August 7, 2025 • 38 mins
EPISODE 11: F*ck, I’m Not Invisible! with Shelly Horton
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In this episode of F*ck, I’m Nearly 50!, I sit down with the unfiltered, fabulous force that is Shelly Horton - journalist, media entrepreneur, founder of Don’t Sweat It, and your official Peri Godmother 👑.
We go there: perimenopause, midlife invisibility, hot flushes in the boardroom, hormone chaos, libido slumps, crying in Woolies, and what happens when your doctor tells you “it’s just stress.” 🙄 Spoiler alert: it’s not.
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This conversation dives into:
🔥 WTF perimenopause moments (and why we need to laugh through them)
💪 How to reclaim power when the world tells you to quiet down
👩⚕️ The medical gaslighting too many women still face
📣 Why Shelly is DONE with silence and building a midlife rebellion
📚 The behind-the-scenes truth of writing I’m Your Peri Godmother
🪄 Her magic-wand wish for how the world treats women in their 40s and 50s
Shelly brings her trademark humour, rage, wisdom, and realness and reminds us that this isn’t the end of anything. Midlife is just the beginning.
Whether you’re knee-deep in brain fog, figuring out HRT, or just wondering if you’re losing your mind, this one’s for you. 🔥
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Hit play, feel seen, and then go pre-order the book, text your peri posse, or book that long-overdue doctor appointment. You’ve got this. 💥
📘 Order Shelly’s book, I’m Your Peri Godmother from Amazon, Booktopia or listen to it on Audible.
🌐 Shelly’s website: https://dontsweatit.com.au
📲 Shelly on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shellyhorton1/
📺 Don’t Sweat It on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dontsweatitmenopause/
👩💼 Connect on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shellyhorton/
🎤 ShellShocked Media: https://shellshockedmedia.com
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🎧 Listen now: https://fckimnearly50.buzzsprout.com
📺 Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@FckImnearly50
📲 Follow along: https://www.instagram.com/fckimnearlyfifty
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Let me know what you'd love to hear about next.
🔥 Let’s keep the conversation going! 🔥
📺 Watch the episodes on YouTube – Subscribe here!
💬 Join the community – Follow me on Instagram @fckimnearlyfifty and share your thoughts on this episode. Or connect with me on LinkedIn.
🎧 Never miss an episode – Subscribe on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
📢 Spread the word – If you loved this episode, share it with a friend (or 10). Because midlife is better when we figure it out together.
Because f*ck, we’re nearly 50, and isn’t that amazing? 🚀
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dominique Hind (00:00):
Hi, I'm Dom Hind and and fuck, I'm nearly 50.
Actually I'm 47 and a half, butwho's counting?
Let's be real.
This stage of life comes with alot, from body changes that
feel like betrayal to silencesurrounding what's actually
going on inside us.
It's no wonder so many womenfeel like they're unraveling and
(00:20):
doing it alone.
But what if we didn't justsurvive perimenopause?
What if we embraced it out loud, with humor, honesty and a
whole lot of power?
Enter today's guest, shelleyHorton.
She's a journalist, mediaentrepreneur, unapologetic voice
of women in midlife and nowyour peri-godmother.
With her new book I'm yourPeri-Godmother.
(00:42):
It is a rally cry for women tostop whispering about hormonal
chaos happening in their bodiesand start owning the
conversation With brutal honestyand laugh out loud moments.
Shelley gives us permission toditch the shame, arm ourself
with knowledge and demand better, better healthcare, better
information and betterconversations, because midlife
(01:03):
isn't the beginning of the end.
It's the start of somethingreal, raw, rebellious and, let's
be honest, fuck.
I'm nearly 50, but isn't itamazing?
Shelley Horton has built acareer on saying the things
(01:31):
other people are afraid to say,from morning television to
running her own media trainingcompany, shellshock Media.
She's always made her voiceloud and unapologetically hers,
but it's her new role that mightjust be her most important one
yet Perigodmother.
In her new book, I'm yourPerigodmother, which has just
(01:53):
hit the shelves, shelley ripsthe cloak of invisibility of
perimenopause and midlife.
She shares the gut-punchingrealities, from wild mood swings
to brain fog and making yourealize why you sometimes forget
why you walked into a room,with humor, heart and helpful
(02:14):
solutions.
This episode is for anyonewho's ever felt dismissed by a
doctor, doubted their own sanityor just needed someone to say
you're not alone and you're notcrazy.
We talk about the symptoms.
No one warned you about thepower of self-advocacy, the
myths of the hot mess and whymidlife women are the most
(02:36):
underestimated powerhousedemographic out there, because
this isn't just a hormonal shift, it's a cultural one.
Let's get into it.
Shelley, welcome to Fuck.
I'm Nearly 50.
Shelly Horton (02:50):
That was the best intro ever, Dom.
I'm so excited to chat to you.
Dominique Hind (02:54):
Amazing.
How would you introduceyourself if you weren't trying
to be polite?
Shelly Horton (03:00):
Hello, I'm your perigodmother.
My name's Shelley, and ifyou're over 40, you fucking need
me.
Dominique Hind (03:09):
Do you know what ?
I've been reading your book andit's been really interesting,
because you think you know mostof it, but there's so much in
there that you just haveabsolutely gone.
Oh okay, I don't really knowany of that stuff.
Shelly Horton (03:23):
But forewarned, forearmed.
You know, this is abouteducating ourselves so we can be
the best we can be.
Dominique Hind (03:29):
I think that is.
It's so true, and so much ofwhat you said or you say in the
book is without the knowledge.
You just go in blind and whatwe were like when we were
younger.
Okay, what's the most absurd,hilarious or completely
maddening thing that's happenedto you because of perimenopause
(03:52):
and how did you handle it?
Shelly Horton (03:54):
All right.
So this is a hot flush moment,but I do my regular spots on
Channel 9 where I debate thenews of the day with journalists
.
And you know I've been doing itI've been on Channel 9 for
nearly a decade, so you know Idon't get stressed or nervous
about it.
I'm normally on with BenFordham or John Mangus or
someone like that.
And then one day they said oh,by the way, today you're going
(04:17):
to be debating Liz Hayes and I'mlike and I love Liz Hayes like
60 Minutes Idol and it broughton the biggest hot flush.
So much of my makeup wasactually dripping off my face.
And Liz is so freaking cool soshe doesn't walk, she glides.
(04:38):
And so, as she was glidingthrough the studio and I'm like
fanning myself, just like tryingto cool down, I just had to own
it.
And I'm just like oh, liz, I'mso sorry I'm having a hot flush.
And she was so amazing.
She just lent in and put hervery cold hand on my hot wrist
and just went oh, sweetheart,I've been there, done that,
(04:59):
trust me, it gets better.
And I was like thank you, and Iappreciated her compassion.
And then she went have you hadthe rage yet?
And I was like what, no, what.
And she's like, oh, I had themeno rage.
She said let me tell you.
One time I was at a petrolstation, I just filled up and I
sat back in my car and I wasorganizing my receipt and
(05:21):
plugging my phone in and thisguy in a sports car pulled up.
She said I got out of my car, Iwalked over there and I ripped
him a new one and then I walkedback to my car, sat in there and
went.
Well, that just happened and Iwas just like, oh my God, I've
(05:48):
never wanted CCT video more inmy life than to see Liz Hayes
ripping some, you know banker, anew asshole.
So in those moments of likeabsolute craziness, to have
someone give you that kind ofshare, that information, is like
this true sisterhood moment.
Dominique Hind (06:01):
And it does make it feel a little bit more
normal, which is a good thing.
Shelly Horton (06:04):
Yes, absolutely.
Dominique Hind (06:07):
You've described perimenopause as feeling like
your body turns against you.
Can you take us into thatexperience emotionally?
What part of yourself did youfeel like you were losing?
Shelly Horton (06:20):
So, as you will know from the book and I have
been quite open about it I amlike one in three women in
perimenopause, in that I gotperimenopausal depression Now.
I had never had mental healthissues before in my life and so
for me, I felt like I was losingmy mind and having to cope with
(06:41):
extreme anxiety, heartpalpitations and this
suffocating depression.
I felt like I wasn't me.
It just felt like someone elsehad taken over my body.
And I am so busy and I love myjob and I love what I do.
(07:02):
And the depression took over sobadly that I wanted to quit my
job.
And when I came home in tears,I was crying nearly every day,
came home in tears to my husbandand I said to him I'm just, I'm
not coping.
I think I need to quit my job.
And that's when he said it wasthe biggest red flag.
(07:23):
He had been tiptoeing around mefor months, but he sat me down
and he just said I don't thinkthere's anything wrong with you,
but I think there might besomething wrong with the
chemicals in your brain.
Yeah, let's go and see someonetogether.
Dominique Hind (07:38):
So amazing.
Shelly Horton (07:40):
How incredible is that?
Yeah.
How incredible is that?
So without him I don't knowwhat would have happened to me.
And I really, really suggestthat, if you can and if you have
a partner, get your partner tocome with you to the first
couple of health appointments,because, even if it's your
(08:02):
sister or your best friend, justso you've got someone there
because your brain's not workingvery well, You're you know, if
you've got depression, if you'vegot all of this going on, it's
really hard to look at yourselffrom the outside in and
sometimes you need someone elsethere advocating for you.
Dominique Hind (08:19):
Yeah, I, I agree .
I do think that one of thethings that I've just discovered
, even just with my own healthjourney, is you have to advocate
for yourself.
You have to advocate becauseotherwise no one else is going
to, and GPs are a bit shit, yeah.
Shelly Horton (08:35):
And that's actually not slagging GPs.
It's not even really theirfault.
So if you're looking at GPs inAustralia, if your doctor is Gen
X or older, they will have gonethrough medical school with
zero training on menopause andperimenopause.
Dominique Hind (08:53):
Zero.
Shelly Horton (08:54):
Which is offensive when you consider it
is half the population and 100%of women, if they live long
enough, will go through it Likenot every woman has a baby, but
they learn all about that.
But every single woman will gothrough perimenopause and
menopause, and it was not taughtat all.
So this is something that Ihave been advocating in
(09:14):
parliament about and getting upon my soapbox saying that this
has to be changed, and I'm veryproud to say that the government
has listened and they are goingto now make it mandatory for
GPs to study perimenopause.
But I also think that's a greatstart.
We don't just need GPs doing it.
We need our psychiatrists, weneed everyone who looks after
(09:37):
women to be aware of this stageof life and the impact the
hormones can have.
Dominique Hind (09:43):
Yeah, I definitely agree with that.
I'm just so lucky that I've gotan amazing GP who, I think
she's probably not Gen X, sothat's why she is so amazing and
is very aware of everything.
But it is, if they don't know,they don't know.
Shelly Horton (09:58):
Yeah, and the other great thing is, when you
do find someone, you hold on tothem.
To me, it's like you know, whenyou find a good hairdresser,
you're like I am never leavingyou.
That's what I'm like with my GPnow.
I love her, but she also isvery informed and very open to
like information from mypsychiatrist and my physio, and
(10:20):
all of them are working together.
So you have a team lookingafter you, I agree, but you're
the one leading the team.
It's no longer that doctors aregods.
No, it's you.
Do your own research andinformation and make sure that
you're on the same page.
Dominique Hind (10:34):
Yeah, and you do have to own it as long as
you've got a great team aroundyou.
What narratives around beauty,age or success did you find
yourself questioning or evenunlearning during this phase?
Shelly Horton (10:48):
I don't think I've ever had a problem with
getting older, but I think nowthe thing that I really fought
against was that your weight isyour worth.
You know that the way you lookis really important, and I think
now I am like I am way moreimportant than my waistline,
(11:10):
Like please.
So my brain is what is, uh, youknow, the impressive thing
about me?
So I think that that ageism andconcerned about the way I look
has definitely just been kickedaside, and it makes me feel
really sad when women my age andolder say that they feel
(11:31):
invisible.
And so I've got a whole sectionin the book where I'm like
let's fucking refuse to beinvisible, let's be loud.
This is your time to beoutrageous.
So don't fade away, Don't feellike you can't take up space.
Take up more space.
Dominique Hind (11:47):
Well, and it is.
I was reading something thismorning that said when at your
funeral, no one's going toremember your six pack or how,
what you looked like, yeah, Ifyou look good in bikini, it's
like no, no, no, they're goingto remember how you made them
feel and how much fun they hadwith you and you go.
That is actually so true,rather than we all get caught up
(12:07):
in what we look like.
Shelly Horton (12:09):
So true.
Dominique Hind (12:11):
How do we reclaim ownership over our
identity when society is tellingus to shrink, settle or fade
out?
Shelly Horton (12:18):
Yeah, I think this, yeah, this is where you
lean into the menopausal zestand you actually tap into.
I have been taking care ofeveryone else for most of my
life.
What do I really want to do?
And that's where you'llactually find so many women
start a side hustle or decidethat they want to go on cruises.
(12:42):
You know what?
There was a study that showedthat menopausal women were more
likely to go on trips with theirgirlfriends than with their
family.
I love that, because they'relike no, no, I need some me time
.
Dominique Hind (12:54):
Yes, which, yeah , but it is like, even with
doing this, like I'm like, yep,I'm just going to do it because
it's you know, I'm nearly 50.
It's the best, like, yep, I'mjust going to do it because it's
you know, I'm nearly 50.
It's the best.
Become a beginner, just learn,you know, stuff it up, but
whatever, it's great.
Shelly Horton (13:09):
It's like chew.
You know, bite off more thanyou can chew and chew like fuck.
Dominique Hind (13:13):
Absolutely, absolutely.
What are some red flags that ahealthcare provider doesn't take
women in midlife seriously?
Shelly Horton (13:25):
And what's your advice for calling it out?
So I, as you can imagine my DMsblow up with women who have
just been so gaslit by doctorsand told that they're just
stressed or they just need tolose a bit of weight or it's
just a natural part of aging,and that drives me crazy, so
that if you have a doctor saythat to you, that is a massive
(13:46):
red flag and I don't even thinkthey deserve a second
opportunity.
Fire them, find another doctor,find someone who has a
specialty in perimenopause andmenopause, and go to someone
who's going to actually careabout you rather than prescribe
an antidepressant and send youon your way.
So I think it's reallyimportant to take charge in that
(14:10):
case and I just won't putdoctors up on a pedestal the way
that they expect to be.
Dominique Hind (14:17):
And I think it has changed.
It definitely has changed.
Like, if you think, even I'vetalked to my nan and she's like,
oh no, we've got to trusteverything that they tell us.
And it's like no, no, no, no.
How do you feel?
Like, how do you feel?
And if it's not in here and youknow something's wrong, you
need to own it.
Shelly Horton (14:34):
Yeah, and I absolutely love it because in my
book Dr Kelly Casperson, who'sa urologist in America, please
follow her, she is hilarious inAmerica, please follow her.
She is hilarious.
But she said when someone says,okay, menopause is just a
natural part of aging, she'slike, okay, then every single
person take their eyeglasses offbecause that's just a natural
(14:54):
part of aging.
But we do something to fix it,we make our life easier, we
don't go around squinting.
So I kind of loved that analogybecause I'm like, yeah, don't
go around squinting.
So I kind of loved that analogybecause I'm like, yeah, let's
get the support we need to bethe best we can be and feel well
, yeah, I think it is so true,like why cope, why suffer?
I'm just so tired of womenhaving to suffer, yeah.
Dominique Hind (15:21):
If a woman is listening and is feeling like
she's not coping, but getting noreal answers, what's the first,
most empowering step she cantake?
Shelly Horton (15:28):
It's educate yourself, like, honestly, once
you learn more about what'sgoing on with your body, the
more you can then understand it,track your symptoms.
So, for me, recording you know,my periods were all over the
shop so recording when you haveyour periods, recording your
(15:49):
moods, things like that becausethat then is like putting
together a case and you can,instead of saying you know so,
doc, here's the information it'slike, and I rest my case your
honor.
Let's sort this out.
Dominique Hind (16:03):
And I think that we track everything anyway,
like with the Aurorink or withyour Apple Watch.
I mean, it's all there, just doit.
Yeah, okay, that's actually agreat one.
You've never been afraid to useyour voice.
How did perimenopause amplifyyour mission and your message
and your refusal to stay quiet?
Shelly Horton (16:27):
and your message and your refusal to stay quiet.
Yeah, so I really feltsideswiped by perimenopause
because my mother had neverdiscussed it with me.
I moved away from my hometownfor my career, so therefore I
didn't have a friendship groupthat was the same age, going
through the same you knowhormonal issues, and I wasn't
even working in a workplace fulltime.
So therefore I just didn't havethat information passed down
(16:49):
through the sisterhood, and so Ifelt like I'm a pretty educated
person.
I work in the media, I havebeen a health reporter for years
, and if I didn't know about it,if I was struggling, then there
would be a lot of other womenstruggling out there.
(17:10):
So once I started to get wellagain after I went on to HRT, I
then, instead of just feelinggrateful that I didn't feel
terrible anymore, I got mad.
It wasn't menorrhage.
Maybe it was menorrhage, butI'm like, no, I'm going to do
something about this.
So that's when I campaigned inParliament.
(17:31):
So I was part of the first everparliamentary round table on
menopause in 2023.
Can you believe?
2023 was the first time thatthe word menopause was ever said
in Australian Parliament.
That's how you know.
We have come a long way veryquickly, but that's where I know
(17:51):
, because I have a history ofspeaking out about taboo topics.
I don't get embarrassed aboutthat.
I stood up, you know, inparliament and spoke about heavy
bleeding and stuff like that so.
I'm going to be the one who'sgoing to talk about it and I'm
okay with that, because I knowthere's a lot of other women out
there who wouldn't have thatvoice or wouldn't be able to get
(18:13):
that platform.
So I'm happy to step up and beloud and proud, yeah, and I
think that is what we need.
Dominique Hind (18:21):
More people need to be talking about it.
Your book, yeah.
This one, yeah, yes, it's partguide, part confessional, part
revolution.
What chapter was the mostcathartic or terrifying to write
?
Shelly Horton (18:40):
So it was the depression chapter.
Yeah, right, so it's thedepression chapter.
And this is.
I'm still processing a littlebit the amount of shame I felt,
because I am a mental healthadvocate.
I have never judged someone forhaving poor mental health, but
then when it happened to me, Ijudged myself.
I judged myself so badly and Ipushed through without getting
(19:06):
help for way too long.
So I got to the point where mysymptoms were horrific and I was
at the point of self-harm.
So I now, when I was writingthat chapter I just told you
about keeping a symptom diary.
The brain is such an incrediblething.
But I honestly in my head wentoh yeah, I got depressed, didn't
(19:31):
see anyone for nine months, gotonto HRT and an antidepressant
and then I was fine.
But then I looked at my symptomdiary and went oh no, it took
me nearly three years to getover my depression and my brain
had erased it.
And so writing it was reallytough because I kind of had to
go back into those dark crevices.
(19:54):
And also, yeah, even writingabout my mum, I felt quite.
I didn't ever want to upset mymum, and the way I phrase it is,
I was mad at my mum, but nowI'm mad for her because she was
treated so badly.
So yeah, the depression chapteris heavy and I do say in the
(20:15):
book like if you're feeling abit wobbly, just skip this until
you're feeling stronger, likeseriously.
But if you're brave, hold myhand, I'll take you through it.
But I just yeah, it was tough.
Dominique Hind (20:26):
Yeah, I can imagine it would be, and you
know what it is.
Also, one of the hardest thingsis admitting it Like it is and
saying it out loud.
Well, not even admitting it,just recognizing it.
Shelly Horton (20:37):
Yeah, like I don't know.
I didn't I just because I hadnever had poor mental health
before, I didn't have the toolsin my toolbox to recognize
symptoms, to know that I had totake action to.
You know all of that and I haveto be really honest and say you
have to do the work.
So it's not just you can take apill and you feel better.
(20:57):
I was having regularappointments with the
psychiatrist.
I picked up my exercise, Iimproved my eating, I value my
sleep.
You know like so there's a lotof work that goes on behind the
scenes.
Dominique Hind (21:09):
Yeah, there is, and that's the thing everyone
keeps saying.
Like everyone that I talk to,it's all about doing the work on
yourself and making sure thatyou as a person, or the asset,
are actually okay.
Yeah absolutely, becauseotherwise everything else goes
to shit.
What do you hope women feel asthey turn the final page of the
(21:32):
book?
Shelly Horton (21:34):
I hope they feel informed and hopeful because,
yeah, it can be a rollickingride and it can be pretty
horrific for quite a few women,but you do get through it.
Dominique Hind (21:50):
Yeah.
Shelly Horton (21:51):
And then on the other side it's, yeah, it's like
coming out of a dark tunnel andit's like, oh, I'm here again.
So I hope, and I hope that theyfeel educated and entertained
because it's an easy read, whichis good.
Yeah, I think that you reallyneed um, I've I worked hard on
(22:12):
breaking down the science to getall of the jargon out of it and
, and you know, things likecalling estrogen the Beyonce
because it gives you the energy,and progesterone is the Snoop
dog because it makes you chill,Like all of that.
I'm like that'll stick inpeople's brains more than just
learning the terms.
I think so.
Yeah, I'm hoping that they willunderstand their bodies a bit
(22:34):
better.
Dominique Hind (22:36):
I do think that they will.
If you could build every womanin midlife a Perry survival kit,
what three things would youabsolutely have inside it?
Shelly Horton (22:47):
Well, I'm going to be very black and white on
this.
It's HIT vaginal estrogen andtestosterone.
That's it Like.
Get your hormones back in yourfreaking body.
That's what you need.
I'm like this is actually whatyou need, and I think that we
need to take that fear away ofHRT.
(23:09):
It has been disproven that itcauses breast cancer.
It's incredibly safe for themajority of women, so for me, I
just don't want women soldieringthrough, so a peri-survival
guide will will be.
Here's your HRT in all forms.
Dominique Hind (23:27):
Yep, yep, and I think that's a good one, and
it's great that there is nowmore research saying that it is
safe to use.
How can we makemicro-rebellions a daily habit,
and whether it's settingboundaries, ditching shame or
just wearing a bikini?
Shelly Horton (23:47):
You know what I think?
It's just using terms likeperimenopause and menopause in
everyday conversation.
You know, if you have a hotflush when you're in the line
for your coffee, tell thebarista.
You know like I just think themore it becomes everyday
language, the less shame andstigma there is.
It is a micro rebellion andthere's something I think
(24:08):
perimenopausal women have thatbit of micro rebellion in them.
So bring it up.
I'm you know.
I am sure my poor family is sosick of me talking about my
vagina, but I will keep talkingabout it.
Dominique Hind (24:22):
Your mum's on her cruise going.
Shelly Horton (24:23):
I don't want to think about your mother either,
my brother is just like oh Jesus, we're just trying to have fish
tacos.
Don't make the connection.
Dominique Hind (24:33):
If there was a national curriculum for women in
midlife, what three truthswould you make mandatory
learning?
Shelly Horton (24:42):
Well, the first one would be HRT is safe for the
majority of women.
Every single menopause societyin the world says the benefits
outweigh the risks for mostwomen.
The second thing will be you'renot alone, so own it and don't
hide it.
I think you feel alone whenyou're not sharing about it.
(25:02):
And then I think, yeah, one,two, three, third, one.
I would say it gets better.
This too shall pass.
Yeah, this too shall pass.
Dominique Hind (25:12):
Oh my God, that's one of my favorite
meditations.
A four-minute meditation, justyep, amazing.
Why do you think sex, libidoand body autonomy are still
taboo topics when it comes tomenopause and midlife?
Shelly Horton (25:26):
It's so funny because when I was single and
younger, I would be braggingabout how good I was in the sack
, like no problem.
And then getting married, it'slike, oh no, now that's private.
I'm like, why?
Like I think there's need totalk about your sex life,
(25:50):
particularly going through peri,because dry vagina is one of
the main symptoms and it's soincredibly treatable.
So I am again.
I put my hand up and now attimes I've shamed myself, but
when I originally was put on HRT, the doctor offered me vaginal
(26:12):
estrogen and I'm just like, ohyeah, nah, I like I'm not
interested, like I don't careabout sex, I don't, uh, and it's
, it's just one more thing to doon the to-do list, nah, not
interested.
And so I didn't use it for acouple of years and then it got
to the point where my vajayjaywas so dry that sometimes I
(26:32):
would split and bleed during sex.
Now it took that for me to go.
Oh, maybe I need to get on.
You know the vaginal estrogenand the thing is about vaginal
estrogen.
Even if you have breast cancerat this moment, you can have
vaginal estrogen because it doesnot go into your bloodstream.
(26:54):
It's like skincare for yourvagina and it's not just about
sex.
It's also because you know Idon't want you to be looking
after your vagina so that youcan keep someone else happy.
No it's about keeping you happyas well.
You can keep someone else happy.
No, it's about keeping youhappy as well, and the other
benefit as well.
(27:18):
As you know, it's softening thetissues and making you feel
more lubricated, it also helpsstop UTIs.
Yeah right, I had my first UTIwhen I was 19.
Let me tell you, that was froma shitload of sex.
I had my second UTI at 51.
And that was not because of alot of sex, that was because of
a dry vagina.
So I'm really passionate abouttalking about this because,
again, it feels like, okay,we're allowed to talk about
(27:40):
perimenopause, but don't talkabout sex and perimenopause.
Dominique Hind (27:43):
Yeah.
Shelly Horton (27:43):
Like no, no, no, let's own it.
And then the other thing whichoften I get women saying, well,
that's convinced me is whenyou're on the vaginal estrogen
you're not getting up to peeduring the night because it
helps with your bladder.
Wow, I didn't know that.
Just if you love your sleep,get on the vaginal estrogen.
Dominique Hind (28:02):
Okay, that is a good thing to know.
Yeah, what advice to women whofeel disconnected from their
bodies or ashamed of the changes?
Can you tell them that they aretotally normal?
Shelly Horton (28:17):
It's like it's everyone's different and it's
normal, for whatever you'refeeling is normal.
I think I think the good thingis if you can break through the
shame and actually talk abouthow you're feeling.
And it might be that you'refeeling a little bit awkward
because you've put some weightaround the middle and you know
(28:40):
you feel funny in bed with yourpartner.
Talk to your partner about it.
So you know, make sure you arecomfortable and and once you get
you know, make sure you arecomfortable.
And once you get you know thediscussion rolling with your
partner, it just stops it frombeing this big elephant in the
room.
Like the last thing you want isto be avoiding sex because
(29:04):
you're not feeling good aboutyour body.
You've got a dry vagina, youknow all of these things.
Like there are so many barriers.
If you actually go hey, hun,this is what's going on, let's
tackle it together.
Um, you can be a team?
Yeah.
And then the other thing againKelly Casperson.
I love her so much, uh, fangirllike crazy when I met her.
(29:25):
Uh, but she just said herbiggest advice after vaginal
estrogen use lube, use a lot oflube.
Don't skip the lube.
All right.
Dominique Hind (29:35):
Yeah, but even just talking about that and
knowing that it's not a shame todo is a good thing.
Shelly Horton (29:45):
I started.
When I started needing to uselube, I felt like I was a
failure because I wasn't gettingwet enough.
Yeah, like what?
Yeah, women blame ourselves foreverything.
Dominique Hind (29:58):
Yes.
Shelly Horton (29:58):
Let's just stop doing that yeah.
Dominique Hind (30:01):
I think you're right.
Stop doing it, start having theconversations and just own it.
Yeah, yeah.
Can laughter and honesty reallydismantle shame, or are they
still things that can be hard tosay out loud, even for you?
Shelly Horton (30:19):
Yeah, look, of course it is I.
It took me a while to actuallydiscuss sex with Darren and I
think it was it.
For me it normally comes from abit of a crisis point.
So I, we had sex one time and Iand I split and bled afterwards
(30:41):
and I cried and because it hurtand he was, he was so shocked
and he's like I never, neverwant to hurt you.
You need to tell me about this.
So like it was me who washolding back.
So I think that is like thecrisis point.
And then the humour comes in,which is like babe, I've got to
(31:02):
grab the lube because I've gotthe Sahara down there, you know,
like that can just make it alittle bit more fun and not like
a serious birds and bees chatsort of thing.
Dominique Hind (31:10):
Yeah, yeah and I think it does make it easier If
you could wave your magicperiwand and change one thing
about how society treats womenin midlife.
What would you change first?
Shelly Horton (31:27):
I would change the way that society thinks that
women's value stops when theystop having babies.
I'm sorry, but when we stopreproducing, we still have half
a life ahead of us.
So for me, I think we need toreally change that stigma in
(31:48):
society.
We need to really change thatstigma in society and I think
that once we get through thishormonal rollercoaster, there is
like a badge of honor, a vag ofhonor, where it's like I've
(32:09):
been through hell and I survivedand I am a warrior.
Now I am a peri-warrior and notmuch is going to knock me
around, because I've beenthrough the trenches, you know,
and I think that there's,there'd be something great, I
you know, in in other, um, oldercommunities, women were
considered wise women and theywould be, you know, treated as
(32:33):
people you'd go to for mentoringand information, and that's
kind of been lost because wedon't have our extended families
like we used to.
So I would love that we steppedback into that wise women role.
Dominique Hind (32:46):
Yeah, I think that's a great thing.
Okay, I've got a rapid fireround for you.
First thing that comes to yourmind no overthinking HRT or
herbal.
Shelly Horton (32:56):
HRT, your body does not have an ashwagandha
deficiency, is it that?
Dominique Hind (33:03):
simple, yeah, good answer Most overrated
menopause trend.
Shelly Horton (33:09):
Anything you can buy on Facebook and can't get
from a doctor, good.
Dominique Hind (33:13):
Go-to comfort binge.
Shelly Horton (33:18):
So right now, I've just finished Untamed.
Have you seen that series?
Yes, with Eric Banner in it?
Yes, love a TV binge Also.
Don't mind a Negroni bingeeither.
Dominique Hind (33:33):
Are you allowed to have that?
No, not supposed to.
Shelly Horton (33:36):
Not supposed to Like not great for
perimenopausal women.
But hey, do as they say, not asthey do.
Okay, Exactly.
Dominique Hind (33:44):
Um, if menopause was a celebrity, who would it
be?
Shelly Horton (33:47):
Oh, yeah, um, russell Crowe, oh, was a
celebrity, who would it be?
Oh yeah, russell Crowe, oh, wow, in his life Badass, gladiator,
beautiful, mind craziness andthen sometimes just throwing a
hotel phone at a receptionist.
Yeah, okay, good.
Dominique Hind (34:05):
Yeah, okay, russell can be the pin-up girl
boy way, everything would be formenopause.
And then, what is the one truthabout perimenopausal midlife
that more women need to hear andbelieve?
Shelly Horton (34:23):
You're not alone and there are solutions out
there.
It's up to you to educateyourself and find out what's
right for you and makeevidence-based, educated
decisions, not shame-baseddecisions of.
I don't want to speak to adoctor about this, so I'll just
(34:44):
get some potion on, you know, onFacebook that gets delivered to
my house and no one will knowabout it.
The best thing to get rid ofshame is sunlight, so let's
shine a light into this area ofa woman's life and make sure
that she is treated as thesuperstar that she is.
Yep.
Dominique Hind (35:04):
I like that.
Okay, shelley, thisconversation has been bold,
hilarious and honest and evenjust reading your book, it is a
bit of a wake-up call for meBefore we wrap up.
If I could try one thing beforeI hit 50, something that shifts
how I see myself, reclaim mypower or sets me up to own the
(35:26):
next decade, or two decades, orthree decades.
Or three decades yeah, whatwould it be?
Shelly Horton (35:31):
So here's the thing, Dom I listened to your
podcast and you're doing so muchalready.
I'm actually super proud of you.
So I know you're doing theweight training, I know you're
doing mindfulness.
I know you're doing so much.
I think maybe the only thing Iwould say is protect your sleep.
Sleep is the super elixir.
(35:53):
So for me, that is what I makesure I am very vigilant about I
have a bedtime now.
Dominique Hind (36:02):
What time is your bedtime?
Shelly Horton (36:05):
9.30.
9.30 is my bedtime.
I get up at 6.30.
Having that routine I know mybrain likes that Making your
room nice and dark and cold sothat it's easy to get to sleep.
I have a very busy brain.
I'm sure you're very surprisedto hear that, but I can't just
lie down and go to sleep becausemy brain just you know thinks
(36:28):
about the conversation where Isaid something awkward three
years ago and I will just spiralfor the rest of the night.
So what I do is I pop an audiobook into my ear, I have one ear
pod in and I set it on a timerfor 20 minutes and then I go off
to sleep and for me, havingthat routine just works.
(36:48):
And then, when I get up at 6.30, I go for a walk in the
sunshine and everything aboutthe day is better.
Dominique Hind (36:55):
Yeah, particularly when you're on the
Gold Coast and you can go to thebeach.
It's so nice up here.
Yes, not down here today.
Anyway, I've heard it's raining.
Yes, thank you.
It sucks to be you.
Yes, it does.
I even looked at like where I'min paradise.
Yeah, okay, whatever, I grew upin Noosa, does that?
Shelly Horton (37:11):
like help.
Oh, okay, that's fair.
Dominique Hind (37:13):
All right, shelley, thank you, thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you for writing the book,thank you for being the voice
so many of us didn't know thatwe really needed, but really do.
You've reminded us that powerdoesn't come from pretending
we're fine.
It comes from speaking up,shaking things up and laughing
through the hot flushes Toeveryone listening.
(37:34):
Get your hands on.
I'm your Perry Godmother.
Order the book or, if it's backon Amazon because it's sold out
.
Shelly Horton (37:43):
Sold out on Amazon one day.
It's also on Audible and it'sin bookstores.
Dominique Hind (37:48):
Okay, good, all right.
Share this episode with threewomen in your life and tag us
when you do.
We're building the midliferevolution, one honest
conversation at a time.
Share this with every woman youknow who's quietly wondering if
she's the only one goingthrough this, because she's not.
And fuck, we're nearly nearly50, but isn't it amazing.
Hi, I'm Dom Hind and and fuck, I'm nearly 50.
Actually I'm 47 and a half, butwho's counting?
Let's be real.
This stage of life comes with alot, from body changes that
feel like betrayal to silencesurrounding what's actually
going on inside us.
It's no wonder so many womenfeel like they're unraveling and
(00:20):
doing it alone.
But what if we didn't justsurvive perimenopause?
What if we embraced it out loud, with humor, honesty and a
whole lot of power?
Enter today's guest, shelleyHorton.
She's a journalist, mediaentrepreneur, unapologetic voice
of women in midlife and nowyour peri-godmother.
With her new book I'm yourPeri-Godmother.
(00:42):
It is a rally cry for women tostop whispering about hormonal
chaos happening in their bodiesand start owning the
conversation With brutal honestyand laugh out loud moments.
Shelley gives us permission toditch the shame, arm ourself
with knowledge and demand better, better healthcare, better
information and betterconversations, because midlife
(01:03):
isn't the beginning of the end.
It's the start of somethingreal, raw, rebellious and, let's
be honest, fuck.
I'm nearly 50, but isn't itamazing?
Shelley Horton has built acareer on saying the things
(01:31):
other people are afraid to say,from morning television to
running her own media trainingcompany, shellshock Media.
She's always made her voiceloud and unapologetically hers,
but it's her new role that mightjust be her most important one
yet Perigodmother.
In her new book, I'm yourPerigodmother, which has just
(01:53):
hit the shelves, shelley ripsthe cloak of invisibility of
perimenopause and midlife.
She shares the gut-punchingrealities, from wild mood swings
to brain fog and making yourealize why you sometimes forget
why you walked into a room,with humor, heart and helpful
(02:14):
solutions.
This episode is for anyonewho's ever felt dismissed by a
doctor, doubted their own sanityor just needed someone to say
you're not alone and you're notcrazy.
We talk about the symptoms.
No one warned you about thepower of self-advocacy, the
myths of the hot mess and whymidlife women are the most
(02:36):
underestimated powerhousedemographic out there, because
this isn't just a hormonal shift, it's a cultural one.
Let's get into it.
Shelley, welcome to Fuck.
I'm Nearly 50.
Shelly Horton (02:50):
That was the best intro ever, Dom.
I'm so excited to chat to you.
Dominique Hind (02:54):
Amazing.
How would you introduceyourself if you weren't trying
to be polite?
Shelly Horton (03:00):
Hello, I'm your perigodmother.
My name's Shelley, and ifyou're over 40, you fucking need
me.
Dominique Hind (03:09):
Do you know what ?
I've been reading your book andit's been really interesting,
because you think you know mostof it, but there's so much in
there that you just haveabsolutely gone.
Oh okay, I don't really knowany of that stuff.
Shelly Horton (03:23):
But forewarned, forearmed.
You know, this is abouteducating ourselves so we can be
the best we can be.
Dominique Hind (03:29):
I think that is.
It's so true, and so much ofwhat you said or you say in the
book is without the knowledge.
You just go in blind and whatwe were like when we were
younger.
Okay, what's the most absurd,hilarious or completely
maddening thing that's happenedto you because of perimenopause
(03:52):
and how did you handle it?
Shelly Horton (03:54):
All right.
So this is a hot flush moment,but I do my regular spots on
Channel 9 where I debate thenews of the day with journalists
.
And you know I've been doing itI've been on Channel 9 for
nearly a decade, so you know Idon't get stressed or nervous
about it.
I'm normally on with BenFordham or John Mangus or
someone like that.
And then one day they said oh,by the way, today you're going
(04:17):
to be debating Liz Hayes and I'mlike and I love Liz Hayes like
60 Minutes Idol and it broughton the biggest hot flush.
So much of my makeup wasactually dripping off my face.
And Liz is so freaking cool soshe doesn't walk, she glides.
(04:38):
And so, as she was glidingthrough the studio and I'm like
fanning myself, just like tryingto cool down, I just had to own
it.
And I'm just like oh, liz, I'mso sorry I'm having a hot flush.
And she was so amazing.
She just lent in and put hervery cold hand on my hot wrist
and just went oh, sweetheart,I've been there, done that,
(04:59):
trust me, it gets better.
And I was like thank you, and Iappreciated her compassion.
And then she went have you hadthe rage yet?
And I was like what, no, what.
And she's like, oh, I had themeno rage.
She said let me tell you.
One time I was at a petrolstation, I just filled up and I
sat back in my car and I wasorganizing my receipt and
(05:21):
plugging my phone in and thisguy in a sports car pulled up.
She said I got out of my car, Iwalked over there and I ripped
him a new one and then I walkedback to my car, sat in there and
went.
Well, that just happened and Iwas just like, oh my God, I've
(05:48):
never wanted CCT video more inmy life than to see Liz Hayes
ripping some, you know banker, anew asshole.
So in those moments of likeabsolute craziness, to have
someone give you that kind ofshare, that information, is like
this true sisterhood moment.
Dominique Hind (06:01):
And it does make it feel a little bit more
normal, which is a good thing.
Shelly Horton (06:04):
Yes, absolutely.
Dominique Hind (06:07):
You've described perimenopause as feeling like
your body turns against you.
Can you take us into thatexperience emotionally?
What part of yourself did youfeel like you were losing?
Shelly Horton (06:20):
So, as you will know from the book and I have
been quite open about it I amlike one in three women in
perimenopause, in that I gotperimenopausal depression Now.
I had never had mental healthissues before in my life and so
for me, I felt like I was losingmy mind and having to cope with
(06:41):
extreme anxiety, heartpalpitations and this
suffocating depression.
I felt like I wasn't me.
It just felt like someone elsehad taken over my body.
And I am so busy and I love myjob and I love what I do.
(07:02):
And the depression took over sobadly that I wanted to quit my
job.
And when I came home in tears,I was crying nearly every day,
came home in tears to my husbandand I said to him I'm just, I'm
not coping.
I think I need to quit my job.
And that's when he said it wasthe biggest red flag.
(07:23):
He had been tiptoeing around mefor months, but he sat me down
and he just said I don't thinkthere's anything wrong with you,
but I think there might besomething wrong with the
chemicals in your brain.
Yeah, let's go and see someonetogether.
Dominique Hind (07:38):
So amazing.
Shelly Horton (07:40):
How incredible is that?
Yeah.
How incredible is that?
So without him I don't knowwhat would have happened to me.
And I really, really suggestthat, if you can and if you have
a partner, get your partner tocome with you to the first
couple of health appointments,because, even if it's your
(08:02):
sister or your best friend, justso you've got someone there
because your brain's not workingvery well, You're you know, if
you've got depression, if you'vegot all of this going on, it's
really hard to look at yourselffrom the outside in and
sometimes you need someone elsethere advocating for you.
Dominique Hind (08:19):
Yeah, I, I agree .
I do think that one of thethings that I've just discovered
, even just with my own healthjourney, is you have to advocate
for yourself.
You have to advocate becauseotherwise no one else is going
to, and GPs are a bit shit, yeah.
Shelly Horton (08:35):
And that's actually not slagging GPs.
It's not even really theirfault.
So if you're looking at GPs inAustralia, if your doctor is Gen
X or older, they will have gonethrough medical school with
zero training on menopause andperimenopause.
Dominique Hind (08:53):
Zero.
Shelly Horton (08:54):
Which is offensive when you consider it
is half the population and 100%of women, if they live long
enough, will go through it Likenot every woman has a baby, but
they learn all about that.
But every single woman will gothrough perimenopause and
menopause, and it was not taughtat all.
So this is something that Ihave been advocating in
(09:14):
parliament about and getting upon my soapbox saying that this
has to be changed, and I'm veryproud to say that the government
has listened and they are goingto now make it mandatory for
GPs to study perimenopause.
But I also think that's a greatstart.
We don't just need GPs doing it.
We need our psychiatrists, weneed everyone who looks after
(09:37):
women to be aware of this stageof life and the impact the
hormones can have.
Dominique Hind (09:43):
Yeah, I definitely agree with that.
I'm just so lucky that I've gotan amazing GP who, I think
she's probably not Gen X, sothat's why she is so amazing and
is very aware of everything.
But it is, if they don't know,they don't know.
Shelly Horton (09:58):
Yeah, and the other great thing is, when you
do find someone, you hold on tothem.
To me, it's like you know, whenyou find a good hairdresser,
you're like I am never leavingyou.
That's what I'm like with my GPnow.
I love her, but she also isvery informed and very open to
like information from mypsychiatrist and my physio, and
(10:20):
all of them are working together.
So you have a team lookingafter you, I agree, but you're
the one leading the team.
It's no longer that doctors aregods.
No, it's you.
Do your own research andinformation and make sure that
you're on the same page.
Dominique Hind (10:34):
Yeah, and you do have to own it as long as
you've got a great team aroundyou.
What narratives around beauty,age or success did you find
yourself questioning or evenunlearning during this phase?
Shelly Horton (10:48):
I don't think I've ever had a problem with
getting older, but I think nowthe thing that I really fought
against was that your weight isyour worth.
You know that the way you lookis really important, and I think
now I am like I am way moreimportant than my waistline,
(11:10):
Like please.
So my brain is what is, uh, youknow, the impressive thing
about me?
So I think that that ageism andconcerned about the way I look
has definitely just been kickedaside, and it makes me feel
really sad when women my age andolder say that they feel
(11:31):
invisible.
And so I've got a whole sectionin the book where I'm like
let's fucking refuse to beinvisible, let's be loud.
This is your time to beoutrageous.
So don't fade away, Don't feellike you can't take up space.
Take up more space.
Dominique Hind (11:47):
Well, and it is.
I was reading something thismorning that said when at your
funeral, no one's going toremember your six pack or how,
what you looked like, yeah, Ifyou look good in bikini, it's
like no, no, no, they're goingto remember how you made them
feel and how much fun they hadwith you and you go.
That is actually so true,rather than we all get caught up
(12:07):
in what we look like.
Shelly Horton (12:09):
So true.
Dominique Hind (12:11):
How do we reclaim ownership over our
identity when society is tellingus to shrink, settle or fade
out?
Shelly Horton (12:18):
Yeah, I think this, yeah, this is where you
lean into the menopausal zestand you actually tap into.
I have been taking care ofeveryone else for most of my
life.
What do I really want to do?
And that's where you'llactually find so many women
start a side hustle or decidethat they want to go on cruises.
(12:42):
You know what?
There was a study that showedthat menopausal women were more
likely to go on trips with theirgirlfriends than with their
family.
I love that, because they'relike no, no, I need some me time
.
Dominique Hind (12:54):
Yes, which, yeah , but it is like, even with
doing this, like I'm like, yep,I'm just going to do it because
it's you know, I'm nearly 50.
It's the best, like, yep, I'mjust going to do it because it's
you know, I'm nearly 50.
It's the best.
Become a beginner, just learn,you know, stuff it up, but
whatever, it's great.
Shelly Horton (13:09):
It's like chew.
You know, bite off more thanyou can chew and chew like fuck.
Dominique Hind (13:13):
Absolutely, absolutely.
What are some red flags that ahealthcare provider doesn't take
women in midlife seriously?
Shelly Horton (13:25):
And what's your advice for calling it out?
So I, as you can imagine my DMsblow up with women who have
just been so gaslit by doctorsand told that they're just
stressed or they just need tolose a bit of weight or it's
just a natural part of aging,and that drives me crazy, so
that if you have a doctor saythat to you, that is a massive
(13:46):
red flag and I don't even thinkthey deserve a second
opportunity.
Fire them, find another doctor,find someone who has a
specialty in perimenopause andmenopause, and go to someone
who's going to actually careabout you rather than prescribe
an antidepressant and send youon your way.
So I think it's reallyimportant to take charge in that
(14:10):
case and I just won't putdoctors up on a pedestal the way
that they expect to be.
Dominique Hind (14:17):
And I think it has changed.
It definitely has changed.
Like, if you think, even I'vetalked to my nan and she's like,
oh no, we've got to trusteverything that they tell us.
And it's like no, no, no, no.
How do you feel?
Like, how do you feel?
And if it's not in here and youknow something's wrong, you
need to own it.
Shelly Horton (14:34):
Yeah, and I absolutely love it because in my
book Dr Kelly Casperson, who'sa urologist in America, please
follow her, she is hilarious inAmerica, please follow her.
She is hilarious.
But she said when someone says,okay, menopause is just a
natural part of aging, she'slike, okay, then every single
person take their eyeglasses offbecause that's just a natural
(14:54):
part of aging.
But we do something to fix it,we make our life easier, we
don't go around squinting.
So I kind of loved that analogybecause I'm like, yeah, don't
go around squinting.
So I kind of loved that analogybecause I'm like, yeah, let's
get the support we need to bethe best we can be and feel well
, yeah, I think it is so true,like why cope, why suffer?
I'm just so tired of womenhaving to suffer, yeah.
Dominique Hind (15:21):
If a woman is listening and is feeling like
she's not coping, but getting noreal answers, what's the first,
most empowering step she cantake?
Shelly Horton (15:28):
It's educate yourself, like, honestly, once
you learn more about what'sgoing on with your body, the
more you can then understand it,track your symptoms.
So, for me, recording you know,my periods were all over the
shop so recording when you haveyour periods, recording your
(15:49):
moods, things like that becausethat then is like putting
together a case and you can,instead of saying you know so,
doc, here's the information it'slike, and I rest my case your
honor.
Let's sort this out.
Dominique Hind (16:03):
And I think that we track everything anyway,
like with the Aurorink or withyour Apple Watch.
I mean, it's all there, just doit.
Yeah, okay, that's actually agreat one.
You've never been afraid to useyour voice.
How did perimenopause amplifyyour mission and your message
and your refusal to stay quiet?
Shelly Horton (16:27):
and your message and your refusal to stay quiet.
Yeah, so I really feltsideswiped by perimenopause
because my mother had neverdiscussed it with me.
I moved away from my hometownfor my career, so therefore I
didn't have a friendship groupthat was the same age, going
through the same you knowhormonal issues, and I wasn't
even working in a workplace fulltime.
So therefore I just didn't havethat information passed down
(16:49):
through the sisterhood, and so Ifelt like I'm a pretty educated
person.
I work in the media, I havebeen a health reporter for years
, and if I didn't know about it,if I was struggling, then there
would be a lot of other womenstruggling out there.
(17:10):
So once I started to get wellagain after I went on to HRT, I
then, instead of just feelinggrateful that I didn't feel
terrible anymore, I got mad.
It wasn't menorrhage.
Maybe it was menorrhage, butI'm like, no, I'm going to do
something about this.
So that's when I campaigned inParliament.
(17:31):
So I was part of the first everparliamentary round table on
menopause in 2023.
Can you believe?
2023 was the first time thatthe word menopause was ever said
in Australian Parliament.
That's how you know.
We have come a long way veryquickly, but that's where I know
(17:51):
, because I have a history ofspeaking out about taboo topics.
I don't get embarrassed aboutthat.
I stood up, you know, inparliament and spoke about heavy
bleeding and stuff like that so.
I'm going to be the one who'sgoing to talk about it and I'm
okay with that, because I knowthere's a lot of other women out
there who wouldn't have thatvoice or wouldn't be able to get
(18:13):
that platform.
So I'm happy to step up and beloud and proud, yeah, and I
think that is what we need.
Dominique Hind (18:21):
More people need to be talking about it.
Your book, yeah.
This one, yeah, yes, it's partguide, part confessional, part
revolution.
What chapter was the mostcathartic or terrifying to write
?
Shelly Horton (18:40):
So it was the depression chapter.
Yeah, right, so it's thedepression chapter.
And this is.
I'm still processing a littlebit the amount of shame I felt,
because I am a mental healthadvocate.
I have never judged someone forhaving poor mental health, but
then when it happened to me, Ijudged myself.
I judged myself so badly and Ipushed through without getting
(19:06):
help for way too long.
So I got to the point where mysymptoms were horrific and I was
at the point of self-harm.
So I now, when I was writingthat chapter I just told you
about keeping a symptom diary.
The brain is such an incrediblething.
But I honestly in my head wentoh yeah, I got depressed, didn't
(19:31):
see anyone for nine months, gotonto HRT and an antidepressant
and then I was fine.
But then I looked at my symptomdiary and went oh no, it took
me nearly three years to getover my depression and my brain
had erased it.
And so writing it was reallytough because I kind of had to
go back into those dark crevices.
(19:54):
And also, yeah, even writingabout my mum, I felt quite.
I didn't ever want to upset mymum, and the way I phrase it is,
I was mad at my mum, but nowI'm mad for her because she was
treated so badly.
So yeah, the depression chapteris heavy and I do say in the
(20:15):
book like if you're feeling abit wobbly, just skip this until
you're feeling stronger, likeseriously.
But if you're brave, hold myhand, I'll take you through it.
But I just yeah, it was tough.
Dominique Hind (20:26):
Yeah, I can imagine it would be, and you
know what it is.
Also, one of the hardest thingsis admitting it Like it is and
saying it out loud.
Well, not even admitting it,just recognizing it.
Shelly Horton (20:37):
Yeah, like I don't know.
I didn't I just because I hadnever had poor mental health
before, I didn't have the toolsin my toolbox to recognize
symptoms, to know that I had totake action to.
You know all of that and I haveto be really honest and say you
have to do the work.
So it's not just you can take apill and you feel better.
(20:57):
I was having regularappointments with the
psychiatrist.
I picked up my exercise, Iimproved my eating, I value my
sleep.
You know like so there's a lotof work that goes on behind the
scenes.
Dominique Hind (21:09):
Yeah, there is, and that's the thing everyone
keeps saying.
Like everyone that I talk to,it's all about doing the work on
yourself and making sure thatyou as a person, or the asset,
are actually okay.
Yeah absolutely, becauseotherwise everything else goes
to shit.
What do you hope women feel asthey turn the final page of the
(21:32):
book?
Shelly Horton (21:34):
I hope they feel informed and hopeful because,
yeah, it can be a rollickingride and it can be pretty
horrific for quite a few women,but you do get through it.
Dominique Hind (21:50):
Yeah.
Shelly Horton (21:51):
And then on the other side it's, yeah, it's like
coming out of a dark tunnel andit's like, oh, I'm here again.
So I hope, and I hope that theyfeel educated and entertained
because it's an easy read, whichis good.
Yeah, I think that you reallyneed um, I've I worked hard on
(22:12):
breaking down the science to getall of the jargon out of it and
, and you know, things likecalling estrogen the Beyonce
because it gives you the energy,and progesterone is the Snoop
dog because it makes you chill,Like all of that.
I'm like that'll stick inpeople's brains more than just
learning the terms.
I think so.
Yeah, I'm hoping that they willunderstand their bodies a bit
(22:34):
better.
Dominique Hind (22:36):
I do think that they will.
If you could build every womanin midlife a Perry survival kit,
what three things would youabsolutely have inside it?
Shelly Horton (22:47):
Well, I'm going to be very black and white on
this.
It's HIT vaginal estrogen andtestosterone.
That's it Like.
Get your hormones back in yourfreaking body.
That's what you need.
I'm like this is actually whatyou need, and I think that we
need to take that fear away ofHRT.
(23:09):
It has been disproven that itcauses breast cancer.
It's incredibly safe for themajority of women, so for me, I
just don't want women soldieringthrough, so a peri-survival
guide will will be.
Here's your HRT in all forms.
Dominique Hind (23:27):
Yep, yep, and I think that's a good one, and
it's great that there is nowmore research saying that it is
safe to use.
How can we makemicro-rebellions a daily habit,
and whether it's settingboundaries, ditching shame or
just wearing a bikini?
Shelly Horton (23:47):
You know what I think?
It's just using terms likeperimenopause and menopause in
everyday conversation.
You know, if you have a hotflush when you're in the line
for your coffee, tell thebarista.
You know like I just think themore it becomes everyday
language, the less shame andstigma there is.
It is a micro rebellion andthere's something I think
(24:08):
perimenopausal women have thatbit of micro rebellion in them.
So bring it up.
I'm you know.
I am sure my poor family is sosick of me talking about my
vagina, but I will keep talkingabout it.
Dominique Hind (24:22):
Your mum's on her cruise going.
Shelly Horton (24:23):
I don't want to think about your mother either,
my brother is just like oh Jesus, we're just trying to have fish
tacos.
Don't make the connection.
Dominique Hind (24:33):
If there was a national curriculum for women in
midlife, what three truthswould you make mandatory
learning?
Shelly Horton (24:42):
Well, the first one would be HRT is safe for the
majority of women.
Every single menopause societyin the world says the benefits
outweigh the risks for mostwomen.
The second thing will be you'renot alone, so own it and don't
hide it.
I think you feel alone whenyou're not sharing about it.
(25:02):
And then I think, yeah, one,two, three, third, one.
I would say it gets better.
This too shall pass.
Yeah, this too shall pass.
Dominique Hind (25:12):
Oh my God, that's one of my favorite
meditations.
A four-minute meditation, justyep, amazing.
Why do you think sex, libidoand body autonomy are still
taboo topics when it comes tomenopause and midlife?
Shelly Horton (25:26):
It's so funny because when I was single and
younger, I would be braggingabout how good I was in the sack
, like no problem.
And then getting married, it'slike, oh no, now that's private.
I'm like, why?
Like I think there's need totalk about your sex life,
(25:50):
particularly going through peri,because dry vagina is one of
the main symptoms and it's soincredibly treatable.
So I am again.
I put my hand up and now attimes I've shamed myself, but
when I originally was put on HRT, the doctor offered me vaginal
(26:12):
estrogen and I'm just like, ohyeah, nah, I like I'm not
interested, like I don't careabout sex, I don't, uh, and it's
, it's just one more thing to doon the to-do list, nah, not
interested.
And so I didn't use it for acouple of years and then it got
to the point where my vajayjaywas so dry that sometimes I
(26:32):
would split and bleed during sex.
Now it took that for me to go.
Oh, maybe I need to get on.
You know the vaginal estrogenand the thing is about vaginal
estrogen.
Even if you have breast cancerat this moment, you can have
vaginal estrogen because it doesnot go into your bloodstream.
(26:54):
It's like skincare for yourvagina and it's not just about
sex.
It's also because you know Idon't want you to be looking
after your vagina so that youcan keep someone else happy.
No it's about keeping you happyas well.
You can keep someone else happy.
No, it's about keeping youhappy as well, and the other
benefit as well.
(27:18):
As you know, it's softening thetissues and making you feel
more lubricated, it also helpsstop UTIs.
Yeah right, I had my first UTIwhen I was 19.
Let me tell you, that was froma shitload of sex.
I had my second UTI at 51.
And that was not because of alot of sex, that was because of
a dry vagina.
So I'm really passionate abouttalking about this because,
again, it feels like, okay,we're allowed to talk about
(27:40):
perimenopause, but don't talkabout sex and perimenopause.
Dominique Hind (27:43):
Yeah.
Shelly Horton (27:43):
Like no, no, no, let's own it.
And then the other thing whichoften I get women saying, well,
that's convinced me is whenyou're on the vaginal estrogen
you're not getting up to peeduring the night because it
helps with your bladder.
Wow, I didn't know that.
Just if you love your sleep,get on the vaginal estrogen.
Dominique Hind (28:02):
Okay, that is a good thing to know.
Yeah, what advice to women whofeel disconnected from their
bodies or ashamed of the changes?
Can you tell them that they aretotally normal?
Shelly Horton (28:17):
It's like it's everyone's different and it's
normal, for whatever you'refeeling is normal.
I think I think the good thingis if you can break through the
shame and actually talk abouthow you're feeling.
And it might be that you'refeeling a little bit awkward
because you've put some weightaround the middle and you know
(28:40):
you feel funny in bed with yourpartner.
Talk to your partner about it.
So you know, make sure you arecomfortable and and once you get
you know, make sure you arecomfortable.
And once you get you know thediscussion rolling with your
partner, it just stops it frombeing this big elephant in the
room.
Like the last thing you want isto be avoiding sex because
(29:04):
you're not feeling good aboutyour body.
You've got a dry vagina, youknow all of these things.
Like there are so many barriers.
If you actually go hey, hun,this is what's going on, let's
tackle it together.
Um, you can be a team?
Yeah.
And then the other thing againKelly Casperson.
I love her so much, uh, fangirllike crazy when I met her.
(29:25):
Uh, but she just said herbiggest advice after vaginal
estrogen use lube, use a lot oflube.
Don't skip the lube.
All right.
Dominique Hind (29:35):
Yeah, but even just talking about that and
knowing that it's not a shame todo is a good thing.
Shelly Horton (29:45):
I started.
When I started needing to uselube, I felt like I was a
failure because I wasn't gettingwet enough.
Yeah, like what?
Yeah, women blame ourselves foreverything.
Dominique Hind (29:58):
Yes.
Shelly Horton (29:58):
Let's just stop doing that yeah.
Dominique Hind (30:01):
I think you're right.
Stop doing it, start having theconversations and just own it.
Yeah, yeah.
Can laughter and honesty reallydismantle shame, or are they
still things that can be hard tosay out loud, even for you?
Shelly Horton (30:19):
Yeah, look, of course it is I.
It took me a while to actuallydiscuss sex with Darren and I
think it was it.
For me it normally comes from abit of a crisis point.
So I, we had sex one time and Iand I split and bled afterwards
(30:41):
and I cried and because it hurtand he was, he was so shocked
and he's like I never, neverwant to hurt you.
You need to tell me about this.
So like it was me who washolding back.
So I think that is like thecrisis point.
And then the humour comes in,which is like babe, I've got to
(31:02):
grab the lube because I've gotthe Sahara down there, you know,
like that can just make it alittle bit more fun and not like
a serious birds and bees chatsort of thing.
Dominique Hind (31:10):
Yeah, yeah and I think it does make it easier If
you could wave your magicperiwand and change one thing
about how society treats womenin midlife.
What would you change first?
Shelly Horton (31:27):
I would change the way that society thinks that
women's value stops when theystop having babies.
I'm sorry, but when we stopreproducing, we still have half
a life ahead of us.
So for me, I think we need toreally change that stigma in
(31:48):
society.
We need to really change thatstigma in society and I think
that once we get through thishormonal rollercoaster, there is
like a badge of honor, a vag ofhonor, where it's like I've
(32:09):
been through hell and I survivedand I am a warrior.
Now I am a peri-warrior and notmuch is going to knock me
around, because I've beenthrough the trenches, you know,
and I think that there's,there'd be something great, I
you know, in in other, um, oldercommunities, women were
considered wise women and theywould be, you know, treated as
(32:33):
people you'd go to for mentoringand information, and that's
kind of been lost because wedon't have our extended families
like we used to.
So I would love that we steppedback into that wise women role.
Dominique Hind (32:46):
Yeah, I think that's a great thing.
Okay, I've got a rapid fireround for you.
First thing that comes to yourmind no overthinking HRT or
herbal.
Shelly Horton (32:56):
HRT, your body does not have an ashwagandha
deficiency, is it that?
Dominique Hind (33:03):
simple, yeah, good answer Most overrated
menopause trend.
Shelly Horton (33:09):
Anything you can buy on Facebook and can't get
from a doctor, good.
Dominique Hind (33:13):
Go-to comfort binge.
Shelly Horton (33:18):
So right now, I've just finished Untamed.
Have you seen that series?
Yes, with Eric Banner in it?
Yes, love a TV binge Also.
Don't mind a Negroni bingeeither.
Dominique Hind (33:33):
Are you allowed to have that?
No, not supposed to.
Shelly Horton (33:36):
Not supposed to Like not great for
perimenopausal women.
But hey, do as they say, not asthey do.
Okay, Exactly.
Dominique Hind (33:44):
Um, if menopause was a celebrity, who would it
be?
Shelly Horton (33:47):
Oh, yeah, um, russell Crowe, oh, was a
celebrity, who would it be?
Oh yeah, russell Crowe, oh, wow, in his life Badass, gladiator,
beautiful, mind craziness andthen sometimes just throwing a
hotel phone at a receptionist.
Yeah, okay, good.
Dominique Hind (34:05):
Yeah, okay, russell can be the pin-up girl
boy way, everything would be formenopause.
And then, what is the one truthabout perimenopausal midlife
that more women need to hear andbelieve?
Shelly Horton (34:23):
You're not alone and there are solutions out
there.
It's up to you to educateyourself and find out what's
right for you and makeevidence-based, educated
decisions, not shame-baseddecisions of.
I don't want to speak to adoctor about this, so I'll just
(34:44):
get some potion on, you know, onFacebook that gets delivered to
my house and no one will knowabout it.
The best thing to get rid ofshame is sunlight, so let's
shine a light into this area ofa woman's life and make sure
that she is treated as thesuperstar that she is.
Yep.
Dominique Hind (35:04):
I like that.
Okay, shelley, thisconversation has been bold,
hilarious and honest and evenjust reading your book, it is a
bit of a wake-up call for meBefore we wrap up.
If I could try one thing beforeI hit 50, something that shifts
how I see myself, reclaim mypower or sets me up to own the
(35:26):
next decade, or two decades, orthree decades.
Or three decades yeah, whatwould it be?
Shelly Horton (35:31):
So here's the thing, Dom I listened to your
podcast and you're doing so muchalready.
I'm actually super proud of you.
So I know you're doing theweight training, I know you're
doing mindfulness.
I know you're doing so much.
I think maybe the only thing Iwould say is protect your sleep.
Sleep is the super elixir.
(35:53):
So for me, that is what I makesure I am very vigilant about I
have a bedtime now.
Dominique Hind (36:02):
What time is your bedtime?
Shelly Horton (36:05):
9.30.
9.30 is my bedtime.
I get up at 6.30.
Having that routine I know mybrain likes that Making your
room nice and dark and cold sothat it's easy to get to sleep.
I have a very busy brain.
I'm sure you're very surprisedto hear that, but I can't just
lie down and go to sleep becausemy brain just you know thinks
(36:28):
about the conversation where Isaid something awkward three
years ago and I will just spiralfor the rest of the night.
So what I do is I pop an audiobook into my ear, I have one ear
pod in and I set it on a timerfor 20 minutes and then I go off
to sleep and for me, havingthat routine just works.
(36:48):
And then, when I get up at 6.30, I go for a walk in the
sunshine and everything aboutthe day is better.
Dominique Hind (36:55):
Yeah, particularly when you're on the
Gold Coast and you can go to thebeach.
It's so nice up here.
Yes, not down here today.
Anyway, I've heard it's raining.
Yes, thank you.
It sucks to be you.
Yes, it does.
I even looked at like where I'min paradise.
Yeah, okay, whatever, I grew upin Noosa, does that?
Shelly Horton (37:11):
like help.
Oh, okay, that's fair.
Dominique Hind (37:13):
All right, shelley, thank you, thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you for writing the book,thank you for being the voice
so many of us didn't know thatwe really needed, but really do.
You've reminded us that powerdoesn't come from pretending
we're fine.
It comes from speaking up,shaking things up and laughing
through the hot flushes Toeveryone listening.
(37:34):
Get your hands on.
I'm your Perry Godmother.
Order the book or, if it's backon Amazon because it's sold out
.
Shelly Horton (37:43):
Sold out on Amazon one day.
It's also on Audible and it'sin bookstores.
Dominique Hind (37:48):
Okay, good, all right.
Share this episode with threewomen in your life and tag us
when you do.
We're building the midliferevolution, one honest
conversation at a time.
Share this with every woman youknow who's quietly wondering if
she's the only one goingthrough this, because she's not.
And fuck, we're nearly nearly50, but isn't it amazing.
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