know because i've existed where i judge every single thing

(01:08:12):
that happens and it's exhausting it's extremely exhausting and it's so much more freeing to be
able to exist in a state where you're not judging everything and as ray talks about and we talk
about all the time like not judging your progress and not judging yourself if you do get caught up
in judging certain things not being like oh [ __ ] like [ __ ] me i'm judging stuff again it's like

(01:08:38):
that's doing that's judging your judgments and that's the same sort of cycle that you were in
in the first place when you judge that thing so if you can just catch it and be like oh i'm judging
stuff again that's not actually how things are and just keep moving forward in that uncertainty
without the need to bring your identity along with you into every single thing

(01:09:00):
that happens there's less to judge and it's just a practice and eventually it becomes
easier and easier to the point that you're always catching it and just able to see things a little
bit more clearly because you know living through these perceptions and judgments is a clouded way
of living it's very difficult to see things clearly when you judge everything through this

(01:09:23):
very limited perception that you have and it's only a perception that's like right now you can't
see the full picture going on you can't see what this leads to and what that next event leads to
and what that next event leads to you can't see any of those things so your judgment right now
is pointless because you just have no idea what this path will lead down so once you

(01:09:49):
get more comfortable in that sort of existence you realize just how silly and kind of futile
judging every single thing that happens really is yeah and it always comes back to reinforcing
my prison it's reinforcing my suffering which is always you know kind of you know i've always
found that to be funny when i'm doing it i understand it's not funny for other people

(01:10:12):
when they're doing it but i when i'm going through my own doubts and fears and stuff and i go
oh i'm thinking about myself again i genuinely find that funny now because
once upon a time that was a mystery to me i didn't know why i was suffering and now it's just like oh
that's why i'm doing that i'm invested in that again but when you're committed to that mentality

(01:10:34):
it's difficult to do anything but judge another mentality like when you are committed to your idea
of yourself if somebody were to come up to you and not take themselves seriously you would consider
that person be lazy right you would judge that person as not you know being committed to their
their goals and not being a go-getter and all this and then you would judge it according to the way

(01:10:54):
you look at yourself right and so this is kind of like the way this the system is reacting to
cryptocurrency right because the system is so completely committed to fiat currency the banking
system that everything that goes with that system of control and minting money and doing all of that
that cryptocurrency comes along the system can't can't adjust to that because it can't

(01:11:15):
adopt that and keep its control and so all it can do is judge that it can just go no cryptocurrency
is going to crash and burn it's going to fall it's going to fail it's going to how many times
have we heard bitcoin is going to fail you know cryptocurrency is over right and it never is right
but it's always the same people saying that it's the end of cryptocurrency until those people a few

(01:11:36):
years down the road end up adopting cryptocurrency and suddenly now they're able to see things
differently why and it's just because they they questioned what they considered to be the truth
and they found a deeper perspective and that changed what was possible for them and so it's
always just about questioning it right that's that's it as soon as you get stuck in a mentality

(01:11:58):
all you can see is your own mentality that's all you're looking at it doesn't matter anything else
like and i know this like in my old videos from 2005 i wasn't really saying anything
differently than i'm saying now somebody left a comment on that video like oh yeah well you know
what do you do for work now i'm the sales director for an agricultural technology company

(01:12:22):
oh oh i didn't know it's like no you just assumed that because i viewed things in a certain way
that i was a certain type of person who didn't like hard work who didn't want
to participate who didn't you know take on responsibilities so on and so forth because
those were all things that they reserved for their way of looking at the world

(01:12:43):
right and that's the point is that we're blind to one another so long as we're committed to our own
fiction and if we're doing anything here and we've said this before and we're going to continue to
say it it's just questioning the validity of that fiction that's all we're ever doing over and over
and over again in this conversation in our own lives collectively on our discord on our patreon

(01:13:06):
and in in as many ways as we can moving forward we are just going to be drumming on this one beat
identity is fiction and that fiction creates a hell of its own
when you don't question it that's the entirety of this movement if there is a movement there
and it's not that we're trying to instigate it it's a rising on its own it's been

(01:13:28):
bubbling up for years we saw it in the hippie movement we've seen it several times since
something's got to give because the system as it stands right now just like a person who is over
committed to their ego inevitably faces crisis as a result that's what we're seeing in the system
and so that crisis is forcing us to change and i'm happy to say i'm embracing that change

(01:13:52):
yes likewise it's interesting seeing just how closely tied like stubborn people are to
that that idea of stubbornness and their beliefs is so closely tied to their suffering as well and
it's like it's it i've always found that to be and like there have been certain things in my

(01:14:13):
life that i've been you know stubborn about in a certain way and i've when i've you know stopped
identify even before i sort of like you know woke up in a sense like when i stopped identifying
with that you know belief as the truth and it being the only way like a lot of my suffering was
all of a sudden relieved and i was like a little bit lighter and things were a little bit easier

(01:14:38):
and like didn't seem like everyone was against me all of a sudden and it's like it comes back
to you and and what you are holding on to because when people are stubborn about things typically
it's because they identify with a certain way of thinking or a certain belief or you know anything
in that realm is where stubbornness comes from so they have to defend it because they are defending

(01:15:04):
their identity when it gets you know when they cling to it hard enough so it's like that's why
people get worked up about those things and and even that uh you mentioned uh the guy the singer
who got called usher last week and like flipped a [ __ ] because we were we were talking about
you know what if what if your identity is in a positive way like can it be clung to in a positive

(01:15:28):
way if someone's just really positive person like and they don't find negative things about
their identity so the singer was jason derulo i looked it up he's a pretty famous american
singer he actually has a big tick tock account too um he's like pretty famous on tick tock um
but yeah and the video is wild someone calls him usher like from a distance at it looks like some

(01:15:51):
sort of like casino or like very nice hotel and he just comes in from like 20 yards away like
fists flying and like dives into the dude and is just throwing punches because the guy maybe
he was messing with him and like trying to get him triggered maybe he wasn't who knows
regardless it's outrageous that someone would like so closely that's like you know identity is

(01:16:15):
you know the idea of you and being called something else can just set someone off that much
but it's kind of like it's all related in that way any sort of like thing that you cling to any
sort of stubbornness not everyone's going to freak out and start throwing punches in broad daylight
in a public setting but it still boils up some degree of defensive mechanisms because they're

(01:16:41):
questioning that which you identify with and that which you cling to as a sense of security but
it's like if someone can just question it and all of a sudden it's not a sense of security like
how secure is it really what are you gonna like try and change everyone else it's like that sort
of idea of getting offended and how you know if i get offended by this then everyone else should

(01:17:03):
change and everyone should be more considerate blah blah blah it's like you know how difficult
your [ __ ] life is gonna be if you try and change everyone else versus just work on yourself
and not getting offended by super you know basic stuff that most of the time people aren't really
trying to be offensive in any way it's almost like just an accident so if you live away where

(01:17:27):
people have to be so careful around you that if they slip you like flip a [ __ ] that's got to
be such an exhausting existence like i can't even fathom living like that right now i can
it's funny because uh before i i met my wife i was single for a number of years
as you and i have discussed and the reason was because the relationships i had prior to that

(01:17:52):
always ended up in that kind of situation where i felt like i was walking on eggshells
and and i was walking on eggshells because i was so invested in that person validating me
right and that was it and so i was afraid to rock the boat
because i was afraid to lose oddly enough the fiction that was causing my fear

(01:18:14):
and so that's what it came and became about and so when i met my wife i told her i'm never gonna walk
on eggshells i'm never gonna worry about what i'm saying to you if i say something offensive
voice it talk to me about it let's get that [ __ ] out in the open right so that we can
because my intention is important to me right so i'm always watching my intention that doesn't

(01:18:37):
necessarily mean that i can compensate for all the variables i don't know everybody's triggers
right just talk to me about it that's as simple as it gets but i'm not going to walk on eggshells and
and it's very important to remember that the reason we walk on eggshells is our own need
because we don't need to walk on eggshells all we have to do is be willing to scrap that situation

(01:18:58):
we just have to be willing to go well if this doesn't work i'll do something else but we we have
a need for that situation we have a perceived need for that situation based on our insecurity which
is based on the fiction that we tell ourselves because we're not really lacking anything
we just tell ourselves we are and then we experience that lack as a result and the
more committed we are to that idea of ourselves the more real that experience becomes we are that

(01:19:23):
powerful we are that powerful in our mind that we can convince ourselves that we are worthless
and we will perceive the world as seeing us as worthless the mind is incredible that way and
so just remember not to believe yourself not to believe your perception it's just a perception
it's never the whole truth it's always just a fragment if you can just remind yourself

(01:19:46):
it's a fragment i don't know you'll find yourself back in reality where you're free
yeah yeah it's it's fascinating and i i had a post recently someone commented um it was talking about
how just like people just aren't really thinking about other people very much and you know the

(01:20:06):
idea that we we get caught up in thinking that you know there are certain things happening that maybe
aren't and our brains sort of conformational bias plays a massive role in that and someone commented
um it was something like well when i'm in public you know i notice everyone staring at me so like

(01:20:27):
i know that they are thinking about me it's like i've responded with the video and i was like well
no you don't you actually don't know that they're all thinking about you and you thinking you having
this perception even writing this comment right now thinking saying that everyone's staring at
you not everyone is staring at you but you think that everyone is staring at you so your brain is

(01:20:50):
noticing people who are looking at you and they may only have a passing glance but you are like
attaching to everything and then you equate someone just glancing at you to all of a sudden
they're thinking about you and you go down this crazy rabbit hole of being like you know they
think this this this this this this i have you know this certain way all because you're just

(01:21:12):
perceiving yourself like that and you're sort of validating your own suffering by thinking
that someone else is thinking the same thing when you it's like someone literally like glanced over
because probably because they thought they heard someone call their name and all of a sudden you
you're thinking that you know they are staring at you and thinking about how silly your shoes look

(01:21:33):
because you know you walked in some mud and now they think that you know you stepped in
dog [ __ ] and you probably smell really bad and it's like they just thought they heard their
name and all of a sudden you're like sweating and like freaking out and in reality like you have
no idea and you don't know even if say everyone is staring at you maybe everyone just thinks you

(01:21:57):
look like a really nice person and they want to be your friend or you know they
find you physically attractive you know whatever it could be an infinite number of things but
because of our limited perceptions we think that they are thinking certain specific things and it's
like you have no idea like you don't even have close to an inkling of an idea of what anyone

(01:22:22):
is thinking so when you're able to sort of relax into that mindset of like i don't know
all of a sudden like those things don't bother you as much and like even just the starting
idea that everyone is staring at you all the time you don't know that so all of a sudden your brain
isn't noticing just like passing glances and all of a sudden you can see things clearly without

(01:22:46):
distortion of your own perceptions and judgments and beliefs about the way the world is and about
how other people are that everyone stares at you all the time it's like when you're able to get
beyond that and just question it and settle on i don't know all of a sudden all those things won't
be confirmed every time you believe that like all of that confirmation bias isn't happening as often

(01:23:10):
and you're able to sort of like the fog starts to settle when you relax into that uncertainty
yeah absolutely but sometimes you have to go through a few experiences where your assumptions
get proven wrong in order for you to learn that you know like it could be one of those
moments where you know somebody's like and you wave back right and they're actually waving to

(01:23:34):
somebody behind you you're like oh okay that didn't have anything to do with me at all um
or there was actually an experience i had at the ship and anchor to bar uh in calgary when
i was much younger and it was very much there was a guy across the bar who kept looking at me and so
i looked back i'm like why is he looking at me and what i didn't understand was that he thought i was

(01:23:55):
looking at him so the two of us were going back and forth wondering why is that guy looking at me
so he ended up coming over and getting like right pissed off and like wanting to get into
a fight and i'm like are you talking about what's happening he's like why are you staring at me i'm
like who are you and that was the whole thing so we ended up talking and having a beer and
all that but it built up to a point where he was legitimately thinking that i was judging

(01:24:18):
him that i was talking to him and i wasn't ever talking about him to my buddy and it was just
like everyone's gonna be able i'd be like why does that guy keep looking at me that was it
and he assumed that i was staring at him and so it just goes to show that you really don't
you don't know right and that you can create this whole thing in your head that's really

(01:24:38):
not happening but i always i find it kind of funny that it's like it dawns on us that they
might be judging us but it doesn't dawn on us that the worst judgment that we assume they're making
is our worst judgment about ourself like we never think to ourselves i wonder if they're judging
me for something that i'm not thinking about we always assume we know what they're judging us for

(01:25:04):
right and it's like that's because you're that's your judgments and the
fact is that you don't know you don't know if they're judging you and more importantly
and this is something i try to rely on if somebody is judging you they're not they don't even see you
right that's why they're judging because they're only looking at themselves right so it's very
important to remember that if you feel like you're being judged you're not even being seen

(01:25:30):
yeah it is fascinating when you start to i don't know like go on this process of sort of waking
up and just like seeing yourself and everyone it's like you were always seeing yourself and
everyone but it's like whether you think of yourself as this idea that you're sort of like

(01:25:51):
seeing a mirror in that idea of themselves or you see that you are you know this deeper
awareness of the universe kind of beyond this personality this idea of yourself all of a sudden
then you're seeing that another awareness of the universe you're seeing yourself like actual you

(01:26:12):
versus if you're caught up in the fiction you're just seeing you know the surface human so it's
always like however whatever wherever you are on the spectrum it's always seeing that reflection
of who you think you are and so once you get deep enough to realizing that it's all the same thing
like i am that other other human is like that's actually me and there's no you know like veil of

(01:26:43):
something to judge it's like that's just another version of me existing right there so
it's interesting how it's always been a mirror even when you get to a point of seeing like
the truth that true them that like sort of deeper them it's like you're still seeing
yourself and before you saw that you were seeing yourself also so it's like always just looking

(01:27:07):
in a mirror every experience everything every judgment you make and every thing you see in other
people and kind of like judge them for and i've caught myself in that way that like some of my
things i used to be very insecure about like when i would see that in someone else like i
that was the first thing that i kind of like noticed about someone else every time because

(01:27:28):
i was afraid that like that was the first thing that other people would notice meanwhile they're
all noticing the first thing about me that they're worried about so it's like no one's
actually noticing anything that everyone's worried about them noticing and it's it's
pretty fascinating why go into every situation now just unconcerned about how people think about

(01:27:52):
me in general because one i don't know and two frankly i don't care i i mean that's that's kind
of where i'm at right now because everybody's gonna think what they need to think based on
wherever they are in their own journey to me what's important is whatever it is we're there
to accomplish right which is very much uh how i treat work or any project that i get onto is

(01:28:13):
that you know we're all doing our own thing but if we can at least get out of our own way enough
we'll have the clarity to work together on something rather than working on a project
for all of our own intentions and all of our own reasons we can actually just put our reasons aside
to focus on that project in clarity which again leads back to what we're doing with

(01:28:34):
beyond transcendence and the upcoming nfts and the dow and everything else that's coming in the
very near future and i just want to say because we're coming up to the end of our podcast episode
today very shortly that if you are interested in the dualistic unity nfts if you're interested
in the dow that is going to be developed over the near future and you want to talk to us about this

(01:28:56):
we are having a patreon exclusive group zoom this wednesday and of course on the first wednesday of
february as well so you're welcome to chat with us there join our discord of course you
can connect with us directly there i think we're up to over 70 members on discord now
so that membership is growing quite quickly and the conversation's awesome

(01:29:16):
it's all about everything that we're talking about here so if you're listening to this and you want
to get more involved join us on discord join us on patreon let us know that you're on this journey
and let everybody else know as well so we can all share in the insights that you're coming to
yeah it's exciting to see it's it's growing quick it'll it'll be interesting it'll be fun kind of

(01:29:38):
looking back on you know this year and everything it was almost it was already crazy like i was only
you know four months of last year was only a third of last year and like sort of like what we were
able to see but it's fun to have this conversation and then see so many other people being involved

(01:29:59):
and like resonating with it and i think there is a sort of thirst for this sort of conversation
that is not always easy to come across and easy to find necessarily and and i know just for me
i kind of like take for granted that other people are you know understand it and resonate with this

(01:30:22):
message as quickly as they do i know you've been going through this for a while and and when you
were in my shoes you know at my age it wasn't always like that so i can imagine it's it's almost
even more exciting to see you know anyone else having you know the ability and desire to

(01:30:45):
you know want to have this conversation so it's it's pretty cool you got it that's what it is it's
it's the enthusiasm for it right because for so long you could start having this conversation
but then as soon as as soon as you set a keyword you know unity consciousness
spiritual fluff just comes out in force and you're no longer talking about anything

(01:31:10):
that's real you're no longer talking about anything that's actually getting past the
identity you just got lost in spiritual ego and it's because you're using concepts that
are part of their discussion and so for a very long time that's what would happen you'd start
getting into these conversations somebody would go oh that sounds like something i read in
the power of now or that sounds like something i read from dolores cannon

(01:31:33):
right and before you know it that's all you were doing now you were just talking to another
spiritual identity rather than you know trying to get past that identity trying to find the reality
behind it it's kind of like people who believe in god versus people who recognize that they are god
one is just a conceptual thing the other one is is an act of peeling away everything you know until
what what is remains right so when i go into our discord for example when we do the group uh the

(01:32:00):
group zooms on patreon and when we do the free public group zooms we have these conversations
with people and what what's inspiring to me is that they're not asking spiritual questions
for the most part they're not even bringing up spirituality what they're bringing up is how their
their consciousness works how their mind works the consequences of over committing to fiction

(01:32:24):
they're talking about this in a very real and tangible and applicable way that's amazing i am
inspired daily daily i i i go for a walk every day just just basking in how exciting it is
that more and more people are looking at this conversation not as a way to feel superior not
as a way to define themselves but a way to get out of that entire prison and find the freedom that

(01:32:49):
we're talking about that inspires me all the time and i can't wait to see how much we can push that
this year because lots of ideas and if if you are listening and you have ideas and you want to
contribute to this this movement that we're doing or this group that's growing definitely join us
because we want we want your participation we want you to be involved with this because you're us

(01:33:13):
yeah i know i know we gotta finish up here soon but i think yeah one thing you brought up just the
applicability is so cool to see like all we do on this is talk about our experiences and experiences
of people around us and just how that relates back to us and it's all just like it is reddit

(01:33:35):
readily set accessible information and readily applicable you know use cases
and experiences and it's not this like you know fufu idea where you have to like cling to all this
stuff and like remember all this stuff it's like a few basic things that everything kind of like

(01:33:57):
stems from that we've you know discussed over and over with you know the ideas of beliefs
and identity and just really not taking anything too seriously is what it comes down to
and and kind of settling into you know everything is uncertain nothing is that serious you aren't

(01:34:18):
who you think you are and from there it's like it's applicable to just about anything we can
discuss it it is cross-disciplinary more so than anything else it's not like this specific
discipline like it's not this practice it's it's this understanding of the uncertainty of reality

(01:34:43):
at its core and just applying that to the infinite number of situations that we find ourselves
in in these infinite number of incarnations of the universe experiencing itself like there is no
limit to this discussion and i think that's why it's been so easy to you know this is

(01:35:05):
our 16th episode and it's never been you know difficult to come up with more stuff because
like we're experiencing life every single week and because i think we don't cling to like sort
of narratives and these sort of reoccurring cycles that a lot of us including myself
have like always sort of lived in it's like we're more aware of what's you know happening every day

(01:35:31):
so like we've come to these episodes where we're not necessarily thinking about like oh what did i
experience this week that could be applicable to dualistic unity it just kind of we kind of
just express whatever we've been through and as we discuss things come up so i think the application
of this stuff and just the the usability of it directly into every single thing that we do

(01:35:57):
and the freedom that comes with that is you know what brings about the sort of freshness and just
it you know helps me every week i re-listen to it after we post it and it's like it just
re-resonates and i'm like oh yeah and it's it's not like you know something where you study it and

(01:36:17):
you have to learn it and you have to you know i i guess it's sort of a practice but it's in through
any experience you have it's not like you have to go out and like go through these certain steps
like a workout or something where you have to work out it's like you can do literally anything and
just apply a few of these understandings and boom that's that's it it's just experience experiencing

(01:36:44):
reality here and now all the time that's it yeah keep it simple right this is what i enjoyed about
wing chun was that wing chun only has three forms there's only three forms in wing chun there's no
other katas or anything else right and it's just because they teach you very basic concepts and
then it's up to you in the moment to use them based on your sensitivity and your own flow

(01:37:10):
they never teach you to do what every other student does they tell you to trust yourself
right it has to be applicable and that's that's exactly what this is and and it's not
you don't have to learn anything that's the thing about this conversation is that sometimes you
walk away from it going okay i'm going to keep these things in mind right but what we're really

(01:37:31):
saying is that as long as you're always willing to just not commit to what you're thinking as
truth as certainty these are just the insights you're going to keep running across
that's what that is right it's identity is just one of those things that you're going to keep
noticing rubs you the wrong way if you keep accepting uncertainty right that's just how

(01:37:52):
it's going to go so we're not teaching anything so much as just talking about what's happening to us
as we're uncertain right and that's it and we're coming from two different stories of uncertainty
i've been uncertain for like half my life right and you're you're basically embarking on to your
and your journey of uncertainty and what's funny is that we're both saying the same thing which is

(01:38:14):
exactly the point is that this conversation is universal and the path to our freedom likewise
is universal individually and as it is expressed more by uh by us individually collectively
that's what i'm looking forward to not even looking forward to i'm enjoying watching it
happen every day i get messages from people going i i just went through something really

(01:38:39):
hard in my life and i didn't think about myself and it was amazing and it's like
nice that's awesome because i'm not offering any advice at all if anything what i'm saying
is just let it happen you'll see exactly what you're capable of and i just trust in that
yeah just settling into the uncertainty just relaxing into it not trying to cling to anything

(01:39:04):
that you know soothes that desire for control and realizing that it's it's never there anyway
so why cling to fictions that tells you that it is when you know that it never
is because it never could be you know we we're not out here predicting the future so
yeah it's it's pretty cool absolutely what eric eric was saying uh we had him on on as

(01:39:27):
a guest in season one he was saying like why are people so certain about things like why
do they always have to assume they know and my only response was need that was pretty much it
right because that's the only reason the only reason you would convince yourself you know
so on that note we're going to end the episode here because it's getting later in the day and
i'm sure we could talk for another two hours if we wanted to but we have a patreon live stream coming

(01:39:51):
up this wednesday that's going to be an hour and a half so of course we'll get to chat again there
um thank you everyone for joining us for this episode it's been a lot of fun i do encourage
you to go to check out andrew's instagram page because he recently did an interview with another
person on his podcast that is well worth the listen so definitely go and check that out and

(01:40:11):
aside from that we will see you this wednesday and of course uh for next week's episode bye everyone
you

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