December 17, 2024 • 26 mins
What happens when passionate fans decide to create the events they've always wanted to attend? Melissa Anelli, CEO and Founder of Mischief Management takes us on her journey from Harry Potter superfan to convention entrepreneur running some of the most beloved fan gatherings in entertainment.
The spark began in 2007 when Anelli and fellow staff members from The Leaky Cauldron (a major Harry Potter fan site) decided they could create better fan events themselves. Their first convention drew 750 attendees, and while creatively successful, it wasn't yet a sustainable business. Their persistence paid off when their second event exploded to 3,500 daily attendees. Today, Mischief Management produces conventions for Broadway lovers, fantasy fans, romance readers, and more.
At the heart of successful fan events is what Anelli calls "unironic enthusiasm" – that special quality where loving something becomes integral to your identity. This authenticity permeates everything from how staff interact with attendees to how venue personnel are trained to treat fans with respect. The goal isn't just entertainment but creating spaces where people can fully express their passion without judgment.
The conversation also explores how brands can meaningfully engage with fan communities without feeling exploitative. The most successful partnerships, like Mean Girls' viral bathroom mirror message at BroadwayCon, come when brands are willing to play and have fun in authentic ways that resonate with the community's spirit.
Ready to experience the magic of fandom for yourself? Whether you're a Broadway enthusiast, fantasy fiction lover, or passionate about any form of entertainment, discover how connecting with fellow fans can transform your relationship with the stories you love.
Recorded Tuesday, December 17th, 2024
Host: Damian Bazadona, CEO & Founder, Situation
Guest: Melissa Anelli, CEO & Founder, Mischief Management
Producer: Peter Yagecic, Innovation Advisor, Situation
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Peter Yagecic (00:05):
You're listening to Fandom Unpacked the podcast,
an audio version of our regularlive stream series where we
unpack modern fandom with someof the brightest minds in sports
and entertainment.
I'm producer Peter Yagecic andin today's episode we'll hear a
conversation between our host,Damian Bazzadana, ceo and
founder of Situation Group, andMelissa Anelli, ceo and founder
of Mischief Management, producerof BroadwayCon.
(00:27):
Put on your best Hamiltoncosplay and let's dive in with
Damian and Melissa.
Damian Bazadona (00:33):
All right, thank you, peter.
Welcome Melissa.
Let's get into it First.
It'd be fantastic, take me into.
I want to talk a little bitabout the origins of your fandom
.
How did Mischief Management getstarted?
And I know a little bit aboutthe origins of your fandom.
How did Mischief Management getstarted?
I know a little bit of thebackstory, which I just find
fascinating.
It would be awesome if youcould share with everyone how
this spark, your own spark, ledto the formation of what you do.
Melissa Anelli (00:56):
Sure so Mischief .
We run events for deep fans,real fans of things.
We were a bunch of Harry Potterfans back in 2007 who were at a
Harry Potter convention and wewere all the staff of the Leaky
Cauldron, which is this hugeHarry Potter fan website back in
the day.
I am sure some people watchingthis were readers of the site
(01:21):
back then and we were all at aconvention and as we walked
around this convention, we justwere brimming with ideas about
how we could do it ourselves andby the end of the convention,
the whole team was jazzed aboutputting on our own Harry Potter
convention once, just as a thingwe do, and we did, and that was
in 2009 in Boston and it hadabout 750 people there and it
(01:43):
was, creatively, everything wewanted.
We wanted it to be an event runby the people who go to them
right, and that happens in awhole lot of ways.
It happens in the attitude ofthe staff, it happens in who you
set to moderate panels, ithappens in the content itself
(02:04):
and it happens a lot in justlike the joy of how the event is
presented, which becomesobvious to the people going to
the event.
So that event, creatively, wasamazing.
Financially absolute disasterGot through it the skin of our
teeth and then our second eventhad 3,500 people per day at it
in 2011 in.
(02:25):
Florida.
And that's when we were like,oh, we'll do this one more time
because the last movie is comingout and we'll have one more
party.
And that weekend we realizedthat, okay, something's right in
the sauce here and we have tocontinue this.
And then, a couple of yearslater, we had the idea for
BroadwayCon and that sort offlipped the script on what kind
(02:45):
of company we were creating.
Since then we've done a Game ofThrones convention, we've
worked with A&E Networks ontheir AlienCon, we now do
RomanceCon, which is inMilwaukee every year and
celebrates romance readership,and MalikiCon, which was that
original Harry Potter event, hasblossomed into Enchanticon,
which is a fantasy convention.
(03:07):
So we really just wanted tocreate the events that we wanted
to go to and we're reallydedicated to it.
Damian Bazadona (03:16):
So on this webinar, there are a significant
number of people who representfans right, represent brands
that have substantial fan bases.
What's the secret sauce to it?
So all those different things,from Game of Thrones to
BroadwayCon, I mean these aredifferent brands all together
different categories.
What would you say?
What are the unifying forcesthat you feel like that you see
across excellence of fandom andhow you create your own events
(03:39):
that you think people shouldknow?
Melissa Anelli (03:40):
There is a certain je ne sais quoi about
the type of fandom that makes usgo.
That fandom is ripe for anevent.
It's hard to quantify, but allgenders enjoying romance novels
(04:07):
and being very loud about it andbeing very proud about it.
So when we sort of put outfeelers about would this be
right?
All the markings came backcorrectly there's an unironic
enthusiasm I will call it.
That is key and joined in allof our events.
(04:29):
When you love something so much, it's a little bit of a part of
who you are, sometimes a lot abit of a part of who you are.
I would say a lot of broadwaycon attendees define themselves
by their love of broadway.
Um, it's that.
It's that joy that lightssomebody up that will lead them
to want to go to an event andimmerse themselves in something
(04:50):
all weekend long what are the?
Damian Bazadona (04:52):
so I've been to BroadwayCon a bunch of times
and I think one of the most.
It's just so.
It's like a very warm feeling.
I remember seeing actually aparent with their child and they
just said like, oh my god, theyjust come to life when they're
here talking about their child.
It was actually really warm,like it was just a moving
experience, just talking to theparent.
What are the must-dos ormust-not-dos in terms of you,
(05:15):
like that fancy term, in termsof engaging with fans?
And I ask that again in thecontext of you know, again, we
work across sports, theater,entertainment, you name it, and
I think everyone has their ownperspective on fandom, of how
they engage with fans.
But I feel you sit at like thecore of it.
Uh, you know I'm a giants fan,so I, you know I haven't painted
(05:36):
my face blue, but I probablywould for the right game.
Sure, go into it, talk to meabout and when we talked, you
talked a little bit authenticity, you talked about the.
You know, take us into thatworld, it'd be helpful.
Melissa Anelli (05:47):
Um yeah, um, fans, in my experience, can spot
authenticity, you know, a mileaway.
They can tell if they're justbeing marketed to as a sort of
grab for them or if they'reinteracting with a brand that
really wants and values theirinput and their love.
When we started all this andI'm talking way back when it was
(06:10):
just the Leaky Cauldron theattitude towards fans was so
different.
I remember accidentallyoverhearing a Warner Brothers
executive talking about theLeaky Cauldron in a kind of
derogatory way that that was notthe way they interacted with me
.
It was a very different time.
(06:32):
In Britain they would call youa sad when you were too invested
in something.
That is not the case these days, because what happened,
especially with Harry Potter,was a huge part of it is that
brands started to see that theseweren't just baked in absorbers
of their content, they weren'ta packed in value.
(06:54):
If you interacted with them,you got more out of it than you
thought.
So immediately it was like well, why would we market to fans?
They're already fans.
(07:28):
But if you, the fans, feel warmand welcome and respected and
that is a key part of everythingwe produce we're never going to
produce something where I meanwe've turned down working on
things that would be seriouslyagainst our values, you know,
and we couldn't get behindemotionally, so like when you
(07:48):
walk into BroadwayCon, everyaspect of it has been thought
about by people who want to makethe experience the best.
So part of that, part of thatis.
One thing that people don't seeis that we speak to the venue.
Every event we've ever done, wehave a talk with the venue
beforehand.
That's common, but in that talkwe always make sure to tell
(08:09):
them that they are also anextension of us and that
treating our fans and ourattendees with respect and
warmth is a key part of ourbusiness with them.
So that has always kind oftranslated.
It comes out in literally theway the staff acts as they walk
(08:30):
around the convention.
You know, nobody's a bother,everybody's a member of this
community.
Nobody's causing them work,everybody's causing them joy to
be able to bring this event tolife.
It's really just a matter ofreally believing in what you're
doing.
And where brands are concerned,I would say that you got to get
nerdy with them, you got tolike.
(08:52):
So, for instance, today we justannounced BroadwayCon night at
A Wonderful World on Broadway.
We've been trying to get thisgoing forever, to have Broadway
shows due at night where if youare in town for BroadwayCon and
you come to the show, you can doa talkback and you get a
discount on your ticket.
And A Wonderful World has beenthe first show in all this time
(09:12):
to really kind of like jump inand do that with us.
So to say like we value thisaudience and we're going to give
you something and interact withyou is a huge, huge thing
something and interact with youis a huge, a huge thing.
Damian Bazadona (09:25):
One thing I've always loved about your events
is I do feel like the people,the staff, from the moment they
kind of scan your ticket likeit's a warm people want the
people who work there look likethey want to be there.
I think this is falls off for alot of live venues.
I think some of the workers arelike just don't want to be at
particular venues and it justcrushes the experience.
How do you just building offkind of the idea of the
experience in terms of theinteraction with people?
(09:45):
How do you go about creatingsort of safe spaces, you know,
because cons are oftenassociated as a safe space for
fans, but that has to come intothe design and how you build it
right, because I've seen thatperson, I've seen this firsthand
where I've seen people go oh,those are the diehards, those
are the freaks, like we don'tneed, we already have those
folks and meanwhile it's likethose are people that fuel many
of these brands.
(10:05):
But the idea of a safe space, Iwould imagine, is important and
they come in there.
I'm assuming that's asignificant part to how you
think of designing events.
Melissa Anelli (10:13):
Absolutely.
It's a huge part of it andwe've been, you know, not
perfect over the yearsEverybody's always learning how
to do it best but it's anenormous part because you can't
have something.
That's where we say to you come, be the most you've ever been
this weekend, but only some ofyou.
So it has to be part of thesauce, and a lot of unseen work
(10:39):
goes into that, a lot ofchecking that we're making sure
that all different backgroundsare represented on every, you
know, every topic, that we'renot just presenting one kind of
kind of uh, viewpoint.
I actually had somebody come upto me, probably kind of one of
the most touching things that'shappened.
Um, it was a black woman, cameup to me and said that she
(10:59):
doesn't, that she feels she seesmore of herself at BroadwayCon
than you know on Broadway, thatBroadway doesn't look like her,
but BroadwayCon looks like her,which was just like.
Honestly, one of the highlightsof my professional career is to
hear that from from an attendee, and it doesn't mean we're
perfect on it.
It's always things you have tolearn.
But, um, you, you have to, justyou have to think about it in
(11:23):
every aspect, from a meetup,every panel, everything that
happens.
Everybody has thought very,very carefully and it's sort of
like a whole company.
The whole company is kind ofinvolved.
If somebody notices like hey,this is looking pretty one-sided
, this panel, we are totallyempowered to, like you know, to
tell the other it has to bebaked into the mission.
Damian Bazadona (11:45):
Peter, what do you got?
Peter Yagecic (11:48):
Yeah, I have a good question that I think
builds on this a little bit andkind of refers to what the fans
do at, specifically, broadwaycon.
The question was as someonewho's attended BroadwayCon in
the past, my favorite part iswhen groups of attendees break
into spontaneous sing-alongs.
As a partaker of the con, doyou incentivize these moments or
do you just try to lay thegroundwork for them and get out
(12:10):
of the way when they happen?
So, building off of what you dowith the staff, but what about
the fans themselves?
Melissa Anelli (12:15):
Yeah, it's both.
So we definitely try to justlay the groundwork and encourage
it when it happens and send oursocial media out to capture it
and share it and show how muchwe enjoy that.
But we've also had, you know,like piano bars and things like
that in the marketplace, andwe've had little stations where
people can come and singtogether and then we've also
(12:36):
done, like YouTube, danceparties on the main stage.
Sometimes the silliest thingsare the things that resonate the
most and just getting a chanceto kind of like dance together
and connect.
All of our events start on thefirst day with meetups and that
sounds like such a silly maybenot silly, it sounds like such a
basic thing, but it's soimportant Because everybody
needs to find their people and alot of people attend alone and
(12:59):
so we hear from people all thetime.
I'm coming alone, will I makefriends?
And it has never been the casethat at the end of the event we
haven't then heard from them andto say, actually, I now have 10
friends that I met at thisevent.
So we sort of have these events.
Whether you are an Andrew LloydWebber fan, a Sondheim fan, a
(13:19):
LGBTQ member, you know any allkinds of meetups If you're
traveling alone, if you are amom, I don't know.
I'm making things up now, butwe start building that community
early and that kind of likelays the groundwork for the rest
.
Peter Yagecic (13:36):
So this goes back to kind of the evolution of
LeakyCon to Enchanticon.
As your events have expanded,how do you ensure that different
micro communities feel likethey are being served and that
the original why isn't beingdiluted as things evolve?
Melissa Anelli (13:52):
Really good question.
It's definitely something wethink about.
One thing we do is we open ourprogramming programming to um to
to attendees.
We open a call for programming.
So do you have something thatyou would like to bring to this
event?
And we get hundreds of of uhsession panels and session ideas
(14:15):
and panel ideas and and umprogram concepts and we work
with with people to bring themin.
So a lot of our most excitingcontent actually comes from our
attendees and that is how we getsome trends in and get some
representation of communities inthat we might might not have
(14:36):
been on our radar.
A lot of that really coolcontent.
So one one year um um, I playedHercules Mulligan in the
original Hamilton cast who I am.
Oak came to us and said I wantto do a panel.
He wanted to do a panel onracial diversity on Broadway and
(14:56):
it was like that is the process.
He came to us and said here'sthe thing that I would like to
do and we said, oh, absolutely,let's make it happen.
So keeping open and talking toyour community, looking at what
they're doing all over social,will give you a really good idea
of, kind of like, where thecommunity is.
But keeping a conversationbetween you and your attendees
(15:18):
will bring so much in that youhadn't even thought of.
Peter Yagecic (15:24):
Fandom Unpacked is brought to you by Situation,
an award-winning marketingagency built for live
entertainment that champions thepower of unforgettable shared
experiences around the world.
We offer full marketing andcreative services for
experience-based brands in liveentertainment, attractions,
theater, sports, arts andculture, and more.
Check us out atSituationInteractivecom.
(15:44):
Now back to our Q&A.
Check us out atSituationInteractivecom.
Damian Bazadona (15:51):
Now back to our Q&A.
One of the lines you said,alyssa, when we had first talked
, was something along the spiritof you said, brands want to
play in the space.
Then play.
What do you mean by that?
You said, and you gave someexamples when you and I were
talking from Mean Girls atBroadwayCon or other of like.
What do you want to expand onthat idea of play and brands in
the space?
Melissa Anelli (16:11):
Something I.
Whenever we talk with partnersfor brand partnerships, we want
them to have the fun that ourattendees are having, because
not just because that's cool,but because it will make the
most lasting impact on people.
I remember the Mean Girlsexample is one the Mean Girls
(16:34):
team wrote a message on themirror in the bathroom saying
call this number for the hotgoss.
I don't remember the exactphrasing and it was so popular
that they kept having to up thecredits on the voicemail number
over the weekend and people tothis day remember that because
(16:54):
it was such a key.
It was like inviting them in,it was in the tone, it was silly
, it was fun, actually funnystory.
The janitor kept taking it offbecause he thought that it was
actually actual graffiti, kepttaking it off because he thought
that it was actually actualgraffiti, and so our creative
director, jordan, went down andgot lipstick in the right shade
and just kept writing it,rewriting it on the mirror the
whole weekend.
So we encourage people to comeand like, really get silly, and
(17:20):
you know what?
It's not only silly, it's alsobeing just being really
thoughtful.
When we did RomanceCon last year, one of the most talked about
brand partnerships was from asmall marketing company who made
little.
We had like 150 authors theredoing tables and talking to
their audience.
They put them together a littlegoodie bag full of everything
(17:40):
they might need for the weekend.
It was like Advil and a coupleof candies and breath mints and
you know little things to kindof take care of their weekend.
And we did not stop hearing allweekend about how key, how
vital that was.
And it was a very smallsponsorship.
It was even barely any money.
The a Wonderful World um,sponsorship nobody.
(18:01):
Uh, partnership, nobody's.
The only people basically wheremoney's being exchanged is like
the people buying tickets toWonderful World.
We really wanted this to happen, so we just wanted to make it
happen.
So it's not always about themost money.
It's about finding somethingcool that will stick in people's
head, something my dream listis I just wish somebody would
(18:22):
buy the Wi-Fi.
They don't understand what ahero they'd be if they could put
their name on the Wi-Fi inthese places.
But we can't make it happen.
Damian Bazadona (18:32):
Maybe after this you might.
Melissa Anelli (18:33):
Maybe after this Maybe someone's listening to
this.
You would be a hero, absolutehero.
Damian Bazadona (18:39):
We actually worked on that Mean Girls.
That was our team that did theMean Girls campaign and it was
so exciting.
But I remember the New YorkTimes covered it, I think it was
posted.
Someone tweeted about it andsaid the marketing team needs a
raise.
Now we didn't get that raise,but we felt really good about
ourselves at that moment.
Peter, make sure you get someof the questions.
Peter Yagecic (19:00):
Yeah, we have lots of questions coming in.
The first, well, one comment,not a question from Jamie
Bartolet, not a question, butwanted to share that over 10
years ago, melissa invited meand my friends to perform the
opening number at LeakyCon inChicago.
She made us feel so seen and sospecial and I still carry that
experience with me in myproducing career.
So you have fans in ouraudience, thank you.
Damian Bazadona (19:22):
That's so cool.
Peter Yagecic (19:25):
Here's an actual question from another attendee.
Many in the BroadwayConpopulation are under 18.
How does that work?
What does that mean?
Or does it not have anythingspecial one has to think about
in terms of marketing or whenthey're, I guess, at the
convention?
Melissa Anelli (19:42):
Yeah.
So we have a kind of policythat if you're you know, adults
in your life think you can go tothis event on your own.
We're not going to, you know,get in your way.
But if you look a little young,we might ask you know, if
(20:03):
there's an eight-year-oldwandering around unattended at
our events, we're going to askwhat's up there.
But if you're not, if you don'tlook like you really need a
guardian next to you, we'reprobably not going to bother you
about it too much.
Damian Bazadona (20:10):
Yeah, well, I would say I want to talk a
little bit about you know, Ithink about passion and
practicality are kind of twoforces that are often coming
together in fandom, right, andoftentimes passion just totally
beats practicality.
The things we will do for thethings that we love are
incredible, including the kindof money we spend, and so I want
(20:31):
to just talk a little bit aboutthe economics of it and how do
you balance, kind of creatingthese fan experiences with
monetizing them right At prettysignificant levels, probably in
a way that feels authentic,because I'm assuming that's a
tricky balance, right, becauseyou have people there, they know
they're all in on the passionand they want to feel respected
and heard and part of thecommunity.
(20:52):
Yet, as an event producerbecause I've seen budgets that
you probably had to deal withthe lunch budgets alone you have
to make money.
The logic, yeah, I've seen,it's crazy.
Uh, that's, that's for another,that's for another panel, um,
yeah, but but I think, like,just how do you balance that in
terms of like, like you want tomaximize revenue, which means
people spend a lot of money, andhow do you do that in a way
that keeps the community freshand without overdoing it?
Melissa Anelli (21:14):
It's incredibly hard, I'm not going to lie.
Putting on an event in New York, especially BroadwayCon, is
super expensive.
It's mostly subsid by the wholeof business we do so.
You know, Brabacon itself issort of a, is it like?
Barely it can't buy price, evenevery year, and we just are
happy with that for now.
(21:34):
Obviously we want it to growand you can't really grow unless
you profit.
But you know it's a struggle.
Of course we have to.
We want to keep prices as lowas we can, but we want to make
sure we take in the most we canto make the event great.
Um, we've actually lowered theprice of the main barbicon
ticket quite a bit over theyears.
(21:55):
The first year it was a 250ticket and that was just what we
felt safe with doing our firstyou know event in new york.
Um, we brought it down to likewhat normal convention prices
are.
You know you want to balance,to balance.
There is an entrance point foreverybody, there's a student
ticket, there's an entrancepoint.
You know that's reachable, kindof like what you would pay for
(22:16):
a Broadway show, and then it'slike you'd be leaving finance on
the, you'd be leaving money onthe table if you don't offer
experiences that people arewilling to pay for, and then
that money helps fuel the restof the event.
So it's really important.
So we're so grateful to thepeople who support us and by
(22:37):
buying those higher ticketlevels they make a huge
difference in what we're able todo.
Damian Bazadona (22:40):
Yeah, well, as we I know, peter, I'm respectful
of time I I wanted.
I wanted just to sort of end inthe lane of sort of the future
of fandom and and really thefuture of and I don't want to
because I didn't get intodigital stuff.
There's a whole bunch of otherquestions we had here but I want
to because we're spending somuch time.
Your, your lane really is likethe in-person, the raw kind of
(23:04):
fan experience, which is whatunifies a lot of our clients,
that in-venue experience.
What does the future look like?
What do you think in terms of?
How does technology impact it?
But if you want to go threeyears down the road, five years
down the road, how do you thinkit'll change it?
Or do you think it'll be like?
Will technology better connectpeople while they're there?
Will it extend the relationshipfurther?
(23:24):
Is it like?
I don't know?
Does it have?
Ai is playing a role in thesevague questions, but just how do
you think about it?
Melissa Anelli (23:38):
I mean, we're very lucky in that what we do is
a little bit resistant to thekind of maybe ravages that AI is
going to bring to a lot ofindustries.
I also think there was a bigpush for everything to go hybrid
, every event to go hybrid,during COVID.
I don't think that'snecessarily going to be the case
.
Obviously, doing more hybrid,doing more things on the
internet, is great because it'saccessible.
There's a difference.
(24:08):
There's a difference in comingtogether and meeting people and
it stokes your enthusiasm in away that is really hard to
replace.
So actually, I think that allthe technology advances will
push people more to havingspecialized go and make sure you
go out to the world and meetpeople who love what you love,
because we all spend so much ofour time now just sitting in
(24:30):
front of our computers that itis even more special to be able
to go and touch and feel andtalk to people and realize
you're not alone in the world.
It really does make a hugedifference.
A mark of success for me atevery single event I've ever
done is about Saturday night,late in the evening or late in
(24:53):
the day or whatever time it'sending.
That's kind of like day two.
I kind of just walk around alittle bit and I just take it in
, I just watch people.
I watch people laughing andconnecting, and sometimes we
have a concert or something sothey're dancing etc.
Um, and that is always for methe fuel that keeps, keeps going
for the year, because you knowyou work for a whole year on
(25:15):
this one, on this one event.
Um, this couple of days thathave to go great, um, so I'm I'm
actually feeling like thesetouchstone moments are going to
become even more important asour world gets more and more
isolated because of technologyum, I know, peter, we're at time
I just before I sort of myfinal words, and this is to say
(25:36):
melissa and I go, I don't knowhow many years ago.
Damian Bazadona (25:38):
Pretty, we go back pretty far and your, your
endurance, uh on on fandom andand I believe what you said
before in terms of how peopleperceive the business of fans,
like the hardcore fans and likethat perception has changed and
you were on it, you were in itbefore it changed, and then you
rode through a pandemic to whichwe've had multiple calls that
(26:00):
were very scary moments in timegoing what is this all going to
look like?
And you've held the enduranceto carry through, which is
remarkably impressive.
So I appreciate you taking thetime for this, but I have just
great admiration for yourbusiness and your perspective on
all this, so I thank you.
Melissa Anelli (26:14):
I appreciate all the help that you've taken, all
those calls when things arereally scary, Damn it.
But I really I appreciateeverything you do to keep people
asking these questions andhaving these talks.
Damian Bazadona (26:29):
Thank you.
Peter Yagecic (26:31):
That's going to do it for this episode of Fandom
Unpacked the podcast.
If you liked what you heard,please be sure to leave us a
review on Apple Podcasts.
Find out how to join us livefor an upcoming recording at
SituationLivecom slash fan.
We'll see you next time, truebelievers.
You're listening to Fandom Unpacked the podcast,
an audio version of our regularlive stream series where we
unpack modern fandom with someof the brightest minds in sports
and entertainment.
I'm producer Peter Yagecic andin today's episode we'll hear a
conversation between our host,Damian Bazzadana, ceo and
founder of Situation Group, andMelissa Anelli, ceo and founder
of Mischief Management, producerof BroadwayCon.
(00:27):
Put on your best Hamiltoncosplay and let's dive in with
Damian and Melissa.
Damian Bazadona (00:33):
All right, thank you, peter.
Welcome Melissa.
Let's get into it First.
It'd be fantastic, take me into.
I want to talk a little bitabout the origins of your fandom
.
How did Mischief Management getstarted?
And I know a little bit aboutthe origins of your fandom.
How did Mischief Management getstarted?
I know a little bit of thebackstory, which I just find
fascinating.
It would be awesome if youcould share with everyone how
this spark, your own spark, ledto the formation of what you do.
Melissa Anelli (00:56):
Sure so Mischief .
We run events for deep fans,real fans of things.
We were a bunch of Harry Potterfans back in 2007 who were at a
Harry Potter convention and wewere all the staff of the Leaky
Cauldron, which is this hugeHarry Potter fan website back in
the day.
I am sure some people watchingthis were readers of the site
(01:21):
back then and we were all at aconvention and as we walked
around this convention, we justwere brimming with ideas about
how we could do it ourselves andby the end of the convention,
the whole team was jazzed aboutputting on our own Harry Potter
convention once, just as a thingwe do, and we did, and that was
in 2009 in Boston and it hadabout 750 people there and it
(01:43):
was, creatively, everything wewanted.
We wanted it to be an event runby the people who go to them
right, and that happens in awhole lot of ways.
It happens in the attitude ofthe staff, it happens in who you
set to moderate panels, ithappens in the content itself
(02:04):
and it happens a lot in justlike the joy of how the event is
presented, which becomesobvious to the people going to
the event.
So that event, creatively, wasamazing.
Financially absolute disasterGot through it the skin of our
teeth and then our second eventhad 3,500 people per day at it
in 2011 in.
(02:25):
Florida.
And that's when we were like,oh, we'll do this one more time
because the last movie is comingout and we'll have one more
party.
And that weekend we realizedthat, okay, something's right in
the sauce here and we have tocontinue this.
And then, a couple of yearslater, we had the idea for
BroadwayCon and that sort offlipped the script on what kind
(02:45):
of company we were creating.
Since then we've done a Game ofThrones convention, we've
worked with A&E Networks ontheir AlienCon, we now do
RomanceCon, which is inMilwaukee every year and
celebrates romance readership,and MalikiCon, which was that
original Harry Potter event, hasblossomed into Enchanticon,
which is a fantasy convention.
(03:07):
So we really just wanted tocreate the events that we wanted
to go to and we're reallydedicated to it.
Damian Bazadona (03:16):
So on this webinar, there are a significant
number of people who representfans right, represent brands
that have substantial fan bases.
What's the secret sauce to it?
So all those different things,from Game of Thrones to
BroadwayCon, I mean these aredifferent brands all together
different categories.
What would you say?
What are the unifying forcesthat you feel like that you see
across excellence of fandom andhow you create your own events
(03:39):
that you think people shouldknow?
Melissa Anelli (03:40):
There is a certain je ne sais quoi about
the type of fandom that makes usgo.
That fandom is ripe for anevent.
It's hard to quantify, but allgenders enjoying romance novels
(04:07):
and being very loud about it andbeing very proud about it.
So when we sort of put outfeelers about would this be
right?
All the markings came backcorrectly there's an unironic
enthusiasm I will call it.
That is key and joined in allof our events.
(04:29):
When you love something so much, it's a little bit of a part of
who you are, sometimes a lot abit of a part of who you are.
I would say a lot of broadwaycon attendees define themselves
by their love of broadway.
Um, it's that.
It's that joy that lightssomebody up that will lead them
to want to go to an event andimmerse themselves in something
(04:50):
all weekend long what are the?
Damian Bazadona (04:52):
so I've been to BroadwayCon a bunch of times
and I think one of the most.
It's just so.
It's like a very warm feeling.
I remember seeing actually aparent with their child and they
just said like, oh my god, theyjust come to life when they're
here talking about their child.
It was actually really warm,like it was just a moving
experience, just talking to theparent.
What are the must-dos ormust-not-dos in terms of you,
(05:15):
like that fancy term, in termsof engaging with fans?
And I ask that again in thecontext of you know, again, we
work across sports, theater,entertainment, you name it, and
I think everyone has their ownperspective on fandom, of how
they engage with fans.
But I feel you sit at like thecore of it.
Uh, you know I'm a giants fan,so I, you know I haven't painted
(05:36):
my face blue, but I probablywould for the right game.
Sure, go into it, talk to meabout and when we talked, you
talked a little bit authenticity, you talked about the.
You know, take us into thatworld, it'd be helpful.
Melissa Anelli (05:47):
Um yeah, um, fans, in my experience, can spot
authenticity, you know, a mileaway.
They can tell if they're justbeing marketed to as a sort of
grab for them or if they'reinteracting with a brand that
really wants and values theirinput and their love.
When we started all this andI'm talking way back when it was
(06:10):
just the Leaky Cauldron theattitude towards fans was so
different.
I remember accidentallyoverhearing a Warner Brothers
executive talking about theLeaky Cauldron in a kind of
derogatory way that that was notthe way they interacted with me
.
It was a very different time.
(06:32):
In Britain they would call youa sad when you were too invested
in something.
That is not the case these days, because what happened,
especially with Harry Potter,was a huge part of it is that
brands started to see that theseweren't just baked in absorbers
of their content, they weren'ta packed in value.
(06:54):
If you interacted with them,you got more out of it than you
thought.
So immediately it was like well, why would we market to fans?
They're already fans.
(07:28):
But if you, the fans, feel warmand welcome and respected and
that is a key part of everythingwe produce we're never going to
produce something where I meanwe've turned down working on
things that would be seriouslyagainst our values, you know,
and we couldn't get behindemotionally, so like when you
(07:48):
walk into BroadwayCon, everyaspect of it has been thought
about by people who want to makethe experience the best.
So part of that, part of thatis.
One thing that people don't seeis that we speak to the venue.
Every event we've ever done, wehave a talk with the venue
beforehand.
That's common, but in that talkwe always make sure to tell
(08:09):
them that they are also anextension of us and that
treating our fans and ourattendees with respect and
warmth is a key part of ourbusiness with them.
So that has always kind oftranslated.
It comes out in literally theway the staff acts as they walk
(08:30):
around the convention.
You know, nobody's a bother,everybody's a member of this
community.
Nobody's causing them work,everybody's causing them joy to
be able to bring this event tolife.
It's really just a matter ofreally believing in what you're
doing.
And where brands are concerned,I would say that you got to get
nerdy with them, you got tolike.
(08:52):
So, for instance, today we justannounced BroadwayCon night at
A Wonderful World on Broadway.
We've been trying to get thisgoing forever, to have Broadway
shows due at night where if youare in town for BroadwayCon and
you come to the show, you can doa talkback and you get a
discount on your ticket.
And A Wonderful World has beenthe first show in all this time
(09:12):
to really kind of like jump inand do that with us.
So to say like we value thisaudience and we're going to give
you something and interact withyou is a huge, huge thing
something and interact with youis a huge, a huge thing.
Damian Bazadona (09:25):
One thing I've always loved about your events
is I do feel like the people,the staff, from the moment they
kind of scan your ticket likeit's a warm people want the
people who work there look likethey want to be there.
I think this is falls off for alot of live venues.
I think some of the workers arelike just don't want to be at
particular venues and it justcrushes the experience.
How do you just building offkind of the idea of the
experience in terms of theinteraction with people?
(09:45):
How do you go about creatingsort of safe spaces, you know,
because cons are oftenassociated as a safe space for
fans, but that has to come intothe design and how you build it
right, because I've seen thatperson, I've seen this firsthand
where I've seen people go oh,those are the diehards, those
are the freaks, like we don'tneed, we already have those
folks and meanwhile it's likethose are people that fuel many
of these brands.
(10:05):
But the idea of a safe space, Iwould imagine, is important and
they come in there.
I'm assuming that's asignificant part to how you
think of designing events.
Melissa Anelli (10:13):
Absolutely.
It's a huge part of it andwe've been, you know, not
perfect over the yearsEverybody's always learning how
to do it best but it's anenormous part because you can't
have something.
That's where we say to you come, be the most you've ever been
this weekend, but only some ofyou.
So it has to be part of thesauce, and a lot of unseen work
(10:39):
goes into that, a lot ofchecking that we're making sure
that all different backgroundsare represented on every, you
know, every topic, that we'renot just presenting one kind of
kind of uh, viewpoint.
I actually had somebody come upto me, probably kind of one of
the most touching things that'shappened.
Um, it was a black woman, cameup to me and said that she
(10:59):
doesn't, that she feels she seesmore of herself at BroadwayCon
than you know on Broadway, thatBroadway doesn't look like her,
but BroadwayCon looks like her,which was just like.
Honestly, one of the highlightsof my professional career is to
hear that from from an attendee, and it doesn't mean we're
perfect on it.
It's always things you have tolearn.
But, um, you, you have to, justyou have to think about it in
(11:23):
every aspect, from a meetup,every panel, everything that
happens.
Everybody has thought very,very carefully and it's sort of
like a whole company.
The whole company is kind ofinvolved.
If somebody notices like hey,this is looking pretty one-sided
, this panel, we are totallyempowered to, like you know, to
tell the other it has to bebaked into the mission.
Damian Bazadona (11:45):
Peter, what do you got?
Peter Yagecic (11:48):
Yeah, I have a good question that I think
builds on this a little bit andkind of refers to what the fans
do at, specifically, broadwaycon.
The question was as someonewho's attended BroadwayCon in
the past, my favorite part iswhen groups of attendees break
into spontaneous sing-alongs.
As a partaker of the con, doyou incentivize these moments or
do you just try to lay thegroundwork for them and get out
(12:10):
of the way when they happen?
So, building off of what you dowith the staff, but what about
the fans themselves?
Melissa Anelli (12:15):
Yeah, it's both.
So we definitely try to justlay the groundwork and encourage
it when it happens and send oursocial media out to capture it
and share it and show how muchwe enjoy that.
But we've also had, you know,like piano bars and things like
that in the marketplace, andwe've had little stations where
people can come and singtogether and then we've also
(12:36):
done, like YouTube, danceparties on the main stage.
Sometimes the silliest thingsare the things that resonate the
most and just getting a chanceto kind of like dance together
and connect.
All of our events start on thefirst day with meetups and that
sounds like such a silly maybenot silly, it sounds like such a
basic thing, but it's soimportant Because everybody
needs to find their people and alot of people attend alone and
(12:59):
so we hear from people all thetime.
I'm coming alone, will I makefriends?
And it has never been the casethat at the end of the event we
haven't then heard from them andto say, actually, I now have 10
friends that I met at thisevent.
So we sort of have these events.
Whether you are an Andrew LloydWebber fan, a Sondheim fan, a
(13:19):
LGBTQ member, you know any allkinds of meetups If you're
traveling alone, if you are amom, I don't know.
I'm making things up now, butwe start building that community
early and that kind of likelays the groundwork for the rest
.
Peter Yagecic (13:36):
So this goes back to kind of the evolution of
LeakyCon to Enchanticon.
As your events have expanded,how do you ensure that different
micro communities feel likethey are being served and that
the original why isn't beingdiluted as things evolve?
Melissa Anelli (13:52):
Really good question.
It's definitely something wethink about.
One thing we do is we open ourprogramming programming to um to
to attendees.
We open a call for programming.
So do you have something thatyou would like to bring to this
event?
And we get hundreds of of uhsession panels and session ideas
(14:15):
and panel ideas and and umprogram concepts and we work
with with people to bring themin.
So a lot of our most excitingcontent actually comes from our
attendees and that is how we getsome trends in and get some
representation of communities inthat we might might not have
(14:36):
been on our radar.
A lot of that really coolcontent.
So one one year um um, I playedHercules Mulligan in the
original Hamilton cast who I am.
Oak came to us and said I wantto do a panel.
He wanted to do a panel onracial diversity on Broadway and
(14:56):
it was like that is the process.
He came to us and said here'sthe thing that I would like to
do and we said, oh, absolutely,let's make it happen.
So keeping open and talking toyour community, looking at what
they're doing all over social,will give you a really good idea
of, kind of like, where thecommunity is.
But keeping a conversationbetween you and your attendees
(15:18):
will bring so much in that youhadn't even thought of.
Peter Yagecic (15:24):
Fandom Unpacked is brought to you by Situation,
an award-winning marketingagency built for live
entertainment that champions thepower of unforgettable shared
experiences around the world.
We offer full marketing andcreative services for
experience-based brands in liveentertainment, attractions,
theater, sports, arts andculture, and more.
Check us out atSituationInteractivecom.
(15:44):
Now back to our Q&A.
Check us out atSituationInteractivecom.
Damian Bazadona (15:51):
Now back to our Q&A.
One of the lines you said,alyssa, when we had first talked
, was something along the spiritof you said, brands want to
play in the space.
Then play.
What do you mean by that?
You said, and you gave someexamples when you and I were
talking from Mean Girls atBroadwayCon or other of like.
What do you want to expand onthat idea of play and brands in
the space?
Melissa Anelli (16:11):
Something I.
Whenever we talk with partnersfor brand partnerships, we want
them to have the fun that ourattendees are having, because
not just because that's cool,but because it will make the
most lasting impact on people.
I remember the Mean Girlsexample is one the Mean Girls
(16:34):
team wrote a message on themirror in the bathroom saying
call this number for the hotgoss.
I don't remember the exactphrasing and it was so popular
that they kept having to up thecredits on the voicemail number
over the weekend and people tothis day remember that because
(16:54):
it was such a key.
It was like inviting them in,it was in the tone, it was silly
, it was fun, actually funnystory.
The janitor kept taking it offbecause he thought that it was
actually actual graffiti, kepttaking it off because he thought
that it was actually actualgraffiti, and so our creative
director, jordan, went down andgot lipstick in the right shade
and just kept writing it,rewriting it on the mirror the
whole weekend.
So we encourage people to comeand like, really get silly, and
(17:20):
you know what?
It's not only silly, it's alsobeing just being really
thoughtful.
When we did RomanceCon last year, one of the most talked about
brand partnerships was from asmall marketing company who made
little.
We had like 150 authors theredoing tables and talking to
their audience.
They put them together a littlegoodie bag full of everything
(17:40):
they might need for the weekend.
It was like Advil and a coupleof candies and breath mints and
you know little things to kindof take care of their weekend.
And we did not stop hearing allweekend about how key, how
vital that was.
And it was a very smallsponsorship.
It was even barely any money.
The a Wonderful World um,sponsorship nobody.
(18:01):
Uh, partnership, nobody's.
The only people basically wheremoney's being exchanged is like
the people buying tickets toWonderful World.
We really wanted this to happen, so we just wanted to make it
happen.
So it's not always about themost money.
It's about finding somethingcool that will stick in people's
head, something my dream listis I just wish somebody would
(18:22):
buy the Wi-Fi.
They don't understand what ahero they'd be if they could put
their name on the Wi-Fi inthese places.
But we can't make it happen.
Damian Bazadona (18:32):
Maybe after this you might.
Melissa Anelli (18:33):
Maybe after this Maybe someone's listening to
this.
You would be a hero, absolutehero.
Damian Bazadona (18:39):
We actually worked on that Mean Girls.
That was our team that did theMean Girls campaign and it was
so exciting.
But I remember the New YorkTimes covered it, I think it was
posted.
Someone tweeted about it andsaid the marketing team needs a
raise.
Now we didn't get that raise,but we felt really good about
ourselves at that moment.
Peter, make sure you get someof the questions.
Peter Yagecic (19:00):
Yeah, we have lots of questions coming in.
The first, well, one comment,not a question from Jamie
Bartolet, not a question, butwanted to share that over 10
years ago, melissa invited meand my friends to perform the
opening number at LeakyCon inChicago.
She made us feel so seen and sospecial and I still carry that
experience with me in myproducing career.
So you have fans in ouraudience, thank you.
Damian Bazadona (19:22):
That's so cool.
Peter Yagecic (19:25):
Here's an actual question from another attendee.
Many in the BroadwayConpopulation are under 18.
How does that work?
What does that mean?
Or does it not have anythingspecial one has to think about
in terms of marketing or whenthey're, I guess, at the
convention?
Melissa Anelli (19:42):
Yeah.
So we have a kind of policythat if you're you know, adults
in your life think you can go tothis event on your own.
We're not going to, you know,get in your way.
But if you look a little young,we might ask you know, if
(20:03):
there's an eight-year-oldwandering around unattended at
our events, we're going to askwhat's up there.
But if you're not, if you don'tlook like you really need a
guardian next to you, we'reprobably not going to bother you
about it too much.
Damian Bazadona (20:10):
Yeah, well, I would say I want to talk a
little bit about you know, Ithink about passion and
practicality are kind of twoforces that are often coming
together in fandom, right, andoftentimes passion just totally
beats practicality.
The things we will do for thethings that we love are
incredible, including the kindof money we spend, and so I want
(20:31):
to just talk a little bit aboutthe economics of it and how do
you balance, kind of creatingthese fan experiences with
monetizing them right At prettysignificant levels, probably in
a way that feels authentic,because I'm assuming that's a
tricky balance, right, becauseyou have people there, they know
they're all in on the passionand they want to feel respected
and heard and part of thecommunity.
(20:52):
Yet, as an event producerbecause I've seen budgets that
you probably had to deal withthe lunch budgets alone you have
to make money.
The logic, yeah, I've seen,it's crazy.
Uh, that's, that's for another,that's for another panel, um,
yeah, but but I think, like,just how do you balance that in
terms of like, like you want tomaximize revenue, which means
people spend a lot of money, andhow do you do that in a way
that keeps the community freshand without overdoing it?
Melissa Anelli (21:14):
It's incredibly hard, I'm not going to lie.
Putting on an event in New York, especially BroadwayCon, is
super expensive.
It's mostly subsid by the wholeof business we do so.
You know, Brabacon itself issort of a, is it like?
Barely it can't buy price, evenevery year, and we just are
happy with that for now.
(21:34):
Obviously we want it to growand you can't really grow unless
you profit.
But you know it's a struggle.
Of course we have to.
We want to keep prices as lowas we can, but we want to make
sure we take in the most we canto make the event great.
Um, we've actually lowered theprice of the main barbicon
ticket quite a bit over theyears.
(21:55):
The first year it was a 250ticket and that was just what we
felt safe with doing our firstyou know event in new york.
Um, we brought it down to likewhat normal convention prices
are.
You know you want to balance,to balance.
There is an entrance point foreverybody, there's a student
ticket, there's an entrancepoint.
You know that's reachable, kindof like what you would pay for
(22:16):
a Broadway show, and then it'slike you'd be leaving finance on
the, you'd be leaving money onthe table if you don't offer
experiences that people arewilling to pay for, and then
that money helps fuel the restof the event.
So it's really important.
So we're so grateful to thepeople who support us and by
(22:37):
buying those higher ticketlevels they make a huge
difference in what we're able todo.
Damian Bazadona (22:40):
Yeah, well, as we I know, peter, I'm respectful
of time I I wanted.
I wanted just to sort of end inthe lane of sort of the future
of fandom and and really thefuture of and I don't want to
because I didn't get intodigital stuff.
There's a whole bunch of otherquestions we had here but I want
to because we're spending somuch time.
Your, your lane really is likethe in-person, the raw kind of
(23:04):
fan experience, which is whatunifies a lot of our clients,
that in-venue experience.
What does the future look like?
What do you think in terms of?
How does technology impact it?
But if you want to go threeyears down the road, five years
down the road, how do you thinkit'll change it?
Or do you think it'll be like?
Will technology better connectpeople while they're there?
Will it extend the relationshipfurther?
(23:24):
Is it like?
I don't know?
Does it have?
Ai is playing a role in thesevague questions, but just how do
you think about it?
Melissa Anelli (23:38):
I mean, we're very lucky in that what we do is
a little bit resistant to thekind of maybe ravages that AI is
going to bring to a lot ofindustries.
I also think there was a bigpush for everything to go hybrid
, every event to go hybrid,during COVID.
I don't think that'snecessarily going to be the case
.
Obviously, doing more hybrid,doing more things on the
internet, is great because it'saccessible.
There's a difference.
(24:08):
There's a difference in comingtogether and meeting people and
it stokes your enthusiasm in away that is really hard to
replace.
So actually, I think that allthe technology advances will
push people more to havingspecialized go and make sure you
go out to the world and meetpeople who love what you love,
because we all spend so much ofour time now just sitting in
(24:30):
front of our computers that itis even more special to be able
to go and touch and feel andtalk to people and realize
you're not alone in the world.
It really does make a hugedifference.
A mark of success for me atevery single event I've ever
done is about Saturday night,late in the evening or late in
(24:53):
the day or whatever time it'sending.
That's kind of like day two.
I kind of just walk around alittle bit and I just take it in
, I just watch people.
I watch people laughing andconnecting, and sometimes we
have a concert or something sothey're dancing etc.
Um, and that is always for methe fuel that keeps, keeps going
for the year, because you knowyou work for a whole year on
(25:15):
this one, on this one event.
Um, this couple of days thathave to go great, um, so I'm I'm
actually feeling like thesetouchstone moments are going to
become even more important asour world gets more and more
isolated because of technologyum, I know, peter, we're at time
I just before I sort of myfinal words, and this is to say
(25:36):
melissa and I go, I don't knowhow many years ago.
Damian Bazadona (25:38):
Pretty, we go back pretty far and your, your
endurance, uh on on fandom andand I believe what you said
before in terms of how peopleperceive the business of fans,
like the hardcore fans and likethat perception has changed and
you were on it, you were in itbefore it changed, and then you
rode through a pandemic to whichwe've had multiple calls that
(26:00):
were very scary moments in timegoing what is this all going to
look like?
And you've held the enduranceto carry through, which is
remarkably impressive.
So I appreciate you taking thetime for this, but I have just
great admiration for yourbusiness and your perspective on
all this, so I thank you.
Melissa Anelli (26:14):
I appreciate all the help that you've taken, all
those calls when things arereally scary, Damn it.
But I really I appreciateeverything you do to keep people
asking these questions andhaving these talks.
Damian Bazadona (26:29):
Thank you.
Peter Yagecic (26:31):
That's going to do it for this episode of Fandom
Unpacked the podcast.
If you liked what you heard,please be sure to leave us a
review on Apple Podcasts.
Find out how to join us livefor an upcoming recording at
SituationLivecom slash fan.
We'll see you next time, truebelievers.
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Ridiculous History
History is beautiful, brutal and, often, ridiculous. Join Ben Bowlin and Noel Brown as they dive into some of the weirdest stories from across the span of human civilization in Ridiculous History, a podcast by iHeartRadio.