September 9, 2025 • 21 mins
🎧 Episode 180: The AI-Ready Customer Experience Playbook with Ty Givens (Part 2)
In Part 2 of this conversation, Ty Givens, founder of CX Collective and CX Collective Advantage, goes deeper into the human side of customer experience leadership—where imposter syndrome, self-trust, and resilience collide with the demands of scaling in the age of AI.
Ty shares openly about her own battles with feeling “not ready,” what it really takes to trust yourself as a leader, and why sometimes the best CX strategy isn’t about speed or automation—it’s about empathy and meeting customers where they are.
We explore:
- The emotional cost of being promoted before you’re ready—and how to overcome imposter syndrome
- Practical strategies to build self-trust and resilience as a CX leader
- How to balance metrics like efficiency and speed with empathy and well-being
- The most common help desk “patchwork” problems—and the simplest fix to stop losing tickets
- The evolving skill set CX leaders need to thrive in 2025 and beyond
- The truth no one talks about: there’s no single “right” way to do CX
- Ty’s one piece of wisdom for leaders everywhere: you’re enough
🔑 Key takeaways:
- Self-doubt doesn’t disqualify you—it can fuel growth if you let it
- Trust is built not by being perfect, but by being transparent about mistakes
- The best customer experience is the one that fits your company, not someone else’s model
- Great CX leadership today requires mastering processes, knowledge management, and AI—not just people management
đź’ˇ Quotes to remember:
“I only make mistakes on days that end with Y.”
 “The best customer experience is the one that’s right for your business.”
 “You’re enough.”
 “Efficiency without empathy isn’t customer experience—it’s customer neglect.”
đź“š Resources mentioned:
✨ Learn more about Ty’s work:
📲 Connect with Ty:
 LinkedIn – Ty Givens
 YouTube – CX Collective Advantage Channel
A rising tide raises all ships, and I invite you along on this journey to Evoke Greatness!
Check out my website: www.evokegreatness.com
Follow me on:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sonnie-linebarger-899b9a52/
https://www.instagram.com/evoke.greatness/
https://www.tiktok.com/@evoke.greatness
http://www.youtube.com/@evokegreatness
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
When I was 24 years old, I got my first management
job at Intuit.
I was 24.
My boss would tell me that Iwasn't strategic.
Well, of course I'm notstrategic.
I'm 24, right.
So now what do I do?
I try to help leaders figureout how to think strategically,
because no one taught me any ofthese things.
I went to the school of hardknocks.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Welcome to Evoke Greatness, the podcast for bold
leaders and big dreamers whorefuse to settle.
I'm your host, sunny.
I started in scrubs over 20years ago doing the gritty,
unseen work and climbed my wayto CEO.
Every rung of that laddertaught me something worth
passing on Lessons in leadership, resilience and what it really
(00:49):
takes to rise.
You'll hear raw conversations,unfiltered truths and the kind
of wisdom that ignites somethingdeeper in you your courage,
your conviction, your calling.
This show will help you thinkbigger, lead better and show up
bolder in every part of yourlife.
This is your place to grow.
Let's rise together.
(01:22):
In part two of my conversationwith Ty Givens, we dive into the
human side of customerexperience leadership the part
no playbook or software canfully prepare you for.
You're going to learn practicalways to build self-trust and
resilience as a leader inhigh-pressure environments, why
being transparent about mistakesis one of the fastest ways to
(01:43):
build credibility and trust, andhow to balance metrics like
speed and efficiency withempathy and well-being.
Okay, let's hop into it.
You've talked about theemotional cost of being promoted
before you're ready and youreferenced it a little bit like
hey, I'm this age and I findthat so often in leadership.
(02:03):
Sometimes we promote peopleinto a role because they were
really good in their last role,with very little training or
setting them up for success inthis promoted role.
Yeah, I'm curious for yourjourney.
How did imposter syndrome showup and how did you overcome it?
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Oh my gosh.
First of all, funny story.
Before I went to Intuit, when Iwas 24 years old, I was working
for the Expo Design Centers,which is a Home Depot company.
This is like during that youknow, huge surge in the real
estate market, where everyonewas buying, remodeling, flipping
homes, things like that.
It was around 2006.
And this lady her name is JulesI hope she doesn't mind me
(02:41):
saying her name Jules wasemailing me a lot and, you know,
on my Yahoo account, to giveyou an idea of how old this was,
and I would see her messagesand I it was like you know,
workforce manager, and I'm likeI'm not ready to be a manager,
so I would ignore it.
And so I had gone to an eventfor Expo with one of our vendors
(03:04):
and I told them hey, if youguys need me, give me a call.
Well, if you called outsidephone numbers, it would show up
as unknown.
So I get a call from an unknownnumber.
I think it's work, so I stepout to answer it.
It's Jules and she's like I'mtrying to email, like get in
touch with you, I think you willbe perfect for this role.
I was like I am not ready to bea manager and then she's like
(03:26):
but I really think you are.
And so I go in for theinterview, I get the job.
I didn't even really know what Iwas supposed to do and because
the term manager to me soundedso official, I mean, I was
blessed.
My first employee was a guynamed Scott we're still friends
(03:49):
to this day and I think that Ihad this expectation of how I
was supposed to show up becauseI was a manager.
But I got lucky because atIntuit they trained us.
Well, it wasn't training, itwas well, it was kind of
training, but it was like 40hours a week, I mean, excuse me,
a year of learning that we hadan opportunity to do.
(04:10):
So what was cool about that isthat I actually kind of got
guided through what does it meanand how do you show up and like
your personal brand and how tomanage.
So that helped me a lot.
But I never felt what's the wordmaybe worthy Like?
I always felt like, maybe likeis this, should I be doing this?
(04:34):
Is this the right thing?
And you know, to be honest withyou, I don't know that that has
ever truly gone away.
It doesn't matter what Iaccomplish Every day I get up
and because I am never satisfiedwith the status quo, I'm always
a little bit unsure and I kindof like it.
For my company, like I said,I've been around nine years.
(04:55):
It took me two years to saythat I was the CEO.
I didn't want to say thatbecause I felt like that was
like who was I to think that Ishould be a CEO?
You know, and yeah, it happensevery day.
But I, you know, I get up and Ido my best and I'm okay with
that.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, I think we take a lot of lessons, though, and
as we work, as we have beenthrough that, and I don't know a
person who hasn't felt that wayat one point in time or another
.
What you just shared, reminded,took me back to my very first
management role, and I rememberI went to the very first meeting
, like, where all the leaderssat around the table and I was
(05:34):
sure I was certain that someonewas going to stand up and say
what is she doing here?
Like I was certain of it.
Somebody like the gig was up, Iwas busted, somebody was going
to be like she has no idea whatshe's doing, because that's how
I felt, and so I reference thatstory a lot as I work with
leaders.
(05:55):
But I also take that experienceand I think about leaders today
In my business.
Today we're doing some reverseengineering where making sure
that our leaders have thetraining they need.
They may have been on board fora year now we're going back to
square one and building aplaybook, a training playbook.
It's never too late.
(06:15):
It's never too late torecognize that.
But I think sometimes takingour own experience and actually
it reveals the human side ofwhat we do, and there are some
of those feelings ofunworthiness, or you know who's
going to figure it out.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Yeah, yeah, and you know, being 24, this person on
our team was 13 years my seniorand they would like refer to me
as little Ty Ty.
And you know, like I rememberthere was like a chain to the
guard.
We had a new VP that came inand he wanted me to work on a
different project and so he wasgoing to make me a project
(06:54):
manager.
And so he's like, but I needyou to find someone to backfill
for workforce management.
So I started looking into that,found someone who I thought
would be good on the team andI'll never forget her boss said
oh, ty's a junior manager.
I'm like I think I'm the samekind of manager she is, but okay
, cool, like whatever, you know,whatever makes people feel good
(07:17):
, because I guess to have a24-year-old on the team didn't
feel the same, you know.
And so those things chip awaybeing told you're not strategic.
That chips away, but it also,at the same time, can be fuel
because, you know, I feel likeI'm pretty decent at my job, but
I definitely have opportunitiesand I'm human.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
Yeah, sure, when you think about the strategies
around like self-trust as aleader, what strategies can you
can help, I guess, thosecustomer experience emerging
leaders as they kind of start tobuild self-trust within
themselves or resilience as theystep into more higher roles or
(07:57):
more demanding roles.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
You know, make new mistakes, because if you're
worried about being perfect,then good luck right Making new
mistakes, and then betransparent about the ones that
you make, because what that doesis that builds trust, not only
for you, but it builds trust forthe people that you're working
with, and you'll start to learnto trust yourself more.
(08:21):
You'll know what you're good atand what you're not good at.
So, for example, I don't fancymyself a good people manager at
all.
I can be introverted, very muchlike being an individual
contributor, but I cannot bethat and operate in the capacity
that I am.
So I constantly have to remindmyself to, kind of like, step
(08:41):
out of my box and to actuallyhelp other people shine, instead
of me being the one that's, youknow, good at building this
process.
It doesn't matter Build theprocess, hand it off, let
someone else own it and run it,but I think that one of the ways
in which I've been able to getpast, you know, being worried
about or consumed with, you knowwhat people may think is to
(09:02):
just be like yeah, I only makemistakes on days that end with Y
.
I say that all the time.
I make mistakes every day.
I just try to make new ones.
That's the thing.
And sometimes I make the sameones.
I don't mean to but it, youknow it happens.
Fake.
I make the same ones.
I don't mean to but it, youknow it happens Right.
(09:22):
But the idea is that you knowI'm constantly trying to learn
from what I did before so that Ican be better in the future.
And you know I'm also okay withwhat I don't know.
So you'll see.
You know, if you look at mySlack, you'll see a lot of like
oops, I'm sorry, yep, I reallyscrewed that up.
Okay, like you'll see a lot oflike oops, I'm sorry, yep, I
really screwed that up.
Okay, let me know how I canhelp you in the future.
(09:42):
It just, it just is.
So just you know.
Be confident, be confident inthe fact that you will overcome
it, whatever it is.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Yeah, and it's, and it's.
It's lessons, not losses, right, it's.
It's facing that in a way whereyou take those things not as a
hit to your ego or that you thatyou're not, you don't know what
you're doing.
Rather, it's like OK, great,like you said, I want to learn
new mistakes.
Like I want to learn the newthings, because then I've
(10:10):
learned the old things, I'veactually got the lesson out of
it.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Yeah.
Yeah, and how do you balance thepursuit of metrics like speed
and efficiency with maintainingthe human side of things like
empathy and humility and overallwell-being?
It's funny you ask that becauseI have.
I can think about a time atThrive Cosmetics we had a team
(10:35):
member who was excellent on thephones with customers, loved her
, but her calls were hours.
It could be two hours one hour,which is a long time because
you're trying to operate withyou know five, six minute handle
time and with that you reallyhave to take it case by case.
But the idea is, what is thattrade off right?
(10:57):
So if this person, if she's onthe phone for an hour but she's
increasing average order valuebecause now that person was
going to buy you know oneproduct but they ended up buying
six products because of herguidance, that's worth it Right
Right Now.
If she's just on the phone withsomeone just letting them vent,
that's a little bit differentand in those cases what you have
(11:19):
to do is have a conversationwith the person to just kind of
help them see how they might bedifferent from the rest of the
team and you give them theopportunity to course correct
and make changes, because Ithink what startup founders
sometimes forget is that andthis is not anything specific to
the startup founder at ThriveCosmetics, because that's not
who I'm referencing in this, butthe startup founders tend to
(11:42):
forget some of the others thatI've worked with that when
people take your word to heart,so when you tell them that you
want them to, you know deliverthe best possible experience and
to make the customer happy,that is exactly what they're
going to try to do.
It's on the fact that theyshould have a five minute handle
time and so you have.
(12:03):
It's just a balance and likeyou take a company like Zappos I
think their longest with eighthours or something wild like
that If you call and talk tothis day, they'll just converse
with you.
Like it, it really is aboutwhat they understand.
Is it's really about the netpromoter, like what other people
are saying about your businessto people that they love and
(12:23):
trust.
That matters more than you knowthat time.
So the metrics thing can behard.
What I found that was justgiving people the awareness
really really helps, because alot of times they just don't
know and they really do thinkthey're doing the best work they
could possibly do.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
And I'm sure you've worked with a lot of kind of
help desk, if you will right,like air quotes help desk, but
like whatever that department isthat helps customers navigate.
What's the most common kind ofpatchwork issues that you've
seen, those types of help desksystems, and what's the simplest
step for people to actuallystart fixing them?
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah, the way that they organize their workflow.
So you take a tool like Zendesk.
The workflow is organizedthrough views typically, and if
you don't set up those viewsproperly, then can't find my
tickets, and the answer reallyis in the way that the views are
organized.
So we have a standard system wedo, which starts with tickets
assigned to you.
Then, ironically, the next oneisn't just tickets that are like
waiting.
There are tickets that areolder than your service level.
(13:40):
So if you want to enter 24hours, then we go to tickets
that have been waiting for 24hours, whether they're assigned
or not.
Why?
Because if I call out today butmy customer replies back,
they're going to have to waituntil I get back.
Unless the ticket's in thatview, then we'll jump down into
new tickets and then we'll go onto your on-hold tickets.
(14:00):
So we have a really clearstrategy on how we approach that
, and I think one of the biggestones we find is I don't know
where my work is.
I can't work.
I can't see what I need to donext.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
As you look ahead at the future, what core skills or
mindsets do you think willdefine successful customer
experience?
Leaders in the age of AI andrapid scaling in the age of AI
and rapid scaling, you have tobe really good at processes.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
I know back, if I go back to like my Home Depot days
even Office Depot, because I wasthere too that customer service
leader was very different thanthe one that we have today.
So back then you know you hadthat your job was people
(14:49):
management and leadershipcoaching discussions.
The reports that you managed to, someone sent those to you.
You didn't have to go and findyour own information.
You want to find out ifsomeone's doing well on the
phones, then you just ping thequality department for them to
send over the scores.
So you had everything prettymuch given to you so that you
could have conversations withpeople.
Today, the CX leader is expectedto generate all of that
(15:10):
information and still have theconversation.
So if you don't, if you're notgood at setting up and
organizing processes andleveraging AI in different ways
to help you automate that workand surrounding yourself with
good people who can take thingsoff your plate, it's going to be
hard, because the name of thegame is no longer just, you know
(15:31):
, coach people.
The name of the game is how doyou become more efficient,
because you know companies areseeing AI and they're baking
that into budgets, thinkingwe're going to hire 50% less
because now we have AI and it'slike it doesn't exactly work
that way.
50% less because now we have AIand it's like it doesn't
exactly work that way.
So I would say understandprocesses, understand knowledge
(15:52):
management.
Those are things that arereally going to shape up the way
that the CX leadership rolechanges 2025 and beyond.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
When you think about customer experience leadership,
what's a truth that nobodyopenly talks about, but needs to
be said out loud?
Speaker 1 (16:11):
That nobody really knows the right way to do
anything, because there's nosuch thing as right, it's just
what's right for that company orbusiness.
So sometimes I'll interviewpeople that I may be considering
bringing on and I'm like sowhat do you think is the best
customer experience?
And if they give me a veryclear answer on what they think
is right, they're not a good fitBecause at the end of the day,
(16:33):
the best customer experience isthe one that is best for that
company.
So we have a client who is notinterested in AI and automation.
People think might think that'sodd, they don't want it.
It's not bad, it's just notwhat they want.
That's okay.
Then we have another clientwho's like the last thing I want
(16:54):
is to get a ticket.
So can you please help me toset up everything to deflect as
much as I can?
I'll answer one, but I don'twant to Help me.
Sure, so it's really about whatis understanding?
That there's no such thing as aright way to do things, and I
think that that is one thingthat nobody wants to talk about.
(17:15):
When you know, even when you goto events, everybody wants to
sound like they know how todeliver the best experience.
It's like that's so subjectiveRight.
The best experience is the onethat your client wants.
Love that.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Well, as we wrap up, there's always a question that I
love to ask, and just reallyusually.
The answer sometimes surprisesyou, it surprises me.
But if it were your last day onearth, and of all the things
you've learned so far, you couldonly impart one piece of wisdom
or guidance to the world, whatwould it be?
Speaker 1 (17:48):
That's a very good question.
One piece of guidance, you'reenough.
You're enough.
You know my niece is going offto college.
Shout out to Tuskegee, hey,she's going off to college, and
(18:11):
so we get to for our you know,our last dinner while she's
living in Los Angeles, beforeshe heads out.
And so I'm like trying to giveher all of this stuff that I
wish someone would have told meat 17, 18, so that she can be as
prepared as possible.
I can't prepare her foreverything.
(18:32):
Her mom can't, none of us can,but you know, one of the things
that I did tell her is like oneday you're going to go through
something that you're not goingto be able to explain, you're
going to be good to someonewho's not good to you and at the
end of the day, I don't wantyou to think there's something
wrong with you.
Right, because there isn't.
Sometimes people just makedecisions and you alone.
(18:55):
You're enough.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Oh, I love that Amen to that.
I love your ability to weave inagain like the human side of
what you do and it really is soingrained in it.
But you just articulate it verywell, thank you.
And so I appreciate you sharingyour story and sharing more
about what you do.
But, ty, I would love for youto share, we'll put all this in
(19:19):
the show notes, but where canpeople find you, find out more
about your business?
You know, if they're lookingfor some of these playbooks that
you talked about, where wouldthey find them?
Speaker 1 (19:26):
So the playbooks you'll find at
cxcollectiveadvantagecom andthen from there you'll be able
to like, browse a list of what'savailable.
We actually have a YouTubechannel where we do overviews.
It's AI generated.
I don't hide that.
It is what it is, but it's anAI generated podcast style
overview of each of the coursesand the idea there is for you to
(19:49):
really understand like, hey, doI, do I need to do this, or is
this enough?
Because if you find what youneed on on YouTube and more
power to you if you want tolearn anything about consulting,
it's cxcollectivecom.
I'm on LinkedIn.
I am super responsive becauseI'm a customer support person,
so feel free to reach out, butyeah, like where I mean I'm
(20:09):
super accessible and I try to.
If I take on a consultingclient, I want to make sure that
it's me that they see most ofthe time.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Awesome.
Well, I appreciate you comingon.
Thank you for sharing time andyour wisdom and knowledge of
what you do.
That is applicable to so manydoesn't mean that someone has to
have necessarily, even like, adedicated customer experience
department.
It means how do we want ourcustomers to feel our support
right?
And so you have talked aboutyour services and what you do,
(20:39):
and really your expertise, sowell that anybody can take
something away from it.
So I appreciate your time, ty.
Thank you so much for going on.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm grateful to be here.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
If today's episode challenged you, moved you or lit
a fire in your soul, don't keepit to yourself.
Share it with somebody who'sready to rise.
Could I ask you to take 30seconds to leave a review?
It's the best way to say thankyou and help this show reach
more bold leaders like you,because this isn't just a
podcast, it's a movement.
We're not here to play small.
(21:20):
We're here to lead loud, onebold and unapologetic step at a
time.
Until next time, stay bold,stay grounded and make moves
that make mediocre uncomfortable.
When I was 24 years old, I got my first management
job at Intuit.
I was 24.
My boss would tell me that Iwasn't strategic.
Well, of course I'm notstrategic.
I'm 24, right.
So now what do I do?
I try to help leaders figureout how to think strategically,
because no one taught me any ofthese things.
I went to the school of hardknocks.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Welcome to Evoke Greatness, the podcast for bold
leaders and big dreamers whorefuse to settle.
I'm your host, sunny.
I started in scrubs over 20years ago doing the gritty,
unseen work and climbed my wayto CEO.
Every rung of that laddertaught me something worth
passing on Lessons in leadership, resilience and what it really
(00:49):
takes to rise.
You'll hear raw conversations,unfiltered truths and the kind
of wisdom that ignites somethingdeeper in you your courage,
your conviction, your calling.
This show will help you thinkbigger, lead better and show up
bolder in every part of yourlife.
This is your place to grow.
Let's rise together.
(01:22):
In part two of my conversationwith Ty Givens, we dive into the
human side of customerexperience leadership the part
no playbook or software canfully prepare you for.
You're going to learn practicalways to build self-trust and
resilience as a leader inhigh-pressure environments, why
being transparent about mistakesis one of the fastest ways to
(01:43):
build credibility and trust, andhow to balance metrics like
speed and efficiency withempathy and well-being.
Okay, let's hop into it.
You've talked about theemotional cost of being promoted
before you're ready and youreferenced it a little bit like
hey, I'm this age and I findthat so often in leadership.
(02:03):
Sometimes we promote peopleinto a role because they were
really good in their last role,with very little training or
setting them up for success inthis promoted role.
Yeah, I'm curious for yourjourney.
How did imposter syndrome showup and how did you overcome it?
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Oh my gosh.
First of all, funny story.
Before I went to Intuit, when Iwas 24 years old, I was working
for the Expo Design Centers,which is a Home Depot company.
This is like during that youknow, huge surge in the real
estate market, where everyonewas buying, remodeling, flipping
homes, things like that.
It was around 2006.
And this lady her name is JulesI hope she doesn't mind me
(02:41):
saying her name Jules wasemailing me a lot and, you know,
on my Yahoo account, to giveyou an idea of how old this was,
and I would see her messagesand I it was like you know,
workforce manager, and I'm likeI'm not ready to be a manager,
so I would ignore it.
And so I had gone to an eventfor Expo with one of our vendors
(03:04):
and I told them hey, if youguys need me, give me a call.
Well, if you called outsidephone numbers, it would show up
as unknown.
So I get a call from an unknownnumber.
I think it's work, so I stepout to answer it.
It's Jules and she's like I'mtrying to email, like get in
touch with you, I think you willbe perfect for this role.
I was like I am not ready to bea manager and then she's like
(03:26):
but I really think you are.
And so I go in for theinterview, I get the job.
I didn't even really know what Iwas supposed to do and because
the term manager to me soundedso official, I mean, I was
blessed.
My first employee was a guynamed Scott we're still friends
(03:49):
to this day and I think that Ihad this expectation of how I
was supposed to show up becauseI was a manager.
But I got lucky because atIntuit they trained us.
Well, it wasn't training, itwas well, it was kind of
training, but it was like 40hours a week, I mean, excuse me,
a year of learning that we hadan opportunity to do.
(04:10):
So what was cool about that isthat I actually kind of got
guided through what does it meanand how do you show up and like
your personal brand and how tomanage.
So that helped me a lot.
But I never felt what's the wordmaybe worthy Like?
I always felt like, maybe likeis this, should I be doing this?
(04:34):
Is this the right thing?
And you know, to be honest withyou, I don't know that that has
ever truly gone away.
It doesn't matter what Iaccomplish Every day I get up
and because I am never satisfiedwith the status quo, I'm always
a little bit unsure and I kindof like it.
For my company, like I said,I've been around nine years.
(04:55):
It took me two years to saythat I was the CEO.
I didn't want to say thatbecause I felt like that was
like who was I to think that Ishould be a CEO?
You know, and yeah, it happensevery day.
But I, you know, I get up and Ido my best and I'm okay with
that.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, I think we take a lot of lessons, though, and
as we work, as we have beenthrough that, and I don't know a
person who hasn't felt that wayat one point in time or another
.
What you just shared, reminded,took me back to my very first
management role, and I rememberI went to the very first meeting
, like, where all the leaderssat around the table and I was
(05:34):
sure I was certain that someonewas going to stand up and say
what is she doing here?
Like I was certain of it.
Somebody like the gig was up, Iwas busted, somebody was going
to be like she has no idea whatshe's doing, because that's how
I felt, and so I reference thatstory a lot as I work with
leaders.
(05:55):
But I also take that experienceand I think about leaders today
In my business.
Today we're doing some reverseengineering where making sure
that our leaders have thetraining they need.
They may have been on board fora year now we're going back to
square one and building aplaybook, a training playbook.
It's never too late.
(06:15):
It's never too late torecognize that.
But I think sometimes takingour own experience and actually
it reveals the human side ofwhat we do, and there are some
of those feelings ofunworthiness, or you know who's
going to figure it out.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Yeah, yeah, and you know, being 24, this person on
our team was 13 years my seniorand they would like refer to me
as little Ty Ty.
And you know, like I rememberthere was like a chain to the
guard.
We had a new VP that came inand he wanted me to work on a
different project and so he wasgoing to make me a project
(06:54):
manager.
And so he's like, but I needyou to find someone to backfill
for workforce management.
So I started looking into that,found someone who I thought
would be good on the team andI'll never forget her boss said
oh, ty's a junior manager.
I'm like I think I'm the samekind of manager she is, but okay
, cool, like whatever, you know,whatever makes people feel good
(07:17):
, because I guess to have a24-year-old on the team didn't
feel the same, you know.
And so those things chip awaybeing told you're not strategic.
That chips away, but it also,at the same time, can be fuel
because, you know, I feel likeI'm pretty decent at my job, but
I definitely have opportunitiesand I'm human.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
Yeah, sure, when you think about the strategies
around like self-trust as aleader, what strategies can you
can help, I guess, thosecustomer experience emerging
leaders as they kind of start tobuild self-trust within
themselves or resilience as theystep into more higher roles or
(07:57):
more demanding roles.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
You know, make new mistakes, because if you're
worried about being perfect,then good luck right Making new
mistakes, and then betransparent about the ones that
you make, because what that doesis that builds trust, not only
for you, but it builds trust forthe people that you're working
with, and you'll start to learnto trust yourself more.
(08:21):
You'll know what you're good atand what you're not good at.
So, for example, I don't fancymyself a good people manager at
all.
I can be introverted, very muchlike being an individual
contributor, but I cannot bethat and operate in the capacity
that I am.
So I constantly have to remindmyself to, kind of like, step
(08:41):
out of my box and to actuallyhelp other people shine, instead
of me being the one that's, youknow, good at building this
process.
It doesn't matter Build theprocess, hand it off, let
someone else own it and run it,but I think that one of the ways
in which I've been able to getpast, you know, being worried
about or consumed with, you knowwhat people may think is to
(09:02):
just be like yeah, I only makemistakes on days that end with Y
.
I say that all the time.
I make mistakes every day.
I just try to make new ones.
That's the thing.
And sometimes I make the sameones.
I don't mean to but it, youknow it happens.
Fake.
I make the same ones.
I don't mean to but it, youknow it happens Right.
(09:22):
But the idea is that you knowI'm constantly trying to learn
from what I did before so that Ican be better in the future.
And you know I'm also okay withwhat I don't know.
So you'll see.
You know, if you look at mySlack, you'll see a lot of like
oops, I'm sorry, yep, I reallyscrewed that up.
Okay, like you'll see a lot oflike oops, I'm sorry, yep, I
really screwed that up.
Okay, let me know how I canhelp you in the future.
(09:42):
It just, it just is.
So just you know.
Be confident, be confident inthe fact that you will overcome
it, whatever it is.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Yeah, and it's, and it's.
It's lessons, not losses, right, it's.
It's facing that in a way whereyou take those things not as a
hit to your ego or that you thatyou're not, you don't know what
you're doing.
Rather, it's like OK, great,like you said, I want to learn
new mistakes.
Like I want to learn the newthings, because then I've
(10:10):
learned the old things, I'veactually got the lesson out of
it.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Yeah.
Yeah, and how do you balance thepursuit of metrics like speed
and efficiency with maintainingthe human side of things like
empathy and humility and overallwell-being?
It's funny you ask that becauseI have.
I can think about a time atThrive Cosmetics we had a team
(10:35):
member who was excellent on thephones with customers, loved her
, but her calls were hours.
It could be two hours one hour,which is a long time because
you're trying to operate withyou know five, six minute handle
time and with that you reallyhave to take it case by case.
But the idea is, what is thattrade off right?
(10:57):
So if this person, if she's onthe phone for an hour but she's
increasing average order valuebecause now that person was
going to buy you know oneproduct but they ended up buying
six products because of herguidance, that's worth it Right
Right Now.
If she's just on the phone withsomeone just letting them vent,
that's a little bit differentand in those cases what you have
(11:19):
to do is have a conversationwith the person to just kind of
help them see how they might bedifferent from the rest of the
team and you give them theopportunity to course correct
and make changes, because Ithink what startup founders
sometimes forget is that andthis is not anything specific to
the startup founder at ThriveCosmetics, because that's not
who I'm referencing in this, butthe startup founders tend to
(11:42):
forget some of the others thatI've worked with that when
people take your word to heart,so when you tell them that you
want them to, you know deliverthe best possible experience and
to make the customer happy,that is exactly what they're
going to try to do.
It's on the fact that theyshould have a five minute handle
time and so you have.
(12:03):
It's just a balance and likeyou take a company like Zappos I
think their longest with eighthours or something wild like
that If you call and talk tothis day, they'll just converse
with you.
Like it, it really is aboutwhat they understand.
Is it's really about the netpromoter, like what other people
are saying about your businessto people that they love and
(12:23):
trust.
That matters more than you knowthat time.
So the metrics thing can behard.
What I found that was justgiving people the awareness
really really helps, because alot of times they just don't
know and they really do thinkthey're doing the best work they
could possibly do.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
And I'm sure you've worked with a lot of kind of
help desk, if you will right,like air quotes help desk, but
like whatever that department isthat helps customers navigate.
What's the most common kind ofpatchwork issues that you've
seen, those types of help desksystems, and what's the simplest
step for people to actuallystart fixing them?
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah, the way that they organize their workflow.
So you take a tool like Zendesk.
The workflow is organizedthrough views typically, and if
you don't set up those viewsproperly, then can't find my
tickets, and the answer reallyis in the way that the views are
organized.
So we have a standard system wedo, which starts with tickets
assigned to you.
Then, ironically, the next oneisn't just tickets that are like
waiting.
There are tickets that areolder than your service level.
(13:40):
So if you want to enter 24hours, then we go to tickets
that have been waiting for 24hours, whether they're assigned
or not.
Why?
Because if I call out today butmy customer replies back,
they're going to have to waituntil I get back.
Unless the ticket's in thatview, then we'll jump down into
new tickets and then we'll go onto your on-hold tickets.
(14:00):
So we have a really clearstrategy on how we approach that
, and I think one of the biggestones we find is I don't know
where my work is.
I can't work.
I can't see what I need to donext.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
As you look ahead at the future, what core skills or
mindsets do you think willdefine successful customer
experience?
Leaders in the age of AI andrapid scaling in the age of AI
and rapid scaling, you have tobe really good at processes.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
I know back, if I go back to like my Home Depot days
even Office Depot, because I wasthere too that customer service
leader was very different thanthe one that we have today.
So back then you know you hadthat your job was people
(14:49):
management and leadershipcoaching discussions.
The reports that you managed to, someone sent those to you.
You didn't have to go and findyour own information.
You want to find out ifsomeone's doing well on the
phones, then you just ping thequality department for them to
send over the scores.
So you had everything prettymuch given to you so that you
could have conversations withpeople.
Today, the CX leader is expectedto generate all of that
(15:10):
information and still have theconversation.
So if you don't, if you're notgood at setting up and
organizing processes andleveraging AI in different ways
to help you automate that workand surrounding yourself with
good people who can take thingsoff your plate, it's going to be
hard, because the name of thegame is no longer just, you know
(15:31):
, coach people.
The name of the game is how doyou become more efficient,
because you know companies areseeing AI and they're baking
that into budgets, thinkingwe're going to hire 50% less
because now we have AI and it'slike it doesn't exactly work
that way.
50% less because now we have AIand it's like it doesn't
exactly work that way.
So I would say understandprocesses, understand knowledge
(15:52):
management.
Those are things that arereally going to shape up the way
that the CX leadership rolechanges 2025 and beyond.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
When you think about customer experience leadership,
what's a truth that nobodyopenly talks about, but needs to
be said out loud?
Speaker 1 (16:11):
That nobody really knows the right way to do
anything, because there's nosuch thing as right, it's just
what's right for that company orbusiness.
So sometimes I'll interviewpeople that I may be considering
bringing on and I'm like sowhat do you think is the best
customer experience?
And if they give me a veryclear answer on what they think
is right, they're not a good fitBecause at the end of the day,
(16:33):
the best customer experience isthe one that is best for that
company.
So we have a client who is notinterested in AI and automation.
People think might think that'sodd, they don't want it.
It's not bad, it's just notwhat they want.
That's okay.
Then we have another clientwho's like the last thing I want
(16:54):
is to get a ticket.
So can you please help me toset up everything to deflect as
much as I can?
I'll answer one, but I don'twant to Help me.
Sure, so it's really about whatis understanding?
That there's no such thing as aright way to do things, and I
think that that is one thingthat nobody wants to talk about.
(17:15):
When you know, even when you goto events, everybody wants to
sound like they know how todeliver the best experience.
It's like that's so subjectiveRight.
The best experience is the onethat your client wants.
Love that.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Well, as we wrap up, there's always a question that I
love to ask, and just reallyusually.
The answer sometimes surprisesyou, it surprises me.
But if it were your last day onearth, and of all the things
you've learned so far, you couldonly impart one piece of wisdom
or guidance to the world, whatwould it be?
Speaker 1 (17:48):
That's a very good question.
One piece of guidance, you'reenough.
You're enough.
You know my niece is going offto college.
Shout out to Tuskegee, hey,she's going off to college, and
(18:11):
so we get to for our you know,our last dinner while she's
living in Los Angeles, beforeshe heads out.
And so I'm like trying to giveher all of this stuff that I
wish someone would have told meat 17, 18, so that she can be as
prepared as possible.
I can't prepare her foreverything.
(18:32):
Her mom can't, none of us can,but you know, one of the things
that I did tell her is like oneday you're going to go through
something that you're not goingto be able to explain, you're
going to be good to someonewho's not good to you and at the
end of the day, I don't wantyou to think there's something
wrong with you.
Right, because there isn't.
Sometimes people just makedecisions and you alone.
(18:55):
You're enough.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Oh, I love that Amen to that.
I love your ability to weave inagain like the human side of
what you do and it really is soingrained in it.
But you just articulate it verywell, thank you.
And so I appreciate you sharingyour story and sharing more
about what you do.
But, ty, I would love for youto share, we'll put all this in
(19:19):
the show notes, but where canpeople find you, find out more
about your business?
You know, if they're lookingfor some of these playbooks that
you talked about, where wouldthey find them?
Speaker 1 (19:26):
So the playbooks you'll find at
cxcollectiveadvantagecom andthen from there you'll be able
to like, browse a list of what'savailable.
We actually have a YouTubechannel where we do overviews.
It's AI generated.
I don't hide that.
It is what it is, but it's anAI generated podcast style
overview of each of the coursesand the idea there is for you to
(19:49):
really understand like, hey, doI, do I need to do this, or is
this enough?
Because if you find what youneed on on YouTube and more
power to you if you want tolearn anything about consulting,
it's cxcollectivecom.
I'm on LinkedIn.
I am super responsive becauseI'm a customer support person,
so feel free to reach out, butyeah, like where I mean I'm
(20:09):
super accessible and I try to.
If I take on a consultingclient, I want to make sure that
it's me that they see most ofthe time.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Awesome.
Well, I appreciate you comingon.
Thank you for sharing time andyour wisdom and knowledge of
what you do.
That is applicable to so manydoesn't mean that someone has to
have necessarily, even like, adedicated customer experience
department.
It means how do we want ourcustomers to feel our support
right?
And so you have talked aboutyour services and what you do,
(20:39):
and really your expertise, sowell that anybody can take
something away from it.
So I appreciate your time, ty.
Thank you so much for going on.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm grateful to be here.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
If today's episode challenged you, moved you or lit
a fire in your soul, don't keepit to yourself.
Share it with somebody who'sready to rise.
Could I ask you to take 30seconds to leave a review?
It's the best way to say thankyou and help this show reach
more bold leaders like you,because this isn't just a
podcast, it's a movement.
We're not here to play small.
(21:20):
We're here to lead loud, onebold and unapologetic step at a
time.
Until next time, stay bold,stay grounded and make moves
that make mediocre uncomfortable.
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