April 21, 2025 • 34 mins
Becoming a principal wasn't on my radar when I was happily teaching math and coaching sports. Someone else spotted my leadership potential before I did—a pivotal moment that set me on an unexpected path to school administration.
My journey from classroom teacher to high school principal wasn't straightforward or easy. It required multiple graduate degrees, mentorship from experienced administrators, and a combined total of 25 interview attempts before landing my dream role. Through each rejection, I refined my approach and learned valuable lessons about educational leadership that I'm passionate about sharing with aspiring administrators.
This deeply personal episode pulls back the curtain on the challenges of transitioning into school leadership. I detail how my perspective on principalship transformed when I witnessed a leader who showed up in classrooms to support rather than criticize. I explain how participation in leadership academies and deliberate resume-building experiences prepared me for administrative roles, even when the path wasn't clear.
The turning point came when a superintendent told me I was "interviewing for the wrong job" because I answered questions like a principal, not an assistant principal. This revelation changed my entire approach to job searching and helped me recognize where my leadership style truly belonged.
For those considering educational leadership, I offer eleven practical strategies developed through my experiences—from wearing school colors to interviews to creating comprehensive transition plans that demonstrate your vision. Most importantly, I emphasize authenticity throughout the process, as school communities are searching for leaders who align with their values and culture.
Whether you're contemplating your first leadership position or looking to advance in educational administration, this episode provides honest insights into finding your place as a school leader. The journey may not be easy, but for those called to make a broader impact in education, it's immensely rewarding.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Principal JL (00:00):
When do you know it's time to step into the
principal role?
For me it wasn't a lightningbolt moment.
I was living the dream teachingmath, coaching football and
wrestling, working with amazingstudents.
The principalship wasn't evenon my radar, but someone saw
something in me that I didn'tsee in myself and that changed
everything.
Today I want to tell you astory how I went from teacher
(00:24):
and coach to principal and how25 interviews and a couple of
key mentors and a whole lot oflearning shaped who I am today
as a leader.
If you're trying to land yourfirst principal role, today's
episode is for you.
Welcome back, everybody, foranother episode of Educational
(00:52):
Leadership Podcast.
In today's episode it is deeplypersonal.
I want to take you on a journey, my journey into school
leadership, from coaching on thefield to leading in a school
building.
I've experienced a lot of bumps, rejections and pivotal moments
that eventually landed me mydream role as the principal of
(01:14):
Hastings High School.
Let's be real I never wanted tobe a principal.
I was happy in the classroom.
I loved teaching math andcoaching football, wrestling.
Happy in the classroom, I lovedteaching math and coaching
football, wrestling and track.
I was living my best life ineducation.
But something happened early onthat planted a seed.
It started with my wifeHeather's grandpa, Don Farley.
(01:36):
He was a longtime educator, arespected principal and a
legendary football coach.
During one of our many chats helooked at me and said you
should be a principal someday.
I laughed.
I told him that I wasn't me,but he was serious.
He said you're meant to make abigger impact.
At the time I didn't believehim, but something stuck.
(01:58):
So I, almost on a whim, Ienrolled into my master's
program for educationaladministration, Just to have it
in my back pocket.
Little did I know that decisionwould change the course of my
life.
While working on my admin degree, I got to work with a principal
named Mr Mike Troxel at HerseyPublic Schools.
(02:21):
He did something I neverexperienced before.
He just showed up in myclassroom.
And when he showed up in myclassroom I was like what the
heck are you doing?
Is there something wrong?
Do you need something?
And he goes nah, I'm just herejust to hang out, see what's
going on.
I just want to watch you teach.
And that made me realizesomething that being a principal
(02:42):
isn't about barking orders.
It's about supporting teachers,encouraging growth, building
relationships.
That shifts something in me.
I did my internship under MrTroxel and for the first time I
thought maybe I could do this.
Maybe this is the next chapter.
I followed that spark with asecond master's in curriculum
instruction, mainly because ifI'm going to be a principal, I
(03:05):
figured I needed to have somemore tools in my toolbox when it
comes to teaching strategies soI can help other teachers have
more tools in their toolbox Forwhen the time comes for me to be
a principal, I have thebackground and the knowledge to
help them become the best theycan be.
After my time at Hershey, Imoved on to the Omaha Metro
(03:27):
where I taught at Millard NorthHigh School, the largest school
in Nebraska at the time.
I learned so much fromPrincipal Brian Begley,
especially around accountabilityand culture.
But I knew I wanted moreleadership opportunities.
But Millard Public Schoolsrequired three years before
joining their leadership academy.
I didn't want to wait, so Ijumped at the chance to teach
(03:48):
and coach in Ralston where myfriend Dr Josh Wilken was
already doing great work.
The main reason why I made theswitch from Millard North to
Ralston was to join theirtwo-year leadership academy
under Dr Mark Adler.
T that was a game changer for mebecause I got to spend two
(04:09):
years experiencing hisleadership and understanding how
he operates as an educationalleader, but also learning from
him through that leadershipacademy.
This experience gave meconfidence and also during my
time at Ralston I was able tobuild my resume, where I was
able to work with Mr Mike Smith,which was our activities
director, and I was able to worksome events.
(04:30):
I was able to be in charge ofsome events and run some events.
So that also helped me as well,because I thought I would start
as an assistant principal or anactivities director when I
became principal but for somereason I wasn't getting a lot of
callbacks for interviews.
I was getting some interviewsand some AD roles and some
(04:52):
assistant principal roles.
I kept getting told you know,you're great, but you don't have
the experience.
And I'm sitting there thinking,well, I got to start somewhere.
It wasn't until I interviewedfor the AD role in Bayard,
Nebraska that's my wifeHeather's hometown, and
everything shifted.
I didn't get the AD job but thesuperintendent, Dr Travis
(05:13):
Miller, saw something in me.
He said you're interviewing forthe wrong job.
You answered every questionlike a principal.
So he happily invited me toapply for their principal job at
Baird.
That was the first time that Ithought to myself should I
become a principal and not anassistant principal?
So I called my friend Dr JoshWilken at the time and we had a
(05:36):
nice long chat and he said Jeff,you're a principal.
Every way you answer thosequestions is telling me that
you're a principal of materialand not assistant principal of
material.
And that was the first time Iwent like whoa, I must be
presenting myself in a way thatI was not cognizant of.
(05:57):
I didn't know I was presentingmyself as a principal leader
instead of assistant principalor an activities director.
That conversation reallyshifted my mindset when it came
to which jobs I applied for.
So then I started applying forprincipal jobs after that
experience in Bayard.
It wasn't easy.
(06:18):
I was applying, I was gettinginterviewed and even though I
applied for the Bayard job andfor the principalship there, I
did not get it.
When I didn't get that job, I'mthinking, man, I'm going to be
a shoe in for that.
And when I didn't get it, itkind of made me go wow, what
does that say?
Well, what I took from that issaying that wasn't the right fit
(06:39):
for me, that wasn't where Ineeded to be.
And when you get theopportunity to get to the place
you're supposed to be, it willall just work, it will all just
happen.
And I just kept remindingmyself.
So I kept driving on, kepttrying and going to these
interviews.
And so the one interview that Iwent on was my experience going
(07:00):
through the interview process inShickley, Nebraska, that was a
tough experience because thatwas the first time I did like a
half day interview.
This was long.
It was a tense interviewprocess that included the entire
school and community.
I didn't just get to interviewwith the administrative team, I
(07:22):
got to interview with teachers,I got to interview with students
and I also got to meet thecommunity members and go on a
town tour and get to learn aboutthe community.
And even though I didn't getthat job, that led to my next
application, where it was toSouthern Valley, because the
outgoing superintendent ofShickley was the new
(07:43):
superintendent at SouthernValley and that person is named
Mr Bryce Jorgensen.
After that interview inShickley was over, he basically
said hey, any of you guys wouldlike to interview for the
principalship at Southern Valley?
I would strongly encourage youto apply.
And so from there I thoughtabout it.
I looked into the school andthen I talked to my wife and my
(08:07):
daughter at that time that wasstill at home and said, hey,
what do you guys think?
And they said, yeah, go for it.
So I went ahead and I appliedfor the Southern Valley job
Through that process, because Iwent through the interview
process as Shickley.
The Southern Valley process wasvery similar so I was used to
it.
So I got that experience, whichwas great for me, and then
(08:30):
Bryce Jorgensen.
Mr Jorgensen saw potential inme and gave me my first
principalship job, which I'll beever grateful to him for giving
me that experience.
I spent four years at SouthernValley honing my leadership
skills.
There were some things thathappened there that I won't get
(08:50):
into because that's for a wholeother podcast.
But when I came right down toit, they were downsizing
principalships, so we had thebuilding principal and we had
the assistant principalactivities director.
So they were going to takethose two positions and put them
together.
So one of us had to basicallybe the one to leave and we
(09:11):
didn't know who that would be.
The board didn't have adecision at that time, Instead
of waiting around to see if theywere going to retain me or if I
was going to have to find a newjob.
I went ahead and just startedlooking at new jobs, but I
wanted to look for jobs thatwere like a bigger school
district.
I spent the last two years atSouthern Valley not knowing what
(09:32):
my future was going to be,knowing that either I was going
to be retained or I was going tobe asked to.
They were going to retain theother person over me.
So, not knowing that, I wentahead and started applying and
it just seemed like every time Iturned around I'd get into a
job interview and I'd getrejected, and it was a lot of
(09:54):
just ups and downs through thosetwo years.
I went on 18 interviews in thattwo-year span and through that
I learned something veryvaluable and got really good at
these interviews and how toprepare for them and what to do.
It wasn't until that 19thinterview was the one where I
(10:16):
got to be named the principal atHastings High School, and so
that journey really developed meas how to approach interviews
and how to understand that youknow you need to find the school
that fits you and how you alignto that school is very
important.
(10:36):
So you have to know who you areas a leader when you decide to
get into these principalshipsand start applying for these
jobs, and then when you getasked to do the interviews, how
do you prepare and how do you dofor that?
And so, through that experiencethat I have, I want to talk to
you guys about the things Ilearned, and here's some tips
(10:57):
for you aspiring principals outthere.
I have 11 of them for you here,and these are the things that
I've learned through my journeythat will help you land your
first principalship.
So I think the first thing youneed to do before you start
applying for jobs, you need tobe able to lead from where you
are and you need to be good atwhat you do at the time.
So you need to start looking atleadership opportunities as a
(11:21):
teacher, join committees, leadprofessional development, run
events, supervise events, dowhatever you need to do to build
that resume on the leadershipside.
Other things such as, if you'reable to, if your school
district has it, be a part oftheir leadership academy or some
sort of leadership developmentprogramming, because that will
(11:41):
get your foot in the door.
So when it's time for you toapply for those positions within
your district if that's whereyou like to be, or to apply
outside of your district,because sometimes you will need
to leave the district you're into get that principalship.
That's what happened to me atRalston, where I was trying
really hard to stay in thedistrict but there just wasn't
opportunities at the time so Ihad to look outside of it and
(12:04):
that's where, going from Ralstoninto Southern Valley, I had to
take that leap and do that justto get my first principal ship.
So, understanding there'sthings you can do now as a
teacher at the building level tohelp build your leadership
capacity, because those thingswill help build the experiences
you need to be able to speak toin those interviews when you get
(12:27):
those chances.
The next thing you need to dois know your path.
So for me, I was thinking Ineed to be assistant principal
or an activities director or adean of students or something.
Assistant principal or anactivities director or a dean of
students or something.
I wasn't even thinkingprincipal because I didn't
understand how I was presentingmyself until later, right Until
that Baird interview, and so,and then talking to my buddy,
(12:49):
Josh, about how I answered thosequestions and he's like, well,
you're presenting yourself as aprincipal, so you need to
understand, like, where you fit.
Do you fit that assistantprincipal role, that AD role or
even building principal role?
I didn't know that I waspresenting myself as a building
principal, but once I knew that,that made it a much more
(13:10):
targeted process for me, knowingwhere I was going to apply and
how I was going to presentmyself in those roles.
And so, through that justknowing your path, knowing kind
of where you want to be, andthen really hone in onto those
schools that are needing thoseparticular types of positions.
(13:31):
Now some people say, just throwa bunch out there and see what
happens.
That's okay too, but I wouldsay, if you know you belong in
that AP role or the athleticdirector role or even that
building principal role, I wouldsay, focus on that and really
get really good and finddetailed on those things.
And the next thing I want youto do before you start applying
(13:54):
is when you create a resume.
What you need to put on thatresume is your leadership
experiences.
Yes, it's great to have yourteaching experiences in there,
but you need to talk about, hey,these committees I was on.
Hey, I supervised events, I didthese type of leadership roles
throughout my time as a teacher,Even if it's becoming the
(14:15):
department head of yourdepartment.
That's something that will showthat, hey, I've done some
leadership and I'm ready forthat next step.
And then, when you create coverletters, make sure you tailor
that cover letter to thatspecific job and to that
particular school district.
Because one thing as aprincipal annoys the heck out of
(14:36):
me is when I get a cover letterthat reads another school's
name or another school's job.
I'm like, oh, and you did nottake the time to correct those
things and make it personalizedto that school district.
So personalize those coverletters and those resumes and
make them look good before yousubmit them.
(14:56):
And make them look good beforeyou submit them and make sure
you check over that, becauseyou're competing against other
teachers and other people thatwant to become leaders, or, in
some cases, you're competingagainst existing principals or
existing APs that want that jobas well.
So you want to make sure youset yourself apart when you put
those resumes and cover letterstogether as well.
(15:18):
The next thing I want you guysto do is you be able to do your
homework.
You need to know the schooldistrict's culture, value, the
program, the systems they havein place.
Are they a PBIS school?
Do they have an MTSS process?
Those things are reallyimportant to know and yes, it's
good to know like, hey, where dothey, what are their testing
(15:41):
scores and where are they at?
That stuff's good to know, butit's not what's most important.
What's most important is toknow the culture of the district
and know the values, and sosome ways you can do that is you
can connect with people.
Maybe you know people that knowpeople in that school district,
or you may know a teacher, oryou may know somebody that
(16:03):
currently works in that districtand you can have a conversation
with them and go hey, what isit like to work there?
What are the values?
What do they uphold?
Another thing I would like youto do is probably really
research that superintendentthat you'd be working for,
(16:24):
because you need to know if yourvalues and what you bring to
the table aligns to thatsuperintendent's values.
And try to do some research onthat superintendent so you can
figure out if what you hold dearaligns with that superintendent
, because the worst thing to dois get into a job and there's no
alignment with thesuperintendent or the district's
path or goals.
You don't want to be in thatschool district, so you want to
(16:44):
make sure you align yourselfwith that school district and
make sure that's something thatyou feel like, yep, this would
be a good fit before you evenstep foot into that interview.
It's really important to knowthose things.
So another trick that I wouldlike to you guys to do, or I
would like to share it this issomething I've done since I was,
you know, coming in as ateacher.
(17:05):
Right, I wore the school'scolors during my interviews.
All right, I did that onpurpose.
I would research because Ididn't want to come in with,
like, the rival's colors.
That would just be terrible.
I didn't want to be like, youknow, put them on, like, oh my
gosh, they're wearing the wrongcolors.
So what I would do is I wouldpurposely wear school colors and
(17:26):
if I did not have their schoolcolors in my wardrobe, I would
go out and buy it.
I'd go out and get the schoolcolors so I can present myself
to show them hey, I'm a part ofyou, I'm ready to be a part of
your district, and that's reallyimportant to do.
And I did that with all myinterviews from the time I was a
teacher all the way through myprincipalship as I wore school
(17:47):
colors in my interviews.
Another great tip is to have anotebook Before you even get
into the interview.
You want to jot down somequestions you may have and if
you're becoming a principal oryou're becoming, you know,
assistant principal, you want towrite down questions that would
be specific to that schooldistrict.
And for me, as a principal, Iwould write down questions that
(18:10):
I'd want to ask the studentcommittee questions I'd want to
ask the teacher committeequestions I want to ask the
admin committee and then alsothe community members as well.
Those are questions that werereally something that I did pre
and I did those questions aroundmy research and the homework
that I did before I even steppedfoot into that school for the
(18:32):
interview.
So that was another reallyimportant thing understand,
depending on the size ofdistrict, depending on how many
layers of interviews you mayhave.
So if you're in a biggerdistrict, you may go through two
to three interviews beforegetting into that building
interview.
If you're in a small district,it may just be that one
interview process.
(18:53):
But there's a lot of waysschool districts will go through
their interview process.
So it's always good to ask whenyou get that first interview,
if you're in a larger district,hey, what's your process?
How, how does this go?
So I can understand what mynext step is.
And so that's also anotherthing to know as well when you
get into that getting thoseinterviews now kind of got
(19:15):
sidetracked in there.
Let's go back to the note takinghere.
So bring that notebook so youcan have questions ready, so you
can ask those questions andyou're not forgetting them,
because I'm telling you, whenyou get on those interviews,
your mind's going to be going athousand miles an hour and
you're going to forget some.
So having a notebook is handyand a good way to go back and go
(19:35):
.
Oh, yeah, these are some thingsI want to ask.
Another good trick with thisnotebook is you could jot down
names.
As they're going around andthey're introducing themselves.
You could jot down names andyou can make it a more personal
connection with them.
You can say, hey, Tom, that wasa really great question and
then give them your answer.
That's just an example of whyyou would want to jot down some
(19:57):
names in that interview process.
That's just another great wayto show just attention to detail
and that actually will set youabove some of the other
candidates that may not do that,and you just want to stay
engaged.
It helps you stay engaged withthe process as well.
Now, we talked about doing yourhomework.
We talked about doing yourresearch, and so one of the
(20:19):
things you need to do whileyou're doing that research in
the interview itself, you wantto mention key things that you
learned about their district.
So there could be a slogan thatthat school district has and
you want to figure out a way tointerject that into your
interview.
There might be initiatives,there might be different things.
(20:40):
That's going on.
You want to be able to speak tothose things, but you want to
be able to take those things andweave it into what you have
done and your experience as aleader and how you can help what
they're already doing moveforward as well.
And another thing is it's okaynot to know everything.
(21:00):
That's just showing yourwillingness to learn and
collaborate.
That's a time where, hey, I maynot know everything you guys do
, but here's some experiencethat I have and I'm willing to
learn, I'm willing tocollaborate, I'm willing to
bring everybody to the table sowe can move forward when it
comes to that.
(21:21):
So, understanding that you maynot know everything, but in that
interview it's okay to not knoweverything, and so try your
best to take your experiencesand weave them into those
questions and to give themanswers.
And the thing I would do,before you even get into
interviews, I would jot downsome questions that you may
(21:43):
think that they may ask you.
You can actually go online andmaybe look up like, hey, what
are questions school districtsmay ask principals, what are
scenarios they may ask you?
And what you do is you can takethose things and you can write
out answers.
You can look at those type ofquestions and write out things.
That how I would answer it.
This is how I would answerthose questions if I'm asked
(22:07):
those things.
And so that's another thing iswhen you're prepping, is when
you're doing your research andyou're really trying to tackle
some of these questions outthere that they may ask you and
you may want to put yourself intheir position of what questions
would I ask myself if I wasthem?
You know about the district andhow I can see myself in there.
(22:31):
And then I think that's anotherstep in is how do you portray
yourself to them when you'reanswering those questions?
How are you presenting yourself, Are you helping them?
Imagine you in that seat.
How do you make it to where,when you are answering a
question, you are showing them Ibelong here.
(22:52):
I want you to imagine me beingyour leader.
This is how I would work withyou guys.
This is how I would collaborate.
This is how I would do things.
It may be different than whatthey're used to, but what you're
doing is you're portraying howyou would do things to them from
the experiences you have and Ithink that's really important to
know as well is to be able tobring these people in and help
(23:17):
them see you be their leader,and that's really important.
Another thing I want you guys tothink about is when you're in
that interview, you want to beconfident but not cocky.
You don't want to be bolstering.
You don't want to be like man,I'm so great, I'm so this, I'm
so that you don't want to bearrogant, but you want to be
confident in a way that says youknow what?
Here's my experiences.
(23:38):
Here's my experiences From myexperience.
This is how I would handle thatsituation, or this is how I
would collaborate through theexperiences I have.
How do you bring yourexperiences into the interview
and you could speak to thethings that they're doing, so
you could help them see you betheir leader, and that's really
important.
But you would have to haveconfidence.
But if you've done leadershipthings you need to own like, yep
(24:02):
, these are some things I'vedone, this is how I've worked it
and this is how I would come inand help you guys do some of
the same things that I'vealready done, and so to them
you're just saying you know Ihave this experience, I want to
show you my knowledge and I wantto show you how I would do
things.
But yet how do I bringeverybody involved and to the
(24:22):
table on those things and beingable to show them that vision?
The other things I did towardsthe end of my interviews.
So I talked about I did like 25interviews between two
principal ships.
Right, the first principal ship.
I did about six interviewsbefore I got that one and then I
did 18.
And then my 19th one, I got myjob at Hastings High.
(24:44):
So over 25 interviews, about 20of those.
I did not do this, but the lastfive I did.
I created what I call the60-90-30 transition plan and
what I did is I created thisplan and I talked about it in
one of my recent episodes.
(25:05):
If you would go back I believeit was episode 25, go back and
listen to that.
I talk about the plan.
But that plan, my transitionplan, helped me land my job at
at Hastings high.
Because what I did is I showedthem what I would do in that
first year, how I would come in,how I would collaborate, how I
(25:27):
would communicate, how I wouldbuild the relationships and
trust on my staff.
Because I knew, coming in as afirst year principal in that
building, I wasn't going to goin there and make changes.
I was going to go in there andlearn.
I was going to go there andlisten.
I was going to go and I wasable to lay that out in my 60,
90, 30 transition plan.
(25:49):
Now the key when you do this iswhen you create this, you're
showing your vision and you wantto be able to show them that
and be able to speak to it.
But then when you get the joband be able to speak to it, but
then when you get the job, youbetter hold yourself to that.
It gives you accountability andyou have to hold it.
So when my first year atHastings High, I took out my
transition plan and I wasfollowing it.
(26:10):
Man, I was like going throughit, checking it off, making sure
I was doing what I said I woulddo and I think that's really
important to do when you havethese transition plans is to
hold to what you said you weregoing to do in that interview.
With that plan, I was able toshow my vision and show them and
be able to really have them seeme in that light of being their
(26:32):
principal.
So that was really important.
And another couple of quickdetail things when it comes to
that plan, make sure you havethat plan with their logo and
their school colors and make itlook really good when you
present that, because you'regoing to give that to the
administrative team, You'regoing to give that to the
teachers.
You may not give it to thestudents, but you're going to
(26:53):
give it to some of those people,some of those adults in those
interviews committees, so youcan show them.
This is what I would do, thisis what I'm about and this is
who I am, and that's reallyimportant to be able to show
that.
And that leads me to my finaltip is you need to be authentic.
Don't be fake.
(27:13):
Be yourself.
You want to make sure yourvalues align with theirs.
Your whole interview process isabout how do I fit with this
school?
How can I help them see me betheir leader?
But yet guess what they'redoing.
They're researching you.
They're getting on social media.
They're getting on Facebook,they're getting on Twitter,
(27:35):
they're getting on TikTok.
They are going to look at yoursocial media to see who you are.
They are going to look at yoursocial media to see who you are.
And you need to make sureyou're being yourself and
authentic when you're in thatinterview.
Because I guarantee you, I'mtelling you that's true, Because
when I got the job at Hastings,they told me yeah, we looked at
your Facebook, we looked atyour stuff, we wanted to see who
(28:00):
you were.
The teachers wanted to know whoI was.
Before I even showed up to theinterview.
They were researching mebecause I was coming from
Southern Valley, the smallschool, and this guy we don't
know if this guy's going to workout.
But then my experiences withRalston and Miller North helped
me with that job as well,because I had big school
(28:21):
experience as well small ruralschool, but I was able to paint
a picture of me, who I am.
This is who I am.
I was able to help them see mebe in that role, and it was said
to me that my teachers that Icurrently have were the ones
that really wanted me.
They really wanted me to betheir principal, their leader.
(28:42):
That meant a lot to me, andthose teachers did look me up on
Facebook and I go, wow, thisguy has a Facebook presence and
we can learn about him and thosethings.
So that's also a trick for youas a principal is to go look at
your candidate's Facebook post.
Go look at who they are and seewho they are and see what they
(29:03):
bring to you when they havethose interviews.
So, with that said, that's myjourney and those are my tips
for you If you're wanting tobecome an educational leader or,
in this case, a principal.
This wasn't something thathappened easily.
It wasn't something thathappened fast.
It was definitely somethingthat happened fast.
It was definitely something Ihad to have resilience with.
(29:26):
I got rejected.
I had to learn from it.
All those things, wrappedtogether, helped me become a
better leader and helped mebecome the leader I am today,
Because without going throughthat journey, I would not be
sitting here as the principal ofHastings High and I absolutely
love my job.
(29:46):
I love what I do on a day-to-daybasis.
Yes, it's hard, yes, there'schallenging moments, but guess
what?
I wouldn't have it any otherway.
I hope you guys got a lot outof this episode and I hope, if
you're an aspiring leader andyou would like help with
interviewing and have some tipsand you'd like to get ahold of
(30:07):
me, I'd definitely love for youto reach out to me.
My stuff's in the show notes.
You could just hit my link andI'll have my email links.
All my social medias are therefor you to contact me with, and
I'd love to hear from thosepeople that are really wanting
to become an educational leader.
And if you're already aneducational leader and you're
(30:27):
looking about taking that nextstep in your leadership, going
from maybe one district toanother, I'd love to help you
out as well.
So don't be afraid to hit me up.
I hope everybody out there ismaking that push to the finish
here, because school is almostover.
I believe we're about fiveweeks left of school where I'm
at, and so we're really pushinghard to accomplish those things
(30:48):
but also to finish off theschool strong in our building.
So with that guys, I hope youguys enjoy this episode.
I hope you got a lot out of it.
I hope you guys subscribe tothe podcast.
Write a review if you haven'tdone so already.
Until next time, everybody.
I hope you guys subscribe tothe podcast.
Write a review, if you haven'tdone so already.
Until next time, everybody.
I hope you guys are being 1%better.
When do you know it's time to step into the
principal role?
For me it wasn't a lightningbolt moment.
I was living the dream teachingmath, coaching football and
wrestling, working with amazingstudents.
The principalship wasn't evenon my radar, but someone saw
something in me that I didn'tsee in myself and that changed
everything.
Today I want to tell you astory how I went from teacher
(00:24):
and coach to principal and how25 interviews and a couple of
key mentors and a whole lot oflearning shaped who I am today
as a leader.
If you're trying to land yourfirst principal role, today's
episode is for you.
Welcome back, everybody, foranother episode of Educational
(00:52):
Leadership Podcast.
In today's episode it is deeplypersonal.
I want to take you on a journey, my journey into school
leadership, from coaching on thefield to leading in a school
building.
I've experienced a lot of bumps, rejections and pivotal moments
that eventually landed me mydream role as the principal of
(01:14):
Hastings High School.
Let's be real I never wanted tobe a principal.
I was happy in the classroom.
I loved teaching math andcoaching football, wrestling.
Happy in the classroom, I lovedteaching math and coaching
football, wrestling and track.
I was living my best life ineducation.
But something happened early onthat planted a seed.
It started with my wifeHeather's grandpa, Don Farley.
(01:36):
He was a longtime educator, arespected principal and a
legendary football coach.
During one of our many chats helooked at me and said you
should be a principal someday.
I laughed.
I told him that I wasn't me,but he was serious.
He said you're meant to make abigger impact.
At the time I didn't believehim, but something stuck.
(01:58):
So I, almost on a whim, Ienrolled into my master's
program for educationaladministration, Just to have it
in my back pocket.
Little did I know that decisionwould change the course of my
life.
While working on my admin degree, I got to work with a principal
named Mr Mike Troxel at HerseyPublic Schools.
(02:21):
He did something I neverexperienced before.
He just showed up in myclassroom.
And when he showed up in myclassroom I was like what the
heck are you doing?
Is there something wrong?
Do you need something?
And he goes nah, I'm just herejust to hang out, see what's
going on.
I just want to watch you teach.
And that made me realizesomething that being a principal
(02:42):
isn't about barking orders.
It's about supporting teachers,encouraging growth, building
relationships.
That shifts something in me.
I did my internship under MrTroxel and for the first time I
thought maybe I could do this.
Maybe this is the next chapter.
I followed that spark with asecond master's in curriculum
instruction, mainly because ifI'm going to be a principal, I
(03:05):
figured I needed to have somemore tools in my toolbox when it
comes to teaching strategies soI can help other teachers have
more tools in their toolbox Forwhen the time comes for me to be
a principal, I have thebackground and the knowledge to
help them become the best theycan be.
After my time at Hershey, Imoved on to the Omaha Metro
(03:27):
where I taught at Millard NorthHigh School, the largest school
in Nebraska at the time.
I learned so much fromPrincipal Brian Begley,
especially around accountabilityand culture.
But I knew I wanted moreleadership opportunities.
But Millard Public Schoolsrequired three years before
joining their leadership academy.
I didn't want to wait, so Ijumped at the chance to teach
(03:48):
and coach in Ralston where myfriend Dr Josh Wilken was
already doing great work.
The main reason why I made theswitch from Millard North to
Ralston was to join theirtwo-year leadership academy
under Dr Mark Adler.
T that was a game changer for mebecause I got to spend two
(04:09):
years experiencing hisleadership and understanding how
he operates as an educationalleader, but also learning from
him through that leadershipacademy.
This experience gave meconfidence and also during my
time at Ralston I was able tobuild my resume, where I was
able to work with Mr Mike Smith,which was our activities
director, and I was able to worksome events.
(04:30):
I was able to be in charge ofsome events and run some events.
So that also helped me as well,because I thought I would start
as an assistant principal or anactivities director when I
became principal but for somereason I wasn't getting a lot of
callbacks for interviews.
I was getting some interviewsand some AD roles and some
(04:52):
assistant principal roles.
I kept getting told you know,you're great, but you don't have
the experience.
And I'm sitting there thinking,well, I got to start somewhere.
It wasn't until I interviewedfor the AD role in Bayard,
Nebraska that's my wifeHeather's hometown, and
everything shifted.
I didn't get the AD job but thesuperintendent, Dr Travis
(05:13):
Miller, saw something in me.
He said you're interviewing forthe wrong job.
You answered every questionlike a principal.
So he happily invited me toapply for their principal job at
Baird.
That was the first time that Ithought to myself should I
become a principal and not anassistant principal?
So I called my friend Dr JoshWilken at the time and we had a
(05:36):
nice long chat and he said Jeff,you're a principal.
Every way you answer thosequestions is telling me that
you're a principal of materialand not assistant principal of
material.
And that was the first time Iwent like whoa, I must be
presenting myself in a way thatI was not cognizant of.
(05:57):
I didn't know I was presentingmyself as a principal leader
instead of assistant principalor an activities director.
That conversation reallyshifted my mindset when it came
to which jobs I applied for.
So then I started applying forprincipal jobs after that
experience in Bayard.
It wasn't easy.
(06:18):
I was applying, I was gettinginterviewed and even though I
applied for the Bayard job andfor the principalship there, I
did not get it.
When I didn't get that job, I'mthinking, man, I'm going to be
a shoe in for that.
And when I didn't get it, itkind of made me go wow, what
does that say?
Well, what I took from that issaying that wasn't the right fit
(06:39):
for me, that wasn't where Ineeded to be.
And when you get theopportunity to get to the place
you're supposed to be, it willall just work, it will all just
happen.
And I just kept remindingmyself.
So I kept driving on, kepttrying and going to these
interviews.
And so the one interview that Iwent on was my experience going
(07:00):
through the interview process inShickley, Nebraska, that was a
tough experience because thatwas the first time I did like a
half day interview.
This was long.
It was a tense interviewprocess that included the entire
school and community.
I didn't just get to interviewwith the administrative team, I
(07:22):
got to interview with teachers,I got to interview with students
and I also got to meet thecommunity members and go on a
town tour and get to learn aboutthe community.
And even though I didn't getthat job, that led to my next
application, where it was toSouthern Valley, because the
outgoing superintendent ofShickley was the new
(07:43):
superintendent at SouthernValley and that person is named
Mr Bryce Jorgensen.
After that interview inShickley was over, he basically
said hey, any of you guys wouldlike to interview for the
principalship at Southern Valley?
I would strongly encourage youto apply.
And so from there I thoughtabout it.
I looked into the school andthen I talked to my wife and my
(08:07):
daughter at that time that wasstill at home and said, hey,
what do you guys think?
And they said, yeah, go for it.
So I went ahead and I appliedfor the Southern Valley job
Through that process, because Iwent through the interview
process as Shickley.
The Southern Valley process wasvery similar so I was used to
it.
So I got that experience, whichwas great for me, and then
(08:30):
Bryce Jorgensen.
Mr Jorgensen saw potential inme and gave me my first
principalship job, which I'll beever grateful to him for giving
me that experience.
I spent four years at SouthernValley honing my leadership
skills.
There were some things thathappened there that I won't get
(08:50):
into because that's for a wholeother podcast.
But when I came right down toit, they were downsizing
principalships, so we had thebuilding principal and we had
the assistant principalactivities director.
So they were going to takethose two positions and put them
together.
So one of us had to basicallybe the one to leave and we
(09:11):
didn't know who that would be.
The board didn't have adecision at that time, Instead
of waiting around to see if theywere going to retain me or if I
was going to have to find a newjob.
I went ahead and just startedlooking at new jobs, but I
wanted to look for jobs thatwere like a bigger school
district.
I spent the last two years atSouthern Valley not knowing what
(09:32):
my future was going to be,knowing that either I was going
to be retained or I was going tobe asked to.
They were going to retain theother person over me.
So, not knowing that, I wentahead and started applying and
it just seemed like every time Iturned around I'd get into a
job interview and I'd getrejected, and it was a lot of
(09:54):
just ups and downs through thosetwo years.
I went on 18 interviews in thattwo-year span and through that
I learned something veryvaluable and got really good at
these interviews and how toprepare for them and what to do.
It wasn't until that 19thinterview was the one where I
(10:16):
got to be named the principal atHastings High School, and so
that journey really developed meas how to approach interviews
and how to understand that youknow you need to find the school
that fits you and how you alignto that school is very
important.
(10:36):
So you have to know who you areas a leader when you decide to
get into these principalshipsand start applying for these
jobs, and then when you getasked to do the interviews, how
do you prepare and how do you dofor that?
And so, through that experiencethat I have, I want to talk to
you guys about the things Ilearned, and here's some tips
(10:57):
for you aspiring principals outthere.
I have 11 of them for you here,and these are the things that
I've learned through my journeythat will help you land your
first principalship.
So I think the first thing youneed to do before you start
applying for jobs, you need tobe able to lead from where you
are and you need to be good atwhat you do at the time.
So you need to start looking atleadership opportunities as a
(11:21):
teacher, join committees, leadprofessional development, run
events, supervise events, dowhatever you need to do to build
that resume on the leadershipside.
Other things such as, if you'reable to, if your school
district has it, be a part oftheir leadership academy or some
sort of leadership developmentprogramming, because that will
(11:41):
get your foot in the door.
So when it's time for you toapply for those positions within
your district if that's whereyou like to be, or to apply
outside of your district,because sometimes you will need
to leave the district you're into get that principalship.
That's what happened to me atRalston, where I was trying
really hard to stay in thedistrict but there just wasn't
opportunities at the time so Ihad to look outside of it and
(12:04):
that's where, going from Ralstoninto Southern Valley, I had to
take that leap and do that justto get my first principal ship.
So, understanding there'sthings you can do now as a
teacher at the building level tohelp build your leadership
capacity, because those thingswill help build the experiences
you need to be able to speak toin those interviews when you get
(12:27):
those chances.
The next thing you need to dois know your path.
So for me, I was thinking Ineed to be assistant principal
or an activities director or adean of students or something.
Assistant principal or anactivities director or a dean of
students or something.
I wasn't even thinkingprincipal because I didn't
understand how I was presentingmyself until later, right Until
that Baird interview, and so,and then talking to my buddy,
(12:49):
Josh, about how I answered thosequestions and he's like, well,
you're presenting yourself as aprincipal, so you need to
understand, like, where you fit.
Do you fit that assistantprincipal role, that AD role or
even building principal role?
I didn't know that I waspresenting myself as a building
principal, but once I knew that,that made it a much more
(13:10):
targeted process for me, knowingwhere I was going to apply and
how I was going to presentmyself in those roles.
And so, through that justknowing your path, knowing kind
of where you want to be, andthen really hone in onto those
schools that are needing thoseparticular types of positions.
(13:31):
Now some people say, just throwa bunch out there and see what
happens.
That's okay too, but I wouldsay, if you know you belong in
that AP role or the athleticdirector role or even that
building principal role, I wouldsay, focus on that and really
get really good and finddetailed on those things.
And the next thing I want youto do before you start applying
(13:54):
is when you create a resume.
What you need to put on thatresume is your leadership
experiences.
Yes, it's great to have yourteaching experiences in there,
but you need to talk about, hey,these committees I was on.
Hey, I supervised events, I didthese type of leadership roles
throughout my time as a teacher,Even if it's becoming the
(14:15):
department head of yourdepartment.
That's something that will showthat, hey, I've done some
leadership and I'm ready forthat next step.
And then, when you create coverletters, make sure you tailor
that cover letter to thatspecific job and to that
particular school district.
Because one thing as aprincipal annoys the heck out of
(14:36):
me is when I get a cover letterthat reads another school's
name or another school's job.
I'm like, oh, and you did nottake the time to correct those
things and make it personalizedto that school district.
So personalize those coverletters and those resumes and
make them look good before yousubmit them.
(14:56):
And make them look good beforeyou submit them and make sure
you check over that, becauseyou're competing against other
teachers and other people thatwant to become leaders, or, in
some cases, you're competingagainst existing principals or
existing APs that want that jobas well.
So you want to make sure youset yourself apart when you put
those resumes and cover letterstogether as well.
(15:18):
The next thing I want you guysto do is you be able to do your
homework.
You need to know the schooldistrict's culture, value, the
program, the systems they havein place.
Are they a PBIS school?
Do they have an MTSS process?
Those things are reallyimportant to know and yes, it's
good to know like, hey, where dothey, what are their testing
(15:41):
scores and where are they at?
That stuff's good to know, butit's not what's most important.
What's most important is toknow the culture of the district
and know the values, and sosome ways you can do that is you
can connect with people.
Maybe you know people that knowpeople in that school district,
or you may know a teacher, oryou may know somebody that
(16:03):
currently works in that districtand you can have a conversation
with them and go hey, what isit like to work there?
What are the values?
What do they uphold?
Another thing I would like youto do is probably really
research that superintendentthat you'd be working for,
(16:24):
because you need to know if yourvalues and what you bring to
the table aligns to thatsuperintendent's values.
And try to do some research onthat superintendent so you can
figure out if what you hold dearaligns with that superintendent
, because the worst thing to dois get into a job and there's no
alignment with thesuperintendent or the district's
path or goals.
You don't want to be in thatschool district, so you want to
(16:44):
make sure you align yourselfwith that school district and
make sure that's something thatyou feel like, yep, this would
be a good fit before you evenstep foot into that interview.
It's really important to knowthose things.
So another trick that I wouldlike to you guys to do, or I
would like to share it this issomething I've done since I was,
you know, coming in as ateacher.
(17:05):
Right, I wore the school'scolors during my interviews.
All right, I did that onpurpose.
I would research because Ididn't want to come in with,
like, the rival's colors.
That would just be terrible.
I didn't want to be like, youknow, put them on, like, oh my
gosh, they're wearing the wrongcolors.
So what I would do is I wouldpurposely wear school colors and
(17:26):
if I did not have their schoolcolors in my wardrobe, I would
go out and buy it.
I'd go out and get the schoolcolors so I can present myself
to show them hey, I'm a part ofyou, I'm ready to be a part of
your district, and that's reallyimportant to do.
And I did that with all myinterviews from the time I was a
teacher all the way through myprincipalship as I wore school
(17:47):
colors in my interviews.
Another great tip is to have anotebook Before you even get
into the interview.
You want to jot down somequestions you may have and if
you're becoming a principal oryou're becoming, you know,
assistant principal, you want towrite down questions that would
be specific to that schooldistrict.
And for me, as a principal, Iwould write down questions that
(18:10):
I'd want to ask the studentcommittee questions I'd want to
ask the teacher committeequestions I want to ask the
admin committee and then alsothe community members as well.
Those are questions that werereally something that I did pre
and I did those questions aroundmy research and the homework
that I did before I even steppedfoot into that school for the
(18:32):
interview.
So that was another reallyimportant thing understand,
depending on the size ofdistrict, depending on how many
layers of interviews you mayhave.
So if you're in a biggerdistrict, you may go through two
to three interviews beforegetting into that building
interview.
If you're in a small district,it may just be that one
interview process.
(18:53):
But there's a lot of waysschool districts will go through
their interview process.
So it's always good to ask whenyou get that first interview,
if you're in a larger district,hey, what's your process?
How, how does this go?
So I can understand what mynext step is.
And so that's also anotherthing to know as well when you
get into that getting thoseinterviews now kind of got
(19:15):
sidetracked in there.
Let's go back to the note takinghere.
So bring that notebook so youcan have questions ready, so you
can ask those questions andyou're not forgetting them,
because I'm telling you, whenyou get on those interviews,
your mind's going to be going athousand miles an hour and
you're going to forget some.
So having a notebook is handyand a good way to go back and go
(19:35):
.
Oh, yeah, these are some thingsI want to ask.
Another good trick with thisnotebook is you could jot down
names.
As they're going around andthey're introducing themselves.
You could jot down names andyou can make it a more personal
connection with them.
You can say, hey, Tom, that wasa really great question and
then give them your answer.
That's just an example of whyyou would want to jot down some
(19:57):
names in that interview process.
That's just another great wayto show just attention to detail
and that actually will set youabove some of the other
candidates that may not do that,and you just want to stay
engaged.
It helps you stay engaged withthe process as well.
Now, we talked about doing yourhomework.
We talked about doing yourresearch, and so one of the
(20:19):
things you need to do whileyou're doing that research in
the interview itself, you wantto mention key things that you
learned about their district.
So there could be a slogan thatthat school district has and
you want to figure out a way tointerject that into your
interview.
There might be initiatives,there might be different things.
(20:40):
That's going on.
You want to be able to speak tothose things, but you want to
be able to take those things andweave it into what you have
done and your experience as aleader and how you can help what
they're already doing moveforward as well.
And another thing is it's okaynot to know everything.
(21:00):
That's just showing yourwillingness to learn and
collaborate.
That's a time where, hey, I maynot know everything you guys do
, but here's some experiencethat I have and I'm willing to
learn, I'm willing tocollaborate, I'm willing to
bring everybody to the table sowe can move forward when it
comes to that.
(21:21):
So, understanding that you maynot know everything, but in that
interview it's okay to not knoweverything, and so try your
best to take your experiencesand weave them into those
questions and to give themanswers.
And the thing I would do,before you even get into
interviews, I would jot downsome questions that you may
(21:43):
think that they may ask you.
You can actually go online andmaybe look up like, hey, what
are questions school districtsmay ask principals, what are
scenarios they may ask you?
And what you do is you can takethose things and you can write
out answers.
You can look at those type ofquestions and write out things.
That how I would answer it.
This is how I would answerthose questions if I'm asked
(22:07):
those things.
And so that's another thing iswhen you're prepping, is when
you're doing your research andyou're really trying to tackle
some of these questions outthere that they may ask you and
you may want to put yourself intheir position of what questions
would I ask myself if I wasthem?
You know about the district andhow I can see myself in there.
(22:31):
And then I think that's anotherstep in is how do you portray
yourself to them when you'reanswering those questions?
How are you presenting yourself, Are you helping them?
Imagine you in that seat.
How do you make it to where,when you are answering a
question, you are showing them Ibelong here.
(22:52):
I want you to imagine me beingyour leader.
This is how I would work withyou guys.
This is how I would collaborate.
This is how I would do things.
It may be different than whatthey're used to, but what you're
doing is you're portraying howyou would do things to them from
the experiences you have and Ithink that's really important to
know as well is to be able tobring these people in and help
(23:17):
them see you be their leader,and that's really important.
Another thing I want you guys tothink about is when you're in
that interview, you want to beconfident but not cocky.
You don't want to be bolstering.
You don't want to be like man,I'm so great, I'm so this, I'm
so that you don't want to bearrogant, but you want to be
confident in a way that says youknow what?
Here's my experiences.
(23:38):
Here's my experiences From myexperience.
This is how I would handle thatsituation, or this is how I
would collaborate through theexperiences I have.
How do you bring yourexperiences into the interview
and you could speak to thethings that they're doing, so
you could help them see you betheir leader, and that's really
important.
But you would have to haveconfidence.
But if you've done leadershipthings you need to own like, yep
(24:02):
, these are some things I'vedone, this is how I've worked it
and this is how I would come inand help you guys do some of
the same things that I'vealready done, and so to them
you're just saying you know Ihave this experience, I want to
show you my knowledge and I wantto show you how I would do
things.
But yet how do I bringeverybody involved and to the
(24:22):
table on those things and beingable to show them that vision?
The other things I did towardsthe end of my interviews.
So I talked about I did like 25interviews between two
principal ships.
Right, the first principal ship.
I did about six interviewsbefore I got that one and then I
did 18.
And then my 19th one, I got myjob at Hastings High.
(24:44):
So over 25 interviews, about 20of those.
I did not do this, but the lastfive I did.
I created what I call the60-90-30 transition plan and
what I did is I created thisplan and I talked about it in
one of my recent episodes.
(25:05):
If you would go back I believeit was episode 25, go back and
listen to that.
I talk about the plan.
But that plan, my transitionplan, helped me land my job at
at Hastings high.
Because what I did is I showedthem what I would do in that
first year, how I would come in,how I would collaborate, how I
(25:27):
would communicate, how I wouldbuild the relationships and
trust on my staff.
Because I knew, coming in as afirst year principal in that
building, I wasn't going to goin there and make changes.
I was going to go in there andlearn.
I was going to go there andlisten.
I was going to go and I wasable to lay that out in my 60,
90, 30 transition plan.
(25:49):
Now the key when you do this iswhen you create this, you're
showing your vision and you wantto be able to show them that
and be able to speak to it.
But then when you get the joband be able to speak to it, but
then when you get the job, youbetter hold yourself to that.
It gives you accountability andyou have to hold it.
So when my first year atHastings High, I took out my
transition plan and I wasfollowing it.
(26:10):
Man, I was like going throughit, checking it off, making sure
I was doing what I said I woulddo and I think that's really
important to do when you havethese transition plans is to
hold to what you said you weregoing to do in that interview.
With that plan, I was able toshow my vision and show them and
be able to really have them seeme in that light of being their
(26:32):
principal.
So that was really important.
And another couple of quickdetail things when it comes to
that plan, make sure you havethat plan with their logo and
their school colors and make itlook really good when you
present that, because you'regoing to give that to the
administrative team, You'regoing to give that to the
teachers.
You may not give it to thestudents, but you're going to
(26:53):
give it to some of those people,some of those adults in those
interviews committees, so youcan show them.
This is what I would do, thisis what I'm about and this is
who I am, and that's reallyimportant to be able to show
that.
And that leads me to my finaltip is you need to be authentic.
Don't be fake.
(27:13):
Be yourself.
You want to make sure yourvalues align with theirs.
Your whole interview process isabout how do I fit with this
school?
How can I help them see me betheir leader?
But yet guess what they'redoing.
They're researching you.
They're getting on social media.
They're getting on Facebook,they're getting on Twitter,
(27:35):
they're getting on TikTok.
They are going to look at yoursocial media to see who you are.
They are going to look at yoursocial media to see who you are.
And you need to make sureyou're being yourself and
authentic when you're in thatinterview.
Because I guarantee you, I'mtelling you that's true, Because
when I got the job at Hastings,they told me yeah, we looked at
your Facebook, we looked atyour stuff, we wanted to see who
(28:00):
you were.
The teachers wanted to know whoI was.
Before I even showed up to theinterview.
They were researching mebecause I was coming from
Southern Valley, the smallschool, and this guy we don't
know if this guy's going to workout.
But then my experiences withRalston and Miller North helped
me with that job as well,because I had big school
(28:21):
experience as well small ruralschool, but I was able to paint
a picture of me, who I am.
This is who I am.
I was able to help them see mebe in that role, and it was said
to me that my teachers that Icurrently have were the ones
that really wanted me.
They really wanted me to betheir principal, their leader.
(28:42):
That meant a lot to me, andthose teachers did look me up on
Facebook and I go, wow, thisguy has a Facebook presence and
we can learn about him and thosethings.
So that's also a trick for youas a principal is to go look at
your candidate's Facebook post.
Go look at who they are and seewho they are and see what they
(29:03):
bring to you when they havethose interviews.
So, with that said, that's myjourney and those are my tips
for you If you're wanting tobecome an educational leader or,
in this case, a principal.
This wasn't something thathappened easily.
It wasn't something thathappened fast.
It was definitely somethingthat happened fast.
It was definitely something Ihad to have resilience with.
(29:26):
I got rejected.
I had to learn from it.
All those things, wrappedtogether, helped me become a
better leader and helped mebecome the leader I am today,
Because without going throughthat journey, I would not be
sitting here as the principal ofHastings High and I absolutely
love my job.
(29:46):
I love what I do on a day-to-daybasis.
Yes, it's hard, yes, there'schallenging moments, but guess
what?
I wouldn't have it any otherway.
I hope you guys got a lot outof this episode and I hope, if
you're an aspiring leader andyou would like help with
interviewing and have some tipsand you'd like to get ahold of
(30:07):
me, I'd definitely love for youto reach out to me.
My stuff's in the show notes.
You could just hit my link andI'll have my email links.
All my social medias are therefor you to contact me with, and
I'd love to hear from thosepeople that are really wanting
to become an educational leader.
And if you're already aneducational leader and you're
(30:27):
looking about taking that nextstep in your leadership, going
from maybe one district toanother, I'd love to help you
out as well.
So don't be afraid to hit me up.
I hope everybody out there ismaking that push to the finish
here, because school is almostover.
I believe we're about fiveweeks left of school where I'm
at, and so we're really pushinghard to accomplish those things
(30:48):
but also to finish off theschool strong in our building.
So with that guys, I hope youguys enjoy this episode.
I hope you got a lot out of it.
I hope you guys subscribe tothe podcast.
Write a review if you haven'tdone so already.
Until next time, everybody.
I hope you guys subscribe tothe podcast.
Write a review, if you haven'tdone so already.
Until next time, everybody.
I hope you guys are being 1%better.
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