#181. First Chapter Analysis: House Of Earth And Blood by Sarah J. Maas

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This Philip Briggs is intriguing because you know
it's like Danica obviously hateshim.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
And you know not to get too far into that, but at
some point he's consideredbehind Danica's murder and then
proven innocent and things likethat.
So I think it's.
What's cool is that, as areader who doesn't know any of
that, you're picking up on thatin the first chapter.
And then let's turn that around.
For if we were to write acharacter like this in our own
books, how could we writesomeone who, yes, we get that

(00:31):
hint that he could be somethingmore?
We don't know yet.
Welcome to the Fiction WritingMade Easy podcast.
My name is Savannah Gilbo andI'm here to help you write a
story that works.
I want to prove to you thatwriting a novel doesn't have to
be overwhelming, so each weekI'll bring you a brand new
episode with simple, actionableand step-by-step strategies that
you can implement in yourwriting right away.

(00:52):
So whether you're brand new towriting or more of a seasoned
author looking to improve yourcraft, this podcast is for you.
So pick up a pen and let's getstarted.
In today's episode, abigail KPerry and I are breaking down
the first chapter of house ofearth and blood by sarah j mass,
and I'm very excited to diginto this book's opening pages,

(01:13):
because not only is sarah j massone of my favorite authors, but
also because this openingchapter provides a really great
example of what it means to havea book with a steep learning
curve.
If you're not familiar withthis term, it basically
describes how long it takesreaders to get up to speed on
the nuances of your story world.
And in something like the HarryPotter books, those have more

(01:34):
of a shallow learning curve,meaning we learn about the world
as Harry does, but in House ofEarth and Blood there is more of
a steep learning curve wherewe're kind of thrown off the
deep end and need to catch up towhat Bryce knows and
understands.
So I love this book as anexample of a steep learning
curve, and we talk more aboutthat in the episode.
Now, what's really going to befun about this episode is that

(01:54):
Abigail has not read this bookor any of Sarah J Maas's other
books, so she is coming in withcompletely fresh eyes and I'm
really eager to see what shepicks up on as a first-time
reader.
Because, remember, the goal ofthese deep dives is to see how
and why the opening chapterhooks us and pulls us into the
story, and also how it makes usa promise of what's to come in

(02:14):
the rest of the book, so I'mvery interested to see what
Abigail will pick up on in termsof that bigger promise, and
you'll hear us talk about thatin the episode as well.
Now, speaking of Abigail, sheis my co-host for today's
episode and if you've never metAbigail before, she is a
developmental editor, a bookcoach and the host of an amazing
podcast called Lit Match, andon her podcast, she helps

(02:35):
writers find the best literaryagent for their writing and
publishing careers.
I will link to where you canfind Abigail around the internet
, as well as her podcast, in theshow notes.
But without further ado, let'sdive into the first chapter of
House of Earth and Blood bySarah J Maas to see how and why
it works.

Speaker 1 (02:54):
Hey, savannah, thanks for joining me again.
I am really excited to get intothe book that we chose to
analyze today, mainly because Iknow this has been top of your
list for a long time, so we aregoing to talk about it.
I, shockingly, have never readthe Sarah J Maas books and I
know how huge they are, but weare going to study today the

(03:17):
first book in Crescent City bySarah J Maas, and I know that
you have a summary for us beforewe get into it.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
Yep, so technically, this is House of Earth and Blood
, which is the first CrescentCity book, and we're
collectively all going to holdAbigail to reading it, or at
least reading one of Sarah JMass's books, because these are
some of my favorites.
So in this very first chapter,bryce Quinlan.
She's at work inside a magicalgallery owned by a sorceress
named Jessaba Roga and she'sdoing some research.

(03:47):
And then there's a knock at thedoor and Bryce realizes that it
must be Thursday because herbest friend, danica, is the one
knocking on the door and sheusually only comes by on
Thursdays.
So Bryce lets Danica into thegallery and Danica asks, or more
like, tells Bryce that she'sgoing to leave her sword in the
gallery and that she needs toshower because she's covered in

(04:08):
grime.
They talk about Jessaba andabout Bryce's new tattoo, and
then Danica reveals that a humannamed Philip Briggs is about to
be released from prison andeverybody is in an uproar over
it.
And Briggs is a bomber slashterrorist intent on starting a
revolution that will allowhumans to overthrow their
magical overlords.

(04:29):
And Bryce's best friend, danica, is the most upset about this
because her and her pack ofdevils are the ones who captured
him in the first place, so theyfeel like a big injustice is
being done by letting him free.
And Danica tells Bryce that sheintends to protest Briggs's
release at the council meetingthat afternoon.
So that's why she's here.

(04:50):
She's going to shower and getready for that.
So she goes off to shower andthen Jessica calls to let Bryce
know that she knows exactlywhat's going on, that Danica is
there because she has a cameramonitoring the gallery at all
times, and that's how thechapter ends.

Speaker 1 (05:04):
Okay, awesome, and you and I actually both
discussed that.
We think that the first sceneextends into chapter two as well
, right, yeah, so we are goingto go a little bit into chapter
two today, but that was a greatsummary.
There's so much world buildingin this first chapter.
Yeah, definitely steep learningcurve.
I'm really excited to pick yourbrain about that, because you
are a world-building master andI like to go to you for all

(05:28):
advice on world-building.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
No pressure.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, no pressure, but you do a great job.
But there's a lot in here.
So I think it will be extracool that I haven't read this
and you have, because I'mprobably going to be asking a
lot of questions and hopefully,if you have not read this with
me, you'll be in that same seat,because this is a great way to
kind of look out when you areapproaching a story from an
analytical perspective.
Where can you start to see howauthors really create valuable

(05:54):
setups?
And especially when it comes tosteep learning curves and we
can get caught in the world anddescribing things too much, when
are you describing things thathave value to what we're going
to see and how it's going tocreate depth to the characters
and the plot and all of thoseimportant details, and when is
it extra?
So I think that I'll be able toask you questions about that,

(06:14):
savannah, and you can probablyanswer them for me.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
Yeah, and that's kind of one of the reasons I want to
do this book so much.
I love it, of course, but Ialso wanted to see what Abigail
would see as someone who'scoming to it with fresh eyes.
Because when you reread thefirst chapter as someone who's
read the book, you can see allthese setups and you're like, oh
, how clever.
The author did X, y, z to setup this thing coming later and I
just wanted to get Abigail'stake on.

(06:38):
What is it like to read it withfresh eyes, knowing nothing
about the rest of the book?
So that's what we're in fortoday and I'm going to actually
ask you the big picturequestions, abigail.
So what we normally do is wewant to look at, like, how does
this first chapter set up ourexpectations, how does it tell
readers what kind of storythey're in for, whether they

(06:58):
realize it or not, and then howdoes each coming scene kind of
deliver on those expectations?
So we do this by using sevenkey questions from Paula
Meunier's book, the Writer'sGuide to Beginnings.
And the first question, abigail, is about genre.
So what kind of story is it?
And we usually say this one ismore the commercial genre and
the next is the content genre.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Okay, so commercial genre we're looking at?
I mean, it feels like epicfantasy to me.
I know it's romantic-y as well,so would you call this
romantic-y?

Speaker 2 (07:29):
Yeah, I would.
I think it's also likecontemporary urban fantasy and
it's for adults.
How do we get clues to this inthe first chapter?

Speaker 1 (07:37):
Well, we know that there's a lot of types of
creatures in this story.
We know that there's a lot oftypes of creatures in this story
.
We know that there's a lot of Isee.
I want to say there's a witch,so we don't necessarily see
magic happening, but it kind ofis magic because we have Danica
can shapeshift into a wolf.
It sounds like there's a lot offaes which are fairies.

(07:59):
We know that the humans theretends to be.
It looks like there's thispolitical setup between humans
and basically anything that isnot human has some sort of like
magical ability and is verypowerful.
And it looks like Bryce is ahalf human so she can't heal.
Context is that they gottattoos.

(08:26):
Danica and bryce got tattoosand hers, bryce, hasn't healed
as quickly but danica's has,because she's one of these ones
that can shape shift into a fullwolf, where someone like bryce
is not going to have as muchmagic.
But she is half of somethingright and it looks like she has
a brother.
I think we read in chapter twowho's a full fairy, so I'm
assuming that she's half.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
Is she a?

Speaker 1 (08:44):
half fae, yeah, half human fae, and there's just a
lot of that I know.
There's like a Chimera who's apet inside the antique shop and
like there's another magicalcreature there.
We're dealing a lot withantique heirlooms that have that
seem like they have somemagical sources to them sources

(09:05):
to them.
So we're in the city.
Yeah, there's a lot of, there'sa lot of clues, there's a lot
of world building.
You don't necessarily go to thedepth of understanding every
single detail about everything,but you can see how the entire
political system is based off ofmagical creatures and not and
we get the hint that we're kindof in this city or this urban
setting.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
Also, the topics the characters are talking about,
like getting tattoos, they'recursing, they have jobs, you
know.
So we can get the sense thatyes, it's for adults, yes, it's
fantasy and yes, we're in somekind of urban setting.
So I think we can say check,the first chapter really tells
us what kind of commercial genrewe're looking at.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
Yes, and then for content genre, this is an
interesting one Because you knowright away when I hear fantasy
I usually will kind of justdefault to action because we
usually can deal with life anddeath stakes.
So that's what my guess wouldbe.
We're not necessarily dealingwith life and death stakes in
like in our face on this page,but there's hints about
rebellion with humans, withPhilip Briggs, and they're in

(09:58):
bombs and things like that.
And Danica and how she can, shesays that she could take him,
but basically Bryce reinforces,everyone says that she could
take him, but everyone basicallyBryce reinforces, everyone
knows that you could take him.
There's a lot of like quarreling, so you can see that there's
kind of this like landscape ofviolence in a way.
At the same time I almost had aquestion like are we going to
have a lot of society stuff inhere as well?

(10:20):
I don't think that's that.
I think that's going to be moreof like a subplot or a main
thematic like plot line going on, because you can see such
divide between the humans andthe magical creatures.
Yeah, but I'd probably saywe're going to.
My vote would be action.
And then I know that there's alot of romance in this I'm going
to say there's a love subplotin there.
I don't see the love storylineset up in the first chapter,

(10:42):
unless it's going to be withPhilip Briggs.

Speaker 2 (10:44):
So love storyline set up in the first chapter, unless
it's going to be with PhilipBriggs.
And it's kind of interestingbecause in a way, we get love
with Danica right Like they'rebest friends.
They've been best friends forthe last five years.
So it's not, you know, not thetypical romantic love that we're
getting a hint at, but there isa flavor of.
Relationships are important,but I think you're spot on,
which is really cool.
I was very curious what youwere going to say for this

(11:04):
question.
So this is number two, kind ofdealing with the plot.
What is the story really about?
And I think Abigail pretty muchnailed it there.
So I do think it is an actionstory.
There's a lot that we get interms like I was going to add up
before this but I didn't get todo it how many times the word
power is used, how many wordslike the word danger and death

(11:24):
and things like that are used.
So we definitely get thisflavor of.
This is a dangerous place,especially now that Philip
Briggs is loose.
And what's really interesting isI've talked to a lot of other
writers who you know spoileralert if you want to skip ahead
30 seconds or so when Danicadies, it kicks off this kind of
crime subplot later in the story.

(11:44):
So I feel like a lot of peoplecould view this as a crime story
and I think that would discountsome of this bigger stuff that
we have going on, because it'sthrough Danica's really her
death and like the investigationinto that that brings Bryce
back around to this bigger plotof this kind of power struggle
and these life or deathsituations and things like that.
But also I thought it was reallyinteresting.

(12:05):
So there's this whole thingabout Luna's horn that readers
of the book will know what I'mtalking about, but if you
haven't read the book, it'sbasically the MacGuffin of the
entire story, so multiple peoplewant it.
In this first chapter Bryce istalking about how you know it
would really.
I think it's in the secondchapter, but she's researching

(12:28):
in the first chapter where tofind the horn and in the second
chapter she's kind of like youknow, this would be meaningful
for my career, my boss reallywants it, whatever.
So there's that's partiallywhat the story is about too, and
it comes into play in a biggerway and we do get hints of that
in the first chapter.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
So I think that's really interesting as well in
regards into what they weregoing to try to achieve,
especially based on how, whenthey talk about suspicions and I

(13:06):
think this is chapter two, butthis is also why we need to
extend the scene into chaptertwo, based on Bryce and where
she gets to have a little bitmore agency in making decisions.
But I forget if it's Danica orBryce that one of them suspects
that the raid, the electricityhas gone off, which I found
really interesting, that thatcaused a raid, because there are
, they are filled in this worldwith tons of these magical

(13:28):
creatures.
So it seemed interesting thatjessica has a generator.
There's a lot of detail put onhaving a generator and the
antique store is able to stay upand running because of the
generators.
That it.
That was one thing I just wantedto mention.
Like with world world-buildingtoo, is interesting to me.
It seems like there were normaland I say that you know in
quotations, but normal parts ofthis world that a human in

(13:51):
today's modern society wouldunderstand mixed within this
like huge magical system.
So that was really interestingbecause there was like generator
.
There was, like you said, likethey're getting tattoos.
There's a reference to Brycebeing high one day and coming to
.
I guess the day of the day thatshe got the tattoo.
So it was interesting becauseit felt like, okay, these are
like things that we would see inour day-to-day mixed in the

(14:13):
magical system.
So that was right.

Speaker 2 (14:15):
That was pretty cool to see that, yeah, which we can
talk about more in a second onsetting, because I think that
really helps ground us into thatsteep learning curve.
But speaking of the tattoo, soreaders of the book will know
that basically her tattoo isLuna's horn.
So we know.
Like on reread we can say, holycow, the author put that, you
know, right in these openingpages with that tattoo, but you

(14:37):
would never know it as a firsttime reader.
However, it's there and it'scool to see like Abigail picked
up on how important, importantthat was, even though she didn't
know why it was going to beimportant.
So I think, um, that's reallycool.
Also, you picked up on thepower struggle between the
different groups.
That's definitely a thing.
And then there's talk about thedifferent archangels, that kind

(14:57):
of rule over everybody.
Micah spoiler is the mainantagonist of this book, so
we've mentioned him already inthis opening chapter two.
So I do think, in a roundaboutway, this first chapter gives us
a sense of what the story isgoing to be about, and of course
it's about this friendshipbetween Danica and Bryce and
things like that, but we mightnot understand that on first

(15:18):
read.
Yep, so okay.
So that's question two.
What is the plot of the story.
What's the story really about?
Question three is point of view.
So I don't know if you wouldknow this, having not read the
book, abigail, but it's a thirdperson limited through two
characters perspectives.
One is Bryce, we meet in thefirst chapter, and the second is
her eventual love interest.
Who is the Umbra Mortis whothey talk about, I believe, in

(15:41):
the first chapter.
So that's Hunt Athalar and hereventual love interest.

Speaker 1 (15:46):
Okay, yes, I would not have suspected that.
You said that they referencedhim, so it's important to see
like, okay, we're already kindof setting up a character who's
going to play a role later inthe story.
So does he really mean to tellme that any of the heads want to
rebel like Briggs at large?
They'll find someonetechnicality and throw his ass
right back in jail.
She added because Danica stillwouldn't look at her.
There's no way the 33rd's notmonitoring his every breath.

(16:08):
Brig so much as blinks wrongand he'll see what kind of pain
angels can rain down on us.
Hell, the governor might evensend the Umbra mortiffs after
him.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
Yeah, so yeah, he's introduced quite early, which is
kind of cool too, and thenlater we get his point of view.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
And that is within the first, like I have the
Kindle version, but it's thefirst four pages of chapter two,
so very early we're seeing that.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Yeah, which is you know, either way you think about
it, if he's the love interest,if he's part of the conflict, if
he's another point of viewcharacter, either way you look
at it, he's in this firstchapter, which is exactly what
we want to do in any of thosescenarios.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
So why do you think it's important that this became
a dual point of view thirdperson limited, then, versus
just Bryce?

Speaker 2 (16:48):
Probably because of their romance, and there's a big
twist, slash, betrayal thatcomes from Hunt later.
So we do need to feel investedin him and he's a character that
has point of view throughoutthe entire series and I think
there's things that he's privyto that Bryce isn't just because
of his job and things like that, but it's actually a pretty
good case study of.

(17:08):
In a way, he's kind of anunreliable narrator because we
will kind of but kind of notright, he's harboring this
secret or like differentmotivations than what we see
from Bryce's point of view.
So the author had to be verystrategic about when we dip into
Hunt's point of view and howmuch she let on in Hunt's point
of view to pull off the twistfrom Bryce's point of view.

Speaker 1 (17:31):
And when does his point of view come in Chapter?

Speaker 2 (17:34):
six, his point of view comes in.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Okay.
So that's interesting, becauseI feel like when you do a dual
point of view, it doesn'tusually take that long before
you get into the second one.
So it's interesting why do youthink we spend so much time with
bryce before we get his pointof view?

Speaker 2 (17:48):
well, because she's our main protagonist and also
he's not really relevant beforethe crime happens okay so like
yes, I mean of course he'srelevant.
I hate saying that, but it'skind of like we don't, we don't
need to know anything, in hispoint of view, until he gets
pulled in to participate infiguring out who killed Danica
and the pack of devils.

Speaker 1 (18:08):
Okay, interesting.
So that's great to know, justbecause I think that a lot of
writers have a hard time makingthe decision of if you have
multiple point of views when youintroduce them, and there has
to be purpose for it, it can'tbe random.
Right so that makes sense thatwe need to spend time.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
I think it's cool that we don't get set up of Hunt
Like imagine if we had andthere's like a point of view of
him and his job and it's like aday-to-day in the life of Hunt,
we wouldn't care.

Speaker 1 (18:35):
Right, and if he's unreliable, you're going to not
trust him as much.
If it's later, right.

Speaker 2 (18:43):
Yeah, and it's funny.
I hate using the wordunreliable, because he's
reliable in the sense that whathe tells us is true, but the way
the author constructed it, ithas the effect of an unreliable
narrator if that makes sense.
Yeah, because we're left out ofhearing things from his
perspective.
Yeah, okay, question four isabout character.
So when we're reading thisfirst chapter and we come out of

(19:06):
the first chapter, who do wecare about?

Speaker 1 (19:08):
the most.
I really care about Bryce andDanica Yep I really care about.
I actually really like Danicathe most.

Speaker 2 (19:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:16):
Based on this first impression, I know you could
kind of tell that these firstcouple of chapters it feels like
and we are dealing with an epicworld, so you could tell like
there was a lot that wasgrounding us and introducing us
to certain characters in theworld itself.
And I think that when you havemore of these grand, big worlds
with the steep learning curves,you have to spend a little bit

(19:36):
more time doing that in thebeginning to set the stage for
us.
It a little bit more time doingthat in the beginning to set
the stage for us.
It's interesting because, likeas a reader knowing a steep
learning curve, you just acceptthings and move on and learn
about them as you learn in thestory.
But there is a lot ofgroundwork done.
But Danica, getting to know thecharacters through you mentioned
earlier their relationship andhow they care for each other I
like their personalities.
I like their snarkiness betweeneach other.

(19:58):
That's obviously veryaffectionate as well.
I like that they have eachother's backs and I like that
they're a little bit rebellious.
So there's a lot of things tolike about them.
What stood out to me why I likeDanica the most was when they
were talking about Sabine, yeah,and there was the day that she
met her at school and Danicastood up to Sabine.

(20:19):
And here she is, I have it.
Bryce and Sabine had hated eachother from the moment that
Alpha had sneered at her onlychild's improper half-bred
roommate that first day at CCUand Bryce had loved Danica from
the moment her new roommate hadoffered her a hand in greeting
anyway, and then said Sabine wasjust pissy because she'd been
hoping for a muscle-boundvampire to duel over Immediately
.
I loved Danica for that.

(20:40):
Yeah, that's what I am.
I mean, most people are, butI'm a big, big, big fan of any
character that's going to standup to a bully in order to defend
someone else.
So I loved that and,interestingly enough, often also
if we have a POV who lovessomeone, naturally the reader is
going to love that character aswell.
So, knowing that Danica youknow you already mentioned the

(21:03):
spoiler, but spoiler alert againin case you did skip knowing
that Danica is going to die, itmade sense that there is going
to be a lot more attentionplaced on making us really care
about her, and we saw also thatit seems like Danica was going
to be threatened a lot more thanBryce.
So my worries are shared withBryce.

(21:24):
It seems like Bryce is gettingmore and more nervous about the
position that Danica is going tobe in.
She's going to stand up to thecouncil that's trying to release
Philip Briggs.
There's mentioning about willPhilip Briggs come after Danica
and the other devils.
So you can see like it feelslike Danica is pretty confident
that she can take care ofherself, but there are hints

(21:44):
that danger is coming for her.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Yeah, definitely hints and I think you're totally
right about all that and thesetup of their friendship makes
the eventual death way more, youknow, impactful.
And also we see this not to gettoo far ahead, but we see it
continue in chapter two becausethe rest of Danica's pack are
texting Bryce like how is she,is she okay about Philip Briggs?
And things like that.

(22:07):
So we're made to care aboutDanica and the rest of the pack,
who they all die in a futurechapter.
So I think you know there'sbecause if you're writing a book
like this and let's say youhave a twist like a Danica dying
, there's so many places youcould start your story right.
You could have just started, orthe author could have just
started with Bryce at work andmaybe dealing with Jessica only

(22:28):
or a client or whatever.
But I think it's exactly whatyou said earlier we need to
build up that love and thatconnection and friendship
between Bryce and Danica to makeit hit harder later.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
And then, on the flip side of that, why did I like
Bryce?
You know I like that Brycetakes care of her friend.
Yeah, you know, bryce felt likethe ordinary I use that so
lightly because obviously nohero is ordinary but she felt
more like the ordinary characterout of the two of them and so
that makes her very relatablebecause it puts us in her
position.

(22:59):
She does seem like she hassomething to prove.
Yeah, she is working at thisantique shop and she helps
Danica out, knowing that Jessica, her boss, doesn't like that
Right.
So with La Habba, her reactionto Danica coming in is not
wanting her there and saying youknow, jessica doesn't, jessopas

(23:20):
isn't going to like her here.
And Bryce immediately stands upfor Danica and, you know,
basically throws that right backin LaHobba's face.
And you just see that Brycealso has something to prove in
what she's trying to do withthis horn, particularly when she
says that she thinks that thiswould be good for her career.
So you see, she's a half-fae,half-human, and it feels like

(23:41):
she is something that she wantsto prove to herself.
She feels like it's going tocome from third party validation
, but you can see that there's alot of growth potential for her
coming into herself and whatshe values about herself and
what she can do to give thatback to the world when she
believes in herself.
Yeah, and that's.
You're rooting for her in thatregard.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
That's exactly right, so bright.
The humans in this world arebasically second-class citizens,
so she's half human.
She's also this is anotherspoiler but she's also the
daughter or, yeah, the daughterof the king of the fae and he
basically doesn't want anythingto do with her because she's
half human, even though he sleptwith her mom.
Who's human?

Speaker 1 (24:22):
So talk about hypocrite God, complex there.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, so she definitely has like a worldview
arc where it's coming tounderstand, like you know,
what's her place in the world,what's her value with or without
finding the horn and with orwithout solving the murder, and
you know all this differentstuff.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
So it's great and really cool that you picked up
on that in the first chapter,not having read the rest of the
book.
Yeah, cool.
So those are the two charactersyou're thinking about and you
know this Philip Briggs isintriguing because you know it's
like Danica obviously hates him, so you're trying to figure out
.
You know she's, she's part ofthe team that brought him in,

(25:03):
but I always felt like, okay,there's something to learn about
this Philip Briggs.
I think that there's more thatmeets the eye with him.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
So something's going to happen, yeah, and you know,
not to get too far into that,but at some point he's
considered behind Danica'smurder and then proven innocent,
things like that.
So I think it's.
What's cool is that, as areader who doesn't know any of
that, as a reader who doesn'tknow any of that, you're picking
up on that in the first chapter.
And then let's turn that around.
For if we were to write acharacter like this in our own
books, how could we writesomeone who yes, we get that

(25:27):
hint that you know he could besomething more?
We don't know yet.
But there's a very valid reasonin this first chapter, if you
read nothing else, why Danica'supset.
We know what he's accused of,we know a lot of information
that we could just take onsurface value and it works.
So I think that's justsomething to be considerate of
if you're writing something likethis.

(25:49):
Yeah definitely, but okay.
So then the question five isabout setting.
So where and when does thestory take place?
And I'll go through this onereally quick, just because
there's kind of a lot here.
So we're on the planet ofMidgard.
The first chapter is at the artgallery mainly, which is in
Crescent City, which is formerlyknown as Lunathion, and we hear

(26:11):
about a lot of really importantplaces.
So we hear at the end of thechapter we kind of visit the
gate at the heart of the oldsquare.
There are some key placesmentioned, like all the
different quarters that peoplelive in, and across the sea we
hear about Panjera and all thesedifferent places.
But it's kind of like we startat the gallery because that's
going to be a significant placefor Bryce.

(26:32):
It's kind of her home baseother than her house.
We also hear about places we'regoing to visit.
So we don't have to go to a lotof these in the first chapter,
but we hear about them and thatkind of starts to set up the
world.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
Yeah, definitely, and what you said when you
mentioned them.
And see, this is where Ihaven't read the story.
So I don't feel like the namesand locations, that's something
that, for the way my brain works, I'd have to write them down
and like look at them before Ican recite them, and I didn't do
that.
But when you name them, I hearthat and I'm like, yep, I
remember reading about Penjir, Iremember reading about the city

(27:03):
itself, to just kind of helpwriters when they're thinking
about how do you write a storylike this?
All of those big, grandlandscapes are being mentioned
while keeping us contained inthe setting of the antique shop.
So, with Griffith Antiques,that is very I can envision that
, right, I can envision thisantique shop with all of these

(27:26):
magical artifacts, with thislike magical pet in there in the
books, and she's, you know,researching through the books it
has the shower.
So I'm being able to helpground myself in something small
and digestible while being toldabout a world that's much
bigger than that, right?
So that's a useful techniquewhen you are having these with

(27:50):
this big world and needing to,early on, set up important
locations without actually likevisually looking at a map while
at the same time containing usin something that feels
relatable and easy to understand.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
Yeah, and so earlier Abigail mentioned the word a
steep learning curve, and solearning curve, for those of you
who don't know, is basicallyhow long does it take the reader
to immerse themselves and feellike they understand your world?
And I think this is a greatexample of a steep learning
curve in this first chapter,because there's so many terms
and you know different creaturesand things that are just thrown

(28:25):
at us and we're like Abigailsaid, we're expected to just say
, okay, I'm going to keepreading and I hope I'm going to
understand this at some point.
You felt that way when you readit right, abigail kind of um.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
Brendan Sanderson, he has his BYU online course
that's free on YouTube and he hetalks about steep learning
curve versus shallow learningcurve and I remember him saying
with the steep learning curve,that's something that readers
will do.
They just they hear it and theyjust accept it.
Yeah, and where the shallowlearning curve, you will be
introduced to it, often throughthe protagonist experiencing it.

(28:58):
So Harry Potter's a shallowlearning curve For me.
My taste, I tend to gravitatemore towards shallow learning
curves than steep learningcurves.
So when I'm reading somethinglike this, just the way my brain
works, that's what I'm talkingabout.
I need to do a reread because Iam picking up on it but I
haven't been able to wrap myhead around it to truly
understand what it is.
But I'm accepting.

(29:19):
Okay, this is a council andthis is, you know, a type of
breed.
And then there are the devilsand there's talk about taking
the immortality plunge that shehasn't done.
So I don't know what that isyet, but I can take it at face
value and assume that I'm goingto learn it later, and I think
that you correct me if I'm wrongwith this Savannah.
When something is mentioned, isit important that eventually

(29:42):
there's a payoff when weunderstand it, or not always.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
I think so and I think that's something that
Sarah J Maas does well is thatat some point we'll learn what
the meaning is.
If we can't infer it, you knowand that doesn't mean that
everything is going to be supermeaningful.
It just means at some pointwe're going to understand fully
what the author's intending.
So I think she does do a goodjob of that, and there's a lot
of important stuff in this firstchapter.

(30:07):
It's like almost like imagineyou get a blank coloring book
page right and so we know thatwe're coloring in a bear.
Right, that's our shape.
And then, as the chapters go on, we start to really color in
the lines and understand oh,this is a brown bear or a black
bear, or it's wearing a bow tie,whatever.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
That's kind of how I like to think about it, okay, so
another quick question for you,just because I think that a lot
of readers would ask this,especially if they're writing
fantasy, regardless of if it's asteep or shallow learning curve
.
How do they know, especially ina series, when it's something
that they need to include in thebook because this is part of a
series, versus something thatmaybe could be saved for a later

(30:46):
book?
Do they need to get everythingin the first book, or can they
allow things to unfold as youread through the series?
And how do you make thosedecisions?

Speaker 2 (30:54):
I think you can definitely allow things to
unfold.
Allow things to unfold and it'skind of what we did see in our
Harry Potter analysis too isthat you know, in that book
particular, we heard about theMinistry of Magic, but we don't
really know anything about it.
So you know it's the same thingin this book is we hear about
things that maybe pay off inlater books.
But what we have to rememberthat's different about House of

(31:15):
Earth and Blood is that Danicaand Bryce are natives, so they
are natives to this world.
They've lived in this world fora long time, like since birth,
right?
So nothing is unfamiliar tothem.
Where something like HarryPotter, everything is unfamiliar
to him.
In the magical world, he'shelping us get up to speed where
Bryce is.
She has no responsibility toget us up to speed because we're

(31:36):
dropping in on her life.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
You know and I think that's really important how you
tie that back to the point ofview.
Because, something like HarryPotter, it's advantageous to
have Ron be his best friend, whohas only known the wizarding
world, but Ron is able toexplain things to Harry, or
Hagrid's able to explain thingsto Harry when he experiences the
world.
If it's an area that needsexplanation and it doesn't seem

(31:58):
like it's telling us, becausewe're the characters learning as
we're learning right, we'reexactly what you said, like in
this situation.
Bryce and Danica were born here, so it would be silly for them
to explain something that theyunderstand, because they're not
telling it to the reader.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
They're telling the story right right, which also
sometimes when you havecharacters who are natives and
they've been born in the land,that does naturally lean itself
to a steeper learning curve,makes sense.
Because imagine, in thisopening chapter, if, like you
know, bryce mentioned the hornand Danica's like remind me what
is the horn, might bedistracting.
You know, that sounds unnatural, it sounds silly, like Abigail

(32:32):
said.
So part of it is like we as thereader, we have to just kind of
trust that we're going to findout what all this stuff means,
and I think that's appropriatefor this kind of adult fantasy.

Speaker 1 (32:43):
So sure, yeah, yeah, yeah, and I can tell that she
does a great job with this.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
So yeah, but I remember reading this for the
first time and thinking likethis is the ultimate example of
a steep learning curve.
So okay so let's, let's kind ofspeed through these last two
questions.
So six is about emotion.
How should we feel about what'shappening?
You kind of hinted at thisearlier.
We're concerned for Danica.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, exactly that's what I think I mean.
You're also to emphasize thatyou're concerned because Bryce
is concerned.

Speaker 2 (33:11):
Right you know.

Speaker 1 (33:12):
So I think that that actually raises the stakes,
because you can see where herconcern is, but not wanting to
say too much.

Speaker 2 (33:18):
Yeah, and so, speaking of stakes, that's the
next question, which I'll kindof answer.
Add my two cents to both.
So we care.
What's interesting is we careabout Danica and Bryce because
Philip Briggs is released.
So we know exactly why Danica'sstruggling with this.
And then also we see that Bryceis like I don't want my mom
coming to the city while PhilipBriggs is out.
We know she's pursuing thishorn which already could be

(33:41):
dangerous.
Danica sets that up a littlebit for us in chapter two and so
it's kind of like Philip Briggs, it throws a layer of caution
over both of their day to day.
But in terms of stakes, I'mcurious, abigail, what you
picked up on.
We kind of did talk about thislike why should we care about
next?
And like what did you infer thestakes were from this opening

(34:02):
chapter?

Speaker 1 (34:03):
Okay.
So you know to even kind ofstep back.
I know I've mentioned thisbefore.
If you've been following me fora while, you know I love James
Scott Bell and he always saysthe whiff of death.
So psychological, physical andprofessional three whiffs of
death, and this can kind of tieinto stakes related to content,
genre as well.
So physical stakes feel highhere.
With philip riggs, I thinkmainly because danica and bryce

(34:25):
talk about how philip riggs,despite being human um, has his
bombs and his plan before,before danica intercepted him,
was to bomb a club, I believe.
So it was going to be a highmortality rate if he had
succeeded.
So like right away, like youknow that there are the physical
stakes there, danica seems likeshe is very familiar on a day

(34:46):
to day basis of getting herhands dirty.
She just broke up a fightbetween one of them was
Nightcrawler, I forget the otherIn a Seder.
In a Seder.
Okay, so she had like blackjuice, like crusting on her
hands Right, so one of them hadspewed on her.
So she's used to this, she'sused to getting into the heat of
quarrels and action and danger.
Um, so you know that thosephysical stakes there are higher

(35:07):
for Bryce.
Her stakes feel very muchrelated to relationships and
right now, like she also has soshe has this risk of, if Danica
is in trouble, there's a stakefor her to lose her best friend
who seems like a constant in herlife.
At the same time, bryce'sstakes are dealing almost on a

(35:28):
professional scale because sheis looking for this horn and she
wants to.
She wants it to escalate hercareer and I'd say you know
psychological stakes, she'swanting to prove something to
herself.
So really you're hitting on allthree of those whiffs of death
you know in your face.
Whenever there's life or deathstakes on the, on the page,

(35:49):
that's always going to dominate,I feel like, because if we die
then it doesn't matter about theother stakes, because you're
dead.
So, I think that those are inyour face, but really there's a
lot of psychological internalstakes here going on and you
know, I'd call them worldviewstakes because they're dealing
with this push and pull betweenwanting to prove yourself and
wanting to rise into somethingmore that maybe the world has

(36:12):
told you that you're not, andfeeling that pressure and
feeling like you need to havesome.
You need to do something inorder to prove that.
So that's where I was kind oflanding, based on this chapter
about what I thought were mainstakes.

Speaker 2 (36:25):
And would it be fair for readers who don't like the
word psychological stakes, canwe call them emotional stakes?
Absolutely Same thing for me.
Yeah, and so I think you're spoton on all of that and I like to
look at this kind of from aworld building perspective, so
kind of what Abigail said.
There's a lot of personalstakes, whether they're
psychological, career orientedor whatever, and I like to think

(36:48):
about it as okay personal, yes,check.
And then there's also this likepublic slash, like more local
set of stakes which is withinthe districts.
There's these power divides andthis hierarchy that exists and
you know, humans are kind of thesecond class citizens.
And then there are globalstakes which are, you know,
bigger than that.

(37:08):
So we hear about this battlebetween humans and the veneer,
and Philip Briggs is kind ofinciting these uprisings of
humans everywhere.
So you know, there's a lot ofthings that we know about.
We don't necessarily feel thosebigger stakes in this opening
chapter because, like Abigailsaid, we're at this gallery and
we're learning about theirfriendship and things like that,

(37:29):
but the stakes are clear.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
I'm just going to read something quickly, because
absolutely everything thatyou're saying, Savannah, and to
build off of that, in particular, this paragraph stood out to me
that mentions stakes in youknow a not obvious way, but it's
there in your face.
She would always have burdensand expectations to shoulder
that Bryce would never have toendure and Bryce was thankful as
hell for that privilege.

(37:52):
When Bryce fucked up, Jessicausually gripped for a few
minutes and that was that.
When Danica fucked up, it wasblasted on news reports and
across the interweb.
Sabine made sure of it.
So you can see how they'reactually day-to-day antagonists,
if not beyond that, globalantagonists, that are working
against these characters that wecare about.
And I love what you said thereabout personal stakes and public

(38:12):
stakes, because I think thatthat's really important when
you're looking at a novel.
You need to have both.
You need to have personalstakes that become public stakes
.
You need to have public stakesthat impact personal stakes.
That's how you raise the stakesin a story, yeah.

Speaker 2 (38:24):
And you play with the balance of that over time, and
so I think it's really cool thatwe get a hint at all of this
stuff.
But we're grounding us in thisrelationship and there are
stakes felt because each ofthese girls care about each
other.
So okay, so that kind of youknow, I think if we said does
this first chapter do its job?
I think so.
I think the part that'sdifficult is just that steep

(38:45):
learning curve.
But I know a lot of readers whoread these kind of books are so
game for that.
So very fun.
I think we can go through thescene structure kind of fast.
Abigail and I'll just introducekind of what we're going to do.
So, if you're brand new tothese episodes, we like to look
at within this first chapter isthere a scene?
If so, how many scenes existand then what's the structure?

(39:05):
So we use the five commandmentsfrom Story Grid, which I will
link to a different podcastepisode about what each of those
elements are if you want to gomore in depth.
But we always like to startwith like, what is the
character's goal, and then thathelps us make decisions about
where do we see the scenestructure.
And Abigail spoiled thisearlier for us.
She said that we think thefirst scene actually spans

(39:28):
multiple chapters and we'll talkabout why in a second.
So if we're to just kind of dipinto Bryce's world in the very
beginning, we know that she'sdoing research and there's this
part I haven't highlightedbeginning.
We know that she's doingresearch and there's this part I
have it highlighted.
There's this part that whenDanica knocks on the door and
they're exchanging words andthen she says you'd know if you

(39:48):
ever picked up a book, danicaglad for the break in what had
been a morning of tediousresearch.
Bryce smiled as she rose fromthe desk.
So we get this sense that thisis already in progress.
She's researching something.
We don't know what it is untillater, but because we've talked
about this, we know she'sresearching where the horn is.
She wants to find the horn andthen Danica arrives, which is
really interesting because weget the sense that it's a common

(40:11):
thing for her to show up onThursdays.
So it's not really a surprise.
It's not really like.
Yes, it gets in the way of herdoing research technically, but
it's not really a surprise.
That, you know, interruptsBryce's day to the extreme.
What would you say about that,abigail?

Speaker 1 (40:27):
Yeah, I mean I think that that's where it was so
interesting to see how thisfirst chapter felt like it was
spending time to introducesister characters and the
setting, because she actuallyanticipates that Danica is going
to come on a Thursday, right.
She mentions how she actuallykeeps track of the week days of
the week by expectation of whenDanica arrives, right, because
Thursday she's patrolling closera block away from the store so

(40:51):
she's just kind of going through.
I think that we're again.
It kind of goes back to thestakes when you learn that she
just was assigned her to findthis horn.
That feels more immediate thanjust I'm selling antiques today.
Like she does have a specificresponsibility or appointment
that she is trying to discoverand she has been looking for for
weeks though.

(41:11):
So, or a week, so you can telllike this has been her day to
day for at least a week, right.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
Yeah, yep, and so I like to sometimes think of that.
If we don't like the word scenegoal, it's like what's her
objective?
Her objective is to findinformation, to find the
whereabouts of this horn.
So then Danica comes in, andthe reason I'm setting it up
this way is because we'relooking for an inciting incident
.
This is that first kind of blipof conflict, and we could say
that it's Danica arriving.
However, like we said, it'skind of expected.

(41:38):
So does it count?

Speaker 1 (41:39):
Does it not.
I didn't mean that way and Idon't think you mean that way
either.
So what were you thinking wasthe inciting incident?
And I just want to do a quick,quick point right here.
When we are selecting thecommandments, one thing that I
know I'm really looking for, andI believe you're looking for
too, is to keep the commandmentsas tightly bound as possible

(42:00):
around the same plot point, solike they're not just being
random commandments that feeldetached from one main thing.
That's building in the scene.
And that's important becausethe commandments are about scene
structure, and a lot more thanstructure needs to happen in
order for a scene to work Like.
We need all these details aboutthe world building.
We need all the setups thatmight not necessarily be based

(42:22):
in the structure but can existand happen because of the
context that is moving the sceneforward.
However, how the commandmentswork is how it's going to force
the character to make thatdecision.
That is going to create actionand agency.
So what around that is beingtightly bound together through
the commandments.
I hope that that is beingtightly bound together through
the commandments.
I hope that that explains yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
And so what we landed on basically for the inciting
incident is that this is whenDanica says you know, briggs is
getting released or he's havinga hearing to get released, or
whatever it is.
So it's not just a typicalThursday, right?
We kind of get the sense ofthat is because Danica wants to
shower and Bryce is thinkinglike why is she going to shower?
And she's realizing, oh, shemust be going in front of the

(43:05):
council.
Why is she going in front ofthe council?
Well, because Philip Briggs isgetting released or getting a
hearing to be released.
So I think that's what welanded on.
And then it's kind of like wellthen what happens?
How do we build up to this peakmoment of conflict?
And what we realized is wedon't think that exists in
chapter one, so we think thescene continues into chapter two
.
You want to talk about that,abigail Yep.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
Yeah.
So when I'm looking for scenestructure, I'm always asking
myself when is that maincharacter making that crisis
decision?
And if they don't make adecision, like?
Danica had some opportunitiesfor some decisions in the first
scene, so you could argue itthat way, but realistically it
didn't feel like Bryce couldreally act on it.
Even when Philip Briggs whenDanica mentions Philip Briggs is

(43:46):
being released, it's shockingto her, but she can't do
anything about that, Right?

Speaker 2 (43:50):
What we landed on was when and Abigail's going to
pull the passage, but we landedon this moment when Danica's,
like you know, the hornsearching for the horn's really
dangerous.
I think that you should justkind of placate Jessaba, say
you're doing your best and theneventually she'll move on and
she'll get some new shiny objectthat she wants you to go find.
So we think, you know, giventhat Bryce's goal is to find

(44:12):
this horn, given that we knowit's important to what she feels
is her worth and her careergrowth and things like that, we
felt like that was a significantturning point because her
friends brought her this idea ofdanger.
Philip Briggs is out, she'sreiterating that to find the
horn people would have to bedangerous and capable of harm
and things like that.
And so then do you have thepassage, abigail?

Speaker 1 (44:33):
Yep, I have it.
And this is interesting too,because actually, danica, it
seems like she's picking up onsomething dangerous for bryce if
she gets too tied into thishorn.
So it says the temple, brycesaid with a sigh honestly, I've
been looking into this thing fordays on end and can't figure
out anything.
No suspects, no murmurings atthe meat market about it for
being sale, no motive for who'deven bother with it.
It's famous enough thatwhoever's got it has it wrapped

(44:56):
up tight.
She frowned the clear sky.
I almost wonder if the poweroutage was tied to it, if
someone shut down the city'sgrid to steal it in the chaos.
There are about 20 people inthe city capable of being that
crafty, and half of them possessthe resources to pull it off.
And then here it is, danica'stail twitched.
If they're able to do somethinglike that, I suggest staying
away.
Lead Jesper around, round up it, make her think you're looking
for it and then let it drop.

(45:17):
Either the horn will show up bythen or she'll move on to her
next stupid quest.
And here's where Bryce is goingto just go into the crisis.
So Bryce now has to decide do Ilisten, do I take this advice
or not.
And then Bryce admits I justit'd be good to find the horn
for my own career, whatever thehell that would be.
A year of working at thegallery hadn't sparked anything
beyond disgust at the obsceneamounts of money that rich

(45:39):
people squandered on old assshit.
Danica's eyes flickered.
Yeah, I know.
Bryce zipped a tiny goldenpendant, a knot of three
entwined circles along thedelicate chain around her neck.
So you see how she kind of hercrisis is.
She's not ready to take thatadvice.
But also it seems like thereare stakes being tied with that
because Danica's sensing withthat tail twitch and then the
advice that she gives that maybegetting tied up in this horn

(46:01):
isn't a good idea.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
Well, and that's so interesting because that's what
we're supposed to believe on thesurface, right.
So what you don't know is thatDanica has found the horn.
She has transmuted it somehowinto powder, into ink.
That is in Bryce's tattoo.
Oh, my.
Oh my, that too is the horn.

Speaker 1 (46:20):
And Bryce now holds the power.

Speaker 2 (46:22):
So Danica knows this and she's kind of like, yes, it
is dangerous if Bryce continuesto look for it, but it's also
kind of pointless.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
Wait a second here.
No, I don't want to go into thebigger plot.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
There's a bigger reason why it's important, and
this whole thing with Danica too, and things like that.
But okay, okay, but yeah.
So it's kind of exactly whatyou said.
We agree on this.
The crisis is do I adhere tothe friend's warning?
Do I heed it and stop lookingKind of given especially to that
Briggs is loose, or do Icontinue to search for the horn,

(46:52):
given its importance to my bossand my career?
And what's really interestingis that, because writers I talk
to are always looking forexamples of well, I don't want
my character to sit there and belike, should I do this or
should I do that?
on the page and this is a greatexample of when she's not doing
it.
But we infer the stakes becausethey've been set up.
So, like Abigail said, theclimax here is that she's not

(47:16):
ready to take this advice.
So the resolution is they go tothe heart gate and they do the
little gift to the gate and thenthey go on their merry way.
So what is interesting and youknow, because if I'm a writer I
might be thinking well, what isall that stuff before Danica
reveals what's happening withBriggs and that's like we've

(47:36):
been talking about.
It's set up, it's grounding usin their relationship, it's kind
of offsetting the steeplearning curve we have in the
world.
So if you're writing a scenelike that, consider it all set
up right, all investment ingetting us ready for the
conflict that's coming, and thenremember that you can
absolutely split your scenes byusing chapter breaks.

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Do you have any quick advice when you're creating
setup like that?
If it does need to be moredetailed, making sure that it
doesn't drag.

Speaker 2 (48:06):
Yeah, so I think it's just what the author has done
is on the surface, there's aninteresting scene, right, like
we're interested in what'shappening between these two
girls, just based on who theyare, right, they're interesting
to observe, and then we get thislayer of conflict and danger
that we're feeling.
So it makes it more interesting.
If it's not relevant to what'shappening within either of those

(48:27):
buckets, like the setup oftheir friendship, the setup of
the conflict, we don't need togo deeper into it.
So we don't need to know moreabout the Umbra Mortis than what
we learn.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
We don't need to know more about Micah than the
things we learn, because it'snot relevant to right now I'd
add on to that also it's allhappening within an action, so
it's not like we're just sittinghere and being told about it.
Danica is like going into thelocker to drop off the sword and
change her clothes and shower,so it is interesting like all
that's happening within them,actually doing things as well,

(48:58):
right.

Speaker 2 (48:58):
Yeah, and I think what's cool too is you can kind
of flip this around and infersome.
You can infer the samestructure from Danica's point of
view.
So it's like you know, what isshe going to do now that Briggs
is released and there's ahearing and yada yada.
So I think that's always a goodthing to think about is what

(49:21):
are the other characters doingand what is their scene crisis
moment, even if it doesn'ttotally line up with your
protagonist.
But so if we're looking at thatcrisis of like, do I pursue
looking for the horn or not?
That's what gives this scene ameaningful arc of change.
If she does, she's going to getpotentially pulled into this
danger.
You know, we talked about thestakes earlier.
So that's why we landed on onescene over two chapters, versus
highlighting a crisis, like Icould see writers saying.
Well, in the first chapter shehas to decide is she going to

(49:42):
let Danica take a shower or not?
Is she going to let Danicastore her sword here or not?

Speaker 1 (49:47):
I'm not sure those stakes are really tied to that
yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:49):
And so it's just kind of who cares right?
Like yeah, she would get introuble with Jessaba, but is she
really going to get in trouble?
Probably not.
There's also a part wherethey're at the heart gate and
it's like you know, bryce putsher hand on the thing and she's
what are you going to wish for?
Like yeah, that's a decision,but we don't really care.
No, and it's not really tied toanything bigger.
So that's kind of why we landedwhere we landed.

(50:11):
And any final thoughts on thatAbigail.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
I'd just like to say some of these things and I know
we've kind of gone into this indetail.
I just like to say some of thesethings and I know, we've kind

(50:35):
of gone into this in detail sowe don't need to say too much on
this.
But when you are choosing whatyou spend more attention to,
more description, more dialogueabout more, you know, just
attend, like basically, thecharacter cares about it.
That is actually with Hunt,who's going to come in, even
though he's only mentioned, youknow, in a couple of sentences,
that's more than just a name,right.
So it's like I think thatthat's just something to keep as
a rule of thumb.
When you spend more descriptionand detail on something that's
usually the author tipping itoff of hey, this is going to be

(50:56):
something to pay attention to.
Pay attention, right, here,we're going to need to pay
attention to this.
So you get it when you, when itcomes in later, versus like
just one naming it or, you know,brushing over something without
even a name.
So that's just.
I think that this is a reallygood example of the author
planting clues in a meaningfulway that hits us and not also

(51:16):
like so obvious of a light thatit's annoying.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
Yeah, and I think the other thing that's probably
important to talk about is thatthis is not happening on the
first draft, so I can't imaginethat Sarah J Maas sat down and
wrote this exact scene.
She probably had to get to theend of her draft to figure out,
like what matters, what am Igoing to plant, what can I get
away with planting versus whatdo I need to hold back?
For chapter two.

Speaker 1 (51:39):
You know things like that?
Yeah, definitely yeah.
And that can be veryoverwhelming, especially with
fantasy writers feeling likethey have to include every
single detail on the first draft.
That is, it's impossible, right, because you don't know what
matters the most in the storyuntil you get to the end usually
.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
And I think it's also important to think about your
ideal reader and your thelearning curve you're putting on
them too, because, like we saidearlier, if you're writing
something like crescent city andyou have a character who's a
native, you're not going to givethem a shallow learning curve.
It just doesn't make sense ifyou have something like harry
potter, where your character isnot a native and they have to

(52:16):
learn about the entire world.
You're probably not going tostart us off with the steep
learning curve, because thatwouldn't make sense.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
Right.
Well, these opening chaptersfor this book definitely grabbed
my attention.
I'd be interested in reading itmore, you know, and I know that
I need to.

Speaker 2 (52:31):
Yeah, we're going to hold you to that.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Yeah, but I'm glad that you brought this one to my
table to read and then it wasfun to analyze and definitely
one I would say again, you knowit might.
It's okay when things take acouple, you know, two, three,
even four reads.
The more times you read a story, the better you're going to
understand what makes it tickRight Really.
So that's part of why we lovedoing these first chapter deep

(52:55):
dives and I hope that you gotout of it as much as I got out
of it, because I definitelylearned a lot yeah, and I think
it's really cool to just thinkabout coming at it from a
first-time reader, you know,because that is what if we're
we're all writers, right.

Speaker 2 (53:07):
So that's what people are going to come to our books
like, and we want them to havethat, on the surface, interest
and then, of course, you canweave in all the other stuff
that comes with it.
So I like doing these where oneof us doesn't know the rest of
the story, because it's so funto see you know, because as a
second time, third time, fourthtime reader, I can't see it the
way you see it anymore, yeah,and so it's cool to know that it

(53:29):
still works from bothperspectives the new reader and
the reader who knows what allthese little Easter eggs mean.

Speaker 1 (53:35):
And you'll see, you notice like I stumbled a couple
of times when I talk about itbecause I'm figuring it out, and
that's okay, because that's metrying to grasp what stands out
to me.
That's the whole point of it.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
Yeah.
So anyway, we hope you enjoyedthis episode and let us know on
social media or respond to ouremails what you thought of the
learning curve.
We're so curious if everyoneelse experienced it as a steep
learning curve or not, so you'llhave to let us know.
Experienced it as a steeplearning curve or not?
So you'll have to let us know.

(54:06):
So that's it for today'sepisode.
As always, thank you so muchfor tuning in and for showing
your support.
If you want to check out any ofthe links I mentioned in this
episode, you can find them inthe show notes listed in the
description of each episodeinside your podcast player or at
savannahgilbocom forward slashpodcast.
If you're an Apple user, I'dreally appreciate it if you took
a few seconds to leave a ratingand a review.

(54:26):
Your ratings and reviews tellApple that this is a podcast
that's worth listening to, and,in turn, your reviews will help
this podcast get in front ofmore fiction writers just like
you.
And while you're there, goahead and hit that follow button
, because there's going to beanother brand new episode next
week, full of actionable tips,tools and strategies to help you
become a better writer.
So I'll see you next week anduntil then, happy writing.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}#181. First Chapter Analysis: House Of Earth And Blood by Sarah J. Maas

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#181. First Chapter Analysis: House Of Earth And Blood by Sarah J. Maas

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