The Man Behind the Voices You Know: James Urbaniak

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From accidentally stealing the spotlight on David Letterman's show as a teenager to voicing beloved animated characters for two decades, James Urbaniak's acting journey reads like a masterclass in versatility and perseverance. 

In this wide-ranging conversation, Urbaniak reveals the unexpected path that took him from New Jersey community theater to New York's experimental off-off-Broadway scene in the late 1980s. With remarkable candor, he shares how challenging theatrical experiences—like performing a 75-minute solo monologue in "Tom Paine"—helped develop his craft before independent filmmaker Hal Hartley introduced him to the different demands of screen acting.

Fans of Adult Swim's cult classic "The Venture Bros." will delight in Urbaniak's behind-the-scenes stories from his 20-year tenure voicing Dr. Rusty Venture and other characters. He recounts the surreal experience of having a makeup artist on the set of an HBO film tell him she was more excited to meet the voice of Dr. Venture than Al Pacino himself—a testament to the profound connection voice actors can forge with audiences.

Urbaniak's philosophy of acting—describing himself as "a skeptic who likes to be surprised"—offers valuable insight into navigating the entertainment industry's inherent uncertainty. Whether discussing his brief but memorable appearance in Christopher Nolan's "Oppenheimer," his experience playing Robert Crumb in "American Splendor," or his current work on Apple TV+'s "Palm Royale," Urbaniak demonstrates why character actors are often the secret ingredient that elevates productions across all media.

For aspiring actors, film buffs, animation fans, or anyone fascinated by the creative process, this conversation provides a rare glimpse into the life of a working actor who has successfully built a diverse career by embracing opportunities across multiple entertainment platforms.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:24):
Hello and welcome back to entertain this a, a
podcast about movies, TV showsand video games and today,
interviews.
I'm not joined by Mitch andHayden.
They decided to flake out andnot be here, so I'm manning the
podcast on my own, and with me Ihave James Urbaniak.
James, how the heck are you?

Speaker 2 (00:41):
I'm great and I'm happy to be a guest and co-host
by default.
I always wanted to co-host apodcast.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
And now's your chance .
Here we are.
We'll add it to your list ofcredits, I see.
So, james, I mean, what acareer you've had.
Ah well, starting from, I guess, 1983, where you went on stage
on the Late Night with DavidLetterman, all the way to now,
well, that's before I turned pro.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
That's when I was a civilian that was a civilian it
was an incident.
I loved that show at the time Imean I still do.
And yeah, I was in the audienceand he came out and told a joke
.
I was very excited to see theshow.
I lived in New Jersey at thetime and of course the show was
taped in New York.

(01:28):
So I got tickets had to do thisthrough the mail.
Back then there was no internet, as young people may not
realize this, but no homecomputers.
So I sent her my tickets.
I got them in the mail.
I went with my friend Anthonyand we went to the show and I
had seen the show the nightbefore and in his monologue the
night before he started to tella joke and he fumbled on the

(01:52):
words and he he just went on tothe next thing.
So the night I'm there, the dayI'm there because they taped
during the day, he tells thesame joke and fumbles it again
Twice and in a moment ofyouthful enthusiasm, oh, and
then he said by the way, he said, oh, damn it, this is the
second night.
I screwed this joke up and hekind of took a beat and then,

(02:13):
without really thinking, I pipedup can I try it?
And he laughed and then invitedme on stage and then I told the
joke somewhat poorly.
I was like 19 years old at thestage.
And then I told the jokesomewhat poorly I was like 19
years old at the time and then Iwent back upstage and that was
that.
But I was thrilled.
I'd never been on TV before.
I was vaguely interested inacting, but I was nowhere near

(02:37):
thinking about that seriously.
So, and as soon as I got onstage I could see myself on the
monitor.
I remember he's a tall man, I'm5'10" but he's taller than me.
So I'm like looking up at himand I remember thinking, was
this a mistake?
But then I just kind of wentfor it.
And then I had an old VHS tapeof that in the 80s which I
accidentally erased at one point.

(02:58):
No, and time went by.
The internet became a thing,youtube became a thing, youtube
became a thing and someone foundthat clip and posted it on
YouTube.
And I must say, much to myregret, because I look at that
tape and I'm like that is a veryawkward.
I'm not the suave character youhear right now, tom, I was a

(03:20):
gangly, awkward youth, but it'shistory and that was my brush
with greatness.
But then it was quite a whilebefore I would appear on
television again as aprofessional actor.
So that's the Letterman story.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
Is the Letterman, I guess is that what started your
interest in doing this.
Like you got up there and justkind of in the back of your mind
was like you know, I couldprobably take over late night.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
They don't need letterman well, I gotta say I
was.
I was interested, I was drawnto acting and at that time I was
going to a community college innew jersey, uh, and doing a lot
of plays there and also doinglike community theater and stuff
.
So I was very drawn to actingas an amateur.
But at that time, at 19, Ithought I wanted to be like

(04:10):
something else, like I wasstudying graphic arts in school
and I was a cartoonist and Ithought I wanted to do something
like be an artist or a graphicdesigner or something, and I
just acted for fun.
But eventually the acting iswhere all my energy went.
But I do remember that momentvery well.

(04:31):
It was certainly my first timein a TV studio.
Do you remember the joke?
I do remember the joke wassomething to the effect that the
New York prison system hadinstituted a lottery and I think
in real life the lottery wassome sort of parole thing.

(04:51):
Right, if your name came up,you might be eligible for parole
early if they thought you weresuitable.
So that was the concept.
The New York prison system hadinstituted a lottery.
Then the punchline was inmatescan win a chance at a brutal
crime spree.
It's very Letterman joke.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
Yeah, that's a pretty Letterman, kind of sounded joke
.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yeah, yeah, and the phrase brutal crime spree is
very Letterman, I remember Ilove Letterman, so I tried to
put kind of a stress on that.
You know, kind of italicizethose brutal, brutal crime spree
.
But I was young and nervous andawkward and I didn't sell it
particularly well.
And then he kind of did a akind of okay, kid, why don't you
just get back up there?

Speaker 1 (05:35):
that's like uh, there's great moments like that.
I gotta say that's.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
That's a tribute to what that show was at that time,
late night with david lettermanpre-cbs the original 12 30 nbc
show.
Very early in that show'shistory.
It had only been on one or twoyears and there was a anything
can happen quality to that show.
I don't think he would haveinvited someone down on the cbs
show later, like in the 90s.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
No, I think at that point, probably not.
Which?

Speaker 2 (06:03):
is not it which is.
I don't have a problem withthat.
He changed the style of theshow, changed somewhat, but
there was a real unpredictablequality to Late Night with David
Letterman and so that was sortof in keeping with the spirit of
that show.
He just let crazy things happenand he was still a master
broadcaster and comedian later,but I think he was less

(06:26):
interested in that sort ofanarchy, that kind of loose
filming, what's that?

Speaker 1 (06:32):
that kind of like loose filming and show set up
was just like oh, you know, oh,you think you could do better.
Will you come up here?
And just you know, people arecoming right out of the audience
.
Yeah, that's like with the whohe always interacted.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
He's always interacted with audiences.
He would always do things wherehe'd come up and talk to people
, so that was part of hisvocabulary.
But yeah, I was young and I wasjust thrilled to be there and I
just saw my moment.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
Do you think you'd ever do a recreation Like we get
David Letterman and it's like,hey, we're going to do a, do a
throwback, we're gonna do it onemore time and have you come up
now?

Speaker 2 (07:06):
I mean I, I, uh, I think I would be.
If I ever met him again, Iguess I'd have to bring it up
right have you met him?
Since I'm not proud of it.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
No, no, never, no he's got to remember it.

Speaker 2 (07:18):
I'm sure he does it's possible, but he did a lot of
shows.
So you know that was somethingI'll never forget.
But you know he's he's he'sdone a lot, so it it may not
ring a bell for him.
It was, it was 40 years ago.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
My god, oh man I remember letting him I mean I'm
lackable march of time yeah, hekeeps marching on and on and on
every year I get up and on abirthday and it's like man why
does my knee hurt now, or myneck, or my back.
Now, looking at all thesetelevision credits or film
credits, there's a couple ofcredits that stuck out to me in

(07:54):
a different genre that I wantedto talk about first Video games.

Speaker 2 (07:59):
Ah, yes, I've done a few.
This is funny because in reallife I don't really play any
video games.
It's slightly generational.
As I said, I was 19 in 1983, sothey weren't a thing back then.
I do know people my age who areinto them.
I just never kind of got intothem.
But you know, I'm an actor andI do do voiceovers now and then,

(08:24):
and so I've done a few voiceson games and then another irony
is that my wife is the artdirector at a video game company
, so she actually works in theindustry oh, does she.
And that company actually hiredme to do some voices once.
And I've gotten some other VOgigs through the connections
I've met through my wife.
But yes, so I've done voices inseveral, but I haven't played

(08:48):
them.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
It might be, I guess, the generational thing.
My parents their big gamingexperience was Nintendo 64.
Sure, and I'd wake up in themiddle of the night.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
I'm kind of weird.
I don't like games in general,like if I'm with a group and
they bring in a board game Iwill play, but I'm not very
competitive in that kind ofthing.
I just sort of audit the game.

Speaker 1 (09:14):
Well, we try to be competitive, but then it just
descends in the anarchy andmadness as we start yelling at
each other or just giving eachother, or we just end up having
a whole conversation while we'rejust mindlessly playing and
then all of a sudden all of usdied.
And we look around it's like,oh, we were doing, oh whoops.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
You know what I like to play time is the game of life
.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
That's, that's, that's the game I like to play.
I want that as an audio clipbutton, the way you said that
was master not that I mean loveybut just for anybody who's
listening and doesn't haveaccess, to just look this up
immediately.
I mean credits for video games,manhunts one into and that's
going to my youth avatar thegame for the.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
James Cameron film.
I forgot about that oneActually fallout.
Vegas Fallout.
New Vegas is a popular one.
A lot of people like that one.
I play a character named dr o,who is also known as dr zero,
and uh, that's a popular one.
I'm also in the new uh uh, thenew republic, the star wars

(10:17):
video game, where I play uh a uh, an android c2d4 or needles not
c3po.
He's got different letters andnumbers, but you know a sort of
high strong android I mean we'vegot the code name steam the
magic circle destiny 2, thefinal shape, the big expansion

(10:40):
that came out not long ago Imean I've done, all done, all
these things, but I, I, I go in,I record and then that's that,
and then other people play them.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
I will say there's been a huge uptick in uh actors
who you know in film and ontelevision shows coming in to do
video game voiceovers.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
Oh sure, and because they, a lot of them, have gotten
very sophisticated you know andcinematic.
And so they'll get you know andtheir vocal performances become
important.
So, yeah, I don't have anythingagainst them and and and you
know, obviously I justpersonally don't really play
them and.
But you know, I've done a lotof TV procedurals but like I

(11:23):
haven't seen every episode ofLaw Order or whatnot, I don't
think I've ever met a personwho's ever seen every episode of
Law.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
Order.
I don't think it's possible towatch all of it in one lifetime
in this game of life, exactly.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
Now going back to the acting career itself.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
you said you started out in theater.
Oh yeah, what was your firsttheater experiences?
I myself had not acted in astage play, but I stood on stage
and did a podcast once, andthat's as close as I've ever
gotten to acting well, I gottasay before I thought about doing
this as a little kid.

Speaker 2 (11:54):
Just in elementary school, I was in some school
plays and stuff and I was verydrawn to it.
Looking back, I know that I was.
You know, it's a funny thingwhen you're a kid sometimes
you're drawn to stuff you don'teven know why and then later it
becomes important to you as anadult, like whatever.
Someone becomes an astronomer,and when they were a kid there
was looking at the sky.

(12:15):
You know, before you thinkabout career, there's stuff that
you're just drawn to.
It's like in your DNA.
So I think I did have a verystrong connection with
performing.
I enjoyed doing it as a kidnever professionally, just like
school plays.
You know stuff we did in class,doing little skits in school or
whatever but I was alwaysreally drawn to that.

(12:37):
And then when I went to thiscollege I started doing.
I really started getting intoit.
I did a lot of plays, but eventhen, like I said, I was
thinking about doing othersomething else for a living,
like being an artist orsomething.
But then eventually the theaterjust took over.
And then the big event of mylife was I met a theater

(12:58):
director long story short, awoman named Karen Coonrod and
she was.
At the time I met her.
She was going to ColumbiaUniversity to get a master's in
theater directing.
She'd actually been a teacheran English teacher in New Jersey
but she actually starteddirecting plays at the school

(13:20):
and then thought wait a minute,I like this, maybe this is what
I should be doing directing Can.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
I get paid to do this .
What's that it's like?
Can I get paid to do this?

Speaker 2 (13:29):
Can I get paid to do something that I'm really
energized by and love Exactly,and that point.
you're off to the races, so Iwas about to kind of switch
careers or was switching careers, and I was a young slacker, I
think at that point I'd likestopped going to college and
dropped out.
But I was just working day jobsand hanging out with my friends

(13:50):
on the Jersey Shore, but alwaysdoing like amateur plays and
community theater and stuff.
And so I met this person whowas really serious about doing
this and we're in New Jersey andshe said, well, I want to form
a theater company, I want to goto New York and start a company.
And then a little light bulbwent off and I thought you know
what this makes sense?

(14:12):
And so that's what brought meinto New York.
So then we started producingourselves.
It was kind of like being in aband, like you know low budget
affair.
We had a core people that wework with.
But then at that time in newyork it was a very supportive
and active so-calledoff-off-broadway community, like

(14:33):
people doing most of the stuff.
It was downtown in manhattanand it was really an exciting
time where people were doing,you know, original plays and
classic plays for very littlemoney.
But there were spaces.
This is a long time ago.
This is like late 80s into theearly to mid 90s New York has

(14:54):
changed so much Like mostcompanies, I think, have gotten
priced out of Manhattan.
But back then we could actuallylike rent a space and do a
little show and slowly butsurely we got attention.
So that's when it started beingserious for me.
But back then it was just aboutdoing these plays and work and
meeting other people downtown.

(15:14):
In fact last night I went to aplay in la by a great theater
company I have a funny.
They're called elevator repairservice, but they're a wonderful
theater company.
They're called Elevator RepairService, but they're a wonderful
theater company that do theseoriginal plays and they started
out like around the time Istarted out and they still exist
.
Like you know, 30 odd yearslater they're still doing these

(15:39):
wonderful plays and same guydirects them, a brilliant guy
named John Collins.
So a lot of my oldest friendsare people I met on that scene
and many of whom are stillinvolved in that.
But then one thing led toanother.
I was in New York and you justkind of you put yourself in that
position.
You just meet people andeventually I met some
independent film directors andthat so the door opened up to

(16:01):
doing some film and theneventually I got an agent and
all that and one thing kind ofled to another.
But I basically spent my 20sdoing like low budget theater in
new york, quite happily, andand we're and always working day
jobs.
Uh, my day job was temping.
I would temp in offices doinglike secretarial work as someone
who's from.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
I did like the typing thing as someone who's from new
york myself uh, 90s, 2000s, newyork just hearing the stories
of 1980s new york it's like itwas an.
It was like a movie to everyone, like the way people just talk
about how?

Speaker 2 (16:35):
yeah, I mean it was back then kind of the pre yeah,
because I moved in in the late80s, sort of right before
giuliani and the so-calleddisneyfication of manhattan.
You know it was still like some70s holdover.
It was a little grungier backthen had a little bit like, if
you were.
If you weren't looking to buydrugs.

(16:55):
You didn't go past avenue a.
It was considered a littlescary, you know now.
Now that's all like you knowcoffee shops the farther north.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
you went into Manhattan it was kind of like,
eh you sure?

Speaker 2 (17:08):
Yeah yeah, A lot has changed, but that's the nature
of the city.
I'm very glass half full aboutNew York.
Like you know, a lot of oldtimers go oh, it's not as good
as it used to be.
And I feel, yeah, everyone saidthat People in the 1950s were
like, yeah, but you should haveseen Manhattan in the 30s.
It was much better, you know.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
People in the 1700s were looking back going man,
those guys in the 1600s theyreally had it.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
That's right, and it just goes on and on and on.
They knew what New York wasabout.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Everybody.
New York is New York.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
I love that city but I live in L now but I get back
there fairly.
I was there a couple of monthsago and I love it.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
I feel bad.
I have not been back since Ileft in 2006.

Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah, I still have family there and in New Jersey
and, like I say, a lot offriends and also just work comes
up fairly.
They shoot a lot of stuff there, so I'll get like TV or movie
gigs there.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Now, with your theater acting credits or your
experiences in the 1980s andthese kind of like off-broadway
productions and a lot of, uh,community college stuff that you
guys were doing back in the 80sand the 90s, what was your,
you'd say, your probably mostchallenging play you had to
perform in?

Speaker 2 (18:21):
well, Well, I can tell you what that was A great
play by a great writer namedWill Eno.
It's a play called Tom Paine.
But it's not about thehistorical.
You know.
There's a guy named Tom Paine,revolutionary War.
Yeah, it's not about him, it'smore of a play on words.
It's a guy who might be namedTom, who's in some kind of pain.
But Tom Paine is a solo play,it's a one-man show, so it's

(18:45):
like an hour and 15-minutemonologue, so it's just this
character talking to theaudience and it's a really great
play.
This guy is like talking to theaudience and then you start
learning about him and he'sfunny.
But he's also kind of neuroticand sometimes he gets kind of
aggressive and acts like anasshole to the audience and all

(19:08):
this stuff is going on.
It's this sort of reallyinteresting character study by a
really talented writer who'salso a very funny writer.
So there's also a lot of jokesin the play and in fact the new
york times reviewed it and theysort of said the character is
almost like a stand-up.
You know the way he.
But it there's no ad-libbing,there's it's.
It was scripted, so I had tolearn a freaking hour and 15

(19:32):
minute monologue.
I forget how many pages thatwas.
You have to know all thesewords and then you have, and
then it's just you.
So normally when you're acting,you're part of the choices you
make are based on what otheractors are doing.
You know when you're respondingto each other and now and then
you have a breather, you cantemper your performance.
You know what I'm saying you canpull like a richard harris but

(19:54):
we had a great director and agreat writer and we figured it
out and that that was verysatisfying creatively, but also
obviously like a great challengeto just be up there by yourself
.
You're like, well, it's just me, so I better know what I'm
doing up here.
We worked hard on that play andit was very well received and

(20:15):
it went very well, but that wasdefinitely like one of the most
challenging and satisfying playsI've ever done.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
Tom Payne, I mean that's got to be a very
rewarding experience to be ableto do an hour plus monologue.
One man play, it's just you andyou got all this whole audience
are all just staring right atyou and you're going through the
gauntlet of emotion, to nailthe certain aspects of the
character and convey it to anaudience.

Speaker 2 (20:40):
It was up to a fun thing in the writing where it's
not really explained why thecharacter is talking to people.
It's just like he's some guyand he suddenly finds himself in
front of an audience so hestarts talking about his life,
you know, uh, kind of like astand-up would.
Except the writing is much more.
It's just different.
It's a different style, youknow.
But there's also a thing wherethe character will like stop,

(21:02):
he'll forget something, he'llget a new idea, he'll get
distracted.
And we really tried to make itseem like there was a balance
where sometimes people would belike is james or benny act
forgetting something or having amoment, or is it the car?
It was always the character,but the idea was to make those
moments so real that it gave thesort of weird tension to the

(21:24):
performance you know, becausethat was what the character was
like.
He was kind of one of theseclassic unreliable narrators,
you know.
So he would like he would sortof trip up now and then and and
it was interesting.
So yeah, there was a lot toplay with in that show and I I
learned a lot doing that.
That I apply to you know, otherstuff where, you know, not solo

(21:45):
performances just because it'sa real workout when you're doing
.
You know, theater requires sortof different muscles than like
film and tv.
So that was like a veryrigorous kind of workout.

Speaker 1 (21:59):
It was a great experience a few uh actors we
had talked to in the past whohad done had theater experience
and then had transitioned intofilmmaking or television movies.
It's like learning how to walkall over again.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
Oh, totally yeah, because when I had done like
theater in New York for about 10years before I did a film, you
know.
So yeah, I had been actingpretty seriously for a while and
then pretty much through my 20sand then when I got into my 30s
I started to have someopportunities to act on film.
And you start, you just kind oflearn.

(22:33):
You know there are things youcan do.
You start learning some tricksand some, you know, technique
that suits film, you know.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
But as an actor you're still basically trying to
do the same thing was there any, like, I guess, old guard kind
of people around that like kindof pull you aside and, like you
know, like basically just putyou under the wing.
It's like, hey, kid, likeyou're doing great, you know,
try this well I gotta say yeah.

Speaker 2 (22:59):
Another sort of mentor for me was a great film
director.
He is a great film directorhe's still making stuff named
hal hartley, who's a newyork-based director.
He's worked in the like theindependent film world since the
early 90s and actually thefirst film I ever did was a
short that hal made like 1994that parker posey was in,

(23:23):
because it was the 90s in NewYork and you had to have Parker
in it.

Speaker 1 (23:27):
Is it New York City 3-94?
It's listed out as a short film.

Speaker 2 (23:35):
That's not the first one, but that's another short I
did around that time that yearin 94, I did a couple.
Yeah, it's called Opera no 1.
It was a short, kind of acomedic, short musical thing.
I sing in that but we're alldubbed so we're not actually
doing our own singing in that.
But yeah, and then a couple ofyears later Hal put me in a

(23:58):
movie called Henry Fool, whichwas really my first big movie.
That I mean it was anindependent movie, relatively
low budget, but it came out andit got reviewed like in major
publications and it played intheaters.
So that was sort of my uh.
I did a couple low budgetmovies before that, but that was

(24:20):
.
That was one where I reallylearned a lot and Hal was a very
good director.
Hal's interesting because heused to go to a lot of that
theater.
I'm talking about that kind ofoff-Broadway theater at that
time.
That's where he saw me.
He saw me do some theaterdowntown and a lot of his actors
came out of that world.
But he also was a very smartfilm director.
So on the set when he directedhe would give me some good

(24:42):
advice now and then like, try itthis way.
It's almost a cliche to say doless.
But he would say that sometimesbecause you know, sometimes you
can be more effective in amovie by withholding an emotion
than showing it, because thenyou're sort of.
Then the camera sees thecharacter struggling with
something.

(25:04):
Sometimes that's moreinteresting than just like I'm
suffering, you know, instead oflike screaming it out like I'm
I'm in deep shit you know, inthe theater sometimes the bigger
gesture is good because you'rein a big theater and you want to
fill the stage.
You know what I mean.
But sometimes and there arethere are exceptions to both
these roles.
But so he was very good athelping me sort of temper my
instincts and kind of adapt tobeing in a movie and I learned a

(25:26):
lot working with him as someoneI worked with very early in my
film career who's a very smartguy who understood sort of film
language and stuff.
So yeah, he hal was definitelyand he was a little older than
me so he was definitely I meanhe was not that much older than
me but he was definitely like amentor to me and he was
definitely like the hey kid,like I mean like an older kind

(25:48):
of brother.

Speaker 1 (25:49):
Yeah, it's like hey, kid, you're effing it up out
there, you're bombing, get ittogether, but he's an awesome
guy and he's still out theremaking stuff I write.

Speaker 2 (25:57):
If people don't know his work, I recommend it.
The movie we made is calledhenry fool, but I've done a few
things with him but I reallyrecommend his stuff.
It's really good andinteresting and very funny.
Well, I'll definitely have tocheck him out, and we'll
recommend him on the podcast andplug his stuff to later on at
the end and this interview islike a list of these people who
are very important to me, whokind of taught me stuff.

(26:19):
It's a theme here.

Speaker 1 (26:22):
One question I do love to ask people because
everybody's always had differentexperiences and seen and done a
lot of different things andit's always fun to ask this
question what was your big starstruck moment?
Where you're kind of like oh mygod, that's so and so.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
So I've met.
You know, when you're an actorI'm just a working actor.
I'm not like famous, like TomHanks or whatever, but I do
stuff and people know who I amin the industry.
So now and then you rubshoulders with famous people.
So I've met some famous people.
I've met Tom Cruise, I'veworked with Steven Spielberg,
you know blah blah, and it'sgreat.

(26:59):
Those are fun experiences.
But normally when I meetsomeone it's usually in a work
environment or at some industryevent.
So if I feel comfortabletalking to these people because
I'm not like a guy in the streetjust running up to them, you
kind of feel like, oh well,we're in the, we're both
supposed to be in this room so Ican talk to bruised or whatever
you know, uh, and so you kindof play cool, you're kind of

(27:23):
like relaxed and I'm usuallyvery happy to meet these people.
But I'm like, yeah, we're bothin the same business.
But the one time I was like a, ablabbering fan boy who could
not control my excitement andthis is very generational is the
first time I met a member ofmonty python.

(27:43):
I met eric idol.
No way, you met eric, yeah, inla a few years ago.
Um and uh, I was just like itwas like meeting a beetle, it
was like meeting paul mccartneyor some.
Because for my generation inparticular, I like I was in
junior high when monty pythonstarted showing on american tv.

(28:04):
It showed on pbs and you knowit's such a brilliant funny show
and it was like unlike anythingand you know we'd ever seen,
and so I met him and I was justflabbergasted, because normally
I'm like, hey, great to meet you, you know I'm james rubin.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
I'm james and I was like I.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
It's so nice to meet you, mr I hi, mr brave, brave
sir robert I was just, I wasstunned.
I was beside myself and he, Igotta say he was very, very nice
.
He was very gentlemanly andvery, very kind, but that was,
that was the most starstruckI've been.
And since then I've met TerryGilliam and the late Terry Jones

(28:46):
.
I had the pleasure of meetingTerry Jones, another great
Python.
He sadly died relatively young.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
I think he died in the last five years.

Speaker 2 (28:58):
When I met those guys I was thrilled to meet them
both, but I'd already met one.
Python Idol was like you know.
I popped my cherry with thatone.
But yeah, that was 100% themost excited I'd been to meet a
famous person was Eric Idol fromArnie Python.

Speaker 1 (29:13):
I mean I have the movies.

Speaker 2 (29:15):
I have.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
Flying Circus, like the whole box set.
Oh, forget about it.

Speaker 2 (29:19):
I'd lose it if I saw one of them in real life and I'm
one of those annoying, nerdymiddle-aged men who can, like,
quote the entirety of theirmovies and sketches.
You know, you gotta shut me up,it's not good like they, like,
they forgot what they did.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
It's like you were in this, I know that was a big one
I know there's a it's kind oflike a running gag, uh where a
lot of people mistake eric.
Idol for michael palin and Isuppose if you're not as serious
a fan, you might make thatmistake, though I would never
like you and eric idol hastalked about it because it

(29:53):
happens to him all the timewhere people walk up and go, hey
, like you're in money, butyou're um senior travel shows.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
You're michael palin and then he's like once they
call me michael, I immediatelyinsult them, tell them to f off
and I yeah, that's right thisway, because I'm slowly ruining
michael palin's reputationthat's fantastic, and michael
palin has the reputation ofbeing like the nicest python you
know.

Speaker 1 (30:13):
Yes, he does versus eric is, I guess, a little more.
I know I'd love to meet.

Speaker 2 (30:16):
I mean I'd love to meet michael and I'd love to
meet John Cleese.
Obviously Then I'd have metthem all.
Couldn't meet Graham Chapmanbecause he died very young In
1989.
Yeah, something like that.

Speaker 1 (30:28):
Yeah, so being a, fan of the Pythons, I guess would
that make you a fan of FawltyTowers.

Speaker 2 (30:33):
Oh, totally.
I mean, john Cleese isfantastic.
John Cleese may be the bestactor of the Pythons, just in
terms of range pound per pound,just in terms of acting ability.
Uh, but he's hilarious.
You know, I know he's becomekind of an.
You know he's old, he's like acrank on twitter.

(30:54):
Sometimes he seems a littlelike boring.
Oh, you can't laugh at anythinganymore.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
It's like just relax, man, you're, everything's fine
and he's like coming from theguy who was the first person to
say the f word on televisionyeah, I mean I, you know, I just
take that stuff with a grain ofsalt, but I would be.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
I mean I would be thrilled to meet him, or michael
palin for that matter.

Speaker 1 (31:15):
You know, I'd hope I'd have it together enough to
be like hey, I know you, you'rethis person, I'm a huge fan, you
have a great day.
Instead of yeah, you know,hopefully standing just kind of
like and everybody's like, areyou going to say something?
It's like how long have I beenstanding here staring at this
guy?

Speaker 2 (31:28):
for 10 minutes, I call him by his right name yes I
would hopefully call him,unless I'm feeling mischievous
and I'm like michael cain.
It's so great to meet you.
I would love to meet mich Caine.
Call him some other BritishNick.

Speaker 1 (31:45):
Call Maurice McElwight, just to throw
everybody off.
Yeah, there you go, his actuallegal name.

Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
Now looking through some of your TV credits, there's
a show that I noticed on herethat's pretty popular.
I'm sure a few people have seenit the Venture Bros.
The Venture, yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
The Venture Brothers, the Venture Brothers, and you
play.
A few people have seen it theventure bros, the venture.

Speaker 1 (32:02):
yeah, the venture brothers, the venture brothers
and you play dr venture, phantomlimb, jonas venture jr and
various voices and that show'sbeen going on for 15 years.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
That show, yeah that the pilot for that premiered
about 20 years ago and then, uh,there, there were seven seasons
and a sort of finale movie thatwe made, uh, but there was
often a very long turnaroundbetween seasons.
It was a small staff really, itwas written mostly by just two

(32:32):
guys and uh, so sometimes it'dbe a couple years between
seasons, which is why we hadonly seven seasons, but it's
been on for over 20 years, uh,but my god, that's been one of
the great gigs of all time,because I love the show.
Do you know the show, thomas,do you?

Speaker 1 (32:49):
I've seen bits, and the one scene that, for for some
reason, lives rent free in mymind is uh, they're doing the
cavity search on brock samson'scharacter yeah and he asked for
the cigarette and they take itand they just give him the
business and he clenches witheverything he's got and breaks
the dude's hand and startsswinging him around very brock

(33:12):
played by patrick warburton.

Speaker 2 (33:13):
The great patrick warburton or putty putty from
nine fell in so many greatthings and the family guy but I
remember watching that.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
I remember when Venture Bros came out on Adult
Swim, Because at that time in mylife it was very much like what
are you doing?
Why are you watching Adult Swim?
You're not an adult, You're alittle kid.
You're supposed to be asleepalready and these shows would
come on.
It'd be Venture Bros and RobotChicken and stuff like that.
And I remember, I like wakingup.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
It's like, oh crap, the venture bros are on and it's
weird that 20 years later I'mtalking to one of the actors.
That's my longest running joband and you know it's a classic
cult show.
A lot of people don't know itbut, uh, most people, who most
of the fans, are like diehardfans.
It's like it's.
It's in my experience peopleeither love it or they're uh,
they're like what is it?
Oh yeah, I think I've heard ofthat, but those who love it

(34:05):
really love it and we have avery loyal and devoted fan base
and that there is a thing where,because it had been on for so
long, there's like whole newgenerations of you know people
who are like you know it'sim.
There's some mild adult content, so not everyone saw it when
they were a kid.

Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yeah.
Adult Swim has been on for solong and just like the shows
I've seen come across, thatchannel is over 20-something
years of my life.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Yeah, it's very early in the original Adult Swim
programming, you know, back inthe OG days, but I loved being a
part of that.
That was just a happy situationwhere I got that because
jackson public, the creator ofthat show, was a friend of a
friend of mine in new york.
So, uh, I just met him throughthis friend and then he had seen

(34:58):
me act and he just thought ofme for that part.
So there's no addition, whichwas awesome.
Jackson was just like I'mmaking this pilot, do you want
to play this character?

Speaker 1 (35:08):
And I thought Are you going to give me?

Speaker 2 (35:10):
money.
Yeah, sure, it wasn't evenabout the money.
I wasn't even that much moneyat that time.
You know, it was just like wewere going to this pilot which
might just be a one off, youknow, maybe pilot which might
just be a one-off.
You know, maybe it'll never seethe light of day, but then lo
and behold, it's been ontelevision for 20 years and then
, 20 years later, I'm stilltalking about it and yeah, I I
go.
I do a little bit of conventioncircuit work, like comic-con,

(35:32):
and I go to other conventionsnow and then where I'll do like
sign pictures and stuff, andpeople are always very, very
happy to meet dr venture, whichis very nice.
Because nice, because it's niceto connect with the fans.
I got to tell you this is notreally a humble brag, this is
just a straight up brag.
Please brag Brag away.
I was because a humble brag iscouched in a self-deprecating

(35:55):
way, but this is not couchedthat way.
I was doing it.

Speaker 1 (35:58):
So I did a movie with Al Pacino.

Speaker 2 (36:00):
It's called.
It's called you Don't Know,jack.
It's from a few years ago.
It's like an HBO film aboutJack Kevorkian, the like suicide
doctor guy.
Remember that guy, dr Kevorkian?
Yeah, so Al Pacino did.
It's a really good movie,directed by Barry Levinson,
about Dr Kevorkian, and I have anice little part in that where
I play a journalist in Detroit,where Kevorkian was from, and I

(36:22):
actually have a couple sceneswith Pacino which was a whole
other story, which was amazing.
I'd love to hear that story too.
Point of the story, point ofthis story is I'm in the makeup
chair and there's a makeup ladyand she's very nice.
We're chatting.
She's like so what else haveyou done?
And I'm like I did this adult.
I'm on this adult swim showcalled the venture brothers and
she does what she stops.

(36:43):
She's like what, wait, wait,who are you?
And I go oh, I'm dr venture.
And she literally like turnsaround, like oh, yeah, yeah,
like she can't believe it, youknow.
And then she said to me shegoes.
She says james, you have tounderstand, al pacino sits in
this chair every morning.
I am more starstruck meeting DrVenture than meeting Al Pacino.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
That is the level.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
And for a working actor like me who's not super
famous, for someone to say I'mmore excited meeting Dr Venture
than Al Pacino, I'm like.
Well, I'll take it.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
That's a.
That is one hell of acompliment to be paid I made my
day.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
But that is one hell of a compliment to be paid.
I made my day it was.
But that is the nature of thefans.
They're so into the show.
It really kind of connects withpeople in a in a wonderful way,
but it's a really fun if peoplehaven't seen it, I mean.

Speaker 1 (37:34):
I mean I'd recommend the show.
It's really great.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
It's really stable if it don't swim and it has like
the characters actually havelike a dimension and you get to
care about them as the years,seasons go on.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
They pitched you this show and you're just sitting
there like it's doing the pilotand you're reading that first
script, but you're just kind oflooking through, going what the
hell is the show?

Speaker 2 (37:54):
Well, I kind of got.
I got the basic idea from thebeginning, which, when it was
conceived, it was basically aparody of Johnny quest, which is
the old sixties cartoon about aboy adventurer and his you know
, his adventurer dad.
And then I got that the conceptwas okay.
So dr venture is like a johnnyquest who's grown up.
His super cool adventure fathercasts a big shadow over him.

(38:19):
He's not as successful as hisfather.
So he's like grown-up, bitter,middle-aged johnny quest and not
as successful as his father.
So he's like grown up, bitter,middle aged Johnny Quest.
And then he's got his own kids,but he's an asshole to them and
his kids are idiots.
So I got the basic premise thatit's like a parody of the
Johnny Quest thing.
But then the show just went off.
Then the show created its ownuniverse.

(38:41):
It has its whole own world andand then, uh, you know where, to
the point where there's so muchdetail that I it's hard for me
to keep up.
Once, uh, doc hammer, who's theco-writer of the show, and I
were at a convention and we weredoing an appearance.
We did like a q a and then thepeople running the convention

(39:04):
had an idea and they're likewe're going to do a venture
brothers trivia contest and it'sgoing to be you and doc versus
the audience.
Oh so the moderator read trivialike what was the name of this
one character, and the audiencetotally won doc, and I often
could not remember stuff.
We're like I don't know Utahand the audience is like episode

(39:26):
seven.

Speaker 1 (39:27):
you know blah blah Well, in season five, episode
six, at exactly 12 minutes and34 seconds in.
Yes, exactly, but that wasgreat because people really, you
know people retain it and acareer span where you are more
exciting to talk to than AlPacino, I mean for that lady

(39:48):
anyway.
For that lady I mean lookthrough Oppenheimer, the Office,
the Venture Bros, law Order,sex and the City, all these
credits, video games, and youbeat out Panic in Needle Park.
The Godfather.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
Heat S park.
The godfather heat son of awoman.
Yeah well, he's amazing, he'sgreat he's one of my favorites.

Speaker 1 (40:09):
a small anecdote, I guess uh, my wife, she has not
really, uh, seen as many pacinofilms as I have.
And now she's looking at me upfrom the couch and starting to
smirk because she knows exactlywhat I'm about to say.
Uh, we were sitting there.
I was like, oh, have you everseen the movie Heat?
And I was like it's like DeNiro and Pacino together and
they're on screen together, notlike in Godfather Part 2 where

(40:30):
you just get the flashbacks.
And I was like you just, andshe was starting to doze off and
I was like you gotta watch thepart and Al cocaine-fueled rage
turn and yells at the guys likeshe's got a great ass, that's
right.
And it's become a joke in thishouse for months now of because

(40:51):
and you can hear someone in theother room just start doing the
rumble it's like she's got itand you know, splunge this
appicino impression that's anamazing moment, because if you
look at that, if you look at itjust as a screenplay, that's
just like a Jerry Orbeck LawOrder type wisecrack.

(41:12):
Yeah with that kind of look onhis face and the sunglasses with
the lube.

Speaker 2 (41:15):
Yeah, he's like.
You know what's-his-face issitting there in the chair and
Pacino is Chris.
I'm spacing out, but you knowthe famous actor from the
Simpsons who's?
And if we had an audiencethey'd be yelling.

Speaker 1 (41:35):
They'd be yelling.
The answer out is right now.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
If we had an audience , yes, now that everyone is
yelling the answer.

Speaker 1 (41:42):
I can't think of who it is.
I'm totally blanking uh, uh.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
This is what happens in my old age stuff starts to uh
, stuff starts to fade away onme hank azaria yes hank azaria.
My god, his name starts with ana.
I should have just gone throughthe alphabet.
Uh, hank azaria is this guy andthey're trying to solve this
stuff.
And and they're like hey,they're talking about some woman

(42:07):
who's you know.
And and uh, and hank azaria islike I don't know, I don't have
the answer for you.
And and and then the cop,pacino's character, says yeah,
because she had a great ass andyou had your head up.
It Like that's.
That's like if that was on Lawand Order, jerry Orbeck would
just throw that away.

(42:27):
Yeah, cause she had a great assand you had your head up.
You know that's what that lineis.
But Pacino makes it into a fivecourse meal, an opera.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
It's its own mini show.

Speaker 2 (42:39):
And then Michael Mann shoots him from below, so it's
even more heightened.
You know she had a great.
I mean that's a legendarymoment.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
It's taking a throwaway line and turning it
into its own mini film.

Speaker 2 (42:51):
Totally.

Speaker 1 (42:52):
That's what I love about it, the only other person,
I think who could do it andit'd be as memorable would
probably Christopher Walken.

Speaker 2 (42:58):
Just because it'd be another, do it.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
Because it's spectacular, or something like
that.
Um, yeah, exactly.
And uh, another guy who, earlyin his career, would have done
it like that is gary oldman, whooften went for the big choice.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
Yes, he would especially like uh leon, the
professional gary old forget it.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
I mean, that's one of the great and it's funny
because I was talking about likeless is more tends to be the
thing in film, but these areclassic exceptions Gino and Heat
, oldman and the Professionalyou know a lot of Nick Cage.
He gets very big in a beautifulway.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
These are all really talented actors and his best
line is a subtle line.
I'm gonna steal the declarationof independence like he doesn't
just yell, it's like we'regonna steal it.
It's like, all of a sudden,it's like that's what.
It's probably so funny thatit's nick cage, because you
expect like the wild kind ofzany cage, but for him to dial

(43:58):
it right back to one and just go, I'm gonna steal the
declaration Like he's Bond.
All of a sudden, it's like waitwhat?

Speaker 2 (44:04):
And again like yeah, and then, in contrast to like
she's got a great ass and youhad your head up and that's a
throwaway, but I'm going tosteal.
The declaration of independenceis a real big, that's an
exclamation point statement, sothat he goes the opposite.
That's the thing about theoriginal actors they.
So that's the thing about theoriginal actors.
They'll kind of they'll tripyou up, they'll do, they won't
do what you expect.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
So in your experience , as you get scripts and do you
kind of look for that line whereit's like a throwaway, it's
like hmm, it's like maybe Icould put something extra into
this.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
A little bit, yeah.
I mean, yeah, when you get ascript and you're going through
it, I tend to make notations andstuff Like I like to have a
hard copy, and then I take apencil and I just like I start
underlining things or I'll evenuse a highlighter, cause you,
you know, you just try to findvariation is what you're looking
for.
You're always trying to find avariation in what you're doing,

(44:56):
so you know.
So, yeah, you try to find, like, basically the thing that works
is you just try to make it yourown, whatever that is.
So another actor might have goneas big as pacino on that line,
but maybe it wouldn't be aseffective because that just
seems to come out of pacino'senergy and personality, you know
.
So you kind of want to kind ofdo something that you know is

(45:21):
true to yourself.
But the fact is we all containmultitudes, as wall whitman said
.
You know we any one of us, youknow, in any given moment of the
day can be big, can be small.
You know we all contain a lotof different emotion and
variation.
So it's just finding thosevariations, but trying to make
them your own so they ring true,as opposed to like just doing

(45:43):
an effect.
You know, like you reallybelieve, pacino is that guy and
he, you know he sells itperfectly.
He sells it because he's greatat that, but you know, he
doesn't always, he doesn'talways do the understated,
naturalistic thing and but itjust rings true, it doesn't seem
fake, it doesn't seem phony,it's just like this is the
energy of this character, he'slike this force, you know.

(46:05):
So that's the thing I try to do.
I think most actors do.
You just try to.
You try to find the unique wayof doing it that reflects
yourself.
But you don't want to be tootimid either, like you know.
If it seems right to be big, gogo big, try it you know a
director will always go.
Okay, we, the classic director,when they want a different take,

(46:25):
is they say we have that.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
All right, we have that now, thank you.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
Most directors are really good at people skills, so
they won't go.
James, that sucks, they'll go.
Okay, we have that, let's tryone smaller.
And we have that usually means,means.

Speaker 1 (46:45):
I don't know it's like, why don't we try that
again?
But you know, yeah, let's tryanother one a little different I
don't know, let it go this day.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
Yeah, don't less acting this time.
Okay, dial it back, rain it.
Usually they're right, becausethe director sees the big
picture.
Sometimes the actor just seesthat moment, but the director
sees it within a greater contextand that's important.

Speaker 1 (47:03):
It's important to have that, that eye, you know
definitely that's why they gotto be in the director's chair
and making sure it all is thatbig picture scope.
Now what you were saying withthe scripts and going through
and you're reading into acharacter, you're learning this
guy and you're making yourlittle notations like, all right
, maybe go big here, go there.
It's like, do you ever look atlines and go?

Speaker 2 (47:23):
I don't think my character would even say that
well, uh, I tend to just uh, itdepends on the context, because
that that's definitely a thingwhere you need a certain
connection.
You have to be at a point whereyou and the director, and

(47:48):
sometimes the writer, just havea kind of collaborative effort
or environment.
So yeah, so like, if I'm hiredby steven spielberg and and you
know, I don't have super highstatus on that set, I'm there to
do, you know, probably asmaller part and it's.

(48:11):
I'm just going to slow thingsdown if I go.
I don't think he'd say this,but, um, usually in that
situation you just figure outwhy he's saying this.
But I've done other films withdirectors.
Like I've worked withwriter-directors on lower budget
things where I have biggerparts and they say, like, if you

(48:31):
want to change the words or soI have had those discussions,
but when I know that it's coolto have them, you know.
When the timing feels right andit's a good moment to just work
that in yeah, and thepersonality that you can just
tell that they're like you know.
And that does happen to adegree in film, where there is
more of a looseness about thedialogue sometimes than like in

(48:53):
a play, where the text is sacred.
You know, you don't change.
It is word by word, in thatorder.

Speaker 1 (48:58):
Don't change Arthur Miller.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
Chekhov or whatever you know.
But yes, so I have done thatwhen I'm, when there is a sense
of give and take and that that'sconsidered cool to bring that
stuff up.
But you know, I feel likesometimes maybe actors do that
but it's just because theyhaven't figured out the key to

(49:20):
the scene.
So they're like can we changethis?
the uh but not always, butsometimes I have occasionally
seen actors who kind of slowthings down and they seem to be
doing kind of a power thing,where they just kind of want to
stop things because it's not somuch about solving the problem
of the scene as just them sortof showing some sort of power.

(49:40):
Oh, do you know what I mean?
I get what you mean.
So I'm very aware of sort ofwhere I fit into a given
environment and just wanting tobe it.
I'm very collaborative bynature but I mean I have, like I
say, done that where thedirector's open to it and it has

(50:01):
been a good experience.
**matt Staufferer Jr**.

Speaker 1 (50:03):
You have, mentioning that.
It brought up an anecdote andit's Python-esque Terry Gilliam,
when they were filming TimeBandits I can't remember the
actor's name who plays theSupreme being or God, but they
were- **Matt Staufferer Jr**Ralph Richardson.

Speaker 2 (50:16):
**matt Staufferer Jr** Ralph.

Speaker 1 (50:17):
Richardson.
I knew it was Richardson.
I didn't want to mess up hisfirst name.
I think it's Sir Ralph, Nowpassed away these many years.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
but a fantastic actor Awesome actor.

Speaker 1 (50:25):
And they were on set and they were looking at his
script to see something and hehad crossed out lines and
written his own in red.
And they were like why'd youcross these out?
And he was like God wouldn'tsay that.
With the most serious look onhis face that they believed him.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
They're like okay, ralph Richardson's serious look
on his face that they believedhim.
They're like, okay, yeah, well,you hire ralph richardson's, a
big shot.
So you hire him.
You're like go right ahead, sirralph, cross him out.
Also, there's related to that.
There's I think it was garycooper who would be like I want
less dialogue, I want less tosay, not more to say.
Or I don't want to change theline, I want no line, because he
knew that a lot of film actingcan be communicated just with a

(51:01):
look.
It makes maybe a character moreinteresting, especially if
you're a leading man guy.
If you say less, then thecamera just catches you, catches
your face and you're processingsomething and the audience is
sort of leaning in, going what'sgoing on?
What's this guy thinking, andthat can be very powerful.
So a smart movie actors knowthe dialogue it's not about how
many lines you have.
It can be very powerful.
So smart movie actors know thedialogue it's not about how many

(51:22):
lines you have.
It can be quite the opposite.
That can also be a very helpfulthing.
It's like make me say less.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
I don't want to talk that much.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
Yeah, yeah, because it's cinema, it's visual.
That's the primary thing aboutit.
And I love words and language.
I love playing characters whotalk a lot and have flowery
speeches.
I'm into that and I think Isell that stuff well.
But I also recognize that it'sa visual medium and sometimes
you can say more with a lookthan with a speech.

Speaker 1 (51:56):
Like John Wayne told Michael Caine years and years
ago.
He's like, hey, you're going tobe a star, but remember, talk
low, talk slow and don't everwear suede shoes.

Speaker 2 (52:07):
And I got to say John Wayne is a classic example of
that kind of acting, where youknow less is more.

Speaker 1 (52:14):
Less is definitely more, I think, with a classic
Western actor.
I mean, I grew up on the JohnWayne movies.
And it was always just Johnwayne in that moment.
It was never that really thatcharacter moves.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
He was a character yeah, well, he's one of those
guys who I mean, he does adapthis persona from film to film,
but there's basically a certainpersona and a certain way of
speaking that he brings toeverything.
And you know, that's the kindof leading actor style that I
enjoy watching.

(52:45):
And, on the other hand, I likethe chameleon actors like Daniel
Day-Lewis, or wherever DanielDay-Lewis doesn't have a persona
, he's whatever the character is.
He changes his voice, he looksdifferent.
You know John Wayne, you knowyou're going to get John Wayne,
daniel Day-Lewis, and they'reboth equally great.
They're just In differentaspects.
They are their Different styles.

(53:06):
It's like two different typesof music.
You'd be in a jazz and you'rein a rock and roll.
One's not better than the other, they're just different.

Speaker 1 (53:13):
Yeah, people are like oh, chicago is way better than
Led Zeppelin.
It's like well, it's likethey're both two fantastic
groups that were, you know,storied careers, but at the same
time it's like they're great,but in a different way yeah,
each other exactly and I knowHayden would kill me if I didn't
mention it and we bring it upand I wanted to save it for the

(53:33):
end.
Uh, wait, there's one actingcredit that popped up.
It's by his favorite directorthat you happen to star in is
oppenheimer oh yeah, I have asmall.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
I'm in it very briefly, but it was a great
experience.
Yeah, the great uh.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
Christopher nolan what was it like being on the
oppenheimer set for your brieftime?

Speaker 2 (53:56):
it was nice.
I, I mr known was was verypleasant, but he was more just
like, focused on the camera andstuff and there wasn't a lot of
discussion with me.
I play a colleague ofEinstein's and I'm in a scene
where Oppenheimer goes to talkto Einstein at the institute
where he works.
I'm there and but I got to sayCaelan Murphy was a real sweet

(54:21):
guy and, like I spent a fairamount of time talking to him
and I got to say he's amazing inthe movie, but he's, he's not
one of these guys who likes todo some character between shots,
like between shots.
He was talking in his normalIrish accent and he was just
very friendly and relaxed.
Oh yeah, how are you doing?
You know he's just talking toyou and then you're actually is

(54:42):
like, excuse me, mr Einstein,you know.

Speaker 1 (54:47):
I'm doctor Turn it on .

Speaker 2 (54:48):
He just turned it on Like the voice, that kind of
mid-Atlantic American accentthat he's doing in that movie,
and then cut and then he's justchill Killian again.
You know she'll kill you again.
Chill killian, chillian,william murphy, but that was
awesome.
Uh, it's just fun to be a partof something.
That was also great because youknow, when you're like me, I do

(55:12):
a lot of like, I tend to havebig parts in small movies and
small parts in big movies.
So, like oppenheimer is one ofthe biggest movies of that year
but I've been it very brieflyand when you're an actor you
tend to assume oh what if Idon't make the cut?
Like they don't really need mein that scene, maybe they'll cut
it out.
You know it's gonna be a longmovie.
So I didn't see the movie.

(55:34):
I didn't go to any screeningsbeforehand.
I paid a ticket and went to seeit.
you, know you paid to see a film, yeah, yeah, but you know this,
and there's a million people inthat movie.
They couldn't bring everyone tothe premiere or whatever, you
know.
Oh, and that was fine, that'snormal.
I don't mind that.
It's not an issue at all that Iwasn't on the red carpet for my
like one minute scene, but I'msitting there next to my wife

(55:59):
and I'm nervous.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
I'm like, yeah, but yeah, but maybe I won't even be
in it.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
And I wasted $15 on this fucking movie.
And then the scene showed upand like everything I shot is in
it, and even like a littlesilent moment where you just
kind of see me reacting tosomething.
So I thought, oh okay, good,that's nice.
And that Mr Nolan was like ohno, we can let this, this small
performance land.

(56:24):
We'll give this charactercredit, even though he's in it
very briefly.
Um, so that was really nice.
That was sort of, because youknow, my thing is, um, I once
heard a description of uh weredescribed as a pessimist who

(56:45):
likes to be surprised.

Speaker 1 (56:48):
I've heard that quote before, but I don't Steven.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
Soderbergh quoted a friend of his saying.
That's how he described himselfand that's kind of my approach
to acting.
You're like, well, maybe I'llget cut out because you kind of
have, you know, you audition forstuff you don't get it.
You can't really let it get toyou.
So you, at least I, tend tooperate with a bit of skepticism

(57:13):
, pessimism, not even pessimismso much as skepticism.
Let's amend that.
I'd say I'm a skeptic who likesto be surprised.
So you know, when you're anactor, when you're a working
actor, it's very common thatthings don't work out Like I
make a living at this and I'mvery happy and I am in a
privileged position, but I stillaudition every week for stuff I

(57:34):
don't get.
I have been cut out of thingsthat I shot and I'm excited
about that.
I'm not in it.
You're kind of just preparedfor something not working out.
So when you have a small partin a blockbuster and you don't
know if you're in it, it's justin your head.
But then when the scene goes by, you're like, ah, okay, good.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
When you popped up on screen, were you giving your
wife the nudge like hey look,it's me.

Speaker 2 (58:02):
Yeah, hi, oh, then I'm doing like a fist bump.

Speaker 1 (58:07):
It's like, yes, they kept me in the movie.
Yes, exactly Because the actingcareer of the trials and
tribulations.
It's like being a baseballplayer.
It's like you're going tostrike out.
There's no way, you're notgoing to, it's not going to
happen.

Speaker 2 (58:18):
Yeah, but you're in the show, as they say, and
that's a cool place to be.
You might get on base.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
You might hit a home run, you never know.
You just gotta, you just gottakeep swinging at least, and it's
fun.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
It's fun to try before we start.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
Uh, wrapping up, I always want, I like to ask
people what was your favoriterole that you did?

Speaker 2 (58:39):
oh, my goodness gracious.
Well, tom pain, that play Italked about for For some reason
I've played a fair number ofreal people Like the guy in
Oppenheimer was a famousphysicist named Kurt Gödel,
german physicist who was afriend of Einstein.

(59:00):
So that character is sort of aneaster egg.
It's like oh, there's KurtGödel people who are in the.
I didn't know who he was when Igot the movie, but he's very
well known in that world, youknow.
So I once another real guy Iplayed was the underground
cartoonist Robert Crumb.
You know Robert Crumb.
He was a cartoonist in thesixties.
He created like Fritz the Catand stuff and a great sort of

(59:24):
underground cartoonist who cameout of that movement in the 60s.
And there's a great moviecalled american splendor which
is actually about a friend ofcrumbs, a guy named harvey picar
who, to bring it back, used tobe on the david letterman show
in the 80s.
Harvey picar was a a comic bookwriter who wrote

(59:44):
autobiographical comics abouthimself and his life as a
Cleveland file clerk and sort ofornery hipster.

Speaker 1 (59:54):
And it was impressive how you just brought that full
circle back to Letterman.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
Yes, but Robert Crumb was a friend of his and, like I
said before again, when I wasyoung I wanted to be a
cartoonist and I was, and stillam, a fan of Robert Crumb.
So I got to play Robert Crumbin this movie.
This is a movie from like early2000s and Paul Giamatti plays
Harvey Pekar.
So all my scenes are with PaulGiamatti, who's a great actor

(01:00:20):
and a great guy, so fun to actwith, and I played this real guy
guy.
So I got super into like tryingto do the you're playing.
When you're playing a realperson, you kind of want to
honor that person but you'realso playing a character who's
separate from that real person.
You're not really that guy,you're an idea of that person.

(01:00:42):
You know what I'm saying.
But crumb had like a has a veryspecific voice.
He talks very different than me.
He's got more of this kind ofback of the throat, internal
kind of voice.
So you have to kind of do that.
So, just because I was a fan ofthe guy and it was and it had
very specific challenges to kindof play my version of him, that

(01:01:03):
was a, a favorite.
You know it was just all theseaspects came together that were
cool.
I get to play Robert Crumb andI get to work on being like him.
So that was definitely ahighlight, that one.
But you know, everything hasits challenges and everything
has its pleasures.
And I'll tell you one more,though there's a great little
independent film that's actuallyout there now.

(01:01:24):
It's streaming.
You can find it on mostplatforms.
It's called breakup season,directed by a guy.
It's written and directed by aguy named nelson tracy, and in
that movie I play a dad in afamily who's got like grown kids
, like college age kids, okay.
And the thing with me is Iactually am a dad in real life
of college students, but I tendnot to be cast as that.

(01:01:46):
And this dad is a nice guy.
He's like he's little, he's alittle derpy in the dad way, you
know, uh, but he's nice, he'sempathetic, he's kind of sweet
and for some reason, justbecause of the way I land to
casting people and directors, Iplay a lot of weirdos and creeps
like Robert Crumb's a littleweird.
Tom Payne is a sort ofdifficult character, but this

(01:02:11):
guy's just like a nice guy andin a funny way.
That was a challenge for mebecause I was like oh, this is
awesome, how do I make a niceguy interesting?
How do I make interesting a guywho's not a psycho or a perv or
neurotic or something,something it's like you're not.
You're not giving me what I need, right how do I, how do I make
this an interesting characterand I I feel like it worked and

(01:02:35):
great director who really helpedme find that character.
In fact, sidebar, my wife saysthat that's one of her favorite
performances of mine, so thatmeans a lot.
So that, in a funny way, wasanother great challenge, playing
a guy kind of without likerough edges.
But how do you make that notboring?
You know that's so.
That was the dad and breakupseason.

(01:02:58):
I played basically myself thispodcast I'm on now because I
know that was what originallybrought me to you.
Uh, this show called in mediarays, which is a great, uh,
scripted podcast which isrelated to the voiceover thing
oh, there's a couple.

Speaker 1 (01:03:17):
Uh, there's another guy we talked to.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
He does like a podcast, but it's a drama that's
scripted and it's based onpower rangers, which yeah yeah,
well, this is a cool thing,which this is another thing that
I'm super into because, as youknow, like back and before tv,
scripted shows were on radio soyou'd have dramas, mysteries,
comedies.

(01:03:39):
The first sitcoms were on theradio.
So it's just voice acting, youknow, and there's kind of
there's kind of a robot I'msorry there's an automatic cat
feeder behind me that's makingsome noise now, but part of the
environment, it's real, so we'lljust deal with that.
Ok, it's done, but there's kindof a revival of that form with

(01:04:02):
podcasting.
There are all these likescripted dramas and comedies and
some of them get like famousactors in them and you're doing
these stories, but it's allaudio sound effects and it
really is a throwback to, likeyou know, the old golden age of
radio With the shadow, likeOrson Welles' great reading of
War of the Worlds.

(01:04:23):
Orson Welles started doing thatbefore he made movies, and that
was the big thing.
War of the Worlds famouslyfreaked people out.

Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
Our friend of ours on our show.
He has the originals, he hasthe copies, he has the rights to
it.
Who does?
A friend of ours, joey Thurmond, an actor.
He's also getting into themusic business now but he has
the War of the Worlds like theoriginal, I guess, recordings of

(01:04:50):
it, and has to it.
Well, that's a great.

Speaker 2 (01:04:52):
That's a great show.
It's really.
It holds up actually that show,cause he did it, he basically
it's like that's like an earlyversion of a found footage
horror movie, because that thatthat Orson Welles wells, war the
worlds it starts out.
It's like a music show.
They're like, and now theso-and-so orchestra from the
so-and-so ballroom, and thenthey play music for a while and
then the guy's like, excuse me,we interrupt this program and

(01:05:14):
then they're talking about someweird thing that happened in new
jersey and then it's likealiens and at the time a lot of
people bought it because andreal people are knocking down uh
water towers because they thinkthey're people freaked out and
it also, I think, because it waslike around 39, so the war in
europe was happening and wehadn't joined the war yet but
there was a lot of anxiety aboutthat.

(01:05:36):
So people in america were reallykind of anxious about like war.
And then orson wells wasselling, and then orson wells is
a very head of the curve, smartguy, so then he makes like a
found footage version where itreally sounds like it's
happening in real time on theradio and a lot of people bought
it, understandably, you know.
But that's what made him superfamous.

(01:05:57):
That's how he got like hiscitizen can contract, because
they're like well, this kid, youknow he's, this guy's going
places.
Yeah, he's got, he's gotcojones and he's got some good
ideas.
Thanks, you know.
But anyway, I just wanted tomention this show, which I
really love being a part of.
This woman named rachel musiccreated it.
She has a, she has a productioncompany called good story guild

(01:06:18):
and they are making thesescripted, uh, podcasts and the
one I'm on it's called in mediarays and it's uh, it's basically
about like the idea of the showis it's fictional, so there's
like a, a james bond style moviefranchise, and then I it's been

(01:06:40):
around for decades, a la jamesbond, and then there's a young
actor who gets chosen to be thenew James Bond.
In this case, the character'sname is Jack Steller, and so the
show is like a Hollywood satireabout what happens to this kind
of young, unknown guy who'ssuddenly put into the frying pan
, as it were.

(01:07:00):
They're like here's your newJack Steller.
So you've got people who areinto that.
You've got people who are likeno, horrible, he's not nearly as
good as the first guy, he's notnearly as good as the old guy,
you know.
And then you've got like theguy's family and friends who are
like now this guy's like on thesuperstar track and the studio
is grooming him.
So it's about this sort oftumultuous experience that this

(01:07:29):
young actor has.
And then my part is super funbecause I'm like a sort of
adjacent character in eachepisode.
Rachel's also a musician, hername is Rachel Music and
nominative determinism is whatwe call that Tom.
But Rachel has composed andsings these songs that in each
episode we have a song that'ssupposed to be a la, a james
bond theme, so, and they go backto like the 60s or whatever.

(01:07:51):
So I played like an npr typemusic host guy.
You know those guys who talk alot about music.
In 1941 this was done at thisstudio and blah blah played bass
, you know so I'm like one ofthose guys, buddy rich but yeah,
exactly buddy rich was yellingat his band on the bus I'm gonna
take yououtside I'm like.

(01:08:11):
So I'm like a dj who it's alittle sort of capper to each
episode, where I then introducethese original songs, which are
really great, which are sort ofin all different genres.
So, like in the 60s, there'slike a shirley bassey,
goldfinger type parody.
Then we we have one from likethe 80s.
That's more like New Wave.
You got A View to a Kill, yeah,yeah.

(01:08:32):
So they're like differentgenres.
So that's my part, but it'sgreat and that's an aspect of
acting that I really enjoy andI've kind of gotten into.
And then meanwhile, sidebar, Ihave my own writing partner and
we've written and produced abunch of our own scripted shows
and actually trying to get a newone in the works.

(01:08:53):
But it's really fun becauseit's like an old form, the old
radio drama form, that's now gota new life in it and people are
into these shows.
So it's a very cool thing.
I'm very into like the audiodrama thing.

Speaker 1 (01:09:10):
The more things change, the more things kind of
just stay the same.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Totally.
And you know, I got to sayrelated to that I'm again I'm
like I'm more optimistic thanskeptical about like AI and all
that.
Like I think it's a seriousconcern, but I also think that
people just want to.
They want to hear human storiesand they want to see human
people perform or listen topeople perform, and they want

(01:09:34):
stuff with a point of view, notjust a, you know, aggregation of
information that a robot ispresenting not 20 minutes of
television with 10 minutes ofads, and you can't skip the
thing is people have alwaysloved, you know, people have
always loved, like stories, inwhatever form they take.
And now there's like aresurgence of you know radio

(01:09:55):
style drama on that you canlisten to on your computer or
you know whatever.
And but it's true, the morethings change because people
just have an interest in thisstuff and they always will.
So there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:10:11):
I was just about to ask before we wrapped up and I
just want to say again thank youfor taking time on a Friday to
meet with us and be on our pokeylittle podcast.
What if there was anything youwanted to plug which I know you
your show?
Yeah, I actually I have youyour show?

Speaker 2 (01:10:26):
Yeah, I actually I have a.
There's a really fun show onApple plus called Palm Royale
the Kristen wig is the star of.
Okay, it's a comedy set in the1960s in Palm beach and it takes
place like a fancy country cluband Kristen wig is sort of

(01:10:47):
social climber who kind offinagles her way into this
country club and the sort of jetset of Palm Beach in the 60s.
So it's really fun.
It's a period thing Buffonhairdos, cool old sports cars,
the whole deal, and I play likethe persnickety manager of the
club.
So you know, I'm like, excuseme, are you supposed to be here.

(01:11:07):
You know that kind of guy andI'm in a bunch of episodes in
season one which is out there,but we we just finished shooting
season two and they actuallygave me more to do this season,
so that's super cool, that'sawesome he's going yeah yeah,
madam, did you drive here in aexactly?
but now I kind of get into morehijinks and stuff and uh, so

(01:11:27):
that's, so, that's, that'll becoming up probably, like I don't
know, I'd say later this year,you know.
And then, yeah, there are justthese other independent films
that I'm in that are either outthere Breakup Season I recommend
the movie that I mentioned andagain, if people haven't seen
the Venture Brothers, I'd saydip your toe in, you might enjoy

(01:11:50):
it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
I think they just need to watch that one clip with
Brock Samson crushing thatguy's hand with his butt.

Speaker 2 (01:11:57):
Brock Samson crushing a guy with his buttocks.
Hey man, he's a MacGyver.
He's a regular MacGyver withhis own body.

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
I would love to high five whoever wrote that, cause I
don't want to shake his handcause he might crush mine.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
Yeah, it was either.
Yeah, jackson or doc would havecome up with that one.
Yeah, james, thank you forhaving me.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
It was fun, it's been an absolute pleasure and we're
going to wrap up now and justwant to say thank you to all of
our listeners out there,especially everybody in
greenland.
We know you guys have beenlistening big time.
We saw the analytics and wewant to say thank you.
Australia, you're letting usdown.
Germany you need to catch backup.
And sorry, uh, matt damon, weran out of time.
I'll see you next time.