How we got into USC Film School and Our 4 Year Experience

Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to the First Act Brave Podcast, episode two.
I'm Richard Li.
I'm Jiayang.
Today, we're going to be talkingabout the whole, what is USC
Film School?
How do you get in?
What makes it such a good place?
And some advice for people whoare looking at film schools.

SPEAKER_02 (00:16):
That's right.
Let's dive

SPEAKER_01 (00:17):
right in.
I'll tell you a funny story.

SPEAKER_02 (00:20):
Yeah, first off, funny story.

SPEAKER_01 (00:23):
I was in my cinematography class a few days
ago, and we were takingattendance.
Semester just started, so theprofessor doesn't really know
any of people's names.
And she gets to my name, startsgetting confused on how to
pronounce it, you know, as allprofessors do.
And I correct her, I was like,it's pronounced Jiayang.
And she was like, oh, and looksup at me, and she was like, are

(00:46):
you the kid who made that How toGet Into USC video?
And I was like, what?
like how did you know and I likethe whole class like there's
people in that class like thatare my friends who watched that
video so it was like everyonestarted laughing and it was like
it was really funny that the aprofessor who's like you know
such a veteran in the industryjust like stumbled upon that

(01:07):
video and it's also crazybecause she works at admissions
for the USC film school so Italked to her oh that kind of
makes sense yeah right I talkedto her during the break and I'm
like what did you think of thevideo and she was like well I
didn't get to watch the wholething but she's seen videos
similar to that where they givelike a step-by-step application
process where they're like youknow for this you gotta submit

(01:28):
this for this and she was likeyou know students that listen to
that guy I don't admit because Iwant to see and she shared a
secret of how to actually getinto film school that we'll get
to in a bit but she told me thatshe didn't want those kind of
videos and I was like well youknow what my video isn't like
that even though I don'tremember what I really said in
that video it was like threeyears ago and So she was like,

(01:53):
you know, I'm going to go watchit afterwards and see how it is.
So I hope she watches it andlikes it.

SPEAKER_02 (02:01):
Yeah, I'm sure she will.
I mean, I think a lot of peoplegot in through your video,
right?
I don't know.
I think you've had students comeup to you.
I have had people come up.
Hey, I watched your video and

SPEAKER_01 (02:11):
that's kind of how I got in.
I love when they do that becausethen it kind of breaks that
barrier between viewer andcreator.
It's like we are all onecommunity.
And it's like, just come up, sayhi.
Love to meet everybody, really.
If you want to grab coffee, justlet me know.
So tell me a little bit aboutyour application process because

(02:32):
you're in high school, justfinished standardized tests.
How is that whole process likefor you?
Did you get a tutor?
How did that work?

SPEAKER_02 (02:41):
We kind of touched on it last episode, but I'll
expand it more here.
So for me, again, I...
kind of applied to collegewithout considering film school
as my major or anything and sothen i didn't really apply as a
film major at all i knew goingin that it was going to be

(03:02):
somewhat of a hobby so i justapplied to college as a
humanities major i was intostorytelling already and into
the whole idea of the monomythuh which is a idea popularized
by joseph campbell and it's Usedby George Lucas, you know, as a
storytelling tool, you know, thestory circle, hero's journey and
all that.
So that was kind of the mainpart of my application was that

(03:25):
as a driving force of mycuriosity and my academic
interest for the most part.
And so it wasn't really film.
It was humanities.
It was whatever major the schooloffered.
I think for some schools Iapplied as English major.
Others, you know, at USC, Iapplied as narrative studies,
which some of our friends are apart of.

(03:47):
It kind of blends film andnovels or literature and theater
and all that together.
So Common App, essays, you know,high school grades, all the
standard stuff you need.
So I didn't really have aportfolio.
So that was my case.
And I got into USC.
Out of all the colleges Iapplied to, it was...

(04:07):
objectively, you know, if youlook at all the college ranking
websites, it was the highestranking one.
And it just made sense to methat if I was into film and it
was also at the same time, thebest college that I got into,
then that has made all the bestsense to me and my parents.
So I basically committed aroundMarch of 21 or I think it was

(04:30):
April, May of 21 ish around thattime, early in the year, got in
and flew all the way fromBeijing to here I was still the
pandemic came here and withinthe first about month or so
during my freshman year it wasalready an eye-opening
experience for me because I wastaking a class full-on just on

(04:52):
filmmaking and I was likethere's no way I can't give this
thing a try right and so I did Itold my parents you know I'm
just gonna apply because why notyou know it's doesn't cause a
lot I think the application feewas like 20 bucks or something
and I Applied Roman essays, andI thought I should apply as a
cinema studies major because itfelt like the right choice for

(05:15):
me.
I didn't have a lot of workbehind me or that I've done
before.
And so it was all about essaysand what I think about cinema
and what I think about this artform and the history of it and
the future of it.
So I wrote a bunch of essays onit, got in, and I was really
excited and so were my parents.

(05:36):
And that's kind of how I got mystart.
And since then, I basicallystarted being involved in
productions, you know, hoppingon set.
My first position was like asecond AC and all that.
And so for me, the applicationprocess wasn't as complicated as
the production major, which I'msure is.
is a bit more complicatedinvolves a little bit more

(05:57):
planning and you know portfoliobuilding so if you want to
expand a little bit more on thaton your end when you were a high
school senior

SPEAKER_01 (06:03):
yeah i mean i started up uh getting ready for
the application a while beforethe application process started
it actually started during covida year before i applied when i
spent every day studying for theact because i knew That was one
of the hardest things for me isthat standardized test score.
And I know it became testoptional at the time, but I did

(06:25):
get a high enough score at thetime.
I took that ACT like officiallylike three times, unofficially
like 16 times.
First time I got a 19 out of 15.
36 which is really sad but thelast time it got somewhere and
then my final one was a 32 36and i was literally one question

(06:48):
away from a 33 doesn't matterthough i got in um but the thing
is like i spent so longpreparing for that that's crazy
and now looking back it's likewow i literally just spent like
a year studying for a testDoesn't matter though, because
at the end of the day, I got tothe goal I wanted to, which is
to get to USC.
And then the process, it wasdefinitely a lot.

(07:12):
so much materials needed a lotof prep time needed ahead of
time so i feel like if you areapplying to film school you
definitely should apply and getyour materials in way more in
advance before the applicationlike opens for example like they
ask for the the media samples orreally make your film early

(07:32):
write your film early on andthen just get good at the craft
of filmmaking right i mean idon't want to be like concrete
like this is exactly what youhave to do to get into usc But
there's certain things that youhave to meet the threshold to be
really considered.
And we'll talk more on thatlater.
I think the main differencebetween production students and

(07:54):
non-production students at thefilm school is just like we had
a...
coming into USC we had to domore than just the writing and
essays and grades it was like alot of things to demonstrate who
we are as a storyteller I thinkthat's so important to embrace
your originality yourauthenticity oh absolutely right
it's like really um showing thatyou are who you are so for me I

(08:17):
grew up in Wyoming but I wasfrom Beijing um and I really
tapped into that identity withmy essays with the film I made
about this guy on a ranch who'slike a rancher who wants to
leave the town but doesn't wantto leave his grandfather behind
um and really just tap into whoyou are and it doesn't have to

(08:38):
really at all be high productionvalue um my one of my best
friends at USC Alex he made afilm about a dude who just like
leaves his hometown and missesuh his hometown when he goes to
the city.
And the whole thing is black andwhite photographs, just like put
together with a voiceover.
So simple, so easy.
You can film it, you know, nobudget needed.

(09:00):
And he got in, but I also knowpeople who spend like 10 grand.
I'm not going to say who, but Iknow people who spend 10 grand
on their application movie andalso got in.
So it really doesn't matter.
I think what matters is to showa unique person, a unique
storyteller, someone who'sconfident in their identity.
I think it's so huge.
And for you, what did you talkabout in your application essay?

(09:22):
I'm so curious.

SPEAKER_02 (09:22):
Yeah, well, from what I remember...
I only spent about a week or so,two weeks maybe, working on it.
That's a long time.
The semester already kind ofstarted, and I think it was due
around September, mid to lateSeptember.
And we start in late August, sothat was about a month.
But then I only realized that Ireally wanted to apply around...

(09:45):
very early to mid-september so ihad about a week or two to prep

SPEAKER_01 (09:49):
wow and this was after you got into us yeah this
was

SPEAKER_02 (09:52):
already freshman year 2021 august 2021 and i
started writing you know theproblem was like you know i
think it was just what do youthink about film and what why
you know this major and whatnoti think what i wrote was this
idea of like moments and time Idrew some quotes from the great

(10:15):
Andrei Tarkovsky, from PeterDocter, from Richard Linklater.
Something I find common in theirwork is their exploration of
existence in time.
And Tarkovsky has his own theoryabout sculpting in time and how
that's unique to the art offilm.
So I kind of relied on that,slightly pretentious with the

(10:39):
Tarkovsky stuff, but I thoughtit was really what I felt.
Whenever you're watching amovie, it's this transcendental
experience where you're throwninto a different way of looking
at time and space and how thereare only moments that we live

(11:02):
for there's only the now it'sone moment after another after
another that somehow creates aunique story and what's
interesting about film is itit's able to you know jump ahead
in hundreds of years with justone cut you know in 2001 but
then You can also make somethinglike Richard Linklater where

(11:22):
it's a very contained story thathappens in one day or a
chronicle of someone's life over12 years.
So it was just this idea of howmoments add up in life and how
that differs from film and howfilms would explore that.
I can't remember the exactdetails.
I thought it was pretty wellwritten.

(11:43):
If I look back on it, it mightchange, but I do remember it was
pretty personal in terms of justhow I really felt about art
form.
And it's interesting because Ithink if I look back on it now,
it's interesting to see how Ifelt about it at that time
versus how I feel about it now.
And if there's any differences,but I think, I think most of it

(12:03):
still, still held true.
So that was the main part.
And then I think there was apersonal statement or was that
the personal statement?
I think that was just a personalstatement.
And there were, I think, twoother essays about why you want
to pursue this major and whatit'll help you in your career

(12:25):
and your time at USC so that wasthe main part and oh there was a
slider room uh slide roomapplication as well I believe it
was not as extensive but it wassort of a short portfolio list i
think it wasn't at all seriousbut it was like a list of oh it
wasn't even creative work it wasjust your written work and you

(12:46):
know i submitted my macbethessay from high school because i
thought our high school was veryfocused on english and we have a
pretty rigorous program thereand i just pulled like the best
essay i had from high school andwith the highest grade submitted
it you know i thought it was agood literary analysis and
everything and since filmstudies is kind of hmm English

(13:08):
but with film I submitted it andI got in I think around October
ish so or November October ishwhatever but yeah it was really
exciting when I found out thenews it was kind of a dream come
true moment for me I stillremember how happy I was because
yeah it went from like somethingthat I only thought about when I

(13:28):
was very little to like areality which is quite exciting
if you can imagine it's you knowit's from zero to one.
So that was a, I was very fondof that memory.
Nice.
Yeah.
Talk about a little bit abouthow, when you found out, you
know, the schools that you gotinto, including USC and how that

SPEAKER_01 (13:51):
felt like for you.
Okay, so, you know, I actuallyapplied to USC summer program a
year before I applied to theactual film school.
And I remember when I first gotmy acceptance to the summer
program, I jumped out of myseat.
I like ran down my hallway, justyelling.
Fast forward a week into thatprogram, I dropped it because I
was like, wait, Loki, it's notthat helpful.

(14:13):
But that's another topic.
Uh-huh.
but my reaction, I recorded myreaction for every application,
every acceptance.
Um, yeah, no, it was so surreal.
And the fact that I got to bewith my mom when I saw the
letter coming from USC was madeit more special.
I think.
Yeah.
I

SPEAKER_02 (14:30):
jumped out and I remember my mom saying that was
like one of the happiest momentsI've seen you.
Cause I also jumped out.
I was like, there's no way

SPEAKER_01 (14:38):
I was so happy.
Like, did you jump up?
Like, For the USC film school?
It was actually just USC.
And I think upon

SPEAKER_02 (14:44):
reflection, when my mom and I talk about it, she was
like, yeah, I feel like youalready had your heart set on
the film school and the filmprogram.

SPEAKER_01 (14:52):
No, I remember it was funny because I had a
similar idea to you, but thatwas when I wanted maybe to study
CS and I wanted to go toStanford for CS.
But I'm like, I'm good at film,so maybe I'll get into Stanford
through film and transfer to CS.
But then I just ended up like,Like that's a stupid idea.
I'm just going to pursue film,which is actually the thing I

(15:13):
want to do.
But yeah, no, I was so excitedthat day.
That day was stressful becausethe acceptance notice didn't
come out until really late inthe day.
It was like supposed to come outon that day and it was like, 4
p.m and i was still not out andi was like this is the day when
i come out maybe like i didn'tget it but then one of my
friends texted texted me he'slike yo did you get the

(15:34):
notification because he alsoapplied to usc and he was like
one of the only people in myhigh school that applied there
he eventually went to nyu but hetold me he didn't get in and i
was like oh shoot i didn't evenget an email notifying me i went
to the portal it's there so theyupdated my status without even
emailing me so i was so scared iclick on it and i I see those
fight on little symbols likefloating.

SPEAKER_02 (15:56):
I was like,

SPEAKER_01 (15:58):
yes.
And I was just like, thatchanged my, that definitely
changed my life.
Like coming to USC, one of themost pivotal moments.
I remember I was so happy forthe whole week.
Um, this is every moment of myday.
I just felt so happy becauseI've been in that small town in
Wyoming for seven years and Iknew I had to get out of there

(16:18):
and pursue my dream with, youknow, the best people I could
surround myself with.
And that's when I knew that Icould finally do that.
Because I didn't go to a privateinstitution growing up, but I
knew I wanted to be with thebest.
And when I found out, I was sohappy.
But I was really cautiousbecause I was like, you know
that idea where it's like whensomething really good happens in

(16:40):
your life, you're like...
Yeah, you're a little bitscared.
Something bad might happen.
Something

SPEAKER_02 (16:43):
bad is going to happen next.

SPEAKER_01 (16:44):
I was driving so carefully.
I was like, no, I'm not gettingin a car accident.
I'm not going to get shot.
I'm not going to get kidnapped.
This is...
Yeah, but thankfully nothinghappened.
I'm at USC and this is my dream.
And it's amazing.
I do want to hear about your...
your mindset when it came to USCbecause I know you applied to so

(17:07):
many Ivy Leagues.
Would you have chosen, like ifyou got into Harvard,
theoretically speaking, but youalso got into USC film school,
which one would you have picked?

SPEAKER_02 (17:17):
That's a great question because I have a story
about it.
So I did also apply to Stanfordand just kind of for the fun of
it.
I mean, I had no expectationsgoing in.
Applied.
And actually, surprisingly, Igot an interview from an alum.
And that was kind of theprocess.
It was like, you know, if theyconsider the application strong

(17:40):
enough, then we'll have someonewho have graduated interview you
and go through that process.
I thought it went well.
A couple weeks later, I think, Iactually got waitlisted off of
Stanford, which to this day, I'mslightly proud of, actually
really proud of because, youknow, It wasn't a straight-up
rejection from Stanford, right?
And Stanford is a huge name.

(18:01):
And at that point, I've alreadygotten into USC.
I've already received anacceptance letter.
I hadn't committed yet.
And so one day during lunch, mydad just asked me, like, okay,
I'm going to ask you a question,and you have to answer it in
three, five seconds.
I think it was five seconds.

(18:21):
And I was like, okay, go ahead.
I'm kind of ready, I guess.
And he goes...
If Stanford accepts you rightnow, and you have to choose
between Stanford and USC, whichone would you choose?
And I actually, I kid you not, Ijust straight up said USC.
Wow.
I had no hesitation.
That's

SPEAKER_01 (18:39):
amazing.
And it wasn't even in the filmschool at that

SPEAKER_02 (18:42):
point?
No, it wasn't even at the filmschool at that point.
And then I think my dad justkind of understood that I had a
strong sort of inclination tothe film, the idea of even...
being close to that world.
And he was actually really happyabout it because it showed that
I was determined and I had astrong opinion about something,
which he really values.
And so, yeah, I mean, I didn'treally wait for the Stanford

(19:06):
results, which honestly, I don'teven really know how I made that
decision really that quickly,but it just felt instinctual
that I've had the choosebetween, you know, pursuing what
i truly love at the best placeto do it versus this idea of you
know going to ivy league anddoing something that i'm not
really passionate about right itfelt like you know you only live

(19:29):
once and so then that's what ichose but um so so back to your
question yeah you know harvardyou know basically is stanford
or synonymous yeah i would iwould say i mean i i That kind
of gives you the answer.
You know, I was prettydetermined on just

SPEAKER_01 (19:44):
committing to USC.
So there was no other schoolthat you debated?
Not

SPEAKER_02 (19:48):
really.
I mean, I got into some collegesin the UK in the film program.
But then, you know, it's LA, USCversus UK, which no disrespect
to the United Kingdom.
I mean, UK, some British filmsare amazing.
But, you know, if you wanted topursue, I mean, I think it's
common knowledge.
I'm on YouTube.
At least people from our agegroup.

(20:09):
You know, if you're in highschool, if you're early in
college, I think USC is thegolden standard for pursuing
film.
I think that's true across theglobe, I would say.
I mean, you look at some of thegraduates, it's pretty obvious
that this is the place to be.
So, yeah, that was pretty muchcommitted at that point.

SPEAKER_01 (20:28):
Yeah, I mean...
i was debating as well iremember um growing up in middle
school my grandpa would alwaysjoke about where not even joke
about like just be likemanifesting like he's like
you're gonna go to harvard oneday harvard harvard yeah and i
just thought it was like youknow what just like just random
nonsense but then i got to theapplication process and I was
like really thinking about maybeI should apply to Harvard

(20:50):
because you know, they have afilm analysis program and it's
Harvard, right?
It's like, what if I get intoboth?
I can do a little poll on myInstagram story to flex.
But I ended up not doing itbecause there's other schools I
thought were better.
I feel like I probably wouldhave gotten more out of like
Chapman film school than Harvardbusiness or Harvard film

(21:13):
studies, just because it's likefilm studies.
Like who wants to do filmstudies?
And so I never applied there,but I did, I really debated
between Chapman and USCactually, the film schools.
Cause I got like a, like a halfscholarship to Chapman, which,
you know, was a lot, a hugedeal.
And I did so much research onthe difference between the two

(21:33):
film schools and, And I thinkthe thing that made me decide on
USC was the fact that it is USC.
The brand, really, it wasn'tjust one art school.
It's more like a wholeinstitution.
And the film school is justtowards the center of it,
whereas Chapman is mainlyfocused on the film program

(21:53):
there.
And I wanted that collegeexperience where it's like
college football game day.
These are all the...
alums from you know USC and alsoI wanted to be like a director
producer so I felt likeChapman's more towards the
technical side of things so Iended up picking USC and it was

(22:15):
the best decision ever really ittook me a few days to really
decide because you know it is agood scholarship but ultimately
I was like USC is the place Iwanted to be you know and I do
want to hear your opinion.
If you got into Harvard orStanford, which one would you

(22:36):
pick, theoretically speaking?

SPEAKER_02 (22:40):
Like between Harvard and Stanford?
Yeah.
Oh, man, that's a difficultquestion.
I mean, I went to high school inthe East Coast, so I think...
So Harvard.
Yeah, if I were back in highschool, I think the safe
choice...
would be harvard in the sensethat it's close and i'm used to

(23:01):
it but i think i also would lovea change of pace and the change
of scenery and everything bygoing to stanford

SPEAKER_01 (23:09):
so okay if you graduated high school you know
offer offer two options usc filmschool or harvard business
school Which one would you pick?
I

SPEAKER_02 (23:19):
mean, USC.
I mean, at least, okay.
Okay.
Back in the, if I was a highschool senior applying to
college.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Which, I mean, the story I justtold you, I think that pretty
much.

SPEAKER_01 (23:28):
What about, what about USC film school or
assistant to Christopher Nolan?

SPEAKER_02 (23:35):
Theoretically.

SPEAKER_01 (23:36):
Theoretically.

SPEAKER_02 (23:39):
You always have.
Probably, probably assistant toChristopher Nolan.
You would not go to college.
No.

SPEAKER_01 (23:44):
Wow.
If I had that position.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But it's like, you're notguaranteed to be his assistant
forever.
How long?
For one film?
No, no, no, not for one film,just until you get fired.

SPEAKER_02 (23:55):
So it could

SPEAKER_01 (23:55):
be

SPEAKER_02 (23:56):
one

SPEAKER_01 (23:56):
day?
It could be one day.
Or it could be a few years.

SPEAKER_02 (24:00):
I mean, if you frame it as one film, guaranteed, I'm
hired.
And unless something terriblygoes wrong, like I get sick or
I'm just entirely untrustworthyand they realize I'm not a good
hire and fire me, And if it's aguarantee for one film, I'm
pretty sure I'm going to takethat because I don't think if I
have that on my resume, youknow, I don't think that you

(24:22):
don't really, I mean, you couldstill, I mean, you could still
go back to school, but it's justhaving that on your resume is
such a good, it's huge.
Yeah.
I mean, I think, well, whatwould you think if now I think I
would probably take a gap yearand then just to do that.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (24:37):
You're right.
Yeah.
And then you go back.
And if it's great, then youdon't have to quit.
Are there any schools thatrejected you?
Oh, a lot, yeah.
What are some of the lower tierschools that rejected you that
you're like, what the heck?
I

SPEAKER_02 (24:54):
didn't apply to...
Actually, I didn't apply to UNU.
Because I knew I didn't.
Did you apply to NYU?
I did.
You did?
I got waitlisted at NYU.
The reason I didn't want thatwas because NYU didn't really
have a campus.
Right, yeah.
It felt like I was just straightup thrown into a huge city,
which has its advantages, right?
You kind of just learn about howto survive and navigate a huge

(25:18):
city, metropolis.
I didn't really kind of wantthat.
I felt like if I was to go tocollege, I'd still want some
kind of...
environment which felt like iwas in a college campus yeah i
feel like nyu obviously it hasits buildings but you know it's
all blended into the larger newyork city vibe and so uh didn't

(25:42):
apply to nyu apply to usc uhapplied to tufts applied to
boston college boston universityYou got in?
BU?
Got into BU.
I got rejected from BU.
Really?

SPEAKER_03 (25:55):
I don't know

SPEAKER_02 (25:56):
why.
I got rejected from Tufts.
I actually found out back toback from USC.
So I first discovered, it wasthe same day that Tufts and USC
came out.
And straight up rejection fromTufts.
Which came first?
Tufts.
Oh, that must have been hard.
So my heart sunk.
I was like, yeah, there's noway.
Because USC, with every ranking,ranked above Tufts and USC.

(26:20):
you know, if you look at theacceptance rate, it was lower.
And I checked and it was astraight acceptance, which
really shocked me.
So that was really great.
And where else?
King's College, London, which Igot in.
And I didn't get into UCL,University of...
University College, London,which is actually the college
that Christopher Nolan went tofor English literature.

(26:44):
Didn't get in.
Where else did I apply to?
That was about...
I applied to Columbia, early...
Or early...
early what was it called earlyaction early decision ed early
decision

SPEAKER_01 (26:54):
oh wow so yeah so i was if i got it that was

SPEAKER_02 (26:58):
it yeah

SPEAKER_01 (26:59):
i know that's bold that's bold it was a different
it would have been a

SPEAKER_02 (27:01):
different world yeah columbia okay and i got i think
i got waylisted I see.
And then I was kind of sad aboutit because I thought I had it.
Didn't get in, which honestlyprobably turned out for the
best.

SPEAKER_01 (27:13):
Oh, absolutely.
I mean, everything really turnsout for the best, I

SPEAKER_02 (27:16):
think.
And I think that was about it.
Boston College, BostonUniversity, Tufts.
Dude, I got rejected from UCLA,bro.
Oh, me too.
Me too.
All the UC brand, I gotrejected.
Besides, I think UC SantaBarbara.

SPEAKER_03 (27:31):
Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 (27:33):
I got rejected from UCSD, from UCLA, from...
UCI?
Berkeley.
I didn't apply to UCI.

SPEAKER_01 (27:40):
Oh, okay.
I don't think.
I got into UCI.
Yeah.
That's cool.
Let's go.
And Eaters.

SPEAKER_02 (27:45):
Some of our friends, cinema friends, DPs actually go
to UCI.
There's a lot of Orange Countypeople

SPEAKER_01 (27:53):
who

SPEAKER_02 (27:53):
are into them.
Oh, yeah.
OC guys.
Yeah.
OC people from...
yeah do we do film

SPEAKER_01 (27:57):
yeah it's crazy because i don't know like the
whole process is so likeintricate and complex and it's
like so subjective too um butthere's also you know ways you
can figure out how to like kindof put yourself above other
people when it comes to yourapplication strength how was the
interview process did you getinterviewed by usc

SPEAKER_02 (28:15):
no actually okay i don't think i did that i think
only a couple colleges did thatstanford did that did you what
other schools did you enternorthwestern i think which
rejected me.
Northwestern, I think,interviewed me.

SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
I

SPEAKER_02 (28:29):
can't exactly remember, but a couple, not a
lot.
I think what I remember wasStanford being the only one that
stood out to me because theinterviewer was pretty
memorable.
But yeah, actually, I waswondering if you applied to
colleges...
without the film program becausei know you applied to chapman
and usc and you know nyu forfilm so yeah were there any

(28:53):
other programs you applied toand how did that affect your
your decision

SPEAKER_01 (28:57):
no that's a good question so i was making my list
of film schools yeah and i waslike if i don't get into the top
like 10 best film schools likeone of them i'm just not gonna
do film and i'm gonna either dolaw or do business and i
actually got rejected for lmufor film but i got into their
business school oh which i don'tknow why I think I don't know I

(29:19):
actually don't know why at allbut besides them it was mostly
just like most are filmproduction and there's a few
film analysis classes or degreesbut it was mostly just film I
was like I have to do it youknow and also for the interview
process for me I interviewedthree times and I actually

(29:40):
really liked the interviewprocess just cause at the time I
was like

SPEAKER_02 (29:43):
this is for

SPEAKER_01 (29:44):
USC or LMU I did three interviews, one's for USC,
one's for FSU.
Gotcha.
One's for Chemin.

SPEAKER_02 (29:52):
FSU as in full scale, full sale?

SPEAKER_01 (29:54):
No, it's Florida State.
Oh, okay, gotcha, gotcha, okay.
And yeah, no, I mean, I was likea speech and debate kid at the
time.
Yeah.
So I was like, yo, I lovetalking and people never really
asked me about film.
Yeah.
So when someone actually askedme about my filmmaking journey,
I was like, yo, Let's go, youknow?
So I had a really good time onall the interviews.

(30:14):
For the USC interview, Iactually looked up the lady who
was part of the interview, whowas my interviewer.
And I found out that she was aneditor.
So I kind of turned myconversation to touch that a
little bit.
and yeah i think my advice forlike interviewers like just like

(30:35):
to be yourself and just showthat you're a passionate film
person but also show that you domore than just like making
movies you know they want to getlike a full person who's like
diverse and stuff and Yeah, Iremember FSU, they were like,
you have to come to FSU campusto do the interview, but it was
during COVID.

SPEAKER_02 (30:55):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (30:55):
And I was like, well, no, because it's COVID.
And they're like, well, that'sour policy.

SPEAKER_02 (31:01):
That's actually kind of, is that really a great
decision on their part?
I mean, would someone justtravel from their home to just
for an interview and then comeback during COVID?

SPEAKER_01 (31:11):
Exactly.
And I was like, if you don't letme interview, I'm just not going
to like, keep going with thisapplication process.
I'm sure a lot

SPEAKER_02 (31:19):
of other people felt that

SPEAKER_01 (31:20):
way.
Yeah, it was.
But then they compromised andlet me do it on Zoom one.
But it's funny because during myZoom one, everyone else in the
Zoom lobby were allinternational people.
And they told me like, eitheryou're international or you
can't, like, you have to comehere.
And I'm like, oh, I still, like,didn't feel comfortable doing
that.
But then I became really goodfriends with a lot of people in

(31:42):
my Zoom lobby who are thecoolest people.
None of them go to USC.
One of them go to FSU.
One of them go to NYU.
One of them...
you know they're all over theplace and um that was like my
first touch of like other filmpeople and i was just so happy
with it yeah uh discovering thiscommunity through film school is
just like one of the best thingsever it really is you know

(32:04):
especially if you're from aplace where you're not
surrounded by creatives all daylike i'm imagining if you're
from oc like you're with filmpeople all the time but if
you're not it's like such such amagical moment to be honest it
is it

SPEAKER_02 (32:15):
is yeah Oh my gosh.
I think we touched on it lastepisode.
But yeah, going from...
My high school was pretty...
It was pretty STEM-focused.
It had a good English program.
It had a good theater program.
It had good emphasis on thearts.
Photography, you know, painting.
Pottery, too.

(32:36):
Okay.
And then I think there was justthe one singular class offered
on filmmaking.
And...
it was taught by the photographyteacher who, who is awesome.
Who's great.
Um, I love having his class, butit was just the, the program
itself was not developedwhatsoever.
It was a very fundamentalbeginner sort of, you know, a

(32:58):
very intro to film kind ofprogram, which is great, but I
just hadn't, we, we just didn'thave that atmosphere.
I mean, everyone was doingpainting.
Everyone was doing theater.
Um, you know, joining bands.
I was in jazz band.
Wow.
What'd you do in jazz band?
I just keys, piano.

(33:20):
You play piano?
Yeah, I do.

SPEAKER_03 (33:22):
How did

SPEAKER_02 (33:22):
I not know this?
Really?
I've never, I think it'sbecause, yeah, I think it's
because, you know, it's hardbecause you have to find a piano
or a keyboard.
You have one in your apartment,right?
I do.
Yeah.
I don't play as much anymore.
I really should, but that's socool.
Yeah.
So that was, there was a lot ofarts, but there wasn't
filmmaking.
I think I was along with likemaybe two other people.
people at my high school waseither into videography or was

(33:48):
sort of into cinema as in youknow watching movies and you
know and breaking them apartlike you do Macbeth or The
Bluest Eye in English class soyeah that transition from that
to all of a sudden over thecourse of a year you know 90%

(34:11):
80% of my friend group werefilmmakers and actors and, you
know, DPs.
It was mind-blowing.
It was a great transition.
I'm sure you felt the same way.

SPEAKER_01 (34:21):
Yeah, dude.
I was, like...
I felt like I changedpersonalities when I stepped
into USC campus.
I was so much more, like,extroverted.
I was, like, trying to meeteverybody, you know?
And before, I really didn't havea huge, like, motivation to meet
everybody.
You know, it's like...
I didn't really care that much,but then at USC, I was like,
wow, this is such a cool placewith the nicest people.

(34:43):
I feel like the quality ofpeople here are really just top
tier.
Not just the way they think,it's the way they carry
themselves.
I mean, of course, there's goingto find people that don't really
fit your vibe, but more oftenthan not, it's very nice and
very genuine, talented peoplethat you find here.

(35:05):
in every field.
It's so diverse.
So, I mean, how was your firstyear at USC?
Because that was towards the endof COVID, so I'm sure you had to
wear masks everywhere.
What was your impression of theschool like?

SPEAKER_02 (35:18):
A lot of masks, obviously, for COVID.
Took a lot of GEs just to figureout what I really wanted to do.
Because at that point, I wasn't,again, really fully, 100%
committed to film.
I took, you know, philosophyclasses, introduction to cinema,
a couple others.

(35:39):
CS actually, introduction toPython.
Oh, wow.
Which my dad kind of talked meinto taking.
It was an elective, but it wasfun.
Slightly challenging, but it wasfun.
So, yeah, it was kind of awhirlwind.
If I remember, I mean, COVID wasa huge part of it.
And I...

(36:01):
Was not on a singular film set.
My first semester of freshmanyear.
One of the reasons being.
I didn't want to step right intoall of it.
In the beginning.
I think maybe I was on one.
I was on one film set.
And it wasn't even like truly afilm set.
It was just a couple friendswith a camera.
Trying to make stuff.
That kind of deal.
Not full on.

(36:23):
Got a grip truck.
All the lighting equipment.
An RE or something.
It wasn't anything like that.
And so...
For me, it was all about let'sfigure out this place first.
And, you know, I got into thefilm program halfway through
first semester anyway.
So I'm meeting people.
I met a bunch of friends, bothinside and outside of USC.

(36:44):
A bunch of actors, freelance,assistant cameras, more actors,
more DPs, actors, both withinand outside of USC.
So a lot of it was about justsoaking it all in.
and adapting to a newenvironment.
Yeah, so the first semester, itwas all about adapting.

(37:04):
It was about soaking it all in,meeting as many people as I can,
trying to figure out what thiscampus is about and what this
city is about.
Second semester was when I firststarted to go, okay, let's try
to hop on a movie set.
And the first one I hopped on,it was amazing.
It was such an eye-openingexperience.

(37:26):
Who was the first one you hoppedon?
It was called...
The Story of This Life by...
Oh.
We've probably heard of it.
Alex Jiang was the...
Oh, right, right, right.
She was also on Dive Into TheBlue, which we touched on last
episode.
Yes.
She was the director along withtwo other producers with whom I
still have contact today.
And it was great.
I had no idea.

(37:47):
For the most part, I had no ideawhat was going on.
There were walkies all over theplace.
There was these stands withthree legs and an arm And some
knobs.
What is that?
What's it called?
I have no idea what it wascalled.
Okay.
You know?
And I was like, what the hell isthat?
What is this?
I've never seen this thingbefore.

(38:09):
And then I think people werejust like, oh, it's a C-stand,
which we have set up

SPEAKER_01 (38:12):
right here.
Now it's all over our studio.
It's all over

SPEAKER_02 (38:14):
the place.
We've got two of them in thisone room.

SPEAKER_01 (38:16):
Here, let me take a video for our viewers.
Here is the video.

SPEAKER_02 (38:24):
We've got one here.
We've got one here.
We've got one here for later.

SPEAKER_01 (38:27):
Yeah, so I guess you really want if you're watching
on YouTube you can see whatwe're talking about.

SPEAKER_02 (38:33):
Yeah Anyways, yeah, I didn't know what a c-stand
really was.
So I learned all of that.
I learned you know, what what isthe first ad?
What is how do you scriptsupervise?
I mean, I think I scriptsupervised for a little bit
because somebody else was sickso I have to take photos of the
monitor and like write downnotes and like continuity and
Back then it was just, you know,I knew what kind of nudity it

(38:55):
was.
I knew what script supervisingwas just from YouTube videos
and, you know, learningfilmmaking yourself.
But then doing it for realreally changed the equation for
me.
And so from then on, I startedjust getting on as many sets as
I possibly can in differentpositions.
I did second AC, I did sound, Idid a lot of boom hopping
actually, because I was toldthat it's, you know, it's

(39:17):
physically demanding.
Yeah.
But you really do get to observea lot about how a set operates.

SPEAKER_01 (39:22):
And you're tall.
You have the long arms.
True.
That's true.
You know, a lot of

SPEAKER_02 (39:26):
people kind of just knew me as the boom operator,
and they just kept asking, like,oh, would you be down to boom
up?
In freshman year, I was like,oh, yeah.
Overnight, I mean, I did a wholeovernight shoot just as boom up
from, like, two to six, just toexperience how it felt freshman
year.
Do you like that?
It was fun.
It was a really fun shoot.
And seeing how it all cametogether...

(39:47):
and how I contributed to a partof that was amazing.
I mean, got to start fromsomewhere.
So yeah, that was kind of mysecond semester was focused on
trying to go on set more andseeing what that's all about and
learning the ins and outs ofproduction.

(40:08):
So there was definitely a stronglearning curve.
I mean, to this day, obviously Istill haven't learned
everything.
But I think over the years, I'vedefinitely have a firmer grasp
about how to set things up, howto produce a movie, you know,
how to pull things together.
And you don't have to knoweverything.
You just have to maybe know alittle bit, slightly about

(40:31):
everything, but not to the pointwhere you're an expert because
that'll take years.
And the point of producing thenis to pull a lot together.
So that was my freshman year.
It was adapting and learning.
being like a sponge that just,you know, soaked in information.
Absolutely.
Yeah.

(40:52):
What about you?
I'm sure it was about the same,but a little bit different
because you jumped right intothe production major.

SPEAKER_01 (40:58):
Yeah.
I mean, the whole idea of beingon someone else's set was so
foreign to me before coming tocollege because in Wyoming, no
one was filming anything, right?
Yeah.
I didn't have any friends whowas filming anything.
Just you

SPEAKER_02 (41:08):
and your camera

SPEAKER_01 (41:09):
and your friends.
And it wasn't like aprofessional set at all.
However, I got to USC and Ijoined this like, you know,
there's so many group chats outthere.
So I was in this one group chatwhere they're like, yo, does
anyone have like, can someone docamera operating?
And I was like, oh my god.

(41:29):
I'm going to be the nextChristopher Nolan tomorrow.
I feel you.
I sent over my director's reel,and they were just really
shocked by how good it was, Iguess.
That's what they said.
Oh, they were like, does anyoneknow how to use a Blackmagic
pocket cinema camera?
And that's the one I used.
There you go.
Yes.
So when I got that gigimmediately, I was so, so

(41:51):
excited.
I was in my G7 class, and I waslike, oh, my God, dude.
I got camera operators.
It was the craziest thing.
Oh, I bet.
I have a friend named Colinwho's a freshman right now.
And I see a lot of me in him,whereas every time anything
somewhat cool happens, he's soexcited.

(42:13):
And that was me freshman year.
Yeah.
He's so enthusiastic about everylittle film-related thing.
Christopher Nolan does a post,and he reposts it, something
like that.
And it's just that energy.
I really, really love thatenergy, and that was what I had
freshman year.
I hear Second AC, and I'm like,oh, my God, I need a Second AC.

(42:38):
Every upperclassman, I justviewed them as like, like a
heavenly figure.
Yeah.
They're kind of like gods who

SPEAKER_02 (42:43):
are looking down upon us and

SPEAKER_01 (42:45):
we're trying to catch up.
Yeah.
So sick.
I was trying to get every singlegig possible.
I got two, two AC gigs, like forthe same weekend.
I'm like, but which one do Ipick?
I need to do the second ACthing.
And it was like, and I was sointimidated to first AC.
I was so intimidated to scriptsupervision.
Cause I was like, what is that?
Like, I'm, I'm gonna screw itup.
I was like, I couldn't do it.

(43:06):
And I remember the first time Ieven slated, I was just like
nervous to say the number.
I said the number, like, my headso many time like seen one take
one mark or something I've saidit so many times before I
actually did it and yeah fastforward now I'm like just old

SPEAKER_02 (43:22):
better attack same I feel that way too I mean gosh I
mean it's so strange sort oflooking back onto freshman year
and even sophomore year justthat kind of energy where you're
really just soaking everythingin like you said you know you're
so excited about another setbecause you get to and another
part of being on set is meetingpeople and once you meet someone

(43:45):
they kind of can recommend youto some other set this happened
to me on diving to the blueactually or it was something
else that was right after that ithink um and that's how i got to
know justin um who i justproduce a film for, and that's
how we got connected.
So it's really this space where,and then that's something I also

(44:07):
really quickly learned, I'm sureyou did as well, is how small
this world can be because youyou know every time after set I
think there's this session ofwhere people just ask each
other's Instagram and try to getconnected and then after a while
you kind of see oh so you knowthis person you know that person
and then they're like oh I'veyeah I've worked with him or her

(44:28):
on this set before and that'show we knew each other and it's
happened so frequently that tothis day I think that's one of
the most wonderful things aboutat least on our level you know
when we're trying to pull a filmtogether we kind of have the
same

SPEAKER_03 (44:40):
yeah

SPEAKER_02 (44:42):
there's a lot of people but same groups where
there's somebody always knowssomebody else and there's some
kind of connection being madeand I think that's one of the
most wonderful things aboutstudent productions on our level
where or even you knowcommercial level people know
each other and I think that'ssuch a strong vibe and it's so

(45:05):
important to have that community

SPEAKER_01 (45:07):
And it's crazy because I don't think I remember
the last time I tried to followsomeone on Instagram who's in
film who I didn't have mutualswith.
Like I met a few new people onmy internship this week and I
have mutuals with all of them.
And I was like, wow, like that'scrazy.
Like no matter who, unless theyhave like 10 followers, then
it's like a little harder, butit's such a small world.

(45:28):
And yeah, no, it's crazy.
And I think my freshman year, Imean, outside of film, I was
also like, Pushing myself to doeverything.
Except...
Absolutely.
Partying, actually, it's funny.
Because I...
Yeah.
Basically went to, like, one ortwo parties my whole freshman
year.
I barely went to any parties incollege.

(45:48):
Really?
Which is kind of just mypersonality.
Yeah.
I don't really...

SPEAKER_02 (45:52):
That's definitely not for everyone.

SPEAKER_01 (45:53):
Yeah, right?
Yeah.
But I remember I was just, like,so driven.
I think all those years.
Oh, yeah.
I could tell.
I wanted to do everything, youknow?
Right.
And, I don't know, at somepoint, you know...
I feel like I still am, but I'mshifting my focus offset to more
developmental stuff, writingstuff, and directing myself.

(46:14):
Same, same.
And I could see that shift in myDMs too, where people don't
really ask me to grip anymore.

SPEAKER_02 (46:20):
Exactly.
People don't ask me to boom upanymore after a bit, just
because I don't do it.
And then there's a couple timesduring my junior year.
Yeah.
people still reach out to me andbe like, Hey, I heard you boomed
off on the set.
Would you be down to do this?
I'm like, probably not, man.
I mean, unless it's a paid gig,I don't think I want to spend,
you know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(46:41):
Or that.
And I don't want to, you know,spend a whole day just holding
up.
It's important.
No disrespect, but you know,

SPEAKER_01 (46:48):
you know our passion at some point has changed yeah
and that's happens to everybodyand it doesn't happen to
everyone and it's funny becauselike yeah i know most of my
friends now they don't reallylike to be on set like at all
really too much anymore yeahlike all my people in my cohort
and i get it you know

SPEAKER_02 (47:06):
i think at some point it's not about being on
set i think at some point it'sabout getting to the core of
your story and your charactersand I mean, I think, I mean, if
you're not, you know, a writeror director, if you're more
focused on DP, then maybe that'sa different story.
But at some point I think it'sabout honing your craft offset,

(47:31):
you know, living life,experiencing things, writing
them down, finding inspirationfrom everywhere.
Um, and then, and then goingback on set to learn the
technical and craft aspects ofit, because obviously that's
important, but yeah, At somepoint, you know, yeah, you are
really just trying to developyour own projects or, you know,

(47:52):
be more, say, above the line,you know, producing, DPing,
directing, writing, you know.
Yeah,

SPEAKER_01 (48:02):
it's funny sometimes when I go on a set and I'm like
first AC or something people areshocked They're like why are you
first AC?
I'm like, why can't I first AC?
Yeah, you know, it's like andthey were shocked It was my
first time first AC too becauseI was scared of first AC for so
long But then I learned how touse the nucleus.
Yeah, I love using that nucleus.
Yeah, it's pretty satisfyingYeah, yeah, it's a video game.

SPEAKER_02 (48:24):
Yeah.
Yeah, it is a video

SPEAKER_01 (48:27):
game What do you what are some memorable
professors or classes you'vetaken over this?
in the last few years at USC?
Yeah,

SPEAKER_02 (48:33):
I really enjoyed Hitchcock class.

SPEAKER_01 (48:37):
Oh, wow, okay.
Film

SPEAKER_02 (48:38):
studies.
It dives into the auteur's sortof filmography and how
influential it was.
I think Hitchcock was someonewho I always, for some reason,
never really got into.
I think part of the reason isbecause of how, I guess you
could say, how...
old it is compared to some ofthe other movies that might

(49:00):
inspire us.
I don't know, I think movies Iwas into, I think the earlier
ones were probably in the 70sand 80s, probably that's as far
back as I allow myself to watchstuff.
But I think I kind of justforced myself to learn about
Hitchcock and how he influencedfilmmakers today.

(49:21):
Because you hear his nameeverywhere.
Bon Jovi pays a homage to him inParasite.
And that's just one of likehundreds, if not thousands of
examples.
And that really got me intolearning how much today's
filmmakers and your favoritemovie directors rely on a lot of
the storytelling techniques andform and style and everything

(49:45):
from him.
Look at Anatomy of a Fall.
You look at a lot of JaneCampion's movies, Christopher
Nolan's movies, even MissionImpossible.
You know, the thriller story andall that.
Suspense building.
A lot of it is from Hitchcock.
A lot of it is from North byNorthwest.
A lot of it is from Vertigo.
You look at the substance.
There's literally a score inthat movie that is straight up

(50:07):
from Vertigo.
And it's a moment that remnants.
I won't spoil it here, but yousee it everywhere.
It's everywhere.
And that's how I thinkeye-opening some of the film
studies classes are.
You realize how much history andhow much...
influence some of the oldmasters really do have on
today's filmmakers and i thinkit allowed me to sort of accept

(50:30):
and open myself up to moredifferent forms of of of cinema
in terms of time in terms ofregion country form you know
documentary experimental fromwherever and that's something
that Martin Scorsese alsochampions you know he sort of
forces himself to watch stuffthat he might not instinctually
want to watch just to beinspired and see what other

(50:51):
filmmakers are doing.
So that was one.
And then I think the other classthat I really enjoyed was 290.
Oh, yes, the production class.
Yeah, production class.
You took it last year.
For me, it was, oh my gosh, Imean, I kind of thought of it at
that time and still think of itas the most sort of free form of

(51:13):
filmmaking at USC in the sensethat there's not a lot at stake
in you have a little camera andyou just film a movie with your
friends and whoever you can pulltogether you just do it there's
no there's not a lot of you knowit's not as big as a 310 which
is the junior thesis class it'snot as big as 480 obviously

(51:35):
which is a senior thesis classand it really allowed me to have
this sort of freedom to exploreand do things i haven't done
before so for the three filmswhich we were supposed to make
throughout the semester Firstone, it was something I've never
made before.
It was sort of this montage-yEdgar Wright kind of movie where
I was trying to imitate hisvisual style.
Second one was heavily inspiredby this Chinese movie called In

(51:58):
the Heat of the Sun.
Again, kind of imitation, butinfusing some kind of personal
perspective to it.
It was probably the mostpersonal film I made in that
class, maybe ever.
And then the third one I madewas sort of an imitation on
Richard Linklater.
It was this sort of containedstory.
So a lot of it is about tryingdifferent things out and seeing

(52:18):
what I can do with my camerathat I've never done before.
So that was definitely one of myfavorites because it doesn't
have the burden of like, weinvested so much time and money
into this one thing andeverything has to come together
for it to all work.
And instead it was all about,you know, it kind of goes back
to the run and gun idea whenyou're first starting out is you
have someone working the cameraand it's you and it's the sound

(52:42):
recordist maybe.
Yeah.
And you just go ahead and makeit, but on a slightly more
professional level because youhave friends who can help you
out.
You have the theater schoolstudents who are actors or
aspiring actors.
That doesn't really come alongthat easily when you're in high
school or Wyoming.

(53:03):
So I would say those two werethe most influential classes
that I took here.
What about you?

SPEAKER_01 (53:09):
yeah i mean i took so many production classes it
was really slow at the beginningto be honest like we first first
semester freshman year we didn'treally do any production it was
mostly just analysis and generaleducation stuff yeah it's so
boring to be honest i wish wejumped in there more but the
first production class i tookwas 285 with uh our professor

(53:31):
who's ben hansford he's thecoolest guy he's super big into
ai and that class kind of showedme why usc was such a cool place
because they had access to someof the most advanced like ai
technology yeah beta tests thatthey let us use and but the
whole class we shot on iphonesome people you know sneakily
use their cameras i'm not gonnasay who but um whatever and

(53:55):
Yeah, it was such a great class.
And then I took 290 the semesterafter, which is the one you were
talking about.
I really took what you said toheart, which was just
experiment, play around.
Absolutely.
Do what you normally don't do.
Exactly.
But I also wanted to put a lotof effort into them, too,
because I didn't want to justlike.
Half as it, yeah.
Yeah.
Full commitment.
If I want to make a movie, Imight as well just like really

(54:15):
try to make something as best Icould.
First film I made was about aguy daydreaming, or not
dreaming, a guy having anightmare about his roommate,
which was a direct recreation ofmy dream that I had.
Wow.
I woke up from that dream.
Very Lynchian of you.
No, it was crazy because I wokeup from that dream and I was
like, I know I have to makeexactly that dream into a movie.

(54:37):
Yeah.
That's what I did.
Obviously, the characters areall different in the real dream
and then the next movie I made athe tongue movie it's all my
yeah yeah that was a moviebecause my bike got stolen and I
was like that's a personal

SPEAKER_02 (54:51):
angle into the story

SPEAKER_01 (54:52):
right and then the third one who is football
players versus musicians as amusical and newer it's getting
finished I got the scoretwo-thirds of it done and show
you afterwards but yeah take thefield and then I took another
class after that called 294which I made a movie about a

(55:14):
city of clay things yeah very

SPEAKER_02 (55:18):
again very

SPEAKER_01 (55:19):
experimental experimental but also put a lot
of work into it yeah called Cityof Meat it's on my YouTube
channel and then 310 after thatwhich I made the Melodies of War
which is the World War 2 movieso as you can see like all these
movies I do try to goexperimental with it just doing
as much as I could but alsotrying to keep it like more as

(55:41):
professional as I could withthese films like try to really
put a lot of work into it youreally don't have to but i just
thought you know i could die anyday and that's a good mindset
yeah if that's the last movie iwant to make that's going to be
something i'm proud of yeah livelife with a little bit more
urgency yeah exactly yeah iactually heard that uh idea from

(56:04):
one of my classmates who i'mgonna bring on next week
octavian yeah and he can speakmore on his philosophy yeah on
filmmaking but yeah i know itwas like definitely something i
care a lot about just likemaking something as best you
could every time yeah and i wantto hear what are there some fun
outside of film moments that yousee that you experienced oh wow

(56:26):
you you'd be going to the clubsometimes i do i did

SPEAKER_02 (56:30):
party a lot freshman year right because i think it
was an opportunity for me toopen up and i was told to get
out of my two things frommentors teachers you know peers
whatever one is get out of yourcomfort zone challenge yourself
do things that make you a littlebit uncomfortable and then
number two is to find yourpeople so the way i did the

(56:51):
first one was to just get go toparties i followed my freshman
year roommate who went toparties a lot and I kind of just
went along wherever he went.
It was great.
It was awesome.
It was a great way to openmyself up because I did not go
to a lot of parties in highschool.
I mean, even the dances orwhatever events we had, I tried

(57:12):
to avoid them.
I was very introverted.
I was very, very...
I kept to myself pretty much24-7.
I was locked in on academics.
Had no...
real energy or attention paidto, you know, my social life.
So I'll say outside of film,that was definitely a big part
of it my freshman year.

(57:33):
I joined the ping pong club fortwo months.

SPEAKER_01 (57:37):
Oh my God, not the ping pong club.

SPEAKER_02 (57:38):
Before I quit.
The ping pong posse.
The ping pong posse, yeah.
That's what they call them.
And then I quit after, I think,two months because I wasn't
really good.
People were way too good

SPEAKER_01 (57:48):
in that club.
I thought I was good.
I also tried to join.
Funny story.
they were i don't know i showedup with my friend jerry

SPEAKER_02 (57:56):
yeah

SPEAKER_01 (57:57):
and we were just like playing and they were like
you got to pay i'm like oh

SPEAKER_02 (58:00):
yeah that was a part of it too

SPEAKER_01 (58:01):
yeah and i was like well let me see if i even wanted
to do this club thing you knowat least let me play once yeah
where's the free trial at yeahnot 30 days maybe one hour you
know and we were just playingthe the club president or some
guy just came up and just tookmy paddle i was like Dude, what?
That's crazy.

(58:22):
That didn't happen to me.
And I was like, well, why wouldI join a club where, first of
all, they treat you like that?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And second, I don't even know ifI want to really do ping pong
like that.
I want to see how the clubworks.
So I never came back.
My main reason was I just wasn'tgood.
I just quit.

SPEAKER_02 (58:38):
We should play sometimes just together.
It would be fun, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (58:40):
Oh, we can play tennis or

SPEAKER_02 (58:41):
pickleball.
Tennis, yeah.
Tennis was something I picked upin college, too.
I was playing with you and someother friends.

SPEAKER_01 (58:46):
Yes, I would love to.
Justin plays tennis.
Yeah, Justin does.
Kai is really good.

SPEAKER_02 (58:52):
Yeah, I've heard he's pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 (58:55):
And he also does videography.
He's videography for the Bengalsnow.
Yeah, which is huge, right?
NFL, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (59:01):
Good for him.
He's into that, and that's agreat career path.

SPEAKER_01 (59:04):
He's a genuinely nice person.
Super cool guy.

SPEAKER_02 (59:07):
I think freshman year was about casting a wide
net of everyone, trying to justsoak it all in.
And then sophomore year wasabout sort of focusing on,
because then you've alreadylearned what this school is
about and what this town isabout.
And so then it becomes aquestion of how do you best
spend your time and, you know,maximize your, the things you've

(59:29):
learned.
And I think that I kind of justcut out a lot of quote-unquote
like extracurricular stuff thatI did.
I was pretty much fullydedicated to filmmaking.
Right, no, me too, yeah.
I didn't really join.
I mean, I went to the beach alot.
I tried surfing.
Oh.
Once.
Wow.
Didn't stand up.
Wasn't able to stand up.

(59:50):
But it was fun.
It felt like I was flying.
That's so

SPEAKER_01 (59:53):
funny.

SPEAKER_02 (59:54):
That was freshman year too.
So I did try a lot of thingsfreshman year.
But you got skiing.
That was your dream.
Skiing was fun.
Yeah, skiing.
Skiing and then going to, youknow, field trips and hikes.
I picked up hiking a little bit.
Helping to do more.
So yeah, those are some of thethings I do outside of film.
But film can take a long, a lotof time out of you.
It does, yeah.
a lot of sometimes you just haveto sacrifice

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:15):
you know i highly recommend high college students
to really find stuff outside oftheir major to do yeah yeah
absolutely especially like forhealth too it's like you want to
find some activities that getyou moving a little bit it's a
for me i really i like playingflag football yeah that's right
um or you just go in the gym ithink it's so important yeah

(01:00:36):
going to the gym developing apassion and like really Doing
outside of film that you fit andlike healthy.
Yeah, it's important.

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:45):
Yeah, I've been running I've been just running
every morning trying to

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:48):
Wow good good Do you run on the street or on the
treadmill

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:51):
on the street treadmill both?

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:53):
Very daring person you're brave for running on the
street.
I know

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:56):
it's the it's not very flat and Also, it's just
not the best place I guess torun.
Yeah, but uh rowing I did rowingin high school and oh wow and so
sometimes i go to the uh the gymto on the erg do

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:11):
you try to apply to the usc rowing team like

SPEAKER_02 (01:01:13):
i looked at it uh and i just realized that that's
first of all too much of acommitment yeah and two everyone
was like bigger and taller andstronger and bigger than me and
i just didn't feel like if iwanted to do filmmaking why did
i you know why do i and that'seven just a club level right
like it wasn't reallycompetitive it was just come

(01:01:35):
drawing, have fun, but it's notreally.
It's 6 a.m.
every other day.
Go to the boat, row.
I did kind of something likethat in high school.
It was every afternoon, but wasnot a fan of it in many ways.
It was a really great way tosort of build sportsmanship, to
build teamwork, to buildresilience and grit and make

(01:01:55):
your body more fit and mentallystronger as well.
So that part helped.
I guess...
A lot of it really was quitechallenging and quite difficult.
And I just didn't want to dothat in college again.
But I do still go to the rowingmachine and the gym sometimes

(01:02:17):
because it's actually a greatway to train and to get fit.
And, you know, it's short.
You can just do it for 20minutes or like 10 minute
intervals for 30, 40 minutes.
Yeah.
It can be pretty exhausting.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:29):
Dude, I know that athletes at USC aren't allowed
to do...
They're not allowed to be a filmmajor here.

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:35):
Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:36):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:37):
I didn't actually know that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:38):
I know...
That

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:38):
totally makes sense.
100% makes sense.
There's no way you can do 310and compete in, like, you know,
lacrosse or football.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:48):
Whatever.
No way.
Yeah.
Because there was a girl who wasin my cohort freshman year.
Yeah, I think it was freshmanyear.
And she was a...
Her name is Yusra, who was onthe Olympic team for swimming.
Yeah.
And they made a Netflixdocumentary about her.
Super nice person.
We talked a few times and shewas in the film program and she

(01:03:11):
told us she had a pick between aswimming career or a film
career.
Right.
And she chose film.
Really respect that.
Yeah.
And yeah, I know the commitmentto film is quite heavy at USC
and so rigorous.
Yeah.
But if you love it, you know,it's really not too hard.
It's not as hard as people say.
Yeah.
What are like, okay, here, let'splay a game.

(01:03:33):
It's not really a game.
What are three advice you wouldgive students who are applying
to film school?
What are three advice you wouldgive students who are at film
school?
What are three advice peopleyou're giving people who can't
get, go to film school?

SPEAKER_02 (01:03:49):
That's great.
Yeah.
So that's what, Nine pieces ofadvice.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:54):
Yep.
Here, we can alternate.
Alternate, yeah.
You'll give one first, I'll givethe other one.
So let's

SPEAKER_02 (01:03:58):
start from applying.
Applying, yeah.
Yeah, number one, don't focus onequipment and focus on your
unique self.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:11):
Cool.
For me, I think it's to...
do things in high school wayahead of time to show that
you're like a passionatefilmmaker, whether it's starting
a filmmaking club, whether it'sattending film festivals,
whether it's, you know, making,building your portfolio, just
like preparing ahead of time.

(01:04:31):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:04:33):
Second one for me is do everything in the sense that,
you know, you want to do film,but show that you also are
curious and passionate aboutother things, whether it's, you
know, debate, whether it's somekind of sport, some kind of
extracurricular, you know,community service, research,
whatever, you know, somethingoutside of it.

(01:04:54):
I think that, I'm not sure howmuch emphasis USC puts on it,
but I think that's, you know, toshow that you're a holistic
person and that, you know,you're not, oh my gosh, you
know, film is everything to me.
I'm dedicating my life to it.
Yeah.
It's a good mindset to have, butI think, you know, as a high
school student, you should havemore on your plate.
Yeah.
Be a more colorful applicant.

UNKNOWN (01:05:16):
Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:17):
I think advice I would have I really like what
you said, by the way.
That's exactly what theadmissions person told me.
It's like, just to be more of afuller person that's not just a
film person.
For me, I would also say, like,don't, make sure you're not
copying other people, really.
Be your own story.
There's so many videos out thereon, like, what I wrote on my
essay, you know, there's so muchstuff online.

(01:05:39):
It's like, you know, askChadGBT, but it's like, at the
end of the day, it's like,that's not what gets you in.
You know, the only thing thatgets you in is yourself.

SPEAKER_02 (01:05:46):
Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:48):
truest most authentic story yeah all right
last advice for our high schoolapplicants

SPEAKER_02 (01:05:53):
get some sleep

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:56):
don't stress too much

SPEAKER_02 (01:05:56):
yeah i mean it can be stressful i mean especially
because it's such a big point inyour life let's say take it easy
i mean like you said things workthemselves out just do your best
um try not to because i think idefinitely pushed myself a
little too hard when i was asenior in high school you know
with applying just to collegesand then covid And everything.
It was just a lot.

(01:06:17):
And so I would say, take a stepback and really make sure to
take care of yourself first.

SPEAKER_01 (01:06:22):
I love that.
My advice would be, if you'vemade it to the interview part,
really do some mock interviews.
Practice what you're going tosay.
Very practical, yeah.
There's going to be the standardquestions like, why do you like
USC?
What questions do you have forme?
Why are you doing film?
So really practice those withsomeone, with an audience

(01:06:44):
member.
Yeah.
Cause that's one of the biggest,like last things for the
application is the interview.
So really take it seriously andprepare for it and just like
relax and be yourself for that.
All right.
So advice for someone who's atUSC.
Then let's say they arefreshmen.
Yep.
These are questions would be forfreshmen.

SPEAKER_02 (01:07:03):
Um, freshmen

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:04):
who I was so lost freshman year.
I literally asked my friend, Iwas like, who's an
upperclassman.
He's a grad student.
I was like, does it get easier?
because I was so lost ineverything.
So I'm sure there's so much youcan talk about.

SPEAKER_02 (01:07:15):
Yeah.
I think I'll totally pass thisadvice I mentioned before, but
it's to get out of your comfortzone.
I mean, this is true for notjust film kids.
I think college is this greathub of people from different
backgrounds and experiences anddifferent interests and
passions.

(01:07:37):
And really try to do...
stuff that you would normally doyou know try things be like a
sponge be like water both spongeand water you know you should be
you know like bruce lee said belike water you know be flexible
try to be a little bit ofeveryone then also be a sponge
that soaks it all up that wouldbe my advice

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:00):
My first piece of advice would be being
independent, being comfortableby yourself.
A lot of times, you know, inhigh school, you're just going
with your friends to the gym,going with your friends to eat.
But in college, you got to becomfortable going to the gym by
yourself.
going to the dining hall byyourself buying groceries by
yourself um that's huge that'sthe next step to adulthood i

(01:08:22):
think is that comfortability andnot dependent on anyone because
you can't depend on anyonereally fully so i think it's
huge to be comfortable byyourself yeah and you don't like
obviously i recommend findingyour group of people your
friends and build your networkbut also be comfortable by
yourself

SPEAKER_02 (01:08:39):
i absolutely agree that's something my mom always
tells me is in chinese and ican't really say it in english
but for in english it's it'ssomething like well say it in
chinese heroes can withstandloneliness and the chinese is
yeah and i my dad has said thatthat kind of changed his life
and his perspective on thingsbecause it kind of implies

(01:09:01):
patience but it also impliesthat if you have something that
you really want to achieve andyou really want to do and you
have to it part of it it reallyis about dedicating yourself And
sometimes it can be lonely.
You know, not everyone will beon board.
Not everyone will be there withyou, but you have to walk that
path anyways.
So I think that's, I guessthat's my second advice.

(01:09:21):
You know, like you said, goingoff of you, I think a lot of it
is about patience too.
It can be grueling or it can be,you know, it can feel a little
bit lonely when you say, oh, whyam I doing this all by myself
when, you know, I see everyoneelse hanging out.
But that's kind of an illusionbecause everyone has to, right
beyond by themselves a lot oftime and especially when you're
out of college a lot of thecommunity doesn't come with you

SPEAKER_01 (01:09:45):
so i think a huge thing this is not the second
piece of advice but just goingoff what you have to say like
fomo is real but oh my gosh youhave to get over that yeah get
over fomo like you see peoplepartying like don't have that
urge to feel bad.
Because at the end of the day,we're on different paths.
You see someone doing this,that's fun.
Or they invite you to this andyou feel obligated to go, but

(01:10:08):
you're not.
And that was something I wasproud of my freshman year self
was everyone's leaving the dormto go partying.
Part of me was like, am Imissing out on college?
But also I'm just like, I knowwhat I want to do and I'm locked
in.
And I'm really happy my freshmanyear roommate, Nansen, he...
he was also like one of thosenon-partiers.

(01:10:29):
Yeah.
So we would both stay home andwe'd both like just work on
ourselves.
That's awesome.
That's really great.
It was nice.
You

SPEAKER_02 (01:10:35):
can always just follow the crowd.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:36):
Yeah.
Following the crowd is, youknow, you get the idea.
It's like you don't want to bethe average, you know.
Yeah.
You want to do your own thing.
And, My second piece of adviceis staying organized, whether it
is your dorm room, keepingeverything clean, being more
minimalist because you are incollege, right?
And also whether it's toorganize your calendar, your

(01:10:57):
time, organizing your homeworkor assignments whenever that's
due, your projects, huge.
It's going to make you way moretime efficient.

SPEAKER_02 (01:11:07):
This is my second or third?
Third.
This might be your third aswell.
I'm not sure, but...

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:12):
I can always change it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:11:13):
This is something that we talk about a lot and a
lot of people feel is don'treally compare yourself to
others.
I think this is a lifelong kindof understanding.
I mean, it's really easy to justbe in the...
mindset of like, oh, I'm notdoing enough.
Why is that person better thanme?
Imposter syndrome too.
Like, you know, you look atsomeone who's younger than you
or your age and you go, how?

(01:11:35):
Why am I not there yet?
You know, what am I doing wrong?
And that can be really, that canbe poison.
And, you know, there's good tothe comparison.
There's some good to comparisonin the sense that you can
extract what someone else isdoing right and then employ it
to your own life and your ownpursuit and your own diverse
that's the healthy part theunhealthy part is going i'm not

(01:11:58):
there yet then thus you know i'mnot as good i'm inferior and
that's not the wrong that's notthe right mindset to yeah go
about especially in film schoolthat's really easy to to do is
to see oh this person has youknow gotten his film there i
haven't and i'm such a loser andi haven't achieved anything that

(01:12:18):
can be really easy to that's atrap and i think both of us have
had to deal with that and comeovercome it so i think that's my
third piece of advice is ifyou're a freshman and you're in
film and you're soaking it allin and there's people on
different levels i would say tryto keep your feet to the ground
and just focus on yourself

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:40):
yeah i do uh love what you said because freshman
year i very distinctly remembermany of my friends saying that
they had an imposter syndromebecause i mean well they just
got into the best film school

SPEAKER_02 (01:12:51):
yeah going from wherever they are yeah to all of
a sudden a hub

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:55):
yeah the best people

SPEAKER_02 (01:12:56):
arguably the best young filmmakers in the world

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:58):
yeah and i just like to speak on imposter syndrome
it's just like you know a lot oftimes you chase success But
imposter syndrome comes fromsuccess.
It comes from, you finally aresuccessful now and now you feel
bad about it.
Whereas this is where I thinkyou gotta chase the process
instead of the end goal.

(01:13:19):
Because the end goal can alwaysbring a lot more things you
don't want.
And I think my third piece ofadvice is to really think um
about the future instead of justletting you yourself flow
through the day you know reallythink about what your next step
is what your goals are what youwant to do and just don't just
go with the flow and just youknow carve your own path right

(01:13:42):
yeah for sure i think it's justuh be intentional with the time
you spend because really collegegoes by so fast

SPEAKER_02 (01:13:49):
absolutely

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:50):
people say that to me all the time my freshman year
and uh the crazy thing is Ibelieve them and there's nothing
I can do about it and you

SPEAKER_02 (01:13:57):
still should believe it because I'm here in my last
semester and I can't believethat this is the last what four
months I have four months noteven four like three and twenty
something days

SPEAKER_01 (01:14:10):
yeah really take advantage of your time in
college like it goes by so fastand also bonus advice because I
think people need to hear thisreally take care of yourself get
that eight hours of sleep

SPEAKER_02 (01:14:21):
yes Yes, yes, yes.
Absolutely.
I mean, essential, I would say.
I mean, this is an essentialskill to build while you're
still in this safety net.

SPEAKER_01 (01:14:31):
You're building the foundation for the rest of your
life.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:14:35):
Eat well, sleep well, take care of your mental
health.
Exercise.
Exercise.
Hang out with your friends.
Don't just, you know, stay inyour dorm room and, you know.

SPEAKER_01 (01:14:45):
Another bonus, don't forget your friends from back
home.
Don't forget your friends.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, my gosh.
Yeah, huge.
Stay in contact with them.
There are three advice forpeople who, let's say, weren't
able to get into film school ordon't have the ability to go to
film

SPEAKER_02 (01:15:00):
school.
Right, or, yeah, but still wantto do film.
Yes.
My one is probably just don't beembarrassed to cold reach out to
people.
Actually, I think I pretty muchlearned this from you.
actually i think the idea that ithink a lot of it is false the
sense that oh people don't wantto get back to you you know
they're on their high positionand you're you know i think it's

(01:15:25):
really important to reach out topeople on wherever instagram
linkedin youtube and just tellthem you know how much you enjoy
what they do and that you wantto connect and learn from them
and maybe build somethingtogether i think that my number
one advice is that if you knownobody if you have no connection

(01:15:46):
and you want to pursue a careerin filmmaking wherever you are
there's got to be somebody inyour area that does videography
that does some kind of videowork

SPEAKER_03 (01:15:57):
yeah

SPEAKER_02 (01:15:58):
reach out to them see what they know get on top of
their projects be involved andthen just yeah i would say do
that

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:07):
yeah yeah i think uh getting a internship or job in
the film related world that'sbasically like film school but
also like i mean definitelydifferent people but you'll
learn a lot that you won't learnin film school which is how the
business works how the realworld works so i think it's very
important to build thatexperience early on at a job.

(01:16:30):
Quentin Tarantino worked at avideo store.
You can really do anything.
On the side, you can be writing,you can be planning your next
project, but definitely don't beafraid to jump to the next step,
which is adult life at a job.

SPEAKER_02 (01:16:52):
I think yeah i mean going off of that i think this
is something similar i thinkjust build your network oh yeah
it's basically the same advice igave but the idea is that you
know

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:04):
and what are some ways you would build a network
outside of film school

SPEAKER_02 (01:17:06):
i mean again cold reach out to people i think
there are there are online kindof communities totally on
youtube instagram wherever thatcelebrates film and you know
writers rooms wherever yeah i'msure there are group chats film
festivals film festivals that'sa big one attend those and and
then in terms of networking ithink this is something barry

(01:17:29):
jenkins said actually i watchedin the clip earlier um a couple
weeks ago where he said thatdon't just network but also
build people around you that cangrow with you and this is
something that I've been told alot throughout film school is to
sure you want you know you wantto know people on the higher ups
but ultimately the people whoare going to stay with you are

(01:17:51):
the people who are on your leveland then bring those people and
then grow together I thinkthat's yeah even if you're not
in film school grab someone whoknows a little bit more about
camera than you do maybe youhave someone who knows someone
who does audio and can recordsound for you start a production
company That way we know thosepeople.

(01:18:12):
Shoot a commercial for yourlocal coffee shop, whatever, get
your, you know, that's how youget started.
And then cold email to peopleand see what advice they can
give.
I would say that's the big one.

SPEAKER_01 (01:18:24):
Yeah.
I think it's just like buildingyour brand.
I think branding yourself, likemarketing yourself as someone
who maybe DPs, you know, youhave your reel, you make some
spec work for people, you shootweddings, you shoot photography,
or if you're a director, youknow, writing your own thing.
And just really putting yourselfout there because if you don't
have the school to bring otherpeople to you, you got to put

(01:18:46):
yourself out there.
So I think that's my secondadvice.

SPEAKER_02 (01:18:51):
My third one, this applies to kind of everyone, but
watch movies.
Yeah.
know if you're not in filmschool and you know you probably
have a phone that can shootvideo great go create you know
like we said but i think one ofthe biggest sources to learn
filmmaking is just this cinemathere's so much out there so

(01:19:11):
much out there and i don't meanjust obviously there's a lot of
content on you know youtubewhatever and those are great and
some of them actually turn intoto movies but i would you know
again go back to hitchcock go towatch some hitchcock watch some
old hollywood and then work yourway to the 70s and then 80s work
through the classics and then goto the niche films that you

(01:19:37):
don't even hear about in likeyou know places you know
identify your voice in the waythat in the sense that you watch
movies and you find what youlike what you don't like what's
somewhere in between and Andthen eventually you'll be able
to go, hey, you know, that's, Ikeep watching this director's
movie or I keep watching thiswriter's movies.

(01:19:57):
And that's exactly the thingsthat I like to create.
And then on top of that, how canI contribute my own voice and
make it something fresh?
I think that's my biggest advicebecause there's so much out
there and it's hard to narrowdown exactly the kind of, like
Christopher Nolan movie is sodifferent from a Richard
Linklater movie.
In terms of scale, in terms oftheme, in terms of budget.

(01:20:19):
It's so different.
And then by watching movies, youget to figure out over time what
kind of movies you like to make.

SPEAKER_01 (01:20:27):
From my third piece of advice, I do want some people
to know, if you belong to thegroup of people who we're
addressing these advice to, knowthat sometimes maybe not going
to film school is the best thingto happen to you.
don't feel like just because youcan't get in or you don't have
the ability to go to filmschool, there's nothing wrong.
100%.

(01:20:47):
There's nothing wrong with that.
A lot of the greatest filmmakersdo not go to film school.
I do have a lot of friends atthe film school who don't think
it's that good of a place.
Same here.
I

SPEAKER_02 (01:20:59):
know people who aren't in film school and who
actually very much dislike theidea of film school

SPEAKER_01 (01:21:05):
yes so there's people of all perspectives we'll
bring them on in future episodesbut here is my secret list of
getting better at film withoutfilm school and i'm just gonna
throw everything i know rightnow yeah so first of all i love
what you said about the moviesabsolutely watch everything yeah
all the new releases all the oldmovies all the classic every

(01:21:26):
oscar winner every sundancewinner all the short films on
youtube scour the internet forevery possible thing you know
download a letterbox if youdon't have a letterbox oh yeah
you know hop on you just gottaorganize what you watch and yeah
letterbox more intentional withwatching movies to um write
write write like keep writing uhjust write as much as you can

(01:21:47):
try to write a script a month oryou know write a feature film
write a pilot just really try towrite and get better at writing
with reps and also be makingcontent constantly if you want
to direct like really findactors out there and just like
direct them you know don't haveto be in film school to direct
people you put out an ad onBreakdown find people shoot a

(01:22:09):
little scene that's how you getgood at directing and then read
a lot of scripts you knowunderstand how the best of the
people like they write theirscreenplays IMDB IMSDB something
like that I don't know justreally try to write a lot just
keep making stuff read a lot ofbooks on filmmaking on

(01:22:29):
storytelling on creativity watcha lot of YouTube videos like
mine just keep learningeverything live life try to live
all experience everything travelis huge yeah You're broadening
your perspective.
Be talking to people.
Have that curiosity out there.
Really want to talk to a lot ofpeople and just get their

(01:22:50):
stories.
Shoot people's everything.
Just be filming.
Practice your cinematography.
Practice production design.
Just make stuff yourself.
Make a feature film.
Nothing's stopping you.
And you have all the timebecause you don't have to worry
about doing general educationwork or CS classes.
That's right.
So...
Yeah, I hope all these advicewere able to help all our

(01:23:13):
listeners.
This is towards the end of yourfilm school career.
Would you say film school isworth it?

SPEAKER_02 (01:23:20):
I would say so, absolutely.
And I think this is somethingthat the people who are ahead of
me, you know, people who havealready graduated and when I was
a freshman, they were, you know,whatever.
The biggest takeaway is thepeople because one of the
hardest things when you're notin film school is to find a
close-knit community around youthat can help you and grow
together and collaborate.

(01:23:41):
That's the biggest part becauseall the, you know, technical and
craft elements, you can findthose on YouTube and books and
watching movies and slowly youjust get a sense of that.
But then if you're all byyourself, if you don't, if you
have like maybe two to threefriends, that's great.
But in the long run, you know,you'd want people who are

(01:24:02):
equally as passionate, if notmore, and who are skilled at
things you might not be greatat.
So I think it was worth itbecause of the people that I've
met, yourself included.
And yeah, gosh, it's the people.
Yeah, it's the collaborators.
It's the people who havedifferent perspectives.
And then I guess another pointis obviously the resources in
the sense that we do have a lotof great guests.

(01:24:24):
I got to meet Damien Chazelle.
I got to meet Chloe Zhao, SeanBaker.
These people are kind of myheroes.
And it's only by being here thatI think I got to meet them.
Which is such a privilege.
I mean, gosh.
If somebody told my 16,15-year-old self that one day I
got to shake Demi Chazelle'shand, got to meet Sean Baker and

(01:24:48):
Chloe Zhao and who else?
A lot of other people.
I think it would...
I wouldn't believe it.
So I think, yeah, the people andthe resources.
I agree, yeah.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25:00):
Absolutely.
It's the collection of thetop...
talented people of our age rangein one place.
So much creativity, so muchpassion between everyone, so
much different perspectives whenit comes to filmmaking.
Some people like to makewesterns, some people like to go
crazy with the edits.
And different

SPEAKER_02 (01:25:18):
crafts too.
Some people really just want aDP, others just want to write.
They just focus on the writingand the story part of it.
Others really just want todirect.
Others just like lighting,others just like editing.
It's all very...
Diverse.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25:33):
And yeah, so much talent.
And even people who don'tadvertise with their talent, you
can see through the way theythink about art.
Yeah.
It's so unique.
I just love working with allthese people.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, I mean, I hope thisepisode has been helpful to
everyone.
You know, whether it is you aretrying to apply to USC film

(01:25:54):
school or some other filmschool, or you're trying to get
the most out of the film school,this is the place for you.
And we are going to figure outWhat's next?
You know, after film school,right?
Yeah.
This is what this film school ispart of the first act.
And it is the break is what'safter school.
Yeah.
What's the career?
What's industry like?

(01:26:14):
Yeah.
So stay tuned for more episodeson that.

SPEAKER_02 (01:26:17):
Stay tuned.
All right.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:19):
Peace out.

SPEAKER_02 (01:26:19):
Peace out.

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