Episode 44: Two Widows walk into a bar.....and then go home and record a podcast.

Whitney and Holly do an impromptu recording to discuss holiday cards, a Later Daters obsession and Whitney's boyfriend.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hello, hello, hello. Hello, am I as loud as you,
Whitney? Never.
All right, I'm turning my down alittle bit.
Then I'm going to be louder thanyou.
Yeah, let me test this maybe. Turn yours up just a little bit.
Hold on. Oh my gosh, try again.

(00:24):
Be sure and put that in the recording.
I will. This is every widow thing.
OK, everyone, it's Whitney and Holly here, and we were out on
the town, just the two of us reconnecting at a Greek
restaurant because we did go to Greece this summer.
We went. To Greece.
So we went to the Greek Restaurant in Austin.

(00:44):
That's right. And it lives up to its name.
Shout out to Yamas. Oh yeah, it was legit.
It was authentic. And even cute Greek guys work
there. Yeah, they did.
You're right. We decided because we were
talking at the bar and we decided, oh, we should come home
and record all of this. So hopefully it's as

(01:05):
entertaining to you guys as it was to us.
And we apologize to Kira and Lacey because they're not here
and weren't even given an opportunity to be here.
It's Monday. It's been a while since we came
to you guys. And I do recognize that there's

(01:27):
a lull in activity for every widow thing.
But we're also trying to acknowledge that we need time
with our families and all the shit that's going down right
now, 'cause even though your husband's dead, you still got to
deal with the other shit. A lot going on, yeah.
So did you do Christmas cards? Fuck no.
Yeah, Laci put a post on every widow thing recently about the

(01:52):
things that she doesn't have thebandwidth for anymore since
Oliver died and it's going on 13years now for her and she still
doesn't have the bandwidth. And I feel the same.
I mean, first of all, let's justbe honest, who really wants to
do Christmas cards? Not me.
No, it's a stress. OK, I I want to say I enjoy

(02:13):
getting the cards in the mail, but I don't.
I don't even enjoy getting them in the mail.
I'm like don't send. Whitney a card?
No, but send me a card. I want to get a card.
Give everyone your address, Holly.
But I was like oh maybe I'll do a card this year. 5 minutes

(02:35):
later I'm like no maybe not. OK, well let me ask you this.
Do you? So when Toby was alive and you
were doing Christmas cards, wereyou into it then or did you feel
a responsibility as a family andthe matriarch of the family to
do the Christmas cards? Well, I was kind of into it
because Toby was a designer and he would, I would get, you know,

(03:00):
we'd get the family photo and then he would.
Do all kinds of cool. Stuff make it cute.
So although we kind of switched to Shutterfly at one point, so
yeah, it kind of became a chore.But you still did it.
Not every year, I don't think wedid it every year.
I did it every year and partly it was because Hunter had a list

(03:23):
of colleagues and work people that he wanted to send it to.
And I and it was so frustrating because I'm like, if you want to
send it to your people, then youcan do it.
Even on Shutterfly I was stressed.
I am creative, but not in a design visual way.
I have a lot of creative ideas in my head, but I cannot make it

(03:45):
happen in real life. Like, you know, I'm not.
Yeah, you help me, but I'm just saying.
So it was very stressful for me.So after Hunter died, I was
like, what's the point? First of all, my family is an
attack. I don't want it.
Well, yeah. OK, let me ask you this, 'cause
we weren't friends before our husbands died, were you one of

(04:07):
those people that would send a note with the card saying all
the things that your family was involved in that year?
No, but I would like OK if it were people like in California
friends, I usually would try to write a little note like just
write like. I wrote a note.

(04:29):
Happy holidays. Always but.
I always gonna and Sydney has started.
Playing Ohh no, I was not a letter, no.
Sometimes, I don't know, sometimes I think it would be
hilarious if I was, if I did have the energy to do a
Christmas card again to write a real life letter.

(04:49):
Like, hey guys. So this year I'm suffering from
depression because all three of my children have gone to
college, but one child is actually still a sophomore even
though she was supposed to be a senior, and another kid failed a
couple of summer school classes.And I'm stressed about the
future for all three. You know, like it would be funny
to be like a real life letter. And then you could have just.

(05:13):
A picture of you my Venmo is. Well, that's.
The thing that is annoying is like half the the Christmas
cards that I get. Well first of all, with social
media and stuff, do we really need Christmas cards anymore?
No, because I see what they ate for breakfast like I know.

(05:36):
Well, some of them there are. OK, I do have highlighted
friends. I mean, I'm.
I should say. People.
Am I highlighted? No, that I get Christmas cards
from and actually one of these people I don't ever talk to but
I can't wait to get their card. Because you don't see them on
social media. No, I just like what they do on

(05:59):
their card. Because they're funny.
I don't know, it's just a good photo or a good, I don't know,
like. But I mean, we're all sending
photos of our kids constantly onsocial media.
Not so much anymore because my kids have.
I had to turn my social media toprivate because one kid was so
worked up about his friends being able to see his baby

(06:21):
photos. I'm like, who often cares dude?
OK, well I want to tell a story about Christmas cards.
So I the other day I went and walked with a friend of mine.
She's has a friend who passed away a couple, I think it was a
couple years ago and she wasn't really close to the family, but

(06:43):
she feels the need to send a card to them.
OK. OK, so my advice was send the
card because it makes you feel good to send the card and that
you're thinking of them right? But write something on the card,
like I'm, you know, thinking of whatever her name is and just

(07:06):
wanted to send you a card. No, but it's kind of cold if
you're sending it to a family where the mom had died.
And you're. You're not really close to the
rest of the family. What's your advice, Whitney?
I'm confused on the question. OK, say I have the, you know,

(07:29):
the perfect family. We're with a husband still in
the picture. And then I have a friend who
dies. But I'm not very close to the
friend's family. But I'm thinking about them all
the time and I want, I want to connect with them.
I want they're on my list. I've always sent them a card.
But it was always for the mom, right?

(07:52):
So my advice would be don't sendthem a Christmas card of your
happy perfect family. Send a card that just says, I'm
thinking about you guys. And I know.
She's done that, but. Well then you don't like my
advice. She was just wondering, do I
send a Christmas card? Yes, she's overthinking it.
If if they've always been on your list and you've already

(08:15):
acknowledged that they lost their mom or their wife and but
they've always been on your list, then keep sending it.
But I will tell you this, I've been in my house that I live in
right now for five years and I'mstill getting Christmas cards
for the people that lived here five years ago.
And I'm like, you know, if they don't know that you've moved,

(08:38):
then maybe you're not that good of friends.
So for a while I kept them and like contacted the woman and
said, hey, you've got some cardshere.
But now I just write return to sender.
Yeah, that's what I. Sometimes I throw them in the
trash. Well, at this point, throw them
in the trash. But five years later, Come on.

(08:59):
Yeah. How close are you if you don't
know that they've moved? Throw them in the trash.
But I also don't want to get it next year.
So that's why I write Return to Cinder.
I think last year I threw them in the trash.
This year I'm writing Return to Cinder.
How many do you get? I mean, there's not many, maybe
like 5, but I still get a lot ofmail for the people that used to

(09:20):
live here. But that's a whole other story.
Well, let's talk about the holiday funk.
We're both seven years in now. How?
How are your holidays? How are you feeling this year?
I think I'm busier this year andthe fact that it's such a short

(09:42):
time between Thanksgiving and Christmas makes it all easier.
Go by faster, which it's harder in some ways and easier in some
ways. But in my boys are older too so
I'm not like. It's not the same as like when
the kids were younger and your husband's dead and you're

(10:03):
putting the, the toys together by yourself.
So I do think that's easier. And I don't feel the need as
much as I did in the beginning to like make this the best
Christmas ever, you know? And I think that's also because
it's been 7 years, but also because they're older.

(10:24):
But I've I've let go of that this is has to be an amazing
Christmas so that they don't as if they're going to forget that
their dad died. I think it's easier.
I don't. I'm not in the funk that I
normally have been in. I'm not really either.
But like you brought up a good point because you're working
now. You work at Wendy Wells Jewelry

(10:46):
store. Shout out to Wendy.
And you're working not every daybut it's a part time job.
But during the holidays I feel like it's more like a full time
job. And it keeps me busy and keeps
my mind off of I don't. Know No, I think you're right.
Especially when we don't have little kids anymore.
Like being free birds as we say now instead of empty nesting.

(11:08):
I'm not having to take care of little people anymore.
I need a job I I want a job I keep.
Honestly I have started to fill out the substitute teaching
application like 4 different times but but they only allow
you to keep the application for 35 days and if you don't finish

(11:28):
it in 35 days then it disappearsand I guess I keep not finishing
it it's more. Confusing than you think the
best substitute teacher. I would kill it.
Well, I was a teacher. So I mean but you would be so
fun like. I think so the.
Teacher The kids wouldn't want their regular teacher to come.
Back, but I, I've noticed for myself, especially in this time

(11:51):
with with empty nesting, yeah, it's it's it's fun to go.
I'm just going to travel and have fun, but there's no purpose
in that, you know, like I could.Stay I can find purpose and
travel and. But you're not doing it all the
time. I mean, there's still, I mean,
look, I've been on some great trips.
You and I went to. I started as soon as the kids

(12:12):
left. I mean, I started very quickly.
I went to North Carolina with some friends and then you and I
went to Greece, and then I came back and I went to
Fredericksburg and then I went to Guatemala and.
The travel queen, Yeah. But there's still time in
between those moments and even, you know, when I have things

(12:33):
planned, it's not fulfilling. I don't, I'm like when you had
kids, when you had a husband andkids that you were taking care
of. It's exhausting, but it gives
you purpose. And now I'm struggling with
like, what's my purpose 'cause Icould literally sit here on this
couch that we're sitting on right now and be on my phone for

(12:58):
8 hours? You're getting up in the morning
to work out at 8 so. OK, let's say that you and I
work out tomorrow at 8:00 AM andthen at 9 AMI come upstairs and
I could get on my phone and I can be on my phone doing
nothing, by the way. And then look up and it's 1:00
PM and I'm like, holy shit, I'vedone nothing.

(13:20):
More than that, you do not sit on on your phone for that long.
Dude, you're right. You're like.
Do things. With your mom.
Sometimes anybody who's been on their phone can understand this.
Like time goes by, like you're just scrolling through cat
videos and all of a sudden two hours have gone by.

(13:41):
I'll do that in the morning before I even get out of bed.
And all of a sudden because you send me stuff.
Yeah, I do. And it's hilarious, isn't it
enriches your life. But my point is you having this
job, even though and I have another friend who's divorced
and she had to get a job, you know, to pay her bills and
everything and she's resentful. Why are you laughing?

(14:03):
She had to get a job, you know, to pay her bills and stuff.
But she's resentful of it and I'm like, I don't.
I try not to say too much because it's annoying if you
have that positive friend all the time.
But I'm like, dude, I'm jealous that you have a place to go.
Like that forces you to get up and get dressed and get.

(14:23):
Out Is she resentful because shedoesn't like it or.
Yeah, she doesn't want to be working, I think, and she
definitely doesn't really like the job itself, but.
Well, that's the whole thing. You have to find something that
fills your bucket and makes you.Right.
But for most people, their job is not it, like my son said the
other day, because I go, what doyou want to like?

(14:46):
What are your plans? Not to stress you out, but like,
do you know what you would like to be doing?
And he goes, no, I just have, I'm assuming that I'm going to
hate my job and I'm just going to try to make a lot of money.
And I'm like. That's really sad.
No, I tell my boys. I didn't say that to him.
He just. Said I know, I know.
My whole point in this rant was that as much as you may think oh

(15:10):
I wish I wasn't working so much or if my friend was thinking oh
I wish I didn't have to work. The truth is when you have no
husband and your kids are all gone, it's not very fulfilling
just to go on trips and lunch every day like you.
You still want some purpose in your life and that's why when we

(15:30):
talked about, you know, how to find your people and I was
saying volunteering or. I mean, I think.
It goes for. Across the board, even like
people who still have their husband that are free birds are
in similar situations of not knowing what to do with their

(15:53):
day. But back to the holiday funk.
You're not feeling it because you're busy.
I'm. Not saying I'm not feeling it,
I'm just trying to plan some funthings.
So we're going to do we're goingto go out on a boat with some
friends, surprise the kid, the the kids.
In Austin. Yeah, and see the lights.

(16:15):
That'll be fun. Well, this.
All started with Mozarts and youcan you can rent a boat and go
through the light tunnel and then go see Mozarts.
There's a new light tunnel on lake and then they take you
around and see like lights on the lake.
That'll be fun. But it's kind of expensive and

(16:39):
it's only an hour and a half andthey don't let you bring your
own drinks. Or, but is there?
Is there a bar? On what?
No. OK.
So you're going to do, you're going to do a, a.
Try to just do some fun different things I.
Need some things to do. I thought of bowling.

(17:01):
Pretty sure no one's going to want to do that.
This is what I'm. Struggling with is and, and I
feel like if Hunter were here, he would force it more.
Whereas I'm like, oh, they don'twant to do it, never mind.
Whereas Hunter would be like, no, we're doing it, you know,
and I'm struggling with that. And I'm, I have one kid at home
right now for Christmas break and the other kid is coming home

(17:25):
later this week. And, and I know I, I, it's
already started with the one that's already home.
He's in his bed all day. Well, it's kind of a heart age
because it's like they're some of them are over 21, some aren't
like so I've thought about doingsome of the fun pop up

(17:49):
Christmas. Bars.
Bars. I thought of Monopoly.
I'm super fun bowling and Monopoly but I'm trying to do
family stuff like well. Then that's that's good.
It's fine. We hope you have a great holiday
season. It's not easy it no matter what

(18:10):
stage you're in, you're not alone and there are things that
you can do to help get you through the season.
Yeah, don't volunteer yourself. Yeah, it's hard in the
beginning. It gets it gets easier.
It really does. I mean, it's crazy to think
where we are now versus where I was the 1st and 2nd, even third
year. It's interesting for me.

(18:31):
I am kind of going back to what we did.
This is maybe the first year that I've gone early to my
sister's. The first year we went to
Mexico, first year without Toby went to Mexico and then I just
didn't. It was hard for me to be around

(18:51):
like the same. The group that you were always
with with totally. Yeah, I don't know.
It's really hard, like, but now it's like it is what it is and
I, I want to be with my family and you know, it's lonely.
Just it's not as painful. That's the thing.
It's like what we've talked about before about the ball in

(19:13):
the box, you know, and for in the beginning, I think the story
that I told was that the ball isalways the ball gets smaller,
but really the box gets bigger. Your life when you first lose
your person, that box is so wrapped up with the ball, the
the person that you lost. And as time goes on, the ball of

(19:36):
grief is still big, it's still painful, but the life around it,
the box around it gets bigger because you're still growing and
and alive and and so it does geta little easier.
But when that ball hits the sideof the box, it's it's still very
big. It's.
Going to hit the side of the box.
Absolutely, Absolutely. What else were we talking about

(19:59):
at the bar that made us think that we needed to recall?
Record it. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, OK, I was
about to tell you about this show that I've started watching
that I want to I've been meaningto get on every widow thing
insiders and tell them to watch it.
It's called later daters. I ran across it on Netflix and I

(20:23):
just was like, OK, I'll see because it's later in life
people got it. Later daters, later daters.
But I was kind of like. Honestly, I'm only in like 3 or
4 episodes but I thought it was really good because let me tell

(20:44):
you what made it interesting. There's a dating coach.
It's not a dating. How old are they?
OK, so some are in there. 50s. Maybe some are in their 50's.
The oldest is 70. She was a little bit of a train
wreck, but but what I loved about it is that this woman

(21:06):
comes in and she's talking to them about their history.
And there were several widows onthere, which makes sense, right?
And she gave them really solid advice about dating.
One of the things that I thoughtwas interesting was that this
woman was like the the dating coach.
So there's a coach, right? It's not like a a matchmaker,

(21:32):
although they do find people forthem to go out with.
And by the way, they are way better than the people that I've
seen on the bachelor and Bachelorette and Golden Bachelor
or whatever. They were much better match.
But anyway, this dating coach sits down, talks to them about
their history and why they thinkthat maybe they haven't found

(21:52):
someone, and then gives them some tips.
So like one of the things that she was saying, because there's
this one woman who's in her 60s,super cute and outgoing, but
she's still dating. Like she dated in the 70s, you
know, like she, the, she was being all coy and mysterious and

(22:18):
the dating coach was like, look,that's not how people date now.
You don't, you're not coy and mysterious.
If they ask you a question, you answer it.
If, if you want to go out on another date, you tell them you
don't go. I don't know, maybe you know you
you give them a definitive answer.
And I thought that was so interesting because I'm very

(22:40):
much a I'm dating someone and hewould really want me to say that
I have a boyfriend. But but if I didn't have a
boyfriend and and just knowing who I've been in in the short
period of time when I have datedafter Hunter died, I am kind of
coy and mysterious and like trying to play hard to get.

(23:01):
They don't want that anymore. Yeah, but you also gave me the
advice. If you go on a date you don't
like them, just say thanks. Well.
That's different. Well, that's different, yes.
If you don't like them, you definitely don't be mysterious.
But if you do like them, don't be mysterious.
If you like them, you say, hey, I like you.
I'd love to go on another date instead of waiting around to see

(23:26):
if they reach out to you. Yeah, but sometimes it could
come across as like. Look, I'm not the dating coach.
I'm just telling you what the dating coach said.
It's got some good advice on Yeah, wait for.
My boys to get home and be like.Hey, let's watch later daters.
They could have come up with a better name.
And home alone. Let's watch later, daters.
Let's watch later daters. Yeah, they need to come up with

(23:48):
a better name, but I would say that it is interesting and give
some good advice. I'm dating somebody, so I don't.
Well I always need advice but I am dating somebody so.
Ryan. Shout out to Ryan.
Hey Ryan, shout out. We love you, Ryan.

(24:12):
He'll be glad to get the shout out because I don't talk about
him on the podcast. And he's like, why don't you
ever tell anybody that you're dating somebody?
And I'm like, 'cause it's not really.
It doesn't. And he?
Took you to Guatemala. He did.
We went to Guatemala and I will say that that changed our
relationship. We've we've been seeing each
other for four years, but he wasgoing through a divorce at the

(24:36):
time, which is a different mindset.
And I had little kids at home. Little they were in high school.
They were at home, they weren't little.
Right. And you know, it's weird to
bring in somebody, but it's not their dad.
That's a whole other podcast. Yeah, and I think, and maybe I'm

(24:59):
wrong 'cause my kids are older, but I feel like it would have
been easier had they been younger.
Like in elementary school, they may have been just very open to
whatever. I don't know.
I don't know, but in my mind. I've never brought anybody home
so. Really.

(25:21):
No, I haven't. You've never introduced anyone
to your children. No, right?
I did it slowly, like it was just like, this is my friend
Ryan, but we didn't go to dinnertogether with the kids or
anything. It was just like he would show
up to, like, help with something.
He's always been around. You know, he took Hayden out for

(25:43):
his birthday on his 16th birthday.
It was during the pandemic. He had a boat.
He took him and his friends out.But as far as Hayden knew, it
was just a a boat driver that I'd hired, you know, like he
didn't know that we were dating.So.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, they know now.But, you know, over the years,
Ryan just kind of been around atcertain moments, but not like

(26:05):
totally involved. So what?
My whole point is that we went to Guatemala together and it was
the first time that we've ever spent that amount of time
together because we're not spending the night at each
other's houses or anything because we each had kids, you
know? Well, there are those.

(26:26):
There were some one offs. OK, No, you're right.
What I'm trying to say is that that Guatemala trip solidified
our relationship. That's awesome in a different
way. Like before that we were like, I
don't know, maybe I don't know, maybe.
And after that we're like all inthat's.
Awesome. I'm happy for y'all, yeah.

(26:48):
Anyway, later date thank. You later later.
All right. Anything else that we should a
dress as far as life now holidays?
I know we went from holidays to.Later daters to Ryan at.

(27:08):
Least we got Ryan in there. Yeah, I might cut it out.
No. We'll see.
We'll see. We want to stay on theme.
We just stay on theme. We don't have to stay on theme.
Makes it funny. Interesting, maybe not funny Do.
You're kidding.