June 6, 2025 • 48 mins
Originally released on Tim Cynova’s podcast, Work Shouldn’t Suck, this episode of FARSIGHT Chats, delves into the significance of coaching in fostering leadership skills, particularly through the lens of equity, diversity, inclusion, and anti-oppression (EDIA). Host of FARSIGHT Chats, Farah Bala, shares her personal and professional journey, emphasizing the importance of values-based coaching. The conversation includes insights on the distinctions between coaching, mentoring, and therapy, as well as the role of identity in coaching relationships. Farah discusses the necessity of continuous self-care for coaches and the impact of a diverse perspective in coaching. She also provides guidance on selecting and interviewing potential coaches and highlights the value of coaching skills for leaders. Resources and certification programs are recommended for those interested in developing coaching skills. This episode serves as a comprehensive guide for anyone seeking to understand, engage in, or grow through coaching as a powerful tool for inclusive and conscious leadership
| KEY TOPICS DISCUSSED |
COACHING PHILOSOPHY & PRACTICE
- Definition: Coaching is present- and future-focused, helping clients reach their goals through thought partnership and self-discovery.
- Distinction:
- Therapy: Past-focused, aims to heal.
- Mentorship: Mentor shares experiences; coach centers on the client.
- Management: Often task- and agenda-driven; coaching is person- and growth-driven.
- Who It’s For: Not limited to executives. Anyone seeking personal or professional development can benefit.
VALUES-BASED & INCLUSIVE COACHING
- Core Lens: Equity, Diversity, Inclusion, and Anti-Oppression (EDIA) are not add-ons—they are integral to leadership and coaching.
- Personal Perspective: Farah draws on lived experience as a Persian-Indian American woman to inform her equity lens.
- Cultural Competency: Coaches with diverse identities or experiences can bring vital nuance, but shared identity isn’t always required—it depends on client needs and goals.
CHOOSING A COACH
- Interview multiple coaches to assess alignment.
- Ask about background, approach, certifications (preferably ICF-accredited), and relevant experience.
- Consider identity, but prioritize connection, trust, and expertise.
TEAM & ORGANIZATIONAL COACHING
- Coaching supports trust-building, conflict resolution, strategic alignment, and inclusive leadership development.
- A coach can help cultivate “healthy conflict” and provide objective, outside perspectives to improve team dynamics.
COACHING SKILLS FOR LEADERS
- Leaders can adopt coaching practices without certification:
- Listen deeply
- Ask open-ended questions
- Reflect back
- Resist problem-solving too quickly
- Core skills foster psychological safety and team empowerment.
TRAINING & RESOURCES
- Recommended coach training programs: iPEC, Co-Active (CTI), Columbia University, all ICF-affiliated.
- Suggested activities: Take improv or storytelling classes to build presence, empathy, and communication.
- Explore Coaching for Everyone, a nonprofit offering subsidized coaching and training for BIPOC individuals.
SELF-CARE & ETHICS
- Coaches must maintain boundaries and care practices to stay effective and avoid harm.
- Every coach should have a coach and engage in continual reflection and learning.
| SHOW NOTES |
00:00 Intro to FARSIGHT Chats
02:00 Introducing Farah’s Background
04:00 What is
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Welcome to Farsight Chats, your guideto navigating complex and important
conversations on workplace culture.
I'm your host, Farah Bala,founder and CEO of Farsight.
We specialize in leadership andorganizational development, focusing
on equity, diversity, and inclusionas core leadership competencies.
(00:23):
Join us in these conversationsthat aim to foster understanding,
growth, and positive change.
Today, we continue the conversationon coaching with something different.
We're bringing you an episode ofthe Work Shouldn't Suck podcast,
hosted by nonprofit executiveand consultant, Tim Sanova.
His nonprofit by the same name, WorkShouldn't Suck, what a great title,
(00:45):
by the way, refines human resourceswith creative and innovative solutions.
All of their work is rooted in values.
So, of course, I said yes to havingthis conversation with him on the
topic of values based coaching.
I wanted to bring you this episodeso you can get to hear more
about my coaching philosophy.
I share examples that cite notonly the impact of coaching,
(01:09):
but also the responsibility thatleadership coaches have to approach
the process with an EDIA mindset.
That's Equity, Diversity,Inclusion, and Anti Oppression.
Also, if you're just getting introducedto coaching, I walk you through all the
steps involved in picking the right coach.
And if you are looking to embark on acoaching career, I'll walk you through
(01:30):
what to think about and prioritizewhen picking an appropriate program.
So, as you listen in today,I'll invite you to consider
what training and skill building would youlike to see in today's coaching programs.
And if you're engaged in coachingas a client, what's been your
biggest takeaway from the process?
And lastly, if you're a coach yourself,how are you continuing your own education
(01:54):
to ensure you are staying current andrelevant with the leadership skills
needed for today's work environments?
Join unlearning in today'sepisode of Farsight Chats
Hi, I'm Tim Sunnova and welcome to WorkShouldn Suck, a podcast about well,
(02:19):
that in this episode, I'm excited toconnect with the amazing Farra Bala.
Farra is an intercultural leadershipand communications specialist, coach
and speaker, her agency foresight.
Focuses on leadership in organizationaldevelopment that prioritizes
equity, diversity, inclusion,and anti oppression practices.
(02:42):
She facilitates and leads individual andgroup programs globally for fortune 500
companies to nonprofit organizations.
With clients that include C suites,emerging leaders, creatives, and
entrepreneurs in wide ranging sectorsfrom finance to law, technology to
media, entertainment, and beyond.
Farah is also a faculty coach at multiplelearning and development institutions.
(03:06):
and believes equity and inclusion arefoundational pillars for effective
leadership and communication.
And it's this last piece that I'mparticularly excited to explore during
our conversation today, having been askedby countless people over the last several
years if I know any coaches who centerequity and inclusion in their practice.
You can find more about Farah inthe Farsight Agency in our bio
(03:28):
linked in the episode description.
So let's get going.
Farah, welcome to the podcast.
Thank you, Tim.
Thank you for that introduction.
And thank you for having me.
I'm very excited aboutour conversation today.
And before we really dive in,why don't we just start with
how do you typically introduceyourself and the work that you do?
I like to introduce myselfthrough story and identity.
(03:51):
My ancestry is Persian.
I grew up in India.
I was born in Lagos, Nigeria, andnow I live in the United States.
And so hyphenated identity.
And I think that is complimentedby my current existence, which is a
hyphenated intersectional trajectoryof experience and career passing.
I moved to the States to study theater.
(04:12):
I have a background, a parallel journeyas a performer, producer, and arts
educator using tools of theater andimprovisation and learning environments.
Starting off in the public schools ofNew York City and then transferring
that to doing the same work throughthe same techniques in national
volunteering initiatives and professionalcompanies literally all over the world.
(04:34):
Where I am today is I use all of that inmy work as a leadership and organizational
consultant and coach through Far Sight.
I think where I am now is reallyconnecting all of these dots of
how do we connect leadership?
To creating healthy work cultures throughhaving equitable, inclusive lens to how we
(04:56):
build communities within our workplaces.
For me, I see the intersectionof identity with the intersection
of everything that I do.
I'm also an executive coach.
I should say that, right?
Given, given the topic at hand,I am a certified executive coach.
And yes, my focus is buildingsocially conscious leaders.
(05:16):
And speaking of coaching, as I mentionedin the introduction to this episode,
it's something we've talked offline.
I'm excited about those who centervalues, especially values of equity,
inclusion, justice, anti racism, antioppression in their coaching practice.
But before we actually really dig intothat, maybe we should pull up from the
page first and start with what exactly iscoaching and how does a coach differ from
(05:40):
a mentor or a manager or even a therapist?
Great question, Tim.
Yes, that's how I startevery potential client call.
Let's start with what is coaching.
The way I like to put it is theprocess of coaching is about starting
from where you're at and lookingahead to where you want to be or
(06:01):
what the goals are for the future.
You're starting as a presentand you move to the future.
The process is about clearing the pathto one's goals, addressing anything
that might be getting in the way.
learning more about oneself asneeded if needed along the way.
But the whole process of coachingis let's get you to who you want to
be or where you want to be in termsof whoever is looking for a coach.
(06:25):
The difference.
So let's start with therapy.
Therapy starts from thepresent and looks backwards.
It goes into the past to understand why.
Understanding, where one has comefrom or why am I the way I am,
what has shaped me, et cetera.
The goal is really to reconcile the past,to be more conscious in the present.
(06:46):
And with coaching, we are startingfrom the present to look ahead.
That does not mean that wedon't step into the past.
Sometimes we do need to step into thepast because of stories that we might
have created for ourselves or narrativesthat have been driving us, that we've
not necessarily interrogated, we've notnecessarily asked ourselves, is this
belief, is this thought process or valuesystem truly mine based on who I am today?
(07:10):
Or is it something that occurreddecades ago and that I just
assumed to be true of me today?
Sometimes it's the case that itis true and sometimes it isn't.
So we do step back, but thegoal is not to stay in the past.
The goal is to reconcile anythingabout the past, to move ahead.
You mentioned mentorship.
A mentor mentee relationshipis all about the mentor.
(07:31):
It's all about their journey,their experiences, their successes,
their failures, and the mentee islearning through their stories.
In a coaching relationship, it'sall about the coachee or the client.
It is not about the coach.
I always say I am only effectiveif I am on your journey,
my client's journey, right?
(07:53):
That means that I'm notcoming in with my stories.
I'm not coming in with my successesor failures or what has worked
for me because it's not about me.
It's about the client, who they are, whothey wish to be and where they've been.
And so coaching, I call it a thoughtpartnership to achieve the client's goals.
I sometimes say it's a brain expansion.
(08:13):
Two sets of neural pathways trying tosolve for something can be exponentially
more effective and adventurous in a goodway than one set of neural pathways.
What are the distinctionswere there manager?
A lot of the work that we do is todevelop leaders and managers to be
effective coaches to their team members.
(08:34):
Let me go to the default role ofmanager that has been perpetuated
through across industries andorganizations that a manager gets work
done from their team members, right?
It's all about projects, deadlines,deliverables, accountability.
There are some developmentalgoals within that.
But it's all very task and work related.
(08:58):
And managers also come with their agendas.
Even if a team member is being developed,it's through the lens of either.
A manager's divisions or organizationsagenda, while your team member
might be growing and developing,they might be growing via a slice
or a side row of something muchbigger than who they're made up of.
(09:18):
I feel like there's a perceptionthat coaches are only for quote
unquote, big time executives.
You know, it's like the C suitesthat get coaches and as someone
who's personally benefited andhad the privilege of being able to
work with a coach in the workplace.
In particular, when our organizationwas going through a period of change
and I needed that outside perspectiveand lens and mirror, and I definitely
(09:39):
wasn't a big time executive.
I know that perception is incorrect.
You've worked with big timeexecutives and like everyone across
the spectrum of sectors and roles.
Who typically works with the coach?
How do they work with the coach?
And what are some of thethings they're working on?
So you're saying whois coaching for, right?
Is it only for executives?
No, I always say if you canbenefit from a coach, get a coach.
(10:01):
And I also say every coach shouldhave a coach for multiple reasons.
The coaching industry is widespread.
You have everything from executivecoaching to career coaching to
presentation coaching to lifecoaching, even in the workplace,
sometimes health and fitness coaching.
There is always a niche,leadership coaching.
(10:22):
So if you take career,leadership, executive coaching,
they have a lot of overlaps.
They have a lot of synergies.
What can you bring to a coaching process?
It's anything from, I need to upscale,I'm looking for a coach specifically to
develop my HR lens within an organization,because that's one of my aspirations and
(10:44):
the feedback that I'm getting currentlyis that I'm not quite there yet.
I want to get some, not training per se,but how can I work with a coach to expand
my current perspective skillset expertisetowards getting to that position.
Some people come for, Hey, Iam a brand new leader and I
have no idea what I'm doing.
(11:04):
I was really good at what I did,which is why I got this promotion.
And now I'm suddenly a people leader.
I have never managed people before.
How do I do that?
Sometimes organizations sponsorcoaching in terms of this is a
really high performer, but theircommunication skills are lacking.
They really just need to work on that.
We have high level executives and Csuites come through to say there is a
(11:27):
lot going on and I just need a space.
I need a thought partner.
I need to just work through strategy.
So there is so much that you can bringto a coaching relationship and there's
really nothing that's off the table.
You could be coming to me fora solid executive coaching
engagement, and we might start theconversation with something that
(11:49):
happened at home or a challengethat you're facing with the kids.
And I always say that the personal andthe professional are very integrated.
They are not separate.
We are wired to think that theyare right, like my personal self
is here, my work self is here,but each informs the other.
And because of that, a lot ofhow we show up in one space
is how we show up in another.
(12:09):
So there are so manytransferable skills in that way.
I just had someone come to mesaying, I'm over a year in my job.
I'm settled in, and I know I'mgoing to be here for a little
longer, but I want to start lookingahead in terms of trajectory.
And so once to get into a coachingengagement to just explore what's next.
A little bit of strategy, a little bit ofmapping out how we get there, et cetera.
(12:33):
Given the topic of this conversation,sometimes I've had a few white leaders
come to me in the last few yearsto say, Hey, I need to do better as
a leader within the organization.
I don't know what I don't know.
And so I just need a safe space to unpack.
I'm hearing about privilege.
I'm hearing about whiteness.
I don't know what that is, orthe patriarchy and masculinity.
(12:54):
And I just need a space to processthat, to unpack that and get tools
of how we do things differently.
Or how I can be a more effectiveleader, how I can create more inclusion,
belonging, psychological safetyfor my team, for my organization.
Let's dive in a little bit more intothat point you were just talking
about where working with white guysin the organization about things
(13:17):
that they might not know about.
I mentioned in the intro that, well,certainly since the summer of 2020, I've
received a lot of inquiries about ifI knew coaches that centered equity,
inclusion, anti racism in their practice.
And this is something that you do.
And I'm curious how that informs yourapproach to coaching that might be
(13:40):
different than someone who doesn't.
I get asked this question a lot, Tim,and I didn't learn to integrate it.
I am a Persian Indian, now American, lightskinned woman living in the United States.
In my first three months in thecountry, I was in the lobby of my
graduate school, and a very wellmeaning person told me, Farah, you're
(14:04):
gonna be working twice as hard aseveryone else because in this country,
you are considered a woman of color.
Race was ascribed to me at that time.
I was much younger, verynaive, right eye, bushy tail.
And I was like, okay, I'll do that.
I'll work twice as hard as everyone else.
So when you live with that, when you aretold that, When the ceiling has already
(14:27):
been set for you, you're living it.
It's not outside of who I am.
A lot of work that we're doingwith our clients right now is how
do you cultivate an equity lens?
How do you cultivate an EDI lens?
Also, I should say for yourlisteners, we use EDI equity,
diversity, inclusion, anti repression.
So when I say EDI, that's what I mean.
(14:49):
How do you cultivate that lensacross all areas of your work?
For me, it's my lived experience thatcultivated it . I didn't have to go do
a training to understand diversity, tounderstand what it is like to be excluded.
I'm just talking from arace perspective, right?
(15:09):
You could say the samefrom a gender perspective.
You can say the same froman LGBTQ plus perspective.
You can say the same from aneurodiverse or disability perspective.
The groups that have been historicallymarginalized don't have the opportunity
to have that outside of themselves.
You just have it becauseyou are living it.
(15:30):
I'm not choosing to show up asa woman of color, but that's
how I am being perceived.
And so that the melding startshappening and now I own it
and I lead with it with pride.
And that is why I start with identity.
My origins, what I call the simpleorigin geographical story, because
having lived and worked where I haveand being treated in different ways,
(15:53):
depending where I'm at, you just have it.
For me, my interest was how doI integrate that into what I
have learned as a facilitator?
How do I integrate that intowhat I've learned as a coach?
And so that's what hasalways been exciting for me.
And that is why I created Farsightbecause for me, it was always separate.
(16:15):
You talk about unconscious bias butyou're not necessarily connecting it
to how biases have created systems ofoppression within which there is so much
harm and ceiling level setting that hasbeen caused, that is very limiting to
certain populations more than others.
Or doing a communication workshopwhere my colleagues who might not be
(16:36):
women or might not be people of color,might not notice certain nuances or
pick up on certain cultural aspects.
I'm not saying that you only have to bea person of color to have a DEI lens, but
since you're asking me, it's who I am.
It's what I had lived.
It's my lived experiences, myobservations, my aspirations of who we
can be collectively as a humanity thatinform the EDI lens to all of the work.
(17:03):
And which is why, for me, it's acore belief that Leadership is not
separate from equity, diversity,inclusion, anti oppression.
It's all connected,but we have been wired.
We have been taught it is different.
Something else that I tell ourclients, especially when we're doing
strategy work with them, is thathistorically organizations have been
(17:24):
built with your strategy, your valuesystem, your mission, your budgeting,
all of that has been considered.
And EDI concepts or systemswere not considered.
And then you started buildingsomething and a quarter along the
way, sometimes halfway along the way,someone said, Oh, what about diversity?
Oh, what about inclusion?
(17:45):
It's like, Oh yeah, we need that.
So let's , slap it on something that'salready been built and has roots.
And so then that becomes a bandaid and theadhesive of that bandaid will wear off.
Work has not been done to createroots for that new initiative.
And that's why we're stillhaving these conversations.
That's why we're still doing thiswork because the adhesive has worn
(18:08):
off over and over and over again.
I'm talking about theorganizational space right now.
Let's localize it in a coachingengagement, the value of someone
being with a coach who brings inthat equity lens, who brings in.
The inclusion belonging diversity lens.
And if they are building themselvesup as a leader, if they are looking to
(18:31):
be more effective, if they're lookingto grow their people, leadership
skills, that coaching engagementis going to help them build those
roots of analysis from the ground up.
And that is the value.
Of that one on one time that you mightbe a really effective leader in terms
of getting the bottom line aligningwith organizational strategy, community
(18:53):
engagement, whatever else that willrequires you to, and if this comes
across as a gap, or if you realize it'sa gap and you want to develop it, a
coaching relationship can be really,really helpful in building those roots.
So that it's not an adhesivethat you can actually grow those
competencies moving forward.
2013 when the organization I waswith started our work in earnest
(19:16):
around anti racism, anti oppression.
Well, the very first things thefacilitator said was, if you're a
white person, don't go to peopleof color to answer your questions.
Don't further oppress thepeople who are already oppressed
to help you figure it out.
Go to other white people who might furtheralong in the journey where you might be.
And as I think about the work thatyou do as a coach, and also when I was
(19:37):
going through my training as a mediator,they talked about how a mediator is a
neutral party, but the act of mediationIsn't a neutral impact on the mediator.
I imagine that might be thecase in coaching relationships.
When I think about care, when Ithink about wellbeing, when I think
about built in versus band aid, whenI think about how you center these
values in your work, how does thatplay out in your coaching practice?
(20:01):
When you talked about the example of afew years ago, white folk were told don't
go to people of color for your questions.
May I just dig into that a little bit.
Please, yeah.
That was a specific thing that ourfacilitator who came in specifically , it
was focused a year on anti oppression.
We started our workfocused on anti oppression.
That was one of the very first things asit preceded the work that then went into
(20:24):
race based caucusing in the workplace.
But these are the places where youshould have those conversations.
I want to add some context andnuance because I don't consider
that statement absolute truth.
This might be a controversialthing that I just said.
And let me say why.
In the work that I have done inmy own lived experiences, every
identity of privilege has thatsame level of responsibility.
(20:48):
So it's not just white folk.
It's CIS folk like me, able bodied folklike me, neurotypical folk like me.
Now US citizen, right?
Citizenship being a space ofEnglish speakers, et cetera.
I think it's really important that whenwe talk about this work, every single
(21:08):
person, including people of color, havea responsibility because every single
person holds levels of privilege,accountability to doing something better.
Now, within that lived experienceshave a spectrum of harm that has been
caused trauma that has been embeddedand perpetuated And a reversal of that
(21:32):
and or I should say a reversal of that.
And again, I can only speak for myselfas someone who identifies as an immigrant
in this country, you know, has seenevery immigrant status from student
to citizen and seen how privilege,autonomy, agency just increases as you
get to that ultimate top in quotes.
(21:55):
It's the same thing growing upas , a person of color, as an
artist who's now a business owner.
That's a whole otherlevel of responsibility.
That's a whole other level ofaccountability and privilege that comes
with, what do I do now with what I have?
If I could stress, cause I want to useevery opportunity I can to do this.
That.
It's on every single person.
(22:15):
It's not just on white folks.
Now, I want to address what you said.
I had a fascinating experiencein 2020 when my black and brown
friends, Asian friends, were on aspectrum of capability of how much
they could give off themselves.
There was a percentage thatwas like, do not come to me.
(22:37):
I am just taking care of myself rightnow because I cannot do, or my family.
I am worried about my safety,or I am just shutting off and I
am not plugging into the news.
And then there were others who wereengaging with each other online in
big spaces saying, Hey, if you havequestions, me as a black person, me
(22:59):
as a brown person, me as an Asianperson, Want to help you understand
or want to help you get to the bottomof whatever your questions are.
So use me as a resource.
Goes without saying, we were allhurting in 2020 and there were certain
spaces again when we are localizing itto specific organizations or specific
(23:19):
teams when we know, a lot of callingout was happening versus calling in.
A lot of people were speaking out.
And so there is alwaysgoing to be a spectrum.
I would hate for anyone to assumethat me as this identity can
never go to this identity, right?
Because it's seeing it in sucha siloed black and white way.
No pun intended to black and white.
But rather, if we could engage our owncuriosity of who can I go to and why and
(23:45):
check our own assumptions of oh, I cango to Tim for this, but really can I?
Have I checked in with him about it?
Is he open to having this conversation?
Those moments of co creation of apossibility of what else we can talk
about is where I think the work is.
You know, everyone talksabout the work, do the work.
I think it's in these micro moments ofhow we make choices of who we go to,
(24:08):
how we make choices of who we get to bevulnerable with and say, Hey, I messed
up, or this is very obvious to everyoneelse around me, I am still not clear about
this, or I have resistances to X, Y, Z.
And again, bringing it back tothis is where you can bring all of
that into a coaching conversation.
You can bring all of that into the space.
(24:29):
There's also something here that youraised where part of the magic, if you
will, of working with coaches is thatthey bring different perspectives.
I wanted the same perspective, I wouldjust sit around and think to myself,
but that's the beauty where like everyway diversity thought experience,
lived experience, everything makes forricher teams and experiences in life.
(24:50):
And to be able to have those allowsus to see things differently and come
up with different solutions and cocreate them at this time in our lives,
we're like, The same old, same old isnot working and there is no template
for what we're trying to do when we'retrying to co create thriving futures.
So I think that's a particularlyreally important piece of it.
How do you pick your coach?
(25:11):
There are certain identities that wantthe same identity and that is okay.
There's no right way to pick your coach.
And there's also no right path to,as a South Asian or a mixed race
woman, that's the coach I want,because there's so much else.
It's based on what your goals are.
It's based on who they are,what their expertise is.
(25:33):
And then the most importantis the magic that happens when
you first connect with them.
Anyone who comes to me inquiring,I always say, please interview
at least three coaches.
Before you come to your decision,because it's a very intimate relationship
that you're going to get into.
And you really want tofeel a connection there.
I'll give you an example.
There was someone who came to mewho is I think one level down from
(25:59):
CEO right now at his organization.
He just did this big joba couple of years ago.
And as he was interviewing afew people, I told him this when
we spoke and he is a black man.
I said, interview a whole bunch of people.
And then he came back and he was like,I have a little bit of a conundrum
because I loved our conversation.
I can see us working together.
And I met this other coach who hasbeen CEO, and I want to be CEO.
(26:23):
And he can lay down the math forme, and I need help choosing.
And of course, I cannot help anyone.
They should always choose their coach.
And that person was a white man.
I give you this example as identities playa role, but they are not the only factor.
Now conversely, you might have aperson of color who is carrying
(26:44):
a lot of workplace trauma.
And they want to heal fromthat, speaking of care.
Because of the trauma that they'reholding, they are finding themselves
limited, and they're not ableto get to their full potential.
They're not able to seethemselves set up for success.
And so they want to do some work.
And the only person they will trustis a coach from that identity.
(27:06):
And that is okay.
So it's very situational.
I might be of a certain identitylooking to do more community
work within the same identity.
So then I will go looking fora coach with that identity.
There's a lot of context.
There's no, if I am a Indian person,I only go to an Indian coach.
If I am a black person, Ionly go to a black coach.
(27:29):
There is an intersection complexspectrum of various criteria
that you want to make the mostthoughtful decision going into it.
I always encourage people.
It's not right and wrong.
It's about staying intentional,staying thoughtful.
And it will likely be the best decisionfor you if you give it that due diligence.
What kind of questions do you encouragepeople to ask potential coaches?
(27:52):
Everything.
Ask them about their experience.
Ask them about case studies,clients that they have or training.
I'll divest a little bit.
When I got certified, peoplecautioned me around, make sure you get
accredited with a credible institution.
(28:13):
Now there is plenty out there.
There is a lot more, the coachingindustry is at a whole other level.
There was a big push for.
Do your due diligence in getting aprogram that really gives you the
training because you have someone'slife and future in your hand.
I would ask clients to ask peoplethey're interviewing where they went.
(28:38):
Do your own research on solid,good, accredited institutions.
Some people love assessments.
The coaching process can be veryassessment heavy for people who like that.
In terms of getting a snapshot of whothey are or a snapshot of a situation or
a snapshot of some 360 feedback, then youwant someone who brings that to the table.
You might be stepping into an executiverole and you are family planning.
(29:02):
How important is it that your coach beable to hold both of those spaces for you?
Ask all of the questions and sometimesthat's the beauty of interviewing
various coaches because a coach mightdisclose something that you might want
to go back to the other one and say,Hey, what is your perspective on this?
Get curious about the coach in a way thathelps you see if they can support you.
(29:25):
Not to test them, not to pull therug up from under them, none of that.
The other thing that I would alsoencourage is when coming to a
call, be ready to really share whyyou're there, because that's when
the magic happens with your coach.
I always say as a coach, I am ledby the client because remember
what I said, it's not my agenda.
I'm not mapping out your journey for you.
(29:46):
You tell me where you want tobe and then we map it together.
So for a potential coach to be effectivewith you, the more you share about who
you are, what your challenges are, whereyour growth opportunities are that you
see, and also what your resistances are,the more that coach can be effective in
how they show up to you when the ways inwhich they might be able to support you
(30:09):
that can then help you make your decision.
We've focused primarily onindividual coaching relationships.
One of the things that I've heardincreasingly over the past couple of
years with hybrid workplaces or entirelyvirtual workplaces where teams have
never met each other, coaches who areworking with teams and organizations
to help them be better teams together.
(30:30):
Can you talk a little bit more aboutthat dynamic and for teams who are
like, Oh, actually, that sounds likea pretty good idea for our team.
We might need one.
How do you suggest people goabout approaching that aspect?
Getting an understanding ofwhat you want out of that.
How do you want your coach to help you?
I've done work with teams where it'sjust like we're new to each other.
(30:51):
We're in a transitional year andwe need to build trust and align on
how we communicate with each other.
Sometimes it is to pseudo mediation.
We have new leadership and the restof the leaders have just come out of a
very traumatic leadership experience.
And so we need some realignment.
(31:12):
I'm just giving instances andsometimes it's all connected.
Sometimes it's all strategy.
We need to create an EDI strategy andwe're working with the not just EDI
committee, but also the sponsor leadershipwho is moving the initiative forward.
It might not just be an EDI strategy.
It can be an organizational strategy.
It can be a transitionstrategy, change management.
(31:34):
Change management is another big topicwhere teams can really leverage a coach.
Conflict resolution, I think forme, is woven into the building of
trust, building of how we communicatewith each other, role clarification.
How do we deal with conflict?
One of the big things, organizationally,I say, to create a true space of
(31:54):
intention and belonging, you have tohave a culture of healthy conflict.
And what that means is, if you andI are working together, I have to be
able to tell you I disagree with you.
You and I have to be able to getinto a heated conversation and
then check in about the kids orwhatever else we know of each other.
The possibility of healthy conflictonly comes from a better foundation
(32:17):
of that trust and relationality.
For me, that is foundational toall of the work that comes after.
You might have individualleaders, but collectively there
is no united leadership voice.
That can really be detrimental to theperception of leadership within an
organization, building that unity,exploring and then refining a collective
(32:38):
voice of who do we want to be asinfluencers in this organization.
We might have our own goals, butthen what are our team goals?
And how then do we execute them?
How do we activate them?
That's where having an executive coachat the table can be really helpful.
And outside perspective.
My goodness.
I love being the fly on the wall.
(32:59):
I love seeing something in a differentway or just seeing something that
someone's never heard before.
I call that breaking the brain orstretching those neural pathways because
that's where the growth opportunity is.
And so there is so much value to bringingsomeone from the outside, even just as
observer sometimes, you know, beforethe work actually starts of how our
(33:21):
meetings run, how is space taken, whospeaks and who doesn't all of those
observations, having that third partycome in, assess the current dynamics,
and then make recommendations after, andthen work with the team towards those
recommendations can be my gosh, so useful.
And so how do you take care ofyourself when you're the person at the
(33:43):
nexus point of those conversations.
I learned the practice of selfcare through my journey as a
coach, facilitator, and consultant.
Holding space is what we do,whether it's for an individual,
whether it's for a room.
And pre pandemic, I was travelingall the time, living out of
this carry on at airports, andI had to create my own practices.
(34:09):
for replenishing whatI call my boundaries.
So I would not scheduleclients on a travel day.
It would be administrative work.
I never do back to back sessions withclients, whether we have a client
workshop that is three or four hourslong, there is no client delivery
happening for the rest of the day.
(34:31):
If it's a coaching day, thereare significant breaks in between.
And then for my own self, my own personalnourishment, whatever that is, whether
it's being with community, whetherit's health and fitness, et cetera,
I learned that very quickly becauseself care was not something that.
Now, I think people growing upin this time are hearing it a
lot more, but I never had that.
(34:52):
I was like, I'm fine, . And then mybody just didn't keep up , and so I
was like, Oh, if I don't take care ofmyself, I'm not effective at what I do.
Okay.
That's reason enough tostart taking care of myself.
So I always say I learnedabout the practice.
of self care, because we've learnedabout self care, we hear it all the
time, but what it takes to practiceit and activate it, growing in
(35:15):
this work, and it is essential.
Remember when I saidevery coach needs a coach?
That's part of the self care piece.
In that moment, I, or you, will havehad to show up, do what is needed to
be effective and have a successfuloutcome for the client, right?
Because remember, it's notabout you in that space.
But then what are you going to dowith everything that came up for you?
(35:37):
You might have been triggered.
Something might have happened.
Like you're talking about divorce.
You might have witnessed something,a dynamic in the room that brought up
something about your own early life.
And if you do not deal, resolve,that then starts influencing
how we start showing up.
Something that I say to my teamas well is that to do this work,
(36:00):
we have to have a growth mindset.
All of this work is around growthmindset, by the way, right?
Our call to action at Farsight is domore, do better, do it differently.
So it's just assuming that thereis something that we can do more.
There's something that we cando differently, and there's
something that we can do better.
And so it's that perpetualcuriosity of how do we get there?
What could I have donedifferently next time?
(36:23):
And that piece, I think, sets thefoundation for both care for self, but
also then being able to show someone elsethat perspective and that possibility.
A lot of the times, Tim, the initialpart of a coaching process is
just slowing someone down becausethey're in the mode of putting out
(36:44):
fires and dealing with emergencies.
And it's like, all right, let'sjust For lack of a better word,
calm things down, slow things down.
The other side to this is without selfcare, making decisions that cause harm.
In the science of unconscious bias,we already know that when you are
stressed, when you are running againsta deadline, when lack of sleep, lack of
(37:07):
nutrition, all of those moments startthe automated neural pathways to kick in.
We want to do what we know.
And when we only decide within therealm of what we know, that's when
intrusion happens because we arenot considering other possibilities.
Oh my God.
Self care, self care,self care all the way
. . We talked a lot about a coaching engagement.
(37:29):
I've said, every coach needs a coach.
Everyone can avail of coaching,should avail of coaching.
I want to also emphasize that youcould have the coaching skills to be
an effective leader without necessarilygoing through a coaching certification.
And those skills are being adarn good listener, learning
to respond versus react.
(37:51):
And just being effusive about yourcuriosity, being a really good,
curious investigator of those openended, what, why, how, explain
this, describe this, being able toreflect back what you're hearing.
Those are core coaching skills.
Because your audience is likelyorganizations and leaders
who are wanting to do better.
(38:12):
We actually did a podcast episode rightnow called Coaching for Inclusion.
Unpacking why, if you are aleader of people, you need to
be honing your coaching skills.
Because it is as much your job to getthe deliverable out of your team as it
is to invest in their success, investin their pathways to who they want
(38:34):
to be in the future, whether withinthe organization or outside of it.
And those are separatecoaching conversations to have.
Yes, the value of a coaching engagementand working with a coach and leaders
get real good at asking curiousquestions, especially questions the
answers to which you don't know.
Get really good at just staying silent andletting the other person talk it through
(38:57):
and coming back with some key reflections.
Get really good at notproblem solving all the time.
Your role as leaders is to problemsolve, but as a coach, it's to
help the other person come totheir conclusion on their own.
It builds agency.
It builds confidence.
It builds trust.
There is so much ROI to having ahandful of coaching skills that you
(39:19):
can get really good at that can helpyour team come together cohesively.
And you being an effective people leader.
For those who are thinkingthat sounds awesome.
What are your suggestions for someresources that they should check out?
Books, classes, certification programsto get better at maybe the skills of
coaching without actually maybe becominga, an officially certified coach.
(39:42):
Let's start with certification programs.
There are a handful that I had heardof then that I still hear of now.
There is IPAC.
That's where I went institution forprofessional excellence in coaching.
There is coach training Institute,and now they're co active.
Columbia university has anexecutive coaching program.
If none of them, my recommendationis to find a program that is in some
(40:07):
form affiliated with ICF, which is atthe international coach federation.
There are other centralized standards forcoaching, but I'm personally affiliated
with ICF because it has a code of ethics.
It has a really.
solid, formal process thatevery coach of the years to.
For your clients they want to makesure that they're in good hands.
(40:27):
So you want to make sure thatyou have done the due diligence
to have someone feel that way.
And also, when you go to a program,you're going to work on yourself.
Friends, it's work.
Something that we say is we don'thave our clients do anything.
We're not willing to do ourselves.
There is huge value to doing that work.
What I call unpacking thebaggage, identifying what is
(40:49):
where and then repacking itinto luggage, organized luggage.
Do improv.
You're going to meetsome incredible humans.
You're going to build your own confidenceas a speaker, and you're going to learn
some foundational principles of whatit takes to listen, what it takes to
build with what someone else has said.
(41:09):
What it takes to make the best lemonadeout of whatever lemons you've been dealt.
I am the product of artseducation, so there is always
going to be a plug for that.
But seriously, go take improv.
The way you listen, the wayyou communicate will change
and shift for the better.
I have a colleague who's a veryaccomplished fundraiser in New York City.
(41:31):
And I was asking her, how didyou get to do what you do?
She's like, the best thing I ever did formy career was I took an improv course.
To your point, like you're going into alot of different situations that you're
not sure how they're going to respondand that ability to listen and Reflect.
I love that.
That it probably is useful forany career in any profession
to take an improv course.
Oh my gosh , transferable skills.
(41:53):
Like the best lawyer fighting acase will have benefited from drama
school, from being in the school play.
These are foundational skills.
improv skills or foundational skills.
Go to the moth, do some storytelling work.
You will learn aboutcrafting your message.
You will learn about influence.
You will learn about communicating ina way that your audience can hear it.
(42:14):
In improv, you will hear about gettingout of your own head and getting
curious about everyone else in the room.
All of that is again, foundationalfor how you show up to your
team, how you show up to people.
So far, I imagine people who are listeningare thinking who might be new to this.
Like how much does coaching cost?
What does a typicalrelationship look like?
(42:34):
Is it four sessions?
Is it four months?
I can imagine that the spectrumis wide on this one with costs and
kind of relationships and frequency.
What are maybe some more typicalarrangements for people who might
be new to coaching relationships?
I can only speak for myself.
So let me tell you how I'veevolved the coaching process.
(42:55):
I started doing coaching by the hour.
First, it was a set of sessions.
And then as I was building my ownexperience around it, I realized
I now had data out workingwith clients of what felt good.
And for me, an hour just wasn't enough.
Then I started shifting that,that I don't do an hour sessions.
(43:16):
Then it went into, we are beinglimited by the number of sessions.
And then I had data around,okay, what is the minimum amount
of time it takes for shifts tohappen based on a client's goals?
So for me, first I landed at three months.
And now I'm closer to six months andthe minimum I will work with someone.
And it's a time commitment becauseof the work that's involved.
(43:38):
Now I just have these packages inplace that are not necessarily per
session or by the hour, it's eitherthree, six or 12 month processes.
And it's more now six, nineand 12 month processes.
For returning clients who have a solidfoundation then it's just brushing up.
And so that looks different.
That can be on a per session basis or aneed based basis of like, I need to talk
(44:04):
through something or I might be up fora different role and sit through that or
something happened at work, et cetera.
Pre pandemic, and I'm surethis is the case now too.
There are different frameworks.
I'm just sharing mine.
There was a framework where.
You just do a half dayintensive with someone.
And so then that looks different withteams, especially it could become
(44:25):
a half day off site or a full dayoff site or a two day off site.
You're still with the coach,but it has a different field.
It has the intensiveness feel to it.
I have peers and colleagueswho do it by the hour.
It could be weekly, bimonthly, quarterly,again, depending on the relationship, who
the coach and client are, how the coachworks and level of work that's needed.
(44:48):
The other thing is coachescome with certifications.
So people might dopersonality tests like Hogan.
Then my God, there are so many others.
I do the energy leadershipassessment and look through that
of what assessments might be goodfor you based on where you're at.
Do your coaches do 360 feedback?
That's another big one as well,especially for creating being an
(45:12):
intrusive leader, and that's somethingI'm always telling clients at some
point, we're going to do a 360 whereyou are asking your people for feedback.
And then we curate that whole processso that the goals start shifting and
changing as needed based on what isneeded of them from their people.
Cost really varies.
I love the way you started thisconversation, Tim, that only executives
(45:34):
need to have coaching engagements.
The one thing I find myselfsaying more and more to leaders
is ask your organization whatkind of professional development
budgeting that you can avail of.
I have had clients say my organization ismatching this or they are sponsoring this
(45:56):
or I'll pay for it and they'll reimburseme or they're doing 50 percent of it.
So definitely ask.
And then in the nonprofitsector, there are always grants
for professional development.
So do some of that due diligence,do some of that research, especially
when you're working with a coach.
With a marginalized identity, justknowing that you want to be fair
(46:16):
in how you show up with a coach aswell, because it is their livelihood.
That's something that Iwill always emphasize.
Now, in terms of accessibility formore coaching, I want to share this
organization called Coaching for Everyone.
One of their founders, VictorMaguire was out our recent
Coaching for Inclusion episode.
Coaching for Everyone is a nonprofitorganization that does two things.
(46:39):
One, it offers subsidizedcoaching to BIPOC leaders.
And then they also partner withthe likes of CTI, Coach Training
Institute, and IPAC to offer coachingcertification for providers who are
interested at, again, a subsidized price.
I love everything about this organization.
(47:00):
I love that this space exists becauseI am sending people there, folk who
are looking for coaching, folk whoare interested in pursuing coaching.
I just wanted to share more aboutthis organization specifically.
As we bring the plane in for alanding on our conversation today,
where do you want to land it?
For anyone who wantsto do more, learn more.
(47:22):
We have Farsight Friday.
When you go to our website,you will see a tab for it.
And we are constantly bringing in gueststo talk about the topics of our time,
which is all infused back to our ownmission of building conscious leaders.
So if you ever curious about a specificissue or a topic or an identity,
go check out some of our episodes.
We're in our fourth season rightnow and see if something piques
(47:43):
your curiosity and hopefully youlearned something along the way.
Our time has flown by.
Thank you so much for your openness, yourinsights, your advice, your genuineness.
It's always wonderful to connect.
And thank you so muchfor being on the podcast.
We continue the exploration ofworkplace culture with our next episode.
(48:05):
Gen Z voices for a more equitable world.
Thank you for listening to Farsight Chats.
I hope that this conversation is thestart to future ones you have with your
colleagues, teams, and communities.
Subscribe now to Farsight Chatswherever you get your podcasts.
And don't forget to follow us onInstagram and Facebook at GoFarsight,
(48:26):
LinkedIn at the Farsight Agency, andcheck out our website, gofarsight.
com, to know more aboutwho we are and what we do.
Thank you for answering the call todo more, do better, and do different.
Welcome to Farsight Chats, your guideto navigating complex and important
conversations on workplace culture.
I'm your host, Farah Bala,founder and CEO of Farsight.
We specialize in leadership andorganizational development, focusing
on equity, diversity, and inclusionas core leadership competencies.
(00:23):
Join us in these conversationsthat aim to foster understanding,
growth, and positive change.
Today, we continue the conversationon coaching with something different.
We're bringing you an episode ofthe Work Shouldn't Suck podcast,
hosted by nonprofit executiveand consultant, Tim Sanova.
His nonprofit by the same name, WorkShouldn't Suck, what a great title,
(00:45):
by the way, refines human resourceswith creative and innovative solutions.
All of their work is rooted in values.
So, of course, I said yes to havingthis conversation with him on the
topic of values based coaching.
I wanted to bring you this episodeso you can get to hear more
about my coaching philosophy.
I share examples that cite notonly the impact of coaching,
(01:09):
but also the responsibility thatleadership coaches have to approach
the process with an EDIA mindset.
That's Equity, Diversity,Inclusion, and Anti Oppression.
Also, if you're just getting introducedto coaching, I walk you through all the
steps involved in picking the right coach.
And if you are looking to embark on acoaching career, I'll walk you through
(01:30):
what to think about and prioritizewhen picking an appropriate program.
So, as you listen in today,I'll invite you to consider
what training and skill building would youlike to see in today's coaching programs.
And if you're engaged in coachingas a client, what's been your
biggest takeaway from the process?
And lastly, if you're a coach yourself,how are you continuing your own education
(01:54):
to ensure you are staying current andrelevant with the leadership skills
needed for today's work environments?
Join unlearning in today'sepisode of Farsight Chats
Hi, I'm Tim Sunnova and welcome to WorkShouldn Suck, a podcast about well,
(02:19):
that in this episode, I'm excited toconnect with the amazing Farra Bala.
Farra is an intercultural leadershipand communications specialist, coach
and speaker, her agency foresight.
Focuses on leadership in organizationaldevelopment that prioritizes
equity, diversity, inclusion,and anti oppression practices.
(02:42):
She facilitates and leads individual andgroup programs globally for fortune 500
companies to nonprofit organizations.
With clients that include C suites,emerging leaders, creatives, and
entrepreneurs in wide ranging sectorsfrom finance to law, technology to
media, entertainment, and beyond.
Farah is also a faculty coach at multiplelearning and development institutions.
(03:06):
and believes equity and inclusion arefoundational pillars for effective
leadership and communication.
And it's this last piece that I'mparticularly excited to explore during
our conversation today, having been askedby countless people over the last several
years if I know any coaches who centerequity and inclusion in their practice.
You can find more about Farah inthe Farsight Agency in our bio
(03:28):
linked in the episode description.
So let's get going.
Farah, welcome to the podcast.
Thank you, Tim.
Thank you for that introduction.
And thank you for having me.
I'm very excited aboutour conversation today.
And before we really dive in,why don't we just start with
how do you typically introduceyourself and the work that you do?
I like to introduce myselfthrough story and identity.
(03:51):
My ancestry is Persian.
I grew up in India.
I was born in Lagos, Nigeria, andnow I live in the United States.
And so hyphenated identity.
And I think that is complimentedby my current existence, which is a
hyphenated intersectional trajectoryof experience and career passing.
I moved to the States to study theater.
(04:12):
I have a background, a parallel journeyas a performer, producer, and arts
educator using tools of theater andimprovisation and learning environments.
Starting off in the public schools ofNew York City and then transferring
that to doing the same work throughthe same techniques in national
volunteering initiatives and professionalcompanies literally all over the world.
(04:34):
Where I am today is I use all of that inmy work as a leadership and organizational
consultant and coach through Far Sight.
I think where I am now is reallyconnecting all of these dots of
how do we connect leadership?
To creating healthy work cultures throughhaving equitable, inclusive lens to how we
(04:56):
build communities within our workplaces.
For me, I see the intersectionof identity with the intersection
of everything that I do.
I'm also an executive coach.
I should say that, right?
Given, given the topic at hand,I am a certified executive coach.
And yes, my focus is buildingsocially conscious leaders.
(05:16):
And speaking of coaching, as I mentionedin the introduction to this episode,
it's something we've talked offline.
I'm excited about those who centervalues, especially values of equity,
inclusion, justice, anti racism, antioppression in their coaching practice.
But before we actually really dig intothat, maybe we should pull up from the
page first and start with what exactly iscoaching and how does a coach differ from
(05:40):
a mentor or a manager or even a therapist?
Great question, Tim.
Yes, that's how I startevery potential client call.
Let's start with what is coaching.
The way I like to put it is theprocess of coaching is about starting
from where you're at and lookingahead to where you want to be or
(06:01):
what the goals are for the future.
You're starting as a presentand you move to the future.
The process is about clearing the pathto one's goals, addressing anything
that might be getting in the way.
learning more about oneself asneeded if needed along the way.
But the whole process of coachingis let's get you to who you want to
be or where you want to be in termsof whoever is looking for a coach.
(06:25):
The difference.
So let's start with therapy.
Therapy starts from thepresent and looks backwards.
It goes into the past to understand why.
Understanding, where one has comefrom or why am I the way I am,
what has shaped me, et cetera.
The goal is really to reconcile the past,to be more conscious in the present.
(06:46):
And with coaching, we are startingfrom the present to look ahead.
That does not mean that wedon't step into the past.
Sometimes we do need to step into thepast because of stories that we might
have created for ourselves or narrativesthat have been driving us, that we've
not necessarily interrogated, we've notnecessarily asked ourselves, is this
belief, is this thought process or valuesystem truly mine based on who I am today?
(07:10):
Or is it something that occurreddecades ago and that I just
assumed to be true of me today?
Sometimes it's the case that itis true and sometimes it isn't.
So we do step back, but thegoal is not to stay in the past.
The goal is to reconcile anythingabout the past, to move ahead.
You mentioned mentorship.
A mentor mentee relationshipis all about the mentor.
(07:31):
It's all about their journey,their experiences, their successes,
their failures, and the mentee islearning through their stories.
In a coaching relationship, it'sall about the coachee or the client.
It is not about the coach.
I always say I am only effectiveif I am on your journey,
my client's journey, right?
(07:53):
That means that I'm notcoming in with my stories.
I'm not coming in with my successesor failures or what has worked
for me because it's not about me.
It's about the client, who they are, whothey wish to be and where they've been.
And so coaching, I call it a thoughtpartnership to achieve the client's goals.
I sometimes say it's a brain expansion.
(08:13):
Two sets of neural pathways trying tosolve for something can be exponentially
more effective and adventurous in a goodway than one set of neural pathways.
What are the distinctionswere there manager?
A lot of the work that we do is todevelop leaders and managers to be
effective coaches to their team members.
(08:34):
Let me go to the default role ofmanager that has been perpetuated
through across industries andorganizations that a manager gets work
done from their team members, right?
It's all about projects, deadlines,deliverables, accountability.
There are some developmentalgoals within that.
But it's all very task and work related.
(08:58):
And managers also come with their agendas.
Even if a team member is being developed,it's through the lens of either.
A manager's divisions or organizationsagenda, while your team member
might be growing and developing,they might be growing via a slice
or a side row of something muchbigger than who they're made up of.
(09:18):
I feel like there's a perceptionthat coaches are only for quote
unquote, big time executives.
You know, it's like the C suitesthat get coaches and as someone
who's personally benefited andhad the privilege of being able to
work with a coach in the workplace.
In particular, when our organizationwas going through a period of change
and I needed that outside perspectiveand lens and mirror, and I definitely
(09:39):
wasn't a big time executive.
I know that perception is incorrect.
You've worked with big timeexecutives and like everyone across
the spectrum of sectors and roles.
Who typically works with the coach?
How do they work with the coach?
And what are some of thethings they're working on?
So you're saying whois coaching for, right?
Is it only for executives?
No, I always say if you canbenefit from a coach, get a coach.
(10:01):
And I also say every coach shouldhave a coach for multiple reasons.
The coaching industry is widespread.
You have everything from executivecoaching to career coaching to
presentation coaching to lifecoaching, even in the workplace,
sometimes health and fitness coaching.
There is always a niche,leadership coaching.
(10:22):
So if you take career,leadership, executive coaching,
they have a lot of overlaps.
They have a lot of synergies.
What can you bring to a coaching process?
It's anything from, I need to upscale,I'm looking for a coach specifically to
develop my HR lens within an organization,because that's one of my aspirations and
(10:44):
the feedback that I'm getting currentlyis that I'm not quite there yet.
I want to get some, not training per se,but how can I work with a coach to expand
my current perspective skillset expertisetowards getting to that position.
Some people come for, Hey, Iam a brand new leader and I
have no idea what I'm doing.
(11:04):
I was really good at what I did,which is why I got this promotion.
And now I'm suddenly a people leader.
I have never managed people before.
How do I do that?
Sometimes organizations sponsorcoaching in terms of this is a
really high performer, but theircommunication skills are lacking.
They really just need to work on that.
We have high level executives and Csuites come through to say there is a
(11:27):
lot going on and I just need a space.
I need a thought partner.
I need to just work through strategy.
So there is so much that you can bringto a coaching relationship and there's
really nothing that's off the table.
You could be coming to me fora solid executive coaching
engagement, and we might start theconversation with something that
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happened at home or a challengethat you're facing with the kids.
And I always say that the personal andthe professional are very integrated.
They are not separate.
We are wired to think that theyare right, like my personal self
is here, my work self is here,but each informs the other.
And because of that, a lot ofhow we show up in one space
is how we show up in another.
(12:09):
So there are so manytransferable skills in that way.
I just had someone come to mesaying, I'm over a year in my job.
I'm settled in, and I know I'mgoing to be here for a little
longer, but I want to start lookingahead in terms of trajectory.
And so once to get into a coachingengagement to just explore what's next.
A little bit of strategy, a little bit ofmapping out how we get there, et cetera.
(12:33):
Given the topic of this conversation,sometimes I've had a few white leaders
come to me in the last few yearsto say, Hey, I need to do better as
a leader within the organization.
I don't know what I don't know.
And so I just need a safe space to unpack.
I'm hearing about privilege.
I'm hearing about whiteness.
I don't know what that is, orthe patriarchy and masculinity.
(12:54):
And I just need a space to processthat, to unpack that and get tools
of how we do things differently.
Or how I can be a more effectiveleader, how I can create more inclusion,
belonging, psychological safetyfor my team, for my organization.
Let's dive in a little bit more intothat point you were just talking
about where working with white guysin the organization about things
(13:17):
that they might not know about.
I mentioned in the intro that, well,certainly since the summer of 2020, I've
received a lot of inquiries about ifI knew coaches that centered equity,
inclusion, anti racism in their practice.
And this is something that you do.
And I'm curious how that informs yourapproach to coaching that might be
(13:40):
different than someone who doesn't.
I get asked this question a lot, Tim,and I didn't learn to integrate it.
I am a Persian Indian, now American, lightskinned woman living in the United States.
In my first three months in thecountry, I was in the lobby of my
graduate school, and a very wellmeaning person told me, Farah, you're
(14:04):
gonna be working twice as hard aseveryone else because in this country,
you are considered a woman of color.
Race was ascribed to me at that time.
I was much younger, verynaive, right eye, bushy tail.
And I was like, okay, I'll do that.
I'll work twice as hard as everyone else.
So when you live with that, when you aretold that, When the ceiling has already
(14:27):
been set for you, you're living it.
It's not outside of who I am.
A lot of work that we're doingwith our clients right now is how
do you cultivate an equity lens?
How do you cultivate an EDI lens?
Also, I should say for yourlisteners, we use EDI equity,
diversity, inclusion, anti repression.
So when I say EDI, that's what I mean.
(14:49):
How do you cultivate that lensacross all areas of your work?
For me, it's my lived experience thatcultivated it . I didn't have to go do
a training to understand diversity, tounderstand what it is like to be excluded.
I'm just talking from arace perspective, right?
(15:09):
You could say the samefrom a gender perspective.
You can say the same froman LGBTQ plus perspective.
You can say the same from aneurodiverse or disability perspective.
The groups that have been historicallymarginalized don't have the opportunity
to have that outside of themselves.
You just have it becauseyou are living it.
(15:30):
I'm not choosing to show up asa woman of color, but that's
how I am being perceived.
And so that the melding startshappening and now I own it
and I lead with it with pride.
And that is why I start with identity.
My origins, what I call the simpleorigin geographical story, because
having lived and worked where I haveand being treated in different ways,
(15:53):
depending where I'm at, you just have it.
For me, my interest was how doI integrate that into what I
have learned as a facilitator?
How do I integrate that intowhat I've learned as a coach?
And so that's what hasalways been exciting for me.
And that is why I created Farsightbecause for me, it was always separate.
(16:15):
You talk about unconscious bias butyou're not necessarily connecting it
to how biases have created systems ofoppression within which there is so much
harm and ceiling level setting that hasbeen caused, that is very limiting to
certain populations more than others.
Or doing a communication workshopwhere my colleagues who might not be
(16:36):
women or might not be people of color,might not notice certain nuances or
pick up on certain cultural aspects.
I'm not saying that you only have to bea person of color to have a DEI lens, but
since you're asking me, it's who I am.
It's what I had lived.
It's my lived experiences, myobservations, my aspirations of who we
can be collectively as a humanity thatinform the EDI lens to all of the work.
(17:03):
And which is why, for me, it's acore belief that Leadership is not
separate from equity, diversity,inclusion, anti oppression.
It's all connected,but we have been wired.
We have been taught it is different.
Something else that I tell ourclients, especially when we're doing
strategy work with them, is thathistorically organizations have been
(17:24):
built with your strategy, your valuesystem, your mission, your budgeting,
all of that has been considered.
And EDI concepts or systemswere not considered.
And then you started buildingsomething and a quarter along the
way, sometimes halfway along the way,someone said, Oh, what about diversity?
Oh, what about inclusion?
(17:45):
It's like, Oh yeah, we need that.
So let's , slap it on something that'salready been built and has roots.
And so then that becomes a bandaid and theadhesive of that bandaid will wear off.
Work has not been done to createroots for that new initiative.
And that's why we're stillhaving these conversations.
That's why we're still doing thiswork because the adhesive has worn
(18:08):
off over and over and over again.
I'm talking about theorganizational space right now.
Let's localize it in a coachingengagement, the value of someone
being with a coach who brings inthat equity lens, who brings in.
The inclusion belonging diversity lens.
And if they are building themselvesup as a leader, if they are looking to
(18:31):
be more effective, if they're lookingto grow their people, leadership
skills, that coaching engagementis going to help them build those
roots of analysis from the ground up.
And that is the value.
Of that one on one time that you mightbe a really effective leader in terms
of getting the bottom line aligningwith organizational strategy, community
(18:53):
engagement, whatever else that willrequires you to, and if this comes
across as a gap, or if you realize it'sa gap and you want to develop it, a
coaching relationship can be really,really helpful in building those roots.
So that it's not an adhesivethat you can actually grow those
competencies moving forward.
2013 when the organization I waswith started our work in earnest
(19:16):
around anti racism, anti oppression.
Well, the very first things thefacilitator said was, if you're a
white person, don't go to peopleof color to answer your questions.
Don't further oppress thepeople who are already oppressed
to help you figure it out.
Go to other white people who might furtheralong in the journey where you might be.
And as I think about the work thatyou do as a coach, and also when I was
(19:37):
going through my training as a mediator,they talked about how a mediator is a
neutral party, but the act of mediationIsn't a neutral impact on the mediator.
I imagine that might be thecase in coaching relationships.
When I think about care, when Ithink about wellbeing, when I think
about built in versus band aid, whenI think about how you center these
values in your work, how does thatplay out in your coaching practice?
(20:01):
When you talked about the example of afew years ago, white folk were told don't
go to people of color for your questions.
May I just dig into that a little bit.
Please, yeah.
That was a specific thing that ourfacilitator who came in specifically , it
was focused a year on anti oppression.
We started our workfocused on anti oppression.
That was one of the very first things asit preceded the work that then went into
(20:24):
race based caucusing in the workplace.
But these are the places where youshould have those conversations.
I want to add some context andnuance because I don't consider
that statement absolute truth.
This might be a controversialthing that I just said.
And let me say why.
In the work that I have done inmy own lived experiences, every
identity of privilege has thatsame level of responsibility.
(20:48):
So it's not just white folk.
It's CIS folk like me, able bodied folklike me, neurotypical folk like me.
Now US citizen, right?
Citizenship being a space ofEnglish speakers, et cetera.
I think it's really important that whenwe talk about this work, every single
(21:08):
person, including people of color, havea responsibility because every single
person holds levels of privilege,accountability to doing something better.
Now, within that lived experienceshave a spectrum of harm that has been
caused trauma that has been embeddedand perpetuated And a reversal of that
(21:32):
and or I should say a reversal of that.
And again, I can only speak for myselfas someone who identifies as an immigrant
in this country, you know, has seenevery immigrant status from student
to citizen and seen how privilege,autonomy, agency just increases as you
get to that ultimate top in quotes.
(21:55):
It's the same thing growing upas , a person of color, as an
artist who's now a business owner.
That's a whole otherlevel of responsibility.
That's a whole other level ofaccountability and privilege that comes
with, what do I do now with what I have?
If I could stress, cause I want to useevery opportunity I can to do this.
That.
It's on every single person.
(22:15):
It's not just on white folks.
Now, I want to address what you said.
I had a fascinating experiencein 2020 when my black and brown
friends, Asian friends, were on aspectrum of capability of how much
they could give off themselves.
There was a percentage thatwas like, do not come to me.
(22:37):
I am just taking care of myself rightnow because I cannot do, or my family.
I am worried about my safety,or I am just shutting off and I
am not plugging into the news.
And then there were others who wereengaging with each other online in
big spaces saying, Hey, if you havequestions, me as a black person, me
(22:59):
as a brown person, me as an Asianperson, Want to help you understand
or want to help you get to the bottomof whatever your questions are.
So use me as a resource.
Goes without saying, we were allhurting in 2020 and there were certain
spaces again when we are localizing itto specific organizations or specific
(23:19):
teams when we know, a lot of callingout was happening versus calling in.
A lot of people were speaking out.
And so there is alwaysgoing to be a spectrum.
I would hate for anyone to assumethat me as this identity can
never go to this identity, right?
Because it's seeing it in sucha siloed black and white way.
No pun intended to black and white.
But rather, if we could engage our owncuriosity of who can I go to and why and
(23:45):
check our own assumptions of oh, I cango to Tim for this, but really can I?
Have I checked in with him about it?
Is he open to having this conversation?
Those moments of co creation of apossibility of what else we can talk
about is where I think the work is.
You know, everyone talksabout the work, do the work.
I think it's in these micro moments ofhow we make choices of who we go to,
(24:08):
how we make choices of who we get to bevulnerable with and say, Hey, I messed
up, or this is very obvious to everyoneelse around me, I am still not clear about
this, or I have resistances to X, Y, Z.
And again, bringing it back tothis is where you can bring all of
that into a coaching conversation.
You can bring all of that into the space.
(24:29):
There's also something here that youraised where part of the magic, if you
will, of working with coaches is thatthey bring different perspectives.
I wanted the same perspective, I wouldjust sit around and think to myself,
but that's the beauty where like everyway diversity thought experience,
lived experience, everything makes forricher teams and experiences in life.
(24:50):
And to be able to have those allowsus to see things differently and come
up with different solutions and cocreate them at this time in our lives,
we're like, The same old, same old isnot working and there is no template
for what we're trying to do when we'retrying to co create thriving futures.
So I think that's a particularlyreally important piece of it.
How do you pick your coach?
(25:11):
There are certain identities that wantthe same identity and that is okay.
There's no right way to pick your coach.
And there's also no right path to,as a South Asian or a mixed race
woman, that's the coach I want,because there's so much else.
It's based on what your goals are.
It's based on who they are,what their expertise is.
(25:33):
And then the most importantis the magic that happens when
you first connect with them.
Anyone who comes to me inquiring,I always say, please interview
at least three coaches.
Before you come to your decision,because it's a very intimate relationship
that you're going to get into.
And you really want tofeel a connection there.
I'll give you an example.
There was someone who came to mewho is I think one level down from
(25:59):
CEO right now at his organization.
He just did this big joba couple of years ago.
And as he was interviewing afew people, I told him this when
we spoke and he is a black man.
I said, interview a whole bunch of people.
And then he came back and he was like,I have a little bit of a conundrum
because I loved our conversation.
I can see us working together.
And I met this other coach who hasbeen CEO, and I want to be CEO.
(26:23):
And he can lay down the math forme, and I need help choosing.
And of course, I cannot help anyone.
They should always choose their coach.
And that person was a white man.
I give you this example as identities playa role, but they are not the only factor.
Now conversely, you might have aperson of color who is carrying
(26:44):
a lot of workplace trauma.
And they want to heal fromthat, speaking of care.
Because of the trauma that they'reholding, they are finding themselves
limited, and they're not ableto get to their full potential.
They're not able to seethemselves set up for success.
And so they want to do some work.
And the only person they will trustis a coach from that identity.
(27:06):
And that is okay.
So it's very situational.
I might be of a certain identitylooking to do more community
work within the same identity.
So then I will go looking fora coach with that identity.
There's a lot of context.
There's no, if I am a Indian person,I only go to an Indian coach.
If I am a black person, Ionly go to a black coach.
(27:29):
There is an intersection complexspectrum of various criteria
that you want to make the mostthoughtful decision going into it.
I always encourage people.
It's not right and wrong.
It's about staying intentional,staying thoughtful.
And it will likely be the best decisionfor you if you give it that due diligence.
What kind of questions do you encouragepeople to ask potential coaches?
(27:52):
Everything.
Ask them about their experience.
Ask them about case studies,clients that they have or training.
I'll divest a little bit.
When I got certified, peoplecautioned me around, make sure you get
accredited with a credible institution.
(28:13):
Now there is plenty out there.
There is a lot more, the coachingindustry is at a whole other level.
There was a big push for.
Do your due diligence in getting aprogram that really gives you the
training because you have someone'slife and future in your hand.
I would ask clients to ask peoplethey're interviewing where they went.
(28:38):
Do your own research on solid,good, accredited institutions.
Some people love assessments.
The coaching process can be veryassessment heavy for people who like that.
In terms of getting a snapshot of whothey are or a snapshot of a situation or
a snapshot of some 360 feedback, then youwant someone who brings that to the table.
You might be stepping into an executiverole and you are family planning.
(29:02):
How important is it that your coach beable to hold both of those spaces for you?
Ask all of the questions and sometimesthat's the beauty of interviewing
various coaches because a coach mightdisclose something that you might want
to go back to the other one and say,Hey, what is your perspective on this?
Get curious about the coach in a way thathelps you see if they can support you.
(29:25):
Not to test them, not to pull therug up from under them, none of that.
The other thing that I would alsoencourage is when coming to a
call, be ready to really share whyyou're there, because that's when
the magic happens with your coach.
I always say as a coach, I am ledby the client because remember
what I said, it's not my agenda.
I'm not mapping out your journey for you.
(29:46):
You tell me where you want tobe and then we map it together.
So for a potential coach to be effectivewith you, the more you share about who
you are, what your challenges are, whereyour growth opportunities are that you
see, and also what your resistances are,the more that coach can be effective in
how they show up to you when the ways inwhich they might be able to support you
(30:09):
that can then help you make your decision.
We've focused primarily onindividual coaching relationships.
One of the things that I've heardincreasingly over the past couple of
years with hybrid workplaces or entirelyvirtual workplaces where teams have
never met each other, coaches who areworking with teams and organizations
to help them be better teams together.
(30:30):
Can you talk a little bit more aboutthat dynamic and for teams who are
like, Oh, actually, that sounds likea pretty good idea for our team.
We might need one.
How do you suggest people goabout approaching that aspect?
Getting an understanding ofwhat you want out of that.
How do you want your coach to help you?
I've done work with teams where it'sjust like we're new to each other.
(30:51):
We're in a transitional year andwe need to build trust and align on
how we communicate with each other.
Sometimes it is to pseudo mediation.
We have new leadership and the restof the leaders have just come out of a
very traumatic leadership experience.
And so we need some realignment.
(31:12):
I'm just giving instances andsometimes it's all connected.
Sometimes it's all strategy.
We need to create an EDI strategy andwe're working with the not just EDI
committee, but also the sponsor leadershipwho is moving the initiative forward.
It might not just be an EDI strategy.
It can be an organizational strategy.
It can be a transitionstrategy, change management.
(31:34):
Change management is another big topicwhere teams can really leverage a coach.
Conflict resolution, I think forme, is woven into the building of
trust, building of how we communicatewith each other, role clarification.
How do we deal with conflict?
One of the big things, organizationally,I say, to create a true space of
(31:54):
intention and belonging, you have tohave a culture of healthy conflict.
And what that means is, if you andI are working together, I have to be
able to tell you I disagree with you.
You and I have to be able to getinto a heated conversation and
then check in about the kids orwhatever else we know of each other.
The possibility of healthy conflictonly comes from a better foundation
(32:17):
of that trust and relationality.
For me, that is foundational toall of the work that comes after.
You might have individualleaders, but collectively there
is no united leadership voice.
That can really be detrimental to theperception of leadership within an
organization, building that unity,exploring and then refining a collective
(32:38):
voice of who do we want to be asinfluencers in this organization.
We might have our own goals, butthen what are our team goals?
And how then do we execute them?
How do we activate them?
That's where having an executive coachat the table can be really helpful.
And outside perspective.
My goodness.
I love being the fly on the wall.
(32:59):
I love seeing something in a differentway or just seeing something that
someone's never heard before.
I call that breaking the brain orstretching those neural pathways because
that's where the growth opportunity is.
And so there is so much value to bringingsomeone from the outside, even just as
observer sometimes, you know, beforethe work actually starts of how our
(33:21):
meetings run, how is space taken, whospeaks and who doesn't all of those
observations, having that third partycome in, assess the current dynamics,
and then make recommendations after, andthen work with the team towards those
recommendations can be my gosh, so useful.
And so how do you take care ofyourself when you're the person at the
(33:43):
nexus point of those conversations.
I learned the practice of selfcare through my journey as a
coach, facilitator, and consultant.
Holding space is what we do,whether it's for an individual,
whether it's for a room.
And pre pandemic, I was travelingall the time, living out of
this carry on at airports, andI had to create my own practices.
(34:09):
for replenishing whatI call my boundaries.
So I would not scheduleclients on a travel day.
It would be administrative work.
I never do back to back sessions withclients, whether we have a client
workshop that is three or four hourslong, there is no client delivery
happening for the rest of the day.
(34:31):
If it's a coaching day, thereare significant breaks in between.
And then for my own self, my own personalnourishment, whatever that is, whether
it's being with community, whetherit's health and fitness, et cetera,
I learned that very quickly becauseself care was not something that.
Now, I think people growing upin this time are hearing it a
lot more, but I never had that.
(34:52):
I was like, I'm fine, . And then mybody just didn't keep up , and so I
was like, Oh, if I don't take care ofmyself, I'm not effective at what I do.
Okay.
That's reason enough tostart taking care of myself.
So I always say I learnedabout the practice.
of self care, because we've learnedabout self care, we hear it all the
time, but what it takes to practiceit and activate it, growing in
(35:15):
this work, and it is essential.
Remember when I saidevery coach needs a coach?
That's part of the self care piece.
In that moment, I, or you, will havehad to show up, do what is needed to
be effective and have a successfuloutcome for the client, right?
Because remember, it's notabout you in that space.
But then what are you going to dowith everything that came up for you?
(35:37):
You might have been triggered.
Something might have happened.
Like you're talking about divorce.
You might have witnessed something,a dynamic in the room that brought up
something about your own early life.
And if you do not deal, resolve,that then starts influencing
how we start showing up.
Something that I say to my teamas well is that to do this work,
(36:00):
we have to have a growth mindset.
All of this work is around growthmindset, by the way, right?
Our call to action at Farsight is domore, do better, do it differently.
So it's just assuming that thereis something that we can do more.
There's something that we cando differently, and there's
something that we can do better.
And so it's that perpetualcuriosity of how do we get there?
What could I have donedifferently next time?
(36:23):
And that piece, I think, sets thefoundation for both care for self, but
also then being able to show someone elsethat perspective and that possibility.
A lot of the times, Tim, the initialpart of a coaching process is
just slowing someone down becausethey're in the mode of putting out
(36:44):
fires and dealing with emergencies.
And it's like, all right, let'sjust For lack of a better word,
calm things down, slow things down.
The other side to this is without selfcare, making decisions that cause harm.
In the science of unconscious bias,we already know that when you are
stressed, when you are running againsta deadline, when lack of sleep, lack of
(37:07):
nutrition, all of those moments startthe automated neural pathways to kick in.
We want to do what we know.
And when we only decide within therealm of what we know, that's when
intrusion happens because we arenot considering other possibilities.
Oh my God.
Self care, self care,self care all the way
. . We talked a lot about a coaching engagement.
(37:29):
I've said, every coach needs a coach.
Everyone can avail of coaching,should avail of coaching.
I want to also emphasize that youcould have the coaching skills to be
an effective leader without necessarilygoing through a coaching certification.
And those skills are being adarn good listener, learning
to respond versus react.
(37:51):
And just being effusive about yourcuriosity, being a really good,
curious investigator of those openended, what, why, how, explain
this, describe this, being able toreflect back what you're hearing.
Those are core coaching skills.
Because your audience is likelyorganizations and leaders
who are wanting to do better.
(38:12):
We actually did a podcast episode rightnow called Coaching for Inclusion.
Unpacking why, if you are aleader of people, you need to
be honing your coaching skills.
Because it is as much your job to getthe deliverable out of your team as it
is to invest in their success, investin their pathways to who they want
(38:34):
to be in the future, whether withinthe organization or outside of it.
And those are separatecoaching conversations to have.
Yes, the value of a coaching engagementand working with a coach and leaders
get real good at asking curiousquestions, especially questions the
answers to which you don't know.
Get really good at just staying silent andletting the other person talk it through
(38:57):
and coming back with some key reflections.
Get really good at notproblem solving all the time.
Your role as leaders is to problemsolve, but as a coach, it's to
help the other person come totheir conclusion on their own.
It builds agency.
It builds confidence.
It builds trust.
There is so much ROI to having ahandful of coaching skills that you
(39:19):
can get really good at that can helpyour team come together cohesively.
And you being an effective people leader.
For those who are thinkingthat sounds awesome.
What are your suggestions for someresources that they should check out?
Books, classes, certification programsto get better at maybe the skills of
coaching without actually maybe becominga, an officially certified coach.
(39:42):
Let's start with certification programs.
There are a handful that I had heardof then that I still hear of now.
There is IPAC.
That's where I went institution forprofessional excellence in coaching.
There is coach training Institute,and now they're co active.
Columbia university has anexecutive coaching program.
If none of them, my recommendationis to find a program that is in some
(40:07):
form affiliated with ICF, which is atthe international coach federation.
There are other centralized standards forcoaching, but I'm personally affiliated
with ICF because it has a code of ethics.
It has a really.
solid, formal process thatevery coach of the years to.
For your clients they want to makesure that they're in good hands.
(40:27):
So you want to make sure thatyou have done the due diligence
to have someone feel that way.
And also, when you go to a program,you're going to work on yourself.
Friends, it's work.
Something that we say is we don'thave our clients do anything.
We're not willing to do ourselves.
There is huge value to doing that work.
What I call unpacking thebaggage, identifying what is
(40:49):
where and then repacking itinto luggage, organized luggage.
Do improv.
You're going to meetsome incredible humans.
You're going to build your own confidenceas a speaker, and you're going to learn
some foundational principles of whatit takes to listen, what it takes to
build with what someone else has said.
(41:09):
What it takes to make the best lemonadeout of whatever lemons you've been dealt.
I am the product of artseducation, so there is always
going to be a plug for that.
But seriously, go take improv.
The way you listen, the wayyou communicate will change
and shift for the better.
I have a colleague who's a veryaccomplished fundraiser in New York City.
(41:31):
And I was asking her, how didyou get to do what you do?
She's like, the best thing I ever did formy career was I took an improv course.
To your point, like you're going into alot of different situations that you're
not sure how they're going to respondand that ability to listen and Reflect.
I love that.
That it probably is useful forany career in any profession
to take an improv course.
Oh my gosh , transferable skills.
(41:53):
Like the best lawyer fighting acase will have benefited from drama
school, from being in the school play.
These are foundational skills.
improv skills or foundational skills.
Go to the moth, do some storytelling work.
You will learn aboutcrafting your message.
You will learn about influence.
You will learn about communicating ina way that your audience can hear it.
(42:14):
In improv, you will hear about gettingout of your own head and getting
curious about everyone else in the room.
All of that is again, foundationalfor how you show up to your
team, how you show up to people.
So far, I imagine people who are listeningare thinking who might be new to this.
Like how much does coaching cost?
What does a typicalrelationship look like?
(42:34):
Is it four sessions?
Is it four months?
I can imagine that the spectrumis wide on this one with costs and
kind of relationships and frequency.
What are maybe some more typicalarrangements for people who might
be new to coaching relationships?
I can only speak for myself.
So let me tell you how I'veevolved the coaching process.
(42:55):
I started doing coaching by the hour.
First, it was a set of sessions.
And then as I was building my ownexperience around it, I realized
I now had data out workingwith clients of what felt good.
And for me, an hour just wasn't enough.
Then I started shifting that,that I don't do an hour sessions.
(43:16):
Then it went into, we are beinglimited by the number of sessions.
And then I had data around,okay, what is the minimum amount
of time it takes for shifts tohappen based on a client's goals?
So for me, first I landed at three months.
And now I'm closer to six months andthe minimum I will work with someone.
And it's a time commitment becauseof the work that's involved.
(43:38):
Now I just have these packages inplace that are not necessarily per
session or by the hour, it's eitherthree, six or 12 month processes.
And it's more now six, nineand 12 month processes.
For returning clients who have a solidfoundation then it's just brushing up.
And so that looks different.
That can be on a per session basis or aneed based basis of like, I need to talk
(44:04):
through something or I might be up fora different role and sit through that or
something happened at work, et cetera.
Pre pandemic, and I'm surethis is the case now too.
There are different frameworks.
I'm just sharing mine.
There was a framework where.
You just do a half dayintensive with someone.
And so then that looks different withteams, especially it could become
(44:25):
a half day off site or a full dayoff site or a two day off site.
You're still with the coach,but it has a different field.
It has the intensiveness feel to it.
I have peers and colleagueswho do it by the hour.
It could be weekly, bimonthly, quarterly,again, depending on the relationship, who
the coach and client are, how the coachworks and level of work that's needed.
(44:48):
The other thing is coachescome with certifications.
So people might dopersonality tests like Hogan.
Then my God, there are so many others.
I do the energy leadershipassessment and look through that
of what assessments might be goodfor you based on where you're at.
Do your coaches do 360 feedback?
That's another big one as well,especially for creating being an
(45:12):
intrusive leader, and that's somethingI'm always telling clients at some
point, we're going to do a 360 whereyou are asking your people for feedback.
And then we curate that whole processso that the goals start shifting and
changing as needed based on what isneeded of them from their people.
Cost really varies.
I love the way you started thisconversation, Tim, that only executives
(45:34):
need to have coaching engagements.
The one thing I find myselfsaying more and more to leaders
is ask your organization whatkind of professional development
budgeting that you can avail of.
I have had clients say my organization ismatching this or they are sponsoring this
(45:56):
or I'll pay for it and they'll reimburseme or they're doing 50 percent of it.
So definitely ask.
And then in the nonprofitsector, there are always grants
for professional development.
So do some of that due diligence,do some of that research, especially
when you're working with a coach.
With a marginalized identity, justknowing that you want to be fair
(46:16):
in how you show up with a coach aswell, because it is their livelihood.
That's something that Iwill always emphasize.
Now, in terms of accessibility formore coaching, I want to share this
organization called Coaching for Everyone.
One of their founders, VictorMaguire was out our recent
Coaching for Inclusion episode.
Coaching for Everyone is a nonprofitorganization that does two things.
(46:39):
One, it offers subsidizedcoaching to BIPOC leaders.
And then they also partner withthe likes of CTI, Coach Training
Institute, and IPAC to offer coachingcertification for providers who are
interested at, again, a subsidized price.
I love everything about this organization.
(47:00):
I love that this space exists becauseI am sending people there, folk who
are looking for coaching, folk whoare interested in pursuing coaching.
I just wanted to share more aboutthis organization specifically.
As we bring the plane in for alanding on our conversation today,
where do you want to land it?
For anyone who wantsto do more, learn more.
(47:22):
We have Farsight Friday.
When you go to our website,you will see a tab for it.
And we are constantly bringing in gueststo talk about the topics of our time,
which is all infused back to our ownmission of building conscious leaders.
So if you ever curious about a specificissue or a topic or an identity,
go check out some of our episodes.
We're in our fourth season rightnow and see if something piques
(47:43):
your curiosity and hopefully youlearned something along the way.
Our time has flown by.
Thank you so much for your openness, yourinsights, your advice, your genuineness.
It's always wonderful to connect.
And thank you so muchfor being on the podcast.
We continue the exploration ofworkplace culture with our next episode.
(48:05):
Gen Z voices for a more equitable world.
Thank you for listening to Farsight Chats.
I hope that this conversation is thestart to future ones you have with your
colleagues, teams, and communities.
Subscribe now to Farsight Chatswherever you get your podcasts.
And don't forget to follow us onInstagram and Facebook at GoFarsight,
(48:26):
LinkedIn at the Farsight Agency, andcheck out our website, gofarsight.
com, to know more aboutwho we are and what we do.
Thank you for answering the call todo more, do better, and do different.
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