June 18, 2025 • 31 mins
The silent epidemic of counterfeit pills laced with fentanyl is claiming thousands of young lives across America, and most parents have no idea until it's too late.
When Laura's 17-year-old son Zach purchased what he thought was a Percocet on Snapchat, she couldn't have known it would end his life. A straight-A student with college acceptance letters to multiple UC schools including UCLA, Zach had his entire future ahead of him. His story demolishes the stereotype of who fentanyl victims are - they're often not addicts but unwitting first-time users deceived by deadly counterfeits.
Host Lisa Carole, who recently lost her own son to fentanyl poisoning, creates a powerful space for Laura to share Zach's story - from his musical talents and academic achievements to the devastating moment she returned home to find paramedics and neighbors outside her house. The raw emotion of this mother's experience serves as an urgent warning for families everywhere: the drug paradigm has changed dramatically, and experimentation that might have been survivable in previous generations can now be instantly fatal.
Most disturbing is how this crisis remains largely invisible in mainstream conversation. Both mothers emphasize the critical need for public awareness campaigns, accurate media reporting that doesn't stigmatize victims with terms like "overdose," and school curricula specifically addressing counterfeit pills. As Laura poignantly notes, "If it can happen to Zach, it truly can happen to any kid who thinks they might just dabble or experiment one time. Well, that one time could be the last."
This episode isn't just heartbreaking - it's essential listening for anyone with children or young adults in their lives. Knowledge truly is power in this fight, and understanding the fatal facts of fentanyl could save someone you love. Subscribe to join this critical conversation and learn how you can help prevent these senseless tragedies in your community.
The Fatal Facts of Fentanyl podcast is dedicated to raising Awareness to the illicit FENTANYL crisis hitting the USA.
The goal is to SAVE LIVES and families from this travesty.
Awareness and Education are the Key.
Knowledge is Power!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Lisa (00:24):
Welcome to the Fatal Facts of Fentanyl.
This is dedicated to raisingawareness of the illicit
fentanyl crisis hitting the USA.
It is killing tens of thousandsof people who suffer from
substance abuse disorders andfirst-time users.
There are no boundaries.
No boundaries.
(00:45):
It is straight across the board, with the number of deaths,
without any regard to race, sex,socioeconomics, age, education,
religious background orlocation.
It is in every community withinour country.
The fentanyl crisis is deadlierthan ever before for various
reasons.
It is time to address the manyissues surrounding this crisis.
It is time to listen and learnfrom experts.
(01:07):
It is time to hear the manystories from people who have
lost their loved ones due todeath by deception.
Change begins with each of usas individuals and collaboration
with others towards thispositive transformation.
The goal is to save lives andfamilies from this travesty.
Awareness and education are thekey.
(01:28):
Knowledge is power.
(01:54):
I am your host, Lisa Carole, aneducator and advocate to help
bring awareness to the fentanylcrisis touching every facet of
our society.
I am a mother who recently losther son to fentanyl poisoning.
I know firsthand the pain ofgrief surrounding the loss of my
(02:16):
firstborn son.
I created this podcast in hopesof channeling my heartbreak and
put my energy into trying toprevent similar tragedies.
I find solace and strength inworking to spare other families
a similar grief and any personbattling this addiction.
(02:37):
Tragedy has a way of beingsomething powerful.
This is in honor of mybeautiful son's life forever 32.
Right here on Fatal Facts ofFentanyl.
You will learn from experts onthe front line combating the
(02:57):
many issues surrounding fentanyl.
You will hear personal storiesfrom families and friends who
have lost their loved ones andhave taken their grief and pain
to turn it around, to makepositive changes and bring
awareness and education.
You will also listen to peoplewho have struggled with an
(03:19):
opioid addiction and are stillstruggling and are now in active
recovery.
All of us share a common bond.
We are all here to make adifference.
We are all here to bring youthe fatal facts of fentanyl.
(03:43):
One pill can kill.
People who knowingly peddleillicit fentanyl, who knowingly
cut it into or substitute it forstreet or party drugs, or
knowingly press it intocounterfeit, fake pills.
They know that their deceitfulproducts can and will kill.
(04:04):
So what does that make them?
What kind of people do this?
Yet many in our society want toblame the unwitting consumer
who does not know they are beingdeceived.
Many of these consumers arekids who have not been warned
that the drug paradigm haschanged.
(04:25):
They have not been told thatdeadly illicit fentanyl is
everywhere and will kill inminutes.
Imagine this nightmare.
This mother was blindsided twodays after Christmas Day of 2020
.
Two days after Christmas Day of2020.
After her beautiful son, zach,17 years of age, died after
(04:57):
buying what he thought was aPercocet on Snapchat, but
instead a fake fentanyl pill,she cries every day for her
wonderful son and for the lifethat was stolen from him.
She cries every day because shedid not know that these
counterfeit, illicit pills evenexisted and could be easily
(05:18):
accessed on social media.
So how could she have protectedand warned her son?
Think about that.
By the grace of god, thismother is here today to bring
awareness and she will not restuntil everyone knows what she
now knows about the fatal factsof fentanyl and until everyone
(05:43):
stops blaming the victims ofthis disgusting crime of death
by deception.
Please open your minds andhearts and listen and learn from
this mom.
Laura.
Welcome, laura.
Laura (06:03):
Thank you, Lisa, for having me.
I wish it was obviously underdifferent circumstances, but I
appreciate your desire to spreadawareness.
Lisa (06:14):
You are so welcome.
Thank you for being here, laura.
Please describe your beautifuland talented son, zach, to our
audience.
Certainly, zach, as ouraudience?
Laura (06:25):
Certainly.
Zach, as you mentioned, was 17.
He was a high school senior,set to graduate.
Of course, he passed away sixmonths before that could happen.
He was just a bright, shininglight.
He loved music.
He was a self-taught musician.
He played piano every day andtaught himself just beautiful
(06:50):
renditions of songs, filling ourhome with music all the time.
He also performed.
He had starred in the schoolmusical right before the
lockdowns had happened.
He was the male lead.
He played Troy Bolton in HighSchool Musical, the school's
production of that.
He was on the track team so hewas a hurdler and he had just
(07:12):
had his sophomore season.
He wasn't able to have onejunior year because of the
lockdowns, but he was justreally on track to have an
incredible season, improving allhis times with every track meet
.
He was a straight A studentsince elementary school.
He loved school.
He was beloved by all of hisfriends, the outpouring, since
(07:36):
his passing, of friends that Iknew and friends of his that I
didn't know.
You know coming out andmessaging me and telling me how
special Zach was, what a greatfriend he was, how encouraging
he always was of his friends.
He loved um, his siblings, hisbig sister and his big brother.
They all three had a very, verytight bond and a lot of
(07:57):
interesting conversations and hejust was a super super guy and
he loved his family.
He adored my mom and dad andhis other grandma who,
tragically, she passed away onlynine days after him.
I think her heart was brokenand otherwise she was in really
(08:20):
really good health.
So we got a double whammy rightright there at the same time
and it was just.
We're still reeling it's.
You know, it's been six months.
He, he just filled our heartsand our home and our family with
so much love and so much, ummuch positivity and energy and
(08:45):
music.
And so even he was on track tobecome an Eagle Scout.
He was very involved in hisscout troop.
He had all his badges.
He just had to get his projectsigned off on and start that.
But all of that had gottensidelined because of COVID and
so he was getting restless about, you know, needing to get that
(09:07):
done before age 18, but it washard because those are group
projects, the Eagle projects,and when you're dealing with
COVID restrictions it made itreally hard for him to progress
to get that Eagle.
They did.
His troop was very kind.
They did award him that afterhe passed posthumously.
(09:28):
And yeah, he's just a super,super kid.
Lisa (09:34):
Well, he sounds like a beautiful child and like
throughout his whole life, and Iknow this was quite a shock, to
say the least, but you said Iknow he was 17.
He was a senior.
What were Zach's plans for hisfuture?
Laura (09:54):
very set to go away to school.
We knew that had been his goal.
He was working really, reallyhard.
He and his friends, they wereall really smart students and
really driven kids and they allhad kind of friendly
competitions and you know aboutwho had the higher grades or who
did the best on the SAT and youknow Zach had gotten a nearly
(10:14):
perfect score on the SAT, um,you know Zach had gotten a
nearly perfect score on the SAThe had done in his AP classes.
He'd gotten all the top score,which is a five um on his AP
tests that he took and so he wasincredibly competitive for
school.
So three weeks before he died,uh, we're in California.
(10:35):
So our university of Californiasystem is system is very
rigorous and very tough to getinto the campuses.
But he knew he was reallycompetitive.
So three weeks before he passedaway, right at the desk where
he ended up dying, I helped himfinalize his applications for
(10:56):
the UC schools and he got in.
Three months after he died wegot his acceptance letters for
UC Davis and UC Santa Cruz andUC Santa Barbara, uc San Diego,
which is where I went, and UCLA,um and UCLA, which was a real
(11:23):
accomplishment because we hadbeen finding out from his
friends that, um, as strong ofcandidates as even all of them
were, um, the best that a coupleof his friends had gotten was
to be wait-listed at UCLA, andZach was the only one in his
tight friend group that got in.
And so I really pictured himthere because of his love for
(11:45):
the arts and he thought he maybemight go into performing
because he fell in love with thetheater and when he played Troy
Bolton his junior year he justhis acting was so natural and so
good and he really loved um.
You know every part of thatexperience.
I just I really pictured thatthat's where he would end up,
(12:08):
though he still hadn't.
Um about maybe 10 days or soafter he died was when his
application would have been duefor the Ivy League schools and
his penultimate dream schoolwould have been Stanford
University out here.
If he had been able to get intoStanford he probably couldn't
(12:29):
have turned that down, but heknew it was a real, real long
shot to get into Stanford, so wethought it was probably more
likely he'd end up at UCLA.
So I just pictured this wholefuture.
I have a twin brother.
He went to UCLA and he livesright next to the campus and I
(12:50):
had this whole future envisioned.
Zach would go to UCLA.
I'd come down, stay with mybrother, my, my brother and my
son would bond over being youknow Bruins together and and
it's, and then, in one you knowtragic incident, it's all taken
(13:13):
away and he just really had thisincredible, incredible future.
He didn't know exactly what hewanted to do.
He he applied as a psychologymajor because he was really
interested in the way peoplethink and form their ideas and
and um, and how they take thatinto the world.
Um, so he put psychology forhis major.
(13:35):
But he, I think if he had beenable to make it into acting and
and into the arts or performingpiano or things like that, um,
that's really where his passion,you know, was Um.
But the one thing he alwayssaid to to his family, to his
beloved girlfriend he had abeautiful girlfriend for a year,
(13:56):
wonderful young lady.
He would always tell all of usI'm not exactly sure what I want
to do, but I know I want tohelp people and that's what he
would say and he did that.
He did that in his life and Ibelieve he would want us to
continue that legacy of helping.
Lisa (14:18):
Laura, my heart breaks for you.
You know that I empathize withyou so much.
I'm so sorry, and Zach ishelping people and he's helping
them through you.
Okay, I want you to know that,if you will, please reenact that
most painful day as youdescribed it to me, only in
(14:41):
hopes that our audience willhave empathy.
And also, I know a lot ofpeople are wondering how does
this happen?
Like, how does tell me?
Like, how did he get getPercocet on Snapchat?
Like, can you explain that?
Because we're here to educatepeople.
A majority of people in ourcountry just are not aware of
(15:03):
this, and so I think that's whatour job is to do is to help
people, bring awareness and toeducate.
So, if you don't mind, can youreenact that day for us, honey,
sure.
Laura (15:17):
It was, as you mentioned, two days after Christmas and,
um, I was not in the house atthe time.
I had let.
I was, um, on a, on a run withfriends.
I was doing a virtual halfmarathon, so you know it takes
several, several hours to dothat.
So I was, I was out doing that.
Um, it was not uncommon for Zachto sleep in because of COVID
(15:42):
and not able to do a lot ofthings with friends in person at
all.
Often he and his friends wouldstay up late on their computers
playing Minecraft, theirheadphones on and building
worlds together and socializingvirtually that way.
So it wasn't uncommon that youknow he would be up late doing
(16:04):
that and and and sleep in.
So I got the call from mydaughter and she just said mom,
you need to get home, you needto get home right now.
She kind of let it slip aboutZach.
I don't think she meant to,because then, as I probed her
(16:25):
more about it on my drive to thehouse, she kind of pulled back
and said no, mom, just get here.
The paramedics are here, justget here here, just get here.
But as soon as I arrived and Isaw no ambulance and my um, you
know every.
You know there were neighbors,there were first responders you
(16:50):
know my family there and thenthat's when Zach's dad, chris um
, just said our baby is gone.
So I guess you know, shortlybefore I got the call he had
gone to um, you know, check onZach.
It was around lunchtime so youknow it wasn't uncommon, when he
did wake up, to get on thephone with his girlfriend first
or whatever, before you know,coming to the kitchen for food.
(17:11):
So he went to you know, see ifZach's ready for some lunch and
and Zach um wouldn't answer thedoor and the door was locked.
So two of our kids share abathroom it's a Jack and Jill
bathroom.
So he was able to access Zach'sroom through the bathroom and
it just looked like Zach had puthis head down on his desk, um,
(17:34):
and so he probably was playinghis video game when he ingested
the fentanyl and just laid hishead down and he died right
there on his desk.
So Chris knew it didn't lookgood but he tried CPR and our
22-year-old, who'd been studyingremote from home, assisted and
(17:57):
called 911.
And paramedics came and triedto see.
But it was pretty clear fromwhat they described to me it was
pretty clear that there was nohope, you know, for Zach.
So, um, that's when they senteverybody you know outside.
That's why everybody wasoutside when I got there, um, so
(18:20):
they could investigate.
You know what could have endedthe life of this really healthy
you know 17 year old high schoolsenior?
Um, they quickly ruled out anyself-harm, which we never would
have believed that anyway,because he was living an
incredible, incredibly happylife.
But they could see no injury tohim.
(18:42):
There were no drugs in his room.
There was no um clear evidenceas to what ended his life until,
um, when the people from thecoroner's office um, first time
we heard the word fentanyl waswhen they said we are going to
(19:03):
suspect that this is probably afentanyl poisoning death,
because they'd been seeing arise in these types of deaths in
our county and we had no ideaabout that.
But they just said you know,we'll have to obviously do an
autopsy and the toxicologyreport, but we'll.
(19:24):
Close friends and neighbors wereasking do you have any idea
what happened?
And we were sharing with them.
(19:45):
Well, they're saying maybe it'sthis fentanyl stuff.
We never had heard of it.
And none of our, you know, zachwas our youngest, our other two
kids neither of them had everhad drug issues or tried drugs
or you know anything like that.
This was not anything that wasyou know, even in our immediate
family or extended family orfriend group.
(20:06):
You know, this was not any kindof situation we had been
exposed to in an intimate way.
So we started diving into theresearch of how could our son
get fentanyl, how could he getenough of it to kill him.
Well, of course, that's when wefound out how minuscule of an
amount of fentanyl you need tobe lethal and that's why it is
(20:31):
everywhere, because it's cheapand it goes a long way.
And but we didn't know any ofthis.
And so as soon as we weretalking to our neighbors and
friends and they were justdumbfounded and said, oh my gosh
, I need to talk to my kidsabout this.
I didn't know what was going on.
(20:51):
And so Chris and I made thedecision that once it was
confirmed and once the event,the investigation, um, they were
, they.
They were pretty clear quicklythrough evidence on Zach's phone
, um, what had transpired withZach getting this deadly pill,
and they had asked, you know,for us to not, to not talk about
(21:14):
it until an arrest was made.
So once those things happened.
Then we said, you know, we need, we need to warn our community,
we need to to warn otherparents and other kids about
this, because the drug paradigmis not what it was.
You know, when we were growingup, when people in their
twenties and thirties weregrowing up, you could experiment
(21:36):
or occasionally recreate, oryou know these types of things
without it ending your life.
But now it's like a mind fieldout there.
Fentanyl has been inserteddeceitfully into all of these,
um, you know, recreational drugs, harder drugs, and now these
(21:56):
counterfeit pills and that'sthat's what ended Zach's life
was one of these counterfeitpills and so many people don't
understand, especially the kids.
You know they think they'regetting a Xanax or a Percocet or
an Adderall or something thatthey are assuming is safe to
(22:17):
experiment with.
You know, because they theymight have even gotten Percocet
for a surgery they have had, hadhad, or they're um might have a
friend that's on Xanax foranxiety, and so these are
recognizable names to them andthey think it's.
You know it's a safer way to toexperiment, test boundaries,
(22:41):
that type of thing.
So he did get it.
Uh, what he thought was aPercocet pill through a dealer
that was um conducting businesson Snapchat.
But none of this was anything weknew until our son was was in a
morgue.
It's just, and that's the wayit is for most families who lose
(23:05):
a child to this is they don'tknow, um um, that this danger is
out there and it's hard to gopublic.
I mean, we have talked to somany parents who struggle with
that, because there is such astigma, there is such a
misunderstanding.
People want to blame the user,they want to think about it in
(23:29):
the old drug paradigm and theydon't know.
They don't know the wayfentanyl has turned everything
around and it truly can happento any family and that's why we
made the decision.
You know, chris and myself,that we were going to share this
information in the hope ofsaving other people, because if
(23:51):
it can happen to Zach, it trulycan happen to any kid who thinks
they might just dabble orexperiment or recreate one time.
Lisa (24:03):
Well, that one time could be the last, laura, you are
exactly right in everything thatyou just said to our audience.
You are so exactly right ineverything that you just said to
our audience.
There's no public healthawareness.
None of us do know, or did know, about the fentanyl crisis that
keeps growing in our country.
(24:25):
Through your pain of thegrieving process, what are your
hopes?
What do you hope happens in ourcountry to combat this crisis?
Laura (24:36):
Well, obviously, it's a complex issue.
Fentanyl's been coming into thecountry since 2013 through many
different channels and, for me,the immediate thing I would
like to see happen is publicawareness.
The main, the immediate thing Iwould like to see happen is
public awareness.
I'd like to see public serviceannouncements, billboards,
(25:05):
things on TV, things in school.
You know whether it is inhealth, you know class.
There's there's severaldifferent school districts that
have devised curriculum that, orcurricula that has addressed
this fake counterfeit pillcrisis, and so there is one that
is called fake and fatal andthat has been put together by a
(25:27):
school district in Oregon.
It's called the BeavertonSchool District.
There is a wonderful parent inOregon, jen Epstein, who is
spearheading, trying to getother districts to implement
this program.
It's being offered for free.
They put the curriculumtogether.
One is aimed toward middleschool kids, one is aimed toward
(25:49):
high school kids about thisproblem, because another thing
that I think is incrediblyimportant is for the media to
start reporting these thingsaccurately, because when you use
the word overdose, a largesegment of the population closes
off their mind, because theyeither think I mean, hopefully
(26:12):
they're still compassionate, butthey think, well, it won't
affect me, or some people arecompletely not compassionate and
they totally close off theirheart and mind.
But if you are hearing theaccurate information of, not
(26:32):
high school senior overdoses onfentanyl, but you hear high
school senior was deceptivelygiven a fatal amount of fentanyl
that poisoned him to death,then people like myself included
if I had a story like that, Iwould be like wait a minute, I
have a high school senior who'spoisoning, who's making fake
(26:55):
pills.
What's going on?
Have I talked to Zach aboutthis issue?
Does he know about this?
You know and he didn't.
So it's the public awarenessthing I think has to be right
away, just happening right away.
But then obviously you know wehave to talk about how is
fentanyl getting everywhere?
(27:17):
What's being done about that?
What do we need to do aboutstrengthening laws for people
who are deceitfully dealing infentanyl?
There's so many complexities tothis and right now it seems
like it's grieving parents thatare having to work all these
(27:37):
fronts.
Now I've got this tremendousand you're at work both a part
of it, this tremendous networkof grieving moms and dads who
are in the front lines of thislines of this.
You know whether they're tryingto bring awareness to the
(27:57):
fentanyl coming into the countryor they're trying to bring
awareness to you know, updatingthe way these cases are
investigated and prosecuted andcharged, or around getting the
education in the schools and we,just we really need a national
response need a nationalresponse.
Lisa (28:21):
I totally agree with you, laura.
I totally agree.
I feel like we're all being ledby a much higher power to be
our children's voice, and itdoes seem that there is a strong
coalition that's growing everyday of parents and loved ones
who have lost their children andperhaps maybe, as we keep going
and keep our faith and hope inthis crisis, that perhaps our
(28:43):
government, our media, otherpeople will take note of that
and and make some positivechanges.
That that's what our hope is.
I know it's the same for you.
Thank you, laura.
I can't thank you enough.
You're a remarkable woman andmother.
Your light and love, with grace, just radiates from you, and I
(29:08):
hope your dreams come true inmaking a positive impact and the
necessary changes of thefentanyl crisis in our country,
and I hope justice will beserved.
I want you to know that Zach isloved and will never, ever be
forgotten.
His light still shines bright,as does yours, and I just want
(29:31):
you to keep shining.
Girl, okay, many blessings.
Thank you again.
I feel as you, laura.
Girl, okay, many blessings.
Thank you again.
I feel as you, laura.
Together we can make adifference for all of our
beautiful children.
Thank you so much, thank you.
(30:03):
To our listeners.
Thank you for tuning in.
Please subscribe to this weeklypodcast.
Visit our website, which islinked below in the description
On the website.
Click on the social media iconsand feel free to share this
podcast with others, and alsoplease leave your reviews and
(30:25):
ask questions that you wouldlike for me to ask our guest For
our next episode dealing withthe fatal facts of fentanyl.
Enjoy your week.
Many blessings, thank you, you.
Welcome to the Fatal Facts of Fentanyl.
This is dedicated to raisingawareness of the illicit
fentanyl crisis hitting the USA.
It is killing tens of thousandsof people who suffer from
substance abuse disorders andfirst-time users.
There are no boundaries.
No boundaries.
(00:45):
It is straight across the board, with the number of deaths,
without any regard to race, sex,socioeconomics, age, education,
religious background orlocation.
It is in every community withinour country.
The fentanyl crisis is deadlierthan ever before for various
reasons.
It is time to address the manyissues surrounding this crisis.
It is time to listen and learnfrom experts.
(01:07):
It is time to hear the manystories from people who have
lost their loved ones due todeath by deception.
Change begins with each of usas individuals and collaboration
with others towards thispositive transformation.
The goal is to save lives andfamilies from this travesty.
Awareness and education are thekey.
(01:28):
Knowledge is power.
(01:54):
I am your host, Lisa Carole, aneducator and advocate to help
bring awareness to the fentanylcrisis touching every facet of
our society.
I am a mother who recently losther son to fentanyl poisoning.
I know firsthand the pain ofgrief surrounding the loss of my
(02:16):
firstborn son.
I created this podcast in hopesof channeling my heartbreak and
put my energy into trying toprevent similar tragedies.
I find solace and strength inworking to spare other families
a similar grief and any personbattling this addiction.
(02:37):
Tragedy has a way of beingsomething powerful.
This is in honor of mybeautiful son's life forever 32.
Right here on Fatal Facts ofFentanyl.
You will learn from experts onthe front line combating the
(02:57):
many issues surrounding fentanyl.
You will hear personal storiesfrom families and friends who
have lost their loved ones andhave taken their grief and pain
to turn it around, to makepositive changes and bring
awareness and education.
You will also listen to peoplewho have struggled with an
(03:19):
opioid addiction and are stillstruggling and are now in active
recovery.
All of us share a common bond.
We are all here to make adifference.
We are all here to bring youthe fatal facts of fentanyl.
(03:43):
One pill can kill.
People who knowingly peddleillicit fentanyl, who knowingly
cut it into or substitute it forstreet or party drugs, or
knowingly press it intocounterfeit, fake pills.
They know that their deceitfulproducts can and will kill.
(04:04):
So what does that make them?
What kind of people do this?
Yet many in our society want toblame the unwitting consumer
who does not know they are beingdeceived.
Many of these consumers arekids who have not been warned
that the drug paradigm haschanged.
(04:25):
They have not been told thatdeadly illicit fentanyl is
everywhere and will kill inminutes.
Imagine this nightmare.
This mother was blindsided twodays after Christmas Day of 2020
.
Two days after Christmas Day of2020.
After her beautiful son, zach,17 years of age, died after
(04:57):
buying what he thought was aPercocet on Snapchat, but
instead a fake fentanyl pill,she cries every day for her
wonderful son and for the lifethat was stolen from him.
She cries every day because shedid not know that these
counterfeit, illicit pills evenexisted and could be easily
(05:18):
accessed on social media.
So how could she have protectedand warned her son?
Think about that.
By the grace of god, thismother is here today to bring
awareness and she will not restuntil everyone knows what she
now knows about the fatal factsof fentanyl and until everyone
(05:43):
stops blaming the victims ofthis disgusting crime of death
by deception.
Please open your minds andhearts and listen and learn from
this mom.
Laura.
Welcome, laura.
Laura (06:03):
Thank you, Lisa, for having me.
I wish it was obviously underdifferent circumstances, but I
appreciate your desire to spreadawareness.
Lisa (06:14):
You are so welcome.
Thank you for being here, laura.
Please describe your beautifuland talented son, zach, to our
audience.
Certainly, zach, as ouraudience?
Laura (06:25):
Certainly.
Zach, as you mentioned, was 17.
He was a high school senior,set to graduate.
Of course, he passed away sixmonths before that could happen.
He was just a bright, shininglight.
He loved music.
He was a self-taught musician.
He played piano every day andtaught himself just beautiful
(06:50):
renditions of songs, filling ourhome with music all the time.
He also performed.
He had starred in the schoolmusical right before the
lockdowns had happened.
He was the male lead.
He played Troy Bolton in HighSchool Musical, the school's
production of that.
He was on the track team so hewas a hurdler and he had just
(07:12):
had his sophomore season.
He wasn't able to have onejunior year because of the
lockdowns, but he was justreally on track to have an
incredible season, improving allhis times with every track meet
.
He was a straight A studentsince elementary school.
He loved school.
He was beloved by all of hisfriends, the outpouring, since
(07:36):
his passing, of friends that Iknew and friends of his that I
didn't know.
You know coming out andmessaging me and telling me how
special Zach was, what a greatfriend he was, how encouraging
he always was of his friends.
He loved um, his siblings, hisbig sister and his big brother.
They all three had a very, verytight bond and a lot of
(07:57):
interesting conversations and hejust was a super super guy and
he loved his family.
He adored my mom and dad andhis other grandma who,
tragically, she passed away onlynine days after him.
I think her heart was brokenand otherwise she was in really
(08:20):
really good health.
So we got a double whammy rightright there at the same time
and it was just.
We're still reeling it's.
You know, it's been six months.
He, he just filled our heartsand our home and our family with
so much love and so much, ummuch positivity and energy and
(08:45):
music.
And so even he was on track tobecome an Eagle Scout.
He was very involved in hisscout troop.
He had all his badges.
He just had to get his projectsigned off on and start that.
But all of that had gottensidelined because of COVID and
so he was getting restless about, you know, needing to get that
(09:07):
done before age 18, but it washard because those are group
projects, the Eagle projects,and when you're dealing with
COVID restrictions it made itreally hard for him to progress
to get that Eagle.
They did.
His troop was very kind.
They did award him that afterhe passed posthumously.
(09:28):
And yeah, he's just a super,super kid.
Lisa (09:34):
Well, he sounds like a beautiful child and like
throughout his whole life, and Iknow this was quite a shock, to
say the least, but you said Iknow he was 17.
He was a senior.
What were Zach's plans for hisfuture?
Laura (09:54):
very set to go away to school.
We knew that had been his goal.
He was working really, reallyhard.
He and his friends, they wereall really smart students and
really driven kids and they allhad kind of friendly
competitions and you know aboutwho had the higher grades or who
did the best on the SAT and youknow Zach had gotten a nearly
(10:14):
perfect score on the SAT, um,you know Zach had gotten a
nearly perfect score on the SAThe had done in his AP classes.
He'd gotten all the top score,which is a five um on his AP
tests that he took and so he wasincredibly competitive for
school.
So three weeks before he died,uh, we're in California.
(10:35):
So our university of Californiasystem is system is very
rigorous and very tough to getinto the campuses.
But he knew he was reallycompetitive.
So three weeks before he passedaway, right at the desk where
he ended up dying, I helped himfinalize his applications for
(10:56):
the UC schools and he got in.
Three months after he died wegot his acceptance letters for
UC Davis and UC Santa Cruz andUC Santa Barbara, uc San Diego,
which is where I went, and UCLA,um and UCLA, which was a real
(11:23):
accomplishment because we hadbeen finding out from his
friends that, um, as strong ofcandidates as even all of them
were, um, the best that a coupleof his friends had gotten was
to be wait-listed at UCLA, andZach was the only one in his
tight friend group that got in.
And so I really pictured himthere because of his love for
(11:45):
the arts and he thought he maybemight go into performing
because he fell in love with thetheater and when he played Troy
Bolton his junior year he justhis acting was so natural and so
good and he really loved um.
You know every part of thatexperience.
I just I really pictured thatthat's where he would end up,
(12:08):
though he still hadn't.
Um about maybe 10 days or soafter he died was when his
application would have been duefor the Ivy League schools and
his penultimate dream schoolwould have been Stanford
University out here.
If he had been able to get intoStanford he probably couldn't
(12:29):
have turned that down, but heknew it was a real, real long
shot to get into Stanford, so wethought it was probably more
likely he'd end up at UCLA.
So I just pictured this wholefuture.
I have a twin brother.
He went to UCLA and he livesright next to the campus and I
(12:50):
had this whole future envisioned.
Zach would go to UCLA.
I'd come down, stay with mybrother, my, my brother and my
son would bond over being youknow Bruins together and and
it's, and then, in one you knowtragic incident, it's all taken
(13:13):
away and he just really had thisincredible, incredible future.
He didn't know exactly what hewanted to do.
He he applied as a psychologymajor because he was really
interested in the way peoplethink and form their ideas and
and um, and how they take thatinto the world.
Um, so he put psychology forhis major.
(13:35):
But he, I think if he had beenable to make it into acting and
and into the arts or performingpiano or things like that, um,
that's really where his passion,you know, was Um.
But the one thing he alwayssaid to to his family, to his
beloved girlfriend he had abeautiful girlfriend for a year,
(13:56):
wonderful young lady.
He would always tell all of usI'm not exactly sure what I want
to do, but I know I want tohelp people and that's what he
would say and he did that.
He did that in his life and Ibelieve he would want us to
continue that legacy of helping.
Lisa (14:18):
Laura, my heart breaks for you.
You know that I empathize withyou so much.
I'm so sorry, and Zach ishelping people and he's helping
them through you.
Okay, I want you to know that,if you will, please reenact that
most painful day as youdescribed it to me, only in
(14:41):
hopes that our audience willhave empathy.
And also, I know a lot ofpeople are wondering how does
this happen?
Like, how does tell me?
Like, how did he get getPercocet on Snapchat?
Like, can you explain that?
Because we're here to educatepeople.
A majority of people in ourcountry just are not aware of
(15:03):
this, and so I think that's whatour job is to do is to help
people, bring awareness and toeducate.
So, if you don't mind, can youreenact that day for us, honey,
sure.
Laura (15:17):
It was, as you mentioned, two days after Christmas and,
um, I was not in the house atthe time.
I had let.
I was, um, on a, on a run withfriends.
I was doing a virtual halfmarathon, so you know it takes
several, several hours to dothat.
So I was, I was out doing that.
Um, it was not uncommon for Zachto sleep in because of COVID
(15:42):
and not able to do a lot ofthings with friends in person at
all.
Often he and his friends wouldstay up late on their computers
playing Minecraft, theirheadphones on and building
worlds together and socializingvirtually that way.
So it wasn't uncommon that youknow he would be up late doing
(16:04):
that and and and sleep in.
So I got the call from mydaughter and she just said mom,
you need to get home, you needto get home right now.
She kind of let it slip aboutZach.
I don't think she meant to,because then, as I probed her
(16:25):
more about it on my drive to thehouse, she kind of pulled back
and said no, mom, just get here.
The paramedics are here, justget here here, just get here.
But as soon as I arrived and Isaw no ambulance and my um, you
know every.
You know there were neighbors,there were first responders you
(16:50):
know my family there and thenthat's when Zach's dad, chris um
, just said our baby is gone.
So I guess you know, shortlybefore I got the call he had
gone to um, you know, check onZach.
It was around lunchtime so youknow it wasn't uncommon, when he
did wake up, to get on thephone with his girlfriend first
or whatever, before you know,coming to the kitchen for food.
(17:11):
So he went to you know, see ifZach's ready for some lunch and
and Zach um wouldn't answer thedoor and the door was locked.
So two of our kids share abathroom it's a Jack and Jill
bathroom.
So he was able to access Zach'sroom through the bathroom and
it just looked like Zach had puthis head down on his desk, um,
(17:34):
and so he probably was playinghis video game when he ingested
the fentanyl and just laid hishead down and he died right
there on his desk.
So Chris knew it didn't lookgood but he tried CPR and our
22-year-old, who'd been studyingremote from home, assisted and
(17:57):
called 911.
And paramedics came and triedto see.
But it was pretty clear fromwhat they described to me it was
pretty clear that there was nohope, you know, for Zach.
So, um, that's when they senteverybody you know outside.
That's why everybody wasoutside when I got there, um, so
(18:20):
they could investigate.
You know what could have endedthe life of this really healthy
you know 17 year old high schoolsenior?
Um, they quickly ruled out anyself-harm, which we never would
have believed that anyway,because he was living an
incredible, incredibly happylife.
But they could see no injury tohim.
(18:42):
There were no drugs in his room.
There was no um clear evidenceas to what ended his life until,
um, when the people from thecoroner's office um, first time
we heard the word fentanyl waswhen they said we are going to
(19:03):
suspect that this is probably afentanyl poisoning death,
because they'd been seeing arise in these types of deaths in
our county and we had no ideaabout that.
But they just said you know,we'll have to obviously do an
autopsy and the toxicologyreport, but we'll.
(19:24):
Close friends and neighbors wereasking do you have any idea
what happened?
And we were sharing with them.
(19:45):
Well, they're saying maybe it'sthis fentanyl stuff.
We never had heard of it.
And none of our, you know, zachwas our youngest, our other two
kids neither of them had everhad drug issues or tried drugs
or you know anything like that.
This was not anything that wasyou know, even in our immediate
family or extended family orfriend group.
(20:06):
You know, this was not any kindof situation we had been
exposed to in an intimate way.
So we started diving into theresearch of how could our son
get fentanyl, how could he getenough of it to kill him.
Well, of course, that's when wefound out how minuscule of an
amount of fentanyl you need tobe lethal and that's why it is
(20:31):
everywhere, because it's cheapand it goes a long way.
And but we didn't know any ofthis.
And so as soon as we weretalking to our neighbors and
friends and they were justdumbfounded and said, oh my gosh
, I need to talk to my kidsabout this.
I didn't know what was going on.
(20:51):
And so Chris and I made thedecision that once it was
confirmed and once the event,the investigation, um, they were
, they.
They were pretty clear quicklythrough evidence on Zach's phone
, um, what had transpired withZach getting this deadly pill,
and they had asked, you know,for us to not, to not talk about
(21:14):
it until an arrest was made.
So once those things happened.
Then we said, you know, we need, we need to warn our community,
we need to to warn otherparents and other kids about
this, because the drug paradigmis not what it was.
You know, when we were growingup, when people in their
twenties and thirties weregrowing up, you could experiment
(21:36):
or occasionally recreate, oryou know these types of things
without it ending your life.
But now it's like a mind fieldout there.
Fentanyl has been inserteddeceitfully into all of these,
um, you know, recreational drugs, harder drugs, and now these
(21:56):
counterfeit pills and that'sthat's what ended Zach's life
was one of these counterfeitpills and so many people don't
understand, especially the kids.
You know they think they'regetting a Xanax or a Percocet or
an Adderall or something thatthey are assuming is safe to
(22:17):
experiment with.
You know, because they theymight have even gotten Percocet
for a surgery they have had, hadhad, or they're um might have a
friend that's on Xanax foranxiety, and so these are
recognizable names to them andthey think it's.
You know it's a safer way to toexperiment, test boundaries,
(22:41):
that type of thing.
So he did get it.
Uh, what he thought was aPercocet pill through a dealer
that was um conducting businesson Snapchat.
But none of this was anything weknew until our son was was in a
morgue.
It's just, and that's the wayit is for most families who lose
(23:05):
a child to this is they don'tknow, um um, that this danger is
out there and it's hard to gopublic.
I mean, we have talked to somany parents who struggle with
that, because there is such astigma, there is such a
misunderstanding.
People want to blame the user,they want to think about it in
(23:29):
the old drug paradigm and theydon't know.
They don't know the wayfentanyl has turned everything
around and it truly can happento any family and that's why we
made the decision.
You know, chris and myself,that we were going to share this
information in the hope ofsaving other people, because if
(23:51):
it can happen to Zach, it trulycan happen to any kid who thinks
they might just dabble orexperiment or recreate one time.
Lisa (24:03):
Well, that one time could be the last, laura, you are
exactly right in everything thatyou just said to our audience.
You are so exactly right ineverything that you just said to
our audience.
There's no public healthawareness.
None of us do know, or did know, about the fentanyl crisis that
keeps growing in our country.
(24:25):
Through your pain of thegrieving process, what are your
hopes?
What do you hope happens in ourcountry to combat this crisis?
Laura (24:36):
Well, obviously, it's a complex issue.
Fentanyl's been coming into thecountry since 2013 through many
different channels and, for me,the immediate thing I would
like to see happen is publicawareness.
The main, the immediate thing Iwould like to see happen is
public awareness.
I'd like to see public serviceannouncements, billboards,
(25:05):
things on TV, things in school.
You know whether it is inhealth, you know class.
There's there's severaldifferent school districts that
have devised curriculum that, orcurricula that has addressed
this fake counterfeit pillcrisis, and so there is one that
is called fake and fatal andthat has been put together by a
(25:27):
school district in Oregon.
It's called the BeavertonSchool District.
There is a wonderful parent inOregon, jen Epstein, who is
spearheading, trying to getother districts to implement
this program.
It's being offered for free.
They put the curriculumtogether.
One is aimed toward middleschool kids, one is aimed toward
(25:49):
high school kids about thisproblem, because another thing
that I think is incrediblyimportant is for the media to
start reporting these thingsaccurately, because when you use
the word overdose, a largesegment of the population closes
off their mind, because theyeither think I mean, hopefully
(26:12):
they're still compassionate, butthey think, well, it won't
affect me, or some people arecompletely not compassionate and
they totally close off theirheart and mind.
But if you are hearing theaccurate information of, not
(26:32):
high school senior overdoses onfentanyl, but you hear high
school senior was deceptivelygiven a fatal amount of fentanyl
that poisoned him to death,then people like myself included
if I had a story like that, Iwould be like wait a minute, I
have a high school senior who'spoisoning, who's making fake
(26:55):
pills.
What's going on?
Have I talked to Zach aboutthis issue?
Does he know about this?
You know and he didn't.
So it's the public awarenessthing I think has to be right
away, just happening right away.
But then obviously you know wehave to talk about how is
fentanyl getting everywhere?
(27:17):
What's being done about that?
What do we need to do aboutstrengthening laws for people
who are deceitfully dealing infentanyl?
There's so many complexities tothis and right now it seems
like it's grieving parents thatare having to work all these
(27:37):
fronts.
Now I've got this tremendousand you're at work both a part
of it, this tremendous networkof grieving moms and dads who
are in the front lines of thislines of this.
You know whether they're tryingto bring awareness to the
(27:57):
fentanyl coming into the countryor they're trying to bring
awareness to you know, updatingthe way these cases are
investigated and prosecuted andcharged, or around getting the
education in the schools and we,just we really need a national
response need a nationalresponse.
Lisa (28:21):
I totally agree with you, laura.
I totally agree.
I feel like we're all being ledby a much higher power to be
our children's voice, and itdoes seem that there is a strong
coalition that's growing everyday of parents and loved ones
who have lost their children andperhaps maybe, as we keep going
and keep our faith and hope inthis crisis, that perhaps our
(28:43):
government, our media, otherpeople will take note of that
and and make some positivechanges.
That that's what our hope is.
I know it's the same for you.
Thank you, laura.
I can't thank you enough.
You're a remarkable woman andmother.
Your light and love, with grace, just radiates from you, and I
(29:08):
hope your dreams come true inmaking a positive impact and the
necessary changes of thefentanyl crisis in our country,
and I hope justice will beserved.
I want you to know that Zach isloved and will never, ever be
forgotten.
His light still shines bright,as does yours, and I just want
(29:31):
you to keep shining.
Girl, okay, many blessings.
Thank you again.
I feel as you, laura.
Girl, okay, many blessings.
Thank you again.
I feel as you, laura.
Together we can make adifference for all of our
beautiful children.
Thank you so much, thank you.
(30:03):
To our listeners.
Thank you for tuning in.
Please subscribe to this weeklypodcast.
Visit our website, which islinked below in the description
On the website.
Click on the social media iconsand feel free to share this
podcast with others, and alsoplease leave your reviews and
(30:25):
ask questions that you wouldlike for me to ask our guest For
our next episode dealing withthe fatal facts of fentanyl.
Enjoy your week.
Many blessings, thank you, you.
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