August 30, 2023 • 37 mins
I've got one hell of a story to share with you in this episode. In this episode, Nancy and I dive head-first into the shocking realities of the church I was raised in. We're tearing down walls, sharing gritty details of my childhood experiences living in constant dread of the rapture, chasing after salvation, sanctification, and the Holy Spirit. The church's insidious techniques of manipulation are laid bare as we dissect the daily regimented rituals that held us captive - from potlucks that weren't so innocent, to speaking in tongues and even exorcisms.
Hold onto your seats as I reveal the disturbing prayers directed towards me and recount my own tumultuous actions as a teenager. An experience I believed to be my rebirth led me to question if I had truly been saved. This unfiltered, raw and real episode uncovers the sinister truth behind what seemed to be a religious group, but bore a striking resemblance to a cult. Come along on this journey of self-discovery, manipulation, and the pursuit of freedom. It's authentic, it's intense, and it's all in here. Buckle up!
[3:57] - Discussing the concept of being 'saved' and its implications.
[6:38] - Reflecting on the changing dynamics within the church community.
[10:05] - Discussing the shift towards homeschooling within the church community
[15:24] - My "aha" moment when I realized things were not as they seemed.
[22:10] - Unveiling the disturbing prayers and my violent past.
[28:45] - Sharing a transformative experience that made me question everything
[35:19] - Exposing the cult-like nature of the religious group.
[41:08] - My journey towards self-discovery and freedom.
You've walked with me down some pretty gnarly memory lanes today, seen the good, the bad, and the freakin' ugly. Remember, life's a wild ride, and it's all about staying true to yourself, questioning everything, and seeking your own freedom. If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to rate us, follow us, share this with your friends, and leave a review. It's your support that keeps us going. Most importantly, stay f*ck’n authentic!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Nick (00:07):
It's time to get fucking authentic.
Oh my god. So here we are again.
Oh man. So it's funny because acouple of people have mentioned
on our episode where Iinterviewed my mom, and it was
mixed bag, where like peoplelike, what you were gonna
fucking lean into her. And otherpeople were like, wow, that was
(00:30):
nice. It was just like thishappen. Obviously, you know, 50s
I mean, this happened some yearsago, years ago, and I've
forgiven her a long time ago,I'll be honest with you, that
really changed my perspective.
As I said, it opened up youreyes a little bit, it opened up
my eyes a little bit more. Butit also gave me I felt released.
(00:51):
Like I felt freedom from it wasdoing that. For me. She actually
talked about ownership of it.
This is true, not just like youweren't born with a manual neck
kind of ship. There wasownership of it. And I think
that Fuck, man, that's huge. Ithink that's huge for anybody to
just have I don't know aboutvalidation. Because I know what
(01:12):
I've felt, or what I've knownthat I went through is real. It
gave me a little bit of freedom.
And since then, I think that Ihave a different feeling and a
little bit of a betterrelationship. Just because of
it.
Unknown (01:27):
Sounds a little weird,
Nick (01:29):
but it's true.
Nancy (01:30):
Well, it was her perspective, too. I think that's
a totally different. Yeah, we'veseen it, you've seen it your
way. And she's just telling youstraight up like that's not
Nick (01:41):
while she's telling us straight up. But not even just
her perspective, because it wasperspective can be different. I
think, for me, she's saying,
Unknown (01:49):
look like,
Nick (01:51):
I didn't make the right choices. I fucked up. It's not
leaning on the excuse of youknow, your kids were with
Emanuel was no excuses. Yeah,for what she did, which is huge.
Yeah, it's pretty fucking core.
So I thought, this time, wewould go into more of the inner
workings in sort of theteachings and should of the
(02:13):
church and a few experiencesthat I experienced. And then we
can maybe go through a couplethat you experienced, too, which
again, we've already come to theconclusion that it was a
completely different experience.
Nancy (02:26):
This is true. For me at least Yes. I mean, growing
Nick (02:29):
up for me, it was full gospel, Bible believing church,
right. And I think the ideabehind that was that, in order
to get to heaven, you had torepent of your sins, you had to
get saved. And this is where alot of the difference comes in
with a lot of religions maybe ordenominations or whatever, but
(02:54):
you had to be saved, but notonly saved, but you had to be
sanctified, saved as youaccepted God, but then you had
to be sanctified, while you'resitting is taken away. And then
you had to be baptized in theHoly Ghost
Nancy (03:07):
filled with the Holy Ghost. Yeah, that's right. I
totally forgot about that. Andthen
Nick (03:11):
when you were filled with the Holy Ghost that gave you the
ability to speak in tongues,prophesy. And then if you were
filled with the Holy Ghost,let's say somebody prophesied in
a tongue that nobody understood,then you inherently there would
be people who were able todecipher that prophecy. So you
would have somebody who wouldprophesy
(03:36):
speak in tongues and prophesiedto the congregation. And then
following that, there would besomeone who deciphered what that
person said,
Nancy (03:46):
Oh, wow. Okay, so I don't think we ever talked about this.
We haven't. So with you thengrowing up to church, when did
the songhappen to you? What do you mean?
Like, when did you get saved toyoung kids get saved? Yeah. So
that's where I think and we'regonna have
Nick (04:07):
a few guests on, that I grew up with, even from the
church, but I know one inparticular, which will keep
anonymous because some peoplehave asked to be anonymous, and
that's cool. They have jobs anda lot of people who whatever,
but this person particularlysaid that they never even felt
(04:27):
anything. So literally, theywere just going through the
motions. Now, the odd thingabout this person is this is the
person that I was supposed tomarry. This is going to be part
of the story right of how we metand how this was. And she is
actually now your best friend.
But yet, I was supposed to marryher. Like it was fucked up.
Yeah. We had mentioned a touchof this in the very first
(04:51):
episode, but she never feltanything, but did you feel
anything? So that's fun. That'sfunny because as a child, it's
hard to explain. You're almostforced. That's your reality,
right? You see this, you'reraised in this. You're raised in
it. And if you don't get saved,sanctified and filled with the
(05:14):
Holy Spirit when the rapturecomes, you're not going to have
it. Oh, we had to be all threeof those. Oh, yeah. Well,
growing up, again, growing up,this is true for you. Because if
you, it was so fucked up, to behonest with you, because if you
got saved and sanctified, butthen you sin, then you back slid
to you than you would have toalmost get resynced like it was
(05:38):
a constant. Fucking struggle.
Nancy (05:43):
I do remember that because I got sanctified Well,
what I thought was sanctified.
And I remember, I was out atlunch doing something and I said
the word Fuck, yeah. And lookedat me. And they're like,
Nick (05:55):
that's it. Yeah. And the funny thing to say funny thing,
the real fucked up thing aboutit was, so as a kid, I'm always
trying to get saved, sanctifiedand filled with the Holy Ghost.
And you would see other peoplearound you getting filled with
the Holy Ghost.
Nancy (06:13):
But I mean, were the young kids getting filled with
the Holy Ghost? Well, yeah. Oh,but so
Nick (06:17):
so that was the funny thing. So I could say that I was
filled with the Holy Ghost. Butwas that really filled with the
Holy Ghost? What the fuck doesthat mean? I don't like I get
speaking in tongues and all thatkind of stuff. Absolutely. I
just have to
Nancy (06:29):
remember kids doing it.
Because
Nick (06:32):
by the time you had gotten there, which I had already been
gone, but right by that time,a lot of that core group of us
had grown up. And there weren'ta lot of kids coming in with
parents. Think about it. All thekids that were there had been
there for a long time. Yes. Andthings had started to change,
like we talked about, right? Soit was a different. It was a
different era, then, like I'mtalking like, 1972 to like,
(06:56):
1980. That was a fucked up time.
Nancy (07:05):
So you growing up in this church? Yeah. Well, you guys
like cut like you guys. Eightdays a week you were going to
church? Right? Yeah. You gohome? Yeah. You are in school,
too. Right. So you? I mean, thisis like 24/7. It almost seems
like when you went home? Wasyour mom like reading the Bible
constantly to you guys?
Nick (07:26):
No, no, there wasn't like constantly reading the Bible,
like you had to do your likeyour daily devotions. You should
pray before you go to bed. Therewere always daily devotions.
Every day in school, there wasBible class, there was daily
devotions, and then going tochurch. It's almost like peer
pressure. When you see everybodyaround you and this is going on.
(07:47):
I have to say that I probablyfake some of that shit. Because
it was like, well, this personspeaking in tongues, and this
person speaking in tongues, andI could be like, I right now
could just bust out speaking intongues. And nobody else would
know the wiser. Like if I was inchurch, right? I could just bust
(08:08):
out speaking in tongues, like, Ilived with that shit. So I can
even speak. It was your tongues.
Right? So it came to you. So ifnobody can decipher it and say,
you're not speaking in tongues,you're a fucking liar. You just
did it. I honestly have to saythat.
(08:30):
A lot of the pressure from doingthat. Here's the bottom line.
I don't ever think I was savedor sanctified or filled with the
Holy Ghost, meaning it wasalmost like I was forced into
being saved, sanctified andfilled with the Holy Ghost.
Because if you didn't do thatyou weren't going to heaven. And
they were constantly preaching.
You can't ride your mother'scoattails. This is all on you.
(08:52):
It's all up to you. You got todo this shit for yourself.
Nancy (08:57):
So being that young, were you afraid that you were gonna
go to hell? Oh,
Nick (09:02):
that's a really good question. And let me tell you,
this is some fucked up shit. I'mgonna be straight up and
Unknown (09:11):
I remember specifically in church,
Nick (09:17):
where, you know, there was always held on fire and
brimstone. Always God was aboutto come any day now. The end of
the world is coming soon. Justlook around. You see the signs
of the times the book ofRevelation.
This is the reason why theystarted to schools sort of
homeschool you. There was noneed to really like a lot of
people had quit their jobsstarted working in the church
(09:39):
and in the ministry. That's whywe never had money. That's why
we had food stamps. You know, mymom worked for a company for a
little while, but then that wasit. And then when my dad was
gone, like there was no moneycoming in. My grandma worked at
a button factory for a while.
And then she retired. You know,there was nothing coming in. The
only thing coming in was foodstamps. And then my mom worked
for the church.
(09:59):
He got out of school startedgoing to school there, eight
days a week, whatever it was. Soyou never really got away from
that. You were completely cutoff from the outside world for
the most part, right? Becauseyou were always in church. You
know, even when you wentshopping and stuff, you went
shopping with a group of people,a lot of times he as well as
(10:21):
together. So we were alwaystogether. We were in vans and
buses, and we were alwaystogether traveling and you had,
like I said, Monday night wascoffeehouse, and then Tuesday
night is Preacher's Wife, or thepreacher, the freakin good, you
run the whole thing. And thenshe was That was her night. So
So basic service would besomething like, you get there by
(10:41):
eight o'clock at night. And thenservice singing went, you know,
half hour, whatever. And thenthey did like something like
testimonies where people wouldstand up. And after the
testimonies, they would do anoffering, of course, you had to
collect the fucking money, youhad to keep them, you know, fat
cats nice and fucking plumping.
And then Tuesday night would beher, right. And she would teach
(11:02):
for like, an hour or so preachfor an hour or so. And
sometimes, if she really gotfilled with the fucking spirit,
she would go even longer. Yes.
And you wouldn't get out ofthere till 1010 3011 o'clock,
then Wednesday night, it wouldbe almost the same type of
service a little bit longer. Butthen the fat cat was there, and
(11:24):
he fucking he had to preach. Andthen Thursday night was coffee
house again. And then Fridaynight was kids service. Right.
So it was the same process withthe singing, but it was kids
songs and all that. And thenthey would have like, where
people would put on plays and indifferent shit like teenagers.
Teenagers. Yeah. And thenafterwards, everybody could get
(11:46):
together. This was a one timethat the guys and the girls were
to hang out with each otherbecause there were like people
watching all over the fuckingplace. And you would play
volleyball in the gym, like gettogether. Yeah, it was sort of
that place. Voting here. Andthen Saturday, you know,
Saturday, you would go and cleanthe pastor's house, or you would
(12:07):
clean the church or you would dowhatever and it was prayer. And
then Saturday night was prayermeeting. So you would go there
and you would be on your kneespraying for hour, hour and a
half, whatever, sleeping.
Sleeping, yes. And then you'dwake up Sunday morning early,
and you'd go to church forSunday school, then they would
preach their whatever, collectofferings just like every other
(12:27):
night, then you'd go home, you'deat, you couldn't do anything,
couldn't work, couldn't donothing. You had to go home, eat
and rest. It was a day of rest.
That was a teaching. That's whatthe Bible says the seventh day
was a day of rest. So youliterally can do zero. If if you
(12:47):
did something you were centered,you probably back slid Sunday
night, you'd get back up and youfucking go right back to church.
And then it started all over onMonday. So what wound up
happening was like on a Tuesdayor Wednesday or Sunday night,
whatever, the I forget what theycall fucking action group or
whatever, fucking whatever. Butthey would go out afterwards.
(13:08):
And they would go out to arestaurant. And by the way, most
of the people in the church, thepeople who were like, at the
top, at least, were like,probably the most unhealthiest
people. They all probably hadsome sort of a food addiction.
Every one of them had fuckingproblems. You know what I'm
saying? I mean, I thinkactually, this fucking joint
(13:29):
brought on more stress andactually tore apart more
families said it was good. But Iremember, we never had money. So
there'd be times when we'd beable to go into the restaurant,
you have to understand thatwe're literally with these
people, this top group of peopleall the time. So all these kids
that we grew up together, by theway, I'm still in contact with
(13:52):
all of those people. Who haveobviously since gotten out of
that, and some of them don'tbelieve in God at all. Some of
them are atheist. Some of themdo believe in God. Some of them.
Yeah, it's a mixture. It's amixture, right? Sometimes we
were able to go in to therestaurant. A lot of times we
weren't. We had to sit in thecar. My mom would go in, she'd
(14:14):
go in with her friends. They'dwind up eating, they'd wind up
doing whatever, we'd be sittingin the car waiting for her. That
happened more times than Irealized.
Nancy (14:24):
Isn't that crazy? And now it's something like that. Are
Nick (14:26):
you kidding me? Yeah. I mean, there'd be times when we
would go in, you know, thewaitress is going around saying,
what are you going to have? Whatare you going to have? What are
you going to have when it comesto me? And she's like, What are
you going to have? And I'll belike, I'll have my mouse like,
no, no, no, we don't have anymoney for that. So use limit
them. Well, you'd sit there andyou'd breadsticks with butter
that came in the basket on thetable or UD three and drink some
(14:47):
water you know? Remember KennyYeah, I mean, that's so that was
the idea. Christmases andthanksgivings. And all the
holidays and everything wasalways together with these
people. We did No our familyoutside of the church, where
things really start to getfucking weird where they
literally bought like nine acresout in Southern Illinois, they
(15:10):
bought a school. Then I wasraised in the thick of it. We
went down there I mean roomafter room after room of just
fixing them up with the girlsand the boys with the boys and
all the holidays, everybodywould go down there and they
would spend the night and thenext day you would celebrate
(15:30):
July 4, you would celebratethis, but you would have church
and then you'd all get togetherand there were massive plates of
food. And just everybody wouldcook all kinds of shit and some
big ol potluck. A big ol massivepotluck. Yeah. And the adults
had to eat first. The childrenwere always second best. The
(15:51):
children are always second inline. There was never when I was
growing up. You fucking satthere and you waited your turn.
You were seen and not heardwhatsoever. If you spoke up, you
got your ass beat. If youquestion anything, you got your
SP if you spoke out of turn, yougot your fucking
Nancy (16:12):
date first, and then they fed you. They wouldn't be
Nick (16:16):
these fucking fat cats would go up there with these big
massive plates and fuckingwhatever. I'm not saying there
wasn't food left, but you gotthe scraps. Let's face it, you
got the fucking scraps. That'sthe way it was. And that's how
you were taught your fuckingsecond rate. Interest is nothing
more to it, right? I'm notsaying that your kid should be
like Jesus Christ. But I'msaying that that's the way it
(16:36):
was. Right? And no matter what,you you were fucking punished
for it. Day after day after day,getting into the car for doing
nothing. And the fear that you'dbe like, you wait till you get
home, you're gonna get yourfucking ass beat. Now my mom
didn't say it like that. But itwas like you wait till you get
home, you're getting a beating.
And it wasn't like I'm gonnaspank you, but it's you're
(16:57):
getting a beating. She wouldfollow through or they owe 100%
This is what would happen. Sothen what would happen is that
as a kid, I'm fucking freakedout, right? So I'm sleeping in
the back. I tried to pretendlike I'm sleeping. So when we
get to the house, I'm asleep.
And what are you going to do?
Wake me up and beat me. Butyeah, that's what would happen.
I mean, yeah, that's exactlywhat would happen. You would
think it wouldn't happen. Oh,she's gonna forget about it. No,
(17:17):
she didn't forget. I fucking askthe question. So you deserve to
get your ass beat.
Nancy (17:23):
That's the way it was this church? And I mean, did you
as a kid get to see all those,they would have these castings
of like, like certain peoplewould go into those rooms. So if
you weren't filled,
Nick (17:36):
so when we were going, Yeah, you weren't filled with
the Holy Ghost that created ashield. So basically, what would
happen is, oh, man, yes, theywould do what? The best way I
can describe it to people is thethe world knows that, say an
exorcism. So that was somethingthat would happen quite a bit. I
mean, they're they what theycall the was casting out demons.
(17:57):
They didn't say exorcism. Right.
It was casting out demons. Oh,yeah. I mean, if that thing
started to happen, they wouldimmediately get all the kids out
from the congregation out fromthe church, they would put
everybody downstairs because thebelief was that if when the
demons come out of the people,they search for someone to go
into. And that that was thing.
So the kids were weak souls, ofcourse. So the kids didn't have
(18:23):
enough power to fight off thedemons. We were weak souls, so
the kids would have to leave.
And it would be all the adultswould be up there. Yeah, that
I've witnessed a couple of morethan a couple of times.
Actually, there was one guy, Idon't know, this guy probably
got demons cast out of them,like every three years or
something. It was just, it wasjust weird. And I want people to
understand that. I don't knowhow to say it other than just
(18:47):
say it as it is. You knew it wasgoing to happen. It would go
from someone just praying. Atthe end of every song, you would
praise the Lord. You put yourhands up and you know, thank
you, Jesus, I pray Thank you,thank whatever everybody was
saying at the time, right? And,well, ultimately, in the long
(19:09):
run, what wound up happening waswhen we were younger, services
were services. You had songs,you had some praise and other
songs and praise. You know,you'd have some testimonies,
you'd have the offeringplayground you would do the
preaching and then it would bedone right. I think what started
to happen was the preacher thedude, you know, fat cat would
starting to get a little older.
(19:32):
And I think he was becoming morerelevant. You know what I mean
as time went on, and so Mrs. FatCat decided that it was easier
just to take over a little bitmore and so it went from that
growing up to all of a suddenyou sing only a couple songs
done at the end of a praise thatall of a sudden that praise.
Like, dude, it was so fuckingtime. If you would do a praise
(19:56):
after a song that would last aminute or two. If it started on
past five, as a kid, I knewlike, okay, there's going to be
an outpouring. In other words,there was no more church,
meaning it would turn into likethis revival where all you were
doing was people were weepingand crying, and they were
getting filled with the Spiritand, and there were people
(20:19):
walking up front, and they weregetting their hands laid on him
and people were falling to theground. And it was just, it was
fucking crazy, right. And thatis almost what started to happen
on the daily. Like the serviceswere almost like not even
existent anymore. But when theywould cast out the demons, what
would happen is, you knew thatthis was about to happen, when
(20:42):
there would be a lot ofcommotion starting. And I mean
commotion, like screaming, therewould be someone that that
they've I don't want to saytargeted, right, I don't know
how it started. But this personwould just be like, overwhelmed,
let's just say they would seemoverwhelmed and they would start
screaming. And immediately whenthat would happen, the leaders
(21:06):
of the church, others, actressesor the whatever, they jump on
these people. That was it whenthat would happen. Everybody
downstairs like they if you arenot saved, sanctified, filled
with the Holy Ghost, you betterget the fuck out of that
congregation.
And it was real. It happened.
I seen it happen. As a matter offact, it happened to me. Don't
(21:31):
talk about it much. People sayoh, you're fucking crazy.
Whatever I will tell you.
Without a shadow of a doubt. Myexperience is very simple to
explain experience. It's notsimple to understand. But it's
simple to explain what happened.
You didn't even know me in thiscongregation
(21:56):
was hand in hand around thewhole congregation praying that
I would become paraplegic. Yes,to save my soul. Because at the
time when my mom had kicked meout, of course, I had just gone
into complete and utter madness,right. So of course, I mean,
that's, I mean, yes, I did. Iwas very hateful. And I did a
(22:19):
lot of bad things, but to tohope that someone would be
paralyzed to save their soulspretty fucked up. Yeah. Well,
when I got kicked out of church,my experience was that God is
love. Jesus loves you. Jesusloves you. He's here to protect
you. He loves you. You have toserve Him. If you don't serve
(22:40):
Him, you're not going to go toheaven, you're going to hell and
you're gonna burn and you'regonna have we watched movies
after movies of the hiding placeand Corrie 10 Boom, and all
these fucking movies where theywere showing where the fucking
Russians came in, and they tookover and the Communists took
over. And they persecuted youand they put fucking sticks
through your ears. And they didlike all this shit happened.
(23:03):
So you had the fear of fuckingthat you were fucked up.
And so when I left I said tomyself, if that's what love is,
that I want to have none to doit. Yeah, I mean, if that's what
Jesus is, and that's what loveis, fuck that. I don't have
nothing to do with that shit.
And so I turned the other way.
(23:29):
I turned intoI don't want to say that I went
full fledged into worshippingSatan or the Devil. But that was
okay to do eg board thing didlike little seances and all that
kind of shit as a kid your yourfucking
Nancy (23:46):
metal.
Nick (23:47):
Heavy Metal? Yeah, like for sure. Yeah, like King
Diamond and fucking crazy shit,right? But I didn't realize how
much of an impact that wouldactually have on me. Right. So.
So on the one side, the impactof church and abuse was very
real. And that being taught aslove, right, but yet it was
(24:11):
violent. The violence ofeverything became pretty natural
to me. And I think that my mindand my body and my spirit just
accepted the violence andaccepted things to be fucked up.
After a while, I realized that Icouldn't keep going on that way.
(24:33):
Because I would either wind updead or in jail for the rest of
my life. So I had gone back tochurch. And I remember very
specifically, I went back tochurch. I was sitting in the
back pews. And they startedpraying, praising again after
(24:59):
song And it got to thisoutpouring. an outpouring was
something where, if you were ata concert, you know, fucking
Metallica saying this badasssong. And afterwards, at the end
of the concert, everyone's like,encore encore, you wouldn't go
anywhere until they came back onstage to do something that's
sort of like an outpouring waslike, going and going and going
(25:23):
and just didn't stop until itstopped waiting for something.
Yeah. So wound up happening wasthere was this prophecy.
Somebody deciphered the prophecygave meaning to the prophecy.
And all I felt at that time wasan absolute fucking hate. The
best way that I can describewhat happened is it was an
(25:45):
absolute hate building inside ofme. And the only thing I
remember, at the time, my wholeface just turned absolutely
fucking red, hot, say red hot.
And somebody came behind me andput their hands on me to pray
(26:06):
for me. And that put me over theedge. them touching, touching
me, put me over the edge.
Because I was there. Because Iknew if I kept doing what I was
doing that I would be in jail,dead or in jail. And still, the
(26:27):
fear in me through all of thiswas that I would go to hell. But
then at some point, I acceptedthat. And I was like, Okay, so
I'm going to help
Nancy (26:35):
you came back to a place that you couldn't just like my
mom says, and that's exactlywhat I was.
Nick (26:42):
It has it has it grips you. It's fucking grips you.
And, and I just was sittingthere. And this dude's got his
hands on me. And to be honestwith you, this dude in
particular, was a really niceguy. There was no malice there.
(27:03):
It wasn't even a leader likethis guy literally came to me
sincere sincerely because he wasdoing what he believed. And he
was literally just showing mekindness in his own way, right?
Because most people that went tohis church, were sincere people.
Don't get me wrong. Noteverybody in that church was a
(27:23):
fucking asshole. So this guy puthis hands on me, and I lost it.
I fucking lost it. I lost it. Istarted punching the fucking the
the bench and in front of me.
And I'm just fucking bang andlike you're at a sports event in
your head in the seats. But nowI'm just punching it. So this is
the same thing I experienced asI was growing up as a kid. And
(27:46):
so now, more people are startingto come behind me. And now
people are shifting out. It's anout of the body experience. To
lose control like that. I'velost control, like literally
lost control in my life, I'd sayprobably three times. And this
was one of them. All I rememberis banging, banging, banging,
(28:10):
and them shoveling people out inthem saying, you know, in the
name of Jesus, and this is howthey would do it in the name of
Jesus, I command you to comeout, I command you to come out.
And I'm fighting. Right now I'mfighting. And they're holding me
down on the bench. So I'm inbetween the benches, which is a
(28:31):
small, it's a very small area.
So. So now I'm on the bench andI'm on my back. And all I
remember is them saying Icommend you to come on, I
command you to come out. Andwhat they would do is they would
ask, What is your name? What isyour name? You know, depending
on how many demons were in you,they would want the name of each
(28:52):
demon or whatever. And then theywould command them by their name
to commodity. Oh, I see. By timeI was done with this whole
ordeal. All I remember as thisis going on, is I kept spitting
up the most foul tasting
Unknown (29:16):
phlegm in my life.
Nick (29:20):
And every time they would say I command you to come out I
command you to come out. Itwould be like this foul tasting
fucking phlegm. It was like thenastiest greenish fucking phlegm
that there was. Wow. And at theend at the end of that
Unknown (29:39):
I was exhausted.
Nancy (29:43):
Everyone was always exhausted, exhausted.
Nick (29:47):
But I felt so fucking light.
Like it was the weirdest, mostunbelievable experience I've
ever had in my life. And I knowThere are going to be people who
are going to listen to this.
And they're going to think I'm afucking nutjob. And I don't give
(30:10):
a fuck, right? We this isfucking authentic, right? I
like, I know what I went throughin my life. I know what I went
through that day. I know what Iwent through that night.
Unknown (30:21):
And it was real.
There's, there's absolutely nodenying it. It was real. And of
course, I'm sitting here and I'mjust like, we have course it was
we'll,
Nancy (30:36):
I mean, you were in a very stressful situation. You
were very upset. Yep, I get whatyou're saying that people might
think you're crazy. You know,when I'm, I'm looking at all of
this stuff at the church when itwould happen. And I just always
thought that it was just people
Nick (30:56):
just creating this. Yeah.
When you work yourself up, youknow it just and I've asked
myself that question. Becauseyou're so such an angry, I was
very angry. But that's what I'msaying. So I don't discount it.
I was a 18 year old, young man,who was very violent and
hateful. And I hated everybodyand everything.
(31:25):
I never had relationships. Itwas a relationship of either
sexual preference, or I didn'tcare about anybody. So
was it something I went throughthat again?
Nancy (31:41):
Did that's what they wanted? Yes. We have always.
Nick (31:45):
It was easier to manipulate. And they you heard
my mom, you know, it's the samething, right?
Nancy (31:49):
I mean, when that happens, they were so ecstatic
that that happens. You know whatI mean? Like, we finally got him
after that. That's when he wasso
Nick (31:58):
right or something. Yeah.
So so what happens is afterthat, they're like, Okay, so
contrary to your, you know, thisis great. So, now we're going to
ship you off to the school thatwe bought, we still don't really
trust you. Because you're,you're such a fucking womanizer.
And you're going to turn youknow, you're just going to
seduce everybody in the fuckingchurch, we're going to send you
out to Wellington. And we'regoing to pay you $50 a week to
(32:19):
stay out there. But you're justgoing to have a place to stay in
your house. And you're gonnastay out there with his other
dudes, which is another wholefucking story. The stories go on
and on and on. And but I go outto this place, I'm sort of still
excommunicated, but under sortof a supervision of this dude,
(32:41):
well, it's because this dude whoI look, I get along with
everybody, and I'm not here tobadmouth anybody,
Nancy (32:48):
but this. This ordeal just happen to you. How did you
feel afterward? The Exorcism orthe kiss whatever it was, that
happened. I felt like I said, Ifelt reborn. So then when they
sent you out there did the angercome back. Did you like
Nick (33:04):
was cool. So when they sent me out there, I'm like, off
this is actually pretty cool.
Nancy (33:08):
You left? You wanted to come back because this was a
safe haven safe place. Thishappens to you. Yeah. They then
ship you out. Yeah. toWellington. Yeah. And you're
ecstatic, right? Because,
Nick (33:23):
because I really don't have to go to church. It was
funny, because the dude that wasthere, he was able to do the
same thing. He actually wasprobably pissed because I was
coming out because I rocked hisboat, you know, like, I messed
up his whole world, because nowhe was forced to do devotions
with me and have this kind ofsense. But then he would, hey,
maybe we do that a little later.
You know, I'm gonna go to thestore. What he's doing is he's
(33:43):
going down the block to fucksome chick, like, it's
hilarious. It's like, it was butagain, I mean, it was in the end
of it all. It was really afucking joke, right? I mean,
like, people are humans and theygot their lives and I don't care
if you think you're safe,sanctified, filled with the Holy
Ghost. I mean, everybodyinherently is doing what they
want, right? You could be undersome sort of condemnation and
(34:06):
stress and, and whatever but atthe end of the day, you're still
going to live your life likeit's a fact that the fat cats in
the fucking church, Mr. Fat Cat,Mrs. Fat Cat and fat cat kids
are all fucking doing their ownthing. Right? Right. I said it
in the first episode. I mean,they're watching TV, they're
fucking taking medicine or doingwhatever. And they're preaching
on the pulpit that you can't do
Nancy (34:28):
that shit. But you were happy. You were but I knew it.
But I was like, you know whywe're in a safe place. Dude,
Nick (34:35):
I was safe. I wasn't going to jail. Right? I had food.
Right? Right. It was almost likegoing to jail. And out there. I
don't have to answer anybodypaid lunch just because I had
the demons cast out of me. Andjust because I was it doesn't
mean that I still wasn't a humanbeing right. You could I still
wasn't still hateful a littlebit in that I still had some
violent tendencies. So it wasn't
Nancy (34:55):
that that was your saved and sanctified and filled with
the Holy Ghost. Notice that hadnothing to do with me to be
honest with you at all at thatpoint,
Nick (35:04):
none of that mattered to me. At this point, things had
started to sort of turn in thechurch. One of the reasons why I
did come back is because I didrealize it here that it wasn't
as strict as it used to be. Itwasn't not to the extent wasn't
you guys were going on I wasgrowing up, it sort of wasn't
(35:24):
like that. So that was part ofthe whole weakening in that
transition that was going on.
Gotcha. So I get back there. Andthis dude, and like I said, I
love this dude. Like, seriously,man. Everybody who came there
was like the same whipped off,you stuck around as a pack.
Like, you'd be like, it was justone of those. You know, I mean,
(35:45):
it's human. It's human. Butanyway, so I get back there, and
I'm with this dude, andeverything's going fine. And
after, I don't know, I want tosay it was probably about a
month or two. I'm like, Okay, socan I come back? Okay, so I can
come back with it. And they keptpushing me off to be honest with
you. But you know, my friends atship everybody I grew up with
was still there. Not a lot ofpeople had left it still at that
(36:06):
point. Yeah. Right. Like mybrother was still insurance.
Like, all my friends were stilllike, I was one of the only ones
literally, beside the otherdude, that got kicked out. But I
wish I haven't seen for years. Iwish I could, because I love
that do too. But we don't talknames here. I mean, it is what
it is my family a couple names.
(36:26):
But that's it. But anyway,finally, I was able to come
back. And I think what we'regonna do is when I came back,
that's when I met you. Yes.
Because I didn't even know thatI didn't know you at that point.
Right. I just came back. Andthen I don't meet you. First
know, I mean, your best friendsare one of your best friends. So
(36:51):
that's what we're gonna leave ittoday. We wanted to bring you
guys into it a little more ofhow the story is and what it
entails Church and the way itYeah. And like I said, Well,
somebody has questions or theywant to know about forgiveness
and how it's even possible. Youguys are going to hear we're
going to talk more about that.
(37:11):
We're going to pick it up nexttime and talk about then when I
came back meeting you and how wegot together. That's where the
real shit happens.
Nancy (37:22):
Talk to you later.
Nick (37:26):
Beeps Have a great day.
It's time to get fucking authentic.
Oh my god. So here we are again.
Oh man. So it's funny because acouple of people have mentioned
on our episode where Iinterviewed my mom, and it was
mixed bag, where like peoplelike, what you were gonna
fucking lean into her. And otherpeople were like, wow, that was
(00:30):
nice. It was just like thishappen. Obviously, you know, 50s
I mean, this happened some yearsago, years ago, and I've
forgiven her a long time ago,I'll be honest with you, that
really changed my perspective.
As I said, it opened up youreyes a little bit, it opened up
my eyes a little bit more. Butit also gave me I felt released.
(00:51):
Like I felt freedom from it wasdoing that. For me. She actually
talked about ownership of it.
This is true, not just like youweren't born with a manual neck
kind of ship. There wasownership of it. And I think
that Fuck, man, that's huge. Ithink that's huge for anybody to
just have I don't know aboutvalidation. Because I know what
(01:12):
I've felt, or what I've knownthat I went through is real. It
gave me a little bit of freedom.
And since then, I think that Ihave a different feeling and a
little bit of a betterrelationship. Just because of
it.
Unknown (01:27):
Sounds a little weird,
Nick (01:29):
but it's true.
Nancy (01:30):
Well, it was her perspective, too. I think that's
a totally different. Yeah, we'veseen it, you've seen it your
way. And she's just telling youstraight up like that's not
Nick (01:41):
while she's telling us straight up. But not even just
her perspective, because it wasperspective can be different. I
think, for me, she's saying,
Unknown (01:49):
look like,
Nick (01:51):
I didn't make the right choices. I fucked up. It's not
leaning on the excuse of youknow, your kids were with
Emanuel was no excuses. Yeah,for what she did, which is huge.
Yeah, it's pretty fucking core.
So I thought, this time, wewould go into more of the inner
workings in sort of theteachings and should of the
(02:13):
church and a few experiencesthat I experienced. And then we
can maybe go through a couplethat you experienced, too, which
again, we've already come to theconclusion that it was a
completely different experience.
Nancy (02:26):
This is true. For me at least Yes. I mean, growing
Nick (02:29):
up for me, it was full gospel, Bible believing church,
right. And I think the ideabehind that was that, in order
to get to heaven, you had torepent of your sins, you had to
get saved. And this is where alot of the difference comes in
with a lot of religions maybe ordenominations or whatever, but
(02:54):
you had to be saved, but notonly saved, but you had to be
sanctified, saved as youaccepted God, but then you had
to be sanctified, while you'resitting is taken away. And then
you had to be baptized in theHoly Ghost
Nancy (03:07):
filled with the Holy Ghost. Yeah, that's right. I
totally forgot about that. Andthen
Nick (03:11):
when you were filled with the Holy Ghost that gave you the
ability to speak in tongues,prophesy. And then if you were
filled with the Holy Ghost,let's say somebody prophesied in
a tongue that nobody understood,then you inherently there would
be people who were able todecipher that prophecy. So you
would have somebody who wouldprophesy
(03:36):
speak in tongues and prophesiedto the congregation. And then
following that, there would besomeone who deciphered what that
person said,
Nancy (03:46):
Oh, wow. Okay, so I don't think we ever talked about this.
We haven't. So with you thengrowing up to church, when did
the songhappen to you? What do you mean?
Like, when did you get saved toyoung kids get saved? Yeah. So
that's where I think and we'regonna have
Nick (04:07):
a few guests on, that I grew up with, even from the
church, but I know one inparticular, which will keep
anonymous because some peoplehave asked to be anonymous, and
that's cool. They have jobs anda lot of people who whatever,
but this person particularlysaid that they never even felt
(04:27):
anything. So literally, theywere just going through the
motions. Now, the odd thingabout this person is this is the
person that I was supposed tomarry. This is going to be part
of the story right of how we metand how this was. And she is
actually now your best friend.
But yet, I was supposed to marryher. Like it was fucked up.
Yeah. We had mentioned a touchof this in the very first
(04:51):
episode, but she never feltanything, but did you feel
anything? So that's fun. That'sfunny because as a child, it's
hard to explain. You're almostforced. That's your reality,
right? You see this, you'reraised in this. You're raised in
it. And if you don't get saved,sanctified and filled with the
(05:14):
Holy Spirit when the rapturecomes, you're not going to have
it. Oh, we had to be all threeof those. Oh, yeah. Well,
growing up, again, growing up,this is true for you. Because if
you, it was so fucked up, to behonest with you, because if you
got saved and sanctified, butthen you sin, then you back slid
to you than you would have toalmost get resynced like it was
(05:38):
a constant. Fucking struggle.
Nancy (05:43):
I do remember that because I got sanctified Well,
what I thought was sanctified.
And I remember, I was out atlunch doing something and I said
the word Fuck, yeah. And lookedat me. And they're like,
Nick (05:55):
that's it. Yeah. And the funny thing to say funny thing,
the real fucked up thing aboutit was, so as a kid, I'm always
trying to get saved, sanctifiedand filled with the Holy Ghost.
And you would see other peoplearound you getting filled with
the Holy Ghost.
Nancy (06:13):
But I mean, were the young kids getting filled with
the Holy Ghost? Well, yeah. Oh,but so
Nick (06:17):
so that was the funny thing. So I could say that I was
filled with the Holy Ghost. Butwas that really filled with the
Holy Ghost? What the fuck doesthat mean? I don't like I get
speaking in tongues and all thatkind of stuff. Absolutely. I
just have to
Nancy (06:29):
remember kids doing it.
Because
Nick (06:32):
by the time you had gotten there, which I had already been
gone, but right by that time,a lot of that core group of us
had grown up. And there weren'ta lot of kids coming in with
parents. Think about it. All thekids that were there had been
there for a long time. Yes. Andthings had started to change,
like we talked about, right? Soit was a different. It was a
different era, then, like I'mtalking like, 1972 to like,
(06:56):
1980. That was a fucked up time.
Nancy (07:05):
So you growing up in this church? Yeah. Well, you guys
like cut like you guys. Eightdays a week you were going to
church? Right? Yeah. You gohome? Yeah. You are in school,
too. Right. So you? I mean, thisis like 24/7. It almost seems
like when you went home? Wasyour mom like reading the Bible
constantly to you guys?
Nick (07:26):
No, no, there wasn't like constantly reading the Bible,
like you had to do your likeyour daily devotions. You should
pray before you go to bed. Therewere always daily devotions.
Every day in school, there wasBible class, there was daily
devotions, and then going tochurch. It's almost like peer
pressure. When you see everybodyaround you and this is going on.
(07:47):
I have to say that I probablyfake some of that shit. Because
it was like, well, this personspeaking in tongues, and this
person speaking in tongues, andI could be like, I right now
could just bust out speaking intongues. And nobody else would
know the wiser. Like if I was inchurch, right? I could just bust
(08:08):
out speaking in tongues, like, Ilived with that shit. So I can
even speak. It was your tongues.
Right? So it came to you. So ifnobody can decipher it and say,
you're not speaking in tongues,you're a fucking liar. You just
did it. I honestly have to saythat.
(08:30):
A lot of the pressure from doingthat. Here's the bottom line.
I don't ever think I was savedor sanctified or filled with the
Holy Ghost, meaning it wasalmost like I was forced into
being saved, sanctified andfilled with the Holy Ghost.
Because if you didn't do thatyou weren't going to heaven. And
they were constantly preaching.
You can't ride your mother'scoattails. This is all on you.
(08:52):
It's all up to you. You got todo this shit for yourself.
Nancy (08:57):
So being that young, were you afraid that you were gonna
go to hell? Oh,
Nick (09:02):
that's a really good question. And let me tell you,
this is some fucked up shit. I'mgonna be straight up and
Unknown (09:11):
I remember specifically in church,
Nick (09:17):
where, you know, there was always held on fire and
brimstone. Always God was aboutto come any day now. The end of
the world is coming soon. Justlook around. You see the signs
of the times the book ofRevelation.
This is the reason why theystarted to schools sort of
homeschool you. There was noneed to really like a lot of
people had quit their jobsstarted working in the church
(09:39):
and in the ministry. That's whywe never had money. That's why
we had food stamps. You know, mymom worked for a company for a
little while, but then that wasit. And then when my dad was
gone, like there was no moneycoming in. My grandma worked at
a button factory for a while.
And then she retired. You know,there was nothing coming in. The
only thing coming in was foodstamps. And then my mom worked
for the church.
(09:59):
He got out of school startedgoing to school there, eight
days a week, whatever it was. Soyou never really got away from
that. You were completely cutoff from the outside world for
the most part, right? Becauseyou were always in church. You
know, even when you wentshopping and stuff, you went
shopping with a group of people,a lot of times he as well as
(10:21):
together. So we were alwaystogether. We were in vans and
buses, and we were alwaystogether traveling and you had,
like I said, Monday night wascoffeehouse, and then Tuesday
night is Preacher's Wife, or thepreacher, the freakin good, you
run the whole thing. And thenshe was That was her night. So
So basic service would besomething like, you get there by
(10:41):
eight o'clock at night. And thenservice singing went, you know,
half hour, whatever. And thenthey did like something like
testimonies where people wouldstand up. And after the
testimonies, they would do anoffering, of course, you had to
collect the fucking money, youhad to keep them, you know, fat
cats nice and fucking plumping.
And then Tuesday night would beher, right. And she would teach
(11:02):
for like, an hour or so preachfor an hour or so. And
sometimes, if she really gotfilled with the fucking spirit,
she would go even longer. Yes.
And you wouldn't get out ofthere till 1010 3011 o'clock,
then Wednesday night, it wouldbe almost the same type of
service a little bit longer. Butthen the fat cat was there, and
(11:24):
he fucking he had to preach. Andthen Thursday night was coffee
house again. And then Fridaynight was kids service. Right.
So it was the same process withthe singing, but it was kids
songs and all that. And thenthey would have like, where
people would put on plays and indifferent shit like teenagers.
Teenagers. Yeah. And thenafterwards, everybody could get
(11:46):
together. This was a one timethat the guys and the girls were
to hang out with each otherbecause there were like people
watching all over the fuckingplace. And you would play
volleyball in the gym, like gettogether. Yeah, it was sort of
that place. Voting here. Andthen Saturday, you know,
Saturday, you would go and cleanthe pastor's house, or you would
(12:07):
clean the church or you would dowhatever and it was prayer. And
then Saturday night was prayermeeting. So you would go there
and you would be on your kneespraying for hour, hour and a
half, whatever, sleeping.
Sleeping, yes. And then you'dwake up Sunday morning early,
and you'd go to church forSunday school, then they would
preach their whatever, collectofferings just like every other
(12:27):
night, then you'd go home, you'deat, you couldn't do anything,
couldn't work, couldn't donothing. You had to go home, eat
and rest. It was a day of rest.
That was a teaching. That's whatthe Bible says the seventh day
was a day of rest. So youliterally can do zero. If if you
(12:47):
did something you were centered,you probably back slid Sunday
night, you'd get back up and youfucking go right back to church.
And then it started all over onMonday. So what wound up
happening was like on a Tuesdayor Wednesday or Sunday night,
whatever, the I forget what theycall fucking action group or
whatever, fucking whatever. Butthey would go out afterwards.
(13:08):
And they would go out to arestaurant. And by the way, most
of the people in the church, thepeople who were like, at the
top, at least, were like,probably the most unhealthiest
people. They all probably hadsome sort of a food addiction.
Every one of them had fuckingproblems. You know what I'm
saying? I mean, I thinkactually, this fucking joint
(13:29):
brought on more stress andactually tore apart more
families said it was good. But Iremember, we never had money. So
there'd be times when we'd beable to go into the restaurant,
you have to understand thatwe're literally with these
people, this top group of peopleall the time. So all these kids
that we grew up together, by theway, I'm still in contact with
(13:52):
all of those people. Who haveobviously since gotten out of
that, and some of them don'tbelieve in God at all. Some of
them are atheist. Some of themdo believe in God. Some of them.
Yeah, it's a mixture. It's amixture, right? Sometimes we
were able to go in to therestaurant. A lot of times we
weren't. We had to sit in thecar. My mom would go in, she'd
(14:14):
go in with her friends. They'dwind up eating, they'd wind up
doing whatever, we'd be sittingin the car waiting for her. That
happened more times than Irealized.
Nancy (14:24):
Isn't that crazy? And now it's something like that. Are
Nick (14:26):
you kidding me? Yeah. I mean, there'd be times when we
would go in, you know, thewaitress is going around saying,
what are you going to have? Whatare you going to have? What are
you going to have when it comesto me? And she's like, What are
you going to have? And I'll belike, I'll have my mouse like,
no, no, no, we don't have anymoney for that. So use limit
them. Well, you'd sit there andyou'd breadsticks with butter
that came in the basket on thetable or UD three and drink some
(14:47):
water you know? Remember KennyYeah, I mean, that's so that was
the idea. Christmases andthanksgivings. And all the
holidays and everything wasalways together with these
people. We did No our familyoutside of the church, where
things really start to getfucking weird where they
literally bought like nine acresout in Southern Illinois, they
(15:10):
bought a school. Then I wasraised in the thick of it. We
went down there I mean roomafter room after room of just
fixing them up with the girlsand the boys with the boys and
all the holidays, everybodywould go down there and they
would spend the night and thenext day you would celebrate
(15:30):
July 4, you would celebratethis, but you would have church
and then you'd all get togetherand there were massive plates of
food. And just everybody wouldcook all kinds of shit and some
big ol potluck. A big ol massivepotluck. Yeah. And the adults
had to eat first. The childrenwere always second best. The
(15:51):
children are always second inline. There was never when I was
growing up. You fucking satthere and you waited your turn.
You were seen and not heardwhatsoever. If you spoke up, you
got your ass beat. If youquestion anything, you got your
SP if you spoke out of turn, yougot your fucking
Nancy (16:12):
date first, and then they fed you. They wouldn't be
Nick (16:16):
these fucking fat cats would go up there with these big
massive plates and fuckingwhatever. I'm not saying there
wasn't food left, but you gotthe scraps. Let's face it, you
got the fucking scraps. That'sthe way it was. And that's how
you were taught your fuckingsecond rate. Interest is nothing
more to it, right? I'm notsaying that your kid should be
like Jesus Christ. But I'msaying that that's the way it
(16:36):
was. Right? And no matter what,you you were fucking punished
for it. Day after day after day,getting into the car for doing
nothing. And the fear that you'dbe like, you wait till you get
home, you're gonna get yourfucking ass beat. Now my mom
didn't say it like that. But itwas like you wait till you get
home, you're getting a beating.
And it wasn't like I'm gonnaspank you, but it's you're
(16:57):
getting a beating. She wouldfollow through or they owe 100%
This is what would happen. Sothen what would happen is that
as a kid, I'm fucking freakedout, right? So I'm sleeping in
the back. I tried to pretendlike I'm sleeping. So when we
get to the house, I'm asleep.
And what are you going to do?
Wake me up and beat me. Butyeah, that's what would happen.
I mean, yeah, that's exactlywhat would happen. You would
think it wouldn't happen. Oh,she's gonna forget about it. No,
(17:17):
she didn't forget. I fucking askthe question. So you deserve to
get your ass beat.
Nancy (17:23):
That's the way it was this church? And I mean, did you
as a kid get to see all those,they would have these castings
of like, like certain peoplewould go into those rooms. So if
you weren't filled,
Nick (17:36):
so when we were going, Yeah, you weren't filled with
the Holy Ghost that created ashield. So basically, what would
happen is, oh, man, yes, theywould do what? The best way I
can describe it to people is thethe world knows that, say an
exorcism. So that was somethingthat would happen quite a bit. I
mean, they're they what theycall the was casting out demons.
(17:57):
They didn't say exorcism. Right.
It was casting out demons. Oh,yeah. I mean, if that thing
started to happen, they wouldimmediately get all the kids out
from the congregation out fromthe church, they would put
everybody downstairs because thebelief was that if when the
demons come out of the people,they search for someone to go
into. And that that was thing.
So the kids were weak souls, ofcourse. So the kids didn't have
(18:23):
enough power to fight off thedemons. We were weak souls, so
the kids would have to leave.
And it would be all the adultswould be up there. Yeah, that
I've witnessed a couple of morethan a couple of times.
Actually, there was one guy, Idon't know, this guy probably
got demons cast out of them,like every three years or
something. It was just, it wasjust weird. And I want people to
understand that. I don't knowhow to say it other than just
(18:47):
say it as it is. You knew it wasgoing to happen. It would go
from someone just praying. Atthe end of every song, you would
praise the Lord. You put yourhands up and you know, thank
you, Jesus, I pray Thank you,thank whatever everybody was
saying at the time, right? And,well, ultimately, in the long
(19:09):
run, what wound up happening waswhen we were younger, services
were services. You had songs,you had some praise and other
songs and praise. You know,you'd have some testimonies,
you'd have the offeringplayground you would do the
preaching and then it would bedone right. I think what started
to happen was the preacher thedude, you know, fat cat would
starting to get a little older.
(19:32):
And I think he was becoming morerelevant. You know what I mean
as time went on, and so Mrs. FatCat decided that it was easier
just to take over a little bitmore and so it went from that
growing up to all of a suddenyou sing only a couple songs
done at the end of a praise thatall of a sudden that praise.
Like, dude, it was so fuckingtime. If you would do a praise
(19:56):
after a song that would last aminute or two. If it started on
past five, as a kid, I knewlike, okay, there's going to be
an outpouring. In other words,there was no more church,
meaning it would turn into likethis revival where all you were
doing was people were weepingand crying, and they were
getting filled with the Spiritand, and there were people
(20:19):
walking up front, and they weregetting their hands laid on him
and people were falling to theground. And it was just, it was
fucking crazy, right. And thatis almost what started to happen
on the daily. Like the serviceswere almost like not even
existent anymore. But when theywould cast out the demons, what
would happen is, you knew thatthis was about to happen, when
(20:42):
there would be a lot ofcommotion starting. And I mean
commotion, like screaming, therewould be someone that that
they've I don't want to saytargeted, right, I don't know
how it started. But this personwould just be like, overwhelmed,
let's just say they would seemoverwhelmed and they would start
screaming. And immediately whenthat would happen, the leaders
(21:06):
of the church, others, actressesor the whatever, they jump on
these people. That was it whenthat would happen. Everybody
downstairs like they if you arenot saved, sanctified, filled
with the Holy Ghost, you betterget the fuck out of that
congregation.
And it was real. It happened.
I seen it happen. As a matter offact, it happened to me. Don't
(21:31):
talk about it much. People sayoh, you're fucking crazy.
Whatever I will tell you.
Without a shadow of a doubt. Myexperience is very simple to
explain experience. It's notsimple to understand. But it's
simple to explain what happened.
You didn't even know me in thiscongregation
(21:56):
was hand in hand around thewhole congregation praying that
I would become paraplegic. Yes,to save my soul. Because at the
time when my mom had kicked meout, of course, I had just gone
into complete and utter madness,right. So of course, I mean,
that's, I mean, yes, I did. Iwas very hateful. And I did a
(22:19):
lot of bad things, but to tohope that someone would be
paralyzed to save their soulspretty fucked up. Yeah. Well,
when I got kicked out of church,my experience was that God is
love. Jesus loves you. Jesusloves you. He's here to protect
you. He loves you. You have toserve Him. If you don't serve
(22:40):
Him, you're not going to go toheaven, you're going to hell and
you're gonna burn and you'regonna have we watched movies
after movies of the hiding placeand Corrie 10 Boom, and all
these fucking movies where theywere showing where the fucking
Russians came in, and they tookover and the Communists took
over. And they persecuted youand they put fucking sticks
through your ears. And they didlike all this shit happened.
(23:03):
So you had the fear of fuckingthat you were fucked up.
And so when I left I said tomyself, if that's what love is,
that I want to have none to doit. Yeah, I mean, if that's what
Jesus is, and that's what loveis, fuck that. I don't have
nothing to do with that shit.
And so I turned the other way.
(23:29):
I turned intoI don't want to say that I went
full fledged into worshippingSatan or the Devil. But that was
okay to do eg board thing didlike little seances and all that
kind of shit as a kid your yourfucking
Nancy (23:46):
metal.
Nick (23:47):
Heavy Metal? Yeah, like for sure. Yeah, like King
Diamond and fucking crazy shit,right? But I didn't realize how
much of an impact that wouldactually have on me. Right. So.
So on the one side, the impactof church and abuse was very
real. And that being taught aslove, right, but yet it was
(24:11):
violent. The violence ofeverything became pretty natural
to me. And I think that my mindand my body and my spirit just
accepted the violence andaccepted things to be fucked up.
After a while, I realized that Icouldn't keep going on that way.
(24:33):
Because I would either wind updead or in jail for the rest of
my life. So I had gone back tochurch. And I remember very
specifically, I went back tochurch. I was sitting in the
back pews. And they startedpraying, praising again after
(24:59):
song And it got to thisoutpouring. an outpouring was
something where, if you were ata concert, you know, fucking
Metallica saying this badasssong. And afterwards, at the end
of the concert, everyone's like,encore encore, you wouldn't go
anywhere until they came back onstage to do something that's
sort of like an outpouring waslike, going and going and going
(25:23):
and just didn't stop until itstopped waiting for something.
Yeah. So wound up happening wasthere was this prophecy.
Somebody deciphered the prophecygave meaning to the prophecy.
And all I felt at that time wasan absolute fucking hate. The
best way that I can describewhat happened is it was an
(25:45):
absolute hate building inside ofme. And the only thing I
remember, at the time, my wholeface just turned absolutely
fucking red, hot, say red hot.
And somebody came behind me andput their hands on me to pray
(26:06):
for me. And that put me over theedge. them touching, touching
me, put me over the edge.
Because I was there. Because Iknew if I kept doing what I was
doing that I would be in jail,dead or in jail. And still, the
(26:27):
fear in me through all of thiswas that I would go to hell. But
then at some point, I acceptedthat. And I was like, Okay, so
I'm going to help
Nancy (26:35):
you came back to a place that you couldn't just like my
mom says, and that's exactlywhat I was.
Nick (26:42):
It has it has it grips you. It's fucking grips you.
And, and I just was sittingthere. And this dude's got his
hands on me. And to be honestwith you, this dude in
particular, was a really niceguy. There was no malice there.
(27:03):
It wasn't even a leader likethis guy literally came to me
sincere sincerely because he wasdoing what he believed. And he
was literally just showing mekindness in his own way, right?
Because most people that went tohis church, were sincere people.
Don't get me wrong. Noteverybody in that church was a
(27:23):
fucking asshole. So this guy puthis hands on me, and I lost it.
I fucking lost it. I lost it. Istarted punching the fucking the
the bench and in front of me.
And I'm just fucking bang andlike you're at a sports event in
your head in the seats. But nowI'm just punching it. So this is
the same thing I experienced asI was growing up as a kid. And
(27:46):
so now, more people are startingto come behind me. And now
people are shifting out. It's anout of the body experience. To
lose control like that. I'velost control, like literally
lost control in my life, I'd sayprobably three times. And this
was one of them. All I rememberis banging, banging, banging,
(28:10):
and them shoveling people out inthem saying, you know, in the
name of Jesus, and this is howthey would do it in the name of
Jesus, I command you to comeout, I command you to come out.
And I'm fighting. Right now I'mfighting. And they're holding me
down on the bench. So I'm inbetween the benches, which is a
(28:31):
small, it's a very small area.
So. So now I'm on the bench andI'm on my back. And all I
remember is them saying Icommend you to come on, I
command you to come out. Andwhat they would do is they would
ask, What is your name? What isyour name? You know, depending
on how many demons were in you,they would want the name of each
(28:52):
demon or whatever. And then theywould command them by their name
to commodity. Oh, I see. By timeI was done with this whole
ordeal. All I remember as thisis going on, is I kept spitting
up the most foul tasting
Unknown (29:16):
phlegm in my life.
Nick (29:20):
And every time they would say I command you to come out I
command you to come out. Itwould be like this foul tasting
fucking phlegm. It was like thenastiest greenish fucking phlegm
that there was. Wow. And at theend at the end of that
Unknown (29:39):
I was exhausted.
Nancy (29:43):
Everyone was always exhausted, exhausted.
Nick (29:47):
But I felt so fucking light.
Like it was the weirdest, mostunbelievable experience I've
ever had in my life. And I knowThere are going to be people who
are going to listen to this.
And they're going to think I'm afucking nutjob. And I don't give
(30:10):
a fuck, right? We this isfucking authentic, right? I
like, I know what I went throughin my life. I know what I went
through that day. I know what Iwent through that night.
Unknown (30:21):
And it was real.
There's, there's absolutely nodenying it. It was real. And of
course, I'm sitting here and I'mjust like, we have course it was
we'll,
Nancy (30:36):
I mean, you were in a very stressful situation. You
were very upset. Yep, I get whatyou're saying that people might
think you're crazy. You know,when I'm, I'm looking at all of
this stuff at the church when itwould happen. And I just always
thought that it was just people
Nick (30:56):
just creating this. Yeah.
When you work yourself up, youknow it just and I've asked
myself that question. Becauseyou're so such an angry, I was
very angry. But that's what I'msaying. So I don't discount it.
I was a 18 year old, young man,who was very violent and
hateful. And I hated everybodyand everything.
(31:25):
I never had relationships. Itwas a relationship of either
sexual preference, or I didn'tcare about anybody. So
was it something I went throughthat again?
Nancy (31:41):
Did that's what they wanted? Yes. We have always.
Nick (31:45):
It was easier to manipulate. And they you heard
my mom, you know, it's the samething, right?
Nancy (31:49):
I mean, when that happens, they were so ecstatic
that that happens. You know whatI mean? Like, we finally got him
after that. That's when he wasso
Nick (31:58):
right or something. Yeah.
So so what happens is afterthat, they're like, Okay, so
contrary to your, you know, thisis great. So, now we're going to
ship you off to the school thatwe bought, we still don't really
trust you. Because you're,you're such a fucking womanizer.
And you're going to turn youknow, you're just going to
seduce everybody in the fuckingchurch, we're going to send you
out to Wellington. And we'regoing to pay you $50 a week to
(32:19):
stay out there. But you're justgoing to have a place to stay in
your house. And you're gonnastay out there with his other
dudes, which is another wholefucking story. The stories go on
and on and on. And but I go outto this place, I'm sort of still
excommunicated, but under sortof a supervision of this dude,
(32:41):
well, it's because this dude whoI look, I get along with
everybody, and I'm not here tobadmouth anybody,
Nancy (32:48):
but this. This ordeal just happen to you. How did you
feel afterward? The Exorcism orthe kiss whatever it was, that
happened. I felt like I said, Ifelt reborn. So then when they
sent you out there did the angercome back. Did you like
Nick (33:04):
was cool. So when they sent me out there, I'm like, off
this is actually pretty cool.
Nancy (33:08):
You left? You wanted to come back because this was a
safe haven safe place. Thishappens to you. Yeah. They then
ship you out. Yeah. toWellington. Yeah. And you're
ecstatic, right? Because,
Nick (33:23):
because I really don't have to go to church. It was
funny, because the dude that wasthere, he was able to do the
same thing. He actually wasprobably pissed because I was
coming out because I rocked hisboat, you know, like, I messed
up his whole world, because nowhe was forced to do devotions
with me and have this kind ofsense. But then he would, hey,
maybe we do that a little later.
You know, I'm gonna go to thestore. What he's doing is he's
(33:43):
going down the block to fucksome chick, like, it's
hilarious. It's like, it was butagain, I mean, it was in the end
of it all. It was really afucking joke, right? I mean,
like, people are humans and theygot their lives and I don't care
if you think you're safe,sanctified, filled with the Holy
Ghost. I mean, everybodyinherently is doing what they
want, right? You could be undersome sort of condemnation and
(34:06):
stress and, and whatever but atthe end of the day, you're still
going to live your life likeit's a fact that the fat cats in
the fucking church, Mr. Fat Cat,Mrs. Fat Cat and fat cat kids
are all fucking doing their ownthing. Right? Right. I said it
in the first episode. I mean,they're watching TV, they're
fucking taking medicine or doingwhatever. And they're preaching
on the pulpit that you can't do
Nancy (34:28):
that shit. But you were happy. You were but I knew it.
But I was like, you know whywe're in a safe place. Dude,
Nick (34:35):
I was safe. I wasn't going to jail. Right? I had food.
Right? Right. It was almost likegoing to jail. And out there. I
don't have to answer anybodypaid lunch just because I had
the demons cast out of me. Andjust because I was it doesn't
mean that I still wasn't a humanbeing right. You could I still
wasn't still hateful a littlebit in that I still had some
violent tendencies. So it wasn't
Nancy (34:55):
that that was your saved and sanctified and filled with
the Holy Ghost. Notice that hadnothing to do with me to be
honest with you at all at thatpoint,
Nick (35:04):
none of that mattered to me. At this point, things had
started to sort of turn in thechurch. One of the reasons why I
did come back is because I didrealize it here that it wasn't
as strict as it used to be. Itwasn't not to the extent wasn't
you guys were going on I wasgrowing up, it sort of wasn't
(35:24):
like that. So that was part ofthe whole weakening in that
transition that was going on.
Gotcha. So I get back there. Andthis dude, and like I said, I
love this dude. Like, seriously,man. Everybody who came there
was like the same whipped off,you stuck around as a pack.
Like, you'd be like, it was justone of those. You know, I mean,
(35:45):
it's human. It's human. Butanyway, so I get back there, and
I'm with this dude, andeverything's going fine. And
after, I don't know, I want tosay it was probably about a
month or two. I'm like, Okay, socan I come back? Okay, so I can
come back with it. And they keptpushing me off to be honest with
you. But you know, my friends atship everybody I grew up with
was still there. Not a lot ofpeople had left it still at that
(36:06):
point. Yeah. Right. Like mybrother was still insurance.
Like, all my friends were stilllike, I was one of the only ones
literally, beside the otherdude, that got kicked out. But I
wish I haven't seen for years. Iwish I could, because I love
that do too. But we don't talknames here. I mean, it is what
it is my family a couple names.
(36:26):
But that's it. But anyway,finally, I was able to come
back. And I think what we'regonna do is when I came back,
that's when I met you. Yes.
Because I didn't even know thatI didn't know you at that point.
Right. I just came back. Andthen I don't meet you. First
know, I mean, your best friendsare one of your best friends. So
(36:51):
that's what we're gonna leave ittoday. We wanted to bring you
guys into it a little more ofhow the story is and what it
entails Church and the way itYeah. And like I said, Well,
somebody has questions or theywant to know about forgiveness
and how it's even possible. Youguys are going to hear we're
going to talk more about that.
(37:11):
We're going to pick it up nexttime and talk about then when I
came back meeting you and how wegot together. That's where the
real shit happens.
Nancy (37:22):
Talk to you later.
Nick (37:26):
Beeps Have a great day.
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