November 3, 2021 • 37 mins
Welcome to our 9th episode of Elevate with Grace. In this episode we are rounding out our first smart risk taking series with an excellent book from Emma Isaacs', Winging It! https://www.emmaisaacs.com/
As the title suggests Emma has some great tips on taking a chance on yourself, trusting your gut and winging it. The sub-heading on her book - Stop thinking, Start Doing. Why Action beats planning every time - gives you a hint. There is a lot of rich content within this book that Claire and Miranda discuss from:
- Gut versus decision tool situations
- "When you know you know, and when you don't you decide"
- Tips & Hacks to make more time... meetings are at the top of Emma's list, also some wonderful honesty around outsourcing & not doing it all!
- If its not a hell yes, its a no (linking back to episode 5 - The one thing Emma talks to the need to say no far more than you say yes)
- Team Decision Making
- Avoiding sunk cost bias & Zoom think
- Networking - to help build lasting relationships
- An encouragement to take action
- "Seize the Day, Today"
- Kindness and Fun always
ELEVATEE CHALLENGE
1. Let's foster some kindness. A thank you note, flowers, coffee with a friend and just remember what it's like to be together again.
2. For our real decision making action challenge. Over the past few weeks you have done the work to analyse a key decision, checked any biases, used 1 or more tools to interrogate the options. So you're 70 or 80% comfortable with decision. This is the week let Emma Isaacs inspire you to to take the decision on and just leap. Let's see what happens.
Booktopia Winging It link: https://booktopia.kh4ffx.net/ElevateWingingIt
This is an affiliate link
For more intel on smart risk taking or Elevate with Grace check out our Instagram or Website
We would love your feedback. Please drop us a line via either of the above or our email elevatewithgrace@gmail.com
Music created by Claire's daughter Hannah
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Claire (00:01):
Welcome to the elevate with grace podcast, for women
who are short on time and longto take steps, to create success
on their own terms.
In each episode, we dive intoone of the pillars of our
elevate with grace success onyour own terms model, we explore
smart.
Risk-taking cultivating ourcareers and fueling our
financial power.
We curate insights from the bestcontent and thought leaders
(00:23):
across Australia and the worldand discuss how these ideas can
be practically applied incurrent contexts.
We also provide bite-sizedactionable steps to help you
move forward from where you are,to where you want to be.
Welcome to our second bookreview our ninth episode.
And gosh, I think the.
Podcasts.
We've actually been on a recordin person.
(00:44):
It is.
It's so exciting.
Very exciting podcast recording.
In-person amazing concept.
So my name is Miranda.
If you haven't listened to anepisode for full, we would love
you to go back and check outsome of the initial ones.
Miranda (00:59):
And with me is the FMS sent Claire.
So to round out our smartrisk-taking series and from
episode six through to now oursmart risk taking series has
been about helping Australianwomen kick butt.
And there is no better way towrap that up.
Then a episode about the amazingbook from Emma Isaak, winging
(01:22):
it.
And the Isaac herself is akick-butt Australian woman who
has taken on the challenges ofcreating her and business and
really setting about to elevatewomen within Australia.
So she's very much at ourHeartland and it was an absolute
joy.
So, yes.
So excited to share this bookwith you today.
Claire and I actually setourselves a mission of trying to
(01:43):
uncover as many Australianthought leaders as we can across
our pillars.
So it was definitely a happydance moment when we came across
this one.
For those that haven't heard ofEmma Isaac, don't be ashamed.
Neither had I it's.
Um, it's quite funny how.
You know, even in Australia, Ithink we're very much into big
(02:04):
American thought leaders.
And we do forget to kind of goand seek out our in, and they're
not given as much air time maybeas they should.
We're looking to change that.
so Emma Isaak starting herentrepreneurial journey at 18.
She speaks about working thoselong hours in the staffing
business that hired her and fromthere when the business partner
decided he didn't want to playanymore she was rewarded with a
(02:24):
50% share of the business.
Then at 24, actually buying astruggling business chicks and
turning it into the phenomenonthat it is today.
So business chicks is known fortheir incredible events, with
huge guest speakers, includingthe likes of Debra Lee finesse
and other kick-ass Australian,Richard Branson.
Claire (02:42):
She's a massive fan of Seth Goden.
Miranda (02:43):
Absolutely.
so just incredible thoughtleaders across the world.
And she also has six kids andhe's a huge fan of home births,
and also outsourcing to makesure that she can survive in
life.
And I think we all need to talka little bit more about how we
can outsource to do it all.
She's not afraid to say no, anddoesn't pretend to have
everything, picture perfect inher life.
She's quite honest about thechallenges and also the joy that
(03:05):
comes from imperfection, justfocuses on those key things that
are important.
She's a breath of fresh air.
I really feel, and her honestyand her pragmatism, and really
stood out.
There has been some bigchallenges she shared in her
book, but she really didn't letthem own her or her identity,
which I've respected so much.
Kept the dramatic very separatefrom who she is and what she
wants to put out there in theworld.
(03:26):
I loved her section around howshe fosters fun in her
workplace.
And we'll go into that in a bitmore detail.
Overall, I think she's aninspiration for Australian
women.
I really can't wait to see whatshe does next.
So we're very excited to sharethis book with you, but before
we dive in and I feel like Ikind of already have let's first
check in with the actionchallenge from last week and
(03:46):
Claire, how are you doing sogood to see you in person?
Claire (03:50):
No, it is.
I'm very great today.
The weather is amazing finally,and it's amazing to be out and
about in person.
So I'm feeling pretty high onlife today.
I.
I wanted to also just quicklytouch on the fact that Emma has
released another new bookactually called the new hustle
and I've had a quick readthrough it.
(04:11):
So I wouldn't mind weaving itinto the podcast episode a
little bit today, in terms ofsome of the content, because it
does draw a lot on the contentof winging it and It's basically
Emma's response to what she'slearned from the COVID pandemic
about better ways to work inlive.
it's written as 77 anti rulesaround embracing radical
flexibility, making quickdecisions, which is a lot of the
(04:34):
topics we've been talking aboutthe last few weeks and working
smarter from the emails that wecraft to figuring out What
people we would like to workwith and what organizations we
want to work for and how we canthrive to be our best selves.
It's an interesting read aswell.
And I think she's learned even alot about herself being locked
down in a house, not being ableto outsource managing six kids
(04:54):
and doing everything that she'sdoing.
There's some realism that comesand a recognition of her
privilege in life too, which Ifound refreshing because I think
she's obviously got a lot ofself awareness in that space.
Looking forward to talking aboutthat.
in terms of our action challengefrom last week, which was
practicing the decision trees Ihave.
(05:15):
I've been looking at adifferent, a couple of different
paid work options over thecourse of the last few weeks.
And I did find that it wasreally helpful to just even do a
quick write down.
Think about some of thosetechniques that we did last
week, what's the worst thingthat can happen.
What's the best thing that canhappen.
What are the different scenariosthat could play out in different
cases, to help make somedecisions around that sort of
(05:38):
stuff.
So, yeah.
I had a bit of success with thedecision-making trees this week.
What about yourself?
I know you like the Seth Godenconcept of the cul-de-sac and
the dip and the cliff.
What have you done this week onthat action challenge?
Have you had success with it?
Miranda (05:51):
I went hardcore.
The full decision tree matrix.
I see a word.
And interestingly, I actually, Igot to a point on the decision
tree where I went, all right.
I need to break this into apro-con list and try and work
out if it's a cliff or a dip.
I absolutely loved that.
I've read a bit more about itand I can't wait to dig in
further.
The interesting thing about thedecision tree matrix is I think
done well, it's not somethingyou can do in one sitting
(06:14):
because I've got it sort ofmapped out to a point and now
I've sort of gotta go andresearch those options.
To really understand whatpercentages of outcomes, what
some of the other options are,because I don't think we have
all of the information rightthere in front of us.
Good to write it all out andthen go or what's missing.
What else do I need to go andfind?
So, yeah, I'm good.
And generally I think justreally bounce back strong this
(06:38):
week after a bit of achallenging week.
Although human experiment, don'tleave home without your phone at
the moment.
It makes it very hard to buyinganything, to getting twins or
those without your COVIDpassport.
So just a little human errorthis morning, we asked over line
on our smartphones.
Let's get into this book.
Claire (06:59):
I listened to the Audible version.
I do like audible from time totime.
I change the mode.
Sometimes audio books work forme, sometimes tactile books work
for me, sometimes reading stuffon my Kindle works Read by
herself and I got quite into it.
As soon as I started listening,I think straight up in the first
chapter, she calls out the needfor us to spend less time trying
(07:22):
to concoct the perfect plan andto future proof ourselves from
dramas that probably won'teventuate.
I think that hooked me inimmediately because the biggest,
most profound light bulb momentI had in the second half of
2020, is that realization that Iactually have very little
control over anything in termsof what might happen tomorrow or
the next day or how your worldcan be turned upside down in the
(07:44):
future.
I had this illusion that I hadmy life pretty much under
control with everything runningon rails, out sourced, project
managing my life project,managing my work, albeit on a
super fast freight train,admittedly, which is another
issue again.
Something that I think when Ifirst started reading the book
that she hooked me into straightaway, that there's an
(08:06):
opportunity to be much morerelaxed and as she has a very
fun approach to life andthinking hey winging it.
What's the worst that canhappen.
What about you?
Did you get into it straightaway?
Do you think, or took you alittle bit longer.
Miranda (08:18):
I did I actually, I remember first I was listening
to the book as well andgenerally loving it.
And I say generally, because Ithink sometimes, her experiences
are very different other people.
So there was definitely periodswhere you go, oh, I don't quite
agree with that piece, but afterthe majority absolutely loved
it.
And to hear an Australian woman,telling her success story was
just super exciting to me.
(08:39):
I liked that she reads the bookherself, very kind of personally
uplifting and there some greatideas and things shared, and
you're maybe more personallyinspirational and a bit ra ra,
this is how I did it.
And some great tips forthriving.
And the second half was really abit more entrepreneurial
business owner for.
I was thinking about with thisbooklet for the podcast.
And I've sort of come to thepoint where I've listened to it
(09:02):
a couple of times and actuallygone into what yes it does.
Because even though people don'tnecessarily have their own
businesses or they might notfeel very entrepreneurial, there
was actually a lot of ourlisteners that are leaders in
our organization.
And I think for that, it's stillan incredibly relevant book.
if you are listening on audio, alittle public service
announcement, she does do at thestart of every chapter, a, a
(09:23):
quote or a big passage aboutsomebody else's life.
And that can go on for a littlebit.
And so you kind of going, hangon, when was she a star on like
a TV show?
I did.
I missed that.
And at the end it's like, oh,but this is this person.
So obviously if you're readingit, you would see that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Claire (09:37):
Her approach to life and her ethos definitely resonated
with me.
I think the other, the otherthing that I liked is.
She Emma talks about successbeing achieved through perpetual
motion and putting one foot infront of the other.
And you just keep walkingforward no matter what.
And that it's about, even if youhave bad days or actually I
(09:59):
prefer the term that Simon Sinekuses, which is that you have
behind days and ahead days, evenon your behind days, rather than
bad and good, because then ithas that connotation.
But even on the, behind the.
Like, even if you just send oneemail or do one thing.
And I just, I think that reallyworks well within our success on
(10:19):
your own terms model that it'sjust one day in front of the
other small micro steps,actionable steps each day.
And that is, she really kind oftalks about that being
absolutely critical in terms ofher getting to where she is
today.
Just this constant ethos aboutone step in front of the other,
which I thought was really goodbecause it ties into a lot of
our other stuff as well.
Like the one thing and etcetera.
Miranda (10:41):
Yeah, I really loved her examples of that risk taking
muscle.
And I found that just give it ago try and work it on the fly is
a great thing to say, but sheactually demonstrated how she
has lived that and, you know,not always comfortable for her
or for us.
What's really stuck with me isher journey of.
Rushing to the airport to pickup a higher car.
(11:01):
And, you know, she acknowledgedshe was on her laptop.
She was trying to do things.
She wasn't giving the staff theattention they needed.
Um, and she ended up with amanual car.
Now, when you do an airportcart, you are kilometers away
from the counter.
By the time you find this car.
And so, you know, most of uswould go, oh, Um, I drive a
manual car, but, you know, forpeople that don't, that is quite
(11:24):
confronting to actually get themin your car and need to get to a
business meeting and not knowhow to drive it.
The majority of people I thinkwould go back to that counter
and swap over the car becausethat's just not going to work
for them instead.
She's like, I need to get tothis meeting.
How hard can it be?
I'll just try and work it outand then speaks about that
journey or.
This is really uncomfortable.
(11:45):
This is awful.
Why did I try and take this ontoo?
All right.
I've worked it out and itactually I'm feeling so
empowered and so strong.
So what a great example ofwinging it, firstly, but also,
you know, if we think about thesmart risk taking that we've
been talking about taking youfrom okay.
70% of sort of map this decisionout.
(12:05):
I think this is what I need todo.
That's the worst that canhappen.
Let's just give it a garri.
If someone can teach themselvesto drive a manual car on a way
to remediating, you know, we cando this.
And so I thought that the waythat she presented those
examples, the way that she sortof presented the fact that, you
know, there is moments in therewhere you are going to have some
serious self-doubt and BCITdoing some awful self-talking
(12:27):
to.
Oh, this is great.
And I mean, you know, Iempowered and I can do this and
I'm a strong, strong woman.
Claire (12:34):
I think the other thing though, there's this sort of
secondary element to that aspectof her pushing through.
I did actually feel that I felta bit of sweat when I was
listening to her talk about thatbunny hopping down the road with
a manual car and there's peoplewaiting at the traffic lights
and she can't and trying to sortof block out that concern about
disrupting others days.
(12:54):
Right.
I'm going to actually learn howto do this, and I'm just going
to figure out, and I'm, it'sdriving me crazy that people are
behind me beeping their horns,but I'm going to push through.
And I felt that experience withher.
I think though, the other aspectof what she does well, and she
talks about this in the newhustle.
And maybe I remember thatbecause I've sort of read it
more just in the last week, butthat she also knows quite early
(13:17):
on.
And that's a bit like the energystuff that we were talking about
last week in the Seth Godenthings, she taps into her gut
when things aren't right and shepulls out if her gut is telling
her it isn't right.
So she says, you know, if she'sfeeling stuck or feeling
stressed or tired and confused,and I would guess that that's
more than bunny hopping down theroad from that.
(13:39):
But if there's a period of time,Whatever that timeframe for you
is a couple of ways, a couple ofmonths or whatever that she uses
him.
She's got a tool that she usesin her business and her in her
personal life.
When she's feeling stuck orfeeling stressed or tired or
confused, she stops and asks, behonest, is this working or not
working?
I get that.
She's probably developed thatmuscle as an entrepreneurs and
(14:01):
as your own boss, you have tomake those decisions quite a lot
of the time and you have to makequick decisions.
And she gives a lot of greatexamples, both in winging it and
in the new hustle aboutexperiences that she's had,
where she's followed her gut andthought about that sort of
stuff.
And so I think that's the otherelement of as that's the, I
guess the complete picture isyeah.
(14:23):
Pushing yourself and gettingright out of your comfort zone
and winging it.
But also knowing that you've gotthat gut behind you to say, at
some point, I've got to askmyself, have I put myself out
there and it's uncomfortable,but in a good way, or is ever
put myself out there.
New job isn't for me or thisparticular thing that I'm doing
(14:44):
isn't for me.
And I think it's the combinationthat work well together.
I think that as women, we allneed to just tap into a lot more
like it's then following yourgut, but also pushing yourself.
Miranda (14:54):
I think we have biases are getting in the way as well.
So she, you know, she spoke tosunk cost bias with the brand
name example, like they paidthese brand naming execs in the
US thousands of dollars and allthat executive time to solve the
brand name.
That's right.
At some point he's like, ignorethe sunk cost, ignore all the
time we're putting into this.
It's not working.
(15:15):
Let's just keep the name and geton with it.
Absolutely.
I'm going to take this on.
I need to do this.
This is a challenge I can do fortoday.
This doesn't feel right.
I'm going to pull back.
I'm going to take time, but it'snot because of the biases.
It's because I've thought aboutthis and I'm going to sit with
this and make sure that I'm notbeing interrupted by my own
unconscious biases.
So that was really good.
Let's get on with this one.
How do you have a favoritepassage or a quote from the book
(15:38):
that you'd like to.
I Am cheating a little bit tosay, but I think the quote that
I pulled out in particularcontext of the last four
episodes that we've done, and Ido really like, it is her quote
that she says, and it's a bitlike what we've been talking
about, the quote that she says,when, you know, you know, when
you don't know, you decide, oh,I like it.
(15:59):
And so.
She talks about that.
If we just sit still and reallylisten to ourselves and what our
core is telling us, we can tapinto what we know.
Does this feel right?
Does this excite me?
And I think that I've started tolearn a lot more about what that
means.
So as we're doing our ownelevate with grace journey and
(16:20):
thinking about, well what's our,why?
Where do we want to be in fiveyears?
It's becoming easier for me tosay, well, if I'm looking at
this opportunity or thatopportunity, or I'm thinking
about what I'm doing, I amtapping into a lot more, not
getting so caught up in.
Specific detail of something, amI feeling really good about this
versus, oh, that one's okay.
Claire (16:41):
And she really always goes for, if it's a mediocre
business arrangement she cutsoff.
She would say that she cuts off15 mediocre deals to have five
great ones, because the fact isif it's the five great ones and
your life is full and crazy andall that sort of stuff.
It won't matter to you becauseyou'll get energy from those
five great ones.
It kind of ties in nicely with,you know, when, you know, and if
(17:01):
you're not sure then thedecision-making tools that we
bought up, like actually reallyspend the time to use them to
help you figure it out when youcan't follow your gut.
I think we tend to around,asking everyone else what they
think.
Now that's different to having afew kind of advisors that you go
to in specific circumstancesthat we talked about last week.
(17:22):
I've got into the habit ofasking my partner or my mom or
my people where they're notgoing to necessarily give you
the right decision.
Miranda (17:31):
You're using them to maybe validate what you want to
hear, or you want to back it upwith some external validation
that did pull it out as one ofmy quotes as well, because I did
love this.
Like if they're not in theentrepreneurial trenches with
you in her instance.
Don't ask them their opinionsand certainly don't give a lot
of credence to the answers thatother people give you all the
feedback they give you.
Claire (17:52):
If you know a bit about where you want to go, what you
want your life to look like, howyou want things to work out in
terms of success on your ownterms only you can really know
whether something is going tofuel that.
You've got to make thosedecisions for yourself because
other people are bringing theirbiases and their concerns and
their views to the table.
And then you just get into thisdecision action paralysis.
(18:14):
So when we were talking aboutour example from this week about
thinking about different workopportunities to think about.
I didn't go and ask my mom or mypartner or, I mean, I would
clearly if it was familysituation, but from a career
point of view I could just usethe methods that we had last
week, talked to a couple ofpeople to bounce some ideas, in
that particular space, and Idon't even actually know that I
(18:37):
needed to do that this week.
I know it was more.
What feels right?
What excites me?
What, have I learned previouslythat I can now apply to these in
terms of previous values?
Like the energy stuff, you bringthat in to help you make some
decisions.
I felt comfortable in my Isaakstyle to trusting myself that I
know what's right.
I've got a couple of otherquotes which ties in a little
bit about disease to please incaring what other people think.
(18:59):
So she says,"so go on and runyour own race and let others run
theirs".
That we need to stay far, faraway from the compare and
despair syndrome, which isreally hard to do in a world of
social media,
Miranda (19:12):
but so important, but it is your mental health.
It's so important and I doagree.
I absolutely loved the exampleshe gave.
Just celebrate women and beexcited for your friends, your
colleagues, when they achieveknow that your time is coming
and know that we're all on ourown race and it is not you or
them, and we are going toachieve together.
Claire (19:31):
So, yeah, I agree down as well.
Miranda (19:34):
To take that one further, it seize the day today.
I think so often where we'reseizing the day tomorrow and
I've seen a lot of quotes popup, which are all about no one
sees a plan, they only see youraction.
So I think that ties in reallywell.
Just wing it, you know, seizethe day, make it happen.
That she is only limited by whatshe can dream and where she
wants to go and who she can takewith her.
(19:55):
I think that does come also withthe caveat that some of our
workplaces at the moment arefeeling a little bit risky
adverse.
We've definitely felt this,Everyone in their box, just do
what you do.
And I think Claire, you've beensort of saying even out in the
workforce, there's not thiswhole, oh, I can see how those
experiences wouldcross-pollinate like, no, no
have you done this exact jobbefore, right?
Claire (20:15):
I think there is a context, particularly my
experience in Melbourne.
I don't know whether that'sglobally as well.
Actually Emma does talk about itin the new hustle, which links
into what I was saying last weekabout the biases that can come
into group meetings in a hybridand virtual workplace.
We've become everyone, whetherit's risk averse or not thinking
(20:36):
outside the box, or I thinkeveryone has become very
transactional and verysingle-minded about how things
need to get done.
don't know whether that'sbecause no one can take any more
mental load or whether we'rejust a bit tunnel vision,
because we're all on virtualmeetings.
As Emma talks about in the newhustle.
I mentioned last week as well inthe podcast, virtual meetings
are a bit clunky andtransactional anyway.
(20:57):
It's about bringing in someskills to widen that out.
Being very clear and she talksabout it at zoom.
I think not group thing, butzoom think, it's easier for
people to nod, agree and get offthe zoom meeting and carry on.
So it's that pre preparationwork that needs happen.
We've become quite tunnel visionand insular over the last 18
(21:17):
months in a COVID world.
But I think there's a massiveopportunity that we need to
reopen that up.
In a virtual and hybrid workingworld, not wait until everyone's
back in bricks and mortarbuildings and all catching up in
3d, albeit that's amazing, westill need to be able to
function properly and make greatdecisions in big creative
(21:38):
individual and hybrid situationas well.
My personal experience is thatthat hasn't been where a lot of
people had been at for the last12 months,
Miranda (21:46):
which my last quote, before we move on to, someone
else section.
Everyone is just a personkindness and respect is needed
at all levels.
Always keep good eye contact, awarm greeting, big genuine.
And I do.
I've absolutely always lived andfelt this personally.
(22:06):
it was great to see Emma withthat quote, because I feel like
it's really important.
What I loved that she did isevery, I think she was saying
every week, she actually justgoes out of our way for one
person.
Like whether it's just a card ora.
Or up some flowers to her mom.
So just putting it in your diaryevery week, just a little act of
kindness.
(22:27):
I think if everybody did thatfor the next set of eight weeks,
we'd be back on track muchfaster than we've ever been.
Claire (22:33):
In the new hustle.
One of our anti rules goes evenfurther, which I really liked,
which is to send a thank youemail every morning.
And she said she started offwith just with having a 15
minute reminder and be like, whocan I thank for something that
they've done for me today anddoing that every day.
I thought that was a great tip.
There is heaps of practical tipsand stuff that you can just
(22:53):
basically start doing likestraight away.
I think for us action peoplebeing I actually found that
there was plenty and plenty ofplenty of ideas and tips and
suggestions that she put throughthe whole book that I just found
was really quite good.
Because she breaks the chaptersup in winging it into various
topics.
And so for example, chapter fouris about Emma's views on what
(23:17):
successful people do andtime-saving hacks.
And at first that was one of thebits of the book where I did a
bit of a mini eye roll.
Cause what successful people dois a done to death topic, in my
opinion.
And I was a bit.
Yeah.
As a bit like, ah, here we go.
It's supposed to be up at 5:00AM, like creating, you know, my
(23:37):
plans for the world until 7:00AM.
And then I was supposed to goexercise for an hour at 8:00 AM.
And then at midnight I can go tobed or something and that's what
you need to do to be successful.
She does come up with somereally just basic practical
tips.
so the time-saving hacks.
One of the things I have noticeddesperately over the last 18
months is everyone is fatiguedby meetings.
Like we've kind of gone from.
(23:58):
Bricks and mortar situationwhere you're meeting in and
probably inefficient andineffective meetings in the
first place.
And then we've transferred theminto a cOVID kind of zoom
meeting world.
And I love the fact that she isa complete meeting, like mad
person.
Like she will not stay on ameeting longer than if it's a
meeting.
That's she'll always ask whatit's for.
If she feels that at the end ofthe 15 minute meeting, again,
(24:22):
she's a CEO founder, perhapsit's a bit different, but I
still think we all need to be abit brave.
I remember she actually, oh,that's right.
That, that was a big thing totalk about.
Miranda (24:33):
I really enjoyed her journey on that.
She's realize somebody else needto be the entrepreneur.
I need to be the founder andhave a great story, but that
somebody can actually run mycompany better.
I was like, whoa.
Claire (24:45):
That's a really good point.
She believes a lot in that aswell.
One of the things is, you know,I don't want people to talk
about finding their passion.
Like you find your passion bydoing like, and going through
and doing something.
If that doesn't work out well,you cull that and you do
something else.
And so I think that actuallydoes live and breathe her, um,
belief in that concept to that.
And then the degree is to say,Actually it's whether it's not
(25:08):
my passion or it's not myskillset, it's probably a
combination of both.
I think that someone can do thatCEO role better, and I need to
hire someone to that role.
I think that that's a pretty biglesson so I think her
time-saving.
Well, actually really practical,really questioning whether a
meeting is required or can it bedone with a 15 minute email
(25:29):
exchange or quick, can you justpick up the phone, before you
set that meeting does it reallyneed to be set.
Is there an easier and moreeffective way for people to do
it be really responsible andaccountable for people's time?
I liked how she says she's gotto do it now hack.
So basically if you open anemail.
Um, answer it right now.
Like if you've gone into yourinbox and you've opened the
(25:50):
email, don't close it and goback to it later.
Just pen out a response.
The response doesn't have to beperfect.
Give yourself 60 seconds.
Obviously, if it's a big emailthat requires a lot of work or a
project, but if it's somethingthat you can respond to
immediately do not shove it downand go back to it later, just
respond all that sort of stuff.
It is very practical, smallmicro things that you can do,
(26:11):
not this whole, how here's, howto be successful.
Wake up at 5:00 AM
Miranda (26:14):
yes, I've got to do what feels right for you.
Um, for me, I really liked how,she was very open about talking
about money and I feel like thisis something new that's coming
into our culture that hasn'texisted before.
I'm excited for some of ourfinancial episodes in the
future.
Claire (26:29):
Needless to say, I love the fact that she had a chapter
on money and finance.
I was very happy to say that.
Miranda (26:35):
Absolutely.
So she has a great relationshipwith investments and balancing.
Um, ensuring that those, thatrainy day funds when she needs
it.
And she really speaks about thecost of running business that
friends that have been on thisentrepreneurial journey that
they really need to have thatback into.
So I think that was a reallygood pragmatic, again, lots of
(26:56):
pragmatic advice throughoutthis.
Um, I did an interview and weactually spoke about how hard
she found that, thatentrepreneurial journey in
Australia and that in LA, sheactually felt that it was much
easier to be an entrepreneur.
A much safer place for women torise up.
I think we need to try andcreate that in Australia.
Not necessarily even justentrepreneurial women, but I
(27:16):
think women that are inbusiness, let's just try and
support each other and celebrateeach other and look for
opportunities that can reallyhelp elevate all of the women
around us.
So she had a lot of thosemessages throughout that I
really enjoyed.
So, like I said, This bookreally sort of is split into two
sections.
So the first half is some greatpersonal advice and great tips.
(27:37):
And then the second half is moreabout running a business and
great leadership, thoughts andhacks.
And she's sort of saying 60% ofsmall businesses in Australia
really don't make it past thefirst three years.
And it's important that weensure that there's a market out
there that do your homework, youexpect it to be all consuming in
the first couple of years andfind others to support you, who
(27:59):
skill surpass yours and otherareas that you just can't do it
all.
And we spoke just before abouthow Emma's really lives that.
I really liked seeing how Emmawas so dedicated to raising the
profile of women.
And as I mentioned reallylooking to.
Encourage women, wherever youare, that each individual can
make a difference in theirchange by supporting the women
(28:19):
around them.
Collectively cheering on thesuccess of the successes of
others and having thatindividual responsibility to go.
How can I help somebody elsetoday and absolutely loved that.
So the last section we wanted todiscuss about with this book is.
Whether it changed our opinionor perspective on anything.
For me, I actually reallyenjoyed her section on
(28:42):
networking.
Genuinely love meeting newpeople, discovering new ideas,
making connections, and sharingnew thoughts.
I am relatively extroverted.
Absolutely gain energy frombeing surrounded by others.
But a networking event is one ofthe most uncomfortable things.
It's never stopped.
Talk to me, I still attenddifferent events.
But you are an extrovert.
Extrovert too as am I.
(29:03):
She really challenges.
I think everybody.
And she calls herself.
How does an introvert And thereis some great tips and hacks on
how you can overcome it.
She came with some tips on howto go about networking.
She recommends everyone brush upon some NPL.
So neuro, linguistic programmingand.
And it's reading people'slanguage.
It's even thinking aboutquestions rather than asking
(29:23):
where do you work or what do youdo?
Having some interestingquestions to ask people.
Have you ever heard thisspeaker?
Before.
Where was the last place youtraveled?
What's what's your passion atthe moment?
What are you excited about?
It's going to be a much betterconversation then.
Oh, yeah, I work.
At the bank.
Claire (29:38):
Let's face it as, as someone that's done business
cheeks.
If we're going to listen toanyone about some suggestions,
leadership's on how you can getbetter at.
Networking and how you can makeit.
It less of a feeling of.
Oh, my gosh.
I'd rather poke my eyes out,then go to that event.
I feel like Emma Isaacs isprobably.
A good one to listen to some ofher networking tips.
She's.
He's got some really good onesin the new hustle as well.
(30:00):
One of the things she says isone of the anti rules is sit
down and work out.
The 10 people in your networkthat are most powerful to you.
Right?
So if you think about what youwant to do for the next 12
months, or a couple of years,sit down and look at your
LinkedIn network or think.
About your network work out, whoare the 10, most powerful people
to you now that couldnecessarily be the CEO.
(30:22):
It could be someone that, youknow, she gives a couple of good
examples.
It could be the assistant of theCEO.
Who knows everybody in thatindustry that you want to get
into it.
Doesn't, it's not about power interms of it's about who can,
who's got the most influence tobe able to help you with stuff
that you need, and that youbasically have those 10 people
(30:42):
and you make a concerted efforteach week on rotation to find a
reason to contact one of themeach week and make it a
discipline and a habit I'veheard.
Others in the past, say if youfind an article that you think
would resonate for one of yourpeople in your network, you
should send it to them.
But even as much as I just thinkEven if you will get to go on
rotation and say, Hey, how's itgoing?
(31:03):
Is there anything I can help youwith at the moment on.
You know, X, Y, and Z, or itcould be, it doesn't have to be
a big deal, but I really lockedher.
It's really important tocontinually foster and build
relationships.
You can't just expect people outof the blue and obviously that's
something that she's sosuccessful at.
I think she's got some greatcontent, both in that book and
(31:24):
the other book.
Yeah.
It's good
Miranda (31:27):
Treating networking like a relationship.
Is that what you're sayingthere?
It's not just going in andgoing, hi, I'm this person.
This is what I do.
can I give you my business card?
Sell, sell, sell it's.
Hey, who are you?
And get to know you as a person.
She sort of speaks to that.
But like dating, you get to knowthe people, you don't try to
sell them anything.
You get to build a relationship.
See if you've got somethingthat's interesting.
(31:47):
And maybe on the second or thirddate, introduce that to them,
but don't necessarily go on grabevery business card, you can
get, put them on a mailing listand start to harass them.
That's not the way to build arelationship.
She's got really greatrelationship building tips to
the whole thing.
And my final takeaway fromnetworking events or doing any
networking or conferencing, evenonline.
Is, if you do connect withsomebody.
(32:08):
Booking in your diary to have 15minutes the next day to actually
do some followups and somereach-outs, she gives an example
of sending a book to somebodylike that.
Hadn't heard of a book that sherecommended or just any little
note saying, thanks so much.
I really appreciated your time,but then playing back some of
the ideas that they've actuallygiven to you, so you've really
heard they've resonated withyou.
(32:30):
It's a great idea.
Claire (32:31):
Yeah.
She's very giving and thoughtflux that comes to her
naturally, I think.
And then she gives some goodtips.
If it doesn't come to younaturally put some diarize items
and then do it right then, andthen send the thank you note.
First thing first up at nineo'clock until it becomes a habit
that was spoken about.
For me it did.
Change my perspective on acouple of things.
I think I've got very seriousand insular over the last decade
(32:54):
of running on a treadmill andall the rest of it.
And so her book.
Combined with a COVID lockdownwake up.
I think it's made me reallyappreciate asking myself every
day.
Am I having fun?
Is this good?
What is my day look like to, howcan I make every situation and
really checking myself when I'mthinking, oh, this is a drag.
Should I really be doing this?
And being very conscious andaware that.
(33:17):
Life is short and it's precious.
And it's about today.
And in the moment, I think I gota lot of.
Inspiration from Emma about thatstuff.
And.
A bit about like similar sort ofstuff with the relationships and
networking about how you can beconsciously thinking about all
the times, how you are makingother people's lives enjoyable.
(33:37):
And fun as well.
So you, if you're a leader, youhave a responsibility to do
that.
Um, but even if you're not, ifyour coworkers, if.
If you, if you walk over.
And you see someone isstruggling with something, you
know, ask them.
Is there anything that you cando if you're grabbing a glass of
water for yourself, just grab aglass of water for another
person and put it on front oftheir desk.
Really basic, simple thingsabout how can I make this
(34:00):
person's life more enjoyable orfun right now?
I love that, that she's got thatphilosophy.
And I need to be more fun.
I think.
I'm fine, but not in everydaymoment., how can I make this
moment more fun?
And also be aware of what fundmay be to me is not fun or for
somebody else and being soconscious of the others in that
environment, that emotionalawareness.
(34:21):
So I really, yeah, I got a lotout of that book from that
perspective.
Excellent.
Excellent takeaways from thisbook.
I think you can tell from ourview that we could not recommend
it high enough.
So please do check it out nowhow to plan to action challenge.
But I think the first actionchallenge that I want to give
everybody is not about decisionmaking.
It's actually what you justsaid.
Let's foster some kindness.
(34:42):
Let's send a thank you note.
Let's send some flowers, let'sget a coffee with a friend and
just remember what it's like tobe together again.
That would just be so good nowfor decision making action
challenge.
Let's also take that on.
So in the past few weeks,there's definitely been a lot of
conversation about bias andtools to interrogated important
(35:03):
decision.
If anything is going to inspireyou.
Emma Isaacs winging at bookshould be about, let's just take
that leap.
So you're 70 or 80% comfortablewith decision.
This is the week to take thedecision on and just leap.
Let's see what happens.
We're all going to do itcollectively together.
Exactly what we've been talkingabout.
(35:24):
Let's raise each other up andyou have our support to make it
happen.
Yes.
Perfect time of the year too.
I've seen some things onInstagram about people reminding
us that this.
It's something like 60 daysuntil the end of the year.
But, you know, there's apositive message in that you've
got 60 days to the end of theyear.
What can you do each day?
That is really going to beimpactful for yourself and the
(35:46):
decision that you want to makeimpactful for somebody else by
sending a thank you note orbeing thoughtful about a gift or
a catch-up.
The message is lots of impactfuldecision making and thoughtful
kind actions, is great.
our next episode will be in afortnight's time.
So in two weeks, 18th ofNovember.
We've got three more episodes togo for this season so we're
(36:07):
going to do them in two infortnightly episode drops from
here on end to the end of theyear next episode we'll be
talking about one of our otherpillars which is cultivating
career success on your terms sothat'll be next episode In two
weeks on the 18th of november sowe look forward to speaking to
you then any final words mirandajust please check us out on all
(36:27):
of the socials if you couldshare the podcast we would be
super super grateful for thatplease share and follow so you
don't miss an episodeparticularly as we move to this
sort of fortnightly drop andjust thank you so much it's been
a wonderful episode wonderfulSeeing you in person claire and
listeners we hope you've reallyenjoyed this book review if you
would like to check it out we dohave a booktopia link in our
(36:50):
show notes have a great weekhave a great fortnight, Awesome
See you next time round upthanks everyone
Welcome to the elevate with grace podcast, for women
who are short on time and longto take steps, to create success
on their own terms.
In each episode, we dive intoone of the pillars of our
elevate with grace success onyour own terms model, we explore
smart.
Risk-taking cultivating ourcareers and fueling our
financial power.
We curate insights from the bestcontent and thought leaders
(00:23):
across Australia and the worldand discuss how these ideas can
be practically applied incurrent contexts.
We also provide bite-sizedactionable steps to help you
move forward from where you are,to where you want to be.
Welcome to our second bookreview our ninth episode.
And gosh, I think the.
Podcasts.
We've actually been on a recordin person.
(00:44):
It is.
It's so exciting.
Very exciting podcast recording.
In-person amazing concept.
So my name is Miranda.
If you haven't listened to anepisode for full, we would love
you to go back and check outsome of the initial ones.
Miranda (00:59):
And with me is the FMS sent Claire.
So to round out our smartrisk-taking series and from
episode six through to now oursmart risk taking series has
been about helping Australianwomen kick butt.
And there is no better way towrap that up.
Then a episode about the amazingbook from Emma Isaak, winging
(01:22):
it.
And the Isaac herself is akick-butt Australian woman who
has taken on the challenges ofcreating her and business and
really setting about to elevatewomen within Australia.
So she's very much at ourHeartland and it was an absolute
joy.
So, yes.
So excited to share this bookwith you today.
Claire and I actually setourselves a mission of trying to
(01:43):
uncover as many Australianthought leaders as we can across
our pillars.
So it was definitely a happydance moment when we came across
this one.
For those that haven't heard ofEmma Isaac, don't be ashamed.
Neither had I it's.
Um, it's quite funny how.
You know, even in Australia, Ithink we're very much into big
(02:04):
American thought leaders.
And we do forget to kind of goand seek out our in, and they're
not given as much air time maybeas they should.
We're looking to change that.
so Emma Isaak starting herentrepreneurial journey at 18.
She speaks about working thoselong hours in the staffing
business that hired her and fromthere when the business partner
decided he didn't want to playanymore she was rewarded with a
(02:24):
50% share of the business.
Then at 24, actually buying astruggling business chicks and
turning it into the phenomenonthat it is today.
So business chicks is known fortheir incredible events, with
huge guest speakers, includingthe likes of Debra Lee finesse
and other kick-ass Australian,Richard Branson.
Claire (02:42):
She's a massive fan of Seth Goden.
Miranda (02:43):
Absolutely.
so just incredible thoughtleaders across the world.
And she also has six kids andhe's a huge fan of home births,
and also outsourcing to makesure that she can survive in
life.
And I think we all need to talka little bit more about how we
can outsource to do it all.
She's not afraid to say no, anddoesn't pretend to have
everything, picture perfect inher life.
She's quite honest about thechallenges and also the joy that
(03:05):
comes from imperfection, justfocuses on those key things that
are important.
She's a breath of fresh air.
I really feel, and her honestyand her pragmatism, and really
stood out.
There has been some bigchallenges she shared in her
book, but she really didn't letthem own her or her identity,
which I've respected so much.
Kept the dramatic very separatefrom who she is and what she
wants to put out there in theworld.
(03:26):
I loved her section around howshe fosters fun in her
workplace.
And we'll go into that in a bitmore detail.
Overall, I think she's aninspiration for Australian
women.
I really can't wait to see whatshe does next.
So we're very excited to sharethis book with you, but before
we dive in and I feel like Ikind of already have let's first
check in with the actionchallenge from last week and
(03:46):
Claire, how are you doing sogood to see you in person?
Claire (03:50):
No, it is.
I'm very great today.
The weather is amazing finally,and it's amazing to be out and
about in person.
So I'm feeling pretty high onlife today.
I.
I wanted to also just quicklytouch on the fact that Emma has
released another new bookactually called the new hustle
and I've had a quick readthrough it.
(04:11):
So I wouldn't mind weaving itinto the podcast episode a
little bit today, in terms ofsome of the content, because it
does draw a lot on the contentof winging it and It's basically
Emma's response to what she'slearned from the COVID pandemic
about better ways to work inlive.
it's written as 77 anti rulesaround embracing radical
flexibility, making quickdecisions, which is a lot of the
(04:34):
topics we've been talking aboutthe last few weeks and working
smarter from the emails that wecraft to figuring out What
people we would like to workwith and what organizations we
want to work for and how we canthrive to be our best selves.
It's an interesting read aswell.
And I think she's learned even alot about herself being locked
down in a house, not being ableto outsource managing six kids
(04:54):
and doing everything that she'sdoing.
There's some realism that comesand a recognition of her
privilege in life too, which Ifound refreshing because I think
she's obviously got a lot ofself awareness in that space.
Looking forward to talking aboutthat.
in terms of our action challengefrom last week, which was
practicing the decision trees Ihave.
(05:15):
I've been looking at adifferent, a couple of different
paid work options over thecourse of the last few weeks.
And I did find that it wasreally helpful to just even do a
quick write down.
Think about some of thosetechniques that we did last
week, what's the worst thingthat can happen.
What's the best thing that canhappen.
What are the different scenariosthat could play out in different
cases, to help make somedecisions around that sort of
(05:38):
stuff.
So, yeah.
I had a bit of success with thedecision-making trees this week.
What about yourself?
I know you like the Seth Godenconcept of the cul-de-sac and
the dip and the cliff.
What have you done this week onthat action challenge?
Have you had success with it?
Miranda (05:51):
I went hardcore.
The full decision tree matrix.
I see a word.
And interestingly, I actually, Igot to a point on the decision
tree where I went, all right.
I need to break this into apro-con list and try and work
out if it's a cliff or a dip.
I absolutely loved that.
I've read a bit more about itand I can't wait to dig in
further.
The interesting thing about thedecision tree matrix is I think
done well, it's not somethingyou can do in one sitting
(06:14):
because I've got it sort ofmapped out to a point and now
I've sort of gotta go andresearch those options.
To really understand whatpercentages of outcomes, what
some of the other options are,because I don't think we have
all of the information rightthere in front of us.
Good to write it all out andthen go or what's missing.
What else do I need to go andfind?
So, yeah, I'm good.
And generally I think justreally bounce back strong this
(06:38):
week after a bit of achallenging week.
Although human experiment, don'tleave home without your phone at
the moment.
It makes it very hard to buyinganything, to getting twins or
those without your COVIDpassport.
So just a little human errorthis morning, we asked over line
on our smartphones.
Let's get into this book.
Claire (06:59):
I listened to the Audible version.
I do like audible from time totime.
I change the mode.
Sometimes audio books work forme, sometimes tactile books work
for me, sometimes reading stuffon my Kindle works Read by
herself and I got quite into it.
As soon as I started listening,I think straight up in the first
chapter, she calls out the needfor us to spend less time trying
(07:22):
to concoct the perfect plan andto future proof ourselves from
dramas that probably won'teventuate.
I think that hooked me inimmediately because the biggest,
most profound light bulb momentI had in the second half of
2020, is that realization that Iactually have very little
control over anything in termsof what might happen tomorrow or
the next day or how your worldcan be turned upside down in the
(07:44):
future.
I had this illusion that I hadmy life pretty much under
control with everything runningon rails, out sourced, project
managing my life project,managing my work, albeit on a
super fast freight train,admittedly, which is another
issue again.
Something that I think when Ifirst started reading the book
that she hooked me into straightaway, that there's an
(08:06):
opportunity to be much morerelaxed and as she has a very
fun approach to life andthinking hey winging it.
What's the worst that canhappen.
What about you?
Did you get into it straightaway?
Do you think, or took you alittle bit longer.
Miranda (08:18):
I did I actually, I remember first I was listening
to the book as well andgenerally loving it.
And I say generally, because Ithink sometimes, her experiences
are very different other people.
So there was definitely periodswhere you go, oh, I don't quite
agree with that piece, but afterthe majority absolutely loved
it.
And to hear an Australian woman,telling her success story was
just super exciting to me.
(08:39):
I liked that she reads the bookherself, very kind of personally
uplifting and there some greatideas and things shared, and
you're maybe more personallyinspirational and a bit ra ra,
this is how I did it.
And some great tips forthriving.
And the second half was really abit more entrepreneurial
business owner for.
I was thinking about with thisbooklet for the podcast.
And I've sort of come to thepoint where I've listened to it
(09:02):
a couple of times and actuallygone into what yes it does.
Because even though people don'tnecessarily have their own
businesses or they might notfeel very entrepreneurial, there
was actually a lot of ourlisteners that are leaders in
our organization.
And I think for that, it's stillan incredibly relevant book.
if you are listening on audio, alittle public service
announcement, she does do at thestart of every chapter, a, a
(09:23):
quote or a big passage aboutsomebody else's life.
And that can go on for a littlebit.
And so you kind of going, hangon, when was she a star on like
a TV show?
I did.
I missed that.
And at the end it's like, oh,but this is this person.
So obviously if you're readingit, you would see that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Claire (09:37):
Her approach to life and her ethos definitely resonated
with me.
I think the other, the otherthing that I liked is.
She Emma talks about successbeing achieved through perpetual
motion and putting one foot infront of the other.
And you just keep walkingforward no matter what.
And that it's about, even if youhave bad days or actually I
(09:59):
prefer the term that Simon Sinekuses, which is that you have
behind days and ahead days, evenon your behind days, rather than
bad and good, because then ithas that connotation.
But even on the, behind the.
Like, even if you just send oneemail or do one thing.
And I just, I think that reallyworks well within our success on
(10:19):
your own terms model that it'sjust one day in front of the
other small micro steps,actionable steps each day.
And that is, she really kind oftalks about that being
absolutely critical in terms ofher getting to where she is
today.
Just this constant ethos aboutone step in front of the other,
which I thought was really goodbecause it ties into a lot of
our other stuff as well.
Like the one thing and etcetera.
Miranda (10:41):
Yeah, I really loved her examples of that risk taking
muscle.
And I found that just give it ago try and work it on the fly is
a great thing to say, but sheactually demonstrated how she
has lived that and, you know,not always comfortable for her
or for us.
What's really stuck with me isher journey of.
Rushing to the airport to pickup a higher car.
(11:01):
And, you know, she acknowledgedshe was on her laptop.
She was trying to do things.
She wasn't giving the staff theattention they needed.
Um, and she ended up with amanual car.
Now, when you do an airportcart, you are kilometers away
from the counter.
By the time you find this car.
And so, you know, most of uswould go, oh, Um, I drive a
manual car, but, you know, forpeople that don't, that is quite
(11:24):
confronting to actually get themin your car and need to get to a
business meeting and not knowhow to drive it.
The majority of people I thinkwould go back to that counter
and swap over the car becausethat's just not going to work
for them instead.
She's like, I need to get tothis meeting.
How hard can it be?
I'll just try and work it outand then speaks about that
journey or.
This is really uncomfortable.
(11:45):
This is awful.
Why did I try and take this ontoo?
All right.
I've worked it out and itactually I'm feeling so
empowered and so strong.
So what a great example ofwinging it, firstly, but also,
you know, if we think about thesmart risk taking that we've
been talking about taking youfrom okay.
70% of sort of map this decisionout.
(12:05):
I think this is what I need todo.
That's the worst that canhappen.
Let's just give it a garri.
If someone can teach themselvesto drive a manual car on a way
to remediating, you know, we cando this.
And so I thought that the waythat she presented those
examples, the way that she sortof presented the fact that, you
know, there is moments in therewhere you are going to have some
serious self-doubt and BCITdoing some awful self-talking
(12:27):
to.
Oh, this is great.
And I mean, you know, Iempowered and I can do this and
I'm a strong, strong woman.
Claire (12:34):
I think the other thing though, there's this sort of
secondary element to that aspectof her pushing through.
I did actually feel that I felta bit of sweat when I was
listening to her talk about thatbunny hopping down the road with
a manual car and there's peoplewaiting at the traffic lights
and she can't and trying to sortof block out that concern about
disrupting others days.
(12:54):
Right.
I'm going to actually learn howto do this, and I'm just going
to figure out, and I'm, it'sdriving me crazy that people are
behind me beeping their horns,but I'm going to push through.
And I felt that experience withher.
I think though, the other aspectof what she does well, and she
talks about this in the newhustle.
And maybe I remember thatbecause I've sort of read it
more just in the last week, butthat she also knows quite early
(13:17):
on.
And that's a bit like the energystuff that we were talking about
last week in the Seth Godenthings, she taps into her gut
when things aren't right and shepulls out if her gut is telling
her it isn't right.
So she says, you know, if she'sfeeling stuck or feeling
stressed or tired and confused,and I would guess that that's
more than bunny hopping down theroad from that.
(13:39):
But if there's a period of time,Whatever that timeframe for you
is a couple of ways, a couple ofmonths or whatever that she uses
him.
She's got a tool that she usesin her business and her in her
personal life.
When she's feeling stuck orfeeling stressed or tired or
confused, she stops and asks, behonest, is this working or not
working?
I get that.
She's probably developed thatmuscle as an entrepreneurs and
(14:01):
as your own boss, you have tomake those decisions quite a lot
of the time and you have to makequick decisions.
And she gives a lot of greatexamples, both in winging it and
in the new hustle aboutexperiences that she's had,
where she's followed her gut andthought about that sort of
stuff.
And so I think that's the otherelement of as that's the, I
guess the complete picture isyeah.
(14:23):
Pushing yourself and gettingright out of your comfort zone
and winging it.
But also knowing that you've gotthat gut behind you to say, at
some point, I've got to askmyself, have I put myself out
there and it's uncomfortable,but in a good way, or is ever
put myself out there.
New job isn't for me or thisparticular thing that I'm doing
(14:44):
isn't for me.
And I think it's the combinationthat work well together.
I think that as women, we allneed to just tap into a lot more
like it's then following yourgut, but also pushing yourself.
Miranda (14:54):
I think we have biases are getting in the way as well.
So she, you know, she spoke tosunk cost bias with the brand
name example, like they paidthese brand naming execs in the
US thousands of dollars and allthat executive time to solve the
brand name.
That's right.
At some point he's like, ignorethe sunk cost, ignore all the
time we're putting into this.
It's not working.
(15:15):
Let's just keep the name and geton with it.
Absolutely.
I'm going to take this on.
I need to do this.
This is a challenge I can do fortoday.
This doesn't feel right.
I'm going to pull back.
I'm going to take time, but it'snot because of the biases.
It's because I've thought aboutthis and I'm going to sit with
this and make sure that I'm notbeing interrupted by my own
unconscious biases.
So that was really good.
Let's get on with this one.
How do you have a favoritepassage or a quote from the book
(15:38):
that you'd like to.
I Am cheating a little bit tosay, but I think the quote that
I pulled out in particularcontext of the last four
episodes that we've done, and Ido really like, it is her quote
that she says, and it's a bitlike what we've been talking
about, the quote that she says,when, you know, you know, when
you don't know, you decide, oh,I like it.
(15:59):
And so.
She talks about that.
If we just sit still and reallylisten to ourselves and what our
core is telling us, we can tapinto what we know.
Does this feel right?
Does this excite me?
And I think that I've started tolearn a lot more about what that
means.
So as we're doing our ownelevate with grace journey and
(16:20):
thinking about, well what's our,why?
Where do we want to be in fiveyears?
It's becoming easier for me tosay, well, if I'm looking at
this opportunity or thatopportunity, or I'm thinking
about what I'm doing, I amtapping into a lot more, not
getting so caught up in.
Specific detail of something, amI feeling really good about this
versus, oh, that one's okay.
Claire (16:41):
And she really always goes for, if it's a mediocre
business arrangement she cutsoff.
She would say that she cuts off15 mediocre deals to have five
great ones, because the fact isif it's the five great ones and
your life is full and crazy andall that sort of stuff.
It won't matter to you becauseyou'll get energy from those
five great ones.
It kind of ties in nicely with,you know, when, you know, and if
(17:01):
you're not sure then thedecision-making tools that we
bought up, like actually reallyspend the time to use them to
help you figure it out when youcan't follow your gut.
I think we tend to around,asking everyone else what they
think.
Now that's different to having afew kind of advisors that you go
to in specific circumstancesthat we talked about last week.
(17:22):
I've got into the habit ofasking my partner or my mom or
my people where they're notgoing to necessarily give you
the right decision.
Miranda (17:31):
You're using them to maybe validate what you want to
hear, or you want to back it upwith some external validation
that did pull it out as one ofmy quotes as well, because I did
love this.
Like if they're not in theentrepreneurial trenches with
you in her instance.
Don't ask them their opinionsand certainly don't give a lot
of credence to the answers thatother people give you all the
feedback they give you.
Claire (17:52):
If you know a bit about where you want to go, what you
want your life to look like, howyou want things to work out in
terms of success on your ownterms only you can really know
whether something is going tofuel that.
You've got to make thosedecisions for yourself because
other people are bringing theirbiases and their concerns and
their views to the table.
And then you just get into thisdecision action paralysis.
(18:14):
So when we were talking aboutour example from this week about
thinking about different workopportunities to think about.
I didn't go and ask my mom or mypartner or, I mean, I would
clearly if it was familysituation, but from a career
point of view I could just usethe methods that we had last
week, talked to a couple ofpeople to bounce some ideas, in
that particular space, and Idon't even actually know that I
(18:37):
needed to do that this week.
I know it was more.
What feels right?
What excites me?
What, have I learned previouslythat I can now apply to these in
terms of previous values?
Like the energy stuff, you bringthat in to help you make some
decisions.
I felt comfortable in my Isaakstyle to trusting myself that I
know what's right.
I've got a couple of otherquotes which ties in a little
bit about disease to please incaring what other people think.
(18:59):
So she says,"so go on and runyour own race and let others run
theirs".
That we need to stay far, faraway from the compare and
despair syndrome, which isreally hard to do in a world of
social media,
Miranda (19:12):
but so important, but it is your mental health.
It's so important and I doagree.
I absolutely loved the exampleshe gave.
Just celebrate women and beexcited for your friends, your
colleagues, when they achieveknow that your time is coming
and know that we're all on ourown race and it is not you or
them, and we are going toachieve together.
Claire (19:31):
So, yeah, I agree down as well.
Miranda (19:34):
To take that one further, it seize the day today.
I think so often where we'reseizing the day tomorrow and
I've seen a lot of quotes popup, which are all about no one
sees a plan, they only see youraction.
So I think that ties in reallywell.
Just wing it, you know, seizethe day, make it happen.
That she is only limited by whatshe can dream and where she
wants to go and who she can takewith her.
(19:55):
I think that does come also withthe caveat that some of our
workplaces at the moment arefeeling a little bit risky
adverse.
We've definitely felt this,Everyone in their box, just do
what you do.
And I think Claire, you've beensort of saying even out in the
workforce, there's not thiswhole, oh, I can see how those
experiences wouldcross-pollinate like, no, no
have you done this exact jobbefore, right?
Claire (20:15):
I think there is a context, particularly my
experience in Melbourne.
I don't know whether that'sglobally as well.
Actually Emma does talk about itin the new hustle, which links
into what I was saying last weekabout the biases that can come
into group meetings in a hybridand virtual workplace.
We've become everyone, whetherit's risk averse or not thinking
(20:36):
outside the box, or I thinkeveryone has become very
transactional and verysingle-minded about how things
need to get done.
don't know whether that'sbecause no one can take any more
mental load or whether we'rejust a bit tunnel vision,
because we're all on virtualmeetings.
As Emma talks about in the newhustle.
I mentioned last week as well inthe podcast, virtual meetings
are a bit clunky andtransactional anyway.
(20:57):
It's about bringing in someskills to widen that out.
Being very clear and she talksabout it at zoom.
I think not group thing, butzoom think, it's easier for
people to nod, agree and get offthe zoom meeting and carry on.
So it's that pre preparationwork that needs happen.
We've become quite tunnel visionand insular over the last 18
(21:17):
months in a COVID world.
But I think there's a massiveopportunity that we need to
reopen that up.
In a virtual and hybrid workingworld, not wait until everyone's
back in bricks and mortarbuildings and all catching up in
3d, albeit that's amazing, westill need to be able to
function properly and make greatdecisions in big creative
(21:38):
individual and hybrid situationas well.
My personal experience is thatthat hasn't been where a lot of
people had been at for the last12 months,
Miranda (21:46):
which my last quote, before we move on to, someone
else section.
Everyone is just a personkindness and respect is needed
at all levels.
Always keep good eye contact, awarm greeting, big genuine.
And I do.
I've absolutely always lived andfelt this personally.
(22:06):
it was great to see Emma withthat quote, because I feel like
it's really important.
What I loved that she did isevery, I think she was saying
every week, she actually justgoes out of our way for one
person.
Like whether it's just a card ora.
Or up some flowers to her mom.
So just putting it in your diaryevery week, just a little act of
kindness.
(22:27):
I think if everybody did thatfor the next set of eight weeks,
we'd be back on track muchfaster than we've ever been.
Claire (22:33):
In the new hustle.
One of our anti rules goes evenfurther, which I really liked,
which is to send a thank youemail every morning.
And she said she started offwith just with having a 15
minute reminder and be like, whocan I thank for something that
they've done for me today anddoing that every day.
I thought that was a great tip.
There is heaps of practical tipsand stuff that you can just
(22:53):
basically start doing likestraight away.
I think for us action peoplebeing I actually found that
there was plenty and plenty ofplenty of ideas and tips and
suggestions that she put throughthe whole book that I just found
was really quite good.
Because she breaks the chaptersup in winging it into various
topics.
And so for example, chapter fouris about Emma's views on what
(23:17):
successful people do andtime-saving hacks.
And at first that was one of thebits of the book where I did a
bit of a mini eye roll.
Cause what successful people dois a done to death topic, in my
opinion.
And I was a bit.
Yeah.
As a bit like, ah, here we go.
It's supposed to be up at 5:00AM, like creating, you know, my
(23:37):
plans for the world until 7:00AM.
And then I was supposed to goexercise for an hour at 8:00 AM.
And then at midnight I can go tobed or something and that's what
you need to do to be successful.
She does come up with somereally just basic practical
tips.
so the time-saving hacks.
One of the things I have noticeddesperately over the last 18
months is everyone is fatiguedby meetings.
Like we've kind of gone from.
(23:58):
Bricks and mortar situationwhere you're meeting in and
probably inefficient andineffective meetings in the
first place.
And then we've transferred theminto a cOVID kind of zoom
meeting world.
And I love the fact that she isa complete meeting, like mad
person.
Like she will not stay on ameeting longer than if it's a
meeting.
That's she'll always ask whatit's for.
If she feels that at the end ofthe 15 minute meeting, again,
(24:22):
she's a CEO founder, perhapsit's a bit different, but I
still think we all need to be abit brave.
I remember she actually, oh,that's right.
That, that was a big thing totalk about.
Miranda (24:33):
I really enjoyed her journey on that.
She's realize somebody else needto be the entrepreneur.
I need to be the founder andhave a great story, but that
somebody can actually run mycompany better.
I was like, whoa.
Claire (24:45):
That's a really good point.
She believes a lot in that aswell.
One of the things is, you know,I don't want people to talk
about finding their passion.
Like you find your passion bydoing like, and going through
and doing something.
If that doesn't work out well,you cull that and you do
something else.
And so I think that actuallydoes live and breathe her, um,
belief in that concept to that.
And then the degree is to say,Actually it's whether it's not
(25:08):
my passion or it's not myskillset, it's probably a
combination of both.
I think that someone can do thatCEO role better, and I need to
hire someone to that role.
I think that that's a pretty biglesson so I think her
time-saving.
Well, actually really practical,really questioning whether a
meeting is required or can it bedone with a 15 minute email
(25:29):
exchange or quick, can you justpick up the phone, before you
set that meeting does it reallyneed to be set.
Is there an easier and moreeffective way for people to do
it be really responsible andaccountable for people's time?
I liked how she says she's gotto do it now hack.
So basically if you open anemail.
Um, answer it right now.
Like if you've gone into yourinbox and you've opened the
(25:50):
email, don't close it and goback to it later.
Just pen out a response.
The response doesn't have to beperfect.
Give yourself 60 seconds.
Obviously, if it's a big emailthat requires a lot of work or a
project, but if it's somethingthat you can respond to
immediately do not shove it downand go back to it later, just
respond all that sort of stuff.
It is very practical, smallmicro things that you can do,
(26:11):
not this whole, how here's, howto be successful.
Wake up at 5:00 AM
Miranda (26:14):
yes, I've got to do what feels right for you.
Um, for me, I really liked how,she was very open about talking
about money and I feel like thisis something new that's coming
into our culture that hasn'texisted before.
I'm excited for some of ourfinancial episodes in the
future.
Claire (26:29):
Needless to say, I love the fact that she had a chapter
on money and finance.
I was very happy to say that.
Miranda (26:35):
Absolutely.
So she has a great relationshipwith investments and balancing.
Um, ensuring that those, thatrainy day funds when she needs
it.
And she really speaks about thecost of running business that
friends that have been on thisentrepreneurial journey that
they really need to have thatback into.
So I think that was a reallygood pragmatic, again, lots of
(26:56):
pragmatic advice throughoutthis.
Um, I did an interview and weactually spoke about how hard
she found that, thatentrepreneurial journey in
Australia and that in LA, sheactually felt that it was much
easier to be an entrepreneur.
A much safer place for women torise up.
I think we need to try andcreate that in Australia.
Not necessarily even justentrepreneurial women, but I
(27:16):
think women that are inbusiness, let's just try and
support each other and celebrateeach other and look for
opportunities that can reallyhelp elevate all of the women
around us.
So she had a lot of thosemessages throughout that I
really enjoyed.
So, like I said, This bookreally sort of is split into two
sections.
So the first half is some greatpersonal advice and great tips.
(27:37):
And then the second half is moreabout running a business and
great leadership, thoughts andhacks.
And she's sort of saying 60% ofsmall businesses in Australia
really don't make it past thefirst three years.
And it's important that weensure that there's a market out
there that do your homework, youexpect it to be all consuming in
the first couple of years andfind others to support you, who
(27:59):
skill surpass yours and otherareas that you just can't do it
all.
And we spoke just before abouthow Emma's really lives that.
I really liked seeing how Emmawas so dedicated to raising the
profile of women.
And as I mentioned reallylooking to.
Encourage women, wherever youare, that each individual can
make a difference in theirchange by supporting the women
(28:19):
around them.
Collectively cheering on thesuccess of the successes of
others and having thatindividual responsibility to go.
How can I help somebody elsetoday and absolutely loved that.
So the last section we wanted todiscuss about with this book is.
Whether it changed our opinionor perspective on anything.
For me, I actually reallyenjoyed her section on
(28:42):
networking.
Genuinely love meeting newpeople, discovering new ideas,
making connections, and sharingnew thoughts.
I am relatively extroverted.
Absolutely gain energy frombeing surrounded by others.
But a networking event is one ofthe most uncomfortable things.
It's never stopped.
Talk to me, I still attenddifferent events.
But you are an extrovert.
Extrovert too as am I.
(29:03):
She really challenges.
I think everybody.
And she calls herself.
How does an introvert And thereis some great tips and hacks on
how you can overcome it.
She came with some tips on howto go about networking.
She recommends everyone brush upon some NPL.
So neuro, linguistic programmingand.
And it's reading people'slanguage.
It's even thinking aboutquestions rather than asking
(29:23):
where do you work or what do youdo?
Having some interestingquestions to ask people.
Have you ever heard thisspeaker?
Before.
Where was the last place youtraveled?
What's what's your passion atthe moment?
What are you excited about?
It's going to be a much betterconversation then.
Oh, yeah, I work.
At the bank.
Claire (29:38):
Let's face it as, as someone that's done business
cheeks.
If we're going to listen toanyone about some suggestions,
leadership's on how you can getbetter at.
Networking and how you can makeit.
It less of a feeling of.
Oh, my gosh.
I'd rather poke my eyes out,then go to that event.
I feel like Emma Isaacs isprobably.
A good one to listen to some ofher networking tips.
She's.
He's got some really good onesin the new hustle as well.
(30:00):
One of the things she says isone of the anti rules is sit
down and work out.
The 10 people in your networkthat are most powerful to you.
Right?
So if you think about what youwant to do for the next 12
months, or a couple of years,sit down and look at your
LinkedIn network or think.
About your network work out, whoare the 10, most powerful people
to you now that couldnecessarily be the CEO.
(30:22):
It could be someone that, youknow, she gives a couple of good
examples.
It could be the assistant of theCEO.
Who knows everybody in thatindustry that you want to get
into it.
Doesn't, it's not about power interms of it's about who can,
who's got the most influence tobe able to help you with stuff
that you need, and that youbasically have those 10 people
(30:42):
and you make a concerted efforteach week on rotation to find a
reason to contact one of themeach week and make it a
discipline and a habit I'veheard.
Others in the past, say if youfind an article that you think
would resonate for one of yourpeople in your network, you
should send it to them.
But even as much as I just thinkEven if you will get to go on
rotation and say, Hey, how's itgoing?
(31:03):
Is there anything I can help youwith at the moment on.
You know, X, Y, and Z, or itcould be, it doesn't have to be
a big deal, but I really lockedher.
It's really important tocontinually foster and build
relationships.
You can't just expect people outof the blue and obviously that's
something that she's sosuccessful at.
I think she's got some greatcontent, both in that book and
(31:24):
the other book.
Yeah.
It's good
Miranda (31:27):
Treating networking like a relationship.
Is that what you're sayingthere?
It's not just going in andgoing, hi, I'm this person.
This is what I do.
can I give you my business card?
Sell, sell, sell it's.
Hey, who are you?
And get to know you as a person.
She sort of speaks to that.
But like dating, you get to knowthe people, you don't try to
sell them anything.
You get to build a relationship.
See if you've got somethingthat's interesting.
(31:47):
And maybe on the second or thirddate, introduce that to them,
but don't necessarily go on grabevery business card, you can
get, put them on a mailing listand start to harass them.
That's not the way to build arelationship.
She's got really greatrelationship building tips to
the whole thing.
And my final takeaway fromnetworking events or doing any
networking or conferencing, evenonline.
Is, if you do connect withsomebody.
(32:08):
Booking in your diary to have 15minutes the next day to actually
do some followups and somereach-outs, she gives an example
of sending a book to somebodylike that.
Hadn't heard of a book that sherecommended or just any little
note saying, thanks so much.
I really appreciated your time,but then playing back some of
the ideas that they've actuallygiven to you, so you've really
heard they've resonated withyou.
(32:30):
It's a great idea.
Claire (32:31):
Yeah.
She's very giving and thoughtflux that comes to her
naturally, I think.
And then she gives some goodtips.
If it doesn't come to younaturally put some diarize items
and then do it right then, andthen send the thank you note.
First thing first up at nineo'clock until it becomes a habit
that was spoken about.
For me it did.
Change my perspective on acouple of things.
I think I've got very seriousand insular over the last decade
(32:54):
of running on a treadmill andall the rest of it.
And so her book.
Combined with a COVID lockdownwake up.
I think it's made me reallyappreciate asking myself every
day.
Am I having fun?
Is this good?
What is my day look like to, howcan I make every situation and
really checking myself when I'mthinking, oh, this is a drag.
Should I really be doing this?
And being very conscious andaware that.
(33:17):
Life is short and it's precious.
And it's about today.
And in the moment, I think I gota lot of.
Inspiration from Emma about thatstuff.
And.
A bit about like similar sort ofstuff with the relationships and
networking about how you can beconsciously thinking about all
the times, how you are makingother people's lives enjoyable.
(33:37):
And fun as well.
So you, if you're a leader, youhave a responsibility to do
that.
Um, but even if you're not, ifyour coworkers, if.
If you, if you walk over.
And you see someone isstruggling with something, you
know, ask them.
Is there anything that you cando if you're grabbing a glass of
water for yourself, just grab aglass of water for another
person and put it on front oftheir desk.
Really basic, simple thingsabout how can I make this
(34:00):
person's life more enjoyable orfun right now?
I love that, that she's got thatphilosophy.
And I need to be more fun.
I think.
I'm fine, but not in everydaymoment., how can I make this
moment more fun?
And also be aware of what fundmay be to me is not fun or for
somebody else and being soconscious of the others in that
environment, that emotionalawareness.
(34:21):
So I really, yeah, I got a lotout of that book from that
perspective.
Excellent.
Excellent takeaways from thisbook.
I think you can tell from ourview that we could not recommend
it high enough.
So please do check it out nowhow to plan to action challenge.
But I think the first actionchallenge that I want to give
everybody is not about decisionmaking.
It's actually what you justsaid.
Let's foster some kindness.
(34:42):
Let's send a thank you note.
Let's send some flowers, let'sget a coffee with a friend and
just remember what it's like tobe together again.
That would just be so good nowfor decision making action
challenge.
Let's also take that on.
So in the past few weeks,there's definitely been a lot of
conversation about bias andtools to interrogated important
(35:03):
decision.
If anything is going to inspireyou.
Emma Isaacs winging at bookshould be about, let's just take
that leap.
So you're 70 or 80% comfortablewith decision.
This is the week to take thedecision on and just leap.
Let's see what happens.
We're all going to do itcollectively together.
Exactly what we've been talkingabout.
(35:24):
Let's raise each other up andyou have our support to make it
happen.
Yes.
Perfect time of the year too.
I've seen some things onInstagram about people reminding
us that this.
It's something like 60 daysuntil the end of the year.
But, you know, there's apositive message in that you've
got 60 days to the end of theyear.
What can you do each day?
That is really going to beimpactful for yourself and the
(35:46):
decision that you want to makeimpactful for somebody else by
sending a thank you note orbeing thoughtful about a gift or
a catch-up.
The message is lots of impactfuldecision making and thoughtful
kind actions, is great.
our next episode will be in afortnight's time.
So in two weeks, 18th ofNovember.
We've got three more episodes togo for this season so we're
(36:07):
going to do them in two infortnightly episode drops from
here on end to the end of theyear next episode we'll be
talking about one of our otherpillars which is cultivating
career success on your terms sothat'll be next episode In two
weeks on the 18th of november sowe look forward to speaking to
you then any final words mirandajust please check us out on all
(36:27):
of the socials if you couldshare the podcast we would be
super super grateful for thatplease share and follow so you
don't miss an episodeparticularly as we move to this
sort of fortnightly drop andjust thank you so much it's been
a wonderful episode wonderfulSeeing you in person claire and
listeners we hope you've reallyenjoyed this book review if you
would like to check it out we dohave a booktopia link in our
(36:50):
show notes have a great weekhave a great fortnight, Awesome
See you next time round upthanks everyone
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