February 28, 2024 • 46 mins
On this episode, I am joined by Kali Desautels. We discuss her book, How Not To Blog: Finding Myself, One Post at a Time and she gives us a preview of her newest book that takes us back to the 1960s.
We talk about how complicated it can be to be a public figure online while living comfortably as an introvert in an extroverted world. We talk about how no one should send an unsolicited dick picture in 2024 and how it is never the correct response when replying to something regarding family content.
She shares about her experience with anxiety, depression, and chronic illness. We discuss how challenging it can be to be a woman needing answers from the health care system to actually get them.
KaliDesautelsSpeaks – #kalidesautelsspeaks (kalidesautelsreadsblog.com)
How Not to Blog: Finding Myself, One Post at A Time: Desautels, Kali Jensina: 9798642548448: Amazon.com: Books
Kali Desautels (@kalidesautelsspeaks) • Instagram photos and videos
🍁 British Columbia Mom (@bcmomdotca) • Instagram photos and videos
Ashley (@filledupcup_) • Instagram photos and videos
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to the Filled Up Cuppodcast.
We are a different kind ofself-care resource.
One that has nothing to do withbubble baths and face masks, and
everything to do withrediscovering yourself.
We bring you real reviews,honest experiences, and
unfiltered opinions that willmake you laugh, cry, and most
(00:21):
importantly, leave you with afilled up cup.
Ashley (00:31):
I am so excited.
Today I have Kali Desautels,joining me.
Kali is the author and bloggerof How Not to Blog, finding
myself one post at a time.
Thank you so much for joiningme.
Kali (00:44):
Thank you.
I'm so excited to chat with you.
Ashley (00:48):
Can you tell me what made you decide to want to start
a blog?
Kali (00:52):
Well, it started because my kids were growing up pretty
fast and I felt like I wanted,I'm not very good at the whole
baby book thing.
So I wanted to have some kind ofrecord of them growing up is
where that started from and Iwas kind of bored as a stay at
home mom.
Not that being a stay at homemom is boring by any stretch of
(01:15):
the imagination, but it waslacking this creative level of
Myself.
And so I was like, what if Ijust create a blog talking about
the funny things that my kids dothroughout the day.
And from there, it kind of went.
Okay.
I love to read, so the originaliteration of the
(01:35):
blog was Kali Desautels
Reads.
And so I would talk about mykids, and I would talk about
book recommendations.
It gave me a kind of creativeoutlet, and it also encouraged
me to continue reading when Iwas too tired, or I was
overwhelmed with little kids.
It just was an outlet for me.
Ashley (01:57):
Which I think is so important to have, because I
think that whether you're a stayat home mom or a working mom,
there are moments where just howthey describe parenthood and
like pregnancy to people thatdon't have kids.
It's like this idea that it'slike you're just gonna be a mom
and it just fills you up and itdoes to some Degree, but it's
like you still are this wholeother person.
(02:18):
It's okay to be bored or notfulfilled every moment and
really trying to find like Asidefrom this role as a mom no
matter how much you love it.
I think it is really Cool thatyou could recognize that within
yourself and were like I'm goingto figure out who I am fully as
a person and it is kind of niceto have that goal of Like I'm
(02:38):
going to read this book or I'mgoing to focus on something else
because it's so easy at the endof the day To be like I'm just
gonna throw on sweats and watchTV and just like I don't know
rot on the couch
Kali (02:49):
Yeah, that's so true.
And that's the thing is it'slike when the kids would go down
sometimes I would see things onthe news or I would find things
that I Felt like I had somethingthat I wanted to say about it So
that's how it kind of went frombeing Kali Desautels reads and
Kali Desautels speaks because Iincorporated more like My
(03:11):
thoughts on current events andpolitical issues and feminist
issues and things like that andmy health and my mental health
became a big part of what Iwould discuss on the blog.
So it kind of just grew as Ifelt more comfortable with what
I was sharing it was just such anice outlet for me.
(03:31):
I felt like there would be timeswhen people would reach out to
me after I'd written something,for example, regarding my health
or my mental health and theywould reach out to me and say,
same, I felt the same way, but Ididn't know how to say it and I
didn't know that there wereother people feeling that and it
was really nice and reassuringto know that my voice was
mattering.
Ashley (03:53):
Well, especially too, the social media landscape or
just the internet in generalgets such a bad rep and
Rightfully so in a lot of thosecases, but it's like as much as
it can divide us or be ourhighlight reel.
There can be that really greatside of building those
connections and making otherpeople feel like they aren't
alone.
I always think it's so bravewhen people are willing to share
(04:18):
their highs and their lows andsaying like, yeah, I have
anxiety and depression orHashimoto's, or I love my
husband today, or oh, myhusband's so annoying, or all of
these things.
It's so nice to share thatauthenticity and that authentic
side of yourself.
And for anybody who's notfollowing Kali on Instagram, I
highly recommend it.
(04:39):
You've created this community ofover 10, 000 people that.
So I think that's such a hugeaccomplishment.
Kali (04:47):
Thank you.
I'm really proud of that.
It's taken years to get tothere, but I feel like it's a
good community and I feel likeit's really nice to be able to
be engaged with people from allover the place because there's
people who follow from theMiddle East, there are people
who follow from London, thereare people who follow from
Canada, and it's justinteresting to see that the
(05:11):
perspective that I'm sharing, orthat I am lucky enough to have,
a community that are, is willingto share with me, is all over
the world, like, it's not justyour next door neighbour is
suffering from the same things,or going through the same
things, or, it's somebody allthe way across the country could
be feeling the same way.
Ashley (05:33):
Which I love, too, because it's like we're sold so
often of how we're different, orhow there's like a divide
between us, but it is reallybeautiful to see, like, yeah,
there could be somebody inLondon that is having the same
struggles, and it really is thisoneness and we really are more
alike than we are different soit's always kind of great to be
(05:53):
able to have that reminder orthat I'm feel justified in what
i'm sharing or I feel like Iknow sometimes i'll share
something and i'll be like Oh,that was so cringy or you like
overthink it or you're scared toput it out there and it's kind
of nice When you see people,That follow you that not
necessarily are like praisingyou all the time for sharing it,
but just don't make you feelstupid or bad for it.
Kali (06:16):
Yes, exactly.
it's not so much an externalvalidation, like looking for
praise, which I feel like a lotof people think that when you
share publicly on social mediaor on a blog or even in a book,
they think that you're lookingfor extreme validation, but I
don't think it's that so much asit's a feeling of connectedness.
(06:39):
Yeah, I agree.
I think that that's the partthat people forget when they are
saying, oh, you're such anexhibitionist, you need everyone
to validate you, and it's like,I don't need their validation, I
just need to feel connected toother people that are outside
myself.
Ashley (06:54):
Did you find as somebody who is more of an introvert that
there was any times where it washarder to share or have you
found that it just seem like asafe space to leave that
information?
Kali (07:07):
I feel like as an introvert, the internet was
invented for people like usbecause there are lots of
Instagram people that you canfollow who are really outgoing
and they seem to just love.
To be like smiling and laughingand having a great time and
going out and being out andabout that they're not
necessarily as outgoing as theyseem, and I know for myself
(07:30):
there's this sort of likesecurity blanket of being behind
a keyboard.
That when you're posting on ablog, you are just putting your
thoughts out there, but there'snobody staring you in the face
going, I can't believe you thinkthis.
There are times when you getfeedback that is very much, I
can't believe you think this, orI can't believe you would say
such a thing.
(07:50):
But then there are other peoplewho, like for example, I wrote
an article for a website calledThe Mighty Ones.
It was about how the media wasportraying Kanye West's
basically his spiral into severebipolar and how, as a person who
suffers from bipolar disorder itcould be very triggering for all
(08:12):
of the Stuff that everyone wasposting and about how funny it
was that he was doing thesethings and it was like it's not
funny you're watching a personliterally have a mental
breakdown I remember writingthis article for the mighty and
it got published on MSN on theiryahoo website and I got an email
(08:32):
from a father whose son wasdiagnosed with bipolar and he
said that until he'd read myarticle he didn't realize what
his son was going through and itreally touched me that he felt
the need to reach out and saythank you for helping me see
what my son is going through andthat's just through writing so I
(08:52):
feel like by being introvertedYou feel more secure behind the
keyboard,
Ashley (08:59):
which makes a lot of sense.
And I really love that theconversations about mental
health are happening so muchmore.
I feel like we're of a similarage, like I'm turning 39 this
year.
Yeah,
Kali (09:13):
and I just turned 41 two weeks ago.
Ashley (09:15):
Well, happy belated birthday.
Thank you, babe.
But I find when we were younger,they never would talk about
mental health.
And if they did, it was alwaysin a negative way.
That I feel like we just don'tunderstand if people are talking
about You know, they'll be like,Oh, I'm so moody.
I'm bipolar.
Or, Oh, I love to clean.
I'm OCD.
And it's like, that's not thesame thing.
(09:36):
And we shouldn't be so flippantthese terms.
So I love the fact that you wereable to share your opinion and
it actually helped changepeople's perspective.
Kali (09:45):
Thank you.
And that's the thing, like,that's one of the things that
drives me crazy.
Like exactly what you said iswhen people are like, Oh, I'm so
bipolar, or I'm so OCD.
And it's like, those are actualmedical conditions that
interferes with your life ifit's not treated.
So it's not something that youjust make a flip comment about
and then carry on with your lifebecause it really kind of
(10:09):
negates the experience of peoplegoing through those.
Mental health issues, and I feellike it's much more important to
recognize that no, this is anactual problem.
This is not obsessive Christmasdisorder.
This is like an actual thingthat somebody is struggling
with.
Ashley (10:28):
And the Kanye West thing is really important too, where I
think in some ways Trump, weneed to acknowledge, are we
laughing at them, or are welaughing with them?
Because it's like when we seepeople that are mentally ill,
and that are in a spiral, andhaving, you know, breakdowns,
That shouldn't be comedy to us,like we should have empathy and
compassion no matter what youthink of the actual person or
(10:51):
the idea because again, we don'tknow either of them that we're
making assumptions based offthis essentially cartoon of
their lives that we have accessto I think we need to lean into
like, if you have a thought,One, does it need to come out of
your mouth?
And two, it's like, are weleading with love and
compassion?
Or are we leading with, youknow, the bravery sometimes of
(11:11):
being behind the keyboard?
You'll get those haters thatwill leave just awful comments
that they would never ever sayto your face.
But somehow feel comfortablewhen they're like a faceless
figure that you're never goingto see.
Kali (11:26):
Oh, absolutely.
I get nasty comments even onsome of the stuff that I post
and my stuff is fairly benigneven when it's a political or a
feminist discussion.
I've had people send me messagessaying, go back into the kitchen
and make me a sandwich, bitch.
And it's like, okay, but I'm notgoing to stop talking just
(11:46):
because you disagree with what Isay and so like you said there's
that sort of freedom from beingbehind the keyboard that
sometimes people they forget tobe kind and It's sort of the
double edged sword of being anintrovert, because being
introvert, you don't want tohave confrontation, like,
whatsoever.
And so, you're feeling nonconfrontational, you feel like,
(12:09):
oh, I've just posted this littlecute update about my eldest
child, and then it's like, goback and make me a sandwich, and
it's like, you kind of sit theregoing, okay, should I, Hang back
on what I'm saying.
Am I offending people with mythoughts?
But at the same time, you can'tjust let somebody who's being
(12:29):
mean, take over.
There's this Brene Brown quotethat I love and it's always
assumed positive intent, and soeven when people are mean, my
goal is to assume, okay, theymight be having a bad day,
something else upset them but Ijust have to try and stay
positive for myself, if thatmakes any sense.
Ashley (12:51):
It totally does and it's good that they don't like live
rent free in your hat.
I think sometimes when you getsay 50 positive or normal
comments.
Sometimes it is that really meanone where it's like, hey, did I
do something wrong?
Or, should I go back to thekitchen?
Where it's nice to be like, it'salmost like a Southern term and
(13:12):
it's like, bless your heart.
Yep.
And to me that kind of soundslike go fuck yourself in the
most nicest possible way.
But I kind of feel like itshould be a, Oh, I should go
back into the kitchen.
Bless your heart kind of thing.
So it's good that it doesn'thaunt you or that it doesn't
stress you out or overly upsetyou.
Kali (13:34):
It's taken a long time to get to this point.
Like when I first startedblogging and I first started
getting a little bit ofattention, I remember I would
get dick pics and I'm like, thisis a blog about children and
books like Good grief.
Like, do you have nothing elsebetter to do?
And it would just stress me out.
I would think maybe I'm puttingmy children, like, I never post
(13:58):
my children's names or wherethey live or anything like that.
But I would wonder, like, am Iputting them in harm's way by,
putting their picture on myblog?
And over time, it became clearthat It was a minority of crazy
people who take it uponthemselves to send dick pics to
a mom who talks about fiction.
Ashley (14:21):
For sure.
Also, like, in 2024, can we juststop sending unsolicited dick
pics just in general.
Kali (14:28):
I agree 100%.
Ashley (14:30):
It just makes me think about Louis CK.
Do you remember that from acouple years ago where he wasn't
sending unsolicited ones, but hewas asking his co workers like,
hey, do you mind if I just showyou?
But it's also, like, maybe wedon't talk about dicks
unsolicitedly to, people aroundus.
I'm sure they're great, I'm suresomebody wants to see it, but,
like, maybe, unless we say firstthat we would like to, or show,
(14:53):
something that is a clear signthat we would.
Maybe just don't.
Kali (14:58):
I agree 100 percent and that's the thing like I would
wonder like what did I post thatmade somebody think that this is
appropriate?
But then I over time learnedthat there are two folders and
there's one that's a junk folderand one that's how I can
communicate with you folder andI feel comfortable talking to
you.
(15:18):
I just stick to that folder.
Ignore the other folder.
Ashley (15:22):
Which is definitely good because I think sometimes it can
be too easy to focus on those.
And I also like that it's beingnormalized by certain
influencers now to actually likedo videos about them or to tag
them in comments, which I guessif those people really want
attention, they're gettingattention that way.
(15:43):
But then to also maybehighlight.
Hey, you know, Bob that works atMcDonald's in this city, this is
how he's talking to peopleonline and really make it so
that you have real lifeconsequences for some of those
things that you say that canpotentially affect other
people's mental health.
Or again, like that fear of ourkids.
As soon as you become a parent,you overanalyze.
(16:06):
Every single little thing youwant to bubble wrap your kids
and you just don't want theworld to ever affect them
negatively.
So it's like it can be so scaryand, it's unfortunate that
people have to wreck it and makeus question it.
Kali (16:22):
And that's exactly it, going back to why I originally
started the blog, it was like, Iwant to share some funny things
that my kids said today.
Well, I'm sharing some funnything that my kids said, and
then you send me an unsoliciteddick pic.
I'm then wondering, have I donesomething wrong?
After all the years that I'vebeen doing it now, I'm no longer
(16:44):
feeling like I've done somethingwrong.
I'm more like, okay, clearly youhave issues.
Ashley (16:49):
Yeah, it can be really, I guess like the ugly side of
the internet and I just almostwish that And all of the social,
like, I'm not trying to harp onInstagram, but just using that
was like, well, it's likeInstagram needs to be better at
taking that kind of stuff down.
I probably have like five cornbots per day that are following
(17:10):
all my stories and liking it.
And it's like, thanks for theengagement, but leave me alone.
There needs to be, I think, justbetter restrictions in place in
general for them to police.
Like, if you report something,they're like, oops, we didn't
have a person to actually lookat this, so we're not going to
do anything.
It's like, why do you have areport button?
Kali (17:29):
Oh, I know.
And then, the reply is like, ifyou want to dispute this, please
click this button.
And I'm like, okay, but Iclicked the last button and you
didn't do anything.
So what makes me think thatclicking this button is going to
help?
Ashley (17:42):
And I find, if you report stuff, it tanks my
engagement, or it negativelyaffects my account.
So it's like, some other personwas potentially harassing me or
bugging me or I was trying tolike make the internet a safe
space and reporting somethingwas a safety issue.
You're telling me you don't havetime to deal with it and now I'm
being punished for essentiallytrying to be a tattletale.
(18:03):
It just seems like the wrongside of it is being policed.
Kali (18:07):
It's absolutely true because I know that when I've,
reported things, my engagementwill just suddenly go from like,
You've interacted with 2, 700accounts this And then next
thing I know it'll be like,you've interacted with 300
accounts this week and it'slike, how did that happen?
Ashley (18:24):
No, it's ridiculous.
Have you found that when youfirst started making blogs
social media was such adifferent landscape in the sense
that you could post a pictureand a link to the blog, and now
everything having to post reelsor TikToks and having it to be
more like video friendly.
Have you found that that's beena challenge for you on your
(18:46):
site?
Kali (18:46):
It is a huge challenge because again with the
introversion and I feel safetyping behind a keyboard putting
myself out on like a live streamor whatever or recording a video
of me like dancing around is notsomething that I'm comfortable
with so I find it A realchallenge to, keep up with what
(19:09):
the content creation demand isnow.
I've attended some seminars on,how to make reels.
And I make reels to the best ofmy ability, but they're really
not very strong.
And compared to what I write, Ifeel like I'm a much better
writer than I am a reelproducer.
So I do struggle with that quitea bit.
(19:31):
Whereas Before it was like,these are my thoughts and this
is.
A link to a source that I found.
Well, you can't really link areel to, a news article.
Ashley (19:42):
It's super, super frustrating.
And I wish that TikTok got to beTikTok and that Instagram stayed
pictures.
Like, I still really appreciatelooking at people's pictures.
And I don't necessarily want tobe sucked into watching reel
after reel.
And I know that that's thepoint.
But I find that it's so mucheasier even to engage with 25
(20:04):
pictures or like comment onpeople's stuff that I like,
where I find that as soon as thevideo starts playing, I'm like,
where did that hour and a halfgo?
And it absorbs you in.
And I also think that so many ofus, when we started, it was like
coming up with that image, likespending time thinking about the
caption.
And I think with video format,it has become so like, and I
(20:26):
have to post it and it has tobe, At this time and I have to
make sure it's this many secondsand I need these hashtags and it
becomes this like have toinstead of get to if you want
to, you know, focus on it fromthe business side and it's so
much more, pressure than it hasbeen in the past and like you
(20:47):
had talked about if you'resomebody who, again, If you're
writing in a way that excelsthrough words and not
necessarily through the screen,it can be really hard to be
authentic but also show up foryour audience in the way that
you feel like you have to.
Or sometimes with captions, Ifeel like or just writing in
general, it's like you can beauthentic in a way that being
(21:10):
like a bubbly person in front ofthe camera doesn't always match
up or if you do have it so thatyou get to the point where I've
made this great reel.
I've probably done it 30 timesjust to make it so that I can
post this story or this reel orwhatever.
But then it's also when peoplesee you in public and you're
like, I'm shy and awkward.
They're like, but where's thatperson that you posted in the
(21:31):
reel?
I don't know if you know TaraJensen, she posts behind British
Columbia Mom.
Yep.
She talks about that huge, whereshe had to host an event, I
think it was like at Costco orsomething, and have people come
up to her and she struggles withmaking eye contact and she
really struggles with likehugging people.
So it's like a lot of timespeople will get the wrong idea
of her because it doesn't matchthe online personality, but it's
(21:54):
like, it's so much harder toshow that part of yourself on a
video in 10 seconds in the sameway, if that's like a long
rambly way of saying it.
But if that makes sense.
Kali (22:07):
Oh, it makes perfect sense.
That's exactly how I feel whereI am a shy person.
I will open up and I'm great onconversations with one on one.
But I've had it where I've beenlike, you know, out in the wild
and somebody will recognize mefrom my blog or from my
Instagram and they'll be like,Oh my gosh, it's so nice to meet
you.
How are your kids blah, blah,blah.
(22:28):
And I'm just like, Oh my God,I'm at the pharmacy.
I don't know.
Ashley (22:32):
It can be so hard because it's like they have this
familiarity with us and theyspend every day with us or, or
however long that it's like,they do feel like they're
visiting an old friend and it'slike, are you stranger danger?
Like, I don't know you in thesame way.
Kali (22:46):
Exactly, and that's the thing, I really encourage, the
community to be involved, and Ilove the engagement, and I
appreciate the fact thatsomebody cares enough that they
want to know how my kids are inreal life, but again, it's like,
when you're off guard, it'sjust, this isn't the setting
that I'm used to sharing in, soI feel, like, literally caught
(23:09):
off guard.
Ashley (23:09):
And I imagine to some degree, it's like, If they come
up to you, it's like, do I knowyou from the internet?
Or I would go through the, like,did I go to high school with
you?
Did I share a job with you?
It's like almost wanting tomatch that familiarity, but not
being able to place them.
Kali (23:23):
Exactly, and it's like, thank you.
And when they're like, oh, I'm abig fan of your blog, and I feel
really humbled because I'm not acelebrity type of person.
So, I mean, I have 10, 000 plusfollowers, but that's such a
small drop in the bucket when itcomes to influencing and having
people in your community.
(23:44):
I'm not like Kim Kardashian, ifyou know what I mean, where it's
like I've got nine millionpeople following me and
everybody in the world knowswhat I look like.
So for me, it's just a, thankyou so much for following my
thoughts and that you're engagedwith them, but again, it's a lot
easier for me to do that inwriting than it is to do that in
(24:06):
person or even on a video.
Ashley (24:08):
I definitely think that more people will benefit of
knowing that.
It's like, I love when peopleare like, I've listened to where
I follow you or whatever,whether it is five people or 5
million, it's just a matter ofknowing that.
Sometimes the online personalityand the real life personality,
it matches, but maybe not in theway that you think.
So it's also like, we promisewe're not trying to be mean.
(24:29):
We're just awkward.
Kali (24:30):
Exactly.
That's the thing, 100%.
And the one thing that I talkabout is like my anxiety.
I have social anxiety and thenin a situation where you're
needing to make small talk andit's like, I just don't know how
to do this.
Ashley (24:44):
Yeah, I definitely have been there and it is so awkward
and it is something that again Iguess gets easier with time but
it can be so hard to be outsideof your comfort zone and I know
in some ways that was kind ofthe nice thing about COVID.
It's like media events stoppedhappening so that you could kind
of Be in your little bubble anddidn't have to do as much like
(25:06):
networking and stuff and I knowI Done a little bit but
definitely not to the amountthat I was doing pre pandemic
that it's hard to get back intobeing so public.
Kali (25:17):
It really is and it's like you don't want to come across
standoffish and you want to befriendly and you want to do the
networking but at the same timeit's like, but I'm cozy at home.
Ashley (25:28):
Yes and I love being at home.
I'm like the biggest homebodyever that I'm the person, I'm
like that meme it's like I wantto be invited but I don't
actually want to go.
Exactly.
When people cancel on me, I'mlike, And don't get me wrong,
like, for anybody who invites meto stuff or anybody that I'm
around, like, I love being outtoo, but it's like, I also
really love it when peoplecancel and I don't have to go.
Kali (25:51):
Oh, me too.
There was a book that I justfinished reading a couple months
ago called Sorry I'm Late But IDidn't Want to Come.
Ashley (25:57):
I love the title of that.
Kali (26:00):
I bought it because the title was so hilarious.
And so when you shared it inyour story the other day, I was
like, such a good book.
And it really is about anintrovert who's trying so hard
to, like, extrovert in life,because we are expected that
extroversion is better thanintroversion.
And it's like, you get rewardedfor being an extrovert.
(26:20):
But I just love the, like, sorryI'm late.
I just, I didn't want to come.
Right.
Ashley (26:27):
How did you go from writing your blog online to
deciding to publish it?
Kali (26:34):
So part of that was it was my COVID project.
I work from home.
I'm really grateful that I getto do that.
But when everybody was at homeall the time, plus working from
home, I kind of, again, got alittle bit bored, which is how I
seem to start most of myprojects.
And I decided that I have alwayswanted to publish a book.
(26:59):
I've always dreamed of having,my name written on the spine of
a book on a bookshelf somewhere.
And So I realized that I had allthese written stories and
written thoughts that I couldcompile it into a book.
I went through my blog slowlythere's a lot that was on the
blog that didn't make it intothe book because I didn't think
(27:21):
it was.
relevant or interesting enoughor the caption was too short or
just for various reasons, but Idecided that it would be fun for
me to just do this as anactivity to go through my blog
and see what I had.
And then I discovered that youcould do self publishing through
(27:43):
Amazon.
And I went, you know what?
I'm just going to do this.
I'm going to I'm going to putthese thoughts all together in
one anthology, and I'm going tomake my first book.
Ashley (27:57):
I love the fact that you were like, I'm just gonna do it.
I love the fact that it wasn'tlike, and I have to find a
publisher, I have to be invited,that it was just let's just put
it out there.
Kali (28:09):
Yeah.
I was just like let's just dothis.
Let's just see what it lookslike to have your name on the
spine of a book.
And so I did that and it's oneof my proudest accomplishments.
I'm not going to lie.
Ashley (28:22):
Which is awesome.
I feel like we all have thatbucket list or those things that
we want to accomplish.
And I think for whatever reason,a lot of the times we'll tell
ourselves that I shouldn't dothis because I'm this age or I
shouldn't do this becauseeverybody will think a certain
thing or, all of the lies andlike just nonsense that we are
so harsh and tell ourselves.
So I love the fact that you putit out there and you were like,
(28:44):
I'm going to do this.
I know that the book roughlygoes until mid April of 2020.
Have you wanted to do a volumetwo.
Kali (28:55):
I have wanted to do that.
It's, right now a pile of papersunder my desk.
I printed off a ton of the nextvolume like with the pictures
and so I can go through and cutthe bits that I don't think are
relevant because There's a lotof editing that went into making
sure that it was appropriate fora book, because some blog posts
(29:16):
are just like, it's my son'ssixth birthday.
Yay.
It's just not necessarilyperfect for the book, but right
now I've actually been workingon my first novel for the last
few years.
And so I just finished the firstdraft of that.
And so the volume two of my blogposts has been on hold waiting
(29:38):
for the novel to get finished.
Ashley (29:41):
That's really, really exciting.
Do you want to tell us a generalidea of what that book might be
about?
Kali (29:49):
Sure.
It's a fiction book based in thelate 60s, of a young woman who
decides that she wants to be ajournalist and she doesn't want
to fall in love, she doesn'twant to get married, she doesn't
want to be a stay at home momlike her mom who had, like, Five
kids.
She wants to have her own bylinein a popular newspaper.
(30:11):
And so she goes and she ends upgetting a job as a typist at one
of the newspapers in the city.
And she lives in a rooming housewith a bunch of other characters
that are these different girlswho do different things that are
very 1960s.
Like there's some who are therewanting to get married.
(30:32):
She ultimately ends up meetingthis man who is also in the
newspaper with her, and she hasto decide whether or not she can
do both, whether she can havethe man that she's kind of
falling in love with, and herbyline, or if the 1960s make
(30:54):
that too hard, and she has topick one or the other, and if
she has to pick one or theother, she'll always pick her
career.
Ashley (31:03):
I love that.
And I love that, even thoughit's based in the 60s, I feel
like that's a timeless dilemmathat women a lot of cases have
to choose.
Are we going to, you know, picktraditional gender roles or are
we going to pick this career?
And is it okay to say, like, Idon't necessarily want this or
can you have it all?
Kali (31:23):
Exactly.
And that's sort of how I feltwhen writing it was like, I
wanted to base it in the 60sbecause I was in love with the
name Peggy and there are veryfew People named Peggy nowadays.
So, she ended up living in the1960s because it felt like an
appropriate time for her name.
Ah, I love that.
(31:43):
I feel like this is somethingthat's relevant even to women
now.
I just spent the last few yearsworking on the first draft and
in my spare time and now it'stime to do the editing and see
where that goes.
Ashley (31:59):
Are you going to self publish again or have you
submitted to publishers at all?
Kali (32:04):
With my fiction one, I have submitted to some agents.
If someone is interested, then Iwould be thrilled over the moon
if somebody was interested init.
But if it comes down to it and Idon't get any, positive feedback
necessarily, I would definitelygo back to self publishing this
(32:25):
fiction as well.
Ashley (32:27):
we've talked about how you've had anxiety and
depression when did that firstkind of appear for you?
Kali (32:36):
My first major depressive episode actually happened when I
was in university.
I was living on my own for thefirst time.
I was in courses that I wasn'tnecessarily interested in.
But I felt like I had to takeand I just felt really
overwhelmed.
(32:57):
That ended up being the firsttime that I went into a deep
depression.
I've had different bouts ofdepression.
Postpartum, for example.
Anxiety, I've kind of alwaysbeen an anxious person.
But it wasn't diagnosed until Iwas an adult.
It kind of coincided withbecoming a parent.
Ashley (33:18):
Did you find that it was easy to get, support via your
doctor?
Or was it something that yousort of had to struggle with
alone for a long time?
I
Kali (33:29):
struggled with it alone for a really long time.
I find that women are quiteoften not believed when we just
get told oh you're having apanic attack or, oh, it's just
anxiety.
They don't actually do anythingto treat it.
So, I find that it becamesomething where I had to
(33:49):
struggle on my own before I gotanybody to listen to me.
Ashley (33:56):
Which is so insanely frustrating, and I swear, Since
I got my breast implants takenout, if one more doctor tells me
that the labs are normal whilethings are not normal, it's like
I just want to like punch themin the face and scream.
It is really hard with women'shealth, that we just, we aren't
taken seriously.
And there's a lot of, I guesslike a lack of funding or a lack
(34:16):
of research that they just havenot prioritized a lot of the
stuff when it comes to women'shealth that they're kind of in
the dark about it so much.
Kali (34:27):
It's true, and I find that like, for example with my
fibromyalgia diagnosis, Irecently had it changed to
ankylosing spondylitis.
And it went from being, oh, it'sall in your head, there's
nothing wrong with you, to, oh,there's actually arthritis in
your lower back that's beengetting worse over the last
(34:49):
eight years.
And we need to put you on thisthousand dollar a month
biologic.
Ashley (34:54):
When you got the different diagnosis, did you
want to call like every otherdoctor, everybody that had told
you it was in your head or thatit was fibromyalgia?
I'm probably saying that wrong.
To be like, see, I told you.
Kali (35:05):
I absolutely did.
And I also felt like all thepeople who were just like, Oh my
God, she's so dramatic.
Oh my God, it's no big deal.
It's totally fine.
I felt like finally being like,look, it's not just fine.
It's not no big deal.
There's actually somethingphysically wrong with me that
shows up in a cat scan or an MRIthat you just totally ignored me
(35:29):
and pretended that everythingwas fine for years because They
couldn't figure out what waswrong, so therefore nothing was
wrong.
Ashley (35:37):
That's another positive thing about social media and the
internet.
It's like, if you had sharedabout your story, and you had
shared about this wholeexperience, like, there's so
many people that would have beenlike, Oh, hey, I have the same
thing that totally resonateswith me.
Maybe I should ask about thisother condition.
Maybe it could be that.
Where I feel like the moreconnected we are with sharing
(35:59):
our stories that way.
It's like, that's.
How we've been able to learnabout different things like I
had never heard about breastimplant illness until I had seen
it on Instagram.
A lot of people hadn't heardmaybe about ADHD being as common
as it is or autism or all ofthese things that I think TikTok
and Instagram have been soinvaluable in that sense that so
(36:22):
many women have to share theirstories publicly to just hope
that somebody out there canrelate to what they're talking
about so that maybe we can getanswers.
Kali (36:31):
Absolutely.
And I think that that's one ofthe things like when I was
sharing about fibromyalgia isthat a lot of people truly
believe that fibromyalgia isn'treal.
That it's just, I'm depressedand therefore I have pain and
therefore it's just all in yourhead.
There's nothing real.
So I would post videos of likerashes that would develop on my
(36:53):
skin or suffering through amigraine because I just was
like, there's something wrong,and this is a physical
condition, like you can actuallysee the rash, so just listen to
me, and I was hoping that byposting these videos and these
photos of me having a meltdownespecially the photos I had
(37:15):
hoped that other women would seeit and go, yes, I develop a rash
across my chest like that too,maybe I have fibromyalgia, maybe
I should talk to my doctor maybeit's not just all in my head and
that I'm just crazy.
Ashley (37:30):
I think too many of us feel like that.
Too many of us feel like it'sjust me and in a lot of ways, we
gaslight ourselves.
Oh, I'm sure it's just becauseI'm a woman.
I'm sure it's just because I'mgetting older.
I'm sure it's just because I'mstressed or all of these things
that it's like, I don't know ifour medical industry just never
did this or if it's Because it'sso broken now that they're so
(37:51):
quick to either dismiss orthey're so quick to, I don't
know, heal the symptoms insteadof finding the root of why we're
having migraines, why we'rehaving pain.
It's just chalked up to, oh,it's a headache instead of like,
it could be a million other muchmore serious conditions.
Kali (38:08):
Exactly.
And that's the thing.
Like, I don't know if it, likeyou said, if it's because of the
way that the health system is.
is at the moment, like it's sooverwhelmed, but like, for me,
this has been going on.
I was diagnosed with Hashimoto'swhen I was 13 and when I was
originally.
presenting symptoms.
(38:30):
My doctor was like, oh, well,she's 13.
She's just lazy.
And my mom went, she went fromdoing dance every single day,
like she would dance around thehouse.
She took dance lessons.
She was active.
And all of a sudden, all she cando is sleep.
There's got to be somethingwrong.
And it wasn't until I was havingblood tests, it was months of
(38:54):
just tests and the doctor notreally believing that there was
anything wrong with me, otherthan that I was lazy and my mom
was a hypochondriac.
It wasn't until we saw anotherdoctor, because our doctor was
off, that she asked me one quickquestion.
She said, how are your periods?
And I explained to her how theywere really heavy, and they
(39:15):
would last a really long time,and they were extremely painful,
and it turned out that that wasexactly what I had.
Now I can live a full life, notConstantly in pain or suffering
from falling asleep all thetime, not saying like relapses
or recurrences, but overall you,it's just one pill and then
(39:37):
you're able to function.
Ashley (39:40):
It's so frustrating that There's not consistency in care,
like if you hadn't by fluke seenthat other doctor It's like you
said who knows how much longeryou would have had to suffer
before Your age becameappropriate that they would be
like, oh, maybe it's this that Ijust wish that every single
doctor to some degree likeobviously there'd be little
(40:03):
variance, but I wish for themost part that they were trained
to offer the same things or toconsider all possibilities I
Kali (40:11):
agree completely.
When my oldest child was two, Inoticed that they had symptoms
that were the same as mine forHashimoto's.
I spoke to the doctor andoriginally this was the same
doctor that had not believedthat I had Hashimoto's.
But because he was my doctorstill when I first had my child,
I changed doctors after thisbecause it drove me crazy.
(40:34):
He told me there's no way that atwo year old has Hashimoto's,
and I said, well, I think thatshe does.
I think that we need to havethem checked out just do the
blood test, and he refused toperform it.
It wasn't until I switcheddoctors, saw a pediatrician, and
the pediatrician finally tookpity on me and was like, fine,
(40:56):
we'll do the blood work, andthen I get a phone call from
Children's Hospital from theendocrine unit saying that my
child's Thyroid number was 16when it should be between 0.
7 and 2.
4 they finally said your childhas Hashimoto's and I was like,
it's taken three years forsomeone to believe me.
Ashley (41:19):
it just makes you want to scream.
It's just so frustrating.
So we're in Canada for anybodylistening in other countries.
You're lucky if you have afamily doctor like a GP on a
list to get a different doctor.
It can take like 10 plus years.
And then if you go to theemergency room, it's like a 10
(41:41):
to 12 hour wait if you want tosee a doctor there.
And then it's like a 50 50 onwhether they're going to take
you seriously or whether they'reso extremely busy that they're
just going to write you aprescription and send you on
your way.
Like it's really hard to find adoctor that will listen to you
and to take you seriously and tobe able to get help.
(42:02):
We don't have the option ofnecessarily paying to see
somebody else unless we want anaturopath or an alternative
doctor.
Which there's pros and cons ofthat,
Kali (42:11):
it's true.
Sometimes it would be nice tohave the two tiered system where
we have the free option forpeople who desperately need it
and like for the averageeveryday person, but if you
really need a second opinion,having the option to pay for a
second opinion would be a nicealternative, but it's just not
(42:32):
something that's feasible in oursystem.
Ashley (42:35):
No, or it's frustrating to think that you just have to
go to a different country.
Okay.
Basically, like I know so manypeople will fly to Mexico or get
care in the States or get careoverseas, depending on what
they're getting done, but it'sfrustrating that you feel like
you can't get help where you arelocally or that you just feel
helpless and like that.
It does feel very frustrating attimes that it takes so many
(42:56):
years and so many doctors oflike feeling like you have to
fight just to have somebodylisten to you.
Kali (43:04):
It's true.
It's very frustrating, and it'san ongoing problem.
Ashley (43:09):
Yes, it definitely is, and it's definitely getting
worse, and I don't know what thesolution is, and I think our
system is so broken, that Idon't even necessarily know that
it's like, A doctor or nursesissue or whether it's like a
systemic overall issue.
Kali (43:26):
Yeah, I agree.
It's challenging when you'resuffering from depression or
anxiety or chronic healthissues, and you just can't get
anyone to listen to you andthere's no option to go and say,
Well, my doctor isn't believingme, so I'm going to talk to this
other doctor, which makes methink that it's a systemic issue
(43:46):
rather than we're just short ondoctors.
Ashley (43:49):
I think it'll be interesting to like, my daughter
is going to be 17 this year.
Okay.
And I find with her generation,I don't know any of her friends
that want to be nurses ordoctors or people necessarily
like I just I, in that sense, Ikind of worry that we're not
(44:13):
going to be able to fill some ofthe roles that we necessarily
have in our society, just ingeneral, but I think the next 20
years or I guess like even 10will be interesting to see what
that looks like.
Kali (44:26):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
Ashley (44:29):
We may end up with just a bunch of like gamers and
Instagram bunch
Kali (44:36):
of Instagram influencers and and nobody in the doctor's
office, right?
Ashley (44:43):
I appreciate you having this conversation with me so
much.
Can you let everybody know ifthey're looking for you online,
where they can find you?
Kali (44:51):
Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you so much.
I've really enjoyed the last bitof time getting to chat with
you.
I'm on Instagram atKaliDesautelsspeaks.
I'm on Facebook also at KaliDesautels Speaks.
My Blog is still Kali DesautelsReads Blog dot com because it's
too challenging to change theurl
Ashley (45:15):
that's kind of cool to have the, historic name in a
sense to like be able to carryit forward, forward.
Kali (45:21):
It is, I I kind of still love it.
It would be nice for branding tohave everything match up, but.
At least for me, it's stillhistorical.
Ashley (45:32):
Thank you so much.
FO4D7F7612C2 - Filled Up (45:36):
Thank you so much for joining us today
for this episode of the filledup cup podcast.
Don't forget to hit subscribeand leave a review.
If you like what you hear, youcan also connect with us at
filledupcup.Com.
Thanks again for tuning in andwe'll catch you in the next
episode.
Welcome to the Filled Up Cuppodcast.
We are a different kind ofself-care resource.
One that has nothing to do withbubble baths and face masks, and
everything to do withrediscovering yourself.
We bring you real reviews,honest experiences, and
unfiltered opinions that willmake you laugh, cry, and most
(00:21):
importantly, leave you with afilled up cup.
Ashley (00:31):
I am so excited.
Today I have Kali Desautels,joining me.
Kali is the author and bloggerof How Not to Blog, finding
myself one post at a time.
Thank you so much for joiningme.
Kali (00:44):
Thank you.
I'm so excited to chat with you.
Ashley (00:48):
Can you tell me what made you decide to want to start
a blog?
Kali (00:52):
Well, it started because my kids were growing up pretty
fast and I felt like I wanted,I'm not very good at the whole
baby book thing.
So I wanted to have some kind ofrecord of them growing up is
where that started from and Iwas kind of bored as a stay at
home mom.
Not that being a stay at homemom is boring by any stretch of
(01:15):
the imagination, but it waslacking this creative level of
Myself.
And so I was like, what if Ijust create a blog talking about
the funny things that my kids dothroughout the day.
And from there, it kind of went.
Okay.
I love to read, so the originaliteration of the
(01:35):
blog was Kali Desautels
Reads.
And so I would talk about mykids, and I would talk about
book recommendations.
It gave me a kind of creativeoutlet, and it also encouraged
me to continue reading when Iwas too tired, or I was
overwhelmed with little kids.
It just was an outlet for me.
Ashley (01:57):
Which I think is so important to have, because I
think that whether you're a stayat home mom or a working mom,
there are moments where just howthey describe parenthood and
like pregnancy to people thatdon't have kids.
It's like this idea that it'slike you're just gonna be a mom
and it just fills you up and itdoes to some Degree, but it's
like you still are this wholeother person.
(02:18):
It's okay to be bored or notfulfilled every moment and
really trying to find like Asidefrom this role as a mom no
matter how much you love it.
I think it is really Cool thatyou could recognize that within
yourself and were like I'm goingto figure out who I am fully as
a person and it is kind of niceto have that goal of Like I'm
(02:38):
going to read this book or I'mgoing to focus on something else
because it's so easy at the endof the day To be like I'm just
gonna throw on sweats and watchTV and just like I don't know
rot on the couch
Kali (02:49):
Yeah, that's so true.
And that's the thing is it'slike when the kids would go down
sometimes I would see things onthe news or I would find things
that I Felt like I had somethingthat I wanted to say about it So
that's how it kind of went frombeing Kali Desautels reads and
Kali Desautels speaks because Iincorporated more like My
(03:11):
thoughts on current events andpolitical issues and feminist
issues and things like that andmy health and my mental health
became a big part of what Iwould discuss on the blog.
So it kind of just grew as Ifelt more comfortable with what
I was sharing it was just such anice outlet for me.
(03:31):
I felt like there would be timeswhen people would reach out to
me after I'd written something,for example, regarding my health
or my mental health and theywould reach out to me and say,
same, I felt the same way, but Ididn't know how to say it and I
didn't know that there wereother people feeling that and it
was really nice and reassuringto know that my voice was
mattering.
Ashley (03:53):
Well, especially too, the social media landscape or
just the internet in generalgets such a bad rep and
Rightfully so in a lot of thosecases, but it's like as much as
it can divide us or be ourhighlight reel.
There can be that really greatside of building those
connections and making otherpeople feel like they aren't
alone.
I always think it's so bravewhen people are willing to share
(04:18):
their highs and their lows andsaying like, yeah, I have
anxiety and depression orHashimoto's, or I love my
husband today, or oh, myhusband's so annoying, or all of
these things.
It's so nice to share thatauthenticity and that authentic
side of yourself.
And for anybody who's notfollowing Kali on Instagram, I
highly recommend it.
(04:39):
You've created this community ofover 10, 000 people that.
So I think that's such a hugeaccomplishment.
Kali (04:47):
Thank you.
I'm really proud of that.
It's taken years to get tothere, but I feel like it's a
good community and I feel likeit's really nice to be able to
be engaged with people from allover the place because there's
people who follow from theMiddle East, there are people
who follow from London, thereare people who follow from
Canada, and it's justinteresting to see that the
(05:11):
perspective that I'm sharing, orthat I am lucky enough to have,
a community that are, is willingto share with me, is all over
the world, like, it's not justyour next door neighbour is
suffering from the same things,or going through the same
things, or, it's somebody allthe way across the country could
be feeling the same way.
Ashley (05:33):
Which I love, too, because it's like we're sold so
often of how we're different, orhow there's like a divide
between us, but it is reallybeautiful to see, like, yeah,
there could be somebody inLondon that is having the same
struggles, and it really is thisoneness and we really are more
alike than we are different soit's always kind of great to be
(05:53):
able to have that reminder orthat I'm feel justified in what
i'm sharing or I feel like Iknow sometimes i'll share
something and i'll be like Oh,that was so cringy or you like
overthink it or you're scared toput it out there and it's kind
of nice When you see people,That follow you that not
necessarily are like praisingyou all the time for sharing it,
but just don't make you feelstupid or bad for it.
Kali (06:16):
Yes, exactly.
it's not so much an externalvalidation, like looking for
praise, which I feel like a lotof people think that when you
share publicly on social mediaor on a blog or even in a book,
they think that you're lookingfor extreme validation, but I
don't think it's that so much asit's a feeling of connectedness.
(06:39):
Yeah, I agree.
I think that that's the partthat people forget when they are
saying, oh, you're such anexhibitionist, you need everyone
to validate you, and it's like,I don't need their validation, I
just need to feel connected toother people that are outside
myself.
Ashley (06:54):
Did you find as somebody who is more of an introvert that
there was any times where it washarder to share or have you
found that it just seem like asafe space to leave that
information?
Kali (07:07):
I feel like as an introvert, the internet was
invented for people like usbecause there are lots of
Instagram people that you canfollow who are really outgoing
and they seem to just love.
To be like smiling and laughingand having a great time and
going out and being out andabout that they're not
necessarily as outgoing as theyseem, and I know for myself
(07:30):
there's this sort of likesecurity blanket of being behind
a keyboard.
That when you're posting on ablog, you are just putting your
thoughts out there, but there'snobody staring you in the face
going, I can't believe you thinkthis.
There are times when you getfeedback that is very much, I
can't believe you think this, orI can't believe you would say
such a thing.
(07:50):
But then there are other peoplewho, like for example, I wrote
an article for a website calledThe Mighty Ones.
It was about how the media wasportraying Kanye West's
basically his spiral into severebipolar and how, as a person who
suffers from bipolar disorder itcould be very triggering for all
(08:12):
of the Stuff that everyone wasposting and about how funny it
was that he was doing thesethings and it was like it's not
funny you're watching a personliterally have a mental
breakdown I remember writingthis article for the mighty and
it got published on MSN on theiryahoo website and I got an email
(08:32):
from a father whose son wasdiagnosed with bipolar and he
said that until he'd read myarticle he didn't realize what
his son was going through and itreally touched me that he felt
the need to reach out and saythank you for helping me see
what my son is going through andthat's just through writing so I
(08:52):
feel like by being introvertedYou feel more secure behind the
keyboard,
Ashley (08:59):
which makes a lot of sense.
And I really love that theconversations about mental
health are happening so muchmore.
I feel like we're of a similarage, like I'm turning 39 this
year.
Yeah,
Kali (09:13):
and I just turned 41 two weeks ago.
Ashley (09:15):
Well, happy belated birthday.
Thank you, babe.
But I find when we were younger,they never would talk about
mental health.
And if they did, it was alwaysin a negative way.
That I feel like we just don'tunderstand if people are talking
about You know, they'll be like,Oh, I'm so moody.
I'm bipolar.
Or, Oh, I love to clean.
I'm OCD.
And it's like, that's not thesame thing.
(09:36):
And we shouldn't be so flippantthese terms.
So I love the fact that you wereable to share your opinion and
it actually helped changepeople's perspective.
Kali (09:45):
Thank you.
And that's the thing, like,that's one of the things that
drives me crazy.
Like exactly what you said iswhen people are like, Oh, I'm so
bipolar, or I'm so OCD.
And it's like, those are actualmedical conditions that
interferes with your life ifit's not treated.
So it's not something that youjust make a flip comment about
and then carry on with your lifebecause it really kind of
(10:09):
negates the experience of peoplegoing through those.
Mental health issues, and I feellike it's much more important to
recognize that no, this is anactual problem.
This is not obsessive Christmasdisorder.
This is like an actual thingthat somebody is struggling
with.
Ashley (10:28):
And the Kanye West thing is really important too, where I
think in some ways Trump, weneed to acknowledge, are we
laughing at them, or are welaughing with them?
Because it's like when we seepeople that are mentally ill,
and that are in a spiral, andhaving, you know, breakdowns,
That shouldn't be comedy to us,like we should have empathy and
compassion no matter what youthink of the actual person or
(10:51):
the idea because again, we don'tknow either of them that we're
making assumptions based offthis essentially cartoon of
their lives that we have accessto I think we need to lean into
like, if you have a thought,One, does it need to come out of
your mouth?
And two, it's like, are weleading with love and
compassion?
Or are we leading with, youknow, the bravery sometimes of
(11:11):
being behind the keyboard?
You'll get those haters thatwill leave just awful comments
that they would never ever sayto your face.
But somehow feel comfortablewhen they're like a faceless
figure that you're never goingto see.
Kali (11:26):
Oh, absolutely.
I get nasty comments even onsome of the stuff that I post
and my stuff is fairly benigneven when it's a political or a
feminist discussion.
I've had people send me messagessaying, go back into the kitchen
and make me a sandwich, bitch.
And it's like, okay, but I'm notgoing to stop talking just
(11:46):
because you disagree with what Isay and so like you said there's
that sort of freedom from beingbehind the keyboard that
sometimes people they forget tobe kind and It's sort of the
double edged sword of being anintrovert, because being
introvert, you don't want tohave confrontation, like,
whatsoever.
And so, you're feeling nonconfrontational, you feel like,
(12:09):
oh, I've just posted this littlecute update about my eldest
child, and then it's like, goback and make me a sandwich, and
it's like, you kind of sit theregoing, okay, should I, Hang back
on what I'm saying.
Am I offending people with mythoughts?
But at the same time, you can'tjust let somebody who's being
(12:29):
mean, take over.
There's this Brene Brown quotethat I love and it's always
assumed positive intent, and soeven when people are mean, my
goal is to assume, okay, theymight be having a bad day,
something else upset them but Ijust have to try and stay
positive for myself, if thatmakes any sense.
Ashley (12:51):
It totally does and it's good that they don't like live
rent free in your hat.
I think sometimes when you getsay 50 positive or normal
comments.
Sometimes it is that really meanone where it's like, hey, did I
do something wrong?
Or, should I go back to thekitchen?
Where it's nice to be like, it'salmost like a Southern term and
(13:12):
it's like, bless your heart.
Yep.
And to me that kind of soundslike go fuck yourself in the
most nicest possible way.
But I kind of feel like itshould be a, Oh, I should go
back into the kitchen.
Bless your heart kind of thing.
So it's good that it doesn'thaunt you or that it doesn't
stress you out or overly upsetyou.
Kali (13:34):
It's taken a long time to get to this point.
Like when I first startedblogging and I first started
getting a little bit ofattention, I remember I would
get dick pics and I'm like, thisis a blog about children and
books like Good grief.
Like, do you have nothing elsebetter to do?
And it would just stress me out.
I would think maybe I'm puttingmy children, like, I never post
(13:58):
my children's names or wherethey live or anything like that.
But I would wonder, like, am Iputting them in harm's way by,
putting their picture on myblog?
And over time, it became clearthat It was a minority of crazy
people who take it uponthemselves to send dick pics to
a mom who talks about fiction.
Ashley (14:21):
For sure.
Also, like, in 2024, can we juststop sending unsolicited dick
pics just in general.
Kali (14:28):
I agree 100%.
Ashley (14:30):
It just makes me think about Louis CK.
Do you remember that from acouple years ago where he wasn't
sending unsolicited ones, but hewas asking his co workers like,
hey, do you mind if I just showyou?
But it's also, like, maybe wedon't talk about dicks
unsolicitedly to, people aroundus.
I'm sure they're great, I'm suresomebody wants to see it, but,
like, maybe, unless we say firstthat we would like to, or show,
(14:53):
something that is a clear signthat we would.
Maybe just don't.
Kali (14:58):
I agree 100 percent and that's the thing like I would
wonder like what did I post thatmade somebody think that this is
appropriate?
But then I over time learnedthat there are two folders and
there's one that's a junk folderand one that's how I can
communicate with you folder andI feel comfortable talking to
you.
(15:18):
I just stick to that folder.
Ignore the other folder.
Ashley (15:22):
Which is definitely good because I think sometimes it can
be too easy to focus on those.
And I also like that it's beingnormalized by certain
influencers now to actually likedo videos about them or to tag
them in comments, which I guessif those people really want
attention, they're gettingattention that way.
(15:43):
But then to also maybehighlight.
Hey, you know, Bob that works atMcDonald's in this city, this is
how he's talking to peopleonline and really make it so
that you have real lifeconsequences for some of those
things that you say that canpotentially affect other
people's mental health.
Or again, like that fear of ourkids.
As soon as you become a parent,you overanalyze.
(16:06):
Every single little thing youwant to bubble wrap your kids
and you just don't want theworld to ever affect them
negatively.
So it's like it can be so scaryand, it's unfortunate that
people have to wreck it and makeus question it.
Kali (16:22):
And that's exactly it, going back to why I originally
started the blog, it was like, Iwant to share some funny things
that my kids said today.
Well, I'm sharing some funnything that my kids said, and
then you send me an unsoliciteddick pic.
I'm then wondering, have I donesomething wrong?
After all the years that I'vebeen doing it now, I'm no longer
(16:44):
feeling like I've done somethingwrong.
I'm more like, okay, clearly youhave issues.
Ashley (16:49):
Yeah, it can be really, I guess like the ugly side of
the internet and I just almostwish that And all of the social,
like, I'm not trying to harp onInstagram, but just using that
was like, well, it's likeInstagram needs to be better at
taking that kind of stuff down.
I probably have like five cornbots per day that are following
(17:10):
all my stories and liking it.
And it's like, thanks for theengagement, but leave me alone.
There needs to be, I think, justbetter restrictions in place in
general for them to police.
Like, if you report something,they're like, oops, we didn't
have a person to actually lookat this, so we're not going to
do anything.
It's like, why do you have areport button?
Kali (17:29):
Oh, I know.
And then, the reply is like, ifyou want to dispute this, please
click this button.
And I'm like, okay, but Iclicked the last button and you
didn't do anything.
So what makes me think thatclicking this button is going to
help?
Ashley (17:42):
And I find, if you report stuff, it tanks my
engagement, or it negativelyaffects my account.
So it's like, some other personwas potentially harassing me or
bugging me or I was trying tolike make the internet a safe
space and reporting somethingwas a safety issue.
You're telling me you don't havetime to deal with it and now I'm
being punished for essentiallytrying to be a tattletale.
(18:03):
It just seems like the wrongside of it is being policed.
Kali (18:07):
It's absolutely true because I know that when I've,
reported things, my engagementwill just suddenly go from like,
You've interacted with 2, 700accounts this And then next
thing I know it'll be like,you've interacted with 300
accounts this week and it'slike, how did that happen?
Ashley (18:24):
No, it's ridiculous.
Have you found that when youfirst started making blogs
social media was such adifferent landscape in the sense
that you could post a pictureand a link to the blog, and now
everything having to post reelsor TikToks and having it to be
more like video friendly.
Have you found that that's beena challenge for you on your
(18:46):
site?
Kali (18:46):
It is a huge challenge because again with the
introversion and I feel safetyping behind a keyboard putting
myself out on like a live streamor whatever or recording a video
of me like dancing around is notsomething that I'm comfortable
with so I find it A realchallenge to, keep up with what
(19:09):
the content creation demand isnow.
I've attended some seminars on,how to make reels.
And I make reels to the best ofmy ability, but they're really
not very strong.
And compared to what I write, Ifeel like I'm a much better
writer than I am a reelproducer.
So I do struggle with that quitea bit.
(19:31):
Whereas Before it was like,these are my thoughts and this
is.
A link to a source that I found.
Well, you can't really link areel to, a news article.
Ashley (19:42):
It's super, super frustrating.
And I wish that TikTok got to beTikTok and that Instagram stayed
pictures.
Like, I still really appreciatelooking at people's pictures.
And I don't necessarily want tobe sucked into watching reel
after reel.
And I know that that's thepoint.
But I find that it's so mucheasier even to engage with 25
(20:04):
pictures or like comment onpeople's stuff that I like,
where I find that as soon as thevideo starts playing, I'm like,
where did that hour and a halfgo?
And it absorbs you in.
And I also think that so many ofus, when we started, it was like
coming up with that image, likespending time thinking about the
caption.
And I think with video format,it has become so like, and I
(20:26):
have to post it and it has tobe, At this time and I have to
make sure it's this many secondsand I need these hashtags and it
becomes this like have toinstead of get to if you want
to, you know, focus on it fromthe business side and it's so
much more, pressure than it hasbeen in the past and like you
(20:47):
had talked about if you'resomebody who, again, If you're
writing in a way that excelsthrough words and not
necessarily through the screen,it can be really hard to be
authentic but also show up foryour audience in the way that
you feel like you have to.
Or sometimes with captions, Ifeel like or just writing in
general, it's like you can beauthentic in a way that being
(21:10):
like a bubbly person in front ofthe camera doesn't always match
up or if you do have it so thatyou get to the point where I've
made this great reel.
I've probably done it 30 timesjust to make it so that I can
post this story or this reel orwhatever.
But then it's also when peoplesee you in public and you're
like, I'm shy and awkward.
They're like, but where's thatperson that you posted in the
(21:31):
reel?
I don't know if you know TaraJensen, she posts behind British
Columbia Mom.
Yep.
She talks about that huge, whereshe had to host an event, I
think it was like at Costco orsomething, and have people come
up to her and she struggles withmaking eye contact and she
really struggles with likehugging people.
So it's like a lot of timespeople will get the wrong idea
of her because it doesn't matchthe online personality, but it's
(21:54):
like, it's so much harder toshow that part of yourself on a
video in 10 seconds in the sameway, if that's like a long
rambly way of saying it.
But if that makes sense.
Kali (22:07):
Oh, it makes perfect sense.
That's exactly how I feel whereI am a shy person.
I will open up and I'm great onconversations with one on one.
But I've had it where I've beenlike, you know, out in the wild
and somebody will recognize mefrom my blog or from my
Instagram and they'll be like,Oh my gosh, it's so nice to meet
you.
How are your kids blah, blah,blah.
(22:28):
And I'm just like, Oh my God,I'm at the pharmacy.
I don't know.
Ashley (22:32):
It can be so hard because it's like they have this
familiarity with us and theyspend every day with us or, or
however long that it's like,they do feel like they're
visiting an old friend and it'slike, are you stranger danger?
Like, I don't know you in thesame way.
Kali (22:46):
Exactly, and that's the thing, I really encourage, the
community to be involved, and Ilove the engagement, and I
appreciate the fact thatsomebody cares enough that they
want to know how my kids are inreal life, but again, it's like,
when you're off guard, it'sjust, this isn't the setting
that I'm used to sharing in, soI feel, like, literally caught
(23:09):
off guard.
Ashley (23:09):
And I imagine to some degree, it's like, If they come
up to you, it's like, do I knowyou from the internet?
Or I would go through the, like,did I go to high school with
you?
Did I share a job with you?
It's like almost wanting tomatch that familiarity, but not
being able to place them.
Kali (23:23):
Exactly, and it's like, thank you.
And when they're like, oh, I'm abig fan of your blog, and I feel
really humbled because I'm not acelebrity type of person.
So, I mean, I have 10, 000 plusfollowers, but that's such a
small drop in the bucket when itcomes to influencing and having
people in your community.
(23:44):
I'm not like Kim Kardashian, ifyou know what I mean, where it's
like I've got nine millionpeople following me and
everybody in the world knowswhat I look like.
So for me, it's just a, thankyou so much for following my
thoughts and that you're engagedwith them, but again, it's a lot
easier for me to do that inwriting than it is to do that in
(24:06):
person or even on a video.
Ashley (24:08):
I definitely think that more people will benefit of
knowing that.
It's like, I love when peopleare like, I've listened to where
I follow you or whatever,whether it is five people or 5
million, it's just a matter ofknowing that.
Sometimes the online personalityand the real life personality,
it matches, but maybe not in theway that you think.
So it's also like, we promisewe're not trying to be mean.
(24:29):
We're just awkward.
Kali (24:30):
Exactly.
That's the thing, 100%.
And the one thing that I talkabout is like my anxiety.
I have social anxiety and thenin a situation where you're
needing to make small talk andit's like, I just don't know how
to do this.
Ashley (24:44):
Yeah, I definitely have been there and it is so awkward
and it is something that again Iguess gets easier with time but
it can be so hard to be outsideof your comfort zone and I know
in some ways that was kind ofthe nice thing about COVID.
It's like media events stoppedhappening so that you could kind
of Be in your little bubble anddidn't have to do as much like
(25:06):
networking and stuff and I knowI Done a little bit but
definitely not to the amountthat I was doing pre pandemic
that it's hard to get back intobeing so public.
Kali (25:17):
It really is and it's like you don't want to come across
standoffish and you want to befriendly and you want to do the
networking but at the same timeit's like, but I'm cozy at home.
Ashley (25:28):
Yes and I love being at home.
I'm like the biggest homebodyever that I'm the person, I'm
like that meme it's like I wantto be invited but I don't
actually want to go.
Exactly.
When people cancel on me, I'mlike, And don't get me wrong,
like, for anybody who invites meto stuff or anybody that I'm
around, like, I love being outtoo, but it's like, I also
really love it when peoplecancel and I don't have to go.
Kali (25:51):
Oh, me too.
There was a book that I justfinished reading a couple months
ago called Sorry I'm Late But IDidn't Want to Come.
Ashley (25:57):
I love the title of that.
Kali (26:00):
I bought it because the title was so hilarious.
And so when you shared it inyour story the other day, I was
like, such a good book.
And it really is about anintrovert who's trying so hard
to, like, extrovert in life,because we are expected that
extroversion is better thanintroversion.
And it's like, you get rewardedfor being an extrovert.
(26:20):
But I just love the, like, sorryI'm late.
I just, I didn't want to come.
Right.
Ashley (26:27):
How did you go from writing your blog online to
deciding to publish it?
Kali (26:34):
So part of that was it was my COVID project.
I work from home.
I'm really grateful that I getto do that.
But when everybody was at homeall the time, plus working from
home, I kind of, again, got alittle bit bored, which is how I
seem to start most of myprojects.
And I decided that I have alwayswanted to publish a book.
(26:59):
I've always dreamed of having,my name written on the spine of
a book on a bookshelf somewhere.
And So I realized that I had allthese written stories and
written thoughts that I couldcompile it into a book.
I went through my blog slowlythere's a lot that was on the
blog that didn't make it intothe book because I didn't think
(27:21):
it was.
relevant or interesting enoughor the caption was too short or
just for various reasons, but Idecided that it would be fun for
me to just do this as anactivity to go through my blog
and see what I had.
And then I discovered that youcould do self publishing through
(27:43):
Amazon.
And I went, you know what?
I'm just going to do this.
I'm going to I'm going to putthese thoughts all together in
one anthology, and I'm going tomake my first book.
Ashley (27:57):
I love the fact that you were like, I'm just gonna do it.
I love the fact that it wasn'tlike, and I have to find a
publisher, I have to be invited,that it was just let's just put
it out there.
Kali (28:09):
Yeah.
I was just like let's just dothis.
Let's just see what it lookslike to have your name on the
spine of a book.
And so I did that and it's oneof my proudest accomplishments.
I'm not going to lie.
Ashley (28:22):
Which is awesome.
I feel like we all have thatbucket list or those things that
we want to accomplish.
And I think for whatever reason,a lot of the times we'll tell
ourselves that I shouldn't dothis because I'm this age or I
shouldn't do this becauseeverybody will think a certain
thing or, all of the lies andlike just nonsense that we are
so harsh and tell ourselves.
So I love the fact that you putit out there and you were like,
(28:44):
I'm going to do this.
I know that the book roughlygoes until mid April of 2020.
Have you wanted to do a volumetwo.
Kali (28:55):
I have wanted to do that.
It's, right now a pile of papersunder my desk.
I printed off a ton of the nextvolume like with the pictures
and so I can go through and cutthe bits that I don't think are
relevant because There's a lotof editing that went into making
sure that it was appropriate fora book, because some blog posts
(29:16):
are just like, it's my son'ssixth birthday.
Yay.
It's just not necessarilyperfect for the book, but right
now I've actually been workingon my first novel for the last
few years.
And so I just finished the firstdraft of that.
And so the volume two of my blogposts has been on hold waiting
(29:38):
for the novel to get finished.
Ashley (29:41):
That's really, really exciting.
Do you want to tell us a generalidea of what that book might be
about?
Kali (29:49):
Sure.
It's a fiction book based in thelate 60s, of a young woman who
decides that she wants to be ajournalist and she doesn't want
to fall in love, she doesn'twant to get married, she doesn't
want to be a stay at home momlike her mom who had, like, Five
kids.
She wants to have her own bylinein a popular newspaper.
(30:11):
And so she goes and she ends upgetting a job as a typist at one
of the newspapers in the city.
And she lives in a rooming housewith a bunch of other characters
that are these different girlswho do different things that are
very 1960s.
Like there's some who are therewanting to get married.
(30:32):
She ultimately ends up meetingthis man who is also in the
newspaper with her, and she hasto decide whether or not she can
do both, whether she can havethe man that she's kind of
falling in love with, and herbyline, or if the 1960s make
(30:54):
that too hard, and she has topick one or the other, and if
she has to pick one or theother, she'll always pick her
career.
Ashley (31:03):
I love that.
And I love that, even thoughit's based in the 60s, I feel
like that's a timeless dilemmathat women a lot of cases have
to choose.
Are we going to, you know, picktraditional gender roles or are
we going to pick this career?
And is it okay to say, like, Idon't necessarily want this or
can you have it all?
Kali (31:23):
Exactly.
And that's sort of how I feltwhen writing it was like, I
wanted to base it in the 60sbecause I was in love with the
name Peggy and there are veryfew People named Peggy nowadays.
So, she ended up living in the1960s because it felt like an
appropriate time for her name.
Ah, I love that.
(31:43):
I feel like this is somethingthat's relevant even to women
now.
I just spent the last few yearsworking on the first draft and
in my spare time and now it'stime to do the editing and see
where that goes.
Ashley (31:59):
Are you going to self publish again or have you
submitted to publishers at all?
Kali (32:04):
With my fiction one, I have submitted to some agents.
If someone is interested, then Iwould be thrilled over the moon
if somebody was interested init.
But if it comes down to it and Idon't get any, positive feedback
necessarily, I would definitelygo back to self publishing this
(32:25):
fiction as well.
Ashley (32:27):
we've talked about how you've had anxiety and
depression when did that firstkind of appear for you?
Kali (32:36):
My first major depressive episode actually happened when I
was in university.
I was living on my own for thefirst time.
I was in courses that I wasn'tnecessarily interested in.
But I felt like I had to takeand I just felt really
overwhelmed.
(32:57):
That ended up being the firsttime that I went into a deep
depression.
I've had different bouts ofdepression.
Postpartum, for example.
Anxiety, I've kind of alwaysbeen an anxious person.
But it wasn't diagnosed until Iwas an adult.
It kind of coincided withbecoming a parent.
Ashley (33:18):
Did you find that it was easy to get, support via your
doctor?
Or was it something that yousort of had to struggle with
alone for a long time?
I
Kali (33:29):
struggled with it alone for a really long time.
I find that women are quiteoften not believed when we just
get told oh you're having apanic attack or, oh, it's just
anxiety.
They don't actually do anythingto treat it.
So, I find that it becamesomething where I had to
(33:49):
struggle on my own before I gotanybody to listen to me.
Ashley (33:56):
Which is so insanely frustrating, and I swear, Since
I got my breast implants takenout, if one more doctor tells me
that the labs are normal whilethings are not normal, it's like
I just want to like punch themin the face and scream.
It is really hard with women'shealth, that we just, we aren't
taken seriously.
And there's a lot of, I guesslike a lack of funding or a lack
(34:16):
of research that they just havenot prioritized a lot of the
stuff when it comes to women'shealth that they're kind of in
the dark about it so much.
Kali (34:27):
It's true, and I find that like, for example with my
fibromyalgia diagnosis, Irecently had it changed to
ankylosing spondylitis.
And it went from being, oh, it'sall in your head, there's
nothing wrong with you, to, oh,there's actually arthritis in
your lower back that's beengetting worse over the last
(34:49):
eight years.
And we need to put you on thisthousand dollar a month
biologic.
Ashley (34:54):
When you got the different diagnosis, did you
want to call like every otherdoctor, everybody that had told
you it was in your head or thatit was fibromyalgia?
I'm probably saying that wrong.
To be like, see, I told you.
Kali (35:05):
I absolutely did.
And I also felt like all thepeople who were just like, Oh my
God, she's so dramatic.
Oh my God, it's no big deal.
It's totally fine.
I felt like finally being like,look, it's not just fine.
It's not no big deal.
There's actually somethingphysically wrong with me that
shows up in a cat scan or an MRIthat you just totally ignored me
(35:29):
and pretended that everythingwas fine for years because They
couldn't figure out what waswrong, so therefore nothing was
wrong.
Ashley (35:37):
That's another positive thing about social media and the
internet.
It's like, if you had sharedabout your story, and you had
shared about this wholeexperience, like, there's so
many people that would have beenlike, Oh, hey, I have the same
thing that totally resonateswith me.
Maybe I should ask about thisother condition.
Maybe it could be that.
Where I feel like the moreconnected we are with sharing
(35:59):
our stories that way.
It's like, that's.
How we've been able to learnabout different things like I
had never heard about breastimplant illness until I had seen
it on Instagram.
A lot of people hadn't heardmaybe about ADHD being as common
as it is or autism or all ofthese things that I think TikTok
and Instagram have been soinvaluable in that sense that so
(36:22):
many women have to share theirstories publicly to just hope
that somebody out there canrelate to what they're talking
about so that maybe we can getanswers.
Kali (36:31):
Absolutely.
And I think that that's one ofthe things like when I was
sharing about fibromyalgia isthat a lot of people truly
believe that fibromyalgia isn'treal.
That it's just, I'm depressedand therefore I have pain and
therefore it's just all in yourhead.
There's nothing real.
So I would post videos of likerashes that would develop on my
(36:53):
skin or suffering through amigraine because I just was
like, there's something wrong,and this is a physical
condition, like you can actuallysee the rash, so just listen to
me, and I was hoping that byposting these videos and these
photos of me having a meltdownespecially the photos I had
(37:15):
hoped that other women would seeit and go, yes, I develop a rash
across my chest like that too,maybe I have fibromyalgia, maybe
I should talk to my doctor maybeit's not just all in my head and
that I'm just crazy.
Ashley (37:30):
I think too many of us feel like that.
Too many of us feel like it'sjust me and in a lot of ways, we
gaslight ourselves.
Oh, I'm sure it's just becauseI'm a woman.
I'm sure it's just because I'mgetting older.
I'm sure it's just because I'mstressed or all of these things
that it's like, I don't know ifour medical industry just never
did this or if it's Because it'sso broken now that they're so
(37:51):
quick to either dismiss orthey're so quick to, I don't
know, heal the symptoms insteadof finding the root of why we're
having migraines, why we'rehaving pain.
It's just chalked up to, oh,it's a headache instead of like,
it could be a million other muchmore serious conditions.
Kali (38:08):
Exactly.
And that's the thing.
Like, I don't know if it, likeyou said, if it's because of the
way that the health system is.
is at the moment, like it's sooverwhelmed, but like, for me,
this has been going on.
I was diagnosed with Hashimoto'swhen I was 13 and when I was
originally.
presenting symptoms.
(38:30):
My doctor was like, oh, well,she's 13.
She's just lazy.
And my mom went, she went fromdoing dance every single day,
like she would dance around thehouse.
She took dance lessons.
She was active.
And all of a sudden, all she cando is sleep.
There's got to be somethingwrong.
And it wasn't until I was havingblood tests, it was months of
(38:54):
just tests and the doctor notreally believing that there was
anything wrong with me, otherthan that I was lazy and my mom
was a hypochondriac.
It wasn't until we saw anotherdoctor, because our doctor was
off, that she asked me one quickquestion.
She said, how are your periods?
And I explained to her how theywere really heavy, and they
(39:15):
would last a really long time,and they were extremely painful,
and it turned out that that wasexactly what I had.
Now I can live a full life, notConstantly in pain or suffering
from falling asleep all thetime, not saying like relapses
or recurrences, but overall you,it's just one pill and then
(39:37):
you're able to function.
Ashley (39:40):
It's so frustrating that There's not consistency in care,
like if you hadn't by fluke seenthat other doctor It's like you
said who knows how much longeryou would have had to suffer
before Your age becameappropriate that they would be
like, oh, maybe it's this that Ijust wish that every single
doctor to some degree likeobviously there'd be little
(40:03):
variance, but I wish for themost part that they were trained
to offer the same things or toconsider all possibilities I
Kali (40:11):
agree completely.
When my oldest child was two, Inoticed that they had symptoms
that were the same as mine forHashimoto's.
I spoke to the doctor andoriginally this was the same
doctor that had not believedthat I had Hashimoto's.
But because he was my doctorstill when I first had my child,
I changed doctors after thisbecause it drove me crazy.
(40:34):
He told me there's no way that atwo year old has Hashimoto's,
and I said, well, I think thatshe does.
I think that we need to havethem checked out just do the
blood test, and he refused toperform it.
It wasn't until I switcheddoctors, saw a pediatrician, and
the pediatrician finally tookpity on me and was like, fine,
(40:56):
we'll do the blood work, andthen I get a phone call from
Children's Hospital from theendocrine unit saying that my
child's Thyroid number was 16when it should be between 0.
7 and 2.
4 they finally said your childhas Hashimoto's and I was like,
it's taken three years forsomeone to believe me.
Ashley (41:19):
it just makes you want to scream.
It's just so frustrating.
So we're in Canada for anybodylistening in other countries.
You're lucky if you have afamily doctor like a GP on a
list to get a different doctor.
It can take like 10 plus years.
And then if you go to theemergency room, it's like a 10
(41:41):
to 12 hour wait if you want tosee a doctor there.
And then it's like a 50 50 onwhether they're going to take
you seriously or whether they'reso extremely busy that they're
just going to write you aprescription and send you on
your way.
Like it's really hard to find adoctor that will listen to you
and to take you seriously and tobe able to get help.
(42:02):
We don't have the option ofnecessarily paying to see
somebody else unless we want anaturopath or an alternative
doctor.
Which there's pros and cons ofthat,
Kali (42:11):
it's true.
Sometimes it would be nice tohave the two tiered system where
we have the free option forpeople who desperately need it
and like for the averageeveryday person, but if you
really need a second opinion,having the option to pay for a
second opinion would be a nicealternative, but it's just not
(42:32):
something that's feasible in oursystem.
Ashley (42:35):
No, or it's frustrating to think that you just have to
go to a different country.
Okay.
Basically, like I know so manypeople will fly to Mexico or get
care in the States or get careoverseas, depending on what
they're getting done, but it'sfrustrating that you feel like
you can't get help where you arelocally or that you just feel
helpless and like that.
It does feel very frustrating attimes that it takes so many
(42:56):
years and so many doctors oflike feeling like you have to
fight just to have somebodylisten to you.
Kali (43:04):
It's true.
It's very frustrating, and it'san ongoing problem.
Ashley (43:09):
Yes, it definitely is, and it's definitely getting
worse, and I don't know what thesolution is, and I think our
system is so broken, that Idon't even necessarily know that
it's like, A doctor or nursesissue or whether it's like a
systemic overall issue.
Kali (43:26):
Yeah, I agree.
It's challenging when you'resuffering from depression or
anxiety or chronic healthissues, and you just can't get
anyone to listen to you andthere's no option to go and say,
Well, my doctor isn't believingme, so I'm going to talk to this
other doctor, which makes methink that it's a systemic issue
(43:46):
rather than we're just short ondoctors.
Ashley (43:49):
I think it'll be interesting to like, my daughter
is going to be 17 this year.
Okay.
And I find with her generation,I don't know any of her friends
that want to be nurses ordoctors or people necessarily
like I just I, in that sense, Ikind of worry that we're not
(44:13):
going to be able to fill some ofthe roles that we necessarily
have in our society, just ingeneral, but I think the next 20
years or I guess like even 10will be interesting to see what
that looks like.
Kali (44:26):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
Ashley (44:29):
We may end up with just a bunch of like gamers and
Instagram bunch
Kali (44:36):
of Instagram influencers and and nobody in the doctor's
office, right?
Ashley (44:43):
I appreciate you having this conversation with me so
much.
Can you let everybody know ifthey're looking for you online,
where they can find you?
Kali (44:51):
Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you so much.
I've really enjoyed the last bitof time getting to chat with
you.
I'm on Instagram atKaliDesautelsspeaks.
I'm on Facebook also at KaliDesautels Speaks.
My Blog is still Kali DesautelsReads Blog dot com because it's
too challenging to change theurl
Ashley (45:15):
that's kind of cool to have the, historic name in a
sense to like be able to carryit forward, forward.
Kali (45:21):
It is, I I kind of still love it.
It would be nice for branding tohave everything match up, but.
At least for me, it's stillhistorical.
Ashley (45:32):
Thank you so much.
FO4D7F7612C2 - Filled Up (45:36):
Thank you so much for joining us today
for this episode of the filledup cup podcast.
Don't forget to hit subscribeand leave a review.
If you like what you hear, youcan also connect with us at
filledupcup.Com.
Thanks again for tuning in andwe'll catch you in the next
episode.
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