Elicia Ybarra on Martial Arts, Resilience, and Overcoming Abuse

Hi!! I would love to hear from you!

Elicia Ybarra defied gender stereotypes in martial arts by embracing her unique style, all while building a brand around the color pink, despite the critics. As a seasoned martial artist with expertise in karate and Taekwondo. Elicia joins us to share her journey of empowerment and resilience. We discuss the importance of boundaries and trust in intuition,  women's self-defense, the struggle women face in finding female-led self-defense classes, and how martial arts can be a vital tool for self-empowerment, especially in places like the Midwest where such classes are sparse.

Elicia’s story is one of personal growth, marked by a series of transformative experiences. We navigate through her tumultuous teenage years and an engagement in a controlling environment that almost derailed her dreams. Listen as she recounts breaking free from an abusive relationship, celebrating her newfound freedom and independence with bold actions that signified her journey towards self-discovery. Her story is a testament to resilience and the power of reclaiming one's life after overcoming manipulation and control.

We also tackle the difficult topic of abusive relationships, focusing on the healing process and the critical importance of setting personal boundaries. Elicia shares insights from her own experiences, emphasizing the significance of therapy, community support, and self-care in overcoming abuse and trauma. From understanding the complexities of manipulation to recognizing the subtle signs of abuse, this episode serves as a guide for those facing similar situations, offering practical advice and empowering listeners to recognize their self-worth and the power of leaving toxic environments.

Empowering Women Through Self-Defense and Resilience
Elicia Ybarra is a seasoned martial artist, dedicated women's self-defense instructor, and passionate advocate for empowering women to live confidently and fearlessly. With over two decades of martial arts experience, including a 4th dan black belt in Taekwondo and a 1st dan black belt in Hapkido, Elicia has transformed her personal journey of resilience into a mission to uplift others.
As the founder of Pretty Hands, Hard Punches, Elicia uses her own experiences overcoming abuse and exploitation within the martial arts industry to teach women practical self-defense techniques, boundary-setting, and how to recognize and stand against abuse. Her unique approach combines technical skill, emotional intelligence, and empowerment to help women build physical and mental strength.

www.prettyhandshardpunches.com if you want more information

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
and welcome to empowered ease.
I have a very amazing guesttoday, Alicia Ybarra.
She is a women's empowermentand women's self-defense.
That's the word I'm looking for.
Thank you so much.
Self-defense coach.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome.
Thanks so much for coming onthe podcast.
Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
I'm really excited, yay, okay, so I have looked up
very little about you so I couldask you as much as I could on
here but so I know you'relocated in California.
Where are you located inCalifornia?

Speaker 2 (00:35):
I am located in Southern California, in Downey.
It's right outside LA.
For anybody that doesn't knowCalifornia, I'm about 16 miles
from LA.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
Love it.
And for those of you thatcannot see, she's like the lady
in pink.
Everything I see in her she'sin bright pink and I love it.
She's got a cute pink jacket onright now.
So tell me a little bit aboutthe pink I see all over your
stuff.
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
So I am a lifelong martial artist.
I've been training for 30 yearsthis year and when I first
started martial arts, it was notvery female at all Wellased
because you know, martial artswas considered a very masculine

(01:26):
sport and so a lot of the boyswould tease me about being too
masculine.
So I would paint my nails pink,like that was my thing.
And as I got older, pink justbegan to be a part of my
wardrobe.
When I did competitions, myuniform was black and pink and I
would get a lot of hate for itas a matter of fact, especially

(01:47):
by, like traditional instructorsand masters, because they would
I had one give me a zero in mycompetition and tell me that I
was a disgrace to the artbecause I was wearing like a
pink uniform.
So when I decided to open, itwas it was really bad Like I got
a lot, a lot of flack for it.
So when I decided to open mywomen's self-defense program, I

(02:10):
was like you know what?
Like F it, I'm going to doeverything pink.
So my logo is actually like themartial arts hands right, as if
you were bowing with pink nails, and so in all of my interviews
and when I teach, I have a pinkuniform with my black belt.
I wear pink.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
Oh, I've seen your pink gi and I was like that is
so cool.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Absolutely Like I.
Really it's a big finger to allof those instructors that told
me that you know this wasn't myplace and I wasn't, I shouldn't
be teaching and you know my jobwas to look pretty and sell
contracts, not to teach martialarts.
So that's kind of where thepink comes from.
I it's been integrated intopretty much everything I do with
my business and and my personallife.

(02:56):
I wear a lot of pink in general.

Speaker 1 (02:58):
I love that so much.
I love it.
That's amazing.
So tell me a little bit abouthow you use martial arts to
empower, actually, hold on.
Where did you start in martialarts?
What kind of martial arts didyou start out in?

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Originally I started in karate Okay and I earned my
first black belt in karate.
That's where I did most of mytournaments.
I was a pretty seriouscompetitor for about 10 years in
my early adolescence and then Iswitched over to Taekwondo,
which for your listeners it'svery similar.
It's almost the same exact wayof learning.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
I took Judo when I was little.
I remember that it was like alot of hip throws.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
Yeah, a lot of throwing, a lot of leverage.
I took some Judo.
I trained in Jiu-Jitsu forabout three years in my early
20s this was before jujitsu wasreally like popular with women.
Now you can go to like allfemale classes.
I was like when I trained.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
I'm in the Midwest.
They still don't have thatstuff, so very cool.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
I'm in Southern California.
You know we're a little bitmore like open to that.
You know we're a little bitmore like open to that.
Yeah, yeah, you are, I'vetrained in Muay Thai swords.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
Uh, I hold a black belt in hockey.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
Yeah, swords is fun, it's very, it's very pretty.
Like if you, if you imagine amartial arts being about
painting it's swords, like I'mgonna go on after this, yeah,
you should, it's, it's, it'svery pretty, it's very, it's
like what you would see inmovies, you know, it's like very
elegant and flowy.
Um, jujitsu is, uh, it's reallymore ground fighting for your

(04:34):
listeners, right?
I think that it's important if,if a woman wants to learn a
martial arts, I usually suggeststarting with jujitsu.
If you find a place you'recomfortable with because almost
any time, as a woman, you'reattacked, you're it's, you're
taken to the ground, right.
What are they going to do?
They're going to put you on theground and jujitsu teaches you
what to do when you're on theground.
How do you?

Speaker 1 (04:52):
get out of that.
Yeah, I like that.
It's like all about takingadvantage of what you have with
you Right, isn't?
I don't know?
I'm like, no, I love Joe Rogan,um, but yes, if a woman wants
to get into it, to start withjujitsu.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Yeah, that's what I always suggest.
I mean really any self-defenseclass will help a woman, like
anywhere you can get into.
A lot of times local policestations will offer self-defense
classes.
Sometimes local martial artsschool will.
What I found is usually it'sran by a man.
So if you have trauma of anysort, walking into a
testosterone filled you know,muscles bulging man class can be

(05:33):
difficult.
So you should try to find likea woman run one.
But a lot of times, especiallyin places like the Midwest, it's
simply not available.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
Yeah, I would rather learn, I think, wrestling with a
woman than a man.
I want to feel strong by thetime I have to like and just
prove that I can do it, and Idon't really want to like
practice on them, you know sotell me about how, how, um.
What do you when you trainwomen in self-defense as your?
What is your practice?
Is it a mix of all of it or isit specific?

(06:04):
What do you do?

Speaker 2 (06:06):
So I train women in all aspects of self-defense so
often as any, anybody, butmainly because I teach women.
I'm going to speak to womenMainly.
When women are taughtself-defense, they're taught the
physical reaction to an attack.
What do you physically do whensomebody grabs your wrist, grabs
your hair?
But I teach an overall aspectof self-defense which is like

(06:30):
you need to know physically whatto do.
But those are very basic,simple techniques that any woman
can learn that I've developedwith the help of multiple
masters across various forms ofmartial arts.
But there's also another aspect.
There's how do you protect yourmental and emotional space?
How do you avoid getting intothat physical altercation in the
first place?
And that's where theempowerment self-defense model

(06:53):
comes in.
It's called a think yell, run,fight, tell.
And it really focuses onsituational awareness, using
things like your language, toneand posture, understanding how
to escape danger, not just fightback, but like how do you get
away If you can run away, runaway.
You know 85% of women who runaway get away.

(07:14):
A lot of times the perpetratorsare looking for an easy
compliant victim.
They're not looking forsomebody to fight back.
There's a whole statistic onthat.
Um, so you, you think.
You think you use situationalawareness, you use your language
, tone and posture, you run, andthen, if none of that works,
how do you physically get out ofthis situation?

(07:34):
And you know, I always thoughtthat like if I fought back, if I
was ever attacked because I wasa martial artist and I was
great at sparring that I wasgoing to do some like super cool
, ninja, shit Right.
And I was just going to liketotally like yeah, you know,
like sidekick and spinning hookkick and you know all these
fancy things that you see inlike martial arts movies.

(07:56):
But the reality is when I wasattacked by my ex-boyfriend and
abuser, I used the basictechnique of a palm strike,
which is opening your hand andusing the palm of your hand as a
weapon, and that is how Isurvived.
There was no like spinninground jump, you know, twirling
kicks.
It was very basic moves.

(08:16):
I grabbed his, grabbed hisAdam's apple, I pulled it.
I broke his nose with my hand.
You know like then I punchedthe hell out of him, but it
wasn't until I got out of.
He was choking me, just so youknow like then I punched the
hell out of him, but it wasn'tuntil I got out of he was
choking me, just so.
Your listeners know that's alot of times that's what men
will do when they're trying tolike make you listen.
Um and so when, what I teach isI teach very basic moves that

(08:39):
women can go home and practicewith their spouse or with their
friends, so that when the timecomes, if they have to use it,
they're not trying to remembersomething fancy.
Their body just responds.
And their body responds byhitting in the eyes, the nose or
the throat, because most of thetime you know, if you're not
bear hugged from behind, you areeither choked or your wrist is

(09:01):
grabbed Like.
Those are the two main ones.
Sometimes your hair will begrabbed.
A lot of these techniques canbe used in any of those
situations.
And oh, real quick.
Finally, the fifth one cause Ididn't grab it is tell it's how
do you, what do you do Ifsomething happens to you?
Most of the time, women are nottaught what to do that.
So by the time we come intothat, it's trauma, right, we're

(09:22):
traumatized.
We don't know what to do.
The judicial system's not setup to protect us and it's only
set up to defend us and hold theperson accountable if the
police officers, theinvestigators and the
prosecutors believe us.
If they don't believe you,they're not going to investigate
.
So what do you do whensomething happens?

(09:43):
That's how I teach Marge, how Iteach self-defense.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
Oh my gosh, you just touched on so many things that I
could talk about for like amillion effing years.
I love it.
So I mean, seriously, you didyou like, went straight for the
meat.
I love it.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
Have you listened to?

Speaker 1 (09:55):
that podcast Um something was wrong.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
I have not.

Speaker 1 (10:00):
No, it's all about well, it tells like victim
stories.
Each season has like adifferent they'll do like cults,
but they've done a lot of likenarcissistic abuse or like the
kind of habitual lying and stufflike that.
But they tell it from like thevictim stance and then they
always educate on like what todo in those situations and then,
like you know, the whole thingis victim based, which I love
because most of the stories arenot, but it's touching on so

(10:22):
much stuff here that they talkedon and like teach you.
So I'm like, oh, my God, youare, you know what you're
talking about.
I love this so much.

Speaker 2 (10:29):
Okay, your mic cut out.
Oh, wait, there you are, am I?

Speaker 1 (10:47):
there're there, don't move.
No, I need to stop touching it.
I keep touching it.
Um, no, touchy, so, um, clearlyyou have a story.
Is this the story that got youinto teaching women's
empowerment and martial artswith this abusive ex of yours?

Speaker 2 (11:04):
It's part of it.
So as a lifelong martial artist, I faced pretty much systematic
abuse from the very beginning,because I was a female martial
artist in a time where therewasn't a lot.
So at 13, I was groomed by my22 year old instructor and by 16
, he was having sex with me.
That completely, like,alienated me from anybody my age

(11:29):
and it really affected everyaspect of how I made choices for
several years following that,and I didn't even know that I
was a victim.
I thought that I was, that Iwas an equal to him and I was
making these decisions as anadult.
But the reality was with a lotof therapy, I have realized that

(11:50):
a lot of those things were verymuch out of my control and he
manipulated, coerced thosevulnerabilities in order to get
what he wanted from me.
And to make matters worse, hehad a pregnant fiance while he
was telling me he loved me andhe wanted to have sex with me,
and so finally, when I had sexwith him, he decided that he

(12:12):
wanted to keep me a secret.
So he told me like hey, let'snot tell anybody, I love you.
And he basically told me oncemy fiance has this baby, we're
broken up, we're just pretendingto be together so that it
doesn't look bad on my school,because he was my martial arts
instructor.
But once she has the baby, I'mgoing to break up with her and

(12:32):
I'm going to leave her, and thenwe're good.
Then you're going to raise thisbaby with me.
And so at 16, I was ready todrop out of high school, get my
GED and just raise this man'sbaby, and I mean, I think it
goes to my immaturity at thattime that I like thought somehow
that was all going to be kosherand it was just going to work
out.
And then when I finally calledhim out and realized that he had

(12:55):
been lying to me, he flippedthat script real quick.
I was a whore, I seduced him, Iwas tempting him, I tried to
ruin his family and I honestlybelieved him Like I really was,
like, oh, I'm such an awfulperson, and that put me in a
very vulnerable state.
And then the next school that Iwent to, when I tried to pick

(13:17):
up all the pieces that I hadjust lost, the owner of that
franchise immediately set me upwith his son and I started
dating his son.

(13:43):
And then before I was actuallyjust getting a lot of
congratulations on thisengagement at 19 years old to
his son and they were planningthis wedding him and the owner
and his wife.
And you know I was like deadinside because I was like I
don't want to, I don't want toget married and have kids.
Right now I'm 19 years old,like my goal is to open my own
martial arts school and be thehead instructor, and after three

(14:07):
years, in a very highlycontrolled and abusive
environment where this franchiseowner pretty much had control
over every aspect of my life, tothe point where every month he
would have me point that printout my bank statements and he
would go through all mypurchases with him and his wife
and they would let me knoweverything I shouldn't be buying
so that I could budget better,because when I had a family with

(14:29):
their son, I was going to needto be on better, a better budget
.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
Girl, how did you survive all of this crazy shit?

Speaker 2 (14:35):
I ended up in a very abusive relationship, my friend,
Understandably understandably.
So it all ended right before Iturned 21.
Um, I realized there was, therewas a moment like you know, you
hear all of those and all of inall these podcasts right,
there's that bubble burstingmoment.
And my moment was when thisfranchise owner finally got

(14:57):
really angry with me because Iwas upset that the instructor
that was hired after me wasmaking $6 more an hour than I
was, but I was still required todo all of the work.
And he finally got upset and hesaid Alicia, your job is to
look pretty and sell contracts.
You're we will never be thehead instructor.
You are 20 years old.

(15:18):
You look like you're 15.
And the only reason a man wouldever come into your school is to
fuck you.
And the only reason a man wouldever come into your school is
to fuck you.
That's it.
That's what you're here for.
Your job is to have is to helpthe family goals, to sell
contracts and to be a good wifeto my son.
If you can't do that, you'regoing to have problems.
And that was the moment Irealized that, throughout all of

(15:38):
these years of trying to workhard to own my own school, that
I was being trained to be thewife of a school owner, not to
be an instructor myself.
And just so your listenersunderstand, and the way that I
explain it to a lot of people,including my own husband, is
like imagine going to medicalschool.

(15:58):
At this point I was 17 years oftraining in martial arts.
Imagine going to medical school, getting all the way through
medical school, getting all theway through medical school and
then having your in-laws be likeokay, you're going to do great
as a secretary, sit here andlook pretty please.
Yeah, you're go ahead and greetthe customers, but you know
your big bad husband.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
He's going to be the one that, like is rides off of
all of your oh my gosh, iflisteners, if you could see the
facial expressions I'm makingthrough this whole story.
I'm like what it's facialgymnastics, I'm telling you, oh
my God, so tell me, how old areyou now?

Speaker 2 (16:37):
I'm 35 now Okay.
So, this happened two weeksbefore I turned 21 and I went
pretty crazy.
I went home to my hometown Iwas living in, I grew up in
Northern California, I moved toSouthern California, I went back
home to Northern California andtwo weeks before I turned 21, I
shotgunned a beer for the firsttime, got a tattoo and bought a

(16:58):
pack of cigarettes For thefirst time For the first time
shotgunned a beer bought a packof cigarettes, I got a tattoo.
I still.
It's the only tattoo I have.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
Can I ask you what it is?
Are you willing to share whatyour tattoo is?
Yeah it's a lotus, it's on myhip.

Speaker 2 (17:11):
It's like very basic.
I love it.
That's cute.
No, a lotus is beautiful.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
It has beautiful symbolism.
I love it.
Yeah, it's hard punches.
I love it, so keep going.
I just got excited Sorry.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
You're perfectly fine .
I know it's like it's sooverwhelming when people first
hear it because they're justlike oh my God, it was just
abuse after abuse after abuse.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
Yeah, and I have so many questions, but I want to
hear the whole thing.

Speaker 2 (17:49):
So so I, for a year, I partied pretty much nonstop,
you know I was drinking it likeevery night.
Like me and my like high schoolfriends were now 21.
So we were out at the bar, youknow like time and that's where
I met my abuser.
He was, I think, four or fiveyears older than me.
He made great money.
He was like six to aconstruction worker in good
shape, told me everything Iwanted to hear.

(18:10):
You know I had spilled my gutsabout all this abuse and he
absolutely filed that away touse at a later time.
Um quickly isolated me from allmy friends and family and I had
spent 18 months with him in avery physically, emotionally and
family and I had spent 18months with him in a very
physically, emotionally,sexually abusive relationship.
Finally, when I fought back waswhat I was talking about when I

(18:30):
used the palm strike and youknow, he was choking me and I
firmly believe that like hewould have killed me that night,
like he wanted me to die, hehated me with every ounce of his
being.
I had caught him cheating.
That's what the whole fight wasabout.
And then he kicked my dog.
He was choking me and I had alittle, you know, six pound

(18:51):
Chawini I had named Rocky Balboa, who was my baby, and he kicked
my dog and as I was likepassing out and I was starting
to see all the black dots, Iheard my dog yelp and that was
what empowered me to fight back.
It wasn't for my own life.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
It was your mommy instinct.

Speaker 2 (19:10):
Oh girl, I beat the hell out of him.
I broke his ribs, I like brokehis nose.

Speaker 1 (19:15):
For those of you that can't see, I have like a
hundred pound cane Corso in theroom and I anyone touched her,
I'd lose my shit.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Right, like that was his mistake, like yeah, he would
have killed me, had he notkicked my dog because I didn't
have anything and I felt like Ideserved the abuse, like I was
such a bad person and I had beenforced in you by these other
people.

Speaker 1 (19:36):
So tell me how long were you with this guy before
this?
He escalated to this point.
How long was the relationship?

Speaker 2 (19:42):
Not that it matters.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
I'm just curious, it was a total of 18 months.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
So the first six months everything was bliss,
honeymoon trips to San Franciscoand spoiling Love bomb, love
bomb, love bomb.
Yeah, and then I moved in withhim and that was when everything
changed.
Then he wanted me to quit myjob and I didn't like my job.
So I quit my job and now I was.
I was financially relying onhim and then he took my car

(20:07):
because his car broke down.
So now I had no car.
And then he took my phonebecause his phone wasn't working
and even though he was makinggreat money, we still were
always broke, turns out.
Just so everyone knows he hadan extra girlfriend on the side
that he was also spending allthis money on, so that's where
the money went.
But yeah, when I caught himcheating, that night was how it

(20:30):
all ended, because at that pointI had had a little bit of
separation from him.
I was very sick Throughout that18 months I was pretty much on
a steady diet of weed and vodka.
I was not living my best life byany means.
Yeah, numbing you were hurting.
Yeah, I mean I was.
I didn't know what trauma wasat the time.

(20:51):
I didn't learn that until my30s, but I was definitely having
a lot of trauma triggers, andhe was a very practiced abuser.
He knew exactly what, whatbuttons to push and when, so
that he could flip it around onme very easily.
Push and win, so that he couldflip it around on me very easily
.
So I fought back and then, youknow, the story actually has a
good ending.
I got my, I went away thatnight, I left him.

(21:17):
I never went back.
I got my life together.
I started college, I went andgot a degree in information
technology.
I remet my now husband.
When we were in our 20s.
I was actually his taekwondoinstructor when we were
teenagers.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
Oh, yeah, and then I love the story that comes back
around.
I don't know it comes backaround I had a great ending.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
He is an incredible man.
He has taught me what true lovereally is, what patience and
understanding and what a healthyrelationship looks like,
because up until this point Ihadn't had one.
I didn't know what healthymeant.
I thought healthy meant likedoing what I was told, and I'm
not really one to do what I'mtold, so flying being easy,

(21:55):
being like yeah, all that thingwent.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
They women, yeah, oh my yeah.

Speaker 2 (22:00):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1 (22:01):
So tell me, okay, um, how long?
Well, actually, the other.
I think, before we get intothat, a lot of women find
themselves in this situation todifferent, varying degrees.
Right and it's all.
It's like you, it's great oneday, and then all of a sudden,
it's not.
And the truth is, there'ssubtle signs in the beginning

(22:23):
and we ignore them becausethere's so much good going on,
there's so many good hormonesbeing released from all the
positive things that happen inthe love bombing and your trust.
It's our natural instinct totrust.
When someone is you know, it'slike it's never your fault.
It's always your good naturethat someone who is a predator
comes and preys on.
So I guess it's such acomplicated situation and most

(22:49):
women are already in it whenthey realize that they're deep,
when they realize, oh shit, thisis what's happening to me.
So what kind of advice or tipsor what was your experience with
this that you would share withwomen who are listening to this?
Thinking like this might be me.
This is a pattern I keepfinding myself in.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
So first is learning to set boundaries for yourself
right.
That helps you understand yourself-worth and your self-value,
and the moment that youunderstand that you are worth
more than the way that thisperson is treating you, you can
start creating an exit plan.
Now for me, I was very, verylucky that my family lived in
town.

(23:20):
They had a room that I couldcome stay at.
I had no children with him, sowhen I decided to leave, I was
able to leave.
He did stalk me for severalmonths, but ultimately I had
what I would say a very easysplit because, although there
was emotional trauma that I hadto deal with, I didn't have
children involved.

(23:41):
When I walked away, I was ableto do a clean cut.
For the women that do have thosestrings attached they've had
children or they haven't had ajob for several years my best
suggestion is to start planningan escape route, start figuring
out how you can get out and thatis very, very difficult.

(24:01):
I do not say that any type ofeasy way right.
This isn't a clean split if youhave children, but by getting a
firm sense of yourself, a firmsense of boundaries, you can
start seeing when those arebeing pushed and you can start
figuring out ways to kind ofpush back If you have all
financial dependence on somebody.

(24:22):
Start looking into women'sshelters, because a lot of times
women's shelters will help youget placed in a job If he has
custody or you both have custodybecause you're living together
and you want to get custody.
Start, if it's safe, keeping anotebook of all of these abusive
things that are happening.
That way when you go to courtyou have some type of evidence.

(24:47):
The thing that happened with mewhen I left and I didn't realize
, was that the judicial systemwas not on my side.
This man was 6'2".
He was a construction worker.
For your listeners, just sothey know, I am a whopping 5'2,
two and at a healthy weight.
I'm like one 35 right now.

(25:07):
I'm at a healthy weight.
I'm at one 35.
At the time that I fought backmy attacker, I weighed less than
a hundred pounds because I hada severe eating disorder of
anorexia.
So, just so anybody can picturethat, I had to fight back with
everything I had.
And when the police showed up,they heard me on top of him
punching the hell out of him andI opened the door with
everything I had.
And when the police showed up,they heard me on top of him
punching the hell out of him andI opened the door and although

(25:29):
I was black and blue, althoughmy eyes were like bloodshot red
because there had been a lack ofoxygen, my throat was bruised.
They told me that I was goingto go to jail, not my attacker,
and the reason it was wasbecause he was more injured than
me and until they figured outwhat happened, I was going to go

(25:57):
to jail while he went to thehospital.
So I could either press chargesand then he could press charges
.
But if I didn't press chargesthey wouldn't allow him to press
charges, you're going to go tojail.
You can sit in jail for thenight while he goes to the
hospital, and that was almostmore traumatizing than actually
getting attacked, because Irealized that I wasn't safe,
that there was like no way ofgetting out of this, and that is
what women have to understand.

(26:17):
If you're already in thissituation, you're seeing it.
Getting out is the mostdangerous time for this to
happen when he knows you're done, when he knows you're gonna
leave, that is when he hasnothing to lose and that's gonna
be the most dangerous time.
Try to do it quietly.
If you can go out, speak towomen's shelters.

(26:38):
If you can do it safely, findsomebody that you can trust and
confide.
Confide into so that you canescape without him knowing
because I didn't.
I was like I'm done, youcheated, I'm out.
And he grabbed me by the hairand he threw me down the hallway
and he started choking me,telling me I was gonna effing
die.
So that's what.
That's what the reality that we,as women who are victimized,

(27:00):
who find ourselves in an abusivesituation, that's what we face.
We the.
How do I get out of this?
There are ways.
Women's shelters, communitysupport, church.
If the church is willing tolisten to what you say in your
grievances, sometimes I will sayand this isn't the greatest

(27:21):
disclaimer, but sometimeschurches believe that you just
need to stand by your husband,whether he abuses you or not, go
to counseling.
Go to counseling.
That can also be more dangerousbecause, like the thing I
always say is, if a man will hita TV, he will hit a wall, and
if he will hit a wall, he willhit your face.
Counseling doesn't get themaway from that.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
It also doesn't address what that issue is.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
No, a lot of times it's power and control.
It's not about the physicalattack, it's different than
relationship?

Speaker 1 (27:49):
Yeah, cause you can have a good relationship and
someone can still react that wayLike not a good relationship,
but they can be good at somerelational things.
And yeah, it's self-control.
So do you know the statisticCause I really think listeners
need to hear this.
I was so shocked when I heardit.
When a man feels, when you arestrangled by a man, your chances

(28:10):
of dying within that next yearin that relationship jumped by
like I think it's like 60 to 80%.
It is a giant percentage thatif someone puts there's a couple
of things like a list ofchecklists of things where you
can rate, like the danger ofyour, because you know some
people may be listening to thisand be like, oh, he just pushes
me when he's mad or you know, henever actually hits me, hits me
or he calls me names.
But you know there's varyingdegrees of this.
Sounds like you were with areal fucking monster at the end,

(28:32):
but the first one wasn't muchbetter.
You know what I'm saying.
So you know I forgot where Iwas going with that statistic.

Speaker 2 (28:41):
No, yes.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
So there's just, but there's more than that.
There's like a couple of thingson there that you could and I.
You can Google it and you cansee what things are actually
more likely to bring it like toshow the real aggression or
violence that people are willingto take it to, and choking is
one of those things.
That is really high on the list, that if a man feels
comfortable cutting off yourairway in any way, you are in

(29:02):
such danger.

Speaker 2 (29:04):
I have not heard that statistic, but it does not
surprise me.
The reality is is when youstart thinking about abuse right
?
Most people think like sexualabuse, right, that's where our
mind goes to.
But the reality is, any type ofabuse is about power and
control, and if a man is willingto take the ultimate control,
which is to completely stop youfrom being able to breathe and

(29:26):
have your life in his hands, heis willing to take your life.
The man ever puts his hands onyou in any way.
The thing that you need tounderstand is that it's it's not
going to be, it's never goingto be enough, right?
So if you say like you fillthis out, and you're like, oh,
every once in a while he pushesme when he's angry, or he'll
like throw me down on the couch,but you know he knows that it's

(29:47):
soft, so it's not hurting me.
The reality is is he is usingyou to release his anger, and
there's going to come a pointwhen throwing you on the couch
isn't enough when he has to hityou.
And then there's going to come apoint when hitting you is not
enough, when he needs morecontrol.
Sometimes that goes into a moreof a sexual component, like I
need to show you that I can haveyou whenever I want, and other

(30:10):
times it goes into a physicalcomponent.
I will black your eye, I willcut your airway off, I will do
what I want to do to your body.
Either way, anytime you seethat first step, you're already
in danger.
It's just a matter of how muchdanger you're in in that moment.
And a lot of times what happensis we talk ourselves out.

(30:33):
The first time my ex-abuser everhit me, we were very
intoxicated.
I'm pretty sure there were somedrugs involved there at some
point on that night and he sawanother man talking to me and he
asked me to come into thebathroom because he wanted to
ask me a question.
And as I walked into thebathroom he just backhanded me

(30:54):
right Like completely out of theblue.
I wasn't even paying attention,I didn't even have a chance to
block it, and the next day itwas.
I don't know what happened toattention.
I didn't even have a chance toblock it, and the next day it
was.
I don't know what happened tome.
I'm so sorry.
You know, I saw you talking tohim and it seemed like you were
interested and I just really gotangry.
And the second time he hit me itwas I'm so sorry, I don't know

(31:14):
what happened to me.
I love you.
There were tears, there wasthis.
All these apologies right, thisis all my fault.
I'm so sorry, but the thirdtime was well, I've never done
this before.
What did you do to make thishappen?
What did you do to make merespond this way?
And the moment that it becomesabout you, that's the moment it

(31:36):
becomes very dangerous, becausenow you are that way that he's
going to get that release, thatpowerful release of of anger,
right.
If I, if I hit you and that'snot enough, i's going to get
that release, that powerfulrelease of of anger right.
If I, if I hit you, and that'snot enough, I'm going to
strangle you, because I needthat power and control.
So I completely understand thatyou're right.
Like if a man is willing to cutoff your airway, he's willing
to take your life, and it reallyis a matter of how much he can

(31:58):
control himself and eventuallyhe won't be able to.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
Such good advice.
It's so important to sharethese stories too.
I like thank you so much fordoing it because I feel like
it's so.
Like you said, I say this allthe time about a totally
different subject women heal incommunity and we need that
because we need to talk, to beable to validate our own
feelings.
But that's so true of trauma,and this kind of trauma is like
a combo of the both.
So, like women need to hearother women say this is what
happened to me, because you knowI can roll through a million
relationships where there's likea touch of this.

(32:28):
When we talk about this stuff.
You know what I mean, likegrowing up dating all kinds of
men.
You know like I live in theMidwest, so it's you know
there's a lot of unhealthy menhere, so I can think about that
role in so many ways, and I feellike every woman can.
You know what I mean.
You took martial arts.
Sounds like this communitythat's very heavily male
dominated, where you and butthat's not the only one you know

(32:49):
what I mean.
This exists on subtle levelsfor every woman who's ever gone
out into the world, and then sothis is so powerful for you to
share the story so people canvalidate in themselves and know,
like, where the real work is isin yourself.
Like go back to yourself, learnyour boundaries, learn your
self-worth, so that you havewhat it takes to like know that

(33:10):
you deserve more.
That's so powerful.

Speaker 2 (33:12):
What I always tell my students, and what I'll tell
you and your listeners too, isthat, like real confidence,
right Is more powerful thananything.
I will ever be able to teachyou physically Like I was a
black belt.
I was a black belt by the timeI was 13.
I could physically defendmyself better than most men
could now, but I had no ideaabout boundaries.

(33:35):
I had no way of understandinghow to protect my mental or
emotional space, so I had noidea when somebody was pushing
those limits and I was allowingother people to set my
boundaries for me.
And that's where it can becomedangerous, because when you
allow other people to set yourboundaries, they set those
boundaries for their benefit.
They're not in your bestinterest.

(33:55):
They're to make their lifeeasier, for them to get what
they want.
So if you have the confidenceto be like, this is my line in
the sand, this is drawn.
And if you start to push it,I'm going to know you become
acutely aware when somebodystarts pushing any of those
boundaries.
If you, as a woman, go on a datewith a man and you know before
you go on that date how much youwant to drink, what you want to

(34:17):
eat and how far you want to gowith that man where you you know
if you want to have sex, if youdon't want to have sex, and you
are confident, and he startstrying to push that third drink
on you, or he starts trying toget you to go up to his
apartment.
You are acutely aware that he ispushing that because you've
already made it clear oh, I'monly having two drinks tonight.
That's my limit, right?
I'm a two glass of wine kind ofgirl, okay, so if you have that

(34:41):
, you know when they're pushingthat boundary and then having
the confidence, and that's thisis where confidence comes in
play.
Being like you know what thisreally.
I'm not having a good job, I'mnot having a good time on this
date.
I think I'm going to leave,right, I'm going to leave.
Having the confidence to get upand walk away from that table
will keep you more safe than anyninja.
Cool spin tricks, kicks,punches I can teach you as a

(35:05):
martial arts instructor.

Speaker 1 (35:06):
And that's kind of men hate confidence in women.
They hate it.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
That's why, too, because we have been taught as a
society to allow, to follow theman's lead he sets our
boundaries for us and to neversay no right.
Be polite, be meek, be quiet.
Don't upset their ego.
So, men have a very strongentitlement to well, you have
that other drink, have one moredrink, you're fine.

(35:32):
Because they are taught growingup that persistence pays off.
So women are taught don't sayno, men are taught don't take no
for an answer.
So you have this society wherewomen can't say no and men don't
take no for an answer, andthat's where a lot of these
issues with things like consentcome into place or things like
well, I thought she wanted itbecause we, as women, are taught

(35:53):
to allow men to set the pacefor us.
And I say, if we want to staysafe, we set our own pace.
We know where we're at, whenwe're ready, where we're ready
to go and what we're willing todo.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
Oh my gosh, that's such good advice.
You know, I never thought ofthe male perspective of that
like that they were, but theyreally are groomed to be
persistent, I mean, and groomedto shove their feelings down,
and groomed to to take things,when you know, like to be the
more dominant, to take thedominant step forward where
women are, why I fullyunderstand how we're groomed the
pleasers make, set theenvironment, take care of

(36:28):
everybody above ourselves, bethese noble martyrs.
But yeah, that's so interestingand you know, I love, I just
love your perspective on this,how you're bringing it back to
yourself.
So in your program, um, I'mgetting the sense that there's
more than physical skills you'reteaching here.
So tell me about what you dowith women who come to you.
And did you say you only coachwomen?

(36:50):
I only teach women.
Yes, I love that.

Speaker 2 (36:52):
I love it.
I am women.
Empowerment throughself-defense.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
I love that.
I only work with women too, sotell me about how you work with
women when they come to you withwomen too, so tell me about how
you work with women when theycome to you.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
So the first thing I do, the way I lay out my my
class is I actually start withwhat I call staggering
statistics.
Right, so, because I believethat, for women, knowledge is
what our power is byunderstanding what we're up
against.
That is where we start tounderstand how to say stay safe.
So the one that I really likeis that, according to the Rape
Abuse and Incest.
National Network, 975perpetrators out of every

(37:29):
thousand sexual assaults walkaway free.
975.
310 are reported to police,which means 690 never even face
a police officer.
Out of 310, I want to say 50are investigated to the point
where they will take it to aprosecutor.
Out of 50 that are taken to aprosecutor, a prosecutor will

(37:51):
decide to prosecute 28.
And out of those 28, they willget a conviction of 25.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
And what are those convictions, what are those
consequences?

Speaker 2 (38:02):
survive.
So then, what are thoseconvictions?
What are those consequences?
Normally the consequences arevery low less than three to five
years, um for for sexualassault.
So, like you know, basicallyit's a slap on the wrist hey,
bad boy, don't do that again ordon't get caught, which is kind
of the way that I see it.
Yeah, yeah, if you're gonna doit, make sure she can't tell on
you and she doesn't have enoughevidence to for the police to
believe her smarter about it.

Speaker 1 (38:23):
Do you know the statistic about survivors
killing in self-defense, likedomestic abuse victims, killing
in self-defense?
I can't remember what it is,but it's like only you're, only
a victim if you die.

Speaker 2 (38:37):
I don't know the exact statistics, but I do know
that women who fight back andkill in self-defense get like a
very high conviction rate andthe consequences are like life
in prison.

Speaker 1 (38:54):
Yeah, where a man can do the opposite and their
consequences are significantlyless.

Speaker 2 (38:59):
Yeah, like, oh well, because and here's why, right,
significantly less.
Yeah, like, oh well, becauseand here's why, right, here's
the reason that, as women, weneed to understand a jury, which
is normal, everyday people.
They will ask the question whydidn't she leave?
If she, if she defends herselfand she kills him, they will say
, well, why didn't she justleave?
There are other places theycould have gone.

(39:21):
Now, if it's the man killingthe woman, they will ask the
question what did she do toupset him to the point?
So, as women, we are likesociety is against us when it
comes to self-defense, and thatis something we have to go into.
That's why, in my program, Idon't teach to kill.

(39:42):
I would like to if I could, butlegally and allegedly right,
you can't.
So what I teach is how to getaway.
If you can recognize thesituation and you can not be in
that situation, that's your bestbet.
But if you can't, if you end upin a situation, for example,
say, walking down a dark alley,right, if you end up having to
walking down a dark alley, right, if you end up having to walk

(40:04):
down the dark alley, what areyour escape routes?
How can you run away?
If you can't run away.
How do you yell, use yourlanguage, tone and posture to
not be a compliant victim sothat, hopefully, that guy won't
choose to attack you?
If you can't do any of thosethree, how do you defend
yourself to a point where youcan get away without getting a
murder charge?

(40:24):
Right, like, how do you?
You could stab him in the eye.
I always say, like you know,spread all your fingers and jab
them as hard as you can in theeye, because a dude that can't
see can't chase you Right.
Yeah, that's Apple.
Pull is Adam's apple.
As hard as you can, because aguy that can't breathe, he can't
chase you.
Right, if he has you in a bearhug, break his finger, because

(40:48):
if he's more concentrated on thepain of his finger, that gives
you the opportunity to get away.
But if he falls to the ground,don't stomp his face in, because
now you are the perpetrator.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
Run.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
And that's like so difficult because we are not
allowed to react out of anger.
We have to react out ofself-defense, whereas men are
definitely.
They're like, oh yeah, you know, what did she do.
It's a given, right.
It's a given like what couldshe have done?
What could she have done tomake you so angry that you
couldn't control yourself andyou had to murder her, like I

(41:20):
love your education on the, themen's like psyche as well.

Speaker 1 (41:24):
I feel like I've listened to like her, like I'm
very interested in this topic,so I listened to a lot of it and
I feel like your education onlike the man's mindset is new
for me and I really enjoy itbecause I think it's very
helpful to understand and soimportant to talk about like all
of this, especially with thecourt stuff too, because we
assume we call the unless youhave called them before and but

(41:45):
if you assume when you call thepolice they're there to help you
and I, that is their intention,don't get me wrong.
I feel like a lot of them comein with that intention but
they're undereducated and theythey don't always help, even
though that's their intention.
Sometimes they make thesituation much worse and they
commonly retraumatize women,which is so absolutely the
judicial system is not set upfor victims.

Speaker 2 (42:05):
That's why you need like an advocate.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
Yeah, totally, it's so sad, it makes me so sad, and
even the advocates at times arenot very well trained, in my
experience and no, they're not.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
they're not because most of the time they're just
doing it to get their hours forsomething, so they're not
survivors themselves.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
That don't you know, because survivors themselves
sometimes can be some of themost judgmental people as well,
because they're you know youdon't get.
There's something we need towork on.
When we put ourselves in thosesituations is not our fault at
all Never but there's some innerwork that that says we probably
need to be doing about like why, what?
Where our love is lacking forourselves.

Speaker 2 (42:43):
Well, and we need to understand that when you're
traumatized right, you and youhave trauma you don't remember
those events, you relive them.
Yeah, and there is acomfortability that we look at
like.
I never say like, oh, you havebad taste in men.
I say like what red flags areyou attracted to?

Speaker 1 (43:00):
Oh my gosh, I love that perspective.
You're so right Because, if youthink about it, there's.
What red flags are youattracted to?
Oh my gosh, I love thatperspective.
You're so right If you thinkabout it.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
there's usually red flags Like.
I was looking for validationwith my abuser, like, and he
gave it to me.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
He validated me for a long time until he didn't, and
then it started the abuse whichis part of that love bombing
period, because they're gettingto know you, they're listening
to you, they're looking forthose things that you're looking
at subconsciously.
But yeah, wow, I love also howyou're, the way you're
approaching boundaries with this.
So it's like from the get-go,from the very beginning, know

(43:32):
what you want, because that'snot necessarily something we're
trying to do from our little.
Go into situations with thesestrict views of this is what I
want, this is what I'm going todo.
That's looked at as beingdifficult, but really that's
being safe, and so how do youincorporate that?
Do you do that Like on the mat?
When you're talking to people,do you do like coursework with
them?
First you do one-on-ones.
How do you reinforce this withthe women you work with?

Speaker 2 (43:54):
I actually have a worksheet that I developed that
I used for myself when I wasgoing through my own trauma and
trying to figure out how to be anew mom and I was dealing with
postpartum and severe depressionand I was trying.
I had all of these toxic peoplein my life.
I call them emotional vampires,right, those?

Speaker 1 (44:10):
friends that energy suckers.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
Yes, those misery love company type of people, or,
you know, the people in yourfamily that are so used to you
not having boundaries and makingtheir life easier.
They start to push, and so Icall it the ideal you worksheet,
and that's where I have all mystudents start.
I have a free download on mywebsite.
I can send you the link and youcan put it in the notes.
The promo code is just ideal,you it's very simple.

Speaker 1 (44:34):
If you want what your website is, go for it.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Oh, my website is wwwprettyhandshardpunchescom.
Luckily, I have a pretty uniquename, so, like, everything is
just pretty hands, hard punches,which I love.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
It goes with my theme too, like empowered ease.
I love it.

Speaker 2 (44:52):
I love it Right With this worksheet.
Basically, what I do is I walkyou through, not trying to
create boundaries in the moment,right, because in the moment
you're emotional.
I can't believe I let thisperson talk to me this way.
I can't believe I went andpicked up my friend's kid for
the 18th time because she askedme to, even though I couldn't
right.

(45:13):
I can't believe I did all ofthis.
There's an emotional attachmentto it.
But if you take yourself out ofthat and you look at your future
version of yourself and youfigure out what does she look
like, really visualize what doesshe look like.
Does she have short hair?
Long hair?
Is she in shape?
Is she out of shape?
Blah, blah, blah, right?
And then you ask what does shefeel like?

(45:33):
Does she wake up excited to seeher friends or does she wake up
dreaded to see her friends?
Because then you know which oneyou want, right?
You want to be excited to seeyour friends, you want to be
excited to go to work, you wantto be excited to spend time with
your children.
So how does she look?
How does she feel?
And then you ask yourself whatare her boundaries?
And I have a list of you knowfinancial, emotional, social,

(45:58):
physical, professional, right,all these boundaries.
And you start to kind of listwhat are the boundaries for this
ideal version of you?
And then you ask after you'vesat down and this takes a little
bit of time, it took me acouple of hours and I still work
on it, I still have that listin my one note notebook and then
you ask, like, what does she dowhen her boundaries are

(46:18):
disrespected, right, what doesshe say to that friend that is
asking her to pick up her childfor like the 12th time when she
couldn't do it?
And you will have be empoweredto be like.
You know what the ideal versionof me says no.
And she says no confidently andno is a full sentence.
And I don't need to explainmyself because this ideal
version of myself, so it takesyou out of the moment.

(46:40):
And finally, the last step ofthat is who does she allow in
her life?
And it was when I hit that stepfor myself that I realized that
a lot of my friends were verytoxic and I did not want them in
my life.
And now you know, four or fiveyears later, I have incredible
supportive friends that I'mexcited to see, that make time

(47:00):
for me, that it's not just a youknow.
Let's get on the phone and talkshit about everyone else and
that's how we're going to buildour bonds right.
It's like empowering andthey're successful and they're
business owners and that'sreally what your listeners can
start with.
How does she look, how does shefeel?
What are her boundaries?
How does she handle whensomebody disrespects her

(47:22):
boundaries and who does sheallow in her life?
And the moment you start tofigure that out, you will start
to take steps to make your lifemuch better for yourself.

Speaker 1 (47:31):
Oh, that's beautiful, I love it.
I I coach women through burnout.
That's my specialty, but it'svery.
They have very like, I guess,similar overlays in that the
struggles for a lot of peopleare that self-love, like giving
themselves that permission tolike put themselves first.
But also, I noticed, once Ireally dig into it with people,
boundaries is a huge issue andfor many, many of my clients

(47:53):
it's like family boundaries,like parents or brothers or
cousins, someone you feel deeplycommitted to for some reason,
and they're allowing them tocontinually step over it.
So so it's so powerful for meto hear you say this, because as
women, it's also when I teach,I also do a lot on women's
issues and good girlconditioning, and this is also
like whoop overlay, right onthat too.

(48:13):
This is part of you know, it'snot our fault, it's part of how
society, unfortunately, hasrolled out through time.
In this patriarchal societywhere we teach women their value
is in well originally, in whatit was to be a wife or what you
brought to a marriage and howthat's evolved over time, is to
be like a pleaser, a caretaker,and it teaches you to subtly put

(48:38):
yourself second, put otherpeople's feelings and the
environment around you above you, and so that tells us to like
not enforce boundaries.
It just like it's pushing us todo the opposite of what's good
for us, and it leaves a lot ofawful stuff right.

Speaker 2 (48:53):
Yeah, it leaves us with things like autoimmune
diseases.
It leaves us where our bodystarts to physically have
changes that are not good forour health.
You know I in the last fiveyears I have been diagnosed with
Hashimoto's disease of thejoints just so your listeners
understand, stress is a big one,and so one of the reasons I had

(49:14):
to set these boundaries and oneof these reasons I had to kind
of take the emotions out of it,is because my body physically
put me in a bed where I couldnot get out.
Because I didn't haveboundaries, because I was too
stressed out trying to pleaseeveryone in my life and
Hashimoto's is directly relatedto an emotional.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
It's like an emotion, the only one.
They directly heart condition.
They directly relate to youremotional wellbeing.

Speaker 2 (49:38):
Well, yeah, cause it's.
It's your thyroid right andit's all hormonal and when you
get emotional and you stressyourself out.
Then you don't take care ofyourself.
Do like like eat healthy, right.
When you're doing so much forother people, it's so much
easier to just run throughMcDonald's right than it is to
like meal prep.
So you end up everything islike a domino effect, right?
You have to put the oxygen maskon yourself first.

(50:01):
You have to make sure you areliving a healthy, happy,
thriving lifestyle and then youbring the people around you up.
You do not diminish your shine.
To make other people feelworthy, you have to understand
that it is your worth and yourvalue that you get to choose.
Other people don't get to tellyou what your worth and value is
.
Other people don't get to tellyou when you can sit down and

(50:23):
when you can take a break youshould be doing that for
yourself, and if you're not,then go to that ideal.
you worksheet right, Workingthrough those five steps so you
can find out where you can makethese changes in your life.

Speaker 1 (50:35):
I love that and you know, for a lot of us, we know
what we need to be doing andthere's just some block there.
I mean, some of us don't know.
We know what we need to bedoing and there's just some
block there.
I mean, some of us don't know.
But then there is a componentto us as well that we know what
we should be doing and somehowwe can't bring ourselves to do
it.
And that's where we need toreach out for a little extra
support, like therapy, which youmentioned, and this was one of
my questions I wanted to ask youjust because it sounds like the
beginning of your life was justlike a lot of things working

(50:58):
against you.
That you know you probably hadto spend a considerable amount
of time processing is myassumption.
So I'm just wondering, like,how that process, the timeframe
maybe that took for you and someof the more like powerful
things you did in that time toheal that you that you could
share.

Speaker 2 (51:16):
Yeah, I'm still healing.

Speaker 1 (51:18):
It's a lifelong one right.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
Yeah, I have been in EMDR therapy for going on two
years.
Okay, I meet with a therapistonce a week.
I am still dealing with settingboundaries with my family.
I am still dealing with thatfeeling of guilt and shame that
you know has been kind ofinstilled in me since a very
young age.
My mother's very sick.
I deal with guilt and shame onthat all the time.

(51:41):
What I would like to tell yourlisteners is that, like, getting
help is like is self-care right?
Therapy is self-care.
Like if you're, if you'redehydrated and you need water,
then you're going to drink water.
You're not going to be like, oh, I don't need the water because
somebody tells me I don't needit.
Right, and you should look attherapy the same way.

(52:02):
Like if you are having a hardtime or a stressful time trying
to figure out where, why you'refeeling the way that you're
feeling, or what is happening orwhat's going on in your life
that's making you feel sodepressed, find a
trauma-informed therapist.
Not just any therapist,trauma-informed therapist,

(52:23):
because they understand at adifferent level than just a
regular therapist.
And I am literally reprocessingthese memories of what happened
to me to realize what steps hadbeen taken to make me
vulnerable.
I had to go back through thatrelationship, that very

(52:44):
inappropriate relationship, withmy 24-year-old instructor for
weeks and figure out why it wasso inappropriate.
It wasn't something that I justlike.
Woke up one day and I was likethat motherfucker right, like he
took advantage of me.
Yeah, it was weeks of like.
Who are the adults in your life,alicia?

(53:04):
Who are the people who shouldhave stepped in and told this
man that you were a child and heshouldn't be trying to have sex
with you?
Because I wasn't just failed byhim, I was failed by all of the
adults around that saw thisabusive behavior and allowed it
to happen and then treated melike it was my fault.
And that includes my own father, who told me I was a whore and

(53:25):
he had wasted his money helpingme get a black belt, paying for
my black belt because all I didwas use it to sleep my way with
my instructor.

Speaker 1 (53:32):
And there's the wound that probably left you open for
someone to be like that didmore damage my, my own dad
telling me that did more damagethan any physical abuse that any
of these men ever put methrough.

Speaker 2 (53:48):
I can tell you.
So it's therapy like EMDR talktherapy but really, if you can
and I do acknowledge that I amvery privileged to be able to
see a therapist every week- andwork through this on a regular
basis.
A lot of women are not allowedto do that.
If you want somewhere to startand you can't afford to, or you
don't have the insurance or youcan't find somebody, a good

(54:11):
place to start is reading acouple of books.
The Body Keeps Score is areally good one.
It helps you understand traumaand how it affects the body.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
And also.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
The Gift of Fear is another one.
It talks about how we are ashuman beings.
We have fear and it is a giftand we should use it to keep
ourselves safe.
But it also talks about verytraumatizing stories, so it can
be triggering a little bit, butit gives you another sense and
idea of what things like peoplego through and how they handle

(54:42):
it.
Just to kind of get you startedbecause like jumping into it
and being like here's all myboundaries, there's 57 is going
to be very rough.
Start small, start small.
Maybe you don't go getmargaritas with your friends
because you don't like having totake care of the one who always
gets drunk right.
Maybe start by saying no tothat or saying no to picking up

(55:03):
the friend's kid, right, don't,don't, I would say, don't start
with.
Like the big mountains, andthat's usually your family.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
Yeah, I always say practice with someone safe and
let them know you're practicingwith them, because the first
couple of times you do it it'sreally scary for some and it
gets so much easier.
But the first time you say noto someone when you're not used
to saying no, there's so muchguilt that follows it, Like you
got to get comfortable with thefeelings that come after and
they do go away, but it's scarythe first couple of times.
You definitely don't want tostart with your biggest problem

(55:31):
number one.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
Yeah.
And so just to add on that alittle bit, when you do start
setting these boundaries with,like your friends and your
family, who you have been makingtheir lives a lot easier by not
having boundaries, they aregoing to be like why have you
changed, what has happened?
And that is where having astrong sense of self, having

(55:54):
these boundaries written down,and also, when you write them
down, right, why that is yourboundary.
Why can't you pick up yourfriend's kid, you know, five
days a week?
Well, I can't because I can'tafford the gas, I don't have the
time and I'm having to leavework early.
That way, when you'rereiterating these boundaries,
you already know there's reasons.

(56:15):
You don't have to explain themto that person, but you are
going to have to remind yourselfover and over again, because
they are going to push.
These people are going to pushback, yeah, especially if
they're family.

Speaker 1 (56:27):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, cause well, families you put
this weird dynamic with families.
I find it like still when I gohome and a 41 year old woman,
but like you're you, you createroles within your family and
it's really hard to shift thoseroles.
Everyone's going to resist itfirst because you're changing
something that's pretty set instone, you know so and that's so
good.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
Yeah, my therapist does it best.
She says that, like your familyworks as like a circle right.
Everyone is moving in thiscircle and when you begin to set
boundaries, you step out ofthat circle and as you move, the
momentum from your family isgoing to try to pull you back
into that circle, because thatis what they are.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Yeah, shove you back into that role they're
comfortable with.

Speaker 2 (57:09):
Exactly.
And so if you just remember whyyou have these boundaries, what
they are for, and that you havethe ability to say no, you are
not wrong for saying no tosomething you're not comfortable
with.
You don't have time for youjust have to keep telling
yourself, you know, like justkeep swimming, just keep
swimming.

Speaker 1 (57:28):
Right, right.

Speaker 2 (57:29):
Just gotta keep swimming on it.

Speaker 1 (57:31):
Yeah, I always tell people to like frame them in
love too.
You know, like this, I'm doingthis because, like this is a way
you can support me and this ishow I can support our friendship
going forward, because I'mfeeling, you know, once you get
to the point where you'recomfortable saying these things,
like if you frame it and likehow you're trying to protect
your relationship, that's areally easy way to go about it
without like, like my, I wantour relationship to continue and

(57:54):
so I need this and I loveframing it that way.
There's one more question Well,probably one more than one, but
so for me, I I have childhoodtrauma, a lot of issues with my
dad.
I don't speak to him currentlyand haven't for several years,
just because that's somethingI've had to relive and process
and it's played.
It's one of the things that'splayed out over and over again.

(58:15):
I have had like multiplerelationships in my early years
and abandonment issues.
When you do finally decide toend something for an unhealthy
reason is something that I found.
Like whoa just hit me like abrick wall, like, yes, I'm
deciding to leave someone, butwhen they decide they're done
too, or when that is actuallycoming to an end there is
something that's like whoa whoa,whoa wait, you want to leave me

(58:36):
, or wait, whoa, whoa.
You're comfortable with this andsometimes that's that moment
where you rebound back and likereach out for something,
regardless of how unhealthy itis, and it's a really hard,
really confusing, odd feeling,but it's natural and for a lot
of people with childhood traumait's significant because that
came from someone, it's anabandonment wound from someone
that we felt shouldn't have beenabandoned.

(58:57):
So what's your perspective onthis?
As I've talked, mike, your earoff, sorry.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
Oh no, I completely, I'm like, I feel it.
I got the feels from it becauseit is true.
You know, it's like when you'rein high school and you have the
on again, off again boyfriendyou always feel more powerful
when you're the one who breaksit.
But when he breaks it, nomatter how toxic it is, you're
trying to go back.
You're like right.

Speaker 1 (59:17):
Because you're like you're not leaving me.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
I think for me it's conditioning Right, like you
have been conditioned to expectthis type of behavior and so the
moment that it changes again,it's that cycle.
And it can be a cycle of abuseto where it's like you want the
power and control to say I'mdone, and then they take it away

(59:40):
from you.
And it's almost like one time,like almost like they're taking
away your empowerment, they'retaking away your power to say no
.
Even if you started it, you'relike no, I'm done, right, like I
don't want, you're not in mylife anymore.
The moment that they say it,it's like no, I'm done Right,
Like I don't want, you're not inmy life anymore.
The moment that they say it it'slike wait.
You start to rethink and that'sconditioning.
It's perfectly normal.
I would say that if it becomesa point where it's affecting you

(01:00:01):
, to the point where, like youcan't get work done, it's
affecting your mental health todefinitely talk to a
professional.
I do not have the professionaltake on that, but for myself I
get this all the time.
I am currently not speaking tomy mother.
My mother is very ill, she hasGraves disease and she is very,
very cruel and she can'tremember that she's cruel.

(01:00:21):
So she said the meanest shityou can imagine and then the
next time I talked to her shejust repeats it.
So I have had to like set thatboundary and be like mom.
I literally can't talk to youbecause it affects my mental
health so much.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
And.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
I feel that guilt and the moment that she's like,
okay, fine, I'm done, my like,the little girl in me, the
little girl that wants my momgoes back mom, please, please.
I you know, I love you, I careabout you, please don't do this.
And I am currently talking withmy therapist literally tomorrow
about this happening and it is aset of conditioning, like, like

(01:00:57):
I said.
Also one thing about trauma,right, not only do you not
remember it, but you relive it,but you also relive it at the
age it happened.
So if you started feeling thissense like for me and my mother,
for example, for your listenersI started feeling this guilt
and shame, like my mom was myresponsibility at like six years
old.
So when she did this this wasjust happened last week, so this

(01:01:21):
is a great example when she waslike I'm done with you, I'm
over it, it wasn't a 35 year old, confident woman talking to her
.
It was a six year old justwanting her mom's attention,
just wanting her mom to say sheloves her and she's proud to her
.
It was a six-year-old justwanting her mom's attention,
just wanting her mom to say sheloves her and she's proud of her
, and that is something thathaving the knowledge that that
is what happening can just helpyou get through it.

(01:01:42):
But like I said I'm in therapyfor it, I'm in EMDR.
I'm having to reprocess all ofthis because that guilt and
shame is so strong that, likeeven talking about it now in my
body, I feel a pit in my stomach.

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
Yeah, me too.
Me too Just thinking about likerelating to my own stuff.
I'm like I don't know if yousaw my body posture just shrunk.
I'm like, yeah, I did too.

Speaker 2 (01:02:02):
Yeah, Like you know, I'm like fidgeting around
because I was clicking a pin.

Speaker 1 (01:02:06):
If you heard that earlier.
Sorry that was my anxiety, butit's so true.
This shit is real and that'swhy I started this podcast
because we need to talk about it.
We're grown ass women.
I'm 41.
I'm still dealing with thisshit.
I'm going to be dealing with ittill the day I probably die,
and it's normal and we need totalk about it more.
We need to talk about it withpeople we care about and trust

(01:02:28):
and create these safeenvironments, because that's how
we heal, and you know for yourlisteners.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
you're not alone, I can.
I can tell you firsthand.
As a female women empowermentinstructor, I have talked to
over 3000 women at this point,probably going closer to 4,000.
I stopped like counting, Um,and I have not met a woman who
doesn't have a story of sometype of sexual abuse to this day

(01:02:54):
, Like not one.
Also, there's a lot of men whohave their own sexual abuse that
they all tell me about too,because they feel like I'm a
safe space.
So we really are living asociety of victims.

Speaker 1 (01:03:06):
Oh yeah, and I think it's becoming evident, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:09):
Yeah, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:12):
I hear you, I hear you, I hear you.
Trauma is just an evil, evilthing that just fester sometimes
if you can't face it and andit's a process, it's a hard
process.
So you mentioned earlier,before we got on, she mentioned
she has a um workshop coming upis that right?

Speaker 2 (01:03:27):
I do, I have, um, I am do.
I am teaching my self-defensecourse at what we call a Rising
in Sacred Rage retreat put on bythe she Is Me global conference
community.
It's up in Washington.
You can find information on iton my website.
I'll be updating it today andon the sheismecom website, where

(01:03:48):
it is.
But we're getting together witha lot of women, right where it
is a.
But we're getting together witha lot of women.
We're figuring out ways tohandle our rage in a healthy way
.
Where we get to, you know,write letters to the people who
hurt us most and burn them.
At the end of my course, we'reall going to break a board,
right, yeah, with our very ownhands.
I think that that, for me, isone of the most empowering

(01:04:08):
moments of teaching is mostwomen that I teach have never
even thrown a punch, andwatching them see their hand go
through the board and thatempowered surprise of like wow,
I can do it is one of the bestmoments of my entire business.
So if you want more informationon it, it will be on my website
.
I'm updating it today, but it'salso on the sheismecom website.

(01:04:29):
Oh, I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
I think my the last guest.
I had her name's Terry Grail.
She runs like a nonprofit forum women's shelters for like sex
trafficking and domesticviolence.
They go in and they like makeshelters dramatic.
But she also works with the.
She is me um in some ways, soI'm like this is so cool.
You guys are all connected,yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
She is me, I will.
I can put you in contact withLisa too.
She's amazing, I would lovethat?

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
I would love that.
Um, so I always ask everybodywhat is your go-to self-care
when things are getting reallyhard, what's the one thing you
go to that, like, as you'd say,you're number one?

Speaker 2 (01:05:08):
Um, I'm a big tea drinker, so I have specific teas
that I like I.
They're expensive.
I buy like loose leaf and Imake my own blends now, but if
you don't want to go that far,right, there's the like.
If I'm feeling anxious or tiredor upset, I will usually make a
cup of tea.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
That kind of helps reset my brain.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
But once a week I do a mani pedi on myself, I do a
face mask, I do like a hair mask.
I spend about an hour and ahalf just pampering myself and I

(01:05:47):
do it consistently because Iknow that like I deserve that
time and I can't.
Ever since I had my son he'ssix now I can't like stand the
smell of uh, of um, like nailsalons, like it just makes me
nauseous since I got pregnant,so I bought all the stuff and I
do it all at home and I put onsome YouTube.
Right now I'm watching all theJustin Baldini and Blake Lively

(01:06:10):
stuff like my, my trash TV and Isoak my feet and, yeah, I put
on my masks and I just enjoythat time and I think
implementing it into yourroutine as like this is my time,
is really my go-to.
Like I know that I am worthbeing able to sit down for one

(01:06:31):
hour and give myself that kindof mental drainage and just have
my, my relaxed time.

Speaker 1 (01:06:39):
I love that.
You're worth it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
I'm worth it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:43):
I love it.
I love it.
Well, is there anything elsethat you think our listeners
should know?
Any tidbits you want to leavethem with?
I feel like you've said so manypowerful things today.
I can't.
I'm just.
I absolutely love it.
I'm so happy you came on here.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
I think the last thing I will leave your
listeners with is that knowledgeis your power.
So if you are feeling weak inany any aspect of your life,
start to research it.
If you don't like your job,start looking into what type of
jobs you want to do.
If you're not comfortable inyour relationship, start looking
into how you might get out ofthat relationship.
You might improve yourself tomake it better.

(01:07:18):
If you improve yourself andit's still not better, leave.
If there's any type of physicalviolence, walk away now.
Don't put yourself throughanything that, like any of your
other listeners, have gonethrough, right, or I've gone
through.
But really, knowledge is yourpower.
I'm a huge Harry Potter fan.
Go to the library, startlooking it up, right, hermione
Granger, that shit like.

(01:07:39):
Figure out what your next stepis, because options give you
power.
If you have the option to leave, if you have the option to
change jobs, if you have theoption of other friends, that is
where your power truly comesfrom Knowing that you are worth
more than the way you're beingtreated, the job you have or
what you're doing in that moment.
I love that beautiful advice.

Speaker 1 (01:08:02):
Thank you so much.
I appreciate that.
So we will put all of herinformation in the show notes so
you can access her website andlook up her workshops.
Have you ever thought abouttraining women to go out and do
this?
In the show notes so you canaccess her website and look up
her workshops?
Oh, here's that.
Have you ever thought abouttraining women to go out and do
this Like teach these kinds ofcourses for you, so that you're
not just like in California andworkshops?

Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
I have.
As a matter of fact, I amworking with Lisa Jimenez of the
she Is Me Global and we arecreating a facilitator.
I'm the co-creator of the Risingin Sacred Rage Ret'm the co
creator of the sheet of therising and sacred rage retreat,
and one of the things that wehave planned is a workshop for
how to teach women how to dothese, these retreats, so that
women can learn healthy ways.

(01:08:44):
As far as my specific business,I haven't, I've thought about
it and it's in my, like,long-term plans, but I'm going
to require that anybody teachingwhat I teach has a black belt,
so it's going to like limit whoI could have, because I think
that you need to have theunderstanding of how the body
works in a martial arts settingin order to teach women how to

(01:09:05):
defend themselves.
Like I know a palm strike works, because I have practiced a
palm strike for 30 years and itworked for me.
But bringing in like the everyaverage day woman, she would
need some consistent martialarts training before she could
kind of do what I do.
My business is very unique tome.

Speaker 1 (01:09:24):
I think any woman who is a black belt might right now
, though, who may have pursuedthat on their own, which I know
they're out there might beinterested in this stuff,
because they've probably youknow, they've probably felt the
same shit you did on some level.

Speaker 2 (01:09:40):
Absolutely, and if they are, they don't need to
come to me.
I learned the empowerment,self-defense model through the
National Women's.
Martial Arts Federationassociated with.
They teach you how to teachthis.
There are multiple differentways I this is not unique to me
specifically, I just use mystory but the National Women's
Martial Arts Federation createdthis curriculum 50 years ago, or
over 50 years ago, and it was agroup of martial artists.

(01:10:02):
So if you have any listenersthat are Black folks that want
to get involved, start there.
You don't need to come to meand do what I specifically teach
.
What we are trying to do isempower women to take their own
stories and then empower others.
My goal- is to empower 1 millionwomen to learn self-defense.
I think that's how we keep theworld safe.

Speaker 1 (01:10:23):
Oh my gosh, I love that.
That was great.
I, I hope, I hope you martialartists women take her up on
that Cause I will come to yourclasses.
That's so cool, I love it.
Okay, well, thank you so muchfor being here.
We're definitely going to haveto have you back sometime,
because I just feel like I'm notdone talking to you, but
absolutely there's so much Iknow I appreciate you so much,

(01:10:44):
thank you.
Thank you, I got to rememberhow to hang this thing up.