November 18, 2025 • 20 mins
What happens when you discover a whole set of siblings who grew up in the donor’s home, but you are not sure they even know you exist
In part one, a simple birthday DNA kit rewrote everything Nick thought he knew about his identity. He learned he was donor conceived at thirty-six, discovered fourteen half siblings, and realized his parents had carried the truth for decades.
But nothing prepared him for what came next.
In this episode, Nick talks about the two siblings who were raised by the donor, and the complicated question that hangs over many donor conceived adults:
Do they know about us
And if they do not, should someone tell them
Part Two explores the unsettling space between biological connection and total silence, and what it means to live with questions you cannot safely or ethically answer.
Nick also shares how he transformed his experience into a book and a podcast, giving other donor conceived people a place to speak honestly, without shame or editing. His story is both deeply personal and universally familiar to anyone navigating DNA surprises.
What We Talk About
• What it feels like to discover donor raised siblings who may be unaware of you
• The ethics of reaching out when the consequences are unknown
• How donor conceived adults become detectives whether they want to or not
• The ongoing challenges of incomplete medical histories
• Writing as a way to process identity shifts
• Why Nick created a podcast for donor conceived voices
• How openness can protect mental and emotional health
• The growing need for reform and transparency in the fertility industry
• How music helped Nick work through identity questions
Takeaways
• Donor conceived people often live with unanswered questions that affect identity, medical decisions, and relationships
• The donor’s raised children may be unaware of their genetic siblings, creating an emotional and ethical dilemma
• Stories and conversation help break isolation and build community
• The fertility industry still offers little guidance to the adults created through these methods
• Honesty and visibility remain the strongest tools for change
Reflection Questions for Listeners
• How would you feel if you learned you had siblings who did not know you existed
• What responsibility, if any, do donor conceived people have toward the donor’s raised children
• What part of your story have you been afraid to speak out loud
• How might telling your truth change your relationships or your sense of self
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Hey there, it's Corey.
(00:01):
Welcome back to Family Twist.
If you missed part one of Nick'sstory, go treat yourself to that
first because, wow.
And you really won't know what'sgoing on in this episode if you
don't listen to that one first.
Today you're gonna hear aboutNick's book and podcast and
stepping right into the role ofgentle truth teller for donor
conceived folks everywhere.
We talk about the mysterysiblings raised by the donor,
(00:22):
the detective work all of us endup doing whether we want to or
not, and why telling the truthout loud is sometimes the only
way to survive it.
Let's get back into it withNick.
SPEAKER_00 (00:38):
I've thought about all the ins and outs of all of
this, and I forget if Imentioned, I actually I ended up
writing a book about my story,and part of what I speculate on
is like if I'm one of those twokids that the donor raised
himself, and I knew that I hadother half siblings out there,
(00:58):
wouldn't I want to have directaccess to that information
myself via a DNA test ratherthan having to rely on, in my
donor's case, an extended familymember who is the one that
happens to be connected to us on23andMe?
To me, like if I were in theirshoes, the donor's children's
(01:22):
shoes, I would want to take atest.
So, like, I'm not relying onanyone else for this info.
And to date, we're not connectedto any of them.
SPEAKER_01 (01:32):
How did they discover that you do have you
know two half siblings that wereraised by the donor?
SPEAKER_00 (01:38):
Well, once we discovered who the donor was, we
were able to access his Facebookprofile.
At the time, there wereInstagram pages that were
available, and we just, youknow, all DCPs become detectives
once they figure out this partof them themselves.
And in our case, we were justable to do some sleuthing and
kind of put the pieces together.
SPEAKER_01 (02:00):
Has anyone in your sibling group wanted to reach
out to those half siblings justto, you know, just drop the
bomb?
SPEAKER_00 (02:09):
I think all of us probably want to, but because
we're unsure of their situation,we want to be respectful of
their privacy and to not dropthe bomb on them.
It doesn't feel like it's ourplace to do so.
That kind of feels like thedonor and his wife's job.
(02:30):
So yeah, with respect to to thechildren he raised, I don't
think there's any real interestin doing that.
That said, because I wrote abook and because there are
writers in the donor's family, Ihave toyed with the idea of
(02:50):
reaching out to the donor andsaying, hey, like there's a book
about what my experience was andwhat you helped to create.
And yeah, I still haven'tmustered up the courage to to
reach out and share that withhim.
I have never had any directcorrespondence with him.
(03:11):
But part of me wants to let himknow and give him the option.
Like, I'm not gonna just mailhim a copy of the book and have
it on his, you know, show up onhis doorstep.
But I think I would like to atleast tell him, like, hey, if if
you are interested, and I don'tneed a response either, but if
you are interested, this exists.
Someone that you're biologicallyconnected to, and maybe you want
(03:32):
to read about what I wentthrough in this process.
His parents and grandparents, weare aware of the major health
concerns that that we shouldhave noted.
But you're right, like in in thecase of the donor's children, we
don't know.
And I guess at this point, theassumption, and I don't know if
(03:55):
it's a safe one, but theassumption would be that because
we are aware of who the donor isand he is aware of us, that if
there was anything serious thatwe needed to be mindful of, that
he would let us know.
That's I think putting a lot oftrust into someone that
ultimately we don't know.
You know, if there wasinformation about a medical
(04:17):
issue that we needed to knowabout, a trust that he would
fill us in on that, just giventhe fact that we know who he is
and he knows that.
You know, I think I'm putting alittle bit of faith into how I
would expect the donor to to,you know, react and respond if
this were the case.
(04:37):
I think part of it also is likeof the 14, there's 12 of us who
were not raised by the donor.
And we are all aware of eachother as well.
So if anyone has a medical issuethat comes up, you know, there's
there's open lines ofcommunication there too, which
if God forbid something were tohappen and maybe it's unclear
(05:01):
like what exactly the problem isor where it's coming from, I
think that would kind of triggera response and you know, reach
out to the donor and say, hey,like we need you to shed some
light on this.
But knock on wood to date,nothing like that has happened,
thankfully.
SPEAKER_01 (05:19):
Nick, can you talk a little bit about why you decided
to start a podcast and what theformat is like?
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Sure.
You know what?
If you don't mind, I'll startwith the book that I wrote.
Okay.
Because that's first, and thenI'll shift quickly into the
podcast.
But the reason the book came tobe was because of this whole
idea that I've touched on.
Like being open about what I wasgoing through, not just me, but
my family as well, that feltlike it was the most healing
(05:50):
approach to take.
Was there might be pain alongthe way and there might be
difficulty, but getting this allcleared out is what's ultimately
gonna put us in the bestposition to go forward.
So with that in mind, beyondjust the conversations I was
having with my family, I knewfor myself, part of the healing
process was to just write all ofwhat I was feeling, you know,
(06:13):
emotions and thoughts and all ofthat, write it down, just in
like a journal form.
It wasn't anything where Ithought, oh, I'm gonna write a
book right off the bat.
I was just trying to use this asa therapeutic tool for what I
was going through.
And eventually I got to a pointin my writing where I was like,
wait a minute, I've got like30,000 words here.
(06:34):
Maybe I can flesh this out intosomething a little bit bigger.
So that's ultimately what I did.
And it turned into afull-fledged book, which I then
put out earlier this year.
Knowing how healing it was forme to express all of this in the
most open and public of ways, Ithought, how can I offer a path
(06:56):
towards that same feeling ofhealing and therapy to other
people?
And that's where the podcastformed was if I could give
people a platform to talk openlyand in an unfiltered way about
what they went through, I thinkthat could not only provide
(07:18):
healing for the individualthemselves, but for the those
who listen as well, to be ableto relate and you know, almost
find a support group andcommunity through hearing these
other stories.
So I knew pretty early on thatwith the podcast, I always tell
(07:39):
the guests this I'm like, theless I speak, the better.
Because I want them to reallytap into the deepest emotions
that they felt and really justvent it all out in a raw and
honest way.
And, you know, I don't really dotoo much editing after the
(07:59):
recording is done.
I try my best to keep it asclose to what the conversation
actually was like as I can.
Obviously, there are pointswhere, if I'm saying little
things that need to be cleanedup, I take that out.
But ultimately, I just want togive space for people to talk
about the things that a lot ofthe times they can't really talk
about in their daily lives.
(08:20):
There's a lot of obstacles forsome people to get past that
keep them from putting thisstuff out openly.
And I think if you're not doingthat, it means you're pushing it
down and suppressing it.
To me, that has an energeticeffect.
I think it can affect yourhealth.
(08:41):
I think if you're not lettingthese things out in an
appropriate way, then there canbe negative consequences to
that.
So knowing how much stigma thereis around donor conception and
that it's not an easy thing forpeople to talk about, I wanted
to be as gentle and as caringand empathetic towards the
(09:07):
experiences of other peoplegoing through the same thing
that I went through as I couldbe.
And yeah, that's that's sort ofthe thinking behind the podcast.
I think we're like 25 or 26episodes into it at this point.
And yeah, most of it is withdonor-conceived people.
Those are the episodes thateveryone has access to.
(09:28):
About a month or two ago, Ibegan a subscribers episode
where people can opt in to hearstories from donors, from
myself.
In the future, I want to speakwith recipient parents and other
therapists that have a focus ondonor-conceived people.
Really just trying to amplifythe voices of people who are
(09:52):
going through a process that weall know needs a lot of change,
still, somehow today.
So that's kind of the thinkingbehind it all.
SPEAKER_01 (10:02):
Well, I think that's fantastic.
I mean, we never feel like we'vegot rival podcasts out there.
The community is getting biggerall the time, and there's room
for all of us in the pool.
Kudos to you for doing thatbecause getting these voices out
there is important.
And podcasts like yours mightactually help with legislation
as well.
Once the right people hear itand get it, changes need to be
made.
SPEAKER_00 (10:21):
Yeah, yeah.
And, you know, that's it's notnecessarily the goal.
It would be amazing to havelegislative change come from
something that, you know, thisis just a project that for now
I'm focusing on a little bitmore.
This was something I was doingin my spare time, beyond my
full-time job.
And you're right, like there'sno such thing as a competitor
(10:42):
podcast in this space because Ithink we all know what's needed
most is louder voices and peoplewho are speaking up on behalf of
a group that doesn't have all ofthe rights that they deserve.
Yeah, like the more the merrierhere.
I would love it if there werehundreds of podcasts around this
(11:05):
stuff, because it just means themessage is getting out there
more and more.
And also saving people from thestruggles that many of us have
dealt with.
It's all about creating abrighter future for the people
who are donor-conceived, becauseI don't think donor conception
is going anywhere, but the waywe go about it, especially on
(11:25):
the anonymity side of things,like that can be changed and
that can make it an easier pathforward for people that are
brought into the world this way.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Yeah, we, you know, when we started this podcast,
you know, three and a half yearsago, it was initially just a
tell Kendall story.
Like we wanted to get CNO, beable to get that out there.
And then once we start havingguests on, we were educated
really quickly, you know, aboutthings that are happening in the
worlds of adoption and donorconception, etc.
And, you know, I didn't knowmuch at all about the fertility
(11:57):
industry and like what we foundout is horrifying.
But again, yeah, it's being ableto share these voices and share
people's stories, and that's whywe welcome donors, we welcome
donor-conceived people,recipients, all of it.
SPEAKER_00 (12:14):
There's a lot of different ways that you can look
at the way that this processplays out.
I think the donor-conceivedperson is the prioritized view
because we are the affectedpeople.
Yes.
But I think it's also importantto hear from all those other
people that are part of thejourney.
And that typically means donorsand recipient parents and really
(12:36):
anyone that's connected to this.
We really don't know how big thecommunities are, and I'm sure
they're bigger than we think.
Totally.
And it's international too.
Like this is a worldwidephenomenon.
So yeah, I think we're stillmaybe in the awareness stage and
trying to explain to people likewhat donor conception actually
(12:57):
is.
But I think we're approaching apoint where this is almost it
might not be common knowledge,but like everyone is gonna be
connected to somebody that'sgone through this friend, a
family member, or a friend of afriend.
Um, they just don't know it yet.
And I think any parent that'sgone through this and hasn't
(13:19):
shared the truth, they gottamuster up the courage and
address the truth.
You know, I think it'sunderstandable why they may have
taken the path of not sharingthis, especially when you're
decades into keeping thissuppressed, but there's no
looking away from it anymore.
(13:40):
And yeah, that's something thatI think a lot of us in the DCP
community are thankful to theDNA companies for exposing.
Because without them, I probablystill wouldn't know the truth.
Many of us wouldn't know thetruth.
So to me, that should have beenthe tipping point for a lot of
parents who once you realizethat the answers are available,
(14:04):
it's better that they come fromyou rather than, you know, a
corporation.
SPEAKER_01 (14:11):
So, Nick, what we've been doing recently for our
final question of the episode isasking about it, and
specifically, I think, for you,like, was there a musical artist
or a song that you leaned onwhile you were writing the book
that kind of helps you throughthe challenging times?
SPEAKER_00 (14:27):
That's a really good question.
I'm glad you asked that becausethe book chapters, the titles of
the chapters in part one are allsong titles of songs that come
from artists that have had aspecial place in my heart for my
entire life.
(14:48):
So I guess to identify a few ofthem, David Bowie has always
been a very present artist in mylife.
I find I can't really go toolong without putting his music
on.
And I think when it comes tobeing donor-conceived, it's
maybe not so surprising thathe's one of the artists that
(15:10):
first come to mind because overthe course of his career, he
changed his identity in so manydifferent ways.
And I think DCPs can probablyrelate to that in having to kind
of reintroduce themselves andyou know kind of let people know
that part of their identityisn't exactly what they thought
(15:31):
it was.
Tom Petty was also a pretty biginfluential artist growing up
for me.
I think his songs are prettytimeless.
And then of the more modernacts, I really, really love the
band Spoon.
They're kind of like an indierock band that's been around
since the late 90s, and for somereason, their songs have always
(15:54):
stuck with me.
The one that I reference in thebook is called The Ghost of You
Lingers, which is tied to thechapter that's related to the
donor.
And I just kind of found that tobe an appropriate title because,
you know, there's this elementof me that is unknown and it's
always around, and I can't seeit, but it's there and it's a
(16:19):
part of who I am, and trying tounderstand what those things are
is really what a big part of mylife is now.
But I love that you asked thatbecause music is such a it's a
tool for healing for me.
I mean, I've been to I can'teven count how many concerts
I've been to over the course ofmy life.
(16:40):
It's in the four or fivehundreds.
Part of what I find so healingmyself is like going out
dancing.
So music is always present in mylife.
And I think that's that is amedicine for many of us as we
try to process these difficultemotions.
Music can really be helpful withthat.
(17:02):
So thank you for asking thatquestion.
I think you should keep askingthat.
SPEAKER_01 (17:06):
Absolutely no, and thank you for the great answer.
Like we're the same.
I mean, music is a constant forus, and we don't go to concerts
as much anymore because we'regetting to be old codgers.
But like when Kendall and Ifirst got together, I mean, we
were probably going at leastonce a week, you know.
Yeah.
And especially when we lived inthe Bay Area, I mean, there were
so many great venues there.
I actually was at Tom Petty'ssecond to last concert before he
(17:29):
passed.
And it was probably my favorite.
Well, it's hard to say becausewe've been to quite a few Tom
Petty shows, but it's definitelyit had to be in the top two just
because the set list wasperfect.
Like I wouldn't have changed athing.
And it was at the Greek inBerkeley, so a really cool,
intimate venue.
And yeah, I was pretty crushedwhen we lost Tom, but I lean on
(17:50):
his music a lot still.
SPEAKER_00 (17:50):
Yeah.
It cuts to the heart.
It really his music, the songsare so simple, but they are it's
just the perfect combination ofsongwriting and beautiful
lyrics.
There's something special abouthim.
And I lived in New York City forabout 11 years, and when he came
to Forest Hill Stadium for whatwould have been his last New
York show, I was like, I'llcatch him next time.
(18:13):
And every time I think of that,I'm like, oh man, I really
messed that one up.
But thankful to say I did seehim.
It was one of the best showsthat I ever saw.
I wish I got one more, one moregig out of it.
But yeah, his music lives onforever.
SPEAKER_01 (18:29):
Yeah, no, definitely the Tom Petty channel on Sirius
is one that's in regularrotation.
Yeah.
Well, Nick, we really appreciatewhat you're doing.
We'll definitely share links toyour podcast and the book in our
show notes.
And yeah, just stop keepfighting the good fight.
SPEAKER_00 (18:45):
Thank you guys.
Yeah, I appreciate you first offcreating the space for people
like me to come on and telltheir stories.
And I thank you for actuallyinviting me on the show.
I really feel like I've told mystory so many times, but it
still never gets old.
And I think just getting my andevery other donor-conceived
(19:10):
person's story out there on asmany outlets as we can, that's
the way that we'll shift out ofthat awareness stage and
actually go into a place wherereal change can take place.
So thank you guys.
It was nice meeting you both.
I appreciate your time.
SPEAKER_01 (19:26):
That was part two with Nick, and we just love how
he turned his story intosomething bigger than the shock
that started it.
A book, a podcast, and a wholelot of honesty.
That takes guts.
If you heard something todaythat feels a little close to
home, we'd love to hear fromyou.
Your story matters, and even ifyou think it's small, even if
you think it's messy, even ifyou're still figuring it out,
(19:47):
reach out to us because younever know who needs to hear
what you've been holding.
And if you know someone whomight connect with mixed
experience, please pass thisepisode along.
Sharing these conversations ishow people find community.
In the middle of a Twitter Theynever asked for.
Until next time, this is FamilyTwist, where Family Secrets are
(20:09):
the ultimate plot twist.
The Family Twist Podcast isproduced by How the Cow Ate the
Cabbage LLC and presented bySavoie Fair Marketing
Communications.
Hey there, it's Corey.
(00:01):
Welcome back to Family Twist.
If you missed part one of Nick'sstory, go treat yourself to that
first because, wow.
And you really won't know what'sgoing on in this episode if you
don't listen to that one first.
Today you're gonna hear aboutNick's book and podcast and
stepping right into the role ofgentle truth teller for donor
conceived folks everywhere.
We talk about the mysterysiblings raised by the donor,
(00:22):
the detective work all of us endup doing whether we want to or
not, and why telling the truthout loud is sometimes the only
way to survive it.
Let's get back into it withNick.
SPEAKER_00 (00:38):
I've thought about all the ins and outs of all of
this, and I forget if Imentioned, I actually I ended up
writing a book about my story,and part of what I speculate on
is like if I'm one of those twokids that the donor raised
himself, and I knew that I hadother half siblings out there,
(00:58):
wouldn't I want to have directaccess to that information
myself via a DNA test ratherthan having to rely on, in my
donor's case, an extended familymember who is the one that
happens to be connected to us on23andMe?
To me, like if I were in theirshoes, the donor's children's
(01:22):
shoes, I would want to take atest.
So, like, I'm not relying onanyone else for this info.
And to date, we're not connectedto any of them.
SPEAKER_01 (01:32):
How did they discover that you do have you
know two half siblings that wereraised by the donor?
SPEAKER_00 (01:38):
Well, once we discovered who the donor was, we
were able to access his Facebookprofile.
At the time, there wereInstagram pages that were
available, and we just, youknow, all DCPs become detectives
once they figure out this partof them themselves.
And in our case, we were justable to do some sleuthing and
kind of put the pieces together.
SPEAKER_01 (02:00):
Has anyone in your sibling group wanted to reach
out to those half siblings justto, you know, just drop the
bomb?
SPEAKER_00 (02:09):
I think all of us probably want to, but because
we're unsure of their situation,we want to be respectful of
their privacy and to not dropthe bomb on them.
It doesn't feel like it's ourplace to do so.
That kind of feels like thedonor and his wife's job.
(02:30):
So yeah, with respect to to thechildren he raised, I don't
think there's any real interestin doing that.
That said, because I wrote abook and because there are
writers in the donor's family, Ihave toyed with the idea of
(02:50):
reaching out to the donor andsaying, hey, like there's a book
about what my experience was andwhat you helped to create.
And yeah, I still haven'tmustered up the courage to to
reach out and share that withhim.
I have never had any directcorrespondence with him.
(03:11):
But part of me wants to let himknow and give him the option.
Like, I'm not gonna just mailhim a copy of the book and have
it on his, you know, show up onhis doorstep.
But I think I would like to atleast tell him, like, hey, if if
you are interested, and I don'tneed a response either, but if
you are interested, this exists.
Someone that you're biologicallyconnected to, and maybe you want
(03:32):
to read about what I wentthrough in this process.
His parents and grandparents, weare aware of the major health
concerns that that we shouldhave noted.
But you're right, like in in thecase of the donor's children, we
don't know.
And I guess at this point, theassumption, and I don't know if
(03:55):
it's a safe one, but theassumption would be that because
we are aware of who the donor isand he is aware of us, that if
there was anything serious thatwe needed to be mindful of, that
he would let us know.
That's I think putting a lot oftrust into someone that
ultimately we don't know.
You know, if there wasinformation about a medical
(04:17):
issue that we needed to knowabout, a trust that he would
fill us in on that, just giventhe fact that we know who he is
and he knows that.
You know, I think I'm putting alittle bit of faith into how I
would expect the donor to to,you know, react and respond if
this were the case.
(04:37):
I think part of it also is likeof the 14, there's 12 of us who
were not raised by the donor.
And we are all aware of eachother as well.
So if anyone has a medical issuethat comes up, you know, there's
there's open lines ofcommunication there too, which
if God forbid something were tohappen and maybe it's unclear
(05:01):
like what exactly the problem isor where it's coming from, I
think that would kind of triggera response and you know, reach
out to the donor and say, hey,like we need you to shed some
light on this.
But knock on wood to date,nothing like that has happened,
thankfully.
SPEAKER_01 (05:19):
Nick, can you talk a little bit about why you decided
to start a podcast and what theformat is like?
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Sure.
You know what?
If you don't mind, I'll startwith the book that I wrote.
Okay.
Because that's first, and thenI'll shift quickly into the
podcast.
But the reason the book came tobe was because of this whole
idea that I've touched on.
Like being open about what I wasgoing through, not just me, but
my family as well, that feltlike it was the most healing
(05:50):
approach to take.
Was there might be pain alongthe way and there might be
difficulty, but getting this allcleared out is what's ultimately
gonna put us in the bestposition to go forward.
So with that in mind, beyondjust the conversations I was
having with my family, I knewfor myself, part of the healing
process was to just write all ofwhat I was feeling, you know,
(06:13):
emotions and thoughts and all ofthat, write it down, just in
like a journal form.
It wasn't anything where Ithought, oh, I'm gonna write a
book right off the bat.
I was just trying to use this asa therapeutic tool for what I
was going through.
And eventually I got to a pointin my writing where I was like,
wait a minute, I've got like30,000 words here.
(06:34):
Maybe I can flesh this out intosomething a little bit bigger.
So that's ultimately what I did.
And it turned into afull-fledged book, which I then
put out earlier this year.
Knowing how healing it was forme to express all of this in the
most open and public of ways, Ithought, how can I offer a path
(06:56):
towards that same feeling ofhealing and therapy to other
people?
And that's where the podcastformed was if I could give
people a platform to talk openlyand in an unfiltered way about
what they went through, I thinkthat could not only provide
(07:18):
healing for the individualthemselves, but for the those
who listen as well, to be ableto relate and you know, almost
find a support group andcommunity through hearing these
other stories.
So I knew pretty early on thatwith the podcast, I always tell
(07:39):
the guests this I'm like, theless I speak, the better.
Because I want them to reallytap into the deepest emotions
that they felt and really justvent it all out in a raw and
honest way.
And, you know, I don't really dotoo much editing after the
(07:59):
recording is done.
I try my best to keep it asclose to what the conversation
actually was like as I can.
Obviously, there are pointswhere, if I'm saying little
things that need to be cleanedup, I take that out.
But ultimately, I just want togive space for people to talk
about the things that a lot ofthe times they can't really talk
about in their daily lives.
(08:20):
There's a lot of obstacles forsome people to get past that
keep them from putting thisstuff out openly.
And I think if you're not doingthat, it means you're pushing it
down and suppressing it.
To me, that has an energeticeffect.
I think it can affect yourhealth.
(08:41):
I think if you're not lettingthese things out in an
appropriate way, then there canbe negative consequences to
that.
So knowing how much stigma thereis around donor conception and
that it's not an easy thing forpeople to talk about, I wanted
to be as gentle and as caringand empathetic towards the
(09:07):
experiences of other peoplegoing through the same thing
that I went through as I couldbe.
And yeah, that's that's sort ofthe thinking behind the podcast.
I think we're like 25 or 26episodes into it at this point.
And yeah, most of it is withdonor-conceived people.
Those are the episodes thateveryone has access to.
(09:28):
About a month or two ago, Ibegan a subscribers episode
where people can opt in to hearstories from donors, from
myself.
In the future, I want to speakwith recipient parents and other
therapists that have a focus ondonor-conceived people.
Really just trying to amplifythe voices of people who are
(09:52):
going through a process that weall know needs a lot of change,
still, somehow today.
So that's kind of the thinkingbehind it all.
SPEAKER_01 (10:02):
Well, I think that's fantastic.
I mean, we never feel like we'vegot rival podcasts out there.
The community is getting biggerall the time, and there's room
for all of us in the pool.
Kudos to you for doing thatbecause getting these voices out
there is important.
And podcasts like yours mightactually help with legislation
as well.
Once the right people hear itand get it, changes need to be
made.
SPEAKER_00 (10:21):
Yeah, yeah.
And, you know, that's it's notnecessarily the goal.
It would be amazing to havelegislative change come from
something that, you know, thisis just a project that for now
I'm focusing on a little bitmore.
This was something I was doingin my spare time, beyond my
full-time job.
And you're right, like there'sno such thing as a competitor
(10:42):
podcast in this space because Ithink we all know what's needed
most is louder voices and peoplewho are speaking up on behalf of
a group that doesn't have all ofthe rights that they deserve.
Yeah, like the more the merrierhere.
I would love it if there werehundreds of podcasts around this
(11:05):
stuff, because it just means themessage is getting out there
more and more.
And also saving people from thestruggles that many of us have
dealt with.
It's all about creating abrighter future for the people
who are donor-conceived, becauseI don't think donor conception
is going anywhere, but the waywe go about it, especially on
(11:25):
the anonymity side of things,like that can be changed and
that can make it an easier pathforward for people that are
brought into the world this way.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Yeah, we, you know, when we started this podcast,
you know, three and a half yearsago, it was initially just a
tell Kendall story.
Like we wanted to get CNO, beable to get that out there.
And then once we start havingguests on, we were educated
really quickly, you know, aboutthings that are happening in the
worlds of adoption and donorconception, etc.
And, you know, I didn't knowmuch at all about the fertility
(11:57):
industry and like what we foundout is horrifying.
But again, yeah, it's being ableto share these voices and share
people's stories, and that's whywe welcome donors, we welcome
donor-conceived people,recipients, all of it.
SPEAKER_00 (12:14):
There's a lot of different ways that you can look
at the way that this processplays out.
I think the donor-conceivedperson is the prioritized view
because we are the affectedpeople.
Yes.
But I think it's also importantto hear from all those other
people that are part of thejourney.
And that typically means donorsand recipient parents and really
(12:36):
anyone that's connected to this.
We really don't know how big thecommunities are, and I'm sure
they're bigger than we think.
Totally.
And it's international too.
Like this is a worldwidephenomenon.
So yeah, I think we're stillmaybe in the awareness stage and
trying to explain to people likewhat donor conception actually
(12:57):
is.
But I think we're approaching apoint where this is almost it
might not be common knowledge,but like everyone is gonna be
connected to somebody that'sgone through this friend, a
family member, or a friend of afriend.
Um, they just don't know it yet.
And I think any parent that'sgone through this and hasn't
(13:19):
shared the truth, they gottamuster up the courage and
address the truth.
You know, I think it'sunderstandable why they may have
taken the path of not sharingthis, especially when you're
decades into keeping thissuppressed, but there's no
looking away from it anymore.
(13:40):
And yeah, that's something thatI think a lot of us in the DCP
community are thankful to theDNA companies for exposing.
Because without them, I probablystill wouldn't know the truth.
Many of us wouldn't know thetruth.
So to me, that should have beenthe tipping point for a lot of
parents who once you realizethat the answers are available,
(14:04):
it's better that they come fromyou rather than, you know, a
corporation.
SPEAKER_01 (14:11):
So, Nick, what we've been doing recently for our
final question of the episode isasking about it, and
specifically, I think, for you,like, was there a musical artist
or a song that you leaned onwhile you were writing the book
that kind of helps you throughthe challenging times?
SPEAKER_00 (14:27):
That's a really good question.
I'm glad you asked that becausethe book chapters, the titles of
the chapters in part one are allsong titles of songs that come
from artists that have had aspecial place in my heart for my
entire life.
(14:48):
So I guess to identify a few ofthem, David Bowie has always
been a very present artist in mylife.
I find I can't really go toolong without putting his music
on.
And I think when it comes tobeing donor-conceived, it's
maybe not so surprising thathe's one of the artists that
(15:10):
first come to mind because overthe course of his career, he
changed his identity in so manydifferent ways.
And I think DCPs can probablyrelate to that in having to kind
of reintroduce themselves andyou know kind of let people know
that part of their identityisn't exactly what they thought
(15:31):
it was.
Tom Petty was also a pretty biginfluential artist growing up
for me.
I think his songs are prettytimeless.
And then of the more modernacts, I really, really love the
band Spoon.
They're kind of like an indierock band that's been around
since the late 90s, and for somereason, their songs have always
(15:54):
stuck with me.
The one that I reference in thebook is called The Ghost of You
Lingers, which is tied to thechapter that's related to the
donor.
And I just kind of found that tobe an appropriate title because,
you know, there's this elementof me that is unknown and it's
always around, and I can't seeit, but it's there and it's a
(16:19):
part of who I am, and trying tounderstand what those things are
is really what a big part of mylife is now.
But I love that you asked thatbecause music is such a it's a
tool for healing for me.
I mean, I've been to I can'teven count how many concerts
I've been to over the course ofmy life.
(16:40):
It's in the four or fivehundreds.
Part of what I find so healingmyself is like going out
dancing.
So music is always present in mylife.
And I think that's that is amedicine for many of us as we
try to process these difficultemotions.
Music can really be helpful withthat.
(17:02):
So thank you for asking thatquestion.
I think you should keep askingthat.
SPEAKER_01 (17:06):
Absolutely no, and thank you for the great answer.
Like we're the same.
I mean, music is a constant forus, and we don't go to concerts
as much anymore because we'regetting to be old codgers.
But like when Kendall and Ifirst got together, I mean, we
were probably going at leastonce a week, you know.
Yeah.
And especially when we lived inthe Bay Area, I mean, there were
so many great venues there.
I actually was at Tom Petty'ssecond to last concert before he
(17:29):
passed.
And it was probably my favorite.
Well, it's hard to say becausewe've been to quite a few Tom
Petty shows, but it's definitelyit had to be in the top two just
because the set list wasperfect.
Like I wouldn't have changed athing.
And it was at the Greek inBerkeley, so a really cool,
intimate venue.
And yeah, I was pretty crushedwhen we lost Tom, but I lean on
(17:50):
his music a lot still.
SPEAKER_00 (17:50):
Yeah.
It cuts to the heart.
It really his music, the songsare so simple, but they are it's
just the perfect combination ofsongwriting and beautiful
lyrics.
There's something special abouthim.
And I lived in New York City forabout 11 years, and when he came
to Forest Hill Stadium for whatwould have been his last New
York show, I was like, I'llcatch him next time.
(18:13):
And every time I think of that,I'm like, oh man, I really
messed that one up.
But thankful to say I did seehim.
It was one of the best showsthat I ever saw.
I wish I got one more, one moregig out of it.
But yeah, his music lives onforever.
SPEAKER_01 (18:29):
Yeah, no, definitely the Tom Petty channel on Sirius
is one that's in regularrotation.
Yeah.
Well, Nick, we really appreciatewhat you're doing.
We'll definitely share links toyour podcast and the book in our
show notes.
And yeah, just stop keepfighting the good fight.
SPEAKER_00 (18:45):
Thank you guys.
Yeah, I appreciate you first offcreating the space for people
like me to come on and telltheir stories.
And I thank you for actuallyinviting me on the show.
I really feel like I've told mystory so many times, but it
still never gets old.
And I think just getting my andevery other donor-conceived
(19:10):
person's story out there on asmany outlets as we can, that's
the way that we'll shift out ofthat awareness stage and
actually go into a place wherereal change can take place.
So thank you guys.
It was nice meeting you both.
I appreciate your time.
SPEAKER_01 (19:26):
That was part two with Nick, and we just love how
he turned his story intosomething bigger than the shock
that started it.
A book, a podcast, and a wholelot of honesty.
That takes guts.
If you heard something todaythat feels a little close to
home, we'd love to hear fromyou.
Your story matters, and even ifyou think it's small, even if
you think it's messy, even ifyou're still figuring it out,
(19:47):
reach out to us because younever know who needs to hear
what you've been holding.
And if you know someone whomight connect with mixed
experience, please pass thisepisode along.
Sharing these conversations ishow people find community.
In the middle of a Twitter Theynever asked for.
Until next time, this is FamilyTwist, where Family Secrets are
(20:09):
the ultimate plot twist.
The Family Twist Podcast isproduced by How the Cow Ate the
Cabbage LLC and presented bySavoie Fair Marketing
Communications.
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