March 10, 2025 • 29 mins
Join us for an enlightening conversation with Dr. Joe Sanfelippo, a retired school superintendent whose experiences and insights are transforming the educational landscape. In this episode, we explore his journey from classroom to leadership, emphasizing the importance of authenticity and vulnerability in education. Joe shares how his daily “One Minute Walks” revolutionized his leadership, connecting directly with educators and building a community of support and recognition.
As a prolific author known for titles like "Hacking Leadership" and "Lead From Where You Are," Joe underscores the significance of using social media as a tool for school branding, enabling educators to celebrate their work and achievements. His perspective on how to create a positive narrative amid prevalent challenges offers essential guidance for educational leaders seeking to inspire change.
Listeners will gain valuable insights into the balance of leadership responsibilities and the power of recognition in the educational community. Joe emphasizes that great leadership is not just about making sound decisions, but also about cultivating relationships, fostering a sense of community, and celebrating successes. This episode aims to inform, inspire, and encourage aspiring leaders to embrace their roles within their schools.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Principal JL (00:00):
Welcome back everybody.
I'm so excited to bring youguys today's episode.
Today's guest is someone I'vebeen following since 2022.
I first saw him speak at theNETA conference in Omaha,
Nebraska.
I also got to see him speak atthe ESU 11 fall workshop that we
did, and it was really great tosee him as that keynote speaker
(00:24):
.
He's also been at the NebraskaAdministrator Days.
I've also seen him speaknationally at the National
Convention as well, and so I'mreally excited to bring on Dr
Joe Sanfelippo onto the showtoday.
Just so you guys know, he is aretired superintendent of Fall
Creek School Districts inWisconsin.
(00:44):
He's an educational leader andauthor.
During his tenure at Fall CreekSchool District, they were
recognized as the innovativedistrict twice by the
International Center forLeadership and Education.
Joe authored multiple books,including bestsellers such as
Hacking Leadership and Lead Fromwhere you Are, He's also got a
(01:06):
brand new book out called OneMinute Walk to Work, which is a
collection of his 100 walks towork that he posted on his
Twitter and Instagram accounts,and so you actually can still
see some of that work going ontoday as well, and so he
actually created this book andit's really great read.
I encourage you to pick it up.
He's been honored as one of the117 future-ready
(01:29):
superintendents and among the 50personalized learning leaders
by the US Department ofEducation.
Joe was also named one of the100 most influential educators
by District AdministrationMagazine in 2019.
Educators by DistrictAdministration Magazine in 2019.
(01:49):
Education Dive awarded him theNational Superintendent of the
Year.
So I'm really excited to bringyou this episode where Joe and I
got to sit down.
We got to talk about hiseducational journey.
Without further to do, here'sour conversation with Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
Hey there, educational leaders.
(02:14):
It's great to be back to bringyou guys another episode of the
Educational Leadership withPrincipal JL podcast.
Today I have a special guest.
He has been around the block awhile for being an educational
leader, someone that actually Ihave looked up to over my
leadership journey, and I'mreally excited to bring to you
(02:36):
guys today Dr Joe Sanfelippo.
Welcome, joe, to the show.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (02:43):
Oh, thanks so much for having me.
I appreciate the opportunity.
It's great to see you, Jeff.
Principal JL (02:46):
We're going to go ahead.
I'm going to dive right in toyour story.
So what was it that?
What was the reason for you toget into education?
What is it to?
Hey, I want to be a teacher,you know, into the principal
side and then eventually intothe superintendent's day.
Can you kind of just take usback and tell us that journey
(03:08):
through your educational journey?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (03:10):
I think the first thing was I just liked
working with kids and I thinkthat was probably the biggest
thing.
And I had a coach that at onepoint I was doing a basketball
camp for him and he saw me doinga drill with a bunch of kids
and they were all excited aboutstuff that we were doing and he
just kind of came over to me inbetween drills and said, have
you ever thought about likedoing this for real, like for a
(03:32):
real job?
And I was still in high schoolat the time and um, and I said,
well, yeah, you know I want tocoach.
I don't know if I want to teach, but I like being around kids.
And he's like you should reallylike at least look into it,
because you know these kidsreally respond to what you're
telling them and they allgravitate towards you during the
(03:53):
breaks and you know if you canmake some, some kids happy and
help them, it's a pretty goodlife.
So that's kind of.
So that's kind of where itstarted and then it just kind of
kept going.
I liked leading as a secondgrade teacher and then I liked
it as a fifth grade teacher andthen I started doing some
(04:14):
counseling because I wanted tohave a little bit bigger impact.
And then a principal job openedup in a place that my wife was
really interested in moving toat some point.
It just kind of came up fasterthan we had anticipated, and so
we get there and everything'sworked out since then.
Principal JL (04:35):
All right, and then from your principalship.
Then what got you into being asuperintendent?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (04:41):
Well, I was in a really good principal
position and, um, like, justgood people in claire, wisconsin
, really good people, a greatschool, we were just everything
was going really well and I kindof felt like I needed um, you
know, I liked building it, Iliked helping build it and it
(05:05):
was.
I think it was at that pointwhere I think, um, you know,
they didn't need what I couldprovide at that time.
They kind of needed somethingelse to to keep moving forward
for other jobs, you know, inthat same area, and applied for
one and it didn't work out.
(05:25):
And the next day after itdidn't work out, I got a call
from the superintendent in FallCreek and he said hey, why don't
you come on out and take a look?
This place is pretty special.
He had been the superintendentfor a while and then he came
back to kind of help out in aninterim role and he said come on
out, just take a look at it,it's pretty special.
And I walked in and it was.
(05:45):
It was from the second that Iwalked in I knew it was special.
So I was principal there for ayear and he told me he was going
to stick around for a while andthen maybe the superintendency
would be something that, if Iwas interested, we could talk
about what it looks like.
And after a year he decidedthat he was done.
He said you're going to begreat, you don't need me around,
you're going to be fantastic.
(06:06):
So he moved on and I took thesuperintendency and then I did
that for 12 years.
That ended up being the jobthat I did the longest.
Principal JL (06:14):
Oh, wow.
So how long were you a teacher,then a principal, and then I
know you were 12 years into thesuperintendency
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (06:21):
I was a teacher for eight?
uh, counselor for eight,counselor for four, that can't
be right.
Teacher for eight, counselorfor four, and uh, and a
principal, no, that's right.
Teacher for six.
Counselor for three, uh,principal for like what would be
(06:46):
, because I did both roles for awhile.
So principal for like six andthen a and then a superintendent
for 12,
Principal JL (06:56):
awesome, awesome
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (06:56):
to get to 26 trying to do math.
Principal JL (07:00):
I'm sorry if I'm, yeah right on the spot on that
one.
Yeah, so this is kind of where,like I know, like Fall Creek is
kind of where I've seen you,because I follow you on Twitter
or X now, where you kind of doyour daily walks and you do your
little daily one minute talksand so I really find those
(07:22):
things really valuable and kindof been following your career
for, I would say, a good five,five, six years roughly.
One of the things is is I haveseen you do presentations, doing
workshops and different things.
I saw you in I think this wasthe book that you co-authored
(07:45):
Hacking Leadership 10 Ways GreatLeaders Inspire Learning that
Teachers, students and ParentsLove.
I remember, you know you beingat ESU 11 in Holdridge doing
those things.
That's where I got the book.
But I also seen you kind of likein the Nebraska Administrator
Days.
I've seen you kind of like inthe Nebraska Administrator Days.
(08:05):
I've seen you at the nationalconferences.
So you know just your body ofwork.
You know with you know yourhacking leadership.
You know you got the lead fromwhere you are.
You have the Changing Narrativeseries and now the One Minute
Walk to Work book that is comingout, kind of like what took you
from, how does that allintertwine, from being an
(08:27):
educational leader,superintendent at Fall Creek and
how did that all just transpire.
And you can kind of take onething after another and kind of
layer it out just to give peoplean idea of kind of what, how
that all came about.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (08:43):
I think the books kind of just started as a
we.
You know, it's funny becausethe book started my friend Tony
and I, who wrote the books, wewrote the books together.
We were at an Ed camp in NewJersey and it must've been in
2000, man, I want to say 13,something like that.
And uh, we were.
We I had been a superintendentfor like three years or two
(09:05):
years and he was a principal andso we were talking about some
stuff.
But we went to an ed camp inNew Jersey because my in-laws
lived out there, my brother andsister-in-law lived out there,
so we were going out forThanksgiving and there was an ed
camp prior to Thanksgiving.
So I thought, well, I'm goingto go check this out.
So I did and get me.
So I thought, well, I'm gonnago check this out.
So I did, and uh, and westarted.
(09:26):
We did a kind of a breakoutsession on changing the
narrative and a day later, um,we had some people from like the
um ed tech chat group reach outand, um, ask us if we wanted to
run a chat, like on that monday.
And so then that turned likeeverybody had a great time with
the chat and there was a ton ofpeople there.
And then the next thing, youknow, we had Corwin Peter DeWitt
(09:52):
from.
He was doing a series withCorwin, the Corwin group, and
decided to and gave us a calland asked if we would be willing
to write like a mini book onbranding, on school branding.
So that kind of took off andthat went really well.
And then we wrote another bookwith that series called
Principal ProfessionalDevelopment.
And then Tony and I connectedwith a guy named Mark Barnes
(10:14):
who's a fantastic leader anddoes a great job with Times 10
Publishing and we were to uhconnect with him and he had a
great process for writing uh,and the process, uh was the
hacking series.
So we jumped in on the hackingseries and uh wrote the, the
hacking leadership book, and itwas just, it was a really fun
(10:36):
project and so we kind of didthat and and then, um, you know,
that's kind of how those, thosekind of books came apart and
then the other ones Lead Fromwhen you Are came up, because I
started doing those walk to workvideos.
Then we tried to figure outways that we kind of put them
into a series of of you know,you know like sequence, and try
(10:56):
to figure out that ways that wecould put them into a situation
that you know, or into a, into atext that would work out.
And uh, I am press publishedthat one with George Curls and
and he was fantastic to workwith too I've had, I've been
very lucky to work with,publishers that were really good
I've worked with, connectedwith Jimmy Casas and Jeff soul
and his group as well, and youknow, there everybody's just
(11:18):
been really good, um, and reallykind of lets you get your voice
out there.
So I've been extremely blessedto be able to work with the
people I've worked with.
Principal JL (11:30):
Yeah, you kind of mentioned something about school
branding, right?
I remember you doing a sessionon that and you just talked
about, you know, hey, doingthese quick videos or these
quick things to kind ofhighlight the great things that
are going on in your school.
And, to be honest with you, Itook that and ran with it as a,
(11:50):
as a principal, because, youknow, one of the things that I
took away from that was, hey,people don't see what's going on
behind our closed doors.
So let's lean into the socialmedia aspect, let's show people
all the great things that aregoing on so people get a
positive you know view of what'sgoing on in the education
(12:11):
building, because you know aswell as I do people, you know,
they know school from when theywere in school.
It doesn't mean it's the sameas a one-time yeah, probably not
.
But at the same time, yeah, andwith some of the negativity you
see in education, being able tohave that positive brand is
super important.
I know for my current position,one of the things we really
(12:33):
stress is getting our messageout, because the high school I'm
a principal out right now um,there was hardly any social
media, uh, footprint, but afterthree years we got a lot bigger
footprint, a lot of really goodthings, um, people are getting
out pushing out really greatcontent for our community, for
our kids, and really celebratingall the great things in our
(12:56):
building.
So that all transpired.
Because I sat in that onesession that you kind of talked
about, and so I would say thankyou for that, because that's
something I took and ran forsure.
And I kind of want to go backto your one-minute walks.
You talked about how theone-minute walks kind of put you
(13:18):
into the lead, where you are,stuff.
So what was it that?
Hey, I'm going to press record,I'm going to do these
one-minute walk to work stuff.
What was it that?
Hey, I'm going to press record,I'm going to do these one
minute walk to work stuff.
What was it that inspired youto do that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (13:27):
That's a great question.
I think it's good and it's good.
The answer is is like you know,it's, it's, it's not
groundbreaking.
Let's just be honest about it.
I mean, the thing is like Ilive across the street from
school and on Saturday morningsI'd get up and I'm super loud,
so I'd have to figure out a wayto just get out of the house.
(13:49):
So I'd just walk over to schooland just hang out at school
until my family woke up, becauseI didn't want to wake them up.
And so on my way over there Ijust started recording some
videos and then people startedto like them after a while.
So I kept making them and then,after I was making them, then
people liked them more and thenI just kind of kept them going.
(14:10):
I think that was at about thetime.
I think it hit at the right timebecause there was a lot of
people on Twitter at that time,a lot of people on X that were,
you know, a lot of educatorsthat were engaging and the and
the views there's like a ton ofpeople watch those videos.
So then it kind of inspired meto do more, because I kept
getting asked when I was goingto do the next one when I was
(14:30):
going to do the next one, and soto be able to just keep it
going, uh was was pretty, prettyimportant for me, and so I kind
of I did ended up doing ahundred walks between 2019 and
2023.
And then, um, I just starteddoing them again.
(14:53):
Um, recently I took a year offbecause I didn't want people to
think I was still walking toschool, cause that's not fair to
the people that are doing realwork.
So I didn't want to make that athing.
So now I started doing themagain.
Now I do them in differentplaces.
I rarely do them in Fall Creekanymore.
We have a place in northernWisconsin.
(15:15):
I'll do them there, or myin-laws house or whatever.
So just changes.
Principal JL (15:21):
Yeah, well, I know those one minute to walks were
a lot of fun for a lot of peopleto look at and just, you know,
hey, you know this guy gets it.
This guy is somebody that I can, you know, really you know get
understand.
Like, hey, he understands whatit means to do, what our, what
we're doing, and and so there'sa lot of value in those one
(15:42):
minute walk to works.
And let's kind of get into, youhad to balance things right.
You're a superintendent, youstart doing these speaking
engagements, you start beingkeynotes, you start, you know,
traveling a little bit.
Talk to us about you know,being the superintendent at Fall
Creek but still going out anddoing these workshops, these
(16:06):
speaking engagements.
How did you balance thatbetween you know doing the work
but then going out and helpingother people learn how to do the
work, and so that's somethingI'm really interested in your
story on how you balance?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (16:19):
I don't know if I balanced it very good.
I think that at some pointpeople they were they kind of
make fun of me because they'relike you know, at some point
you're just in the explode andlike be all over the wall and
that kind of thing, and I'm Icouldn't disagree with them
because I just kind of keptgoing.
I said we'll deal with mebreaking down when I break down.
So I wasn't doing a great jobtaking care of myself because I
was always trying to help andlike if I could get to one more
(16:41):
group or get one moreopportunity.
And it kind of came down tolike I knew it was helping other
people, but I also knew it waskeeping me sharp to make sure
because I couldn't talk aboutstuff that we didn't do.
And because that's that's thebiggest problem with speakers, I
think, is what is when you getthat side eye from the audience
saying do you really know whatthat feels like?
(17:03):
Because that doesn't soundright.
So the cool thing about mespeaking in groups to groups was
when I would go to conferencesas much as I could.
I'd write into the conferencecontract that the conference
would pay for some of my staffmembers to come and present, and
(17:25):
so they knew like, first of all, they're in the audience, which
means that I can't lie aboutanything.
We can talk about what's reallyhappening.
They get a chance to present onsomething that they're really
passionate about, and then theybring back what they learned, uh
, to the from the event.
So all of it is just really itwas really helpful in and just
(17:49):
trying to get some momentum forour group and for the message.
Principal JL (17:54):
Yeah, I remember seeing the people that you
brought with you on occasion.
So I've seen some of thosebreakout sessions and their
stories that they would share,and I think that's what people
resonated with you or they stilldo, is like they know you're
doing the work because you'reshowing them the evidence.
Hey, here's the evidence ofdoing the work.
I know this works because Iactually have done it right.
(18:17):
You're not just somebody that'sblowing smoke.
So you know, that's what Ithink made you unique and that's
where people start going.
Hmm, this guy understands somethings that some people may not
understand, and so with that,you know, you start doing this
public speaking.
You're a superintendent of theschool.
What was it that said?
(18:38):
You know, I'm going to stepaway, I'm going to retire from
being the superintendent andthen pursue, you know, some of
these speaking engagements andthe things that you are doing
now.
What kind of led to up to that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (18:51):
I think it was just my.
It was somebody else's turn torun the district.
To be really honest, we have agreat school district with great
people.
I still live across the streetfrom school, you know.
We have unbelievable teachersand incredible support staff and
the administrators are greatand the board the school board's
phenomenal.
The community is extremelysupportive and I thought it was
(19:13):
just like it was just somebodyelse's turn.
You know, I I could have stuckaround for two or three more
years and nobody would have saidanything.
Everything would have just beenfine.
But they didn't deserve thatand I didn't want to be looking
over my shoulder and I never didnot once that.
I look over my shoulder andthink, what are people saying?
Because everybody was reallytransparent.
(19:35):
If they liked it or they didn'tlike it, whatever, they weren't
holding anything back, whichwas great, but at least I knew
where I stood and when I left, Ileft in just a really good
situation and I knew that wecould leave it to a person to
run it that was ready and whohad been there for a while and
(19:58):
that was going to be reallyfantastic for the next chapter.
Principal JL (20:02):
So it sounds like you had somebody there that
understood the culture and youjust knew, like you know what,
they're going to be fine andthis thing was, you know, in a
good place and you feltconfident about that.
So that's really interesting onhow you came to that decision,
because that's not true all thetime and you're able to leave a
(20:22):
place you know in a good spotfor the next person.
They just come in and kind ofcarry the torch, so that's
really really great to hear.
So when it comes down to let'sjust talk about educational
leadership in general, you havesome inspired educational
leaders that are out there.
What kind of advice, whatadvice would you give them?
(20:45):
You know, if they're thinkingabout getting into educational
leadership, what are some thingsthat are like you know what.
These are things that arereally wish I knew before
getting in and maybe if you knewthese things, maybe I could
keep you from some of the hardlessons I learned as a leader.
So what are some advice thatyou'd give to aspiring leaders
that are looking at um becominga principal or even a
(21:07):
superintendent down the road?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (21:09):
Right.
The first one is that you don'tknow everything and don't
pretend to know everything,because they know you don't know
everything.
And so when you pretend to knoweverything and they know that
you don't know everything, thenyou lose credibility for the
stuff that you do know.
So keep in mind that you knowthe more vulnerable you are with
the group and be the honestythat you have with them is going
(21:30):
to carry you a long way when itcomes to building the capacity
to lead in that, in that spot.
Principal JL (21:42):
Awesome, Awesome.
So building culture.
I think sounds like you've donethat.
What would you say is the bestadvice to building culture in
your school?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (21:48):
The first thing is your willingness to
recognize that great thingshappen in the school.
The second thing is acknowledgeto the people who are doing the
great things that they're doinggreat things.
And the third is to extendthose great things to somebody
who didn't see them.
So if you're always in thatspot where you put yourself in
(22:08):
the right mindset to see greatthings and then you tell the
person that's doing the greatthings that they're doing them,
but then also tell somebody elsewho doesn't see them, every day
Everybody walks with a littlebit more confidence in that
building.
And I would say a fourth onewould be extended to somebody
that person that was doing greatthings.
(22:35):
Extend that conversation tosomebody outside of school that
they care about, that they don'tget a chance, that doesn't get
a chance to see what they doevery day.
Principal JL (22:39):
So it sounds like celebrating your people and all
the great things and making surethat they're being recognized
not just internally butexternally, and so it's a
community thing, not just an inthe building thing.
Is that what I'm understanding?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (22:51):
Yeah, but I think you also have to know your
people well enough to know howthey want to be celebrated,
because some people don't wantpublic praise, and that's fine,
there's nothing.
You know, I don't want to putpeople in a tough spot, but
there's a difference betweenpublic praise for doing a great
thing and calling somebody'shusband or wife or kids or
parents and telling them thattheir kid or their wife or their
(23:13):
husband is awesome at theirwork.
That's not public praise.
That's just making sure thatwhen they go home, somebody
values what they did during theday.
Awesome, that's different.
Principal JL (23:23):
Yeah, that's really great.
Great advice there.
Yeah.
So with everything, what areyou up to now, what is Joe doing
in retirement and what keepsyou busy?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (23:37):
Well, I'm still speaking a lot, so I think
that's probably.
You know I'll do a lot of eventsthis year, but I'm trying to
figure out ways to just kind ofkeep relevant, to be honest,
because I think I've got.
You know, the farther that youget from it, the harder it is to
tell people how to do it, andeven if you have 26 years in the
(24:00):
building, the farther that youget after three years like, well
, you didn't lead through thisor it didn't you know, you don't
know what it feels like here orwhatever.
And so I'm just trying toconnect with as many schools as
I can to ask questions aboutwhat they're going through and
how I can help, and I try tokeep my stuff really, really
simple, partly because I'm notvery smart.
(24:22):
But the second thing is like Idon't want people to have to
think they have to go throughlike a 10 step process to get
better at X, y or Z.
It's really three things, it'sthat I mean, it's that
recognizing knowledge, extendmodel and then, with their
willingness to, you know, totake care of every interaction.
Principal JL (24:40):
Awesome, awesome.
Well, yeah, that's reallyreally great to hear Sounds like
you're staying busy Even thoughyou're retired.
You're out there, you're doingthe work, you're helping people.
I see you all the time on X.
There's this thing going on andit's really fun to just kind of
watch your journey as itunfolds.
(25:00):
And so with that, I mean Ireally appreciate your time
today for coming on theEducational Leadership Podcast
and I really appreciate justyour openness about your journey
and all the things that you aredoing for educational leaders
out there.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (25:17):
Well, thanks , jeff.
I appreciate the opportunityand good luck, and if anybody
needs any help with anything,please tell them to reach out
and see if we can help and ifnot, I can probably connect you
to people who could.
Principal JL (25:27):
You bet so, Joe, if people wanted to reach out
and connect with you, how canthey do that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (25:33):
I'd probably just go to the website
jsanfelippocom,J-S-A-N-F-E-L-I-P-P-O.
com, and you can get ahold of methere.
Principal JL (25:41):
Perfect, and what I'll do is I'll put that in the
show notes so people make itreal easy to find you.
Hey Joe, it was great to seeyou.
It was great to have you on theshow.
We're going to go ahead and goride off in the sunset on this
one.
I really appreciate your timetoday.
No problem.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (26:08):
Take care, Jeff.
Principal JL (26:11):
I hope everybody enjoyed the episode with Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
I hope you guys will go aheadand get out there and buy his
book One Minute Walk to Work.
It's great.
Also works like his hackingleadership and lead from where
you are or other great things tocheck out.
I will put down Joe'sinformation down in the show
(26:32):
notes so it'll make it easy foryou guys to access.
And, if you like what you guysare hearing, I would encourage
you guys to leave a five-starreview and tell me what you like
about the show.
I'd really appreciate yourfeedback.
I do read them, I do see themand hey, if you ever need any
guidance or anything out thereand you would like to get in
touch with me, shoot me an email.
(26:53):
I hope you guys are enjoyingthe content put out there and
I'm so excited to bring you guyssome more guests like Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
And remember, until next time.
Look to Be 1% Better!
Welcome back everybody.
I'm so excited to bring youguys today's episode.
Today's guest is someone I'vebeen following since 2022.
I first saw him speak at theNETA conference in Omaha,
Nebraska.
I also got to see him speak atthe ESU 11 fall workshop that we
did, and it was really great tosee him as that keynote speaker
(00:24):
.
He's also been at the NebraskaAdministrator Days.
I've also seen him speaknationally at the National
Convention as well, and so I'mreally excited to bring on Dr
Joe Sanfelippo onto the showtoday.
Just so you guys know, he is aretired superintendent of Fall
Creek School Districts inWisconsin.
(00:44):
He's an educational leader andauthor.
During his tenure at Fall CreekSchool District, they were
recognized as the innovativedistrict twice by the
International Center forLeadership and Education.
Joe authored multiple books,including bestsellers such as
Hacking Leadership and Lead Fromwhere you Are, He's also got a
(01:06):
brand new book out called OneMinute Walk to Work, which is a
collection of his 100 walks towork that he posted on his
Twitter and Instagram accounts,and so you actually can still
see some of that work going ontoday as well, and so he
actually created this book andit's really great read.
I encourage you to pick it up.
He's been honored as one of the117 future-ready
(01:29):
superintendents and among the 50personalized learning leaders
by the US Department ofEducation.
Joe was also named one of the100 most influential educators
by District AdministrationMagazine in 2019.
Educators by DistrictAdministration Magazine in 2019.
(01:49):
Education Dive awarded him theNational Superintendent of the
Year.
So I'm really excited to bringyou this episode where Joe and I
got to sit down.
We got to talk about hiseducational journey.
Without further to do, here'sour conversation with Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
Hey there, educational leaders.
(02:14):
It's great to be back to bringyou guys another episode of the
Educational Leadership withPrincipal JL podcast.
Today I have a special guest.
He has been around the block awhile for being an educational
leader, someone that actually Ihave looked up to over my
leadership journey, and I'mreally excited to bring to you
(02:36):
guys today Dr Joe Sanfelippo.
Welcome, joe, to the show.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (02:43):
Oh, thanks so much for having me.
I appreciate the opportunity.
It's great to see you, Jeff.
Principal JL (02:46):
We're going to go ahead.
I'm going to dive right in toyour story.
So what was it that?
What was the reason for you toget into education?
What is it to?
Hey, I want to be a teacher,you know, into the principal
side and then eventually intothe superintendent's day.
Can you kind of just take usback and tell us that journey
(03:08):
through your educational journey?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (03:10):
I think the first thing was I just liked
working with kids and I thinkthat was probably the biggest
thing.
And I had a coach that at onepoint I was doing a basketball
camp for him and he saw me doinga drill with a bunch of kids
and they were all excited aboutstuff that we were doing and he
just kind of came over to me inbetween drills and said, have
you ever thought about likedoing this for real, like for a
(03:32):
real job?
And I was still in high schoolat the time and um, and I said,
well, yeah, you know I want tocoach.
I don't know if I want to teach, but I like being around kids.
And he's like you should reallylike at least look into it,
because you know these kidsreally respond to what you're
telling them and they allgravitate towards you during the
(03:53):
breaks and you know if you canmake some, some kids happy and
help them, it's a pretty goodlife.
So that's kind of.
So that's kind of where itstarted and then it just kind of
kept going.
I liked leading as a secondgrade teacher and then I liked
it as a fifth grade teacher andthen I started doing some
(04:14):
counseling because I wanted tohave a little bit bigger impact.
And then a principal job openedup in a place that my wife was
really interested in moving toat some point.
It just kind of came up fasterthan we had anticipated, and so
we get there and everything'sworked out since then.
Principal JL (04:35):
All right, and then from your principalship.
Then what got you into being asuperintendent?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (04:41):
Well, I was in a really good principal
position and, um, like, justgood people in claire, wisconsin
, really good people, a greatschool, we were just everything
was going really well and I kindof felt like I needed um, you
know, I liked building it, Iliked helping build it and it
(05:05):
was.
I think it was at that pointwhere I think, um, you know,
they didn't need what I couldprovide at that time.
They kind of needed somethingelse to to keep moving forward
for other jobs, you know, inthat same area, and applied for
one and it didn't work out.
(05:25):
And the next day after itdidn't work out, I got a call
from the superintendent in FallCreek and he said hey, why don't
you come on out and take a look?
This place is pretty special.
He had been the superintendentfor a while and then he came
back to kind of help out in aninterim role and he said come on
out, just take a look at it,it's pretty special.
And I walked in and it was.
(05:45):
It was from the second that Iwalked in I knew it was special.
So I was principal there for ayear and he told me he was going
to stick around for a while andthen maybe the superintendency
would be something that, if Iwas interested, we could talk
about what it looks like.
And after a year he decidedthat he was done.
He said you're going to begreat, you don't need me around,
you're going to be fantastic.
(06:06):
So he moved on and I took thesuperintendency and then I did
that for 12 years.
That ended up being the jobthat I did the longest.
Principal JL (06:14):
Oh, wow.
So how long were you a teacher,then a principal, and then I
know you were 12 years into thesuperintendency
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (06:21):
I was a teacher for eight?
uh, counselor for eight,counselor for four, that can't
be right.
Teacher for eight, counselorfor four, and uh, and a
principal, no, that's right.
Teacher for six.
Counselor for three, uh,principal for like what would be
(06:46):
, because I did both roles for awhile.
So principal for like six andthen a and then a superintendent
for 12,
Principal JL (06:56):
awesome, awesome
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (06:56):
to get to 26 trying to do math.
Principal JL (07:00):
I'm sorry if I'm, yeah right on the spot on that
one.
Yeah, so this is kind of where,like I know, like Fall Creek is
kind of where I've seen you,because I follow you on Twitter
or X now, where you kind of doyour daily walks and you do your
little daily one minute talksand so I really find those
(07:22):
things really valuable and kindof been following your career
for, I would say, a good five,five, six years roughly.
One of the things is is I haveseen you do presentations, doing
workshops and different things.
I saw you in I think this wasthe book that you co-authored
(07:45):
Hacking Leadership 10 Ways GreatLeaders Inspire Learning that
Teachers, students and ParentsLove.
I remember, you know you beingat ESU 11 in Holdridge doing
those things.
That's where I got the book.
But I also seen you kind of likein the Nebraska Administrator
Days.
I've seen you kind of like inthe Nebraska Administrator Days.
(08:05):
I've seen you at the nationalconferences.
So you know just your body ofwork.
You know with you know yourhacking leadership.
You know you got the lead fromwhere you are.
You have the Changing Narrativeseries and now the One Minute
Walk to Work book that is comingout, kind of like what took you
from, how does that allintertwine, from being an
(08:27):
educational leader,superintendent at Fall Creek and
how did that all just transpire.
And you can kind of take onething after another and kind of
layer it out just to give peoplean idea of kind of what, how
that all came about.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (08:43):
I think the books kind of just started as a
we.
You know, it's funny becausethe book started my friend Tony
and I, who wrote the books, wewrote the books together.
We were at an Ed camp in NewJersey and it must've been in
2000, man, I want to say 13,something like that.
And uh, we were.
We I had been a superintendentfor like three years or two
(09:05):
years and he was a principal andso we were talking about some
stuff.
But we went to an ed camp inNew Jersey because my in-laws
lived out there, my brother andsister-in-law lived out there,
so we were going out forThanksgiving and there was an ed
camp prior to Thanksgiving.
So I thought, well, I'm goingto go check this out.
So I did and get me.
So I thought, well, I'm gonnago check this out.
So I did, and uh, and westarted.
(09:26):
We did a kind of a breakoutsession on changing the
narrative and a day later, um,we had some people from like the
um ed tech chat group reach outand, um, ask us if we wanted to
run a chat, like on that monday.
And so then that turned likeeverybody had a great time with
the chat and there was a ton ofpeople there.
And then the next thing, youknow, we had Corwin Peter DeWitt
(09:52):
from.
He was doing a series withCorwin, the Corwin group, and
decided to and gave us a calland asked if we would be willing
to write like a mini book onbranding, on school branding.
So that kind of took off andthat went really well.
And then we wrote another bookwith that series called
Principal ProfessionalDevelopment.
And then Tony and I connectedwith a guy named Mark Barnes
(10:14):
who's a fantastic leader anddoes a great job with Times 10
Publishing and we were to uhconnect with him and he had a
great process for writing uh,and the process, uh was the
hacking series.
So we jumped in on the hackingseries and uh wrote the, the
hacking leadership book, and itwas just, it was a really fun
(10:36):
project and so we kind of didthat and and then, um, you know,
that's kind of how those, thosekind of books came apart and
then the other ones Lead Fromwhen you Are came up, because I
started doing those walk to workvideos.
Then we tried to figure outways that we kind of put them
into a series of of you know,you know like sequence, and try
(10:56):
to figure out that ways that wecould put them into a situation
that you know, or into a, into atext that would work out.
And uh, I am press publishedthat one with George Curls and
and he was fantastic to workwith too I've had, I've been
very lucky to work with,publishers that were really good
I've worked with, connectedwith Jimmy Casas and Jeff soul
and his group as well, and youknow, there everybody's just
(11:18):
been really good, um, and reallykind of lets you get your voice
out there.
So I've been extremely blessedto be able to work with the
people I've worked with.
Principal JL (11:30):
Yeah, you kind of mentioned something about school
branding, right?
I remember you doing a sessionon that and you just talked
about, you know, hey, doingthese quick videos or these
quick things to kind ofhighlight the great things that
are going on in your school.
And, to be honest with you, Itook that and ran with it as a,
(11:50):
as a principal, because, youknow, one of the things that I
took away from that was, hey,people don't see what's going on
behind our closed doors.
So let's lean into the socialmedia aspect, let's show people
all the great things that aregoing on so people get a
positive you know view of what'sgoing on in the education
(12:11):
building, because you know aswell as I do people, you know,
they know school from when theywere in school.
It doesn't mean it's the sameas a one-time yeah, probably not
.
But at the same time, yeah, andwith some of the negativity you
see in education, being able tohave that positive brand is
super important.
I know for my current position,one of the things we really
(12:33):
stress is getting our messageout, because the high school I'm
a principal out right now um,there was hardly any social
media, uh, footprint, but afterthree years we got a lot bigger
footprint, a lot of really goodthings, um, people are getting
out pushing out really greatcontent for our community, for
our kids, and really celebratingall the great things in our
(12:56):
building.
So that all transpired.
Because I sat in that onesession that you kind of talked
about, and so I would say thankyou for that, because that's
something I took and ran forsure.
And I kind of want to go backto your one-minute walks.
You talked about how theone-minute walks kind of put you
(13:18):
into the lead, where you are,stuff.
So what was it that?
Hey, I'm going to press record,I'm going to do these
one-minute walk to work stuff.
What was it that?
Hey, I'm going to press record,I'm going to do these one
minute walk to work stuff.
What was it that inspired youto do that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (13:27):
That's a great question.
I think it's good and it's good.
The answer is is like you know,it's, it's, it's not
groundbreaking.
Let's just be honest about it.
I mean, the thing is like Ilive across the street from
school and on Saturday morningsI'd get up and I'm super loud,
so I'd have to figure out a wayto just get out of the house.
(13:49):
So I'd just walk over to schooland just hang out at school
until my family woke up, becauseI didn't want to wake them up.
And so on my way over there Ijust started recording some
videos and then people startedto like them after a while.
So I kept making them and then,after I was making them, then
people liked them more and thenI just kind of kept them going.
(14:10):
I think that was at about thetime.
I think it hit at the right timebecause there was a lot of
people on Twitter at that time,a lot of people on X that were,
you know, a lot of educatorsthat were engaging and the and
the views there's like a ton ofpeople watch those videos.
So then it kind of inspired meto do more, because I kept
getting asked when I was goingto do the next one when I was
(14:30):
going to do the next one, and soto be able to just keep it
going, uh was was pretty, prettyimportant for me, and so I kind
of I did ended up doing ahundred walks between 2019 and
2023.
And then, um, I just starteddoing them again.
(14:53):
Um, recently I took a year offbecause I didn't want people to
think I was still walking toschool, cause that's not fair to
the people that are doing realwork.
So I didn't want to make that athing.
So now I started doing themagain.
Now I do them in differentplaces.
I rarely do them in Fall Creekanymore.
We have a place in northernWisconsin.
(15:15):
I'll do them there, or myin-laws house or whatever.
So just changes.
Principal JL (15:21):
Yeah, well, I know those one minute to walks were
a lot of fun for a lot of peopleto look at and just, you know,
hey, you know this guy gets it.
This guy is somebody that I can, you know, really you know get
understand.
Like, hey, he understands whatit means to do, what our, what
we're doing, and and so there'sa lot of value in those one
(15:42):
minute walk to works.
And let's kind of get into, youhad to balance things right.
You're a superintendent, youstart doing these speaking
engagements, you start beingkeynotes, you start, you know,
traveling a little bit.
Talk to us about you know,being the superintendent at Fall
Creek but still going out anddoing these workshops, these
(16:06):
speaking engagements.
How did you balance thatbetween you know doing the work
but then going out and helpingother people learn how to do the
work, and so that's somethingI'm really interested in your
story on how you balance?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (16:19):
I don't know if I balanced it very good.
I think that at some pointpeople they were they kind of
make fun of me because they'relike you know, at some point
you're just in the explode andlike be all over the wall and
that kind of thing, and I'm Icouldn't disagree with them
because I just kind of keptgoing.
I said we'll deal with mebreaking down when I break down.
So I wasn't doing a great jobtaking care of myself because I
was always trying to help andlike if I could get to one more
(16:41):
group or get one moreopportunity.
And it kind of came down tolike I knew it was helping other
people, but I also knew it waskeeping me sharp to make sure
because I couldn't talk aboutstuff that we didn't do.
And because that's that's thebiggest problem with speakers, I
think, is what is when you getthat side eye from the audience
saying do you really know whatthat feels like?
(17:03):
Because that doesn't soundright.
So the cool thing about mespeaking in groups to groups was
when I would go to conferencesas much as I could.
I'd write into the conferencecontract that the conference
would pay for some of my staffmembers to come and present, and
(17:25):
so they knew like, first of all, they're in the audience, which
means that I can't lie aboutanything.
We can talk about what's reallyhappening.
They get a chance to present onsomething that they're really
passionate about, and then theybring back what they learned, uh
, to the from the event.
So all of it is just really itwas really helpful in and just
(17:49):
trying to get some momentum forour group and for the message.
Principal JL (17:54):
Yeah, I remember seeing the people that you
brought with you on occasion.
So I've seen some of thosebreakout sessions and their
stories that they would share,and I think that's what people
resonated with you or they stilldo, is like they know you're
doing the work because you'reshowing them the evidence.
Hey, here's the evidence ofdoing the work.
I know this works because Iactually have done it right.
(18:17):
You're not just somebody that'sblowing smoke.
So you know, that's what Ithink made you unique and that's
where people start going.
Hmm, this guy understands somethings that some people may not
understand, and so with that,you know, you start doing this
public speaking.
You're a superintendent of theschool.
What was it that said?
(18:38):
You know, I'm going to stepaway, I'm going to retire from
being the superintendent andthen pursue, you know, some of
these speaking engagements andthe things that you are doing
now.
What kind of led to up to that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (18:51):
I think it was just my.
It was somebody else's turn torun the district.
To be really honest, we have agreat school district with great
people.
I still live across the streetfrom school, you know.
We have unbelievable teachersand incredible support staff and
the administrators are greatand the board the school board's
phenomenal.
The community is extremelysupportive and I thought it was
(19:13):
just like it was just somebodyelse's turn.
You know, I I could have stuckaround for two or three more
years and nobody would have saidanything.
Everything would have just beenfine.
But they didn't deserve thatand I didn't want to be looking
over my shoulder and I never didnot once that.
I look over my shoulder andthink, what are people saying?
Because everybody was reallytransparent.
(19:35):
If they liked it or they didn'tlike it, whatever, they weren't
holding anything back, whichwas great, but at least I knew
where I stood and when I left, Ileft in just a really good
situation and I knew that wecould leave it to a person to
run it that was ready and whohad been there for a while and
(19:58):
that was going to be reallyfantastic for the next chapter.
Principal JL (20:02):
So it sounds like you had somebody there that
understood the culture and youjust knew, like you know what,
they're going to be fine andthis thing was, you know, in a
good place and you feltconfident about that.
So that's really interesting onhow you came to that decision,
because that's not true all thetime and you're able to leave a
(20:22):
place you know in a good spotfor the next person.
They just come in and kind ofcarry the torch, so that's
really really great to hear.
So when it comes down to let'sjust talk about educational
leadership in general, you havesome inspired educational
leaders that are out there.
What kind of advice, whatadvice would you give them?
(20:45):
You know, if they're thinkingabout getting into educational
leadership, what are some thingsthat are like you know what.
These are things that arereally wish I knew before
getting in and maybe if you knewthese things, maybe I could
keep you from some of the hardlessons I learned as a leader.
So what are some advice thatyou'd give to aspiring leaders
that are looking at um becominga principal or even a
(21:07):
superintendent down the road?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (21:09):
Right.
The first one is that you don'tknow everything and don't
pretend to know everything,because they know you don't know
everything.
And so when you pretend to knoweverything and they know that
you don't know everything, thenyou lose credibility for the
stuff that you do know.
So keep in mind that you knowthe more vulnerable you are with
the group and be the honestythat you have with them is going
(21:30):
to carry you a long way when itcomes to building the capacity
to lead in that, in that spot.
Principal JL (21:42):
Awesome, Awesome.
So building culture.
I think sounds like you've donethat.
What would you say is the bestadvice to building culture in
your school?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (21:48):
The first thing is your willingness to
recognize that great thingshappen in the school.
The second thing is acknowledgeto the people who are doing the
great things that they're doinggreat things.
And the third is to extendthose great things to somebody
who didn't see them.
So if you're always in thatspot where you put yourself in
(22:08):
the right mindset to see greatthings and then you tell the
person that's doing the greatthings that they're doing them,
but then also tell somebody elsewho doesn't see them, every day
Everybody walks with a littlebit more confidence in that
building.
And I would say a fourth onewould be extended to somebody
that person that was doing greatthings.
(22:35):
Extend that conversation tosomebody outside of school that
they care about, that they don'tget a chance, that doesn't get
a chance to see what they doevery day.
Principal JL (22:39):
So it sounds like celebrating your people and all
the great things and making surethat they're being recognized
not just internally butexternally, and so it's a
community thing, not just an inthe building thing.
Is that what I'm understanding?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (22:51):
Yeah, but I think you also have to know your
people well enough to know howthey want to be celebrated,
because some people don't wantpublic praise, and that's fine,
there's nothing.
You know, I don't want to putpeople in a tough spot, but
there's a difference betweenpublic praise for doing a great
thing and calling somebody'shusband or wife or kids or
parents and telling them thattheir kid or their wife or their
(23:13):
husband is awesome at theirwork.
That's not public praise.
That's just making sure thatwhen they go home, somebody
values what they did during theday.
Awesome, that's different.
Principal JL (23:23):
Yeah, that's really great.
Great advice there.
Yeah.
So with everything, what areyou up to now, what is Joe doing
in retirement and what keepsyou busy?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (23:37):
Well, I'm still speaking a lot, so I think
that's probably.
You know I'll do a lot of eventsthis year, but I'm trying to
figure out ways to just kind ofkeep relevant, to be honest,
because I think I've got.
You know, the farther that youget from it, the harder it is to
tell people how to do it, andeven if you have 26 years in the
(24:00):
building, the farther that youget after three years like, well
, you didn't lead through thisor it didn't you know, you don't
know what it feels like here orwhatever.
And so I'm just trying toconnect with as many schools as
I can to ask questions aboutwhat they're going through and
how I can help, and I try tokeep my stuff really, really
simple, partly because I'm notvery smart.
(24:22):
But the second thing is like Idon't want people to have to
think they have to go throughlike a 10 step process to get
better at X, y or Z.
It's really three things, it'sthat I mean, it's that
recognizing knowledge, extendmodel and then, with their
willingness to, you know, totake care of every interaction.
Principal JL (24:40):
Awesome, awesome.
Well, yeah, that's reallyreally great to hear Sounds like
you're staying busy Even thoughyou're retired.
You're out there, you're doingthe work, you're helping people.
I see you all the time on X.
There's this thing going on andit's really fun to just kind of
watch your journey as itunfolds.
(25:00):
And so with that, I mean Ireally appreciate your time
today for coming on theEducational Leadership Podcast
and I really appreciate justyour openness about your journey
and all the things that you aredoing for educational leaders
out there.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (25:17):
Well, thanks , jeff.
I appreciate the opportunityand good luck, and if anybody
needs any help with anything,please tell them to reach out
and see if we can help and ifnot, I can probably connect you
to people who could.
Principal JL (25:27):
You bet so, Joe, if people wanted to reach out
and connect with you, how canthey do that?
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (25:33):
I'd probably just go to the website
jsanfelippocom,J-S-A-N-F-E-L-I-P-P-O.
com, and you can get ahold of methere.
Principal JL (25:41):
Perfect, and what I'll do is I'll put that in the
show notes so people make itreal easy to find you.
Hey Joe, it was great to seeyou.
It was great to have you on theshow.
We're going to go ahead and goride off in the sunset on this
one.
I really appreciate your timetoday.
No problem.
Dr. Joe Sanfelippo (26:08):
Take care, Jeff.
Principal JL (26:11):
I hope everybody enjoyed the episode with Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
I hope you guys will go aheadand get out there and buy his
book One Minute Walk to Work.
It's great.
Also works like his hackingleadership and lead from where
you are or other great things tocheck out.
I will put down Joe'sinformation down in the show
(26:32):
notes so it'll make it easy foryou guys to access.
And, if you like what you guysare hearing, I would encourage
you guys to leave a five-starreview and tell me what you like
about the show.
I'd really appreciate yourfeedback.
I do read them, I do see themand hey, if you ever need any
guidance or anything out thereand you would like to get in
touch with me, shoot me an email.
(26:53):
I hope you guys are enjoyingthe content put out there and
I'm so excited to bring you guyssome more guests like Dr Joe
Sanfelippo.
And remember, until next time.
Look to Be 1% Better!
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.