Episode 45- Navigating From Darkness To The Light w/ Kristen Lee Mansourian

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Kristen Lee Mansourian shares her transformative journey through postpartum psychosis and how she discovered that our darkest moments can become our greatest teachers on the path to healing and self-mastery.

• Kristen's experience with postpartum psychosis stemming from a retained placenta fragment that caused recurring infections
• How the medical system's separation of physical and mental health led to misdiagnosis and prolonged suffering
• Reframing life challenges as "initiations" rather than problems to overcome
• Breaking generational cycles of trauma through conscious awareness
• Finding growth in marriage through seeing your partner as a mirror
• Embracing sensitivity and empathic abilities as gifts rather than disorders
• Creating safe spaces for emotional expression in relationships
• Using conscious communication to deepen connection instead of triggering defensiveness
• How parenting becomes our greatest mirror for personal growth
• Learning to trust the process even when you can't see the purpose yet

Connect with Kristen on Instagram @LeighMansourian or visit The Elysian Retreat at theelysianretreat.com to learn more about her family retreats and wedding ceremonies focused on healing generational trauma and building legacy.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's going on, guys ?
Welcome to the Evolve MasteryPodcast.
I'm excited to be sitting downwith a new friend of mine and we
had an amazing conversation.
Today I'm sitting down withKristen Lee Mancerian and she's
a published author, consultant,speaker, the founder of the
Elysian Retreat in Sedona,Arizona, who's known for her raw
storytelling andtransformational lens on love.

(00:20):
Kristen also creates intimateweddings and family retreats
that help to break generationalcycles and rebuild trust,
connection and legacy.
So, guys, you know I'm allabout connection, I'm all about
trust, I'm all about legacy andliving in the integrity of your
power, potential and purpose inevery area of your life.
But Kristen is also a formerPeace Corps volunteer and she

(00:40):
draws from her own journeythrough postpartum psychosis,
cross-cultural marriage andmotherhood to help guide others
towards healing that sticks,Because a lot of the times when
we're growing, we'll take a fewsteps and then we go backwards.
We'll take a few steps and wego backwards.
But she really helps to guidepeople in a way that it helps
them to stick and lock into thatgrowth and that evolution, into

(01:06):
that growth and that evolution.
But she does this throughdifferent ways through sacred
space, holding, somaticpractices and honest
conversation.
Kristen helps families andcouples reimagine what's
possible when love becomes thestarting point.
But, guys, I'm excited to moveinto this next phase with you
guys.
But without further ado, we'regoing to go ahead and dive right
into this segment and I hopeyou guys enjoy listening as much

(01:27):
as I enjoyed having thisconversation.
Again, welcome to the EvolveMastery Podcast, Cause I know
that it's worth it.

Speaker 2 (01:36):
These affirmations Let me know that I'm already
perfect.
Are you that one Say, yes, I amHundred miles up?

(01:58):
Say, yes, I can.
Is it our love?
Say, yes, I am.
Yes, I am, yes, I am.
Are you that one?
Say, yes, I am, yes, I am.
I said yes, I am A hundredmiles up, yes, I can.
Is it all?
Yes, I am, yes, I am, yes, I am, it's my life.
So I tell me I'm alright, andit helps me Realize that I'm

(02:21):
wealthy, rich in passion, richin magic, it's my life.

Speaker 1 (02:25):
So I tell me Hello and welcome to this episode of
the Evolve Mastery Podcast.
I'm your host, princeton Clark,and today I have another very
special guest with me, MrsKristen Mansourian, and I'm
really excited about this guest,guys.
I actually connected to herthrough her husband, who I'm a

(02:47):
part of a men's group with, andhe just talked about just how
special she was and the journeythat she's been taking.
But, guys, you guys know I sitdown and I talk with different
people from different walks oflife who are taking that journey
of self-mastery.
And, as we know, withself-mastery comes a lot of
opportunities for growth, comesa lot of challenges, and many
people who choose this path, whochoose to show up in the world

(03:10):
as a light, as powerful beingswho want to assist others, have
also traversed their own paththrough the darkness to find
that light within themselves.
And Kristen is one of thosepeople.
So, kristen, welcome, I'm soglad to have you here today.
How are you doing?

Speaker 3 (03:26):
Good.
Thank you so much for such awarm introduction.
I'm so excited to be here.
I love what you said aboutself-mastery.
I think that's the wholepurpose of human beings, right,
like we are here to masterourselves and we are given so
many life lessons along the wayfor us to really learn what we
are here to learn, and so I'm soexcited to talk today about my

(03:47):
journey as well as maybe inyours together, and yeah, I'm
excited, thank you.

Speaker 1 (03:52):
Yeah, we're going to have a great conversation.
I'm really excited about thisone.
Now we know that together youand your husband host a retreat
space and you also cater to alot of different people within
that space, but your main focusprofessionally within that space
.
You also cater to a lot ofdifferent people within that
space, but your main focusprofessionally within that space
you've catered to intimateweddings, and I know there's so
much more to it than that.

(04:13):
But I want to give you somespace because you are also a
returning thought leader afterhaving a baby and growing
through different phases in yourlife, and so the people in
podcast land they don't know you, they don't know anything about
you, and so this is the momentwhere I just want to give you
some space to kind of tell us alittle bit about who you are now
and then, if you feel free,open up and share a little bit

(04:34):
about your journey and what hasbrought you to this point.

Speaker 3 (04:38):
I'm a mom right, I'm also a daughter.
I am a creator, I'm an author,I'm a speaker there's so many
facets of me that I wish I couldsay I can literally write a
whole long list and I think thatpeople listening in sometimes
they group themselves as onerole, but we actually fall into
so many, and so currently I'mactually really focused on

(04:58):
building a retreat space,continuing that journey, but
later on I really see myselfspeaking again on stages,
writing another book, and whenit comes to our retreat space,
I'm so in love with it becausewe don't just serve intimate
weddings.
I think when people think aboutweddings, they think about the
wedding industry, and it's avery performative space.
I actually used to be a weddingplanner in LA and I planned 300

(05:21):
person weddings and that wasvery stressful, and that
experience taught me that a lotof weddings are based purely on
performance.
People are paying so much moneyjust to have that feeling of
like wow, so many people came tomy wedding and the aspect of
love is really lost.
So we basically created a spacewhere it's focused more so on

(05:42):
the love itself and then legacybuilding, created a space where
it's focused more so on the loveitself and then legacy building
.
So I'm really excited to notjust host weddings for people,
but also have family retreats aswell as something I call the
embodied facilitator, which iswhere retreat facilitators
actually get to host their ownretreats and we create that
retreat package for them.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
So there's a lot to come, but essentially, I would
like to say that our space isreally meant for the person
that's becoming I love that Nowwe often say you see the version
of the person today and youhear the stories of why they got
into the current work thatthey're doing.
But we all know that the journeydidn't start there and I know

(06:22):
you just recently went through avery challenging experience and
there's other experiences thatyou've grown through.
But talk about major dark nightof the soul experience I'd love
for you to kind of share,because I know there's a lot of
people out in podcast landsaying and they're experiencing
different things and they'resaying how can I get to this
point where I can share mymessage, how can I get to a

(06:45):
point where I can start addingmore light to the world by
adding more light to my life?
Because right now I just I feelkind of stuck.
Right now I feel like I've beenthrough so much and I have so
much potential.
I know my soul is calling mehigher, but how do I navigate
through it?
But just so they can connectmore deeply to you and who you

(07:05):
are and what's brought you tothis point, I'd love to talk a
little bit about what you justrecently experienced, because I
know there's a lot that we havein common as far as my story and
your story, but you justrecently came out of something
very challenging and I'd lovefor you to share a little bit
about that, if you would.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
Yeah, so I really do think that darkness you need
darkness in order to have lightright.
So I actually recentlyexperienced something called
postpartum psychosis, somethingthat I never imagined would
happen to me.
I didn't even know that existed.
I knew that postpartumdepression was a thing.
I knew that postpartum anxietywas a thing, but I did not ever

(07:43):
think or believe that I would besomeone that went through
postpartum psychosis.
But basically, what happened wasa year ago I gave birth to my
baby.
I had a home birth in Sedona atour retreat space, and after
the home birth I actually had aretained placenta.
So basically, what that is isthat after you give birth to
your baby, you also have to givebirth to your placenta, and

(08:06):
essentially, when my placentacame out, it looked completely
intact.
I mean, I spoke to a friend ofmine who also had retained
placenta, but she had her babyin the hospital and mine was so
small it was only half acentimeter that it was
undetectable to the eye, so mymidwife who delivered my baby
didn't notice it.
I didn't notice it, obviously,as a new mom, and so essentially

(08:27):
, this retained placenta stayedinside of me and developed an
infection that I did not knowthat I had, and so that
infection alone caused asnowball effect of me having
reoccurring infections.
It caused me to bleed out, itcaused me to go to the hospital
to get it removed and then onthat process or in that process,

(08:51):
the surgeon that removed myretained placenta actually
lacerated my cervix and I endedup actually bleeding out.
And that's when I kind of likethe psychotic break kind of
started to happen.
I didn't notice it at the time,and my husband didn't either,
because we were just dealingwith so many new things as
parents, right like on top ofall of that, we also had a new
baby to take care of.
So, um, as a parent yourself,princeton, you totally get it

(09:13):
right like babies require a lotof work, a lot of sleepless
nights.
So it's often very great tounderstand, like, what's really
happening with me, right likeI'm a new mom, navigating like
sleepless nights andbreastfeeding, and then I'm also
navigating this infection thatwas in my body and on top of
that, because of the surgeonmessing up and like accidentally

(09:34):
lacerating my cervix, it kindof prolonged my healing and I
actually continue to havereoccurring infections for many
months.
It probably took me around fourmonths for all the infections
to completely clear and the mostimportant thing I want people
to gather is that reoccurringinfections, especially for women
in the uterus, can causepsychosis.

(09:56):
So that was like the mainculprit of what happened.
And what was really scary isthat in the state of Arizona,
and in any state, we treatmental health separately than
your physical health.
So I guess my symptoms wereshowing that I was having
depression or anxiety.
So when I went to the doctorthey were treating my mental
illness not knowing that I had areoccurring infection, and that

(10:20):
was kind of tying into mydelusional thoughts.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
I just have to take a moment and just be present with
that and breathe with you onthat, because I can only imagine
, as a man who doesn't have togo through any of what you
experienced.
I can only imagine the weight,the pressure, the confusion, the
fear, the worry being a new momand having this baby that's
depending on you, and having ahusband that you want to show up

(10:50):
for, and all while trying tofigure out what the heck is
happening to me right now, andthen, of course, having people
in the medical space who don'treally understand, they can't,
they're not really treating itcorrectly, and so it goes a lot
longer than it should.
I imagine that that felt likesuch a lonely time because

(11:10):
you're experiencing this butnobody can really understand.
What do you think it is, as now, clearly you're on the other
side of that what do you thinkwas?
I always say there's a gift inevery challenge, there's
something that happens thatcomes for us, or comes to us,
rather, when we experience toughmoments like that in life, and

(11:31):
sometimes we don't really knowwhat that is, but I believe,
just from our conversations, youfound a lot of yourself
returning after this experience.
So what was that like, comingout of it and facing those fears
and still processing throughbeing a mom, being a wife, but
more than that, just being anindividual, a spirit on this
journey.

(11:51):
What was that transition like,as you began to heal?

Speaker 3 (11:57):
oh my gosh, like the transition was not black and
white.
It took a while in my healingjourney.
It took so much, not just.
What I learned from thisexperience is obviously trust.
I think trust is the forefrontof everything.
I came from a family that wasvery scarce, like my scarcity
mindset, I would say.
I grew up middle class.

(12:17):
I didn't come from a very poorfamily.
However, my ancestors were poor, and what I mean by that is my
dad actually grew up in SouthCentral.
His experience of life was ofscarcity right, and so even
though he like kind of brokethat mold with his own family
meaning he went to USC and hegot a good degree and like he

(12:38):
got a good job, like a lot of mychildhood was, through his lens
, of scarcity right, and so Ireally was brought up thinking
that the world was untrustworthy, people who are untrustworthy,
and so my experience added tothat right.
I was like, oh my gosh, like Ican't trust nobody.
I can't trust the doctor, Ican't trust my husband, and I

(13:00):
really think that the postpartumperiod is such a huge
initiation, not just for mothersbut for fathers as well, more
so, maybe on the mother's frontin the beginning, because we're
the ones actually giving birth.
Maybe for fathers it's a littlebit later in life.
But essentially, what it taughtme was that I really needed to
go through this initiation.
It was very dark, so dark wheremaybe I don't wish it upon

(13:24):
anyone because it has brought meto a, to a place where it was
like I almost died.
Essentially, I was so lost in mythoughts that I were.
I have thoughts that my husbandwas drugging my daughter.
I had thoughts that my husbandwas part of the Illuminati, like
really, really crazy thoughts,and it's funny to think back on
it now, but at the time I reallybelieved it and as someone

(13:47):
that's like part of thespiritual world, like when you
really believe your thoughts, itcan become like a really scary
thing.
And so, to answer your question, what I learned from this whole
experience is that any bigchange either it's birth,
whether it's getting marriedMarriage is a huge one too that
people don't realize.
It's a portal, it's aninitiation, it's a new chapter

(14:10):
and we really need to look atthose emotions behind our
behaviors.
And that's also why I'm sopassionate about what we're
doing now with the RetreatCenter, because most people
bypass these big initiations andthen it kind of like comes out
sideways later.
So, to answer your question,that's what I basically learned
from my whole experience.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
Learning to lean in and trust the process.
Also, don't try to escape.
I love the word initiation.
One of my favorite quotes is ifyou change the way you see
things, the things you see willchange.
Imagine if everyone sawchallenging moments, or those
quote unquote dark night of thesoul moments, as initiations
into a new version of you,initiations into a new reality.

(14:54):
And they begin tointrospectively ask the question
what is this teaching me abouthow I get to show up now?
What is this teaching me aboutwhere I get to heal now?
What is this teaching me aboutwhat I must let go of now in
order to step into this reality,to be this next version of

(15:17):
myself?
And it's so huge because youhave to trust yourself.
And a lot of the times this iswhat's happening.
Ultimately, our spirit istrying to bring us back to
ourselves, back to that innerchild, back to that freedom of
expression, back to the fullnessof what we are.
And with all the things thatare in the way situations,
circumstances, emotional trauma,mental trauma, physical trauma,

(15:42):
the things that can happenthere's a multitude of things
that can happen in our life.
I love that word initiationbecause it's initiating a
process, it's bringing you backto yourself and that's so
beautiful.
Now we know that that's a recentexperience that you had, but
when we first spoke, you saidyou heard my story and, of
course, for my podcast listeners, you guys have heard me talk

(16:04):
about what I've experienced, asfar as the abuse, the
molestation, the deep depressionand even being an alcoholic and
all those different things.
If you've been here long enough,if you haven't go back, check
out previous episodes.
But I know that's somethingthat we also connected on and
you definitely had a journey,just like I've had, leading up

(16:26):
to that, because, again, we havepeople from every walk of life
that listen to this podcast.
What were some otherexperiences that you had?
That because you are a thoughtleader and a speaker and you're
returning back to that space,and so I know you speak a lot
about healing, a lot aboutowning your power, a lot about
really taking this life andhonoring each breath, honoring

(16:48):
the moment, getting present withyourself.
But we also know that gainingthat wisdom does not come
without many initiations, and sogive us a little bit of your
background, how you were raised,some of the things that you
experienced that opened the doorfor you to be that thought
leader, that guide, as I say forso many others.

Speaker 3 (17:09):
Yeah, I love that you say that and I loved our
conversation beforehand becauseit really opened the window of
the possibility of what we couldtalk about today.
And to answer your question, Igrew up I think on the outside
people see it like, oh, she hada really normal childhood, right
Like her parents were middleclass, she went to college, but
there was so much underneaththat no one saw, and I think

(17:32):
that is the part that's thehardest for me that the trauma
that I went through was sodifferent, because so, for
example, right when I was, whenI went through my postpartum
psychosis, I had to go inpatientto an inpatient hospital.
I was amongst other people thathad mental health issues, and a
lot of them came from familiesof like substance abuse,

(17:53):
molestation, like very similarwalks of life.
For example, like you, I didn'tgo through like any like.
I didn't have any history oflike substance abuse because my
parents didn't believe in that.
Like, we're Asian and we'reallergic to alcohol.
So, in a way, I almost feellike God blessed me in that
sense, because I never got toexperience that.
However, what I've learnedrecently is that you don't have

(18:15):
to have substance abuse toexperience trauma because
something that I used to copefor many years without realizing
that was super unhealthy, wasactually like my toxic thoughts
about myself.
So, as an Asian American, I grewup with a dad that was very
critical, so nothing was evergood enough for him, and I
actually was abused as a child.

(18:36):
My dad didn't drink right, sohe didn't even have a coping
mechanism.
Imagine if you didn't get todrink.
You just bottled up all youremotions and of course, you're
going to lash out on your family, right?
So I was like on the receivingend of that.
Like my whole dad's line wasabusive.
And again, it was from a lot ofstruggle.

(18:58):
It was from a lot of justcoming from a place where they
didn't know how to express theiremotions, and so a lot of it
came from abuse.
And I didn't know how toexpress their emotions, and so a
lot of it came from abuse.
And I want to talk about thesubstance abuse part too,
because I didn't grow up withalcohol.
I didn't have any place to cope.
For me, it was just all in mymind.
I was just in my mind all thetime and it came out in so many

(19:21):
different ways.
It came out in anger, it cameout from criticism.
I remember when my husband andI first started dating, I was
just criticizing him all thetime, thinking that that was
like super normal.
But it was from a lot of trauma, like it was a trauma response.
And so I think that because ofso much mental trauma growing up

(19:41):
, I also experienced depression.
I also experienced anxiety, butit was masked.
It was masked because, as anAsian American, I had to look
the part.
I had to be a good girl.
We're often seen as very likesilent and we don't really
express our emotions, but all ofthat was bottled up and I
really do think part of it wasreleased during my postpartum.

(20:03):
It kind of like it has to comeout some way.
So there you go, yeah.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
Well, one thing we know is you can't hold it down
for long, especially when youhave a calling, when you have a
purpose, even if you aren't evenaware of any of any of those
things.
The more you push down, it'seventually got to find a way to
come out.
And it's those moments where weget hit, we get blindsided by

(20:30):
life or by an experience, that alot of that stuff begins to
come up.
And it's so crazy how you canreally deceive yourself into
thinking you're okay, because,again, the masks we were.
I was a prof.
I learned how to create masksreally well when I was in high
school because of my deepdepression.

(20:51):
I was the person that madeeverybody laugh.
I was the person that showed up, I defended people and I would
cry myself to sleep at night andnobody saw that.
Nobody saw that version of me.
And I did that for years.
But, unlike you, alcohol, drugsthose were my coping mechanisms
because I was trying to find anescape, and so, in a way, it's
kind of a blessing that youdidn't have that coping

(21:12):
mechanism, because it's so easyto get lost in it, because, at
the end of the day, if all Ihave is my masks when I'm at
home or when I'm by myself.
It doesn't matter if I have amask, because the masks are not
for me, it's for everybody thatI'm experiencing.
But when I'm by myself, theonly thing I can do is face
myself self.

(21:35):
So when the awakening pointcomes for someone who doesn't
have those other copingmechanisms, it can be a massive
awakening, a massive shift atonce, because they don't have
anything else to turn to.
And so, yeah, and so I knowthat you experienced a lot of
that, but go ahead, continue.

Speaker 3 (21:48):
I was going to say that mass can also come in the
form of hustle, or like to likeconstantly doing things right
Because I didn't drink, likebasically, drinking made me
break up out into hives.
In a way, it's a blessing andagain, I'm still.
I still feel very blessed thatI don't turn to alcohol, but
turning to like an obsessionover working or work, like being

(22:10):
a workaholic.
Again, people might think, oh,that's such a good thing, but
we're human beings, we burn outand, just like what you said,
it's going to come out one wayor another.
And in my case, I really thinkthat my postpartum was not just
the retained placenta.
In a way, yes, that happened,but when I look at it from a
spiritual lens, it was almostlike I couldn't avoid it.

(22:33):
It was part of my karma, it waspart of what I had to go
through in order to be where Iam today.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Wow.
Talk about not only having ahigher level of awareness, but
also taking a high level ofaccountability through the
experience.
I think that's something thatwe often run from.
Is that accountability and alsothat responsibility?
I was recently talking aboutthis and I said, if you break
that word, responsibility, if wesay my life is my

(23:01):
responsibility, that means mylife is based on my ability to
respond.
How I choose to respond to itis creating my reality.
And a lot of people you hearthey say I know I create my own
reality.
I create my own reality, but doyou understand the magnitude of
what that means?
How you think, how you speak,how you respond to your life in

(23:24):
every single now moment iscreating the reality of the next
now moment and the future nowmoment.
And so when you're able to takethat, look at it.
Of course, hindsight is 20-20also and there's a lot of wisdom
and downloads we get as we'recoming out of it.
But even if during it, as youbegin to heal, you can say, wow,

(23:46):
these things happened, it's apart of the process, this has
been my journey.
But you start looking at OK,how am I choosing to respond?
You start looking at how am Ichoosing to think you start
taking accountability for youractions, because it's in that
space of accountability that youbegin to honor and respond
differently to the life thatyou've of.

(24:10):
My clients are women.
I'd say 95% of the people thatI work with are women, and so I
know listeners out there rightnow that are listening to this,
and also men.
We all grow through things.
I know men don't often talkabout things, but I'd love for
you to lean a bit more into asyou begin to acknowledge and
become more aware of theopportunity that you have been

(24:33):
given.
Going back to that word youused initiated.
It initiated a process ofawareness.
What was something that youbegan to learn about yourself
through this process?
That maybe someone else outthere, another woman or another
man who is going through a darknight, or maybe they're playing
the victim, they're pointing thefinger at everything external.

(24:54):
What would be a piece of advicethat you would give them, based
on what you've learned and howyou handled the trauma and how
you handled the I guess we couldsay the initiation of what you
experienced?

Speaker 3 (25:10):
Yeah, that's a great question.
When I was going through myinitiation and through my dark
night of the soul, I was nottaking any responsibility.
I think that what I would liketo say is that everything that's
hard in life will pass.
Life is cyclical, right.
If you're going through a hardtime right now, just know that
it's not going to be forever.

(25:30):
I will say that when I wasgoing through what I was going
through, it feels like forever.
When you're in it, itdefinitely feels like forever,
and the thing is that what'sreally hard is that, when you're
in it, I remember that, evenwhen I was going through my
postpartum psychosis and I waslike literally having delusional

(25:50):
thoughts, I was still askingmyself, okay, like, what is this
trying to teach me?
What is this trying to teach me?
And like like continuing to askthese questions.
But what's really crazy to me,though, is is not just
self-trust, it's also the trustin God, trust in the universe,
trust in whoever you believe in,because self-trust can only, in

(26:12):
my opinion, take you so farright.
Like that, to me, is like theego, but when you're able to
trust something outside of youand just really trust in life
itself, I really do think thatlife is speaking to you Right
now.
I'm in the process of goingthrough a course in miracles.
I don't know if you're familiarwith that book.
I'm on day 10 right now, stillin the very beginning.

(26:34):
But when I start to really playwith life and be open to what
life has to give me, there areliterally teeny mini miracles
happening in my life every day.
I swear I feel like theuniverse is just talking to me
all the time and I think thatmost of the time people miss
that.
They're so busy in theireveryday life that they're not

(26:56):
realizing that there are signseverywhere.
There's a quote that says ifyou are looking for flowers,
you'll always find them.
I really believe that whenyou're going through the dark
night of the soul, moment thatis really meant for you.
I like to say that mypostpartum psychosis was the
best thing that happened to me,because if it wasn't for that, I
would never be able to see lifethe way that I see it now.

(27:17):
Granted, it sucks.
At the time, like I said, Ialmost faced death, but I do
think that if you are goingthrough a dark night of soul,
just know that it's not forever.
It's a season of your life thatyou need to tend to tend to it,
whether it's just staying in it, staying in those emotions.
Maybe the lesson for you islearning how to just be with

(27:38):
your emotions.
That alone is really.
It's like challenging workright and know that it will.
Just, it will never last.
It's there for a reason.

Speaker 1 (27:49):
Oh man, so much that, so much that I want to say to
that that was good.
But I specifically loved howyou spoke about having that
divine connection to theexternal, realizing that there
is something greater than you.
Before you had a name, you hada purpose.
Before you came, you didn'tcome from nothingness, your soul

(28:10):
didn't come from nothingness,nothingness, your soul didn't
come from nothingness.
And personally that's somethingthat I realized as well when I
failed to commit suicide.
That moment, after thatexperience, I realized that
something greater than me lifesource, universe, god, whatever
pronoun people want to use, Ibelieve the finite mind can't
even begin to comprehend theinfinite, but we're experiencing
it every day.

(28:31):
It's moving in every experienceand our spirit I firmly believe
this knows and understandsevery challenge before we ever
even face it.
And if you are given, there's apassage biblically that says
God will not put more on youthan you can bear.
So when I think about that, Isay spiritually everything that
I am experiencing.

(28:51):
If I've experienced thesechallenging times, it was
because something greater thanme knew that I was strong enough
to make it through it, everynegative thing or perceived
negative thing that I haveexperienced.
There's at least a millionpeople out there struggling with
just one of those things thatmy spirit knew it was strong
enough to make it through.
It's like the quote you've madeit through a hundred percent of

(29:13):
the things that you didn'tthink you would make it through
and you're still here now.
You're still here now, and sopeople like you and I who have
traversed these dark paths, wenow, because we found our light
in the darkness, we get to helpother people.
And one thing that I want to sayto the podcast listeners out
there today is, if you areexperiencing challenges in your

(29:35):
life be it relational, spiritual, mental, emotional, financial,
whatever that challenge is yourspirit is completely able to
handle it.
But you got to disconnect fromthe ego.
You got to disconnect from thisidea that something's wrong
with me my life sucks.
You got to disconnect from thisidea that something's wrong
with me, my life sucks.

(29:55):
You got to disconnect fromplaying the victim.
You don't understand.
This person did this and thishappened to me.
Understand that everythingyou've experienced, I always say
for myself my pain waspreparation for my purpose.
There is something being calledout of you, something being
called out of you.
It's something being called outof you, and I like the analogy

(30:16):
of the vessel that breaks andall the cracks are filled with
gold.
You are going to be better forwhat you've experienced and I
know, just like Kristen said, itdoesn't feel like it when
you're in it.
It didn't feel like it when Iwas struggling with deep
depression, couldn't sleep atnight, having to drink myself
into oblivion just to be able tofunction, having to stay high

(30:39):
just to feel like I was stillalive.
It didn't feel great in thatexperience.
It didn't feel great when Itried to take my life.
It didn't feel great overcomingthe abuse and the molestation.
But on the other side, comingthe abuse and the molestation,
but on the other side, I realizeand, just like you said, I am

(31:01):
grateful for every experiencethat I've had, because if it
were not for those things, theperson that you guys get to hear
, the light you get to see, thesmile, the passion, the
inspiration I get to share andthat Kristen gets to share, it
wouldn't be there.
And so what I want to challengeeveryone listening to do today
is ask yourself, as we've saidbefore, what is this challenge
offering me the opportunity toevolve into?

(31:23):
What wisdom is it gaining or amI gaining?
What truth is being spoken tomy soul right now.
How have I been neglectingmyself, how have I been putting
other people or circumstancesbefore me, how have I been
neglecting and not honoring eachbreath in my life?
Because it's something you getone.

(31:44):
You get one life to be thisversion of you, and it's so easy
to get caught up in the processof survival that we forget how
to live.
And what we want for you guysis for you to live, for you to
understand that you are special.
You are divinely unique.
There never has been, nor willthere ever be, another version

(32:06):
of you on this planet, you know,and so we just want to
encourage you to be the bestversion of you.
And again, kristen, coming backto you, I know you there's a
lot that you have to share, butwhat do you feel your purpose is
in this season of your life, asfar as the impact that you want
to have and the space that lifecurrently has you in?

Speaker 3 (32:48):
Yeah.
So right now, I'm definitely ina season of reaching people
that want to end the cycle,whatever that cycle may look
like for them.
Right, because the thing isthat when it comes to either
marriage relationships, we oftentake so much stronger because I
do not want to see my daughterrepeat what happened to me in my
childhood, and that means thatI need to do the work right.
It has nothing to do with heror my husband yes, my husband is
half of the equation, but Ican't force him to do something

(33:08):
that he doesn't want to do.
So really, my main goal is tomake sure that I'm mastering
myself in terms of healing a lotof my family trauma and
creating a space where otherpeople can do the same.
So that's also why the ElysianRetreat has evolved so much
after postpartum.
It's no longer a space for justintimate gatherings I think

(33:29):
that was the whole intentionbefore I became a mom but now
it's a place of legacy building.
It's a place of healing a lotof generational trauma.
Starting from your wedding day,it may seem really heavy.
That's also why, with ourweddings, it's much more lighter
and it's much more focused on,like the couple itself and like
what kind of legacy you wantmoving forward.

(33:52):
But we also have familyretreats where we actually
unwind a lot of generationaltrauma through modalities like
CFT.
But, most importantly, I thinkthat when it comes to our
embodied facilitators, thefacilitators that choose our
space to run their retreats,they need to understand that any
big life initiation, so tospeak, is a way for them to be

(34:16):
able to show up very greatly fortheir people right?
So, again, it's just, it'samazing, because I really do
feel very lucky that my life hasturned out this way.
But the fact that I had to gothrough such a hard thing not
just physically, right, butmentally I do think sometimes
what you said about how, likeGod doesn't give you much more

(34:37):
than you can handle when I wasgoing through that I really
really felt, okay, there must beno God because I'm handling so
much, I can't bear it.
And when you talk about suicide, that was actually something
that I contemplated as well.
I was.
I went through such a dark hole, my thoughts became so
delusional that I contemplatedas well.
I went through such a dark hole, my thoughts became so
delusional that I contemplatedthat and I really think that God

(34:59):
really put me in that positionbecause it's such an extreme
level of things that I kind oflike didn't get to navigate, I
didn't get to sit with myemotions growing up.
All of these things pushed meto be still.
It pushed me to look at myselfversus hustling.
During that time, when I was inpostpartum, I was not working at

(35:21):
all.
My husband carried most of thethings like the baby stuff, my
team carried everything when itcame to work, and there were
many times where I felt soashamed of myself I'm like
there's no way I can have thisretreat center.
I literally told my husband I'mlike we need to close our
business down.
I don't feel like I'm anintegrity to like have people
come to our retreat space andheal when I'm like in the middle

(35:42):
of my crisis.
And so I guess, to kind of wrapeverything up, whatever stage
you are in, just know that youare worthy of healing right.
You are worthy of healing notjust yourself, but all of your
family, generational trauma,because in order for you to

(36:02):
really make a difference in theworld, you need to heal that
part of you, not just yourself,but your family.
Most people want to just focuson teaching what they know
without healing the parts ofthemselves that are still
keeping them back, and that'swhere I really want to help
people with.

Speaker 1 (36:20):
I love that and I love that you shared that bit
about judging yourself andcritiquing yourself because you
weren't able to work, youweren't able to show up, you
started questioning yourworthiness, your capacity or
your capability and showing upfor others.
And this is something that Ioften say it's okay.
We have to get to a point wherewe're okay not being okay
sometimes.
Ok, we have to get to a pointwhere we're OK not being OK

(36:43):
sometimes where we understandthat life is going to have
certain ebbs and flows on thisgrowth journey and sometimes you
need to pause because there'spower in the pause, there's
power in the pause, there'spresence in the pause, and when
these things come and it feelslike life just kind of halts
everything, that's life saying Ilove you so much that I need

(37:07):
you to focus on you right now.
I need you to be still, I needyou to just grow through this
process.
Allow yourself to feel what'shappening, what's coming up for
you, and don't judge yourselffor being human.
You are a spirit on a journey,having this human experience,
and there is a plethora ofthings that you're going to
experience, positively ornegatively.

(37:29):
However you want to quote,unquote, label them, but there
are so many different humanexperiences that we're going to
have and all of them are notgoing to be favorable.
All of them are not going tofeel good, and so you have to
get to this place where, on thespiritual journey, you
understand that anything thatdoes not serve you, doesn't
deserve you, is going to bebrought up.

(37:51):
It's going to be brought up foryou to feel through, for you to
address and for you to heal.
And that's such a beautifulopportunity, but we have to
change our perspective around it.
And also what I want to say andpodcast listeners you've
probably heard me say thisbefore true awakening and true
healing is waking up andrealizing there was nothing

(38:11):
wrong with you.
Because I think a lot of thetimes we grow through these
experiences and because we havea human experience that's not
favorable, we start believingthat something's wrong with us,
that something's not right, orthat something's not right or
that I'm not good enough, I'mnot worthy enough.
No, there's nothing wrong withyou.
It's just an experience.
It's a season and, just likenaturally in nature, there are

(38:35):
seasons.
There's a season for things tobe born and for things to grow.
There's a season for things todie to make room for the new
growth of the next season, so onand so forth.
There's a season of showersthat come to water the seeds
that have been sown prior sothat in the next season things
can grow, and so you're growingthrough seasons as well.
So when these challengingmoments come, lean into the

(38:58):
season, you are not broken, youare not unworthy.
You're being given anopportunity to pause, rest in
the season.
It's okay not to be okay.
It's okay not to beperfectionist.
Be a perfectionist and to feellike things have to be a certain
way, and I'd love to hear yourthoughts on that as well,
kristen.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
Yeah, I love that you say that.
Here's the thing.
That's something that Irecently learned as well.
I used to really judge myself.
For example, I really do thinkthat I have undiagnosed ADHD.
I think my husband does too.
We both kind of was like Ithink we both have it.
But here's the thing like, sowhat?
Like sometimes I like judgeourselves.
I'm like we're like messy peopleor like we're not as organized,
like we need to be like X, yand Z, and then, like I, when I

(39:45):
learned this concept, it reallyfreed us and it really freed me,
because I'm like okay, so whatif we have ADHD?
Okay, and so what if we let ourdaughter like play in the mud?
And it's not like perfect.
Once I really sat with that.
It's like these are justjudgments that we have on
ourselves, that we need to be acertain way, we need to be
organized, our car needs to bespotless, our room needs to look
like this right, what if we'rejust easy on ourselves?

(40:10):
And what if we're just gentle?
And what if those are ourgreatest powers?
Sometimes I look at my mess andI'm like that's the whole reason
why I can be creative and I canthink the way I think it's
because of my creative mess, andso oftentimes, I think that we
often are way too hard onourselves.
Instead of saying, like Ishould be more like this, or I
should be more like so-and-so,just relax into like this is who
you are and that's why you'resuch an amazing human being.

(40:34):
This is what makes who you areand that's the most beautiful
thing, because someone like meis different than my husband.
Like, my husband can do thingsthat I can never do, and vice
versa, and once we are able toown that, that's when magic
happens.

Speaker 1 (40:51):
It's amazing.
It's so awesome that you bringup the ADD, adhd, the labels
that they've put on us insociety.
But because I was medicated forthat, I was the same way so
hard on myself.
Oh, because I was constantlytold you have a learning
disability.
You're not, you're all over theplace and coming up.
I was on medication for ADD,adhd, hyperactivity, from the

(41:12):
time I was in first grade upuntil the eighth grade and
during that time like I feltlike a zombie.
On that medication I did notfeel like myself.
My hands would get really cold,my feet would get really cold.
Even my family would recognizeit when my parents would make me
take it They'd be like you putthat boy on those pills today,
didn't you?
He doesn't even look likehimself, he doesn't sound like

(41:33):
himself.
And one day in my pre-algebraclass, my aunt was my teacher in
my pre-algebra class and so I'msitting sideways in my desk,
I'm drawing and I'm just kind ofhumming to myself.
And then in between my friendMike was sitting behind me and
we're having a conversation.
Well, she tries to call me outin front of the class and make
an example of me, and she callsme up to the board to answer a

(41:56):
problem.
Not only did I answer theproblem, I showed the class a
different way to do it that wasfaster to get the same answer,
she wrote up a referral and sentme to the office.
But as I sat in that office andI didn't understand the
magnitude of this download untilafter, my life changed.
But I realized I didn't have adisorder, I didn't have a
problem, I actually had a gift Iwas able to tune into multiple

(42:19):
things at once.
I had extrasensory perception,and so I was really sensitive.
I was a deep empath, and so thelinear system of education
wasn't favorable for someonelike me To the system that
wanted me to focus on one thing.
When I had the capacity to see amuch bigger picture and to tune
into my environment in itsentirety, I looked like a

(42:42):
problem.
They told me I had an issue andI bought into it.
My parents bought into it, butI realized that, look, I'm a a
problem.
They told me I had an issue andI bought into it.
My parents bought into it, butI realized that, look, I'm a
divine creator and I'm soconnected to my creative prowess
that I'm less focused on theminute things that so many other
people say, makes youproductive or makes you a good
student or a good employee, thatI automatically would rebel

(43:04):
from it.
I was never a great employeebecause I was so connected to
the environment and if otherpeople were hurting or not being
as productive and thensupervisors or managers were
coming down on them, I wouldspeak up every single time.
I lost a few jobs because of it, because I've always been an
intercessor, I've always beensomeone who stood in the gap for
others.
But yeah, that thing, there's somany people who are taking on

(43:28):
that label and it's like no,you're just a deep empath who
has a high level of extrasensoryperception and it's very easy
for things to pull yourattention.
But what helped me wasmeditation.
I meditated a lot.
I got silent and I wasn't.
In the beginning I thought, ohman, I got to stop all these
negative thoughts.
My mind is wondering.
And then I realized that inmeditation, it's not about

(43:51):
stopping the thoughts.
It's actually about steppingout of the thoughts, becoming
aware of the thoughts andobserving them, just like you
would a movie playing in yourmind, in your mind.
And I recognize that, as Iactually taught meditation for
six and a half years once Istarted learning these different
things, but just really how westart our day.
When we are these sensitivebeings, it's very important for

(44:13):
us to pause at the beginning ofthe day to really sit with, okay
, what's coming up for me, whatthoughts are processing, what
are the fear-based thoughts,what are the thoughts of worry,
what are the thoughts ofunforgiveness or resentment?
What are the thoughts that areprocessing in my brain right now
?
Because the brain, like thiscomputer, is just a system and

(44:34):
when we become observant and wecan look at what's happening,
what we allow ourselves to do isto take back control from the
brain and we can really startputting our attention to what
serves us.
And that's really what helpedme.
When there's some days where Iwould wake up and my bed wasn't
made, there was a mess in thekitchen and instead of saying
your house is so messy like, youneed to do this, you need to do

(44:55):
that, I would really getconnected to myself, you know,
and really just observe thosenegative thoughts, that negative
programming, and then I'll justask myself okay, this is my
life.
Nobody else is in my houseright now, but the question I
would ask is but does it feelgood to me?
Does it feel good for this notto be done, okay, no, no, it

(45:16):
doesn't.
My environment feels a littlecluttered.
Yeah, I can be creative in myoffice and I can do these
different things, but how can Iposition myself so that this
doesn't happen as much?
But it became more of a muchmore conscious process, because
there would be some days whereI'd say, okay, I'm going to
worry about that tonight,because right now I'm in flow
and I'm just going to be in flow.
I'm not going to be put so muchpressure on myself.

(45:38):
Oh, I got to get this done, orI got to get this done, or I'm
productive, or I'm not a gooddad, or I'm not a good well, I'm
not a woman, so but in yourcase I'm not a good mom.
And so it's really the more webecome aware of that and we
begin to honor the gift of thatextrasensory perception, the
gift of that higher state ofconnection to the world around
us, we then start making moreintentional decisions,

(46:02):
energetically to be in thatspace and how to honor that
space.
Of any experience, whether itbe our homes, our relationships
or our emotional state, ourmental state, we become highly
aware, but more in tune with whowe are and where we are at any
phase in our life and we have apowerful capacity to do that.

(46:24):
As to where people who are veryby the book, they're very rigid
when life says it's time to moveor it's time to shift.
It's much harder for them toshift because they're so in that
and growing up, asian A-typepersonalities, things got to be
perfect.
That's why you think I might beundiagnosed, I might have a
problem.
No, you're really actually verygifted.
You're very gifted and it's areason you have the heart that

(46:47):
you have.
And even with Roger, yourhusband, he's such an amazing
person but he's also a very deepempath.
He feels things deeply and heand I related on several levels
as men because he's actuallyexperienced some of the same
things that I've experienced andI'm like, wow, this dude is so

(47:09):
sensitive Emotionally, heprocesses things very deeply,
and so you guys are both veryspecial individuals.
But what I know about two veryspecial individuals is that life
can present some obstacles,especially when you're both very
sensitive.
You're both traversing the samepath and, like you said,

(47:30):
marriage is an initiation.
It's two worlds coming together, colliding, two people who see
the world and who haveexperienced the world in two
completely different ways andyou have to enter into that
space, not rigid.
You have to enter into thatspace not being a perfectionist
or thinking your way is right.
I'm really building the bond ofcommunication that creates and

(47:50):
facilitates a space for both ofyou to heal and be able to
communicate what you're growingthrough, because initially, what
will happen is, if people aregrowing through that phase and
they come together and thoseworlds collide, it's very easy
for the ego to take root andthen you're just butting heads,
you're just constantly againsteach other, and it's even
outside of marriage.

(48:11):
Close relationships in generalare your greatest mirror, you
know, and so I'd love for you asas a wife.
What do you think are some ofthe greatest mirrors you've
experienced in relationships,cause I know that there's a lot
of women out there right now.
Like girl, you've been througha lot.
You're married, you just had ababy.
You went through all theseexperiences.
What are some lessons thatyou've learned from being a wife

(48:33):
that you believe you wouldn'thave learned any other way?

Speaker 3 (48:36):
My gosh, where do I begin?
Okay, first of all, yes, myhusband is also deeply empathic.
We both are right, and it's sofunny because we put into chat
to beat you the other day how tonavigate a neurodivergent
relationship.
I get it.
We shouldn't be putting labels,but in a way, labels systemize

(48:56):
things right.
It helps us, like, understandthings from our logical mind.
Anyway, to answer your pointabout mirrors, my husband is
completely opposite than I am.
First of all, not only are wefemale and male, we come from
two different cultures that areextremely different Asian
Americans or just Asians ingeneral.
We're very critical by nature.

(49:18):
I think it's like we struggledfor so many decades or not just
decades, but lifetimes and ourancestors that we just really
think that, like it's all aboutperfectionism, that's how we
show our love, right.
We think that by criticizingyou, by feeding you more, doing
your laundry, like that's how weshow you love, right.

(49:39):
And then, on the other hand, wehave my husband, who is an
Armenian, and Armenians are veryI don't know if anyone knows
much about the Armenian culture,but you know there's the
genocide, and then there's also,like Armenians like to how
would I say this?
They're very prideful and Iwould say that they're very like
emotional and like familyoriented, and there's some

(50:00):
similarities across our cultures, but I would say that he has
mirrored the parts of myselfthat I'm still getting to know.
So, for example, he's, I wouldsay, much more softer, in the
sense that he's less critical ofhimself.
He's much more like go with theflow.
And again, I have like grown, Ifeel like a lot with him, but

(50:23):
when we first started dating, Iwas just so hard and he was so
soft and we were constantly justlike.
I was just like criticizing himall the time and he was just
like getting really likesensitive with my criticism.
And I would just say that Ithink that when we're able to
see our partners as really justlike deep parts of ourselves,
then we can actually be a lotkinder to them, because he is

(50:47):
basically the part of me thathas not been expressed, right
Like he has really taught me howto be much more softer, how to
be more graceful, and I havetaught him how to be maybe like
a little bit more selfresponsible or like a little bit
self constructive criticism,right, like so, so, and then
whenever he gets like I feelsattacked by me or he feels like,

(51:09):
oh, like my wife is like soannoying, it's the part of him
that needs to like rise up andkind of like correct himself
Right.
And whenever I'm annoyed at himfor not taking more action, or
whatever the case may be, it'sthe part of me that needs to
soften.
So I don't know if that makessense, but whatever relationship
you're in, whether you'remarried or you're dating someone

(51:29):
, that person is really just amirror to the parts of yourself
that needs the most love.

Speaker 1 (51:35):
I love that and it's awesome how you share this is
where I typically dive deep andmy partner and I we talk a lot
about the masculine and thefeminine dance as a mirror
because, as men, what I'verealized because I used to be
very reactionary, because I wassuper sensitive, but I was never
, as a man, given a space toreally operate in my emotions.

(51:56):
If I felt down or felt upset,typically it would come out as
anger or as ego, like I feltlike I had to fight for myself
all the time, and so I neverreally had a space to show
myself and, as a result, Ididn't really develop into my
masculine, because a lot of menthink that being hard is
masculine but actually beingvulnerable is masculine, being

(52:19):
in your vulnerability, beingable to take the mask of
strength off, to lean into thatbecause that's where you meet
yourself.
And what I realized is that asa man, I evolved so much, and
one thing that you know mypartner often says is the way
that you hold space, the way youare so solid when I come and

(52:40):
something comes up for me andyou create space for me to talk
about it and have the hardconversations she's like I just
love that because I can leaninto it, and I know that if it
had not been for me learning howto be vulnerable, learning how
to hear my partner, it was soimportant because I realized
this person, who I'm now sayingI want to dedicate my life to,

(53:03):
she's going to see things in methat nobody else sees.
She's going to feel things fromme that nobody else feels, and
vice versa, and so I really hadto learn not to take it
personally in my pastrelationships.
But what that taught me is tobe more present.
If my partner comes to me andthis is for all the couples or
those who want to get marriedout there If your partner comes

(53:25):
to you as a man and women beaware of this as well but if
your partner comes to you menand they're expressing something
that is mirroring to them, ormaybe they're seeing the
potential in you and they seethe capacity that you have to be
so much more.
It's not to challenge that, butreally what I started seeing is

(53:48):
, wow, like you really love meenough to address the things
that I don't see, you reallylove me enough to address the
things that I don't see, andwhat that allowed me to do now
in my new relationship is whensomething comes up, even for me,
that I would typically try tobe strong and navigate through.
And I got it.
I'll figure it out Now.

(54:09):
I found early in ourrelationship her mirror to me
allowed me to share thingsemotionally that I had never
shared with anyone, and viceversa, my mirror to her allowed
her to do the same thing withoutjudgment, no-transcript.

(54:50):
The more deeply I can connectto her and as deep empaths, this
is the gift that you guys bring, and so I imagine that just
being married, having a kidthere's a lot of things that are
coming up and yeah, I'd saymarriage and any really close
relationship is going to mirrora lot of different things to you
, for both of you to heal.
I don't think you'll heal asmuch as you can as you can with

(55:12):
someone, because they are yourgreatest mirror.

Speaker 3 (55:15):
Yeah, I was going to respond and say that when you
say how you used to react likevery like kind of you react your
reaction is like almost likedefensiveness right, so to speak
.
My husband also displayed someof that too in the earlier days,
and what I realized is thatcomes from a lot of like
survival mentality.
You need to defend yourselfwhen you're trying to survive,

(55:37):
and so once we're able to shiftfrom survival to thriving, then
you're no longer needing todefend yourself because you're
realizing that the other personis really just projecting what's
going on with them.
Most of the time, like when I'mannoyed at my husband, it's
like my own thing or his ownthing, right, we're just
bouncing back from each other,and that's something that I
really learned from A Course inMiracles, too.

(55:59):
A lot of our thoughts are noteven present thoughts.
They're thoughts from the pastthat are echoing.
I can be annoyed about this cup, for example, and it has
nothing to do with what's likethe cup itself, but my
perception of the cup from thepast.
It's all just coming up nowfrom the future.
So a lot of the times whenpeople are thinking that they're
having a specific thought orthey're angry at their spouse

(56:20):
for a specific reason or they'reannoyed at them.
It has nothing to do withwhat's actually happening.
It's actually from the pastthat's coming up, whether it's a
childhood wound or whether it'ssomething that happened last
week.
So, anyways, I wanted to touchon that because a lot of people
don't realize that when they'recoming from a place of
defensiveness, it's really likea survival thing.

(56:42):
Right, they're wanting toprotect themselves from a place
of defensiveness.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
It's really like a survival thing, right?
The wanting to protectthemselves.
Yeah, I know, I created aframework for myself and I now
apply it to my relationships.
When it comes to growing like,I know I want to be a better,
wiser, more connected, moreconscious, more aware version of
myself, and so I started askingmyself when I would face
challenges or life broughtsomething my way that wasn't
favorable, I would ask myselfhow is this challenging me to be

(57:08):
more loving, how is itchallenging me to find more
peace?
How is it challenging me to bemore grateful?
Is this situation presenting anopportunity for me to be better
or is it a distraction fromwhat I truly desire?
And now I bring that into ourrelation, my partners in our
relationship, where I always sayif something comes up, if we

(57:30):
feel ourselves getting pulledinto ego or doing this, the
first question we ask is is thismaking us better?
Is this bringing us deeper intolove or disconnecting us from
it?
Is this creating more peace forus?
Is it enhancing the vision thatwe have together or is it
hindering it?
And if it's anything coming upthat's going to hinder us loving

(57:52):
more deeply, connecting moredeeply, having more gratitude
for the experience of thisengagement, this relationship,
then it's not worthy of us.
It's not.
And immediately we stop and weask the question what can we do
right now to go deeper?
What can we do right now tolove on each other?
What can we do right now tobring more peace?
Because at this point, it's notabout me, my and I, it's about

(58:15):
us, we and our.
It's about oneness.
How can we become one in thismoment?
And sometimes, man, it's notabout fixing anything.
One in this moment andsometimes, man, it's not about
fixing anything.
It's about just being present,holding space and being quiet.
Just be quiet.
Sometimes they just want you tolisten, not fix.
They need the space to releasewhat's in them, those emotions.

(58:37):
As they get closer to you, theydon't want to carry a lot of
the negative feelings andnegative emotions, but you
become a mirror that gives thema space where they feel safe
enough to release it.
And that's what we have to payattention to as men.
When women feel safe with us,they feel safe unloading
everything.
And as men, we must now learnhow to love ourselves, love them

(58:58):
, understand that spirituallythey're on a journey just like
us and ultimately, for them,it's about creating a space
where they can release that andthen we can ask the deeper
questions.
What do you think that's comingup from?
Because, like you said, it'snot most of the time, it never
has anything to do with what'shappening right now.
It's something that's happenedin the past that's now coming up

(59:21):
and showing itself, and so it'slike, really, I now get to be a
partner to take that journeywith her Babe.
What do you feel that's comingup from?
How can I be of support?
Do you just need me to?

Speaker 3 (59:32):
listen.
Yeah, exactly.
I mean like our emotions arelike it's like the weather,
right, it can change, likeanytime, like sometimes it's
raining, sometimes it's sunshine.
I think when they're able tojust like see it that way, then
they could just pull out anumbrella right and be like okay,
Emily, it's raining, and thatthere's just no, there's nothing
attacking you.

(59:53):
And it is hard.
I get it Like I think I try toput myself in my husband's shoes
and it's definitely probablyhard for him sometimes when I'm
going through one of myemotional moments, right, and he
has to hold space for it.
And in a way, I think that thatGod designed us in that way, to
for women to be highly emotional, or and sometimes women can

(01:00:14):
feel like, oh, I don't want tobe emotional, or like but this
is who we are right, Like we arecapable of things that men are
not capable, or vice versa.
And I think what you sharedabout how men holding space for
women, I really do think thatit's so needed because we do
feel safe with you guys, andbeing like feeling safe with you

(01:00:35):
also means that you would haveto see the parts of us that
don't, that are not very happyor are not very joyful, so to
speak.
You can't get all of the goodstuff and not get right, Right.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
That's where the work is, and I tell anybody you want
a serious relationship, youwant to get married, get ready
to do the work.
I feel like people nowadaysjump from one person to the next
person the moment somethinggets hard.
And I'm like you do realizethat that's a gift, like you get
to spend your life with thisperson, and I'm like you do
realize that that's a gift, likeyou get to spend your life with
this person.
And that means you get to seethe depth of this person and,

(01:01:10):
instead of labeling it good, bad, challenging, ugly, whatever,
you imagine that it's abeautiful journey.
If I'm taking a journey and I'mtraversing a mountainous
experience, there may be somesmooth points, there may be some
major peaks that I got to worka little harder to get over, but
once I make it to the top andstart to come down, it becomes a
little easier.
And in the beginning you'reclimbing a steep mountain.

(01:01:32):
In a lot of cases, when thoseemotions start coming up and the
terrain gets a little rocky,you better have on the right
boots to travel that terrain ortraverse that terrain, because
you're well-equipped to do it.
But man, I personally I'm so inlove with love and I'm so in
love with my life.
I'm so in love with the journeyof this life that, no matter

(01:01:54):
what I experience, it's alwaysabout what I'm getting to learn.
It's always about what I'mgetting to step into and the
opportunity that I get to be alight in my life and in my
partner's life and in otherpeople's lives.
But it takes a lot of workself-mastery, creating that
space where you have theself-awareness, the
self-discipline, the self-loveand the capacity to meet other

(01:02:17):
people in that same space.
But also learning how to bepatient with other people,
because your speed is not theirspeed.
I don't care how much you loveeach other, your journey is not
their journey.
And when you can create thatspace to say OK.
I have some things that I wantto discuss and I don't know how
it's going to be received, but Ijust want to preface what I'm
about to say with I love you somuch and I'm just at a phase in

(01:02:41):
this journey where I don't knowif any of this makes sense.
But I'm so grateful that I getto take this journey with you
and I want us to grow.
I want us to go deeper.
Right now we may be facing somechallenges, but I'm so glad
that I get to face this with you.
But, with that being said,there's some things that have
been happening lately and it'scoming up, and in some cases,

(01:03:04):
because we know, we know whenit's more us than them, and
that's something that I ask.
If emotion is energy in motion,which means it's based on my
thought, whatever my focus goesto, that's where my energy is
going to flow from, and sothat's another thing.
Before we communicate things,really ask ourselves okay, what
am I focusing on right now?
What am I judging?
What am I judging?
What am I critiquing?

(01:03:24):
Is this a product of oldprogramming or is this a product
of something that I've beenexperiencing and I haven't
opened my mouth to communicate,because it's going to change the
way we respond to it.
And this is all emotionalintelligence 101.
Because I know, for me it wasvery important to have a partner
that was very emotionallyintelligent, not reactive, but

(01:03:46):
who could slow down process andthen come to me from a space of.
This is what's coming up for me, this is what I'm feeling, and
in some cases she would say well, when you did this, I felt this
way.
And again, man, don't take thatpersonally.
Really assess yourself.
Could I have shown updifferently.

(01:04:07):
Could I have said thisdifferently?
Is this a valid concern?
Because how I've responded inthe past, this wasn't an issue,
but this is a new experience, sohow I respond with my partner
now may not be in alignment withwho I've been and how I've
showed up.
It's an opportunity to grow.
It's an opportunity again tolook into the mirror,
self-reflect and step forward,and I know you and Roger are

(01:04:30):
doing a lot of that.
I've had chances to haveconversations with him and now
getting to meet you you both aresuch a beautiful couple and the
work that you guys are going todo together I know it's early
in this baby, the baby, oh man,that's another mirror.
That's probably going to be thegreatest mirror either of you
ever experienced, especially asthey get older and start

(01:04:52):
expressing themselves and youstart seeing the mirror of how
you respond to things throughthem and it's like, oh, wait a
minute.
I often say my kids are mygreatest teachers.
I've learned so much from mychildren because I saw so much
of myself.
But what I can say is because Icontinue to grow with each one
of my kids.
Each one of them reflects nowthe best parts of me and so,

(01:05:16):
yeah, there's definitely ajourney ahead and I'm just
excited to stay connected to youguys.
Maybe we'll have to host aretreat together or something at
some point.
That would be awesome.

Speaker 3 (01:05:27):
I was going to say that it's funny that you say
that your kids are your greatestteachers, because one of my
friends asked me, like why doyou want to become a mom so bad?
Because, basically, to make itshort, we had trouble conceiving
.
So we were trying to conceivefor a year and I started having
these questions of like, why doI want a baby so bad?
And I thought about it and Icontemplated on it and my answer

(01:05:52):
to that was because I wanted tomeet my greatest teacher.
And so I met my greatest teacherand when, I was going through
my postpartum, my husband's likedo you remember?
You wanted to meet yourgreatest teacher.

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
She's here.
Well, listen.
I look so forward to seeingwhat you guys give birth to and
what you give birth to the womenthat you help, the men that he
helps and, collectively, therelationships that you guys help
other people to forge, movingforward.
And I know there's people whoare listening right now and
they're like how can I reach outto you, Kristen?

(01:06:31):
How can I connect with her?
What resources are available?
What would be the best way forthem to currently reach out to
you?

Speaker 3 (01:06:38):
Yeah, so you can follow me on Instagram.
It's at Leigh Mansourian it'sboth my last name, my husband's
last name.
I believe that I'm reallybuilding a legacy on both of our
sides.
And then you can also find meat the Elysian Retreat that's
our retreat space, and both onInstagram you can visit our
website at theelysianretreatcom,and I'm sure Princeton will

(01:07:01):
drop all of those in the shownotes.
I'm excited.
We are definitely evolving.
There's so many excitingprojects that are being born.
We're opening up a shop in ourretreat space literally next
month where I'm curating veryintentional wellness products,
both for men and women, to theversion of them that they're
becoming, and so I'm very picky,so I know that these products

(01:07:25):
will really be not just aproduct itself, but an extension
of whoever is using it.
So I'm excited, thank you forhaving me.

Speaker 1 (01:07:33):
Awesome, Awesome, Awesome.
There you have it EvolveMastery Family.
Kristen, I could literally sithere and talk to you all day,
but if you've been tuning intoday, as I always say, share
the wealth of wisdom, share theexperience, promote it to the
people in your life, Share withthose who maybe are experiencing
some of what we've discussed.
Help us shine our light moreextensively in the world.

(01:07:54):
And, as Kristen shared herinformation, everything will be
in the show notes.
So reach out to her, askquestions, connect notes.
So reach out to her, askquestions, connect.
If you want to host a retreator you want to be a part of an
upcoming retreat, make sure youconnect with her.
All her links will be on hersocials and you'll be able to
find everything.
And, again, they will also bein the show notes.
But, as you guys know, if you'reout there the Evolve Mastery

(01:08:17):
family, every step we take,every opportunity for growth we
receive, we're all evolving andso the more we learn to love
ourselves, the more we learn tohonor the experiences, the more
we learn to pause, the more welearn to give ourselves space
and grace in the opportunitiesthat are presented for us to
love, for us, to create more joyfor us, to create more peace.

(01:08:37):
The more we can evolve, themore we can grow.
Don't be hard on yourself.
We're all facing andexperiencing something.
It's like the quote sayseverybody's fighting a battle
you know nothing about and whenwe can see those battles as
again opportunities for growthand we can learn to honor the
experiences of those around uswhile also have to throw this in

(01:08:58):
there creating healthyboundaries to understand when
and when they're not able to bein our space.
We create those boundaries butstill honor the journey.
Obviously I love everybody, butsome people I got to love from a
distance because they just arewhere they are and I honor their
journey.
Guys, we're evolving togetherand the more of us that choose
love, the more of us to chooseto connect, the more of us to

(01:09:21):
choose to do the work ofself-mastery, the more light we
can add to the world.
But thank you guys for tuninginto this episode of Evolved
Mastery.
More to come and if you haveany questions for me, reach out
to me at princetonclarkcom oracross social media at
princetonclark, on Instagram,TikTok and also on Facebook.

(01:09:44):
But thank you guys for tuningin, sending you guys lots of
loves and I'll be talking to youguys again soon.