July 11, 2023 • 35 mins
Are you aware of the power of a single phone call when it comes to preparing for a photography session? Imagine having your client's expectations clearly laid out in front of you just by taking the time to communicate effectively. In this episode, we'll delve into the critical importance of communication, decluttering, and adequate preparation for photography sessions. We'll also share some handy tips for handling pets that might be present during the session, and how keeping the area minimal can contribute to a better photographic outcome.
Now, you might wonder how you can capture real and authentic moments during a photography session? Well, the secret is in adaptability and flexibility! We'll discuss how pivotal it is to be open to unexpected moments and how to prepare yourself to capture them as they occur. We'll also discuss the importance of being honest with your photographer about any personal worries or issues you may have and how not expecting your session to look identical to someone else's can lead to a more personalized experience.
Finally, we aim to help you make your photoshoots feel more natural and authentic. We share the best ways to make the day special, yet familiar and comfortable. We even share tips on how to handle uncooperative children or couples during a session. After all, photography is about capturing moments, not creating artificial ones! So tune in, and let's learn how to create a positive and natural photography session together.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey guys, you're listening to part two of today's
episode.
If you haven't listened to partone of this episode, we'd
strongly recommend you listenfrom the beginning of part one
to understand where ourconversation starts up.
When you're done with thisepisode, please feel free to
rate, review and subscribe onApple Podcast.
It's the easiest way to supportthis podcast.
Enjoy part two and we'll seeyou next week.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
So at the end of the day, I'm always just trying to
get individuals to talk aboutthemselves so I can get an
understanding of what they're,what it's like, what they're
almost like so I can know whatto do when I walk in the door.
What to expect, do?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
you have a phone call with them.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I always have a minimum phone call Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Oh, okay, okay, So I used to do phone calls and then
I changed it to questionnaire.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Questionnaire works too.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Yeah, I changed it to an online questionnaire and if
I have any questions I can emailthem and ask them and all of
that.
But I feel like having itwritten down, having it written
exactly in their words, and Ican kind of go back and check it
before the session.
I feel like that always reallyhelps me to kind of know what
I'm walking in and just like youinstead of well, i know that
you said that you're not like isit clean?
(01:04):
But usually what I'll say islike for our session, i usually
ask that you declutter the areasthat you're looking to be
captured in most.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That's what I'm getting at.
That's essentially what you'regetting at.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
And then I tell them that minimal is best.
Minimal.
If you're thinking about addingthings to your space to help it
feel more homey, I always tellpeople to like, don't, like.
Don't go out and like, buysomething just to put up on the
walls just because you feel likethe walls are blank.
What blank walls are reallynice in photos.
Actually, minimal is better.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah it always does kill me sometimes the hardest
part of doing it.
Being in a hotel room is likeartwork that just is so loud and
it's in and it's like, yeah,like, because the focus is the
subjects.
That's the focus.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
So right, we don't need to be loud.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
I'm gonna, i'm going to the next.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
The next clip that you post on our thing should
just be every single time youhit it.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Yeah, that's actually good, yeah, so I have to
emphasize too on thisconversation.
So I'm thinking back.
When you do these podcasts, youlike, you just you're just
talking and you listen back andyou're like, oh, that sounded
odd, because in my head itsounds good, but maybe it's
interpreted correctly.
If you know me, i'm anextremely patient person.
(02:21):
I'm very tight.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
No, he's not.
Yeah, i'm just like get on here.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
I'm extremely patient , i'm really easy going, so I
don't walk into anybody's houseand go like this is trash, like
this is not what we discussed.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
There's a lot of work to do here.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I make anything work, we'll make it work.
I'm just looking for you totell me about you, that's
essentially what it comes downto, and little tips that will
help hopefully give theexpectations that you're looking
for in the photos, and I cangive you as much as I can on
that.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Right, and when we, when we offer to do phone calls,
when we offer to do you knowthe questionnaires and when I
know, so, like you know,scheduling the phone call might
seem a little bit more Mm, idon't know.
Fun, i want to say fun but Idon't think that that's.
I feel maybe professional iswhat I'm trying to look for, but
I know that some of my clientswhen they get the questionnaire
(03:14):
they just kind of like blow itoff and they're like go whatever
you know, But I strongly urgethe clients to write in.
I mean, I have questions aboutlike how can I have your kiddos
warm up to me?
Do you have pets and does ittake them a minute to warm up to
me?
Because I've also walked intoin-home sessions and gotten bit
by dogs because I have a bigcamera in my hand and they think
that I'm coming for theirnewborn baby, like that's dogs
(03:36):
are.
They're animals, they're gonnaassume the worst.
So I always ask them, you know,is there treats that I can give
your dog at the door before Ieven take out my camera?
Things like that where it's notonly gonna help me but it's
also going to help you?
because if I know, when peoplewalk into my door and Nelly is
just going buck wild all overthem, not only am I a little bit
embarrassed I know she's a dogand I know people expect it for
(03:58):
the most part but it'sembarrassing that I can't get a
hold of like my animal, like getover here, come on, you know.
And especially if they're notdog people, if they're not dog
people, and Nelly is going nutson them, like it's a little
embarrassing and it's notsomething you know that I think
my clients would make me feelbad about, you know.
But if I had somebody come inand I'm just like oh my God, i'm
(04:21):
so sorry It already is puttingyou in this position of you feel
uncomfortable and so you'reapologizing and that's not the
foot that you wanna start yoursession on.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
No, it's yeah that's so.
This wraps into the wholepicture of gaining as much
information as you can about youand the individual.
It helps in any situation,especially for photography.
So when we're dealing withpeople and this goes for any
business, honestly when you,when it's not just a service of
(04:54):
tech or something, a software,and you throw in people, you
automatically now have a wholenew level of if you can
understand them, it will makeyour experience that much better
.
Like, just apply that conceptto any business, any interaction
with humans you have to.
It will help always.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Actually, while we're talking about this, i wanna
send you oh, you might have seenit, i just posted a photo, but
I wanna send you one of thephotos from a family session
that this the mom.
My client described her sessionas what she wanted to be cozy
but chaotic, because that's whattheir life feels like at the
moment, and so I'm sending yousome pictures so that you can
(05:39):
see, because it helped me prepfor my session so much.
It helped me prep in a way whereI was like, okay, like I'm just
we're having fun with theirgirls and like we're gonna, you
know, jump on the bed and we'regonna get a little rambunctious,
cozy and chaotic, like, tell me, these photos do not scream
that to you.
But if I didn't, have if Ididn't have her description of
(06:02):
what she was hoping for, I mighthave gone a totally different
route 10 out of 10.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
This is exactly that description.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yep, that is wonderful, but it helps me so
much because, if I you know shewas, it was a newborn session,
but she has two older girls andshe wanted to make sure that
they were feeling just as loved,as, you know, the little guy
that she was welcoming So that'swhat we were focusing on was
okay.
how is this family kind ofworking through this newborn
(06:32):
stage in a cozy and chaotic way,like I loved it.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Yeah, i can't stop looking at them.
they're so good.
That's it Just a really goodexample.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Yeah, just a really good example of like how to help
your photographer prep in a waywhere they understand exactly
what you're hoping for.
And you know, somebody mighthave given Chris that prompt and
Chris might have captured it ina totally different way.
But this specific client ofmine has looked through all of
my you know my galleries andthings like that my blog posts
And so I feel like she chose mefor a specific reason.
(07:04):
And being able to look at herwords and go, okay, yeah, we got
this, like, let's do it.
Getting home and seeing thosephotos and editing them, i was
like oh my God, i love it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
They're, perfect So what we'll have to do is I wish
there was a way we could sharethis so you could see it, just
to get a picture.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
but We can post it on the feed.
I did post it on my feed so wecan share it on like our story
or something.
So when this comes out we canjust like share that specific
set that I posted so that peoplecan kind of reference like what
the cozy and chaotic?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
looked like So, they, they.
She hit the nail on my head, sothat was perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Love that.
So a few other points, and Idon't know how much more time do
you have, cause we can runthrough them quick.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Let's run through them quick, okay.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
So I'm just gonna run through my list and if you have
anything to add, go for it.
After booking, order youroutfits early, and the reason
why is because a lot of yoursession at least for mine is
going to be very movement-based.
I see a lot of photographerstaking that onto.
Movement-based sessions givesprompts and not poses.
So if you are jumping around inyour outfit which I strongly
(08:14):
encourage you doing it after youorder your outfit when it comes
in, wear it for a day.
Do not wear something that'sbrand brand brand new to your
session, because you don'treally know how you feel in that
outfit.
You don't know how you lookStanding in front of a mirror
and you know sucking in yourbelly a little bit isn't going
to be the way that you lookthroughout an entire session.
So I would encourage you to run, jump, play, do whatever you
(08:36):
need to do to make sure that youare staying confident in that
outfit for a longer period oftime, if you feel like That goes
for any session.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
That goes for any session.
Yeah, doing something brand newon that day of is very risky.
So I mean you can take thatrisk, but you've got to be
really confident that you'regoing to look good in this.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
But even if you think about a wedding dress, how many
times do you go and you try iton and you're moving around and
you're trying you know you'redancing in front of a mirror to
make?
sure that you're not likefalling out of the top of your
dress.
I mean, if, basically, if youdon't feel confident in it,
you're not going to lookconfident in it and your photos
will show that.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Great business idea.
We need a-, so it's like a likean indoor trampoline park, but
just for attempting new clothes.
So, and we'll just have onephotographer there and just like
start shooting everybodyjumping around.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Done.
This outfit is certified.
Yeah, we have, like, a beforeand after.
Like, will this one make it?
Will this one make the cut?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Different winners.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
So the other thing, too, is that if you can't decide
on an outfit and sometimes I'llhave in-home sessions where my
clients want this is mostly for,like, newborn sessions, and I
totally understand it's it'sappealing to get dressed up for
your photo session, becauseyou're paying all this money,
you want to look really good,all of that but sometimes when
you dress up at an in-homesession, it actually kind of
doesn't really look quite right.
(09:51):
Having a more cozy vibe andhaving something that you know
you want to if you're having anin-home session, basically, what
I'm trying to say is that youwant to be wearing something in
your house that you wouldnormally wear.
Doesn't have to be your yourripped up sweats like I'm
wearing today, but you candefinitely you can talk to your
photographer about what packagethey have that might include two
(10:11):
outfits where maybe you startin-home.
I don't I just felt somethingmove under my feet, but I don't
know what it was.
You start in-home with like acozy outfit.
I'm just gonna totally ignore it, just think about it, keep it
going And then you can actuallyyou know plan for a second, you
know a second location orsomething like that and a
fancier outfit.
(10:32):
So if you wanted to do aportion in-home and then go
somewhere else, talk to yourphotographer about what they
have that offers for atwo-outfit session, so that you
don't necessarily have to choose.
Or if you're doing the thing ofordering an outfit last minute
and you're like I don't know ifthis is gonna work for the
entire thing, you might want tothink about doing a two-outfit
session.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Two-outfit session is a win, so that's- he's like I
got nothing to add.
No on the two-outfit session.
I mean, that's you you hit-.
It's nothing else for real forme to add to that other than you
know it's some people for theengagement session realm.
some people only care about oneoutfit And if that's your vibe,
you know I'm totally down forit.
But if you are someone whowants to explore a little bit.
(11:12):
you know, two-outfits is alwaysfun too, So It is fun.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
It is fun And by the second outfit you usually
understand a little bit moreabout, like, the ways in which
your photographer wants you tomove, And I feel like the second
outfit is always the one Ialways tell people make your
second outfit your favoriteoutfit, because your first
outfit you're just gonna be kindof like figuring it out,
learning how to be posing andstuff like that.
Yeah, that's good.
Another point is to talk toyour photographer about timing
(11:36):
and lighting.
So if you have a specific ideaas far as your engagement
session, if you want to bephotographed on the top of a
garage, if you want to bephotographed at a beach in full
sun, you want to be able to talkto your photographer about what
specific vibe you're lookingfor, because a lot of the time
you know we'll be, we'll beworking with some weather issues
(11:56):
, like I am today, as far as youknow, planning a session around
a certain type of weather or acertain type of day.
I would strongly encourage youto talk to your photographer
about that, but then not be tootied to the specific look in
what you're trying to go for,because life happens And what I
always try to I'm alwaysencouraging my clients.
(12:17):
I'm like don't cancel for therain.
Don't cancel for the rain,because I really love rainy
sessions.
I really do.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
I feel like getting underneath a clear umbrella,
which I always have at the readyin my car, like oh yeah, it's
so romantic, they look so funAnd some of my favorite photos
have been in the rain.
It's just, yeah, it's, it'stotally the vibe.
So I'm you know it depends onwho you are and what you're
posting and so forth So I'm ahuge fan of, so I was gonna say,
solar flares.
That's really intense.
(12:44):
Some flares sun flares in myespecially, like in my
engagement photos.
I'm just I can never get enoughof it, like a backlit, just sun
poking through.
So obviously when I post a lotof that, the repercussions are,
you know, that's expected.
It turns into an expectation.
So I have to lean into makingsure that my couples are aware
(13:08):
if the weather doesn't look good, i'm gonna be on top of before
you And then I have to do adouble check.
Like we can get amazing photosin the rain and the clouds.
Absolutely, i know, and mostpeople are pretty aware nowadays
too, like when they see theclouds it's actually I'm not
gonna say surprising, but it'sinteresting.
How many people will say to me,like isn't this a good thing?
We've got a lot of clouds goingon, so people are very aware
some basics of lighting And itjust comes.
(13:34):
Yeah, it's just expectations,so just making sure, but the
rainbows can be great.
This is a nap, colts.
What the heck is it called?
Speak easy, i told you it wasspeako.
The nap called speako.
I have it like I paid for it towork on me talking into this
mic.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
I don't think it's that bad.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
No, I need a counter We need to be in the.
AI for encounter to hear howmany times.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Oh, that can be another post.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
You're absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
You should do it Every time.
you should do ding.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
It would be a whole episode Like a counter, like 10
minutes.
You're right, That's no, and itwill be painful for myself, but
I need to see it.
I need to see the I don't.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Honestly, though, listening to you, i personally
don't.
I mean, we talk a lot and Idon't hear the ums as much as I
think you hear them.
But I also say like a lot anduh, so we'll see.
All right, so the next one islet go of your expectations and
self doubt After you've talkedto your photographer about what
(14:34):
you're hoping for and you have,like, openly discussed okay, i'm
hoping for this kind of asession, i'm hoping to capture
this kind of a vibe After thatrelease it.
Release it you've talked toyour photographer about what
you're hoping for and now youjust need to sit back and kind
of it sounds kind of weird, butlike hope for the best and just
trust the process.
You really just need tocommunicate at the very
(14:56):
beginning and throughout thosequestionnaires or the phone
calls or whatever.
Definitely you want to haveyour expectations heard, but
then you don't wanna be tied tothem too much.
You can't force a session to besomething that it is not.
If your kids start cryingduring a session, some of those
photos are my favorite becausemom or dad comes to the rescue
(15:17):
and they're loving on them andit's just so.
I feel so bad when I'm takingphotos of a crying kid.
I'm not even gonna lie.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Oh no, it does, but they're so cute.
But that was the real memory,that was the thing that happened
.
You're gonna wanna look back atthat.
It's not always all smiles.
It's not close to that.
So it's yeah Basically, if youcan't plan life.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
you can't plan how a session is gonna go You just
can't.
And if you pick a photographerwho is pretty lenient on the
style in which, if you have aphotographer where all you're
seeing is the happy sitting posysmiles, then yeah, you're not
gonna have those memoriescaptured of your baby crying
after they trip over a stumpwhich has happened to me.
But that photo, that oneparticular photo where dad came
(16:00):
to the rescue and he was holdinghis babe with tears streaming
down the face, it's my favoritephoto that I've ever taken of
that family and I photographedthem for like eight years.
So I mean just kind of let yoursession happen as it happens
and understand that meltdownswill happen.
Things will happen like thatwhere it's okay.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
I feel I think the tangible like comparison to this
would be the Pinterest boardexample, where it's providing a
Pinterest board of poses andanytime anyone does that, i
always, i encourage it, i alwayssay like that's wonderful,
because that means you care,fantastic, like you know, go in
there Always a star, asteriskpreface, whatever you wanna call
(16:41):
it.
Don't expect that they're gonnalook exactly the same, because
we have different light,different location, different
colors, different outfits anddifferent guess what you
different person, so you don'twant it to be the same.
I'm gonna take the idea of whatyou provided and maybe we can do
some very close things to thatand mimic that.
(17:01):
You know that specific shot wecan get If it's a very, very,
very specific shot, like youknow Who wants to copy somebody
else's wedding photo anyway, or?
lifestyle photo or whatever.
Who wants?
Speaker 1 (17:11):
to have an exact copy .
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Exactly that's the point.
These are your photos.
You want them to be unique.
So we're gonna take some ofthose ideas and we're gonna
mimic some of them to get thatvibe that you're looking for.
But it's always a two-waystreet where there's an
expectation that it will lookexactly the same and it's not
going to.
So I encourage that's a goodthing.
That's a good thing becauseyour photos are gonna go up and
(17:36):
somebody else is gonna be likeoh, i want that photo.
So, you gotta think of it likethat.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Right, okay, I have two more.
I can see you're kinda likelooking at your watch like
you're gonna have to go prettysoon.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
I actually know someone was calling me and this
is the first time.
In spite of this, i'm using forvideo.
I'm using my iPhone because ithas a thing called continuity
camera, which is wirelesslysending this video in very great
quality So someone was callingme and I was like oh, how does
that work now?
Like is it showing up on myscreen.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Like is it gonna?
mess with it So, but I've gotthe watch that tells me someone
was calling, so I just wannamake sure that we're keeping you
on schedule, because I'm justediting today, so we're good.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, as soon as this is over, you're gonna see me
just flip this table and run andgo do my next thing.
Okay, bye, You know it's over.
bye.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
We have check your worries at the door.
So if there's something at work, if there's something with
family, if there's somethingthat is kind of occupying your
mind, if there's something thatis, and if it's something that
is occupying your mind so muchwhere and I'm talking about like
grief if there's a situationwhere you are literally just not
(18:41):
going to be able to be okay forour session, it is 100% on you
and I'm really lenient.
Each of my sessions come withlike a built in reschedule date.
I think for and I don't know ifyou do the same thing, chris I
try really hard to stay exactlywhere I schedule my clients.
I try to keep them on that date, no matter what rain or shine,
(19:03):
unless there is something thatis going on family-wise, mental
health-wise.
I'm a huge advocate for takingcare of yourself first.
And if you're gonna show up toyour session with all of these
fears, worries, you know, puffyeyes from crying about something
that you have no control over,i want you to reach out to me
and I want you to tell me that,rather than just try to suck it
(19:24):
up and just stick through it forthe photos, because I don't
want it to be a reminder of thatmemory.
But in the same sense, if thisis a painfully beautiful time
for you, i also want you toweigh that too.
I've had sessions that werearound a heart-breaking time,
(19:44):
but it captured the vibe of whatwas happening in their life,
whether it was losing someone orsomeone was sick, or maybe they
were losing a family home andthey decided to have a session
there one last time and it'svery emotional.
What I'm trying to say is thatbeing emotional is okay, but if
(20:06):
it's something where you areliterally not going to enjoy the
process of taking your photosin the slightest because
something is going on, you needto be upfront and honest about
that and not be I don't wannasay not be worried about losing
your potential date, because Idefinitely try to keep people
where I book them, but there'salways a special circumstance.
(20:30):
There's always something whereit's and I wanna be very clear
here my sessions come with abuilt-in rescheduled date.
Weddings do not.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Weddings have a lot riding on them so I just wanna
make sure in the world of yeah,yeah, we'll just change the
wedding date, no, no butsessions where you are mentally
not able to get it together foryour session, i understand it.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
I have days like that .
I'm totally fine withrescheduling.
So leave your worries at thedoor.
Here's I'll do it.
I guess I'll do one.
Leave your worries at the door.
If you cannot, then two embraceit.
Embrace it and understand thatthis time in your life right now
is happening in a fleetinglypainfully beautiful way and if
(21:16):
you can handle that and you canprocess that and it's not doing
anything.
I mean, when I cry my eye, theylook like balls.
I swear to God.
They're so no, they're soswollen.
It's insane.
When my grandfather died, i wasliving with a roommate and I
walked out of my room.
She goes dude, you look likealien versus predator right now.
(21:38):
Oh my God, i was like are youserious?
Speaker 2 (21:43):
The only equivalent I have to that is.
What hurts my soul is seeingpeople finish a marathon or a
race and they're in front of thecamera smiling, and they look
unchanged.
And that is the one person inlife that I'm like, because I
run 500 feet and on my face is achair.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Right, right, yeah, mine too.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Like a monster, yeah, at the end of a race.
Yeah, i'm not.
It's not good, it's not photoquality.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
No, no, it's like.
Should Chris go to the hospital, or should we be taking photos
of him right now?
Speaker 2 (22:14):
Just yeah, literally just photos for reference that I
needed to go to the hospital,that's it.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
I guess what I'm trying to say is like don't be
afraid to talk to yourphotographer, or something too
intense is going on where youfeel like you cannot do this
session.
There's a really good chancethat your photographer is a
human and they're gonnaunderstand you, and if they
don't, that wasn't thephotographer for you in the
first place.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yeah, and there's gonna be both.
There's gonna be photographersthat can't handle it and I have
to be completely honest, thosereally intense sessions that
you're describing, i want to dothem and it almost makes me
nervous.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So it's a it's so intense, it's really hard.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I've seen, i've been presented this idea of these
photos but like someone was inthe hospital and it was like a
literally last gathering and man, it's that tough that is so
tough, and it's something,though, that you have to.
It's on our end.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
It's a.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I don't wanna say suck it up, kind of like this is
above you and you'reeverything's, so you wanna have
a photographer that can handleit?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
obviously so it's, but it's for those photos And
some photographers can't handleit, but they do it anyway.
They do it anyway, like me.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
I know.
But that's a good thing.
I mean, that makes you a reallygood person.
So because you know theimportance of it, you know how
much, how the value isimmeasurable, absolutely
immeasurable.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I've done a few memory sessions and they're
every single one is just as hardas the last.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Yeah, yeah, there's no training yourself for this.
There's no getting stronger,thicker skin in this realm.
It's you're human to human,that's it, and you're breaking
walls down.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
No, and if you're a photographer who's been asked to
do something like that, don'tfeel the pressure to do it just
because you feel like you wouldbe a bad human if you didn't do
it.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
There's actually It's a really strong, it's tough,
that's really hard, it's tough.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
I feel like the only reason why I was even able to do
it is because I've gone throughso much grief in my life and I
understand the feelings thatthey will be left with
afterwards.
So the fact that they evenasked me, I felt just honored,
just honored to do anything likethat Incredible yeah.
To be the one to capturesomeone's last photos with
somebody, and sometimes theirfirst photos with somebody,
(24:29):
their first and their last andit is a really, really hard
thing to do, but it's, like Isaid, it's painfully beautiful
because you get to spend thatmoment with those people and
they'll forever remember you asthe person who showed up and did
that.
And so don't feel obligated.
(24:50):
But if you can help someone outlike that in that way, i would
encourage you to do it.
Yep, but not if it is going tofuck with your mental health.
Okay, now the last one that Ihave.
That I try to do with all of myclients and sometimes we do it
and sometimes we don't.
Sometimes it works andsometimes it doesn't, but it's
(25:11):
always a good idea and you tellme if you agree.
It's always a good idea to planan activity for you and your
spouse, for you and your family,whether it's going on an ice
cream day and having you knowice cream together, or going on
a hike, or are you saying postsession.
No, no, no In the session.
I love to have a session whereit's surrounded by things that
(25:33):
you are naturally doing and willstop and I'll pose you and all
of those things.
But you know, like aroundChristmas time, making hot
chocolate together, it doesn'thave to be something that's
going to take so long, it's justsomething where it's like it
adds a little bit of like thatcandidness, that playfulness,
and it's I always tell peopleI'm like be yourselves, but like
a little lovier, you know.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
That's always yeah, always when in doubt.
yeah for any decisions.
when in doubt, cozy is good,cozier is better, Yeah, we want
to fill the space, so love thatidea.
That's just that.
I think what sticks out with meand that and to take away would
be whatever you are doingnaturally, whatever feels
natural for that activity.
That's where you're, i mean,that's that's you're not looking
(26:15):
to, and it ties in with the newclothes, the new dress, like
you know do the brand new thingon the day of the suit, because
it feels like it's something youshould do Right, like an
activity that feels like homeRight, and if it feels like home
dress like you would dress forthat activity, maybe a little
bit cuter, maybe a little bitcozier Maybe, instead of maybe
(26:37):
instead of the sweatshirt youcan do like a really cute
sweater or something.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
So you want to like spice it up just a little bit,
but not so much where you getthe photos back and you're like
these don't even feel like us,these don't even feel like me.
You want your session to comeback and you want it to remind
you of this time At least.
If you're booking me as yourphotographer, you want your
photos to come back and remindyou of this fleeting moment that
is your engagement session,your newborn session, your
(27:03):
family session and all theselittle, the little toes and like
the quiet giggles and all ofthose things.
That's what you should hear andsee when you get your photos
back.
And if you're trying to forceit to be something that it's not
, i can guarantee you won't behappy with the photos, because
it's not actually capturing whatyou're looking to capture,
which is the happiness and thelove in your family.
(27:24):
If you're gritting your teethand you're like you fucking sit
down right now and look at thatcamera You don't know how many
sessions I've had where peopledo that And I'm like, oh I know,
so maybe we could just throw ababy in the air for a few.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
You know, like anything else, yeah, yeah, the
change gears really quick.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
Oh, no worries, Maybe he needs a snack.
Oh my gosh, yeah.
Have you ever had a sessionlike that?
Speaker 2 (27:47):
or somebody was like sit, yeah, i mean from the
moment we got there, it was aand it was I go, i.
this will be my, like, lastinput on this.
I, i, I still like manysessions, but I say this very
carefully This is a debatedtopic.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
Mm, hmm.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
For a lot of reasons.
I'll just pick one reason.
right now, many sessions aregood because I do appreciate
that there are families whoreally do just want a couple of
professional looking phones.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
They just can't, they just don't have the person,
they don't want to use theirphone camera, they just don't
feel comfortable or they can'tafford a full session.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
That's totally fine.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
That is totally okay.
So I like I can't.
We love to preach that everyperson should get the full hour
session, and you know all thesethings, but there are just the
realities.
There are some people who don'tpay, don't care that much, or
be they don't have the time,they don't want to make the time
, they just want some photos,but they're willing to pay a
little bit for it.
So it's always a push and pullin our industry.
(28:50):
But the one thing on what yousaid, though, that I will say,
which is the screaming child orjust the frustrated session the
moment you walk in I've had thatat many sessions, that's pretty
much when I have them is a minisession And it's a Because
they're like we have fiveminutes.
Yeah, and I always, you know,always try and preface, and with
(29:11):
the problem with mini sessionsis that you're blasting
information to everybody.
You can't get this one-on-oneconnections, which is like you
could try, but it's verydifficult.
So the individuals come andthey're rushing because they
don't want to miss their sessionand the kid's not in.
Well, and it's one I have toalways say, like you know, give,
let's give it.
You have a 15, 20 minute slot.
(29:32):
Let's wait five minutes.
Like let's take the kid down tothe lake, like, is there any?
can we grasp Any?
like grasp is there?
like let's go picking, pick upsticks.
Let's go and you've got the toy, and just, we're gonna put the
camera away.
Put the camera away becausethere's nothing you can do about
it.
There's nothing in your photoswill not come out like you want
them to.
So we're gonna just wait.
We're just gonna wait a fewminutes.
Let the individual, the child,some adult, like take a minute,
(29:57):
and yeah, just.
And then we'll come back andwe'll have to.
You know we'll take some quickphotos and we'll do some things
and I think it's gonna be okay.
That's a but yeah, going intothe session frustrated and
having someone say, oh, sit down, and, you know, smile at the
camera, and it's like this is.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
And as a photographer , i don't know about you, but I
can tell when I show up to ahouse and you and your spouse
were just fighting, i can tellalmost 100% of the time.
Or if you're like super annoyedwith one of the kids that just
like doesn't wanna do it, assoon as I walk in I'm like, oh
okay, like this is the vibe.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
It's, it's that and shit happens.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
That's like people are giving us time to think of
it.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
No, yeah, yeah, yeah.
But it's one of those thingswhere you know, these are the
things that we come back to theconcept of we deal with.
When you immediately of yourbusiness or what you're doing,
you're dealing with people,there's this shit you're gonna
run into that you don't thinkabout.
Or you're taking an educationalcourse and you're a new
photographer and you're, likeyou know, home session like this
is how you do it.
And then you forget about thewhole psychology of your dealing
(30:59):
with humans, and weird thingshappen when you're dealing with
humans, and one of those wouldbe like how do you, how do you
go about creating an environmentfor these photos that you had
in mind when the two people arefighting?
when you walked in, Bet, youdidn't think about that one.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
You pop open a bottle of champagne.
No, i'm just kidding.
Yeah, i'm all for that Here.
Take a sip very real quick.
Let's celebrate.
I'm all gonna toast, we'retoasting.
Yeah, that's I'm kidding.
I don't.
I don't condone that.
I love champagne in sessions.
When I'm saying I don't condonedrinking because you're like
fighting, i'm saying.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
I'm saying I literally walked in with bottle
of champagne and said drink this.
I'm kidding, brooke haddefinitely the like smile of
like.
Is he sick?
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I'm like, uh, That's just yeah, totally kidding.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, okay, I think it would be a good idea on this,
all of these individual piecesof session expectations and how
to prepare.
I would love so.
you and I have been talkingabout you know our experiences,
but this is a really wide topic.
It would be great if we somehowcould get information from
other other photographers andmaybe each of them give us a
piece of advice or somethingthat would be fun to share,
(32:07):
either in the next one or maybedown the road.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
That would be fun.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Re-up this conversation with individuals
and what they and we can talkabout that.
I think that would be a goodidea.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
And you know this is.
This is just a glimpse of ourprocess.
This isn't, you know, thisisn't all the things that we do.
This is just some ideas to makeyour session a little bit
easier, whether it's anengagement session and you're
feeling some nerves, or you havea family session And it's not
to.
You know us saying that we cantell when we walk into an
awkward situation.
(32:38):
I'm not saying that in a waywhere it's like you shouldn't do
that.
Like life does happen, it'stotally fine.
And if you need a minute whenwe walk in to just like, I just
need a second to decompress.
It's totally fine to ask forthat.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
And there's a yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah, of course, because if you need a second,
the thing is is that if you'reaggravated, when we show up and
we jump right into photos, yourphotos are gonna have that vibe.
Your kids are gonna be like,okay, cool, this is what we're
doing because we just got yelledat you know like We want the
photos that look relaxed and fun, or however you describe it.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Okay, what did you say?
It was cozy with chaos.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Cozy with chaos.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Cozy with chaos.
That sounds yeah.
That's like that's an episodetitle Cozy with chaos.
I like that.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Maybe that should be this title In home sessions cozy
and chaotic.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
I love it.
I gotta write that down.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I have to thank my client who sent me that.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Yeah, you do.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
But yeah, this is just a small part of the process
.
This is obviously, and it'skind of a shorter episode, so I
think we can release this one injust one, right Cause the other
ones were like a little bitover an hour.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
No, we're over an hour right now.
Oh, we're an hour and sixminutes, so we can split this in
two.
This will be part one, part two, about 30 minutes each, so
which is perfect.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Okay, Well, hopefully I didn't ramble too too much in
the very beginning.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
No, it's all information, all good stuff.
I feel like I woke up on thispodcast Well, that happens, that
happens, that happens, right,shit All right.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
So I'm going to go ahead and say good luck to you
tomorrow and Wednesday and we'llreconvene on.
Thursday And that's all I got.
You got anything else, that'sit.
That's all I got Tell Jamie, isaid hi, virtually.
I've never met her, but I seeyou're in the background.
Speaker 2 (34:25):
I will.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
So what's up, jamie?
Oh, we're going to do it rightnow.
Oh, we're going to do it rightnow.
Podcast host.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Brooke says hi, she hasn't met you, but says hi.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Hi, all right.
Thanks for putting me on thespot for us.
I wasn't ready, no.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
I'm just kidding.
You handled yourself well.
I know you got it.
I'm like yeah.
All right, we out.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
We out Good luck, have a good week.
Bye.
Hey guys, you're listening to part two of today's
episode.
If you haven't listened to partone of this episode, we'd
strongly recommend you listenfrom the beginning of part one
to understand where ourconversation starts up.
When you're done with thisepisode, please feel free to
rate, review and subscribe onApple Podcast.
It's the easiest way to supportthis podcast.
Enjoy part two and we'll seeyou next week.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
So at the end of the day, I'm always just trying to
get individuals to talk aboutthemselves so I can get an
understanding of what they're,what it's like, what they're
almost like so I can know whatto do when I walk in the door.
What to expect, do?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
you have a phone call with them.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I always have a minimum phone call Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Oh, okay, okay, So I used to do phone calls and then
I changed it to questionnaire.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Questionnaire works too.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Yeah, I changed it to an online questionnaire and if
I have any questions I can emailthem and ask them and all of
that.
But I feel like having itwritten down, having it written
exactly in their words, and Ican kind of go back and check it
before the session.
I feel like that always reallyhelps me to kind of know what
I'm walking in and just like youinstead of well, i know that
you said that you're not like isit clean?
(01:04):
But usually what I'll say islike for our session, i usually
ask that you declutter the areasthat you're looking to be
captured in most.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That's what I'm getting at.
That's essentially what you'regetting at.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
And then I tell them that minimal is best.
Minimal.
If you're thinking about addingthings to your space to help it
feel more homey, I always tellpeople to like, don't, like.
Don't go out and like, buysomething just to put up on the
walls just because you feel likethe walls are blank.
What blank walls are reallynice in photos.
Actually, minimal is better.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah it always does kill me sometimes the hardest
part of doing it.
Being in a hotel room is likeartwork that just is so loud and
it's in and it's like, yeah,like, because the focus is the
subjects.
That's the focus.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
So right, we don't need to be loud.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
I'm gonna, i'm going to the next.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
The next clip that you post on our thing should
just be every single time youhit it.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Yeah, that's actually good, yeah, so I have to
emphasize too on thisconversation.
So I'm thinking back.
When you do these podcasts, youlike, you just you're just
talking and you listen back andyou're like, oh, that sounded
odd, because in my head itsounds good, but maybe it's
interpreted correctly.
If you know me, i'm anextremely patient person.
(02:21):
I'm very tight.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
No, he's not.
Yeah, i'm just like get on here.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
I'm extremely patient , i'm really easy going, so I
don't walk into anybody's houseand go like this is trash, like
this is not what we discussed.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
There's a lot of work to do here.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I make anything work, we'll make it work.
I'm just looking for you totell me about you, that's
essentially what it comes downto, and little tips that will
help hopefully give theexpectations that you're looking
for in the photos, and I cangive you as much as I can on
that.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Right, and when we, when we offer to do phone calls,
when we offer to do you knowthe questionnaires and when I
know, so, like you know,scheduling the phone call might
seem a little bit more Mm, idon't know.
Fun, i want to say fun but Idon't think that that's.
I feel maybe professional iswhat I'm trying to look for, but
I know that some of my clientswhen they get the questionnaire
(03:14):
they just kind of like blow itoff and they're like go whatever
you know, But I strongly urgethe clients to write in.
I mean, I have questions aboutlike how can I have your kiddos
warm up to me?
Do you have pets and does ittake them a minute to warm up to
me?
Because I've also walked intoin-home sessions and gotten bit
by dogs because I have a bigcamera in my hand and they think
that I'm coming for theirnewborn baby, like that's dogs
(03:36):
are.
They're animals, they're gonnaassume the worst.
So I always ask them, you know,is there treats that I can give
your dog at the door before Ieven take out my camera?
Things like that where it's notonly gonna help me but it's
also going to help you?
because if I know, when peoplewalk into my door and Nelly is
just going buck wild all overthem, not only am I a little bit
embarrassed I know she's a dogand I know people expect it for
(03:58):
the most part but it'sembarrassing that I can't get a
hold of like my animal, like getover here, come on, you know.
And especially if they're notdog people, if they're not dog
people, and Nelly is going nutson them, like it's a little
embarrassing and it's notsomething you know that I think
my clients would make me feelbad about, you know.
But if I had somebody come inand I'm just like oh my God, i'm
(04:21):
so sorry It already is puttingyou in this position of you feel
uncomfortable and so you'reapologizing and that's not the
foot that you wanna start yoursession on.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
No, it's yeah that's so.
This wraps into the wholepicture of gaining as much
information as you can about youand the individual.
It helps in any situation,especially for photography.
So when we're dealing withpeople and this goes for any
business, honestly when you,when it's not just a service of
(04:54):
tech or something, a software,and you throw in people, you
automatically now have a wholenew level of if you can
understand them, it will makeyour experience that much better
.
Like, just apply that conceptto any business, any interaction
with humans you have to.
It will help always.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Actually, while we're talking about this, i wanna
send you oh, you might have seenit, i just posted a photo, but
I wanna send you one of thephotos from a family session
that this the mom.
My client described her sessionas what she wanted to be cozy
but chaotic, because that's whattheir life feels like at the
moment, and so I'm sending yousome pictures so that you can
(05:39):
see, because it helped me prepfor my session so much.
It helped me prep in a way whereI was like, okay, like I'm just
we're having fun with theirgirls and like we're gonna, you
know, jump on the bed and we'regonna get a little rambunctious,
cozy and chaotic, like, tell me, these photos do not scream
that to you.
But if I didn't, have if Ididn't have her description of
(06:02):
what she was hoping for, I mighthave gone a totally different
route 10 out of 10.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
This is exactly that description.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yep, that is wonderful, but it helps me so
much because, if I you know shewas, it was a newborn session,
but she has two older girls andshe wanted to make sure that
they were feeling just as loved,as, you know, the little guy
that she was welcoming So that'swhat we were focusing on was
okay.
how is this family kind ofworking through this newborn
(06:32):
stage in a cozy and chaotic way,like I loved it.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Yeah, i can't stop looking at them.
they're so good.
That's it Just a really goodexample.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Yeah, just a really good example of like how to help
your photographer prep in a waywhere they understand exactly
what you're hoping for.
And you know, somebody mighthave given Chris that prompt and
Chris might have captured it ina totally different way.
But this specific client ofmine has looked through all of
my you know my galleries andthings like that my blog posts
And so I feel like she chose mefor a specific reason.
(07:04):
And being able to look at herwords and go, okay, yeah, we got
this, like, let's do it.
Getting home and seeing thosephotos and editing them, i was
like oh my God, i love it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
They're, perfect So what we'll have to do is I wish
there was a way we could sharethis so you could see it, just
to get a picture.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
but We can post it on the feed.
I did post it on my feed so wecan share it on like our story
or something.
So when this comes out we canjust like share that specific
set that I posted so that peoplecan kind of reference like what
the cozy and chaotic?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
looked like So, they, they.
She hit the nail on my head, sothat was perfect.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Love that.
So a few other points, and Idon't know how much more time do
you have, cause we can runthrough them quick.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Let's run through them quick, okay.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
So I'm just gonna run through my list and if you have
anything to add, go for it.
After booking, order youroutfits early, and the reason
why is because a lot of yoursession at least for mine is
going to be very movement-based.
I see a lot of photographerstaking that onto.
Movement-based sessions givesprompts and not poses.
So if you are jumping around inyour outfit which I strongly
(08:14):
encourage you doing it after youorder your outfit when it comes
in, wear it for a day.
Do not wear something that'sbrand brand brand new to your
session, because you don'treally know how you feel in that
outfit.
You don't know how you lookStanding in front of a mirror
and you know sucking in yourbelly a little bit isn't going
to be the way that you lookthroughout an entire session.
So I would encourage you to run, jump, play, do whatever you
(08:36):
need to do to make sure that youare staying confident in that
outfit for a longer period oftime, if you feel like That goes
for any session.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
That goes for any session.
Yeah, doing something brand newon that day of is very risky.
So I mean you can take thatrisk, but you've got to be
really confident that you'regoing to look good in this.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
But even if you think about a wedding dress, how many
times do you go and you try iton and you're moving around and
you're trying you know you'redancing in front of a mirror to
make?
sure that you're not likefalling out of the top of your
dress.
I mean, if, basically, if youdon't feel confident in it,
you're not going to lookconfident in it and your photos
will show that.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Great business idea.
We need a-, so it's like a likean indoor trampoline park, but
just for attempting new clothes.
So, and we'll just have onephotographer there and just like
start shooting everybodyjumping around.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Done.
This outfit is certified.
Yeah, we have, like, a beforeand after.
Like, will this one make it?
Will this one make the cut?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Different winners.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
So the other thing, too, is that if you can't decide
on an outfit and sometimes I'llhave in-home sessions where my
clients want this is mostly for,like, newborn sessions, and I
totally understand it's it'sappealing to get dressed up for
your photo session, becauseyou're paying all this money,
you want to look really good,all of that but sometimes when
you dress up at an in-homesession, it actually kind of
doesn't really look quite right.
(09:51):
Having a more cozy vibe andhaving something that you know
you want to if you're having anin-home session, basically, what
I'm trying to say is that youwant to be wearing something in
your house that you wouldnormally wear.
Doesn't have to be your yourripped up sweats like I'm
wearing today, but you candefinitely you can talk to your
photographer about what packagethey have that might include two
(10:11):
outfits where maybe you startin-home.
I don't I just felt somethingmove under my feet, but I don't
know what it was.
You start in-home with like acozy outfit.
I'm just gonna totally ignore it, just think about it, keep it
going And then you can actuallyyou know plan for a second, you
know a second location orsomething like that and a
fancier outfit.
(10:32):
So if you wanted to do aportion in-home and then go
somewhere else, talk to yourphotographer about what they
have that offers for atwo-outfit session, so that you
don't necessarily have to choose.
Or if you're doing the thing ofordering an outfit last minute
and you're like I don't know ifthis is gonna work for the
entire thing, you might want tothink about doing a two-outfit
session.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Two-outfit session is a win, so that's- he's like I
got nothing to add.
No on the two-outfit session.
I mean, that's you you hit-.
It's nothing else for real forme to add to that other than you
know it's some people for theengagement session realm.
some people only care about oneoutfit And if that's your vibe,
you know I'm totally down forit.
But if you are someone whowants to explore a little bit.
(11:12):
you know, two-outfits is alwaysfun too, So It is fun.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
It is fun And by the second outfit you usually
understand a little bit moreabout, like, the ways in which
your photographer wants you tomove, And I feel like the second
outfit is always the one Ialways tell people make your
second outfit your favoriteoutfit, because your first
outfit you're just gonna be kindof like figuring it out,
learning how to be posing andstuff like that.
Yeah, that's good.
Another point is to talk toyour photographer about timing
(11:36):
and lighting.
So if you have a specific ideaas far as your engagement
session, if you want to bephotographed on the top of a
garage, if you want to bephotographed at a beach in full
sun, you want to be able to talkto your photographer about what
specific vibe you're lookingfor, because a lot of the time
you know we'll be, we'll beworking with some weather issues
(11:56):
, like I am today, as far as youknow, planning a session around
a certain type of weather or acertain type of day.
I would strongly encourage youto talk to your photographer
about that, but then not be tootied to the specific look in
what you're trying to go for,because life happens And what I
always try to I'm alwaysencouraging my clients.
(12:17):
I'm like don't cancel for therain.
Don't cancel for the rain,because I really love rainy
sessions.
I really do.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
I feel like getting underneath a clear umbrella,
which I always have at the readyin my car, like oh yeah, it's
so romantic, they look so funAnd some of my favorite photos
have been in the rain.
It's just, yeah, it's, it'stotally the vibe.
So I'm you know it depends onwho you are and what you're
posting and so forth So I'm ahuge fan of, so I was gonna say,
solar flares.
That's really intense.
(12:44):
Some flares sun flares in myespecially, like in my
engagement photos.
I'm just I can never get enoughof it, like a backlit, just sun
poking through.
So obviously when I post a lotof that, the repercussions are,
you know, that's expected.
It turns into an expectation.
So I have to lean into makingsure that my couples are aware
(13:08):
if the weather doesn't look good, i'm gonna be on top of before
you And then I have to do adouble check.
Like we can get amazing photosin the rain and the clouds.
Absolutely, i know, and mostpeople are pretty aware nowadays
too, like when they see theclouds it's actually I'm not
gonna say surprising, but it'sinteresting.
How many people will say to me,like isn't this a good thing?
We've got a lot of clouds goingon, so people are very aware
some basics of lighting And itjust comes.
(13:34):
Yeah, it's just expectations,so just making sure, but the
rainbows can be great.
This is a nap, colts.
What the heck is it called?
Speak easy, i told you it wasspeako.
The nap called speako.
I have it like I paid for it towork on me talking into this
mic.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
I don't think it's that bad.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
No, I need a counter We need to be in the.
AI for encounter to hear howmany times.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Oh, that can be another post.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
You're absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
You should do it Every time.
you should do ding.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
It would be a whole episode Like a counter, like 10
minutes.
You're right, That's no, and itwill be painful for myself, but
I need to see it.
I need to see the I don't.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Honestly, though, listening to you, i personally
don't.
I mean, we talk a lot and Idon't hear the ums as much as I
think you hear them.
But I also say like a lot anduh, so we'll see.
All right, so the next one islet go of your expectations and
self doubt After you've talkedto your photographer about what
(14:34):
you're hoping for and you have,like, openly discussed okay, i'm
hoping for this kind of asession, i'm hoping to capture
this kind of a vibe After thatrelease it.
Release it you've talked toyour photographer about what
you're hoping for and now youjust need to sit back and kind
of it sounds kind of weird, butlike hope for the best and just
trust the process.
You really just need tocommunicate at the very
(14:56):
beginning and throughout thosequestionnaires or the phone
calls or whatever.
Definitely you want to haveyour expectations heard, but
then you don't wanna be tied tothem too much.
You can't force a session to besomething that it is not.
If your kids start cryingduring a session, some of those
photos are my favorite becausemom or dad comes to the rescue
(15:17):
and they're loving on them andit's just so.
I feel so bad when I'm takingphotos of a crying kid.
I'm not even gonna lie.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Oh no, it does, but they're so cute.
But that was the real memory,that was the thing that happened
.
You're gonna wanna look back atthat.
It's not always all smiles.
It's not close to that.
So it's yeah Basically, if youcan't plan life.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
you can't plan how a session is gonna go You just
can't.
And if you pick a photographerwho is pretty lenient on the
style in which, if you have aphotographer where all you're
seeing is the happy sitting posysmiles, then yeah, you're not
gonna have those memoriescaptured of your baby crying
after they trip over a stumpwhich has happened to me.
But that photo, that oneparticular photo where dad came
(16:00):
to the rescue and he was holdinghis babe with tears streaming
down the face, it's my favoritephoto that I've ever taken of
that family and I photographedthem for like eight years.
So I mean just kind of let yoursession happen as it happens
and understand that meltdownswill happen.
Things will happen like thatwhere it's okay.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
I feel I think the tangible like comparison to this
would be the Pinterest boardexample, where it's providing a
Pinterest board of poses andanytime anyone does that, i
always, i encourage it, i alwayssay like that's wonderful,
because that means you care,fantastic, like you know, go in
there Always a star, asteriskpreface, whatever you wanna call
(16:41):
it.
Don't expect that they're gonnalook exactly the same, because
we have different light,different location, different
colors, different outfits anddifferent guess what you
different person, so you don'twant it to be the same.
I'm gonna take the idea of whatyou provided and maybe we can do
some very close things to thatand mimic that.
(17:01):
You know that specific shot wecan get If it's a very, very,
very specific shot, like youknow Who wants to copy somebody
else's wedding photo anyway, or?
lifestyle photo or whatever.
Who wants?
Speaker 1 (17:11):
to have an exact copy .
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Exactly that's the point.
These are your photos.
You want them to be unique.
So we're gonna take some ofthose ideas and we're gonna
mimic some of them to get thatvibe that you're looking for.
But it's always a two-waystreet where there's an
expectation that it will lookexactly the same and it's not
going to.
So I encourage that's a goodthing.
That's a good thing becauseyour photos are gonna go up and
(17:36):
somebody else is gonna be likeoh, i want that photo.
So, you gotta think of it likethat.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Right, okay, I have two more.
I can see you're kinda likelooking at your watch like
you're gonna have to go prettysoon.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
I actually know someone was calling me and this
is the first time.
In spite of this, i'm using forvideo.
I'm using my iPhone because ithas a thing called continuity
camera, which is wirelesslysending this video in very great
quality So someone was callingme and I was like oh, how does
that work now?
Like is it showing up on myscreen.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Like is it gonna?
mess with it So, but I've gotthe watch that tells me someone
was calling, so I just wannamake sure that we're keeping you
on schedule, because I'm justediting today, so we're good.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, as soon as this is over, you're gonna see me
just flip this table and run andgo do my next thing.
Okay, bye, You know it's over.
bye.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
We have check your worries at the door.
So if there's something at work, if there's something with
family, if there's somethingthat is kind of occupying your
mind, if there's something thatis, and if it's something that
is occupying your mind so muchwhere and I'm talking about like
grief if there's a situationwhere you are literally just not
(18:41):
going to be able to be okay forour session, it is 100% on you
and I'm really lenient.
Each of my sessions come withlike a built in reschedule date.
I think for and I don't know ifyou do the same thing, chris I
try really hard to stay exactlywhere I schedule my clients.
I try to keep them on that date, no matter what rain or shine,
(19:03):
unless there is something thatis going on family-wise, mental
health-wise.
I'm a huge advocate for takingcare of yourself first.
And if you're gonna show up toyour session with all of these
fears, worries, you know, puffyeyes from crying about something
that you have no control over,i want you to reach out to me
and I want you to tell me that,rather than just try to suck it
(19:24):
up and just stick through it forthe photos, because I don't
want it to be a reminder of thatmemory.
But in the same sense, if thisis a painfully beautiful time
for you, i also want you toweigh that too.
I've had sessions that werearound a heart-breaking time,
(19:44):
but it captured the vibe of whatwas happening in their life,
whether it was losing someone orsomeone was sick, or maybe they
were losing a family home andthey decided to have a session
there one last time and it'svery emotional.
What I'm trying to say is thatbeing emotional is okay, but if
(20:06):
it's something where you areliterally not going to enjoy the
process of taking your photosin the slightest because
something is going on, you needto be upfront and honest about
that and not be I don't wannasay not be worried about losing
your potential date, because Idefinitely try to keep people
where I book them, but there'salways a special circumstance.
(20:30):
There's always something whereit's and I wanna be very clear
here my sessions come with abuilt-in rescheduled date.
Weddings do not.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Weddings have a lot riding on them so I just wanna
make sure in the world of yeah,yeah, we'll just change the
wedding date, no, no butsessions where you are mentally
not able to get it together foryour session, i understand it.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
I have days like that .
I'm totally fine withrescheduling.
So leave your worries at thedoor.
Here's I'll do it.
I guess I'll do one.
Leave your worries at the door.
If you cannot, then two embraceit.
Embrace it and understand thatthis time in your life right now
is happening in a fleetinglypainfully beautiful way and if
(21:16):
you can handle that and you canprocess that and it's not doing
anything.
I mean, when I cry my eye, theylook like balls.
I swear to God.
They're so no, they're soswollen.
It's insane.
When my grandfather died, i wasliving with a roommate and I
walked out of my room.
She goes dude, you look likealien versus predator right now.
(21:38):
Oh my God, i was like are youserious?
Speaker 2 (21:43):
The only equivalent I have to that is.
What hurts my soul is seeingpeople finish a marathon or a
race and they're in front of thecamera smiling, and they look
unchanged.
And that is the one person inlife that I'm like, because I
run 500 feet and on my face is achair.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Right, right, yeah, mine too.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Like a monster, yeah, at the end of a race.
Yeah, i'm not.
It's not good, it's not photoquality.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
No, no, it's like.
Should Chris go to the hospital, or should we be taking photos
of him right now?
Speaker 2 (22:14):
Just yeah, literally just photos for reference that I
needed to go to the hospital,that's it.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
I guess what I'm trying to say is like don't be
afraid to talk to yourphotographer, or something too
intense is going on where youfeel like you cannot do this
session.
There's a really good chancethat your photographer is a
human and they're gonnaunderstand you, and if they
don't, that wasn't thephotographer for you in the
first place.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yeah, and there's gonna be both.
There's gonna be photographersthat can't handle it and I have
to be completely honest, thosereally intense sessions that
you're describing, i want to dothem and it almost makes me
nervous.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So it's a it's so intense, it's really hard.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
I've seen, i've been presented this idea of these
photos but like someone was inthe hospital and it was like a
literally last gathering and man, it's that tough that is so
tough, and it's something,though, that you have to.
It's on our end.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
It's a.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I don't wanna say suck it up, kind of like this is
above you and you'reeverything's, so you wanna have
a photographer that can handleit?
Speaker 1 (23:18):
obviously so it's, but it's for those photos And
some photographers can't handleit, but they do it anyway.
They do it anyway, like me.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
I know.
But that's a good thing.
I mean, that makes you a reallygood person.
So because you know theimportance of it, you know how
much, how the value isimmeasurable, absolutely
immeasurable.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I've done a few memory sessions and they're
every single one is just as hardas the last.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Yeah, yeah, there's no training yourself for this.
There's no getting stronger,thicker skin in this realm.
It's you're human to human,that's it, and you're breaking
walls down.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
No, and if you're a photographer who's been asked to
do something like that, don'tfeel the pressure to do it just
because you feel like you wouldbe a bad human if you didn't do
it.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
There's actually It's a really strong, it's tough,
that's really hard, it's tough.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
I feel like the only reason why I was even able to do
it is because I've gone throughso much grief in my life and I
understand the feelings thatthey will be left with
afterwards.
So the fact that they evenasked me, I felt just honored,
just honored to do anything likethat Incredible yeah.
To be the one to capturesomeone's last photos with
somebody, and sometimes theirfirst photos with somebody,
(24:29):
their first and their last andit is a really, really hard
thing to do, but it's, like Isaid, it's painfully beautiful
because you get to spend thatmoment with those people and
they'll forever remember you asthe person who showed up and did
that.
And so don't feel obligated.
(24:50):
But if you can help someone outlike that in that way, i would
encourage you to do it.
Yep, but not if it is going tofuck with your mental health.
Okay, now the last one that Ihave.
That I try to do with all of myclients and sometimes we do it
and sometimes we don't.
Sometimes it works andsometimes it doesn't, but it's
(25:11):
always a good idea and you tellme if you agree.
It's always a good idea to planan activity for you and your
spouse, for you and your family,whether it's going on an ice
cream day and having you knowice cream together, or going on
a hike, or are you saying postsession.
No, no, no In the session.
I love to have a session whereit's surrounded by things that
(25:33):
you are naturally doing and willstop and I'll pose you and all
of those things.
But you know, like aroundChristmas time, making hot
chocolate together, it doesn'thave to be something that's
going to take so long, it's justsomething where it's like it
adds a little bit of like thatcandidness, that playfulness,
and it's I always tell peopleI'm like be yourselves, but like
a little lovier, you know.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
That's always yeah, always when in doubt.
yeah for any decisions.
when in doubt, cozy is good,cozier is better, Yeah, we want
to fill the space, so love thatidea.
That's just that.
I think what sticks out with meand that and to take away would
be whatever you are doingnaturally, whatever feels
natural for that activity.
That's where you're, i mean,that's that's you're not looking
(26:15):
to, and it ties in with the newclothes, the new dress, like
you know do the brand new thingon the day of the suit, because
it feels like it's something youshould do Right, like an
activity that feels like homeRight, and if it feels like home
dress like you would dress forthat activity, maybe a little
bit cuter, maybe a little bitcozier Maybe, instead of maybe
(26:37):
instead of the sweatshirt youcan do like a really cute
sweater or something.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
So you want to like spice it up just a little bit,
but not so much where you getthe photos back and you're like
these don't even feel like us,these don't even feel like me.
You want your session to comeback and you want it to remind
you of this time At least.
If you're booking me as yourphotographer, you want your
photos to come back and remindyou of this fleeting moment that
is your engagement session,your newborn session, your
(27:03):
family session and all theselittle, the little toes and like
the quiet giggles and all ofthose things.
That's what you should hear andsee when you get your photos
back.
And if you're trying to forceit to be something that it's not
, i can guarantee you won't behappy with the photos, because
it's not actually capturing whatyou're looking to capture,
which is the happiness and thelove in your family.
(27:24):
If you're gritting your teethand you're like you fucking sit
down right now and look at thatcamera You don't know how many
sessions I've had where peopledo that And I'm like, oh I know,
so maybe we could just throw ababy in the air for a few.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
You know, like anything else, yeah, yeah, the
change gears really quick.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
Oh, no worries, Maybe he needs a snack.
Oh my gosh, yeah.
Have you ever had a sessionlike that?
Speaker 2 (27:47):
or somebody was like sit, yeah, i mean from the
moment we got there, it was aand it was I go, i.
this will be my, like, lastinput on this.
I, i, I still like manysessions, but I say this very
carefully This is a debatedtopic.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
Mm, hmm.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
For a lot of reasons.
I'll just pick one reason.
right now, many sessions aregood because I do appreciate
that there are families whoreally do just want a couple of
professional looking phones.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
They just can't, they just don't have the person,
they don't want to use theirphone camera, they just don't
feel comfortable or they can'tafford a full session.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
That's totally fine.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
That is totally okay.
So I like I can't.
We love to preach that everyperson should get the full hour
session, and you know all thesethings, but there are just the
realities.
There are some people who don'tpay, don't care that much, or
be they don't have the time,they don't want to make the time
, they just want some photos,but they're willing to pay a
little bit for it.
So it's always a push and pullin our industry.
(28:50):
But the one thing on what yousaid, though, that I will say,
which is the screaming child orjust the frustrated session the
moment you walk in I've had thatat many sessions, that's pretty
much when I have them is a minisession And it's a Because
they're like we have fiveminutes.
Yeah, and I always, you know,always try and preface, and with
(29:11):
the problem with mini sessionsis that you're blasting
information to everybody.
You can't get this one-on-oneconnections, which is like you
could try, but it's verydifficult.
So the individuals come andthey're rushing because they
don't want to miss their sessionand the kid's not in.
Well, and it's one I have toalways say, like you know, give,
let's give it.
You have a 15, 20 minute slot.
(29:32):
Let's wait five minutes.
Like let's take the kid down tothe lake, like, is there any?
can we grasp Any?
like grasp is there?
like let's go picking, pick upsticks.
Let's go and you've got the toy, and just, we're gonna put the
camera away.
Put the camera away becausethere's nothing you can do about
it.
There's nothing in your photoswill not come out like you want
them to.
So we're gonna just wait.
We're just gonna wait a fewminutes.
Let the individual, the child,some adult, like take a minute,
(29:57):
and yeah, just.
And then we'll come back andwe'll have to.
You know we'll take some quickphotos and we'll do some things
and I think it's gonna be okay.
That's a but yeah, going intothe session frustrated and
having someone say, oh, sit down, and, you know, smile at the
camera, and it's like this is.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
And as a photographer , i don't know about you, but I
can tell when I show up to ahouse and you and your spouse
were just fighting, i can tellalmost 100% of the time.
Or if you're like super annoyedwith one of the kids that just
like doesn't wanna do it, assoon as I walk in I'm like, oh
okay, like this is the vibe.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
It's, it's that and shit happens.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
That's like people are giving us time to think of
it.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
No, yeah, yeah, yeah.
But it's one of those thingswhere you know, these are the
things that we come back to theconcept of we deal with.
When you immediately of yourbusiness or what you're doing,
you're dealing with people,there's this shit you're gonna
run into that you don't thinkabout.
Or you're taking an educationalcourse and you're a new
photographer and you're, likeyou know, home session like this
is how you do it.
And then you forget about thewhole psychology of your dealing
(30:59):
with humans, and weird thingshappen when you're dealing with
humans, and one of those wouldbe like how do you, how do you
go about creating an environmentfor these photos that you had
in mind when the two people arefighting?
when you walked in, Bet, youdidn't think about that one.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
You pop open a bottle of champagne.
No, i'm just kidding.
Yeah, i'm all for that Here.
Take a sip very real quick.
Let's celebrate.
I'm all gonna toast, we'retoasting.
Yeah, that's I'm kidding.
I don't.
I don't condone that.
I love champagne in sessions.
When I'm saying I don't condonedrinking because you're like
fighting, i'm saying.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
I'm saying I literally walked in with bottle
of champagne and said drink this.
I'm kidding, brooke haddefinitely the like smile of
like.
Is he sick?
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I'm like, uh, That's just yeah, totally kidding.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, okay, I think it would be a good idea on this,
all of these individual piecesof session expectations and how
to prepare.
I would love so.
you and I have been talkingabout you know our experiences,
but this is a really wide topic.
It would be great if we somehowcould get information from
other other photographers andmaybe each of them give us a
piece of advice or somethingthat would be fun to share,
(32:07):
either in the next one or maybedown the road.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
That would be fun.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Re-up this conversation with individuals
and what they and we can talkabout that.
I think that would be a goodidea.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
And you know this is.
This is just a glimpse of ourprocess.
This isn't, you know, thisisn't all the things that we do.
This is just some ideas to makeyour session a little bit
easier, whether it's anengagement session and you're
feeling some nerves, or you havea family session And it's not
to.
You know us saying that we cantell when we walk into an
awkward situation.
(32:38):
I'm not saying that in a waywhere it's like you shouldn't do
that.
Like life does happen, it'stotally fine.
And if you need a minute whenwe walk in to just like, I just
need a second to decompress.
It's totally fine to ask forthat.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
And there's a yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah, of course, because if you need a second,
the thing is is that if you'reaggravated, when we show up and
we jump right into photos, yourphotos are gonna have that vibe.
Your kids are gonna be like,okay, cool, this is what we're
doing because we just got yelledat you know like We want the
photos that look relaxed and fun, or however you describe it.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Okay, what did you say?
It was cozy with chaos.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Cozy with chaos.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Cozy with chaos.
That sounds yeah.
That's like that's an episodetitle Cozy with chaos.
I like that.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Maybe that should be this title In home sessions cozy
and chaotic.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
I love it.
I gotta write that down.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
I have to thank my client who sent me that.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Yeah, you do.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
But yeah, this is just a small part of the process
.
This is obviously, and it'skind of a shorter episode, so I
think we can release this one injust one, right Cause the other
ones were like a little bitover an hour.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
No, we're over an hour right now.
Oh, we're an hour and sixminutes, so we can split this in
two.
This will be part one, part two, about 30 minutes each, so
which is perfect.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Okay, Well, hopefully I didn't ramble too too much in
the very beginning.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
No, it's all information, all good stuff.
I feel like I woke up on thispodcast Well, that happens, that
happens, that happens, right,shit All right.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
So I'm going to go ahead and say good luck to you
tomorrow and Wednesday and we'llreconvene on.
Thursday And that's all I got.
You got anything else, that'sit.
That's all I got Tell Jamie, isaid hi, virtually.
I've never met her, but I seeyou're in the background.
Speaker 2 (34:25):
I will.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
So what's up, jamie?
Oh, we're going to do it rightnow.
Oh, we're going to do it rightnow.
Podcast host.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Brooke says hi, she hasn't met you, but says hi.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Hi, all right.
Thanks for putting me on thespot for us.
I wasn't ready, no.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
I'm just kidding.
You handled yourself well.
I know you got it.
I'm like yeah.
All right, we out.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
We out Good luck, have a good week.
Bye.
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.