March 21, 2025 • 15 mins
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This episode is part of my initiative to provide access to important court decisions impacting employees in an easy to understand conversational format using AI. The speakers in the episode are AI generated and frankly sound great to listen to. Enjoy!
What happens when workplace harassment goes unchecked? The landmark EEOC vs. Mitsubishi Motors case provides a sobering answer. Join us as we dissect one of the most significant sexual harassment lawsuits in American history, where hundreds of women at a manufacturing plant faced systematic abuse that led to a staggering $34 million settlement.
We unpack the shocking details of what these women endured—unwelcome touching, sexual graffiti, offensive jokes—and the culture of fear that prevented them from speaking up. The case reveals how Mitsubishi's initial denial strategy crumbled, resulting not just in financial penalties but a court-mandated overhaul of their workplace policies with external monitoring to ensure compliance.
Looking beyond this single case, we explore cutting-edge research on workplace harassment, including organizational justice theory and the real costs of toxic work environments. The consequences extend far beyond legal settlements, affecting everything from employee health to company reputation. We examine modern prevention strategies like bystander intervention training and discuss how definitions of harassment continue to evolve in our digital world.
Whether you're a manager, employee, or business owner, this episode offers crucial insights into creating workplaces where everyone feels safe and respected. The Mitsubishi case may be decades old, but its lessons remain profoundly relevant today. After all, addressing harassment isn't just about compliance—it's about fostering environments where all employees can thrive.
If you enjoyed this episode of the Employee Survival Guide please like us on Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn. We would really appreciate if you could leave a review of this podcast on your favorite podcast player such as Apple Podcasts. Leaving a review will inform other listeners you found the content on this podcast is important in the area of employment law in the United States.
For more information, please contact our employment attorneys at Carey & Associates, P.C. at 203-255-4150, www.capclaw.com.
Disclaimer: For educational use only, not intended to be legal advice.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We talk a lot about workplace equality.
You know fair treatment.
It's a nice idea.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
It is.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
But if you actually look under the surface at what's
really going, on the reality issometimes pretty different.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
And today we're looking at one of those stories,
a legal case.
This one really brings some ofthese hidden problems to light.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
It does, yeah, and we're going to take a deep dive
into it.
Eeoc versus Mitsubishi MotorManufacturing of America, inc.
And this is not just some dustyold legal case.
It's a really powerful exampleof how we think about and deal
with workplace harassment.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Absolutely, and we've got a bunch of different
sources here the court documents, news articles, even statements
from Mitsubishi themselves,plus some research papers to
give us the bigger picture aboutworkplace discrimination and
harassment.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, and what we really want to do is pull out
the most important insights fromall of this for you, our
learner.
You know, what does this casetell us about?
What goes on at work?
What's the real impact whenthings go wrong?
Yeah, and how do we create aworkplace that's actually fair
and respectful?
So let's jump right into thisMitsubishi case.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Okay, so EEOC versus Mitsubishi Motor Manufacturing
of America Inc.
Sounds very, very official.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
It does.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But what was the real story here?
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Well, at the heart of it, it was a class action
lawsuit started by the EqualEmployment Opportunity
Commission, we call it the EEOC.
They were suing Mitsubishi'sfactory in Normal Illinois.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
And class action.
That just means a bunch ofpeople who have all been hummed
in a similar way.
They come together to sue Rightso the EEOC.
They were acting on behalf ofhundreds of women who worked at
this plant.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Wow, hundreds, yeah, ok.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
And they were alleging some pretty serious
stuff Sexual harassment that waswidespread and systematic.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
Right.
And when we say widespread, Imean the sources we've got here
paint a really, really awfulpicture, unwelcome and offensive
, touching.
They say sexual graffitieverywhere.
Just awful jokes, right, andeven worse, women were afraid to
speak up because they might getpunished.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah, it's pretty shocking it is.
The scale of harassment thatthey were alleging is pretty
staggering Hundreds of women andover a long period of time
throughout the 90s.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
This wasn't just a few isolated things happening.
They were saying this was justpart of the culture at the plant
.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
I mean, can you imagine going to work every day
in that kind of environment?
Speaker 1 (02:17):
It's hard to imagine.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So Missy Bishi gets hit with these accusations.
What do?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
they do Well.
At first they denied everything.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Really.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Yeah, Typical for a big lawsuit.
You know they downplayed it.
They said it wasn't that bad,not that many people involved.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
But as the case went on, as more evidence maybe came
out, their story started tochange.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
Yeah, I mean it did change, because this never
actually went to trial, Right.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
They settled right, they did yeah, and for a lot of
money too.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
So I wonder why they changed their tune so much.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Right, yeah.
Well, they ended up settlingwith the EEOC for $34 million
$34 million.
Yeah, Massive amount of money.
I mean at the time it was oneof the biggest settlements the
EEOC had ever gotten for asexual harassment case.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
It really shows you how seriously they were taking
it.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
And I mean that sent a really strong message to
companies If you let this kindof thing happen, you're going to
pay for it.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Right Literally.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Literally.
But it wasn't just about themoney, was it?
Didn't they have to do someother stuff too?
They did Like.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I think I saw something about a consent decree
.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, yeah, that was part of the settlement a
consent decree.
It's basically a legalagreement that the court makes
sure you stick to.
Okay, and this one was in placefor several years.
It made Mitsubishi change awhole bunch of their policies
and how they did things Got it.
So it wasn't just here's somemoney go away.
They actually had to makechanges.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
And someone was watching to make sure they did
that right.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
They did.
Yeah, they had to have aconsent decree.
Monitor someone from outsidethe company looking over their
shoulder, you know, making surethey were implementing the
changes, reporting back to thecourt.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
So they really couldn't mess around?
No, they had to take itseriously.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And I'm sure all this had a huge impact on how people
saw Mitsubishi.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I mean their reputation must have taken a
major hit.
A case this big with suchserious accusations, that sticks
with you.
I mean, would you want to buy acar from a company with that
kind of baggage?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Exactly, it might make it harder to get good
employees too.
Yeah, people want to work for acompany they feel good about.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
Right.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
It really shows you that what's going on inside a
company, how they treat people,that affects everything.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
And it's really interesting to look at what
Mixie Beachy's been sayinglately.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
It is yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Because in their statements now they're all about
positive work environments anddiversity.
Like they've learned somethingfrom all this.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It seems that way.
I mean a lot of organizationsafter something like this.
They try to make changes, learnfrom their mistakes.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So they say they're committed to building a better
workplace.
Yeah, which is a good thing,right, but it's important to
remember changing a company'sculture, especially after
something this big.
That takes a long time and ittakes real effort.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Definitely Okay.
So we've talked about theMitsubishi case.
Now let's zoom out a little,look at the bigger picture of
harassment in the workplace, andwe've got some research here to
help us do that.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
This first one is called workplace harassment and
organizational justiceperspective.
What are the main points fromthis one?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Well, this article.
It gives us a good way todefine workplace harassment.
Basically, it's behavior that'sunwelcome, it's based on things
like a person's sex, race,those kinds of things, and it
creates a hostile workenvironment.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And what this paper does really well is it looks at
how this affects people.
It's not just about beinguncomfortable at work.
It can have really seriousconsequences.
People can get stressed out.
Obviously they might not liketheir jobs anymore.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
But it can even lead to physical health problems, wow
.
Or it might make it harder forthem to get promoted, you know,
move up in their careers.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Yeah, I can see that.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah, it really can mess up your whole life.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
And yeah, I can see that.
Yeah, it really can mess upyour whole life, and it's not
just bad for the employees right, no, no.
This article talks about thecosts for companies too.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Exactly, yeah, it can cost a lot of money, not just
from lawsuits, but whenemployees are unhappy, they
don't work as well.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
They might take more sick days.
And then there's the wholereputation thing we talked about
, which can affect profits.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Right.
So creating a workplace wherepeople feel respected, it's not
just the right thing to domorally, it's also good business
.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Definitely Makes sense.
So what's this organizationaljustice perspective?
What's that about?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Right?
Well, that's a reallyinteresting part of this paper.
They're saying that fairness isreally important in how
employees experience and respondto problems at work, including
harassment.
So they break this idea offairness down into a few parts.
Okay, distributive justice,that's about outcomes.
Do people get fair promotions?
Is the pay fair?
Speaker 1 (06:25):
Okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Then there's procedural justice.
Okay, that's about howdecisions get made.
Are the processes fair?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
And then the last one .
This is really important forharassment Interactional justice
.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
That's just about how people are treated day to day
Like are they treated withdignity and respect?
Right, and think about thoselewd jokes and the touching we
talked about at Niki Bishi.
That wasn't just breaking arule, it was showing those women
that they weren't respected.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And what this paper says is that when people feel
like things aren't fair, they'reless likely to report
harassment.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Even if they see it happening to someone else, they
might not say anything.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Yeah, I could see that.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
So it's really important for companies to have
clear policies, you know, rulesthat everyone understands and
that are applied fairly, andthey need ways for people to
report harassment that areconfidential, that people feel
comfortable using, and when theydo investigate, those
investigations have to be fairand thorough.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Right, so people have to trust the system.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Otherwise they're not going to use it and the
problems are just going tocontinue.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Exactly, which brings us to our next source.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Okay, this one's called Preventing Discrimination
and Harassment in the Workplace.
Okay, so this one is more aboutwhat companies can do to
prevent these problems in thefirst place.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Exactly, yeah, this one really focuses on being
proactive.
Don't wait for something bad tohappen.
Try to stop it from happeningat all.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Okay, how do they suggest doing that?
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Well, one big thing is training.
Make sure all your employeesunderstand what harassment is,
what's acceptable and what's not.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
And then you need clear codes of conduct.
You know written rules that sayexactly what's not allowed.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Right right.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
And maybe the most important thing, the leadership
has to be on board.
They have to show everyone thatthey're serious about this.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Lead by example.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Exactly If the leaders don't care, then nobody
else will either.
Makes sense and it won't matterwhat kind of policies you have.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Right.
What about specific trainingprograms?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Right, yeah, so this source talks about bystander
intervention training.
What's that it's about givingpeople the tools to step in.
You know, if they see somethingthat's not right, okay.
Even if it's not happening tothem directly, like maybe
someone's telling a defensivejoke, yeah, this training helps
people know how to say something, how to shut it down.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
I can see how that could be really helpful.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
It can.
It's about changing.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Yeah, ok.
So training, codes of conduct,leadership, buy in.
What about the law Like whatare companies legally required
to do?
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Right?
Well, this source makes itclear that employers have a
legal responsibility to preventharassment.
They have to provide a safework environment for everyone.
Yeah, that means having thosepolicies in place, making sure
people know how to reportproblems and actually doing
something to stop harassment, ifit happens, makes sense, it's
not just a nice idea.
Harassment, if it happens,makes sense.
It's not just a nice idea, it'sthe law Got it and the thing is
(09:06):
what counts as harassment?
That's changing all the time.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
This source mentions online harassment, which is a
big issue now, and somethingcalled microaggressions.
Microaggressions I'm not sure Iknow what that means yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
So those are like little things, subtle things
that might not seem like a bigdeal on their own.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
OK.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
But they can be hurtful, they can be
discriminatory and when theyhappen over and over again, they
create a really negativeenvironment.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I see.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
So companies have to keep up with all this.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Right.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
They need to adapt their training and policies to
make sure they're covering allthe bases.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
So let's bring it back to the Mitsubishi case.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
OK.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
How does that whole story illustrate what we've been
talking about here with thisresearch?
Like the company denyingeverything at first.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah Well, mitsubishi is a perfect example of what
can go wrong when a companydoesn't take this stuff
seriously.
Well, that harassment happeningfor years, right, and them just
saying, oh no, it's not aproblem, right?
It shows you that if you don'thave a good system in place, a
system people trust, you're notgoing to know what's really
going on.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Right and the fact that they needed the EEOC to
come in and force them to makechanges.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Right.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
That says something too right.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
It does.
It shows that sometimescompanies can't or won't fix
themselves.
They need someone from theoutside to come in and say this
is how it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, we've got another research paper here
Sexual Harassment in theWorkplace Developments in Theory
and Research.
What does this one add to theconversation?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Well, this one really digs into why sexual harassment
happens in the first place, andthey present a few different
theories about that.
Okay, so one idea is that it'sall about power.
Okay, you know, some peoplehave more power than others at
work.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
And they might use that power to harass people.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Makes sense.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Another theory focuses on the overall culture
of the workplace.
Okay, Like what are the values?
What are the norms?
Do people feel like they couldspeak up if something's wrong?
Speaker 1 (10:50):
So it's not just about a few bad apples.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
No.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
It's about the whole barrel.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Right.
The environment itself caneither encourage or discourage
harassment.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
That's a good way to put it.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
And this paper also looks at how common sexual
harassment is, and it comes inall different forms, you know,
from stuff like offensive jokesto unwanted touching, even to
forcing someone to do somethingsexual.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
That's awful.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
It is.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And it sounds like it's pretty hard to study this
stuff.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Yeah, trying to measure sexual harassment,
that's really tough.
A lot of people don't report it, you know, and everyone has a
different idea of what it is.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Yeah, I can imagine.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
It's sensitive, it's personal.
So researchers have to bereally careful how they study it
.
Ok To get good information.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
Last thing, we have those statements from Mitsubishi
Motors North America.
Right, what are they saying now?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Well, these days, they're really emphasizing their
commitment to diversity andinclusion, creating a respectful
workplace.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
OK.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Which you know.
After everything that happened,that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
They're talking about the steps they've taken to make
things better.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
New policies, training programs, things like
that.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
And they talk a lot about accountability, you know,
making it clear that if youharass someone, there will be
consequences.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Yeah, but as we said before, changing a whole company
culture, that's not easy.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
It's not, it takes time, it takes a real commitment
.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Definitely so.
Putting it all together, whatare the big takeaways here from
this Mitsubishi case and allthis research?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Well, the Mitsubishi case.
It's a really stark reminder ofwhat can happen when harassment
is allowed to go unchecked.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Both for the individuals involved and for the
company.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
I mean $34 million.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
That should make any company sit up and take notice,
and it's clear that if you wantto prevent harassment, you can't
just have a policy you know,sitting in a drawer somewhere.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
It's got to be more than that.
You need clear rules thateveryone understands and you
need ways for people to reportproblems that they feel good
about Right.
You need fair investigationsand, most importantly, you need
leadership that shows they careabout this stuff, that they're
going to hold people accountable, right and those employees.
They need to trust the system.
They need to believe that ifthey report something, it'll be
(12:49):
taken seriously.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Right, and even when there's a settlement, like
Mitsubishi paying all that money, it doesn't really fix
everything.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
It doesn't.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
You know the people who are harassed.
They might get some money butthat doesn't erase what happened
the emotional damage, theimpact on their careers.
That can last a long time.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Absolutely.
Money can't fix everything andeven if a company like
Mitsugishi, they try to makethings better, that's an ongoing
process.
It's not like you flip a switchand everything's fixed.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Definitely, and it's interesting too what counts as
harassment.
That keeps changing, like withonline harassment and those
microaggressions.
We have to keep learning andadapting.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
We do.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
And it's not just about reacting to problems.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Right.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
It's about preventing them from happening in the
first place.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Exactly being proactive.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
So we've really gone deep on this topic today.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
We have.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
The Mitsubishi case, all the research.
It really shows you how complexthis issue is.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
It does.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
And how important it is to create workplaces where
everyone feels safe, everyonefeels respected.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Yeah, I mean, understanding this stuff is
crucial.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
If we want workplaces where people can thrive, you
know, reach their full potential.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Right, exactly, and so we'll leave you with a
question to think about.
You know, after everythingwe've talked about, what do you
think is the most importantthing a company can do to stop
harassment and discrimination?
Speaker 2 (14:04):
right.
Keep thinking about theseissues.
You know, pay attention towhat's happening around you
definitely and thanks forjoining us for this deep dive
thanks for being here.
We talk a lot about workplace equality.
You know fair treatment.
It's a nice idea.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
It is.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
But if you actually look under the surface at what's
really going, on the reality issometimes pretty different.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
And today we're looking at one of those stories,
a legal case.
This one really brings some ofthese hidden problems to light.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
It does, yeah, and we're going to take a deep dive
into it.
Eeoc versus Mitsubishi MotorManufacturing of America, inc.
And this is not just some dustyold legal case.
It's a really powerful exampleof how we think about and deal
with workplace harassment.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Absolutely, and we've got a bunch of different
sources here the court documents, news articles, even statements
from Mitsubishi themselves,plus some research papers to
give us the bigger picture aboutworkplace discrimination and
harassment.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, and what we really want to do is pull out
the most important insights fromall of this for you, our
learner.
You know, what does this casetell us about?
What goes on at work?
What's the real impact whenthings go wrong?
Yeah, and how do we create aworkplace that's actually fair
and respectful?
So let's jump right into thisMitsubishi case.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Okay, so EEOC versus Mitsubishi Motor Manufacturing
of America Inc.
Sounds very, very official.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
It does.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But what was the real story here?
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Well, at the heart of it, it was a class action
lawsuit started by the EqualEmployment Opportunity
Commission, we call it the EEOC.
They were suing Mitsubishi'sfactory in Normal Illinois.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
And class action.
That just means a bunch ofpeople who have all been hummed
in a similar way.
They come together to sue Rightso the EEOC.
They were acting on behalf ofhundreds of women who worked at
this plant.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Wow, hundreds, yeah, ok.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
And they were alleging some pretty serious
stuff Sexual harassment that waswidespread and systematic.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
Right.
And when we say widespread, Imean the sources we've got here
paint a really, really awfulpicture, unwelcome and offensive
, touching.
They say sexual graffitieverywhere.
Just awful jokes, right, andeven worse, women were afraid to
speak up because they might getpunished.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Yeah, it's pretty shocking it is.
The scale of harassment thatthey were alleging is pretty
staggering Hundreds of women andover a long period of time
throughout the 90s.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
This wasn't just a few isolated things happening.
They were saying this was justpart of the culture at the plant
.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
I mean, can you imagine going to work every day
in that kind of environment?
Speaker 1 (02:17):
It's hard to imagine.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So Missy Bishi gets hit with these accusations.
What do?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
they do Well.
At first they denied everything.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Really.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Yeah, Typical for a big lawsuit.
You know they downplayed it.
They said it wasn't that bad,not that many people involved.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
But as the case went on, as more evidence maybe came
out, their story started tochange.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
Yeah, I mean it did change, because this never
actually went to trial, Right.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
They settled right, they did yeah, and for a lot of
money too.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
So I wonder why they changed their tune so much.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Right, yeah.
Well, they ended up settlingwith the EEOC for $34 million
$34 million.
Yeah, Massive amount of money.
I mean at the time it was oneof the biggest settlements the
EEOC had ever gotten for asexual harassment case.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
It really shows you how seriously they were taking
it.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
And I mean that sent a really strong message to
companies If you let this kindof thing happen, you're going to
pay for it.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Right Literally.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Literally.
But it wasn't just about themoney, was it?
Didn't they have to do someother stuff too?
They did Like.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I think I saw something about a consent decree
.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, yeah, that was part of the settlement a
consent decree.
It's basically a legalagreement that the court makes
sure you stick to.
Okay, and this one was in placefor several years.
It made Mitsubishi change awhole bunch of their policies
and how they did things Got it.
So it wasn't just here's somemoney go away.
They actually had to makechanges.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
And someone was watching to make sure they did
that right.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
They did.
Yeah, they had to have aconsent decree.
Monitor someone from outsidethe company looking over their
shoulder, you know, making surethey were implementing the
changes, reporting back to thecourt.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
So they really couldn't mess around?
No, they had to take itseriously.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And I'm sure all this had a huge impact on how people
saw Mitsubishi.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I mean their reputation must have taken a
major hit.
A case this big with suchserious accusations, that sticks
with you.
I mean, would you want to buy acar from a company with that
kind of baggage?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Exactly, it might make it harder to get good
employees too.
Yeah, people want to work for acompany they feel good about.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
Right.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
It really shows you that what's going on inside a
company, how they treat people,that affects everything.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
And it's really interesting to look at what
Mixie Beachy's been sayinglately.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
It is yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Because in their statements now they're all about
positive work environments anddiversity.
Like they've learned somethingfrom all this.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It seems that way.
I mean a lot of organizationsafter something like this.
They try to make changes, learnfrom their mistakes.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So they say they're committed to building a better
workplace.
Yeah, which is a good thing,right, but it's important to
remember changing a company'sculture, especially after
something this big.
That takes a long time and ittakes real effort.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Definitely Okay.
So we've talked about theMitsubishi case.
Now let's zoom out a little,look at the bigger picture of
harassment in the workplace, andwe've got some research here to
help us do that.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
This first one is called workplace harassment and
organizational justiceperspective.
What are the main points fromthis one?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Well, this article.
It gives us a good way todefine workplace harassment.
Basically, it's behavior that'sunwelcome, it's based on things
like a person's sex, race,those kinds of things, and it
creates a hostile workenvironment.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And what this paper does really well is it looks at
how this affects people.
It's not just about beinguncomfortable at work.
It can have really seriousconsequences.
People can get stressed out.
Obviously they might not liketheir jobs anymore.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
But it can even lead to physical health problems, wow
.
Or it might make it harder forthem to get promoted, you know,
move up in their careers.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Yeah, I can see that.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah, it really can mess up your whole life.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
And yeah, I can see that.
Yeah, it really can mess upyour whole life, and it's not
just bad for the employees right, no, no.
This article talks about thecosts for companies too.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Exactly, yeah, it can cost a lot of money, not just
from lawsuits, but whenemployees are unhappy, they
don't work as well.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
They might take more sick days.
And then there's the wholereputation thing we talked about
, which can affect profits.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Right.
So creating a workplace wherepeople feel respected, it's not
just the right thing to domorally, it's also good business
.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Definitely Makes sense.
So what's this organizationaljustice perspective?
What's that about?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Right?
Well, that's a reallyinteresting part of this paper.
They're saying that fairness isreally important in how
employees experience and respondto problems at work, including
harassment.
So they break this idea offairness down into a few parts.
Okay, distributive justice,that's about outcomes.
Do people get fair promotions?
Is the pay fair?
Speaker 1 (06:25):
Okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Then there's procedural justice.
Okay, that's about howdecisions get made.
Are the processes fair?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
And then the last one .
This is really important forharassment Interactional justice
.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
That's just about how people are treated day to day
Like are they treated withdignity and respect?
Right, and think about thoselewd jokes and the touching we
talked about at Niki Bishi.
That wasn't just breaking arule, it was showing those women
that they weren't respected.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And what this paper says is that when people feel
like things aren't fair, they'reless likely to report
harassment.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Even if they see it happening to someone else, they
might not say anything.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Yeah, I could see that.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
So it's really important for companies to have
clear policies, you know, rulesthat everyone understands and
that are applied fairly, andthey need ways for people to
report harassment that areconfidential, that people feel
comfortable using, and when theydo investigate, those
investigations have to be fairand thorough.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Right, so people have to trust the system.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Otherwise they're not going to use it and the
problems are just going tocontinue.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Exactly, which brings us to our next source.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Okay, this one's called Preventing Discrimination
and Harassment in the Workplace.
Okay, so this one is more aboutwhat companies can do to
prevent these problems in thefirst place.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Exactly, yeah, this one really focuses on being
proactive.
Don't wait for something bad tohappen.
Try to stop it from happeningat all.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Okay, how do they suggest doing that?
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Well, one big thing is training.
Make sure all your employeesunderstand what harassment is,
what's acceptable and what's not.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
And then you need clear codes of conduct.
You know written rules that sayexactly what's not allowed.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Right right.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
And maybe the most important thing, the leadership
has to be on board.
They have to show everyone thatthey're serious about this.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Lead by example.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Exactly If the leaders don't care, then nobody
else will either.
Makes sense and it won't matterwhat kind of policies you have.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Right.
What about specific trainingprograms?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Right, yeah, so this source talks about bystander
intervention training.
What's that it's about givingpeople the tools to step in.
You know, if they see somethingthat's not right, okay.
Even if it's not happening tothem directly, like maybe
someone's telling a defensivejoke, yeah, this training helps
people know how to say something, how to shut it down.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
I can see how that could be really helpful.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
It can.
It's about changing.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Yeah, ok.
So training, codes of conduct,leadership, buy in.
What about the law Like whatare companies legally required
to do?
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Right?
Well, this source makes itclear that employers have a
legal responsibility to preventharassment.
They have to provide a safework environment for everyone.
Yeah, that means having thosepolicies in place, making sure
people know how to reportproblems and actually doing
something to stop harassment, ifit happens, makes sense, it's
not just a nice idea.
Harassment, if it happens,makes sense.
It's not just a nice idea, it'sthe law Got it and the thing is
(09:06):
what counts as harassment?
That's changing all the time.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
This source mentions online harassment, which is a
big issue now, and somethingcalled microaggressions.
Microaggressions I'm not sure Iknow what that means yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
So those are like little things, subtle things
that might not seem like a bigdeal on their own.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
OK.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
But they can be hurtful, they can be
discriminatory and when theyhappen over and over again, they
create a really negativeenvironment.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I see.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
So companies have to keep up with all this.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Right.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
They need to adapt their training and policies to
make sure they're covering allthe bases.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
So let's bring it back to the Mitsubishi case.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
OK.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
How does that whole story illustrate what we've been
talking about here with thisresearch?
Like the company denyingeverything at first.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah Well, mitsubishi is a perfect example of what
can go wrong when a companydoesn't take this stuff
seriously.
Well, that harassment happeningfor years, right, and them just
saying, oh no, it's not aproblem, right?
It shows you that if you don'thave a good system in place, a
system people trust, you're notgoing to know what's really
going on.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Right and the fact that they needed the EEOC to
come in and force them to makechanges.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Right.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
That says something too right.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
It does.
It shows that sometimescompanies can't or won't fix
themselves.
They need someone from theoutside to come in and say this
is how it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, we've got another research paper here
Sexual Harassment in theWorkplace Developments in Theory
and Research.
What does this one add to theconversation?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Well, this one really digs into why sexual harassment
happens in the first place, andthey present a few different
theories about that.
Okay, so one idea is that it'sall about power.
Okay, you know, some peoplehave more power than others at
work.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
And they might use that power to harass people.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Makes sense.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Another theory focuses on the overall culture
of the workplace.
Okay, Like what are the values?
What are the norms?
Do people feel like they couldspeak up if something's wrong?
Speaker 1 (10:50):
So it's not just about a few bad apples.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
No.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
It's about the whole barrel.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Right.
The environment itself caneither encourage or discourage
harassment.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
That's a good way to put it.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
And this paper also looks at how common sexual
harassment is, and it comes inall different forms, you know,
from stuff like offensive jokesto unwanted touching, even to
forcing someone to do somethingsexual.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
That's awful.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
It is.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And it sounds like it's pretty hard to study this
stuff.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Yeah, trying to measure sexual harassment,
that's really tough.
A lot of people don't report it, you know, and everyone has a
different idea of what it is.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Yeah, I can imagine.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
It's sensitive, it's personal.
So researchers have to bereally careful how they study it
.
Ok To get good information.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
Last thing, we have those statements from Mitsubishi
Motors North America.
Right, what are they saying now?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Well, these days, they're really emphasizing their
commitment to diversity andinclusion, creating a respectful
workplace.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
OK.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Which you know.
After everything that happened,that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
They're talking about the steps they've taken to make
things better.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
New policies, training programs, things like
that.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
And they talk a lot about accountability, you know,
making it clear that if youharass someone, there will be
consequences.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Yeah, but as we said before, changing a whole company
culture, that's not easy.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
It's not, it takes time, it takes a real commitment
.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Definitely so.
Putting it all together, whatare the big takeaways here from
this Mitsubishi case and allthis research?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Well, the Mitsubishi case.
It's a really stark reminder ofwhat can happen when harassment
is allowed to go unchecked.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
Both for the individuals involved and for the
company.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
I mean $34 million.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
That should make any company sit up and take notice,
and it's clear that if you wantto prevent harassment, you can't
just have a policy you know,sitting in a drawer somewhere.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
It's got to be more than that.
You need clear rules thateveryone understands and you
need ways for people to reportproblems that they feel good
about Right.
You need fair investigationsand, most importantly, you need
leadership that shows they careabout this stuff, that they're
going to hold people accountable, right and those employees.
They need to trust the system.
They need to believe that ifthey report something, it'll be
(12:49):
taken seriously.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Right, and even when there's a settlement, like
Mitsubishi paying all that money, it doesn't really fix
everything.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
It doesn't.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
You know the people who are harassed.
They might get some money butthat doesn't erase what happened
the emotional damage, theimpact on their careers.
That can last a long time.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Absolutely.
Money can't fix everything andeven if a company like
Mitsugishi, they try to makethings better, that's an ongoing
process.
It's not like you flip a switchand everything's fixed.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Definitely, and it's interesting too what counts as
harassment.
That keeps changing, like withonline harassment and those
microaggressions.
We have to keep learning andadapting.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
We do.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
And it's not just about reacting to problems.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Right.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
It's about preventing them from happening in the
first place.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Exactly being proactive.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
So we've really gone deep on this topic today.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
We have.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
The Mitsubishi case, all the research.
It really shows you how complexthis issue is.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
It does.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
And how important it is to create workplaces where
everyone feels safe, everyonefeels respected.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Yeah, I mean, understanding this stuff is
crucial.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
If we want workplaces where people can thrive, you
know, reach their full potential.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Right, exactly, and so we'll leave you with a
question to think about.
You know, after everythingwe've talked about, what do you
think is the most importantthing a company can do to stop
harassment and discrimination?
Speaker 2 (14:04):
right.
Keep thinking about theseissues.
You know, pay attention towhat's happening around you
definitely and thanks forjoining us for this deep dive
thanks for being here.
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