September 2, 2025 • 41 mins
Debra Enos shares her powerful journey from anger to acceptance after receiving a breast cancer diagnosis despite living what she thought was a perfectly healthy lifestyle. This conversation reveals how unforgiveness and people-pleasing tendencies can create disease in the body even when we're doing everything else "right."
• Debra, a certified nutritionist and health expert, was shocked by her breast cancer diagnosis in 2020
• Initial anger at God for not "protecting" her despite her healthy lifestyle choices
• Early environmental toxin exposure growing up on a farm created toxic burden
• The hidden connection between unforgiveness, rumination, and physical disease
• How people-pleasing creates chronic stress that can manifest as illness
• Daily forgiveness practice as essential to physical and spiritual health
• Shifting from people-pleasing to God-pleasing brings unexpected peace
• Upcoming women's retreat in Montana focused on midlife reset and healing
• The importance of changing your environment to change your health
• Finding worthiness beyond performance or others' approval
Join us in Montana for our women's retreat focused on midlife reset. Visit our website for more details on how to register for this transformative October event with limited spots available.
Women’s Wellness Retreat at The Meadows on Rock Creek in beautiful Montana! Four days of faith-based wellness, hormone balance, clean living tips, and pure restoration—plus hiking, yoga, horseback riding, and gourmet meals in luxury cabins. Spots are limited, so grab your ticket today and let’s do this together! https://themeadowsonrockcreek.com/special-events/womens-wellness-retreat/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Deb (00:00):
When I got that phone call.
Dr. Tabatha (00:02):
I was really mad, so you felt like God betrayed
you essentially.
Deb (00:06):
And it shifted my perspective.
Dr. Tabatha (00:09):
So why do you think you got breast cancer?
Deb (00:12):
Oh, that is the $10 million question.
Dr. Tabatha (00:15):
Welcome back to the Fast to Faith podcast.
I know we've been on a breakfor a minute, but I'm really
excited to be back with newtopics, new information, new
experts and a renewed passionfor bringing you the truth when
it comes to women's health.
So here's the deal.
(00:36):
You guys, I have been workingdiligently on bringing you a
faith-based summit for midlife,and we are in the works for a
in-person retreat where you cancome and work with me and some
other incredible women.
So we're gonna talk about thatin a little bit.
So stay with us and rememberthe beauty of the podcast.
(00:59):
You can push, pause and comeback to it.
You can listen to a podcastfrom three years ago, like I
love podcasts for that reason.
So listen to the whole thing.
If you have to pause and comeback, I totally understand.
But I want to introduce you toa really sweet friend of mine
that I have come to know overthis past year.
(01:20):
Her name is Debra Enos.
Welcome, deborah.
Deb (01:23):
How are you?
Oh, I am so good and it'swonderful to see you and I just
I.
I love your book and I lovethat.
I'm a big Audible fan, so Ilove that you were reading it on
Audible and I'm sure it was alot of work.
Dr. Tabatha (01:40):
Oh my gosh.
Thank you for acknowledgingthat, because it was.
They told me it should takeabout four weeks and it took
almost nine weeks, because myhouse is always noisy there is
always something going on sonine weeks.
Deb (01:57):
Wow, that's, that's committed right there, honey.
Dr. Tabatha (02:00):
Yes, it was a long process, so I'm glad you enjoyed
it.
And yes, my book is availableon Audible.
I love books on Audible becauseI talk my dog a lot and I am
like outdoors, walking, ridingmy bike, weeding the garden.
You can listen to stuff throughAudible right.
Deb (02:18):
I feel like I'd never get through a book if I didn't have
Audible.
And I'm a voracious reader, andmy husband said the other day
does it still count as readingif it's on.
Dr. Tabatha (02:32):
Audible.
I said absolutely, of course itdoes.
Oh, my goodness.
Okay, well, I just want to tellmy ladies about you really
quickly, because you have areally awesome story.
You are a certifiednutritionist awesome story.
You are a certifiednutritionist, nationally
recognized health living expertand breast cancer thriver.
So you may have seen her,ladies, on Q13, fox News, nbc or
(02:53):
News Nation, or even as the oneminute wellness coach on the
doctor's TV show.
She's also regular contributorto the Costco Connection
magazine.
But after decades of living ahealthy lifestyle, deborah was
shocked by a breast cancerdiagnosis in 2020.
So this experience led her tolaunch her powerful podcast why
(03:18):
Did I Get Cancer?
And it's helping women beeducated and protecting others
because she was just in shock.
So she's going to talk aboutthat a little bit and she has
this background in healthscience, exercise science and
nutrition.
But she needed to understand,like what was the missing piece.
(03:39):
So she blends her personalexperience and faith in such a
beautiful way.
So I know you're going to beinspired and you're going to
have some tools to really tacklewhat it means to live well and
thrive.
So welcome, debra.
I'm so excited for thisconversation.
Deb (03:55):
Oh, thank you.
I'm so excited for it too.
And yes, I'm coming up on myfive year anniversary of getting
that phone call and I, just inlooking back, I just think, oh
my gosh, that went so fast andyet it went so slow.
Dr. Tabatha (04:12):
Yes, so you were living your best life, like life
was good.
You were doing all the things.
Deb (04:20):
you were super healthy super healthy eating, organic
doing.
You know hot yoga, running halfmarathons, going to church
every Sunday, you know ladies,bible study.
I was doing all of the thingsand I was having a great life.
You know great relationships,wonderful community giving back
(04:42):
to my community.
And so when I got that phonecall, wonderful community giving
back to my community.
And so when I got that phonecall, I was really mad.
Dr. Tabatha (04:55):
To be honest, I was furious.
Deb (04:56):
It's the most angry I have ever been.
Wow, okay.
So what was going through yourhead?
Well, I was thinking okay, god,look at all the things I'm
doing for you.
I'm giving back to my community, I'm volunteering, I'm tithing,
I'm all of these things.
And when all my friends areordering margaritas and hot dogs
(05:16):
, I'm getting the organicchicken salad.
So what happened?
What happened here?
What did I miss?
So, not only was I mad at Godfor not protecting me, I was
also mad at myself, thinking twothings One, what did I miss?
And two, why was I so healthymy whole life?
(05:42):
If it, it just, you know, whenI turned 55, I got cancer.
Why not just go ahead and eatthe hot dog?
Dr. Tabatha (05:50):
Oh, wow.
So you felt like God betrayedyou essentially.
Deb (05:55):
I did.
I felt like God didn't protectme and I felt like my body
betrayed me, and I think aboutthe five half marathons.
I was a collegiate athlete.
I have been athletic my entirelife and taken really good care
of myself, even doing thingslike acupuncture and massage in
(06:16):
my 20s, knowing that was soimportant to continue to do
self-care even when you're 25and you're doing other things.
But I would go home early, goto bed.
I was taking care of myself.
So what could have possiblyhappened?
But I think out of all of thosefeelings, probably the most
(06:40):
heartbreaking was feeling likeGod wasn't for me.
Dr. Tabatha (06:45):
Yeah, so obviously you sat in that for a minute.
But then what happened?
Because you are not bitter, youhave pivoted big time I have
pivoted.
So what happened?
Deb (07:01):
Yes, well, I went about, I got my diagnosis and, and it
took a couple of weeks of justgoing to all the oncology
appointments.
You know, I felt like I, threedays a week, I was at the cancer
center and it took a couple ofweeks for them just to tell me
oh, by the way, women don't diefrom the type of cancer you have
(07:23):
.
And I thought you couldn't havetold me that two weeks ago when
I came in like, you know, justa deer in the headlights, so
that two weeks of just you know,am I going to have to do chemo,
radiation combination.
Could I die Like I love my life?
Really I'm.
You know, I was so mad at theLord and after a few days of
(07:47):
that I realized I was soheartbroken.
And it wasn't heartbroken bythe diagnosis, I was heartbroken
because I gave up myrelationship with him and I'm
not saying I didn't believe inhim anymore, I was just really
mad at God and so I just saidI'm not going to talk to you for
a little while.
I'm not going to talk to youright now.
(08:09):
I'm so mad at you that youdidn't protect me.
And I remember just being on myknees one day and I was like
Lord, I'm sorry, I'm back.
And he said I've never left.
I've never left.
I'm here.
I've never left, I'm here.
(08:36):
And that's what got me throughis knowing like I can leave and
being really angry when I'd walkthrough those big double doors
and it was also during COVID, soa lot of the time I was by
myself and my husband couldn'tgo, or my mom or, and I'd be
(08:57):
there by myself and instead oflike, looking around the room
with these angry eyes, I startedto really soften at that point
and I'd see these precious womencoming in with you know,
they're bald, they've been goingthrough chemo, they've got hats
on and wigs and I just startedpraying for them.
I wouldn't necessarily go overto them and talk to them, but I
(09:19):
would just be standing in linewaiting to check in and I'd see
a woman walk in and I would juststart praying for her and it
shifted my perspective andthat's what changed my mindset
to get through the next fivesurgeries.
Dr. Tabatha (09:34):
Wow, okay, I love that and I think that's because
you invited God back in to yourlife and he softened your heart
right he did.
Deb (09:46):
He softened my heart and it changed my perspective and it
really.
That was when everythingchanged and I feel like that's
why I'm thriving today.
And even my oncologists theywould say wow, you've got the
best attitude of anybody we'veseen.
And I thought well, let's goback to that first day when I
(10:09):
was so angry and so bitter andso mad.
But things did shift and all ofa sudden I was just gentle and
generous but focused.
Dr. Tabatha (10:20):
Yeah, and I'm so glad that you're sharing this,
because God can handle all ourfeelings.
He already knows that we can'thide anything, none of it is a
surprise.
Deb (10:32):
It's not like he's up there saying, oh my gosh, I can't
believe she got diagnosed withcancer.
Like he's.
It's not a surprise to him.
Dr. Tabatha (10:39):
Right, or that you're angry at him, so so why
do you think you got breastcancer?
Deb (10:48):
Oh, that is the $10 million question.
I, I did everything right.
When it comes to physicalself-care, let's just say I did
90% right.
I was a very early adopter intonot using deodorants with a lot
(11:09):
of toxic ingredients.
I mean, for years I just woulduse coconut oil and other things
.
I knew the risks.
Ate well, non-gmo organichomemade meals.
Ate well, non-gmo organichomemade meals.
(11:30):
But there's a couple things.
One I had a lot of early toxinexposure growing up on a farm in
the 70s and 80s and I neverreally understood that aspect of
the.
You know that we'd have cropdusters come through and you had
to stay inside for 15 minutesuntil all the chemicals went
away.
Really, 15 minutes.
Dr. Tabatha (11:51):
Right, they don't actually go away, they never go
away.
Deb (11:54):
So then we'd go back outside and play in the dirt and
all of those things.
That was the era of, you know,farmers being told roundup is
fine, it's going to increaseyour yields and there's no harm
to animals or people orenvironment and everything's
going to be fine.
Use all of these chemicals.
(12:14):
At that point, mid to late 70s,early 80s, farming was very
chemically based, at least whereI lived, and I'm sure it was
like that throughout our country, because, again, it was the
marketing.
It's not easy being a farmer.
You don't make a lot of money.
It's a lot.
It's a seven day, seven days aweek job and so you'll do
(12:37):
anything to increase your yields, especially if you know it's
not going to harm anybody rightand you know people were told,
told a story, yeah, yeah, and Iwant women listening to really
understand the gravity of it.
Dr. Tabatha (12:53):
Because you know, we flippantly say, like roundup
is killing us, or you know it'sdestroying our food.
But these organophosphates,they are chemicals, they are not
leaving our body once they arein and they are so destructive,
like it boggles my mind, that wethink, yeah, we're just trying
(13:15):
to kill the tiny little insectswith this stuff, but it's not
actually going to kill our cellsinside of us.
It's like the lies that we tellourselves to be okay with it.
You know, and you're right,like the farmers didn't know,
they're trying to make a living,they're trying to get more
(13:35):
crops and not have their cropsdestroyed by insects and things,
and so it's like we can't evenblame anybody at this point,
except you know the higher ups.
But I tell you, the worstcancers, especially like brain
cancers and muscle cancers andall of these uncommon cancers
(13:58):
that I've seen, they all camefrom the farmland.
People grew up on a farm.
Deb (14:04):
Yeah, and think about those farm workers which you know, I
was a farm worker, so thinkabout that.
I mean, there's an area verysouth of the Mississippi and I
think they call it Cancer Alleybecause it's where all of the
chemicals go to die andunfortunately they're killing
the environment and animals thathave been there for years and
(14:29):
years, and people.
So that was one piece, is Inever really understood toxins
and it wasn't really, let's behonest, it wasn't really talked
about until probably five toeight years ago.
There were a few outliers whostarted talking about talk.
Now we're talking about it alot, which I'm so grateful for.
(14:51):
And then the other piece I wouldsay was in my thought life is
that I really struggled withforgiveness.
I struggled to forgive peopleand situations and many other
(15:11):
things, and I was somebody whowould ruminate, and what I mean
by that is I would play thenegativity, even though I'm a
very positive person.
I would play the negativity.
I'd rehearse it over and over.
Well, I should have done that,or I could have done that
differently, or oh, I'm so upsetwith this person and what they
said, but I didn't have theboundaries to say, hey, you hurt
(15:37):
my feelings.
Hey, this is what happened.
Did you mean to make it soundlike that?
So I didn't have the ability atthat time in my life to really
say, hey, here's my boundary,here's how this is going to work
for me, and if it doesn't workfor you, that's fine.
But just so you know, I'mmoving you from my inner circle
(15:58):
to an outer circle because thisisn't working for me.
So I didn't have a voice to beable to do that.
Because this isn't working forme.
So I didn't have a voice to beable to do that.
And I really believe that whenwe struggle with forgiveness
which is such a gift from Godthat we can forgive others, as
he has forgiven us, it's such agift but when we struggle with
it, that lack of forgiveness hasto go someplace.
(16:20):
And for me, it really impactedmy health.
Dr. Tabatha (16:27):
Yeah, oh, my goodness.
I hope this is hitting home forsome women, because this is the
truth right here.
You know, and you can see thework of Dr Gabor Mate and Dr Amy
Apegian and other leaders inthe field of trauma biology.
(16:48):
Like our body keeps the score,it is holding that unforgiveness
in a place in our body and itis destroying our cells.
Our cells are listening toeverything we believe,
everything we think and they areresponding aren't they yeah?
Deb (17:09):
They are, and research also shows that.
I'll just use myself as anexample.
Let's say, yesterday I had anemail issue with one of my
employees and it really got badblah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Then I go to bed last night andI'm rereading the email.
I'm rethinking about the email,I'm thinking about how she
(17:31):
could have handled it.
I could have handled it.
So then, an hour later, I'mstill ruminating on this email.
Well, the body doesn't realize,wow, this happened eight hours
ago or wow, this happened eightyears ago.
Your body still has the sameresponse to it because it's like
I'm sitting down, I popped aDVD in, I popped some popcorn
(17:55):
and now I'm just going to watchthis DVD all over again of some
sort of work trauma or divorcetrauma or whatever it is.
Your body doesn't know that ithappened 10 years ago.
Dr. Tabatha (18:09):
Right, you still create all of those same
chemicals.
I know I say to women thinkabout a time when you were super
angry, like you were in aheated argument, maybe with your
spouse or your sibling, and ifyou start to think about that
and the details of thatconversation, your body will
(18:29):
create all those originalchemicals of epinephrine, all
those endorphins and all thatcortisol which is so destructive
.
Deb (18:38):
So destructive.
Dr. Tabatha (18:39):
Your body has the same response, whether it was
five minutes ago or five minutesago or 50 years ago, and that
will create destruction anddisease.
Deb (18:52):
Yes, yes, yes, it absolutely is the truth.
And so I had to learn to stopthat.
I had to learn to thinkactually not even think
differently when I got into bed,just stop thinking.
And I had to figure out how toforgive some really old stuff
and some really fresh stuff, andthe way I forgive because
(19:18):
forgiveness is a gift toyourself but sometimes just
saying the words I forgive DrTabitha for blah, blah, blah.
I forgive my husband, but youhave to forgive and you have to
release.
I forgive my husband, but youhave to forgive and you have to
release.
And so the way I do it now iswhen I go to the gym and I'm
lifting weights and the class isreally loud and nobody can hear
(19:41):
me, I'll get going and I'll say, okay, god, who do I need to
forgive today?
And a picture will come to mindand maybe I'm bench pressing
and I'll say I forgive you soand so and I I really hear it I
forgive and I release, and thathas made all the difference for
(20:01):
me.
And then I have this physicalaspect of forgiveness because
I'm exercising and I'll tell you, I leave the gym and it's the
best I've ever felt.
Dr. Tabatha (20:14):
I love that so much .
I had that similar situationrecently because I feel like
I've worked so much on myforgiveness, and most recently
just with my ex-husband andbeing betrayed know being
betrayed, and all of these liedto and all of these things and
(20:36):
it's like I felt so at peacewith that forgiveness.
And God said to me you stillhave unforgiveness in your heart
and I was like searching andsearching.
I'm like, no, I really am atpeace.
He's like it's not about him.
It's about five years ago whenthis happened with your job and
(21:01):
with church, and I was juststunned.
I thought I moved past that,but I released it and it was me
talking to God, asking him toreveal that to me.
And so I went through a fewdays of feeling all the feelings
, all the anger, all this stuffcame back and then I was finally
(21:22):
able to release it and I was sograteful because you can feel
disease starting to develop inyour body.
People will get sick, they willbe, you know, just have this
chronic fatigue or malaise.
That doesn't make any sense andthey're like I just don't want
to do life anymore and it's like.
That is the bitterness.
Deb (21:47):
It is.
It's that bitter root that istaking hold and you mentioned
gardening and you don't just gothrough and you just don't clip
the weeds.
You got to pull them out orit's going to leave a mark.
And I can look back in my lifeand see where I just clipped
(22:08):
bitterness and I just clippedanger, but I didn't really
eradicate it.
And God wants to eradicate itout of my life so I can live
with full joy, full generosityand just love, so I can love
people.
Dr. Tabatha (22:28):
Yeah, oh, my goodness.
So I'm assuming, over the pastfive years with your podcast and
just being on this quest, thatyou have learned some tools and
some ways to navigate all ofthis and really to empower women
, right.
Deb (22:47):
Absolutely yes.
Yes, it has been quite ajourney.
Absolutely yes.
Yes, it has been quite ajourney.
And I would say two thingsreally come to mind.
We've talked about theforgiveness piece, but just to
kind of finish that off,forgiveness is a daily task.
It's like brushing your teeth,and it could be a little thing,
(23:09):
it could be a big thing and itcould be something from 30 years
ago.
You could search your mind ofgosh, who do I need to forgive?
Or you could just go to thesource and say God, who do I or
what do I need to forgive today?
And it might be yourself, formaking decisions when you were
(23:32):
30 that weren't his best, butthey still worked out and he was
still there with you and foryou.
So I feel like for me,forgiveness is a daily now.
It's just a daily part of mylife.
So that has been reallybeautiful part of my life.
(23:55):
So that has been reallybeautiful.
And then the other thing that Ido is I really prioritize my
health, and it's probably aninteresting comment to hear from
somebody who's a certifiednutritionist.
You know, with all this, youknow additional, you know study
and education, exercise, science.
So I was good about going tothe gym.
I was good about going for afive mile run, but maybe what I
(24:17):
wasn't good about was being inbed at a certain time, making
sure I'm hydrated, making sure Ihave a refrigerator of easy to
go to foods foods and then theother thing that I wasn't good
(24:39):
at was really showing who Itruly was to the people in my
life, because I'm a loser.
So if you needed me to make acomment like this or support you
in a certain way that I didn'tbelieve, yeah, I'll do that for
you.
So I have dramatically changedin that area and what I've
realized is I need to please himand not other people, and that
(25:06):
has given me honestly, tabitha,such a sense of peace that I
just move through my day withcalmness and peace, patience
most of the time.
And I've mentioned generosity afew times, but that's one of
the things that I pray every dayis Lord, show me how to be
generous, how you're generous,and I can now be generous with
(25:32):
my time and my talents and manyother things without being a
people pleaser.
Dr. Tabatha (25:40):
Oh, my goodness.
Yeah, the research is prettyclear that people pleasers get
more cancer than any otherpersonality profile.
Really, yes, yes.
So that does not surprise methat you're saying that, and I I
would love to maybe help womenunderstand this a little more,
(26:03):
because it sounds on the surfacelike you're just saying, okay,
god, who can I support, who canI help?
But that's different thanpeople pleasing.
People pleasing is an ego thing, it's a pride thing, it's a let
me be good enough for humanskind of thing.
Let me get their accolades andfeel my worthiness from people.
(26:29):
And what you're saying is I hada huge paradigm shift and now
I'm here to glorify the Fatherand make him happy and do his
will his will, not mine andthere's no suffering in that way
of pleasing and serving right.
(26:51):
There's a huge difference there.
There's so much underlyingresentment when you're a people
pleaser, because it's never goodenough.
It's never good enough, takerswill keep taking, they will
always want more, they will wantyou to go and do more, and so
you never feel satisfied, younever feel worthy and like.
(27:14):
That just breaks my heartbecause, by and large, people
pleasers are women, right.
Deb (27:20):
Absolutely.
And autoimmune diseases and somany other things.
Fatigue, yes, all of thosethings, yeah, oh my goodness,
yes, yes.
So people pleasing youmentioned pride and it's
interesting because it really ispride in its control, which I
(27:43):
think of people pleasing as meekand mild and kind of quiet, but
you know what it's actuallyincredibly controlling when
you're trying to please thepeople around you.
You you need to please them soyou can control the situation.
And when I really got a visionof that, I thought, wow, I, this
(28:06):
is an area I need to work ongiving control back to God and
not walking in pride, butwalking in generosity.
Dr. Tabatha (28:15):
Yeah, yeah.
I see this on a whole notherlevel with women.
Sometimes it's like they don'ttrust God to do his job in the
lives of the people they careabout and they love and they
feel like if I don't do this,this person isn't going to
change, this person is going tosuffer, like it's not going to
(28:37):
work out for them.
And you know, I had an epiphanyat one point.
I was like, wow, I know I feellike I have to take care of my
parents or whatever, but thereare many times when I don't and
they're just fine, god takescare of them, they take care of
themselves.
Like it really is my egothinking it's all me.
(29:00):
And I had that as a doctor withmy patients and it's like, oh
my goodness, I don't trust Godto do his job.
Deb (29:10):
Right.
What a revelation.
It's not about you.
It's not about you.
It's not about me.
He's really good at being Godand I stink at it.
Dr. Tabatha (29:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, oh, my goodness.
Well, I'm so excited that youhave gone on this journey, and
you know God turns everythingfor our good.
He does, and you know God turnseverything for our good If you
receive his invitation to walkwith him and allow him to make
your path straight.
(29:40):
He will, and so he's doing thatin such a huge way for you.
And now you have, like, feltthis calling to create an
in-person women's retreat right.
So we need to talk about thisbecause I'm super pumped.
It's very soon, I don't know.
Deb (29:56):
October yeah, october 9th through 13th in Montana.
Now I call it a dude ranch, butit's not a dude ranch, it is a.
It's a guest ranch, it is afive star dude at ranch.
It's a five star guest ranch andI tell you the food it's like a
(30:18):
Michelin starred I mean it'snot, but it's just like that
level of food.
We're going to go fly fishing,we're going to ride horses.
It's just like the mostbeautiful setting I've ever been
.
I went there last Septemberwith a bunch of girlfriends, but
now the shift is yes, it'sgoing to be in this beautiful
setting, but we have threepowerhouse speakers you, our
(30:43):
friend Kirsten and myself.
And we are going to talk aboutmidlife reset.
We're going to talk about yourbook.
We're going to talk about myexperiences when it comes to
living toxin-free and mindset.
Kirsten is the most amazinghealth coach, focusing on sleep
(31:03):
and all things health andhealthy hacks.
But we all have such a commontheme is that we love God.
We love the Lord.
Dr. Tabatha (31:14):
Yeah, and I love that we're going to God's
country.
Honestly, oh my gosh I canalready tell how palpable it's
going to be.
I can feel it.
We're not even there yet.
It's going to be so justbreathtaking and it's going to
move women.
So just breathtaking and it'sgoing to move women, that's what
I'm really excited about,because I hear women just saying
(31:37):
I am so stuck, I'm tired ofbeing stuck right, so stuck
mentally and physically.
Deb (31:48):
you know just like we were talking about people pleasing.
When we spend a good chunk ofour day focused on pleasing
others, where's your energygoing?
My energy is gone, and so thisis really a retreat for women
who are just fed up with beingsick and tired all the time.
Dr. Tabatha (32:07):
And I want to point out that because our bodies and
our minds, especially oursubconscious, which runs 95% of
the decisions we make, is soingrained in us and it is just
on autopilot, that it is reallyhard to have transformations and
(32:28):
epiphanies and shifts whenyou're in your normal everyday
environment, because your bodyand your subconscious is
receiving cues from everythingaround you and so if you're
still in the space that got yousick, it's really hard to get
out of that mentally and makethat shift in that same physical
(32:52):
space, if that makes sense.
Deb (32:53):
And so it totally does make sense.
Dr. Tabatha (32:55):
Yes, yeah, that's why so many women need to go on
a retreat.
It doesn't even matter whereyou go to Sedona, you go to
Alaska, you go to Italy, you goto Montana because you have to
get your physical body in adifferent environment, in a
healing environment, so thatyour subconscious can start to
(33:18):
hear different things and rewireyour beliefs and change the
future.
You that you see.
Deb (33:26):
So I'm exactly right, all of that so.
Dr. Tabatha (33:28):
I'm excited to unpack all of that.
Deb (33:31):
I am too, and that's a really good point is that you
can't heal in the sameenvironment that made you sick.
It's just it's.
I don't.
I don't know how that evenhappens.
So if you could just again pushthe pause button, get away for
just a few nights and so, again,one of the most beautiful
settings I have been in in mylife.
(33:52):
We come home with a freshperspective and we also come
home with a different community,and this community is going to
be emailing each other and we'regoing to be learning a lot.
And it is really helpful tohave somebody reach out to you
(34:14):
and say hey, how are you doingwith that relationship you were
telling me about?
It's a little bit like when youget on an airplane and then
you're you're really enjoyingtalking to your seatmate, and
then you just kind of go blahlike you're telling them
everything and you're thinkingwhy am I telling this person on
this airplane?
Similar when you go to aretreat, like all of a sudden
(34:35):
you're just bonded with otherwomen and I do love that female
bond.
Dr. Tabatha (34:42):
Yes, absolutely.
It's going to be such a safespace.
It's going to be very intimate.
What are we having?
Like 25 women or something likethat Right.
Deb (34:51):
It's small.
Dr. Tabatha (34:52):
Yes, yeah, and you know these are incredible women.
I already know like most of theseats are taken, so if you want
to get in, we want you to likejump at this.
But the women who are comingare incredible.
Their powerhouse is in theirown right, and so you're going
to be in good company, and theirpowerhouses in their own right,
and so you're going to be ingood company.
(35:13):
And I just keep having thisvision of the fish in the dirty
fish bowl, like the fish isalmost dying and belly up and
the water is like so dark anddirty.
You don't just keep feeding thefish or you know giving it more
light, like you change thewater water.
You put the fish in a differentfish tank or you put the fish
(35:33):
in a different fish tank withother fish so it can have
relationships and I love thatthat's so simple and so true.
Deb (35:45):
Why didn't I know you 25 years ago?
Dr. Tabatha (35:49):
I wasn't me.
I wasn't me 20 years ago right.
Deb (35:52):
Like we're all on this journey.
Dr. Tabatha (35:55):
Jesus has done so much work on me.
I'm not even recognizable LikeI am a sinner, a cheater, a liar
, a thief, a fraud, like I'm allthe.
That was me and now I am a newcreation in Christ, and so any
woman can have that, and I'mreally excited that we're just
(36:16):
going to like peel back stufflike an onion, peel back the
layers and really like get realwith God and with each other,
and it's going to betransformational.
So thank you for putting thistogether.
Deb (36:30):
I'm ridiculously excited and the more we talk about it,
the more my heart just startspumping and it just is.
It's just leaping for joybecause I know it's going to be
just a small handful of dayswith just incredible
transformation.
Dr. Tabatha (36:48):
Yeah, okay.
So if you're listening, ifyou're watching, you don't even
need the details.
You need the dates because yougot to know if you're physically
available, but literally thatis it.
You need to ask God, am Isupposed to be there?
Did I hear this podcast episode?
Because I am supposed to showup for myself and do this next
(37:09):
step and if not, cool, like Ihope that you receive some
epiphanies out of thisconversation.
I know you did, but if, if youare feeling that nudge and
you're supposed to be with us inMontana, figure it out make it
happen.
Deb (37:28):
Everything is figureoutable .
Dr. Tabatha (37:30):
I live by that motto God will provide.
If he wants you there, he willprovide a way.
You just have to make thedecision yes, I'm going, and
he'll help you find the money.
He'll help you find the timeand the flights and all of those
things.
Deb (37:45):
It will all work out when we put our trust in him.
Dr. Tabatha (37:50):
Exactly.
Oh my goodness, can you closeus out?
What is one last thing you wantto say to women?
Deb (37:57):
Oh, that is a great question.
So much, right.
I know there's so.
There's so much you.
You are worthy of love, you areworthy of peace and you are
worthy this is not grammaticallycorrect, but you are worthy of
things going well and continuingto go well.
(38:20):
Don't anticipate the wheelsfalling off the wagon.
Be present, love the peoplearound you, smile at your
barista at Starbucks.
Just really be present in eachand every moment and I think
that God will just really blessthat time.
Dr. Tabatha (38:41):
Oh, I love that so much.
So what you're saying is try tobe more like Jesus In your
daily life.
Just live more like Jesus.
I love that so much.
Okay, yes, your story is just apowerful reminder that even
when we do everything right bythe world's standards, life can
(39:02):
still bring unexpected battles.
So what you've shared todayleaning into your faith, asking
deeper questions, takingownership of your health it is
giving us hope and clarity.
So, ladies, deborah's journeyproves that we are not powerless
.
God has entrusted us with thesebodies through wisdom,
(39:22):
intentional choices and hisguidance, and we can live with
both joy and purpose, no matterwhat challenges come our way.
So if you've been inspired byher story, I encourage you to
listen to her podcast.
Why Did I Get Cancer andconsider joining us in Montana?
Because when you start makingthese faith-based shifts,
(39:45):
everything changes.
So remember you were fearfullyand wonderfully made.
God has equipped you witheverything you need to thrive,
so let me know what hit you onthis episode.
We are here to serve you and Ican't wait to see you next week.
Continue to be christ's handsto serve.
Bye, ladies.
When I got that phone call.
Dr. Tabatha (00:02):
I was really mad, so you felt like God betrayed
you essentially.
Deb (00:06):
And it shifted my perspective.
Dr. Tabatha (00:09):
So why do you think you got breast cancer?
Deb (00:12):
Oh, that is the $10 million question.
Dr. Tabatha (00:15):
Welcome back to the Fast to Faith podcast.
I know we've been on a breakfor a minute, but I'm really
excited to be back with newtopics, new information, new
experts and a renewed passionfor bringing you the truth when
it comes to women's health.
So here's the deal.
(00:36):
You guys, I have been workingdiligently on bringing you a
faith-based summit for midlife,and we are in the works for a
in-person retreat where you cancome and work with me and some
other incredible women.
So we're gonna talk about thatin a little bit.
So stay with us and rememberthe beauty of the podcast.
(00:59):
You can push, pause and comeback to it.
You can listen to a podcastfrom three years ago, like I
love podcasts for that reason.
So listen to the whole thing.
If you have to pause and comeback, I totally understand.
But I want to introduce you toa really sweet friend of mine
that I have come to know overthis past year.
(01:20):
Her name is Debra Enos.
Welcome, deborah.
Deb (01:23):
How are you?
Oh, I am so good and it'swonderful to see you and I just
I.
I love your book and I lovethat.
I'm a big Audible fan, so Ilove that you were reading it on
Audible and I'm sure it was alot of work.
Dr. Tabatha (01:40):
Oh my gosh.
Thank you for acknowledgingthat, because it was.
They told me it should takeabout four weeks and it took
almost nine weeks, because myhouse is always noisy there is
always something going on sonine weeks.
Deb (01:57):
Wow, that's, that's committed right there, honey.
Dr. Tabatha (02:00):
Yes, it was a long process, so I'm glad you enjoyed
it.
And yes, my book is availableon Audible.
I love books on Audible becauseI talk my dog a lot and I am
like outdoors, walking, ridingmy bike, weeding the garden.
You can listen to stuff throughAudible right.
Deb (02:18):
I feel like I'd never get through a book if I didn't have
Audible.
And I'm a voracious reader, andmy husband said the other day
does it still count as readingif it's on.
Dr. Tabatha (02:32):
Audible.
I said absolutely, of course itdoes.
Oh, my goodness.
Okay, well, I just want to tellmy ladies about you really
quickly, because you have areally awesome story.
You are a certifiednutritionist awesome story.
You are a certifiednutritionist, nationally
recognized health living expertand breast cancer thriver.
So you may have seen her,ladies, on Q13, fox News, nbc or
(02:53):
News Nation, or even as the oneminute wellness coach on the
doctor's TV show.
She's also regular contributorto the Costco Connection
magazine.
But after decades of living ahealthy lifestyle, deborah was
shocked by a breast cancerdiagnosis in 2020.
So this experience led her tolaunch her powerful podcast why
(03:18):
Did I Get Cancer?
And it's helping women beeducated and protecting others
because she was just in shock.
So she's going to talk aboutthat a little bit and she has
this background in healthscience, exercise science and
nutrition.
But she needed to understand,like what was the missing piece.
(03:39):
So she blends her personalexperience and faith in such a
beautiful way.
So I know you're going to beinspired and you're going to
have some tools to really tacklewhat it means to live well and
thrive.
So welcome, debra.
I'm so excited for thisconversation.
Deb (03:55):
Oh, thank you.
I'm so excited for it too.
And yes, I'm coming up on myfive year anniversary of getting
that phone call and I, just inlooking back, I just think, oh
my gosh, that went so fast andyet it went so slow.
Dr. Tabatha (04:12):
Yes, so you were living your best life, like life
was good.
You were doing all the things.
Deb (04:20):
you were super healthy super healthy eating, organic
doing.
You know hot yoga, running halfmarathons, going to church
every Sunday, you know ladies,bible study.
I was doing all of the thingsand I was having a great life.
You know great relationships,wonderful community giving back
(04:42):
to my community.
And so when I got that phonecall, wonderful community giving
back to my community.
And so when I got that phonecall, I was really mad.
Dr. Tabatha (04:55):
To be honest, I was furious.
Deb (04:56):
It's the most angry I have ever been.
Wow, okay.
So what was going through yourhead?
Well, I was thinking okay, god,look at all the things I'm
doing for you.
I'm giving back to my community, I'm volunteering, I'm tithing,
I'm all of these things.
And when all my friends areordering margaritas and hot dogs
(05:16):
, I'm getting the organicchicken salad.
So what happened?
What happened here?
What did I miss?
So, not only was I mad at Godfor not protecting me, I was
also mad at myself, thinking twothings One, what did I miss?
And two, why was I so healthymy whole life?
(05:42):
If it, it just, you know, whenI turned 55, I got cancer.
Why not just go ahead and eatthe hot dog?
Dr. Tabatha (05:50):
Oh, wow.
So you felt like God betrayedyou essentially.
Deb (05:55):
I did.
I felt like God didn't protectme and I felt like my body
betrayed me, and I think aboutthe five half marathons.
I was a collegiate athlete.
I have been athletic my entirelife and taken really good care
of myself, even doing thingslike acupuncture and massage in
(06:16):
my 20s, knowing that was soimportant to continue to do
self-care even when you're 25and you're doing other things.
But I would go home early, goto bed.
I was taking care of myself.
So what could have possiblyhappened?
But I think out of all of thosefeelings, probably the most
(06:40):
heartbreaking was feeling likeGod wasn't for me.
Dr. Tabatha (06:45):
Yeah, so obviously you sat in that for a minute.
But then what happened?
Because you are not bitter, youhave pivoted big time I have
pivoted.
So what happened?
Deb (07:01):
Yes, well, I went about, I got my diagnosis and, and it
took a couple of weeks of justgoing to all the oncology
appointments.
You know, I felt like I, threedays a week, I was at the cancer
center and it took a couple ofweeks for them just to tell me
oh, by the way, women don't diefrom the type of cancer you have
(07:23):
.
And I thought you couldn't havetold me that two weeks ago when
I came in like, you know, justa deer in the headlights, so
that two weeks of just you know,am I going to have to do chemo,
radiation combination.
Could I die Like I love my life?
Really I'm.
You know, I was so mad at theLord and after a few days of
(07:47):
that I realized I was soheartbroken.
And it wasn't heartbroken bythe diagnosis, I was heartbroken
because I gave up myrelationship with him and I'm
not saying I didn't believe inhim anymore, I was just really
mad at God and so I just saidI'm not going to talk to you for
a little while.
I'm not going to talk to youright now.
(08:09):
I'm so mad at you that youdidn't protect me.
And I remember just being on myknees one day and I was like
Lord, I'm sorry, I'm back.
And he said I've never left.
I've never left.
I'm here.
I've never left, I'm here.
(08:36):
And that's what got me throughis knowing like I can leave and
being really angry when I'd walkthrough those big double doors
and it was also during COVID, soa lot of the time I was by
myself and my husband couldn'tgo, or my mom or, and I'd be
(08:57):
there by myself and instead oflike, looking around the room
with these angry eyes, I startedto really soften at that point
and I'd see these precious womencoming in with you know,
they're bald, they've been goingthrough chemo, they've got hats
on and wigs and I just startedpraying for them.
I wouldn't necessarily go overto them and talk to them, but I
(09:19):
would just be standing in linewaiting to check in and I'd see
a woman walk in and I would juststart praying for her and it
shifted my perspective andthat's what changed my mindset
to get through the next fivesurgeries.
Dr. Tabatha (09:34):
Wow, okay, I love that and I think that's because
you invited God back in to yourlife and he softened your heart
right he did.
Deb (09:46):
He softened my heart and it changed my perspective and it
really.
That was when everythingchanged and I feel like that's
why I'm thriving today.
And even my oncologists theywould say wow, you've got the
best attitude of anybody we'veseen.
And I thought well, let's goback to that first day when I
(10:09):
was so angry and so bitter andso mad.
But things did shift and all ofa sudden I was just gentle and
generous but focused.
Dr. Tabatha (10:20):
Yeah, and I'm so glad that you're sharing this,
because God can handle all ourfeelings.
He already knows that we can'thide anything, none of it is a
surprise.
Deb (10:32):
It's not like he's up there saying, oh my gosh, I can't
believe she got diagnosed withcancer.
Like he's.
It's not a surprise to him.
Dr. Tabatha (10:39):
Right, or that you're angry at him, so so why
do you think you got breastcancer?
Deb (10:48):
Oh, that is the $10 million question.
I, I did everything right.
When it comes to physicalself-care, let's just say I did
90% right.
I was a very early adopter intonot using deodorants with a lot
(11:09):
of toxic ingredients.
I mean, for years I just woulduse coconut oil and other things
.
I knew the risks.
Ate well, non-gmo organichomemade meals.
Ate well, non-gmo organichomemade meals.
(11:30):
But there's a couple things.
One I had a lot of early toxinexposure growing up on a farm in
the 70s and 80s and I neverreally understood that aspect of
the.
You know that we'd have cropdusters come through and you had
to stay inside for 15 minutesuntil all the chemicals went
away.
Really, 15 minutes.
Dr. Tabatha (11:51):
Right, they don't actually go away, they never go
away.
Deb (11:54):
So then we'd go back outside and play in the dirt and
all of those things.
That was the era of, you know,farmers being told roundup is
fine, it's going to increaseyour yields and there's no harm
to animals or people orenvironment and everything's
going to be fine.
Use all of these chemicals.
(12:14):
At that point, mid to late 70s,early 80s, farming was very
chemically based, at least whereI lived, and I'm sure it was
like that throughout our country, because, again, it was the
marketing.
It's not easy being a farmer.
You don't make a lot of money.
It's a lot.
It's a seven day, seven days aweek job and so you'll do
(12:37):
anything to increase your yields, especially if you know it's
not going to harm anybody rightand you know people were told,
told a story, yeah, yeah, and Iwant women listening to really
understand the gravity of it.
Dr. Tabatha (12:53):
Because you know, we flippantly say, like roundup
is killing us, or you know it'sdestroying our food.
But these organophosphates,they are chemicals, they are not
leaving our body once they arein and they are so destructive,
like it boggles my mind, that wethink, yeah, we're just trying
(13:15):
to kill the tiny little insectswith this stuff, but it's not
actually going to kill our cellsinside of us.
It's like the lies that we tellourselves to be okay with it.
You know, and you're right,like the farmers didn't know,
they're trying to make a living,they're trying to get more
(13:35):
crops and not have their cropsdestroyed by insects and things,
and so it's like we can't evenblame anybody at this point,
except you know the higher ups.
But I tell you, the worstcancers, especially like brain
cancers and muscle cancers andall of these uncommon cancers
(13:58):
that I've seen, they all camefrom the farmland.
People grew up on a farm.
Deb (14:04):
Yeah, and think about those farm workers which you know, I
was a farm worker, so thinkabout that.
I mean, there's an area verysouth of the Mississippi and I
think they call it Cancer Alleybecause it's where all of the
chemicals go to die andunfortunately they're killing
the environment and animals thathave been there for years and
(14:29):
years, and people.
So that was one piece, is Inever really understood toxins
and it wasn't really, let's behonest, it wasn't really talked
about until probably five toeight years ago.
There were a few outliers whostarted talking about talk.
Now we're talking about it alot, which I'm so grateful for.
(14:51):
And then the other piece I wouldsay was in my thought life is
that I really struggled withforgiveness.
I struggled to forgive peopleand situations and many other
(15:11):
things, and I was somebody whowould ruminate, and what I mean
by that is I would play thenegativity, even though I'm a
very positive person.
I would play the negativity.
I'd rehearse it over and over.
Well, I should have done that,or I could have done that
differently, or oh, I'm so upsetwith this person and what they
said, but I didn't have theboundaries to say, hey, you hurt
(15:37):
my feelings.
Hey, this is what happened.
Did you mean to make it soundlike that?
So I didn't have the ability atthat time in my life to really
say, hey, here's my boundary,here's how this is going to work
for me, and if it doesn't workfor you, that's fine.
But just so you know, I'mmoving you from my inner circle
(15:58):
to an outer circle because thisisn't working for me.
So I didn't have a voice to beable to do that.
Because this isn't working forme.
So I didn't have a voice to beable to do that.
And I really believe that whenwe struggle with forgiveness
which is such a gift from Godthat we can forgive others, as
he has forgiven us, it's such agift but when we struggle with
it, that lack of forgiveness hasto go someplace.
(16:20):
And for me, it really impactedmy health.
Dr. Tabatha (16:27):
Yeah, oh, my goodness.
I hope this is hitting home forsome women, because this is the
truth right here.
You know, and you can see thework of Dr Gabor Mate and Dr Amy
Apegian and other leaders inthe field of trauma biology.
(16:48):
Like our body keeps the score,it is holding that unforgiveness
in a place in our body and itis destroying our cells.
Our cells are listening toeverything we believe,
everything we think and they areresponding aren't they yeah?
Deb (17:09):
They are, and research also shows that.
I'll just use myself as anexample.
Let's say, yesterday I had anemail issue with one of my
employees and it really got badblah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Then I go to bed last night andI'm rereading the email.
I'm rethinking about the email,I'm thinking about how she
(17:31):
could have handled it.
I could have handled it.
So then, an hour later, I'mstill ruminating on this email.
Well, the body doesn't realize,wow, this happened eight hours
ago or wow, this happened eightyears ago.
Your body still has the sameresponse to it because it's like
I'm sitting down, I popped aDVD in, I popped some popcorn
(17:55):
and now I'm just going to watchthis DVD all over again of some
sort of work trauma or divorcetrauma or whatever it is.
Your body doesn't know that ithappened 10 years ago.
Dr. Tabatha (18:09):
Right, you still create all of those same
chemicals.
I know I say to women thinkabout a time when you were super
angry, like you were in aheated argument, maybe with your
spouse or your sibling, and ifyou start to think about that
and the details of thatconversation, your body will
(18:29):
create all those originalchemicals of epinephrine, all
those endorphins and all thatcortisol which is so destructive
.
Deb (18:38):
So destructive.
Dr. Tabatha (18:39):
Your body has the same response, whether it was
five minutes ago or five minutesago or 50 years ago, and that
will create destruction anddisease.
Deb (18:52):
Yes, yes, yes, it absolutely is the truth.
And so I had to learn to stopthat.
I had to learn to thinkactually not even think
differently when I got into bed,just stop thinking.
And I had to figure out how toforgive some really old stuff
and some really fresh stuff, andthe way I forgive because
(19:18):
forgiveness is a gift toyourself but sometimes just
saying the words I forgive DrTabitha for blah, blah, blah.
I forgive my husband, but youhave to forgive and you have to
release.
I forgive my husband, but youhave to forgive and you have to
release.
And so the way I do it now iswhen I go to the gym and I'm
lifting weights and the class isreally loud and nobody can hear
(19:41):
me, I'll get going and I'll say, okay, god, who do I need to
forgive today?
And a picture will come to mindand maybe I'm bench pressing
and I'll say I forgive you soand so and I I really hear it I
forgive and I release, and thathas made all the difference for
(20:01):
me.
And then I have this physicalaspect of forgiveness because
I'm exercising and I'll tell you, I leave the gym and it's the
best I've ever felt.
Dr. Tabatha (20:14):
I love that so much .
I had that similar situationrecently because I feel like
I've worked so much on myforgiveness, and most recently
just with my ex-husband andbeing betrayed know being
betrayed, and all of these liedto and all of these things and
(20:36):
it's like I felt so at peacewith that forgiveness.
And God said to me you stillhave unforgiveness in your heart
and I was like searching andsearching.
I'm like, no, I really am atpeace.
He's like it's not about him.
It's about five years ago whenthis happened with your job and
(21:01):
with church, and I was juststunned.
I thought I moved past that,but I released it and it was me
talking to God, asking him toreveal that to me.
And so I went through a fewdays of feeling all the feelings
, all the anger, all this stuffcame back and then I was finally
(21:22):
able to release it and I was sograteful because you can feel
disease starting to develop inyour body.
People will get sick, they willbe, you know, just have this
chronic fatigue or malaise.
That doesn't make any sense andthey're like I just don't want
to do life anymore and it's like.
That is the bitterness.
Deb (21:47):
It is.
It's that bitter root that istaking hold and you mentioned
gardening and you don't just gothrough and you just don't clip
the weeds.
You got to pull them out orit's going to leave a mark.
And I can look back in my lifeand see where I just clipped
(22:08):
bitterness and I just clippedanger, but I didn't really
eradicate it.
And God wants to eradicate itout of my life so I can live
with full joy, full generosityand just love, so I can love
people.
Dr. Tabatha (22:28):
Yeah, oh, my goodness.
So I'm assuming, over the pastfive years with your podcast and
just being on this quest, thatyou have learned some tools and
some ways to navigate all ofthis and really to empower women
, right.
Deb (22:47):
Absolutely yes.
Yes, it has been quite ajourney.
Absolutely yes.
Yes, it has been quite ajourney.
And I would say two thingsreally come to mind.
We've talked about theforgiveness piece, but just to
kind of finish that off,forgiveness is a daily task.
It's like brushing your teeth,and it could be a little thing,
(23:09):
it could be a big thing and itcould be something from 30 years
ago.
You could search your mind ofgosh, who do I need to forgive?
Or you could just go to thesource and say God, who do I or
what do I need to forgive today?
And it might be yourself, formaking decisions when you were
(23:32):
30 that weren't his best, butthey still worked out and he was
still there with you and foryou.
So I feel like for me,forgiveness is a daily now.
It's just a daily part of mylife.
So that has been reallybeautiful part of my life.
(23:55):
So that has been reallybeautiful.
And then the other thing that Ido is I really prioritize my
health, and it's probably aninteresting comment to hear from
somebody who's a certifiednutritionist.
You know, with all this, youknow additional, you know study
and education, exercise, science.
So I was good about going tothe gym.
I was good about going for afive mile run, but maybe what I
(24:17):
wasn't good about was being inbed at a certain time, making
sure I'm hydrated, making sure Ihave a refrigerator of easy to
go to foods foods and then theother thing that I wasn't good
(24:39):
at was really showing who Itruly was to the people in my
life, because I'm a loser.
So if you needed me to make acomment like this or support you
in a certain way that I didn'tbelieve, yeah, I'll do that for
you.
So I have dramatically changedin that area and what I've
realized is I need to please himand not other people, and that
(25:06):
has given me honestly, tabitha,such a sense of peace that I
just move through my day withcalmness and peace, patience
most of the time.
And I've mentioned generosity afew times, but that's one of
the things that I pray every dayis Lord, show me how to be
generous, how you're generous,and I can now be generous with
(25:32):
my time and my talents and manyother things without being a
people pleaser.
Dr. Tabatha (25:40):
Oh, my goodness.
Yeah, the research is prettyclear that people pleasers get
more cancer than any otherpersonality profile.
Really, yes, yes.
So that does not surprise methat you're saying that, and I I
would love to maybe help womenunderstand this a little more,
(26:03):
because it sounds on the surfacelike you're just saying, okay,
god, who can I support, who canI help?
But that's different thanpeople pleasing.
People pleasing is an ego thing, it's a pride thing, it's a let
me be good enough for humanskind of thing.
Let me get their accolades andfeel my worthiness from people.
(26:29):
And what you're saying is I hada huge paradigm shift and now
I'm here to glorify the Fatherand make him happy and do his
will his will, not mine andthere's no suffering in that way
of pleasing and serving right.
(26:51):
There's a huge difference there.
There's so much underlyingresentment when you're a people
pleaser, because it's never goodenough.
It's never good enough, takerswill keep taking, they will
always want more, they will wantyou to go and do more, and so
you never feel satisfied, younever feel worthy and like.
(27:14):
That just breaks my heartbecause, by and large, people
pleasers are women, right.
Deb (27:20):
Absolutely.
And autoimmune diseases and somany other things.
Fatigue, yes, all of thosethings, yeah, oh my goodness,
yes, yes.
So people pleasing youmentioned pride and it's
interesting because it really ispride in its control, which I
(27:43):
think of people pleasing as meekand mild and kind of quiet, but
you know what it's actuallyincredibly controlling when
you're trying to please thepeople around you.
You you need to please them soyou can control the situation.
And when I really got a visionof that, I thought, wow, I, this
(28:06):
is an area I need to work ongiving control back to God and
not walking in pride, butwalking in generosity.
Dr. Tabatha (28:15):
Yeah, yeah.
I see this on a whole notherlevel with women.
Sometimes it's like they don'ttrust God to do his job in the
lives of the people they careabout and they love and they
feel like if I don't do this,this person isn't going to
change, this person is going tosuffer, like it's not going to
(28:37):
work out for them.
And you know, I had an epiphanyat one point.
I was like, wow, I know I feellike I have to take care of my
parents or whatever, but thereare many times when I don't and
they're just fine, god takescare of them, they take care of
themselves.
Like it really is my egothinking it's all me.
(29:00):
And I had that as a doctor withmy patients and it's like, oh
my goodness, I don't trust Godto do his job.
Deb (29:10):
Right.
What a revelation.
It's not about you.
It's not about you.
It's not about me.
He's really good at being Godand I stink at it.
Dr. Tabatha (29:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, oh, my goodness.
Well, I'm so excited that youhave gone on this journey, and
you know God turns everythingfor our good.
He does, and you know God turnseverything for our good If you
receive his invitation to walkwith him and allow him to make
your path straight.
(29:40):
He will, and so he's doing thatin such a huge way for you.
And now you have, like, feltthis calling to create an
in-person women's retreat right.
So we need to talk about thisbecause I'm super pumped.
It's very soon, I don't know.
Deb (29:56):
October yeah, october 9th through 13th in Montana.
Now I call it a dude ranch, butit's not a dude ranch, it is a.
It's a guest ranch, it is afive star dude at ranch.
It's a five star guest ranch andI tell you the food it's like a
(30:18):
Michelin starred I mean it'snot, but it's just like that
level of food.
We're going to go fly fishing,we're going to ride horses.
It's just like the mostbeautiful setting I've ever been
.
I went there last Septemberwith a bunch of girlfriends, but
now the shift is yes, it'sgoing to be in this beautiful
setting, but we have threepowerhouse speakers you, our
(30:43):
friend Kirsten and myself.
And we are going to talk aboutmidlife reset.
We're going to talk about yourbook.
We're going to talk about myexperiences when it comes to
living toxin-free and mindset.
Kirsten is the most amazinghealth coach, focusing on sleep
(31:03):
and all things health andhealthy hacks.
But we all have such a commontheme is that we love God.
We love the Lord.
Dr. Tabatha (31:14):
Yeah, and I love that we're going to God's
country.
Honestly, oh my gosh I canalready tell how palpable it's
going to be.
I can feel it.
We're not even there yet.
It's going to be so justbreathtaking and it's going to
move women.
So just breathtaking and it'sgoing to move women, that's what
I'm really excited about,because I hear women just saying
(31:37):
I am so stuck, I'm tired ofbeing stuck right, so stuck
mentally and physically.
Deb (31:48):
you know just like we were talking about people pleasing.
When we spend a good chunk ofour day focused on pleasing
others, where's your energygoing?
My energy is gone, and so thisis really a retreat for women
who are just fed up with beingsick and tired all the time.
Dr. Tabatha (32:07):
And I want to point out that because our bodies and
our minds, especially oursubconscious, which runs 95% of
the decisions we make, is soingrained in us and it is just
on autopilot, that it is reallyhard to have transformations and
(32:28):
epiphanies and shifts whenyou're in your normal everyday
environment, because your bodyand your subconscious is
receiving cues from everythingaround you and so if you're
still in the space that got yousick, it's really hard to get
out of that mentally and makethat shift in that same physical
(32:52):
space, if that makes sense.
Deb (32:53):
And so it totally does make sense.
Dr. Tabatha (32:55):
Yes, yeah, that's why so many women need to go on
a retreat.
It doesn't even matter whereyou go to Sedona, you go to
Alaska, you go to Italy, you goto Montana because you have to
get your physical body in adifferent environment, in a
healing environment, so thatyour subconscious can start to
(33:18):
hear different things and rewireyour beliefs and change the
future.
You that you see.
Deb (33:26):
So I'm exactly right, all of that so.
Dr. Tabatha (33:28):
I'm excited to unpack all of that.
Deb (33:31):
I am too, and that's a really good point is that you
can't heal in the sameenvironment that made you sick.
It's just it's.
I don't.
I don't know how that evenhappens.
So if you could just again pushthe pause button, get away for
just a few nights and so, again,one of the most beautiful
settings I have been in in mylife.
(33:52):
We come home with a freshperspective and we also come
home with a different community,and this community is going to
be emailing each other and we'regoing to be learning a lot.
And it is really helpful tohave somebody reach out to you
(34:14):
and say hey, how are you doingwith that relationship you were
telling me about?
It's a little bit like when youget on an airplane and then
you're you're really enjoyingtalking to your seatmate, and
then you just kind of go blahlike you're telling them
everything and you're thinkingwhy am I telling this person on
this airplane?
Similar when you go to aretreat, like all of a sudden
(34:35):
you're just bonded with otherwomen and I do love that female
bond.
Dr. Tabatha (34:42):
Yes, absolutely.
It's going to be such a safespace.
It's going to be very intimate.
What are we having?
Like 25 women or something likethat Right.
Deb (34:51):
It's small.
Dr. Tabatha (34:52):
Yes, yeah, and you know these are incredible women.
I already know like most of theseats are taken, so if you want
to get in, we want you to likejump at this.
But the women who are comingare incredible.
Their powerhouse is in theirown right, and so you're going
to be in good company, and theirpowerhouses in their own right,
and so you're going to be ingood company.
(35:13):
And I just keep having thisvision of the fish in the dirty
fish bowl, like the fish isalmost dying and belly up and
the water is like so dark anddirty.
You don't just keep feeding thefish or you know giving it more
light, like you change thewater water.
You put the fish in a differentfish tank or you put the fish
(35:33):
in a different fish tank withother fish so it can have
relationships and I love thatthat's so simple and so true.
Deb (35:45):
Why didn't I know you 25 years ago?
Dr. Tabatha (35:49):
I wasn't me.
I wasn't me 20 years ago right.
Deb (35:52):
Like we're all on this journey.
Dr. Tabatha (35:55):
Jesus has done so much work on me.
I'm not even recognizable LikeI am a sinner, a cheater, a liar
, a thief, a fraud, like I'm allthe.
That was me and now I am a newcreation in Christ, and so any
woman can have that, and I'mreally excited that we're just
(36:16):
going to like peel back stufflike an onion, peel back the
layers and really like get realwith God and with each other,
and it's going to betransformational.
So thank you for putting thistogether.
Deb (36:30):
I'm ridiculously excited and the more we talk about it,
the more my heart just startspumping and it just is.
It's just leaping for joybecause I know it's going to be
just a small handful of dayswith just incredible
transformation.
Dr. Tabatha (36:48):
Yeah, okay.
So if you're listening, ifyou're watching, you don't even
need the details.
You need the dates because yougot to know if you're physically
available, but literally thatis it.
You need to ask God, am Isupposed to be there?
Did I hear this podcast episode?
Because I am supposed to showup for myself and do this next
(37:09):
step and if not, cool, like Ihope that you receive some
epiphanies out of thisconversation.
I know you did, but if, if youare feeling that nudge and
you're supposed to be with us inMontana, figure it out make it
happen.
Deb (37:28):
Everything is figureoutable .
Dr. Tabatha (37:30):
I live by that motto God will provide.
If he wants you there, he willprovide a way.
You just have to make thedecision yes, I'm going, and
he'll help you find the money.
He'll help you find the timeand the flights and all of those
things.
Deb (37:45):
It will all work out when we put our trust in him.
Dr. Tabatha (37:50):
Exactly.
Oh my goodness, can you closeus out?
What is one last thing you wantto say to women?
Deb (37:57):
Oh, that is a great question.
So much, right.
I know there's so.
There's so much you.
You are worthy of love, you areworthy of peace and you are
worthy this is not grammaticallycorrect, but you are worthy of
things going well and continuingto go well.
(38:20):
Don't anticipate the wheelsfalling off the wagon.
Be present, love the peoplearound you, smile at your
barista at Starbucks.
Just really be present in eachand every moment and I think
that God will just really blessthat time.
Dr. Tabatha (38:41):
Oh, I love that so much.
So what you're saying is try tobe more like Jesus In your
daily life.
Just live more like Jesus.
I love that so much.
Okay, yes, your story is just apowerful reminder that even
when we do everything right bythe world's standards, life can
(39:02):
still bring unexpected battles.
So what you've shared todayleaning into your faith, asking
deeper questions, takingownership of your health it is
giving us hope and clarity.
So, ladies, deborah's journeyproves that we are not powerless
.
God has entrusted us with thesebodies through wisdom,
(39:22):
intentional choices and hisguidance, and we can live with
both joy and purpose, no matterwhat challenges come our way.
So if you've been inspired byher story, I encourage you to
listen to her podcast.
Why Did I Get Cancer andconsider joining us in Montana?
Because when you start makingthese faith-based shifts,
(39:45):
everything changes.
So remember you were fearfullyand wonderfully made.
God has equipped you witheverything you need to thrive,
so let me know what hit you onthis episode.
We are here to serve you and Ican't wait to see you next week.
Continue to be christ's handsto serve.
Bye, ladies.
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