Special Edition: Jonathon Miller Weisberger, Rainforest Medicine

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:42):
Well, here we are. It is officially Autumn Equinox. It's
the beginning of autumn, September twenty second to the twenty third.
It is an energy change and this is also a
special edition of Earth Ages. This clip your host of
Earth Ancients, and today we are presenting a look at

(01:04):
the rainforest of the Amazon. In the book we're focusing
on is Rainforest Medicine, which was written by Jonathan Miller
Weisberger almost eleven years ago, and it's very appropriate today
because we're talking about plant medicines from an ethnobotanist who

(01:25):
can give us not only the insight on the medicines
that are psychedelic based ayahuasca, DMT and other plant derivatives
that cause us to leave our conscious minds and move
into other dimensions, but it's a chance to also celebrate Earth,

(01:47):
celebrate the changing seasons, and also consider how we move forward,
what the next phase of our evolution is. You might say,
how does that fit in with the Earth Ancients theme. Well,
as you will hear we're talking about lost realms. You've

(02:07):
heard of move which is also known as limoria. Of
course we talk about Atlantis, but in part of our
interview today there are regions of the Amazon that are
recognized as being populated by people who migrated from Limoria
and move and there's a there's a region that also

(02:30):
was home to giants, people that were over seven feet
tall and left their wisdom with the people known as
the Sequoia Indians of the Amazon. And we're gonna learn
about not only the giants, but some of the plant

(02:51):
medicine wisdom that was handed down thousands and thousands of
years ago. We don't hear enough about plant medicine used
from ancient, an ancestral point of view, how our ancestors
incorporated it. Another thing that I didn't realize is this
book that we're talking about today gets into the proper
preparations for ayahuasca and how to collect the leaves and

(03:16):
who to work with, because there's a lot of different
people who are claiming to be ayahuasca experts and this
is becoming some kind of an industry, especially in Peru.
We know that people like our friend Graham Hancock travels
to Peru occasionally and partakes in ceremony vision quest. But

(03:39):
you have to be very very careful who you get
involved with. So there's steps in this book reinforest medicine,
on how to look for the good shaman, how to partake,
how to prepare a tea or a broth, and most importantly,
how to prepare and what intentions to use for the

(04:03):
ayahuasca ceremony. But again that's only part of our discussion.
This is actually gets into some important anthropology, some archaeological
parks that we will talk about archaeology as a whole,
all in celebration of the autumn equinox. So today's program

(04:25):
is Rainforest Medicine, and my guest is Jonathan Miller Weisberger. Hey,
we're going to be in the jungle this December first
through the twelfth on the Guatemala Sacred Temple Tour, and
this is an opportunity not only to climb pyramids, but

(04:45):
to interact with the local shaman in understanding what the
Maya were up to, their state of mind and ceremony,
to connect with the sacred temples and pyramids that we'll
interact with. This is a chance to not only climb
pyramids connect with them, but also to take in the

(05:06):
spirit and the consciousness that is the genius of the Maya.
If you'd like to join us, go to Earthancients dot com,
forward slash Tours and you'll see all the details. To
get details on the Guatemalo tour, send an email to
me at Earth Ancients the number four the letter you
at gmail dot com and join me for a private

(05:29):
zoom conference with our hosts Lydia and Arturo Di Leong. Again.
The Guatemalo tour is December first to the twelfth, twenty
twenty five. For more information, go to earth Agents dot com,
forward slash Tours or send me an email earth Agents
the number four the letter YOUU at gmail dot com

(05:49):
for a discussion on just what we'll be doing. This
tour is perfect for you.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
Another rain he as tonon. I don't know what to do.
I just miss you more than anything.

Speaker 1 (06:29):
We haven't talked enough about the rainforest of the Amazon.
When we had Graham Hancock on the program, he discussed
his trips to the rainforest for ayahuasca journeys. And today
we're talking with Jonathan Miller Weisberger, who is the author
of Rainforest Medicine, and this is a book that came

(06:49):
out in twenty thirteen that really highlights not only ayahuasca,
but the sacred plants in the Amazon forest. And really
what to look for when you're taking an eye I
watch a journey. It's just a really well written book.
But there's so much more we want to talk about today.
So Jonathan, welcome to Earth Ancients. Great to have you
on the program.

Speaker 3 (07:10):
Thank you so much. An It's an honor and a
joy to be here. Listens to program for quite a
well known It's wonderful to be here. Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
I want to mention and get an idea from you.
You're an ethnobotanist, which is really and I want to
get your definition of it, because this is somebody who
is relating plants to how people use those plants, but
not only that, how plants can be turned into two food, clothing,
and other I guess you could call them beneficial projects.

(07:45):
Give me an idea of what you how you decided
to become an ethno botanist, but also the region that
you chose, which is Northern Amazon.

Speaker 3 (07:57):
Yeah, well, I mean in the northern northeast from northwestern Amazon.
Reasion is the pinnacles terrestrial botanical and biological diversity. But
I was raised in Equator, so I guess the jungle
chose me circumstances. I was raised in Equator and when
I was about eleven, and then again thirteen years old,

(08:18):
a friend of my parents was an ethnobotanist. We lost
touch with and he hasn't have any publications. It's been
a mystery. And he brought me to the Amazon with
him and I helped him press plants. But what most
impressed me is the seeing nettle bush. You know, I

(08:39):
brushed up against the steeing nettle and now they're they're
pretty potent. The nettles, all nettles, some especially where then
other's been in the Amazon. They got some metals that
you really feel it when they get you. I was
just amazed that a plant can sting you. That really
she brought me in. That was my first like. And
then I learned that the use of the nettles, and
later I'm living amongst the wallwood. I the what Arnie

(09:01):
called the nettle the mother of all medicines. And it's
because they use the nettle to transmit their energy to
the younger generation. Like if a parent's come back from
or a father comes back from a successful hunting trip,
he'll grab the nettles and the kids will run off.
He'll chase them down and he'll spank his the nettle
on their on his child, and that asses that that

(09:23):
success of the triumph of a good day onto their child.
So the mother of the medicine, because the waite Arnies
use very few medicinal plants because they're a remote wilderness
tribe and they don't have many illnesses, is really how
to transmit ones like chi they call your invite energy
to onto their children. So it's interesting. But yeah, and

(09:44):
so ethnobotany, you know, at in essence is the study
of the relationship between people and plants. Ethnos, people and
botany plants, and like you said, mentioned there's it's you know,
ethnobotany is all the relate ways that we relate to plants.
So later when I went on to study at the
Humble State University.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
Humble, Northern California, Humble in San Francisco, that's my backyard. Wow. Okay, Yeah,
were you raised in like Eureka or where were you raised?

Speaker 3 (10:15):
No, I was actually I was born here in the
East Bay in Berkeley, and okay, and I'm in al
so Bronte, else Bronte. That's awesome. Yeah, I was raised
in Equador. My parents had a Vegetarian Cultural Center in
Ecuador when I was growing up, and there's a there's
a book that spoke about them, called The Making of
an un American, and there's a chapter in there where

(10:37):
my mom she put a complaint to this supermarket where
we used to go shopping, because they had the indigenous
people would go to buy the dog meat, which was
that they sold for dogs, which was actually quality beef,
but just like you know, sides and pieces and or
the bones. But they wouldn't let them buy there. And

(10:57):
so my mom put a complaint and they got the
the store owners to realize that there was no reason
why they couldn't buy there, so then they were allowed
to buy the natives there. So she was written up
in the book. So I come from a family of
you know, like activists, I guess you could say, working
to improve the quality of life for other people, for
the planet. And yeah, so that's about me. Is a
fascinating way to you know, it's just led me on

(11:20):
a lot of journeys ten years in the Amazon.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah. Yeah, And so this book, this wonderful book you wrote,
and I'm curious, Jonathan, was it because there was a
growing interest in these ayahuasca journeys that you decided to
give people a definition not only of the plant itself,
the importance of the plant and how to journey correctly,

(11:45):
but also who to do it with, what to look for,
how to have an intention because you were working with
the uh and we're gonna talk about this in a minute,
the Sequoia people of the of the Amazon, and how
the indigenous people were working with this psychedelic So, I mean,

(12:07):
it seems because I mean, the book has so much
more depth to it than what I'm mentioning, but it
seems like it's your helpful guide to psychedelics and the
importance of having good intention to talk about that because
so much of the book is really not only focused
on ayahuasca. But I guess you call it yeah yahee

(12:31):
as well yeah hey yeah he yeah yeah right.

Speaker 3 (12:37):
Well. I worked between nineteen ninety and the year two thousands,
and when I was studying botany at humble Se University
of Music, about the music of the plants, I returned tequitor.
It took a year leave of absence that turned into
ten years, and because it was just too exciting, my
parents supported me too on it, and I worked with

(12:59):
an organization who, well, at first a prior student a
Humboldt State who I'm still very close friends with, founded
an organization in Equator that started a biological reserve called
hatun Sascha the Big Forest. And so I went to
volunteer on the creation of minicial plank Guard and I
got in touch with them and they said they're starting,
they need some volunteers. So simultaneously there was another organization

(13:22):
called the Reinforced Information Center that was organizing this project
to begin the demarcation of the waward Any People's ancestr homelands.
The what any people received one thing, it's about one
third of their ancestral lands, which is a huge area.
It was probably like a few million acres. And it
was an oil company road that went down south to

(13:44):
this colonization frontier town called Coca, and so it was
a canyon of colonization. So it was one hundred and
thirty kilometers that we had to create the boundary lines
of so that the colonists in this canyon of colonization
wouldn't go into the wa Ani territory to make their adjudication.
I'm irrelevant at ground level that was there's a chapter

(14:06):
in the book that I talked someone about that the
deep forest perspective of the Wildernie. And anyway, I worked
a bunch of years in the Amazon before we could
say Ayahuasca became or yahi became popular. And then after
nineteen ninety five the project with the wat Onnie came
to a conclusion. But some close friends of mine had
been working with the Sieko Pie or the Sequoia, a

(14:28):
province to the north of where the ones lived in
the Equador in Amazon, and so I went to go
collaborate there because I was always fascinated by the Sequoia
because when I was a kid growing up in Ecuador,
there was a postcard that you would see at a
lot of the gift shops, and it was a face
and he's a photo of like two elders, very happy, smiling,

(14:50):
just ribbing, a smile familiar to ear, with a feathered
crown and flowers in their ears. I was like, these
guys are amazing. The imagery stuck with me and said
those are the so my I finally had the opportunity
to go down there with some friends, and I went
and then I became friends off the first trip with

(15:10):
who became my maestro, Don Cesardio Piaguay. May his name
be a blessing to all that here. He passed a
year and a half ago at one hundred and twenty
amazing years of age. He had great age, one hundred
and twenty, one hundred and twenty. He passed on Eastern Friday,
and he was laid to rest on the Resurrection Sunday.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
And so was he was he a shaman.

Speaker 3 (15:35):
He was a yahead drinker with the way the sequoia
caused yahe and cuckoo. The yeah, they don't use the
word sharming, but yeah, that's the equivalent a yahead drinker.
He was a high level maestro the yahid realities, and
the great healer and a great friend and anyone whoever
came met him, and a very accomplished healer too, a
spiritual healer who he could help woman. He learned from

(15:58):
the celestial Doan immortals that he would commune with a
magic cure where he would enchant invocation over a cotton
flower just recently opening up cotton flower, and then and
then with that she would help women who weren't able
to conceive to have children. That's one of his famous attributes,

(16:18):
And there was a French woman who came who her
husband had an eco lodge up river. They couldn't have children,
and she has like three children now thanks to hint too. Yeah,
so he's a very effective filer on that level and
then the other levels. Yeah, don't Socidia. So I we
became friends, and he invited me back, and he was
amazed that I had worked amongst the wilde any Indians.

(16:40):
And he said, if I learned how to make the
arrow poisons, And sure enough I had actually studied the
making of the arrow poison among the waite Anie from
a from a waite Antie by the name of Webbe.
Grandfather Wepe and Houstle lived a great age. Webbe in
the last month of his life, he never laid down.
He just sat up until and without eating for a

(17:02):
whole month. He was also great age, well over one
hundred and when he laid down, he was on the
other side. And I visited Webbe and worked with him.
Finally we met on the boundary line demarcation. But finally
I went. I took a four day journey across the
territory to his home and spent a month there. And
it was amazing. And when I was living with him,

(17:23):
he would never lay down. I got to see that firsthand,
like what they talk about in Chuangsu, the wise men
of old, like thousands of years back, still in existence.
He would never lay down. And I had read I
was moved by the French anthropologist uh Levy Strauss's book Tropeque.
I read that. So he said that to studying the natives,

(17:44):
he wanted to be the first one up and the
last one to sleep. So I tried that, and Web
immediately knew what I was up there. She would when
I'd fall asleep, and he'd come and light my fire
and wake up, and he's giggled and like retreating to
his to his hammock, like Katia, you never to be
the first one up or the last one to sleep here, buddy.
Let that settle in for a while, you know. And

(18:06):
he would literally never lay down. He never laid down
the whole month that was there. So but I learned
the water on the arrow poisoning technique from whip it,
and so I taught society. We went out to the
forest in the sequor tert where we found the plants,
and his wife made the clay pot so we made it,
and then we went out hunting with the blowpipe he had,
and sure enough we stuck a wild boar and the

(18:28):
thing ran off like a little bit and dropped, and
he was just like amazed. He couldn't believe it. They
we're smoking meat. He's like that. Then that's like huge
to the Sequoia is to be smoking a wild boar.
And then you start talking real story, you know. And
then so he's like, what, we got to drink your head?
And I was like sure, I'd love to, and so
we started drinking yeah hey, And then I was blown
to a million pieces and managed to pull myself back together.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
That the first time you had yeah hey? Uh you
know while you were down there, or had you had
ayahuasca or other psychedelics.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
I had tried to the ayahuasca once when I was
thirteen years old with my friend Fred, who brought my
mother's friend who brought me to the Amazon who's death
no botanist, and he said that I couldn't. He was
going to be away for the night and I just
to stay in this lot. And then then so I
was like, yeah, right, I'm saying. So when he left,
I followed him. I snuck behind him because I wasn't

(19:23):
going to stay in this hut on the forest all alone.
I'm following Fred because I was thirteen. He was my mentor,
like my father there and so I and I was like,
so I snuck behind him, and then he got to
the ceremony lodge and then I walked in and once
the tradition is that you get to the ceremony lodge
right before a ceremony, you can't leave. You have to
stay there to the night. So they ended up giving

(19:45):
me the drink because they asked me directly, you want
I was like sure.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
So Fred was like, uh oh, my my god.

Speaker 3 (19:50):
I must have said, whatever you do, don't give any
of that. And then I drank it when I was thirteen.
But I mean, really with the sequoias is then when
I started having the really full blown experiences, you know,
because we were drinking and doing society was prepared very strong.
You taught me how I was. I became designated.

Speaker 1 (20:05):
Yeah, he cook, so you understand the combination to make
a a ayahuasca brew.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
Correct. In my book, I described that chapter five, Preparing
a proper Brew. I was the chef for five years
for the Master and when you cook it wrong, he'll
get a headache and he can't sing. And he said,
I would be out in the forest cooking and I
do what I'd make a mistake, and that night you
have a headache. The Master's like, we're not going to
drink this. And he explains to me what I did wrong.
He said, son, you took off your tunic right when

(20:34):
when you were cooking. I was like, I did because
it was so hot. He said, then you can't because
you're you have to fast all day when cooking the
yeah and something, and then you have to like down
there it was rough. You have to haul water from
the slip creek up the slippery muddy bank.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
Subtle preparation that have to be followed for the brew
to be just right.

Speaker 3 (20:54):
For sure. It's a lot of a lot of things.
And so she saw he and the visions that I
basically took off my two and then you have you
dumped the brew, bad brew. Dump it. But when you
finally get it right and everything comes together, the Master,
like you know, he puts us both of his hands
together up into the sky, and when he opens his hands,

(21:14):
the most exquisite reality you can ever imagine, just comes
cascading down. You're just engulfs and you're in heaven.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
Talk about your understanding of the history of ayahuasca and
ya hey, because it seems to me that it's been
taken out of context. Now it's like I want a trip,
so I'm going to Peru to do so ayahuasca. What
is it traditionally or from an indigenous perspective?

Speaker 3 (21:44):
What does it use for that's a great question. Let
me get to Let me just summarize the last question.
So that the book came came out later many years later,
seeing that this is, you know, traveling the world over.
The book came out of more of an active social
responsibility because it's it's quite a bit of work. At
the time, I was already in full swing and running

(22:06):
the eco Lodge. And also so I'd wake up at
three in the morning. For three straight years, I woke
up at three in the morning till sunrise. It was
the only time I had to work without interruptions. And
I wrote the book more, as I say, not the
social responsibility to share the some of the information and
the oral traditions. Because plants, they travel, but the oral
tradition gets left behind, and that's the pinka. The pinta

(22:29):
is like the spiritual cloud. That's why, like when the
eye has harvested, you have to harvest it slowly and
put it down. You can't throw it down so that
the pinta doesn't get disturbed. The energetic essence that like
engulfs the vine and that's easy to disperse. And so
that's the one thing is alkaloid soup. Another thing is
like an ecstatically charged sacred beverage. That's that is owned

(22:52):
by the celestial divine immortals and we're just just for
a little bit we can experience what the reality is like.
And so that's the that's the purpose of the And
so yeah, the hopefully of the book is to sort
of kind of guide this ayahuasca or yahi bards that's
floating the world over and guide it steered an auspicious
directions so that the original intentions of this can be

(23:15):
what prevails, which is as a medicine to heal all
kinds of things. This can heal from physical elements like
cancer to like CycL you know, to like you know,
emotional things to help people find their life path. When
it's so the proper intentions of the yahey in yahuasca
are are positive to help make the world a better

(23:36):
place and community on the personal, community and planetary level.
But of course, up one of the International Irbal Symposiums
two years ago, I was invited to give a talk
precisely this topic, and so I thought about it quite
a bit, and I came up with the with the
title for the talk. It was called And there's a
blog on my that we'll mention at the end of
my website too, about this the delicate nature, right, the

(23:59):
delicate nature of ayahuasca, and yeah, hey and so and so.
I asked the question to a group of maybe fifty
or sixty participants. I said, who here has seen has
participated in yaousca ceremony? And almost everyone rose her hands.
And I asked, how many people have seen the nyausca ceremony,
go haywire, and like eighty percent of the you know

(24:21):
the people rose your hand. And I've heard one too
many stories of people having you know, like getting knocked
off course, kind of like Humpty dumpty fell off the wall, right,
But who's there to put the peace?

Speaker 1 (24:30):
What does that mean? Off the court? You mean a
bad trip or just poor guidance?

Speaker 3 (24:36):
Well, a lot of things can converge and people. Sometimes
you have spoken to people that have bad trips and
left them frailed and shattered. So the purpose and then
like not knowing what they're doing with themselves totally discombobulated,
like nothing that we could call positive because they're confused.
So the proper intention when this is upheld properly, people

(24:57):
leave the ceremony completely integrated, charge the room with positive energy,
with a clear understanding what their life purposes and understanding
of maybe what's been going on with them how to
improve their life. Some people radically change their life. They
have the courage to maybe just drop what they were
doing because they know it's not the correct thing for
them to follow their highest path like to you know,

(25:18):
like get out of the karmen into the dharma, so
to say, you know, so they become spiritual too, like
people when so the positive effects of it are are
is what your original intentions are. And so back to
your question is the indigenous people For them, this is
a sacred medicine that's used to for many reasons, but

(25:38):
you know, basically to up you know, to merge with
what they call like a celestial wind or an energy
alignment that gives them the energy to live, you know,
more joyously in the wilderness, because to live in the
wilderness is not an easy thing, so you need energy
for that. So it gives them energy. And then it's
also the school of life or their own basically Native

(26:01):
indigenous university, because they learn the cosmology bursthand by experiencing
the cosmology. So the yahe is used for on oral
transmission of the oral traditions. And then it's completely taken
out of context now of course in the modern times.
But since this is the Earth Ancients podcast, let me

(26:21):
share before we go into modern day uses one of
the oldest stories I know because I asked Don Delphine
pay why may his memory be a blessing for all
who knew him as well? One of the great traditional
ethors who passed some years ago. Now she was the
master of silence, because of course we relate ayahuasca ceremonies

(26:42):
to you know, chanting and singing, and the sequoia have
incredible songs. There's some they call them the he hen yeah.
And then another kind of song is the weenia kaye,
which is a call and response between the participants in
the ceremony. And the divine immortals, the weenia pay. So
the fundamental purpose of yahe Sequoia drinking is to basically

(27:06):
understand the truth of the weenia pie the divine immortals.
And Weenya is a beautiful word because weenia means like
burgoning or crispy, ultra fluffy clean, or like it can
be compared to like young young young flower just opening,
or the butterfly that just comes out, or the down

(27:27):
of the baby bird, the most ultra ultra clean, ultra
fluffy clean like phenomena.

Speaker 1 (27:33):
You know.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
So it is the is the ween ya. So the
Wenia pinea, the divine immortals always new divineing mortals. So
the sequoia drink that I had to understand the truth
and the reality of these divine immortals, which are the
you can be looked at as the extensions of of
God or the Creator, the great Spirit, the subtle origin

(27:56):
that goes through all the dimensional realities without out the
eluding assessence. Anything that touches the windia bind becomes divine,
is more divine, so we become healed. That's why people
who drink I understand their life purpose because the windia
pine anything that is in touch with that celestial type

(28:16):
of energy basically becomes a whole.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
We're gonna take a short commercial break to allow our
sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with
my guest today, Jonathan Miller Wisberger, discussing his book Rainforest Medicine,
will be right back. We're talking plant medicines, most notably

(29:28):
ayahuasca in our program today and the book we are
focusing on is Rainforest Medicine. With my guest today, Jonathan
Miller Weisberger. Do they talk about the ancestors, the ancestral
history of the plant usage and sacred plants and how

(29:51):
far back it goes?

Speaker 3 (29:53):
Oh? Yeah, they go. I asked done Delphine, which is
the oldest or the first legend of the head that
he knows. He shared me with the story. That's just remarkable.
So before humanity existed on the planet, it's like long
before there were any ancestors of the human us humans
here Yan Yeah, or also known as Pina, the Creator,

(30:16):
which was created the Earth, not the universe, but created
the Earth and formed many animals and also created humanity,
was experimenting with different types of beings and he brought
to the earth the ni pie, and so Nigh is
the dawn or the dusk. So these are the dawn

(30:37):
or dusk immortals. And he brought them to the earth.
And Creator had two bundles. The story goes that one
was a day bundle and the other was a night bundle.
And so he would open the day bundle and out
would come to day, and then you would close it
and it would put the day away, and then you'd
open the night bundle, and that would come to night
and all the stars. So the Creator went on a

(30:59):
walk and he he he he had in formed the
night pie no one to mess with his bundles, you know,
not no one touched my bundles, he would say. And
so he went on the walk, and then the night fell.
So he knew one of the knight Pie was mischievous
and went against his word and opened the night bundle.
And so he started to break sticks along the trails
that when the day came he would find his way back.

(31:22):
But he came across the ceremony of yah hey that
was occurring, because the Sequois say that yeahe. Many different
legions of divine immortals have the yah For example, the Nypie.
These immortals have yeah he as well as like the
Usseppo Pie, the sndianmmortals have yeah hey. The high Quinti
Pai that are inside the Earth in the holographic Universe

(31:46):
universal vision of the Earth is inside is like a heaven.
So inside the Earth there's alternate dimensions where these high
Quintipai exists, and those are the they have yeahey as well.
So in this case, the Nightpie were in the ceremony,
Yeah hey, Concho Pie. The Psykata psychicata in worlds have
yeahey as well, and so one other there was a

(32:08):
master sitting on the bench blowing on the yah and
one of the drinkers went up and said, Master, I
wanted in the future, when the people exist on the planet,
they're going to damage, They're going to ruin this beautiful paradise.
I want to have the powers to stop that from happening.
And so he gave them. He blew on the yahey

(32:29):
so that that person, that Knightpie, would have those powers.
And then the Knight Pie went and said Master, in
the future, I want to just live simply the want,
and so I'm blowing the powers for me to live simple,
and so the Master blew on the powers from to
live simply. Another one went and said, Master, I want
to have the powers to heal with the singing nettle.

(32:49):
Give me. And so so he blew on the powers
so that he could heal with singing metal. When the
day came and the Creator came back and he brought
all the knight Pie together, he scolded them. He said,
you all, someone amongst you touched the day and night bundles,
which I had said not to touch. And so he
took a bundle in each hand and he clapped his hands,
Creator ah, and the cloud clap came out in all directions.

(33:14):
In that moment, the day and the night became the
same amount of time. He unified the day of the
night on the ear, so it's twelve hours and twelve hours,
and the Knypie he sent them back to their realm.
But many of them transformed into different animals right when
that clap happened, mostly when flying back to the other
to their immortal abode, and some turned into wild boarers,

(33:37):
others turned into into pirates. And the Master that that
was blowing the ahe he transformed into the Mikaka, which
is the Amazonian cupra it's a giant venomous snake.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
That is.

Speaker 3 (33:52):
His bench that he was sitting on transformed into a turtle.
The knypie that wanted to in the future harm people
top of people from you know, existing it was transforming
to the non poisonous snakes. The one that wanted to
just live simply was transformed into the poisonous snakes. And

(34:13):
I have quite a bit of experience with them. When
you live in the jungle, you come across them, and
the venomous snakes are not aggressive unless they're molested, and
so when you're poison it's easier for them to hunt.
So that the one who wanted to live simply was
transformed into the non venomous snake, and then the one
who wanted to learn how to heal with the thing
that was transformed to the giant caterpillar.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
Yeah. Uh are we supposed to uh use ayahuasca? You
know in a lifetime? Is I mean, is it your
belief as someone who prepares the brew, that it's it's
made for people to awaken?

Speaker 3 (34:55):
Oh? Yeah, it has a it has a place. At
the time, the sequoia has learned the tradition of ye
from the yan Nyanya Skopai. Yanye is the name of
creator and sieko Pai is multi colored people from God's
multicolored people. There's a legend that in this room of
my book they were they encountered the squois were like
nomadic swid and agriculturalists. There were loin cloths, and they

(35:17):
encountered this group of divine immortals that were striped multicolored tunics,
and they had these bushes cane bushes were the hum
and out of them would come flying from the tips
beautifully redesceded bluebirds. And they taught to Sekoyas how to
prepare the yaha for the sunrise renewal to vomit at
three in the morning, and then how to prepare yahi

(35:37):
water we drink a bunch of that, and then how
to do the graduation yeah what they call yah the
yah or oh yeah, that has the consistency of honey,
very thick. They taught them everything how to prepare. But
sure enough, some of the Sekois this obeyed some of
the hierarch some of the basically guidelines they laid out,
and so they disappeared when they vanished. But the Sequoias

(36:00):
in that encounter completely transformed their culture. Now they start
to wear tunics and cross necklaces and feathered crowns, and
they learn many many wisdoms from them, how to recuperate
or nature, and so indigenous mythology and cosmology has to
be interpreted. And that's part of my task is to
find the modern day interpretation of ancient truths without diluting

(36:22):
the essence of this right. And so the fact that
to the multicolored people, God's multicolored people, this shows it's
I guess we could say it's similar to the eging
the eaching. It's like it could have been right, it
could have been all in Chinese calligraphy that only you know,
people that understand that could understand. Well, it's no, it

(36:42):
was in a very simple, broken and whole line terminology.
So it's definitely the eaching is a universal tool. So
you know, many Daoist you know, scholars have gone through
great efforts seeing the value and seeing the oneness of
humanity to you know, make lucid modern day renderings like
the New Masternee. Watching these versions of each thing that

(37:02):
I've studied extensively has helped me a lot for all
my projects. But so the Yaha tradition as well. It's
it's indeed one of the great world heritage traditions that's
here to help humanity. And what's important is that it's
used correctly. It's like the sword, a double edged sword,
you know, of the master's sort in the novice's hand.

(37:24):
You know, like you know, there's so good can come
from it as well as harm. So the important thing
is the guidelines. That's what the book is intended to share,
that guide this in the auspicious direction.

Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, Graham talks about the use of ayahuasca in his
book Hallucinations as a evolutionary tool, and I'd like to
hear from you on that topic, where sacred journeys are
used to understand what the future is looking like, where
the problems are, and how to set up the next

(37:58):
move and the next the life.

Speaker 3 (38:03):
Ayahuasca has always been used to transform culture to live
a life more aligned. It shows that basically, like you know,
the way to you know, to salvation can only happen
when we align with the integral salvation because the illusion
of duality, there's not a you or an I to save.
It's like everything together, you know, basically, when it aligns
that's why it's called the integral salvation. But each person

(38:26):
we cultivate ourselves. If one person saves themselves, you know,
then that that's going to be you know, step in
the right directory for all all life, all humanity. So
these tools help us to align with spiritual reality. What's
phenomenal too, is that no matter what religious you know,
belief someone might have the yah hey or ayahuasca, it

(38:48):
doesn't go against that. It's not a religion or a
culture to spiritual reality. It helps any person wherever they are,
with whatever ideology or whatever belief their purpose, find that clarify,
oxygenate their their place in the mosaic of life. And
it just has to be used correctly. For example, there's

(39:10):
a lot of medications now that are contradicative. People on
certain medications, if they were to take this, they could
be greatly harmed different kinds of like and you know,
there's more and more medications different like antidepressants basically because
the you know, it's a certain.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
Anti psychotics, I mean they're everywhere precisely.

Speaker 3 (39:32):
So that's that's something for modern day people that really
has to be looked into before they embark on the
Niawak contry. They have to make sure they're they're qualified. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:41):
Uh, if it's a special plant medicine, should we use
it more than once in a lifetime? I mean other
than a I mean I'm wondering, because when I hear
people doing multiple journeys, I'm thinking, Okay, this is a

(40:02):
this is a kind of a fun game for them.
But somebody who's serious about it, like you are, who's
written an entire book about it, what's your interpretation on
the usage?

Speaker 3 (40:14):
Yeah, you know, it's such a vast phenomenon. But basically,
there's a story of a person in nineteen thirties from
Colombia that came to the Sequoid territory and drank one
well place ceremony, just boom, the proper one, and he
became a famous healer that never drank iOS again. He
just became a famous healer that used many kinds of
methods to healer. I forget this person's name, but he

(40:36):
became a well known, renowned, very famous healer in Columbia.
And the Sequoias they go back all the time. This is,
you know, because they want to stay aligned and keep
the energy because it's easy to drift and go out
of balance. So, but so there's everything from in between
from you know, going back regularly to drinking once and
letting that one time and you know, like basically affect

(40:58):
the rest of your life. There's a I wanted to
hear something about the you know, how vast the ways
this is used and as an example of how I
was because it always used to improve the person's life.
In the Colombian coastal region of the Choko, amongst the

(41:21):
Afro Colombians, there black Colombians on the coast of very
remote wilderness areas where they live on the Pacific coast
of Columbias and natives. They're natives, they're blacks. But even
in Equador, indigenous Afro Equadors have been declared they're very
different than they're more like Africans because these people up

(41:41):
into the nineteen thirties, it was only there was African
tongues still being spoken in coastal Ecuador from escaped slaves
from these slave boats, and so these wilderness, tropical wildness
areas were very much like Equatorial Africa, and so it's
really amazing. So and then they merged with the indigenous peoples, right,
a lot of beautiful culture have come out of that marimba.

(42:02):
And but they learned the use of ayahuasca. But I
learned a very strange use. So these these Afro Colombians
and would drink what they call the pinde, they drink
the syauasca beverage. And then they'd sit down, squatting down
with their head between their knees, and the master would

(42:22):
with a vine of the ayahuasca vine would walk around,
you know, swinging this violin there slowly like this in
the air. And then at some point in the night,
like at randomly, he just like swipe it down onto
the back of one of the participants, random like just
she's in the transit of the medicine too. And in
that moment they'd get up and scream, and they're screaming.

(42:43):
They'd see in their vision where on the river was
the gold deposits, and they'd use it to find gold. Wow,
and it actually worked, well that's how they use it. Yeah,
they would work, they'd find the gold amazed. So that's
a strange, very strange use. But basically the ihusca offers
a soccer right in that case is like getting whip
by the master mastroom and then so like in other cases,

(43:05):
you know, it always so that the minimal cases, that's
why the people fast. The sequoia is fast all day.
I'm kind of amazed how in Lahuasca traditions, I've seen
people that don't fast, but the Sequoias they fast all
day because they you know, they they're gonna put something
so holy in their body that they wanted to be
the only thing about the experiences if you're had breakfast, sunch,

(43:27):
and dinner, that's the body is absorbing all the nutritients
from all those foods. Right.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
So yeah, that's a very special part of the world,
that Central American area. Is there any legends of it
being related to the ancient place of Limoria, which is
also known as MoU uh i mean, and and we
we don't know a great deal about that place because

(43:53):
it's you know, ancient tens of thousands of years ago.
But is there any any legends or any related to
the use of ayahuasca or yahi by these ancient people.

Speaker 3 (44:08):
With MoU I think the plant that goes back there
is the lotus. The lotus is considered to be the
oldest known cultagen and it comes originally from MoU from
Limuria and there's a legend. Let's go back to cosa ekanaw.
So in the year two thousand and I returned to
basically you know the millennium bugs at me into another
part another wilderness area, the Oxcept Peninsula. For like lived

(44:30):
out there, built this eco lodge and for the first
fifteen years we had a very limited solar system and
had to only access was by boat. After an hour
boat drive, we had the land up on the beach
and now we had we built up with the Ocean
Forest Eco Lodge and it's our family business. We have
a beautiful visitor center right on the beach run by
Rainforest and at the potential garden. The Sequoia elders have

(44:51):
visited many times back in the day and we hold
our annual Rainforest Medicine Council gathering retreats there and then
so I had also mentioned the Living Bridges Foundation. So
the founder of the Living Bridges is a woman named
Donna Ronald's a very dear friend of mine who worked
many years in Peru with the Ketto natives with water projects,

(45:14):
and so she was very inspired by the work of
Doune an Equador with High Indian natives to as well
with different water projects that we've done there to help
imput the life of Purua. Indigenous families were in a
combative with the people had to go elect basically forty
an hour by donkey to get water from the creeks,
and now they have, you know, water in their communities.

(45:35):
We did this whole engineering, really amazing projects. So that
joined me onto the Living Bridges Foundations many years ago,
and then I'm a board member of the foundation and
the Donna. So some in two thousand and seven, it
was she contacted me and said that she's been organizing

(45:55):
these talks for these Taoist masters in the in the
Bay Area and they had asked her about Costadika, a
site called the Kanye Island because they heard there's these
petro spheres there and if they if she knew anybody,
and and because they wanted to visit. So of course
she contacted me because I have the lodge. So she's like,

(46:17):
do you know what what what lodge? Can we say?
That's the closest we can get to the Kanye Island.
I was like, Donald, not just because they're great friends
and I want to hear, but actually our lodge is
the closest you can get to the Kanye Islands.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
Really it is.

Speaker 3 (46:30):
You can see it right out in front of the
lodge is the Kanye Island. And so they so of course,
so then they booked her stay and they came and
so we went to pick him up. And I having
a friend, don't man Meeto Morales, who's in his nineties
now still doing good, who's a blunka elder, Indigenous elder.
And he years ago came out to visit us. We

(46:50):
became friends and stayed at our lodge like eight years,
just lived with us out there, and so he was
living with us, and so I was really excited, so
I told him because they wanted so I said, I
have an indigenous elders. This will be awesome because I
think it'd be really important for the meeting of the minds,
you know, because they wanted to visit these spears, and
they said, No Memo knows the stories of all these fears.
So they were really excited. I have a blog on

(47:12):
an article about this is called c d the ninth
dimensional goddess that protects the Eosa Peninsula. And so we
met No Memo. We met with the Taoist masters. They came.
We went to different sites near Palmarrto where the ancient
petro spheres are found. And I'm going to get to
Limoria in a bit, because the sphears have to do
with Moo and Limoriah and they don't have Before we

(47:38):
get into this topic specifically, I haven't heard any connection
with ayahuascar Yeahe and Limoria or MoU. But I think
the consciousness that these energetic realities, that the that the
Yahey opens up was they were you know, the Limurians
were for sure tapped into that same and I don't
think they even needed it because they were so pure.
I think their holy plant was the loaded Well there's

(48:00):
information about that, yeah, and so anyway, so the article
that I wrote, which is fascinating and it goes the
Taoist masters in their meditations, we're seeing the Burunka cosmology
because after they came out of these sacred sites we'd meditated,
they shared these encounters with this goddess that told them

(48:22):
all the stuff, and the memo was like that's that's
our stories, and like you're seeing our stories. So I
wrote about that in this article. When you went off
to the Kanyu Island, the Kanyu Island is a very
special place. It's an island that's off the coast right
in front of our lodge, and there's still a few
spheres there. It was an indigenous burial site of pre

(48:45):
Columbian times and it's considered to be a magnetic vortex
compasses go around in circle. Is one of the spots
that's most hit by lightning, and then the other location
in Central America.

Speaker 1 (48:58):
We're gonna take an extra commercial right to allow our
sponsors to identify themselves and will return shortly with my
guests today, Jonathan Miller Weisberger discussing his book Rainforest Medicine,
will be right back. My guest today is Jonathan Miller Weisberger,

(50:01):
and we're discussing sacred plants, plant medicines of the northern
region of the Amazon and just how special this part
of the world is. Thank you. So on this island,
Kanye Island. The uh, the gravity, the magnetic feels very high,

(50:22):
is what.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
You're suggesting, correct?

Speaker 1 (50:24):
Okay? Is there any ruins of buildings there from an
earlier civilization or just these stone spheres in great quantity.

Speaker 3 (50:34):
There's not that many of the stone spheres, just a
few and they're not they're not the mega big ones
like found in Palmer Norte on the mainland just across
from the island, but they're smaller. But there's many, many,
many rock line pits, like hundreds, if not thousands, and
still there's intact in digitous ceremonies anders like insane level

(50:54):
archaeology was found there. That's at the Metropolitan Museum of Art.
And the Gold Section of meso America, like triple gold eagles,
like pound one pound of gold and like three gold
eagles embracing each other. Jaguar head made a solid gold
and jade Moeller's. They were very, very advanced, and these
were navigators, these ancient pre Columbia Corso people's were jade

(51:17):
Carver's and they were navigators and they visited. That's when
you are Zapp talk talks about these spheares of and
they used as navigational sight lines, you know for these
natives who at the right time, they were so skilled
that the patterns and they knew when they could just
drift across as happy, you know, like ego tourists. You know,

(51:38):
it's completely sustainably being blown over.

Speaker 1 (51:40):
That I was gonna ask you, uh, if.

Speaker 3 (51:44):
They pop into ceremonies and Giza. Uh huh.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
I mean, did you do you believe iv are Zapp's
theory that they were navigational tools these stone spheres, because
it doesn't make sense. They're they're solid cut stone, granted,
and I mean maybe they float if you put them
in certain water situations. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (52:08):
No, there they're granite, and I think it's probably close
to impossible, from which I've read some studies say to
replicate them even with modern lays. So back then there
was no way they made anyone made him in the brunka.
What they say about this fears is that there were
very teardrops of compassion from the from the divine realms
that God that when they fell to the earth at

(52:29):
a time of apocalypse, the earth burned up, and there
were like seeds of fire that fell from heaven and
burned the whole earth. There was a time of apocalypse
like before the Great flood, and then from the ashes,
and there are more tear drops of the gods grew
with the first cowtry that gave birth out of the
pod of the CACW pod to the first woman who
gave birth to the first man. But INDI just myths

(52:50):
have to be interpreted, right, so I have some ideas
of what that means, what that could be indicating basically
what kind of interpret well, what can we do interpret
from that, because you know, it seems pretty highly unlikely
that a person would you know, be born out of
a woman, you know, would be born out of a
cow pod. I look at it as more that Cacao
had a very profound impact on transforming culture, you know,

(53:14):
and and these fears basically the alignment was like splattered
by heaven like of course it have to be that way,
like you know, it's like God, you know, throwing down
some speckles onto the planet and the align and so
they will served for so many multiple purposes. One as
you were as that pretty much prob and Ericsson, you know,
they they lay out all the arguments of how they

(53:36):
were used to go to all the Verst sacred sites,
and I can just imagine these old times, you know,
these boss arrassed very deep keels going to popping into
ceremonial life, you know, just going wow, look like like
we go to festivals today and just bugging out and
then just you know, vanishing back across the ocean to
their stomping grounds. But what if these fears were used

(54:00):
for navigation, which is transportation, you know, from one place
to the next. And maybe it's it's here's another idea.
This is even less blow our minds a bit more ready.
So the Taoist masters when they were there, Master Tiang Ying,
who has the Berlin Institute of Chiang Chiang, he is

(54:20):
called it. It's a Chigung institute. I think it's called
She's a Chigung teacher in Berlin, Master Chiang Yin and
her grandmaster Leed Tyeung. They Tiangong is the name of
their group, and they they're very in in connected with
the Limorian realities. And they saw that this CD, this

(54:46):
ninth dimensional goddess explained to them that a thousand years
ago that the people along those coasts, these navigator cultures
that were jade karbers, they could they spent a whole
year carving with their like no tools at all other
than jay dust and a bosaw or a jade carving
to hang on her neck. That thousands of years later

(55:09):
is like the first day was made listening immaculate. And
so these people were so pure that she won basically
appeared to them and said that I'm going to transform
you into the fourth dimension of the water realm, because
there's going to come a time when if you don't
do it now, you won't be able to do it later.
So she transformed all these people into the fourth dimension

(55:32):
of the water reality. And so the memo was shocked
because he said, there's an indigenous legend that a thousand
years ago all the natives along that land committed collective suicide.
Because he's part of the Brunka. He's Brunka. They migrated
from Columbia up into Costainica. They found the series where

(55:54):
they were, and but there was the land was uninhabited.
There was rumors of these people that once live there,
but they all and so and so he we discussed
this like and he even thought about like she thought,
and the memo was is a very intellectual and most

(56:14):
of the Native elders that are versed in the oral
tradition are highly intellectual analytical because these their mythologies and
legends have are so long, and they have so many
aspects of them, and there's so much meaning to it all.
That's their science. They're indigenous science. And he said five
hundred years ago, would makes sense that you know, you

(56:34):
hear about the first arrival of the conquistad Ortis and
killing everyone in their weight. They're like they were so
pure and they they were not afraid of death, and
so you could think how they'd take the leap. A
whole culture would commit collective suicide rather than like Saul
in the Bible, who like fucked ell On is his spear,
you know, instead of getting caught, they'd collect commit undertake

(56:55):
such a crazy act. But a thousand years ago, when
this is like the Christine Paradise five hundred years ago,
before this quote unquote discovery of the Americas, and so
it made us perfect sense that like and you know,
don't know, was like that, I like, that's it, that's it.
He was like a moment of enlightening. The CD, this
ninth dimensional goddess. She transformed the cultures into the water

(57:21):
reality where they still exist today as divide immortals in
the alternate dimension inside the water and get this the masters,
the Daoist master said that CD did this accomplish this
through the use of the spheres, the granite spheres, so
like the spheres had uses that regular people or not regular,

(57:43):
but like advanced navigators with you know, very skilled knowledge
of the earth climatic patterns could use to you know,
travel across the ocean. And then CDA goddess she was
able to use these fears to like save a whole
culture into an alternate dimension inside the water?

Speaker 1 (57:58):
Did she did those did the thinking that the suicide
was so that they could pass into the different dimension.

Speaker 3 (58:08):
Well, that was probably just a way of you know,
like saying that you know, they disappeared because there's indigenous
legend that they all just killed the committed collective suicide
thousand years ago before the Brunkahs arrived as a way
of explaining whether it was underhabited. They just found remnants
of these people in large amounts pottery, all kinds of pottery,

(58:30):
stone work, but that they were gone. So but so
the dow Masters they basically you know, received this informasion
from this ninth dimensional goddess that it wasn't that they
collective committed suicide, they were transformed into an alternate dimension
and then dow Masters that they went in there in
the in the article I speak about that that they

(58:52):
that was masters to their cultivation. They achieved as well
as Shawnman masters extra your ability to be able to
send part of their soul into immortal realms and see
what it's like in there. That's not a few regular
mortals can do. Masters can.

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Damn. It's funny because you were you were talking about
the Taois masters, Dawis masters, whatever. And I wondered if
anybody had considered the stone spheres as some form of
technology or some form of perhaps they have an energy
field or a gravitational fiel that has that these ancient

(59:34):
ones thought were technology of some kind.

Speaker 3 (59:38):
Well, I saw this article that I've searched high and
low for and had not been able to find again
years ago. I saw that it was a someone from
England who photographed the spheres with infrared photography and published
the photos. And there was art and there was messages.
It was not just a granite ball coming out in

(01:00:01):
the photo. You can see like faces of ancient shamans
and like see who it was, Like, yeah, it was
next level. There was like a lock of like archaic
arcastic records, you know, kind of information, right, was coming off.

Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
And what were they doing? They were shining lights into
the stone spheres and this was coming off or they
just used some kind of a technology like an aura
camera or something.

Speaker 3 (01:00:25):
That's what I didn't take the article seriously enough. And
when I went to when when I want to go
back now, I don't even know if it was a thing,
you know, like a pigment of my imagination. I could
never find this, but it was they were doing, settling
up cameras and doing something like you're mentioning, is if
I recall infra red or or imagery of like, you know,

(01:00:46):
resident imageries of these spheres from like I think it
was infrared photographs he was, and then he played with
the photos a bit, you know, to like kind of
make the bring out contrasts and and so. But yeah,
there was much more than this fears coming off of them.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Do the Sequoia people relate to the spheres? Is there
a cosmology that we are not paying attention to that
they talk about that is related to the spheres at all?

Speaker 3 (01:01:16):
Well, just before we get to that, the doomsters they
said something else too. They said that the same goddess
who could be prayed to, They said, her name is Cid.
She protects the Osa Peninsula. She's the ninth dimensional goddess,
divine immortal. She transformed. When Limoria was sinking, the sinking

(01:01:38):
continent of MoU, she translocated a group of giants that
were very noble and took pledges to you know, live
noble lives and celestial pledges they made, so they lived
on the Kanye Island for a long time. After this

(01:02:00):
seeking of Limoria.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
There's a giant a giant race or the actual race.
Some people think that the Melmorians were actually giants.

Speaker 3 (01:02:10):
Yeah, there's church Ward studies of Limoria, which is pretty
far out the criminal church Ward. Yeah, she transformed them
and then she knew that since they were so noble,
that they'd be like massacred, you know, once they were discovered.
So she transformed them into a fourth dimension. And there's
so there's water temples near Kanyo Island where these giants

(01:02:31):
still live, but an alternate dimension. So these the spheres
again are mentioned as tools for transimensional or transportation or
transoceanic transportation. Who knows what else on Earth could come
of these if their studies born over time. But the
Sequoia they don't know about the spheres. There there is

(01:02:51):
an indigenous legend and the Amazon with Amasanga Supai, which
is the spirit of nature where nature and gold deposits
are found, and these are seen in Costainika. And there's
the orbs. So orbs just mentioned of orbs being seen,
I can talk. I can check quite a bit about
that because in our area in Cosaka, we have seen orbs.
But when the Sequoias were at the lodge and they
drank the medicine, they corroborated that these divine and mortals

(01:03:14):
were there because this was before the Doois came and
the Sequoyas, who are you know, bless your hearts, they're
on the other side. Now, these elders they had they
can see visions that regular people we can't see because
they're advanced masters from the whole life of drinking yea
and living in the wildernes. So they called them the
nyan ye sie. Yeah, hoopo pai so Nyanya is the

(01:03:36):
creator ci Ya Hoopo is this high. Cia is the
salty high on c Cia is the salty ocean, the
salty lake, and the Hoopo is from the center. So
anything that has the word hoopo, it comes from the
center of creation. So there's the divine immortals that come
from the center of the creation of the Great Salty Lake,
and they had visions to them and they said that

(01:03:57):
the coast all all off the beach where our Eco
lodges is these fourth dimensional water temples in there, and
they were encountering them. And then when the Dowers came,
they went in there and their visions and they have
these energy swings. They don't need to eat any food.
They look like they're about forty years old, but they're
a thousand years old. The Organs don't perish, and so

(01:04:20):
the Sequoias were really happy because in the Amazon they
have to deal with a lot of heavy stuff, and
so drinking the medicine in their territory oftentimes their sorcery.
They have to set up ar khanas, which takes a
lot of effort to set up, like protection seals around
and so it's a whole Here on Theiosa, they felt
like it was like an open reality and they were

(01:04:41):
able to Like one of the Sequoi elders came and
when he drank and he said he saw the entire
spiritual cosmology. He saw this boat come across the water
and mermaids came out, and all the divine beings came down.
It was just he had the most one of the
most glorious visions that he's never seen in his own country.
They were amazed by the fears. I brought the Sekoy

(01:05:02):
elders to see the sphears and and they they remembered
the legend of Pina. So the creator who I mentioned
earlier in yan Ya Pina who brought and dismissed the
Knypie when he merged the two bundles and made the
same amount of time for day and night, he was born.
And there's a Taoist legend too, they called pang Kaw
that was born from a stone drum. The Sequoya also

(01:05:23):
say Pina was born from a stone drum. So that
immediately was the first thing that came to mind in
the Sequoya saw these fears Pina, that the drum were
out came the creator from.

Speaker 1 (01:05:33):
That amazing Uh. Did the Dallas masters actually do a
plant medicine ceremony with you? Did you prepare the Brew
or did somebody else prepare the Brew?

Speaker 3 (01:05:45):
They didn't prepare. We didn't. They didn't. We didn't even
talk about that. They were on a whole different mission.
They don't even need the brew. Freaking master cheg In.
They was there for ten days and didn't eat anything
the whole time she was there. I mean, these are masters,
they're not regular people, and like they.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Just got regular Probbably.

Speaker 3 (01:06:02):
You're happy like that, you're having you know, like I'm
Champagne and there she wasn't even eating. She did like
the Guayusa tea a lot, though we grew Guayusa tea there. Yeah,
she said, it's one of the finest teas she's tried.
Amazing the Guayusa, which is a yeh but mati relative.
It's ilex Kuayusa and it's it's the longevity tree. It's
the oldest living tree in the Amazon. It's a oscoll.

(01:06:26):
It's the tea that's used for cultural transmission, to drink
in the morning and it inspires conversation. So we we
did drink the Guayusa with them quite a bit. And yeah,
so the lodge is amazing in them. But we have
our our plant, we have we have our ceremonies there
the Rainforest Medicine Council gatherings that we hold once twice
a year. The next one is at the lodge in

(01:06:48):
January and twenty twenty six and then in Ecuador in
this November to Galta's Wilderness. Yeah, to a really nice camp.
About the pet about the orbs? Have you heard about that?
What's your take on those orbs?

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
Or the orbs are in different parts of the world.
We see them in ancient England. Uh, They're actually have
been found at different sites here in the United States.
American Stonehenge apparently has them there. Places where there's ancient
dwellings is one place. But you know, they're also found

(01:07:28):
in daily life, you know. And I don't know if
it's because you have if you have to have people
that are conscious for them to appear, But what's your
feeling on them? Are they Are they in abundance where
you live?

Speaker 3 (01:07:41):
Well? You know, I first heard about these equarters from
the Qischwa. They call them amasanga amazangas, and these amasangas
are the spirit of nature where nature's pristine and we're
deep in the earth and the river's there's gold deposits,
and these fears appear like orbs of light, and the
shamans could have them like merge into their bodies and

(01:08:03):
gain energy and wisdom to heal. And but in Costadica
they're quite common and I heard about him and I
finally I heard about him first from the memo or
bunka elder, and he's heard some amazing stories.

Speaker 1 (01:08:18):
What do they have to say about it? What do
the indigenous people say?

Speaker 3 (01:08:21):
Well, don't mean to live along the banks of Costadika's
largest river, called the Telaba River. And sometimes he gets
it in him in the middle of the night to
go on a bicycle ride down the highway. So he
was telling me he went out of the bike ride
down the highway and this orb came up the river
and it came out over and it came out like
about three hundred meters in front of him and was

(01:08:41):
overy so obviously he stopped his bike and he was
just standing on the middle of the road, just in
the middle, like three in the morning, and then it
dropped down. He's told me with explicit detail. It dropped
straight down like it had weight, and when it hit
the road, it sparked up and he sparks went up
like four meters. In the sparks was a giant black

(01:09:03):
person that ran right there into the rock. And it
turned out that right when the orb dropped it was
a large almost like a door shaped face like thirty
you know, that went up quite like one hundred feet
or thirty meters high a rock, and the being went
just into the rock like if it was you know,

(01:09:23):
a doorway. It just disappeared into the rock.

Speaker 1 (01:09:26):
Amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:09:27):
Yep. And so one time I actually have to admit
I did see one of these orbs. I was with
two other people and thank goodness, was three of us.
Could probably no, I would believe me if it was
just myself, dig get alone. And we were right up
by the cafeteria at their lodge and the full moon

(01:09:48):
was shining beautifully, and I was we were happy with
conversations and we started mining.

Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
Well.

Speaker 3 (01:09:56):
We were like, wow, what a beautiful full moon. Yeah,
look how beautiful the full moon is. And then I
was like, it's not the full moon because I keep
track of the moontime. It's like a crescent moon. And
looked over there was the crested moon. But what there's
the crystal moon. Would have looked back, he was gone.
But for like ten minutes we were there basking in
the beautiful orb light. It was just like a full moon.

Speaker 1 (01:10:17):
Amazing, three of us.

Speaker 3 (01:10:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:19):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
So you don't see orbs on a regular basis when
you're doing ceremony or you're with the Sequoia people or whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:10:30):
Now it's the orb is an advanced vision. To see
the orbs, you have to have a lot of virtue
or you have to do diets, dietas and the orbs
like I say, these are amasanga soup i'es believe there's this.
It's a spirit of nature. So it comes to you
and comes to the people when they're ready. It has
its purpose. It's like you know, like sometimes you if
you go out into the ocean and I'm floating out

(01:10:53):
in front of our lodge, it's amazing. You can hear
the whales singing. It's like an amphithea or the whales.
They be hundreds of one hundred miles. The way you
can hear them singing, the way their sound travels through
the water is just incredible.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
With a little with a snorkeling mask, you can see
like amazing little creatures floating by there like sacred geometry,
very intricate little sea creatures floating by What purpose does
that sea creature have? You know, like a little microsopics,
Just super beautiful little sea creature, like translucent like jellyfish
type thing. Right. Wow, the orb is the same it

(01:11:28):
just happens to be something bigger that floats around once
in a while, like there's like Earth when it's in
the prestige. That's what's so wonderful. The Daoist master said,
the Osa Peninsula has to be protect it. It's like
a celestial island.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
It has to do with energy though, because I know
when I'm in Maya Land, which is Mexico, and looking
at an ancient archaeological park, there's certain pyramids that attract orbs.
In fact, they've been photographed and it's an energetic thing.
There's energy. A lot of these pyramids were built over
uh Tolleric energy fields, and I think that the the

(01:12:07):
the orbs are are attracted or perhaps they're even generated
by the said dimensional portal or something.

Speaker 3 (01:12:16):
Yeah. No, the that makes that brings it into what
the phenomena of the Ayahuasca world, thea tekuna or believe orbs,
or that out of the orbs comes seekret geometry. They
can be there. There's there's no Don Pablo on Marico,
our great friend and spiritual mentor, Don Pablito, who had

(01:12:37):
a good portrait of befriendly his cover. His artwork graces
the cover of my book, Reinforce Medicine. He encouraged so
much that book to be written because when we were friends,
he came to the lodge three times.

Speaker 1 (01:12:49):
I was gonna say that paintings looking like Ayahuasca journeys beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:12:54):
Of course, and he has there's a book that you know,
if if people haven't seen that, the iconography of the
proving shaman divisions of Ayahuasca visions by Don Pablo Almardigo
are incredible insights into the visionary realities that these elder
shamans perceive and can witness and be testimony of. But
in some cases he shows orbs coming in other it's

(01:13:15):
like trend it's like sacred geometry. But these tiagunas are
like portals, so they're the way the divine supertle, you know,
higher dimensional energies enter into this three D reality where
we are temporarily. They come through the orbs or through
the tuna, the portals passageways.

Speaker 1 (01:13:38):
We're gonna take a short commercial break to allow our
sponsors to identify themselves, and will return shortly with my
guests today, Jonathan Miller Weisberger discussing his book Rainforest Medicine,
will be right back. My guest today is ethnobotanist Jonathan

(01:14:42):
Miller Weisberger. He's coming to us today from Costa Rica
and he has spent a good portion of his life
studying the indigenous people of the Amazon as well as
the sacred plant medicines that are cultivated there. Amazing. Hey,
I want to get into Cacau here regarding an article

(01:15:05):
you wrote, but before I jump into that, on these giants,
these Limorian giants, you're saying that they were transformed into
a different dimension and they're still on the island. But
what do we know about the giants? Is there anything?
Is there any local mythology or lore regarding their existence?

Speaker 3 (01:15:29):
You know, amongst there is legends, not that many amongst
the natives of South America that I've lived amongst the Sequolitas,
and they talk more about small spirits like Mannahuoni South
Hawaiian Manahni's a little pig, small spirits. But there's been,
you know, I of course, quite extensive research that can

(01:15:52):
be found about giants and hobby South America, and I
think there was different racism giants from what I understand,
nobal one that were very noble in others that were
not as noble. So it's it's a field of study
that I haven't had the opportunity yet to go down
that far.

Speaker 1 (01:16:12):
So yeah, cool, great, all right.

Speaker 3 (01:16:16):
But the artist amazing is that the giants of the CD.
Since she's a divine motal, she saved the giants from Lamoria.
They were very noble race. They had taken They shared
with us that they had taken oaths, celestial oaths to
help basically, you know, maintain things as they are and
keep the peace, so to say, you know, they have powers.
So they they had. CD saved these giants that were

(01:16:38):
living after Lemoria sank on the Kanye Island by transforming
them into a protected as she did with the coastal
people's fourth dimensional water temples, like inside the water, scuba
divers can't see them because there was you know, scuba
divers is going to go down there and see you know,
white tip ree sharks and you know, like parrotfish. But

(01:17:00):
on the fourth dimentioned they're inside the water, these giants.
So it's interesting that that cave into being as you know,
related with the spears.

Speaker 1 (01:17:10):
Yeah, that's a great story. I haven't heard that before.
Oh wait, talk about the article cacao, the World tree
and her planetary mission. This is an article you wrote
and I had to say this. I've been fascinated with
cancao for decades because it's thought that it was one
of the gifts from Quetzaquattle, the Mayan god. Uh, it

(01:17:37):
was a gift from him, and it's a superfood in
many ways. But talk about the energy behind this article.

Speaker 3 (01:17:49):
Yeah, it is a super food in all regards to
the term. Raw cocu powder is the highest ranking on
the ORG scale of anti antioccidents as the most antioxidants
of any known food supplement, which is of itself amazing

(01:18:11):
knowing the effects and anti oxidens out on the body.
So that's that makes some of course, if it's the
food of the gods, and you know is some and uh,
like you mentioned, you know the legend of questal Quatto
bringing questal Cuado was the god of culture who transformed

(01:18:32):
culture and about the early people so many skills, literally
taught them civilization right and brought cacao. But uh, according
to the genetics by the name of Omar Cornell, he
studied the old cacao varieties. He says that their co

(01:18:55):
cow strains come from the Amazon originally and the oldest
known are archeological remnants of cacau use utensils come from
Ecuador on on the eastern slopes of the Andes, and
the mon archaeological cycle left Florida and a culture known
as the Mayo chin Chipe and five five hundred year
old beautiful red jasper arakati which is the small two

(01:19:19):
con bowls and then clay bowls too. All the clay
vessels that we used for pouring cacao are holding you know,
jug with two spouts merging into one spout. So it's
again like the using cacao is the phenomenon to bring
two sides together spirit matter, you know, oppose your opposite,

(01:19:45):
the merging of opposites. So cacao, like all cigaret places
kind of we could say, used to help us approach
a non dual the non dual reality. And that's always
that the has been the stry for, you know, for
you know, first nation peoples is to stay close always
to the non dual reality while we're living in the

(01:20:08):
you know, dual reality, and to hold the truth of
non duality in the realms bounded by duality, you know,
the indigenous culture and traditions. You can say all our
you know, technologies to help us sustain that one act
there our entire life. They can view it as like,

(01:20:29):
for example, like when you're born, it's like diving into
a river and you're swimming underwater, holding your breath until
you pop out to the other side. Is when in
this world we die boom. They were back in the
spirit room. And like they say, like the physical awakened
reality is like a shadow of the spirit world. Master
and he says the proportion of the physical realms to

(01:20:49):
the spiritual realms could be looked at as less than
one to four quadrillion. So we live on this planet
for purpose to you know, to like you know, maybe
work something out so that we can learn experience the
wake in reality before you go back to a higher reality.
So these cacao bowls that have two spots going into one,
which I find fascinating, I interpret that as definitely cacao

(01:21:12):
because all of them are like that was used for.

Speaker 1 (01:21:16):
So describe describe the ball because I've always wondered if
it's if they're venting getting air into the mixture somehow
because of those tubular shapes, or maybe that's just something
to hold on to. I don't know, it.

Speaker 3 (01:21:29):
Could be something to hold on to because it's practical,
like you know, because there's two years a bowl and
then two two determintive spots, so that it does offer
a handle and the kid oxygen as well. Usually the
cacao is highly frothed the Aztecs in the code Ses,
there's instructions they froth. They like the cacaw well frothed
with a outer of quandity, bad flowers, certain flowers they

(01:21:51):
dry of cacao relatives that have been unique aromas and
powder that and there's many recipes. But what's amazing is
that the cacaw is brought to Mexico most likely by
intercultural exchange, because there was you know, I haven't intercultural
exchange in pre Columbian times. That's shown because you know,
like for example, pasta rica you find oh mec jade,

(01:22:13):
and many foods were brought up, such as cacao. And
so what amazes me is how profound and the impact
the cow has been on Central American cultures, Like it's
even in the Popol Vu and the you know, the
creation of the hero twins when they find the outsmart
every possible trap of the gods of death. Everyone day

(01:22:35):
out smart, but they know that they count outsmart the
last one. So they saw sacrifice themselves, throw themselves into
the fire, and then are the gods and death are furious.
They also defang the gods of death seriously that hold
bout and made them less harmful. They're thrown into the river.
They swim off as fish. That's why the Mayan asked

(01:22:56):
the Omec and then is and then Maya. The Maya
stand out at the old Mac and their language and
culture of the word cacao comes from Omek. First the
glyph is of of like a man looking up or
like the hero at the hero twins with fishkills and
cacao means two fish, and it's like so they say
that cow gives the energy like fish to swim through

(01:23:16):
the rapids of life, the rapids of the water. But
and then out comes the cacao tree is born from this,
but it's originally underneath and like the the underworlds like
a garden that nobody can look at. It's like a
cow tree that spat on the the daughter of the
god of Death's hand when she disobeyed his advice that
don't go anyone to my garden. Of course, the daughter

(01:23:38):
of the god of death goes and sees it. Her
hand gets spot on because the first her parents, the
first hero two were sacrifice immediately because they were too noble,
they were too simple. They didn't And then so their
heads are hung on this tree, which is like a
cow tree. It'd split the blue light onto her head.
And there's a whole song in the popol vu with
the copal, you know, that blinds the guy so she

(01:24:00):
can escape. And then those are born, and then they
become ballplayers that make so much noise, and again this
time they're more savvy. But so Cacao is such a
mystic tree. And then you know and and like you know,
as mentioning the Brunca legend of Cacao being born from
the tudor ups of God to be, you know, the

(01:24:20):
outcoming of fish humanity. That to me, that says it
totally transformed culture. There's may I pottery showing Chuck, the
god of agriculture, exchanging Cacao, and the thunder God exchanging
Cacau with east Shell, the godess of fertility and medicine. Right,
so you know it could be the cacao or the
phenomena of cacau. Like what cacao does to you know,

(01:24:42):
how delates us is the phenomena that pertains the spiritual
realms because alkaloids, you know, can be found on many
other plants, but co cow's unique mixture, you know, theo
bruma and what that does in the bodies like opening.
That's why like modern day like they say cacao ceremony,
what theobromine is like affects the center like the hard chakra.

Speaker 1 (01:25:01):
So yeah, it's a very powerful, uh, stimulant and healer.
But what is there a variety that they use of
cacao that they turn into cocoa or chocolate or is
it just that they cook the seeds and that's what
we get today for present day cocoa.

Speaker 3 (01:25:21):
There's a there's a team bank of a cacao Gebak
in Trinidad and Tobago that has over two thousands varieties
of cacao. It's amazing how many varieties there are. Wow.
The ones that go into like the mainstream you know,
consumer flow of chocolate or cacao beads are usually hybridized.
They require a lot of pesticide. It's it's the cacao,
like all sacred plants that make yourself, you know, bring

(01:25:44):
get brought out into the world, has a lot of
It's like the sword, the double edged sword on the
one handed. You know, it does both good and also harm.

Speaker 1 (01:25:52):
There's a lot of like because of the mass growth,
commercial farming, and they got to grow it quicker, so
they're going to add harm. Not hormones, but enhancers and
things like that.

Speaker 3 (01:26:03):
Well, also because it grows in the wettest parts of
the planet, which is also the most diverse part. So
the tropical wet forest on the eastern slopes and western
slopes of the Indies, it's the most diverse part of
the region. Has been greatly deforced for chocolate tree plantations,
you know, turning like a forest that has three hundred
species of trees pro hector into one tree, and consequently

(01:26:25):
there's cocw blights. So there's a lot of So it's
hard to find organic basically cacao because a lot of
it is if you beginning, I think cow is brought
to Africa. There's a lot of deforestations, there's childhood slavery.

Speaker 1 (01:26:36):
I kind of believe that when I read that in
your article and there's a huge cocw uh plantations in Africa.

Speaker 3 (01:26:45):
There's been class actual lawsuits against the big companies to
prove that another cocow comes, but it's kind of silence.
It's hard to track. But ultimately, you know, coco is
a super food and her message. I call it the
world tree because it's one tree that gotten around the
entire globe. Who doesn't know chocolate, right, So, and it's
also it's kind of symbolic of the world tree that

(01:27:08):
could be maybe seen as the tree of life in Genesis.
You know, Adam and eve Ache from the Tree of
Knowledge that were given were booted out of the garden
of Eden, but the Tree of Life was protected by
divine hours. I think we're the cultural beams were to
protect this tree, so that the knowledge of the Tree
of life. But what does that mean? So if the

(01:27:29):
sages that are able to perceive the wisdom, the knowledge
of the Tree of life have aligned themselves with celestial
virtues so that the divine the guardians, the celestial gardens
that are protecting the Tree of life allowed them to
receive this wisdom. And so I think cacao is one
of those trees because if people see her as the

(01:27:50):
representative of the precious element water. Without water, we'd all
be dead. It's the most precious element, way more valuable
than gold or any or anything else that's considered highly
valuable in this time. And so Cacao she comes from
the most the wettest part of the planet. So consequently

(01:28:10):
she's a representative, the ambassador for water. We're just not
seeing her that way yet. And for diversity, there's I
study permaculture. There's a there's like an interconnecting cycle in
permaculture that speaks of diversity, engenders fertility and fertility and
genders stability and stability in gender's diversity. It's like a triangle,

(01:28:34):
like a circle that's like in perpetual unison. So basically,
without diversity, we can't have fertility nor stability, diversity and
genders stability stability, and gender's fertility and fertility and gender's diversity.
So it's so Picao is the representative of the most
of the peak pinnacle of planetary botanical diversity. So I

(01:28:56):
think if we can see her as that and aligned
with heavily virtues, Cacao can become part of helping improve
the quality of life of people, both where she it's
grown and all the world over, both in health her health.

(01:29:16):
The cacao is not just a superfood, is also a
health tonic. People who consume rock cocau daily will be
much healthier and it can heal a lot of ailments
if it's taken like you know, like rock cow in
the morning, like a remedy every day. The Natives have
three types of cacao. According to Bruca, there's a bitter

(01:29:37):
cacaw that's used as medicine for healing all ailments. The
sickle to drink bitter cacao every morning on an empty
stomach and they'll heal whatever they got going on, and
it could be from high level antioxidants and the other
amazing things that hasn't it's as well, there was this sweet,
a neutral cacao that wasn't too sweet nor too bitter

(01:29:59):
for daily use as food. And then the sweet cocow
was for ceremonies, for weddings and for festivals.

Speaker 1 (01:30:08):
Yeah. Uh, I didn't realize that the raw cacao as
well as the prepared cocou was considered a super food.
You mentioned the antioxidants, uh, but there's also properties that appear,
and I wanted to ask you a little bit about
the spiritual side of it. If it's used in a

(01:30:32):
ceremonial fashion, uh, to enhance meditation or enhance spiritual journeying,
that's not necessarily psychoactive.

Speaker 3 (01:30:44):
That's one of the most douible plants for our cocau.
I mean, it does have some caffeine and theobromine, but
most people probably you know, can handle that. It's not
It's a lot of people that you know would never
dare drink ayahuasca could benefit greatly from cacao and it's not.
And then theogin so it's just more like a but
the cow is I believe active based like the finest

(01:31:07):
gland in the heart chok or. So it helps people
to open their hearts more. With continual use, people are
stuck holding on to grudges, so the cacciumony gives us
that extra nudge. I think it's a modern day thing.
It might have been, you know. Cacao has always been
used ceramon instantation times as a form of community with
divine energy with the gods, basically the name theobroma's food

(01:31:29):
of the gods, but when used in the modern day setting.
I've participated in ca causumeries that are very enriching and healing,
where you know, people sit together and drink cocao and
usually you know, talk about something that perturbs you, something
that's holding you back in your heart, you know, so
you talk about it, you get it off your chest.
People cry together, they laugh together, people feel more relieved.
So that can be very healing. So it's it's centered

(01:31:52):
around like heartwarming. Opportunity to unpack rudge is maybe you know,
like they're say in Hawaii, forgive and pardon, to forgiveness
and pardoning ourselves and others, we can come to like,
you know, peace on things.

Speaker 1 (01:32:11):
Mm hmm, fantastic, Jonathan. We can speak for hours. Uh,
wonderful world that you live in as an ethnobio Uh botanist.
Uh what do you want to leave us with? Uh?
What's what's some wisdom from your part of the world
for us modern ah seekers.

Speaker 3 (01:32:37):
Well, cacao can be purchased at Kayati k A L
L A R I. And he's like Kayati talk to
company from Ecuador the past. In these past, President of
the future, they're restoring the greatest farmland. It's an amazing
source of wholesome, energetically high quality cacao. And but yeah,

(01:32:57):
what I'd like to say is, you know, back to
where you know the begin Thank you so much Cliff
for having me on, for having this opportunity to share.
We have, you know, quite a few projects going. Just
maintained the lodge, like we got the ocean rows and
we had a very strong RADI season last year to
wash out our bridge. We were working on a thin budget,
so we're raising funds to build a new bridge out
to the lodge. We have a Perma Culture teaching center

(01:33:19):
that's still a fledged league and we're trying to you
eventually get out. We have half the materials ready to
build attle volunteer teaching center. We support projects in Equador.
So we can't receive donations through the Living Bridges Foundation
for our work. I'd love to we have that, you know,
it's basically that I don't know how we could share

(01:33:39):
that with people, but.

Speaker 1 (01:33:40):
It's living what's the web address? Give us the web
address and I'll also place it. I'll also place it
on the show notes so people can go there.

Speaker 3 (01:33:51):
Okay, great, Yeah, So donations can be made tax deductible
in the United States, through the Living Bridges Foundation, which
is a five O one see through non profit organization,
and the website to that is basically the Living Bridges Foundation.
And let me just pull that up because kind of
cart mef guard. I really appreciate you bringing that up.

(01:34:14):
So that's some Living Bridges Foundation dot org. Perfect, And
then my work is the main site. Our family business
is the Oceanforest Ecolodge. That's Oceanforest dot org. And we
have a blog there too, and we have a visitor
center and that's in that's in Coasta Eca on the
Osa Peninsula. It's surrounded by wildlife. It's a nature sanctuary.

(01:34:37):
We have moved from to twenty three visiting guests. This
January twenty twenty six, we have our classic all Time
Rainforest Medicine Council gatherings. Those are posted on my book's
website under the link that's his gatherings. It's Rainforest Medicine
dot net and you can read about the book. There's
videos about the treatises. Yeah hey, and you'll see the

(01:34:57):
retreats are posted there. Both Ecuador, we go out to
the Knapoca let Us Wilderness this November twenty first and
twenty ninth. I would love for some of your listeners
to join us and be wonderful. And also there are
Rainforce Medicine Council gathering in Costaika which would be the
seventeenth of January to the twenty ninth of January in
twenty twenty six. Fantastic, Yes, So, Oceanforest dot org is

(01:35:22):
the lodge, Rainforestmedicine dot net is the book and the retreats,
the medicine retreats and then the Living Bridges Foundation dot
org to donate to our work if you'd like to
tax exempt status for your donation, yep.

Speaker 1 (01:35:40):
And you lead, you lead seminars a couple of times
a year down there, right.

Speaker 3 (01:35:46):
Yeah, we do our what we call our Rainforce Medicine
Council gatherings. Those are bi annual two times a year
in Nequarter and then in Costa Eka and those are
seven day wilderness immersions. Was really good yet to Filly Neils.
We have a very good chef and we the opportunity
for people to experience the plant medicine ceremonies an authentic
fashion and so we we do wilderness trekking and because

(01:36:09):
I think has a bit more plush, because we have
the cabins and that wit where it's wildern is camping.
So it's more for people who like to experience the
elements really close up. Because you think, we have our
beautiful cabins right on the beach, and we have a
beautiful ceremony lodge up on the hill of beautiful facility.
That's just really really wonderful.

Speaker 1 (01:36:28):
Yeah, fantastic, Jonathan, A pleasure, really great to meet you
and get to know about the details of the book
and your work and continued success in what you're doing.
I think you're doing a great job and I really
appreciate speaking with you.

Speaker 3 (01:36:46):
Oh, thank you so much. It's been a great shot
to meet you that I really appreciate this opportunity to share.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (01:37:01):
Check the Facebook page for some images from Jonathan, not
only the rainforest photographs, but some of the beautiful types
of fruit that are derivatives from cacao, from Ayahuasca. The
plants that they use are just many of them are
gorgeous plants and you don't see them because they're deep

(01:37:25):
in the rainforest and they don't last very long without
you know, staying in the ground. So interesting the interview.
Fun to have him on the program, and a lot
that I didn't expect in that interview that was made
it memorable. It was fun to have him on the program. Hey,

(01:37:45):
I want to mention I am really excited about our
new Megalithic Egypt tour coming up April twenty eighth through
May tenth. We're all gonna meet in Cairo. The itinerary
is such that most of the sites we go to
we'll have private visits, and this is where you need
to have a expert tour guide with us who can

(01:38:08):
open doors. And what makes us fun is that we
get out, we get to touch, we get this walk
among these amazing sites, and the concluding event is a
walk inside the Great Kufu Pyramid. I've been talking about
this forever and this tour is special because it's everywhere

(01:38:29):
we go to is unique special. We get to climb
in pyramids, we get to climb on temples and sacred sites.
It's fun to be a part of that tour. I'm
excited about it because we're all will almost half full
right now and I want to get as many people
on this tour as possible. For the full itinerary and
details go to Earth Ancients dot com. Four Slash Tours.

(01:38:54):
You'll see the full itinerary. If you have any questions whatsoever,
send me an email. Send it to the ancients the
number four of the letter you at gmail dot com
and I'll get right back to you. All of our
tours are reasonably priced and we even have payment plans
if you're a little tight. So come out join us
for twenty twenty six, the seventh annual Grant Egyptian Tour

(01:39:17):
April twenty eighth through May tenth. Come on and see us.
All right, that's it for this program. I want to
thank my guest today, Jonathan Miller Weisberger, coming to us
from Costa Rica. As always, the team of Guil Tour,
Mark Foster and Faeiya in Pakistan. You guys rock all right,

(01:39:38):
take care if you will, and we will talk to
you next time.

Speaker 2 (01:40:05):
Another rainy afternoon. I don't know what I'm to do.
I just miss you more than anything. It's way to
quiet in the house. I'm just waste it on the
couch because I don't want to feel anything. Wish you

(01:40:25):
stay stayed here excited me. This isn't how it's supposed
to be.

Speaker 3 (01:40:34):
Wish you stay stay here with me?

Speaker 2 (01:40:41):
I can't shame the feeling

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