March 27, 2024 • 28 mins
Our theme this season is “Women Leading Democracy.” And yet, lately, it feels as though our democracy itself has become fragile. Frail. This episode, we are shoring up our strength.
NOW National President Christian F. Nunes is thrilled to speak with Speaker Emerita Nancy Pelosi. She was the 52nd Speaker of the United States House of Representatives, the first woman ever elected to the office, and the representative of the 11th district of California. She’s one of the chief architects of the Affordable Care Act and has been a strong advocate for the rights of women throughout her career.
Christian will speak with the Speaker Emerita about the fate of democracy, the power of the vote, and what makes the democratic process strong.
Take Action NOW: https://now.org/issues/constitutional-equality/
Listen to new episodes of Feminism NOW released every other Wednesday. To find out more about the National Organization for Women, visit our website.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
(upbeat music)
(00:06):
- Welcome back to Feminism NOW,
a podcast featuring leaders and activists
who are on the front lines of the fight
for constitutionalquality, economic justice,
and reproductive rights.
I'm Christian F. Nunes,the national president
of the National Organization for Women.
The theme of season two iswomen leading democracy.
(00:27):
And so it's obvious thatwe would want to speak
with women leaders whohave done just that,
led our democracy.
And what better person to speak with
than the first womanelected US House speaker
and the first woman to leada major political party
in Congress.
(upbeat music)
(00:50):
Many people might havegrown up feeling like life
in the United Stateswas solid, predictable.
Many of us, white women, people of color,
the LGBTQIA community, andmany other marginalized groups,
knew we didn't have all the rights
and all the choices that we deserved.
But we knew one thing.
We knew we lived in a democracy
(01:10):
that if we put up and voted for candidates
who would stand up for us,
we would in time see a better world.
Lately, that doesn't feel true.
Democracy has begun tofeel shaky and frail.
That's why I am especially excited
and pleased to be here with you today
and help us welcome SpeakerEmerita Nancy Pelosi.
(01:32):
She has made amazing history in 2007
when she was elected the first speaker
of the House of Representatives
and one of the chief architects
behind the Affordable Care Act.
You know, you all know who she is.
She has done amazing things in Congress.
She has also helped pass
the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Act of 2009.
(01:52):
She's an advocate for child poverty.
She's worked on prohibitingsex-based wage discrimination.
She's helped be insurmountable changes
for us in this Congress in our country.
Please help me welcomeMadam Speaker Pelosi
to Feminism NOW.
Thank you for being here, madam.
(02:13):
- Thank you so much, Christian.
You said you wereexcited for this podcast.
Well, I'm excited too. You know why?
NOW endorsed me when I ran the first time.
And not every woman's group did.
They endorsed some men,if you can imagine that.
But in any event, NOW hasbeen there from the start,
not only politically endorser,
but an inspiration, anintellectual resource,
(02:35):
a mobilizing resource, and the rest.
So I'm always, alwaysfaithful and loyal to NOW,
and I'm so proud of you asthe youngest leader of NOW,
as well as the second African American.
So important right now to haveyour youth, your diversity,
and the rest at the head of this very,
very important organization.
(02:55):
- Well, I thank you so much for that.
And just want you to knowNOW is still with you,
and we will still be there tosupport you in any way we can.
But I want us to get in this conversation.
I tell everyone right at thebeginning I'm a truth teller.
And I know you are a truth teller,
and that's why I'm so excitedto have you on this podcast.
We have been really watching
(03:16):
so much go on in ourworld, in our country,
and we can say that somuch has been happening
where people are reallyfeeling like democracy itself
is more frail than ever before.
Do you agree with thesesentiments, and what do you feel?
And if you do agree with it,
(03:36):
what do you feel iscontributing to the frailty
of our democracy right now?
- Well, I think you're right.
There is a frailty to our democracy.
It is always something thatwe have to be vigilant about.
But really points out the realnecessity for feminism now,
because my hopes are riding
on women playing a more leading role.
(03:58):
Women, young people, peopleof color, the diversity.
And that is what has contributed
to some of the insecurityon the part of other people.
They are afraid of globalization,
they're afraid of innovation,they're afraid of immigration,
they're afraid of LGBTQ.
Women playing a moreleading role of diversity
is threatening their,shall we say, preeminence
(04:22):
as sort of a white man kindof insecurity, if I just may.
And that has been an opportunity
for people like what's his name
who used to be presidentof the United States,
I hesitate to use his name, DT.
And he has prayed on that.
He didn't create it, but he normalized it,
(04:43):
and he generated thatinsecurity among people,
and that has been a dividingforce in our country.
So we have to, as I say, ourdiversity is our strength,
our unity is our power,
and we have to work togetherto protect our democracy.
I think one path to unifyingis to have a strong economy
(05:06):
that includes everyone.
And that's what PresidentBiden has been about
with whether it was our rescue package,
our infrastructurepackage, our CHIPS package,
our package for veterans,
our IRA to lower the costof prescription drugs,
but to involve young peoplein how we save the planet,
new young people.
And all of it with justice. With justice.
(05:29):
In the infrastructure package,
billions of dollars to gospecifically for environmental
and infrastructure justice.
Same thing with some of the other bills,
including IRA, called theInflation Reduction Act,
but about justice.
So the way we will makeour democracy stronger
(05:50):
is to make our democracy stronger.
In other words, to reducethe role of big dark money
in politics, to elevate thegrassroots involvement in it,
to stop partisan redistricting,
to, again, pass a voting rights act.
And John Lewis's bill,
Voting Rights Act is named for John Lewis,
(06:10):
but the bill to stop votersuppression and the rest
is one that he wrotethe first 300 pages of.
So again, how we make ourdemocratic system more,
shall we say, true to theaspirations of the people
so that they know that their vote counts,
that their voice is important,
and it's just not big darkmoney calling the shots.
(06:32):
That's why we have to win the election
with enough votes in the Senate
to overturn the filibuster rule
so that we can pass the JohnLewis Voting Rights Act,
as well as the For the People Act.
- Yeah, thank you for saying that.
I wanna go back to a couple things
that you mentioned at the verybeginning as what you said,
'cause that really summed up a lot for us.
(06:54):
You said that what we're seeing
and part of the reason whyour democracy is seen as frail
is because white patriarchy, right?
There's some misogyny, there'ssome fear of inclusion.
They're afraid of this progression.
They're afraid of thepower of the diversity
and difference of everyone
(07:14):
and what the capabilitieswe've seen happen
from people shifting.
And what we needultimately is that equality
and that justice to happen,
but that can't happen without equity.
But we have seen,
and since Biden-Harris administration,
they have really been investing in equity
in so many of the different packages.
And you all have beenreally investing in equity
(07:35):
in so many of the differentacts that you've been doing,
which is what I feel is very different
from a long time I've seen.
It's just really investing in equity
and truly understanding thatyou cannot have equality
without equity.
Would you agree that's beena big part of the investment?
- Yes, absolutely.
And again, as you were speaking,
I'm thinking of what we need to do.
And we talked about what we have done,
(07:57):
but there's some thingsthat have not been done.
And for us to have that equity,
whether it's environmental justice,
social justice, economic justice,
gender justice, gender equalityjustice, whatever it is,
we have to pass specificlegislation to enable,
for example, maternity mortality,
(08:18):
which affects the AfricanAmerican community.
We have a whole slew oflegislation put forth
by many of our African-American members,
but really embraced by our entire caucus.
Alma Adams of North Carolinahas taken the lead on this.
This is an identifiableproblem in our society
and there are answers to it.
(08:40):
And there's resistance to passing,
and that's why we wanna buildthe outside mobilization
for these things.
It's there because people know.
The other thing is these thingshave to happen for women.
We have to have affordable childcare.
We have to have family and medical leave.
We have to have home healthcare.
(09:01):
So it's not just about children and that.
It's about a sibling,a parent, or something.
So that women can be inthe workplace present
without worrying about, oh my gosh,
we always worry about our family,
but not worrying thata child is in danger,
or a family member is gonna fall down
because nobody is there.
And as we have that homehealthcare, we have to,
(09:22):
and the childcare, wehave to invest in it.
We have to have theresources, the good pay.
Good pay, good training,good safety for it all.
And that, in my view,unleashes the power of women
in a stronger way in theworkforce to be there,
to take leadership roles, totake a command of a lot of it.
(09:44):
'Cause some of this is cultural.
Then with the three Gs.
Gays, guns, God, and that'swhat they call abortion.
You know, for them it's God, right?
They don't feed thechildren once they're born,
but they call that God.
So we have those big challenges,
and quite frankly, in my view,
they're exploiting thereligious issue on the board.
(10:07):
I mean, I'm a devout practicing Catholic,
all the rest of that,
but give me a break, youknow, with these bills.
In vitro fertilization whenwe're talking about that,
when we're talking abouta woman's right to choose,
and the rest of that.
God gave us a free will tohonor our responsibilities.
It's not up to any politician to do that.
(10:28):
So again, these things thatrelate to women's freedom
and women's liberation to beable to be in the workforce.
And I do believe that it is an answer.
You know, when I was very young,
there was something thatpeople talked about:
women's intuition.
A mother's intuition. You have to act.
You have to act. You can't think about it.
(10:50):
You have to act.
And that is what leaders need to be doing,
is acting instead of lettingother people diminish
the initiative becauseyou're thinking about it.
And women know.
I mean, we're multitaskersand all the rest.
We know we have the courage,the confidence to act.
(11:11):
- And I think going off ofthat, the women do know,
so it's really important
that we are asking women what they need
that's gonna give them afull sustainable life, right?
It's not leaving themout of the conversation.
It's not leaving them out of the process
of developing thislegislation, these policies.
It's making sure that you'regoing to those communities
(11:32):
that are directly impacted andmaking sure that their voice
and their narrative and theirexperience is really heard,
so there is no disconnect, right?
So there is no disconnect.
- That's essential to it, is don't let me,
and that's not for anybody totell anybody what they need.
We have to hear from people,
and that applies to almost everything.
When we're talking infrastructure,to go to the community.
(11:54):
What do you want?
In the past, they builtfreeways to divide communities.
We wanna break that downto unite communities.
But let's listen to the community.
And in our community in San Francisco,
we are very, shall we say,proud of almost everything.
I went to Bayview-HuntersPoint the other day
about the Bayview-Hunters Point Center,
(12:15):
which is relatively new.
And the community had sayin every aspect of it.
When we do housing, whenwe do transportation,
we do every aspect thesame thing on things
that relate to childcare, healthcare,
women's right to choose,and the rest of that.
Listening to women aboutnot just what will happen,
(12:36):
but the terminology that will be used.
That is respectful.
- Absolutely.
And I appreciate you also naming that,
because terminology matters.
My background is social work,
so I'm big on, like, startingwhere the people are at
and using that terminology tomake sure we are connecting
with people and we're speaking in language
(12:57):
and words that are meaningful and powerful
for those people andempowering for those people.
So I really appreciate you, Madam Speaker,
naming that about that language.
I think that's so extremely important.
I wanted to kind of just goa little bit more into this
and ask you a little bit more about
when we're talkingabout what we're seeing,
(13:17):
especially for the women andour rights being overturned
and the state of democracy,
how do you feel women aregoing to contribute to helping,
I wanna put it past saving democracy,
but saving democracy, butalso rebuilding democracy
(13:37):
to the democracy that we truly envision?
- That is absolutely has to be the goal.
It's not about incrementalismor returning to something.
It's about how we go forward.
And I have always believed,
I'm a former chair of theCalifornia Democratic Parties,
where there's the biggest partyin the country and the rest.
(13:58):
And my experience therewas always you have
to make democracy more democratic.
You have us to make theDemocratic Party more democratic.
One example that I will use ishealthcare. What's his name?
You know, what's his name?
I hate to use his name. It'slike a curse word to me.
- Oh, I know, I hear you. (laughs)
(14:18):
- (laughs) He said Obamacaresucks. That's his language.
So he knows what he'ssaying. That has a market.
And we're saying, "No, itdoesn't suck. It cures."
But when we did the Affordable Care Act
and when we saved the Affordable Care Act,
people said, "How'd you do it?"
I said, "Well, we had, you know,
there were a lot of reasons how we did it,
but we could not have done it
(14:39):
without the outside mobilization."
And the outside mobilization to pass it
and to save it was dependenton a lot about the terminology.
We had 10,000 events to save it
from his repeal and replace.
10,000 where people told their stories.
Not our provisions, their stories.
(15:02):
And they told us that if we wanted them
to be calling Congress about that,
we had to frame it in their terms.
In their term. Not, oh,this is one of the...
You know, it was in theirterms and in their priorities.
And that was a beautiful thing.
(15:23):
So again, whether we'repolicymaking or doing politics,
it's important to listen, learn,
and go forward in that positive way.
Because there is skepticism,there is suspicion,
there is just concern about
whether people's votereally counts and matters
(15:44):
and makes a difference.
That's why we must, absolutelymust reduce the role
of big dark money in politics,
because it has such a big role to play.
But again, we have toencourage the grassroots.
Well, it is who we are.
We are a grassroots party.
And sometimes that looks, should we say,
(16:07):
I don't wanna say messy,but not as organized
as some people like tohave their lives be.
But that's a democratic party.
The vitality of it all is what we welcome.
And again, women, youngpeople, people of color,
diversity is the beauty of,
I wanna say the beauty is in the mix.
(16:28):
The beauty is in the mix.
So if you want the democracyto be more democratic,
actually, you know what makesAmerica even more American?
Is the vitality ofnewcomers to our country.
They come with their courage.
They come with their optimism,
their hope, their determination
to make the future betterfor their families.
(16:50):
In some cases, they bring their faith,
their commitment to family and the future.
Those are American values,
and they make America more American.
So again, the historyof our country has been
of reinvigoration, andwe must welcome that
and understand that itis that invigoration
(17:11):
that is so important to our country.
(upbeat music)
- We have so many more questions to ask,
but right now we're goingto pause for a short break
for our new segment, Action NOW.
For this Action NOW, I'dlike to talk about voting.
Voting is the foundation of our democracy,
(17:32):
and protection of ouraccess to the ballot remains
as critical as ever.
Over the past five years,
voter suppression has manifested itself
in racial and partisan gerrymandering
and voter suppression laws thatdisenfranchise many voters.
Now it's dedicated toproviding women equal access
to the ballot and electingfeminist candidates to office.
(17:53):
So today we're asking you to take action,
register to vote yourself,
and educate your family and friends
about issues on the ballot.
Together, we can take action now.
And now back to our interview.
(upbeat music)
So one of the things youjust mentioned I think
is important for us toexpand on is about the votes.
(18:16):
And it's the vote is part of democracy,
but it's not just only part.
And a lot of times we hear people,
like, especially Ithink right now we hear,
a lot of times we hear,
sometimes we hear youngervoters feeling like
they're disenfranchised from the,
they're not feeling connected.
They don't feel, like, as engaged to vote.
Sometimes they feel, peoplefrom some communities feel
(18:39):
as why do they need to vote because,
you know, the ones speakingto them or speaking for them.
But I think it's bigger than that.
I think just in general,we all have to do better.
Instead of just tellingpeople just to go vote,
we have to tell them whythat vote is important
and why their voice matters,you know, a little bit more
(19:03):
and give them examples ofhow their voice matters.
Instead of just saying, "Just go vote,"
we have to, like, maybe educate
and tell them exactlymore tangible reasons
about why their voice matters
and examples in their communities
about how they can use theirvoice to make an impact.
So I would ask for you,
besides just telling aperson just to go vote,
(19:24):
what can we give examplesfor people and voters
to let them know areas of whyit's important they're voting
because of some of the restrictionswe're seeing happening,
and why it's important that they get out
and exercise their voicein this upcoming election?
- You have put the challengeforth with great clarity.
(19:46):
Let me just give you someexamples of listening
to the voters.
After one of the electionsrecently, the '16 election,
which was a disaster fordemocracy, for women's rights,
for everything, horrible,
when what's his name was elected,
some of the young African-American,
gonna say some college age,
(20:06):
some, like, senior in highschool, some one year out,
you know, just in that 18 to23, 24-year-old, they said,
"We wanna meet with you totell you what we think."
They said, "Just becauseyou send a sports figure
or a Hollywood star to say, 'Vote,'
it doesn't mean anything to us
(20:26):
unless they're talkingto us about our needs."
And they found that almost condescending.
And I said, "Well, you know,
they're not there to condescend to you.
They're there to attract your attention
and then hopefully have an exchange."
So I think it's really important
when we're talking to people,
it's about their needs, notabout our vision, necessarily,
(20:50):
unless it's capturing theirneeds, these young people.
And they said, "Youknow, in this election,
the one thing we heard isthe candidate deserves it."
It's not about what you have done,
it's about what you're going to do.
And what you have donemay qualify you to speak
with some authority aboutwhat you're going to do.
(21:11):
But elections are always about the future.
So I tell this story aboutthese young people, saying,
"Yeah, it's nice tohave a star talk to us,
but we want them to talkto us about what we need
to see in the election,
not necessarily why theyare supporting that person."
And it's about the future.
(21:31):
And I say this all the time.
It's not about anybody deserving anything.
It's about what's coming next.
Now, we like to talk aboutwhat we've done to prove
that we share values andcan get something done,
but that is a springboard.
It's not a base.
It's not the reasonthey should vote for us.
It's what comes next.
(21:53):
And what comes next has to be listened to
so that we're really focusinghow they see the future, A,
and B, in their terminology.
- Absolutely. It's aboutthat legacy, right?
It's about that legacy.
- It is. And they are the future.
The future belongs to the young people.
(22:13):
They have to takeresponsibility for it too.
You know, and it's notjust, what are you doing?
It's how they take responsibility for it.
Many of them care abouttheir individual liberties.
They care about jobs andeconomic opportunity.
They care about theplanet that they live in.
They compare, again, therespect for the dignity worth
(22:36):
of every person they are.
And again, they have to knowit's all there for the taking.
For the taking.
And I always say to them,
"There's nobody in thehistory of the world like you.
You are so special.
Know your power and use it
as you join with othersaround ideas for the future.
(22:58):
Be yourself, know your why,
what you wanna see in all this why.
Know what you're talking about.
Join with friends. Embrace the future."
- Well, I think I was gonna ask you
what your call to action was, (laughs)
but do you have any other call to action?
Because I think that reallysums it up for us, really,
(23:19):
truly, is be yourself, know whoyou are, embrace the future,
and get out there and do the work.
Would you have any other call to action
that you would like ourlisteners to know or to act on
that you feel will bevery important for us
as we move forward in embracing this
to help us all be a part ofthis relationship we need
to build the democracythat we are looking for?
(23:42):
- It's important foreveryone to understand
that elections ramifications.
It's a very big difference
between Democrats andRepublicans at this time.
I wish it weren't so drastic,but it's very drastic.
And then you hear them talking
about life begins at conceptionor something like that,
and it's like,
125 members of the Houseare co-sponsors of that.
(24:04):
Doesn't mean it doesn'teven have more than that.
Eight members of theRepublican Party voted
for women to have access to contraception.
Eight. Eight.
That means 195 of them voted
against women havingaccess to contraception.
So we're talking about a big difference
in your personal life.
Disrespect for your ability
(24:27):
to make your own decisions in this regard.
And those very same people
in many cases don't wanna feed children.
They say they don't believein what they call welfare.
But no, it's feeding children.
Imagine there are governors in the state
which will not acceptthe free package of food
that is part of our legislation
'cause they don't believein welfare to feed children.
(24:48):
So I say this because Idon't wanna be a fearmonger,
but I think it's really important to know
that elections have ramifications.
So again, know your power
in terms of engaging in the elections,
but not just as a foot soldier,
but as a person who is helpingto establish the priorities.
(25:08):
There are a lot of challenges.
What are the priorities?
So know your power in prioritizing,
know your power in building support,
and know your power in winning elections
and then having the impactof your responsibility
for that success recognized by people.
(25:30):
Again, Lincoln said publicsentiment is everything.
With it, you can do almost anything.
Without it, practically nothing.
Also, I say nothing is moreeloquent to a member of Congress
than the voice of hisor her own constituents.
So weigh in.
And if they are not with you,
then maybe they need to be replaced.
(25:51):
Maybe they need to replace.
So anyway, the call toaction is know your power
in terms of policy, know yourpower in terms of politics,
and elections are very important.
And winning them is not just important
from a political standpoint,but from a policy standpoint
and from a personal standpoint.
(26:12):
Again, with healthcare,
access to quality, affordable healthcare,
recognizing diversityamong our communities
in terms of how peopleare impacted, weigh in.
Weigh in.
And again, I'm very proud that
in the House Democratic Caucus,
70% of our caucus are women,people of color, LGBTQ.
(26:35):
This is a remarkable thing.
You know, they say Congressdoesn't have enough.
We do in the House Democratic Caucus.
And you know what? We want more.
We want more.
As we reach out for that,I'm saying to people,
have the courage to run yourself
'cause you are very special
and will make a very big difference.
(26:56):
- Speaker Emerita, thank you so much
for being here with us today.
We appreciate your continued leadership
and your support for the American women
and support for this country.
Listeners, please make sureyou're out there voting,
weighing in, knowing thepolicy, knowing the politics.
- Christian, thank you foryour tremendous leadership.
We're so proud of you. Thank you.
(27:16):
- Thank you so much.
(upbeat music)
Thank you, listeners, for being with us
as we use season two of our podcast
to showcase people makinga real difference to women
and their allies in democracy.
Stay tuned for our next episodes
as we cover the issuesthat affect women most:
childcare and voting rights,
(27:38):
reproductive justice and gun violence,
the rise of Generation Z,
and the need for healthcare for all,
from affordable prescriptionsto gender-affirming care.
This podcast, Feminism NOW,
is a production of theNational Organization for Women
and Voxtopica.
I'm Christian F. Nunes,NOW's national president.
(27:58):
And if you like what youhear, please go to now.org,
read up on our core issues
and our approach toadvancing women's equality.
And get involved. We'dlove to hear from you.
Send your thoughts to feminismnow@now.org.
Thanks for listening,and we'll see you soon.
(upbeat music)
(upbeat music)
(28:26):
- Voxtopica.
(upbeat music)
(00:06):
- Welcome back to Feminism NOW,
a podcast featuring leaders and activists
who are on the front lines of the fight
for constitutionalquality, economic justice,
and reproductive rights.
I'm Christian F. Nunes,the national president
of the National Organization for Women.
The theme of season two iswomen leading democracy.
(00:27):
And so it's obvious thatwe would want to speak
with women leaders whohave done just that,
led our democracy.
And what better person to speak with
than the first womanelected US House speaker
and the first woman to leada major political party
in Congress.
(upbeat music)
(00:50):
Many people might havegrown up feeling like life
in the United Stateswas solid, predictable.
Many of us, white women, people of color,
the LGBTQIA community, andmany other marginalized groups,
knew we didn't have all the rights
and all the choices that we deserved.
But we knew one thing.
We knew we lived in a democracy
(01:10):
that if we put up and voted for candidates
who would stand up for us,
we would in time see a better world.
Lately, that doesn't feel true.
Democracy has begun tofeel shaky and frail.
That's why I am especially excited
and pleased to be here with you today
and help us welcome SpeakerEmerita Nancy Pelosi.
(01:32):
She has made amazing history in 2007
when she was elected the first speaker
of the House of Representatives
and one of the chief architects
behind the Affordable Care Act.
You know, you all know who she is.
She has done amazing things in Congress.
She has also helped pass
the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Act of 2009.
(01:52):
She's an advocate for child poverty.
She's worked on prohibitingsex-based wage discrimination.
She's helped be insurmountable changes
for us in this Congress in our country.
Please help me welcomeMadam Speaker Pelosi
to Feminism NOW.
Thank you for being here, madam.
(02:13):
- Thank you so much, Christian.
You said you wereexcited for this podcast.
Well, I'm excited too. You know why?
NOW endorsed me when I ran the first time.
And not every woman's group did.
They endorsed some men,if you can imagine that.
But in any event, NOW hasbeen there from the start,
not only politically endorser,
but an inspiration, anintellectual resource,
(02:35):
a mobilizing resource, and the rest.
So I'm always, alwaysfaithful and loyal to NOW,
and I'm so proud of you asthe youngest leader of NOW,
as well as the second African American.
So important right now to haveyour youth, your diversity,
and the rest at the head of this very,
very important organization.
(02:55):
- Well, I thank you so much for that.
And just want you to knowNOW is still with you,
and we will still be there tosupport you in any way we can.
But I want us to get in this conversation.
I tell everyone right at thebeginning I'm a truth teller.
And I know you are a truth teller,
and that's why I'm so excitedto have you on this podcast.
We have been really watching
(03:16):
so much go on in ourworld, in our country,
and we can say that somuch has been happening
where people are reallyfeeling like democracy itself
is more frail than ever before.
Do you agree with thesesentiments, and what do you feel?
And if you do agree with it,
(03:36):
what do you feel iscontributing to the frailty
of our democracy right now?
- Well, I think you're right.
There is a frailty to our democracy.
It is always something thatwe have to be vigilant about.
But really points out the realnecessity for feminism now,
because my hopes are riding
on women playing a more leading role.
(03:58):
Women, young people, peopleof color, the diversity.
And that is what has contributed
to some of the insecurityon the part of other people.
They are afraid of globalization,
they're afraid of innovation,they're afraid of immigration,
they're afraid of LGBTQ.
Women playing a moreleading role of diversity
is threatening their,shall we say, preeminence
(04:22):
as sort of a white man kindof insecurity, if I just may.
And that has been an opportunity
for people like what's his name
who used to be presidentof the United States,
I hesitate to use his name, DT.
And he has prayed on that.
He didn't create it, but he normalized it,
(04:43):
and he generated thatinsecurity among people,
and that has been a dividingforce in our country.
So we have to, as I say, ourdiversity is our strength,
our unity is our power,
and we have to work togetherto protect our democracy.
I think one path to unifyingis to have a strong economy
(05:06):
that includes everyone.
And that's what PresidentBiden has been about
with whether it was our rescue package,
our infrastructurepackage, our CHIPS package,
our package for veterans,
our IRA to lower the costof prescription drugs,
but to involve young peoplein how we save the planet,
new young people.
And all of it with justice. With justice.
(05:29):
In the infrastructure package,
billions of dollars to gospecifically for environmental
and infrastructure justice.
Same thing with some of the other bills,
including IRA, called theInflation Reduction Act,
but about justice.
So the way we will makeour democracy stronger
(05:50):
is to make our democracy stronger.
In other words, to reducethe role of big dark money
in politics, to elevate thegrassroots involvement in it,
to stop partisan redistricting,
to, again, pass a voting rights act.
And John Lewis's bill,
Voting Rights Act is named for John Lewis,
(06:10):
but the bill to stop votersuppression and the rest
is one that he wrotethe first 300 pages of.
So again, how we make ourdemocratic system more,
shall we say, true to theaspirations of the people
so that they know that their vote counts,
that their voice is important,
and it's just not big darkmoney calling the shots.
(06:32):
That's why we have to win the election
with enough votes in the Senate
to overturn the filibuster rule
so that we can pass the JohnLewis Voting Rights Act,
as well as the For the People Act.
- Yeah, thank you for saying that.
I wanna go back to a couple things
that you mentioned at the verybeginning as what you said,
'cause that really summed up a lot for us.
(06:54):
You said that what we're seeing
and part of the reason whyour democracy is seen as frail
is because white patriarchy, right?
There's some misogyny, there'ssome fear of inclusion.
They're afraid of this progression.
They're afraid of thepower of the diversity
and difference of everyone
(07:14):
and what the capabilitieswe've seen happen
from people shifting.
And what we needultimately is that equality
and that justice to happen,
but that can't happen without equity.
But we have seen,
and since Biden-Harris administration,
they have really been investing in equity
in so many of the different packages.
And you all have beenreally investing in equity
(07:35):
in so many of the differentacts that you've been doing,
which is what I feel is very different
from a long time I've seen.
It's just really investing in equity
and truly understanding thatyou cannot have equality
without equity.
Would you agree that's beena big part of the investment?
- Yes, absolutely.
And again, as you were speaking,
I'm thinking of what we need to do.
And we talked about what we have done,
(07:57):
but there's some thingsthat have not been done.
And for us to have that equity,
whether it's environmental justice,
social justice, economic justice,
gender justice, gender equalityjustice, whatever it is,
we have to pass specificlegislation to enable,
for example, maternity mortality,
(08:18):
which affects the AfricanAmerican community.
We have a whole slew oflegislation put forth
by many of our African-American members,
but really embraced by our entire caucus.
Alma Adams of North Carolinahas taken the lead on this.
This is an identifiableproblem in our society
and there are answers to it.
(08:40):
And there's resistance to passing,
and that's why we wanna buildthe outside mobilization
for these things.
It's there because people know.
The other thing is these thingshave to happen for women.
We have to have affordable childcare.
We have to have family and medical leave.
We have to have home healthcare.
(09:01):
So it's not just about children and that.
It's about a sibling,a parent, or something.
So that women can be inthe workplace present
without worrying about, oh my gosh,
we always worry about our family,
but not worrying thata child is in danger,
or a family member is gonna fall down
because nobody is there.
And as we have that homehealthcare, we have to,
(09:22):
and the childcare, wehave to invest in it.
We have to have theresources, the good pay.
Good pay, good training,good safety for it all.
And that, in my view,unleashes the power of women
in a stronger way in theworkforce to be there,
to take leadership roles, totake a command of a lot of it.
(09:44):
'Cause some of this is cultural.
Then with the three Gs.
Gays, guns, God, and that'swhat they call abortion.
You know, for them it's God, right?
They don't feed thechildren once they're born,
but they call that God.
So we have those big challenges,
and quite frankly, in my view,
they're exploiting thereligious issue on the board.
(10:07):
I mean, I'm a devout practicing Catholic,
all the rest of that,
but give me a break, youknow, with these bills.
In vitro fertilization whenwe're talking about that,
when we're talking abouta woman's right to choose,
and the rest of that.
God gave us a free will tohonor our responsibilities.
It's not up to any politician to do that.
(10:28):
So again, these things thatrelate to women's freedom
and women's liberation to beable to be in the workforce.
And I do believe that it is an answer.
You know, when I was very young,
there was something thatpeople talked about:
women's intuition.
A mother's intuition. You have to act.
You have to act. You can't think about it.
(10:50):
You have to act.
And that is what leaders need to be doing,
is acting instead of lettingother people diminish
the initiative becauseyou're thinking about it.
And women know.
I mean, we're multitaskersand all the rest.
We know we have the courage,the confidence to act.
(11:11):
- And I think going off ofthat, the women do know,
so it's really important
that we are asking women what they need
that's gonna give them afull sustainable life, right?
It's not leaving themout of the conversation.
It's not leaving them out of the process
of developing thislegislation, these policies.
It's making sure that you'regoing to those communities
(11:32):
that are directly impacted andmaking sure that their voice
and their narrative and theirexperience is really heard,
so there is no disconnect, right?
So there is no disconnect.
- That's essential to it, is don't let me,
and that's not for anybody totell anybody what they need.
We have to hear from people,
and that applies to almost everything.
When we're talking infrastructure,to go to the community.
(11:54):
What do you want?
In the past, they builtfreeways to divide communities.
We wanna break that downto unite communities.
But let's listen to the community.
And in our community in San Francisco,
we are very, shall we say,proud of almost everything.
I went to Bayview-HuntersPoint the other day
about the Bayview-Hunters Point Center,
(12:15):
which is relatively new.
And the community had sayin every aspect of it.
When we do housing, whenwe do transportation,
we do every aspect thesame thing on things
that relate to childcare, healthcare,
women's right to choose,and the rest of that.
Listening to women aboutnot just what will happen,
(12:36):
but the terminology that will be used.
That is respectful.
- Absolutely.
And I appreciate you also naming that,
because terminology matters.
My background is social work,
so I'm big on, like, startingwhere the people are at
and using that terminology tomake sure we are connecting
with people and we're speaking in language
(12:57):
and words that are meaningful and powerful
for those people andempowering for those people.
So I really appreciate you, Madam Speaker,
naming that about that language.
I think that's so extremely important.
I wanted to kind of just goa little bit more into this
and ask you a little bit more about
when we're talkingabout what we're seeing,
(13:17):
especially for the women andour rights being overturned
and the state of democracy,
how do you feel women aregoing to contribute to helping,
I wanna put it past saving democracy,
but saving democracy, butalso rebuilding democracy
(13:37):
to the democracy that we truly envision?
- That is absolutely has to be the goal.
It's not about incrementalismor returning to something.
It's about how we go forward.
And I have always believed,
I'm a former chair of theCalifornia Democratic Parties,
where there's the biggest partyin the country and the rest.
(13:58):
And my experience therewas always you have
to make democracy more democratic.
You have us to make theDemocratic Party more democratic.
One example that I will use ishealthcare. What's his name?
You know, what's his name?
I hate to use his name. It'slike a curse word to me.
- Oh, I know, I hear you. (laughs)
(14:18):
- (laughs) He said Obamacaresucks. That's his language.
So he knows what he'ssaying. That has a market.
And we're saying, "No, itdoesn't suck. It cures."
But when we did the Affordable Care Act
and when we saved the Affordable Care Act,
people said, "How'd you do it?"
I said, "Well, we had, you know,
there were a lot of reasons how we did it,
but we could not have done it
(14:39):
without the outside mobilization."
And the outside mobilization to pass it
and to save it was dependenton a lot about the terminology.
We had 10,000 events to save it
from his repeal and replace.
10,000 where people told their stories.
Not our provisions, their stories.
(15:02):
And they told us that if we wanted them
to be calling Congress about that,
we had to frame it in their terms.
In their term. Not, oh,this is one of the...
You know, it was in theirterms and in their priorities.
And that was a beautiful thing.
(15:23):
So again, whether we'repolicymaking or doing politics,
it's important to listen, learn,
and go forward in that positive way.
Because there is skepticism,there is suspicion,
there is just concern about
whether people's votereally counts and matters
(15:44):
and makes a difference.
That's why we must, absolutelymust reduce the role
of big dark money in politics,
because it has such a big role to play.
But again, we have toencourage the grassroots.
Well, it is who we are.
We are a grassroots party.
And sometimes that looks, should we say,
(16:07):
I don't wanna say messy,but not as organized
as some people like tohave their lives be.
But that's a democratic party.
The vitality of it all is what we welcome.
And again, women, youngpeople, people of color,
diversity is the beauty of,
I wanna say the beauty is in the mix.
(16:28):
The beauty is in the mix.
So if you want the democracyto be more democratic,
actually, you know what makesAmerica even more American?
Is the vitality ofnewcomers to our country.
They come with their courage.
They come with their optimism,
their hope, their determination
to make the future betterfor their families.
(16:50):
In some cases, they bring their faith,
their commitment to family and the future.
Those are American values,
and they make America more American.
So again, the historyof our country has been
of reinvigoration, andwe must welcome that
and understand that itis that invigoration
(17:11):
that is so important to our country.
(upbeat music)
- We have so many more questions to ask,
but right now we're goingto pause for a short break
for our new segment, Action NOW.
For this Action NOW, I'dlike to talk about voting.
Voting is the foundation of our democracy,
(17:32):
and protection of ouraccess to the ballot remains
as critical as ever.
Over the past five years,
voter suppression has manifested itself
in racial and partisan gerrymandering
and voter suppression laws thatdisenfranchise many voters.
Now it's dedicated toproviding women equal access
to the ballot and electingfeminist candidates to office.
(17:53):
So today we're asking you to take action,
register to vote yourself,
and educate your family and friends
about issues on the ballot.
Together, we can take action now.
And now back to our interview.
(upbeat music)
So one of the things youjust mentioned I think
is important for us toexpand on is about the votes.
(18:16):
And it's the vote is part of democracy,
but it's not just only part.
And a lot of times we hear people,
like, especially Ithink right now we hear,
a lot of times we hear,
sometimes we hear youngervoters feeling like
they're disenfranchised from the,
they're not feeling connected.
They don't feel, like, as engaged to vote.
Sometimes they feel, peoplefrom some communities feel
(18:39):
as why do they need to vote because,
you know, the ones speakingto them or speaking for them.
But I think it's bigger than that.
I think just in general,we all have to do better.
Instead of just tellingpeople just to go vote,
we have to tell them whythat vote is important
and why their voice matters,you know, a little bit more
(19:03):
and give them examples ofhow their voice matters.
Instead of just saying, "Just go vote,"
we have to, like, maybe educate
and tell them exactlymore tangible reasons
about why their voice matters
and examples in their communities
about how they can use theirvoice to make an impact.
So I would ask for you,
besides just telling aperson just to go vote,
(19:24):
what can we give examplesfor people and voters
to let them know areas of whyit's important they're voting
because of some of the restrictionswe're seeing happening,
and why it's important that they get out
and exercise their voicein this upcoming election?
- You have put the challengeforth with great clarity.
(19:46):
Let me just give you someexamples of listening
to the voters.
After one of the electionsrecently, the '16 election,
which was a disaster fordemocracy, for women's rights,
for everything, horrible,
when what's his name was elected,
some of the young African-American,
gonna say some college age,
(20:06):
some, like, senior in highschool, some one year out,
you know, just in that 18 to23, 24-year-old, they said,
"We wanna meet with you totell you what we think."
They said, "Just becauseyou send a sports figure
or a Hollywood star to say, 'Vote,'
it doesn't mean anything to us
(20:26):
unless they're talkingto us about our needs."
And they found that almost condescending.
And I said, "Well, you know,
they're not there to condescend to you.
They're there to attract your attention
and then hopefully have an exchange."
So I think it's really important
when we're talking to people,
it's about their needs, notabout our vision, necessarily,
(20:50):
unless it's capturing theirneeds, these young people.
And they said, "Youknow, in this election,
the one thing we heard isthe candidate deserves it."
It's not about what you have done,
it's about what you're going to do.
And what you have donemay qualify you to speak
with some authority aboutwhat you're going to do.
(21:11):
But elections are always about the future.
So I tell this story aboutthese young people, saying,
"Yeah, it's nice tohave a star talk to us,
but we want them to talkto us about what we need
to see in the election,
not necessarily why theyare supporting that person."
And it's about the future.
(21:31):
And I say this all the time.
It's not about anybody deserving anything.
It's about what's coming next.
Now, we like to talk aboutwhat we've done to prove
that we share values andcan get something done,
but that is a springboard.
It's not a base.
It's not the reasonthey should vote for us.
It's what comes next.
(21:53):
And what comes next has to be listened to
so that we're really focusinghow they see the future, A,
and B, in their terminology.
- Absolutely. It's aboutthat legacy, right?
It's about that legacy.
- It is. And they are the future.
The future belongs to the young people.
(22:13):
They have to takeresponsibility for it too.
You know, and it's notjust, what are you doing?
It's how they take responsibility for it.
Many of them care abouttheir individual liberties.
They care about jobs andeconomic opportunity.
They care about theplanet that they live in.
They compare, again, therespect for the dignity worth
(22:36):
of every person they are.
And again, they have to knowit's all there for the taking.
For the taking.
And I always say to them,
"There's nobody in thehistory of the world like you.
You are so special.
Know your power and use it
as you join with othersaround ideas for the future.
(22:58):
Be yourself, know your why,
what you wanna see in all this why.
Know what you're talking about.
Join with friends. Embrace the future."
- Well, I think I was gonna ask you
what your call to action was, (laughs)
but do you have any other call to action?
Because I think that reallysums it up for us, really,
(23:19):
truly, is be yourself, know whoyou are, embrace the future,
and get out there and do the work.
Would you have any other call to action
that you would like ourlisteners to know or to act on
that you feel will bevery important for us
as we move forward in embracing this
to help us all be a part ofthis relationship we need
to build the democracythat we are looking for?
(23:42):
- It's important foreveryone to understand
that elections ramifications.
It's a very big difference
between Democrats andRepublicans at this time.
I wish it weren't so drastic,but it's very drastic.
And then you hear them talking
about life begins at conceptionor something like that,
and it's like,
125 members of the Houseare co-sponsors of that.
(24:04):
Doesn't mean it doesn'teven have more than that.
Eight members of theRepublican Party voted
for women to have access to contraception.
Eight. Eight.
That means 195 of them voted
against women havingaccess to contraception.
So we're talking about a big difference
in your personal life.
Disrespect for your ability
(24:27):
to make your own decisions in this regard.
And those very same people
in many cases don't wanna feed children.
They say they don't believein what they call welfare.
But no, it's feeding children.
Imagine there are governors in the state
which will not acceptthe free package of food
that is part of our legislation
'cause they don't believein welfare to feed children.
(24:48):
So I say this because Idon't wanna be a fearmonger,
but I think it's really important to know
that elections have ramifications.
So again, know your power
in terms of engaging in the elections,
but not just as a foot soldier,
but as a person who is helpingto establish the priorities.
(25:08):
There are a lot of challenges.
What are the priorities?
So know your power in prioritizing,
know your power in building support,
and know your power in winning elections
and then having the impactof your responsibility
for that success recognized by people.
(25:30):
Again, Lincoln said publicsentiment is everything.
With it, you can do almost anything.
Without it, practically nothing.
Also, I say nothing is moreeloquent to a member of Congress
than the voice of hisor her own constituents.
So weigh in.
And if they are not with you,
then maybe they need to be replaced.
(25:51):
Maybe they need to replace.
So anyway, the call toaction is know your power
in terms of policy, know yourpower in terms of politics,
and elections are very important.
And winning them is not just important
from a political standpoint,but from a policy standpoint
and from a personal standpoint.
(26:12):
Again, with healthcare,
access to quality, affordable healthcare,
recognizing diversityamong our communities
in terms of how peopleare impacted, weigh in.
Weigh in.
And again, I'm very proud that
in the House Democratic Caucus,
70% of our caucus are women,people of color, LGBTQ.
(26:35):
This is a remarkable thing.
You know, they say Congressdoesn't have enough.
We do in the House Democratic Caucus.
And you know what? We want more.
We want more.
As we reach out for that,I'm saying to people,
have the courage to run yourself
'cause you are very special
and will make a very big difference.
(26:56):
- Speaker Emerita, thank you so much
for being here with us today.
We appreciate your continued leadership
and your support for the American women
and support for this country.
Listeners, please make sureyou're out there voting,
weighing in, knowing thepolicy, knowing the politics.
- Christian, thank you foryour tremendous leadership.
We're so proud of you. Thank you.
(27:16):
- Thank you so much.
(upbeat music)
Thank you, listeners, for being with us
as we use season two of our podcast
to showcase people makinga real difference to women
and their allies in democracy.
Stay tuned for our next episodes
as we cover the issuesthat affect women most:
childcare and voting rights,
(27:38):
reproductive justice and gun violence,
the rise of Generation Z,
and the need for healthcare for all,
from affordable prescriptionsto gender-affirming care.
This podcast, Feminism NOW,
is a production of theNational Organization for Women
and Voxtopica.
I'm Christian F. Nunes,NOW's national president.
(27:58):
And if you like what youhear, please go to now.org,
read up on our core issues
and our approach toadvancing women's equality.
And get involved. We'dlove to hear from you.
Send your thoughts to feminismnow@now.org.
Thanks for listening,and we'll see you soon.
(upbeat music)
(upbeat music)
(28:26):
- Voxtopica.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!