Film Catchup: The Bombs and Breakthroughs

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Every March, Hollywood seems to enter a strange twilight zone – award season is over, summer blockbusters remain months away, and the theatrical landscape becomes a curious mix of studio castoffs and hidden gems. This year proves particularly fascinating as we've witnessed an unprecedented $320 million Netflix disaster alongside genuinely brilliant filmmaking that's struggling to find its audience.

The stark contrast between something like The Electric State – a bloated, CGI-heavy disappointment from the once-celebrated Russo Brothers – and Steven Soderbergh's masterfully crafted spy thriller Black Bag perfectly illustrates the film industry's current identity crisis. While Netflix burns through hundreds of millions for minimal cultural impact, filmmakers like Paul Schrader continue creating thought-provoking character studies like O Canada with a fraction of those resources.

We're particularly excited about Opus, a psychological folk horror that blends elements of Get Out and Midsommar with John Malkovich delivering some of his finest work as an aging pop star. This divisive but mesmerizing directorial debut from Mark Anthony Green represents exactly the kind of original filmmaking that deserves theatrical support. Meanwhile, smaller releases like Borderline demonstrate how even promising premises with talented leads like Samara Weaving can falter without proper development.

What's becoming increasingly clear is that budget size bears little correlation to quality or cultural significance. The most memorable cinematic experiences of the season come from filmmakers with clear vision and artistic purpose rather than those with the deepest pockets. Whether you're planning your next theater visit or deciding what to stream, let quality guide your choices rather than marketing budgets or algorithm recommendations.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
welcome back.
To excuse the intermission, myname is max fosberg, my name is
alex mccauley, and today we'replaying catch up and diving into
some of the biggest releases,or biggest bombs, uh, that we
missed over the last couple ofmonths.
We are, uh, we're going totouch on a little bit of
everything, kind of break downwhat stood out, what fell short.

(00:27):
So buckle up, uh, for thiscinematic roller coaster right
after this break.
All right, alex max, here weare.
We Gosh, what a nice day today.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Nice day of the year.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Yeah, it's something right in the mid-70s, just
perfect outside.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
Well, mid-60s, Mid-60s or high-60s maybe.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Just perfect out today here in the Pacific
Northwest and you know we kindof had some trouble coming up
what we were going to do ontoday's episode.
We're lost without erica.
A little bit.
I'm feeling a little nervouswithout our third chair here.
Uh, good news though for fansof erica she will be back on the

(01:16):
pod next week.
Uh, and and back with morestrength than ever well, we've
really could be.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
The reason why we're sort of in this holding pattern
is we really want to celebrateher win at the grand cinema,
guessing the most correct Oscarpicks, and do her like her to,
to embrace her in this victorylap and do her episode format
that we won't spoil until nextweek, but it's one that we're
really looking forward to.
So, yeah, today was a littlebit of a, or this week's been a

(01:45):
little bit of filler.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah, yeah.
So how, how has your week gone?
Uh, any, any, any movie news.
Any people are saying stories.
You have right up front Gosh.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
People are saying, um , from the movie industry, from
Hollywood.
People are saying this is aheavy one.
Okay, I like to have.
Usually we like to have funwith this segment.
People are saying that thedirector of the documentary
winning feature at the academyawards no other land, that one

(02:17):
of the co-directors of the filmhas been kidnapped, lynched,
kidnapped, and his whereaboutsare unknown as of this moment.
This happened in the west bank.
Um, so that goes out withobviously a heavy heart.
Yeah, um, that that people aresaying message you hate to see
it.
Um, again though I was talkingto a friend about this speaks to

(02:41):
the power of cinema as art, andobviously these are very trying
times, especially in relationto the Israel Palestine conflict
.
Um, I don't want to speak out ofturn on any of it.
However, when you see aresponse as strong as this,
where you know the, the directorof a film, the, the painter of

(03:05):
an, a piece of art, where,whatever it may be, when, when
something strikes a chord andgets noticed and awareness is
spread, and you have the otherside of, whatever the topic or
the issue may be, feel like youknow an, an opposition needs to
be felt, that it, that thatknowledge needs to be met with
force.
I don't want to say that it is,um, uh, some sort of validation

(03:29):
of the work.
However, it it does speak tothe greater importance of making
meaningful movies, music,artwork, whatever it may be.
Um, so again, that news breakswith with obviously our thoughts
and prayers with the director,but um, yeah, I did see that
come across my feed.

Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah, yeah, heavy, heavy heart there and um, you
know, it's I, I think I, I echoexactly what you said, and
especially now more than ever,right, uh and uh, this is
terrible, it's horrific, it'sfrightening, um, and really
really scary.
And uh, you know, no one shouldever have to go through

(04:13):
something like that because of apiece of art that they made.
Um, and you know, documentariesare, are pieces of art as well,
and I mean mean they are.
They are documenting real, realtime, real life things.
Um, so, yeah, just uh, really,yeah, really terrible really

(04:36):
terrible um gosh.
How do I say?

Speaker 2 (04:39):
no, no, easy pivot.
I have another one.
People are saying I heard thistitle thrown around three
different times by threeunexpected people in my life
yesterday the new Netflixminiseries Adolescence I've been

(04:59):
hearing a lot about thisalgorithm on social media, boots
on the ground, talking to thepeople, and they are saying that
adolescence is this incredibleexpose into.
It's not like true crime oranything like that, but of of
like a true crime-esque type ofstory, um, about a 13 year old

(05:21):
where they've committed a murder, and what you get is this story
unfolding over four episodes.
Each episode plays out like itsown mini movie and it's all one
.
Each episode is one take, it'sone shot.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
Oh really, I haven't heard that it's got a little
it's got a little gimmick to it.
Sure.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
And I'm not using that.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
Stephen Merchant, I believe is is the lead in it
Okay.
Uh, you know, has shown up in abunch of.
He's usually like a gangsterand something in you know in you
know a Guy Ritchie film or uh,you know, he's in snatch, he's
in lock stock, he's in rock androll.
Uh, um, he was also in theIrishman.
But yeah, I've heard reallyreally good things about this

(06:04):
miniseries.
I haven't checked it out myselfas Netflix.
I tell people this Don'tsubscribe.

Speaker 2 (06:13):
They don't believe me .
I don't subscribe either.
And other people in my family,other people in my life, I could
mooch off of their account.
I refuse to.
I pay for Macs.
Big fan of Paramount plus.
You guys all know that, likethere are other streaming
services that it would be, Iwould be hard pressed to remove
from my you know rotationnetflix.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
I'm so fine not having netflix yeah, really
interesting if each episode it'sa four episode miniseries.
And you said, each episodeplays out like a movie.
I wonder when I whenever I hearthat I feel like the material

(06:56):
might be stretched a little thin, because if four episodes Right
, like I've, what I've heard, isthat like it could just be a
two hour movie.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
It could be, because what I've heard is that, like,
episode three is really the onethat you're edging towards and
so it's like could okay.
So then could you take maybe 40, the 45 of the best minutes
from episode one and two.
Keep what you have in episodethree and take the best 30
minutes of episode four and youhave like a really good two and

(07:23):
a half hour film, yeah, yeah, 30minutes of episode four and you
have like a really good two anda half hour film.
Yeah, yeah, that's a film thatwould that we call that it's a
movie.

Speaker 1 (07:28):
That's that's called a movie.
Um, yeah, and how?
You know, gosh, kind of wishthat was going on right now.

Speaker 2 (07:36):
Way, I don't think march is usually as bad as
something like january, orfebruary, when it's typically
anchored by at least in the pastfew years, maybe since sort of
the fall of marvel, it has stillbeen anchored by some sort of
big studio property.
Or, like last year, this iswhen we were getting excited

(07:58):
dune 2 and we were gettingexcited and ready for something
like challengers, like there wasalready buzz around a film that
could potentially be playingduring the award season yeah,
but I will.

Speaker 1 (08:07):
I will say this year, uh, has been a little dry so
far.
Yeah, been a little dry.
Uh, maybe some some other quicknews points before we get into
films that we've watched.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
I do want to go back to adolescence and just the act
of being into a good tv show andand one of the folks who
brought up the Netflixminiseries to me the other day I
did say you know what I feellike.
I'm hearing this at the righttime because I am in the middle
and so many of us are in themiddle of season three of the

(08:39):
white Lotus right now.
I have I that high of beinginvested in a good tv show.
Is it's on like I have it rightnow.
I have the itch right now to tolook for it.
And now, of course, the waynetflix rolls out their
programming, which sucks and youcan binge it all and it really
stops or it prevents their filmsfrom, or their content from

(09:03):
having like longevity, becauseit isn't like a water cooler
moment where every Sunday youwatch white Lotus like how you
do on max, and then the next twodays you can read stuff and you
see the new memes come out orwhatever it hits your algorithm
and you can talk to your friendsor realized appointment
television.
It is Um, but the fact that Iam still in the middle of a good

(09:23):
TV show right now and I knowthat feeling of like, okay, yeah
, this is great.
I do kind of love somethingthat's like digestible, and an
hour long segment does actuallyhave me planning when I'm going
to watch this miniseries.
Adolescence Well, that very,very rarely happens with
television.

Speaker 1 (09:41):
That just sparked a thing in my head.
Another TV show is about todrop tomorrow.
Do you subscribe to the AppleTV app?
I do have Apple TV plus.

(10:02):
Apple TV plus is dropping a newcomedy satire series about
Hollywood called the Studio,starring Seth Rogen, with a star
studded cast of cameos,apparently including some of
Martin Scorsese's greatestacting to date Interesting.
And people are saying this isthis is the best like version of

(10:24):
Hollywood satire sinceEntourage.
Really, wow, high praise, highpraise.
Cannot wait.
That comes out tomorrow, the26th of March.
Okay, so by the time you'relistening to this, maybe you've
watched the first episode.
And is it?

Speaker 2 (10:37):
because I believe that the way Apple does, apple
does it.
Appointment yes, yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
So Wednesday nights.
Okay, might have another,another great show on the way,
wow, um, and with someone likeseth rogan like I'm, I'm in evan
goldberg as well uh, in thecreative yeah uh side.
Um, you know I'm making fun ofhollywood.
I'm in I'm in, I'm in, I'm in.
That sounds good.

(11:02):
And then another people aresaying one more people are
saying Bon Joon-ho hosted ascreening, saw this Of the Thing
this weekend.
Mr John Carpenter was inattendance, did a Q&A with Bon
after the film.
The very last question Bonasked Mr Carpenter is if he

(11:27):
would score Bond June.
Ho's next film, which he alsosaid is a straight-up horror
movie Very exciting.
I know the reviews and resultsof Mickey 17 have been very

(11:48):
lukewarm.
The fact that Bond has come outnow and said he is doing a
straight-up horror, he's got,hopefully Carpenter on the ones
and twos doing the score, couldbe very exciting.
I know how much Bond loves thething very exciting, we know, I

(12:09):
know how much you know bondloves the thing.
Uh, and if it's, if he, if hecan get back to something like
as we talked about on the bondepisode?
You know, snow piercer,parasite, you know, maybe even a
little bit of the host, but notnot so much a monster movie,
but I don't know.
I, I, I love to see that he is.
He is going to go hard into thehorror genre.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
I saw that news as well, very exciting, and
something that I wish we sawmore of was like you almost take
the Avengers format of casting,but do that with your crew.
That's brilliant.
Like bring your all, bring theall-star team together, because

(12:49):
so many of these different guysdo different things right, and
so it's like what if there wasjust a movie that was like
directed by bong joon-ho, scoredby john carpenter, edited by
sean baker?
You had all these differentguys that do different things on
a film set would be amazing andthen come in and you know it's.
It's shot by Greg Frazier or oneof, like, the biggest
cinematographers out there.

(13:10):
And you're just like, oh damn,like they didn't spend money in
front of the camera, they spentall their money behind the
camera.

Speaker 1 (13:16):
Yeah, that's really brilliant and bomb could do that
, because also he's got, I'msure, a wealth of knowledge and
his own acting pool that he canpull from South Korea Right,
because I'm guessing it would bea South Korean film, or at
least you could do it that wayand again spend all your money
on the people behind.
Why Sean Baker doesn't, Iwonder.

(13:38):
If he edits movies like formoney, that would be a great way
to make money for your nextfilm, sean Baker, and he could
white label stuff.
Not that he needs any sort ofadvice from me, of course.

Speaker 2 (13:51):
And I mean it could be white labeled too right, like
he could use a different nameor he you know, however, that
works.
You know he doesn't have to bethe one taking credit, so I
wonder if he has.
I wonder, I wonder if he has.
I did see something to whatpeople are saying that like, um,
just just along the same linesthat killers of the flower moon,
because a lot of you know thethe Paul Thomas Anderson new
teaser dropped for his film.

(14:14):
We have an official title for itnow.
One battle after another, onebattle after another.
The teaser, of course, featuresLeonardo.
Did you watch it?
Uh, no.

Speaker 1 (14:25):
Um, and so I'm in.
I'm'm in, like what do I needto?
I watch it.
Listen, paul thomas andersonfamously cuts his own trailers
uh-huh just an excellent trailercutter okay, I've watched this
thing about 16 times.
Doesn't give away anything.
Okay, gives you some vibes ofof what we're looking at.
I don't know.
I don't even know if I want totell you if you haven't watched
if you, you're, if you're,endorsing it as far as I'm

(14:45):
endorsing away, I can watch it,I'm endorsing.
However, I will say there issuch a fucking hive mind within
filmmaking.
Uh, there was a movie that cameout last year that feels a lot
like this movie Interesting, orat least from the snipp I saw my
people are saying no is thatpeople are saying that Paul
Thomas Anderson rewrote thefinal draft of the killers of

(15:07):
the flower moon script.

Speaker 2 (15:08):
I saw that come across my algorithm.
Wow, and that's how he and Leoreally got close and how one
battle after another ended uphappening.
Huh.
That's cool, that's great.
Yeah, because Leo I think thisis been famously reported was
not happy with the way the firstdraft of that script looked the
adaptation of the book and howhe was supposed to be playing

(15:29):
the Jesse Plemons detective roleactually.
So he wanted his part to belooked at and PTA apparently was
the person who came in.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
Killers of the Flower Moon will go down as a hidden
gem of Sc scorsese's that's onepodcaster's opinion that listen
it.
It just grows at each day.
Okay, the myth continues togrow if we ever get on fucking
physical media.

Speaker 2 (15:55):
Insane that you can't do that I can't believe.

Speaker 1 (15:58):
What are we doing um?

Speaker 2 (16:01):
apple back to apple.
Yeah, we're doing right fuckingapple.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
Um, okay, I, I think, I think that's all, that's all
my people.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Apple Back to Apple.
What are you doing, right?
Fucking Apple.
Okay, I think that's all mypeople.
That's all my people.
In the movie industry, globalpeople are saying Seattle's
ready for an NBA team.
Again, people are saying thatMarch Madness up in Seattle was
a huge success.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
I was there both days you were scouting it out.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
The amount of retro throwback Sonic stuff that
people were wearing.
Oh sure, Just the energy thatwas in Climate Pledge Arena for
those two days.
I know that we have the Storm.
The Storm have beenhistorically one of the better
WNBA teams.
Some say the best People aresaying but honestly, like Lauren
Jackson's's retired in therafters.

(16:45):
Sue Bird's jersey retired in therafters.
Yes, you can go to watch theHuskies play.
You can do.
You can still access basketballin Seattle.
The city needs an NBA teamagain, though, and so if there
is an expansion in two years,and if people want to start
caring about the NBA again,which I think they should,
watching live basketballunearthed something in me that I

(17:08):
had forgotten was such a loveof mine.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
Are we finally going to start the NBA podcast?

Speaker 2 (17:15):
If we get a team, if the West the Western conference,
it needs to be Seattle theEastern conference.
If they want to do somethingfucking stupid and like, put a
Vegas team in the Easternconference wouldn't make the
most sense, but EasternConference.
If they want to do somethingfucking stupid and put a Vegas
team in the Eastern Conferencewouldn't make the most sense,
but whatever, do it.
If Vegas takes the WesternConference team, because what
I've heard people are sayingthat an expansion would be two

(17:36):
teams, one for the West, one forthe East.

Speaker 1 (17:38):
This is what you do you realign and you put New
Orleans in the East.
Thank you, that would make somuch sense.
And then you add Seattle andVegas to the West and Vegas to
the West.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
And Vegas can be part of that Southwest group, adam
Silver, if you're listening.

Speaker 1 (17:51):
Of course, seattle's in the Northwest division.
Yeah, it's time, I think it'stime.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
It is.

Speaker 1 (17:59):
And I mean everything is pointing towards it.
I don't have a lot of people onthis, but I mean everything is
pointing towards it.
You know I don't have a lot ofpeople on this, but the people I
do have on it, uh, everythingis pointing towards Seattle
getting 18 within, at at thevery least four years, next four
years.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
Oh yeah, I think.
I think an expansion is comingwithin the next two years.
Yeah, yeah, that's going to beinteresting.

Speaker 1 (18:20):
Um, okay, but we're here to talk about movies, yeah,
movies that we've uh, newreleases.
We've not been doing that.
Yeah, we just kind of turnedinto a yeah, a little news
podcast, uh movies that havereleased again.
So march usually not this dry Ifeel like it is extremely dry.

(18:42):
There are some, maybe some gemsout there that people need to
pay more attention to.
There's a lot of crap right now, um, and so I I spent my week
last week watching some films,uh, from all different kinds of
of apps and, well, actually,honestly, honestly, just

(19:03):
pirating shit, uh, so I don'tknow if that really counts
against my new year's resolutionof not streaming, uh, because I
am streaming.

Speaker 2 (19:13):
I'm just illegally streaming and not paying I'm
trying to figure out who you'rehurting the most, because
streaming a movie doesn'tnecessarily help the filmmaker
if you were to stream somethingoff of Netflix or max.
So I think the people you'rehurting the most by pirating are
the streaming studios.

Speaker 1 (19:29):
Yeah, the people I'm hoping will hire me.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
Um, but I mean to your point.
Right now.
I'm looking at the popular thisweek tab on letterboxd.
Right now it is a ton of logsfor films that played at the
Oscars, that that competed atthe oscars this year and things
that have hit streamers now from2024 that are very popular.
So, like in your top 10 reallyyour top 12 you have things like

(19:56):
heretic conclave, moana 2,wicked flow and anora, yeah.
So that tells you right nowthere are no new releases right
now making any noise Really.

Speaker 1 (20:06):
Not, not really at all.
Um, the first film that Iwatched uh this past week is uh
directed by Anthony and JoeRusso, uh produced by their
company, a GBO, and Netflix.
Uh, the streaming company, thenumber one streamer in the world

(20:27):
, made this movie called theelectric state.
It is a science fiction filmfeaturing millie bobby brown,
chris pratt and woody harrelsonas the voice of mr peanut.
The narrative follows anorphaned teenager who embarks on
a journey through a retro,futuristic world alongside a

(20:49):
peculiar robot.
Uh, this movie was estimatedhad a estimated budget of
approximately 320 milliondollars.
Whoa is based on a illustratednovel of the same name, the
Electric State, written by SimonStalenhag, who has also had

(21:15):
another piece of his fictionalnovel work produced into I
believe it was a TV show talesfrom the loop on Amazon.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
Uh this movie garnered the rare half star
rating from you.

Speaker 1 (21:33):
It is a big pile of dog shit.
It is Uh, I, I, I, uh, I hopeNetflix doesn't look at my
letterbox either, cause I'veapplied for a couple of jobs for
them.
Uh, but someone is I go off, Igo off on on.
Netflix doesn't look at myletterbox either, because I've
applied for a couple of jobs forthem.
Someone is I go off on myletterbox review.
It is kind of what is wrong, Ifeel like, with mainstream movie

(22:00):
making right now.
It is, and it's reallyinteresting because I've never
read the novel the electricstate.
However, I've seen some of theillustrations and drawings from
it and, yes, they, they takethose illustrations and drawings
and they have recreated them ina, in a movie format.
However, it is the movie.

(22:23):
It seems like it's in suchopposition to the text, the text
, and when you're looking atthese illustrations and what
I've read from reviews of thebook, it is a very dire down,
like the world has fallen apart.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
Very dystopian science fiction novel I'm gonna
stop you right there because,based off that description, the
russo brothers are the lastpeople who I would want to grab
to try to communicate thatexactly, and they don't
understand the definition of anyof those words you just said
that is so true.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
It it is so crazy that the Russo brothers got this
much money to make this filmthat they they continue.
You know, as someone who, likein the in the teens, in the 20
teens, the Russos were hailed aslike this forward-thinking,

(23:26):
genre-bending directing duo.
But as soon as they have left,as soon as they left marvel, as
soon as they left all thatbehind and and their stuff works
in in a marvel world, I think,and everything, every project
they've done after that has beena huge miss.

(23:47):
I mean even something like thegray man, which I had way more
fun watching Right Um, becauseit is so like garbage, special
ops.
Yeah, it is so like bad, it'sgood, uh and, and it's I don't
know, it's just, it's like funnyon a on a meta level, because

(24:09):
you are wasting the talents ofsomeone like Chris Evans and
Ryan Gosling and a big spythriller.
This is.
This movie is just, it's justdepressing that when you, when
you click on this movie to play,and the first thing that comes
up is a straight-up commercialfrom Planters Peanuts assembling

(24:30):
the character Mr Peanut.
He's a straight-up walkingtalking logo in this film,
voiced by Woody Harrelson, andhe's a freedom fighter and he's
the president of the robots orsomething like that.
This movie it just misses on somany levels as far as stakes,

(24:55):
as far as script.
Millie Bobby Brown Listen, I'veonly ever seen her in stranger
things.
That's my only relationshipwith her.
I know you really liked themovie damsel.
I was going to bring this up.
She is completely dead.
I in this movie, and this isbecause she is acting with

(25:18):
probably people in green suitsand surrounded by green, like
this whole thing.
They set this thing in Seattle.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
I think the only reason and again, I don't know
if it's set in Seattle in thenovel, but I think the only
reason it's set in Seattle is sothat you can have an overcast
day, so that your graphics soit's easier to render your
graphics- the frustrating thingabout that is because damsel was

(25:48):
such a nice surprise to me lastyear because I had zero
expectations and I thought itactually did do a really good
job of showcasing millie bobbybrown as a professional actor,
someone who could work oppositenothing but green screen.
Cgi, um, props, you know,tennis balls, whatever they're
saying, here's the dragon.

(26:08):
Look, you know, okay, look thisway, look that way, whatever.
Um, because that's mostly whatdamsel is.
It's her carrying that movieand it's a good time.
Yeah, and maybe it's becausethat didn't have the expectation
of a 300 million dollar movie,of a russo brothers production

(26:28):
of co-starring with chris uh,whoever it is chris pratt, who
continues to just play han soloripoffs from in every movie,
every single movie he does.
He is the exact same characterdown to like the vest in this
movie straight up and no, he's asmuggler.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
They call him a smuggler, a robot smuggler or
whatever, um, and he's got arobot sidekick who, like can't
really talk, uh, or makes noises.
He's he is, he's got bad hair,um, and then I mean, I just
can't't believe that.
Woody Harrelson, jenny Slate,brian Cox.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Coleman Domingo.

Speaker 1 (27:11):
Coleman Domingo.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
Anthony Mackie, stanley Tucci.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
Tucci is in this Jason, as an evil, steve Jobs,
jason Alexander is is prettymuch a cameo and again like it's
set in the 90s.
So they really try to nostalgiabait you with someone like
jason alexander, kind of beinglike george from seinfeld, kurt
loder playing himself.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
does anybody who does ?
Anybody who knows who milliebobby brown is also know who
kurt loder is?
Besides, maybe people that havea movie podcast?
Absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (27:44):
Yeah, this movie is so, so, incredibly bad and it's
just boring and it's gray andconcrete looking.
It's overly lit, it's overlylong.
It has no Gene Carlo Espeon,again just like playing a bad

(28:05):
guy who he's never actually inthe movie.
He's just a face on a screen sohe's just like again doing
voice work, pretty much.
It is so bad.
The stakes there's this bigbattle at the end of this movie.
There's this big battle at theend of this movie and the

(28:26):
sidekick of Chris Pratt, who is,I guess, the robot you're
supposed to really fall in lovewith, because you know whatever
comedy, and that robot gets shot, gets killed, and there's a
moment there like oh man, oh no,my friend, my friend, only
maybe three minutes, threeminutes of this moment.

(28:48):
And then the robot opens up andit's revealed that it's
actually a smaller robot insideof this big robot.
So the friend is still alive.
I mean, that's the kind ofstakes that they.
There's just nothing.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
There's nothing good about this movie, absolutely
nothing let me say something,and I don't want to sound like a
pessimist.
Good, it's a movie like thisfailing.
And now here's the thingnetflix, of course, will release
some bullshit metric.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
They'd say that this was streamed by 20 million
people worldwide.

Speaker 2 (29:23):
Blah, blah, blah.
And the press tour for thisfilm has been incredible.
They've probably spent half ofthat production budget on the
press tour, because I've seenmillie bobby brown over in asia,
I've seen her across the globepromoting this film.
They've been doing in theaterpremieres for it.
She's hit the tonight show,she's done all the talk shows,
and so the moment for theElectric State was really

(29:47):
pressed on us right now, reallypressed.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
And also to see it fail.

Speaker 2 (29:52):
I'm kind of like good , At least critically, If you're
going to do all that.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
Put it in fucking theaters?
Yeah, because actually the $320million production budget is
the production budget.
There is a separate marketingbudget that comes after the
movie is made.
Who knows how much they spenton that, but you're right, it's
probably close to half half theproduction, yeah 150 million.
That's another 150, and so likeI just don't understand what

(30:19):
netflix is doing printing money.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
That's what they're doing.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
How, yeah, there's no way they got an an influx of
subscribers because of theelectric state no and yeah, no
one was like this is the onethat's.
Uh, that's gonna get me tosubscribe yeah, and quite
frankly, I, the russos, whoagain, like made some amazing
movies in the marvel cinematicuniverse captain america, winter

(30:45):
soldier, infinity war, end game, three of the best marvel
movies ever made the fact thatthey go around spewing this like
weird perverted shit, talkingabout the 320 million dollar
budget as if they're like reallyproud of like that's how much
money we got, and then also likeall their ai bullshit where

(31:06):
they're very pro-AI, and reallyagain in this film about a robot
revolution kind of thing, andwe're supposed to feel something
for robots, even though theyare robots, they're not people.
You know it stinks.
It stinks to high heaven.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
I fucking hate this movie.

Speaker 1 (31:27):
It is one of the worst movies, I think, of the
2020s.
It's one of the worst moviesI've seen in a long time and
again, it's not even like.
It's not even that.
It's atrocially written, it'sjust nothing.
It's just absolutely nothing.
And I, I I just worry that ifthis is what something like

(31:53):
netflix is is willing to givemoney, like they've gone from
scorsese and coron with likeirishman and I was just talking
to somebody about white noisethe other day too, and Fincher
to this not good it is.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
It does feel contradictory to have them say,
after the reception of somethinglike white noise, that, like
you know what, noah Baumbach, welove you, we tried, or whatever
we're done, doing directorpassion projects and having the
quote unquote blank check be$200 million so that you can
make sure that every singlelittle cassette tape has the
right you know artist written onit, or however you want to

(32:35):
spend that money.
But here, joe and anthony,because you made end game 10
years ago, here's your blankcheck.

Speaker 1 (32:43):
Well, and to adapt an illustrated novel, yeah, yeah
yeah, and again it just comes ina long line of this.
The gray man, cherry cherry wasI've.

Speaker 2 (32:54):
Cherry was the first sign that like this is not going
to go well post marvel for them.
Yeah, cherry should have workedshould have worked.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
Um, and it just shows .
And obviously they're runningback to Marvel.
Now they are doing the whateverAvenger movie is coming out in
a couple of years.
But I just you know these guys,they were such good, they were
so exciting, they were suchexciting filmmakers when they

(33:25):
started out in communityarrestedrested Development and
then getting a shot with CaptainAmerica, winter Soldier and
like, really honestly, like in atime when Marvel was kind of
like, maybe the first dip ofMarvel, right, that was around
the Thor 2 sequel.
It was around Iron man 2 sequelwhere, like, these movies

(33:46):
weren't working as well as thefirst movies that came out and
winter soldier took it toanother level because of some
really ingenious, like smartfilmmaking.
To now be the russos now andand have this crap and then also
like to fucking go aroundtelling people to like, you know

(34:10):
, like, stay in your mom'sbasement If you, if you don't
like this movie or somethinglike that, fuck those guys, fuck
those guys.
And uh, yeah, that electricstate is, is horrendous and
there'll be kids who like it,but like because there's big
robots, but like it's bad, it'sreally really bad.

(34:32):
Okay and that, but luckilythat's as bad as we get the next
film that I saw is a comedythriller called Borderline.
This is Jimmy Warden'sdirectorial debut.
This features Samara Weaving asSophia, a 1990s pop star whose

(34:57):
home is invaded by an obsessivefan I can't even read my own
writing Obsessive fan played byRay nicholson, the son of jack
nicholson.
Having a bit of a moment rightnow, he was in this, he was in
smile too.
I believe he has another moviecoming out that he is in soonish

(35:19):
.
Um, the film explores themes ofcelebrity and obsession.
Uh, with a supporting cast thatincludes eric dane, jimmy falls
and alba baptista.
It's produced by lucky chapentertainment and productive
media.
Uh, borderline had an estimatedbudget budget of five million.

(35:41):
The film was released intheaters and on digital
platforms at the same time.
I don't know how much it madein theaters, but it was very
limited.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
This is something you've had on your radar for a
long time Because I did notwatch it in preparation for this
episode.
But I'm going back on myletterboxd watch list and at the
time that I added this film.
Here are the other films thatare right around the same time.
This is how long that thismovie has been in production,

(36:10):
gone through, I think, a bunchof different rewrites on the
script.

Speaker 1 (36:14):
Eli Roth's Thanksgiving, oh, yes, I
remember that so we're talkingabout like two years ago.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
Basically, there is a couple of other movies here
that weren't like 2023, moviesthat I added, though when that I
you know here on the podcast, Ican kind of think about, like
what we were doing, why I addedthis movie to my list or
whatever, the Roman Polanskifilm, frantic, that stars

(36:43):
Harrison Ford.
So, like when we did ourHarrison Ford batting lineup,
whatever it was.
So it's been a long time sinceBorderland was announced, and
originally anticipated.

Speaker 1 (36:55):
Yeah, borderline is.
It's interesting.
If I you know, I didn't reallydo any research on the
production, but if there were alot of rewrites, I think you can
kind of feel it while you'rewatching this film.
It is kind of a nice containedstory.
Once we get to the story there,there are a little bit of jumps
in time that were a littleconfusing but and it's a little

(37:20):
messy around the edges as far asthe plot goes um, um, but some
pretty fun and really actuallylike absurd moments.
Like there is a straight uplike song and like musical
moment in this movie which iskind of, which is actually it's

(37:41):
pretty funny when it happens um,but the title borderline, I
assume, is indicative of the thenicholson character having
borderline personality disorderthey never say that.
Okay, they never say that.
They just call him crazy, okayhe?
So, yeah, the movie opens upwith him like getting dressed up

(38:05):
, buying flowers, and it lookslike he's going on a date.
He shows up to this girl'smansion.
A man comes out who you're notreally sure who he is.
You find out he eventually he'slike the security guard for
this pop star.
This guy, ray Nicholson, youknow, is under the guise that he

(38:28):
has a date with this pop star,they get into a confrontation.

Speaker 2 (38:33):
He stabs the uh, the bodyguard and then and like
turns into like a home invasioncomedy.
Well, then.

Speaker 1 (38:42):
Then it cuts six months or maybe two years.
Is it two years later?

Speaker 2 (38:46):
okay yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
So then it cuts and a title card comes up that says
two years later.

Speaker 2 (38:51):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Um, which is like some confusing.
I don't know why they felt likethe need to do that, cause you
could have just gone straight inand like this is the rest of
the movie.
Because then the movie doesbecome a home invasion movie
where this somehow this RayNicholson character and two
other characters from the mentalinstitution and we can still

(39:15):
call him that, I almost saidloony bin have broken out of the
loony bin and are on their wayto this pop star's house, and
then it's a home invasion thingwhere they kidnap people and you

(39:36):
know all this stuff.
But there's also a moment wherethey kidnap the bodyguard.
Now, two years later, and again, like they take him out to the
woods and supposedly shoot them,and so again, great stakes,
right, like oh, these people arecrazy and they're willing to
kill.
Somehow.

(39:58):
This bodyguard shows up later.
Apparently he just grazed hishead the bullet.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
As bullets do.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
As bullets do, bullets do, I guess again feels
like a rewrite moment wherethey're like, oh, we need to
bring this character back forsome reason to save the day, I
guess.
Um, but yeah, ray nicholson isin moments he channels his, his
father, um, but also like kindof feels forced to be this crazy

(40:34):
person because his dad is JackNicholson.
Um, there are moments, though,where he looks exactly like Jack
Nicholson and like that it's.
It works to a certain degree.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Well, that that's what we got to see out of Ray
and smile too, even though hedidn't really have anything to
do other than one flashbackscene where he's actually acting
.
Other than that, he is thishallucination of one of the
smile demons that is doingnothing, but basically the
shining Jack Torrance.
Overlook Hotel.

(41:07):
You know know, like down thebarrel of the camera, we're
arching our eyebrows, we'resmiling, yeah and he does that.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
They have him do that quite a bit in this film and
again some of it works, some ofit's like okay, we get it, he is
.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
He looks like Jack Nicholson something else that I
would say about this filmBorderline is that I'm not sure
if this concerns me or validatesopinions that I already had on
Samara Weaving as notnecessarily like a scream queen,
because I do think that she isnot necessarily playing a final

(41:46):
girl.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
She's not.
She's a victim.

Speaker 2 (41:47):
She's a victim, right's a victim, right?
Not that final girls aren't allvictims.
In some manner.
However, I think that there issome sort of hope that she could
be a A-list leading actor inHollywood, and because this
movie gets dumped in March,because it has a day and day

(42:09):
release for theaters and vod, itmakes me it, I think it, it
validates this thought that I'vehad post, ready or not, where
ready or not, had and hascontinued to have a moment and
become sort of this like cultclassic of a film.
I view it it as a your nextcopycat and we were both on

(42:30):
record of saying that, whichwhich lessens my opinion of that
film and makes me think it'sless successful than a lot of
other folks.
That's neither here nor there.
She's great in it and got hugenotoriety for her role in that
film.
The way that she was used assort of the Drew Barrymore
character in the scream remakes,um is, is also indicative of of

(42:51):
where I think a lot of peoplein the industry view her as as
far as being a a-list actor, ascream queen of sorts.
But the fact that this moviedidn't really make any noise
hurts my thoughts and kind ofvalidates the opinions of her as
far as like reaching that levelof celebrity the problem is she

(43:12):
doesn't really she doesn't doanything to fight back in this
film.

Speaker 1 (43:16):
I guess she has one moment where she fights back a
little bit, but honestly, it's alot of her screaming and being
scared.
Um, yeah, so, and, and you know, if you're gonna make a
character, a pop star, which iskind of like a weird, like
really popular thing to do rightnow, I mean, smile too, did it?

(43:38):
Um, I think we've, we've gottentrap trap did it.
We have another, I think, horrormovie coming out this year
about a pop star, or a drama orsomething about pop star let's I
.
You know.
I know it's a trope, but likecan I see her music?

Speaker 2 (43:55):
or like a performance , or have not watched something
on the stage.
Smile too.
No, have not Sky Riley I would.
That'd be front row.

Speaker 1 (44:04):
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (44:05):
Sky Riley concert.
They do a great job of doingthis.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
Yeah, and instead in this film they, just like you
know, they give her a big fancymansion and there's like a
recording room.
They just tell you, they justtell you she's a pop star.

Speaker 2 (44:16):
Yeah, show me.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
Yeah, show me.

Speaker 2 (44:19):
Again.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
Now Jimmy Warden, who knows first time filmmaker,
maybe doesn't have the budget,sure.
However, let's get creative.
There's ways to do it.
There's ways to do it.
And and also like, let's,instead of just like opening
with this ray nicholsoncharacter already obsessed, like
, let show me the moment hebecomes obsessed, why.
What is the moment that hebreaks and like, okay, the
switch is flipped and now he isthis obsessive, cause he's even

(44:49):
like having these hallucinationsagain.
Like we get into some absurdlike comedy towards the end of
this film.

Speaker 2 (44:55):
Could have been played as a straight up thriller
.
It sounds like yeah, is whatI'm hearing you say.
Could have been, could havebeen taken a lot like a single
white female type of like a realstalker movie?
Yeah, and it's.
It's not.
Um, so again.
Check it out though, Cause ithas been.
I've been anticipating it for along time.
Fine movie, Uh, but three starsfor Max Fosberg on letterbox.
Three stars for Max is good.

Speaker 1 (45:17):
Good Listen, I had watched it right after a lecture
state.
So, so take that uh.
How take that uh?

Speaker 2 (45:24):
how you will.

Speaker 1 (45:25):
Um, uh, yeah, the next film, uh, is actually one I
still have yet to watch.
This is one that you havewatched, I think I've mentioned
a couple times, but now we canactually really really dive into
it.
I know the all the thriller,all the or the spoilers for this
film, um, so feel free to speakfreely, but is the gorge,

(45:48):
directed by Scott Derrickson, anaction thriller starring Miles
Teller, anya Taylor-Joy,sigourney Weaver.
The plot centers on two highlytrained operatives who develop a
close bond after a perilousmission.
Take it away.
Perilous mission, take it away.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
So the thing about the gorge, which I gave three
and a half stars, which for meis borderline good.
Yeah, that's a 70%, if I'mbeing super analytical about it.
This movie works in all theways that I didn't think it

(46:29):
would and then come short in allthe ways that I expected it to
produce, that is to say, thegarbage special ops highly
trained sniper duo of MilesTeller and Anya Taylor-Joy,
which I did not expect to feelauthentic at all, actually has

(46:50):
some real heart to it, and Ithink both actors are talented.
Yep, I think they bothunderstand what is needed of
them in these roles.
And so the meet cute thathappens across this gorge from
their two different snipertowers.
The idea is that western forcesand eastern forces have been

(47:10):
allied to protect this unknownblack zone that is not visible
from satellites.
It's, and you can't find it onlike whatever this this movie's
world's equivalent to like aGoogle Earth would be.
Like it is just blacked out.
And so Miles Teller is the onewho we see on like day one of

(47:33):
his job day zero really whenhe's meeting his predecessor,
the person who was on watch theyear prior to him being there,
and he is told you don'tcommunicate with the other side,
you don't do this, you don't dothat.
Miles teller, who we meet inthe beginning of the film, is
someone who can't hold arelationship very regimented
what you would expect from likea combat veteran, someone with

(47:56):
200 confirmed kills, whateverkind of personalists.
And so he and anya taylor joy.
Anya taylor joy, who is muchmore kind of like the wild child
Like she, he.
We get a kind of a interestingintroduction to her character
via a conversation that she haswith her father.
You can tell she also is verydisciplined, but also willing to

(48:21):
kind of have more fun, breakthe rules with this prevent with
this profession, this of beinga, a hired gun.
And so she's the one that sortof initiates the contact.
They had these whiteboards, andso they're looking through each
other's you know sniper scopesat each other as they're writing
these notes.
Miles teller starts off bysaying we can't be in contact on

(48:43):
each other.
Joy is like look at bro, no,she's.
She's like have a little funwith it.
And then he slowly lets hisguard down.
Sure, all of that stuff actuallyworks really well.
So then, when they do findthemselves in peril, you want
them to make sure that eachother are safe and you buy the,
the commitment to theirrelationship that each other

(49:06):
show as far as like, oh yeah,you know what I probably they
probably wouldn't just leavethat person down there to die.
They probably would go back forthat person, they probably
would fight.
And you buy that.
You buy that part, the stuffthat doesn't work, which I hate
to blame scott derrickson,because I think he's a talented
filmmaker who has his flaws.
He's a he's a great elevatorpitch guy.

(49:30):
I I don't think that there'sone scott derrickson movie that
you couldn't sell me on in 15seconds.
You're absolutely right.
This and this is no exceptionlike great premise this is great
, this is really good.
two snipers guarding a, aforbidden gorge with unknown
monsters in it, right.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
Well, and I've also heard that like it's kind of
referred in the beginning of thefilm as like a gateway to hell.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
Like a gateway to hell, allegories for
christianity and sin, and andmen at large, you know the human
race dealing with this, thisburden of existence, of the
thought, of religion, of anafterlife whatever, like we saw
that in the black phone.
You know these kids go to someyou know purgatory, and they
communicate back so that youknow homeboy can get out of

(50:23):
ethan hogg's basement orwhatever, and that movie becomes
so messy.
But scott derrickson has doneso such good.
You know extra sim of emilyrose, obviously huge religious
overtones and that sinister hasit too.
But like again I'm you know I'mnaming good films here like an
accomplished filmmaker.
No doubt this movie falls soflat on the effects and it is so

(50:44):
reliant on visual effects andnot that it shouldn't be,
because it is it becomes.
It's one of these type of likeforbidden, quarantined off,
failed government researchfacilities, where Plant people

(51:19):
when an outbreak has occurred,and there are these plant people
down there that you knowthere's all sorts of reasons
it's almost like you know wehave to of reasons it's almost
like you know we have to containthe thing.
You have to contain this youhave to contain all these
different things because wecould be dealing with like an
apocalypse level event if ifanother, greater outbreak

(51:39):
occurred or if these people gotout of this gorge, and so so
much of the action is justridiculous, cgi, green screen
nonsense which you can stillhave fun with, because the
people dealing with them areAnya Taylor-Joy and Miles Teller
.
And now Miles Teller, who, like,we have probably the most

(52:01):
recent relationship with fromTop Gun Maverick, where you're
like, okay, I love the bravadothat this guy has and so you can
buy him as as this gun.
Anya taylor joy is so funnybecause I made the comment to
you where I'm like anya taylorjoy is probably 115 pounds,
soaking wet and she's supposedto be carrying around like this
tactical vest, a backpack, thissniper that's like five feet

(52:25):
long, all this different stuff,um, but it's just like.
It's really funny, though,because it reminds you of a
movie that, without the visualeffects component, would have
been made in the 80s or the 90s,with like a, a harrison ford
and a meg ryan or something likethat john carpenter movie two
snipers defending the gates ofhell, or like or you know,

(52:50):
preventing the gates of hellfrom opening.
Yeah, it could have been a KurtRussell and a Jamie Lee Curtis
movie.
So I like it has parts of itthat that really work the action
once and it's.
It's bad because once you getused to some things it's almost
like watching subtitles on amovie you start to forget you're
watching them and you're justkind of in in grained with it

(53:12):
all.
And then there'll be somethingwhere it's like now we're
driving a Jeep without the topon it through, you know, all
this fog and and fallen treesand it's and it just looks so
bad so it's like you can fallout of it and start to sort of
like whatever I've alreadyaccepted this that this looks
bad and then something thatlooks worse follows it and so it

(53:35):
just like it really prevents it.
Excuse me from being like a, a,b, a, b minus movie.
Even um stays in that in that Crange for me can recommend it.
I think you can have a goodtime with it.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
Do you think it would have looked better on the big
screen, Cause this is on Appleplus right.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
So it was definitely um only available to watch at
home.
You know, that's a goodquestion.

Speaker 1 (54:03):
Or do you think that's why they didn't put it on
the big screen?

Speaker 2 (54:05):
I'm inclined to think it would have looked worse on
the big screen.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
Yeah, man, that's too bad.
Scott Derrickson yeah, we needa win.
I don't know if it's going tobe black phone too.
I don't think it's going to beblack phone too, Uh the next
film is from another, anothergreat filmmaker who just

(54:28):
continues to do his own thing,the beat of his own drum, and
that, of course, is thelegendary Paul Schrader.
O Canada is a drama starringRichard Gere, Leonard Fife, or
as Leonard Fife, a filmmaker anddraft evader confronting his
past.
You know Schrader has been onthis mission to do these like

(54:56):
deep, deep, lonely men in a roomdramas for the past.
It seems like what since firstperformed was 10 years ago.
I think Um, and this movie mightbe his most autobiographical,

(55:17):
even though it is based on anovel, um, which is called uh,
from the it's adapted screenplayfrom the Russell Banks novel,
uh, foregone, uh.
And this is a very you know,very character driven drama

(55:39):
about Richard gear as afilmmaker being interviewed for
a documentary by former studentstalking about his experiences
of being a draft evader in the60s for the Vietnam War.
It is literally a snapshot ofthis man's story, right Again.

(56:00):
Don't know if the novel is thesame way, but there just feels
like a lot of missing pieces inthis film, uh, or in the story.
But also I think that is someof the point here that leonard
fife is he did evade the draftbut, like, the stories he is
told of how he did that and nowhow he's remembering it, or

(56:23):
maybe how it really happened,are very different and you're
jumping back and forth betweentime.
Jacob Elordi plays the youngerversion of Richard Gere.
It's the best I've seen RichardGere do in years and we haven't
seen a lot of him.
I know he's on that one of yourParamount Plus shows, the
Agency, with Michael Fassbender.

Speaker 2 (56:44):
I have not watched that one, but yes.

Speaker 1 (56:47):
But Gere is really great.
Elordi is fantastic.
Elordi knows ball.
He yeah quite a revelation inthis film and he doesn't even
really like speak that much, heis just such a presence because
he's such a big dude.
But he does an excellent job.

(57:08):
The movie looks beautiful.
All the stuff that's like inthe past is obviously shot on
like either 35 or 16 millimeterfilm, you know.
You can tell that there's realgrain there.
The lighting is beautifulthroughout.
The costumes, the cars,everything in the past is really
great.
The stuff in the present isinteresting because it's very

(57:33):
documentary style, right, andit's a lot of Richard Gere just
looking down the barrel andtalking to you about these
stories, but then also havingthese moments of because he's
very sick, right, he has canceror something, he's about to die,
but he's having like memoriesrush back but he doesn't know
what's real and what's not.
And so it's again very dramaticpiece about the past, about

(58:03):
memories and about your ownmythology and what you have
created, and especially andespecially Leonard Fife as a
filmmaker I feel like Schraderis, who was a draft I believe a
draft of Vader himself back inthe day Speaks that
autobiographical part.
Yeah, it does feel a very, verypersonal film from him, um, but

(58:27):
yeah, looks beautiful, uh,sounds beautiful, um, really
well-written.
I oh Canada, uh, he, heSchrader continues.

Speaker 2 (58:39):
Schrader does continue to deliver.
Now I don't think that he's hadas high of a high as first
reformed since then.
But the card counter, mastergardener, and now this like
quietly three, and you know,based off of your review here of
oh Canada, three solid films inthe 2020s.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Yeah, and you know this one doesn't go into any
sort of like violence, or I meanmore of a morality play yeah
fife is definitely a womanizerand there's a lot of womanizing
throughout the film.
Um and and drinking and whatnot, but like I've got to have a
highball glass of whiskey, yeahalways um, but there is no.
There is no violence.

(59:21):
As you know, first reformed orcard counter.
I still have yet to see masterGardner, but I'm guessing
there's probably some someviolence, just knowing what that
film's about.
But yeah, really interestingfilm and like, listen again,
Paul Schrader, one of these guysworking into his eighties
working into his eighties.

(59:42):
Probably you know in like theWerner Herzog, like realm of,
like, how famous he is as afilmmaker, how much he is
revered as a filmmaker, um, buthe should be up there with the
Spielbergs, the Scorseses, theDe Palmas.
He is one of these guys thatcame up in the seventies that
has been a profound voice allthe way through.

(01:00:04):
And you know, a guy who hasjust lived in independent film,
which is, apart from a couple ofdifferent releases, but just
just a great filmmaker, justreally has something to say
every single time I mentionedMichael Fassbender from the
Agency, just really hassomething to say every single

(01:00:24):
time I mentioned MichaelFassbender from.
The Agency.
He's one of the stars of BlackBag, the second film from Steven
Soderbergh this year.
Another man who just continuesto work.
The amount of work Soderberghjust puts in every single day is
really inspiring.
It's truly prolific.
It's crazy.
This uh caps the trilogy thathe has done now with writer

(01:00:49):
David Koepp uh, starting withKimmy starting with Kimmy
presence, and now black bag.
Black bag is fucking awesome.
Black bag is exactly what wehave asked for on this podcast
for years now.
Original story, adult thriller,spy thriller, movie stars

(01:01:15):
throughout the film well-lit,well-written, great sound.
Soderbergh always showing offhis camera movements just
fucking awesome, great twists Idon't want you to say too much
more about this.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
I really don't.
It's a cat and mouse game.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
There's a mole within the mi5 or mi6 or whatever
agency they're part of and theyhave to find that mole.
That's all you need to know.
And I had a great time Went andsaw this with Kaylee and some
friends.
It inspired us to go out afterthe movie and talk about it.

(01:01:57):
Just, soderbergh, continue todo this, please, and I know you
know.
Unfortunately it didn't makelike any money.
It was released into over 2000theaters.
It grossed an approximate 7.6million during its opening
weekend and totaled out around14.7 million.

(01:02:19):
I believe the budget was around60 million, so not a great
return.
But again, I feel like thismovie should have been middle of
the summer.
I don't know why we're doingthis in March.
We just had another Soderberghcome out film come out in
January or February withPresence.

(01:02:39):
Like this should have been amovie that lived in the theaters
for a while.
I went on the second weekendand the theater was packed, so
word of mouth has been good.
But again, this is going to beon streaming in like probably a
week, four weeks at the most.
Yeah, but man, just a reallygreat.

(01:03:02):
The 40 bajillionth movie fromSoderbergh is still really,
really good Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Last film you can actually.
I don't know what this is,because I know that Voodoo is
owned by Fandango, but Black Bagis available to buy on fandango
at home.
I hate, so you could actuallywatch it already.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
I hate that and you know what this movie is.
As sodeberg does, this movie ismade for big screen and again I
think we talked about this lastweek like the thing I noticed
the most in films now, or islighting what he's doing with
the lighting.
Here and there there is adinner scene where, like it was,

(01:03:49):
it was so beautiful to look at.
It looked like a fuckingpainting.
It was gorgeous.
Um, yeah, please go out and seeblack bag.
It's really good, it's reallygood and it's really what, what
we want in theaters.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
Uh, the last film is another great film, another one
I'm gonna ask you to I will talkabout in a spoiler-free manner,
because this movie has not madeits way to the south sound yet
yes, no, it has.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
I saw it at amc lakewood.
It's at lake At last week.
It was that's where you watchedit.

Speaker 2 (01:04:23):
That's where I went, and saw it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
Oh Yep, I went and saw it at AMC Lakewood, me and
you know two other sickos.
We're in there on a Thursdayafternoon.
This movie is the directorialdebut from Mark Anthony Green.
It is a.
It's like a psychological,almost like folk horror.

(01:04:47):
You know, I think the bestthing I can say about it is that
it's it's got parts of, it'sgot tones of midsommar and get
out smash together.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
You must have seen some premiere really thing?
Yeah, because it's there's noshow times for amc uh town
center.

Speaker 1 (01:05:08):
Well, hopefully hopefully it's going to go wide
here, because this movie iscalled opus and man, I haven't
had this and black bag are arethe most fun I've had in a
theater this year.
Oh I, I thought this movie wasincredibly entertaining.
It moved well.
It's.
It's a great like mystery thatyou are.

(01:05:32):
You are a hundred percent inthe acting is fantastic.
You've got great supportingcharacters like Murray Bartlett
from the first season of whiteLotus.
You've got AOo uh, is it eddebris, edibiri, edibiri,
edibiri from the bear as yourmain protagonist and you've got

(01:05:55):
72 year old john malkovich againdoing a pop star, playing a pop
star it's just a thing rightnow in films, um and doing some
of his best work I I think I'veever seen john malkovich do this
.

Speaker 2 (01:06:14):
This feels to me a little bit like uh, some of
blink twice as well from justreading.

Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
So I never saw blink twice, but yes, I I think it, I
think it's kind of on that level, but I I don't know, and maybe,
maybe I would really reallylove blink twice, because I've
never I still have not seen that, but but I just think some of
the again, I I think it's theway it's shot, the way it's
presented it.

(01:06:40):
It's got get out midsommarvibes where like a lot of
tension, a lot of tension,there's some, there's some gore,
but like not overly cartoonishand just a good kind of folk
cult horror.
Uh, so go see it because Ithink you really love.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
It sounds right up my alley yeah I'm hoping that it
either comes to the grand orback at town center.
If they did do a a premierescreening of it, which I think
is just what you were luckyenough to go see, because I'm on
my amc app right now with noshow times available I hope it
wasn't just there for a week.
But no, I can't imagine that,because it's still listed under

(01:07:24):
their thrills and chills okay,great so they will.
They will hopefully bring itback, yeah yeah, or maybe
fucking snow white.
Push it out, because they haveto have snow white on four
screens christ, I don't thinkwe're gonna see snow, white snow
.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
I will not be covered on.
Excuse the the intermission.

Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
Yeah, goodness gracious, I'm looking at the
snow time.

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
The snow times.

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
The snow times and there's like a screening every
45 minutes of that movie.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
Wow, but yeah, opus Again, favorite movie of the
year, best time I've had in thetheater.
That's awesome.
I cannot wait to see it again.

Speaker 2 (01:08:02):
Something I want to get on Blu-ray go watch it and
Erica, while she's been out oftown, has also been able to see
it.
So something that you and hercan talk about next week, maybe
I will have a shot so I think Itexted both of you as soon as I
got out separately.

Speaker 1 (01:08:16):
I was like you need to go see Opus.
I haven't even seen what sherated it.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
I'll leave that for you to find out.

Speaker 1 (01:08:23):
Yeah I I will say the movie is getting killed.
Like there's a few folks herewho critically yeah do not like,
people do not like this filmwhich I don't get.

Speaker 2 (01:08:33):
I had a great time yeah, I mean shout out to, to
some of our, you know friendsand listeners out there.
Geo really liked it, hayley'skind of lukewarm, or yeah, my
friend hayley has it like Idon't know, not great, but
erica's somewhere in the middlelike I don't know it does seem
to be divisive.
Yeah, we love a device, adivisive movie, absolutely um,

(01:08:55):
those are all the new films Isaw.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
uh, those are all the new films a saw this week, so
any other, any other?

Speaker 2 (01:09:05):
I will just say you want to shout out adolescence
and it's weird how letterboxdoes this.
But adolescence can actually belogged on letterbox as a 228
long minute miniseries.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:09:20):
You know, eventually they're just going to add TV to
letterbox is there not?

Speaker 2 (01:09:27):
it does.
Do they not already have theirown version somewhere out there?

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
I don't know, I I know, I know what you're saying.
Yeah, eventually, once you getthat big once letter, you know
letterbox is gigantic.

Speaker 2 (01:09:40):
I think it is.
I think it now has surpassed asfar as, like red carpet press
coverage goes, a platform forfilmmakers to talk about their
work, to give interviews.
I think that it has surpassed.
It is now this generation'sentertainment tonight, totally
E-news.

(01:10:00):
Whatever comparison you want totry to make, I think Letterboxd
holds the belt right now as faras the press coverage of the
movie industry with the mostnotoriety.
Yeah, which is great to see.
It's awesome.
How long have we been praisingLetterboxd?
Not as long as some other folksthat we know, but for a long

(01:10:21):
time, for a long time.
Yeah, so yeah, that is ourepisode this week Should we
tease Eric's episode a littlebit yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah,
next week we're going to becovering.
Do we even want to say I thinkwe should say, because we still
are giving definition to thisterm in real time Great Then you

(01:10:45):
do the tease and take us out.
So this is funny, Cause I had abuilding leadership team meeting
tonight and I'm like doingnotes in our live Google doc and
there's some things where I'mlike I don't want to type that
Cause I don't want someone to gointo the version history and be
like, well, Alex was the onethat said this event needs to
last until 7 pm at night I waslike someone else can say that I

(01:11:07):
don't necessarily want to bethe one, that if erica's
listening is like you were notsupposed to say anything, I'll
do it whatever.
Uh, the episode that erica hashas chosen is a top five list
ranking of our favorite guiltypleasure films.
Yeah, so I and we can talk waymore about this next week.

(01:11:29):
Obviously it's funny becauseyou've got four on display right
there, I sure do right next tome is ridley scott's robin hood
starring russell crowe, house ofwax, the jean-maje clet sarah
house of wax into the blue,which is going to be so hard for
me not to bring up again, thejohn stockwell film.
And then what is that at thebottom?
The original michael baytransformers.

(01:11:50):
So that should paint a prettygood picture as to what we're
talking about.
Yeah, however, I'm curious doyou have any knee-jerk reactions
to what a guilty pleasure movielooks like to max bosberg?

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
so I was thinking of, like what is something that I
just I turn on at any time andit puts me in a good mood?
Yeah, and like the first thingthat came into mind because I
just recently did this, uh, wasbest in show.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
Now, best in show is probably too good to be a guilty
pleasure, and I think that'swhere we have to discern yeah,
so it needs to be a lesser moviebecause to me, like a comfort
film is different from a guiltypleasure film if I came on here
and talked about my top fivecomfort films, yeah, you would

(01:12:41):
try to administer me to one ofyour loony bins Cause I would be
like yeah.
I fall asleep every nightwatching Midsommar.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
They're called medical institutions.

Speaker 2 (01:12:50):
Yes, Mental wellness centers.
Yes, and, and.
So I do think that a guiltypleasure film has to be a little
, a little bit of lesser qualitythat maybe also you feel like
you need to be a closeted fan of, because the public perception

(01:13:12):
is that like that movie is notgood, like I think of shows that
would fit into this really good, where, like I could say like
oh yeah, like a guilty pleasureshow for me is like I will throw
on, you know, you could saylike I would throw on love is
blind or I would throw on thevampire diaries or I would throw
on pretty little liars, youknow like kind of these, just

(01:13:33):
like brain rot, mindless.
Uh, young adult targeted cwdramas or whatever.
Netflix original reality showskind of stuff.
Laguna beach is a guiltypleasure, right, yeah.
So what does that look likecinematically?
It'll be fun to see it's gonnabe.

Speaker 1 (01:13:54):
It's gonna be a really hard list to build, I
think it will be it'll it'll be,you don't have to be honest
with yourself.

Speaker 2 (01:14:00):
You do have to be, and it'll be interesting to see
if Erica takes the same stanceon quality as I think you and I
are sort of mutually agreeing todo right now, because, like a
film that is a quote unquoteguilty pleasure to me, one that
I could watch all the time, thatI almost feel like I would need
to be a closeted fan of, butthen when I think about it, I'm
like no, I've talked about thismovie all the time very openly

(01:14:20):
on the podcast and think that itis a legitimate five-star film.
It's something like Mean Girls.
There's no reason why MeanGirls needs to be a guilty
pleasure movie for anybody.

Speaker 1 (01:14:31):
Mean Girls, retroactively, I think, has
become a cult classic rightAgain.
I think the level of.

Speaker 2 (01:14:40):
I think it's like an overall classic, yeah.
Yeah, like the quality of thatfilm is higher than I think
again what we're talking about,if you were going to say, like
from the same era, the HilaryDuff joint Cinderella story,
there you go there you go yeah.
Now we're cooking.

(01:15:00):
Okay, I've just I've opened my,my horizons wide open.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
Now I'm thinking about this.
This is going to be.
This will be fun to make Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:15:10):
So yeah, that'll be next week.
We'll welcome Erica back.
That'll be triumphant, that'llbe awesome.
We'll catch up on her travels,things she's done, movies that
she has also seen in comparison.
In the meantime, follow thethree of us on Letterboxd to
track what we are watchingbetween shows, and we'll talk to
you next time on Excuse theIntermission, where movies still
matter.