March 19, 2025 • 21 mins
Episode 133 - Hard Faith: Embracing Real Life in Storytelling
In this episode of the Faith and Family Filmmakers podcast, Jaclyn interviews Spencer Folmar, filmmaker and founder of Hard Faith Films. Spencer shares his inspiring journey from a film enthusiast growing up in rural Pennsylvania to a transformational conversion in New Zealand. He discusses the creation and mission of Hard Faith Films, which focuses on telling raw and authentic faith-based stories that tackle challenging and often R-rated adult themes. He also talks about the Hard Faith Film Festival, emphasizing its role in celebrating and encouraging filmmakers with similar visions. The conversation dives into the complexities of faith and the necessity of addressing real-world struggles in cinema.
Highlights Include:
- Welcome and Introduction
- First Encounter at Content Film Festival
- Early Life and Film Passion
- Journey to Faith
- The Birth of Hard Faith
- Challenges and Realities of Hard Faith
- The Importance of Realistic Faith-Based Films
- Personal Testimonies and Redemption
- R Rated Bible Stories
- Hard Faith Film Festival
Bio:
Spencer T. Folmar is an accomplished filmmaker, producer, and founder of Hard Faith Films, a production company dedicated to telling raw, authentic stories that inspire transformation and faith. Known for his bold storytelling, Spencer has directed and produced several films, including Generational Sins and Saint Nick of Bethlehem, earning recognition for tackling challenging topics with honesty and hope. He is the driving force behind the Hard Faith Film Festival, championing diverse voices in faith-based cinema. With over a decade of experience, Spencer’s passion lies in creating stories that liberate audiences, blending his deep faith with a dynamic cinematic vision.
Spencer’s Links:
https://www.spencerfolmar.com/
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2875023/
Edited by Michael Roth
FAFF Association Online Meetups: https://faffassociation.com/#faff-meetings
Screenwriters Retreat - Mexico: https://www.faffassociation.com/writers-retreat
Jaclyn's Book - In the Beginning, Middle and End: A Screenwriter’s Observations of LIfe, Character, and God: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0D9R7XS9V
The Faith & Family Filmmakers podcast helps filmmakers who share a Christian worldview stay in touch, informed, and inspired. Releasing new episodes every week, we interview experts from varying fields of filmmaking; from screenwriters, actors, directors, and producers, to film scorers, talent agents, and distributors.
It is produced and hosted by Geoffrey Whitt and Jaclyn Whitt , and is brought to you by the Faith & Family Filmmakers Association
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jaclyn (00:00):
Hello, you're listening to the Faith and Family Filmmakers podcast.
My name is Jaclyn, and I haveSpencer Folmar with me today.
Spencer Folmar is an accomplishedfilmmaker, producer and founder of Hard Faith Films, a production company dedicated to telling raw, authentic stories that inspire transformation and faith.
Known for his bold storytelling.
(00:21):
Spencer has directed and producedseveral films including Generational Sins and Saint Nick of Bethlehem, earning recognition for tackling challenging topics with honesty and hope.
He is the driving force behind thehard faith film Festival championing diverse voices in faith-based cinema with over a decade of experience.
(00:41):
Spencer's passion lies in creating storiesthat liberate audiences blending his.
Deep faith with adynamic cinematic vision.
Welcome to the podcast.
Spencer (00:51):
Thank you, Jaclyn.
What a lovely introduction.
Thank you so much.
So glad to be on the podcast.
Jaclyn (00:57):
same.
I'm so glad to be able to,to have your full attention.
We kind of met briefly at,um, at Content Film Festival.
Yeah, yeah.
But you know, there was a lot of peopleand so now I get to have you to myself for a little bit, so this is fantastic.
Spencer (01:11):
I appreciate it.
Content.
It was my first time attending thefestival in person, and I got in at like 3:00 AM and left that night at 12:00 AM so it was a real whirlwind, but I'm glad we got to meet briefly in person.
Jaclyn (01:24):
Yeah.
Yeah, no, it, and it kind of feels likethat at festivals a lot of the time.
Also, you know, you get thereand like everything's happening.
It's a whirlwind.
You meet a bunch of people and then you gohome and you're like, what did I just do?
Spencer (01:38):
Yep.
Jaclyn (01:39):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, and you did a presentation, soI'm definitely, I'm excited to be able to get into, um, more of the things that you do with hard faith films and the, the festival that you run.
But I kind of wanna back upand understand your journey.
Where did you get started?
Uh, both in faith and with films.
Spencer (01:58):
Um, so my film journey started before my faith journey, which I think really, um, spoken to the types of faith films I wanna make.
I grew up, um.
Outside the church.
You know, I didn't attend church.
I, I didn't recognizemyself as a Christian.
I didn't, profess faith,but I always loved films.
I grew up in the sticks of Pennsylvania.
(02:20):
Um, very rural.
Not a whole lot to do here.
Small town, 50 people.
And.
Film was always a exciting escape for me,whether it was going to the local drive-in or to our single screen historic theater.
I just fell in love with moviesand I knew from a very young age that I wanna be a filmmaker and I wanna be a film director and writer.
And so my whole life I have orchestratedaround trying to become a better filmmaker, a better storyteller, seeing the world in a cinematic way, and, and studying films, you know, the great films of a hundred years of cinema.
(02:53):
And, and trying to figureout how to tell a new story.
Um, you know, with thatclassic cinematic feeling.
Um.
Then it was when I was, afterI graduated from college, I was planning on moving to Los Angeles, moving to Hollywood where I've lived the last 15 years predominantly.
and my sisters had both started totake their faith very seriously.
(03:15):
They had been going to church.
My sister had just read to theBible for the first time, and they encouraged me to study my faith before I moved to Los Angeles, before I moved to Hollywood, where I knew no one, um, very far away from home.
And I. I was searchingat that time in my life.
I think God was calling me, wooing me.
Um, I had read other religious books.
I'd read the Book of Mormon.
(03:36):
I read the Quran and I read some, youknow, other books trying to seek truth because I, I think I was searching for truth at that age right after college.
Um, but I had, I had writtenoff Christianity for whatever reason, just because I had.
Known so much about it for just frompopular Western culture, but I never ever read the Bible and so I was going to go to like a European cafe and just read the Bible from the front to the back and then decide once and for all if it was true as I'd done with other religious books.
(04:05):
My sisters and friends encouraged meand some classmates from college that it might be better to read the book along, uh, with other people kind of searching for God as well as under tutelage.
And so I went to an informal bibleschool overseas in New Zealand and then in England, and it was over in the New Zealand bush that I actually converted to Christianity.
(04:26):
Um, and it wasn't, it wasn't automatic.
It took about six weeks and I. Everysingle day I was at that Bible school, I thought, you know, this is dumb.
I, I should be in Los Angeles.
I should be pursuing my passions.
Um, I was very ambitious.
I graduated college earlyand I just wanted to work.
I didn't even wanna go to college.
But, um, it was just after six weeksof I. Starting to read the Bible for the first time and just realizing how much I need a savior, how selfish I was, how prideful I was.
(04:57):
And somewhere in the bush ofNew Zealand, my heart of stone turned to a heart of flesh.
And I realized that the entire point ofmy life and existence wasn't to glorify myself, but it was to glorify God.
And so I still had this passionfor making films and always still just love films more than anything.
And I. But I realized that,you know, this passion could be a toll, uh, for God's glory.
(05:21):
And so I'm try, I was trying to figureout that age 21, 22, um, how I now use these skills that I've been developing my whole life and wanted to continue to develop, but to glorify God and tell his stories and speak about him accurately.
And so that, is where I think thebeginnings of hard faith began.
Jaclyn (05:38):
okay.
I just wanna say.
I do find that it's amazing that eventhough you, you didn't believe and you weren't even interested for the first while you kept reading because you were seeking truth and you wanted to be able to know one way or the other.
That is such an amazing perspective andheart and I can't even imagine what the world will be like if more people were that desperate for truth, that they would even sit through studies to be like, well, you know, okay, I'm giving it a shot and, and I'm gonna give it the whole shot, but I'm not enjoying it yet.
(06:16):
You know, I'm not getting it yet.
You know, and so that,that's really amazing.
And so I can see how that would alsospeak to your hard faith journey because.
It didn't come easy,
Spencer (06:28):
No,
Jaclyn (06:29):
you know?
And it seems like even with whatyou're developing with the hard faith genre, like that's not something that comes easy either.
Spencer (06:37):
no, it isn't.
Jaclyn (06:38):
So, okay.
Carry on with your journey.
Spencer (06:41):
it's an interesting calling and it's one that I am questioning and dialoguing with God about because the hard faith journey has been a difficult journey and it reflects my own difficulties with faith.
You know, as we try and describehard faith or I try to do in that workshop, you know, life is hard.
There's a lot of hardships.
Um, I think it's unbearable withoutfaith, but faith can also be difficult.
(07:03):
You know, we have.
A infinite God who is loving evenin a very r rated broken world.
And there's, there feels likeconflicts or contradictions.
I, I, I don't believe there are any,uh, contradictions, but you know, we're just living in a real world where God is loving and perfect, but everything around us isn't.
(07:24):
And so after Bible school.
I actually went to seminary, um, toget my master's of theology because I wasn't familiar at the time when I first converted to Christianity, um, about like the faith-based genre of films.
Like I hadn't seen a lot ofthe, the famous films at that time, and this is 20 years ago.
But, so I started to watch a lot offaith-based films of the time and.
(07:48):
You know, the, the genrewas kind of emerging.
You know, there were some big megahits like, uh, you know, the passion of the Christ, which is extremely well done, but some of the more independent films just starting to emerge and there were some successes and I watched these films and for my life and what I was wrestling with, a lot of them I didn't connect with or relate to.
I have a contemplative and sometimes.
(08:10):
You know, I, I think deeply about thingsas I wanted to do about my faith, but in my own experience, I converted to Christianity because it felt like a need.
Like I needed to understand the purposeof living and my purpose in life.
And I didn't just wanna coast.
And it also came at a crisis,you know, of my own life.
And I find that a lot of people that Iread about in the Bible, and a lot of people that I meet whenever they convert to Christianity, especially later in life, there is a moment in their life that.
(08:37):
Pushes them, you know, to to figureout what they believe or to reach out to a higher power to be saved.
And so a lot of films inthe faith-based genre.
Don't typically get into the PG 13 or Rrated topics of adult Christian living.
They stay more in kindof Sunday school living.
Um, and it's, that wasespecially true 20 years ago.
(08:57):
Thankfully, the genre has maturedand incredible funding and, and, and great storytellers, so.
This isn't as true as it was then.
But I also wanted to go to seminarybecause I just, if I was going to talk about God, I didn't want to do it in a trite way, but I wanted to articulate the God of the universe that I had just met accurately and not lead
people astray.
(09:18):
Um.
I went to seminary, never to be becomea preacher or pastor or anything like that, but just so I could write theologically, sound or least aspire to write theologically sound scripts.
Then I went to film school at NYU, um,for my Master's of Arts and, and then I did a lot of commercial jobs, even working at Microsoft and a whole bunch of other places just to start paying off all this student debt that I had accrued.
Jaclyn (09:43):
Right.
Spencer (09:43):
And then my first hard faith proper film, which had a small theatrical release was generational sins, and that came out in 2017 and established and gave us the vocabulary to talk about hard faith.
That's the first timethat we really used the
Jaclyn (09:56):
Right.
Yeah.
And you know, I think.
It's so important because as you weresaying, like as you're watching these films, like you weren't necessarily relating, and I think that that's because there wasn't necessarily these other situations or, walks of life that you know, typically they're just not represented, uh, in, in faith-based films.
(10:17):
And I think this is where it's expanding.
So I love, like with what you're doingis kind of pushing that to include.
More conversations, themore complex conversations.
Because the thing is that thereare complexities in life and if we don't bring God into the conversation, it's not gonna go well.
(10:37):
You know, I, so we have torepresent different situations and different characters.
Um, can you imagine if there wassomeone in this horrible situation and they're looking for an answer and.
If they see themselves representedin a movie that is pointing them toward hope in Christ, they're going to see themselves there.
(10:59):
They're going to realize,you know, it worked for that person, maybe it'll work for me.
Because that was actually part of whatgot me like in my moment, right before I gave myself wholeheartedly to God, I literally was about to commit suicide.
I thought I had just madesuch a mess of my life that it was irreparable and, and I.
(11:20):
In that moment, God did speak to me.
Um, I, I heard a voice that actuallygave me some wisdom in my moment that, you know, made me realize, like.
I'm the only mother my kids have.
And so I realized like, I needto stick around for them, right?
Uh, but my response to that, 'causeI didn't, it didn't clue in for me that it was God speaking to me.
I just all of a suddenhad this revelation.
(11:42):
But, uh, my immediate next thoughtwas to give my life to God because I remembered hearing testimonies.
That, you know, people at their lowestpoint, they gave their life to God, and then God turned their life around.
I was like, well.
Then maybe there's hope for me.
Right?
And so that was my response becauseI had heard these testimonies, like if God can take this person who was like strung out and just living this lifestyle full of drugs and alcohol and you know, sexual immorality and all of this stuff, and that's where that person was, and God pulled them out and gave them a completely different life.
(12:21):
They're, you know, standing infront of me telling me about it.
'cause I, I saw these kindsof testimonies growing up.
I went to the Salvation Army Churchand a lot of people that are at the Salvation Army Church came out of those kinds of lifestyles.
Um, I. And so I'd seen it so manytimes, so I saw myself represented, well, I wasn't necessarily, you know, into drugs and alcohol, but I had made such a mess of my life that I was able to recognize that that's really what they were saying was they destroyed their own life and then they gave it to God and he was able to repair it.
(12:53):
So we need more stories like that.
Spencer (12:56):
Man, what a powerful testimony and thank you for sharing that and your vulnerability, where you were at, that place you know of, great depression and hopelessness is why we do hard faith.
You know, it's like even for me, youknow, so many times in my life before I found faith and even after faith, just struggles and depression and everything else, hardships of life, and.
(13:18):
I felt like, you know, I, I convertedlater in life in my twenties and I wish I had heard that gospel clear message earlier and I didn't hear it.
Um, and, you know, feltlike I was seeking it.
But, you know, in, in our films, wejust wanted to show that I. There's no one that is beyond redemption.
There's no dark situation.
(13:39):
There's no, you know, r rated situationthat God cannot redeem and bring light to.
And it's not like our films aremissional in that they're not necessarily preaching to the choir or talking to people in church.
Of course, many people can relate,um, because we all have stories and we've all lived lives, but, you know, I'm, we're really trying to find the lost sheep and bring them home.
(14:02):
Um.
We, push the envelope, and it's not to becontroversial, it's not to be glorifying dark things, but we do want our audience members, our lost sheet that we're trying to help, you know, bring home.
We want them to see the real world inwhich they're living in the darkness and they're living in and accurately depicted, you know, with, honoring the difficulty of their experience because we're not making, you know.
(14:29):
We're not glossing over it, uh,we're not glorifying it, but we want to honor the struggle and the real world in which they're living in.
And that's often R-rated or PG 13 because
you know, that's, that's just the worldwe live in and that's our own hearts.
Jaclyn (14:44):
And, that's how the Bible was written.
I mean, when you look at it, it,it's not written to say like, Hey, look how great these people were and how they always got it right.
Or, you know, like, we see someof the really dark details.
I mean, look at King David's life.
Uh,
like things got pretty bad for him.
Spencer (15:02):
So bad.
Jaclyn (15:03):
his own choices and like it.
He, he was not a PG 13 guy.
Like things did, you know,went way beyond that.
But then when he did humble himselfbefore God, then you know, God was able to redeem his life and his lineage and and that's just one example of many.
(15:25):
There's so many examples.
I mean, Sam's, well justread the book of judges like
Spencer (15:28):
Oh man.
It's wild.
It's X rated.
Jaclyn (15:32):
It's, and there's so many crazy things like that.
Like Genesis itself isjust like a soap opera.
Uh, so we can't just pretend likeeverything is gonna be this, you know, PG life when we're living for God.
Like not only are we stillhuman and going to still make.
Massive mistakes on occasion,um, and get our own pride in the way of what God's trying to do.
(15:58):
And then him having to likereorchestrate things once we've finally humbled ourselves to whatever it is he's calling us to.
Uh, you know, it is, we're alsoliving in a fallen world around us.
Like you were saying, like, everythingis broken here and God just in his.
incredible mercy and just his abilityas an artist, as an author, to work with the mess and to, to make it something amazing anyway, um, you know, like that doesn't always happen in, uh, a PG rated storyline.
(16:31):
So, yeah, I love this.
Spencer (16:33):
Yeah, and, and I think it's, important, you know, even for our testimony and for explaining, you know, our savior, because like if we pretend our life, our struggle was pg, you know, the crucifixion really doesn't make sense.
Because things were so bad andbecause I was so bad, that's why this bloody r rated crucifixion happened.
(16:58):
You know?
That's how, that's how horrible oursituation and how desperate we were.
And so, you know, we're not boastingof our sin or the state of the world, but we're boasting about our savior that would go into that mess and that mire to save us.
Jaclyn (17:14):
Amen.
I love that.
All right, so we've gotjust a couple minutes left.
Um, for this portion of the interview, canyou tell people about Hard Faith Festival?
Spencer (17:23):
Yeah.
Um, so we're having our thirdannual Hard Faith film Festival this July 17th through the 19th.
It'll be a three day event, and ittakes place in Hollywood, California, right near Warner Brothers.
Um, this is the third year thatwe've done it, and it's been.
Incredible because we reach,uh, and get to meet so many other hard faith filmmakers.
(17:45):
We coined this term, youknow, about 13 years ago.
Um, but we realized a lot of otherartists, a lot of other people have this same kind of calling in their life.
And so we get to celebrate the art andthe good work that these filmmakers and storytellers are already doing, and have a time of community together where we can encourage one another in person and share our hard faith stories and our hopes for the future.
Jaclyn (18:07):
And how do people.
People find it.
Spencer (18:09):
If you go to hard faith.org, that's so much about hard faith, more than you could ever consume, but also film freeway.com.
Hard faith if you'reinterested in submitting.
I think we still have submissionsopen till the first week of May.
Jaclyn (18:23):
Okay, great.
Well, I'm looking forward to divinginto more about hard faith and even, uh, I wanna see if, maybe you've got some strategies to give some writers on how to approach it.
With that balance of, of being able torepresent the grittiness of life and then also honoring God through the story.
(18:44):
So I'm looking forward tohaving that conversation
Hello, you're listening to the Faith and Family Filmmakers podcast.
My name is Jaclyn, and I haveSpencer Folmar with me today.
Spencer Folmar is an accomplishedfilmmaker, producer and founder of Hard Faith Films, a production company dedicated to telling raw, authentic stories that inspire transformation and faith.
Known for his bold storytelling.
(00:21):
Spencer has directed and producedseveral films including Generational Sins and Saint Nick of Bethlehem, earning recognition for tackling challenging topics with honesty and hope.
He is the driving force behind thehard faith film Festival championing diverse voices in faith-based cinema with over a decade of experience.
(00:41):
Spencer's passion lies in creating storiesthat liberate audiences blending his.
Deep faith with adynamic cinematic vision.
Welcome to the podcast.
Spencer (00:51):
Thank you, Jaclyn.
What a lovely introduction.
Thank you so much.
So glad to be on the podcast.
Jaclyn (00:57):
same.
I'm so glad to be able to,to have your full attention.
We kind of met briefly at,um, at Content Film Festival.
Yeah, yeah.
But you know, there was a lot of peopleand so now I get to have you to myself for a little bit, so this is fantastic.
Spencer (01:11):
I appreciate it.
Content.
It was my first time attending thefestival in person, and I got in at like 3:00 AM and left that night at 12:00 AM so it was a real whirlwind, but I'm glad we got to meet briefly in person.
Jaclyn (01:24):
Yeah.
Yeah, no, it, and it kind of feels likethat at festivals a lot of the time.
Also, you know, you get thereand like everything's happening.
It's a whirlwind.
You meet a bunch of people and then you gohome and you're like, what did I just do?
Spencer (01:38):
Yep.
Jaclyn (01:39):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, and you did a presentation, soI'm definitely, I'm excited to be able to get into, um, more of the things that you do with hard faith films and the, the festival that you run.
But I kind of wanna back upand understand your journey.
Where did you get started?
Uh, both in faith and with films.
Spencer (01:58):
Um, so my film journey started before my faith journey, which I think really, um, spoken to the types of faith films I wanna make.
I grew up, um.
Outside the church.
You know, I didn't attend church.
I, I didn't recognizemyself as a Christian.
I didn't, profess faith,but I always loved films.
I grew up in the sticks of Pennsylvania.
(02:20):
Um, very rural.
Not a whole lot to do here.
Small town, 50 people.
And.
Film was always a exciting escape for me,whether it was going to the local drive-in or to our single screen historic theater.
I just fell in love with moviesand I knew from a very young age that I wanna be a filmmaker and I wanna be a film director and writer.
And so my whole life I have orchestratedaround trying to become a better filmmaker, a better storyteller, seeing the world in a cinematic way, and, and studying films, you know, the great films of a hundred years of cinema.
(02:53):
And, and trying to figureout how to tell a new story.
Um, you know, with thatclassic cinematic feeling.
Um.
Then it was when I was, afterI graduated from college, I was planning on moving to Los Angeles, moving to Hollywood where I've lived the last 15 years predominantly.
and my sisters had both started totake their faith very seriously.
(03:15):
They had been going to church.
My sister had just read to theBible for the first time, and they encouraged me to study my faith before I moved to Los Angeles, before I moved to Hollywood, where I knew no one, um, very far away from home.
And I. I was searchingat that time in my life.
I think God was calling me, wooing me.
Um, I had read other religious books.
I'd read the Book of Mormon.
(03:36):
I read the Quran and I read some, youknow, other books trying to seek truth because I, I think I was searching for truth at that age right after college.
Um, but I had, I had writtenoff Christianity for whatever reason, just because I had.
Known so much about it for just frompopular Western culture, but I never ever read the Bible and so I was going to go to like a European cafe and just read the Bible from the front to the back and then decide once and for all if it was true as I'd done with other religious books.
(04:05):
My sisters and friends encouraged meand some classmates from college that it might be better to read the book along, uh, with other people kind of searching for God as well as under tutelage.
And so I went to an informal bibleschool overseas in New Zealand and then in England, and it was over in the New Zealand bush that I actually converted to Christianity.
(04:26):
Um, and it wasn't, it wasn't automatic.
It took about six weeks and I. Everysingle day I was at that Bible school, I thought, you know, this is dumb.
I, I should be in Los Angeles.
I should be pursuing my passions.
Um, I was very ambitious.
I graduated college earlyand I just wanted to work.
I didn't even wanna go to college.
But, um, it was just after six weeksof I. Starting to read the Bible for the first time and just realizing how much I need a savior, how selfish I was, how prideful I was.
(04:57):
And somewhere in the bush ofNew Zealand, my heart of stone turned to a heart of flesh.
And I realized that the entire point ofmy life and existence wasn't to glorify myself, but it was to glorify God.
And so I still had this passionfor making films and always still just love films more than anything.
And I. But I realized that,you know, this passion could be a toll, uh, for God's glory.
(05:21):
And so I'm try, I was trying to figureout that age 21, 22, um, how I now use these skills that I've been developing my whole life and wanted to continue to develop, but to glorify God and tell his stories and speak about him accurately.
And so that, is where I think thebeginnings of hard faith began.
Jaclyn (05:38):
okay.
I just wanna say.
I do find that it's amazing that eventhough you, you didn't believe and you weren't even interested for the first while you kept reading because you were seeking truth and you wanted to be able to know one way or the other.
That is such an amazing perspective andheart and I can't even imagine what the world will be like if more people were that desperate for truth, that they would even sit through studies to be like, well, you know, okay, I'm giving it a shot and, and I'm gonna give it the whole shot, but I'm not enjoying it yet.
(06:16):
You know, I'm not getting it yet.
You know, and so that,that's really amazing.
And so I can see how that would alsospeak to your hard faith journey because.
It didn't come easy,
Spencer (06:28):
No,
Jaclyn (06:29):
you know?
And it seems like even with whatyou're developing with the hard faith genre, like that's not something that comes easy either.
Spencer (06:37):
no, it isn't.
Jaclyn (06:38):
So, okay.
Carry on with your journey.
Spencer (06:41):
it's an interesting calling and it's one that I am questioning and dialoguing with God about because the hard faith journey has been a difficult journey and it reflects my own difficulties with faith.
You know, as we try and describehard faith or I try to do in that workshop, you know, life is hard.
There's a lot of hardships.
Um, I think it's unbearable withoutfaith, but faith can also be difficult.
(07:03):
You know, we have.
A infinite God who is loving evenin a very r rated broken world.
And there's, there feels likeconflicts or contradictions.
I, I, I don't believe there are any,uh, contradictions, but you know, we're just living in a real world where God is loving and perfect, but everything around us isn't.
(07:24):
And so after Bible school.
I actually went to seminary, um, toget my master's of theology because I wasn't familiar at the time when I first converted to Christianity, um, about like the faith-based genre of films.
Like I hadn't seen a lot ofthe, the famous films at that time, and this is 20 years ago.
But, so I started to watch a lot offaith-based films of the time and.
(07:48):
You know, the, the genrewas kind of emerging.
You know, there were some big megahits like, uh, you know, the passion of the Christ, which is extremely well done, but some of the more independent films just starting to emerge and there were some successes and I watched these films and for my life and what I was wrestling with, a lot of them I didn't connect with or relate to.
I have a contemplative and sometimes.
(08:10):
You know, I, I think deeply about thingsas I wanted to do about my faith, but in my own experience, I converted to Christianity because it felt like a need.
Like I needed to understand the purposeof living and my purpose in life.
And I didn't just wanna coast.
And it also came at a crisis,you know, of my own life.
And I find that a lot of people that Iread about in the Bible, and a lot of people that I meet whenever they convert to Christianity, especially later in life, there is a moment in their life that.
(08:37):
Pushes them, you know, to to figureout what they believe or to reach out to a higher power to be saved.
And so a lot of films inthe faith-based genre.
Don't typically get into the PG 13 or Rrated topics of adult Christian living.
They stay more in kindof Sunday school living.
Um, and it's, that wasespecially true 20 years ago.
(08:57):
Thankfully, the genre has maturedand incredible funding and, and, and great storytellers, so.
This isn't as true as it was then.
But I also wanted to go to seminarybecause I just, if I was going to talk about God, I didn't want to do it in a trite way, but I wanted to articulate the God of the universe that I had just met accurately and not lead
people astray.
(09:18):
Um.
I went to seminary, never to be becomea preacher or pastor or anything like that, but just so I could write theologically, sound or least aspire to write theologically sound scripts.
Then I went to film school at NYU, um,for my Master's of Arts and, and then I did a lot of commercial jobs, even working at Microsoft and a whole bunch of other places just to start paying off all this student debt that I had accrued.
Jaclyn (09:43):
Right.
Spencer (09:43):
And then my first hard faith proper film, which had a small theatrical release was generational sins, and that came out in 2017 and established and gave us the vocabulary to talk about hard faith.
That's the first timethat we really used the
Jaclyn (09:56):
Right.
Yeah.
And you know, I think.
It's so important because as you weresaying, like as you're watching these films, like you weren't necessarily relating, and I think that that's because there wasn't necessarily these other situations or, walks of life that you know, typically they're just not represented, uh, in, in faith-based films.
(10:17):
And I think this is where it's expanding.
So I love, like with what you're doingis kind of pushing that to include.
More conversations, themore complex conversations.
Because the thing is that thereare complexities in life and if we don't bring God into the conversation, it's not gonna go well.
(10:37):
You know, I, so we have torepresent different situations and different characters.
Um, can you imagine if there wassomeone in this horrible situation and they're looking for an answer and.
If they see themselves representedin a movie that is pointing them toward hope in Christ, they're going to see themselves there.
(10:59):
They're going to realize,you know, it worked for that person, maybe it'll work for me.
Because that was actually part of whatgot me like in my moment, right before I gave myself wholeheartedly to God, I literally was about to commit suicide.
I thought I had just madesuch a mess of my life that it was irreparable and, and I.
(11:20):
In that moment, God did speak to me.
Um, I, I heard a voice that actuallygave me some wisdom in my moment that, you know, made me realize, like.
I'm the only mother my kids have.
And so I realized like, I needto stick around for them, right?
Uh, but my response to that, 'causeI didn't, it didn't clue in for me that it was God speaking to me.
I just all of a suddenhad this revelation.
(11:42):
But, uh, my immediate next thoughtwas to give my life to God because I remembered hearing testimonies.
That, you know, people at their lowestpoint, they gave their life to God, and then God turned their life around.
I was like, well.
Then maybe there's hope for me.
Right?
And so that was my response becauseI had heard these testimonies, like if God can take this person who was like strung out and just living this lifestyle full of drugs and alcohol and you know, sexual immorality and all of this stuff, and that's where that person was, and God pulled them out and gave them a completely different life.
(12:21):
They're, you know, standing infront of me telling me about it.
'cause I, I saw these kindsof testimonies growing up.
I went to the Salvation Army Churchand a lot of people that are at the Salvation Army Church came out of those kinds of lifestyles.
Um, I. And so I'd seen it so manytimes, so I saw myself represented, well, I wasn't necessarily, you know, into drugs and alcohol, but I had made such a mess of my life that I was able to recognize that that's really what they were saying was they destroyed their own life and then they gave it to God and he was able to repair it.
(12:53):
So we need more stories like that.
Spencer (12:56):
Man, what a powerful testimony and thank you for sharing that and your vulnerability, where you were at, that place you know of, great depression and hopelessness is why we do hard faith.
You know, it's like even for me, youknow, so many times in my life before I found faith and even after faith, just struggles and depression and everything else, hardships of life, and.
(13:18):
I felt like, you know, I, I convertedlater in life in my twenties and I wish I had heard that gospel clear message earlier and I didn't hear it.
Um, and, you know, feltlike I was seeking it.
But, you know, in, in our films, wejust wanted to show that I. There's no one that is beyond redemption.
There's no dark situation.
(13:39):
There's no, you know, r rated situationthat God cannot redeem and bring light to.
And it's not like our films aremissional in that they're not necessarily preaching to the choir or talking to people in church.
Of course, many people can relate,um, because we all have stories and we've all lived lives, but, you know, I'm, we're really trying to find the lost sheep and bring them home.
(14:02):
Um.
We, push the envelope, and it's not to becontroversial, it's not to be glorifying dark things, but we do want our audience members, our lost sheet that we're trying to help, you know, bring home.
We want them to see the real world inwhich they're living in the darkness and they're living in and accurately depicted, you know, with, honoring the difficulty of their experience because we're not making, you know.
(14:29):
We're not glossing over it, uh,we're not glorifying it, but we want to honor the struggle and the real world in which they're living in.
And that's often R-rated or PG 13 because
you know, that's, that's just the worldwe live in and that's our own hearts.
Jaclyn (14:44):
And, that's how the Bible was written.
I mean, when you look at it, it,it's not written to say like, Hey, look how great these people were and how they always got it right.
Or, you know, like, we see someof the really dark details.
I mean, look at King David's life.
Uh,
like things got pretty bad for him.
Spencer (15:02):
So bad.
Jaclyn (15:03):
his own choices and like it.
He, he was not a PG 13 guy.
Like things did, you know,went way beyond that.
But then when he did humble himselfbefore God, then you know, God was able to redeem his life and his lineage and and that's just one example of many.
(15:25):
There's so many examples.
I mean, Sam's, well justread the book of judges like
Spencer (15:28):
Oh man.
It's wild.
It's X rated.
Jaclyn (15:32):
It's, and there's so many crazy things like that.
Like Genesis itself isjust like a soap opera.
Uh, so we can't just pretend likeeverything is gonna be this, you know, PG life when we're living for God.
Like not only are we stillhuman and going to still make.
Massive mistakes on occasion,um, and get our own pride in the way of what God's trying to do.
(15:58):
And then him having to likereorchestrate things once we've finally humbled ourselves to whatever it is he's calling us to.
Uh, you know, it is, we're alsoliving in a fallen world around us.
Like you were saying, like, everythingis broken here and God just in his.
incredible mercy and just his abilityas an artist, as an author, to work with the mess and to, to make it something amazing anyway, um, you know, like that doesn't always happen in, uh, a PG rated storyline.
(16:31):
So, yeah, I love this.
Spencer (16:33):
Yeah, and, and I think it's, important, you know, even for our testimony and for explaining, you know, our savior, because like if we pretend our life, our struggle was pg, you know, the crucifixion really doesn't make sense.
Because things were so bad andbecause I was so bad, that's why this bloody r rated crucifixion happened.
(16:58):
You know?
That's how, that's how horrible oursituation and how desperate we were.
And so, you know, we're not boastingof our sin or the state of the world, but we're boasting about our savior that would go into that mess and that mire to save us.
Jaclyn (17:14):
Amen.
I love that.
All right, so we've gotjust a couple minutes left.
Um, for this portion of the interview, canyou tell people about Hard Faith Festival?
Spencer (17:23):
Yeah.
Um, so we're having our thirdannual Hard Faith film Festival this July 17th through the 19th.
It'll be a three day event, and ittakes place in Hollywood, California, right near Warner Brothers.
Um, this is the third year thatwe've done it, and it's been.
Incredible because we reach,uh, and get to meet so many other hard faith filmmakers.
(17:45):
We coined this term, youknow, about 13 years ago.
Um, but we realized a lot of otherartists, a lot of other people have this same kind of calling in their life.
And so we get to celebrate the art andthe good work that these filmmakers and storytellers are already doing, and have a time of community together where we can encourage one another in person and share our hard faith stories and our hopes for the future.
Jaclyn (18:07):
And how do people.
People find it.
Spencer (18:09):
If you go to hard faith.org, that's so much about hard faith, more than you could ever consume, but also film freeway.com.
Hard faith if you'reinterested in submitting.
I think we still have submissionsopen till the first week of May.
Jaclyn (18:23):
Okay, great.
Well, I'm looking forward to divinginto more about hard faith and even, uh, I wanna see if, maybe you've got some strategies to give some writers on how to approach it.
With that balance of, of being able torepresent the grittiness of life and then also honoring God through the story.
(18:44):
So I'm looking forward tohaving that conversation
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