September 5, 2023 • 14 mins
Dare to step into the chilling underworld of organ trafficking with me, Dr. Celia Williamson. This harrowing journey paints a stark picture of how human organs are commercially traded outside of the recognized medical system, a realm where profit trumps ethics. Gain insight into how this horrific form of exploitation occurs. Brace yourself as we lift the veil on the shocking prices attached to human organs and the astronomical value of the organ trafficking industry.
Later in the segment I delve into the grim realities underlying organ trafficking. Witness the stark contrast between the scarcity of organs and the skyrocketing demand for them. Confront uncomfortable questions around why organ trafficking occurs and who is involved. Join me as we expose the often desperate buyers in this illicit trade, and grapple with the dire choices made by those living in poverty. This episode promises to expand your understanding of human trafficking beyond its conventional definitions of forced labor and sexual exploitation, casting a harsh light on this lesser-known yet equally tragic facet of human exploitation.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
You know the why human trafficking work is needed
To fight for the freedom ofmodern day slaves.
But love, passion, commitmentisn't all you need to be an
effective and successfulanti-trafficking advocate.
Learn the how.
I'm Dr Celia Williamson,director of the Human
Trafficking and Social JusticeInstitute at the University of
(00:23):
Toledo.
Welcome to the EmancipationNation podcast, where I'll
provide you with the latest andbest methods, policy and
practice discussed byexperienced experts in the field
, so that you can cut throughthe noise, save time and be
about the work of saving lives.
Welcome to the EmancipationNation, episode 189.
(00:44):
I'm Dr Celia Williamson andtoday I just want to talk to you
solo about a little known areaof human trafficking.
Yet it is human trafficking theorgan trade.
So the organ trade, accordingto the World Health Organization
, is the trading of human organs, tissues or other body products
(01:06):
usually used for transplanting.
So it's the commercialtransplant, where there's a
profit that's made and itusually occurs outside of the
accepted medical system.
So in 2000, people agreed onthe Palermal Protocol, and that
(01:30):
is where trafficking in personsshall mean the recruitment, the
transportation, transfer,harboring or receipt of persons
by means of a threat or use offorce or other forms of coercion
, abduction, fraud, deception,abuse of power, position of
(01:53):
vulnerability or the giving orreceiving of payments and
benefits to achieve the consentof a person having control over
another person for the purposeof exploitation.
So exploitation shall include,at a minimum, the exploitation
of the prostitution of others orother forms of sexual
(02:15):
exploitation for slave orservices, slavery or practices
similar to slavery, servitude orthe removal of organs.
So, as we understand humantrafficking, there has to be an
act, and that is recruiting,harboring, transporting,
(02:36):
providing or obtaining by meansof what First, fraud or coercion
, and it has to be a purpose forthe purpose of exploitation and
voluntary servitude, p&h, debt,bondage, slavery.
And we often forget organtrafficking.
(02:56):
According to a source calledBloody Harvest, they list some
prices of various organs.
Prices are going for $30,000,us dollars Lungs 150,000, a
heart 130,000, liver 98,000,kidneys 62,000.
(03:24):
I'm not sure how accurate theyare, but you can look them up.
That's called Bloody Harvest.
According to the Council ofEurope Convention in 2018, they
estimate that organ traffickingis about $840 million to $1.7
(03:49):
billion industry.
So why organ trafficking, right?
Why?
Because we kind of think thatthere are just bad guys out
there stealing or manipulatingpeople out of their organs
because they're bad people.
But we really have to think ofwhy people are stealing and
(04:10):
manipulating to get organs, whyI want to break into this
podcast and ask you an importantquestion why did you become so
passionate about the issue ofhuman trafficking?
Because you know how preciousfreedom really is and you know
that if you could offer that tosomeone else, it would make your
life that much richer, as wellas theirs.
(04:31):
Whatever you've accomplishedthus far in life, nothing is
more satisfying than being ableto help someone receive the gift
of freedom.
If you're interested in takingthe deep dive in becoming
trained, write this down.
It's my effective casemanagement with human
trafficking survivors course.
You know many direct serviceproviders are passionate about
(04:54):
working with survivors.
They understand their why indoing this work, but many don't
understand their what to do orhow to do it, or when to do it
and where and how much to dowhat.
And unfortunately, we don'tgive permission for someone to
be honest and say they don'thave the knowledge and skills to
effectively work with thepopulation of survivors that
(05:16):
have suffered trauma.
Well, I have a course on how towork directly with survivors,
including the 10 common areas ofneed and how to assess those
areas of need and then how tointervene more effectively and
in trauma informed ways.
Complete my course EffectiveCase Management with Human
Trafficking Survivors at yourOwn Pace.
(05:37):
I'll walk alongside you as youwalk alongside survivors,
sharing with you my almost 30years of experience.
If you're interested, you canfind my free webinar on my
website at ciliawilsoncom.
And now on with the podcast, theMoney right and my favorite
(06:02):
series, television series of alltime.
It's called the Wire.
I'm actually going to do apodcast on it one day.
I love it so much.
It's an old series, but one ofthe stars on the show called the
Wire his name was Lester andit's a show about drugs and all
(06:28):
kinds of illegal activities.
But Lester said you follow thedrugs, you get drug addicts and
drug dealers.
You follow the money and youdon't know where it's going to
take you.
Same is true with organtrafficking.
If we follow the money, welearn a lot more about organ
(06:49):
trafficking, because we have tothink who's buying.
There has to be a market forthis, so let's think about it.
There is definitely a shortageof organs in terms of people who
need them around the worldpeople in first world countries.
There are too few volunteers.
(07:09):
People are on these organwaiting lists for weeks, for
months, for years.
There's a high demand fororgans around the world, yet
there's an abundance of poorpeople.
So when the supply doesn't meetthe demand, crimes are going to
(07:40):
be committed.
So, for instance, the wait timefor just a kidney and kidneys
are the number one commoditythat people are looking for
Right.
So a study in 2015 in Canada,just for an example, said the
(08:00):
average wait time for a kidneyis four years.
In the US, the average waittime was 3.6 years and in the UK
between two and three years,and this is according to the
kidney foundation of Canada, theNational Kidney Foundation and
(08:23):
a couple of other sources.
So years, people are waitingfor kidneys.
In 2023, according to HRSA andPenn Medicine, 104,234 people
were on the National TransplantWaiting List.
That's, in the US, 17 peopledie each day waiting, every 10
(08:52):
minutes.
Somebody has added to thewaiting list.
So let me ask you we are againstorgan trafficking, absolutely.
If you had a loved one let'ssay your spouse, your life
partner, let's say your child,let's say your parent was on
(09:14):
this waiting list, and you know,17 people die each day waiting,
what would you be willing to do?
It's really another way oflooking at it.
You know, there's one kind ofvery elementary way of looking
at it organ trafficking.
(09:34):
That's bad, but once you startto pull back the layers, follow
the money.
Who's buying?
Why are they buying?
Because they're bad people orbecause they're trying to save
the lives of their loved ones?
Who's selling?
Typically third world residents, people living in third world
(09:59):
countries that live in poverty,that need the money.
Are they making a real choice?
For the ones who say I'mwilling to sell my kidney, is
that even a choice when you'reliving in poverty and you have
to feed your family?
So other statistics as ofJanuary 2023, 88,901 people were
(10:35):
waiting for a kidney.
10,625 were waiting for a liver.
857 were waiting for a pancreas.
3,365 people were waiting on aheart.
960 people were waiting on alung.
So this is a very complex issue.
(11:01):
According to the globalfinancial integrity organization
, about 10 percent of all organtransplants including the lungs,
the heart, the liver they'redone via trafficked organs.
Buying and selling organs isillegal in most countries,
(11:25):
except in Iran.
That's the only country in theworld where buying and selling
an organ is legal, but it onlyapplies to their citizens.
Also, there's not many laws tostop a person from leaving their
own country to get an organfrom someone abroad.
There are some companies thatcater to transplant tourism they
(11:50):
call it, but they say theymatch needed recipients with
those that are willing to donate.
So how are people buying theseorgans?
How does that even happen?
Well, sometimes the personsells their organ.
(12:14):
They are aware and they selltheir organ.
Sometimes they're manipulated,they're tricked into believing
that they need a surgery andthen, while they're under
surgery, their kidney or liveror whatever is taken.
Some survive, some don'tsurvive.
(12:34):
Sometimes they're kidnapped andthey're drugged and their
organs are taken.
And oftentimes these surgeriesoccur in makeshift hospitals.
Sometimes they occur inlegitimate hospitals.
But even some of the people whoare in first world countries
(12:59):
perhaps that participate in theblack market and purchase an
organ, they can also be scammedand be out of money and not
receive the organ.
So just some information onorgan trafficking to make you
aware that not only sextrafficking and labor
(13:19):
trafficking, but we have toremember that organ trafficking
does occur.
I think a really good video towatch is called the deadly
underground organ harvesters.
That's a really good video.
It was online I'm not sure ifit's online anymore on YouTube
and then Tales from the OrganTrade, which is a pretty good
(13:42):
documentary.
And until next time, the fightcontinues.
Let's not just do something,let's do the best thing.
If you like this episode ofEmancipation Nation, please
subscribe and I'll send you theweekly podcast.
Until then, the fight continues.
You know the why human trafficking work is needed
To fight for the freedom ofmodern day slaves.
But love, passion, commitmentisn't all you need to be an
effective and successfulanti-trafficking advocate.
Learn the how.
I'm Dr Celia Williamson,director of the Human
Trafficking and Social JusticeInstitute at the University of
(00:23):
Toledo.
Welcome to the EmancipationNation podcast, where I'll
provide you with the latest andbest methods, policy and
practice discussed byexperienced experts in the field
, so that you can cut throughthe noise, save time and be
about the work of saving lives.
Welcome to the EmancipationNation, episode 189.
(00:44):
I'm Dr Celia Williamson andtoday I just want to talk to you
solo about a little known areaof human trafficking.
Yet it is human trafficking theorgan trade.
So the organ trade, accordingto the World Health Organization
, is the trading of human organs, tissues or other body products
(01:06):
usually used for transplanting.
So it's the commercialtransplant, where there's a
profit that's made and itusually occurs outside of the
accepted medical system.
So in 2000, people agreed onthe Palermal Protocol, and that
(01:30):
is where trafficking in personsshall mean the recruitment, the
transportation, transfer,harboring or receipt of persons
by means of a threat or use offorce or other forms of coercion
, abduction, fraud, deception,abuse of power, position of
(01:53):
vulnerability or the giving orreceiving of payments and
benefits to achieve the consentof a person having control over
another person for the purposeof exploitation.
So exploitation shall include,at a minimum, the exploitation
of the prostitution of others orother forms of sexual
(02:15):
exploitation for slave orservices, slavery or practices
similar to slavery, servitude orthe removal of organs.
So, as we understand humantrafficking, there has to be an
act, and that is recruiting,harboring, transporting,
(02:36):
providing or obtaining by meansof what First, fraud or coercion
, and it has to be a purpose forthe purpose of exploitation and
voluntary servitude, p&h, debt,bondage, slavery.
And we often forget organtrafficking.
(02:56):
According to a source calledBloody Harvest, they list some
prices of various organs.
Prices are going for $30,000,us dollars Lungs 150,000, a
heart 130,000, liver 98,000,kidneys 62,000.
(03:24):
I'm not sure how accurate theyare, but you can look them up.
That's called Bloody Harvest.
According to the Council ofEurope Convention in 2018, they
estimate that organ traffickingis about $840 million to $1.7
(03:49):
billion industry.
So why organ trafficking, right?
Why?
Because we kind of think thatthere are just bad guys out
there stealing or manipulatingpeople out of their organs
because they're bad people.
But we really have to think ofwhy people are stealing and
(04:10):
manipulating to get organs, whyI want to break into this
podcast and ask you an importantquestion why did you become so
passionate about the issue ofhuman trafficking?
Because you know how preciousfreedom really is and you know
that if you could offer that tosomeone else, it would make your
life that much richer, as wellas theirs.
(04:31):
Whatever you've accomplishedthus far in life, nothing is
more satisfying than being ableto help someone receive the gift
of freedom.
If you're interested in takingthe deep dive in becoming
trained, write this down.
It's my effective casemanagement with human
trafficking survivors course.
You know many direct serviceproviders are passionate about
(04:54):
working with survivors.
They understand their why indoing this work, but many don't
understand their what to do orhow to do it, or when to do it
and where and how much to dowhat.
And unfortunately, we don'tgive permission for someone to
be honest and say they don'thave the knowledge and skills to
effectively work with thepopulation of survivors that
(05:16):
have suffered trauma.
Well, I have a course on how towork directly with survivors,
including the 10 common areas ofneed and how to assess those
areas of need and then how tointervene more effectively and
in trauma informed ways.
Complete my course EffectiveCase Management with Human
Trafficking Survivors at yourOwn Pace.
(05:37):
I'll walk alongside you as youwalk alongside survivors,
sharing with you my almost 30years of experience.
If you're interested, you canfind my free webinar on my
website at ciliawilsoncom.
And now on with the podcast, theMoney right and my favorite
(06:02):
series, television series of alltime.
It's called the Wire.
I'm actually going to do apodcast on it one day.
I love it so much.
It's an old series, but one ofthe stars on the show called the
Wire his name was Lester andit's a show about drugs and all
(06:28):
kinds of illegal activities.
But Lester said you follow thedrugs, you get drug addicts and
drug dealers.
You follow the money and youdon't know where it's going to
take you.
Same is true with organtrafficking.
If we follow the money, welearn a lot more about organ
(06:49):
trafficking, because we have tothink who's buying.
There has to be a market forthis, so let's think about it.
There is definitely a shortageof organs in terms of people who
need them around the worldpeople in first world countries.
There are too few volunteers.
(07:09):
People are on these organwaiting lists for weeks, for
months, for years.
There's a high demand fororgans around the world, yet
there's an abundance of poorpeople.
So when the supply doesn't meetthe demand, crimes are going to
(07:40):
be committed.
So, for instance, the wait timefor just a kidney and kidneys
are the number one commoditythat people are looking for
Right.
So a study in 2015 in Canada,just for an example, said the
(08:00):
average wait time for a kidneyis four years.
In the US, the average waittime was 3.6 years and in the UK
between two and three years,and this is according to the
kidney foundation of Canada, theNational Kidney Foundation and
(08:23):
a couple of other sources.
So years, people are waitingfor kidneys.
In 2023, according to HRSA andPenn Medicine, 104,234 people
were on the National TransplantWaiting List.
That's, in the US, 17 peopledie each day waiting, every 10
(08:52):
minutes.
Somebody has added to thewaiting list.
So let me ask you we are againstorgan trafficking, absolutely.
If you had a loved one let'ssay your spouse, your life
partner, let's say your child,let's say your parent was on
(09:14):
this waiting list, and you know,17 people die each day waiting,
what would you be willing to do?
It's really another way oflooking at it.
You know, there's one kind ofvery elementary way of looking
at it organ trafficking.
(09:34):
That's bad, but once you startto pull back the layers, follow
the money.
Who's buying?
Why are they buying?
Because they're bad people orbecause they're trying to save
the lives of their loved ones?
Who's selling?
Typically third world residents, people living in third world
(09:59):
countries that live in poverty,that need the money.
Are they making a real choice?
For the ones who say I'mwilling to sell my kidney, is
that even a choice when you'reliving in poverty and you have
to feed your family?
So other statistics as ofJanuary 2023, 88,901 people were
(10:35):
waiting for a kidney.
10,625 were waiting for a liver.
857 were waiting for a pancreas.
3,365 people were waiting on aheart.
960 people were waiting on alung.
So this is a very complex issue.
(11:01):
According to the globalfinancial integrity organization
, about 10 percent of all organtransplants including the lungs,
the heart, the liver they'redone via trafficked organs.
Buying and selling organs isillegal in most countries,
(11:25):
except in Iran.
That's the only country in theworld where buying and selling
an organ is legal, but it onlyapplies to their citizens.
Also, there's not many laws tostop a person from leaving their
own country to get an organfrom someone abroad.
There are some companies thatcater to transplant tourism they
(11:50):
call it, but they say theymatch needed recipients with
those that are willing to donate.
So how are people buying theseorgans?
How does that even happen?
Well, sometimes the personsells their organ.
(12:14):
They are aware and they selltheir organ.
Sometimes they're manipulated,they're tricked into believing
that they need a surgery andthen, while they're under
surgery, their kidney or liveror whatever is taken.
Some survive, some don'tsurvive.
(12:34):
Sometimes they're kidnapped andthey're drugged and their
organs are taken.
And oftentimes these surgeriesoccur in makeshift hospitals.
Sometimes they occur inlegitimate hospitals.
But even some of the people whoare in first world countries
(12:59):
perhaps that participate in theblack market and purchase an
organ, they can also be scammedand be out of money and not
receive the organ.
So just some information onorgan trafficking to make you
aware that not only sextrafficking and labor
(13:19):
trafficking, but we have toremember that organ trafficking
does occur.
I think a really good video towatch is called the deadly
underground organ harvesters.
That's a really good video.
It was online I'm not sure ifit's online anymore on YouTube
and then Tales from the OrganTrade, which is a pretty good
(13:42):
documentary.
And until next time, the fightcontinues.
Let's not just do something,let's do the best thing.
If you like this episode ofEmancipation Nation, please
subscribe and I'll send you theweekly podcast.
Until then, the fight continues.
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