January 5, 2025 • 55 mins
In this episode of End of a Species, Jeff has a chat with Super Solid about Bulverism, a logical fallacy where someone decides to showcase their mind reading skills. We go over how this fallacy rears its ugly head in the debate world and what it says about the person that uses it.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jeff (00:09):
What up, Super Solid?
Super Solid (00:11):
Yo.
Jeff (00:12):
Yo. That's so funny. So it's on your live the other day.
Right? Oh, I can't see you, butit's on your live the other day.
And just the the quoting of MLK,hilarious. Hilarious. Should we
(00:32):
just play
Super Solid (00:33):
it? Yeah. I think we should play it.
Jeff (00:35):
Yeah. That's man. Man, listen.
Shaun (00:40):
Alright. Prove it. Apologize for what you said
about MLK.
Kedunkachud (00:44):
What I wait. I have to apologize for saying that we
should judge we should judgepeople based on character?
Shaun (00:51):
What did he say before that?
Kedunkachud (00:53):
I I don't remember the exact What
Shaun (00:54):
did he say directly after that?
Kedunkachud (00:58):
Dream?
Shaun (00:59):
What did
he say 2 weeks after? Dream? Ohmy god.
Super Solid (01:08):
What Martha the king said, judge people based on
the content of their characterand not the color of their skin.
What do you say directly beforethat? I have no idea. What did
you say directly out of that?Dream?
Jeff (01:26):
Yo. That's that's too funny.
Super Solid (01:29):
The first part is, like, why would you quote the
man without knowing any likeNothing. Without knowing where
the quote came from, without,like, knowing any of the speech.
Because later on, didn't we askhim what the name of the speech
was? And he couldn't remember?Or is that today?
Jeff (01:50):
Yeah. No. Well, I don't I don't know. I don't remember.
After dream that took me out.
Yeah. It completely took me out.I didn't know what to say. I was
like, I was like out of it. So,but to use a quote like that,
(02:11):
just to, like, prove a point,but not know the whole end.
Look, just so you know, foranybody listening, the point of
the conversation was to takeaccountability for racism. And
Du said, I'm a
Kedunkachud (02:26):
just quote MLK and not know what he actually said,
and then just quote him and say,dream?
Jeff (02:35):
Right. That's too much. That's that's too much. I was
laughing for the rest of the dayafter that. And I know you could
Super Solid (02:42):
I couldn't help it. So that was New Year's Eve.
Right? I went out with some somefellas from work.
Kedunkachud (02:50):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (02:51):
On the way there, I was listening to that live. I
was listening to that portion ofthe live on repeat because
because I I honestly, Jeff, I'mnot gonna hold you, man. I'm so
tired of people intuiting,refutations to to, like, racism.
(03:16):
It's like they vehementlydisagree with the existence of
racism, with the severity ofracism, and they do so without
having any knowledge base inracism at all. Right?
They have no idea what they'retalking about. They haven't
studied it at all, but they justknow that they're smarter than
you on this subject.
Jeff (03:39):
And I think I think for me, it's for any subject that's
annoying, but specifically forrace, like when you enter in the
conversation and the first thingout of your mouth is I'm right.
I don't know what you're talkingabout. I don't know what it is.
I'm looking at a thing and Ijust wanna be right.
Kedunkachud (03:59):
But
Super Solid (04:00):
just wanna be right.
Jeff (04:01):
But no matter what you show me, I'm still gonna I'm
still gonna, like, go againstthe tide of facts and just go,
like, I'm right anyway.
Super Solid (04:12):
It's irritating to no end. And I think the the
worst part of it is the, like,off bat, the assumption that
you're wrong. Right?
Kedunkachud (04:23):
And
Super Solid (04:23):
then the immediate, like, you're wrong and here's
why. Well, Slim, you you haven'tyou haven't proven me wrong.
Jeff (04:33):
Yeah. You haven't you haven't done the work.
Super Solid (04:35):
Yeah. Yeah. Show me your work. Because why are we
already on to, you know, mebeing indoctrinated or making
excuses or being a victim, whenwhen you you're like, right?
Like, you're wrong about mebeing wrong.
(04:56):
We gotta figure out what realityis first before we can just go.
Right? And that's that's one ofthe most annoying things.
Jeff (05:05):
This is a good segue. So I wanna say for anybody listening,
welcome to, the the new end ofthe species podcast. I'm Jeff,
and I'm here with Super Solid,my brother in arms. And today,
we're gonna talk about, we'rewe're talking about bulvarism
and and the example of howpeople use it, why it's a
(05:31):
fallacy, why it's annoying, allof those things. Like, all of
Super Solid (05:40):
why it makes me wanna pull my eyelashes out.
Jeff (05:43):
Yeah. All everything.
Super Solid (05:46):
Yeah.
Jeff (05:47):
And if you know me, if you know Solid, you'll see us
usually, as we're divesting fromTikTok, but you'll see us
usually on a TikTok live doingdebates. And, look, I'm not
gonna lie to you. When we havedebate topics, I think about
debate topics a lot. Like, whenI'm not on a live and I'm doing
(06:12):
something else, I'm thinkingthrough stuff. I'm writing.
I'm taking notes. I'm writingout arguments, because I really
just wanna know. Right? I findit interesting. And then I go
into a conversation, and afterhaving done all of this prework
and go through, like, a Socraticquestioning or laying out an
(06:34):
argument to hear someone go, youjust want free shit.
Super Solid (06:45):
To to hear somebody say, that's how it's always
been. That's just how it works.Mhmm.
Jeff (06:51):
It it's as if, like I'm I'm look. My my my number one
mission this year happy newyear, everybody. But my number
one mission this year is tonormalize certain in group, out
group dynamics that I think makesense. Academia is one of these
(07:12):
in group, out group dynamicsthat make sense. And to that
end, I'm going to continue thisdrumbeat.
You're gonna get tired of mesaying it, and I'm gonna keep
saying Bob in row 6 until peoplelisten to me and understand that
I'm dead ass serious when I saythat. Like when I say Bob and
Rose
Super Solid (07:31):
6 Bob and Rose 6.
Jeff (07:33):
So the concept of Bob and Rose 6 is this is like I it's in
my head, the way it, the way itshaped out was you watch late
night and you watch like Fallonor or Kimmel or Colbert, and
they're always interviewing.Like, you don't get on that show
unless you either have somethingto say, like you're an up and
coming comedian or you're likesomebody of note that just did
(07:56):
something or you're an actor andyou're you're trying to promote
a movie or or a singer. You gotan album or something like that.
But you're not, like, there justto shoot the shit. That's not
what you're what you're doingwhen you're when you're doing
this.
Super Solid (08:11):
You're there with a purpose.
Jeff (08:13):
And so I thought to myself when I'm when I'm talking to
these people on these lives, andI said, what if instead of,
like, hey, the new Deadpoolmovie's out, and we were gonna
interview Ryan Reynolds and HughJackman, but nah, forget that. I
just told him to go back home. Iwant to interview Bob and row 6.
(08:37):
Hey, Bob and row 6, come on downand tell us about how you went
to, like, the grocery storetoday, and you picked out
Super Solid (08:47):
a trip to the deli.
Jeff (08:49):
Yeah. How they had just the right amount of roast beef
in your sandwich today, player.It was Tell us
Super Solid (08:55):
folded it over real nice.
Jeff (08:57):
Tell us about how you're on there. Tell us about how you
looked at a Facebook meme, andnow you know everything there is
to know about, socialism. Thankyou. That's that's what we need.
Right?
And I feel when when, whenthere's a an asymmetrical effort
(09:20):
put into a conversation, that'swhere that's where a lot of the
frustration comes in because,like, you're talking to somebody
who didn't think of this stuff.And if they were honest about
them not thinking about it andsay, hey. You know what? I never
I never thought about that. Letme let me come back.
Let me read. Let me do this. Letme do that. But, no, that's not
(09:43):
what they do. We get no.
No. They dig
Super Solid (09:49):
in. They dig their heels in, and it's personal
attack time.
Jeff (09:56):
Yeah.
Super Solid (09:57):
Right.
Jeff (09:59):
And I call like, you actually pointed out the term
bulvarism to me, and I had neverheard of it. So I was happy to
learn it.
Super Solid (10:08):
Right.
Jeff (10:09):
Which, by the way, don't do that with no ops. Don't point
out no new info to them. I knowwhat it is.
Super Solid (10:21):
Yeah. You tell a Kentucky about something new.
They're an expert.
Jeff (10:27):
I know what it is. What is it? I'm not tell I'm not playing
your game.
Super Solid (10:31):
I'm not playing your mind games.
Jeff (10:35):
This is this is a quiz show or what?
Super Solid (10:39):
I know what it is. What is it? I'm not I don't have
to answer your question. Go lookit up.
Jeff (10:46):
Go do your own research.
Super Solid (10:48):
I don't think you know what it is.
Jeff (10:51):
But when it but when when when I'm having a conversation
and I lay out a thing andsomebody just says, do I call it
the mind reading fallacy?Somebody goes, you just don't
like thing x. You just you justlazy, and you don't wanna do
nothing under this thing. And Igo, oh, so you went into my
(11:17):
mind. Right?
You you scooped out part of mythoughts and you read them out
loud. So you a mind reader.That's awesome. I love that. You
may have seen me sometimes.
Like, I'll I'll I'll write 8digits. Like, I actually do it
every time. I write 8 randomdigits into my notes app, and
I'm like, tell me what what 8digits are in my notes app since
(11:39):
you know what I'm thinking.
Super Solid (11:42):
Can I ask you a question about that? Yeah. How
many times have have they hasanyone ever been really close
and then and and you were, like,a little scared, like, a little
uh-oh?
Jeff (11:54):
Nah. Solid. Nobody's ever even tried it.
Super Solid (11:58):
Of course not. Because they know better. Right?
Jeff (11:59):
They haven't even made an attempt at a guess. Not even
close. And, like, I know I'mbeing snarky when I do it. I'm
I'm 100% being a jerk. Mhmm.
But at the same time, like, ithappened today. It happened
today on on your on your joint,like, where you were talking
where we were talking to the onedude about the the reparations
(12:21):
thing. And we're just having athought experiment. And he goes,
you're up here. After we havethe whole conversation, we get
to the part where it's like,okay, your thing don't make
sense.
You just begging for free money.What?
Super Solid (12:39):
What do you mean I'm begging for free money? It's
a thought experiment. To be tolike, to for context y'all,
sometimes I do a live that posesa hypothetical or the
hypothetical. If and that if isdoing so much heavy lifting, if
(13:00):
reparations were to end racism,if me and I I cannot stress this
enough. If means under to getlike, under the conditions.
Right? If under the conditionsthat racism or excuse me, that,
reparations ended racism, wouldyou then support reparations?
(13:21):
And the reason why I came upwith that is because it's kind
of a double bind for bigots.
Jeff (13:26):
Yeah.
Super Solid (13:26):
Because they have to choose between supporting
black people and supportingblack people, and they don't
wanna do either one of them.It's like, wait a minute. Wait a
minute.
Jeff (13:37):
It's the ultimate trolley problem. On one end, you're
saving a black person. On theother end, you're saving a black
per which do you pull?
Super Solid (13:45):
Right. Which which one do you oh, no. And so so
it's it, that's the reason why Icame up with it. But, and the
reason why, like, I came acrossthe idea of Bolvarism in the
first place was because of thatexact dynamic. Right?
Just the sheer inability of,like, white people to be to,
(14:07):
like, participate in anymeaningful way in conversations
about race and racism.
Jeff (14:13):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (14:13):
Right? But I had no idea, Jeff. Jeff, I had no idea.
Kedunkachud (14:22):
Like, I had no idea that
Super Solid (14:23):
it would be that difficult for them.
Jeff (14:26):
That we get to that level.
Super Solid (14:28):
Yeah. I didn't I didn't pick up on the fact like,
it it Jeff, how long we've beendoing this? We like, you and I
known each other for at least ayear. Right?
Jeff (14:35):
A little yeah. A year or more. Yeah.
Super Solid (14:38):
Okay. So I remember sitting in a Walmart parking lot
when we did the the pterodactylfallacy. Kitchen razor. Mhmm.
Right?
Even then people were usingthese genetic fallacies. You
know, basically, just sayingbecause this idea comes from
(15:01):
this source, the idea must bewrong. Right?
Jeff (15:04):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (15:05):
But I never picked up on how that that, ad hominem
is assumed. Right? Like, theassumption of wrongness is there
and they never talk about it,and then they they immediately
skip past it and go on to the tothe follow-up. Yeah. And so I
(15:28):
think on some level, maybe on avisceral level, I'm saying,
like, okay.
He is just assuming I'm wrong.But instead of debating against
that and saying, hey. No. Comeback and prove me wrong. I end
up getting in the weeds about,the assumptions they're making
themselves or the ad hominemitself.
(15:49):
Right?
Jeff (15:50):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (15:51):
Let me ask you the like, are you like me? Have you
have you been able to unseebulvarism?
Jeff (16:01):
No. I actually I actually told you that you shallow held
me with that because normallynormally when it like, when I
see that kind of stuff and youknow where I see it the most is
something that we don't talkabout is when you're presenting
a source and somebody goes, hey.Where did you what source are
(16:22):
you using? And you're like, the,the, associated press. That's a
liberal blah blah blah blahblah.
Super Solid (16:31):
Somebody told me the other day that the FBI was
liberal.
Jeff (16:35):
Yeah. Come on. So so, you know, we're using FBI dot gov.
Those liberals, those leftylefties, they they killed all
them people on suspicion to be aMarxist, but they're super
lefty. You didn't know that?
Come on now.
Super Solid (16:55):
The the notoriously liberal Federal Bureau of
Investigation. You mean thepeople that weren't, allowed to
investigate sex crimes in the in
Kedunkachud (17:06):
the eighties?
Super Solid (17:07):
Those guys? You mean the people who sent, death
threats to to Martin LutherKing? Those that FBI? Okay.
Jeff (17:20):
Alright. Super leftist. 100%.
Super Solid (17:23):
Oh, yeah. Straight commies.
Jeff (17:26):
But when but now I see it over and over and over, like,
especially with men dealing withwomen. Like, they'll go up. This
is this is why you ain't got aman. You just somebody Yeah.
Somebody divorced you and askedwhat.
And it's like, yo, could youjust, like, address
Super Solid (17:48):
Could you just address the argument, please?
Right. Who'd be wrong before youstart talking about why I'm
wrong?
Jeff (17:55):
Yeah. Like, show like, I see conversations about, like,
the gender the the the genderpay gap, and a source will pop
out, and another source will popout, and then another source
will pop out to where where nowwe're sea lining. Now we're
just, like, asking for, like,you wanna pull every paycheck in
the world and compare it toevery other paycheck in the
(18:17):
world 1 by 1 as opposed to justlooking at the studies. And then
it's this is why y'all wannahave abortions because you wanna
like, what? Time out.
Wait. Rewind. Where did thatcome from?
Super Solid (18:35):
How did we get to abortions?
Jeff (18:37):
Like, like we were just, we were just chilling on
sources. And now you assumingthere's a whole group of women's
motivation for talking aboutit's not that they wanna work
and get like the equal wage. Andeven that may not even be true.
Like they could all beindependently wealthy and they
just, they just want informationabout a thing, which is
(19:00):
perfectly fine. Right?
I'm curious about a bunch ofshit that got nothing to do with
me. Right? And and in that case,my motivation is just I'm
curious and nosy, and I wannaknow shit. That's it.
Kedunkachud (19:14):
Right.
Jeff (19:15):
But then I get into the conversation, and the minute it
gets a little uncomfortable, youjust want abortion. Like, what
the like, get out
Super Solid (19:23):
of here. Going on?
Jeff (19:24):
I do not understand it. I don't know. Like, there was a a
a dude I should look him up. Hehe's, it's his daughter's TikTok
account, but he used to be a spyfor, like, the CIA or the NSA or
something. He used to do spywork.
(19:46):
And she asked him, what is itthat's gonna cause the fall of
society? And my man sayssophistry. And Boverism is a
form of sophistry. It really is.It's a form of, like, I don't
want to engage the argumentdirectly.
So instead, I'm just gonna saythe person thinks that way
(20:08):
because and it's just you know,to me, it's just one of, like,
what
Super Solid (20:17):
poetic.
Jeff (20:19):
It it's one of, like, a 1000 lazy habits that people
that get into these debateshave. And, sure, we could talk
about the people on TikTok.They're just like, and they
don't know what they're doing.But this happens in congress. It
happens on the 24 hour newscycle.
(20:40):
This should be happening on thestreet. Like, whenever, like and
look, audience, you're not goingto be able to unsee this now.
When you go and and thank thankgoodness we're doing this
recording after the holidays.Because if I would if this was
October and we were saying thisshit, and then you go to
Thanksgiving dinner, you you'resaying you in your twenties, and
(21:05):
you only saying that because youhaven't lived yet.
Super Solid (21:08):
You ain't lived yet.
Jeff (21:09):
Yeah. Then you're like, oh, no. Listen to this. Listen
listen to this, episode. You'redoing.
Can you address the argument? Wewould be ruining so many
thanksgiving and Christmasdinners.
Super Solid (21:21):
Listen. We might still for years to come. Let's
hope. Let's one can only hopethat we ruin your thanksgiving.
You know?
Jeff (21:28):
Yeah. Absolutely. Or or encourage people to stop talking
about certain things at theThanksgiving table.
Super Solid (21:37):
So what is the remedy? Like, what how do we
remedy, though?
Jeff (21:43):
Oh, that's, I was about to say that's easy, but that's so
dismissive. Don't do that, Jeff.There are a couple yes. It's not
actually easy because it's it'sa habit that you have to have. I
think one of the one of thebiggest effects that has that
makes it effective is that ittalks to your ego.
(22:08):
Right? Like so for example, me,I'm an atheist. I don't every
now and again, I'll engage inthe in atheism debates. And when
you and you'll find somebody whodoesn't wanna talk about the
thing that that you wanna talkabout. And instead, they'll say,
you're just afraid of this god,or you're just mad at this god.
(22:30):
And for someone who's like me,who I'm like, the fiction guy?
No. There's a there's this thingin your in your stomach that
you're like, did you just what'dyou just say to me? And you
wanna talk about that.
Super Solid (22:43):
Right.
Jeff (22:44):
Like, the conversation part is over. You just wanna
talk about that. When it's likewhen we talk about racism,
somebody you just want freemoney, and you're sitting in a
nice house, and you got a nicejob. But mind you, typically,
like, you look like us and youdidn't just blue chip your way
into that.
Super Solid (23:03):
Right.
Jeff (23:04):
Like, I didn't just go, hey, my my my my dad and my
dad's dad and my dad's dad'sdad. Like, you you worked your
ass off to get where you at. Andnow somebody's like, you just
want free money. And you hearthat? And you're like, wait a
minute.
Super Solid (23:16):
It's a rap. It's a rap. That's all I'm a be able to
talk about. Mhmm.
Jeff (23:21):
Like, what was what was I saying about the 19 fifties and
Jim Crow? Nah. Right. You're nottalking about that no more. We
talk about my house.
Right? And I've fallen for it.
Super Solid (23:31):
Right. Oh, yeah.
Jeff (23:33):
Me too. We all have. But I think the best way to handle
that and I think I'm I'mactually glad you brought it up.
The best way to handle that isto just sidestep it. Accept it.
Just be like, yeah. You'reright. But that doesn't change
this argument.
Super Solid (23:53):
Right.
Jeff (23:54):
Like, cool. Cool. Fine. I want free money. But and you
know what?
You might
Super Solid (23:58):
have to do if we just say prove me if we just
repeat it, prove me wrong overand over again with that.
Jeff (24:04):
You know, that can be a like, okay. That can be
effective. And I've seen somepeople do this, and it works
where, like, let's say I ask youa question. The other day, I had
somebody and, you know, I I Ifollow in your footsteps
sometimes with these with thesetopics because I like I like the
ones that that put in a put in apoint. And so I have a this
(24:27):
topic that goes, all migrantsare pro American.
Super Solid (24:34):
Mhmm.
Jeff (24:35):
And it piques the interest. But the and and, you
know, the exercise here issomebody's gonna say something
negative about migrants, and I'mgonna say, well, that's just
following in the great Americantradition of of thing that they
did. Right? And so, like, youknow, saying that is is great.
Cool.
(24:55):
But I'm not being lazy about it.I'm still gonna follow in the in
the full dialectic to itsconclusion. And so I had a guy
who was talking about peoplecoming here illegally. And so we
got to the point where I'masking him, are treaties legal?
Super Solid (25:17):
Right. Are treaties yeah. Treaty laws. Yeah.
Jeff (25:21):
And he don't wanna say yes.
Super Solid (25:24):
Of course.
Jeff (25:24):
He wants to he wants to hem and haw. Like, come on. It's
a treaty. You know a treaty islegal. Like, that's a law.
If it's not, then what the hellare we signing it for?
Super Solid (25:36):
Yeah.
Jeff (25:38):
So what
Super Solid (25:38):
At the very least, it should be legal legally
binding. Right?
Jeff (25:41):
Yeah. So every time he didn't answer the question, I
just said, I'm just gonna keepasking until you until you
answer my question. And we wentfor a full 10 minutes of me. Are
treaties legal? Well, there'salright.
No. No. That's cool. Ourtreaties legal, though. So in
(26:01):
your case, where it's like proveme wrong, prove me wrong, like,
you get into this feedback loopwhere you're you're basically
telling the person until youengage, you're just gonna hear
the same thing over and overagain.
Super Solid (26:15):
Right.
Jeff (26:16):
So that that can be
Super Solid (26:17):
a Wait. Hold on. He went a full 10 minutes without
crashing out?
Jeff (26:22):
This particular I'm gonna show you the clip later on. And
this particular dude, he wasn'tgonna crash out. Like, the the
crash out he was gonna do withslurs. Right?
Super Solid (26:30):
Oh, wow. Yeah.
Jeff (26:31):
That's the crash out that he was gonna, he wasn't gonna
start screaming and yelling. He,it, it took a long, I mean,
credit to him with, you know,I'm, I'm not a I'm I'm pretty in
your face with it when when Isee somebody in my side. So
credit to him. He did he took itlike a champ, but he still
(26:52):
wasn't engaging. And that's thepart where you start getting
into these things where I'm justgonna keep asking you the
question until you engage.
All that other stuff you'redoing is just delaying the
inevitable because we're on mypart. Yeah. But the the the
other thing I encourage peopleto do and I like to do is start
(27:14):
with, specifically, what is thepoint of that work? What's the
point that we're disagreeingabout? Because if you clean that
up, everything around that isnice for, like and, like, that
WWE entertaining where wherewhere we're joking with each
other stuff.
(27:34):
Yeah. But if I'm saying to you,like, you know, there's some
moral question that we wannaanswer. Right? So that would be,
like, for an abortionconversation or or something
about xenophobia and how itmoves in society, and we're
(27:56):
talking about immigration.There's going to be a point
where somebody's making a claim.
What and if it's me, then I'mfocused on that claim. That's
all I wanna know about is thespecific claim I just made and
how it relates to the argument.And how can I foundationally,
like, say, okay, this claim isthis? But if that's not like, if
(28:21):
you're distracting from that,the north star that I have is
always gonna be, what are wetalking about? And if we shift
it from that, let's just bringit back.
Right? Right.
Super Solid (28:35):
What's what's on the background? AKA, what are
the words that I have put herespecifically for us to look at
so that we remember what thetopic is in the first place?
Jeff (28:46):
Exactly that. Exactly that. And you know what?
Sometimes when you really, like,start going down a rabbit hole,
when you come back to the topic,I'll even say to some people,
like, look. You went you did allof that, and we didn't get no,
(29:06):
we didn't get an inch closer toyou proving that the thing that
you wanted to say.
Super Solid (29:12):
Exactly.
Jeff (29:12):
Not, not, not like we didn't take a step in that
direction. We're, we're talkingabout this other thing now Mhmm.
And we could have been talkingabout the thing you wanted to
say, and that's crazy to me thatwe not. Like, how do we get to
that point? Yeah.
You know? So What are the most,
Super Solid (29:33):
frustrating things about debating Bob and row 6, I
think, in the world is all thewasted time.
Jeff (29:43):
Yeah. Yeah. There's layers of it, though. Because alright.
If I'm talking to you and thensomebody's on deck.
Right? And you're making anargument about whatever. The
(30:04):
person that comes in generally,typically speaking, the next
person that comes that that isgonna have a conversation, I I
like them to start from thebeginning of their the whatever
argument they're gonna make. Idon't like to staple. I I call
it stapling the last person'sargument to your forehead.
I don't like doing that becausethere's going to there are gonna
(30:25):
be parts of it that people aregonna miss. But if you've been
sitting there waiting, and weand I just like, I've seen you
give people a class on what isthe history and the material
analysis
Kedunkachud (30:45):
Right.
Jeff (30:46):
Of the last 100 years of race in this country. Then the
next person starts off likethey've they they didn't hit
none of that. They their theirtheir joint was on mute for that
whole time, and we gotta startover.
Super Solid (31:03):
Mhmm. When I know they've been watching. That's
the worst part.
Jeff (31:08):
Yeah.
Super Solid (31:08):
I just thought I was been sitting here looking at
you watching, so I didn't evenhear what I explained.
Jeff (31:14):
Because they write a comment like that person's point
didn't make no sense. Oh, youyou heard that point.
Super Solid (31:20):
So you heard that? You you listening. Right.
Jeff (31:23):
Why are we starting over?
Super Solid (31:25):
Why are we starting from scratch? Yeah.
Jeff (31:27):
I've seen some of our mutuals. Like, I don't like
talking about politicians afteran election because the thing is
done. But people still talk,like, hey. Why did you vote for
this person? Why did you votefor that person?
Mhmm. I've seen some of ourmutuals have 5 conversations in
a row. And in all of theconversations, they have to
start off by explaining what atariff is. And I'm gonna tell
(31:53):
you this. This is the unspokenthing about tariffs.
I'm gonna say it, and I'm notgonna take it back. Tariffs are
boring. Boring. I don't knowthat there's a thing in
economics that you could talkabout this more boring than a
tariff. Like, it's boring forthe
Super Solid (32:21):
Price ceilings? No. No. Mm-mm.
Jeff (32:28):
Because at least with price ceilings, you you get into
a point where it's like,alright. Whew.
Super Solid (32:33):
No more gouging. Because there's an end to it.
Right?
Jeff (32:36):
Yeah. But, like, when there's a tariff, it's it's
boring to the person paying thetariff. It's boring to do the
argument about the tariff. Whenyou get to it, like a targeted
tariff, everything else isspeculation like, Hey, are they
gonna bring jobs back?Everything about a tariff is
boring.
Right. But there's nothing moreboring than just explaining what
(32:58):
a tariff is. Right. And havingto do that 5 times in a row is
outrageous to me. I don't knowhow somebody could do that and
not become a supervillain thatday.
Super Solid (33:16):
So then, like because there are times when
I'll just say, hey. Listen. No.I talked about this with the
last guy. We've we alreadytalked about this.
You know? Mhmm. Because let'ssay I'm I'm a I'm a college
professor, and I'm sitting inthe middle of my, you know, of
my lesson. And then somebodybust in the classroom in the
(33:36):
middle of the class. Excuse me.
And says, sorry, I'm late. Won'tyou go over all the shit you
just went over again? Right? Myman's gonna say, get out. Mhmm.
Why are you here? But for somereason, we'll start alive and
(33:56):
and you know what I mean? Forthe brand new kid in the class
or the guy that was late to theclass, we'll repeat the same
thing over and over again. Startfrom scratch. Start from
scratch.
Yeah. To exercise in futility.It's sisophisian.
Jeff (34:11):
And I'll tell you this. I will give somebody, like, the
the opening premise. Like, whenI do the when I talk about,
like, the the immigrate, the themigrants are all migrants are
pro American.
Super Solid (34:24):
Yeah.
Jeff (34:24):
There's a boilerplate sentence. I just say all
migrants exhibit the culture,traditions, and values of the
United States. Boom. So then wecan you get you pick one of
those and you pick at it, or yougive me an argument based on
whatever. But I don't wanna haveto tell you, hey, what's
culture?
What are values? What what is atradition? If I have to do that
(34:49):
every time, this is where thebob and row 6 of it comes in, is
you have people who don't knowthis stuff, but they really
wanna talk about it. And maybeyou shouldn't. Maybe what you
need to do
Super Solid (35:06):
Maybe you should not talk
Jeff (35:08):
about it. At least not in this forum. Right? If we're
having a conversation where alot of people are watching and
there's people who wanna learnabout this stuff and they want
us maybe there are even peoplewho are like, hey, I wanna get
my argument stronger. But youwanna get your argument stronger
against the strongest version ofthat argument.
(35:30):
You don't wanna get it strongeragainst, like, you know,
somebody who doesn't know thebasics. So it's a disservice
even to to, like, an audiencethat's watching. Right. And it's
a disservice to the personthat's engaging in that
conversation without knowingstuff because you're gonna look
(35:50):
dumber than you are. Right?
Like, if I walked into like, Ialways use CERN as an example.
But if I walked into CERN rightnow and I had a conversation
about, you know, quantumparticles of any kind, whoever's
sitting in there is gonna walkcircles around me. Yeah. I don't
that's not what I do. I don'tknow anything about that.
(36:12):
Now is it possible that I could,like, buckle down and start
studying and and probably not.Like, I'm probably not gonna be
an expert in quantum physicsanytime in my life. But, you
know, maybe I'll pick up somethings and not look dumb. I'll
know about, like, hey. Maybe Ishouldn't who I not to talk to.
(36:32):
But for people who don't knowanything, and you give you give
them the most basic question.What hey. Here's a callback.
What did he say right afterthat?
Super Solid (36:47):
Right.
Jeff (36:48):
And the answer is dream.
Super Solid (36:50):
Dream? I don't even think it's that complex because
you went straight to CERN, and Ido this too. I I I go to, like,
these really complex professionswhen I try to do that analogy.
It's not a good idea to arguewith the cashier at books a
million. You know what you knowwhat I mean?
(37:13):
About how to do their job.
Jeff (37:15):
Yeah. You
Super Solid (37:16):
know what I'm saying? If you've never worked
at Books A Mill you if you'venever worked at, you know, you
don't have access to theirinventories, to their system.
You don't know what books arethere, what books aren't there.
Right? But you wanna steady tellthem how to find the book, that
you're looking for, that youcan't find in the first place.
Jeff (37:37):
I don't think the staggered close is really the
the most safe way to close yourstore.
Super Solid (37:43):
You see what I'm saying? What's your name again?
Tell me. Right. Like, you youargue with people without having
any knowledge base in what youarguing about in the first place
is at at You want
Jeff (37:57):
to eat fries for 3 and a half minutes? Blood? The whole
basket of fries?
Super Solid (38:04):
The whole thing? And a half minutes? You've gotta
leave it in there for at least20.
Jeff (38:10):
I could do it in 3.
Super Solid (38:14):
Oh oh, so you like soggy frozen? Oh, okay. No salt.
What you put
Jeff (38:21):
salt on there for?
Super Solid (38:23):
And that's what a kadunkatrade really is. A
kadunkatrade is really theepitome of Dunning Kruger. Yes.
The a kadunkatrade is themanifestation of Dunning Kruger.
Jeff (38:39):
Absolutely. Yeah.
Super Solid (38:40):
Yes. That's what I'm saying. Chud. It's a
kadunkajud.
Jeff (38:45):
Kadunkajud. Yeah. Super Dunning Kruger.
Super Solid (38:50):
Yeah. And cause it's like my confidence is going
to make me right. You know,
Jeff (38:55):
and the bulbarism is just a coping or a defense mechanism
for when you like, you havethese shells up like, Hey, I got
my confidence. I got my, myinsults. I got my slurs. And
when all of that is being pulledapart and you bought this like,
Hey, mask is about to come off.The is the last thing.
(39:19):
Like, but you're just sayingthat because you because you
just generally mad. You unhappy.
Super Solid (39:25):
Second last line of defense. The first line of
defense is the n word.
Jeff (39:29):
Yeah. Mhmm.
Kedunkachud (39:30):
Or that that's the last one.
Jeff (39:32):
Yeah. The slurs is the is the is the very last peel of
wall before you get into thecity. Right? That's where
Super Solid (39:39):
you pull the you pull the, pull the rip cord. Oh,
I really am though. So yeah.Really. That's what we gotta do
it on a daily basis, man.
Jeff (39:57):
I'm excited about I'm excited about being on YouTube.
I'm excited about being back in,in, like, podcast land.
Super Solid (40:08):
Yeah.
Jeff (40:11):
I I cannot I, like, I enjoy being on TikTok lives. I
enjoy, like, havingconversations. I don't know that
the trade off, for me anyway,the trade off of having a
conversation with the amount ofand you said, like, wasted time,
(40:34):
but just the bulk of wastedwords, the waste that you it's
almost like you're diggingthrough a a a mountain of
haystacks, and then you get 1 1or 2 worthwhile needles where
you're like, oh, this is thiswas super satisfying. Hey. We we
made progress here.
Right?
Super Solid (40:53):
Right.
Jeff (40:54):
And I don't and the further that that we you know,
that the that that app goes, themore bills of hay are being
added, and the more needles arebeing taken away. And I think
for me, it's gotten to a pointwhere I'm super excited about
(41:14):
being on YouTube because on thisplatform right now, right, you
and I are having thisconversation. Right? We're going
to get to a point where thereare going to be others of our
mutuals that are gonna join ushere and have conversations. And
there are topics that we thatwe're gonna get to talk about
that we don't normally get to.
And we're we're going to be ableto share information that we
(41:37):
don't normally get to. But we'realso going to be able to curate
like, I wanna hear fromdissenting voices. And not just,
like, dissenting voices among,like, the people that I fully
disagree with, but even amongstus. Like, we don't all agree on
stuff, and there are going to beopportunities for us to debate
things and not just politicalthings. Right?
(42:01):
We're going to be able to docommentary on pop culture, on
society, video games, likeanything that it is that makes
you move in a certain way.
Super Solid (42:17):
Right.
Jeff (42:18):
I wanna be able to to talk about it. I wanna be able to
speak to it. I wanna be able to,to have discourse around it and
entertain people around it andjoke around about it without the
the specter of, having a peoplewho don't know what they're
(42:38):
talking about entering theconversation. Be an app that is
perfectly okay allowing all theslurring and, and weird behavior
while punishing what itperceives as some other stuff.
(43:00):
Right?
Like, we we've all seen wheresomebody is on mute and they're
on a panel, and all of a sudden,they disappear and we find out,
hey. They got banned
Super Solid (43:10):
for a week.
Jeff (43:12):
Yeah. And they didn't say nothing.
Super Solid (43:16):
Yeah. And then on real time.
Kedunkachud (43:19):
Mhmm. And
Jeff (43:20):
then on top of
Kedunkachud (43:21):
all that
Super Solid (43:21):
I think it comes from, like, they might be in
another space, and then they getreported there, and then TikTok
just lags so hard that theydon't get reported until they
get to the Maybe. Space. Buteither way, you shouldn't have
let that slide. Like, you youwaited this long. Why why you
know?
But also, like, no Do
Jeff (43:41):
you know statute of limitations?
Super Solid (43:44):
Right. The will will come up, say the shit to
you. They will come up on yourin your space. The other day,
the the the last banana I got,it was some good Dunkin' Chuds
calling me the n word, tellingme to do self harm to myself,
and they got they got off scotfree. But because they dropped
(44:04):
down and then reported me for itwithout even vetting it at all,
TikTok just said, we're we'regonna ban you.
It's like, no. So let go afterthose people who actually said
the thing.
Jeff (44:16):
Yeah.
Super Solid (44:17):
You know? If there's no there's there's no
way around it. You know? BecauseTikTok has every resource
available to refine thereporting process, give creators
a way to kind of, you know,voice, you know, plead their
(44:39):
case. And they just they haven'tdone it yet, which means they
they don't care.
They don't want to because theywould have done it already. You
know?
Jeff (44:50):
I I wanna here's something I wanna do before we we close
out.
Super Solid (44:55):
Yeah.
Jeff (44:56):
And that is let me open up a new window here. I wanna talk
about how you can support theseefforts. I think that's
important. And I'll call itshilling, but it's also you
know, we're moving platforms. Sowe're going to be somewhere
(45:19):
where we're not, like, gettingtiny dineys or whatever.
Super Solid (45:24):
Right.
Jeff (45:26):
And, you know, it is a hobby, but it's also labor.
Right? So we wanna we wanna giveeverybody an opportunity to
support. And I have thisdriving, like, philosophy that
I've always felt weird aboutpeople just, I don't know,
(45:49):
giving me some form form ofmonetary support for a an
animation or for nothing. Right?
So, for starters, I wannahighlight the fact that you have
merch, right, on your, on yourwebsite. And
Kedunkachud (46:10):
I Yeah.
Jeff (46:12):
And end of a species has merch that you can and and I
think that's the to me, that'sthe best way to support the
platform.
Super Solid (46:19):
Yeah. Absolutely. If you go to my website, 4 tpbuy
solid.com, there's all types ofmerchandise on there. I got
throw pillows. I got coffeemugs, prints, like canvas
prints.
I have, athleisure wear,hoodies. The people really go
(46:43):
for the hoodies. I don't knowwhat it it might be the season.
Who knows? We'll see how itturns out in the summer.
We'll see how people act in thesummertime. But but the hoodies
are, the people love thehoodies. They've been buying
them up. So yeah. And that's fortpbuy solid dot com.
It's one of the, my main sourcesof side revenue here. Oh, there
(47:08):
we are there. Also, I got a linkto the RSS feed for the pod.
Right? Right now, that'sabsolutely free.
Kedunkachud (47:17):
Okay?
Super Solid (47:18):
Oh, see. You see there? Look at the the for your
neighbor athleisure wear. Lookat that. Mhmm.
That's pretty. I like it.
Jeff (47:26):
And and you have, like, inclusive sizes.
Super Solid (47:30):
Yes. We are size inclusive. We're gender
inclusive. You know, you can getyou, if you scroll up oh, never
mind. If you
Jeff (47:39):
Let me bring it up.
Super Solid (47:40):
There's a non Biscay hoodie. 1 of the one of
my sign on tags and sign offtags is I'll say I'll talk to
everybody. I'll say, hey,broskis, siskis, and non Biscis.
And I think some of the nonbinary homies got a kick out of
that, so I went ahead and madethem a little non Biscay hoodie.
Jeff (48:00):
Non Biscay is I like that. I've actually never heard you
say that, but I but I like thata lot.
Super Solid (48:06):
Yeah. You say you got your broskis, you got your
siskeis, and you got your nonbiskeis. We got the black joy
hoodie. That flannel thatflannel, the looks are deceiving
because once you look at theback of that flannel, it's a
whole it's a whole thing. Right?
Jeff (48:22):
They're you know, that's that's that's what it is. Yeah.
I like that. No. That thatdesign is pretty cool.
Super Solid (48:30):
Yeah. It's what I mean, it's a it's a labor of
love. I I grew up quite poor,and so I I wasn't really able to
dress as well as I wanted to. Sonow it's just really important
to me that, you know, I'm welldressed. I'm a large I'm a large
guy, and so, I want I havetrouble finding inclusive sizes,
(48:57):
so I just tried to make surethat I had something that I felt
like I would be okay wearingthat also Mhmm.
You could wear. And if you'redifferently sized, then all the
better. You know?
Jeff (49:09):
Absolutely. And on the end of a species size, there's also
merch.
Super Solid (49:14):
I'll take that. I'll look at
Jeff (49:16):
that. Like It's
Super Solid (49:17):
so it's so clean. Like, your your, like, the just
the layout is so crisp. It'sjust really pleasant to look at.
Jeff (49:33):
Yeah. I didn't do it. I can't pay no credit for that.
This is just how it how it, howit lined up. But I think if I
had to highlight 1 right?
If I had to highlight 1, itwould definitely be the, the
intellect intellectual violenceline. And that's strictly
(49:56):
because, although the debatingon YouTube is going to be less
than it was. Right?
Super Solid (50:04):
Right.
Jeff (50:06):
We are in a space now where the ideas are the
violence. Right?
Super Solid (50:13):
Right.
Jeff (50:13):
The ideas are the the revolution. So, it for me,
intellectual violence is is alike, a term that I've wanted to
normalize for a long timebecause it just shows that, hey,
if you if your if your ideas aregood and you're willing to
(50:35):
defend them and you're willingto, like, articulate them in a
specific way, then you're goingto you're going to do well.
Right? Yeah. And I would beremiss if I didn't also
highlight debate Dexter, whichby the way, that's the first
shirt my wife got was the debateDexter.
Super Solid (50:57):
And I'm sure the debate Dexter, please. Because
that that thing I like all Ilike the marshmallow brain junk.
Jeff (51:04):
So, like, debate Dexter is also, like, part of the, I
guess, tangential to,intellectual violence because
Super Solid (51:13):
Right.
Jeff (51:14):
You know, there there's the argument. And then just to
to you you know, I don't I don'twanna focus on that because it's
not what we were talking abouthere. But there are ways to
handle kadunkajuds. Right? Yeah.
Without having you don't alwayshave to be respectable, if you
(51:36):
know what I mean.
Super Solid (51:38):
Not always. So, Jeff, I gotta tell you, the
reason why I even started theonline debating in the first
place was because, a lot of thepeople that I thought were
really cool turned out to beabsolute kadunkajuds. And it was
painful for me to, in a sense,lose them as I knew them.
Jeff (52:00):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (52:00):
And so I first wanted to learn, like, to, like,
figure out how to talk toKadunkajuds because I wanted
them to stop being Kadunkajuds.Right? Then I figured out, oh,
you have to get them before theyactually become Kadunkajuds. You
have to get people who don'twanna be Kadunkajuds. And those
(52:22):
people are not the ones yellingat you and doing the bulverism.
Those people are the ones in theaudience.
Jeff (52:32):
Right?
Super Solid (52:35):
And that's the part of that, the the reason I bring
that up is because I'm reallythankful for the audience.
Really am. I really am because Iyou could tell you could you can
attest to it even today. I mean,they're super supportive. Mhmm.
I think what you had some somebig some big purchases today. I
(52:58):
I got some orders today. Like,it's the our audience is
probably the best audience, andI just wanna make sure that
they're able to follow us tothese new these new platforms.
You know?
Jeff (53:11):
And and rock and rock the colors. Exactly. For me, the one
thing I want is I want people tolearn how to think. I want
people to learn how to reason,and I want people to learn how
to say like, learn that it'sokay to to say I don't know and
to be curious and to read and toget more information and to just
(53:35):
think of the argument, and totry not to get distracted by,
like, the the BS, like, whenyou're talking about something.
Compartmentalize where you can,all of those things.
Absolutely. And I and I thinkpart of it is my own like, the
way my own brain works, like,the way I approach these things.
(53:56):
But it's also, like, a drivingforce for me that I need I need
for, for truth. I need the bestway to get to truth. And I think
the best way to get to truthinvolves taking an idea and
(54:18):
getting to a conclusion the bestway possible.
And that does not involverepressing information. That
doesn't involve throwing in yourown bias. Like, it there's so
much to it, and it seems verycomplicated. But at the end of
the day, it's very, very simple.Mhmm.
(54:39):
And so for me, that's why Istarted is because there's so
many places where I think we canimprove how we approach ideas
and concepts. And instead ofthrowing our ego at it, we can
throw just we can we can justapproach it in a way that is
conducive to getting to truth.
Super Solid (55:02):
Right. Absolutely.
Jeff (55:04):
Like, the w's don't matter. The l's don't matter.
It's just the you know, justlet's get to to truth somehow.
Super Solid (55:09):
Get to the truth. Yeah. Absolutely.
Jeff (55:15):
I appreciate y'all for listening today. We got to the
end of this first episode ofmany, and, yeah, we'll see you
guys next time.
Super Solid (55:29):
Hasta Luego.
What up, Super Solid?
Super Solid (00:11):
Yo.
Jeff (00:12):
Yo. That's so funny. So it's on your live the other day.
Right? Oh, I can't see you, butit's on your live the other day.
And just the the quoting of MLK,hilarious. Hilarious. Should we
(00:32):
just play
Super Solid (00:33):
it? Yeah. I think we should play it.
Jeff (00:35):
Yeah. That's man. Man, listen.
Shaun (00:40):
Alright. Prove it. Apologize for what you said
about MLK.
Kedunkachud (00:44):
What I wait. I have to apologize for saying that we
should judge we should judgepeople based on character?
Shaun (00:51):
What did he say before that?
Kedunkachud (00:53):
I I don't remember the exact What
Shaun (00:54):
did he say directly after that?
Kedunkachud (00:58):
Dream?
Shaun (00:59):
What did
he say 2 weeks after? Dream? Ohmy god.
Super Solid (01:08):
What Martha the king said, judge people based on
the content of their characterand not the color of their skin.
What do you say directly beforethat? I have no idea. What did
you say directly out of that?Dream?
Jeff (01:26):
Yo. That's that's too funny.
Super Solid (01:29):
The first part is, like, why would you quote the
man without knowing any likeNothing. Without knowing where
the quote came from, without,like, knowing any of the speech.
Because later on, didn't we askhim what the name of the speech
was? And he couldn't remember?Or is that today?
Jeff (01:50):
Yeah. No. Well, I don't I don't know. I don't remember.
After dream that took me out.
Yeah. It completely took me out.I didn't know what to say. I was
like, I was like out of it. So,but to use a quote like that,
(02:11):
just to, like, prove a point,but not know the whole end.
Look, just so you know, foranybody listening, the point of
the conversation was to takeaccountability for racism. And
Du said, I'm a
Kedunkachud (02:26):
just quote MLK and not know what he actually said,
and then just quote him and say,dream?
Jeff (02:35):
Right. That's too much. That's that's too much. I was
laughing for the rest of the dayafter that. And I know you could
Super Solid (02:42):
I couldn't help it. So that was New Year's Eve.
Right? I went out with some somefellas from work.
Kedunkachud (02:50):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (02:51):
On the way there, I was listening to that live. I
was listening to that portion ofthe live on repeat because
because I I honestly, Jeff, I'mnot gonna hold you, man. I'm so
tired of people intuiting,refutations to to, like, racism.
(03:16):
It's like they vehementlydisagree with the existence of
racism, with the severity ofracism, and they do so without
having any knowledge base inracism at all. Right?
They have no idea what they'retalking about. They haven't
studied it at all, but they justknow that they're smarter than
you on this subject.
Jeff (03:39):
And I think I think for me, it's for any subject that's
annoying, but specifically forrace, like when you enter in the
conversation and the first thingout of your mouth is I'm right.
I don't know what you're talkingabout. I don't know what it is.
I'm looking at a thing and Ijust wanna be right.
Kedunkachud (03:59):
But
Super Solid (04:00):
just wanna be right.
Jeff (04:01):
But no matter what you show me, I'm still gonna I'm
still gonna, like, go againstthe tide of facts and just go,
like, I'm right anyway.
Super Solid (04:12):
It's irritating to no end. And I think the the
worst part of it is the, like,off bat, the assumption that
you're wrong. Right?
Kedunkachud (04:23):
And
Super Solid (04:23):
then the immediate, like, you're wrong and here's
why. Well, Slim, you you haven'tyou haven't proven me wrong.
Jeff (04:33):
Yeah. You haven't you haven't done the work.
Super Solid (04:35):
Yeah. Yeah. Show me your work. Because why are we
already on to, you know, mebeing indoctrinated or making
excuses or being a victim, whenwhen you you're like, right?
Like, you're wrong about mebeing wrong.
(04:56):
We gotta figure out what realityis first before we can just go.
Right? And that's that's one ofthe most annoying things.
Jeff (05:05):
This is a good segue. So I wanna say for anybody listening,
welcome to, the the new end ofthe species podcast. I'm Jeff,
and I'm here with Super Solid,my brother in arms. And today,
we're gonna talk about, we'rewe're talking about bulvarism
and and the example of howpeople use it, why it's a
(05:31):
fallacy, why it's annoying, allof those things. Like, all of
Super Solid (05:40):
why it makes me wanna pull my eyelashes out.
Jeff (05:43):
Yeah. All everything.
Super Solid (05:46):
Yeah.
Jeff (05:47):
And if you know me, if you know Solid, you'll see us
usually, as we're divesting fromTikTok, but you'll see us
usually on a TikTok live doingdebates. And, look, I'm not
gonna lie to you. When we havedebate topics, I think about
debate topics a lot. Like, whenI'm not on a live and I'm doing
(06:12):
something else, I'm thinkingthrough stuff. I'm writing.
I'm taking notes. I'm writingout arguments, because I really
just wanna know. Right? I findit interesting. And then I go
into a conversation, and afterhaving done all of this prework
and go through, like, a Socraticquestioning or laying out an
(06:34):
argument to hear someone go, youjust want free shit.
Super Solid (06:45):
To to hear somebody say, that's how it's always
been. That's just how it works.Mhmm.
Jeff (06:51):
It it's as if, like I'm I'm look. My my my number one
mission this year happy newyear, everybody. But my number
one mission this year is tonormalize certain in group, out
group dynamics that I think makesense. Academia is one of these
(07:12):
in group, out group dynamicsthat make sense. And to that
end, I'm going to continue thisdrumbeat.
You're gonna get tired of mesaying it, and I'm gonna keep
saying Bob in row 6 until peoplelisten to me and understand that
I'm dead ass serious when I saythat. Like when I say Bob and
Rose
Super Solid (07:31):
6 Bob and Rose 6.
Jeff (07:33):
So the concept of Bob and Rose 6 is this is like I it's in
my head, the way it, the way itshaped out was you watch late
night and you watch like Fallonor or Kimmel or Colbert, and
they're always interviewing.Like, you don't get on that show
unless you either have somethingto say, like you're an up and
coming comedian or you're likesomebody of note that just did
(07:56):
something or you're an actor andyou're you're trying to promote
a movie or or a singer. You gotan album or something like that.
But you're not, like, there justto shoot the shit. That's not
what you're what you're doingwhen you're when you're doing
this.
Super Solid (08:11):
You're there with a purpose.
Jeff (08:13):
And so I thought to myself when I'm when I'm talking to
these people on these lives, andI said, what if instead of,
like, hey, the new Deadpoolmovie's out, and we were gonna
interview Ryan Reynolds and HughJackman, but nah, forget that. I
just told him to go back home. Iwant to interview Bob and row 6.
(08:37):
Hey, Bob and row 6, come on downand tell us about how you went
to, like, the grocery storetoday, and you picked out
Super Solid (08:47):
a trip to the deli.
Jeff (08:49):
Yeah. How they had just the right amount of roast beef
in your sandwich today, player.It was Tell us
Super Solid (08:55):
folded it over real nice.
Jeff (08:57):
Tell us about how you're on there. Tell us about how you
looked at a Facebook meme, andnow you know everything there is
to know about, socialism. Thankyou. That's that's what we need.
Right?
And I feel when when, whenthere's a an asymmetrical effort
(09:20):
put into a conversation, that'swhere that's where a lot of the
frustration comes in because,like, you're talking to somebody
who didn't think of this stuff.And if they were honest about
them not thinking about it andsay, hey. You know what? I never
I never thought about that. Letme let me come back.
Let me read. Let me do this. Letme do that. But, no, that's not
(09:43):
what they do. We get no.
No. They dig
Super Solid (09:49):
in. They dig their heels in, and it's personal
attack time.
Jeff (09:56):
Yeah.
Super Solid (09:57):
Right.
Jeff (09:59):
And I call like, you actually pointed out the term
bulvarism to me, and I had neverheard of it. So I was happy to
learn it.
Super Solid (10:08):
Right.
Jeff (10:09):
Which, by the way, don't do that with no ops. Don't point
out no new info to them. I knowwhat it is.
Super Solid (10:21):
Yeah. You tell a Kentucky about something new.
They're an expert.
Jeff (10:27):
I know what it is. What is it? I'm not tell I'm not playing
your game.
Super Solid (10:31):
I'm not playing your mind games.
Jeff (10:35):
This is this is a quiz show or what?
Super Solid (10:39):
I know what it is. What is it? I'm not I don't have
to answer your question. Go lookit up.
Jeff (10:46):
Go do your own research.
Super Solid (10:48):
I don't think you know what it is.
Jeff (10:51):
But when it but when when when I'm having a conversation
and I lay out a thing andsomebody just says, do I call it
the mind reading fallacy?Somebody goes, you just don't
like thing x. You just you justlazy, and you don't wanna do
nothing under this thing. And Igo, oh, so you went into my
(11:17):
mind. Right?
You you scooped out part of mythoughts and you read them out
loud. So you a mind reader.That's awesome. I love that. You
may have seen me sometimes.
Like, I'll I'll I'll write 8digits. Like, I actually do it
every time. I write 8 randomdigits into my notes app, and
I'm like, tell me what what 8digits are in my notes app since
(11:39):
you know what I'm thinking.
Super Solid (11:42):
Can I ask you a question about that? Yeah. How
many times have have they hasanyone ever been really close
and then and and you were, like,a little scared, like, a little
uh-oh?
Jeff (11:54):
Nah. Solid. Nobody's ever even tried it.
Super Solid (11:58):
Of course not. Because they know better. Right?
Jeff (11:59):
They haven't even made an attempt at a guess. Not even
close. And, like, I know I'mbeing snarky when I do it. I'm
I'm 100% being a jerk. Mhmm.
But at the same time, like, ithappened today. It happened
today on on your on your joint,like, where you were talking
where we were talking to the onedude about the the reparations
(12:21):
thing. And we're just having athought experiment. And he goes,
you're up here. After we havethe whole conversation, we get
to the part where it's like,okay, your thing don't make
sense.
You just begging for free money.What?
Super Solid (12:39):
What do you mean I'm begging for free money? It's
a thought experiment. To be tolike, to for context y'all,
sometimes I do a live that posesa hypothetical or the
hypothetical. If and that if isdoing so much heavy lifting, if
(13:00):
reparations were to end racism,if me and I I cannot stress this
enough. If means under to getlike, under the conditions.
Right? If under the conditionsthat racism or excuse me, that,
reparations ended racism, wouldyou then support reparations?
(13:21):
And the reason why I came upwith that is because it's kind
of a double bind for bigots.
Jeff (13:26):
Yeah.
Super Solid (13:26):
Because they have to choose between supporting
black people and supportingblack people, and they don't
wanna do either one of them.It's like, wait a minute. Wait a
minute.
Jeff (13:37):
It's the ultimate trolley problem. On one end, you're
saving a black person. On theother end, you're saving a black
per which do you pull?
Super Solid (13:45):
Right. Which which one do you oh, no. And so so
it's it, that's the reason why Icame up with it. But, and the
reason why, like, I came acrossthe idea of Bolvarism in the
first place was because of thatexact dynamic. Right?
Just the sheer inability of,like, white people to be to,
(14:07):
like, participate in anymeaningful way in conversations
about race and racism.
Jeff (14:13):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (14:13):
Right? But I had no idea, Jeff. Jeff, I had no idea.
Kedunkachud (14:22):
Like, I had no idea that
Super Solid (14:23):
it would be that difficult for them.
Jeff (14:26):
That we get to that level.
Super Solid (14:28):
Yeah. I didn't I didn't pick up on the fact like,
it it Jeff, how long we've beendoing this? We like, you and I
known each other for at least ayear. Right?
Jeff (14:35):
A little yeah. A year or more. Yeah.
Super Solid (14:38):
Okay. So I remember sitting in a Walmart parking lot
when we did the the pterodactylfallacy. Kitchen razor. Mhmm.
Right?
Even then people were usingthese genetic fallacies. You
know, basically, just sayingbecause this idea comes from
(15:01):
this source, the idea must bewrong. Right?
Jeff (15:04):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (15:05):
But I never picked up on how that that, ad hominem
is assumed. Right? Like, theassumption of wrongness is there
and they never talk about it,and then they they immediately
skip past it and go on to the tothe follow-up. Yeah. And so I
(15:28):
think on some level, maybe on avisceral level, I'm saying,
like, okay.
He is just assuming I'm wrong.But instead of debating against
that and saying, hey. No. Comeback and prove me wrong. I end
up getting in the weeds about,the assumptions they're making
themselves or the ad hominemitself.
(15:49):
Right?
Jeff (15:50):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (15:51):
Let me ask you the like, are you like me? Have you
have you been able to unseebulvarism?
Jeff (16:01):
No. I actually I actually told you that you shallow held
me with that because normallynormally when it like, when I
see that kind of stuff and youknow where I see it the most is
something that we don't talkabout is when you're presenting
a source and somebody goes, hey.Where did you what source are
(16:22):
you using? And you're like, the,the, associated press. That's a
liberal blah blah blah blahblah.
Super Solid (16:31):
Somebody told me the other day that the FBI was
liberal.
Jeff (16:35):
Yeah. Come on. So so, you know, we're using FBI dot gov.
Those liberals, those leftylefties, they they killed all
them people on suspicion to be aMarxist, but they're super
lefty. You didn't know that?
Come on now.
Super Solid (16:55):
The the notoriously liberal Federal Bureau of
Investigation. You mean thepeople that weren't, allowed to
investigate sex crimes in the in
Kedunkachud (17:06):
the eighties?
Super Solid (17:07):
Those guys? You mean the people who sent, death
threats to to Martin LutherKing? Those that FBI? Okay.
Jeff (17:20):
Alright. Super leftist. 100%.
Super Solid (17:23):
Oh, yeah. Straight commies.
Jeff (17:26):
But when but now I see it over and over and over, like,
especially with men dealing withwomen. Like, they'll go up. This
is this is why you ain't got aman. You just somebody Yeah.
Somebody divorced you and askedwhat.
And it's like, yo, could youjust, like, address
Super Solid (17:48):
Could you just address the argument, please?
Right. Who'd be wrong before youstart talking about why I'm
wrong?
Jeff (17:55):
Yeah. Like, show like, I see conversations about, like,
the gender the the the genderpay gap, and a source will pop
out, and another source will popout, and then another source
will pop out to where where nowwe're sea lining. Now we're
just, like, asking for, like,you wanna pull every paycheck in
the world and compare it toevery other paycheck in the
(18:17):
world 1 by 1 as opposed to justlooking at the studies. And then
it's this is why y'all wannahave abortions because you wanna
like, what? Time out.
Wait. Rewind. Where did thatcome from?
Super Solid (18:35):
How did we get to abortions?
Jeff (18:37):
Like, like we were just, we were just chilling on
sources. And now you assumingthere's a whole group of women's
motivation for talking aboutit's not that they wanna work
and get like the equal wage. Andeven that may not even be true.
Like they could all beindependently wealthy and they
just, they just want informationabout a thing, which is
(19:00):
perfectly fine. Right?
I'm curious about a bunch ofshit that got nothing to do with
me. Right? And and in that case,my motivation is just I'm
curious and nosy, and I wannaknow shit. That's it.
Kedunkachud (19:14):
Right.
Jeff (19:15):
But then I get into the conversation, and the minute it
gets a little uncomfortable, youjust want abortion. Like, what
the like, get out
Super Solid (19:23):
of here. Going on?
Jeff (19:24):
I do not understand it. I don't know. Like, there was a a
a dude I should look him up. Hehe's, it's his daughter's TikTok
account, but he used to be a spyfor, like, the CIA or the NSA or
something. He used to do spywork.
(19:46):
And she asked him, what is itthat's gonna cause the fall of
society? And my man sayssophistry. And Boverism is a
form of sophistry. It really is.It's a form of, like, I don't
want to engage the argumentdirectly.
So instead, I'm just gonna saythe person thinks that way
(20:08):
because and it's just you know,to me, it's just one of, like,
what
Super Solid (20:17):
poetic.
Jeff (20:19):
It it's one of, like, a 1000 lazy habits that people
that get into these debateshave. And, sure, we could talk
about the people on TikTok.They're just like, and they
don't know what they're doing.But this happens in congress. It
happens on the 24 hour newscycle.
(20:40):
This should be happening on thestreet. Like, whenever, like and
look, audience, you're not goingto be able to unsee this now.
When you go and and thank thankgoodness we're doing this
recording after the holidays.Because if I would if this was
October and we were saying thisshit, and then you go to
Thanksgiving dinner, you you'resaying you in your twenties, and
(21:05):
you only saying that because youhaven't lived yet.
Super Solid (21:08):
You ain't lived yet.
Jeff (21:09):
Yeah. Then you're like, oh, no. Listen to this. Listen
listen to this, episode. You'redoing.
Can you address the argument? Wewould be ruining so many
thanksgiving and Christmasdinners.
Super Solid (21:21):
Listen. We might still for years to come. Let's
hope. Let's one can only hopethat we ruin your thanksgiving.
You know?
Jeff (21:28):
Yeah. Absolutely. Or or encourage people to stop talking
about certain things at theThanksgiving table.
Super Solid (21:37):
So what is the remedy? Like, what how do we
remedy, though?
Jeff (21:43):
Oh, that's, I was about to say that's easy, but that's so
dismissive. Don't do that, Jeff.There are a couple yes. It's not
actually easy because it's it'sa habit that you have to have. I
think one of the one of thebiggest effects that has that
makes it effective is that ittalks to your ego.
(22:08):
Right? Like so for example, me,I'm an atheist. I don't every
now and again, I'll engage inthe in atheism debates. And when
you and you'll find somebody whodoesn't wanna talk about the
thing that that you wanna talkabout. And instead, they'll say,
you're just afraid of this god,or you're just mad at this god.
(22:30):
And for someone who's like me,who I'm like, the fiction guy?
No. There's a there's this thingin your in your stomach that
you're like, did you just what'dyou just say to me? And you
wanna talk about that.
Super Solid (22:43):
Right.
Jeff (22:44):
Like, the conversation part is over. You just wanna
talk about that. When it's likewhen we talk about racism,
somebody you just want freemoney, and you're sitting in a
nice house, and you got a nicejob. But mind you, typically,
like, you look like us and youdidn't just blue chip your way
into that.
Super Solid (23:03):
Right.
Jeff (23:04):
Like, I didn't just go, hey, my my my my dad and my
dad's dad and my dad's dad'sdad. Like, you you worked your
ass off to get where you at. Andnow somebody's like, you just
want free money. And you hearthat? And you're like, wait a
minute.
Super Solid (23:16):
It's a rap. It's a rap. That's all I'm a be able to
talk about. Mhmm.
Jeff (23:21):
Like, what was what was I saying about the 19 fifties and
Jim Crow? Nah. Right. You're nottalking about that no more. We
talk about my house.
Right? And I've fallen for it.
Super Solid (23:31):
Right. Oh, yeah.
Jeff (23:33):
Me too. We all have. But I think the best way to handle
that and I think I'm I'mactually glad you brought it up.
The best way to handle that isto just sidestep it. Accept it.
Just be like, yeah. You'reright. But that doesn't change
this argument.
Super Solid (23:53):
Right.
Jeff (23:54):
Like, cool. Cool. Fine. I want free money. But and you
know what?
You might
Super Solid (23:58):
have to do if we just say prove me if we just
repeat it, prove me wrong overand over again with that.
Jeff (24:04):
You know, that can be a like, okay. That can be
effective. And I've seen somepeople do this, and it works
where, like, let's say I ask youa question. The other day, I had
somebody and, you know, I I Ifollow in your footsteps
sometimes with these with thesetopics because I like I like the
ones that that put in a put in apoint. And so I have a this
(24:27):
topic that goes, all migrantsare pro American.
Super Solid (24:34):
Mhmm.
Jeff (24:35):
And it piques the interest. But the and and, you
know, the exercise here issomebody's gonna say something
negative about migrants, and I'mgonna say, well, that's just
following in the great Americantradition of of thing that they
did. Right? And so, like, youknow, saying that is is great.
Cool.
(24:55):
But I'm not being lazy about it.I'm still gonna follow in the in
the full dialectic to itsconclusion. And so I had a guy
who was talking about peoplecoming here illegally. And so we
got to the point where I'masking him, are treaties legal?
Super Solid (25:17):
Right. Are treaties yeah. Treaty laws. Yeah.
Jeff (25:21):
And he don't wanna say yes.
Super Solid (25:24):
Of course.
Jeff (25:24):
He wants to he wants to hem and haw. Like, come on. It's
a treaty. You know a treaty islegal. Like, that's a law.
If it's not, then what the hellare we signing it for?
Super Solid (25:36):
Yeah.
Jeff (25:38):
So what
Super Solid (25:38):
At the very least, it should be legal legally
binding. Right?
Jeff (25:41):
Yeah. So every time he didn't answer the question, I
just said, I'm just gonna keepasking until you until you
answer my question. And we wentfor a full 10 minutes of me. Are
treaties legal? Well, there'salright.
No. No. That's cool. Ourtreaties legal, though. So in
(26:01):
your case, where it's like proveme wrong, prove me wrong, like,
you get into this feedback loopwhere you're you're basically
telling the person until youengage, you're just gonna hear
the same thing over and overagain.
Super Solid (26:15):
Right.
Jeff (26:16):
So that that can be
Super Solid (26:17):
a Wait. Hold on. He went a full 10 minutes without
crashing out?
Jeff (26:22):
This particular I'm gonna show you the clip later on. And
this particular dude, he wasn'tgonna crash out. Like, the the
crash out he was gonna do withslurs. Right?
Super Solid (26:30):
Oh, wow. Yeah.
Jeff (26:31):
That's the crash out that he was gonna, he wasn't gonna
start screaming and yelling. He,it, it took a long, I mean,
credit to him with, you know,I'm, I'm not a I'm I'm pretty in
your face with it when when Isee somebody in my side. So
credit to him. He did he took itlike a champ, but he still
(26:52):
wasn't engaging. And that's thepart where you start getting
into these things where I'm justgonna keep asking you the
question until you engage.
All that other stuff you'redoing is just delaying the
inevitable because we're on mypart. Yeah. But the the the
other thing I encourage peopleto do and I like to do is start
(27:14):
with, specifically, what is thepoint of that work? What's the
point that we're disagreeingabout? Because if you clean that
up, everything around that isnice for, like and, like, that
WWE entertaining where wherewhere we're joking with each
other stuff.
(27:34):
Yeah. But if I'm saying to you,like, you know, there's some
moral question that we wannaanswer. Right? So that would be,
like, for an abortionconversation or or something
about xenophobia and how itmoves in society, and we're
(27:56):
talking about immigration.There's going to be a point
where somebody's making a claim.
What and if it's me, then I'mfocused on that claim. That's
all I wanna know about is thespecific claim I just made and
how it relates to the argument.And how can I foundationally,
like, say, okay, this claim isthis? But if that's not like, if
(28:21):
you're distracting from that,the north star that I have is
always gonna be, what are wetalking about? And if we shift
it from that, let's just bringit back.
Right? Right.
Super Solid (28:35):
What's what's on the background? AKA, what are
the words that I have put herespecifically for us to look at
so that we remember what thetopic is in the first place?
Jeff (28:46):
Exactly that. Exactly that. And you know what?
Sometimes when you really, like,start going down a rabbit hole,
when you come back to the topic,I'll even say to some people,
like, look. You went you did allof that, and we didn't get no,
(29:06):
we didn't get an inch closer toyou proving that the thing that
you wanted to say.
Super Solid (29:12):
Exactly.
Jeff (29:12):
Not, not, not like we didn't take a step in that
direction. We're, we're talkingabout this other thing now Mhmm.
And we could have been talkingabout the thing you wanted to
say, and that's crazy to me thatwe not. Like, how do we get to
that point? Yeah.
You know? So What are the most,
Super Solid (29:33):
frustrating things about debating Bob and row 6, I
think, in the world is all thewasted time.
Jeff (29:43):
Yeah. Yeah. There's layers of it, though. Because alright.
If I'm talking to you and thensomebody's on deck.
Right? And you're making anargument about whatever. The
(30:04):
person that comes in generally,typically speaking, the next
person that comes that that isgonna have a conversation, I I
like them to start from thebeginning of their the whatever
argument they're gonna make. Idon't like to staple. I I call
it stapling the last person'sargument to your forehead.
I don't like doing that becausethere's going to there are gonna
(30:25):
be parts of it that people aregonna miss. But if you've been
sitting there waiting, and weand I just like, I've seen you
give people a class on what isthe history and the material
analysis
Kedunkachud (30:45):
Right.
Jeff (30:46):
Of the last 100 years of race in this country. Then the
next person starts off likethey've they they didn't hit
none of that. They their theirtheir joint was on mute for that
whole time, and we gotta startover.
Super Solid (31:03):
Mhmm. When I know they've been watching. That's
the worst part.
Jeff (31:08):
Yeah.
Super Solid (31:08):
I just thought I was been sitting here looking at
you watching, so I didn't evenhear what I explained.
Jeff (31:14):
Because they write a comment like that person's point
didn't make no sense. Oh, youyou heard that point.
Super Solid (31:20):
So you heard that? You you listening. Right.
Jeff (31:23):
Why are we starting over?
Super Solid (31:25):
Why are we starting from scratch? Yeah.
Jeff (31:27):
I've seen some of our mutuals. Like, I don't like
talking about politicians afteran election because the thing is
done. But people still talk,like, hey. Why did you vote for
this person? Why did you votefor that person?
Mhmm. I've seen some of ourmutuals have 5 conversations in
a row. And in all of theconversations, they have to
start off by explaining what atariff is. And I'm gonna tell
(31:53):
you this. This is the unspokenthing about tariffs.
I'm gonna say it, and I'm notgonna take it back. Tariffs are
boring. Boring. I don't knowthat there's a thing in
economics that you could talkabout this more boring than a
tariff. Like, it's boring forthe
Super Solid (32:21):
Price ceilings? No. No. Mm-mm.
Jeff (32:28):
Because at least with price ceilings, you you get into
a point where it's like,alright. Whew.
Super Solid (32:33):
No more gouging. Because there's an end to it.
Right?
Jeff (32:36):
Yeah. But, like, when there's a tariff, it's it's
boring to the person paying thetariff. It's boring to do the
argument about the tariff. Whenyou get to it, like a targeted
tariff, everything else isspeculation like, Hey, are they
gonna bring jobs back?Everything about a tariff is
boring.
Right. But there's nothing moreboring than just explaining what
(32:58):
a tariff is. Right. And havingto do that 5 times in a row is
outrageous to me. I don't knowhow somebody could do that and
not become a supervillain thatday.
Super Solid (33:16):
So then, like because there are times when
I'll just say, hey. Listen. No.I talked about this with the
last guy. We've we alreadytalked about this.
You know? Mhmm. Because let'ssay I'm I'm a I'm a college
professor, and I'm sitting inthe middle of my, you know, of
my lesson. And then somebodybust in the classroom in the
(33:36):
middle of the class. Excuse me.
And says, sorry, I'm late. Won'tyou go over all the shit you
just went over again? Right? Myman's gonna say, get out. Mhmm.
Why are you here? But for somereason, we'll start alive and
(33:56):
and you know what I mean? Forthe brand new kid in the class
or the guy that was late to theclass, we'll repeat the same
thing over and over again. Startfrom scratch. Start from
scratch.
Yeah. To exercise in futility.It's sisophisian.
Jeff (34:11):
And I'll tell you this. I will give somebody, like, the
the opening premise. Like, whenI do the when I talk about,
like, the the immigrate, the themigrants are all migrants are
pro American.
Super Solid (34:24):
Yeah.
Jeff (34:24):
There's a boilerplate sentence. I just say all
migrants exhibit the culture,traditions, and values of the
United States. Boom. So then wecan you get you pick one of
those and you pick at it, or yougive me an argument based on
whatever. But I don't wanna haveto tell you, hey, what's
culture?
What are values? What what is atradition? If I have to do that
(34:49):
every time, this is where thebob and row 6 of it comes in, is
you have people who don't knowthis stuff, but they really
wanna talk about it. And maybeyou shouldn't. Maybe what you
need to do
Super Solid (35:06):
Maybe you should not talk
Jeff (35:08):
about it. At least not in this forum. Right? If we're
having a conversation where alot of people are watching and
there's people who wanna learnabout this stuff and they want
us maybe there are even peoplewho are like, hey, I wanna get
my argument stronger. But youwanna get your argument stronger
against the strongest version ofthat argument.
(35:30):
You don't wanna get it strongeragainst, like, you know,
somebody who doesn't know thebasics. So it's a disservice
even to to, like, an audiencethat's watching. Right. And it's
a disservice to the personthat's engaging in that
conversation without knowingstuff because you're gonna look
(35:50):
dumber than you are. Right?
Like, if I walked into like, Ialways use CERN as an example.
But if I walked into CERN rightnow and I had a conversation
about, you know, quantumparticles of any kind, whoever's
sitting in there is gonna walkcircles around me. Yeah. I don't
that's not what I do. I don'tknow anything about that.
(36:12):
Now is it possible that I could,like, buckle down and start
studying and and probably not.Like, I'm probably not gonna be
an expert in quantum physicsanytime in my life. But, you
know, maybe I'll pick up somethings and not look dumb. I'll
know about, like, hey. Maybe Ishouldn't who I not to talk to.
(36:32):
But for people who don't knowanything, and you give you give
them the most basic question.What hey. Here's a callback.
What did he say right afterthat?
Super Solid (36:47):
Right.
Jeff (36:48):
And the answer is dream.
Super Solid (36:50):
Dream? I don't even think it's that complex because
you went straight to CERN, and Ido this too. I I I go to, like,
these really complex professionswhen I try to do that analogy.
It's not a good idea to arguewith the cashier at books a
million. You know what you knowwhat I mean?
(37:13):
About how to do their job.
Jeff (37:15):
Yeah. You
Super Solid (37:16):
know what I'm saying? If you've never worked
at Books A Mill you if you'venever worked at, you know, you
don't have access to theirinventories, to their system.
You don't know what books arethere, what books aren't there.
Right? But you wanna steady tellthem how to find the book, that
you're looking for, that youcan't find in the first place.
Jeff (37:37):
I don't think the staggered close is really the
the most safe way to close yourstore.
Super Solid (37:43):
You see what I'm saying? What's your name again?
Tell me. Right. Like, you youargue with people without having
any knowledge base in what youarguing about in the first place
is at at You want
Jeff (37:57):
to eat fries for 3 and a half minutes? Blood? The whole
basket of fries?
Super Solid (38:04):
The whole thing? And a half minutes? You've gotta
leave it in there for at least20.
Jeff (38:10):
I could do it in 3.
Super Solid (38:14):
Oh oh, so you like soggy frozen? Oh, okay. No salt.
What you put
Jeff (38:21):
salt on there for?
Super Solid (38:23):
And that's what a kadunkatrade really is. A
kadunkatrade is really theepitome of Dunning Kruger. Yes.
The a kadunkatrade is themanifestation of Dunning Kruger.
Jeff (38:39):
Absolutely. Yeah.
Super Solid (38:40):
Yes. That's what I'm saying. Chud. It's a
kadunkajud.
Jeff (38:45):
Kadunkajud. Yeah. Super Dunning Kruger.
Super Solid (38:50):
Yeah. And cause it's like my confidence is going
to make me right. You know,
Jeff (38:55):
and the bulbarism is just a coping or a defense mechanism
for when you like, you havethese shells up like, Hey, I got
my confidence. I got my, myinsults. I got my slurs. And
when all of that is being pulledapart and you bought this like,
Hey, mask is about to come off.The is the last thing.
(39:19):
Like, but you're just sayingthat because you because you
just generally mad. You unhappy.
Super Solid (39:25):
Second last line of defense. The first line of
defense is the n word.
Jeff (39:29):
Yeah. Mhmm.
Kedunkachud (39:30):
Or that that's the last one.
Jeff (39:32):
Yeah. The slurs is the is the is the very last peel of
wall before you get into thecity. Right? That's where
Super Solid (39:39):
you pull the you pull the, pull the rip cord. Oh,
I really am though. So yeah.Really. That's what we gotta do
it on a daily basis, man.
Jeff (39:57):
I'm excited about I'm excited about being on YouTube.
I'm excited about being back in,in, like, podcast land.
Super Solid (40:08):
Yeah.
Jeff (40:11):
I I cannot I, like, I enjoy being on TikTok lives. I
enjoy, like, havingconversations. I don't know that
the trade off, for me anyway,the trade off of having a
conversation with the amount ofand you said, like, wasted time,
(40:34):
but just the bulk of wastedwords, the waste that you it's
almost like you're diggingthrough a a a mountain of
haystacks, and then you get 1 1or 2 worthwhile needles where
you're like, oh, this is thiswas super satisfying. Hey. We we
made progress here.
Right?
Super Solid (40:53):
Right.
Jeff (40:54):
And I don't and the further that that we you know,
that the that that app goes, themore bills of hay are being
added, and the more needles arebeing taken away. And I think
for me, it's gotten to a pointwhere I'm super excited about
(41:14):
being on YouTube because on thisplatform right now, right, you
and I are having thisconversation. Right? We're going
to get to a point where thereare going to be others of our
mutuals that are gonna join ushere and have conversations. And
there are topics that we thatwe're gonna get to talk about
that we don't normally get to.
And we're we're going to be ableto share information that we
(41:37):
don't normally get to. But we'realso going to be able to curate
like, I wanna hear fromdissenting voices. And not just,
like, dissenting voices among,like, the people that I fully
disagree with, but even amongstus. Like, we don't all agree on
stuff, and there are going to beopportunities for us to debate
things and not just politicalthings. Right?
(42:01):
We're going to be able to docommentary on pop culture, on
society, video games, likeanything that it is that makes
you move in a certain way.
Super Solid (42:17):
Right.
Jeff (42:18):
I wanna be able to to talk about it. I wanna be able to
speak to it. I wanna be able to,to have discourse around it and
entertain people around it andjoke around about it without the
the specter of, having a peoplewho don't know what they're
(42:38):
talking about entering theconversation. Be an app that is
perfectly okay allowing all theslurring and, and weird behavior
while punishing what itperceives as some other stuff.
(43:00):
Right?
Like, we we've all seen wheresomebody is on mute and they're
on a panel, and all of a sudden,they disappear and we find out,
hey. They got banned
Super Solid (43:10):
for a week.
Jeff (43:12):
Yeah. And they didn't say nothing.
Super Solid (43:16):
Yeah. And then on real time.
Kedunkachud (43:19):
Mhmm. And
Jeff (43:20):
then on top of
Kedunkachud (43:21):
all that
Super Solid (43:21):
I think it comes from, like, they might be in
another space, and then they getreported there, and then TikTok
just lags so hard that theydon't get reported until they
get to the Maybe. Space. Buteither way, you shouldn't have
let that slide. Like, you youwaited this long. Why why you
know?
But also, like, no Do
Jeff (43:41):
you know statute of limitations?
Super Solid (43:44):
Right. The will will come up, say the shit to
you. They will come up on yourin your space. The other day,
the the the last banana I got,it was some good Dunkin' Chuds
calling me the n word, tellingme to do self harm to myself,
and they got they got off scotfree. But because they dropped
(44:04):
down and then reported me for itwithout even vetting it at all,
TikTok just said, we're we'regonna ban you.
It's like, no. So let go afterthose people who actually said
the thing.
Jeff (44:16):
Yeah.
Super Solid (44:17):
You know? If there's no there's there's no
way around it. You know? BecauseTikTok has every resource
available to refine thereporting process, give creators
a way to kind of, you know,voice, you know, plead their
(44:39):
case. And they just they haven'tdone it yet, which means they
they don't care.
They don't want to because theywould have done it already. You
know?
Jeff (44:50):
I I wanna here's something I wanna do before we we close
out.
Super Solid (44:55):
Yeah.
Jeff (44:56):
And that is let me open up a new window here. I wanna talk
about how you can support theseefforts. I think that's
important. And I'll call itshilling, but it's also you
know, we're moving platforms. Sowe're going to be somewhere
(45:19):
where we're not, like, gettingtiny dineys or whatever.
Super Solid (45:24):
Right.
Jeff (45:26):
And, you know, it is a hobby, but it's also labor.
Right? So we wanna we wanna giveeverybody an opportunity to
support. And I have thisdriving, like, philosophy that
I've always felt weird aboutpeople just, I don't know,
(45:49):
giving me some form form ofmonetary support for a an
animation or for nothing. Right?
So, for starters, I wannahighlight the fact that you have
merch, right, on your, on yourwebsite. And
Kedunkachud (46:10):
I Yeah.
Jeff (46:12):
And end of a species has merch that you can and and I
think that's the to me, that'sthe best way to support the
platform.
Super Solid (46:19):
Yeah. Absolutely. If you go to my website, 4 tpbuy
solid.com, there's all types ofmerchandise on there. I got
throw pillows. I got coffeemugs, prints, like canvas
prints.
I have, athleisure wear,hoodies. The people really go
(46:43):
for the hoodies. I don't knowwhat it it might be the season.
Who knows? We'll see how itturns out in the summer.
We'll see how people act in thesummertime. But but the hoodies
are, the people love thehoodies. They've been buying
them up. So yeah. And that's fortpbuy solid dot com.
It's one of the, my main sourcesof side revenue here. Oh, there
(47:08):
we are there. Also, I got a linkto the RSS feed for the pod.
Right? Right now, that'sabsolutely free.
Kedunkachud (47:17):
Okay?
Super Solid (47:18):
Oh, see. You see there? Look at the the for your
neighbor athleisure wear. Lookat that. Mhmm.
That's pretty. I like it.
Jeff (47:26):
And and you have, like, inclusive sizes.
Super Solid (47:30):
Yes. We are size inclusive. We're gender
inclusive. You know, you can getyou, if you scroll up oh, never
mind. If you
Jeff (47:39):
Let me bring it up.
Super Solid (47:40):
There's a non Biscay hoodie. 1 of the one of
my sign on tags and sign offtags is I'll say I'll talk to
everybody. I'll say, hey,broskis, siskis, and non Biscis.
And I think some of the nonbinary homies got a kick out of
that, so I went ahead and madethem a little non Biscay hoodie.
Jeff (48:00):
Non Biscay is I like that. I've actually never heard you
say that, but I but I like thata lot.
Super Solid (48:06):
Yeah. You say you got your broskis, you got your
siskeis, and you got your nonbiskeis. We got the black joy
hoodie. That flannel thatflannel, the looks are deceiving
because once you look at theback of that flannel, it's a
whole it's a whole thing. Right?
Jeff (48:22):
They're you know, that's that's that's what it is. Yeah.
I like that. No. That thatdesign is pretty cool.
Super Solid (48:30):
Yeah. It's what I mean, it's a it's a labor of
love. I I grew up quite poor,and so I I wasn't really able to
dress as well as I wanted to. Sonow it's just really important
to me that, you know, I'm welldressed. I'm a large I'm a large
guy, and so, I want I havetrouble finding inclusive sizes,
(48:57):
so I just tried to make surethat I had something that I felt
like I would be okay wearingthat also Mhmm.
You could wear. And if you'redifferently sized, then all the
better. You know?
Jeff (49:09):
Absolutely. And on the end of a species size, there's also
merch.
Super Solid (49:14):
I'll take that. I'll look at
Jeff (49:16):
that. Like It's
Super Solid (49:17):
so it's so clean. Like, your your, like, the just
the layout is so crisp. It'sjust really pleasant to look at.
Jeff (49:33):
Yeah. I didn't do it. I can't pay no credit for that.
This is just how it how it, howit lined up. But I think if I
had to highlight 1 right?
If I had to highlight 1, itwould definitely be the, the
intellect intellectual violenceline. And that's strictly
(49:56):
because, although the debatingon YouTube is going to be less
than it was. Right?
Super Solid (50:04):
Right.
Jeff (50:06):
We are in a space now where the ideas are the
violence. Right?
Super Solid (50:13):
Right.
Jeff (50:13):
The ideas are the the revolution. So, it for me,
intellectual violence is is alike, a term that I've wanted to
normalize for a long timebecause it just shows that, hey,
if you if your if your ideas aregood and you're willing to
(50:35):
defend them and you're willingto, like, articulate them in a
specific way, then you're goingto you're going to do well.
Right? Yeah. And I would beremiss if I didn't also
highlight debate Dexter, whichby the way, that's the first
shirt my wife got was the debateDexter.
Super Solid (50:57):
And I'm sure the debate Dexter, please. Because
that that thing I like all Ilike the marshmallow brain junk.
Jeff (51:04):
So, like, debate Dexter is also, like, part of the, I
guess, tangential to,intellectual violence because
Super Solid (51:13):
Right.
Jeff (51:14):
You know, there there's the argument. And then just to
to you you know, I don't I don'twanna focus on that because it's
not what we were talking abouthere. But there are ways to
handle kadunkajuds. Right? Yeah.
Without having you don't alwayshave to be respectable, if you
(51:36):
know what I mean.
Super Solid (51:38):
Not always. So, Jeff, I gotta tell you, the
reason why I even started theonline debating in the first
place was because, a lot of thepeople that I thought were
really cool turned out to beabsolute kadunkajuds. And it was
painful for me to, in a sense,lose them as I knew them.
Jeff (52:00):
Mhmm.
Super Solid (52:00):
And so I first wanted to learn, like, to, like,
figure out how to talk toKadunkajuds because I wanted
them to stop being Kadunkajuds.Right? Then I figured out, oh,
you have to get them before theyactually become Kadunkajuds. You
have to get people who don'twanna be Kadunkajuds. And those
(52:22):
people are not the ones yellingat you and doing the bulverism.
Those people are the ones in theaudience.
Jeff (52:32):
Right?
Super Solid (52:35):
And that's the part of that, the the reason I bring
that up is because I'm reallythankful for the audience.
Really am. I really am because Iyou could tell you could you can
attest to it even today. I mean,they're super supportive. Mhmm.
I think what you had some somebig some big purchases today. I
(52:58):
I got some orders today. Like,it's the our audience is
probably the best audience, andI just wanna make sure that
they're able to follow us tothese new these new platforms.
You know?
Jeff (53:11):
And and rock and rock the colors. Exactly. For me, the one
thing I want is I want people tolearn how to think. I want
people to learn how to reason,and I want people to learn how
to say like, learn that it'sokay to to say I don't know and
to be curious and to read and toget more information and to just
(53:35):
think of the argument, and totry not to get distracted by,
like, the the BS, like, whenyou're talking about something.
Compartmentalize where you can,all of those things.
Absolutely. And I and I thinkpart of it is my own like, the
way my own brain works, like,the way I approach these things.
(53:56):
But it's also, like, a drivingforce for me that I need I need
for, for truth. I need the bestway to get to truth. And I think
the best way to get to truthinvolves taking an idea and
(54:18):
getting to a conclusion the bestway possible.
And that does not involverepressing information. That
doesn't involve throwing in yourown bias. Like, it there's so
much to it, and it seems verycomplicated. But at the end of
the day, it's very, very simple.Mhmm.
(54:39):
And so for me, that's why Istarted is because there's so
many places where I think we canimprove how we approach ideas
and concepts. And instead ofthrowing our ego at it, we can
throw just we can we can justapproach it in a way that is
conducive to getting to truth.
Super Solid (55:02):
Right. Absolutely.
Jeff (55:04):
Like, the w's don't matter. The l's don't matter.
It's just the you know, justlet's get to to truth somehow.
Super Solid (55:09):
Get to the truth. Yeah. Absolutely.
Jeff (55:15):
I appreciate y'all for listening today. We got to the
end of this first episode ofmany, and, yeah, we'll see you
guys next time.
Super Solid (55:29):
Hasta Luego.
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.